[Weekly Compilation of Presidential Documents Volume 40, Number 23 (Monday, June 7, 2004)]
[Pages 996-999]
[Online from the Government Publishing Office, www.gpo.gov]

<R04>
Interview With RAI Television

June 1, 2004

Europe-U.S. Relations

    Q. Mr. President, it will be in a few days the anniversary of the D-
day. Italy and Europe are grateful to the United States for the 
liberation from fascism and the nazism. But today, Europe and America 
are still divided about Iraq. When you go in Europe, there will 
certainly be some demonstration against you. What is the responsibility 
of this situation?
    The President. Yes, look, first of all, we share the same values--we 
being America and Europe. And one of the values we share is the freedom 
for people to express themselves. So I have no problem with people 
saying, ``I disagree.'' Matter of fact, I think it's a healthy sign, and 
I think it's positive.
    Secondly, there are--there is common agreement that Iraq must be 
free and peaceful. We had disagreements about the decision to enforce 
the U.N. Security Council resolution, but there's common agreement in 
Europe with America that it's in the world's interest that Iraq be free 
and peaceful. Today I just talked to the new Prime Minister and had a 
very good conversation with him. And he said, ``Thank you for giving us 
a chance, and thank you for standing with us.'' And when he said thank 
you, he wasn't talking just to me. He was talking to the Italian people 
and the American people and the Brits and all the people in our 
coalition that are now helping in Iraq.
    So I'm very upbeat and very--as I head over to honor what happened 
60 years ago, I think we're now seeing unity to work toward common good 
today. And I'm looking forward to it.

Proposed U.N. Security Council Resolution/Situation in Iraq

    Q. Yes, but some Europeans blame you for having kept them out of the 
decision to go to the war in Iraq.
    The President. Yes.
    Q. Do you think this is the real reason for present difficulties?
    The President. Well, first of all, I don't see many difficulties. 
You mean in Iraq?
    Q. In Iraq.
    The President. Oh, in Iraq.
    Q. And at the U.N. as well.
    The President. Well, I think you'll see----
    Q. The ground and the----
    The President. Yes. No, I think you'll see in the U.N. there's going 
to be common agreement. I think we'll get a new Security Council 
resolution. Remember, 1441--at the Security Council, we voted 
unanimously to

[[Page 997]]

say to Saddam Hussein, ``Disarm, or face serious consequences.'' Then it 
became clear he didn't disarm and didn't disclose, and so we had a 
debate about the definition of serious consequences.
    My attitude is, when you say something, you better do it. In other 
words, the world said, ``Serious consequences, Mr. Hussein.'' And had 
there not been serious consequences, I think he would have been 
extremely dangerous, and the United Nations would have been viewed as 
very weak.
    And so, the United States, along with a lot of other nations, agreed 
that we must enforce serious consequences. But everybody had a chance to 
participate. Everybody had a chance, particularly on the Security 
Council, to say yes or no. But that is now behind us, and that's what is 
important for the people of your great country to understand. There is a 
better day ahead.
    Now, in terms of Iraq, it's tough. And the reason it's tough is 
because there are killers in that country who want to stop the march to 
freedom. The worst thing they fear is free elections, but they're not 
going to stop us. That's what you've got to understand. We are not going 
to be intimidated by killers in Iraq or anywhere else, for that matter.
    Q. Some have said that you never admit to any shortcomings, much 
less failures. Looking back at the past year, do you have anything to 
reproach yourself regarding what has gone wrong? Did you make any 
mistakes?
    The President. Listen, any time you go to war, circumstances change. 
And the fundamental question is, were we flexible enough to change with 
the circumstances? And we have been. Could we--this is all hypothetical, 
when you think about it. We are changing a country from tyranny to 
freedom, a country where people were brutalized, tortured, raped, 
killed, maimed, to a country which is going to govern itself. And it has 
been hard work.
    A lot of things didn't happen that we thought might happen, the oil 
production, for example. We thought that would be blown up, and it would 
cost the Iraqi citizens a lot of money. It wasn't. We thought that 
people would go hungry or there would be mass refugees, neither of which 
happened.
    What did happen is, is that we moved too quickly. Our troops stormed 
through to Baghdad, and then it caused--it enabled some of the Saddam 
loyalists, some of them, to disperse. In other words, they didn't stay 
and fight. They ran off. They regrouped and came back to fight. And I--
and our troops were given the flexibility on the ground to deal with 
that. Now, I wish the Iraqi people had overwhelmingly said, ``Thank you 
for coming.'' I think they will. But some didn't. Some said, ``Let's 
fight them.''

