[Congressional Record (Bound Edition), Volume 152 (2006), Part 11]
[House]
[Pages 15082-15087]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office, www.gpo.gov]




              MT. SOLEDAD VETERANS MEMORIAL PROTECTION ACT

  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I move to suspend the rules and pass the 
bill (H.R. 5683) to preserve the Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial in San 
Diego, California, by providing for the immediate acquisition of the 
memorial by the United States, as amended.
  The Clerk read as follows

                               H.R. 5683

       Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of 
     the United States of America in Congress assembled,

     SECTION 1. FINDINGS.

       Congress makes the following findings:
       (1) The Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial has proudly stood 
     overlooking San Diego, California, for over 52 years as a 
     tribute to the members of the United States Armed Forces who 
     sacrificed their lives in the defense of the United States.
       (2) The Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial was dedicated on 
     April 18, 1954, as ``a lasting memorial to the dead of the 
     First and Second World Wars and the Korean conflict'' and now 
     serves as a memorial to American veterans of all wars, 
     including the War on Terrorism.
       (3) The United States has a long history and tradition of 
     memorializing members of the Armed Forces who die in battle 
     with a cross or other religious emblem of their faith, and a 
     memorial cross is fully integrated as the centerpiece of the 
     multi-faceted Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial that is replete 
     with secular symbols.
       (4) The patriotic and inspirational symbolism of the Mt. 
     Soledad Veterans Memorial provides solace to the families and 
     comrades of the veterans it memorializes.
       (5) The Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial has been recognized 
     by Congress as a National Veterans Memorial and is considered 
     a historically significant national memorial.
       (6) 76 percent of the voters of San Diego supported 
     donating the Mt. Soledad Memorial to the Federal Government 
     only to have a superior court judge of the State of 
     California invalidate that election.
       (7) The City of San Diego has diligently pursued every 
     possible legal recourse in order to preserve the Mt. Soledad 
     Veterans Memorial in its entirety for persons who have served 
     in the Armed Forces and those persons who will serve and 
     sacrifice in the future.

     SEC. 2. ACQUISITION OF MT. SOLEDAD VETERANS MEMORIAL, SAN 
                   DIEGO, CALIFORNIA.

       (a) Acquisition.--To effectuate the purpose of section 116 
     of division E of Public Law 108-447 (118 Stat. 3346; 16 
     U.S.C. 431 note), which, in order to preserve a historically 
     significant war memorial, designated the Mt. Soledad Veterans 
     Memorial in San Diego, California, as a national memorial 
     honoring veterans of the United States Armed Forces, there is 
     hereby vested in the United States all right, title, and 
     interest in and to, and the right to immediate possession of, 
     the Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial in San Diego, California, 
     as more fully described in subsection (d).
       (b) Compensation.--The United States shall pay just 
     compensation to any owner of the property for the property 
     taken pursuant to this section, and the full faith and credit 
     of the United States is hereby pledged to the payment of any 
     judgment entered against the United States with respect to 
     the taking of the property. Payment shall be in the amount of 
     the agreed negotiated value of the property or the valuation 
     of the property awarded by judgment and shall be made from 
     the permanent judgment appropriation established pursuant to 
     section 1304 of title 31, United States Code. If the parties 
     do not reach a negotiated settlement within one year after 
     the date of the enactment of this Act, the Secretary of 
     Defense may initiate a proceeding in a court of competent 
     jurisdiction to determine the just compensation with respect 
     to the taking of such property.
       (c) Maintenance.--Upon acquisition of the Mt. Soledad 
     Veterans Memorial by the United States, the Secretary of 
     Defense shall manage the property and shall enter into a 
     memorandum of understanding with the Mt. Soledad Memorial 
     Association for the continued maintenance of the Mt. Soledad 
     Veterans Memorial by the Association.
       (d) Legal Description.--The Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial 
     referred to in this section is all that portion of Pueblo lot 
     1265 of the Pueblo Lands of San Diego in the City and County 
     of San Diego, California, according to the map thereof 
     prepared by James Pascoe in 1879, a copy of which was filed 
     in the office of the County Recorder of San Diego County on 
     November 14, 1921, and is known as miscellaneous map No. 36, 
     more particularly described as follows: The area bounded by 
     the back of the existing inner sidewalk on top of Mt. 
     Soledad, being also a circle with radius of 84 feet, the 
     center of which circle is located as follows: Beginning at 
     the Southwesterly corner of such Pueblo Lot 1265, such corner 
     being South 17 degrees 14'33" East (Record South 17 degrees 
     14'09" East) 607.21 feet distant along the westerly line of 
     such Pueblo lot 1265 from the intersection with the North 
     line of La Jolla Scenic Drive South as described and 
     dedicated as parcel 2 of City Council Resolution No. 216644 
     adopted August 25, 1976; thence North 39 degrees 59'24" East 
     1147.62 feet to the center of such circle. The exact 
     boundaries and legal description of the Mt. Soledad Veterans 
     Memorial shall be determined by survey prepared by the 
     Secretary of Defense. Upon acquisition of the Mt. Soledad 
     Veterans Memorial by the United States, the boundaries of the 
     Memorial may not be expanded.

