[Weekly Compilation of Presidential Documents Volume 44, Number 19 (Monday, May 19, 2008)]
[Pages 695-699]
[Online from the Government Publishing Office, www.gpo.gov]

<R04>
Interview With Lukman Ahmed of BBC Arabic

May 12, 2008

Jenna Bush Wedding

    Mr. Ahmed. Thank you so much, Mr. President, for this. And first, I 
must congratulate you for your daughter's wedding. And how does it 
feeling, being a father? I know you are listening to your mom; I know 
you are a father, and you are having a daughter's wedding. How does it 
feel?
    The President. You know something, I was emotional, and--because I 
was so happy and proud. And she's marrying a good guy, Lukman. And we 
were out there on our ranch, which is a part of the world Laura and I 
love, and it was just a special evening, and it was great. I feel great. 
Thank you.

Lebanon/Iran

    Mr. Ahmed. All right. You have given--we are going to Lebanon. You 
are giving Hizballah the choice of being terrorist organization or a 
political party. What do you think would prompt Hizballah to abandon

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its--[inaudible]? Why Hizballah claim the existence of legitimate 
concern for these weapons?
    The President. Yes. I don't know. I mean, it's hard for me to get 
inside Hizballah's head. I do know that they are destabilizing Lebanon. 
I do know that they were viewed at one time as the protectors against 
Israel, and now, in fact, they're turning against the Lebanese people 
themselves.
    And I do know that Lebanon's success is very important for peace in 
the Middle East. And so our position--the--my Government's position is 
to support the Siniora Government, is to beef up his army so that he can 
have a chance to respond to people who are acting outside the confines 
of government.
    And, you know, Hizballah wouldn't be--would be nothing without 
Iranian support. And Iranian is the crux of many of the problems in the 
Middle East, whether it be funding of Hizballah, funding of Hamas, or 
obviously, actions within the young democracy of Iraq. And so a lot of 
my trip is going to be to get people to focus not only on Lebanon and 
remember Lebanon but also to remember that Iran causes a lot of the 
problems around the Middle East.

Lebanese Armed Forces

    Mr. Ahmed. We are going to touch that Iranian support and Syrian 
support to Hizballah. Many supporters of the U.S. policy in Lebanon 
criticize the lack of practical American support to the Siniora 
Government. That's what we are seeing right now. The USS Cole is now 
heading to the region, in what you call a--or previously mentioned, the 
support of an American ally. Does this mean the USS Cole is willing to 
offer this practical assistance?
    The President. Well, the most practical assistance, really, is to 
help the Lebanese Armed Forces become effective. And that's what we're 
doing. A couple years ago, I sent one of our top admirals to Lebanon to 
assess the needs of the military. And as well as I've been watching very 
carefully to assess the courage of the leadership, like Prime Minister 
Siniora. I'm impressed by the Prime Minister. He's a good guy who cares 
deeply about the future of his country. And he needs a military that has 
got the practical equipment necessary to deal with elements in this 
society that are destabilizing. And that's really where our practical 
help is going to be.

Situation in Lebanon

    Mr. Ahmed. And as supporting the Lebanese military, that means they 
should go, or do you think would go, to disarm Hizballah?
    The President. Well, of course, I don't see how you can have a 
society with Hizballah armed up the way they are. I mean, any time they 
feel like moving, they try to do it. In this case, though, they moved 
against the Lebanese people. They're not moving against any foreign 
country; they're moving against the Lebanese people. And it should send 
a signal to everybody that they're a destabilizing force. And--but the 
first step, of course, is to make sure that the Siniora Government has 
got the capacity to respond with a military that's effective, that can 
move point A to point B in a quick fashion, and that's got the capacity 
to get the job done.

