[Weekly Compilation of Presidential Documents Volume 42, Number 12 (Monday, March 27, 2006)]
[Pages 498-516]
[Online from the Government Publishing Office, www.gpo.gov]
<R04>
Remarks to the City Club of Cleveland and a Question-and-Answer Session
in Cleveland, Ohio
March 20, 2006
The President. Thank you all. Please be seated. Sanjiv, thanks for
the introduction. He called me on the phone and said, ``Listen, we
believe in free speech, so you're going to come and give us a speech for
free.'' [Laughter] Thanks for the invitation; thanks for the warm
welcome. It's good to be here at the City Club of Cleveland.
For almost a century, you have provided an important forum for
debate and discussion on the issues of the day. And I have come to
discuss a vital issue of the day, which is the safety and security of
every American and our need to achieve victory in the war on terror.
I want to thank the mayor for joining us. Mr. Mayor, appreciate you
being here. It must make you feel pretty good to get the ``Most Livable
City'' award. [Laughter] I want to thank all the members of the City
Club for graciously inviting me to come. I want to thank the students
who are here. Thanks for your interest in your government. I look
forward to giving you a speech and then answering questions, if you have
any.
The central front on the war on terror is Iraq, and in the past few
weeks, we've seen horrific images coming out of that country. We've seen
a great house of worship--the Golden Mosque of Samarra--in ruins after a
brutal terrorist attack. We have seen reprisal attacks by armed militia
on Sunni mosques. We have seen car bombs take the lives of shoppers in a
crowded market in Sadr City. We've seen the bodies of scores of Iraqi
men brutally executed or beaten to death.
The enemies of a free Iraq attacked the Golden Mosque for a reason:
They know they lack the military strength to challenge Iraqi and
coalition forces in a direct battle, so they're trying to provoke a
civil war. By attacking one of Shi'a Islam's holiest sites, they hoped
to incite violence that would drive Iraqis apart and stop their progress
on the path to a free society.
The timing of the attack in Samarra is no accident. It comes at a
moment when Iraq's elected leaders are working to form a unity
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government. Last December, 4 short months ago, more than 11 million
people expressed their opinion. They said loud and clear at the ballot
box that they desire a future of freedom and unity. And now it is time
for the leaders to put aside their differences; reach out across
political, religious, and sectarian lines; and form a unity government
that will earn the trust and the confidence of all Iraqis. My
administration, led by Ambassador Zal Khalilzad, is helping and will
continue to help the Iraqis achieve this goal.
The situation on the ground remains tense. And in the face of
continued reports about killings and reprisals, I understand how some
Americans have had their confidence shaken. Others look at the violence
they see each night on their television screens, and they wonder how I
can remain so optimistic about the prospects of success in Iraq. They
wonder what I see that they don't. So today I'd like to share a concrete
example of progress in Iraq that most Americans do not see every day in
their newspapers and on their television screens. I'm going to tell you
the story of a northern Iraqi city called Tall `Afar, which was once a
key base of operations for Al Qaida and is today a free city that gives
reason for hope for a free Iraq.
Tall `Afar is a city of more than 200,000 residents, roughly the
population of Akron, Ohio. In many ways, Tall `Afar is a microcosm of
Iraq. It has dozens of tribes of different ethnicity and religion. Most
of the city residents are Sunnis of Turkmen origin. Tall `Afar sits just
35 miles from the Syrian border. It was a strategic location for Al
Qaida and their leader, Zarqawi.
Now, it's important to remember what Al Qaida has told us, their
stated objectives. Their goal is to drive us out of Iraq so they can
take the country over. Their goal is to overthrow moderate Muslim
governments throughout the region. Their goal is to use Iraq as a base
from which to launch attacks against America. To achieve this goal,
they're recruiting terrorists from the Middle East to come into Iraq to
infiltrate its cities and to sow violence and destruction so that no
legitimate government can exercise control. And Tall `Afar was a key way
station for their operations in Iraq.
After we removed Saddam Hussein in April 2003, the terrorists began
moving into the city. They sought to divide Tall `Afar's many ethnic and
religious groups and forged an alliance of convenience with those who
benefitted from Saddam's regime and others with their own grievances.
They skillfully used propaganda to foment hostility toward the coalition
and the new Iraqi Government. They exploited a weak economy to recruit
young men to their cause. And by September 2004, the terrorists and
insurgents had basically seized control of Tall `Afar.
We recognized the situation was unacceptable, so we launched a
military operation against them. After 3 days of heavy fighting, the
terrorists and the insurgents fled the city. Our strategy at the time
was to stay after the terrorists and keep them on the run. So coalition
forces kept moving, kept pursuing the enemy and routing out the
terrorists in other parts of Iraq.
Unfortunately, in 2004, the local security forces there in Tall
`Afar weren't able to maintain order, and so the terrorists and the
insurgents eventually moved back into the town. Because the terrorists
threatened to murder the families of Tall `Afar's police, its members
rarely ventured out from the headquarters in an old Ottoman fortress.
The terrorists also took over local mosques, forcing local imams out and
insisting that the terrorist message of hatred and intolerance and
violence be spread from the mosques. The same happened in Tall `Afar's
schools, where the terrorists eliminated real education and instead
indoctrinated young men in their hateful ideology. By November of 2004,
2 months after our operation to clear the city, the terrorists had
returned to continue their brutal campaign of intimidation.
The return of Al Qaida meant the innocent civilians in Tall `Afar
were in a difficult position. Just put yourself in the shoes of the
citizens of Tall `Afar as all this was happening. On the one side, you
hear the coalition and Iraqi forces saying they're coming to protect
you, but they'd already come in once and they had not stopped the
terrorists from coming back. You worry that when the coalition goes
after the terrorists, you or your family may be caught in the crossfire
and your city might be destroyed. You don't trust
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the police. You badly want to believe the coalition forces really can
help you out, but three decades of Saddam's brutal rule have taught you
a lesson: Don't stick your neck out for anybody.
On the other side, you see the terrorists and the insurgents. You
know they mean business. They control the only hospital in town. You see
that the mayor and other political figures are collaborating with the
terrorists. You see how the people who worked as interpreters for the
coalition forces are beheaded. You see a popular city councilman gunned
down in front of his horrified wife and children. You see a respected
Sheikh and an Imam kidnapped and murdered. You see the terrorists
deliberately firing mortars into playgrounds and soccer fields filled
with children. You see communities becoming armed enclaves. If you are
in a part of Tall `Afar that was not considered friendly, you see that
the terrorists cut off your basic services like electricity and water.
You and your family feel besieged, and you see no way out.
The savagery of the terrorists and insurgents who controlled Tall
`Afar is really hard for Americans to imagine. They enforced their rule
through fear and intimidation--and women and children were not spared.
In one grim incident, the terrorists kidnapped a young boy from the
hospital and killed him, and then they boobytrapped his body and placed
him along a road where his family would see him. And when the boy's
father came to retrieve his son's body, he was blown up. These weren't
random acts of violence; these were deliberate and highly organized
attempts to maintain control through intimidation. In Tall `Afar, the
terrorists had schools for kidnapping and beheading and laying IEDs. And
they sent a clear message to the citizens of the city: Anyone who dares
oppose their reign of terror will be murdered.
As they enforced their rule by targeting civilians, they also preyed
upon adolescents craving affirmation. Our troops found one Iraqi
teenager who was taken from his family by the terrorists. The terrorists
routinely abused him and violated his dignity. The terrorists offered
him a chance to prove his manhood by holding the legs of captives as
they were beheaded. When our forces interviewed this boy, he told them
that his greatest aspiration was to be promoted to the killer who would
behead the bound captives. Al Qaida's idea of manhood may be fanatical
and perverse, but it served two clear purposes: It helped provide
recruits willing to commit any atrocity, and it enforced the rule of
fear.
