[Congressional Record Volume 165, Number 13 (Tuesday, January 22, 2019)]
[House]
[Pages H989-H995]
From the Congressional Record Online through the Government Publishing Office [www.gpo.gov]
ISSUES OF THE DAY
The SPEAKER pro tempore. Under the Speaker's announced policy of
January 3, 2019, the gentleman from Texas (Mr. Gohmert) is recognized
for 60 minutes as the designee of the minority leader.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, it is an honor to be here tonight, with so
much going on, but it seems, other than some people rushing to judgment
to beat up on a smiling high school kid with a sweet disposition,
people are still concerned about the border.
In talking to some TSA agents, some Border Patrol, some of those who
are not getting checks--we are still getting some calls--I am still
hearing from people, personally, saying: Look, it is really hurting not
to have gotten a check; and if we don't get a check, our next check
here in the next week, it is going to hurt. But we also know how many
American people are hurting because of an insecure border.
How many people have to die, how many people have to have their homes
broken into, how many people have to be hit by drivers that should not
be driving without insurance, without a driver's license, without fully
understanding the laws?
It shouldn't have to be said, but because there are so many people
who are quite dense in the liberal media, we know that everybody who
comes into this country illegally is not out to hurt America. But what
they don't understand and what some in this country--thank God,
literally, that it is a minority--don't understand is that, if you keep
the border as open as it is, then this country will continue to be more
and more overwhelmed, and we will
[[Page H990]]
lose that great light on the hill that has helped illuminate so much of
the world through our being the most generous country in the history of
the world, helping others that couldn't help themselves.
But when you do enough damage to a country, this country--the
greatest, I would continue to submit, in the history of the world, and
that is because of all races, creed, color, gender. I mean, we have
blessed the world. God has blessed this world through us.
But as we weaken ourselves by having more and more people without
regard to the law and we give more and more of our cities over to being
used by the drug cartels in Mexico, and as we continue to use Homeland
Security--thank goodness it is to a much, much lesser extent than
during the Obama administration. But during the Obama administration, I
have said here before, the Border Patrol says: The drug cartels call us
at Homeland Security, and also HHS, their logistics. They get people
illegally into the country who still owe more money to the drug
cartels, and they provide them with a piece of paper with an address, a
name sometimes, sometimes a phone number, but mainly that address.
{time} 2015
And Homeland Security, sometimes HHS, they ship them where the drug
cartels need them to be to help finish out their network through the
United States that will continue to poison our young people with drugs,
70,000 or so a year, to their deaths. At some point it has got to stop.
I was fortunate to be on a trip to the border. Actually, we all just
met there, down in southern Arizona. I have spent a tremendous amount
of time, all hours of the day and night, on our Texas-Mexico border,
but I had not spent time, like I should have, on the Arizona border. It
was quite eye-opening.
They have areas where they do have some border fence that is making a
world of difference. Like Secretary Nielsen testified, when we add a
wall barrier, it cuts down illegal immigration by 90 to 95 percent.
They have seen it in San Diego, El Paso, and some places in Arizona
where there is a massive fence or barrier. So it was interesting.
Here is something we put up down by Douglas, Arizona, and we have got
this fence here, and you can see between these big metal poles--and
those go deep into the ground. These metal, hollow pipes are filled
with concrete. So it is not easy to get through those. And then even if
you do, you get over it--and there is some razor wire. But if you get
over it, then at least to this point you still have another barrier.
When there are heavy rains, there is water in there, but then you
have got that to get over, and then you have a road here that the
border patrol drives. They can see--and I was there--you can see for a
long way. They can come zipping up, just like we watched them do near
Nogales, Arizona, yesterday.
So it does make a difference. Talking to the border patrolmen that
were patrolling this area, they said: Oh, you wouldn't believe what a
help this is. It is a huge help.
Here is another area. This barrier, it is hard to tell, it looks
solid, but you can see through the wall. Border patrolmen say they
actually like to see through the wall or the fence so they can see what
is on the other side, and, you know, see what is coming, and it is very
helpful. And this is a great fence--a great barrier. You can tell a
little better here that, you know, it has got razor wire.
And they were telling us that that is something that the National
Guard, that President Trump had sent down--or not National Guard--our
military. The military has been sent down. Just in the last 90 days,
they put up a tremendous amount of concertina wire that has made it
much more difficult for people to get over.
So this has been a terrific barrier until you get up here to the end,
and that is the end of the barrier. They say: Well, then we have got
this Normandy barrier for vehicles. Well, most of them aren't coming in
vehicles into the United States, unless they have real serious drugs.
But anyway, this is a major, major problem.
So I now recognize my friend, who was down there on the border with
me on this trip that Andy Biggs and Paul Gosar helped put together. I
yield to Morgan Griffith.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, I really want to ask a question. So I
guess I should ask if the gentleman would yield for a question.
Because if he would put up that slide where they had the barrier that
would stop the vehicles, I wonder if he had time yet--because we just
got back to--in fact, I think that might be me in the picture.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, it looks like--no, it is him because that
is his--nobody else had binoculars that good. I yield to Congressman
Griffith.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, I appreciate that. We were able to--maybe
not here, but that's fine.
