[Weekly Compilation of Presidential Documents Volume 34, Number 13 (Monday, March 30, 1998)]
[Pages 506-509]
[Online from the Government Publishing Office, www.gpo.gov]

<R04>
Interview With Tavis Smiley of Black Entertainment Television in Cape 
Town

March 26, 1998

    Mr. Smiley. Mr. President, nice to see you. Thanks for talking to 
us. Let me start by asking you how you're holding up. I'm having--it's 
my first time traveling in the White House press pool; I'm tired of 
trying to keep up with you. You must be tired.
    The President. Yes, I have a couple periods during the day still 
where I get a little tired or jet-lagged. We've been traveling at night 
a lot. But the trip is so exciting it kind of keeps the adrenalin 
flowing.
    Mr. Smiley. Let me ask you if I can, Mr. President, to share your 
impressions of Africa. You at this point have now visited three African 
countries, three quite diverse African countries. I'm wondering if you 
can share your impressions, is Africa what you expected it to be upon 
your arrival?
    The President. Yes, it's what I expected it to be, but it's even 
more interesting, more fascinating than I though it would be. It's a 
place that's just brimming with energy, and I think, basic good will on 
the part of the citizens of the countries that I met. I think it's a 
place of great opportunity for the United States. I think it's a place 
that we

[[Page 507]]

 should be far more concerned about than we have been in the past and a 
place that can be a good partner for us in dealing with the challenges 
of this new century we're about to enter.
    Mr. Smiley. And to move, if I can, from talking about the continent 
to the content of some of what you've had to say--and I'm wondering 
specifically, Mr. President, how you think some of your remarks are 
going to play back home, particularly to those outside of the African-
American community? You've made some rather provocative statements; many 
African Americans have been pleased by those remarks. You said in Ghana 
that we all came out of Africa; folks were surprised to hear you say 
that. In Uganda, you said that everyone--that European-Americans, 
rather, had benefited from the fruits of the slave trade and that we 
were wrong in that as well. In Rwanda, you said we didn't move fast 
enough to deal with the genocide happening there. Some provocative 
statements, again, pleasing the African-American community in large, I 
think, but how do you think those provocative statements are going to 
play outside of the black community?
    The President. Well, I would hope that they would play well. At 
least, I hope that they would prompt all my fellow Americans to think. 
What I said about us all coming out of Africa is, as far as we all know, 
absolutely accurate. That is, the oldest known species of humanity from 
all the archaeological and anthropological studies are people who were 
in Africa. We just--I just read an article about two people walking 
upright, where they found footprints that are 2 million years old right 
near where we're doing this interview. So that's just a simple fact.
    When I talked about the slave trade, I meant that when I was in 
Uganda. The Europeans basically organized the slave trade. They yanked 
Africans out of their lives and turned them into slaves. But Americans 
bought them, and therefore, we were part of the slave trade. Quite apart 
from the injury to the slaves that were in America, what we did to 
Africa was wrong. And I thought it was important to acknowledge that, 
that it wasn't just--that Americans weren't just simply passive in that.
    And finally, I think we all recognize that the world was not 
particularly well organized for the breathtaking speed of the genocide 
in Rwanda. Take it out of Africa--if you look at what happened in 
Bosnia, where many, many people were killed and millions were 
dislocated, it took the international community more than 2 years to get 
organized enough for the U.N. to support a NATO action that NATO took 
and then for NATO to come in with our allies--Russia and the others, 
many other countries, two dozen other countries--to stop the killing in 
Bosnia and effect a peace settlement.
    In Rwanda, where you had a million people killed in 90 days, it is 
simply a fact that the United States, Europe, Japan, and the whole 
United Nations, the whole world community--we were not organized for or 
prepared for the consequences.
    I'm proud of what the United States did when we finally got to 
Rwanda. We saved hundreds of thousands of people's lives who were 
refugees, children who might have died from dehydration and disease, for 
example. But I think this is the--what happened in Rwanda should be a 
clear message to not just Americans but to the world community that 
these are things that we can stop from happening and keep countries on a 
more positive course if we're well organized.
    And it was particularly tragic in Rwanda because Rwanda is not a 
country that was created by European colonial mapmakers. It was a 
coherent entity long before colonialism in Africa. And the Hutus and the 
Tutsis lived together literally for centuries, speaking the same 
language, having the same religious practices, dividing their society on 
lines that were quite different from tribal lines. So it was a world-
class tragedy.
    Mr. Smiley. Let me ask you whether or not these, as I termed them 
earlier, provocative comments that you made were planned. I talked to a 
lot of folks in the White House pool, and no one will tell me that they 
had any idea that you were going to make the kinds of statements you've 
been making. I'm wondering whether or not, then, these statements were 
planned or whether you got caught up in the moment where the emotion is 
overtaking you. Were they planned remarks?