The result of this barbarity was a city where normal life had
virtually ceased. Colonel H.R. McMaster of the 3d Armored Cavalry
Regiment described it this way: ``When you come into a place in the grip
of Al Qaida, you see a ghost town. There are no children playing in the
streets. Shops are closed and boarded. All construction is stopped.
People stay inside, prisoners in their own homes.'' This is the brutal
reality that Al Qaida wishes to impose on all the people of Iraq.
The ability of Al Qaida and its associates to retake Tall `Afar was
an example of something we saw elsewhere in Iraq. We recognized the
problem, and we changed our strategy. Instead of coming in and removing
the terrorists and then moving on, the Iraqi Government and the
coalition adopted a new approach called clear, hold, and build. This new
approach was made possible because of the significant gains made in
training large numbers of highly capable Iraqi security forces. Under
this new approach, Iraq and coalition--Iraqi and coalition forces would
clear a city of the terrorists, leave well-trained Iraqi units behind to
hold the city, and work with local leaders to build the economic and
political infrastructure Iraqis need to live in freedom.
One of the first tests of this new approach was Tall `Afar. In May
2005, Colonel McMaster's unit was given responsibility for the western
part of Nineveh Province where Tall `Afar is located, and 2 months
later, Iraq's national Government announced that a major offensive to
clear the city of the terrorists and insurgents would soon be launched.
Iraqi and coalition forces first met with tribal leaders and local
residents to listen to their grievances. One of the biggest complaints
was the police force, which rarely ventured out of its headquarters.
When it did venture, it was mostly to carry out sectarian reprisals. And
so the national Government sent out new leaders to head the force. The
[[Page 501]]
new leaders set about getting rid of the bad elements and building a
professional police force that all sides could have confidence in. We
recognized it was important to listen to the representatives of Tall
`Afar's many ethnic and religious groups. It's an important part of
helping to remove one of the leading sources of mistrust.
Next, Iraqi and Army coalition forces spent weeks preparing for what
they knew would be a tough military offensive. They built an 8-foot
high, 12-mile long dirt wall that ringed the city. This wall was
designed to cut off any escape for terrorists trying to evade security
checkpoints. Iraqi and coalition forces also built temporary housing
outside the city so that Tall `Afar's people would have places to go
when the fighting started. Before the assault on the city, Iraqi and
coalition forces initiated a series of operations in surrounding towns
to eliminate safe havens and make it harder for fleeing terrorists to
hide. These steps took time, but as life returned to the outlying towns,
these operations helped persuade the population of Tall `Afar that Iraqi
and coalition forces were on their side against a common enemy, the
extremists who had taken control of their city and their lives.
Only after all these steps did Iraqi and coalition authorities
launch Operation Restoring Rights to clear the city of the terrorists.
Iraqi forces took the lead. The primary force was 10 Iraqi battalions,
backed by 3 coalition battalions. Many Iraqi units conducted their own
antiterrorist operations and controlled their own battle space, hunting
for the enemy fighters and securing neighborhoods block by block.
Throughout the operation, Iraqi and coalition forces were careful to
hold their fire to let civilians pass safely out of the city. By
focusing on securing the safety of Tall `Afar's population, the Iraqi
and coalition forces begin to win the trust of the city's residents--
which is critical to defeating the terrorists who were hiding among
them.
After about 2 weeks of intense activity, coalition and Iraqi forces
had killed about 150 terrorists and captured 850 more. The operation
uncovered weapons caches loaded with small arms ammunition and ski
masks, RPG rockets, grenade and machine gun ammunition, and fuses and
batteries for making IEDs. In one cache, we found an axe inscribed with
the names of the victims the terrorists had beheaded. And the operation
accomplished all this while protecting innocent civilians and inflicting
minimal damage on the city.
After the main combat operations were over, Iraqi forces moved in to
hold the city. Iraqis' Government deployed more than 1,000 Iraqi Army
soldiers and emergency police to keep order, and they were supported by
a newly restored police force that would eventually grow to about 1,700
officers. As part of the new strategy, we embedded coalition forces with
the Iraqi police and with the army units patrolling Tall `Afar to work
with their Iraqi counterparts and to help them become more capable and
more professional. In the weeks and months that followed, the Iraqi
police built stations throughout Tall `Afar, and city residents began
stepping forward to offer testimony against captured terrorists and
inform soldiers about where the remaining terrorists were hiding.
Inside the old Ottoman fortress, a joint coordination center manned
by Iraqi Army and Iraqi police and coalition forces answers the many
phone calls that now come into a new tip line. As a result of the tips,
when someone tries to plant an IED in Tall `Afar, it's often reported
and disabled before it can do any harm. The Iraqi forces patrolling the
cities are effective because they know the people; they know the
language; and they know the culture. And by turning control of these
cities over to capable Iraqi troops and police, we give Iraqis
confidence that they can determine their own destiny, and that frees up
coalition forces to hunt the high-value targets like Zarqawi.
The recent elections show us how Iraqis respond when they know
they're safe. Tall `Afar is the largest city in western Nineveh
Province. In the elections held in January 2005, of about 190,000
registered voters, only 32,000 people went to the polls. Only Fallujah
had a lower participation rate. By the time of the October referendum on
the Constitution and the December elections, Iraqi and coalition forces
had secured Tall `Afar and surrounding areas. The number of registered
voters rose to about 204,000, and more than 175,000 turned out to vote
in each election, more than 85 percent of the eligible
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voters in western Nineveh Province. These citizens turned out because
they were determined to have a say in their nation's future, and they
cast their ballots at polling stations that were guarded and secured by
fellow Iraqis.
One young teacher described the change this way: ``What you see here
is hope--the hope that Iraq will become safer and fairer. I feel very
confident when I see so many people voting.''
The confidence that has been restored to the people of Tall `Afar is
crucial to their efforts to rebuild their city. Immediately following
the military operations, we helped the Iraqis set up humanitarian relief
for the civilian population. We also set up a fund to reimburse innocent
Iraqi families for damage done to their homes and businesses in the
fight against the terrorists. The Iraqi Government pledged $50 million
to help reconstruct Tall `Afar by paving roads and rebuilding hospitals
and schools and by improving infrastructure from the electric grid to
sewer and water systems. With their city now more secure, the people of
Tall `Afar are beginning to rebuild a better future for themselves and
their children.
See, if you're a resident of Tall `Afar today, this is what you're
going to see: You see that the terrorist who once exercised brutal
control over every aspect of your city has been killed or captured or
driven out or put on the run. You see your children going to school and
playing safely in the streets. You see the electricity and water service
restored throughout the city. You see a police force that better
reflects the ethnic and religious diversity of the communities they
patrol. You see markets opening, and you hear the sound of construction
equipment as buildings go up and homes are remade. In short, you see a
city that is coming back to life.
The success of Tall `Afar also shows how the three elements of our
strategy in Iraq--political, security, and economic--depend on and
reinforce one another. By working with local leaders to address
community grievances, Iraqi and coalition forces helped build the
political support needed to make the military operation a success. The
military success against the terrorists helped give the citizens of Tall
`Afar security, and this allowed them to vote in the elections and begin
to rebuild their city. And the economic rebuilding that is beginning to
take place is giving Tall `Afar residents a real stake in the success of
a free Iraq. And as all this happens, the terrorists, those who offer
nothing but destruction and death, are becoming marginalized.
The strategy that worked so well in Tall `Afar did not emerge
overnight; it came only after much trial and error. It took time to
understand and adjust to the brutality of the enemy in Iraq. Yet the
strategy is working. And we know it's working because the people of Tall
`Afar are showing their gratitude for the good work that Americans have
given on their behalf. A recent television report followed a guy named
Captain Jesse Sellars on patrol and described him as a ``pied piper,''
with crowds of Iraqi children happily chanting his name as he greets
locals with the words ``Salaam alaikum,'' which means ``Peace be with
you.''
When the newswoman asks the local merchant what would have happened
a few months earlier if he'd been seen talking with an American, his
answer was clear: ``They'd have cut off my head. They would have
beheaded me.'' Like thousands of others in Tall `Afar, this man knows
the true meaning of liberation.
