[Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States: George W. Bush (2005, Book II)]
[June 30, 2005]
[Pages 1171-1180]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office www.gpo.gov]
Interview With Foreign Print Journalists
June 30, 2005
The President. Just a couple of comments. One, I'm looking forward
to going to the G-8. It's always a good opportunity to talk about common
values, common interests, ways we can work together to improve the
world. I'm looking forward to seeing the leaders. I've got a good
personal
[[Page 1172]]
relationship with the leaders. It's a good chance to visit.
Agenda items are--important agenda items: Africa, I just gave a
speech on the continent of Africa; global climate change, it's important
to move the debate beyond the Kyoto era and talk about what we can do
together to improve the environment. I'm looking forward to that. One of
the things there hasn't been much focus on is, there will be time to
discuss progress in the Middle East--the Middle East peace process. Jim
Wolfensohn is coming to discuss a way
forward, how we can all help the Palestinians improve their security,
enhance the entrepreneurial spirit so people can see their lives
improve. We're looking forward to that.
Anyway, it's going to be a good trip. I'm looking forward to going
to Denmark. The Prime Minister is a
friend. He's a good man. He's got a good, strong backbone. When he says
he's going to do something, he means it. I'm looking forward to seeing
Her Majesty the Queen. It's going to be a
good experience. I've never been to Denmark, so I'm looking forward to
going.
Charlie, we'll start with you, and then we'll do a couple of rounds,
and I'll let you all go get some lunch.
Aid to Africa
Q. All right. My first question really is an aid question, with
respect to Africa. Mr. Blair has really been pressing this issue of
dramatically increased aid to Africa. You have substantially increased
U.S. assistance to Africa, but on the other hand, it falls way short of
what Mr. Blair has been asking for. You've been really, I think, fairly
cool to both the $25 billion that he's asked and the commitment for,
what is it, seven-tenths of a percent of GDP for foreign assistance.
The President. A couple of comments on that. One is that our aid
increase has been dramatic. We've tripled our aid since I've been
President, and I just announced today that I'll ask Congress to double
it by 2010, which is a significant increase.
Secondly, though, you've got to look at Africa as more than just
aid. Aid is one aspect of participating on the continent in a
compassionate way. Trade is a vital part of lifting people out of
poverty.
The other thing is, you know, there's all kinds of ways to calculate
generosity. I happen to think that the formula that some people try to
use is not an effective way to judge America's generosity or a fair way.
For example, we've got a Tax Code structure to encourage private
citizens to contribute. And so I will remind our G-8 friends that aid to
developing countries is more than just grants from Government. It is
grants from Government. It is generous contributions by private
individuals, and we contribute billions on an annual basis.
I'm also going to tell people that a compassionate policy is one
that focuses less on formulas and more on improving people's lives. And
so today I talked about the malaria initiative, for example. There's a
great place where the G-8 countries can come together and help nations
on the continent of Africa eradicate malaria.
So I'm going to the G-8 with an agenda, where we've been the leader.
The HIV/AIDS initiative was a powerful statement of our compassion and
our willingness to take the lead on a lot of issues.
Klaus.
Iraq/War on Terror
Q. Another subject which will be in some way at the G-8 meeting
also, Iraq. Denmark is contributing a substantial proportion of the
amount of troops to the conflict. Your most recent speech continuously
made the link between the conflict and 9/11. How do you react towards
those who say that connection has been disproved and that growing
skepticism in this country and even more in Europe cannot simply be
dismissed by your resolve to stay the course, as you say?
[[Page 1173]]
The President. My point was, about September the 11th, is that
America was attacked, and now we're at war in a global war on terror.
That's the connection with September the 11th. Some in Europe, I
recognize, view September the 11th as a terrible moment. We view it as
not only a terrible moment but a clear indication that we're at war with
an ideology, people that are willing to use terror to spread their
ideology. So my speech, if you look carefully at how it was written--I'm
confident you did, Klaus--shows that I was making the connection between
the attack and the global war on terror that we now face--and the
ideology of those who attacked us is very similar to those that have now
gone into Iraq to try to stop the progress--and make clear, our strategy
is to find the terrorists, bring them to justice before they harm us
here, as well as defeat the ideology of hate with an ideology of hope,
and that's democracy. Our strategy in Iraq is to promote a stable
democracy, in other words, encourage political progress and, at the same
time, train up the Iraqis so they can do the fighting.