But just on the other side of that, do we have a picture of the rope?
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, funny he should ask. Yes, we just happen to
have the rope. So here is the end of the barrier right here. It is an
impressive barrier till you get to the end, and then you have got the
rope he was referring to, and then they have got this barbwire fence--
pretty sad barbwire, four-strand, and it is anything but tight. The
only thing that keeps somebody from crossing our border, you have got
the massive barrier, the concertina wire, and then you have this little
quarter-inch cord here and kind of a slipknot that you can undo, and
then pull the gate open and come right through.
That is one of our brave border patrolmen right there. I won't give
Art's full name. But anyway, and the other thing we saw, there is a
trail that goes right down there. That trail--and I know Mr. Griffith
noticed this--but that trail doesn't come down all the way to the
barrier. It leads--and you can follow it all the way through this area
for miles. It comes right here to where the cord is instead of where
the big barrier is.
Mr. Speaker, I yield to my friend.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, shocking. I mean, you know, it was
shocking. And then the trail, if I remember correctly, and Mr. Gohmert
can correct me if I am wrong, but the trail then goes on up into the
hills.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, it absolutely does.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Where it makes it much harder for the border patrol
agents, we heard, to track them down. So where there is a wall, even if
they get over it somehow, it slows them down.
The border patrol folks can then spot them, using some of that
electronic equipment we have talked about, maybe using their pony
patrols, you know, where they are out on horseback, but they can then
have a better chance of catching a substantial number of these folks.
But where you don't have that wall/fence barrier, and you just have a
rope or a little fence--in fact, I know a picture was taken of it,
too--we saw a rancher, who may not want his picture out there--but we
saw a rancher who has to be in his seventies, and probably is in his
eighties, who had climbed under the fence to show that even he, in his
advanced age, could get under the fence. It was just remarkable.
I mean, did you have the same reaction I did that this was just
outrageous, and that, clearly, we just have a line that demarks it, so
that if you are law-abiding, you know that is where to stop. But the
people we are dealing with are not law-abiders, are they, sir?
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, it was interesting to hear from the
landowners down there that, you know, even up to the 1990s, the people
that came were, you know, mainly people looking for jobs, and they
would put out food and stuff. The border patrolmen had confirmed this.
We were hearing it from the landowners, and we were hearing it from the
border patrol. It used to be that when they caught people, it was the
first time they had been caught. They probably were just looking for a
job in the U.S.
But now, most of the people coming, other than family units, most of
them have records, criminal records. Not just in Mexico. Like one that
we were being told about is wanted for murder in Mexico, but for all
kinds of crimes, including murder in the United States. And that this
has become a common event. You catch them, you do the fingerprints, and
then here comes this big criminal history, and that that is what they
are getting so much of. That used
[[Page H991]]
to be an anomaly, and now it is regular course of business.
I yield to Mr. Griffith.
Mr. GRIFFITH. I would say to the gentleman that one of the things
that really struck me that I probably didn't know or hadn't heard
stories of--a lot of this was just confirming what I believed might be
going on and bringing it visually home.
But one of the things that I was astounded with was the residents in
the area who were talking about it--we had a number of residents we met
with--that the drug runners are bringing the drugs in, sometimes they
are just dropping them off at a GPS site, sometimes they are handing
them off and getting cash and bringing the cash back, but they also
were looters. So all those properties along the border have to worry
about home invasions and burglaries and thieving; because there is
nothing to stop them, whatever they can carry, they are carrying out
and carrying south as well.
You know, if it was folks, that would be one issue--and I understand
that issue is a big part of it--but if it was just folks coming north
to look for a better way of life, that would be one thing. But a huge
number of these people are coming north with methamphetamine that comes
into my district, and probably into Mr. Gohmert's as well, with
fentanyl, with heroin, and with marijuana, and they are coming in with
that. They are taking the cash and anything they can steal back with
them.
And so it is a two-way street, so to speak. We have got illegal
commerce going both ways through a rope as our defense for our country,
a mere rope, an inch of cotton thread.
Mr. GOHMERT. It is amazing.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Amazing.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, he brings up a matter that touched a memory
of what was being said by my friend--and sometimes people say that
sarcastically--John Garamendi is a friend. He is a good man.
But there were people talking before us about the drugs and that 90
percent of the drugs are coming through our legal ports of entry.
I have been contending for some time, having spent so much time on
the Texas-Mexico border, we cannot know how much drugs is coming where.
They are catching more drugs coming through the legal port of entries.
But there have been all hours--virtually every night down on that
border south of McAllen, southwest there, where the border patrol tell
us: We know. They send a group of people across in the middle of the
night; they know we have to all come to start processing them, asking
the questions, and we know that is when the big drug shipments come
across, and they know we are tied up.
And how do we know how much drugs? Nobody can say there is a
percentage.
I now yield to my good friend, Ralph Norman.
