    [Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States: George W. Bush (2003, Book II)]
    [October 14, 2003]
    [Pages 1344-1346]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office www.gpo.gov]

    Interview With Laurence Oakes of Australia's
    Channel 9 TV
    October 14, 2003

    President's Upcoming Visit to Australia

        Mr. Oakes. Mr. President, thanks for speaking to us. What's the main
    purpose of your trip to Australia? Are you hoping for greater Australian
    contribution to the stabilization and rebuilding of Iraq?
        The President. No, the main purpose is to thank the people of
    Australia and thank my friend John Howard for
    being strong in the face of terror and being understanding that we have
    a historic opportunity to bring peace and freedom to parts of the world
    that need peace and freedom. It really is the main purpose. Australia is
    a great country. I would define our relationship as a unique
    relationship. And I'm looking forward to it. I've been there. They tell
    me it's kind of like Texas, which is another reason I want to go.
        Mr. Oakes. I think that's right. But not everyone agrees--in
    Australia, agrees with you on the war. Some members of the opposition
    are talking about possibly protesting when you address the Parliament by
    wearing white armbands or turning their backs. Would that concern you?
        The President. Not at all. No, it means that democracy is alive and
    well. It's a--I don't expect everybody to agree with us, but one thing
    is for certain, the Prime Minister was strong.
    And the Australian

    [[Page 1345]]

    military performed brilliantly; I mean brilliantly. And I've talked to a
    lot of our generals and commanders about how the Australians
    participated, and they were just--A-plus was the rating. And I think a
    lot of people would like to hear that from the American President, and
    I'm going to tell them. And if somebody feels like they want to express
    discontent, that's okay. That's democracy.

    Iraq

        Mr. Oakes. Well, what about the suggestion from your critics that
    while you won the war, the peace is being bungled?
        The President. They're wrong. We're making great progress in Iraq.
    We've got a pretty steep hill to climb. After all, one, we're facing a
    bunch of terrorists who can't stand freedom. These thugs were in power
    for a while, and now they're not going to be in power anymore, and they
    don't like it. And they're willing to kill innocent people. Their
    terrorist activities--we'd rather fight them there than here.
        And secondly, that life is pretty darn good compared to what it was
    under Saddam Hussein. People aren't going to
    be tortured. They're not going to be raped. They're not going to
    mutilated. There are not going to be mass graves. And plus, that the
    infrastructure is improving. I talked to our Secretary of
    Commerce today. His exact--he's in Baghdad.
    He said, ``Look,'' he said, ``Mr. President,'' he said, ``You're not
    going to believe the world here is a lot different than some in America
    think it is. There's a burgeoning marketplace.'' He met with women
    businessowners. I mean, there's excitement there about a free society
    emerging, and it's in our interests that this society be free.

    Australian Detainees in Guantanamo Bay

        Mr. Oakes. Sir, there are two Australian citizens being held in
    Guantanamo Bay.
        The President. Yes.
        Mr. Oakes. What's going to happen to them? And what do you say to
    people in Australia who think they should be either charged or released?
        The President. Well, we would be glad to work with the Government on
    the issue. And if John wants to discuss it, I'm
    more than happy to discuss it. We're working with a variety of countries
    that have got people in Guantanamo Bay. These are people picked up on
    the battlefield. We're trying to learn more about them to make sure we
    fully understand----
        Mr. Oakes. Are they being tortured?
        The President. No, of course. We don't torture people in America.
    And people who make that claim just don't know anything about our
    country.

    Australia-U.S. Free Trade Agreement

        Mr. Oakes. Another issue between the two countries is the--possibly
    the free trade agreement.
        The President. Yes, sir.
        Mr. Oakes. Do you think you will get it, and will you be using this
    to push it along?
        The President. Yes. I told John that we'd like to get a free trade
    agreement done by the end of this year, and I think it's a good
    opportunity to say that again. And he and I won't sit down and negotiate
    the fine points. That's what we've got fine staffs to do, but at our
    level we can encourage the negotiators to move along. Let's get it done.
    Let's resolve our differences. Australia is an important friend, an
    important economy, and I think trade is in our national interests.

    War on Terror

        Mr. Oakes. Australians have spent this week at memorial services for
    the victims of the Bali bombing. Can you hold out any hope for them that
    this--that the war on terrorism is actually getting somewhere?
        The President. Yes, Hambali is no longer a problem. He's the guy
    that organized the Bali bombing. He won't be bombing anybody anymore.
    That's a positive step.

    [[Page 1346]]

        First of all, I understand what it means to be in a country that
    grieves over the senseless death of innocent life. And the Australians
    suffered a mighty blow. And the--matter of fact, the other day I was in
    Kentucky, you know, politics for a guy running for Governor. And a mother--a fine looking couple walked up, a mom
    and dad, said, ``You've got to know, our daughter died in Bali,'' and
    tears in his eyes. And I gave him a big hug. And he said, ``Mr.
    President, whatever you do, don't stop, so it doesn't happen again.''
        The best way to deal with terror is to be on the offensive and to
    find these people and bring them to justice. That's why Australia is
    such an important partner, equal partner, in the war on terror. John
    Howard gets it. He understands. The Prime
    Minister knows that we've got to be tough and at the same time create
    the conditions where there's an alternative to terrorism, and that's
    freedom and peace.
        Mr. Oakes. One final question.
        The President. Sure.

    Australian, British, and U.S. Leaders' Popularity

        Mr. Oakes. You're in trouble politically, if you believe the polls.
        The President. Why do you say that?
        Mr. Oakes. The polls show you dropping in popularity.
        The President. Well, actually, there's a poll that showed me going
    up yesterday. Not to be on the defensive, but go ahead. [Laughter]
        Mr. Oakes. Well, I was going to ask why you think you and Tony Blair
    seem to have lost support, but John Howard hasn't?
        The President. Well, it must be his charisma. [Laughter] I don't
    know. Actually, I'm in pretty good shape politically. I really am. I
    didn't mean to sound defensive.
        Mr. Oakes. No, sir.
        The President. I am. Politicians, by the way, who pay attention to
    the polls are doomed to be kind of chasing--trying to chase opinion.
    What you need to do is lead, set the tone. And I've taken some tough
    decisions. And I will look forward to making the case that the decisions
    I have taken will make America more secure, make the world more
    peaceful, and make this country more prosperous. And so I'm upbeat about
    it. And as to why Howard is maintaining his
    popularity and--he married well, and he's smart.
        Mr. Oakes. Sir, thank you. And I look forward to seeing you in
    Australia.
        The President. Yes, sir. Looking forward to it. Thanks.

    Note: The interview was taped at 3:44 p.m. in the Library at the White
    House, and the transcript was released by the Office of the Press
    Secretary on October 18. In his remarks, the President referred to Prime
    Minister John Howard of Australia; former President Saddam Hussein of
    Iraq; Secretary of Commerce Donald L. Evans; Nurjaman Riduan Isamuddin
    (known as Hambali), Al Qaida's chief operational planner in Southeast
    Asia; and Kentucky gubernatorial candidate Ernie Fletcher. Mr. Oakes
    referred to Prime Minister Tony Blair of the United Kingdom. A tape was
    not available for verification of the content of this interview.