[Congressional Record Volume 147, Number 25 (Wednesday, February 28, 2001)]
[Senate]
[Pages S1676-S1678]
From the Congressional Record Online through the Government Publishing Office [www.gpo.gov]
UNANIMOUS CONSENT REQUEST--BANKRUPTCY
Mr. LOTT. Mr. President, as most Members know, the Senate has been
waiting for the Judiciary Committee to complete action on the very
important bankruptcy bill for some time now. There is a long history
behind it. As you recall, we passed the bankruptcy bill last year by a
very wide margin, 70-28. The bill was eventually vetoed, even though,
when I talked to the President personally about it, I had the
impression that he had some hesitancy in vetoing it, but he did. And in
view of the lateness of the hour, it was not overridden--an effort was
not made to override it.
So at the beginning of this session, it seemed to me this was a bill
that had been worked through the meat grinder very aggressively and
that we should move it very quickly. So my thought was we should file
it and, under rule XIV, bring it directly to the floor of the Senate. I
did not make any effort to do that in a surprising way. There seemed to
be pretty broad agreement that that would be a reasonable way to
approach it.
However, there was some feeling by the ranking member on the
Judiciary Committee that the committee should have a chance to have a
look at the legislation. I discussed it with the chairman of the
Judiciary Committee, Senator Hatch. While he would have preferred that
it go straight to the floor, he thought that was a reasonable request
and that that would make the Members feel it was being done in a fairer
way. So be it; that would be fine.
All along, of course, I was talking to Senator Daschle, and we were
talking about the best way to proceed, never wanting to surprise him at
all. So it went to the Judiciary Committee. At that point then, there
was an objection which delayed it for another week. And I thought the
next week we would get it out. For a variety of reasons, without
pointing fingers at anybody, it did not come out the week before the
President's Day work period. Then I thought that this week we would get
to it.
I think the committee needs to be congratulated because the committee
worked yesterday, it worked again today, and it completed its work. I
do not know how many amendments actually were considered, but they
dealt in some way with as many as 30 amendments and I guess voted on a
whole lot of them. They reported out the bill today, so we are ready to
go. I hope we can get to the substance of the bill and have a full and
free debate--amendments will be offered, considered, and voted on--and
then we will bring this legislation to conclusion.
This is a part of my extraordinary, good-faith effort, I say to the
distinguished Senator from Minnesota, to make sure we go by regular
order--let the committees do their job, be considerate of other
Senators' wishes, be considerate of the chairman of the Judiciary
Committee, be considerate of the ranking Democrat on the committee, and
confer with my colleague, Senator Daschle, the leader of the Democrats
here in the Senate, to make sure he is aware of what I am thinking, and
ask for his help. And he has given it.
So I really bent over backward. It is part of this atmosphere we are
trying to create--bipartisanship, working together. As we look toward
bringing education to the floor, and campaign finance reform to the
floor, and the budget resolution, I am doing everything I can to set a
tone where everybody can make their case. Everybody will have that
opportunity. But I must say, I am really getting frustrated. However, I
am ever hopeful that my gentle nature and my plaintive plea will appeal
to the Senators who might have some reservations about us moving to
consider this bill.
So, Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that the Senate begin
consideration of the bankruptcy bill, reported out of the Judiciary
Committee today, at 10 a.m. on Thursday.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there objection?
Mr. WELLSTONE. Mr. President, I object.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. Objection is heard.
Mr. REID. Will the Senator yield?
Mr. LOTT. I am glad to yield to the distinguished assistant minority
leader.
Mr. REID. Mr. President, I say to the majority leader, we know the
strong feelings the Senator from Minnesota has, and we respect that
wholeheartedly.
I had one problem with the bill that dealt with something that was
offered on the floor by Senator Schumer and me dealing with clinic
violence. It went to conference. They stripped it, even though it
passed here by an extremely wide margin.
The Judiciary Committee put that in yesterday. It is in the bill that
will come before the Senate. I am very grateful to Senator Leahy, who
worked so hard on this matter, and the entire Judiciary Committee for
allowing it to be part of this bill.
I believe it is a much better bill with this provision in it. It was
not in the bill when it came to the floor out of conference. I voted
against it. I am appreciative of what the Judiciary Committee has done
in this regard.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The majority leader.
Mr. LOTT. Mr. President, I will be glad to yield to the Senator from
Minnesota.
Mr. WELLSTONE. Mr. President, I will follow our minority leader. I
wanted to respond to what the majority leader said, but I will follow
the leader.
