    [Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States: WILLIAM J. CLINTON (1999, Book II)]
    [October 31, 1999]
    [Pages 1936-1940]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office www.gpo.gov]

    Interview With Bryant Gumbel of CBS's ``The
    Early Show''
    October 31, 1999

        Mr. Gumbel. Mr. President, first off, thank you very much for the
    time. I'm grateful.
        The President. You're welcome. I'm glad to see you. Congratulations
    on your new program.
        Mr. Gumbel. Thank you very much.
        The President. It's going to ruin your golf game getting up at 4
    o'clock every morning.

    EgyptAir Flight 990 Aircraft Tragedy

        Mr. Gumbel. Well it's not bad, though; you're on the tee by noon, so
    it's okay. Let me turn serious for a moment.
        We meet against the backdrop of the EgyptAir 990 crash. At this
    point in time, have you any reason to believe this was anything other
    than an accident?
        The President. No. I don't. But I think it's important that we draw
    no conclusions about it and just let the investigation take its course.
        Mr. Gumbel. Given history, given the volatile nature of Mideast
    relationships, do you see the absence of answers in any way impacting
    the Mideast talks in Oslo?
        The President. Based on what I know now, I don't. I had a good talk
    with President Mubarak. I called him
    immediately when I got up this morning, and we talked about it a little
    bit. We're working together with the Egyptian Government in every way we
    can on this crash. So, now, I don't. So, unless there is some question I
    don't know about that arises in the next day or 2, I don't think it
    will.
        Mr. Gumbel. Would you say President Mubarak shares your view right
    now that there is no reason to believe this was anything other than an
    accident?
        The President. Well, I think we agree that the evidence doesn't give
    us any indication that there was, now. But the evidence doesn't say
    anything one way or the other. We don't know. And I think the honest
    answer to people who ask is that they shouldn't have a prejudice about
    it one way or the other. We should just look and see.

    Upcoming Middle East Peace Talks in Oslo, Norway

        Mr. Gumbel. As you look to Oslo, what are your realistic
    expectations of what you can accomplish?
        The President. Well, I hope that by getting together with Prime
    Minister Barak and Chairman Arafat in a setting designed to honor the memory and to evoke
    the memory of Yitzhak Rabin, we can give some new energy to this
    process. They've done really quite well with

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    their cooperation on security, with opening the safe passage from the
    West Bank to Gaza, with agreeing to a very disciplined timetable. But
    now they're getting into these issues which are all hard. And my strong
    conviction is that we've known what these issues are for a long time
    now; they're not going to get any easier. So whatever I and whatever the
    United States can do to facilitate a timely resolution of these issues I
    think will be positive. So I think this will have a positive impact on
    getting the process going along here.
        Mr. Gumbel. Is it easier for you to feel a degree of optimism
    because it's Barak involved right now instead of Netanyahu?
        The President. Well that may be part of it. But I think the main
    thing is that Barak and Arafat have now made an agreement and they're implementing
    it. And they're also cooperating on security issues. And Barak has made
    publicly clear that he had a timetable for resolving this, and he's
    received the support of the Israeli people. So that whole set of
    circumstances make me optimistic.
        On the other hand, I want to say again, we're now down to the hard
    decisions. When Oslo was negotiated, the Oslo agreement, way back at the
    very end of '92, they knew what they were doing in saying, ``Okay, here
    is what we're going to do now; here's what we're going to do in the next
    4 or 5 years; here is what we're going to do at the end.'' And they left
    the hard stuff to the end. It was the right decision, but we're now down
    to the end, and we have to deal with the hard stuff.