And I look forward to sharing my thoughts about the progress we are
making with your Prime Minister.
They've been--Denmark has been a steadfast ally, and I know he has
obviously stood strong in the face of political pressures, made a
decision based upon what he thought was right for the world, spreading
peace.
I strongly believe that we're laying the foundation for peace for
generations to come. I reject the notion that certain countries cannot
be democratic. I view that elitist--I view that as condemning people to
hopelessness. Our policy up to now, prior to September the 11th, was,
``Why don't we just kind of tolerate tyranny and hope for the best.'' It
doesn't work that way, and we learned a strong lesson.
The speech, I think you'll see, was that the attack indicated we're
at war, and Iraq is part of that war. Otherwise, why would people be
pouring into the country trying to defeat us? Why? Because they fear
democracy. They fear the competing ideology that is a hopeful ideology.
Joe.
U.S. Aid to Africa
Q. Mr. President, a question about your malaria program.
The President. Sure.
Q. By the time we get back to the office, there will probably be a
statement from some group praising your proposal but saying once
again,``Why didn't the President go through the Global Fund to Fight
AIDS, Tuberculosis, and Malaria?'' Why do a separate program?
The President. Well, first of all, we are supporting the Global
Fund. But like our AIDS Initiative, we also feel it is an effective way
to achieve results. See, you just asked a process question. You're
assuming somebody is going to--let's focus on the process. What I want
the world to do is focus on how best to get the job done, how best to
achieve the objective.
And so our strategy has been two-fold: one, support the Global Fund;
but on the other hand, target specific countries. And if you noticed, I
said in there, this will--we're taking the lead. We want people to
follow. We want people in other countries to follow--we want people to
follow. And the United States Government is going to take the lead. The
Gates Foundation is taking the lead, and I call upon other governments,
other foundations, to do the same. So our strategy is one of results,
how best to achieve the objective.
Give me your name again.
Q. Olivier. You can call me Mr. Knox. That's fine. [Laughter]
The President. Pretty good. Pretty good retort. [Laughter] Very
good. Olivier.
Iran
Q. Thank you, sir. Sir, were you surprised when you heard the
allegations that the President-elect of Iran might have been
[[Page 1174]]
one of the people who took Americans hostage in Tehran? And do you have
any information that would confirm or refute those charges?
The President. I have no information, but obviously, this is--
his involvement raises many questions,
and knowing how active people are at finding answers to questions, I'm
confident they'll be found. And I spoke to Prime Minister Blair this morning, spoke to Chancellor Schroeder the other day. I look forward to speaking to Jacques
Chirac when we get to Scotland.
My message is, is that it's very important at this moment for the
EU-3 to send a strong message to the new person there that the world is
united in saying that you should not be given the capabilities of
enriching uranium, which could then be converted into a nuclear weapon.
In other words, we've got a new man who
has assumed power, and he must hear a focused message. I was pleased
with Gerhard Schroeder's statement here,
and Prime Minister Blair can speak for himself.
But let me just say, I believe the EU-3's message is going to be a very
strong message, and that's where our message is--that's where my
attention is focused right now.
In order to achieve a diplomatic objective, it's very important to
have clear goals. And we have a clear goal, and that is to say to the
Iranians--well, there's a clear understanding that Iran should not have
a nuclear weapon. It would be a very destabilizing, dangerous situation.
And the world is speaking in one voice, and so the message now to the
new leader is a very strong message.
Charlie.
Trade With Africa
Q. With regard to trade, African leaders have been pretty loud in
pointing out that subsidies and tariffs are a tremendous handicap to the
development of trade. Europe, in particular, has been hostile to really
lifting tariffs and subsidies. Any chance of any movement on that,
within the context of the G-8?
The President. Well, I appreciate you bringing that up. The African
Growth and Opportunity Act, signed by my predecessor and extended by the
Congress in my administration, is working. I want to remind people that
ultimately it's commerce, trade, economic growth that will overwhelm the
need for aid itself. And exports from sub-Sahara Africa to the United
States are up 88 percent because we've opened up our markets.
