[Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States: George W. Bush (2005, Book I)]
[March 4, 2005]
[Pages 366-376]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office www.gpo.gov]



Remarks in a Discussion on Strengthening Social Security in Notre Dame, 
Indiana
March 4, 2005

    The President. Thank you all. Please be seated. Thanks for coming. 
More importantly, thanks for letting me come. We're here to have a 
dialog with some of our fellow citizens about Social Security. But I've 
got some things I want to share with you before we get there.
    First, this is a serious conversation, and it's an important 
conversation. This is a conversation about the future of the country. 
And I want to thank Father Malloy and 
Father Jenkins for letting us come to this 
fantastic--letting me come back to this fantastic university. I come 
back as a graduate--well, kind of a graduate. I got a degree--
[laughter]--honorary degree. [Laughter] For all you C students out 
there, it's amazing what can happen to you if you keep working hard. 
[Laughter]
    It's such an honor to be with Father Hesburgh as well. What a great American. I'm proud to be in your 
presence, sir.
    I'm glad to be here with my man, Mitch. Governor, we miss you. He was a solid member of my 
Cabinet, and he's a solid buddy.
    Laura sends her best, by the way. She is 
doing great. Believe it or not, she's in Death Valley, California, 
looking at wildflowers. [Laughter] She loves flowers, and I love her.
    I appreciate Congressman Chris Chocola. He 
is a strong leader. See, I've been up there long enough to be able to 
determine who knows how to lead and who's just up there holding office. 
You've got a leader in Chris, and I appreciate your leadership. 
Congressman Mark Souder is with us. Mark, 
thanks for coming; appreciate working with you as well.
    I know the attorney general is here, Attorney General Steve 
Carter. Thank you for being here, General. 
Mayor Luecke is with us. Mr. Mayor, I'm 
honored you're here. Thanks for--you tell those firefighters and 
policemen how grateful I am for them having to stand out in the cold to 
deal with my entourage. But thanks very much. Mayor Jeff Rea, good to see you, Jeff. Thanks a lot.
    Most of all, thank you all for sharing your time and paying 
attention to some crucial issues. First, I do want to talk a little 
foreign policy. You know, I believe deep in everybody's soul is the 
desire to live in freedom. I told a lot of people around the country 
that freedom is not America's gift to the world; freedom is the 
Almighty's gift to each person in this world. And that's what I believe.
    And I know we've got some students here, and you're living in an 
amazing--we're all living in amazing times, when you think about what 
has taken place in a brief period of time. I mean, millions voted in 
Afghanistan to elect a President. That country 
has gone from darkness to light because of freedom. The Palestinians 
have elected a new leader who is 
showing courage. And I believe someday soon there will be a Palestinian 
state living side by side with Israel in peace. The Iraqis defied the 
terrorists and went to the polls by the millions because they want to 
live in a free society.
    The desire for people to self-govern and to live in a free world is 
catching on in parts of the Middle East. In Beirut, Lebanon, thousands 
of people took to the streets in peaceful protests because they're 
saying, ``We want to live in freedom as well.'' And now it's time for 
Syria to end its occupation of that good democracy. They need to remove 
all their troops, all their secret services. They need to listen to the 
voices of not only the United States and France and other European 
countries but the voices of people like Crown Prince Abdullah from Saudi Arabia. The leader of

[[Page 367]]