Mr. DASCHLE. I would prefer to follow the senior Senator from the
State of Minnesota.
[[Page S1677]]
Mr. LOTT. To help with all this, why don't I yield the floor. I will
stay to participate because I have a feeling the Senator from Minnesota
is going to be persuaded by the generous nature of his leader and my
persuasive abilities to let us get to the substance of the bill. I know
with this Senator from Minnesota, I have heard him time and time again
say: I have a right as a Senator to make my case and offer my
amendments. I believe he will remember on occasion I have supported his
right to be able to do that. He will have his right. But to delay this
bill another week, what does it accomplish? We could begin to make
progress, and we could have a vote on amendments.
I wish he would reconsider. This is on the motion to proceed. I think
the American people look at us and say: Excuse me? You are going to
have a cloture vote to cut off a filibuster on the motion to proceed to
the bill; then you are on the bill and you have to do it again?
I hope the Senator will relent. I yield the floor to see what the
Senator has to say.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Minnesota.
Mr. WELLSTONE. Mr. President, I won't be long. I thank the majority
leader for his graciousness, even though we are in disagreement. I
appreciate not only what he said but the way he said it.
It is extremely important that to the maximum extent possible we work
together. This bill is going to come to the floor of the Senate; there
is no question about it. There are going to be votes. As a Senator from
Minnesota, I will use this occasion. Perhaps we will have discussion
tomorrow and can reach some agreement about how to move forward. Let me
say that to the majority leader.
This is an opportunity for me to say to other Senators and, more
importantly, to the people of Minnesota, this bill is harsh and one
sided. I cannot believe that we make it so difficult for people who
find themselves in such difficult circumstances. Fifty percent of the
people of the country who declare bankruptcy do it because of a major
medical expense. Almost all the rest of the cases are because of
someone losing a job or because of a divorce.
I will not speak long, but I want the majority leader to know how
heartfelt my objection is. It is not just a question of procedure or
inside baseball in the Senate. I don't want to miss an opportunity to
talk about how harsh and mistaken this piece of legislation is.
We just had 1,300 LTV workers laid off work in northeast Minnesota.
The way this bill reads, in terms of what they can file for chapter 7,
they are supposed to look at the average of their income over the last
5 months. That doesn't help them. Many of them just lost their jobs. I
don't want them to go under. I want them to be able to rebuild their
lives.
In my not so humble opinion, this is a classic example of a financial
services industry with enormous clout putting on a full court press. I
am proud, working with other Senators, to have held them off and held
them off. This bill may pass. It doesn't ask these credit card
companies to be accountable at all. It does not deal with some of the
worst circumstances that affect families that are going to go under. It
has an onerous means test. It is extremely one sided.
The first piece of legislation we are going to pass in the Senate, as
the economy begins to go down and people are worried about losing their
jobs and are feeling the economic squeeze, is a piece of legislation
that is going to make it practically impossible for many families that
are going under, through no fault of their own, to file for chapter 7
and rebuild their lives. What a start.
I come to the floor to object because I believe this is an egregious
piece of legislation. The majority leader has been gracious to me. He
knows I have the right, as does the minority leader, to object.
I say to the majority leader: This is tonight. Because he has been
gracious, we can talk tomorrow and maybe we can figure out a way that
we can proceed. However, I am not going to give up my opportunity to
talk about how harsh this legislation is, and I am not going to give up
my opportunity, in every way I can, to point out the weaknesses. There
will be plenty of opportunity next week as well.
I hope when we do move forward--and this is something I want to
discuss with the leader--there will be the opportunity for amendments,
and we will have a full-scale debate; we will operate as a Senate,
which is what the majority leader and minority leader want us to do.
For tonight, I have to object, and I object for those reasons.
The PRESIDING OFFICER. The minority leader.
Mr. DASCHLE. Mr. President, once again, we hear the eloquent passion
of a Senator who cares deeply about an issue. I applaud him for that
passion and his compassion for those who are now out of work as a
result of layoffs in Minnesota. I understand how deeply felt his views
are.
He has expressed, in his own eloquent way, that it is within his
right to object tonight. Each Senator has enormous power to stop
things. Each Senator has enormous power to change the legislative
process.
The majority leader, on several occasions, could have thwarted this
process, avoided regular order, prevented Senators from the opportunity
that I believe we will have next week to offer amendments. He could
have done a number of things using his rights, first as a Senator and,
secondly, as a leader, to undermine what we have delicately constructed
here in this new bipartisan environment. He could have done that.