Recently, Senator Joe Biden said that America cannot want peace for
Iraqis more than they want it for themselves. I agree with that. And the
story of Tall `Afar shows that when Iraqis can count on a basic level of
safety and security, they can live together peacefully. We saw this in
Tall `Afar after the bombing of the Golden Mosque in Samarra. Unlike
other parts of Iraq, in Tall `Afar, the reaction was subdued, with few
reports of sectarian violence. Actually, on the Friday after the attack,
more than 1,000 demonstrators gathered in Tall `Afar to protest the
attack peacefully.
The terrorists have not given up in Tall `Afar, and they may yet
succeed in exploding bombs or provoking acts of sectarian violence. The
people of the city still have many challenges to overcome, including
old-age resentments that still create suspicion, an economy that needs
to create jobs and opportunity for its young, and determined enemies
[[Page 503]]
who will continue trying to foment a civil war to move back in. But the
people of Tall `Afar have shown why spreading liberty and democracy is
at the heart of our strategy to defeat the terrorists. The people of
Tall `Afar have shown that Iraqis do want peace and freedom, and no one
should underestimate them.
I wish I could tell you that the progress made in Tall `Afar is the
same in every single part of Iraq. It's not. Though most of the country
has remained relatively peaceful, in some parts of Iraq, the enemy is
carrying out savage acts of violence, particularly in Baghdad and the
surrounding areas of Baghdad. But the progress made in bringing more
Iraqi security forces on line is helping to bring peace and stability to
Iraqi cities. The example of Tall `Afar gives me confidence in our
strategy, because in this city, we see the outlines of the Iraq that we
and the Iraqi people have been fighting for: a free and secure people
who are getting back on their feet; who are participating in government
and civic life; and who have become allies in the fight against the
terrorists.
I believe that as Iraqis continue to see the benefits of liberty,
they will gain confidence in their future, and they will work to ensure
that common purpose trumps narrow sectarianism. And by standing with
them in their hour of need, we're going to help the Iraqis build a
strong democracy that will be an inspiration throughout the Middle East,
a democracy that will be a partner in the global war against the
terrorists.
The kind of progress that we and the Iraqi people are making in
places like Tall `Afar is not easy to capture in a short clip on the
evening news. Footage of children playing or shops opening and people
resuming their normal lives will never be as dramatic as the footage of
an IED explosion or the destruction of a mosque or soldiers and
civilians being killed or injured. The enemy understands this, and it
explains their continued acts of violence in Iraq. Yet the progress we
and the Iraqi people are making is also real. And those in a position to
know best are the Iraqis themselves.
One of the most eloquent is the mayor of Tall `Afar, a courageous
Iraqi man named Najim. Mayor Najim arrived in the city in the midst of
the Al Qaida occupation, and he knows exactly what our troops have
helped accomplish. He calls our men and women in uniform ``lionhearts.''
And in a letter to the troopers of the 3d Armored Cavalry Regiment, he
spoke of a friendship sealed in blood and sacrifice, as Mayor Najim had
this to say to the families of our fallen: ``To the families of those
who have given their holy blood for our land, we all bow to you in
reverence and to the souls of your loved ones. Their sacrifice was not
in vain. They are not dead but alive, and their souls are hovering
around us every second of every minute. They will not be forgotten for
giving their precious lives. They have sacrificed that which is most
valuable. We see them in the smile of every child and in every flower
growing in this land. Let America, their families, and the world be
proud of their sacrifice for humanity and life.'' America is proud of
that sacrifice, and we're proud to have allies like Mayor Najim on our
side in the fight for freedom.
Yesterday we marked the third anniversary of the start of Operation
Iraqi Freedom. At the time, there is much to--this time, there's much
discussion in our country about the removal of Saddam Hussein from power
and our remaining mission in Iraq. The decision to remove Saddam Hussein
was a difficult decision. The decision to remove Saddam Hussein was the
right decision.
Before we acted, his regime was defying U.N. resolutions calling for
it to disarm; it was violating cease-fire agreements, was firing on
British and American pilots which were enforcing no-fly zones. Saddam
Hussein was a leader who brutalized his people, had pursued and used
weapons of mass destruction, and sponsored terrorism. Today, Saddam
Hussein is no longer oppressing his people or threatening the world.
He's being tried for his crimes by the free citizens of a free Iraq, and
America and our allies are safer for it.
The last 3 years have tested our resolve. The fighting has been
tough. The enemy we face has proved to be brutal and relentless. We're
adapting our approach to reflect the hard realities on the ground. And
the sacrifice being made by our young men and
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women who wear our uniform has been heartening and inspiring.
The terrorists who are setting off bombs in mosques and markets in
Iraq share the same hateful ideology as the terrorists who attacked us
on September the 11th, 2001, those who blew up the commuters in London
and Madrid, and those who murdered tourists in Bali or workers in Riyadh
or guests at a wedding in Amman, Jordan. In the war on terror, we face a
global enemy, and if we were not fighting this enemy in Iraq, they would
not be idle. They would be plotting and trying to kill Americans across
the world and within our own borders. Against this enemy, there can be
no compromise. So we will fight them in Iraq. We'll fight them across
the world, and we will stay in the fight until the fight is won.
In the long run, the best way to defeat this enemy and to ensure the
security of our own citizens is to spread the hope of freedom across the
broader Middle East. We've seen freedom conquer evil and secure the
peace before. In World War II, free nations came together to fight the
ideology of fascism, and freedom prevailed. And today, Germany and Japan
are democracies, and they are allies in securing the peace. In the cold
war, freedom defeated the ideology of communism and led to a democratic
movement that freed the nations of Central and Eastern Europe from
Soviet domination. And today, these nations are strong allies in the war
on terror.
In the Middle East, freedom is once again contending with an
ideology that seeks to sow anger and hatred and despair. And like
fascism and communism before, the hateful ideologies that use terror
will be defeated. Freedom will prevail in Iraq; freedom will prevail in
the Middle East. And as the hope of freedom spreads to nations that have
not known it, these countries will become allies in the cause of peace.
The security of our country is directly linked to the liberty of the
Iraqi people, and we will settle for nothing less than victory. Victory
will come when the terrorists and Saddamists can no longer threaten
Iraq's democracy, when the Iraqi security forces can provide for the
safety of their citizens on their own, and when Iraq is not a safe haven
for terrorists to plot new attacks against our Nation. There will be
more days of sacrifice and tough fighting before the victory is
achieved. Yet by helping the Iraqis defeat the terrorists in their land,
we bring greater security to our own.
As we make progress toward victory, Iraqis will continue to take
more responsibility for their own security and fewer U.S. forces will be
needed to complete the mission. But it's important for the Iraqis to
hear this: The United States will not abandon Iraq. We will not leave
that country to the terrorists who attacked America and want to attack
us again. We will leave Iraq, but when we do, it will be from a position
of strength, not weakness. Americans have never retreated in the face of
thugs and assassins, and we will not begin now.
Thanks for listening. And I'll be glad to answer some questions, if
you have any.
Yes, ma'am.
War on Terror
Q. Thank you for coming to Cleveland, Mr. President, and to the City
Club. My question is that author and former Nixon administration
official Kevin Phillips, in his latest book, ``American Theocracy,''
discusses what has been called radical Christianity and its growing
involvement into government and politics. He makes the point that
members of your administration have reached out to prophetic Christians
who see the war in Iraq and the rise of terrorism as signs of the
apocalypse. Do you believe this, that the war in Iraq and the rise of
terrorism are signs of the apocalypse? And if not, why not?
The President. The answer is--I haven't really thought of it that
way. [Laughter] Here's how I think of it. First I've heard of that, by
the way. I guess I'm more of a practical fellow. I vowed after September
the 11th, that I would do everything I could to protect the American
people. And my attitude, of course, was affected by the attacks. I knew
we were at a war. I knew that the enemy, obviously, had to be
sophisticated and lethal to fly hijacked airplanes into facilities that
would be killing thousands of people, innocent people doing nothing,
just sitting there going to work.