  The SPEAKER pro tempore. Pursuant to the rule, the gentleman from 
California (Mr. Hunter) and the gentleman from North Carolina (Mr. 
Butterfield) each will control 20 minutes.
  The Chair recognizes the gentleman from California.


                             General Leave

  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent that all Members 
have 5 legislative days within which to revise and extend their remarks 
on the legislation under consideration.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. Is there objection to the request of the 
gentleman from California?
  There was no objection.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I yield myself such time as I may consume.
  Mr. Speaker, today I rise to ask my colleagues' support for H.R. 
5683, the Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial Protection Act. Since 1954, a 
29-foot cross has stood atop Mt. Soledad in San Diego, California, 
memorializing the sacrifices of American soldiers during World War I, 
World War II, and the Korean conflict.
  This beautiful and historic memorial cross was erected and is 
maintained by a private organization, the Mt. Soledad Memorial 
Association, with the permission of the city of San Diego.
  Over the years, the memorial association has added many elements to 
this memorial, including over 1,700 granite plaques commemorating 
individual servicewomen and men on concentric walls, bollards, pavers, 
and a flag pole proudly flying the American flag. The memorial cross 
now is fully integrated as a centerpiece of the multifaceted Mt. 
Soledad Veterans Memorial. It is without question a world-class war 
memorial, dedicated to all of those, regardless of race, religion or 
creed, who have served our armed services.
  In 1989, a single plaintiff brought suit against the city of San 
Diego because he stated he was offended by the sight of the cross. The 
district court found that presence of this memorial cross violated the 
California Constitution's guarantee of free exercise and enjoyment of 
religion without discrimination or preference and ordered the removal 
of the display.
  The city of San Diego, like other municipalities faced with similar 
court orders, endeavored in good faith to divest itself of the memorial 
property by selling it to a private party who could choose to display 
the memorial cross.
  In this case, however, the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals found that 
the method of sale violated the California Constitution's ban on aid to 
sectarian purposes. On May 3, 2006, the district court ordered the city 
of San Diego to comply with the original injunction.
  The city has appealed that order to the Ninth Circuit Court of 
Appeals, and the United States Supreme Court Justice Anthony Kennedy 
has stayed enforcement of the order pending the outcome of that appeal.
  In 2004, the United States Congress designated the Mt. Soledad 
Veterans Memorial a National Veterans Memorial and authorized the 
Federal Government to accept the donation of the memorial from the city 
of San Diego. The voters of San Diego passed, by an overwhelming 76 
percent, a ballot measure providing for the donation.

[[Page 15083]]

But in response to a complaint by the same lone plaintiff, a San Diego 
County superior court judge invalidated the citywide referendum as 
violating the California Constitution.
  The vast majority of the citizens of the city of San Diego favor 
finding a way to keep the Mt. Soledad Memorial intact, even if that 
means giving up ownership of the parkland property on which it is 
located.
  A 1994 ballot measure authorizing the sale of the property also 
passed with 76 percent of the vote, as did a 2005 ballot measure 
directing the city to donate the memorial property to the Federal 
Government.
  The efforts of the city to vindicate the desires of the citizenry, 
however, have been stymied by one plaintiff and a few judges who find 
the city of San Diego's display of the decades-old memorial cross 
impermissible under the California Constitution.
  H.R. 5683 vests title and possession of the Mt. Soledad Veterans 
Memorial, a national memorial honoring the war dead and veterans of the 
United States Armed Forces, in the United States. Once the memorial 
property belongs to the United States, the constitutionality of the 
property transfer, as well as the display of the cross as an element of 
the Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial, will be determined under the 
establishment clause of the United States Constitution.
  Applying the establishment clause to the government's display of 
religious symbols, the United States Supreme Court has determined that 
displays of religious symbols on government property are 
unconstitutional only if their purpose is entirely religious and they 
include no secular components.
  Most recently the Supreme Court has determined that the establishment 
clause analysis of passive monuments like this one is driven by the 
nature of the monument and by our Nation's history. In the case of the 
Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial, it is surrounded by a plethora of 
secular symbols. In fact, Mr. Speaker, there are some 1,700 memorials 
that make up this overall veterans memorial.
  In accordance with the United States' long tradition of memorializing 
members of the Armed Forces who die in battle with religious symbols, 
the memorial cross serves a legitimate secular purpose of commemorating 
our Nation's war dead and veterans. Therefore, the display of the Mt. 
Soledad memorial cross on Federal property as part of a larger memorial 
is constitutional.
  In fact, Mr. Speaker, we have many pictures of large crosses in 
national cemeteries and other national property or Federal property 
across this Nation, and we will display those at the appropriate time.
  The memorial cross on Mt. Soledad is not only a religious symbol, it 
is a venerated landmark, beloved by the people of San Diego for over 50 
years. It is a fitting memorial to all persons who have served and 
sacrificed for our Nation as members of the Armed Forces.
  Passage of H.R. 5683 will preserve the beautiful memorial for the 
families of those who have died in service, for all current military 
servicemembers, for veterans, for the citizens of San Diego and for the 
Nation.
  For the Record, Mr. Speaker, I would like to submit letters of 
support from Jerry Sanders, mayor of San Diego; San Diegans for the 
Mount Soledad National War Memorial; the American Legion; AMVETS; 
Veterans for Foreign Wars of the United States; Disabled American 
Veterans; the American Center for Law and Justice; and Robert and Sybil 
Martino, the parents of a soldier who gave his life in the war on 
terror and was honored for his sacrifice at the Mt. Soledad Memorial.

