[Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States: George H. W. Bush (1991, Book I)]
[June 15, 1991]
[Pages 663-673]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office www.gpo.gov]



Interview With Linda Douglas of KNBC, Jim Lampley of KCBS, and Paul 
Moyer of KABC in Los Angeles, California
June 15, 1991

President's Health

    Q. You won't play in an hour and a half, I guarantee you. You won't 
get around.
    The President. Even in a cart?
    Q. If you drive fast, you might.
    The President. ----a little golf today.
    Q. Gaining some of the weight back, are you?
    The President. Unfortunately.
    Q. Do you still do the stair-climber?
    The President. Is that a vicious assault on my figure, or what? 
[Laughter]
    Q. No, you look good. I know you dropped----
    The President. Actually, I got it down. I was, normally, weighed out 
about 198. Got it down to 185 in a not-very-pleasant way. The medicine 
drove it--now I'm at 190.
    Q. Can you feel the thyroid medicine's side effects?
    The President. Not anymore. I feel it in that it's not quite right 
in the tummy and stuff, when it affects you in that way.
    Q. Doesn't make you feel logy and tired, though?
    The President. By the end of the day I'm probably a little more 
tired than I would have been, but I have a full schedule. Go to work at 
7 a.m. and all of that; work normally. Like yesterday, though, I came 
home before going to the ball game and took a little nap, which I might 
have done anyway because of the 3-hour time change.
    Q. Have you had any other recurrence of the accelerated heartbeat? 
Has that happened?
    The President. I don't think so. I think it's supposed to from time 
to time, but if it has, it's been very, very short. But I think it's 
been normal 99.9 percent of the time. They don't seem to worry about 
that anymore.

Abortion

    Q. Mr. President, as you know, abortion may be a key issue in the 
1992 Presidential campaign. You have supported the overturning of Roe 
versus Wade. Why do you think that States should be able to make 
abortion illegal? Why do you think abortion should be illegal?
    The President. Well, because I think there are too many abortions, 
and I favor life over abortion. I think there are other means. I've said 
this in the past, but I think adoption is a good one; I think education 
is one. The spiraling rate of abortions in this country just bothers me 
from an ethical standpoint. So, it's that. And my position is well-
known.
    Incidentally--you put it in a context of an election--I remember in 
1988. Some think this is the deciding factor. It's but one of but many 
issues. And in the Republican Party, for example, we have people that 
agree with me and we have people that disagree with me. And so, I think 
it will always be that way, and it's a very tough personal issue for the 
American people. But that's my position, and I'm going to stay with it.
    Q. Pete Wilson, Governor of California, has taken a very strong 
position against your position, that is, your position support-

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ing the law which would prohibit Federal funding of clinics that 
disseminate abortion information. He would use scarce California tax 
dollars to supplant those Federal funds that you are trying to cut off. 
How do you react to that? Is that frustrating to you?
    The President. No, not at all. What's frustrating to me is using 
Federal taxpayers to promote or counsel on abortion. That's against the 
policy of this and previous administrations. But whatever somebody else 
at State levels do, I can't argue with the Governor. We have a 
difference on how we look at that very sensitive question. But there are 
so many other issues with which I agree with him that it doesn't bother 
me, if that was the question, at all.
    So, I think the thing is, look, here's what I believe. We've got 
people in our party that agree and people that disagree, so stay with 
your position. And have people understand that we've got a ``big tent'' 
approach in our party, and I think the Democrats do. I think many, many 
Democrats support my position.
    You know, they had some protesters out at CalTech where I spoke 
yesterday. As I said to the crowd there, it was kind of beneath the 
dignity of my office because there were so few. [Laughter] Normally, we 
can attract more protest than that. But they had gags. They were the 
noisiest people with gags in their mouths, I'll admit, that I've ever 
seen. What they were protesting, though, is something quite--a 
misunderstanding. I think they were saying the Federal Government says 
you can't inform people about--I mean, that the policy in the country as 
a result of the Supreme Court decision is that you can't inform people 
about abortion. That's not correct. I just don't want them done with 
Federal taxpayers' money going in a way that would promote abortion. And 
that's my view. But people are free to do it, but I don't want the 
Federal money going into that.