The best approach to dealing with Europe--and our own subsidies for
that matter--on agricultural matters, is to go to the Doha round of the
WTO and jointly declare that we're going to get rid of all agricultural
subsidies. That has been our proposal.
The other thing is, it's very important for African nations
themselves to eliminate the barriers of trade intracontinent, between
themselves. There are, if you look--at least there was the last time I
looked--there were some impediments to trade amongst the African
nations. And so the--we've all got responsibilities to make trade freer.
I said in my speech today that it's--the World Bank estimated that a
successful Doha round--in other words, a new trading regime that enabled
all countries to trade freely, would lift 140 million people out of
poverty, in their estimate. And that's why this Doha round is very
important. And so we'll spend time articulating how best to continue
moving forward on the Doha round. That's probably the most--the place
where you're going to find that would be most effective in being able to
deal with the subsidies, whether it be the EU or our own subsidies for
that matter.
Klaus.
Guantanamo Bay Detainees
Q. Guantanamo is still a very hot topic for many Europeans. After 3
years, there are still prisoners there who haven't had
[[Page 1175]]
their case heard. And the U.N. now are talking about investigating
secret U.S. prisons and detainee facilities. Is that a thing--in the
investigation, the U.S. would cooperate with? And don't you have fears
that this is going to harm the U.S. image a lot if this situation goes
on for years?
The President. Well, I think--I think if the truth is not told, it's
a problem. But let's talk about the truth, in terms of Guantanamo. First
of all, there's inspections 24 hours a day, 7 days a week available for
the International Red Cross. There's been a lot of press contingents
down to take a look at the situation firsthand and a lot of
congressional folks going down. In other words, a lot of people--there's
a transparent situation there.
I think we probably had about 800 or so people detained there, and
remember, Klaus, I made a decision as to what to do with people swept
off of a battlefield who didn't wear uniforms. I mean, this is a
different kind of war. I made the decision they would be treated
humanely, just like the Geneva Accords insist, and they have been.
Of the 800 detained, some 200 or so have been sent back to their
countries. In other words, we screened and analyzed and took a look at
whether they would be a threat again. I'm in a dilemma--at one point
during this process, because people were let back out on the--sent back
to a country, and they ended up killing an American. What do I tell the
loved one? In other words, these people were fighting. They were
fighters. They were on the battlefield.
Secondly, I agree with you. We need to make sure there is a way
forward. And that's why I set up military commissions. But the
military--and by the way, in a military commission, people would have
lawyers; they would have--there would be procedures, court procedures.
Unfortunately--or fortunately, I shouldn't--let me take that back--what
has happened has been that our court system is analyzing, making a
judicial decision as to whether or not the military--these people should
be tried in a military commission or in a civilian court, and we're
awaiting a verdict on that. And once that happens, then there will be a
way forward.
Joe.
Debt Relief/Development Grants
Q. Mr. President, a question about debt cancellation.
The President. Yes.
Q. The G-8 finance ministers came up with a figure of 18 countries.
Shortly after that, a number of African Presidents meeting in Nigeria
said, ``It's a good start. We'd like more.'' Is that 18 figure carved in
stone, or is there----
The President. Not at all, Joe. There's a--it's a criterion-based
agreement, and that other countries will be able to qualify for debt
forgiveness as well. So there's a way forward for the other countries
that they expressed concerns about.
The other thing is, is that I would hope people would take notice of
the initiative that I proposed a couple of years ago, and that is the
World Bank, in its desire to help developing nations, give grants as
opposed to loans. And we're making progress toward that goal. Jim
Wolfensohn did a fine job of making
progress toward that goal, and Paul Wolfowitz will continue toward that goal.
But the idea is that we're relieving the pressure on the balance
sheet. But governments have got to make good choices. They've got to be
willing to invest and fight corruption, kind of like the criterion in
our Millennium Challenge Account, which is a very important initiative.
It's one I called on Congress to fund. Congress has been reluctant to
fully fund our request because we haven't got the money out the door
fast enough. And so my message today was, like it has been the last
couple of times I've talked about Millennium Challenge Account, we'll do
a better job of processing and moving along.
[[Page 1176]]
Olivier.