         Executive Office of the President, Office of Management 
           and Budget,
                                    Washington, DC, July 19, 2006.

   Statement of Administration Policy--H.R. 5683--Acquisition of Mt. 
                       Soledad Veterans Memorial

                (Rep. Hunter (R) CA and two cosponsors)

       The Administration strongly supports passage of H.R. 5683 
     to protect the Mount Soledad Veterans Memorial in San Diego. 
     In the face of legal action threatening the continued 
     existence of the current Memorial, the people of San Diego 
     have clearly expressed their desire to keep the Mt. Soledad 
     Veterans Memorial in its present form. Judicial activism 
     should not stand in the way of the people, and the 
     Administration commends Rep. Hunter for his efforts in 
     introducing this bill. The bill would preserve the Mount 
     Soledad Memorial by vesting title to the Memorial in the 
     Federal government and providing that it be administered by 
     the Secretary of Defense. The Administration supports the 
     important goal of preserving the integrity of war memorials.
                                  ____

                                                    July 18, 2006.
     Hon. Duncan Hunter,
     House of Representatives,
     Washington, DC.
       Dear Congressman Hunter: As the U.S. House of 
     Representatives prepares to consider the Mt. Soledad Veterans 
     Memorial Protection Act (H.R. 5683), I write in support of 
     this bill.
       As you know, I have strongly voiced my support for 
     maintaining the integrity of the Mt. Soledad Memorial as a 
     multi-faceted site that recognizes veterans of all wars and 
     all faiths.
       H.R. 5683 provides that, ``The United States shall pay just 
     compensation to any owner of the property for the property.'' 
     As acknowledged in the legislation, ``The United States has a 
     long history and tradition of memorializing members of the 
     Armed Forces who die in battle with a cross or other 
     religious emblem of their faith and a memorial cross is fully 
     integrated as the centerpiece of the multi-faceted Mt. 
     Soledad Veterans Memorial that is replete with secular 
     symbols.''
       I believe this legislation provides a possible means of 
     preserving the integrity of the memorial and for that reason 
     I support these efforts.
           Sincerely,
                                                    Jerry Sanders,
     Mayor.
                                  ____

         San Diegans for the Mount Soledad National War Memorial,
                                     San Diego, CA, July 19, 2006.
     Hon. Duncan Hunter,
     House Armed Services Committee,
     Washington, DC.
       Dear Chairman Hunter: San Diegans for the Mount Soledad 
     National War Memorial applauds your efforts on behalf of the 
     vast supermajority of San Diegans, including thousands of 
     veterans, to maintain the integrity of this important 
     monument to those courageous heroes who have fought and died 
     in defense of this great Nation.
       By joining Congressmen Issa and Bilbray in introducing 
     legislation that would transfer the site of the memoria1 to 
     the federal government, you are upholding the will of over 75 
     percent of San Diegans who voted Yes on Proposition A to keep 
     Mount Soledad as it is, where it is. You are also drawing a 
     clear line in the sand against those who seek to undermine 
     the history and heritage of our great Nation by eradicating 
     from the historic record the heroic individual sacrifices 
     that have not only preserved our own freedom, but liberated 
     millions of people across the globe.
       As Chairman of the committee that spearheaded the 
     overwhelmingly successful referendary petition drive and 
     subsequent ``Yes on Prop A'' campaign last July, and a 
     practicing Jew, I am pleased to offer you the full support of 
     San Diegans for the Mount Soledad National War Memorial and 
     any further necessary assistance in preserving this sacred 
     monument on behalf of the people of San Diego and the United 
     States of America.
       Thank you.
           Sincerely,
                                             Philip L. Thalheimer,
                                                         Chairman.
                                  ____
                                  