Syria must understand the world is speaking 
with one voice: Lebanon must be free.
    And the reason that's important is because free societies will help 
keep the peace, the peace we all want, the peace for generations to 
come, so young and old can grow up in a peaceful world regardless of 
your home country. I believe this world is becoming more peaceful. And 
when it becomes more peaceful, all of us who've been involved in public 
policy and all who've served our country can know we have done our duty 
for generations to come.
    We got some good news today about the economy. The economy added 
262,000 new jobs last month. The entrepreneurial spirit is strong in 
America, and we need to keep it strong. These jobs were added because--I 
think--of good policy, which said, ``How can we stimulate small-business 
growth? What can we do to make sure the entrepreneur is doing well, not 
only in Indiana but around the country?'' And the fundamental question 
is, what do we do now?
    I believe firmly that the scales of justice are not balanced in 
America. We need legal reform. We got a good class-action bill to my 
desk. Republicans and Democrats supported it. We now need to get 
asbestos reform so people don't get driven out of work. And I'll tell 
you another reform we need in the Halls of Congress. We need medical 
liability reform so good doctors aren't run out of practice.
    Laura told me, she said, ``Make sure when you 
get up there, remember, you've got some panelists, so don't do all the 
talking.'' But I've got a lot to say. [Laughter] We're doing great in 
Washington. We're working hard to make sure that there's a new spirit 
that--where people decide to set aside politics and work on problems, 
and one of the biggest problems we face is Social Security.
    Let me first start off by saying something really important, and 
we'll talk about this as this discussion goes on. If you're relying upon 
Social Security today, nothing will change. I don't care what the ads 
say, what the politicians say. You're going to get your check. That's 
just the way it is. That is a fact. The problem for Social Security is 
not for those who now depend upon it. Listen, Social Security has been a 
great safety net. It's been a vital part of our country. But we're 
getting some holes in the safety net, particularly for younger 
generations of Americans.
    And you're probably wondering why somebody who has been in politics 
is talking about Social Security. After all, it's been called the third 
rail of American politics. You grab ahold of it, and you get 
electrified. I'm talking about it because I see a problem, and I believe 
I have a duty as the President of the United States to bring problems 
forward for public discussion. So I'm traveling our country, which I 
like to do, by the way, talking about the problem and reassuring seniors 
that you don't have anything to worry about--unless you're worried about 
your grandkids, like most seniors are.
    And here is the problem: Baby boomers like me are getting ready to 
retire. Starting in the year 2008, a lot of us will turn the age of 62 
years old. We're the--that's where the leading edge of the baby boomers 
are--that would be me. Is that you, Mitch? Almost, yes. [Laughter] You don't look it. We've got a 
lot of us. See, there's a bulge of retirees getting ready to retire. And 
we're living longer than the generation before us. You've got a lot of 
people getting ready to retire who are living long years. And yet the 
Government has promised us benefits that are much greater than the 
previous generation's. So you're beginning to get a sense for the math: 
A lot of people living longer, being promised greater benefits.
    And the problem is, as you can see on this chart, that the number of 
workers paying into the system is shrinking dramatically. In the 
fifties, it was 16 to 1, 16 workers paying into the system for every 
retiree.

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So that if you took the average compensation today for the Social 
Security retiree--it's 14,200--that would be each worker would pay $900 
to make sure that one person got their benefits. Today, it's 3.3 to 1, 
and soon it's going to be 2 to 1. More people living longer, getting 
greater benefits with fewer people paying into the system. The math just 
doesn't work any more.
    Now, this is a pay-as-you-go system. The checks come in, and the 
checks go out. Some of you probably think, when you think about the 
Social Security trust, that there is a bank account with your name on 
it, that the Government is dutifully collecting your money so that it 
will accumulate over time and pay it out. That's not how it works. 
That's not the way it works. The money is coming in, and the money is 
going out. And if there's extra money above and beyond the promises made 
to Social Security retirees, that money is going to pay for other 
Government programs. I hate to tell you, but that's just the way it's 
working. And what has happened is you got a bunch of paper accumulating 
in the form of IOU. But this is a pay-as-you-go system. It is not a 
savings system.
    Now, when you get more people retiring who are getting greater 
benefits and are living longer, with fewer people paying in, at some 
point in time the system starts to go into the red. Right now, on that 
chart you can see, there's more money coming in than going out. But in 
2018, there's more money going out than coming in. That's the beginning 
of the trust beginning to become depleted. I mean, it's the beginning of 
the IOUs being dissipated.
    Let me tell you how bad it will be if we don't do anything. In the 
year 2027, the Government will need to raise $200 billion more than the 
payroll taxes just to make good on the promises. And it gets worse the 
next year and the next year and the next year. It's up to about 300 
billion by 2030-something. And in 2042, the system is flat broke. All 
the IOUs have been gone.
    So we've got a problem. I don't care how you look at it; it is a 
problem. It is a problem that I think needs to be addressed. The longer 
you wait, the harder it is to come up with a solution. Imagine if this 
Government of ours does nothing at this point in time on Social 
Security, and you've got a 5-year-old child. When that child turns 18, 
the system goes into the red. When that child turns 28, it requires 
billions of dollars to make good on the promises to people like me. When 
that child--in the year 2027, that child and other workers are going to 
be confronted with at least a $200 billion deficit per year to make good 
on the promise. So my first mission is to travel around this country 
saying to folks, ``We've got a problem,'' and to remind seniors that 
nothing will change, that you'll get your check.
    And if I'm successful at doing that, then all of a sudden you can 
imagine where the debate will go. The American people will start saying, 
particularly the younger Americans who are going to have to pay for 
this, will start saying, ``What you going to do about it? If you see a 
problem, Mr. President and Congress and Senate, what do you intend to do 
about it in order to make sure there's a retirement system and safety 
net for future generations of Americans?'' And I understand that.
    And that's why at my State of the Union, I stood up and said, 
``Bring your ideas forward. This is no longer the third rail of American 
politics. I don't care if it's a Republican idea or a Democrat idea. I'm 
interested in knowing what's on your mind as to how to permanently fix, 
permanently solve this problem.'' And I mentioned that President 
Clinton and Senator Moynihan and many 
Democrats who've come up with interesting ways, interesting ideas, a 
variety of options to fix the situation. Now, I realize I've got a duty 
to participate as well. First thing I'm going to do is keep traveling 
the country over and over and over again, making the point, we got a 
problem and now is the time to act.