Mr. NORMAN. Mr. Speaker, I was there along with him, and I just
wanted to emphasize the statement--I don't think I will ever forget--
from an angel mom who said: Congressman Norman, a wall won't stop
everyone. No wall will stop no one.
And put that picture up right there. What we found on the border
was--particularly where the wall ended where Mr. Gohmert showed the
rope was.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, this is a different spot where the wall
ended from the one that we are talking about a moment ago.
Mr. NORMAN. Mr. Speaker, right. All along were bottles of water. We
walked up on a sleeping bag. We walked up on all types of----
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, he pulled that sleeping bag out, and that
was in the area where the wall stopped, was it not?
Mr. NORMAN. Mr. Speaker, exactly. That is where it stopped. You know,
and in talking with these agents, who are drastically understaffed,
they can't do--they can't chase down everybody that comes.
I will tell you, every agent we talked with had no hesitation to run
after one person or run after a group of 10 or more. And my question to
him was: How do you handle that type? That is how dedicated they are.
That is how diligent they are. They are sacrificing their safety.
The other thing I would point out that you and I saw to show you how
deceptive these drug runners are, they use carpet; they have stitched
together a carpet-type that wraps their feet so that you can't tell
where they go. You can't track them. And that is all along. You can see
where they are going, but you can't see the actual footprint that they
are leaving.
The other thing that stuck out to me that I thought was just amazing
were to talk to the ranchers. That one rancher had had four home
invasions. Now, think about it. How would you like to wake up, as he
did, in the middle of the night, with a person dressed in black staring
at his wife? How would you like, what the sheriff told us--I am not
going to name his name--when his home--a bounty was put on his head. He
woke up, because he had surveillance, to see four people coming in to
kill him.
{time} 2030
How would you like to see the rape trees that you and I saw?
Children's underwear, clothing, it really is a humanitarian crisis. It
is a crisis, as Congressman Griffith mentioned, the drugs in this
country, the photo you showed where the ropes were, 60 percent of the
heroin comes in there, 40 to 60 percent.
So anybody, once you go down there--and what was sad is when they
said we were some of the few who had. Our nine were some of the few who
have ever visited the border.
When you put a face with a situation like we saw with the ranchers,
like we saw with the Border Patrol agents, like we saw with the Angel
Moms--and the Angel Mom is the one who made the comment about the wall:
A wall's not going to stop everyone. No wall stops no one.
Her husband or her son was killed.
The other Angel Mom we talked to, an illegal alien came in a store.
The illegal asked for cigarettes. He gave it. While he was counting
change, he shot him in the face. These are the type of real-life
stories.
Anybody who says that this thing isn't real, go down to the border.
You look at what we saw and I think you will change your mind. And I
think that now, if we don't do it now, it will never happen.
Mr. GOHMERT. If my friend will yield for a question.
Did you go in the Sasabe little store there where we stopped?
Mr. NORMAN. I did, Congressman Gohmert. And to see what they sell,
bullets for the drug-runners to carry out.
Mr. GOHMERT. How were those bullets packaged? I had not seen them in
a store like that.
Mr. NORMAN. The bullets were packaged in a small plastic bag.
Mr. GOHMERT. Have you ever seen bullets for sale in a plastic bag
like that before?
Mr. NORMAN. I have never seen bullets sold like that, and this is
what we are dealing with. This is what we are dealing with.
Mr. GOHMERT. What was the other big thing you don't normally see, but
it took up a whole row there?
Mr. NORMAN. The rations, the Army MREs.
Mr. GOHMERT. MREs, Meals, Ready-to-Eat.
Mr. NORMAN. MREs, which was food that would last for weeks.
And I guess the other thing is these are professionals. They are
armed. The rations that they carry out, they are planning to stay there
for a long time, until they get the drugs over, and then they come
back.
It is our duty--we are not doing our duty to not stop this or make
the effort to stop it.
So, Congressman, I want to thank you for showing the pictures. What
makes it real is to go down there and see it. And there is no way you
can make the case that this is not a crisis, this is not a safety
issue, this is not a--we are in it for the sovereignty of the country.
Mr. GOHMERT. I hope the gentleman can stick around and we can talk
some more.
But we have been joined by our friend from northern California,
Congressman Doug LaMalfa. I know his friends and families have endured
quite a tragedy this past year with the fire, but I yield to the
gentleman for such comments as he might have about our border.
Mr. LaMALFA. Thank you, Mr. Gohmert, for leading this tonight and for
allowing me and some of my colleagues some time on this.
[[Page H992]]
Yes, coming from California, you know, we feel the brunt, as any
border State does, especially. But we know it is pervasive through all
50 States of this Nation.
What are the ideals of this country, its founding? We welcome legal
immigration. What is so hard about that concept?
Instead, we get into these euphemisms of just immigration or
immigrants or migrants. And that is the disservice that is being done
by people out there who are listening and watching what we are arguing
about here, that we are somehow all against immigration or against
migrants or evacuees or refugees, and that couldn't be further of from
the truth.