    President's Role in 2000 Elections

        Mr. Gumbel. Let's move closer to home. Let's talk politics, close to
    your heart, of course. The two people who have been closest to you for 7
    years are about to get out there on the campaign trail while you stay at
    home and deal with the issues. Is that terribly frustrating?
        The President. No. Actually, I enjoy it. I knew when I started that
    it would come to an end. I was hoping I would be fortunate enough to
    serve two terms, and I have been. And I've loved every day of it. And
    now it's important that the work of the country go on and that the
    direction that we have taken continue and that the changes that still
    need to be made by the country be made. So I'm actually very--I'm proud
    of the Vice President, and I'm very proud
    of my wife for being willing to stick
    their necks out and do this. And I wish them well.
        Mr. Gumbel. What role do you see yourself playing in their
    campaigns?
        The President. Well no official role, really. And I shouldn't. But I
    will do what I'm asked to do. I've helped the Vice President at a couple of fundraisers, and we talk with some
    frequency. And of course, I talk to Hillary all the time, every day. And it's so funny because our
    roles are almost completely reversed now. All the things that she did
    for me over more than 20 years, all the encouragement, reminders,
    helpful suggestions, everything, all the things, we've just kind of
    reversed roles. And I'm enjoying it. I'm trying to do a good job in my
    new role.
        Mr. Gumbel. How do you view the polls that have suggested that if
    you're on the campaign trail with them, you may be more of a liability
    than a positive?
        The President. Well, what I think people are saying is we want these
    people to sell themselves. And we don't want anyone to tell us how to
    vote. That's the point I tried to make in Philadelphia when I was
    campaigning for John Street, that I don't
    want to tell you how to vote. I would like to offer you some reasons
    about why you should vote.
        And I think particularly in New York where Hillary--which has been wonderful to me; I got 58
    percent of the vote; we won by 1.8 million votes in New York in 1996,
    but that doesn't mean that those New Yorkers believe I should tell them
    who should be their Senator. They want to see Hillary out there
    committed to them, their issues, their needs, their future. And the more
    she does that, the more everybody else will be able to make arguments
    about why she should be elected. But I think--and that's just the way
    the democratic process works. And it's good.
        Mr. Gumbel. Would you welcome the chance to get out there and stump
    against Rudy Guiliani, or if the case calls for it, George W. Bush?
        The President. Well, what I hope that I will be able to do is to
    remind the American people of where we were 7 years ago, where we are
    now, where we need to go in the future. I agree with the majority of
    people who say they still want change. The question is, what kind of
    change do we want? And the vote of the public in the year 2000--the
    American people will not decide whether we're going to change

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    or not; we are. You know, things are changing at a breathtaking pace,
    and we have to keep up. The question is, what kind of change will we
    embrace? And insofar as I can offer my observations, not only as the
    President but as a citizen, as someone who wants our grandchildren to
    live in the strongest possible country, I will do that.
        But you have to be careful. I can't expect anybody to vote for
    anyone, not just the Vice President and
    Hillary, not anyone, just because I
    say they should do it. So the only thing I can do is hope that the
    position I have will get people to listen to whatever reasons I offer.

    Vice President's Candidacy

        Mr. Gumbel. Why do you think, turning to the Vice President's
    campaign for a second, if I might, why do you think the Vice President
    is having such a difficult time opening up ground between himself and
    Bill Bradley?
        The President. Well, first I think he's doing a good job on his
    campaign right now. I thought he did a good job in the debate. I think
    he did a good thing to go home to Tennessee. And I think that if--by
    historical standards, he's doing quite well. I think Bill
    Bradley is an intelligent, a compelling man
    with a good life story and a lot of friends built up in professional
    basketball and 18 years in the Senate and all the other things he's
    done. And he's out there running a credible campaign.
        But if you look at the last time this happened, when then-Vice
    President Bush was running against Bob Dole, at this time in that race
    Vice President Bush was only one point ahead of Bob Dole in the national
    polls.
        People want to see the Vice President out there establishing his own
    identity with his own program for the future, making clear where he
    wants to go. If he does, I think he will be nominated. And I think he's
    doing a good job of that now.