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    But I want to share with you an interesting idea, an idea that I 
think will make America a better place, and that is I believe that as 
part of a Social Security reform package, younger workers ought to be 
allowed to take some of their own money--remember, when you pay in 
payroll taxes, it's your money, it's not the Government's money; it's 
your money--you ought to be allowed to take some of your own money and 
set it aside in a personal savings account that you call your own. And 
here are the benefits--and here's the benefits as I see them. First, 
there's something called the compounding rate of interest. In other 
words, if you set aside dollars over time, they will grow with interest, 
and it compounds. It gets bigger and bigger and bigger.
    Now, you say, ``Well, why can't that happen with my own money now?'' 
Well, it can. But it is a paltry rate of return compared to conservative 
stocks and bonds. If you put your money in a conservative mix of stocks 
and bonds, the rate of return you'll get on your money is significantly 
greater than that which the Government is getting for you. And that's 
important.
    Take, for example, the idea I've suggested to Congress that a worker 
ought to be able to take 4 percent of the payroll taxes and set it aside 
in a personal account. And if you average $35,000 over your life as a 
worker and set aside that money in a personal savings account, over 
time, the money you've set aside will grow to $250,000. That's on a 
worker earning $35,000. That's your money, $250,000. Now, what would 
that be used for? That would be in addition to that which the Government 
can afford to pay you. In other words, a personal account is on top of 
the check you're going to get. The Government can't possibly pay the 
promises we have made, as you've seen from the charts. It's just 
impossible to do so. So my idea is to let you take some of your own 
money, set it aside, let it earn interest over time, let it grow, let it 
compound with interest so that the money you end up having for 
retirement is closer to the promise the Government has made.
    Second benefit: It's your money, and when you pass on, you can leave 
it to whomever you want. That's not the way the system works today. The 
system works today--it will help a family who--where a wage-earner has 
died suddenly, because that money is now available to be spent for that 
family. We'll talk to somebody who went--had an issue along these lines.
    I'll tell you another thing I like about it. I like the fact that 
people can own money. There is a myth in America that only certain 
people can be an investor, the investor class. You've heard that 
discussed before. I guess that's kind of the pinstripe, Wall Street 
types. That's not what I think about America. I think everybody in this 
country has got the capacity to manage a personal account. I think 
everybody should be allowed to be able to take his or her own money and 
watch it grow over time.
    Now, you can't put it in the lottery. You can't take the money and 
shoot dice with it. There will be guidelines. There will be a 
conservative mix of investments. And guess what--guess where you can 
find a go-by for this type of system? Federal employees are allowed to 
do just this, in the Federal employee thrift benefit plan. That's 
exactly what happens at the Federal Government right now. They say, ``If 
you're working for the Government, you can set aside some of your money 
and you can invest it in a conservative mix of stocks and bonds so that 
you can get a better rate of return.''
    Fourth, I think it makes sense to have people open up a quarterly 
statement and watch how their wealth is growing. It certainly would 
cause people to pay attention to what's happening in Washington, DC. It 
will make people wonder what the policies are--are the policies that are 
being articulated good enough to continue to make sure our economy 
continues to grow? In other words, when you own something,