I also knew this about this war on terror, that the farther we got
away from September
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the 11th, the more likely it is people would seek comfort and not think
about this global war on terror as a global war on terror. And that's
good, by the way. It's hard to take risk if you're a small-business
owner, for example, if you're worried that the next attack is going to
come tomorrow. I understand that. But I also understand my most
important job, the most important job of any President today--and I
predict down the road--is to protect America.
And so I told the American people that we would find the terrorists
and bring them to justice, and that we needed to defeat them overseas so
we didn't have to face them here at home. I also understood that the war
on terror requires some clear doctrine. And one of the doctrines that I
laid out was, ``If you harbor a terrorist, you're equally as guilty as
the terrorist.'' And the first time that doctrine was really challenged
was in Afghanistan. I guess the Taliban didn't believe us--or me. And so
we acted. Twenty-five million people are now free, and Afghanistan is no
longer a safe haven for the terrorists.
And the other doctrine that's really important, and it's a change of
attitude--it's going to require a change of attitude for a while--is
that, when you see a threat, you got to deal with it before it hurts
you. Foreign policy used to be dictated by the fact we had two oceans
protecting us. If we saw a threat, you could deal with it if you needed
to, you think--or not. But we'd be safe.
My most important job is to protect you, is to protect the American
people. Therefore, when we see threats, given the lesson of September
the 11th, we got to deal with them. That does not mean militarily,
necessarily. Obviously, the first option for a President has got to be
the full use of diplomacy. That's what you're watching in Iran right
now. I see a threat in Iran. I see it there--I'm kind of getting off
subject here, not because I don't want to answer your question, but kind
of--I guess that's what happens in Washington, we get a little long-
winded. [Laughter]
But now that I'm on Iran, the threat to Iran, of course--
[laughter]--the threat from Iran is, of course, their stated objective
to destroy our strong ally, Israel. That's a threat, a serious threat.
It's a threat to world peace; it's a threat, in essence, to a strong
alliance. I made it clear and I'll be making it clear again, that we
will use military might to protect our ally, Israel, and--[applause].
At any rate, our objective is to solve this issue diplomatically.
And so our message must be a united message, a message from not only the
United States but also Great Britain and France and Germany as well as
Russia, hopefully, and China, in order to say, loud and clear, to the
Iranians, ``This is unacceptable behavior. Your desire to have a nuclear
weapon is unacceptable.''
And so to answer your question, I take a practical view of doing the
job you want me to do--which is, how do we defeat an enemy that still
wants to hurt us; and how do we deal with threats before they fully
materialize; what do we do to protect us from harm? That's my job. And
that job came home on September the 11th, for me--loud and clear. And I
think about my job of protecting you every day. Every single day of the
Presidency, I'm concerned about the safety of the American people.
Yes, sir.
Intelligence/War on Terror
Q. Mr. President, at the beginning of your talk today, you mentioned
that you understand why Americans have had their confidence shaken by
the events in Iraq. And I'd like to ask you about events that occurred 3
years ago that might also explain why confidence has been shaken. Before
we went to war in Iraq, we said there were three main reasons for going
to war in Iraq: weapons of mass destruction, the claim that Iraq was
sponsoring terrorists who had attacked us on 9/11, and that Iraq had
purchased nuclear materials from Niger. All three of those turned out to
be false. My question is, how do we restore confidence that Americans
may have in their leaders and to be sure that the information they are
getting now is correct?
The President. That's a great question. First, just--if I might
correct a misperception, I don't think we ever said--at least I know I
didn't say that there was a direct connection between September the 11th
and Saddam Hussein. We did say that he was a state sponsor of terror--by
the way, not declared a state sponsor of terror by me
[[Page 506]]
but declared by other administrations. We also did say that Zarqawi, the
man who is now wreaking havoc and killing innocent life, was in Iraq.
And so the ``state sponsor of terror'' was a declaration by a previous
administration. But I don't want to be argumentative, but I was very
careful never to say that Saddam Hussein ordered the attacks on America.
Like you, I asked that very same question, where did we go wrong on
intelligence? The truth of the matter is, the whole world thought that
Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. It wasn't just my
administration; it was the previous administration. It wasn't just the
previous administration. You might remember, sir, there was a Security
Council vote of 15 to nothing that said to Saddam Hussein, ``Disclose,
disarm, or face serious consequences.'' The basic premise was, ``You've
got weapons.'' That's what we thought.
When he didn't disclose and when he didn't disarm and when he
deceived inspectors, it sent a very disconcerting message to me, whose
job it is to protect the American people and to take threats before they
fully materialize. My view is, he was given the choice of whether or not
he would face reprisal. It was his decision to make. And so he chose to
not disclose, not disarm, as far as everybody was concerned.
Your question, however, the part that's really important is, how do
we regain credibility when it comes to intelligence? Obviously, the
Iranian issue is a classic case, where we've got to make sure that when
we speak, there's credibility. And so, in other words, when the United
States rallies a coalition--or any other country that had felt that
Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, is trying to rally a
coalition in dealing with one of these nontransparent societies, what do
we need to do to regain the trust of not only the American people but
the world community?
And so what I did was I called together the Silberman-Robb
Commission--Laurence Silberman and former Senator Chuck Robb--to take a
full look at what went right and what went wrong on the intelligence,
and how do we structure an intelligence network that makes sure there's
full debate among the analysts? How do we make sure that there's a full
compilation of data points that can help decisionmakers like myself feel
comfortable in the decision we make?
The war on terror requires the collection and analysis of good
intelligence. This is a different kind of war; we're dealing with an
enemy which hides in caves and plots and plans, an enemy which doesn't
move in flotillas or battalions. And so therefore, the intelligence
gathering is not only important to make a diplomatic case; it's really
important to be able to find an enemy before they hurt us.
And so there was a reform process they went through, a full analysis
of what--of how the operations worked, and out of that came the NDI,
John Negroponte and Mike Hayden. And their job is to better collate and
make sure that the intelligence gathering is seamless across a variety
of gatherers and people that analyze. But the credibility of our country
is essential--agree with you.
Yes, sure.
Spread of Democracy/U.S. Armed Forces
Q. Thank you, Mr. President. Welcome to Cleveland. It's an honor to
have you here. I represent the Cleveland Hungarian Revolution 50th
Anniversary--[inaudible].
The President. That's good. I was there, by the way.
Q. Thank you all. [Laughter]
The President. At least for the celebration in Capitol with Tom
Lantos. But go ahead.
Q. Mr. President, in the interest of free speech, if you'll indulge
me, I have to give you a little context of my question. On this third
anniversary of your--I consider--courageous initiative to bring freedom
and basic human dignity to the Iraqi people, the image of the statue of
the tyrant Saddam falling in Baghdad was very reminiscent of another
statue, another tyrant, Josef Stalin, who fell in Budapest 50 years ago
at the hands of many young Hungarian freedom fighters who were seeking
to overthrow the tyranny of Soviet communism. Mr. President, just like
our brave fighting men and women today and many Iraqi people, those
young Hungarian patriots paid a very heavy price for a few days of
freedom. But they lit the torch that eventually set the captive nations
on the
[[Page 507]]
path to achieving liberty. And so, Mr. President, our Cleveland
Hungarian community is planning a major event in Cleveland in October--
[laughter].
The President. The guy seized the moment, you know. He's a----
Q. Right.
The President. I'm not sure what I'm doing in October. Put me down
as a maybe. [Laughter] Sorry to interrupt.
Q. Just like you came for the Children's Games in 2004, we hope to
have you here for that as well. Mr. President, just want to let you
know, to win the war on terror, we feel that what was started in 1776
and continued in 1956 must be remembered in 2006.
The President. Thank you. How much more you got?