                                                     May 15, 2006.
     President George W. Bush,
     The White House,
     Washington, DC.
       Dear Mr. President: My wife and I would like to express our 
     support for the effort initiated by Representative Duncan 
     Hunter of California and the Mayor of San Diego to save the 
     cross at Mt. Soledad wherein the Federal Government would 
     take the property by eminent domain as a veteran's memorial.
       Our son Captain Michael D. Martino, USMC, was killed in 
     action in Iraq on November 2, 2005, when his Cobra Helicopter 
     was shot down by a SA 16. This past week our son's Camp 
     Pendleton unit, which had just recently returned from Iraq, 
     dedicated plaques at Mt. Soledad to honor him and his fellow 
     pilot Major Gerry Bloomfield for their heroic service. There 
     is no better place to honor our fallen heroes than under that 
     cross, overlooking the country they fought and died to 
     preserve.
       Our son loved his country and the many rights and liberties 
     it provided, especially our right to freedom of religion. A 
     few in this country would like to see the cross removed from 
     Mt. Soledad and thus deny the majority their rights to 
     religious expression. This cross is no more an affront to 
     personal beliefs than the thousands of crosses in Arlington 
     Cemetery.
       Is it fair to the majority who have served or fallen for 
     our Nation and wish to keep the

[[Page 15084]]

     cross for the sake of the few who look to strip all religion 
     from our country, under a false interpretation of the 
     separation of church and state? Our son died with a strong 
     belief that he was fighting to preserve the freedom of all 
     Americans. Please let us have OUR freedom from activist 
     judges and their personal interpretation of our Constitution.
       Mr. President, please take the Memorial at Mt. Soledad 
     under federal ownership.
       You are always in our prayers.
           Sincerely,
     Robert A. and Sybil E. Martino.
                                  ____

                                                    June 21, 2006.
     Hon. Duncan Hunter,
     Chairman, House Armed Services Committee
     Washington, DC.
       Dear Chairman Hunter: As the leaders of the Nation's four 
     largest veterans organizations, we respectfully request your 
     assistance on an issue that is important to former military 
     personnel and to American values.
       The Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial is a historic site 
     overlooking the Pacific Ocean that has stood for over 52 
     years as a tribute to our Nation's Armed Forces. This 
     veterans memorial is the first and last thing that ships see 
     as they arrive or depart from one of the world's largest 
     naval installations. Unfortunately a small group of 
     plaintiffs wish to destroy the integrity of the Memorial and 
     the courts have complied by requiring that the Memorial's 
     centerpiece cross be removed by August 1, 2006. We believe 
     that destruction of the Memorial is an affront to the 
     sacrifices made by America's veterans and is contrary to the 
     will of citizens of San Diego, 76 percent of whom voted in a 
     recent referendum to try to preserve the Memorial. 
     Accordingly, we request that the Congress pursue all 
     available legislative options to take federal possession of 
     the Memorial with the intention of preserving the Veterans 
     Memorial in its current form.
           Sincerely,
     Thomas L. Bock,
       National Commander, the American Legion.
     Paul W. Jackson,
       National Commander, Disabled American Veterans.
     James R. Mueller,
       Commander-in-Chief, Veterans of Foreign Wars of the U.S.
     Edward W. Kemp,
       National Commander, AMVETS.
                                  ____
                                  
                                                    June 29, 2006.
     Hon. Duncan Hunter,
     Chairman, House Armed Services Committee,
     Washington, DC.
       Dear Chairman Hunter: As the leaders of the Nation's four 
     largest veterans' service organizations, we write to you 
     today in appreciation for introducing with Representatives 
     Issa and Bilbray a measure which would provide for the 
     immediate acquisition of the Mount Soledad Veterans Memorial 
     by the United States. While this step is extra-ordinary, our 
     organizations feel it is the appropriate measure to take.
       As we noted in our letter to you last week, we believe that 
     the destruction of this Memorial is an affront to the 
     sacrifices made by America's veterans and is contrary to the 
     will of the citizens of San Diego. This Memorial has stood in 
     its historic location overlooking the Pacific Ocean for 52 
     years, a silent tribute to the sacrifices made by veterans 
     past, present and future.
       As we answered the call in the past to serve this country, 
     so we will answer the call now. Accordingly, we offer to help 
     in any way we can to aid you in preserving this hallowed 
     Memorial.
           Sincerely,
     Thomas L. Bock,
       National Commander, the American Legion.
     Paul W. Jackson,
       National Commander, Disabled American Veterans.
     James R. Mueller,
       Commander-in-Chief, Veterans of Foreign Wars of the U.S.
     Edward W. Kemp,
       National Commander, AMVETS.
                                  ____
                                  