Iraqi Interim Government

    Q. But don't you think that now this new government could been seen 
as a puppet government because there are a lot of elements close to 
America--America gives them money?
    The President. Well, we--look, you're talking about the current 
Prime Minister.
    Q. Yes.
    The President. And you bet we supported a group that he headed. We 
didn't support him. We supported his group. You know why? Because he 
wanted to get rid of Saddam Hussein, and the reason why he did is not 
because of America. He wanted to get rid of Saddam Hussein because 
Saddam Hussein killed and tortured his fellow citizens. You remember 
what Saddam Hussein is like. He was a tyrant. He was brutal. He had 
torture rooms. There was mass graves we discovered. I had the other day 
in the Oval Office seven men whose hands had been cut off by Saddam 
Hussein.
    Q. We have shown this picture.
    The President. Have you? Good.
    Q. Yes, we have.
    The President. A very touching moment.
    Q. Are you happy with this new government in Iraq?
    The President. I am happy that Mr. Brahimi did what he said he would 
do. The government was picked by the United Nations. Mr. Brahimi went 
under very difficult circumstances and consulted with a lot of people 
and came up with what appears to be a very diverse government.
    Now, I have just spoken to the Prime Minister and the new President. 
And I told them two things: One, thank you for taking on a

[[Page 998]]

very difficult assignment, thank you for leading; and two, America and 
our coalition will help you succeed, but it's up to you to succeed. 
You're in charge, and we will work with you to succeed.

Prisoner Abuse at Abu Ghraib Prison/U.S. Credibility

    Q. How much has the abuse of prisoners at Abu Ghraib damaged the 
American moral authority and credibility?
    The President. Yes. Well, that's a very good question. Obviously, it 
was a shameful moment when we saw on our TV screens that soldiers took 
it upon themselves to humiliate Iraqi prisoners, because it doesn't 
reflect the nature of the American people or the nature of the men and 
women in our uniform. And what the world will see is that we will handle 
this matter in a very transparent way, that there will be rule of law, 
which is an important part of any democracy. And there will be 
transparency, which is a second important part of a democracy, and 
people who have done wrong will be held to account for the world to see.
    That will stand--this process will stand in stark contrast to what 
would happen under a tyrant. You would never know about the abuses in 
the first place. And if you did know about the abuses, you certainly 
wouldn't see any process to correct them.

President's Upcoming Visit With Pope John Paul II

    Q. You will visit the Pope as well on June 4th.
    The President. Yes, sir.
    Q. The Vatican opposed the war and now recommends, look forward and 
pay more attention to the religious and moral sensitivity of the Iraqi 
people. What's your opinion about this recommendation?
    The President. Well, I can understand. Look, a lot of people didn't 
like the war. I understand that completely, and I don't like war. But 
I'm the guy who has to decide, for our case, whether or not a Saddam 
Hussein would be a threat to peace, and made a very difficult decision. 
After having tried all diplomacy, war was the last option.
    Secondly, I will tell the--His Holy Father I appreciate his 
positions--he is a great man--and that I look forward to working with 
the Iraqis to put in place the conditions so that human rights prevail, 
something that didn't happen under Saddam Hussein, looking forward to 
the development of a society in which boys and girls can go to schools 
and not be filled with hateful propaganda but with knowledge. I look 
forward to working with the health care workers in Iraq so that people 
can get decent health care. I will assure His Holy Father that we will 
do everything we can to elevate the human condition so that people can 
live in peace and freedom and remind him that a free Iraq in the midst 
of the Middle East will serve as a great moment of change, will serve as 
an example for others to follow. You see, when the people in the Middle 
East see that a free society can exist in the Muslim world, they'll 
demand the same thing. And free societies are peaceful societies. Free 
societies are hopeful societies. And in the long run, the best way to 
defeat terror is to promote freedom, and that's what we're going to do.
    Q. Last question.
    The President. Sure.

Proposed U.N. Security Council Resolution/Future of Iraq

    Q. If you cannot succeed with the United Nations, do you have a plan 
B as an exit strategy in Iraq?
    The President. We will succeed--we will succeed with the United 
Nations.
    Q. It's sure?
    The President. I'm confident. I'm an optimist. I've talked to most 
of the leaders on the Security Council. I've talked to the Russians, the 
Chinese, the Germans, the French, of course the Brits, and I know there 
is a consensus that we must work together for the good of the Iraqi 
people. This isn't about America. This is about Iraq and the citizens of 
Iraq who suffered under tyranny for so long. And now we have a chance to 
work together to promote a free society in a part of the world, by the 
way, that is desperate for free societies. And I know we'll succeed. 
I've got great faith in the future. And having talked to the new 
leadership--some of the new leadership in Iraq--I can tell you they 
share that same sense of destiny, the same great hope for their people.

[[Page 999]]

    Q. Thank you, Mr. President.
    The President. Good to see you, sir.

Note: The interview was taped at 2:55 p.m. in the Library at the White 
House for later broadcast. The transcript was released by the Office of 
the Press Secretary on June 2. In his remarks, the President referred to 
Prime Minister Ayad al-Alawi and President Ghazi Ujayl al-Yawr of the 
Iraqi interim government; former President Saddam Hussein of Iraq; and 
Lakhdar Brahimi, Special Adviser to the U.N. Secretary-General. A tape 
was not available for verification of the content of this interview.