You don't have a sovereign nation if you don't have defined borders
that we as a nation set the policy, set what is going to happen with
who is going to enter, and so it is chaos.
So, Mr. Gohmert, we could do DACA after DACA, amnesty after amnesty.
Ronald Reagan, in good faith, back in 1986, sat down and hammered
something out, and the other side did not adhere to it.
Mr. GOHMERT. What was that something? He signed off on the amnesty.
What was it that the other side didn't provide that they had promised
in that law?
Mr. LaMALFA. A continued effort at establishing a solid border, a
barrier. Mr. Norman talked about this as well.
We are not talking about a solid fence for all 2,000 miles. We are
talking about a system. We are talking about a system where the fence
makes sense, where there would be patrols where you have the type of
terrain where you don't need to do a whole lot.
So it is a combination, like any other aspect of--whether it is a
sports team, you know, a football offense, you have got linemen,
quarterback, running backs, split ends, or even in the military
situation.
An Army tank by itself is a good piece of equipment, but you have got
to have people in it. You have to have people surrounding it. You have
to have air support. It is not that much different an analogy that you
have to have an overall system that is tailored to each piece of region
there.
So when we have seen our colleagues on the other side of the aisle,
in previous years, Bill Clinton, right on this floor, talking about the
scourge of illegal immigration in this country--Barack Obama, Senator
Schumer down the hall here, Senator Hillary Clinton, they have all
talked about this, and others that I am not naming, they have all
talked about the need to do this.
So the question is: What has changed? What has changed in the last 2
years, 4 years, 5 years, when we, just as recently as 2013, had funding
put in place in a bipartisan fashion to put stronger and more border
barrier up? What has changed?
Is it merely because of the election of Donald J. Trump, and we are
all in for resistance from here till whenever that Presidency ends,
that we have to hold hostage the entire country to this concept of
merely resistance instead of doing what is right for the border?
This shouldn't be a partisan issue at all, and, in the past, it has
proven not to be partisan. It has proven to be what makes sense for our
sovereign border. And it is so sad and maddening, I think, for a lot of
American people because here we are right now. The line has been drawn
on this, and we need to get this done.
Nobody wants to get the government operations open once again that
are closed, that are being hampered right now, but there is a
combination of things that need to happen here.
What is so appalling is that this President has put a lot of
different ideas on the table: a year ago, the four pillars, and
recently, with different ideas, different combinations. He has invited
every Member of this body to come down to the White House at one time
or another and sit and talk about this.
And when the other side roundly rejects the opportunity to have a
conversation, that is what we are supposed to always try and do, have a
conversation in this body, in this place, where we are duly elected, to
hammer out our differences.
We come from such diverse backgrounds and diverse States and diverse
districts. Just California alone, 53 different Members of the House,
very diverse viewpoints and ideas and geography. It is our job to
hammer this stuff out.
Why are Members of this House and over in the Senate getting away
with roundly rejecting a conversation about our sovereign borders here,
about the need to have a good steel barrier and the other combination,
the other system, parts of the system that make the whole thing work?
It is appalling, and we need to do better.
Mr. Gohmert, you were speaking with Mr. Norman and others about your
recent visit. I have also spent time on the California border, San
Ysidro, and a little bit of time in Arizona as well.
Mr. GOHMERT. Has the gentleman been there where the fence is or where
the barrier is, like San Diego?
Mr. LaMALFA. The San Diego portion, yes, but not currently, as
additional pieces have been done. I need to go back again and see how
the newest design is working and such.
But we have had experience at this, and we see that the stations
where people are coming through, we have got an incredible amount of
volume being done, an incredible job by our personnel there to vet
people and vet their vehicles and make sure that stuff is not getting
through that should not get through, whether it is drugs or guns or
what have you, and they are doing an incredible job.
But we are also doing them a disservice by making it so overwhelming
for them by not giving them the whole system and the whole amount of
funding as the President laid out. He wants to put extra border
security personnel, I think 2,750, as well as the facilities for those
who are coming to meet that border for medical attention and for
speeding up the process for those who are seeking asylum.
What is wrong with this package? Or what is wrong with at least the
conversation that could be had about well, if it is a little short in
some area, then talk to the President, talk to all of us about what
needs to be boosted up in it.
Instead, it is a nonconversation, and that is what is so appalling
for the American public who are watching this, who are depending on us
to uphold our oath for the security of this Nation and of its people.
Mr. GOHMERT. All three of you, Mr. Norman, Mr. LaMalfa, and Mr.
Griffin, you guys are caring guys, and the Republicans are often
castigated as being hard-hearted and not caring. But the stories we
have heard from Angel Families and Angel Moms, I know it has affected
you guys. We have talked about it.
How anybody can work so hard to get elected to come to this body and
not be deeply moved by these stories of families that are ripped apart
because someone came in illegally and killed a family member--and I
know it is a serious issue.
We don't normally abide separating children from families, even
though it is temporary, but there is a point to make sure that children
are not handed over to sex traffickers.