Q. I'm at the question now. Thanks for your indulgence.
The President. Okay, good. [Laughter]
Q. My basic question is, how can we help you, from the grassroots
level, how can we help you promote the cause of freedom and liberty for
all peoples throughout the world?
The President. I appreciate that. My main job is to make sure I make
the case as plainly as I can why it's worth it. And I fully understand--
I understand people being disheartened when they turn on their TV screen
and see the loss of innocent life. We're compassionate people. Nobody
likes beheadings and it--nobody--when innocent children get car bombed.
So it's my job, sir, to make it clear about the connection between Iraq
and the war on terror. It's my job to remind people that progress is
being made, in spite of the violence they see. It's my job to make it
clear to the people the stakes.
I've spent time talking about what happens if we were to lose our
nerve and Iraq would fall to Al Qaida. And the stakes are high. Look, I
understand some don't view that we're in a war against the terrorists. I
know that. And therefore, there's a sense that this--9/11 might have
been an isolated incident. I just don't agree. And here's what I--here's
the basis from which I make decisions. You heard one--is that 9/11
affected the way I think. I know these are like totalitarian fascists:
They have an ideology; they have a desire to spread that ideology; and
they're willing to use tactics to achieve their strategy.
And one of the tactics, I said early on in the speech--the stated
objectives of Al Qaida. This isn't my imagination of their strategy;
this is what they have told us. And I presume you want the Commander in
Chief to take the words of the enemy seriously. And they have told us
they believe that we're soft and that with time, we'll leave, and
they'll fill the vacuum. And they want to plan and plot and hurt
Americans. That's what they have said. And I think it's really important
we take their words very seriously.
And so I will continue making the case, sir, but the best way you
can help is to support our troops. You find a family who's got a child
in the United States military; tell them you appreciate them. Ask them
if you can help them. You see somebody wearing a uniform, you walk up
and say, ``Thanks for serving the country.''
Ours is a remarkable country where hundreds--[applause]--where we've
got thousands of people signing up, volunteering for the United States
military, many of them after September the 11th, knowing full well what
they were signing up for. And what's amazing about our military is that
retention rates are high; people are still signing up. They want to
defend the country. And for that, I am grateful.
But my job, sir, is to lay out the strategy and to connect the
notion of liberty with peace. And that's hard for some. Sometimes
there's a little bit of a--kind of a point of view that says, ``Well,
maybe certain people can't be free; maybe certain people can't self-
govern.'' I strongly believe that liberty is universal. I believe in the
natural rights of men and women. That was part of our founding. And if
you believe in that, if you believe in the universality of freedom, then
I believe those of us who are free have an obligation to help others
become free.
Yes, ma'am. I'm tied up in October, but you know--[laughter].
Iraq/Spread of Democracy
Q. I'm a Marine mom.
The President. Okay, good. Thank you. Tell your--[applause].
Q. My son signed up after 9/11, and I didn't raise a terrorist. But
let's face it; there's a continuum and a lack of clarity about who's
[[Page 508]]
violent and who's a terrorist. And we really do want to use the word
``enemy'' in a meaningful way. I think your speech has been very brave
and very important and very clarifying. And in the interest of
clarifying the purpose of our country to fight preventive war, which we
know does involve violence, it's very important for us to understand
what you're saying about your model community in Iraq. And my question
is that you are killing the bad guys, and that's very important--that's
the entire story of the battle. And we want to know who the bad guys
are. Do you feel that Iraq is like a honeycomb, and that we can draw the
Al Qaida there so we can stand and fight them there? I'm really asking
for clarification.
The President. Sure. I think in Iraq there are three types of folks
that are trying to stop democracy. First of all, I think it's very
important for people to understand, one reason they're so violent and
desperate is because they're trying to stop a society based upon
liberty. And you got to ask why. And the reason why is because it's the
exact opposite of what they believe.
There are three types. One is Al Qaida, and Al Qaida is headed into
there. Al Qaida understands the danger of democracy spreading. And so
Zarqawi, this fellow named Zarqawi, is in charge of Al Qaida inside of
Iraq, which recruits foreign fighters. And they headed into Iraq because
they wanted to fight us. They wanted to stop democracy.
Secondly, there are Saddamists. These were the folks that really
enjoyed a life of privilege. These are people that were top of the heap.
They were--they represented a minority in the country, but they got all
the deal--they got all the goods. And they don't like it--when Saddam
was removed. And so they are trying to regroup.
And the third group are rejectionists. These are essentially Sunnis
as well, who really weren't sure as--about whether or not it meant--what
it meant to have minority rights, whether or not they'd be protected.
You can understand. They didn't--during Saddam, there was no such thing
as minority rights. And so as a new society emerged, they were doubtful.
And it is those folks that I believe will become marginalized as
democracy advances. We're seeing the Sunnis change their mind about
things. They barely voted in the first January 2005 elections; they
participated overwhelmingly in the December 2005 elections. In just an
11-month period of time, there was a change of attitude to participate
in the democratic process.
And the fundamental question that I know people ask is whether or
not democracy, one, can take hold in Iraq, and two, will it change
people's attitude about the future? And I believe it will. History has
proven that democracies can change societies. The classic case I like to
cite is Japan. Prime Minister Koizumi is one of my best buddies in the
international arena, and when we sit down, we talk the peace. I find it
interesting that he is a peacemaker with me on a variety of issues, and
yet my dad fought the Japanese. And I'm sure many of your relatives did
as well.
Sixty years ago, Japan was the sworn enemy of the United States.
Today, they're an ally in peace. And what took place? Well, what took
place was a Japanese-style democracy. I can't say I promise you this,
but I suspect that if somebody were standing up at the City Club of
Cleveland talking about, ``Don't worry; someday, Japan is going to be
peaceful with the United States, and the 43d President is going to be
designing how keep the peace''--they'd say, ``Get him off the stage.''
[Laughter] ``What's he thinking? They're the sworn enemy.'' And now
they're our ally. So I have faith in the capacity of democracies to help
change societies.
And again, I repeat to you, the debate--one of the debates is
whether or not certain folks can self-govern. There's kind of a--``Maybe
there are some in the world that aren't capable,'' say the skeptics. I
strongly disagree with that. I believe there's--hold on a second--I
believe there's a great desire for people to be free. I believe that.
And history has proven that democracies don't war with each other.
Again, I kind of glossed over this, but particularly for the students
here, look at what happened in Europe over a 100-year period, from the
early 1900s to today. Europe was at war twice, that cost Americans
thousands of lives. Today, they don't war, because the systems of
government changed. Democracies are at peace. Europe is whole, free, and
at peace.
[[Page 509]]
And that's an important history lesson for those of us--what I'm
saying to you, ma'am, is that there is a battle for Iraq now, but it's
just a part of the war on terror. It's a theater in the war on terror.
Afghanistan was a theater. And we're in a global battle which requires
strong alliances, good cooperation, and a constant reminder of the
nature of this war. So today I met with the Secretary General of NATO.
And the first subject that came up was the war on terror and how much I
appreciated NATO's contribution to helping Afghanistan succeed. But it
is--the enemy in this case is disgruntled folks inside of Iraq coupled
with an Al Qaida presence there that wants to harm Americans again.
I don't know--is your son still in the military?
Q. Yes, sir.
The President. Thanks. You tell him the Commander in Chief is proud
of him. You tell him to listen to his mother too.
Yes. First, and then second; sir, you're next.
National Economy/Education
Q. On behalf of the students here from various high school student
leadership programs, we thank you for speaking with us here at the City
Club of Cleveland.
The President. Thanks--I hope it's a convenient excuse to skip
school, but--[laughter].
Q. Mr. President, with the war in Iraq costing $19,600 per U.S.
household, how do you expect a generation of young people such as
ourselves to afford college at a time like this, when we're paying for a
war in Iraq?
The President. Yes. [Applause] Well--hold on for a minute. Hold on.