Iraq

    Q. Mr. President, Saddam Hussein is still there.
    The President. Yes.
    Q. The sanctions before the war didn't get him out. His people did 
not overthrow him, as you called for them to do. He put down two 
rebellions, one in the north, one in the south. The bottom line is he's 
still there. What's it going to take to get him out?
    The President. Well, may I remind you a little history. The policy 
was not to get him out of office; the policy was to get him out of 
Kuwait. International statements by the United Nations in concert said, 
this aggression won't stand. The original call for sanctions by those 
who opposed my policy right up to the very end was, ``Sanctions will get 
him out of Kuwait; sanctions will reverse the aggression.'' It was very 
clear to me that it wouldn't. And so, out he went from Kuwait--which 
would have, under the policy of everybody, achieved all the objectives. 
It achieved ours.
    Then along comes the Kurd problem and the Shiite problem. And my 
view is, we will not have normalized relations with Saddam Hussein as 
long as he's behaving this way. But get it in focus. Don't change the 
goalposts, I tell my critics. The goalposts were, aggression will not 
stand. And aggression didn't stand. And it was an enormous victory that 
was properly celebrated here and all around the world.
    Now, am I happy that Saddam Hussein is there? Absolutely not. Will 
we lighten up on international sanctions as long as he's there? No. But 
I must clarify, because the way your question came at me made me think 
of some of the political critics who were saying we didn't succeed. We 
did succeed. And our objective was never to throw him out of office. 
Look at all the U.N. resolutions.
    So, I'm still hopeful that, recognizing the economy in that country 
is very sorry, that the Iraqi people will do what they should have done 
long ago, in my view. This man is unforgivably brutal. What he's done to 
the environment, what he did to the people of Kuwait, what he's doing to 
his own people is unconscionable. But it was not an objective of the 
United Nations resolutions or the U.S. policy to throw him out of 
office. The objective was to throw him out of Kuwait, and boy, did our 
people perform well.
    Q. If I can follow up, your people are interviewing an Iraqi 
defector, and they

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take great credence in what he's saying about the fact that there are 
maybe four nuclear installations in northern Iraq that we didn't know 
about, one hidden in a mountain. There could be 88 pounds of highly 
enriched uranium, enough to make two or three bombs. Forty percent of 
his chemical capability could still be there. What are the implications 
of that, Mr. President, to Israel's security, to the United States, and 
what are we going to do about it?
    The President. The implications are that he is violating agreements 
with the overall peace agreement. The implications are that he's got 
to--I mean, the answer to these charges is that we're going to have to 
find out how much of all these allegations are true and make him comply 
with what is now international law through an agreement with all the 
parties that they would fully account for what's left.
    And so, there are a lot of sources. I think you're dealing, 
understandably, with part of the data. I hope I'm dealing with more of 
the data. I don't think either of us is dealing with all of the data. 
So, one, we've got to establish the facts, and two, we have to make 
clear that he will not remain with a nuclear capability. And, yes, 
probably some of it did survive, obviously. And I can state this without 
contradiction: His ability to project all this into an atomic weapon has 
been set back into the Dark Ages. But nevertheless, you're right when 
you say there should--or indicate that there should be concern about his 
possession of any of these things.
    So, we've got to probe. The U.N. has a committee; they must go and 
examine every lead. They must go into the geography, into the places 
that defectors or any other pieces of intelligence lead us. And he 
better be open about it. And that's one more reason there will not be 
any normalized relations under the status quo.

Military Base Closures

    Q. Mr. President, let's turn to the subject of our military defenses 
and California's economy. We are 2 weeks away now from final 
recommendations as to how many California military bases are going to be 
recommended for closure. Millions of dollars--hundreds of millions of 
dollars, thousands of jobs at stake. The Long Beach Naval Shipyard, just 
for one example, turns a profit, returned $56 million to the Treasury 
last year, and is targeted for elimination. What do you see as the most 
important criteria in making these final decisions?
    The President. What I see is the most important criteria is what's 
best for the overall defense of this country. We pledged to get defense 
spending down, and it is moving down dramatically. We've seen in the war 
the need to have a rapid-deployed force that is the best in the world. 
And we've seen in this, out of the Gulf Desert Storm operation, Desert 
Shield, the need to project naval forces around the world.
    So, the policies of the Defense Department are based on this 
national interest. Now, there is a Base Closure Commission that will be 
making final recommendations, and they are trying to approach this 
without regard to politics. They are trying to say what is the best for 
the national defense. And as you would cite the concerns from a shipyard 
that has performed well, I can shift you to the east coast and cite the 
concerns about an airbase that my airplane lands in that was the first 
one--Air Force One up at Pease Air Force Base, the SAC base--that had a 
useful role to play in Desert Storm and is targeted for the first 
airbase to be closed.
    I would also make a political statement that I hope is not 
misinterpreted by the people of Long Beach. Every Congressman I know 
wants to close bases, but they want to close them in the other guy's 
district. And so, what we're trying to do is take into consideration the 
economic facts, take into consideration how well an installation has 
performed, but do what's best for the national good. And then it will go 
up to the Congress, and it will be fine-tuned there.
    But I might say, it's not just bases. It is systems, vast, expensive 
military systems. And I have great confidence in the Secre- tary of 
Defense and in Colin Powell and the Chiefs to make these very tough 
decisions. But I remember the campaign and the politics where--``Why are 
you spending so much on defense?'' Well, defense has taken a big hit, 
and we can live with it. But we've