Q. Thank you, sir.
The President. One more round after this, so everybody be preparing
your questions.
Sudan
Q. On Darfur, sir, the Deputy Secretary of State told the House
Foreign Relations Committee this week or last that the United States and
Europe shouldn't send troops to Darfur because they would come up
against bloodthirsty, coldblooded killers. Does this mean that the
bloodthirsty, coldblooded killers can set the agenda in Darfur? And what
do you say to some critics who say that your administration is easing
off Sudan because of good counterterrorism intelligence cooperation?
The President. That's a preposterous claim. It's not even close to
the truth. First, my administration, with Jack Danforth and Colin Powell's good work,
helped solve the north-south civil war. And now we're working close--
working with parties to get that peace agreement implemented.
Secondly, the strategy, an effective strategy, is to work with the
AU--African Union--and use AU forces to help keep the warring parties
apart while we continue to press the Sudanese Government as well as
rebel groups for a comprehensive settlement. And the United States has
helped--worked with NATO and the EU to provide logistical support for
the movement of 7,700 troops into Darfur.
Today I announced it will help build 16 additional base camps; it
will provide maintenance services, as well as C-130 to help remove
Rwandan troops. We spend a lot of time on this important issue. Ours is
a nation that called this a genocide. And we take this situation in
Darfur very seriously--and, by the way, lead in terms of aid and working
with other nations. Canada, by the way, has come up with a big tranche
of aid the other day, for which we're grateful.
Charlie.
Zimbabwe
Q. What are you telling or asking Thabo Mbeki now, as Robert Mugabe
intensifies his crackdown against his opposition in Zimbabwe?
The President. As you know, Thabo Mbeki was
here. You might remember, I did go to South Africa as well. And my
message has been very consistent: ``You're a great democracy. You're
showing the world what is possible after the terrible period of
apartheid. In other words, you showed how to reconcile differences, and
you're a very strong nation on the continent of Africa. And next door to
you is a person that is destroying a country
because of bad policy, and it's not right. And the nations in the
neighborhood must be strong.''
I was asked yesterday, are we willing to tie some of our aid to the
position that nations take on Zimbabwe? I said no because I don't want
people to suffer as a result of--more people to suffer as a result of
Zimbabwe. In other words, our aid is focused at people.
And on the other hand, working with nations and providing help and
aid and trade and, you know, partnering does give us a chance to lend
our voice to others who are saying, ``This has got to change in
Zimbabwe.'' He is a terrible example.
Q. Are you disappointed in Mbeki?
The President. I'm disappointed in Mugabe.
He is--Zimbabwe was a bread basket, provided a lot of food on a
continent that often needs food, and it's a country being wrecked. And I
am--the world needs to speak very clearly about the decisions he has
made and the consequence of the decisions he has made.
Klaus.
President's Upcoming Visit to Denmark
Q. You have already expressed your admiration for the Danish Prime
Minister, but I wondered if there were other good reasons behind your
decision to take the detour to our tiny country like Denmark
[[Page 1177]]
and even ruining part of your birthday by doing that? [Laughter]
The President. No, no, it's enhancing it--it's enhancing it. Listen,
Denmark has been a great friend of the United States for years. And I
hope my visit sends a statement to the Danish people: Thank you for the
friendship. I don't expect everybody to agree with the decisions my
administration has made----
Q. You know there will be demonstrations in Denmark?
The President. That's fine. Good. That's the great thing about going
to a free society, see. One of the things about--a wonderful thing about
freedom is, people are able to express their opinions, and I expect
people to express their opinions.
On the other hand, I would hope my visit says to the Danish people
that America respects you and we share values. And those shared values
are important. They're universal values. They're not American values or
Danish values. They're universal values, freedom of speech and minority
rights, human dignity.
So I'm looking forward to it. Selfishly, I'm looking forward to
going to Denmark. I've never been there, and I can't wait to see it.
Now, admittedly, I'm not going to take the typical tourist tour. I don't
expect you'll find me walking the streets of--you know, in the evening,
arm in arm with my wife. On the other hand, I bet
I get to see enough of the country to give me a good sense of the beauty
of the country. I'm really looking forward to it.