    Gov. George W. Bush of Texas

        Mr. Gumbel. It would seem that at this point that whoever prevails
    will be going up against George W. Bush. In style and personality,
    Governor Bush has been characterized as the GOP's version of you.
    Flattering? Offensive?
        The President. It's certainly not offensive. I think he's got--he's
    a very accomplished political leader, and he's got good instincts for
    where the political center is.
        Mr. Gumbel. Flattering then?
        The President. And I think--well, let me say, and I think he's made
    a deliberate decision to present his candidacy as sort of a new
    Republican, kind of a kinder, gentler Republican alternative. What I
    hope the American people will focus on when they get to the general
    election--and we're not there yet. Let me say, I don't think Senator
    McCain is out of this yet. I think he's a very
    credible alternative. And I think that the fact that he's been willing
    to participate in these debates, and Governor Bush hasn't, I think is a
    plus for McCain.
        Assuming we get to that point, then I think the issue will be, what
    does the Republican nominee offer for the future? What does the
    Democratic nominee offer to the future? What would the combination of a
    Republican President and Republican Congress bring to our future? Will
    it bring back this tax cut I vetoed? Does it mean the NRA will continue
    to control the gun debate? Or will we have somebody trying to have
    sensible gun restraint mechanisms? Does it mean we'll never get a
    Patients' Bill of Rights because the health insurance companies don't
    want it? There are all these issues that I think will become quite clear
    maybe not even until next August, but in August, September, and October,
    you're going to see a very vigorous debate that will shape not only the
    next 4 years but maybe the next 10 or 15 years of America's new century.
        Mr. Gumbel. Before I leave the subject of Governor Bush, what's your
    take on the demarkation line he's drawing on past drug use for his
    personal life?
        The President. I'm going to leave that to--that's up to the public
    really. The people are in the driver's seat now. And the press will
    express their views and do what they think is right, and the politicians
    will express their views and do what they think is right. But in the
    end, the public has to be the judge of that.
        Mr. Gumbel. Let me rephrase. In your opinion, do you believe
    previous cocaine use should disqualify someone from sitting in this
    office?
        The President. My opinion is that the public will make a decision,
    that if--most people think they ought to know if there is some serious
    problem in someone's background, and if so, how that person has dealt
    with it. The American people tend to be forgiving about many things, but
    there are some things they want to know and then there are other things
    they don't want

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    to know. And they may change their mind from time to time. Maybe they
    think it depends upon how long ago it was. Maybe they think it depends
    upon how it was treated.
        But I think that if I get in the middle of this debate, it will
    interfere with having a debate that's free of distraction; that is, my
    opinion would only be a distraction given the way--the kind of treatment
    I got from '91 forward from the Republicans and their allies. And I
    think I should stay out of it and let the people make the right
    decision.
        Mr. Gumbel. New York Times Magazine cover, as I think you probably
    saw, had a cover a week and a half ago of ``Slam, Bam, Sham,''
    suggesting that modern culture generates Presidential candidates whose
    lone qualifications are fame and a degree of celebrity. Do you see that
    as a disturbing trend?
        The President. Well, I certainly didn't have any fame or celebrity
    when I ran. In President Bush's terms, I was the Governor of a small
    southern State.
        Mr. Gumbel. I think the headline was aimed at those who are courting
    the Reform Party at this point.
        The President. Oh, I know. But no, I don't. You know, Governor Bush
    is in part of the position he's in because his father was President. But
    in the end, the voters will judge him, I think, based on his own merits.
        The Kennedys have spawned, now, two generations, and it won't be
    long before there will be a third generation, of young people who
    present themselves for public service. They're aided in the beginning
    because of their name, but in the end, they're judged on their own
    merits.
        And I don't think someone should be disqualified for seeking public
    office because they've been in entertainment, or business, or athletics.
    But sooner or later, the voters look at them and they say, ``Well, can
    this person perform?'' So I don't see it as a bad thing. I basically
    trust the voters on this. As long as they've got time enough to make a
    good decision, I think they normally make it. That's why we're still
    around here after 200 years.
        And the more--the bigger the country gets, the more people will have
    an advantage, who for some reason or another, are already known by a lot
    of people. On the other hand, if somebody really good and is known by no
    one has a chance to start, the same mass media can make you famous in a
    hurry. So I'm not particularly worried about this.