Syria/Iran

    Mr. Ahmed. You are calling both Iran and Syria to halt their support 
to Hizballah. But in the absence of any direct contact with Iran and 
Syria, your administration--how do you think both countries should stop 
doing this? You are not negotiating with them. You are not exploring 
other means to have them halt their support.
    The President. So what's there to negotiate? I mean, they know my 
position. Early on in my administration, we sent the word to the 
Syrians, with top administrative officials, that if you want better 
relations with the United States, stop supporting these extremist groups 
that are trying to stop the advance of free societies. And every time, 
their response was nothing. So they know our position, the Syrians and 
the Iranians.
    I have made it abundantly clear there's a better way forward. If the 
Iranians want to have relations with us, they ought to verifiably 
suspend their enrichment, and then they will--they can visit with us and 
other nations involved with the--through the U.N. process.
    But they--both sides, both countries have made the decision to not 
take up offers. And they're very destabilizing influences. And

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they're--I truly believe that the Middle East is where the world ought 
to spend a lot of time, attention, and focus to help bring prosperity 
and peace, and that when people do pay attention closely, they'll 
recognize the destabilizing influence that the Iranians and the Syrians 
are having.

U.S. Foreign Policy/Iran

    Mr. Ahmed. So what are the other means that you think you could take 
to have them stop their support?
    The President. Well, you know, there are sanctions, of course. 
There's international--working with the international community to send 
common messages, working with the financial community. And we're doing 
that. The problem is, some folks just don't see the same--the threat 
that Iran poses in the Middle East, for example, as others do. I view 
them as a serious threat to peace, and therefore, I spend a lot of time 
trying to convince other nations, other leaders to join in this common 
concern.

Palestinian State

    Mr. Ahmed. We are going to the Palestinian and Israeli issue. And we 
know that you are going there to commemorate the 60th anniversary of the 
establishment of Israel, and you are the President who put the idea of 
the two-state solution. There are the other sayer in the Palestinian 
side. They call this anniversary as Nakba, or disaster. What do you say 
to them, Mr. President?
    The President. I say to them that I care deeply about the 
Palestinian people and their future. They're going to have a choice to 
make, hopefully, and that choice is, here's what a state's going to look 
like, or do you want the kind of state that Hamas has brought you? And 
there needs to be a vision that people can see, that's clearly spelled 
out, with defined borders and the refugee issue settled and something on 
how to move forward on the holy sites, security discussions.
    And those discussions are ongoing right now. And our job in the 
United States, it seems like to me, is to encourage the parties to come 
and reach a common solution so that they can then say, the world can 
say, here's what a state will look like, and now you suffering 
Palestinians have a choice to make: You can accept that, or you can 
continue to follow or accept in your presence these extremists who 
murder innocent people.
    Isn't it interesting that as the talks begin to emerge, there's more 
rockets flying into Israeli neighborhoods? Why? Because they want to 
stop the advance of a Palestinian state. And so, no, I got a good 
message for the people of the Palestinian Territories.

Middle East Peace Process

    Mr. Ahmed. In fact, I'm going to carry on that message. I'm given 30 
seconds, so I hope if you could allow me to ask this question here. In 
your last meeting with Abu Mazen here in the White House, you stated, as 
I quote here, that, ``I'm confident we can achieve the definition of a 
state.'' Actually, Abu Mazen, he expressed some concern after that 
meeting that he couldn't see anything that would suggest that the 
possibility of establishing the state before the----
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Ahmed. ----end of your term. And he's hoping, and you are 
hoping, right now you are heading there. Are you willing to tell me that 
before the end of your administration, there will be an agreement to be 
concluded, based on the assurance you get from the--both sides?
    The President. I think we can; I really do. We're going to work hard 
for that end. Look, it's hard. I understand that. And Abu Mazen was 
expressing frustrations with the process, and that's okay. He's sending 
a message. He wasn't speaking necessarily to the American people. He was 
sending a message back home that he's frustrated, and he expects there 
to be more progress made to his liking. I understand that. That's what 
negotiations are all about.
    Abu Mazen and Olmert are, of course, necessary to get a good deal, 
but there's still--Tzipi Livni and Abu Ala are talking now. There's a 
lot of discussions going on. And it's just a process. And the 
fundamental question is, when it gets down to it, will they be able to 
agree? They've closed a gap, closed a gap; will they be able to agree at 
that last minute? And that's why Condi Rice and Hadley and others are 
going out there all the time to encourage them to get a deal done.

