[Congressional Record (Bound Edition), Volume 145 (1999), Part 8]
[House]
[Pages 11929-11935]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office, www.gpo.gov]



                        EDUCATION LAND GRANT ACT

  Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, by direction of the Committee on Rules, I 
call up House Resolution 189 and ask for its immediate consideration.
  The Clerk read the resolution, as follows:

                              H. Res. 189

       Resolved, That at any time after the adoption of this 
     resolution the Speaker may, pursuant to clause 2(b) of rule 
     XVIII, declare the House resolved into the Committee of the 
     Whole House on the state of the Union for consideration of 
     the bill (H.R. 150) to amend the Act popularly known as the 
     Recreation and Public Purposes Act to authorize disposal of 
     certain public lands or national forest lands to local 
     education agencies for use for elementary or secondary 
     schools, including public charter schools, and for other 
     purposes. The first reading of the bill shall be dispensed 
     with. General debate shall be confined to the bill and shall 
     not exceed one hour equally divided and controlled by the 
     chairman and ranking minority member of the Committee on 
     Resources. After general debate the bill shall be considered 
     for amendment under the five-minute rule. It shall be in 
     order to consider as an original bill for the purpose of 
     amendment under the five-minute rule the amendment in the 
     nature of a substitute recommended by the Committee on 
     Resources now printed in the bill. The committee amendment in 
     the nature of a substitute shall be considered as read. 
     During consideration of the bill for amendment, the chairman 
     of the Committee of the Whole may accord priority in 
     recognition on the basis of whether the Member offering an 
     amendment has caused it to be printed in the portion of the 
     Congressional Record designated for that purpose in clause 8 
     of rule XVIII. Amendments so printed shall be considered as 
     read. The chairman of the Committee of the Whole may: (1) 
     postpone until a time during further consideration in the 
     Committee of the Whole a request for a recorded vote on any 
     amendment; and (2) reduce to five minutes the minimum time 
     for electronic voting on any postponed question that follows 
     another electronic vote without intervening business, 
     provided that the minimum time for electronic voting on the 
     first in any series of question shall be 15 minutes. At the 
     conclusion of consideration of the bill for amendment the 
     Committee shall rise and report the bill to the House with 
     such amendments as may have been adopted. Any Member may 
     demand a separate vote in the House on any amendment adopted 
     in the Committee of the Whole to the bill or to the committee 
     amendment in the nature of a substitute. The previous 
     question shall be considered as ordered on the bill and 
     amendments thereto to final passage without intervening 
     motion except one motion to recommit with or without 
     instructions.

  The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. Shaw). The gentleman from Texas (Mr. 
Sessions) is recognized for 1 hour.
  Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, for purposes of debate only, I yield the 
customary 30 minutes to the gentlewoman from New York (Ms. Slaughter), 
pending which I yield myself such time as I may consume. During 
consideration of this resolution, all time yielded is for the purpose 
of debate only.
  Mr. Speaker, H. Res. 189 is an open rule providing 1 hour of general 
debate, divided equally between the chairman and ranking minority 
member of the Committee on Resources. The rule makes in order the 
Committee on Resources' amendment in the nature of a substitute as an 
original bill for the purpose of amendment, which shall be considered 
as read.
  Members who have preprinted their amendments in the record prior to 
their consideration may be given priority in recognition to offering 
their amendments if otherwise consistent with House rules.
  The Chairman of the Committee of the Whole may postpone votes during 
consideration of the bill and reduce

[[Page 11930]]

voting time to 5 minutes on a postponed question if the vote follows a 
15-minute vote.
  Finally, the rule provides for one motion to recommit, with or 
without instructions.
  Mr. Speaker, H.R. 150, the Education Land Grant Act, is the product 
of tireless efforts of my colleague, the gentleman from Arizona (Mr. 
Hayworth). The gentleman is looking for innovative ways to provide 
educational resources for State and local governments.
  Like many western States, Arizona has scarce non-Federal resources 
within the National Forest land system, making it very expensive and 
cost-prohibitive for school districts to buy land needed to expand or 
build the necessary school facilities.
  The gentleman from Arizona (Mr. Hayworth) recognized this clearly 
when he had to fight to convey 30 acres of Forest Service land to the 
Alpine School District for the purpose of building new school 
facilities during the 104th Congress. The Education Land Grant Act 
would codify this process for all Forest Service land. This legislation 
authorizes the Secretary of Agriculture to convey Forest Service lands 
for educational purposes, as long as the school is publicly funded, the 
conveyance serves the public interest, and the land is not 
environmentally sensitive or needed for the purpose of the National 
Forest System.