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got to live with it in a way that projects force rapidly and so I can go 
to the American people and say, look, we've got the adequate defenses--
sea and air and ground--to, one, safeguard this country, and two, to do 
what's right around the world.
    Q. So, are you saying that you're likely to go down the line with 
the recommendations of the Defense Base Closure Commission regardless of 
whether those recommendations run counter to your short-term economic 
goals and dollars?
    The President. Absolutely. Short-term economic--I will go down the 
line with the recommendations of the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs and 
the Secretary of Defense, just as I did when we waged war in Desert 
Storm.
    Q. If they say Long Beach, Long Beach goes?
    The President. I have great confidence in them. And if I didn't have 
confidence in them, they wouldn't be in their jobs. It's not a 
President's role to second-guess the fine-tuning of the defense. It is 
his dire responsibility to guarantee to the American people that the 
national security interests are being met and that our military is 
second to none in the world. So, I have to look at it that way.
    Q. If they recommend to close the Long Beach Naval Shipyard, you'll 
close it?
    The President. I will not use politics to counter a decision by the 
Chairman of the Joint Chiefs and the Secretary of Defense. And Congress 
will take a look at these matters. But do not count on the President to 
look after my political interests, confident as I am of the ability of 
that shipyard and other shipyards around this country, air-bases around 
this country. That is, the President has to rise above politics no 
matter whether it hurts him or helps him politically. And I have to look 
at it that way. And my appeal to the American people if I run again will 
be, look, we're doing what's in the best interest of the United States.
    And I make one more observation. There's some history to base 
closings. And there's also a history that after bases close, if the 
economy is in good shape, there's a vigorous private sector that comes 
in and that gets these facilities in one way or another. There's a 
public service aspect where some of these could be turned into 
facilities for other purposes. But I am not going to use politics to 
second-guess my Secretary of Defense. And I hope the American people 
understand that.

Vice President

    Q. Mr. President, the Office of the Vice Presidency has always been 
the most powerful springboard into the Presidency that has existed over 
time. Do you hope that Dan Quayle will some day become President?
    The President. Look, let me say something about that. I was there 
for 8 years. You say it's a powerful springboard, but do you remember 
the flak I got that no Vice President since Martin Van Buren had ever 
ascended to the Presidency in his own right? It was called the Martin 
Van Buren syndrome. And I used to go around saying Marty is going to be 
proved wrong, or proved right. And sure enough, it worked out that way.
    My view on Dan Quayle is he's done a good job. He is getting the 
most unfair rap from his critics of anybody that's been in this job. And 
you're talking to ``the wimp.'' You're talking to the guy that had a 
cover of a national magazine that I'll never forgive that put that label 
on me. And now some that saw that we can react when the going gets tough 
maybe have withdrawn that allegation. But it wasn't pleasant. The job 
doesn't lend itself to high profile and decisionmaking. It lends itself 
to loyally supporting the President of the United States, giving him 
your best judgment, and then when the President makes a decision, 
supporting it.
    And Dan Quayle has been superb. May I give you an example? He just 
came back from Eastern Europe. I don't remember any front-page stories 
or spelling out the great success of that trip. And it was successful. 
He's over there reassuring the Eastern Europeans that we are interested 
in their recovery. All you read about is the Soviet Union in that 
regard. He did a fantastic job there. He's done it in South America. 
He's done it in Asia. He's done it domestically, supporting my domestic 
agenda that we don't read too much about. And so,

