[Congressional Record Volume 143, Number 85 (Wednesday, June 18, 1997)]
[Senate]
[Pages S5922-S5924]
From the Congressional Record Online through the Government Publishing Office [www.gpo.gov]




         DENYING VETERANS BENEFITS IN FEDERAL CAPITAL OFFENSES

  Mr. SPECTER. Mr. President, on behalf of our distinguished majority 
leader, Senator Lott, I ask unanimous consent that the Veterans' 
Affairs Committee be discharged from further consideration of S. 923, 
and I ask unanimous consent that the Senate proceed to the immediate 
consideration of S. 923.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without objection, it is so ordered. The clerk 
will report.
  The bill clerk read as follows:

       A bill (S. 923) to deny veterans benefits to persons 
     convicted of Federal capital offenses.

  The Senate proceeded to consider the bill.


                           Amendment No. 414

  Mr. SPECTER. Mr. President, there is an amendment at the desk, and I 
ask for its consideration.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The clerk will report the amendment.
  The bill clerk read as follows:

       The Senator from Pennsylvania [Mr. Specter] proposes an 
     amendment numbered 414.

  Mr. SPECTER. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that the reading 
of the amendment be dispensed with.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without objection, it is so ordered.
  The amendment is as follows:
       On page 1, lines 4 and 5, strike ``or star''.

  Mr. SPECTER. During the pendency of this bill, Mr. President, I ask 
unanimous consent that 5 minutes be allotted to Senator Nickles for 
debate.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without objection, it is so ordered.
  Mr. SPECTER. Mr. President, at this time I ask for the yeas and nays.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there a sufficient second? There is a 
sufficient second.
  The yeas and nays were ordered.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The yeas and nays are ordered on final passage 
of the bill.
  Mr. SPECTER. Mr. President, this bill would amend existing law to 
deny benefits to veterans who have been convicted of a Federal capital 
offense. Current law denies such benefits to veterans convicted of 
Federal crimes, such as sabotage, treason, and sedition, but not 
murder.
  I offer this bill on behalf of myself and my distinguished colleague 
from New Jersey, Senator Torricelli, and also Senator Byrd, Senator 
Nickles, Senator Inhofe, Senator Feinstein, Senator Campbell, and the 
distinguished Presiding Officer, Senator Santorum.
  Mr. President, yesterday I was informed by staff in the Veterans' 
Affairs Committee, which I chair, that there is a gap in the law which 
allows Mr. Timothy McVeigh to be entitled to veterans benefits 
notwithstanding his murder of 168 persons, and his conviction

[[Page S5923]]

for murder in the first degree in connection with his terrorist attack 
on the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City on April 19, 1995.
  Frankly, I was surprised to learn of the current gap in the law which 
would allow him to claim veterans benefits. Those guilty of offenses 
such as sedition, treason, and espionage forfeit veterans benefits, but 
those who are guilty of murder in the first degree do not.
  The terrorist attack in Oklahoma City was the most heinous criminal 
act in the history of the United States of America, to my knowledge. It 
resulted in the murder of 168 persons, including many children. It also 
resulted in the wounding and maiming of hundreds of others who were in 
that building.
  Yesterday, Senator Torricelli introduced legislation similar to mine. 
We talked this morning, and we decided to join our efforts. Senator 
Lott consented to have the matter placed on the calendar for quick 
action. And we have had it now cleared by all Senators.
  I think this is a piece of legislation which ought to be adopted 
promptly. It would set a mark, saying that capital murderers, like 
those who commit espionage and similar offenses, forfeit a variety of 
veterans benefits. I cannot say exactly what benefits Mr. McVeigh might 
be eligible for--there could be a variety of possibilities, including 
education, employment or housing benefits. Certainly he would be 
entitled to burial benefits, under current law. It surely would be 
unseemly to have Timothy McVeigh buried in a veterans cemetery with 
heroes who served the United States of America.
  So I believe this is a fair piece of legislation. We ought to act on 
it promptly.
  I am pleased now to yield to my distinguished cosponsor, the Senator 
from New Jersey.
  Mr. TORRICELLI addressed the Chair.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from New Jersey.
  Mr. TORRICELLI. Mr. President, I am very pleased today to join my 
colleague from Pennsylvania, Senator Specter, in offering this 
legislation, and very proud, as a Member of this institution, that 
Senator Specter has taken the leadership in correcting what would 
clearly be an inexplicable action upon the execution of Timothy 
McVeigh.
  Mr. President, in the United States today there are 114 national 
cemeteries. They contain the bodies of 2.5 million brave Americans who 
have fought for over 200 years to protect this country, its people, and 
its ideals. Fifty-seven of those cemeteries remain open. And many 
Americans living in the last years of their lives who fought bravely 
for this country intend one day to be interred into that soil.