    Post-Presidential Plans

        Mr. Gumbel. Are you going to miss being President?
        The President. I think so, yes. I think I will because I love the
    job. You know, just today I got up--I do what I did Sunday afternoon,
    every Sunday afternoon. I went through all my work for the last week
    that I hadn't done, and all the plans for the next week. I love this
    job. I've worked at it, and I've loved it, and it's been an honor to
    serve. So yes, I will miss it.
        On the other hand, I'm so focused, almost to the point of obsession,
    on what we can still get done here. And I'm genuinely looking forward to
    what I'm going to do when I'm not President anymore.
        Mr. Gumbel. And that would be?
        The President. Well, I'm going to set up my library and public
    policy center. And I'm going to try to be a very good citizen without
    getting in the way of the next President.
        Mr. Gumbel. What kind of odds would you quote on you ever running
    for office again, any office?
        The President. Oh, I think they would be pretty long. Although, you
    know, I used to joke that I might run for the school board someday. I
    don't know. I certainly have no plans to run for office. And I'm going
    to have to get out here and earn a little money and try to make sure
    that my wife and daughter are okay. Maybe something could happen someday
    and I would want to run. I just don't know.

    President's Legacy

        Mr. Gumbel. Presidents generally get one line in the history, if
    they get one line. JFK was shot. Nixon had Watergate. Reagan beat
    communism. Clinton?
        The President. Turned the economy around and prepared America for a
    new century.
        Mr. Gumbel. You would be satisfied if your legacy was erasing the
    Nation's red ink?
        The President. I think that's one of my legacies. But I think the
    real legacy is America is genuinely transformed from where it was 7
    years ago. Look at where we were in `92. We had economic distress. We
    had social divisions, as embodied in the riot in Los Angeles. We

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    were in political drift; government was completely discredited. And I
    said, ``Look, give me a chance. I've got some new ideas to create
    opportunity, to increase responsibility among our citizens, to build a
    community of America.'' And we set about changing. Meanwhile, America
    was changing.
        The day I took office as President there were only 50 websites on
    the Internet in the whole world, 50. That's how much we've changed. So
    yes, we've got the strongest economy in history. And yes, we're paying
    off the debt instead of being in debt. But we also have cut our welfare
    rolls in half. We've got the lowest crime rate in 30 years. We've got
    the lowest poverty rate in 30 years. We've reversed this wage
    inequality. All groups are growing. A couple of million children have
    been moved out of poverty. The air is cleaner. The water is cleaner. We
    set aside more land to protect it than any other administration except
    those of Franklin and Theodore Roosevelt.
        So the whole Nation has been transformed. We literally have prepared
    the country for another century. If you compare it from now to then;
    instead of a distressed economy, you've got a booming economy. Instead
    of a divided society, you've got the social problems being solved. And
    instead of political drift and discrediting of government, we've got the
    smallest Government in 37 years, and it's actually doing things for
    people, empowering people.
        So I think that I have been fortunate enough to serve as President
    at a time of dramatic transformation, when we really have--in the
    metaphor I used in 1996--built a bridge to the future. And now the
    American people are going to have to decide how they want to walk over
    it.

    President's New York Residence

        Mr. Gumbel. Final note. If my research is correct, you sign papers
    next week, final papers, on the house in Chappaqua. Do you happen to
    know what's the closest golf course to your house in Chappaqua?
        The President. I don't, no.
        Mr. Gumbel. Whippoorwill Country Club in Armonk. Do you know who is
    a member there?
        The President. Are you?
        Mr. Gumbel. Yes, sir.
        The President. I would be happy to be your guest any time. I'm easy
    about that.
        Mr. Gumbel. Mr. President, safe travels.
        The President. Thanks.

    Note: The interview was videotaped at 4:08 p.m. in the Oval Office at
    the White House for broadcast on November 1. In his remarks, the
    President referred to President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt; Prime Minister
    Ehud Barak of Israel; Chairman Yasser Arafat of the Palestinian
    Authority; Philadelphia mayoral candidate John F. Street; and former
    Senators Bill Bradley and Bob Dole. A portion of this interview could
    not be verified because the tape was incomplete.