[[Page 667]]

he's doing a first-class job.
    And I'll let the system work on the politics, but I'm glad to have 
this opportunity to defend him fully. You're not going to get me into 
1992 politics as it relates to the Vice President or this one except to 
say he's going to be on the ticket if I run again.
    Q. That wasn't my question. My question was----
    The President. That's all right, that's my answer. [Laughter] Thank 
you, nice try.
    Q. Do you hope that he will some day become President?
    The President. I gave you my answer. Don't try to get me--and 
listen, I've learned a lot since I saw you guys last, and that is to 
answer what I want to answer, not what you want to ask.
    Q. I'm going to ask you this anyway.
    The President. Go ahead.
    Q. Let's talk about Dan Quayle, the man, all right? Your support for 
him is undeniable. We have just heard it. What is it about Dan Quayle, 
the man, that prompts these jokes from Carson, Letterman, the ``piling 
on,'' as one Congressman put it the other day, and the impugning of this 
man's character? What is it about Dan Quayle, the man, that created 
these kinds of jokes?
    The President. Hey, listen, you're talking to the number one butt of 
the jokes for Leno and Letterman and Johnny Carson for 8 years. I think 
I led the parade. Every once in a while, Ronald Reagan, popular as he 
was with the people, would take a couple of broadsides. But I led the 
parade. It goes with the territory. It has nothing to do with Dan 
Quayle's performance because his performance is superb.
    Q. How did it start?
    The President. Same way it started with me. Same way it starts with 
any Vice President. So, it just goes with the territory. Don't you 
remember what Herbert Hoover said--I mean, who was it said--Vice 
President Garner--``The Vice Presidency isn't worth a warm bucket of 
spit.'' Now, try that one on for size and see how Jay Leno goes with it.
    Q. Are you suggesting that if Pete Wilson were Vice President he'd 
be the subject of just such jokes and barbs?
    The President. I'm suggesting that when I was Vice President for 8 
years, I was the subject of such barbs. It goes with the territory. So, 
look at it that way. And I tell Dan that. I say, hey, start the word 
with a B, not a Q, and put history in perspective. This isn't anything 
new. I admit they're piling on more. But it's so grossly unfair. But the 
only explanation I can give you to a very good question is, it goes with 
the territory. Some good things go with it, too.
    Q. The implications of some of these comments----
    The President. Here I sit, Martin Van Buren to the contrary.
    Q. That's right. The implication of some of these comments about Dan 
Quayle, Mr. President, to be quite candid with you, are that he is not 
very bright, that he's a dufus.
    The President. And they're just so unfair and so grossly wrong that 
I can think of no other answer than it goes with the territory. I really 
believe that. I see the guy every day in action. He asks the tough 
questions. And I ask him--I challenge him on things inside. And I could 
ask for no more loyal supporter in that job than Dan Quayle. So, I can't 
explain it.
    But you know, I'll tell you something. After I had a little 
fibrillation cum thyroid, there was kind of a--there was a piling on. 
Any fair-minded American knows that. Might have been a joke; might have 
been a hype in these news magazines--regrettably, some of them going 
more to the gossip, the little squibs in the front. And yet there was a 
reaction, I think. The American people are saying enough is enough. Look 
at the guy on the merits. And I'm confident when all look at him on the 
merits, they'll see what I see. So, I enjoy defending him because I know 
I'm right. I see him in action. Jay Leno doesn't; he needs a laugh in 
1991, just like he needed one off of me in 1987. It took me a while, 
incidentally, as Vice President to get used to it. Then they were saying 
to me, hey, he's spelling B-U-S-H right, so why not let him fire away. 
[Laughter] You can't do anything about it anyway.
    Q. Well, sir, I guess you do appear to be willing to talk about Mr. 
Quayle, so I guess I don't understand why you're not willing to address 
the question of whether or not you'd like him to be President some day.
    The President. I answered your question

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as best I can, and I'm not going to answer it anymore. I think he's 
well-qualified to be, but please don't inject me into 1996 politics 
before a final decision's been made on 1992. That's the only reason.
    Q. Well, let's talk about----
    Q. So when will that decision----
    The President. If you're asking me, is he qualified, the answer is, 
absolutely, yes. So, let me go a little further and tell you that.