                              {time}  1115

  This process mirrors the Recreation and Public Purposes Act, which 
allows Congress to sell or lease Bureau of Land Management land to 
State and local governments, and qualified nonprofit organizations for 
public purposes.
  I am proud of the work my colleague, the gentleman from Arizona (Mr. 
Hayworth) has done.
  Mr. Speaker, I urge support for the rule and the underlying 
legislation, and I reserve the balance of my time.
  Ms. SLAUGHTER. Mr. Speaker, I yield myself such time as I may 
consume.
  Mr. Speaker, today we return to the Education Land Grant Act, which 
was scheduled for consideration a few weeks ago but postponed until 
today. The bill was reported on a voice vote from the Committee on 
Resources. It is a relatively straightforward bill and enjoys 
bipartisan support.
  Although I know there are Members who have objections which will be 
raised in the ensuing debate, it will be ably handled on our side by my 
good friend, the gentleman from California (Mr. George Miller).
  Mr. Speaker, this is a request for an open rule on a bill which could 
easily be handled on the suspension calendar, and an open rule which 
was granted only after the Democrat efforts to bring forward the 
juvenile justice bill were defeated on a party line vote.
  Mr. Speaker, this weekend I had the privilege to attend my 
granddaughter's high school graduation and to hear her give a 
commencement address welcoming her classmates to the last day of their 
childhood and the first day of the rest of their lives.
  She stated:

       We have come to an intersection with no signs, our past 
     beeping loudly at us and a foggy road ahead. Some of us are 
     struggling wildly to go into reverse, which in life is 
     utterly impossible. We are hesitantly facing our future, an 
     unnerving task for we know not what the future holds. But 
     take comfort, the beauty of the future lies not in its 
     planning, but in its spontaneous creation.
  Mr. Speaker, I was just like thousands of other parents and 
grandparents who attended the graduation ceremonies over the past few 
weeks. There we were, watching our kids, our grandkids, the kid next 
door who only last week it seems was learning to ride without training 
wheels, and is now about to claim his or her future.
  Sadly, so many, far, far too many children in recent years have gone 
through that rite of passage forever tinged by violence inside their 
school walls. In some instances, the classes following these children 
will have learned not only the fire drill but the evacuation drill, in 
case a classmate has a gun.
  A columnist in my hometown paper, the Democrat and Chronicle in 
Rochester, New York, observed that we have had so many school shootings 
that we can now rank them in order of the carnage which was created. It 
is so sad I can hardly speak to it, but in homes across this country, 
families are being forced to have exactly that discussion.
  Mr. Speaker, if Members do not believe the threat is real, ask the 
mere child who came to me recently wondering how to find a bulletproof 
vest.
  Mr. Speaker, let us not get complacent on the issues of gun violence 
and juvenile justice. Let us not let another graduation day pass 
without action by this House to reduce violence and to help our 
troubled children.
  Mr. Speaker, that is still a debate which this House needs, which I 
encourage the leadership to allow, and which America wants. Instead of 
or at least in addition to the debate on the Education Land Grant Act, 
let us have a constructive and bipartisan debate on our response to the 
growing crisis of school violence.
  Mr. Speaker, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, continuing debate on H.R. 150, I yield 
such time as he may consume to the gentleman from Utah (Mr. Hansen), 
the chairman of the Subcommittee on Public Lands and National Parks.
  Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Speaker, I thank my friend, the gentleman from Texas, 
for yielding time to me.
  Mr. Speaker, I rise in support of the rule for H.R. 150. H.R. 150 is 
an important piece of legislation that will help schoolchildren in 
rural communities throughout this country.
  The Education Land Grant Act will allow publicly-funded education 
entities to acquire Forest Service land at nominal cost for school 
facilities. This will help many of the cash-strapped communities that 
are hemmed in by government land to provide an education for their 
children.
  Mr. Speaker, this is an important bill that will help the Nation's 
children. I would like to thank the minority for working with us to 
fine-tune this legislation, and I look forward to the discussion on 
H.R. 150 on the floor. I support the rule, and hope that my colleagues 
will do likewise.
  Ms. SLAUGHTER. Mr. Speaker, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, I yield such time as he may consume to the 
gentleman from Nevada (Mr. Gibbons).
  Mr. GIBBONS. Mr. Speaker, I rise today in support of the rule and the 
underlying legislation, H.R. 150. I want to thank the gentleman from 
Texas for yielding time to me to speak on this bill, and I want to 
congratulate the gentleman from Arizona (Mr. Hayworth) for his vision 
and forthrightness and commitment in bringing this bill before the 
floor.
  Mr. Speaker, I represent the Second Congressional District of Nevada. 
It has numerous communities that are land-locked by the Federal 
government, Federal land, including Forest Service lands. We have 
several rural communities that have very little private land from which 
to expand or build new schools.
  For example, let me take one of the counties which I represent. It 
has an area of approximately 10,000 square miles. That is bigger than 
the State of Maine. It has 98 percent of that land being owned, 
operated, and managed by the Federal government. That leaves 2 percent 
of 10,000 square miles to pay for education, for the infrastructure, 
highways, for police and fire services, and all of the other county and 
local community needs. They are not able to reach out and improve their 
economic and financial base without H.R. 150.
  Let me say that that 2 percent is not enough to support many of these 
counties. What we are asking for here is 80 acres at a maximum, that is 
80 acres for this one county out of 10,000 square miles; 80 acres, not 
a lot. Without this legislation, there is no chance for these people to 
build new schools, to expand their community for their children, and to 
improve the future for their children.
  H.R. 150 is a commonsense proposal to enhance the education of our 
children, not just in Nevada, not just in Arizona, but across America, 
as well.
  I urge my colleagues to support H.R. 150, the rule and the underlying 
bill.