                            American Center for Law & Justice,

                                    Washington, DC, July 17, 2006.
     Congressman Duncan Hunter,
     Rayburn House Office Building,
     Washington, DC.
       Congressman Hunter: We write today in support of your 
     legislation to protect the war memorial at Mt. Soledad, H.R. 
     5683.
       We believe the public has a vital interest in ensuring that 
     centuries-old American traditions and practices are not 
     declared unconstitutional without careful and accurate 
     judicial review of all issues involved. The Establishment 
     Clause does not require that crosses, Stars of David, and 
     other religious symbols be removed from Mount Soledad, 
     Arlington National Cemetery, and the countless other places 
     across the country where the lives and sacrifices of veterans 
     are commemorated. The longstanding, venerable tradition of 
     using crosses and other religious symbols on memorials and in 
     the public square is fully consistent with the Supreme 
     Court's Establishment Clause analysis in its County of 
     Allegheny v. ACLU (1998), ACLU of Kentucky v. Mercer County 
     (2005), Elk Grove Unified School District v. Newdow (2004), 
     and Van Orden v. Perry (2005) decisions.
       Your actions, those of other Members and the Departments of 
     Defense and the Interior, and the citizens of San Diego, to 
     help preserve the integrity and sanctity of memorials 
     honoring the lives and sacrifices of veterans are well taken 
     and constitutionally permissible.
       To remove the Mt. Soledad cross is an insult to the men and 
     women who fought to protect our freedoms. To allow activist 
     organizations to strip religious symbolism from public life 
     would cut against America's heritage and remove a vital 
     component which makes our country unique.
       We applaud your efforts and stand ready to assist you as 
     you continue your fight to save the war memorial at Mt. 
     Soledad.
     Jay A. Sekulow,
       Chief Counsel.
     Colby M. May,
       SeniorCounsel& Director.

  Mr. Speaker, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. BUTTERFIELD. Mr. Speaker, I yield myself such time as I may 
consume.
  Mr. Speaker, as the chairman said a moment ago, this bill is intended 
to preserve the Mt. Soledad Veterans Memorial in San Diego, California, 
and it allows for the immediate acquisition of this memorial by the 
United States Government.
  The distinguished chairman, my friend from California, feels 
obviously very strongly about this issue, and apparently the people of 
that region also feel very strongly about it, by virtue of a vote that 
they took, a popular vote, indicating some 76 percent support for this 
idea.
  Mr. Speaker, for that reason I will not be opposing the resolution. I 
will have some speakers who would like to speak to the issue.
  Mr. Speaker, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I yield 5 minutes to the gentleman from San 
Diego, California (Mr. Issa), who has been a real champion in this 
effort to preserve the memorial.

                              {time}  1445

  Mr. ISSA. Mr. Speaker, I rise today in strong support of this 
acquisition by the Federal Government, because it is so consistent with 
how we as Americans have honored our war dead and those who have given 
in service to our country.
  I just want to point out for a moment a picture of Mt. Soledad, of 
the actual cross, and then, Mr. Speaker, as you look at pictures of the 
other Federal sites, the amazing thing is how similar they are. These 
are sites which are not contested. They are not contested because our 
Founding Fathers didn't want the establishment of a religion, but they 
didn't want a godless society; just the opposite, they wanted a freedom 
for people to observe their God as they chose fit. Particularly when we 
deal with those who have fallen in support of this country, they should 
be free to honor them with or without symbols that they find comfort 
in.
  I think, Mr. Speaker, as we consider this important piece of 
legislation, I think it is important that we realize that that cross is 
about men and women who have given their lives and a symbol that says 
they gave their life for their country. It is an arbitrary symbol, but 
it is not a symbol without meaning. It stands, like those crosses in 
faraway lands of Americans who fell in Tripoli, Americans who were 
buried at Normandy, and of Americans who have never been returned home 
from the sea. It stands as a symbol of their passing and their 
sacrifice.
  Mt. Soledad, no one ever doubted that this was a war memorial. No one 
ever doubted that. In fact, people found comfort in this symbol to 
those men and women in San Diego, the home of both Marines and Navy, 
for more than 100 years. No one ever found that this was inappropriate 
to honor our dead. What they found was one person, one out of 2 million 
people, who said, I am offended, I want no cross. It offends me.
  Mr. Speaker, the definition of offensive language and offensive 
behavior and signs like the swastikas and other