Senator Lott chose not to do that.
The majority leader said, in keeping with the spirit we are trying to
maintain, as much as I wanted to go to this bill 3 weeks ago, last
week, the week before, as many times as we have talked about this,
every time I have asked him, he has said: Look, I am going to try to
maintain the kind of spirit that we have been able to create so far
where we can have a win-win; Senators who are passionately opposed to
this bill ought to have the right to express themselves, ought to have
the right to offer amendments, ought to have the right to have a good
debate; Senators who want to move this process along ought to be able
to use the tools available to them to do that as well.
What we are trying to do is to strike a delicate balance because
there is passion on both sides. There is a depth of feeling on both
sides. I, frankly, have been on both sides because I am so ambivalent
about the importance of the arguments raised by the Senator from
Minnesota as well as the concern that I have for the abuse we find in
the system.
I appreciate very much the Senator from Minnesota expressing himself
and at least giving us the possibility that we could revisit this issue
tomorrow, and I recognize, once again, that if every Senator exercised
all of their rights, we probably wouldn't get much done in this body.
But because everybody uses common sense, attempts to strike a balance
between exercising those rights and moving along the legislative
process, generally, we have worked out things in a way that has
accommodated the needs of most people. It is in keeping with that
spirit that I hope we can talk to the issue again tomorrow. I thank the
Senator from Minnesota, and I thank the majority leader.
I yield the floor.
Mr. LOTT. Mr. President, I appreciate the comments of the Senator
from South Dakota. He has been working with me in good faith. We
communicate regularly. We have to keep trying to do that. That is why I
sense that he feels the same frustration that I do, that we both try to
bend over backward to accommodate everybody, and it is still very
tough. We are facing further delays.
I am encouraged. The Senator from Minnesota has indicated we can talk
tomorrow, and we will look for a way to move this legislation forward
in a way that is acceptable hopefully to him and everybody else. I will
look for him tomorrow.
There are two points I want to make. The first bill we pass in the
Senate this year is not going to be the bankruptcy bill. I think the
first one we passed was pipeline safety. It is good legislation,
broadly supported. We passed one other bill that week. I think pipeline
safety was the first one.
The other thing is that I understand how the Senator feels, and you
have to have some emotions and compassion for people who get into
difficult straits. There needs to be a way for them to
[[Page S1678]]
come out of them and get a job or have a job and get back into
business. Also, this is personal with me, too. My mother and father
tried to be small business owners. My dad was a pipefitter in the
shipyard. It was hot, tough work. He decided they could get into the
furniture business at one point. He would go pick up the furniture in
his pickup truck and bring it back to the store. It was Market Street
Furniture Company. I will never forget it. He would do the selling and
delivering, and they sold a lot of items on credit. My mother was the
bookkeeper in the back of the store. One of the reasons why they could
not make it was that many of those people to whom they sold the
furniture on credit just would not pay their bills.
So there is another side. There are small business men and women who
wind up holding the bag, and when you are a small business man or
woman, that profit margin is pretty tiny. It is 5 percent, 10 percent
maybe. But I remember it was very small in that furniture store.
There were other factors involved, but eventually it ran them out of
business. My dad went back to the shipyard, and he got to work in the
pipe department. But that is the other side of the coin.
What about the small business men and women who are out there trying
to create jobs to help their family and people say, ``We don't want to
pay"? A lot of them hide behind bankruptcy.
I have supported bankruptcy laws and reform of bankruptcy laws. I
supported the bankruptcy judges system. But we have made it too easy
now for people to use bankruptcy as an excuse to hide and get out of
paying what they owe. There is broad, bipartisan support on this. I
think we ought to get it done as soon as we can. I will work with the
Senator to make sure he believes his voice was heard. I know how he
feels about it personally. I do, too. There is another side of that
coin. It is kind of a family thing with me. We will find a way to get
it done.
I thank Senator Daschle and Senator Reid for staying on the floor and
working through this.
I yield the floor.
Mr. WELLSTONE. Mr. President, I don't want to debate the majority
leader tonight. I want him to know that one of the good things about
the very important debate we are going to have is that I will be able--
the Presiding Officer is involved in this debate as well--to cite
independent study after independent study showing that the abuse, when
it comes to bankruptcy, is a very small percentage. I think the
majority leader will be pleased to hear that given the comment he made.
We will have the debate. I thank the majority leader.
____________________