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you have a stake in the future of the country.
    So I think this is an idea worth discussing, and I put it out there 
for people to debate and listen to and argue about. But one thing is for 
certain that Congress needs to know, that we have a problem that needs 
to be addressed. And if somebody has got some better ideas, I'm looking 
forward to hearing them. I'm looking forward to the people around our 
country saying to the elected Members of this Congress of ours, ``We've 
got a problem. Now we expect you as an elected leader to come to the 
table and solve it now, before it is too late.'' And that's what I want 
to discuss here.
    By the way, I'm really excited about the opportunity to fix Social 
Security. That's why we run for office. Someone said, ``It's a steep 
hill to climb, Mr. President.'' Well, my attitude is, the steeper the 
better, because when you get up top, you realize you have left a 
significant contribution behind. And that's the spirit in which I go 
into this dialog with members of both political parties.
    A couple of other points on the accounts. One, you can't take out 
all your money when you retire. In other words, the account is there to 
add on to that which the Social Security system has given you; it's in 
addition to. Secondly, it's a--there is a way to make sure that when you 
come closer to retirement, you can alter the mix of stocks and bonds or 
T bills or whatever it might be so that you're able to better control 
the investment portfolio. In other words, there's flexibility within the 
guidelines that the Government has set, just like the Thrift Savings 
Plan of Federal employees.
    We've got some citizens here who have agreed to lend some of your 
expertise to the subject. After all, you're dependent on Social 
Security, and I'm not. You're an expert on it.
    First, I want to bring in Jeff Brown. 
What do you do, Jeff? That's a loaded question, I already knew the 
answer, of course. [Laughter]
    Jeffrey R. Brown. I'm a Ph.D. in 
economics, and I'm a professor at one of the other great Midwestern 
universities.
    The President. Ph.D. in economics. It's an interesting lesson, isn't 
it? He's the adviser and the Ph.D. I'm the 
President and a fair student. [Laughter]
    All right, Doc. You're an expert on 
Social Security.
    Dr. Brown. That's right. I've been 
studying it for about a decade now, and the good news is, it doesn't 
really require a Ph.D. to understand that the program is in trouble.
    The President. Well, give people your thoughts, seriously.

[At this point, Dr. Brown, assistant professor, Department of Finance, 
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, Champaign, IL, made further 
remarks.]

    The President. Yes, tell me--you know what's interesting about this 
subject? I was just looking at Dr. Brown--
he's a young-looking guy--and I was thinking about when I was his age, I 
don't remember much discussion about Social Security being in trouble. I 
think we all took it for granted, precisely because the math was fine. 
And what he's telling you is, is that there has been a demographic 
shift. People are living longer; people are having fewer babies. And you 
might remember the old campaigns. They'd say, ``Vote for me. I'm going 
to make sure you get greater Social Security benefits.'' Well, that's 
what happened. They'd promise more and more and more. And so my 
generation has been promised benefits that the Government just can't pay 
for, unless graduates from Notre Dame University are willing to pay a 
significant chunk of their earnings to support me. And I'm not so sure 
they're going to be willing to do so when it comes time.
    You got anything else there, Jeffrey?

[Dr. Brown made further remarks.]