  I do not know how the Members of this Senate, how this Government 
could ever explain to those brave souls or their families who will 
visit those national cemeteries through the years, generation after 
succeeding generation, if by chance some of that soil, one of those 
graves, next to someone they love and they admire and respect, were to 
contain the body in a Federal grave of someone who committed a capital 
offense against the U.S. Government.
  Timothy McVeigh is responsible for the greatest loss of life in a 
terrorist act of anyone in the long and proud history of these United 
States. When he committed that act and took the lives of these brave 
Americans, including officers and employees of the U.S. Government, he 
forfeited, according to a jury of his peers, his life.
  Today, by the actions of the U.S. Senate, he can also have forfeited 
his right to be buried and have the honor of being in the sacred ground 
of a national cemetery of the United States.
  Mr. President, a person cannot both commit a capital offense and then 
receive the high honor of the U.S. Government for having served this 
country. They are in conflict. They cannot both occur.
  I am very proud today once again to be joining with Senator Specter 
in offering this legislation. I am very pleased to have received the 
support of Senator Rockefeller and so many of our colleagues. I am very 
proud today to be offering this legislation.
  By our action today, we let every family of every brave American who 
remains at rest in these national cemeteries to know these soils will 
remain sacred, these cemeteries will remain only the home for the 
brave. That is the exclusion we vote upon today.
  Mr. President, I yield the floor.
  Mr. SPECTER addressed the Chair.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Pennsylvania.
  Mr. SPECTER. We are awaiting Senator Nickles.
  We invite other Senators to make a statement, but in the interim I 
suggest the absence of a quorum.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The clerk will call the roll.
  The bill clerk proceeded to call the roll.
  Mr. NICKLES. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that the order 
for the quorum call be rescinded.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without objection, it is so ordered.
  Mr. NICKLES. Mr. President, first, I wish to thank Senator Specter, 
Senator Torricelli, and Senator Inhofe for bringing this bill to the 
floor, and also Senator Lott for bringing it to the floor this quickly.
  I think it is somewhat of a tragedy. I read in today's paper that an 
official of the Department of Veterans Affairs said that Tim McVeigh 
would be eligible to be buried in a national cemetery. I think that 
would be a desecration of our national cemeteries. I think it would be 
an affront to all the veterans who are buried in a national cemetery 
and to their families. And so I want to compliment my colleagues for 
bringing this to the floor so quickly.
  In looking at the statutes, there is a forfeiture of veterans 
benefits for a lot of crimes: mutiny, sedition, harboring and 
concealing persons who have committed espionage crimes, gathering 
classified information for a foreign government, treason, rebellion, 
insurrection, and advocating the overthrow of the Government. But there 
is not for a Federal capital offense.
  Mr. McVeigh was found guilty by a jury, with a unanimous verdict of 
murdering--actually, I think the verdict was murdering eight Federal 
agents, Federal officers. He is responsible for the murdering or the 
deaths of 168 individuals, including 19 children. He planned this 
terrorist attack. It was not done at the spur of the moment. He planned 
it for months, maybe for years. He was found guilty. The jury has made, 
in my opinion, the appropriate sentence, a sentence that is appropriate 
for a crime of this magnitude--the death sentence.
  Certainly it would be a dishonor to our national cemeteries and the 
veterans if he was accorded veterans benefits, both financial benefits 
as well as burial rights in our national cemetery. I think it would 
desecrate the cemetery. I think that is certainly sacred ground, 
hallowed ground, honoring our national veterans, individuals that gave 
their lives in service to their country, individuals who served our 
country and were willing to give their lives.
  To have Mr. McVeigh buried alongside our national heroes I think 
would be a serious, serious mistake and a real denigration to our 
national heroes.
  So, Mr. President, I am happy to cosponsor this legislation. I am 
happy with the leadership of the Senate and the leadership of the 
Veterans' Affairs Committee, Senator Specter, and Mr. Torricelli, for 
bringing this to the floor of the Senate. And I am hopeful that it will 
receive a unanimous vote in this Senate and also be adopted by our 
colleagues in the House.
  I yield the floor.
  Mr. CAMPBELL. Mr. President, today I support a bill to correct a 
serious problem made apparent by the recent conviction of Timothy 
McVeigh for his cowardly act of terrorism. I was in the process of 
drafting a bill on this issue, but in light of the scope of the bill 
proposed by the Veteran's Committee chairman, I am pleased to join as a 
cosponsor of this legislation to accomplish my goals.
  Our Nation remains outraged at that terrorist act and the individual 
who was convicted of committing it. We now are further outraged at the 
thought of that person being eligible for burial in a military cemetery 
beside our fallen brothers and sisters.
  As you well know, Mr. President, these military burials function to 
honor the brave men and women who have placed themselves in harm's way 
in order to defend our freedom and the system of government that has 
protected us for more than 200 years. As a