Voter Turnout

    Q. Mr. President, there's a brand new book by the political writer 
of the Washington Post, ``Why Americans Hate Politics.'' Recently we had 
a municipal election here, 5 city council seats up for grabs; voter 
turnout was well under 20 percent. Do Americans hate politics?
    The President. No. I don't agree with whoever the writer is for----
    Q. Why don't they vote?
    The President. Who wrote the book?
    Q. E.J. Dionne.
    The President. Good man. I haven't read the book, regrettably, so 
I----
    Q. Why don't Americans vote?
    The President. Why don't they what?
    Q. Vote.
    The President. Maybe they're happy with their President. Do you 
think? I don't know why. I don't know why they don't participate. 
They're making a big mistake if they don't. And I think there's a 
turnoff on politics. I've been pointing out some of it recently in the 
fact that I think there's a frustration with the legislative branch as a 
body because I think people see the Congress, as a whole, not acting.
    And maybe it's my own frustration because we have proposed 
initiative after initiative. I'll give you one example: an anticrime 
bill that we put forward 24 months ago, I think, today, and no action 
has been taken on it. And American people look at their neighborhoods 
and they say, wait a minute, we have 535 Members of Congress, and why 
hasn't something happened? This could be part of it. I don't know. I 
don't know why there's a frustration, but I mean, I should, in fairness, 
look at Dionne's book because I think he's a cogent observer of the 
American political scene. But I hadn't heard of the book or seen it.

1980 Hostage Deal Reports

    Q. Mr. President, I know that you recently wrote a letter to former 
hostage William Morehead, I believe, is his----
    The President. No, not William. Morehead Kennedy.
    Q. Morehead Kennedy, excuse me.
    The President. Yes.
    Q. Eight of the former hostages have called for an investigation of 
the accusations that the Reagan campaign people delayed the release of 
the hostages until after he was inaugurated, signed also by a local 
hostage by the name of Jerry Plotkin, local former hostage. I know your 
feelings on this. Let me ask you, you don't like what you call the 
rumormongering and the speculation. Wouldn't a bipartisan congressional 
investigation with subpoena power put all that to rest?
    The President. It could, and Congress is looking at it.
    Q. Would you like to see it?
    The President. I haven't seen any evidence to support it. None. But 
if Congress concludes it, I'd welcome it. But I've seen enough 
rumormongering and hatemongering, accusing me of things inferentially 
that I don't like, that I can categorically deny it, as I did to 
Morehead Kennedy. I think he's accepted that.
    They had me in Paris on October 20th. So, what did we do? We put out 
a play-by-play, an hour-by-hour part of the schedule. And so, some of 
them had the decency to retract that charge. Others are still saying, 
hey, there's evidence out there. Let Congress do it. I think anything by 
the executive branch would be suspiciously viewed as something less than 
objective.
    Q. But you'd welcome a congressional investigation?
    The President. If they see the evidence to go forward. But to spend 
millions of taxpayers' dollars based on rumors, I'm sorry, I don't think 
that's good.
    But let me tell you this on that one. To assign to me the motive 
that for political gain I would assign an American to captivity one 
minute longer than necessary, I think is a vicious personal assault on 
my integrity and my character as President. I don't think I'd deserve to 
be in this Office

[[Page 669]]

if for one minute I suggested a person be held hostage so I could get 
political gain. And I know the same is true of President Reagan.
    So, this is what troubles me about these allegations. But if there's 
evidence--the Congress is looking, they've got committees looking at 
it--let them go forward. I have nothing to--wouldn't stand in the way of 
that. But if there's no evidence, I think they ought to say so, to lay 
it to rest. If I were a hostage--I told Kennedy, hey, if I were in your 
position and I read a bunch of allegations about me or anyone else, I'd 
be heartbroken. I'd want to get to the bottom of it. But that's not the 
case. So, let me tell you, Morehead, what I know. And I know I had 
nothing to do with it, and I have no knowledge of anybody that had 
anything to do with it.
    Q. Was there an ``it''?
    The President. They're alleging there was an ``it''.
    Q. Can you categorically state that there was never any such plan?
    The President. To the best of my knowledge, I can. I know of 
nothing, direct or indirect, that would suggest this. And I can 
categorically deny that I wasn't in Paris when these rumors and these 
allegations put me there.
    How do you clear your name? Maybe the investigation is it, but it 
has to be based on fact. It can't just go out there and have a billion-
dollar witch-hunt. So, I'd love to get it cleared, and I've done it as 
emphatically as possible. Because this gets to the heart of character. 
This gets to your soul. This gets to what's decent and right in the 
world.
    And to suggest that a sitting President or a then Vice President 
would in any way, direct, indirect, know of and condone this, it touches 
me much more than some that--like disagreeing on abortion or disagreeing 
on closing bases. This one gets to the soul. And I'm glad you gave me a 
chance to wax emotional about it because it really turns me off, these 
little clever suggestions that I might have been involved. And all I can 
do is deny any knowledge of it, direct, indirect, for me or anyone else. 
That's all I can do. And I have a feeling that the American people are 
fair and they'll understand this. This is the most emotional I've been 
about it, but you touched a real nerve, and so did Kennedy. That's why I 
wrote him the letter I did, which categorically denied it, direct or 
indirect.