But it broke my heart as a felony judge, and it happens in this
country over and over every single day of the year, that someone
commits a crime and they are taken away; their children are separated
from the parent--the parent goes to jail--because we don't believe in
incarcerating the children for the father's sins or illegal activity or
the mom's. It happens every day.
So it rings kind of hollow to me when people start screaming about
that and yet have no compassion whatsoever. We heard from a lot of
Angel Moms, so many of those who are so derogatory about Republicans
wanting to secure our borders, but they will not even give these moms
who have lost precious children a minute of their time to hear these
tragic stories.
One of the stories we heard this weekend was there was a group of
people who were being smuggled into the country, and as we have talked
about before, nowadays, the drug cartels control every inch of our
border from the south side--and, some might argue, from our side as
well.
There was a wife who was the only female with the group, and they got
to the border and they spent, I believe it was, 7 days where the wife
was raped by all the other men; and they would hold the husband hostage
while the men, for
[[Page H993]]
several nights in a row, raped his wife, and there was nothing he could
do about it.
I mean, how hard-hearted do you have to be to not want to stop the
invitations of the drug cartels to contribute to that kind of activity?
Mr. Speaker, I yield to the gentleman from Virginia (Mr. Griffith)
for his comments.
I hope my friend from California won't have to go far because we have
got enough microphones for everybody here.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, that was a horrible story. And what was so
interesting was that the people who we were talking to in that group,
some of them had helped these folks out when they were found and helped
them recover as best they could in that situation. It was just a
horrible situation, and it was just one of many stories.
My colleague referenced the rape trees. We heard one of the ranchers
tell us that he was out on his property and he saw all this women's
underwear, and he picked up three trash bags full of women's underwear.
That represents somebody, each one of those, somebody who had been
raped.
This is a crisis, as you know. It is a crisis, and it is a crisis of
so many dimensions that we are not going to be able to talk about all
the different aspects.
One of the ranchers said to me: Why isn't anybody talking about the
environment?
It was really interesting. He pointed up to the mountains, and he
said: Those mountains used to be filled with Douglas firs.
Whether intentionally or unintentionally, whether it was somebody
building a campfire and was negligent or whether it was a diversion by
the cartels to pull all the first responders to one end of the county
while they ran drugs into the other end of the county, he didn't know,
but they burned down that mountain, all the trees on the whole range of
mountains.
Mr. GOHMERT. It was over 200,000 acres in one of the fires.
Mr. GRIFFITH. It was.
And he said, you know: That wasn't just old growth. That was virgin
forest. Where are the folks who normally care about the environment?
Why aren't they saying anything?
And what I found really interesting, he talked about some of the
other environmental problems with all the trash and so forth.
Well, the next day, we were talking to border security, and the
fellow who was in our car started talking about how once they put the
wall up and made it more secure, it was amazing. It just took a few
years for the wildlife to come back.
{time} 2045
Apparently, where they cross on a regular basis and are having lay-
bys--that is where they hang out until they move on to the next camp,
and they leave all their trash and stuff there--a lot of the wildlife
had just disappeared. But once they started having a fence like this or
the ability to have a road into certain areas and they cut that off,
all of a sudden, the wildlife started coming back.
He showed me a picture on his phone that he had taken of a bear. He
said: That wasn't here 5, 6, 10 years ago. Now they are back. We have
big cats. We have bear. It really is amazing.
He didn't know that, the day before, I had been talking to a rancher
about similar issues, that it is a real detriment to the environment.
Then the other thing that probably won't get a lot of attention is
that, even if we are not able to build the wall everywhere we want, it
channels the folks. Just like we saw on the end of each wall, we saw
several segments and you could see the paths. What happens is that you
are then channeling the illegal immigrants into a particular area,
which makes it easier for the electronic devices and the agents to get
in there.
If you have the electronic surveillance, you have the walls, or the
wall fence, and you have the border agents with the supplies and the
equipment, including dogs and horses, et cetera, that they need, then
they know where there are pinch points where they can cut off a lot of
this. But it will be an ongoing problem that we will have to deal with
as a Nation.
This year is just a part of it. As we close in and close off some
areas, we will see other areas where they start going in, in greater
numbers. But we will start concentrating on where we can catch more of
the drugs coming in.
As my colleague said, the lady had said you won't catch them all, but
without a wall, you will not catch any of them. I think that those are
two important points.
Mr. Speaker, I don't know how the gentleman felt about that, but I
would love to hear his opinion on that as well.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, I was going to ask Congressman Norman if he
would reflect. We heard from a lot of landowners. Individually, we
talked to a number of folks on a separate basis.
But, yes, we see here the end of that barrier, all you have to do is
just go to the end.
Mr. Speaker, after all the folks we talked to in the last few days, I
would like to ask Mr. Norman his thoughts about what needs to be done.
We have some of our friends across the aisle who say we don't need any
kind of barrier. We just need the technical equipment, the cameras, the
drones. We don't need a wall.
After what he has seen and heard, I would like to hear his thoughts
regarding that.