Q. Do you plan to bring all your family members and your wife?
The President. I'm bringing wife, for
certain, and a family member. All my family
members? It's a lot. [Laughter] If you're talking about my daughters,
one of my daughters will be accompanying me. Thank you for asking.
Joe.
Group of Eight/Africa
Q. Mr. President, David Dodge, the Governor of Canada's Central
Bank, questions the whole G-8 process, saying it really shouldn't be
focusing on Africa and climate change but rather global prosperity and
economic imbalances. And he says that a new mechanism, a new institution
is needed that includes China, India, and South Africa. What do you
think about that?
The President. You know, the G-8 conferences used to be focused
strictly on global--you know, economic--our respective economies, and
it's an economic discussion. And it's an interesting growth out of just
talking about economics to just understanding that together we can make
a difference by helping developing nations grow their economies as well.
It's really what you're talking about.
The ultimate success on the continent of Africa is going to be
whether or not strong economies develop, being able to give people a
chance to succeed. And many of the initiatives we're focused on will lay
the conditions for economic growth. And you can't grow if you're at war.
That's why I talked about the peacekeeping initiatives. You can't grow
if you've got a huge part of the future of your nation being wiped out
because of HIV/AIDS. It's very difficult to grow if you don't educate
your women, and that's why I announced a very strong initiative for the
education of girls on the continent of Africa. These are projects--it's
hard to grow when you've got a million people dying of malaria because
of the inability to treat a mosquito bite.
I mean, there's something very practical about dealing with--dealing
with, on the continent of Africa, the nations, helping nations,
partnering nations. And I think it speaks to the admonition that ``To
whom much is given, much is required.'' And so I find this an important
part of an agenda.
It shouldn't be the only agenda. We're definitely talking about the
environment, definitely talking about Africa. But we'll
[[Page 1178]]
also be talking about the Palestinian conflict. There's a chance for G-8
nations, developed nations to help the Palestinians. We'll be talking
about our economies. There's always a nice discussion about currency,
for example--an interesting part of the dialog. And I find it
interesting to talk with other nations about what they are doing to
stimulate their economies.
I suspect this G-8--in other words, there will be very--current
events will be discussed one way or the other. Iraq, of course, will be
discussed. But obviously, one of the interesting parts of this G-8 that
folks will be looking at will be the recent issues within the EU. And my
message there will be the same as it was here when Jose Barroso and others came, Juncker came, and I said, ``Look, we want Europe to succeed.
We want there to be a Europe that is whole, free, and at peace. And we
want Europe to be successful in its enterprise, and we want it to be
growing.'' I mean, after all, we've got enormous trade with Europe, and
trade is an important part of raising standards of living. If that's the
case, you want your trading partner to be healthy. And so we'll be
discussing--I'm confident there will be some discussions about what has
taken place.
I'm looking forward to it. In other words, a broad agenda makes
sense to me.
G-8 Membership/Kyoto Protocol
Q. But just a quick follow up----
The President. Yes.
Q. What about including India and China and South Africa?
The President. Well, no, India and China and South Africa will be
there. Absolutely. There will be some African nations there. There will
be India, China, Brazil, and Mexico--I can't remember all the nations--
but yes, there will be a forum or a discussion including those
countries.
I'm particularly interested in discussing energy with China. One of
the--we had a problem with Kyoto because Kyoto would have--we didn't
think the way forward to really achieve an objective we wanted because,
first of all, Kyoto would really have hurt our economy a lot. Kyoto
didn't include countries like India and China. And now is the chance to
work with developed nations and developing nations to develop a way to
share technologies, for example, that will enable us to achieve the
objective we want.
And the United States recognizes there's warming, and that some of
that is caused by manmade emissions. But we also recognize that we're
dependent upon foreign sources of oil. We want to diversify away from
fossil fuels, and we want to help developing nations do the same. And so
we have a great opportunity, because of the presence of these nations at
this moment to discuss how to go forward. And so, he's right. They
should be included, and they are.
Final question, Olivier.
First Lady's Upcoming Visit to Africa
Q. Thank you, sir. Sir, you're coming back stag from Europe----
The President. Coming back?
Q. Stag. Your wife is going on to Africa.
The President. That's an accurate statement.