[[Page 11931]]

Again, I want to congratulate the gentleman from Arizona (Mr. 
Hayworth).
  Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, I yield such time as he may consume to the 
gentleman from Arizona (Mr. Hayworth).
  Mr. HAYWORTH. Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague, the gentleman from 
Texas (Mr. Sessions), a member of the Committee on Rules, for yielding 
time to me.
  I also thank my colleague, the gentlewoman from New York (Ms. 
Slaughter) for her remarks, such as they pertain to this particular 
piece of legislation.
  Mr. Speaker, today we have the opportunity to come together as 
Americans, not as Democrats or as Republicans but as Americans, to pass 
an important piece of legislation that will make it easier for 
economically-challenged communities to provide educational facilities 
for our children.
  The title of this bill says it all: The Education Land Grant Act. 
This act would allow school districts around the country to apply for 
conveyances of small tracts of Forest Service land at nominal cost to 
build, renovate, or expand their educational facilities.
  Currently only school districts near Bureau of Land Management land 
can apply for conveyances under the Recreation and Public Purposes Act, 
or R&PPA. Modeled after the R&PPA, my legislation simply adds Forest 
Service lands to this equation.
  Mr. Speaker, the idea for this legislation grew out of work I was 
honored to do in the 104th Congress during my first term here 
representing the Sixth Congressional District of Arizona. At that time 
the Alpine School District in eastern Arizona was in desperate need of 
new school facilities. This district lies within Apache County in the 
eastern part of the State, near our border with New Mexico.
  Eighty-five percent of Apache County, Arizona, is federally-
controlled land. That limited what could be raised in property taxes, 
so the school district was dependent on proceeds from timber 
harvesting. However, due to lawsuits, logging had been halted. 
Consequently, the timber receipts that had gone toward funding the 
schools all but dried up.
  The Alpine School District faced a dilemma. It could not afford both 
the cost of land, estimated to be $225,000, and the cost of new school 
facilities. So I introduced legislation which was signed into law that 
conveyed 30 acres of Forest Service land to the Alpine School District 
so that the people there could use that land for the construction of 
new school facilities.
  Construction of those facilities proceeds, and I am pleased to report 
that when the children of Alpine return to school this fall, the 
facilities will be completed.
  The legislation we consider today sets up a national mechanism for 
school districts to apply to the Secretary of Agriculture for Forest 
Service land without having to come to Congress to draw up a specific 
bill for a special remedy, as the people of Alpine did.
  However, the Education Land Grant Act authorizes the Secretary of 
Agriculture to convey Forest Service land only if certain specific 
conditions are met:
  First, the entity seeking the conveyance must use the land for a 
public or publicly-funded elementary or secondary school.
  Second, the conveyance must serve the public interest.
  Third, the land cannot, cannot be environmentally sensitive or needed 
for purposes of the National Forest system.
  Finally, the total acreage to be conveyed will be limited to the 
amount reasonably necessary for the proposed use, but not to exceed 80 
acres.
  It also provides that conveyances under this legislation shall be 
made for a nominal cost using guidelines established under the R&PPA 
for approximately $10 an acre. The bill would provide expedited review 
of applications by requiring the Secretary of Agriculture to 
acknowledge the receipt of an application within 14 days.
  A final determination about whether to convey the land must be made 
within 120 days unless the Secretary of Agriculture submits a written 
notice to the applicant explaining the delay.
  Passage of this bill will be a boon for rural areas throughout our 
Nation, but especially in the West and in the South, where there is a 
large amount of federally-controlled land.
  For example, Gila County, Arizona, a county in my district which is 
approximately the size of the State of Connecticut, only finds 3 
percent of its land mass privately owned. In other words, 97 percent of 
Gila County, Arizona, is under the control, the ownership, if you will, 
of some governmental entity.
  That is why in the West private land, when we can find it, like in 
Gila County, only 3 percent, is extremely expensive. Not only that, but 
the West also confronts the problem and the challenge of rapidly 
growing populations. In fact, Arizona, Utah, and Nevada are the three 
fastest growing States in the Nation. This means there will be more 
demand to build school facilities but less land to do it on.
  The Education Land Grant Act is one of the ways we can alleviate some 
of the West's growing pains and at the same time help our children 
receive the education they need and deserve.
  Mr. Speaker, my colleagues on both sides of the aisle have 
continually talked about the importance of education and the future of 
our children. H.R. 150 is a commonsense proposal on which we can all 
agree because it will allow economically-strapped school districts 
throughout the United States to put the money where it counts, in the 
classroom, helping teachers teach, helping children learn. This is a 
goal I believe we all support, Mr. Speaker.
  I hope this House will strongly support the rule and this bipartisan, 
commonsense legislation.
  Ms. SLAUGHTER. Mr. Speaker, I have no further requests for time, and 
I yield back the balance of my time.
  Mr. SESSIONS. Mr. Speaker, I have no further requests for time, I 
yield back the balance of my time, and I move the previous question on 
the resolution.
  The previous question was ordered.
  The resolution was agreed to.
  A motion to reconsider was laid on the table.

                              {time}  1130

  The SPEAKER pro tempore (Mr. Sessions). Pursuant to House Resolution 
189 and rule XVIII, the Chair declares the House in the Committee of 
the Whole House on the State of the Union for the consideration of the 
bill, H.R. 150.