[[Page S5924]]

Korean war veteran and a member of the Veterans' Affairs Committee, I 
am personally aware of the sacrifices made by our men and women in 
uniform to serve and protect these freedoms.
  When anyone seeks to destroy our system of government by acts of 
terrorism, it is certainly a slap in the face to those who have served 
to protect freedom. Allowing that individual to be buried alongside 
truly honorable veterans is not only an injustice, it is disrespectful 
of the memory of those buried in our military cemeteries and to their 
families who sacrificed as well.
  This bill, introduced by Senator Specter, expands the criteria by 
which a veteran should be denied benefits and although I had planned to 
introduce such a bill, I am pleased to cosponsor S. 923 to be 
absolutely certain that any individual convicted of a crime as heinous 
as the Oklahoma City bombing will never be buried among our Nation's 
heroes.
  I thank the Chair and yield the floor.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there further debate on the amendment?
  Without objection, the amendment is agreed to.
  The amendment (No. 414) was agreed to.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The question is on the engrossment and third 
reading of the bill.
  The bill was ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, and was 
read the third time.
  Mr. NICKLES. Mr. President, I suggest the absence of a quorum.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The clerk will call the roll.
  The assistant legislative clerk proceeded to call the roll.
  Mr. NICKLES. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that the order 
for the quorum call be rescinded.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. Hagel). Without objection, it is so 
ordered.
  Mr. NICKLES. Mr. President, I believe we are already for a vote on 
this bill.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there further debate on the measure? If 
not, the question is, Shall the bill pass?
  The yeas and nays have been ordered, and the clerk will call the 
roll.
  The assistant legislative clerk called the roll.
  Mr. FORD. I announce that the Senator from South Dakota [Mr. Daschle] 
and the Senator from South Dakota [Mr. Johnson] are necessarily absent.
  I further announce that the Senator from South Dakota [Mr. Johnson] 
is absent attending a funeral.
  I further announce that the Senator from South Dakota [Mr. Daschle] 
is absent due to a death in the family.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. Are there any other Senators in the Chamber 
desiring to vote?
  The result was announced--yeas 98, nays 0, as follows:

                      [Rollcall Vote No. 106 Leg.]

                                YEAS--98

     Abraham
     Akaka
     Allard
     Ashcroft
     Baucus
     Bennett
     Biden
     Bingaman
     Bond
     Boxer
     Breaux
     Brownback
     Bryan
     Bumpers
     Burns
     Byrd
     Campbell
     Chafee
     Cleland
     Coats
     Cochran
     Collins
     Conrad
     Coverdell
     Craig
     D'Amato
     DeWine
     Dodd
     Domenici
     Dorgan
     Durbin
     Enzi
     Faircloth
     Feingold
     Feinstein
     Ford
     Frist
     Glenn
     Gorton
     Graham
     Gramm
     Grams
     Grassley
     Gregg
     Hagel
     Harkin
     Hatch
     Helms
     Hollings
     Hutchinson
     Hutchison
     Inhofe
     Inouye
     Jeffords
     Kempthorne
     Kennedy
     Kerrey
     Kerry
     Kohl
     Kyl
     Landrieu
     Lautenberg
     Leahy
     Levin
     Lieberman
     Lott
     Lugar
     Mack
     McCain
     McConnell
     Mikulski
     Moseley-Braun
     Moynihan
     Murkowski
     Murray
     Nickles
     Reed
     Reid
     Robb
     Roberts
     Rockefeller
     Roth
     Santorum
     Sarbanes
     Sessions
     Shelby
     Smith (NH)
     Smith (OR)
     Snowe
     Specter
     Stevens
     Thomas
     Thompson
     Thurmond
     Torricelli
     Warner
     Wellstone
     Wyden

                             NOT VOTING--2

     Daschle
     Johnson
       
  The bill (S. 923), as amended, was passed, as follows:

                                 S. 923

       Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of 
     the United States of America in Congress assembled,

     SECTION 1. DENIAL OF VETERANS BENEFITS.

       Notwithstanding any other provision of law, a person who is 
     convicted of a Federal capital offense is ineligible for 
     benefits provided to veterans of the Armed Forces of the 
     United States pursuant to title 38, United States Code.

  Mr. SPECTER. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.
  Mr. STEVENS. I move to lay that motion on the table.
  The motion to lay on the table was agreed to.
  Mr. GRASSLEY addressed the Chair.
  The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Iowa is recognized.

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