Mr. NORMAN. Mr. Speaker, specifically about the drones, we were
talking to one of the agents, and he said: Tell me one drone that has
ever run down an illegal alien and put him in handcuffs? Drones don't
do that.
Electronic devices alert you. Like the illegals that we saw at the
end of the day who were near us, the cameras picked it up. But you have
to have a body, somebody like these brave agents, to go catch them.
That is what they do.
But it is just words, as far as I can tell, to anybody who ever
witnesses this.
To hear the ranchers, we asked about vacations, with all of the
crime. When you see their truck chained in the carport, as we saw,
because somebody tried to steal it, we asked how they take a vacation.
He said: Well, we have to stagger it.
These are older people. They were 70 and up. At this stage of their
life, for them to have to worry about their life, worry about their
property being destroyed? How many waterlines did we see that were cut?
How many fires did he point to on the mountaintops that were set fire?
So these people are trying to make an honest living. Ranchers are
some of the most honest, hardworking people I know. It is in their DNA.
For them to have to worry about their safety, about their life, as was
described when one of the ranchers went up to the person who was
hobbling and he got shot and killed, you know, to hear----
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, that was a family member of some of the
folks we were with.
Mr. NORMAN. Mr. Speaker, that was his sister, who could talk about
him.
So that is why there is urgency to this thing. And, you know, go down
there. Like Congressman Griffith mentioned, this is just a start. The
$5.7 billion, it is a start to really get the job done and add enough
fence to help these agents. If you do it for nothing else, help these
agents so that at least it is quarantined where they come in.
I compare it to a football game. I think I mentioned I had a friend
of mine who is deathly opposed to the wall. I knew he went to the
Clemson-Alabama game, and I knew he had tickets. I said: Did you have a
problem?
He said: With what?
I said: Getting into the game.
He said: Oh, no. I had a ticket.
I said: Did you go in at one place?
He said: Yeah, I went in at one place. We were in line, not for long.
I said: You couldn't just walk in?
Then he got it. He said: That is different.
I said: Well, wait a minute. If you go to a football game and have it
walled off where you had to go to a point of entry, you tell me how
that is different than what we are talking about on this wall.
He said, and this astounded me: Well, it wasn't a concrete wall.
I said: Okay. It was a combination of metal. It was a combination of
posts, concrete. It was a barrier. How would you feel if people had
just walked in there and taken your seat and hadn't paid for it? What
is the difference?
He couldn't tell me. He could not tell me, because he couldn't.
[[Page H994]]
That is what we are talking about here, but we are talking about
human lives.
Back on that story about the husband who watched the rape, what they
did to him is stabbed him. They stabbed him in the side as to make a
point that he was to bring the drug money back and watch his wife get
raped over a 3-day period.
So if anybody can watch that and see these people, I mean, really.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, that is right. It was seven people raping
his wife 3 days in a row.
Mr. NORMAN. Three days in a row.
Mr. GOHMERT. Right. That is it.
Mr. NORMAN. Mr. Speaker, it is the right thing to do. Now is the
time. I applaud the gentleman for having these pictures. This brings it
to life.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, we were all taking pictures down there.
I want to go to a point about the caravans. We all heard about the
caravans. We knew that this was a serious invasion coming. The
mainstream, or lame stream, media was trying to say it was a
manufactured crisis. These were thousands and thousands of people
coming to try to invade this country.
From news reports, it sounded like they were originally heading to
Texas, but our Governor made it clear he was going to work with the
Federal Government and anybody the President would send, and we were
going to do all within Texas' power with Federal help and the military
that was there, to keep them from coming in. Then we hear they are
heading toward California, Congressman LaMalfa's State.
It sounds like this new caravan that is ginned up may be heading to
California, too. I would appreciate the Congressman's comments and
thoughts about people heading toward California. People elected him.
Surely, they can't be thrilled about an invasion coming like that.
Mr. LaMALFA. Mr. Speaker, it is interesting that even Mexico is
catching on to this, because, yes, it is about twice as many miles to
come from those Central American countries just to gain entrance to the
U.S. If you are doing it legally at a point of entry, why wouldn't you
go to Texas and go through the process?
It is almost double the mileage to come over toward the California
border from Central America, because California has a sanctuary-state
and a defy-the-Federal-Government-on-this-work attitude, and so it is a
magnet for that.
We are seeing, in Tijuana on the Mexican side of the border there,
those folks are fed up with what is going on there.
We are doing a disservice. The other side wants to talk about
compassion. Where is the compassion when you are basically fooling
people into saying: Oh, I guess we have an open door up there. Let's
all go do it. Let's all head that way and get an opportunity.
You are teasing people, basically.
When we talk about compassion, as my colleagues mentioned, as a
family, we were talking about this over the weekend. Rape trees?
Articles of women's clothing there that are basically trophies for
these people, showing who is in charge. It is the gangs at the border?
Who are we helping?
Then we talk about the individual names. I can name some Californians
here. I will go back to Kate Steinle; Jamiel Shaw; and, more recently,
a police officer from central California, Ronil Singh, serving
honorably, cut down unnecessarily by people who shouldn't be having
access to be able to commit crime in our country.