[[Page 15085]]

symbols of hate are just that. They are unique symbols that people have 
no doubt are designed to offend.
  This cross was never intended to offend. Just the opposite; it was 
intended to do what it does for the vast majority of San Diegans and 
people who come to our fair city. It honors our war veterans for the 
sacrifice they made. That is the symbolism it has. That is the reason 
that hundreds of thousands of people climb that hill every year to 
spend a moment to look at the cross, but, more importantly, to look at 
the pictures of the men and women throughout the lower part of this 
memorial who, in fact, are there on plaques to be observed and 
remembered for their sacrifice.
  I ask full support of this resolution.
  Mr. BUTTERFIELD. Mr. Speaker, I yield 5 minutes to a distinguished 
member of the House Armed Services Committee, the gentlewoman from 
California (Mrs. Davis).
  Mrs. DAVIS of California. Mr. Speaker, I would like to begin by 
saying I appreciate the sensitivity of my colleagues on this issue who 
believe this bill is about veterans. I, too, have a deep appreciation 
of our veterans and the sacrifices they have made for our Nation and 
our freedoms.
  If this bill were nothing more than a veterans issue, we would have a 
very simple decision before us today. But, unfortunately, that is not 
the case. The courts have told us time and time again what this issue 
is about. It is about a demonstrated preference of one religion over 
all others. It is about a uniquely religious symbol on public land. 
Make no mistake about it, this bill is not about preserving a veterans 
memorial. It is about preserving a 29-foot cross that sits within the 
boundaries of a veterans memorial, a veterans memorial that is supposed 
to honor all veterans.
  Yet towering over the American flag, and the plaques, names, and 
photos of honored veterans, and I can see many of their faces in the 
plaques today, is a 29-foot symbol of one religion, and that is why we 
are here today.
  A district court ruling on the memorial noted, ``Even if one strains 
to view the cross in the context of a war memorial, its primary effect 
is to give the impression that only Christians are being honored.''
  I can certainly understand, Mr. Speaker, the emotion that this issue 
has generated. Believe me, I can understand that emotion. But as 
today's discussion has proven, this issue has become more about a cross 
than about a veterans memorial. Our focus should be on the veterans, 
and it should be inclusive of all veterans.
  Mr. Speaker, I would like to take a moment to share the words of one 
of my constituents who just recently wrote me. He says, ``My father, a 
Bronze Star recipient for being wounded twice during D-Day, died a few 
years back, and I would like to pay tribute to his service to our 
country by purchasing a plaque to honor him.
  ``Mt. Soledad is one mile from where I live, and it would be the most 
logical choice, given its beautiful location and proximity.
  ``However, my father, being a practicing Jew, would be dishonored by 
the cross.'' That was the way he felt he would see it. ``Shouldn't,'' 
he asked, ``a war memorial pay homage to all who served and defended 
this country?''
  And he continues to write, ``It is un-American to create a memorial 
to veterans which is not all-inclusive.
  ``There are many things,'' he writes, ``which could be erected as a 
tribute, but a cross, a crescent moon, a statue of Buddha, or a Star of 
David, are completely inappropriate and illegal.
  ``This is all about religion, because if the monument being 
considered were a statue of a dove or a soldier, we would not even be 
having this conversation.''
  Mr. Speaker, I say to you, I fully understand the sensitivity of this 
issue. Believe me, it would be easy to vote with the majority on this 
issue. But the easiest decision, or the most popular one, is not always 
the right one.
  In the words of James Fenimore Cooper, and I quote, ``It is a 
besetting vice of democracies to substitute public opinion for law. 
This is the usual form in which masses of men exhibit their tyranny.''
  The beauty of our Constitution is that it protects the voice of the 
minority, so I ask you to join me in protecting that minority today.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I yield 5 minutes to the gentleman from San 
Diego, California (Mr. Bilbray), a gentleman who has worked tirelessly 
to preserve the memorial.
  Mr. BILBRAY. Mr. Speaker, I rise in strong support of this 
resolution. This memorial is in my district. It is a very prominent 
memorial, not just in the landscape, but in the history of San Diego 
County.
  I remember as a child my father driving me past this memorial and 
looking up and saying this is one of the few memorials in the country 
that recognize the heartbreak of what went on in Korea. As a Korean 
veteran, he was also very much impressed with the fact that San Diegans 
set aside a memorial for the Korean war.
  Frankly, I am shocked in a time of war, a time when our men and women 
are out exchanging deadly fire with the enemy, that we are talking 
about destruction of a war memorial. It is a war memorial dedicated to 
800-plus people that never came back from the Korean war, the missing 
in action.
  Now, in San Diego County, we have many religious symbols on public 
lands. We have a cross to Father Serra on Presidio Hill. We have a 
cross to Cabrillo, who found San Diego Harbor. We have Point Lomo. We 
have a county synagogue in our county park, and we have a cross on 
Mount Helix that was set aside by a gentleman for his wife. We are not 
asking to tear those religious symbols down.
  All I have to say, Mr. Speaker, is we have enough tolerance for a 
cross to Father Serra. If we can find the tolerance to save a major 
historical building such as the synagogue, Beth Israel Synagogue, if we 
can find the tolerance to have a cross for Cabrillo, my God, can't we 
find the tolerance to preserve a war memorial to 800,000 missing in 
action in Korea? This really is about common sense, common decency and 
tolerance.
  Mr. Speaker, there are those who will find excuses to attack what 
they may not like, but this is not about religion; it is about the 
tolerance of our heritage and the memorials to those who have fought 
for our heritage across the board. I would just like to point out, if 
somebody wants to say that this is somehow a Christian conspiracy, that 
Phil Thalheimer, the chairman of Save the Cross, happens to be of the 
Jewish faith, his family survived the terrible Holocaust in Europe.
  One of his biggest statements, that his family always talked about, 
the first thing that the Fascists wanted to do was to destroy religious 
symbols when his parents were trying to escape.
  Now, Mr. Speaker, the State of California has many religious symbols, 
and we do too here. All I have to say is I don't think anybody in 
California or in this Chamber is asking for the cross in Father Serra's 
hands to be taken off that statue in Statuary Hall. The fact is that 
both of the statues for California happen to be someone who is 
affiliated with the Christian faith. But their affiliation with 
Christianity does not change the historical significance or the 
justification and the logic of us honoring him here in Washington.
  Mr. Speaker, we are asking today to do a very easy thing. Understand 
that mistakes can be made by courts; but the voters have said very 
clearly they do not find offense in a memorial to veterans. They do not 
find offense to this symbol for these people, for the people that 
committed so much for America.
  I would ask anyone who thinks that the cross is offensive, because it 
is a religious symbol, to go to the memorial and walk around the wall 
of it. You will see every religious symbol thinkable around that 
memorial that have been dedicated.
  If we take this cross down because someone may take offense to a 
religious symbol, when will they next go for the Star of David, the 
star or crescent? They will go after the other symbols that somebody 
may take offense to.