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    The President. Yes, what he also is 
saying is that when you save more, when there's more savings, it 
encourages capital investment. Capital investment means the economy is 
more likely to be strong. And that's important. There is a direct 
correlation between savings and investment, and investment means jobs 
and productivity and, eventually, higher wages. And so this will not 
only have a good--be good for our fellow workers and fellow Americans 
but it will be good for the economy.
    Well, good. Glad you're here, Jeff, 
thanks for coming.
    Listen, we've got Mark and Betty 
Batterbee. Isn't that right?
    Betty Batterbee. That's right.
    The President. Okay, where do you live?
    Mrs. Batterbee. We live in Edwardsburg, 
Michigan.
    The President. Good. Welcome. I'm glad the people of Indiana let you 
in. [Laughter]
    Mrs. Batterbee. Yes, they did. 
[Laughter] We're from Michiana.
    The President. Yes, you're Michiana, all right. You've got some 
children?
    Mrs. Batterbee. Yes, we do. Together, 
Mark and I have 11 children. We have a very large family, which 7 of 
them are here today.
    The President. Seven are here? Good.
    Mrs. Batterbee. Yes, they're over here.
    The President. There they are. Make sure you listen to your 
mother. [Laughter]
    Mrs. Batterbee. We have 35 
grandchildren, and we have six great-grandchildren.
    But first, Mr. President, I think it's an honor to be here. I'm so 
delighted.
    The President. Well, thanks for coming, Betty. I appreciate you being here.
    Mrs. Batterbee. And I have a message 
that I would like you to take to Laura. We think she is a gracious and 
adorable First Lady, and we're so proud that she's our First Lady.
    The President. Thank you. I'm proud of her. 
Thank you, Betty.
    Mrs. Batterbee. Okay.
    The President. Social Security. [Laughter]

[Mrs. Batterbee made further remarks.]

    The President. Yes, let's stop here; this is an important point. Her 
husband had paid into the system. She was too young for survivor 
benefits, and therefore, the money they paid into the system just went 
away. There was nothing. Here was a man who had worked, supported his 
family, paid payroll taxes, passed away earlier, and she had zero. I 
don't think that's a fair system. If we had personal accounts, there 
would have been an asset that this family had earned.
    You're doing great. Keep going on.
    Mrs. Batterbee. I'll let Mark talk.
    The President. You want to introduce Mark?
    Mrs. Batterbee. Oh, this is my 
husband. [Laughter]
    The President. I was wondering who he was 
sitting there, you know? [Laughter] Very good job.
    Mark, thank you. Tell everybody what you 
did.
    Mark Batterbee. My name is Mark 
Batterbee, and this is my very gracious wife, Betty. I served as a 
pastor in the missionary church for over 40 years in--both in Michigan 
and in the Michiana area. I retired just about 3 years ago. I have to 
say something, Mr. President, how much I appreciate and I believe how 
much we appreciate the strong leadership that you have provided in the 
office of President of the United States.
    The President. I appreciate that. Thank you. [Applause] Thank you 
all. Okay. They've got to go back to work here. Thank you. Thanks.
    Mr. Batterbee. Also I want to say that as 
a, quote--maybe I shouldn't--as a, quote, ``evangelical'' myself, I want 
to say how much I have appreciated the moral and--leadership that he has 
provided for all of us, and the fact that he has been an example for the 
youth of America and for everyone.

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    The President. Well, thanks, Mark.
    Mr. Batterbee. Now to business. 
[Laughter]
    The President. Yes, now we got the preacher over with, let's head 
toward the pocketbook. [Laughter]

[Mr. Batterbee made further remarks.]

    The President. Let me ask you something, Mark. Sorry to interrupt. You're getting Social Security now. 
Does it matter?
    Mr. Batterbee. Yes. Today, Betty and I--
Social Security provides a great part of our day-to-day expenses. And we 
appreciate that very much. However, I have a number of children. You've 
already seen them out here, children, grandchildren, and great-
grandchildren, that when their time comes to receive Social Security, 
apparently there will be none.

[Mr. Batterbee made further remarks.]