George Deukmejian

    Q. Mr. President, is George Deukmejian on your list of candidates 
for Attorney General to replace Mr. Thornburgh?
    The President. Hey, you know something? One, great respect for 
George Deukmejian. Two, that matter's been thrown into a cloud, a judge 
intervening in the process up there, so I don't know there's a vacancy. 
And three, I don't have a list. High regard for Deukmejian, tremendous. 
He seems very happy in what he's doing.

President's Health

    Q. Can we get, just very quickly--we touched on it in the 
beginning----
    The President. This is the longest 15-minute interview I've had, 
too. But I've enjoyed it very----
    Q. I know you've got to go tee it up at Sherwood.
    The President. Let's get our priorities sorted out here. [Laughter]
    Q. How are you feeling?
    The President. Healthy.
    Q. Are you still taking the medication?
    The President. Yes, I take medication, and I've brought along my 
doctor, who's tethered out here somewhere, who would be glad to give 
you--oops, he's not tethered out there somewhere. But if you really want 
it, on-camera question, I'm sure he'd be glad to answer it. I'm on 
medication. The medication is trying to get the thyroid in balance and 
guards against, in the process, fibrillation of the heart.
    Incidentally, I think every other guy on the street has had a heart 
fibrillation. I have never seen so much mail from people across the 
country. Not only that, but they're all doctors. They're all telling me 
exactly what to do. We had a letter from one saying it was a conspiracy 
of the Mossad, which happens to be the very good security agency in 
Israel. It's the damnedest thing I have ever seen.
    Q. Are you running again?
    The President. And I'm flattered with the

[[Page 670]]

interest. But I feel very good.
    Q. Running? Are you running again?
    The President. I ran 2 miles on Monday. I worked out on one of those 
bicycles this morning. Play golf today. Play tennis tomorrow. So, I feel 
good. I can't tell you I feel perfect yet, but I'm getting there. Weight 
got low and now bounced up a little. And I'm back. But I want to get off 
all this medicine. And I think they proclaim in a couple of weeks I'll 
be there.

California Elections

    Q. Are you going to endorse Senator Seymour in his race against Bill 
Dannemeyer?
    The President. Yes.
    Q. Even though he's pro-choice?
    The President. Listen, there's a thousand issues, and I'm proud to 
have his support. You know, you asked a good question. What is it that 
tries to find a difference--I guess it's because you don't want to talk 
about all the banks that weren't robbed today, that were not robbed 
today. [Laughter] So, everybody looks for a difference between me and 
another Republican, just as they look at the differences the Democrats 
are fighting endlessly about in the same way. Really carving themselves 
up, nationally. I don't know how it is out here. Maybe it's more 
tranquil, the Willie Brown versus whoever it is in the Senate.
    But nevertheless, I support Seymour. It is my view that the country 
has got other issues on their mind--national security, the economy, the 
environment--a thousand issues, including pro-choice. Are you for 
abortion or are you against it? A lot of people have that one as the 
number one issue. But elections aren't decided on that. And then you 
have another layer which is the values. People tease me about talking 
about family, faith, all this kind of thing.
    So, it's not as simple as some proponents of a special issue would 
have you believe. And I learned long ago, there isn't one single 
Republican that agrees with me on every issue. And I learned something 
else: I'm not going to ask that there be a litmus test on every single 
issue. I want somebody else to vote for me besides me. And so, I support 
Seymour. He's an incumbent Senator. I think I'm going to be out here in 
the fall for a fundraiser for him and I hope it drags in some bucks.
    Q. The other Senate race to fill Alan Cranston's seat. We've got a 
Representative Tom Campbell from up around Stanford who's a moderate 
Republican; we have a conservative by the name of Bruce Herschensohn, 
who's a political commentator. How do you handicap that one?
    The President. The same way I did in handicapping when I ran for 
President in '88. Let the voters decide it.
    Q. You want to endorse somebody there?
    The President. Let the voters decide it. No. I don't get into 
primaries. I'm supporting tickets, but I don't get into primaries.