We can do more than one thing at one time. And when you grow your
economy, like we're growing our economy, there is an opportunity to not
only protect ourselves but also to provide more Pell grants than any
administration in our Nation's history and increase the student loan
program. So if you take a look, I think you'll find that we're robust in
helping--at the Federal level, helping people go to college. And it's
essential you go to college. It's essential that there be a group of
youngsters coming up that are well-educated so that we can maintain our
economic leadership position in the world. We've got a robust program to
do just that.
But it's also essential that we keep policies in place that keep the
economy growing. This economy of ours is strong, and it's--it is, in my
judgment, growing stronger. But it is possible to put policy in place
that would weaken it, such as raising taxes. I think we got to keep
taxes low to keep the economy moving. It's possible to put policy--
[applause]--it's possible to put policy in place that would hurt this
economy, like protectionist policy. It's possible to--if we keep suing
our people trying to risk capital, it's conceivable, we won't be the
leader. That's why we need good tort reform. We got to make sure that--
[applause].
My point to you is, economic growth enables us to do more than one
thing. And that's what we'll continue to do.
Yes, sir. Right. No, no, hold on for a minute. Hold on for a minute.
India/Pakistan
Q. Thank you, Mr. President.
The President. Yes, sir.
Q. Every chief needs Indian on their side. [Laughter]
The President. How long were you working on that for? [Laughter]
Q. I applaud your vision and foresight to sign a long-term treaty
with India. But, sir, I am confused that, on one side, you're helping
democratic countries to flourish and establish democracy in the world
market, whereas how do we deal with country who has known to harbor
terrorism, like Pakistan?
The President. I thought you might be heading there. [Laughter] I,
obviously, had a trip recently to India and Pakistan and Afghanistan and
was able to say in India and in Pakistan both, ``It is a positive
development for America to be a friend of Pakistan. It's a positive
development for India for America to be a friend of Pakistan, and it's a
positive development for Pakistan for America to be a friend of India.
It's an important accomplishment in order to help keep the peace.''
I don't view our relationships with Pakistan and India as a zero-sum
relationship. As a matter of fact, I view our relationships with
[[Page 510]]
both countries as different sets of issues and the need to nurture both
relationships to achieve common objectives. And we're in a position to
be able to do so now.
President Musharraf is a friend to the United States. President
Musharraf understands that he must help rout out Al Qaida, which is
hiding in parts of his country. President Musharraf was reminded of that
the four times Al Qaida tried to kill him. He is a--and so I was able to
have a very good discussion with the President about our mutual concerns
in the war on terror. And it's important that that dialog go on. It's a
very important part of our--me doing my most important job, which is to
protect you.
He also said in a press conference that he understands that
democracy is important. So one of the conversations that I had with him
in private--I feel comfortable saying this in public because he himself
brought it up--was the need for democracy to advance in Pakistan.
History has showed us that democracies don't war.
What's interesting about the relationship between Pakistan and
India--and I'll get to India in a minute. I want to say something on
India, so thanks for bringing it up--is that when we first--when I first
got into office, I remember asking Colin Powell to go get in between
India and Pakistan. There was a lot of noise--you might remember, I
think it was '01 or '02, where there was deep concerns about--I think
'01--deep concerns about a potential nuclear conflict. And so there was
shuttle diplomacy, back and forth between India and Pakistan, including
not only our--Colin but also Jack Straw, the Foreign Minister of Great
Britain. And you never know how dangerous one of these situations can
become until it's too late, but nevertheless, we took it very seriously.
And today, you don't see the need for the United States shuffling or
Britain shuffling diplomats back and forth, to walk back--walk the two
countries back from a potential conflict which would be incredibly
damaging for the world. That's positive. In other words, it's--and I
give Prime Minister--President Musharraf credit, and I give the Indian
Prime Ministers--both Vajpayee and the current Prime Minister--credit
for--Prime Minister Singh--for envisioning what is possible, how is it
possible to develop a relationship that's a peaceful relationship with
our neighbor.
And, sir, I think it's very important for the United States to stay
engaged with Pakistan and encourage them. We're trying to negotiate an
investment treaty with them, with the hopes of being able to eventually
develop more trade with Pakistan, in the belief that trade helps nations
develop stability and prosperity is achieved through trade.
India--the visit there was a very important visit. And I want to
describe to you right quick, so be careful on the questions. You're
going to have to--you'll leave your hand up for a while. I agreed with
the Indian Government that India ought to be encouraged to develop a
nuclear power industry. And that's a controversial decision on my part,
because it basically flies in the face of old cold war attitudes as well
as arm control thinking.
Let me just share the logic with you. First of all, in that we live
in a global economy, there is a demand for fossil fuels--an increase in
the demand for fossil fuels in one part of the world affects the price
of gasoline in our world. We're connected. Whether people like it or
not, there is an interconnectedness today that affects our economy.
Somebody's decision overseas affects whether or not people are going to
be able to work here in America. So I think it makes sense for the
United States, as we ourselves become less addicted to oil and fossil
fuels, which I'm serious about, encourage others to do so as well. And
one good way to do so and to protect the environment at the same time is
to encourage the use of safe nuclear power. It's in our interests, our
economic interests that we work an agreement with India to encourage
their expansion of civilian nuclear power.
Secondly, unlike Iran, for example, India is willing to join the
IAEA. They want to be a part of the global agreements around nuclear
power. Thirdly, India has got a record a nonproliferation. They've had
30 years of not proliferating. Fourthly, India is a democracy and a
transparent society. You find out a lot about India because there's a
free press. There is openness. People run for office and are held to
account. There's committee hearings. It's an open process.
[[Page 511]]
I feel very comfortable recommending to the United States Congress
that it's--that they ought to agree with the agreement that Prime
Minister Singh and I have reached. It's important--it's important--it's
also an important relationship. For too long, America and India were not
partners in peace. We didn't deal with each other because of the cold
war. And now is the time to set the cold war behind us. It's over,
folks. It no longer is. And let's think about the next 30 years.
And so my hope is someday, somebody will be asking a question,
``Aren't you glad old George W. thought about entering into a strategic
relationship with India?'' And I believe it's in our country's interest
that we have such a relationship and, at the same time, maintain close
relations with Pakistan. And it's possible to do so. And we are doing
so.
Yes, sir.
How long do you usually ask questions here for? [Laughter]
Terrorist Surveillance Program
Q. Mr. President----
The President. The guy is supposed to smile over there. Yes.
Q. Another theater in the war on terror is domestic. And there's a
controversy around warrantless wiretaps domestically.
The President. Yes.
Q. Could you explain why living within the legislation that allowed
your administration to get a warrant from a secret court within 72 hours
after putting in a wiretap wouldn't be just as effective?
The President. No, I appreciate the question. He's talking about the
terrorist surveillance program that was--created quite a kerfuffle in
the press, and I owe an explanation to you. Because our people--first of
all, after September the 11th, I spoke to a variety of folks on the
frontline of protecting us, and I said, ``Is there anything more we
could be doing, given the current laws?'' And General Mike Hayden of the
NSA said, ``There is.'' The FISA law--he's referring to the FISA law, I
believe--is--was designed for a previous period and is slow and
cumbersome in being able to do what Mike Hayden thinks is necessarily--
called hot pursuit.
And so he designed a program that will enable us to listen from a
known Al Qaida or suspected Al Qaida person and/or affiliate, from
making any phone call outside the United States in, or inside the United
States out--with the idea of being able to pick up, quickly, information
for which to be able to respond in this environment that we're in. I was
concerned about the legality of the program, and so I asked lawyers--
which you got plenty of them in Washington--[laughter]--to determine
whether or not I could do this legally. And they came back and said yes.
That's part of the debate which you're beginning to see.
I fully understood that Congress needed to be briefed. And so I had
Hayden and others brief Members of the Congress, both Republicans and
Democrats, House Members and Senators, about the program. The program is
under constant review. I sign a reauthorization every--I'm not exactly
sure--45 days, say. It's something like that. In other words, it's
constantly being reviewed. There's an IG that is very active at the NSA
to make sure that the program stays within the bounds that it was
designed.