                     In the Committee of the Whole

  Accordingly, the House resolved itself into the Committee of the 
Whole House on the State of the Union for the consideration of the bill 
(H.R. 150) to amend the Act popularly known as the Recreation and 
Public Purposes Act to authorize disposal of certain public lands or 
national forest lands to local education agencies for use for 
elementary or secondary schools, including public charter schools, and 
for other purposes, with Mr. Shaw in the chair.
  The Clerk read the title of the bill.
  The CHAIRMAN. Pursuant to the rule, the bill is considered as having 
been read the first time.
  Under the rule, the gentleman from Utah (Mr. Hansen) and the 
gentleman from California (Mr. George Miller) each will control 30 
minutes.
  The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Utah (Mr. Hansen).
  Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Chairman, I yield myself such time as I may consume.
  Mr. Chairman, I rise in strong support of H.R. 150, the Education 
Land Grant Act. H.R. 150 is a good piece of legislation that will help 
school children in rural communities throughout the country. I commend 
the gentleman from Arizona (Mr. Hayworth) for his hard work on this 
bill.
  The Education Land Grant Act was designated to alleviate the problem 
that may help small Western communities. These towns are often hemmed 
in by government-owned lands such as BLM land, Indian reservations, 
national forests, State land, national monuments, national parks, et 
cetera.
  Since so much of this land base in these areas is nontaxable 
government

[[Page 11932]]

land, they often find it difficult to afford school facilities. The 
little private land that does exist in these areas tends to be very 
expensive. This often makes land acquisition for school facilities 
cost-prohibitive.
  Those communities that are fortunate enough to have a suitable parcel 
of BLM land near their town can get land at a nominal cost for school 
facilities through the Recreation and Public Purposes Act. 
Unfortunately, those communities that are next to a suitable parcel of 
forest land do not have this option because the Recreation and Public 
Purposes Act does not apply to Forest Service lands.
  H.R. 150 was designed to help these towns and cities surrounded by or 
adjacent to Forest Service land. They would be able to buy parcels of 
land for school facilities from the Forest Service at nominal cost. 
This will allow many of these cash-strapped communities to build more 
adequate education facilities for their children.
  I would like to thank the minority for working closely with us on 
this legislation. The legislation we have before us today is much 
improved and something I believe we should all support.
  I understand that the administration has some concerns with this 
legislation. In particular, they object to the concept of selling 
Forest Service lands at less than full market value. While I understand 
their concerns, I think it is important to note who it is that we are 
trying to help. We are talking about schoolchildren. We are talking 
about giving school districts a little land to build an elementary 
school or a playground for the children.
  This is a good cause and a very good idea. H.R. 150 is simple 
legislation that resolves a difficult problem for rural school 
districts. I urge all of my colleagues to support H.R. 150.
  Mr. Chairman, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. GEORGE MILLER of California. Mr. Chairman, I yield myself such 
time as I may consume.
  Mr. Chairman, as introduced, H.R. 150 had significant problems. The 
bill would have amended the Recreation and Public Purposes Act to 
provide for the transfer of national forest lands to local education 
entities for use as elementary and secondary schools, including public 
charter schools.
  At the Committee on Resources hearing on H.R. 150, the administration 
testified in opposition to the bill. While they supported the objective 
of making Federal lands available in certain circumstances for public 
purposes, they testified that the legislation was burdensome.
  One of the problems with the bill was that the Recreation and Public 
Purposes Act was designed to apply to public lands only. H.R. 150 tried 
to shoehorn national forest lands into that law and it was not a very 
good fit. The problem was not only with using the Recreation and Public 
Purposes Act, but also the fact that the bill sponsor was seeking 
waivers or changes to the normal requirements of land conveyances.
  We should not be setting different requirements for school lands than 
applied to public lands used for hospitals or other public purposes. 
Further, we had no definition of a public charter school and, as such, 
we did not know what such use would entail.
  During the Committee on Resources' consideration of H.R. 150, an 
amendment in the nature of a substitute was adopted and made 
substantial improvements to this legislation. As reported by the 
Committee on Resources, the bill is now a freestanding measure that 
provides discretionary authority to the Secretary of Agriculture to 
make available certain national forest system lands at nominal cost to 
qualifying entities for use as elementary and secondary schools and 
related facilities.
  The bill requires that in order to make such a conveyance, the 
Secretary must determine that, one, the land will be used for the 
intended purposes, two, that the conveyance will serve the public 
interest, three, that the land to be conveyed is not otherwise needed 
for the national forest system, and four, the total acreage to be 
conveyed does not exceed the amount reasonably necessary for the 
proposed use.
  In any event, the conveyance is limited to 80 acres, and the mineral 
rights are reserved to the United States. In addition, the committee 
amendment includes the reverter clause that would be applicable if the 
lands were to be used, without consent of the Secretary, for use other 
than the use for which the lands were not conveyed.
  Mr. Chairman, H.R. 150, as amended by the Committee on Resources, is 
a significant improvement from the bill as it was introduced. Although 
the administration objects to the bill because the lands are authorized 
to be conveyed for less than full cost, I do not think that what the 
bill provides in this case is unreasonable, given the discretionary 
nature of the bill and the public interests being served.
  Mr. Chairman, I reserve the balance of my time.
  Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Chairman, I yield such time as he may consume to the 
gentleman from Arizona (Mr. Hayworth), the author of this legislation, 
and compliment the gentleman for doing such an excellent job on this 
very necessary bill.
  Mr. HAYWORTH. Mr. Chairman, I thank the gentleman from Utah (Mr. 
Hansen) for yielding to me. I also thank the gentleman from California 
(Mr. George Miller) because, as I have learned since coming to this 
institution, good legislation is often a collaborative process.
  I would simply say in response to a couple of points raised by the 
administration and the Forest Service, it is precisely because so many 
rural communities find themselves enclosed by federally controlled land 
are so economically strapped, so economically challenged, so 
economically disadvantaged that we brought this legislation forward.
  Fair market value in this case cannot apply, nor should it apply; and 
this bill rectifies that at a nominal cost to allow these communities 
to concentrate their resources where they are best utilized, in the 
education of our children, by helping teachers teach, helping children 
learn, and helping local communities within their discretion use this 
as another tool to empower parents, to empower these varied 
communities.
  The irony of the Forest Service opposition I think speaks volumes, 
sadly, of the fact that ofttimes there are two Americas. There is the 
America that is the cause celebre of the news magazines, of the media 
events, of the cries on our National Mall to remember the children, to 
care for the children.
  Mr. Chairman, folks from the Sixth District of Arizona in remote 
communities, folks from rural America, do not often get the chance to 
come to Washington and engage in a photo op. They do not often get the 
chance to have officials from the administration come with hordes of 
media to cover an hour in a schoolroom.
  But, Mr. Chairman, do rural children not count as much as those in 
the city? Do those who find their industry shut and their way of life 
abandoned not have the same rights as those who are easily accessible 
by the national media and so many opportune photo experiences? I say 
yes.
  Mr. Chairman, I believe Members on both sides of the aisle, rhetoric 
notwithstanding, understand full well our responsibility to children, 
whether they reside in a cosmopolitan place such as the Bay area of 
California or a rural location such as Apache County, Arizona.
  Mr. Chairman, I have often said that Mark Twain had it right. History 
does not repeat itself, but it rhymes. With this new Education Land 
Grant Act, we will reaffirm one of the greatest examples that has gone 
before.
  Another Republican member of the Committee on Ways and Means, Justin 
Smith Morrill, in the 1860s brought similar legislation to the floor of 
this body. Indeed, in the presidential campaign of 1860, it is often 
obscured because of the terrible Civil War that followed, but a one-
term Member, former Member of this body, a man named Abraham Lincoln, 
told Congressman Morrill that his land grant act would be one of the 
pillars of the Lincoln administration.
  What the Morrill land grant act did for institutions of higher 
learning,