[[Page 15086]]

  Mr. Speaker, I think we need to honor our war dead, our missing in 
action from Korea. We should honor ourselves by showing that tolerance 
is not a politically correct catch term, but truly is the sign of an 
enlightened people, that as Moses looks down on us here, we will be 
proud to have him guide us on this vote.
  I ask for a ``yes'' vote on this, and ask you, for the people of the 
50th District of California, to support their will, support their 
veterans, and vote ``yes'' on this resolution.
  Mr. BUTTERFIELD. Mr. Speaker, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I yield myself such time as I may consume.
  Just to make one point, what we are doing with this legislation is 
taking ownership that we have already designated by law the memorial at 
Mt. Soledad, the Korean war memorial. We have already designated this 
memorial as a Federal memorial. What we are doing is taking ownership 
of the memorial.
  So for those who don't like it and who think that it is 
unconstitutional, that memorial will still be intact and will be 
subject to any attacks that they or others may want to make on the 
memorial.
  What it simply does is transfer title of the memorial, of the 
property, to the Federal Government. I think that is absolutely 
appropriate in light of the fact that these are veterans from all over 
America who are represented on those 1,700-plus little memorials that 
make up this big memorial. So it is absolutely reasonable and 
appropriate that the Federal Government, having designated this as a 
Federal memorial, takes ownership of the property as a Federal 
memorial.