I fully understand people's concerns about it, but ours is a town,
by the way, in Washington, where when you don't connect the dots, you're
held up to Congress, and when you do connect the dots, you're held up to
Congress. I believe what I'm doing is constitutional, and I know it's
necessary. And so we're going to keep doing it.
Domestic Policy
Q. Thank you, Mr. President. Your comments today about Iraq have
been, for me, very enlightening. And I greatly appreciate the level of
clarity that you've provided. But my question is about domestic policy.
Today, in our neighborhoods, there are terrorists. Children cannot play
in some of our neighborhoods. Today, we've got--when you see post-
Katrina, our country was startled at some of the images around poverty
in some of our cities. Can you be as clear about your domestic policy,
to address those kinds of things?
The President. Absolutely. Thanks. Let me start with education,
which I view as a vital part of providing hope and eradicating poverty.
I was disturbed, when I was the Governor of Texas, disturbed about a
system
[[Page 512]]
that just moved kids through. There was kind of a process-oriented
world, that said, ``Okay, if you're 10, you're supposed to be here;
you're 12, you're supposed to be here,'' and on through. It was like--
without any sense of accountability. If you believe education is one of
the cornerstones to a hopeful world, then it seems like to me, it makes
sense that we've got to have a system that measures so we know whether
or not people are getting educated.
So when I got to Washington, I proposed what's called No Child Left
Behind, which passed with both Republican and Democrat votes. And the
whole spirit of No Child Left Behind is this: It says in return for
increased Federal money, for particularly Title I students, we expect
you to measure grades three through eight. We want to see strong
accountability because we believe every child can learn, and we expect
every school to teach. That's the whole spirit of the No Child Left
Behind Act.
If you--it turns out that if you can solve problems early, if you
can find out whether or not a curriculum is working or not early on in a
child's career, we can correct the problems. And so part of the No Child
Left Behind Act is, when you measure and find somebody not up to--
measuring to par, not meeting standards, there's extra money called
special service money available in the No Child Left Behind Act to make
sure that there's early tutoring, to make sure that children are not
just simply shuffled through, to make sure an accountability system is
used properly--which is to diagnose and solve problems.
The No Child Left Behind Act is beginning to work. You know why?
Because we measure. There was an achievement gap in America; that's bad
for the country. It's an achievement gap between the difference between
some Anglo children and some African American children, particularly
inner city. That's beginning to close.
We need to apply the same rigor of No Child Left Behind,
particularly in middle [school] * age, for math and science, to make
sure that we're able to compete for the jobs of the 21st century.
* White House correction.
And so step one, in my judgment, to address exactly what you
described as true--kind of this enlightenment that, uh-oh, there are
parts of our society in which people are, in fact, being completely left
behind--is to make sure the education system is rigorously based upon
accountability. And when we find the status quo is unacceptable, have
the political courage to change, demand high standards and change.
And the cornerstone of demanding change in a system that tends to
protect itself is measurement. And I realize there are people in my
party who want to undo No Child Left Behind. And I'm sure there are in
the other party. But my judgment is, you can't achieve educational
excellence unless you measure and correct problems.
Now, there's another aspect to providing a hopeful society, and that
is to encourage ownership. One of the interesting things about Katrina,
as you well know, is many of the people displaced did not own their own
homes, that they were renters. One of the goals that I set for my
administration through a variety of pretty simple programs--like helping
with downpayment and education programs, recognizing that interest rates
drive most of the housing purchases--was to encourage minority
homeownership. It's now at an alltime high.
I believe that the idea of empowering our faith-based institutions--
Government can help, but Government sometimes can't find--well, it just
doesn't pass--it's just not a loving organization. And so I believe
strongly--I believe strongly in empowering faith-based and community-
based programs all throughout America to help achieve certain
objectives. Mentoring, for example, mentoring of children in prisoners--
whose mother or dad may be in prison is an initiative I started. Drug
rehabilitation, giving those who are eligible for drug money a voucher,
money themselves, a scrip so they can redeem it at a program that they
choose, not that the Government assigns them to--in other words, there's
a variety of social service programs aimed at lifting people up.
And so I--look, many Americans kind of were--didn't really realize
what's taking place in parts of the country that you've described. And
Katrina was a wake-up call for
[[Page 513]]
many Americans. And now there's an opportunity, in my judgment, to
take--well, for people to take notice and put in policy--put policies in
place that help those who need help, like community health centers, or--
for health care--or expand educational opportunities through rigorous
accountability systems, and, I repeat, demanding change where change is
due--needed, and promoting ownership.
Thanks. Good question.
Support for the President
Q. ----is no shrinking violet. First of all, I want to commend you
on your presentation today. And I tell you I'm 100 percent behind your
fight against terrorism. Also----
The President. Why don't you just leave it at that?
Q. Oh, no. Oh, no. [Laughter]
I tell you, one of the reasons I'm qualified to say that; you
probably heard of Ernie Shavers, the boxer. I trained Ernie Shavers. He
fought Muhammad Ali, and Muhammad Ali say he hit him so hard, he woke up
his ancestors in Africa. [Laughter] So I know a little bit about boxing
and things. But I know in boxing--and I taught over 3,300 children over
13 years. Two of them fought for world championships, including Ernie
Shavers. I taught them that the best defense is a good offense. That's
what you're doing over there now. And I commend you.
My mom and daddy had moved from Alabama to Ohio in the mid-40s. They
were the parents of five sons. We all served in the military. I served 8
years, and we all served honorably. So I am a marine. I've also been a
Boy Scout and a firefighter. To lead in, the young person spoke about
domestic policy. This Wednesday coming, I'll be making my sixth trip to
the New Orleans/Mississippi area as a contractor. I'm president of the
Ohio Minority Contracting Association. I want to publicly thank Senator
Voinovich right now for directing me to Senator Trent Lott, who has
directed me to Haley Barbour, the Governor down there, who opened up
opportunities.
We got people doing debris removal, putting on roofs. And I got a
$600,000 proposal to feed 22,000 workers down there who have been
underfed. You've been down there. I have too. People are working 14 and
16 hours a day. And I've never been so proud to be an American, to see
the outpouring of people out there helping one another, particularly the
faith-based community. So I thank you, appreciate you, and look forward
to putting this proposal in your hand. Thank you.
The President. Well, let's see, I got an invitation and a proposal.
[Laughter]
Yes, sir. Anybody work here in this town? [Laughter]
Q. Sorry about that. Mr. President, I just finished Ambassador Paul
Bremer's book, and one of the things I just wanted to say to you and to
Ambassador Bremer is, thank you for protecting us.
The President. Thanks.
You're next.
Immigration
Q. Okay, my question is----
The President. We have dueling microphones here. Keep firing away.
Q. Okay. My question is, since 9/11, one of the key things that we
need is immigration reform, including comprehensive immigration reform
that is right now in front of Senator Specter's committee in the
Judiciary. There are two principles I'm hoping that you would support:
One, the good people, the engineers, the Ph.D.s, the doctors, the
nurses, the people in the system who have followed the rules, will go to
the head of the line in any form of immigration reform. That's title IV
of the bill.
Secondly, the illegals who have not followed the rules--I understand
the debate, I appreciate your statements about immigration reform, but
isn't it better that we know who they are, have them finger-printed and
photographed, and allow some form of 245(i) to come back so----
The President. Tell people what that is. Tell people what 245(i) is.
Q. Okay--245(i) is a partial amnesty program that expired back in
2001, in fact, was going to be voted on on 9/11, unfortunately. But
those--it was a small segment of the illegal population where they would
pay the $1,000 fine and, for example, coming in illegally, then marrying
an American citizen, could somehow legalize their status.
[[Page 514]]
The President. Okay. Let me give you some broad principles on
immigration reform as I see them. First of all, we do need to know who's
coming into our country and whether they're coming in illegally or not
legally--legally or not legally--and whether they're coming in or going
out. And part of reforms after September the 11th was a better system of
finding out who's coming here.