    The President. Yes, I appreciate that, Mark. This is a generational issue, when you think about it. 
See, this good couple counts on their Social Security check. And there's 
a lot of people that really do rely upon their check. It's important for 
people to know we know that. I know it. And we would never put anything 
in place that would cause this couple not to get their check, not to 
have the Government promise fulfilled. And that's really important for 
people to hear. But this is a generational issue beyond that. This is--
you're hearing--how many grandkids, 34?
    Mrs. Batterbee. Thirty-five.
    The President. Thirty-five, yes. It keeps growing. Either that or I 
didn't hear you right. [Laughter] There's a lot of people who are 
saying, ``Once I'm confident that I'm going to get my check,'' older 
Americans should be saying to Members of Congress, ``What about my 
grandkids,'' because we have a significant problem for our grandkids 
coming up, and for kids.
    And I want to thank you all for joining us. I--we were talking 
earlier, and one of the things that made me feel great was when they 
both said, ``I don't worry about my check being taken away from me.'' 
And that's important for me to hear. You know, when you launch a dialog 
like this, you--one of the things that a President must be mindful of is 
creating uncertainty amongst people who depend upon their check. So I'm 
going to spend a lot of time assuring our fellow citizens that when you 
talk about reform, you're not talking about making sure that you don't 
get the promise.
    So I want to thank you all for sharing that with me. Thanks for 
having all those kids, too. [Laughter]
    Anyway, Fran Martinez. Fran, thanks 
for coming. What do you do?

[Francisco Martinez, steel purchasing manager, Steel Warehouse, South 
Bend, IN, made brief remarks.]

    The President. Let me stop you right there. Everybody know what a 
401(k) is--401(k)? I don't think we'd have known that when we were 
coming up, Mitch. A 401(k) means 
manage your own money, see it grow.
    Mr. Martinez. Exactly.
    The President. Does that make you----
    Mr. Martinez. It's a sense of 
ownership. And I think the idea of personal retirement accounts, as 
you're proposing in these reforms, I'm very encouraged as a taxpayer to 
know that that could be a reality one day for us.
    The President. Some people say, ``Well, it's really hard to manage 
your own money.'' I mean, it's a--for some people it's a foreign 
concept. Is that the case for you, on your 401(k), I mean----
    Mr. Martinez. No, that's--you know 
what, you look at it all the time. You get a quarterly statement once 
every quarter, every 3 months, and you see your money grow. This money 
that you're putting in every week continues to grow. And I believe that 
we should have a part of that in our system today that we have, and we 
don't have that.

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    The President. Long-term investments take out swings in markets, and 
a conservative mix takes them out even further. So when you hear people 
say, ``Oh, if you put your money in the market, you'll lose it all,'' 
that's just not the way it works. We're talking about people holding 
money over a long period of time with a conservative mix in stocks and 
bonds.
    I hear people say, ``Well, I can't do that,'' or ``Certain people 
can't manage their own money.'' But you've got to understand life is 
changing, particularly for younger generations of Americans. Here you're 
looking at a 36-year-old man who has got a 401(k). It's a defined 
contribution plan. He's watching his 
money grow. My attitude is, why shouldn't we apply that very same 
concept to his other source of money, his payroll taxes, and setting up 
his own account?
    Now, let me ask you something. Your children--obviously, you're in 
the business of making sure they're educated----
    Mr. Martinez. Correct.
    The President. ----but I presume you're trying to build up an asset 
base for them.
    Mr. Martinez. Absolutely. Part of the 
responsibility of us parents is to set aside money for them, for their 
education and for down the road. And that's a very important part of our 
family.
    The President. So he builds up--Fran 
sets aside money. It grows; it grows; it grows from his personal 
account. He passes on, and the kids can do with the money whatever they 
want to do with it. It's not their retirement account. It is their money 
to live on. It's their money to invest. It is a nest egg. It is a part 
of their wealth and their worth. Seems like to me that's a concept that 
we ought to spread to every family in America. This idea of, only a 
certain number of people should be allowed to invest is something I 
totally reject, and I think it's wrong. There will be plenty of help for 
people to learn how to watch as stocks and bonds grow, to be able to 
pick and choose the risk and reward that the Government says is 
available for you. There's plenty of people that have got the capacity 
to do that.
    And I want to thank you for thinking that way, Fran. It's an important concept.
    Debbie Johnson. You don't need to tell 
your age. [Laughter]
    Debbie Johnson. Thank you, Mr. 
President. [Laughter]
    The President. But you do have the hardest job in America, which is 
being a single mom.

[Deborah Johnson, business development and public relations officer, 
Bayer Federal Credit Union, Mishawaka, IN, made brief remarks.]

    The President. So, why--single mom, too, 
really busy, sitting on the stage with the President talking about 
Social Security--why?
    Ms. Johnson. I forgot to tell you, I'm 
also a part-time student at Bethel College.