                              {time}  1500

  Mr. BUTTERFIELD. Mr. Speaker, I yield 3 minutes to the gentleman from 
New York (Mr. Ackerman).
  Mr. ACKERMAN. Mr. Speaker, I had not intended to speak on this 
matter, but the eloquence of the gentlewoman from California and the 
remarks of the distinguished gentleman from California have moved me to 
stand up and say a few words.
  I do not know why in a pluralistic society, in a great democracy that 
we are, that we have become, that we continue to be, that we look to 
find things and issues to divide us rather than to unite us.
  I am not of the Christian faith. Christian symbols do not offend me. 
They stand for things that are good and decent and pure and idealistic, 
and I think that is wonderful. But to make them the symbol of something 
public is something that I do find offensive.
  We talk about so often our Judeo-Christian heritage. I am not sure 
what that means exactly. I know it means that somebody is reaching out 
to try to include me and my small faith when they want to look 
pluralistic.
  I know that my dad fought in World War II. I know that I had 
relatives who went to Canada to join the Royal Mounted Police because 
they were in World War II fighting the Nazis before the United States 
of America did. I know that people of all faiths of this great Nation 
died in that war and all other wars that we fought, and continue to die 
today as you read the list of people coming back, tragically killed by 
terrorists.
  I do not know why we have to put a religious symbol on the entire 
monument. There is nothing wrong with the crucifix in the hands of 
whoever wants to hold it, even in Statuary Hall. Nobody is saying 
remove that cross. That is an individual sign of faith, not a 
collective societal sign of faith.
  The gentleman from California justifies it by saying it is a symbol 
of our heritage. I beg to differ. It is not a collective symbol of our 
heritage because it is not the symbol of my heritage, though I respect 
it as a symbol of somebody else's heritage. And if, indeed, the only 
symbol up there was a statue of Buddha or a Muslim symbol or a Jewish 
Star of David, I would object as strenuously.
  If you cannot represent all religions, then represent no religion. 
They did not die in a crusade. It was not a religious Korean war. Why 
put the symbol of Christianity or any other religion there?
  Make it a monument for people who fought and died for freedom of 
liberty, who died for freedom of religion, who died for people's 
ability to express themselves in a free society. That was the intent, 
and I think that is something we would all be proud of, and we are 
proud of the veterans.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I thank the gentleman for his statement. How 
much time do both sides have left?
  The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. Linder). The gentleman from California 
(Mr. Hunter) has 5\1/2\ minutes remaining. The gentleman from North 
Carolina (Mr. Butterfield) has 11\1/2\ minutes remaining.
  Mr. HUNTER. Do we have the right to close?
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman is correct.
  Mr. HUNTER. In that case, we would like to reserve our time.
  Mr. BUTTERFIELD. I do not have any additional speakers, Mr. Speaker, 
and I yield back the balance of my time.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, I yield myself the balance of the time.
  Mr. Speaker, I want to thank all Members for engaging in this debate. 
I think it is a good one and a healthy one, and I would like to point 
out to all Members that preserving this memorial, that is, transferring 
it to the United States of America, is supported strongly by the 
American Legion, by the Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States, 
by the Disabled American Veterans, and by AMVETS and by all of their 
national commanders.
  Mr. Speaker, let me point out that there are dozens and dozens not 
only of crosses but of Stars of David and other religious symbols on 
Federal property throughout this country.
  I noticed during the debate here that we are standing under a 
statement, ``In God we trust,'' that stands over the Speaker's chair, 
arguably a target for a constitutional argument that it violates 
separation of church and State.
  Now, in answer to my friend from New York and his statement that why 
did we have to go and put this cross on this memorial, this memorial is 
52 years ago. It is a memorial that has evolved and grown since not 
only the Korean war but actually right after the turn of the century, 
like so many memorials that we have.
  Today, there is not really just one memorial. There are really 1,701 
memorials in composite because there are 1,700 plaques to people that 
gave everything they had to the United States of America.
  This last letter that I received in support of this from the parents 
of Captain Martino, who fell in Iraq last year, saying please do not 
let them tear down the memorial, reminded me to look back and look at 
some of the other people that are on this memorial. There is a thread 
of patriotism between every American alive today and those who served 
our country and those who fell for our country, those 619,000 Americans 
who died in the last century, those 2,500-plus Americans who have given 
their lives in Iraq and the 300-plus Americans who have given their 
lives in Afghanistan. There is a thread of patriotism between those 
people.
  So for Captain Martino, who gave his life in Iraq just last year 
because of that, and for his family, somebody is able to teach at a 
synagogue or a church today or a college; because of a machine gunner 
in Belleau Wood early in this century, a businessman is able to operate 
freely in Cincinnati; and because of people who fell in the Korean war, 
a young couple is able to walk down the streets without being arrested 
in Washington, D.C.
  So the freedoms that we have are combined by a thread to every single 
person who gave that full measure of devotion to our country, and 
whether we like it or not and whether the courts like it or not, the 
people, the families, the service people, think that those threads come 
together in little monuments and memorials throughout this country, not 
the least of which is Arlington Cemetery, but also not the least of 
which is 3,000 miles away on Mt. Soledad overlooking the Pacific Ocean 
where the 1st Marine Division

[[Page 15087]]

embarked for those incredible fights in the island chains, taking back 
Guadalcanal, Iwo Jima and other islands in the Axis Powers in World War 
II. That is a point of embarkation. It is a point where many families 
last saw their loved ones.
  This memorial has a thread of patriotism and a thread of meaning to 
the people of the United States, not just San Diego, and it is fully 
appropriate that the United States of America, having made this 
memorial a national memorial, now takes ownership of the memorial.
  Mr. Speaker, I yield back the balance of my time.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. The question is on the motion offered by the 
gentleman from California (Mr. Hunter) that the House suspend the rules 
and pass the bill, H.R. 5683, as amended.
  The question was taken.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. In the opinion of the Chair, two-thirds of 
those present have voted in the affirmative.
  Mr. HUNTER. Mr. Speaker, on that I demand the yeas and nays.
  The yeas and nays were ordered.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. Pursuant to clause 8 of rule XX and the 
Chair's prior announcement, further proceedings on this question will 
be postponed.

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