[[Page 11933]]

granting back to our States federally controlled land for the 
establishment of institutions of higher learning with concentration in 
the agricultural and mechanical arts, what that act did to make higher 
education available to all Americans is what we seek to do today with 
this land grant act, for schools K through 12, for those who find 
themselves embattled and at an economic disadvantage, without the 
voices of the special interests in Washington, to step up and put them 
on the cover of ``Time'' or ``Newsweek,'' or speak about the challenges 
they face, to say to rural America, this Congress recognizes the needs 
that you have.
  Mr. Chairman, bipartisan passage of this legislation is essential 
because the impact of this legislation will literally be ground 
breaking because it will empower local districts. It will give them the 
opportunity to have another tool at their disposal to educate their 
children as they see fit.
  That is why today I come to the floor of this House and I ask my 
colleagues to join me, not as Democrats or as Republicans, but as 
Americans, in offering this opportunity so that we can end the days 
that existed before, so that individual Members of Congress do not have 
to come with a bill exclusively designed for a school district in their 
area and hope that it is attached like an ornament on a Christmas tree 
to a larger piece of legislation and end up with a crazy quilt that 
exists at the discretion of this House and at the whims of the 
legislative winds that may blow.
  This legislation strikes a powerful blow on behalf of America's 
children, and its impact will be far-reaching and have consequences 
that the pundits may ignore and the spinmeisters may do their best to 
sweep aside, but will not soon be forgotten in the classrooms of rural 
America.
  I ask my colleagues to join me in passage of this legislation.
  Mr. GEORGE MILLER of California. Mr. Chairman, I yield myself such 
time as I may consume.
  Mr. Chairman, as I said before, we do not deny the bill has been, we 
believe, substantially improved with the substitute, as proposed, to 
the bill, as amended. We have no problem with this.
  I would say I do not think this bill is going to solve the education 
problems in this country. There is much for this Congress to do. While 
we are happy to help pass this legislation, we wish that the majority 
would get on with the rest of the agenda that the people in this 
country want with respect to schools, and clearly part of that is to 
protect our students and schools from violence. We wish that before the 
break you had taken up the legislation dealing with background checks 
at gun shows, child safety locks, and other measures to try to prevent 
the easy access and irresponsible access of young people to guns that 
have played out in the tragic incidents, oft too often, in this 
country.