Secondly, we have a big border between Texas and Mexico that's
really hard to enforce. We got to do everything we can to enforce the
border, particularly in the South. I mean, it's the place where people
are pouring across in order to find work. We have a situation in our own
neighborhood where there are ways--disparities are huge, and there are
jobs in America that people won't do. That's just a fact. I met an onion
grower today at the airport when I arrived, and he said, ``You got to
help me find people that will pull onions,'' or pluck them or whatever
you do with them, you know. [Laughter] There are jobs that just simply
aren't getting done because Americans won't do them. And yet, if you're
making 50 cents an hour in Mexico, and you can make a lot more in
America, and you got mouths to feed, you're going to come and try to
find the work. It's a big border, of which--across which people are
coming to provide a living for their families.
Step one of any immigration policy is to enforce our border in
practical ways. We are spending additional resources to be able to use
different detection devices, unmanned UAVs, to help--and expand Border
Patrol, by the way, expand the number of agents on the border, to make
sure we're getting them the tools necessary to stop people from coming
across in the first place.
Secondly, part of the issue we've had in the past is, we've had--for
lack of a better word, catch-and-release. The Border Patrol would find
people sneaking in; they would then hold them for a period of time;
they'd say, ``Come back and check in with us 45 days later,'' and then
they wouldn't check in 45 days later. And they would disappear in
society to do the work that some Americans will not do.
And so we're changing catch-and-release. We're particularly focusing
on those from Central America who are coming across Mexico's southern
border, ending up in our own--it's a long answer, because it's an
important question: How do we protect our borders and, at the same time,
be a humane society?
Anyway, step one, focus on enforcing border; when we find people,
send them home, so that the work of our Border Patrol is productive
work.
Secondly, it seems like to me that part of having a border security
program is to say to people who are hiring people here illegally, we're
going to hold you to account. The problem is, our employers don't know
whether they're hiring people illegally because there's a whole forgery
industry around people being smuggled into the United States. There's a
smuggling industry and a forgering industry. And it's hard to ask our
employers, the onion guy out there, whether or not he's got--whether or
not the documents that he's being shown which look real are real.
And so here's a better proposal than what we're doing today, which
is to say, if you're going to come to do a job that an American won't
do, you ought to be given a fool-proof card that says you can come for a
limited period of time and do work in a job an American won't do. That's
border security, because it means that people will be willing to come in
legally with a card to do work on a limited basis and then go home. And
so the agents won't be chasing people being smuggled in 18-wheelers or
across the Arizona desert. They'll be able to focus on drugs and
terrorists and guns.
The fundamental question that he is referring to is, what do we do
about--there's two questions--one, should we have amnesty? And the
answer, in my judgment, is, no; we shouldn't have amnesty. In my
judgment, granting amnesty, automatic citizenship--that's what amnesty
means--would cause another 11 million people, or however many are here,
to come in the hopes of becoming a United States citizen. We shouldn't
have amnesty. We ought to have a program that says, you get in line like
everybody else gets in line; and that if the Congress feels like there
needs to be higher quotas on certain nationalities, raise the quotas.
But don't let
[[Page 515]]
people get in front of the line for somebody who has been playing by the
rules.
And so--anyway, that's my ideas on good immigration policy.
Obviously, there's going to be some questions we have to answer: What
about the person who's been here since 1987--'86 was the last attempt at
coming up with immigration reform--been here for a long period of time?
They've raised a family here. And my only advice for the Congress and
for people in the debate is, understand what made America. We're a land
of immigrants. This guy is from Hungary, you know. And we got to treat
people fairly. We've got to have a system of law that is respectful for
people.
I mean, the idea of having a program that causes people to get stuck
in the back of 18-wheelers, to risk their lives to sneak into America to
do work that some people won't do, is just not American, in my judgment.
And so I would hope the debate would be civil and uphold the honor of
this country. And remember, we've been through these periods before,
where the immigration debate can get harsh. And it should not be harsh.
And I hope--my call for people is to be rational about the debate and
thoughtful about what words can mean during this debate.
Final question, sir. You're paying me a lot of money, and I got to
go back to work. [Laughter]
Iran
Q. My name is Jose Feliciano.
The President. No.
Q. Yes, it is. [Laughter]
The President. Yes--it's like the time I called a guy and said,
``Hey, this is George Bush calling.'' He said, ``Come on, quit kidding
me, man.'' [Laughter] Que Jose? Que quiere decir?
Q. [Inaudible]. [Laughter]
The President. That's right.
Q. And, actually, I'm chairman of the Hispanic Roundtable--I was
going to ask you that same question. However, I'm going to ask you a
simple one now, and this relates to preemptive self-defense. How is it,
Mr. President, that Iran today is really different from what Iraq was 3
years ago?
The President. Well, first of all, there were 16 Security Council
resolutions. The world had spoken with a clear voice not one time; I
think 16--is that right, Stretch [Richard Keil, Bloomberg News], 16? I'm
asking a member of the press corps. I like to, like, reverse roles
sometimes--[laughter]. Really checking to see if they're paying
attention, you know. [Laughter] Halfway through, they kind of start
dozing off. [Laughter]
But the world had spoken by a lot against Saddam Hussein. There was
a diplomatic process. You might remember that the Congress, I think in
'98, voted a resolution that there should be regime change. My
predecessor looked at the same intelligence I looked at and saw a
threat. But the difference--one difference was that in Iraq, there was a
series of unanimous resolutions that basically held the Iraqi Government
to account, which Saddam Hussein ignored. It was, like, resolution after
resolution after resolution.
The Iranian issue is just beginning to play out. And my hope, of
course, is, as I said earlier, that we're able to solve this issue
diplomatically. It's very important that the United States work with our
allies--in this case, the lead group of negotiators has been Germany,
France, and Great Britain--so that the Iranians hear a unified voice.
Now, the voice sometimes--I mean, if you're one--you're negotiators,
probably got some lawyers here who are good negotiators--it's easier to
negotiate one person versus six. I'm not suggesting you're a lawyer, you
know, but I kind of had the feeling you might have been. [Laughter]
And so it's very important for us to continue to make sure that they
hear one voice. Nontransparent societies have got an advantage over
those of us who are transparent, where every move is in the press, every
opinion is aired out. And so it's very important for us to work to make
sure that they hear the one voice. Now, you might have read in the
newspapers where our Ambassador in Iraq, Zal, has reached out to the
Iranians to make it clear to them about our concerns about involvement
in Iraq--Iranian involvement in Iraq. It's very important, however
[[Page 516]]
for the Iranians to understand that the discussion is limited to Iraq.
We feel like they need to know our position.
Ultimately, Iraq-Iranian relations will be negotiated between the
Iraqi Government and the Iranian Government. Ours is just--we're using
this as an opportunity to make it clear about our concerns of
interference within a process that is--a democratic process that is
evolving. Our position is still very clearly that the Iraqis--Iranians
should not have a program to build a nuclear weapon, and/or the
capacity, the knowledge necessary to build something which could lead to
a nuclear weapon. And we're working closely with or allies and friends
to continue to make that clear to them.
So the issues are different. The issues are different stages of
diplomacy.
Listen, I've enjoyed this. I hope you have as well. God bless.
Note: The President spoke at 12:25 p.m. at the Renaissance Cleveland
Hotel. In his remarks, he referred to Sanjiv K. Kapur, president, City
Club of Cleveland; Mayor Frank G. Jackson of Cleveland, OH; senior Al
Qaida associate Abu Musab Al Zarqawi; former President Saddam Hussein of
Iraq; Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi of Japan; Secretary General Jakob
Gijsbert ``Jaap'' de Hoop Scheffer of the North Atlantic Treaty
Organization; President Pervez Musharraf of Pakistan; former Secretary
of State Colin L. Powell; and former Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee
and Prime Minister Manmohan Singh of India. The Office of the Press
Secretary also released a Spanish language transcript of these remarks.