Upcoming Presidential Campaign

    Q. Sir, you say ``if you run'' again in `92. Why wouldn't you?
    The President. Oh, you're pressing me a little early. Why wouldn't 
I? Can't really think of a reason except, certainly health. I'd owe it 
to the American people to say, hey, I'm up for the job for 4 more years. 
I'm absolutely convinced on that one. If you had to ask me that one 
today, I think health's in good enough shape to certify, yea, but I want 
to take a look at it later on. I don't know. I've got a strong-willed 
wife. Oh, she's strong. [Laughter]
    Q. Who doesn't? [Laughter]
    The President. And the Silver Fox, boy----
    Q. Is there another kind?
    The President. But if the family appealed that I not do it, I'd have 
to say that would weigh with me. Our kids differ, incidentally. Some of 
them are enthusiastic: ``Hey, Mom, I'm on TV.'' [Laughter] And others 
want to shun the--they want to protect their privacy. I think we've 
worked out a balance as a family, but in all seriousness, that could 
have an effect. It wouldn't be decided on running away from a battle. 
The fact if there's a battle, and there will be, that would make me 
inclined to say, ``I'm going to be a candidate again.''
    I just haven't decided. It's early. Don't push me. I think it's good 
politics, too, not to have to get out front and have, ``Here's my 
campaign manager for Orange County,'' or ``Here's who's going to run the 
fundraising effort in San Francisco.'' Too early. You

[[Page 671]]

know, one more point on the politics. They always say, hey, these 
campaigns are too long. Campaigns go on too long. The political 
observers--you had mentioned one. I don't know about Dionne's position, 
but many of them--it's brutal. It's unfair to the American people. 
There's no active political campaign on now for 1992 on either side of 
the aisle. And people are saying, hey, how come you're not in there? How 
come you haven't said you're a candidate?
    Q. So you oppose moving the California primary to March, as opposed 
to its present position in June?
    The President. I'm going to take an heroic position on that one and 
say let Californians decide. [Laughter] That's the federalist system. 
That's the way it works, the way it should work.
    I've got to get out of here now. Come on----
    Q. One more. One more.
    The President. This is Saturday. What is this--Saturday. I'm going 
to go tee it up. A quick one for him, one for her, and then I'm history.
    Q. Thank you.
    The President. And don't ask me the same question again, because I 
just can't answer it. [Laughter]

The Presidency

    Q. I'll ask you a different one. You are perhaps one of the most 
qualified Presidents in our history in terms of your experience, before 
you became President, in government. In light of that, search your soul 
for this one----
    The President. Yes.
    Q. ----and tell me what is it, the one thing about this job that's 
just so doggone harder--much more difficult than you thought it would 
be?
    The President. In many ways it's less hard. But the one thing that's 
harder, or if I could substitute the word frustrating, is the inability 
to get my domestic program through. We're in a fight on civil rights, 
for example. I pride myself on having a record of conscience and 
compassion on civil rights. We have before the Congress a civil rights 
bill that, in my view, would go a long way to eliminating discrimination 
in the workplace. And it would not result in quotas, direct or indirect. 
It wouldn't compel employers to put in quotas in order to avoid 
lawsuits. I feel strongly about this legislation. I can't get my 
legislation seriously considered, hearings before committees on it.
    So, there's a frustration level, and I guess I'd have to accept your 
word: It is harder, given the fact the other party controls both Houses 
of the Congress, to get the things done I want done--or put it more 
broadmindedly, get the things done that I think I was elected to do. 
Therein lies a frustration. But I have to accept the fact that the 
executive branch is ours, the congressional branch is controlled by the 
leaders. So, when we get into the campaign you're pushing on, I'll go 
after them. They've already started going after me. And I've started a 
little bit kinder and gentler approach so far. But the American people 
will get this in focus.
    But therein is the harder part because I spell out an agenda, I take 
my case to the people on an agenda, and we're frustrated. The war was 
something else. We needed the support of the Congress. And I think if 
you go back and look at the history of Desert Storm and Desert Shield, I 
had to bring the American people along as Commander in Chief or as 
President and then, at the appropriate moment, go to the Congress, 
although I didn't think I had the constitutional responsibility to do 
this, and say: Sanction the use of force. Do what every nation in the 
world has done almost through the United Nations sanctions.
    There it was different because the President in foreign policy and 
in running a war, if you will, has much more power in the ability to 
call decision. I didn't have to call the subcommittee on military 
defense to ask if the air war should start. I didn't have to summon the 
congressional leaders to say, please give me a vote, 6 to 4, as to 
whether we're going to start the ground war.
    And so, that part--not that the war was easy, not that the 
committing of forces was easy, but from a running-my-job standpoint it 
was easier. I could assign the duties to Norm Schwarzkopf, through Colin 
Powell, through Cheney, and not have to worry about a subcommittee 
wanting to take a look and now we'll reallocate--hey, Norm,