                              {time}  1145

  We appreciate that this legislation may impact 40, 50, maybe 60, 70 
districts that may have access to some lands, but there are millions of 
students that are in schools that are crumbling, that are not ready for 
the next century, that have not been wired, and we really think that 
the Federal Government ought to participate in helping, whether it is 
through the Tax Code or whether through loans or grants, to rebuilding 
some of these crumbling schools in America that are both urban and 
rural so that children can have a decent setting in which to learn and 
in which knowledge can be conveyed and can be acquired by these 
children.
  So this is an interesting piece of legislation, but it falls far 
short of what the country expects out of this Congress with respect to 
the children's education in this Nation. And we would hope at some 
point, since we are only working a couple of hours a week around here, 
that we would find time to address that legislation and deal with the 
issue of revitalizing the infrastructure of education in this country.
  Mr. Chairman, I yield back the balance of my time.
  Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Chairman, I yield myself such time as I may consume 
to concur with what the gentleman from Arizona said regarding this bill 
before us. I do not think that people who come from the large 
metropolitan areas or the large heavily populated States realize the 
problems we have in some of rural America. Many States, and we can look 
at a lot of the western States in particular and some in the south, 
where there is a small community surrounded by government land. I come 
from one of those communities myself where all of a sudden the Forest 
Service or BLM land has you hemmed in and communities can do nothing. 
They cannot touch it or do anything with it. Then, when they want to 
expand for a playground or expand their school, they have to come up 
against this bureaucracy of how do we do it.
  Nothing is more difficult, Mr. Chairman, in America than trying to 
figure out a way to get the Federal Government to trade, barter, or 
somehow buy some Federal land. It goes through the biggest fudge 
factory there is in America, and communities are lucky if they get it 
done. It normally takes 11 years before they even look at it. 
Therefore, this is an overdue piece of legislation.
  At this particular time we have a President of the United States and 
Vice President of the United States, and last Thursday the minority 
leader of the Democratic side, talking about the need for education, 
but we are not seeing too much happening around here. This is the first 
time this term, in my mind, that we have seen something that 
substantially helps schoolchildren.
  I commend the gentleman from Arizona for taking it upon himself to do 
it. I know he had some tough fights in committee to get it to this 
point, but finally we will get something that will help these little 
communities that are a forgotten part of America. Everyone thinks of 
the New Yorks and the San Franciscos and the L.A.s, but they do not 
think of the little Apache areas or Farmington, Utah, or some other 
little place in Wyoming. Finally, we are doing something for those 
folks. I commend the gentleman.
  Mr. THOMAS. Mr. Chairman, I support H.R. 150, the Education Land 
Grant Act, because it will help children in my district in Kern County, 
California, to continue to attend their school situated on federally 
owned land in the Los Padres National Forest. Passage of this bill will 
finally give the U.S. Forest Service the authority to dedicate 10 acres 
of land currently used by the Frazier Park Elementary School for 
continuation of this school's operation.
  Many schools in the rural West were built on land owned by the U.S. 
Forest Service. There is often no other choice because the communities 
are surrounded by government owned land--``land-locked''. However, 
under current regulations, these schools are facing skyrocketing lease 
prices from the Forest Service's new land value assessment methods. 
Many schools are finding it almost impossible to remain open because of 
being hit by the higher leases. Yet, it makes no sense for the federal 
government to dedicate billions to general education while strangling 
specific schools that operate on federal land.
  Frazier Park Elementary is a good example of a rural school the bill 
could aid. Imbedded within the Los Padres National Forest, the school 
is now facing a financial crisis. Since 1975, the School has leased and 
developed land from the Forest Service. Like many leaseholders, their 
property has been reevaluated by the Forest Service, and the lease has 
gone up by 1300% in one year from $1,290 per year to $17,750 per year.
  Does it make sense to take education dollars from isolated, rural 
schools to put into the coffers of a federal land agency? Local Forest 
Service officials have repeatedly lamented that they had no authority 
to dedicate the land to the school district. Passage of this bill will 
finally give the Forest Service the authority and direction from 
Congress to make such a dedication in the case of Frazier Park 
Elementary School.
  The Education Land Grant Act provides real and immediate assistance 
to school districts like Frazier Park Elementary School that are asking 
for our help. I urge my colleagues to stand and join me in voting for 
this bill and provide a resounding answer that we do support education 
for our children.
  Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Chairman, I yield back the balance of my time.
  The CHAIRMAN. All time for general debate has expired.

[[Page 11934]]

  Pursuant to the rule, the committee amendment in the nature of a 
substitute printed in the bill is considered as an original bill for 
purposes of amendment and is considered as read.
  The text of the committee amendment in the nature of a substitute is 
as follows:

                                H.R. 150

       Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of 
     the United States of America in Congress assembled,

     SECTION. 1. SHORT TITLE.

       This Act may be cited as the ``Education Land Grant Act''.

     SEC. 2. CONVEYANCE OF NATIONAL FOREST SYSTEM LANDS FOR 
                   EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES.

       (a) Authority To Convey.--Upon application, the Secretary 
     of Agriculture may convey National Forest System lands for 
     use for educational purposes if the Secretary determines 
     that--
       (1) the entity seeking the conveyance will use the conveyed 
     land for a public or publicly funded elementary or secondary 
     school, to provide grounds or facilities related to such a 
     school, or for both purposes;
       (2) the conveyance will serve the public interest;
       (3) the land to be conveyed is not otherwise needed for the 
     purposes of the National Forest System; and
       (4) the total acreage to be conveyed does not exceed the 
     amount reasonably necessary for the proposed use.
       (b) Acreage Limitation.--A conveyance under this section 
     may not exceed 80 acres. However, this limitation shall not 
     be construed to preclude an entity from submitting a 
     subsequent application under this section for an additional 
     land conveyance if the entity can demonstrate to the 
     Secretary a need for additional land.
       (c) Costs and Mineral Rights.--A conveyance under this 
     section shall be for a nominal cost. The conveyance may not 
     include the transfer of mineral rights.
       (d) Review of Applications.--When the Secretary receives an 
     application under this section, the Secretary shall--
       (1) before the end of the 14-day period beginning on the 
     date of the receipt of the application, provide notice of 
     that receipt to the applicant; and
       (2) before the end of the 120-day period beginning on that 
     date--
       (A) make a final determination whether or not to convey 
     land pursuant to the application, and notify the applicant of 
     that determination; or
       (B) submit written notice to the applicant containing the 
     reasons why a final determination has not been made.
       (e) Reversionary Interest.--If at any time after lands are 
     conveyed pursuant to this section, the entity to whom the 
     lands were conveyed attempts to transfer title to or control 
     over the lands to another or the lands are devoted to a use 
     other than the use for which the lands were conveyed, without 
     the consent of the Secretary, title to the lands shall revert 
     to the United States.