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    The President. One was planned, and two were remarks that I thought 
I ought to say to try to get the American people to identify more 
closely with Africa and then to look to the future--to a common future.
    We clearly planned to acknowledge the deficiencies of the United 
States and the world community in dealing with the Rwanda genocide. The 
Secretary of State had already been here and done the same thing, and I 
thought it was important that I do it as well, to focus the attention of 
the world on what we have to do to keep things like this from happening 
in the future, not just in Africa but everywhere.
    The comment about our involvement in the slave trade and what it did 
to Africa, as well as what it did to African-Americans who became 
slaves, was a comment that I decided to make based on my feelings about 
the situation and my reading of what would be appropriate.
    The comment about how we all came out of Africa was--I think is 
just--to the best of our knowledge, is simply an anthropological fact 
and that Americans ought to know that. I don't think--I got interested 
in this because Hillary spent a lot of time over the last 2 years 
studying the origins of humankind, and I learned a lot through her 
extensive reading and study. And I think that it's one more way to make 
all Americans identify with Africa and with the common humanity we share 
with people across the globe.
    Mr. Smiley. I know you're leaving in just a moment to go speak to 
Parliament here in Cape Town, South Africa, so let me squeeze out a 
couple quick questions, and I'll let you go. I'm wondering whether or 
not you think this trip is going to dispel the negative stereotypes and 
myths about Africa. You've said repeatedly you want to put a new face on 
Africa for Americans.
    My sense is that a lot of what's happening here, certainly much of 
what's happening here, in my own judgment is not being portrayed 
accurately by the American media, some things being taken out of 
context. I'm thinking now specifically of the incident in Ghana when the 
crowd lunged first. I know you were concerned about people on the front 
line. That was not initially portrayed by the American media as 
accurately as it should have been. I'm wondering whether or not you 
think that the trip ultimately will dispel the myths about Africa that 
you're concerned about, or do you think that what you are trying to do, 
your efforts are in some way being overshadowed by some press people who 
insist on raising questions on other matters that have nothing to do 
with why you are here in Africa.
    The President. Oh, no. Well, I think that the trip is getting, I 
think, basically constructive, positive, and accurate coverage back 
home, as nearly as I can tell. Now, in Ghana, where we had a half 
million people--and more if you count the people who were right outside 
the square there--there was a little metal fence dividing me from the 
people. And when I was shaking hands, the enthusiasm of the crowd was 
such--and this has happened to me in America, not just in Ghana, but 
it's the biggest crowd I've ever spoken with--there were two women there 
who were--and it was over 100 degrees; keep in mind it was very hot, and 
they had been out there a long time--and they couldn't breathe. They 
were literally being crushed against the fence. So what I was worried 
about was that just the crowd, the enthusiasm and the happiness, the 
ardor of the crowd would inadvertently cost those women their lives. And 
I was just trying to help them. But it was a wonderful, wonderful event.
    I think basically this trip will end a lot of the stereotypes that 
people have. I think people tend to think that--who don't know much 
about Africa--that all they ever read is when there are troubled tribal 
societies and they're fighting with each other or there's one more 
military coup or one more failed democracy. And half the countries in 
sub-Saharan Africa have elected leaders of their own choosing. They're 
more and more interested in market economies. They're struggling to 
provide basic education and other services like health. And they're very 
interested in being a part of the world of the 21st century. And the 
people are so energetic, and they're intelligent people who are looking 
to the future.
    And what I want Americans to do is to imagine what we can do with 
Africa in the future as partners. I believe that this trip will 
contribute to that, and I certainly hope it will.

[[Page 509]]

    Mr. Smiley. Let me ask you, finally, Mr. President--I mentioned 
earlier that you are headed to speak to Parliament as soon as we leave 
here--as soon as you leave here. I am told that you may, may, in fact, 
speak to the issue of apartheid and America's complicity in that 
certainly for many, many years. How would you respond to particularly 
African-Americans back home who ask of their President, respectfully, 
how he could address apartheid in Africa and not address America's 
version of apartheid, the legacy of slavery and segregation, back at 
home?
    The President. Well, I would say that we are addressing the legacy 
of slavery back home, that this race--we addressed apartheid with the 
Civil War, with the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments, later with all the 
civil rights legislation. I think it's plain that there is a deep 
determination in America to overcome the mistakes of our past and the 
unjustice we did.
    But the race initiative that I set up in America is focused on the 
future. I think the same thing should be done here. While it is true 
that the American Government for many years, in effect, was complicity 
in the apartheid in South Africa by the cooperation with and support of 
the South African Government, it's also true that Americans had a lot to 
do with ending apartheid here by the sanctions, the legislation that 
swept cities and States across the country that the Congress eventually 
put forward at the national level.
    So I think Mr. Mandela would say that Americans of all racial and 
ethnic backgrounds had a lot to do with creating the international 
climate of opposition to apartheid in South Africa.
    But what we need to be doing today in South Africa and in the United 
States is dealing with the legacy of apartheid here and slavery and 
racial discrimination there, insofar as it still needs to be stamped 
out, but our focus ought to be on the future. The only way we can 
liberate people from the problems of the past is to focus on tomorrow. 
And that's what I'm going to do in my speech today and what I'm trying 
to do with the race initiative back home.
    Mr. Smiley. Mr. President, thank you for your time. It's nice to see 
you.
    The President. Thank you. It's really good to see you.

Note: The interview was recorded at approximately 3 p.m. at the Cape 
Grace Hotel for later broadcast on ``BET Tonight.'' This interview was 
made available by the Office of the Press Secretary on March 26 but was 
embargoed for release until 6 a.m., March 27. A tape was not available 
for verification of the content of this interview.