[Ms. Johnson made further remarks.]

    The President. Let me stop you, sorry. Do you hear what she said? ``I do not believe''--Members of Congress need 
to hear--``I do not believe that Social Security will be around when it 
comes time to retire.''
    Ms. Johnson. No, I don't.
    The President. I don't blame you. [Laughter]

[Ms. Johnson made further remarks.]

    The President. Yes, this is a very important part of the dialog. 
We've got folks saying, ``I'm comfortable when I get my check.'' And 
we've got taxpayers saying, ``I don't think I'm ever going to see one.'' 
As a matter of fact, somebody told me one time, a poll amongst youth--I 
didn't see the poll, generally don't pay attention to them, but 
nevertheless, it said that young people think it's more likely they're 
going to see a UFO than get a Social Security check. [Laughter] Were you 
in that poll?
    Ms. Johnson. Yes.

[[Page 374]]

    The President. The fundamental question facing our society and 
facing our Congress is, are we willing to worry about taxpayers that 
have yet to come close to retirement? That's really what we're talking 
about. I campaigned on this issue. I said, ``Vote for me, and I'm going 
to bring forth interesting ideas to make the Social Security system 
sound.'' I believe people appreciate a candid approach to issues and 
want people to work together to solve problems. And if I were a younger 
American, I'd be asking loud and clear, ``What are you going to do about 
this train wreck that's headed my way?'' Again, retirees, people like me 
who are fixing to retire, we're fine. The system is in pretty good 
shape. But it's the people paying into the system to make sure the baby 
boomer generation is given what we've been told, that is really going to 
have a heavy, heavy burden to bear.
    Speaking about young Americans--good job, by the way--Jon Paul 
Surma. Jon Paul, how old are you?
    Jon Paul Surma. I'm 24.
    The President. Anybody here from Notre Dame? That's not much older 
than you, so you need to be paying attention to this.
    Mr. Surma. I'm 24. I'm from Rolling 
Prairie, Indiana. It's about 20 miles from here.
    The President. Rolling Prairie?
    Mr. Surma. Yes, 500 people.
    The President. Yes?
    Mr. Surma. Yes.
    The President. About the size of Crawford.
    Mr. Surma. Yes. [Laughter] I'm part owner 
of a small business, Pyramid Equipment. We're in the waste industry. We 
sell and service waste equipment or garbage trucks. [Laughter] I'm proud 
of what I do, so----
    The President. I'm proud you're an entrepreneur.
    Mr. Surma. Yes. I have 18 employees, 16 
of them full-time.
    The President. Good.
    Mr. Surma. I pay 100 percent of their 
insurance, and then I also implemented a simple IRA for them where I'll 
match 3 percent of what they put in.
    The President. That's good. So that's an individual personal 
account, by the way?
    Mr. Surma. Yes.
    The President. A different kind of personal account.

[Mr. Surma made further remarks.]

    The President. So what do you like about the personal accounts?
    Mr. Surma. What do I like about the 
personal accounts? Is that--right now I don't feel any ownership because 
I feel like you guys are going to take my money, and I'm not going to 
get any of it back.
    The President. Yes, that's a--plain way of saying it. [Laughter]
    Mr. Surma. Yes. And I have the worst luck 
in the world. I'll probably die before I ever get that----
    The President. Wait a minute. [Laughter]
    Mr. Surma. No, no, serious.
    The President. You need to seek help right here at Notre Dame. 
[Laughter]
    Mr. Surma. So I'm afraid that I'll die, 
and then you guys will take more of my money, and then I wish my nieces 
and nephews--being single, I don't have any kids, and I probably will 
never have kids.
    The President. Don't give up. Wait a minute. [Laughter] I thought 
you were an entrepreneur. Entrepreneurs need to be optimistic. How can 
you start you own business unless you see a better future?
    Mr. Surma. I'm married to my job.
    The President. Yes, okay, well--[laughter]--you got plenty of time. 
Don't worry about it.
    Any other 20-year-olders talking about the issue?
    Mr. Surma. What's that?
    The President. Any other 20-year-old people talking about the issue? 
Do 20-year-olders care?
    Mr. Surma. Yes.
    The President. They do? That's good.