  The CHAIRMAN. During consideration of the bill for amendment, the 
Chair may accord priority in recognition to a Member offering an 
amendment that has been printed in the designated place in the 
Congressional Record. Those amendments will be considered read.
  The Chairman of the Committee of the Whole may postpone a demand for 
a recorded vote on any amendment and may reduce to a minimum of 5 
minutes the time for voting on any proposed question that immediately 
follows another vote, provided the time for voting on the first 
question shall be a minimum of 15 minutes.
  Are there any amendments to this bill?
  If not, the question is on the committee amendment in the nature of a 
substitute.
  The committee amendment in the nature of a substitute was agreed to.
  The CHAIRMAN. Under the rule, the Committee rises.
  Accordingly, the Committee rose; and the Speaker pro tempore (Mr. 
McHugh) having assumed the chair, Mr. Shaw, Chairman of the Committee 
of the Whole House on the State of the Union, reported that that 
Committee, having had under consideration the bill (H.R. 150) to amend 
the Act popularly known as the Recreation and Public Purposes Act to 
authorize disposal of certain public lands or national forest lands to 
local education agencies for use for elementary or secondary schools, 
including public charter schools, and for other purposes, pursuant to 
House Resolution 189, he reported the bill back to the House with an 
amendment adopted by the Committee of the Whole.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. Under the rule, the previous question is 
ordered.
  The question is on the committee amendment in the nature of a 
substitute.
  The committee amendment in the nature of a substitute was agreed to.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. The question is on the engrossment and third 
reading of the bill.
  The bill was ordered to be engrossed and read a third time, and was 
read the third time.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. The question is on the passage of the bill.
  The question was taken; and the Speaker pro tempore announced that 
the ayes appeared to have it.
  Mr. HANSEN. Mr. Speaker, I object to the vote on the ground that a 
quorum is not present and make the point of order that a quorum is not 
present.
  The SPEAKER pro tempore. Evidently a quorum is not present.
  The Sergeant at Arms will notify absent Members.
  The vote was taken by electronic device, and there were--yeas 420, 
nays 0, not voting 14, as follows:

                             [Roll No. 171]

                               YEAS--420

     Abercrombie
     Ackerman
     Aderholt
     Allen
     Andrews
     Archer
     Armey
     Bachus
     Baird
     Baker
     Baldacci
     Baldwin
     Ballenger
     Barcia
     Barr
     Barrett (NE)
     Barrett (WI)
     Bartlett
     Barton
     Bass
     Bateman
     Becerra
     Bentsen
     Bereuter
     Berkley
     Berman
     Berry
     Biggert
     Bilbray
     Bilirakis
     Bishop
     Blagojevich
     Blumenauer
     Blunt
     Boehlert
     Boehner
     Bonilla
     Bonior
     Bono
     Borski
     Boswell
     Boyd
     Brady (PA)
     Brady (TX)
     Brown (FL)
     Brown (OH)
     Bryant
     Burr
     Burton
     Buyer
     Callahan
     Calvert
     Camp
     Campbell
     Canady
     Cannon
     Capps
     Capuano
     Cardin
     Carson
     Castle
     Chabot
     Chambliss
     Clay
     Clayton
     Clement
     Clyburn
     Coble
     Coburn
     Collins
     Combest
     Condit
     Conyers
     Cook
     Cooksey
     Costello
     Cox
     Coyne
     Cramer
     Crowley
     Cubin
     Cummings
     Cunningham
     Danner
     Davis (FL)
     Davis (IL)
     Davis (VA)
     Deal
     DeFazio
     DeGette
     Delahunt
     DeLauro
     DeLay
     DeMint
     Deutsch
     Diaz-Balart
     Dickey
     Dicks
     Dingell
     Dixon
     Doggett
     Dooley
     Doolittle
     Doyle
     Dreier
     Duncan
     Dunn
     Edwards
     Ehlers
     Ehrlich
     Emerson
     Engel
     English
     Eshoo
     Etheridge
     Evans
     Everett
     Ewing
     Farr
     Fattah
     Filner
     Fletcher
     Foley
     Forbes
     Ford
     Fossella
     Fowler
     Frank (MA)
     Franks (NJ)
     Frelinghuysen
     Frost
     Gallegly
     Ganske
     Gejdenson
     Gekas
     Gephardt
     Gibbons
     Gilchrest
     Gillmor
     Gilman
     Gonzalez
     Goode
     Goodlatte
     Goodling
     Gordon
     Goss
     Graham
     Granger
     Green (TX)
     Green (WI)
     Greenwood
     Gutierrez
     Gutknecht
     Hall (OH)
     Hall (TX)
     Hansen
     Hastings (FL)
     Hastings (WA)
     Hayes
     Hayworth
     Hefley
     Herger
     Hill (IN)
     Hill (MT)
     Hilleary
     Hilliard
     Hinchey
     Hinojosa
     Hobson
     Hoeffel
     Hoekstra
     Holden
     Holt
     Hooley
     Horn
     Hostettler
     Houghton
     Hoyer
     Hulshof
     Hunter
     Hutchinson
     Hyde
     Inslee
     Isakson
     Istook
     Jackson (IL)
     Jackson-Lee (TX)
     Jefferson
     Jenkins
     John
     Johnson (CT)
     Johnson, E. B.
     Johnson, Sam
     Jones (NC)
     Jones (OH)
     Kanjorski
     Kaptur
     Kasich
     Kelly
     Kennedy
     Kildee
     Kind (WI)
     King (NY)
     Kleczka
     Klink
     Knollenberg
     Kolbe
     Kucinich
     Kuykendall
     LaFalce
     LaHood
     Lampson
     Lantos
     Largent
     Larson
     Latham
     LaTourette
     Lazio
     Leach
     Levin
     Lewis (CA)
     Lewis (GA)
     Lewis (KY)
     Linder
     Lipinski
     LoBiondo
     Lofgren
     Lowey
     Lucas (KY)
     Lucas (OK)
     Luther
     Maloney (CT)
     Maloney (NY)
     Manzullo
     Markey
     Martinez
     Mascara
     Matsui
     McCarthy (MO)
     McCarthy (NY)
     McCrery
     McDermott
     McGovern
     McHugh
     McInnis
     McIntosh
     McIntyre
     McKeon
     McKinney
     McNulty
     Meehan
     Meek (FL)
     Meeks (NY)
     Menendez
     Metcalf
     Mica
     Millender-McDonald
     Miller (FL)
     Miller, Gary
     Miller, George
     Minge
     Mink
     Moakley
     Mollohan
     Moore
     Moran (KS)
     Moran (VA)
     Morella
     Murtha
     Myrick
     Nadler
     Napolitano
     Neal
     Nethercutt
     Ney
     Northup
     Norwood
     Nussle
     Oberstar
     Obey
     Olver
     Ortiz
     Ose
     Owens
     Oxley
     Packard
     Pallone
     Pascrell
     Pastor
     Paul
     Payne
     Pease
     Pelosi
     Peterson (MN)
     Peterson (PA)
     Petri
     Phelps
     Pickering
     Pitts
     Pombo
     Pomeroy
     Porter
     Portman
     Price (NC)
     Pryce (OH)
     Quinn
     Radanovich