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It's in their interests. It's in the Israelis' interests that there be a 
state living side by side with them in peace, and it's in the 
Palestinians' interest. The status quo is unacceptable; Gaza's 
unacceptable. What they need is a state that responds to the will of the 
people. And the first step is to define what the state looks like. And 
we'll work hard for the next months to see if we can't get it done.

Palestinian State

    Mr. Ahmed. And the agreement that you are trying to get it done, is 
it going to be a description of the state or the establishment of the 
state?
    The President. No, it will be a description of the state. Remember, 
I told everybody earlier that there's got to be some roadmap obligations 
that have to be met. Everybody understands that. Step one is the 
description. And the state can't look like Swiss cheese. It has to be 
contiguous territories with defined borders--and the refugee issue 
concluded as well.
    Mr. Ahmed. And that's what we're going to get before the end of your 
administration----
    The President. I think so.
    Mr. Ahmed. ----is a description of the state?
    The President. I'm working hard to get there.

Iran

    Mr. Ahmed. Thank you so much. With regard to Iran, President----
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Ahmed. ----Bush, it's very vital, as you say it always, that 
their cooperation to have stability in Iraq. Do you think that it--you 
consider one day that--talking direct to them to have them achieve that 
goal to----
    The President. They know--look, if I thought talks would matter, 
we'd talk. But they know our position. We have had talks between our 
Embassy and their Embassy. They know, and they know that the Iraqi 
Government, along with the U.S. Government, wants them to stop sending 
their weapons from Iran into Iraq, all aiming to kill innocent people. 
That's what they're doing. They're being very--they're not being 
constructive at all. But they absolutely know our position. And when we 
catch them doing it, they'll be brought to justice. And we are catching 
them doing it right now.

Syria/North Korea

    Mr. Ahmed. And the issue of the possible cooperation between Syria 
and North Korea on the weapon of--nuclear weapons, actually----
    The President. Yes. Well, their--yes, that was a troubling 
development, wasn't it, that all of a sudden, out of the blue, there's--
in the middle of a kind of a remote area, a reactor is there, built with 
the help of Koreans, North Koreans. And it just goes to show, unless 
there's transparency and openness, unless there's a strong inspection 
regime, what could happen. And that's why it's very important that the 
world stay diligent and pay attention to what goes on in the Middle 
East, and not hope for the best, but remain active.
    Mr. Ahmed. But thus, the evidence is seriously being--my last 
question, last question. This evidence, Mr. President, seriously being 
questioned. Obviously, the people have in mind that--the presentation at 
the U.N. with regard to the Iraqi weapon of mass destruction. So how do 
you see that, how----
    The President. Yes, look, I mean, it's--the difference was, in this 
case, there was concrete examples. I mean, everybody that analyzed the 
data realized it was true. I mean, are people saying that it didn't 
exist? Is that what the line of reasoning is? Well, I just--just not the 
case or the truth. The truth is, is that out of nowhere was discovered 
this reactor that nobody talked about. The Syrians didn't tell anybody 
about it. The North Koreans didn't tell anybody about it. And it was 
discovered, and now it's destroyed.
    Mr. Ahmed. Mr. President, thank you so much.
    The President. You're a good man.
    Mr. Ahmed. Thank you so much for this opportunity.
    The President. Yes, sir.

Note: The interview was taped at 11:52 a.m. in the Map Room at the White 
House for later broadcast. In his remarks, the President referred to 
Henry Hager, husband of Jenna Bush; Prime Minister Fuad Siniora of 
Lebanon; President Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen) and former Prime

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Minister Ahmed Qureia (Abu Ala) of the Palestinian Authority; and Prime 
Minister Ehud Olmert and Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign 
Affairs Tzipora ``Tzipi'' Livni of Israel. The transcript was released 
by the Office of the Press Secretary on May 13.