[[Page 375]]

    Mr. Surma. That's good.
    The President. You should care. You're not--you're kind of one of 
these lonely heart things, are you, trying to find a--[Laughter]
    Mr. Surma. I'm not going to lie. I was 
looking out in the crowd. [Laughter]
    The President. Yes, that's good. Social Security. [Laughter]
    Mr. Surma. Okay, there you go. [Laughter] 
Like I was saying, if something happens to me, I want my nieces and 
nephews to get the money I paid in. My biggest problem is, being self-
employed, I have to pay the whole percent. I have to pay the employee 
side and the employer side of mine. And I feel like it's a tax burden.
    The President. Yes. You think it's high now--if we don't do 
anything, it's really going to be high.
    Mr. Surma. And I'm afraid that the first 
person you guys come to is me if there's going to be problems.
    The President. You're successful----
    Mr. Surma. Yes. So in the future, if we 
don't do anything, we're either going to have to cut benefits, which you 
say we're not going to do, or we're going to have to take the money from 
another part of the sector.
    The President. Well, I said we weren't going to--the benefits will 
be the same for those who've retired.
    Mr. Surma. Okay.
    The President. I have said we can't afford the benefits that have 
been promised. That's important to hear. And the best way to make sure 
we come closest to the benefits which have been promised--come closest 
to them--is to allow people to take and have that money compound. That's 
how we get closest to the promises. But benefits will not be changed for 
seniors. But beyond that, from 1950 and before, people who have been 
born from 1950 on, there is a serious problem. Let me make that clear.
    Mr. Surma. But my thing is, if we don't 
do anything, we're going to have to probably then raise taxes. And a 35-
percent tax bracket is already too high as it is, in my opinion. And 
it's hurting the economic development and spurns investment.
    The President. Good job. I want to thank you all for joining me on 
this.
    I do want to say one other thing. When I landed, I met Lucy 
Kuminecz. She was at the foot of Air Force 
One. She is a volunteer here in this part of the world with the Busy 
Hands program. It's an interesting way for somebody to contribute to 
somebody's--to help somebody have a bright spot in their life. She makes 
little dolls for children in hospitals and passes them out. She's chosen 
to do this because she's heard a call to love a neighbor like you'd like 
to be loved yourself.
    We talk a lot about the strength of America being our great 
influence in the world or our economic engine, and hopefully we'll solve 
Social Security so that that economic engine continues. But the true 
strength of America is in the hearts and souls of our fellow citizens.
    I remember coming to Notre Dame; in my graduation speech, I talked 
about the call to service, the need for people to realize that a 
contribution to your country can be made in all kinds of ways, 
particularly contributions that come to help those who hurt, those who 
wonder whether or not the American experience is meant for them.
    Lucy, I love to--where is Lucy? She's 
somewhere around here, I know. Oh, Lucy, thank you for coming. I 
appreciate you being here. She volunteers with the retired and senior 
volunteer program. She is a soldier in the army of compassion. And for 
those of you who are interested in how you can serve our country, feed 
the hungry. Provide shelter for the homeless. Put your arm around a 
brother and sister who hurts, and says, ``I love you.'' Mentor a child. 
Teach somebody to read. Take time out of your busy life to help somebody 
who hurts, and this country will be able to realize its full promise for 
every single citizen.

[[Page 376]]

    I'm honored you all came. I hope you've enjoyed this as much as I 
have. May God bless you all, and may God continue to bless our country.

Note: The President spoke at 4:25 p.m. in the Joyce Center at the 
University of Notre Dame. In his remarks, he referred to Rev. Edward A. 
Malloy, C.S.C., president, Rev. John I. Jenkins, C.S.C., president-
elect, and Rev. Theodore M. Hesburgh, C.S.C., president emeritus, 
University of Notre Dame; Gov. Mitch Daniels and State Attorney General 
Steve Carter of Indiana; Mayor Stephen J. Luecke of South Bend, IN; 
Mayor Jeffrey L. Rea of Mishawaka, IN; President Hamid Karzai of 
Afghanistan; President Mahmoud Abbas (Abu Mazen) of the Palestinian 
Authority; Crown Prince Abdullah of Saudi Arabia; and President Bashar 
al-Asad of Syria.