[[Page 672]]

don't send the 81st Airborne there; put them over here in Iraq 
somewhere.
    It's a big difference; foreign policy is a big difference, not in 
funding but a big difference in how you run, making something happen. My 
frustration: inability to make stuff happen. And that's going to mean I 
need more support in the Congress--excuse the pitch.
    Q. In a sense, you're saying that, as for your job, the war with 
Iraq was easier than the war with Congress?
    The President. Yes. In terms of making decisions, not in terms of 
emotion. Not in terms of what's in my heart when I have to say to a 
mother or a cousin or a brother: I'm going to put your son in harm's 
way; I'm going to send your daughter to be the first woman that might be 
in combat--thinking of a dead woman who performed heroically, the 
helicopter pilot.
    I mean, therein, it's much tougher. I confessed the other day--I 
don't like these personal confessions, but I confessed that up at Camp 
David the tears came down my eyes as I had to contemplate this. So, it's 
not easier in that, in the moral obligation you have, but it's easier in 
getting something to happen.

Upcoming Presidential Campaign

    Q. Can you imagine, understanding that you want to stay away from 
the '92 campaign, that you or whoever runs in your place will, 
nevertheless, make a point of those Democrats who voted against the war, 
a strong point, to defeat them on that issue?
    The President. Well, you're already seeing some of that on both 
sides. You're seeing people defending their votes, and you're seeing 
people attacking some on their votes.
    Q. How about you, though?
    The President. I don't know. As I told you, I haven't contemplated 
tactics or campaign. I think on that one I would say, look, you're--kind 
of like I did just now--here's what I had to do, here's how the American 
people responded.
    You see, I don't think it's wrong to have these parades. When I go 
down--yesterday, riding in a big limo in areas where people--I'm sure 
they didn't vote for me in overwhelming numbers, some of the 
neighborhoods we went through. They were just areas that demographically 
are tough for Republicans. But when you see them out there with a little 
American flag, they're not saying hooray for George Bush; they're saying 
something's different in our country. There's a pride. There's a 
patriotism. And back inside the beltway, on some of these deadly talk 
shows, some of them don't get it. They don't understand what's happened 
in the country. I don't have to flog this. I don't have to put it, ``I 
did it.'' This team--these are young men and women, many of whom are--
put it in political terms--for me, against me, they did their duty for 
their country. And I think the American people will understand that 
without my having to throw a partisan spin on it for 1992.
    It was bigger than that. It was more majestic than that. And I'll 
try to resist demagoguery because I really feel so emotional about what 
our troops did and what our general officers did and how the war was 
done, compared to other wars. And for that, I salute those who had the 
authority to make decisions. So, I hope I can rise above a temptation to 
politicize something that was noble for our whole country and in which 
everybody--Democrat, Republican, liberal, conservatives--should take 
enormous pride.
    Q. Thank you, Mr. President.
    Q. Thank you, sir.
    The President. Thank you for this 15-minute opportunity. [Laughter] 
Sorry I got wound up, but these are very----
    Q. We were wound up as well as you, sir.
    The President. Well, I enjoyed it--as you could tell--very, very 
much. Thank you.

                    Note: The interview began at 7:55 a.m. in the Burton 
                        Room of the Four Seasons Hotel. The following 
                        persons were referred to: Gov. Pete Wilson of 
                        California; President Saddam Hussein of Iraq; 
                        Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney; Colin L. 
                        Powell, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff; 
                        Vice President Dan Quayle; television talk show 
                        hosts Johnny Carson, David Letterman, and Jay 
                        Leno; journalist E.J. Dionne; former hostages 
                        Morehead Kennedy and Jerry Plotkin;

[[Page 673]]

                        former President Ronald Reagan; former Governor 
                        of California George Deukmejian; Attorney 
                        General Dick Thornburgh; Senators John Seymour 
                        and Alan Cranston; Representatives William E. 
                        Dannemeyer and Tom Campbell; California State 
                        Assembly Speaker Willie Brown, Jr.; Bruce 
                        Herschensohn, Republican senatorial primary 
                        candidate in California; and Gen. H. Norman 
                        Schwarzkopf, commander of the U.S. forces in the 
                        Persian Gulf.