So where are we? There are a lot of things we need to do.
California, being very heavily involved in agriculture, high-value
crops that really don't grow anywhere else in this country, we need a
labor force. We need a legal labor force. All this goes hand-in-hand
here.
You do the workers a much better service by having them come here
with legal documentation, with numbers that we decide as a country, and
allow them to take part in what we see fit. They have documents; they
are safer.
We have so much more we can do by having a comprehensive approach to
legally enforcing our borders and who comes across. It is better for
the people and better for those who we ask to come in, and not have
them break in.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, it is a great point, just a great point.
We have heard from angel moms, angel families here, and they complain
that they have tried to talk to our Speaker and others on the other
side of the aisle, and they are not given time.
But we heard from additional angel moms and families down in southern
Arizona in the last few days. They didn't seem to me to be bitter. They
were just heartbroken, seemed like, not only for losing their loved
one, but there will continue to be people who were separated from their
children forever, not just for the pendency of a hearing, but forever,
because we weren't doing our job that we took an oath to do.
Congressman Griffith, what about those meetings struck you?
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, I mean, we heard from so many people, and
the ones who had lost loved ones really just wanted to try to make a
difference. They just wanted to make a difference to make their
communities safer, to make it safer for everybody. They are not going
to bring back their family member, but they want to make the whole area
safer.
They believe that it is a crisis. Every one of them believed it was a
crisis.
One night, we were having dinner, and a lady who didn't know we were
from the United States Congress walked over because she recognized one
of the local officials and said we have to do something on the border--
spontaneously. We are just in town having dinner.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, she didn't know who we were.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, she had no idea who we were until she
walked over and said that and then was invited to address us: Well, you
have some Members of the United States Congress here. Why don't you
tell them what you think we need to do?
There wasn't any question. These folks who live right down there on
the border, they believe that the wall, fence, whatever you want to
call that structure there in your picture, they believe that that
helps, that it is not the whole equation, but that it is a big help and
that we have to do it.
They were very encouraging to us, to a person, to continue to work
hard to try to secure that border, to stop this humanitarian crisis, to
stop our security crisis, to stop the environmental crisis.
That one person was adamant that this is devastating. He was an
environmentalist person who really was very, very concerned about what
had happened to the ecology in his area and to the environment. He
attributes that directly to the flood of not a handful of people, but
tens of thousands coming across.
One of the ranchers that we talked to, their ranch is looking at
10,000 or more people coming across there every year.
We are not talking about a trickle. We are talking about a flood. We
are talking about a crisis.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, I know some on the left try to say, oh,
this is because you are a xenophobe or afraid of Hispanics. I know this
is a generalization, but personally, in my opinion, I think the three
things that helped make America the greatest country in history were a
love of God, a love of family, and a hard-work ethic.
Generally speaking, when I look at the Hispanic culture, all my
friends, they have a love of God, tremendous devotion to family, kind
of like a lot of people in my hometown used to have, but don't have.
{time} 2100
I think the Hispanic culture can help reinvigorate what made America
the greatest country in the world. I want those folks coming. But like
Congressman LaMalfa was saying: Legally. I know Congressman LaMalfa has
got a lot of agriculture, and it takes a lot of workers who are willing
to get out there and sweat. I hear it is harder and harder to find
those folks. We know it. Hispanic folks are some of the hardest working
folks I have ever been around. But, as Congressman LaMalfa said, it has
got to be legal.
Some people are saying: Well, so what is it going to take? Why don't
you throw out there on the table so many more visas? And my contention
is: We have been through this in `86, again when Clinton was President;
how many times do we have to be fooled?
I keep contending: We secure the border and we can work this out. We
are
[[Page H995]]
already the most generous country in the history of the world when it
comes to legally allowing people to come into this country. Nobody
gives a million visas like we do--over a million. But, even then, we
can still get the workers we need, we can do what we need.
But as long as that border is porous--it is silly to keep luring more
people in with the hope that they will be given amnesty before we
secure the border, because then we will see more and more of the human
tragedy that both gentlemen have been talking about.
California has had its share of human tragedy at the hands of illegal
aliens, but so has the whole country.
Mr. Speaker, I yield to my friend from California (Mr. LaMalfa) one
more time, and then I would like to hear from my friend, Congressman
Griffith, before we wrap this up.
Mr. LaMALFA. Mr. Speaker, I thank the gentleman again for yielding.
Mr. Speaker, the bottom line, for our personnel on the border, our
Border Patrol folks: this infrastructure helps them to do their job
much easier, with much less risk. We are talking about the stadium
analogy. Having a focused effort where they don't have to run every
mile. They can put one every 10 miles, one officer every 10 miles.
Mr. GOHMERT. By the way, we saw, last week, a big photograph of a
massive metal barrier around the perimeter of the 2016 Democratic
National Convention. Somebody there knows that walls or fences work
when they are combined with security.
I yield to my friend.