Q. We understand from African sources that she's going to South
Africa, Tanzania, and----
The President. Interesting way to put it. You could have said,
``You're coming back alone from Europe,'' or ``You're coming back
sans''----
Q. Oooh! [Laughter]
The President. But you say, ``You're coming back stag.''
Q. If I'd known, I would have gone with the sans. [Laughter] You
beat me to it, sir. [Laughter]
Communications Director Dan Bartlett.
Where's Gregory [David Gregory, NBC News] when you need him? [Laughter]
The President. That's right. [Laughter] Classic moment, wasn't it?
Q. Absolutely.
[[Page 1179]]
The President. Were you there for that?
Q. I was not, but I----
The President. We're laughing about the fact that one of their
comrades, a very important person in the White
House pool went over to Paris, France, and fired off a series of
questions to Jacques Chirac in French.
Q. My mother e-mailed the corrected French. [Laughter]
The President. That's good. [Laughter] I corrected his French too--[laughter]--and didn't even know what he
was saying. [Laughter] This is all off the record, because this will
hurt Gregory's feelings. Please. Holland [Steve Holland, Reuters],
you're copiously taking notes. [Laughter]
Q. It's going right to him. [Laughter]
The President. Good. [Laughter]
Communications Director Bartlett. He
just had twins.
The President. He had twins?
Communications Director Bartlett. Yes,
last week.
The President. Fantastic. Gender?
Communications Director Bartlett. A boy
and a girl.
The President. Weight? Health?
Q. Good. Good.
The President. Mother?
Communications Director Bartlett.
Strong. They're in the fives. I think both of them are 5 pounds.
The President. That's good, 5. How big were yours?
Communications Director Bartlett. Same,
midsize.
The President. We're back--where were you?
Q. Well, we heard that your wife is going----
The President. I'm flying alone, yes. [Laughter]
Q. You're flying alone, sans First Lady. She's going to South
Africa, Tanzania, Rwanda. My question to you is, what message is she
bringing from the United States, and what can she get across that a
diplomat or a rock star could not?
The President. Her message is: One, the United States is committed
to Africa, and we've got a good record; secondly, that our commitment to
Africa is aimed at helping people. She'll be talking about educating
young girls, and she'll be talking about our HIV/AIDS initiative. Her
presence shows commitment. This is the second time she's been to Africa
since I've been sworn in as President. Plus, she's a darn good diplomat.
She speaks clearly, and she is a--she's a compassionate soul when she
speaks, which is--she's a genuinely compassionate person. And people
will see her compassion. And there will be no problem with her getting
any news coverage, so, in other words, she'll be seen, which makes her
an effective representative.
And part of people knowing that the United States cares is for the
messenger to have a platform. And so she'll have a--she'll have the
ability to talk from her heart about the specific initiatives that we're
very much involved in.
All right, listen, thank you all. Looking forward to it. Klaus, see
you over there? Are you going to be there?
Q. I leave that to my colleagues.
The President. You're going to lateral me. You're going to transfer
me off. [Laughter] Well, I'm sure they're going to be as professional as
you were.
Q. I hope so.
The President. Nice to see you again. Thank you. Appreciate you.
Note: The interview began at 10:48 a.m. in the Roosevelt Room at the
White House. In his remarks, the President referred to James D.
Wolfensohn, Quartet Special Envoy for Gaza Disengagement; Prime Minister
Anders Fogh Rasmussen and Queen Margrethe II of Denmark; President-elect
Mahmud Ahmadi-nejad of Iran; Prime Minister Tony Blair of the United
Kingdom; Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder of Germany; President Jacques
Chirac of France; Paul D. Wolfowitz, President, International Bank for
Reconstruction and Development; President
[[Page 1180]]
Thabo Mbeki of South Africa; President Robert Mugabe of Zimbabwe;
European Commission President Jose Manuel Durao Barroso; and European
Council President Jean-Claude Junker. A reporter referred to Deputy
Secretary of State Robert B. Zoellick. Journalists participating in the
interview were Charles Cobb of AllAfrica.com; Klaus Justsen of Jyllands-
Posten; Joseph DeCapua of Voice of America; and Olivier Knox of Agence
France Press. The transcript was released by the Office of the Press
Secretary on July 3. A tape was not available for verification of the
content of this interview.