[Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States: George W. Bush (2008, Book II)]
[August 11, 2008]
[Pages 1134-1137]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office www.gpo.gov]



Interview With Bob Costas of NBC Sports in 
Beijing
August 11, 2008

2008 Beijing Olympics

    Mr. Costas. All right, Al, we thank you. In a few minutes, we'll 
have more of the women's team qualifying from Sunday afternoon here in 
Beijing. But now, live, we're joined by President George W. Bush, who 
has been at these games since the opening ceremony.
    You saw the opening ceremony. You've seen Michael Phelps and company 
at the pool. You went to beach volleyball, the USA's win over China in 
basketball last night. What are your impressions so far?
    The President. First of all, I think the Chinese are being great 
hosts. The venues are fantastic. And our team's fired up, and so am I. 
I'm excited to be here. It's such a thrill to watch our men and women 
compete.

U.S. Olympic Men's Basketball Team

    Mr. Costas. You met with the ballplayers before the basketball game 
last night.
    The President. I did. [Laughter]
    Mr. Costas. What was their response to you?
    The President. Their response was--well, first of all, obviously, 
these are great stars. And their response was, ``Thanks for coming. We 
are really, really honored to represent America.'' And I was impressed 
by them. And of course, they go out and put on a great performance.

China-U.S. Relations

    Mr. Costas. And winning 101 to 70. All right, our time here is 
limited. We'll get to as much as we can.
    The President. Okay.
    Mr. Costas. The opening ceremonies were glorious. There's much to 
admire about China's people, China's culture, and its present 
accomplishments. But this remains an authoritarian state----
    The President. That's true.
    Mr. Costas. ----with an abysmal human rights record. In the long 
run, is China's rise irreconcilable with America's interests?
    The President. No. In the long run, America better remain engaged 
with China and understand that we can have a cooperative and 
constructive, yet candid, relationship. It's really important for future 
Presidents to understand the relationship between China and the region, 
and it's important to make sure that America is engaged with China, even 
though we may have some disagreements.

China-U.S. Relations/U.S. Foreign Policy

    Mr. Costas. You met with President Hu Jintao, not just at the 
opening ceremony----
    The President. Right.
    Mr. Costas. ----but privately since then. Did you press him on the 
full array of American concerns: human rights; press freedom; Tibet; 
China's support of rogue regimes like Sudan and Myanmar?
    The President. Yes--and North Korea and Iran.
    Mr. Costas. It was all on the table?
    The President. Oh, absolutely, every time, every time. And you got 
to understand something, Bob, I don't need the Olympics to advance 
America's agenda. I've met with Hu Jintao a lot 
since I have been the President. And yes, I had a full range--hey,

[[Page 1135]]

listen, we agree with them on a lot of things, and we disagree with them 
on things. And that's the way the relationship is going to be. It needs 
to be, as I mentioned, constructive and cooperative.

U.S. Foreign Policy

    Mr. Costas. This past week, you restated America's fundamental 
differences with China.
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. But given China's growing strength and America's own 
problems, realistically how much leverage and influence does the U.S. 
have here?
    The President. First of all, I don't see America having problems. I 
see America as a nation that is a world leader, that has got great 
values. And leverage is--I don't think you should look at the 
relationship as one of leverage. I think you ought to look at the 
relationship of one of constructive engagement where you can find common 
areas, like North Korea and Iran, but also be in a position where they 
respect you enough to listen to your views on religious freedom and 
political liberty.

2008 Beijing Olympics/China

    Mr. Costas. If these Olympics are as successful as they are shaping 
up to be, most people believe this only further legitimizes the ruling 
party in the minds of most Chinese----
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. ----citizens. And even absent true liberty as we 
understand it, the lives of hundreds of millions of Chinese people are 
much better than they once were. Therefore, what's the party's incentive 
to reform?
    The President. Well, first of all, if you're a religious person, you 
understand that once religion takes hold in a society, it can't be 
stopped. And secondly, I think it--the Olympics are going to serve as a 
chance for people to come and see China the way it is and let the 
Chinese see the world and interface and have the opportunity to converse 
with people from around the world. And this is a very positive 
development, in my view, for peace.
    And who knows what--how China is going to progress? They've been 
through some very difficult political times--the Cultural Revolution, 
where the leadership actually created violent anarchy as the society 
turned on itself. All I can tell you is, is that it's important for the 
United States to be active in this part of the world with all countries 
and to stay engaged with China.

Situation in Georgia

    Mr. Costas. Moving away from China for just a second, during the 
opening ceremony, we saw you conferring with Vladimir Putin.
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. We now know you were talking about the conflict that had 
erupted that day----
    The President. That's true.
    Mr. Costas. ----between Russia and Georgia. Now, Georgia is a former 
Soviet republic that is sympathetic to the West----
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. ----and that is attempting to embody many Western 
values. But just as you need China, you need Russia strategically around 
the globe.
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. You got to walk a fine line. What did you say to Putin?
    The President. I said, this violence is unacceptable. I not only 
said it to Vladimir Putin, I said it to 
the President of the country, Dmitry 
Medvedev. And my administration has been engaged with both sides in 
this, trying to get a cease-fire, and saying that the status quo ante 
of--for all troops should be August 6. And, look, my--I expressed my 
grave concern about the disproportionate response of Russia and that we 
strongly condemn bombing outside of South Ossetia.