Mr. LaMALFA. Of course they do. They have worked for millennia. The
argument these days is really very specious on this.
I throw it right back: How is it compassionate to put people at risk
with the magnet this country is, the opportunity it is, when we are
making people take horrendous risk, whether it is the men in the
family, their wives, their children, the separation, and all the things
that happen. That is not compassion at all. It, indeed, is a horrendous
crime against them, by giving them these mixed signals.
We need to have a legal process for people who want to come here to
work, who want to come here for education, whatever it is. I do not see
the downside of anything they have argued about here tonight: Mr.
Griffith on the environmental side of it, the wildlife and all that.
There is no downside to what we are talking about. Once we put this
barrier in place and that infrastructure is paid for, it will pay for
itself many, many, many times over, not just in tax dollars, but in
people's lives, in people's quality of life, in this country and those
that would approach it.
There is no negative argument to this, other than the rhetoric out
there in this resistance movement that is seeming trying to cash out, I
guess, in terms of elections.
When we are talking about the census that is coming up here, the
number of illegal immigrants that are in California is probably untold.
But here is a distortion that happens in California: We may have up
to three or more Members of Congress in the State who are representing
a population that is not legal here, which is unfair to the other 49
States and their representation because they should be counting
citizens and not illegal aliens in this country in that State.
Mr. GOHMERT. So you are going on the record as saying, you believe
the question of citizen or noncitizen should be on the census?
Mr. LaMALFA. Absolutely. I think anybody with common sense would look
at it that way.
Mr. GOHMERT. Well, that would exclude some of our Federal judges,
apparently.
Mr. LaMALFA. I can't speak for everything.
Yeah, the common sense seems to be lost because of this obfuscation,
the resistance, and what have you that is a political end.
Normal people sitting around their kitchen table would say: Yeah,
that is right, we should count citizens.
We treat people, otherwise, humanely in this country, we help them.
We need to help people where they come from. Whether we are talking
about the refugee situation, whether it is in the Middle East, or in
Central America, help them to thrive where they are, help them to beat
back the things that are causing the problems there, whether it is the
drug cartel. We shouldn't have the magnet of drug use in this country,
but that is a whole other discussion and battle. But let's help them
where they are. We are that compassionate country that will do so. We
can't be a magnet for, basically, an erased border and think that is
going to provide a solution.
Mr. Speaker, I thank the gentleman for the time tonight, and my
colleagues for bringing this argument forward. I hope the American
people can hear that we care about all human life. We do. But address
it in a way that works as a sovereign nation and for other nations as
well.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, I thank Congressman LaMalfa, and I thank my
friend, Congressman Norman, who was here earlier, for their comments.
Mr. Speaker, we ought to be able to extend that barrier just a little
further. It is too easy to walk around the end. Where it is there, it
does a lot of good.
Mr. Speaker, I yield to the gentleman from Virginia (Mr. Griffith)
for his comments.
Mr. GRIFFITH. Mr. Speaker, I thank Congressman Biggs and Congressman
Gosar for inviting us out there to see this, making the arrangements
for us to meet with people who live on the border, people who work on
the border, people who are trying to secure America's border and are
putting their lives on the line, and they know that. They have had
friends and family members who have died. I appreciate them inviting us
down. And I appreciate Congressman Gohmert for having this time this
evening and giving me an opportunity to talk about some of the things I
saw. This discussion will continue because there is a crisis on the
American border.
I yield back.
Mr. GOHMERT. Mr. Speaker, I thank Congressman Griffith. I appreciate
his wisdom. I always have and always will.
I, again, echo the comments he made about thanking Congressman Andy
Biggs, for arranging this, and Paul Gosar for his help. They are both
fantastic Members of Congress from Arizona.
I thank Arizona for sending Andy Biggs and Paul Gosar here. They
are invaluable.
I hope we are going to be able to help Arizona finish--look, the
President has already backed off of the $25 billion requested. I
thought that was an exceedingly reasonable request when you look at the
damage occurring to families all over America, and especially to the
families of people who are being lured in here to their death or
detriment.
Let's move that fence a little further along. Let's get an agreement
done so that we can help out these landowners and the people who are
suffering, so no more people will be stabbed, even though they were not
American citizens, stabbed and forced to watch your wife be repeatedly
raped. I mean, how callous do you have to be to say: No, we don't want
to deal with that problem; we are going to allow that to keep going?
How callous do you have to be?
As we understand it, the family member--we have talked to his
sister--he went out there and always provided water and food to people
who were illegally crossing into the United States and were illegally
on their property, and yet he ends up being shot dead in the head.
It is time to start doing more to protect Americans. It is time to
start doing more out of compassion for the people of Mexico to dry up
the tens of billions of dollars every year going to the drug cartels.
Let's extend the barriers where we need it. Let's do the humane thing
for our friends south of the border, and especially those people to
whom we have taken an oath to protect their constitution, including
them.
Mr. Speaker, I yield back the balance of my time.
The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair would remind Members to properly
yield and reclaim time in debate.
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