[[Page 11935]]


     Rahall
     Ramstad
     Rangel
     Regula
     Reyes
     Reynolds
     Riley
     Rivers
     Rodriguez
     Roemer
     Rogan
     Rogers
     Rohrabacher
     Ros-Lehtinen
     Rothman
     Roukema
     Roybal-Allard
     Royce
     Ryan (WI)
     Ryun (KS)
     Sabo
     Salmon
     Sanchez
     Sanders
     Sandlin
     Sanford
     Sawyer
     Saxton
     Scarborough
     Schaffer
     Schakowsky
     Scott
     Sensenbrenner
     Serrano
     Sessions
     Shadegg
     Shaw
     Shays
     Sherman
     Sherwood
     Shimkus
     Shows
     Shuster
     Simpson
     Sisisky
     Skeen
     Skelton
     Slaughter
     Smith (NJ)
     Smith (TX)
     Smith (WA)
     Snyder
     Souder
     Spence
     Spratt
     Stabenow
     Stark
     Stearns
     Stenholm
     Strickland
     Stump
     Stupak
     Sununu
     Sweeney
     Talent
     Tancredo
     Tanner
     Tauscher
     Tauzin
     Taylor (MS)
     Taylor (NC)
     Terry
     Thomas
     Thompson (CA)
     Thompson (MS)
     Thornberry
     Thune
     Thurman
     Tiahrt
     Tierney
     Toomey
     Towns
     Traficant
     Turner
     Udall (CO)
     Udall (NM)
     Upton
     Velazquez
     Vento
     Visclosky
     Vitter
     Walden
     Walsh
     Wamp
     Watkins
     Watt (NC)
     Watts (OK)
     Waxman
     Weiner
     Weldon (FL)
     Weller
     Wexler
     Weygand
     Whitfield
     Wicker
     Wilson
     Wise
     Wolf
     Woolsey
     Wu
     Wynn
     Young (AK)
     Young (FL)

                             NOT VOTING--14

     Bliley
     Boucher
     Brown (CA)
     Chenoweth
     Crane
     Kilpatrick
     Kingston
     Lee
     McCollum
     Pickett
     Rush
     Smith (MI)
     Waters
     Weldon (PA)

                              {time}  1213

  So the bill was passed.
  The result of the vote was announced as above recorded.
  The title of the bill was amended so as to read:
  ``A bill to authorize the Secretary of Agriculture to convey National 
Forest System lands for use for educational purposes, and for other 
purposes.''
  A motion to reconsider was laid on the table.
  Stated for:
  Mr. SMITH of Michigan. Mr. Speaker, on rollcall No. 171, I was 
inadvertently detained in a meeting with AARP re Social Security. Had I 
been present, I would have voted ''yes.''
  Ms. LEE. Mr. Speaker, on rollcall No. 171, I was unavoidably absent 
from the vote on H.R. 150. Had I been present, I would have voted 
``yes.''

                          ____________________