[[Page 1136]]

    It was just interesting to me that here we are trying to promote 
peace and harmony, and we're witnessing a conflict take place.
    Mr. Costas. Right, no Olympic truce in this case.
    The President. There wasn't. And I was very firm with 
Vladimir Putin--and he and I have got a 
good relationship--just like I was firm with the Russian 
President. And hopefully, this will get 
resolved peacefully. There needs to be a international mediation there 
for South--the South Ossetia issue.

Darfur

    Mr. Costas. A couple more quick things.
    The President. Sure.
    Mr. Costas. China is a nation that warmly received Umar al-Bashir of 
Sudan, who has since been indicted by the International Court on charges 
of genocide.
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. Then this past week, they revoke the visa of Joey Cheek, 
an exemplary Olympian who had planned to come here not to directly 
protest China's Government, but to call attention to the humanitarian--
--
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. ----crisis in Darfur.
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. What's your reaction?
    The President. My reaction is, I'm sorry Joey Cheek didn't come; he's a good man. Joey Cheek's just got to 
know that I took the Sudanese message for him. My attitude is, is if you 
got relations with Mr. Bashir, 
think about helping us solve the humanitarian crisis in Darfur. That was 
my message to the Chinese Government.

China-U.S. Relations/Freedom Agenda

    Mr. Costas. As you attempt to press these points with them, do you 
find Hu Jintao not just warm toward you personally, but is he receptive? 
Do you sense any movement?
    The President. It's hard to tell. I mean, it's--all I can tell you 
is, is that it is best to be in the position where a leader will listen 
to you. Hey, I went to church here, and I'm sure the cynics say, ``Well, 
you know, it was just a state-sponsored church.'' On the other hand--and 
that's true. On the other hand, it gave me a chance to say to the 
Chinese people, religion won't hurt you; you ought to welcome religious 
people. And it gave me a chance to say to the Government, why don't you 
register the underground churches and give them a chance to flourish? 
And he listened politely. And I can't read his 
mind, but I do know that every time I met with him, I pressed the point.

President's Visit to China

    Mr. Costas. Your father has longstanding connections to China. He 
was an envoy here even before we established an official ambassador's 
position, during the 1970s, and he is here with you on this trip. So 
there's a connection, a family connection.
    The President. Absolutely. Yes, there's a great connection. You 
know, I can remember riding my bike around Beijing in 1975, and it is--
--
    Mr. Costas. Only bikes then, just about.
    The President. ----unbelievable how far this has changed. I mean, it 
is--and he feels the same way. And we were 
honored yesterday when the President, Hu Jintao, 
invited my dad and me and Laura and my 
sister and my daughter, my brother for dinner. It was a--
lunch. It was just a great gesture of kindness.
    Bob, it's very important for the American people to know that coming 
here gave me a chance obviously to root for our team, and you've 
captured that, but it's also--coming here is a sign of respect for the 
Chinese people. And this is a big, important nation. We'll have our 
differences; we'll have our agreements. But in order to find common 
ground and to move the world toward peace, it is important for this 
country to show respect for the people of the country.

[[Page 1137]]

Major League Baseball

    Mr. Costas. Briefly, one more sports question.
    The President. Sure.
    Mr. Costas. You have been outspoken--your past connections to 
baseball--you used a State of the Union speech to do it, to talk about 
performance-enhancing drugs in sports. Marion Jones recently petitioned 
you for clemency.
    The President. Yes.
    Mr. Costas. She's serving time because of involvement in the BALCO 
case--one-time Olympic hero. We know many Olympians, and in your 
favorite sport and mine, baseball, big names: Barry Bonds, Roger 
Clemens. What's your feeling about this? And how much do you, as an 
American, trust the integrity of the sports you watch?
    The President. Yes, well, you know, let's just talk about baseball. 
Obviously, one of the great things about baseball is we can compare the 
records of the players of the fifties to the sixties and the seventies 
and, obviously, the 1990s. And it is very important for there to be a--
for the sport to be clean so that the great continuity of and the 
history of baseball is real. And secondly, we don't want adults sending 
mixed messages to children that it's okay to shoot up drugs in order to 
become a star, because it's not okay.

2008 Beijing Olympics

    Mr. Costas. You going to go to a few more events before you leave?
    The President. I'm going to swimming here--if you'd ever let me off 
this set. [Laughter]
    Mr. Costas. All right. You are dismissed.
    The President. Thank you, sir.
    Mr. Costas. Thank you, Mr. President.

Note: The interview began at 8:55 a.m. at the International Broadcasting 
Center. In his remarks, the President referred to President Hu Jintao of 
China; President Dmitry A. Medvedev and Prime Minister Vladimir V. Putin 
of Russia; former U.S. Olympic athlete Joey Cheek; and President Umar 
Hassan Ahmad al-Bashir of Sudan. He also referred to his sister Dorothy 
Bush Koch; his daughter Barbara P. Bush; and his brother Marvin P. Bush. 
Bob Costas referred to Alan Michaels, reporter, NBC Sports; former U.S. 
Olympic athlete Marion Jones-Thompson; and former Major League Baseball 
players Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens.