    [Senate Hearing 119-123]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                                                            S. Hrg. 119-123

                           EISNER, WALSH, ROBERTSON,
                             AND ERDOS NOMINATIONS
    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                                  COMMITTEE ON
                          ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES
                              UNITED STATES SENATE

                        ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                                 FIRST SESSION

                                       TO

     CONSIDER THE NOMINATIONS OF DAVID EISNER TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF
    ENERGY FOR INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS, DEPARMENT OF ENERGY; TIMOTHY WALSH TO
        BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF ENERGY FOR ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT,
      DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY; AUDREY ROBERTSON TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF
       ENERGY FOR ENERGY EFFICIENCY AND RENEWABLE ENERGY, DEPARTMENT OF
    ENERGY; AND LANNY ERDOS TO BE DIRECTOR OF THE OFFICE OF SURFACE MINING
            RECLAMATION AND ENFORCEMENT, DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR

                                   __________

                                  JULY 9, 2025

                                   __________

                           Printed for the use of the
                   Committee on Energy and Natural Resources

            Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.govinfo.gov

                                    __________

                       U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
    61-243                      WASHINGTON : 2026
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                   COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES

                            MIKE LEE, Utah, Chairman
    JOHN BARRASSO, Wyoming               MARTIN HEINRICH, New Mexico
    JAMES E. RISCH, Idaho                RON WYDEN, Oregon
    STEVE DAINES, Montana                MARIA CANTWELL, Washington
    TOM COTTON, Arkansas                 MAZIE K. HIRONO, Hawaii
    DAVID McCORMICK, Pennsylvania        ANGUS S. KING, Jr., Maine
    JAMES C. JUSTICE, West Virginia      CATHERINE CORTEZ MASTO, Nevada
    BILL CASSIDY, Louisiana              JOHN W. HICKENLOOPER, Colorado
    CINDY HYDE-SMITH, Mississippi        ALEX PADILLA, California
    LISA MURKOWSKI, Alaska               RUBEN GALLEGO, Arizona
    JOHN HOEVEN, North Dakota

                      Wendy Baig, Majority Staff Director
                Patrick J. McCormick III, Majority Chief Counsel
                     Jasmine Hunt, Minority Staff Director
                     Sam E. Fowler, Minority Chief Counsel

                                C O N T E N T S

                                  ----------

                               OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                       Page
    Lee, Hon. Mike, Chairman and a U.S. Senator from Utah............     1
    Heinrich, Hon. Martin, Ranking Member and a U.S. Senator from
      New Mexico.....................................................     4
    McCormick, Hon. David, a U.S. Senator from Pennsylvania..........     5

                                   WITNESSES

    Eisner, David, nominated to be Assistant Secretary of Energy for
      International Affairs, Department of Energy....................     7
    Walsh, Timothy, nominated to be Assistant Secretary of Energy for
      Environmental Management, Department of Energy.................    11
    Robertson, Audrey, nominated to be Assistant Secretary of Energy
      for Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy, Department of
      Energy.........................................................    15
    Erdos, Lanny, nominated to be the Director of the Office of
      Surface Mining Reclamation and Enforcement, Department of the
      Interior.......................................................    19

              ALPHABETICAL LISTING AND APPENDIX MATERIAL SUBMITTED

    American Coal Council:
        Letter for the Record........................................    84
    Eisner, David:
        Opening Statement............................................     7
        Written Testimony............................................     9
        Responses to Questions for the Record........................    46
    Energy Communities Alliance:
        Letter for the Record........................................    70
    Erdos, Lanny:
        Opening Statement............................................    19
        Written Testimony............................................    21
        Responses to Questions for the Record........................    69
    Hanford Communities:
        Letter for the Record........................................    73
    Heinrich, Hon. Martin:
        Opening Statement............................................     4
    Lee, Hon. Mike:
        Opening Statement............................................     1
    McCormick, Hon. David:
        Opening Statement............................................     5
    Ohio Coal Association:
        Letter for the Record........................................    85
    Richland, WA (City of):
        Letter for the Record........................................    75
    Robertson, Audrey:
        Opening Statement............................................    15
        Written Testimony............................................    17
        Responses to Questions for the Record........................    56
    Scioto Valley-Piketon Area Council of Governments:
        Letter for the Record........................................    78
    SRS Community Reuse Organization:
        Letter for the Record........................................    81
    Walsh, Timothy:
        Opening Statement............................................    11
        Written Testimony............................................    13
        Responses to Questions for the Record........................    51
    Wyoming Energy Authority:
        Letter for the Record........................................    86
    Wyoming Mining Association:
        Letter for the Record........................................    87

                           EISNER, WALSH, ROBERTSON,
                             AND ERDOS NOMINATIONS

                                  ----------

                            WEDNESDAY, JULY 9, 2025

                                           U.S. Senate,
                     Committee on Energy and Natural Resources,
                                                        Washington, DC.
        The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:30 a.m. in Room
    SD-366, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Mike Lee, Chairman
    of the Committee, presiding.

                  OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. MIKE LEE,
                         U.S. SENATOR FROM UTAH

        The Chairman. The Committee will come to order. Good
    morning and welcome to all of you.
        Before beginning my opening statement, I want to let my
    colleagues know how we will proceed today with this hearing. I
    also want to thank Senator Heinrich and his staff for working
    with us on the schedule for today's activities and to thank all
    Senators in advance for their participation. Today, we will be
    holding our eighth hearing on nominations to serve in this
    administration in posts under this Committee's jurisdiction,
    and we will hear testimony from four nominees for important
    positions in the government.
        I thank President Trump for sending us these nominees. They
    are: at the Department of Energy, David Eisner, to be the
    Assistant Secretary of Energy for International Affairs;
    Timothy Walsh, to be the Assistant Secretary of Energy for
    Environmental Management; Audrey Robertson, to be the Assistant
    Secretary of Energy for Energy Efficiency and Renewable
    Energy--I think the name of the game at the Department of
    Energy is use the word energy as many times in these titles
    they possibly can--and then, at the Department of the Interior,
    we have Lanny Erdos, to be the Director of the Office of
    Surface Mining Reclamation and Enforcement.
        We will now meet these highly qualified nominees and allow
    them each to give an opening statement and to introduce their
    family and friends. I will go over a brief introduction of each
    of them first.
        Our first witness today will be David Eisner, to be
    Assistant Secretary of Energy for International Affairs. At the
    Department of Energy, the Office of International Affairs, or
    IA, is the primary coordinator for international implementation
    of the Department's programs, including bilateral meetings with
    foreign energy leaders and programs. IA works to advance
    America's economic and energy goals and also to counter malign
    influences that could threaten our nation's energy supply. The
    Office leads dozens of bilateral and regional fora, advocates
    for American energy priorities, and is the lead office for
    DOE's responsibilities as a member of the Committee on Foreign
    Investment in the United States, or CFIUS.
        Mr. Eisner is an excellent choice to handle these duties.
    He currently serves as Counselor to the Secretary of the
    Treasury, and in the first Trump administration was the
    Assistant Secretary for Management at the U.S. Department of
    the Treasury, as well as serving as the Acting Treasurer of the
    United States. During his prior service at Treasury, Assistant
    Secretary Eisner helped develop the Department's $13 billion
    budget, as well as engage in strategic planning, risk
    management, and led the implementation of various Treasury
    programs. He also provided the internal oversight of all
    Treasury bureaus, including the IRS.
        In the private sector, Mr. Eisner has worked as an
    operating partner at Edison Parker in New York, Chairman of
    K1x, Inc., and as Chairman of the Board at Finality LTD. He
    holds a bachelor of science in accounting and government from
    American University and earned his juris doctorate from Boston
    University School of Law.
        Next, we will hear from Timothy Walsh, to be Assistant
    Secretary of Energy for Environmental Management. Our
    colleague, Senator David McCormick, will introduce Mr. Walsh
    because they served in uniform together, but before he does so,
    I will remark briefly on this position and on Mr. Walsh's
    impressive career.
        The Office of Environmental Management supports the
    Department of Energy to meet the challenges of the nation's
    Manhattan Project and Cold War legacy responsibilities.
    Established in 1989, it is responsible for the cleanup of
    radioactive waste, spent nuclear fuel and materials, and
    disposing of transuranic and low-level waste and contaminated
    soil and water, and decommissioning excess facilities. This
    office oversees an annual budget of more than $8 billion, over
    90 percent of which is contracted to industry. Mr. Walsh is the
    CEO of Confluence Companies. He graduated from the United
    States Military Academy. At Ranger School, he served as an Army
    officer with the 237th Engineer Battalion in Heilbronn, Germany
    and commanded a company in an engineer battalion of the 82nd
    Airborne Division, deploying in support of Operations Desert
    Shield and Desert Storm, where he earned the Bronze Star for
    heroism.
        After his military service, Mr. Walsh earned an M.S. in
    civil engineering and construction and management from Stanford
    University. He then joined Rudolph and Sletten as a project
    manager in California and served as VP at Mortenson, overseeing
    projects exceeding $3.5 billion.
        Third, we will hear testimony from Audrey Robertson, to be
    Assistant Secretary of Energy for Energy Efficiency and
    Renewable Energy. The Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable
    Energy (EERE) encompasses 11 technology offices in the
    Department, focusing on issues including solar, wind, hydrogen,
    and geothermal. EERE's research agenda is centered on emerging
    geothermal and hydropower technologies, biofuels, and critical
    minerals. Securing domestic supply chains for critical minerals
    and components of energy technologies, strengthening America's
    industrial sector, and ensuring the reliability, security, and
    modernization of the electricity grid are all priorities of
    this office under the Trump administration.
        Ms. Robertson has been an active business entrepreneur in
    the oil and gas field since 2018, including serving as CFO and
    Executive VP of Franklin Mountain Energy, LLC, co-founder of an
    energy-focused private equity firm in Denver, and is managing
    partner of Copper Trail Partners, LLC. Since 2021, Ms.
    Robertson has served on the Board of Directors of Liberty
    Energy, Inc., and has been Vice Chair of the New Mexico Oil and
    Gas Association since 2022. She also worked as an investment
    banking analyst at Goldman Sachs and as a director and partner-
    member at Kayne Anderson Capital Advisors. Ms. Robertson holds
    a bachelor of science, magna cum laude, from Cornell University
    and a master's degree in accounting from the University of
    Southern California. In addition to her academic achievements,
    Ms. Robertson was a member of Cornell's women's varsity polo
    team and was named one of the Denver Business Journal's
    Outstanding Women in Business in 2014. She is an award-winning
    children's author and the proud mother of two sons.
        Fourth and finally, we will hear from the honorable Lanny
    Erdos, to be the Director of the Office of Surface Mining
    Reclamation and Enforcement. The Office of Surface Mining
    Reclamation and Enforcement regulates active coal mining as
    required by the Surface Mining Control and Reclamation Act, or
    SMCRA, that ensures mines are restored to beneficial use after
    mining activity concludes and mitigates the effects of past
    mining through abandoned coal mine reclamation. The Office
    authorizes states and tribes to administer their own coal
    permitting and regulation activities under SMCRA, subject to
    oversight. The Office also helps these states and tribes by
    providing operational funding, training, technical assistance,
    and support. The President's OSM budget request of $262 million
    for Fiscal Year 2026 supports the President's goals to
    revitalize the domestic coal industry as part of the economy's
    energy sector.
        Mr. Erdos is returning to the position of Director after
    having served as Principal Deputy Director at the Office of
    Surface Mining Reclamation and Enforcement beginning in 2019.
    Following his service, Mr. Erdos worked in reclamation and
    environmental compliance management at Eagle Forge Services,
    LLC, and is currently President of Cardinal Reclamation
    Company, LLC, Vice President at Eagle Summit Resources, and
    Vice President of Iron Eagle Land Rehabilitation. Mr. Erdos has
    considerable public policy and industry experience, having
    served in various capacities at the State of Ohio's Department
    of Natural Resources for 31 years, including nine years as
    Chief. His range of responsibilities included the management
    and regulation of Ohio's coal and aggregate resources, as well
    as management of Ohio's abandoned mine land and mine safety
    programs. Mr. Erdos worked extensively with agencies and
    departments, including the Ohio Environmental Protection Agency
    and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, as well as the
    Office of Surface Mining. Mr. Erdos began his career as the
    foreman at Horizon Coal Company in Strasburg, Ohio and operator
    at Y&O Coal Company in Hopedale, Ohio. Mr. Erdos is a native of
    West Virginia and received bipartisan support from the Senate
    for this position, to which he was confirmed by a voice vote in
    2020.
        Energy underpins everything we do--our jobs, our security,
    and our livelihoods. Today, we are going to evaluate nominees
    tasked with strengthening every link in America's energy chain.
    They are being considered for positions that affect whether we
    can mine our own resources, whether we can reclaim what has
    been left behind, develop next-generation energy, and do all of
    this while defending our interests abroad. Each of these
    offices controls vast sums of taxpayer resources, each touches
    a critical role in America's energy strategy, and each has,
    under the Biden administration, drifted from its core mission.
        The Office of Surface Mining Reclamation and Enforcement
    exists to enforce the law, not slow-walk permits or bog down
    states in endless red tape. The Office of Environmental
    Management was created to clean up Cold War era nuclear waste,
    not to fund open-ended contracts with no accountability. The
    Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy has lost its
    way, chasing pet projects and overreaching appliance mandates
    instead of focusing on early-stage R&D for dispatchable clean
    sources like geothermal and hydro. And the Office of
    International Affairs, it has to understand the stakes. Energy
    can be used as a weapon in the hands of our adversaries. We
    need people who know how to use American resources to
    strengthen our position, not apologize for it. We need nominees
    who are ready to streamline permitting, cut waste, rein in
    overreach, and advance an energy strategy that actually works
    for the American people.
        So, today, we look forward to hearing from our nominees.
    Will abandoned mines be restored, or tied up in bureaucracy
    while states wait for Washington to act? Will nuclear waste be
    secured and repurposed, or left to sit while federal
    contractors bill overtime? Will EERE be a research hub, or a
    political slush fund? And will our international engagement
    make us stronger, or leave us more dependent? That's the bar.
    That's the mission. And we expect results.
        I will now turn to Ranking Member Heinrich for his opening
    statement.

              OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. MARTIN HEINRICH,
                      U.S. SENATOR FROM NEW MEXICO

        Senator Heinrich. Thank you, Chairman Lee, and welcome, Mr.
    Erdos, Ms. Robertson, Mr. Walsh, Mr. Eisner.
        The Committee meets this morning to consider nominations to
    four very different offices. They range from expertise in coal
    mining to energy efficiency and renewable energy, from cleaning
    up nuclear weapon sites, to international affairs. Two things
    that the four jobs have in common, however, are their
    importance and the responsibility the officeholders will have
    to do well by the American people. Our task this morning, as in
    every confirmation hearing, is to determine how the nominees we
    are asked to entrust with these important offices plan to use
    them to do well by the American people.
        Mr. Erdos has the advantage of having been nominated and
    confirmed to the position five years ago. And while much may
    have changed in the past five years, the need for the Office of
    Surface Mining to protect communities and the environment
    during mining, to restore the land after mining, and to reclaim
    abandoned mine lands, remains as great as ever. Indeed, the
    need may be even greater, as this administration seeks to
    increase coal production. We need your assurance, Mr. Erdos,
    that you remain committed to enforcing our surface mining laws
    and regulations and to restoring and reclaiming abandoned mine
    lands. Similarly, we seek assurances from you, Mr. Walsh, that
    you will work diligently to clean up the environmental legacy
    of the Manhattan Project and Cold War weapon sites. Secretary
    Wright testified last month that the Department remains
    committed to the cleanup program, and we want to hear that
    commitment from you as well.
        I harbor greater concerns for your offices, Ms. Robertson
    and Mr. Eisner. One of President Trump's first acts after being
    sworn in for his second term was to abandon our efforts to
    transition to a clean energy economy. The Department has
    announced plans to cut dozens of energy efficiency rules that
    save consumers hundreds of dollars on their utility bills
    annually. It has proposed a 74 percent reduction in next year's
    budget for energy efficiency and renewable energy programs.
    These cuts, combined with the rollback of the clean energy tax
    credits in the reconciliation bill that Republicans supported,
    will undoubtedly drive up energy prices. The reconciliation
    bill alone is estimated to increase annual energy costs more
    than $16 billion in 2030 and more than $33 billion by 2035, and
    American families will bear those increased costs.
        I need to ask you, Ms. Robertson, whether you intend to
    continue the Department's longstanding efforts to improve
    energy efficiency and develop renewable energy sources, or
    whether you plan to abandon those programs. I am similarly
    concerned by the 40 percent reduction in the Department's
    budget request for International Affairs, and this
    administration's apparent disdain for our allies and global
    alliances. The work of DOE's International Affairs Office is
    critical to maintaining U.S. competitiveness and securing
    economic alliances with our allies, and I will seek your
    assurance, Mr. Eisner, that the Department will remain
    committed to working with our allies on international energy
    issues.
        I look forward to hearing from our nominees on these and
    other issues this morning, and I appreciate their willingness
    to take on these important and challenging responsibilities.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Senator McCormick.

              OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. DAVID MCCORMICK,
                     U.S. SENATOR FROM PENNSYLVANIA

        Senator McCormick. Great. Thank you, Chairman Lee and
    Ranking Member Heinrich. Colleagues, thanks for giving me the
    opportunity to introduce my friend and fellow West Point
    graduate, Tim Walsh, for his nomination to be Assistant
    Secretary of Energy for Environmental Management, and
    congratulations to all four nominees and thank you for your
    willingness to serve. This is a great opportunity to really
    focus on a critical part of America's future.
        Tim, welcome to the Committee. I am so thrilled to see you
    and Lisa and Alex and Natalie, and Lisa, who I have known for
    more than 30 years. And I first met Tim at Fort Bragg as a
    young lieutenant in the 82nd Airborne. In 1990, when the 82nd
    Airborne Division deployed to Saudi Arabia as part of Operation
    Desert Shield, Tim was the Commander of C Company, 307th
    Engineering Battalion. I was his executive officer. Tim's Army
    career followed in the footsteps of his father, a decorated
    soldier who fought in World War II, Korea, and Vietnam, and
    took his family around the world. That legacy prepared Tim well
    for what we would soon face in the Middle East. In February
    1991, our unit rolled across the Iraqi desert in the opening
    hours of Desert Storm, helping to clear mines and destroy enemy
    munitions. And under the pressure of combat, Tim led our
    company with professionalism and courage, dedication to the
    mission, and was awarded the Bronze Star.
        Earlier in his career, Tim helped manage base projects in
    Turkey and other NATO countries and later earned a master's
    degree in civil engineering and construction management from
    Stanford. After retiring from the Army as a Captain, Tim
    applied what he learned in the military to begin a successful
    career in the private sector, eventually founding Confluence, a
    major real estate developer based in Golden, Colorado. If
    confirmed, Tim would lead the Office of Environmental
    Management, which works to clean up some of the world's most
    dangerous radioactive sites. Given Tim's experience as an Army
    engineer and managing large projects in the private sector, I
    am confident he will bring effective leadership to this
    important office.
        I hope my colleagues will join me today in supporting this
    combat veteran, this patriot, this successful businessman, and
    truly, one of the finest people I know. Congratulations, Tim,
    and I wish you all the best.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Thank you, Senator McCormick.
        The rules of the Committee require that all nominees be
    sworn in connection with the testimony they will provide, so if
    you would, each of you please rise and raise your right hand.
        Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you are about to
    provide to the Committee will be the truth, the whole truth,
    and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
        [Witnesses sworn.]
        The Chairman. Let the record reflect that all the witnesses
    answered in the affirmative.
        Now, before I have you begin your opening statements, I
    will also ask each of the witnesses three questions that are
    posed to all nominees appearing before the Committee.
        First, will you be available to appear before the Committee
    and other congressional committees to represent departmental
    positions and respond to issues of concern to Congress?
        [Witnesses respond, ``yes.'']
        The Chairman. Second, are you aware of any personal
    holdings, investments, or interests that could constitute a
    conflict of interest or create the appearance of such conflict,
    should you be confirmed and assume the office to which you have
    been nominated by the President?
        [Witnesses respond, ``no.'']
        The Chairman. And third, are you involved in, or do you
    have any assets in a blind trust?
        [Witnesses respond, ``no.'']
        The Chairman. Let the record reflect that all the witnesses
    answered in the affirmative to the first question and in the
    negative to the two next questions.
        All right, we will now hear from each of you. Mr. Eisner,
    we will start with you and then we will move to your left from
    there to Mr. Walsh, Ms. Robertson, and Mr. Erdos. Feel free to
    introduce any friends or family members, as you may choose, who
    may be here today.
        Thank you very much.

    STATEMENT OF DAVID EISNER, NOMINATED TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY
       OF ENERGY FOR INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS, DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY

        Mr. Eisner. Thank you, Chairman Lee, Ranking Member
    Heinrich, and distinguished members of the Senate Energy and
    Natural Resources Committee.
        I am honored to appear before you as President Trump's
    nominee to be the next Assistant Secretary of International
    Affairs at the U.S. Department of Energy. I am grateful to
    President Trump for the honor and chance to serve my beloved
    country again. I am thankful to have the support of many loved
    ones today, both from near and far. Here today is my beautiful
    fiancee Rachael, my brother Ken, as well as friends and former
    colleagues from Treasury and my former business ventures. I am
    also grateful to be joined by three of my spiritual guides,
    Rabbi Mordechai Kamenetzky from Long Island, New York, Rabbi
    Shaul Robinson from New York City, and Rabbi Levi Shemtov from
    here in the District. Also, watching online is my 93-year-old
    mom, who is taking time out of her daily schedule of board
    games and activities at her home to proudly watch her beloved
    son appear before the U.S. Senate as a presidential nominee.
        I was born and raised just outside of Pittsburgh, in a
    middle-class suburb with my younger brother, Ken, by my father,
    who was a bookkeeper, and my mother, who was a schoolteacher.
    From an early age, I developed a deep appreciation for public
    service and a strong passion for giving back. That came
    directly from my parents, who were both active in the
    Pittsburgh Jewish community and always taught us the importance
    of serving others. As a teenager, I was active in my
    synagogue's youth service organization, and in 1975 and 1976, I
    had the honor to work for Senator Henry ``Scoop'' Jackson, a
    towering figure in the U.S. Senate for three decades. Senator
    Jackson inspired my passion for public service, and I went off
    to law school believing I would return to Washington, D.C., for
    a career in public policy.
        But, as life often does, mine took a different path. After
    law school, I was blessed with five separate careers, as a
    corporate attorney, investment banker, senior executive of a
    global investment bank, entrepreneur and startup CEO, and
    investor. In 2000, I co-founded TheMarkets.com, a financial
    data company backed by nine global financial institutions. One
    board member of that company was someone who's name you might
    recognize--Steven Mnuchin. Seventeen years later, then U.S.
    Treasury Secretary Mnuchin contacted me and asked if I had any
    interest in public service. I enthusiastically said yes. Among
    the many roles I played as the Assistant Secretary for
    Management at the Treasury Department, in addition to those
    roles, from March 2020 until January 2021, I had the privilege
    of working alongside a small, dedicated team in the office
    every day to design and execute the largest economic rescue
    plan in American history. That experience, during a time of
    profound national challenge, was both humbling and meaningful.
    I was honored to receive the Hamilton Medal, Treasury's highest
    award, from Secretary Mnuchin in recognition of my work at
    Treasury.
        I feel blessed to have had a successful career of more than
    thirty-five years in business. However, I can say without
    hesitation that working and serving the American people at the
    U.S. Treasury Department was the best job I ever had. Having
    previously served in government, I know the sense of purpose
    that public service brings. So when I was asked to return, this
    time to the Department of Energy, I accepted without
    hesitation, and would be honored to serve again, if confirmed.
    Even while working in the private sector, I never lost my drive
    to make a positive impact on my community and the betterment of
    others. I have dedicated significant amounts of my time to
    philanthropy, serving on the boards of various organizations,
    from my university alma mater, to prostate cancer research, to
    pro-Israel advocacy, to Jewish education. Through business and
    philanthropic work, I have been fortunate to travel to dozens
    of countries and sit across the table from heads of state,
    ministers, diplomats, and business leaders. Those experiences
    have given me a deep appreciation for the power of American
    energy and the men and women who produce it to shape our future
    at home and to build peace and prosperity abroad. I
    wholeheartedly embrace this administration's energy dominance
    agenda. If confirmed, I look forward to sharing this vision
    around the world. I believe our abundant energy resources are
    not only an engine of economic growth, but a strategic tool in
    American diplomacy.
        Thank you very much for your time today. I look forward to
    your questions.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Eisner follows:]
        [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        The Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Eisner.
        Mr. Walsh.

    STATEMENT OF TIMOTHY WALSH, NOMINATED TO BE ASSISTANT SECRETARY
      OF ENERGY FOR ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT, DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY

        Mr. Walsh. Thank you. Chairman Lee, Ranking Member
    Heinrich, and distinguished members of the Senate Energy and
    Natural Resources Committee, I am honored to appear before you
    as President Trump's nominee to be the next Assistant Secretary
    of Environmental Management at the U.S. Department of Energy. I
    am grateful to President Trump for this nomination, and I seek
    to earn your trust and support today as well. This role holds
    significant responsibilities, and I will bring my extensive
    leadership and management expertise to the world's largest
    environmental cleanup program.
        Before I begin, I would like to thank the most important
    person in my life, Jesus Christ, my Lord and Savior, for the
    many blessings he has bestowed upon me. My amazing wife, Lisa,
    and two awesome children, Alex and Natalie, are here today.
    When Lisa and I married 35 years ago, I was stationed at Fort
    Bragg, North Carolina, where I was a company commander in the
    82nd Airborne Division. Shortly after being married, with 18-
    hours' notice, my unit was combat-deployed for Operation Desert
    Shield. As Senator McCormick mentioned, back then he was First
    Lieutenant McCormick. He was my XO. But little did I know that
    I would spend most of my first year of my marriage with Dave
    instead of my wife. I used to call him my roommate, tentmate,
    but anyways, and I am sure Lisa had no idea that as the CO's
    wife, her first year of marriage, as a 27-year-old, would be
    spent taking care of my soldiers' spouses and family members.
    Sacrifices are made, but love endures.
        If confirmed, it will be an honor for me to serve the
    people of this great nation as the leader of Environmental
    Management at the U.S. Department of Energy. My love for the
    United States and passion to serve stems from growing up
    overseas and realizing the exceptionalism of America. My dad
    was a decorated Army soldier who fought in World War II, Korea,
    and Vietnam. In the mid-1950s, he met my mom, who had escaped
    from Soviet East Germany. I am the youngest of five kids, and
    grew accustomed to the adventure of moving every couple of
    years, mostly in Europe and the Middle East. I have always had
    an intellectual curiosity of science and building. This drew me
    to West Point, where I studied civil and mechanical
    engineering. After graduation and Ranger School, I led combat
    engineers in Germany and built construction projects in Turkey
    during the Reagan Cold War buildup.
        After the Army, with a master's degree from Stanford
    University, I began a career in the construction industry,
    building complex, advanced technology facilities for the
    semiconductor industry--aka chip plants--and other industries.
    Realizing there is a better way to deliver construction
    projects more efficiently, faster, and cheaper, I created
    Confluence Builders as a vertically integrated real estate
    development company. I am proud of my company's many
    accomplishments to build over $2.5 billion of landmark real
    estate developments.
        I recognize the significance of Environmental Management's
    mission, and the responsibility of addressing the legacies of
    the Manhattan Project and Cold War nuclear weapons development
    is enormous. Living only 16 miles south of the Rocky Flats in
    Golden, Colorado, I understand the impact these sites have on a
    community. Safe, efficient, and effective cleanup is critical.
    Rocky Flats, however, demonstrates what the Environmental
    Management program can achieve to safely and successfully
    accomplish its cleanup mission. The Manhattan Project's rapid
    development helped end World War II, and subsequent nuclear
    research contributed to preventing further use of nuclear
    weapons. It is now our duty to address legacy waste and ensure
    a safe, secure, and clean environment for all Americans. I
    appreciate the program is also focused on new missions,
    including President Trump's and Secretary Wright's goal of
    creating space for the Golden Era of American Energy.
        My strengths are being a strong leader, building cohesive
    teams, and achieving complex goals. If confirmed, I would bring
    to Environmental Management strategic focus, planning for the
    entire environmental mission to ensure the most pressing risks
    receive maximum attention, and decisive decision-making and
    disciplined project management to ensure accountability and
    results are achieved. Finally, I will bring my collaborative
    spirit and approach to work with all stakeholders, including
    Congress, local communities, and the tribal nations. I am
    honored for this opportunity, and if confirmed, I would be
    grateful for the opportunity to lead the Environmental
    Management team to drive down environmental risks and enable
    U.S. jobs, U.S. security, and U.S. energy.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Walsh follows:]
        [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        The Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Walsh.
        Ms. Robertson.

       STATEMENT OF AUDREY ROBERTSON, NOMINATED TO BE ASSISTANT
    SECRETARY OF ENERGY FOR ENERGY EFFICIENCY AND RENEWABLE ENERGY,
                          DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY

        Ms. Robertson. Chairman Lee, Ranking Member Heinrich, and
    distinguished members of the Senate Energy and Natural
    Resources Committee, I am honored to appear before you as
    President Trump's nominee to be the next Assistant Secretary of
    Energy for Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy. First, I
    would like to thank President Trump for his steadfast
    leadership during this pivotal time in America and for the
    trust and confidence placed in me with his nomination. This
    office plays a critical role in the Department of Energy and
    the tools we will develop as a nation to meet today and
    tomorrow's energy demands. President Trump's nomination deeply
    humbles me, and if I have the honor of being confirmed, serving
    our country and leading this office will be the greatest honor
    of my life.
        I first want to thank my parents, Dr. Scott and Dr. Karen
    Robertson, and my brother, Andrew Robertson, for being here
    today and always believing in me. I also want to thank my
    incredible fiance, retired Green Beret and Silver Star
    recipient, Nathan Buelow, as well as some of my closest friends
    and partners who are here from all over the country. And
    lastly, I want to thank my sons, William and Wyatt. Only
    William can be here today. Wyatt is backpacking through the
    Great Rocky Mountains and has no idea this hearing is taking
    place. He will have to watch it later.
        I have lived a life that is only possible in the United
    States of America. I grew up in Arizona. I went on to earn a
    bachelor of science in applied economics from Cornell
    University, followed by a master's degree in accounting from
    the University of Southern California. My early career in the
    corporate world was foundational to my knowledge of energy
    systems, energy infrastructure, and the complex role of
    companies, markets, banks and governments in the production and
    distribution of energy. Over time, I developed my own ideas
    about energy and how it could be produced more efficiently and
    with less risk. About 10 years ago, I left the comfort of my
    corporate job for an unpredictable life as an entrepreneur.
    Several businesses and partnerships followed. One such business
    I started in 2018 when I co-founded an oil and gas company. As
    a single mom raising two young boys in suburban Denver, I was
    not a stereotypical oil and gas entrepreneur. However,
    successfully producing energy has nothing to do with
    stereotypes. Energy is about numbers and science, two areas
    where I am very comfortable. To me, the numbers added up and
    the science was sound. This was a risk worth taking, and I
    risked everything. We grew this business from non-producing
    leases in beautiful Southeast New Mexico into one of the
    largest private oil companies in America. I am proud of the
    safe and reliable energy we produced and the hundreds of great
    Americans who worked hard alongside us as we developed not only
    oil and gas resources in New Mexico, but we built roads,
    pipelines, and even a microgrid.
        This was not my only entrepreneurial energy endeavor. In my
    home State of Colorado, I partnered with a vertically
    integrated operator of utility-scale solar to transform an
    agricultural property outside of Fort Collins into the largest
    utility-scale solar facility in the state. This 250-megawatt
    project will provide power to tens of thousands of homes in
    northern Colorado. As an investor and board member, I have
    dedicated time and resources to numerous next-generation energy
    technologies, including small modular nuclear, next-generation
    geothermal, and advanced sodium-ion batteries. Advancing
    technologies like these will be critical to meeting our
    nation's growing power demands. President Trump has made it
    clear that we must--and I believe we will--unleash American
    energy to protect our nation and its future. But energy is a
    complex subject, and I believe it is not only inaccurate, but
    incredibly disingenuous to apply labels like ``Clean Energy''
    and ``Dirty Energy.'' There is only energy, and every source
    and form of energy has trade-offs. I support all forms of
    reliable, affordable, and secure energy.
        If I am so fortunate to be confirmed, I will provide steady
    leadership to this office and make science-based, common-sense
    decisions that will benefit all Americans. If confirmed, it
    will be a privilege to work closely with our national labs,
    especially the National Renewable Energy Lab in my home State
    of Colorado. I am a newcomer to Washington and a novice to
    politics. If confirmed, I also ask for a close partnership with
    this Committee as we work towards an energy-abundant America.
        Thank you for your time and consideration. I look forward
    to your questions.
        [The prepared statement of Ms. Robertson follows:]
        [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        The Chairman. Mr. Erdos.

    STATEMENT OF HON. LANNY ERDOS, NOMINATED TO BE THE DIRECTOR OF
       THE OFFICE OF SURFACE MINING RECLAMATION AND ENFORCEMENT,
                       DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR

        Mr. Erdos. Chairman Lee, Ranking Member Heinrich, and
    members of the Committee, thank you for the opportunity to
    appear before you today as President Trump's nominee for the
    position of Director of the Office of Surface Mining
    Reclamation and Enforcement, or OSM. I would like to thank
    President Trump and Secretary Burgum for their confidence in
    me. I am excited to be here today to share with you my vision
    for OSM. I appreciate the opportunity to provide insight into
    my background, give you an idea about where I come from, and
    provide a snapshot into my professional career in the public
    and private sectors.
        If confirmed, my nearly 35 years of experience in public
    service at the Department of the Interior and the Ohio
    Department of Natural Resources (Ohio DNR) have prepared me
    well for the position of Director at OSM. Additionally, my
    recent time spent in the private sector as an environmental and
    reclamation manager has given me a unique 360-degree
    perspective of the challenges facing the coal industry. As a
    former Director at OSM, I have working knowledge and specific
    experience in every aspect of OSM's mission, and as a former
    Chief at the Ohio DNR, where I represented Ohio on the
    Interstate Mining Compact Commission for more than a decade, I
    developed both state and federal relationships across the
    country that have proven beneficial throughout my career.
        Most recently, I have worked in the mining industry as
    President and Vice President for two reclamation companies and
    also Vice President for environmental compliance for all the
    associated companies. I am responsible for reclamation and
    remediation of mining permits in Kentucky, Virginia, West
    Virgina, and Alabama. At Cardinal Reclamation, one of the
    reclamation companies that I manage, we have made significant
    reclamation and remediation progress over the past five years.
    In Kentucky, Cardinal stepped up to the plate to assist the
    people of the Commonwealth when permits, affected by another
    permittee, were not properly reclaimed. Today, many of those
    permits (60-plus) have been fully reclaimed and returned to a
    productive post-mining land use.
        As a former Director at OSM, we made important inroads in
    improving relationships with the states, the tribes (where OSM
    is the primary regulator), and the mining industry. Those
    relationships were strained under the previous administration.
    I will work to establish a collaborative and mutually
    beneficial relationship that recognizes the important role that
    the states play relative to regulation within their borders and
    just as importantly recognizes the importance of the energy
    that is provided by our coal industry. At the Ohio DNR, I began
    my career as an environmental technician. I was soon promoted
    to Reclamation Inspector, where for seven years I was
    responsible for inspections associated with coal and industrial
    mineral mining. I later transferred to the abandoned mine land
    program, or AML, as a design specialist. Working under the
    supervision of a registered professional engineer, I designed
    AML remediation projects, such as highwall backfills, surface
    subsidence caused by pre-law underground mining, coal refuse
    reclamation projects, and stream restoration, to name just a
    few. I was also a Permitting Manager, where my responsibilities
    included oversight of all coal and industrial mineral mining
    applications.
        Later, I was promoted to Deputy Chief responsible for
    managing the state's coal, industrial minerals, and mine safety
    programs. My responsibilities included statewide management of
    nearly a thousand permits, and the protection, training, and
    certification of the state's mining workforce. Three years
    later, I was promoted to Chief. I maintained my Deputy Chief
    responsibilities and assumed management of the AML program. As
    Chief, I worked with federal partners, such as the U.S.
    Environmental Protection Agency, the Office of Surface Mining,
    the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, and the Mine Safety and
    Health Administration, to name just a few.
        From a personal perspective, I come from a very strong-
    willed, blue-collar background where family comes first. From a
    very young age, my mother and father instilled in my brother,
    sister, and me the lesson that hard work is important. They led
    by example and taught us this lesson through their own hard
    work. My father worked for nearly 30 years in an underground
    coal mine. And although it was an incredibly difficult job, he
    enjoyed it, as well as the life it provided his family. My
    mother worked as a cook at the local school and later worked in
    the county court system. They both worked hard to support their
    family, and seeing that day after day stuck with me.
        My wife, Rhonda, of 37 years, and I have tried to instill
    much of the same in our children, Courtney and Jordan. I have
    tremendous respect for the men and the women who mine the coal
    that helps to supply the country's energy needs. An energy need
    that will only continue to grow in the coming years. But I also
    understand the need to protect our land and water. Striking
    that environmental balance, as I have tried to do throughout my
    career, ensures the protection of our natural resources while
    also recognizing the ever-increasing energy consumption of the
    country. If confirmed, it would be an honor to serve the
    citizens of this great country as Director of the Office of
    Surface Mining.
        Thank you for today's opportunity. I look forward to
    answering your questions.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Erdos follows:]
        [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        The Chairman. Thank you very much.
        We will now proceed to five-minute rounds of questions. I
    will ask the first round, followed by Senator Heinrich, and
    then we will alternate between Republicans and Democrats after
    that in just a moment.
        All right, Mr. Erdos, I would like to start with you, if
    that is all right.
        Last time you were before this Committee, and that was
    regarding your nomination to be the Director of the Office of
    Surface Mining Reclamation Enforcement, I asked you about
    permitting deadlines for coal mines. And at that point--this
    was in 2019--you said you were looking to reduce the timelines
    for permitting from six to ten years down to two or less years.
    This would be a really welcome set of news if we could do that,
    including and especially for mines in Utah, some of which have
    spent literally decades in a sort of permitting purgatory
    process. So why is certainty, in your opinion, so important
    when it comes to the permitting process, especially for mines
    and for miners?
        Mr. Erdos. Well, certainly, predictability is something the
    industry has to have. They have to know how to get from Point A
    to Point B. And permitting has been an issue. So I think we are
    talking about NEPA reviews on coal--on federal coal--and that's
    what I was referring to back in 2019. So I think, obviously,
    progress has been made over the last two to three months. Two
    or three have been--OSM has approved the EIS and record of
    decision. So the short answer is predictability. The industry
    needs predictability, and the way you get that is--the way you
    achieve that is by having a permitting system that functions
    for everyone--it functions for the states, it functions for the
    Federal Government, and for the operator.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Mr. Walsh, the Department of Energy currently holds about
    30 metric tons of defense plutonium that it plans to dilute and
    then dispose of at the WIPP facility in New Mexico. This
    strategy is projected to take over 30 years and to cost about
    $20 billion. Now, think about it, we are spending $20 billion
    to dispose of this valuable asset that was produced at taxpayer
    expense. I don't know what the exact figures are, but I am
    willing to guess that in present day dollars it costs tens of
    billions of dollars to create it.
        One of President Trump's recent executive orders directs
    the Department to end the dilute and dispose strategy and
    establish a program to process the plutonium into a form that
    can be fabricated into fuel for advanced nuclear reactors. This
    would allow the plutonium to be used as a resource to advance
    nuclear technology leadership in the world, while still
    accomplishing our non-proliferation objectives, which I think
    were part of what they had in mind when they started this
    program. Do you agree that the surplus plutonium should be used
    to support the commercial nuclear industry? And if confirmed,
    will you work with the Secretary and with NNSA to end the
    dilute and dispose program and carry out President Trump's
    executive order?
        Mr. Walsh. Yes, I will. As I understand it, plutonium can
    be mixed with other materials so that it isn't--essentially, to
    proliferation proof it, and as you know, to fuel the future of
    AI so America can be a leader with the data centers located
    here, we need energy from every source. And small modular
    reactors and all nuclear reactors, for that matter, their
    limiting factor right now is fuel--enriched uranium--which
    we're not doing here in the United States, and I think it ends
    in 2028. So we need to bring all dense energy sources like
    plutonium, and I believe NNSA is also working on a program
    right now where we can use that.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Mr. Eisner, the past administration relied on the
    Department of Energy's International Affairs Office to broker
    deals on climate cooperation in the development of more
    expensive and unreliable energy resources. If confirmed, how do
    you plan to reorient the office to focus on American energy
    dominance and energy security for our allies?
        Mr. Eisner. Mr. Chairman, as I stated in my opening
    remarks, it was an honor for me to serve at the U.S. Department
    of the Treasury in the previous Trump administration. In that
    role, I had the honor to work with several career federal
    employees, two of whom are here with me today. Two things that
    I think really marked my experience with these individuals was
    their patriotism and their respect that elections have
    consequences. Despite what I was sure was a very wide range of
    political views among those whom I worked with, we operated
    under a very basic understanding that the work that we were
    doing was not red and it was not blue. It was red, white, and
    blue. And we used that approach to motivate the people who
    worked with me, because at the end of the day, it really does
    come down to leadership. We were able to effectuate the
    policies and the programs of the previous Trump administration
    without flaw, I would say.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        And finally, Ms. Robertson, as geothermal technology has
    continued to advance, energy analysts have become increasingly
    bullish and appropriately very excited about its viability to
    supply sustained power. As I am sure you are aware, I
    introduced bipartisan legislation with Ranking Member Heinrich
    to accelerate the adoption of geothermal technology. I included
    provisions of that legislation in the energy title of the One
    Big Beautiful Bill, but unfortunately, my Democrat colleagues
    used the Byrd Rule to strip those provisions out of that bill,
    so those weren't able to make it into law, even though they
    could have under that circumstance. Nonetheless, given the
    circumstances, we must to continue to focus on finding ways to
    develop this energy resource.
        Will you commit, if confirmed, to assisting the Secretary
    to ensure that product classes are used to protect features--
    I'm sorry, I have blended two different questions there. What
    can you tell us about the importance of geothermal energy, and
    what can we do from a legal and regulatory standpoint to help
    advance that technology?
        Ms. Robertson. Thank you, Chairman Lee, for that question.
        Geothermal is undoubtedly one of the most exciting
    resources that can create stable, baseload power in this
    country between--the three geothermal powerhouses are right in
    front of me, with Utah, Nevada, and New Mexico really leading
    the way. Geothermal is so exciting and rightly a focus of both
    Secretary Wright and President Trump because, unlike many other
    non fossil-based energy sources, geothermal has the potential
    to provide stable, baseload power, which, as we look at the
    power demands in the United States over the next five, ten, and
    twenty years, we are in a situation we haven't been in as a
    country before. We have had relatively stable electricity
    demand over the years, relatively stable and increasing,
    obviously, power demand, but with the development of
    supercomputers and AI, we need to drastically, significantly
    ramp-up our baseload power, and geothermal provides one of the
    most exciting avenues to do that.
        I am sure Senator Heinrich is very familiar with the XGS
    Energy and Meta project in New Mexico that was announced. This
    is new geothermal technology. That particular project's pipe-
    in-pipe technology that is free from using additional water in
    the process, you know, programs like those and many of the
    others being developed at national labs across the country are
    going to be a more sustainable solution to step function
    changes in how we deliver power.
        The Chairman. Great. Thank you very much.
        Senator Heinrich.
        Senator Heinrich. Thank you, Chairman.
        I want to start just by addressing something you said, Mr.
    Walsh, and this is not to quibble with you, but I want to point
    out that in New Mexico we actually produce enriched uranium,
    and it supplies roughly 25 to 30 percent of the demand in the
    country. I think that is a good example of what we should be
    expanding around the country in order to meet additional
    demand.
        I am going to start my questions with you, Ms. Robertson,
    and I was glad to hear your description of some of the solar
    projects that you executed in Colorado. I have been looking
    closely at NERC's 2025 Summer Reliability Assessment in Texas.
    Texas added seven gigawatts of solar power in 2024--nearly
    seven and a half gigawatts of battery storage in 2024 alone--
    which is helping the state meet growing electricity demand from
    AI and data centers and some of the things that you have
    articulated. As a result of those additional capacities, the
    risk of power emergencies has dropped to just three percent now
    as opposed to 15 percent a little over a year ago.
        So Ms. Robertson, do you agree that in the face of rising
    demand, that the grid requires more, not less affordable,
    reliable, energy?
        Ms. Robertson. Oh, undoubtedly, the grid demands, and we
    need to deliver more reliable, affordable, secure energy. Are
    you specifically asking about best systems or solar systems?
        Senator Heinrich. So looking at Texas, would you agree that
    deploying both energy storage in tandem with renewable energy
    technologies can actually increase grid reliability, hold
    prices down, and add new generation sources?
        Ms. Robertson. It certainly has the capability to do that.
    Texas still relies primarily on natural gas as its baseload
    power, and that has to be the baseload and the maximum, because
    solar plus batteries can provide a number of benefits, both as
    a large scale and a small scale, but we have yet to see the
    five- to ten-year implications of these large battery systems,
    which, unfortunately, or ironically, the environments that are
    wonderful for solar, like Texas, are not great for batteries.
    And so, battery degradation and the lifetime of a utility-scale
    battery is something that is going to be a further effort of my
    Department, if I am so fortunate to be confirmed. But those
    technologies have yet to play out.
        Senator Heinrich. I would beg to differ. In New Mexico, we
    were an early adopter of grid-scale storage. At this point in
    my personal grid in the Albuquerque area, we're not only 35
    percent solar, seven percent nuclear, 15 percent wind, but
    using 15 percent battery storage. We have been able for a
    number of years now to maintain a high level of reliability--
    and not just a high level of reliability, but a low retail
    cost, which is the other thing that American consumers care
    about. I pay about 10.8 cents. Now, I rarely pay that because I
    have solar on my roof at a scale that I don't get an electric
    bill most months, but when I do, I pay 10.8 cents, which is, if
    you look at the country as a whole, much lower than what you
    see in the Midwest and the East.
        Mr. Walsh, the Waste Isolation Pilot Project (WIPP) in New
    Mexico is the sole, as you know, only geological repository
    licensed to store transuranic radioactive waste. It is one of
    three globally. We are currently working to refurbish and
    repair parts of the lift system that is used to bring up mined
    salt out of the ground. Two other lifts, one used for
    transporting TRU waste, the other used for emergency purposes,
    are in need of repair and replacement.
        So talk to me a little bit. I know you are familiar with
    that facility. It is our only facility that serves this
    purpose. Describe to the Committee your commitment to
    overseeing the swift construction and rehabilitation of the
    elevator systems at the WIPP facility.
        Mr. Walsh. Yes, thank you, Senator Heinrich, for that
    question.
        I am very familiar with the WIPP and its importance to
    Environmental Management's cleanup across the DOE's complex.
    And as you mentioned, the lift system, I think, dates back to
    the early 1900s. It came from a mine in Colorado. So, it's
    absolutely in need of repair, and I would be happy to look into
    that. As you know, I am not confirmed yet, so I haven't looked
    at the details of the current budget, but I will ensure,
    because it is such an important facility to our mission, that
    we will make sure we have a serviceable lift system.
        Senator Heinrich. I look forward to following up with you,
    Mr. Walsh.
        Mr. Walsh. Thank you.
        Senator Heinrich. Yes.
        The Chairman. Senator Justice, you are up next.
        Senator Justice. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Ranking
    Member. Thank all of you all for coming. I mean, really and
    truly, when it really boils right down to it, you are great
    witnesses, you are great nominees, and really and truly, I am
    anxious to be able to see you confirmed because I know you'll
    do fabulous work. That's all there is to it.
        I welcome your families. I am extremely impressed with just
    this--your acknowledgement of God in your life. I mean, it is
    absolutely just what we should all be doing, in my opinion, all
    the time because the blessings are unbelievable. You know, we
    see the tragedies all across our nation. We see what's going on
    in Texas right now, and it just jerks your heart out. I mean,
    that's just all there is to it. But, and please, God above,
    some way, somehow, you know, look after those folks.
        But I would just tell you just this--you know, I am, for
    all practical purposes, the new kid in town, but I have been an
    energy kid for a long, long, long time. And really and truly,
    it is an honor beyond belief to be on this Committee. And why
    would you think that? I mean, really and truly, I have tons to
    do in my life, and why would that be such an unbelievable honor
    for me? And it's simply just this--I have said this until I am
    blue-green--energy is everything. Energy is everything. It's in
    every part of every single thing that we do. And our country
    today needs you like you can't imagine. Every single last bit
    of you, we need you.
        And so, you know, when I was the Governor, I was the
    Governor of West Virginia and I had the honor to be that for
    eight years. And I embraced all the energy forms because I knew
    what was coming. Right around the corner here we are going to
    have a meltdown on energy in this country. And if we don't
    watch out, we are going to be in a real mess. And then, we are
    going to have to make decisions. We are going to need to decide
    where we can have that, but we can't have this. And America
    doesn't normally do that. And if we can't have this, we are
    going to be at a real disadvantage that could be a national
    defense disadvantage or whatever it may be.
        Now, the only other tidbit I would say about embracing all
    is, let's just have a fair playing field. I mean, for God's
    sakes-a-livin', let's not give one form, you know, so many
    benefits and perks and everything and take away from another.
    And please, to God above, let's quit thinking of coal as a bad
    word. Our coal miners work so hard. And Mr. Erdos, you know,
    just talked about his dad--30 years in the coal mines and
    everything in an underground mine. Right at this moment, right
    this very second, there are people that are thousands and
    thousands of feet underground in coal seams where they cannot
    hardly sit up, and in no way they could stand up. They may be
    in 40 inches of coal, thousands of feet underground, for all of
    us, for absolutely all of us. They're good people. They're
    family people. We need them. My good Lord above, we need them
    today.
        So, let's quit thinking and blowing our own legs off and
    letting the world on some righteous movement, you know, that we
    are going to blow our own legs off and have China build a coal-
    fired power plant every other day. It's ridiculous. It's
    totally ridiculous. I would tell all of you just this: we are
    so lucky to have you. Your experience is off the chart. Your
    service is off the chart, and I am very, very anxious to work
    with you in every way.
        I really only have one question, and it came to me from the
    Coal Association, and so this is for Mr. Erdos. And I wish you
    would call me Jim. I would like to call all of you by your
    first names, Lanny, or whatever it may be. And so, but with all
    that being said, the question was just this: In West Virginia--
    this is from the Coal Association and Chris, this is from Chris
    Hamilton. He's a good guy and he is asking this question and he
    wanted me to ask it.
        In West Virginia--West Virginia has nine program amendments
    pending approval at OSM today. The oldest is 16 years old. And
    in most of these cases, the state rules, we have complied
    exactly with the language of the Office of Surface Mining. So
    my question is real quick. Will you just look? Will you just
    try to help and look, because we need you?
        Mr. Erdos. Thank you for the question, Senator. Yes,
    absolutely, I will. Program amendments are a problem. It has
    been a problem for 10 to 15 years at OSM. And I know Chris
    very, very well. And I am familiar with some of those program
    amendments. So one of the things we will do, if I am fortunate
    enough to get confirmed, I will be briefed by staff, day one,
    relative to program amendments. It's important to me too. Ohio
    has one probably 12 years old that has been sitting there.
        So there are things that we need to do at OSM to fix that,
    and it can be fixed, and we were working on that under the
    previous administration, the Trump administration, when I was
    there. So we will do those things and we will get that backlog
    down. And I absolutely will look at those.
        Senator Justice. Thank you. And I'm sorry that you have to
    put up with Chris.
        Mr. Erdos. He is a great guy. Like you said, he is a great
    guy.
        [Laughter.]
        Senator Justice. Thank you all. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Senator Hickenlooper.
        Senator Hickenlooper. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thanks to each
    of you for being here at a really challenging time for energy
    in our country.
        Ms. Robertson, let me just say that I always appreciate
    people with a strong athletic background, but if you can be
    that good in water polo, that has to be a remarkable testament
    to your endurance and your ability to put up with all this
    rigmarole, but you are going into a really tough position, if
    confirmed. I know NREL, Colorado's renewable energy lab, is
    truly a world-class hub of reliable energy and innovation. It's
    a major employer in Colorado, but it adds real value, yet the
    President's budget appears to want to cut over half the staff,
    and there is some shifting of funds that, to some, appears
    unlawful. I have a lawyer in our office that feels that it is
    unlawful. I think there are a lot of lawyers that are looking
    at that. It doesn't appear to me that you can just reassign
    experts and fill in the gaps.
        So I guess my first question is, are you willing to commit
    to preventing, to the best of your capability, significant
    staff cuts at NREL and to really make sure we maintain those
    research capabilities?
        Ms. Robertson. Senator Hickenlooper, thank you for the
    question, and I agree with you that NREL is an extraordinary
    hub of innovation and that the best tools we are going to have
    to make a stronger, better, more energized America are going to
    come through innovation. It's not just going to come from, you
    know, additional subsidies. It's going to come from big,
    innovative changes to the way we do things and the way we
    create energy. You asked a few specific questions, and let me
    try and answer them. I have not been in the Department of
    Energy. I am still living in Colorado and riding horses with my
    kids and hanging out for the summer, and at the point where I
    hopefully am confirmed, I look forward to being briefed on a
    number of the matters that you brought up regarding the budget,
    but I am not informed at this point in time or in a position
    where I can comment on that. I will tell you that I always
    follow the law, and I intend to follow the law, the advice of
    counsel, and if I am so fortunate to be confirmed, hold this
    office with the dignity that it deserves, and from a legal
    perspective, always do the right thing.
        As it relates to staff cuts at EERE or NREL, you are a
    business owner, you have been a business owner, and a mayor and
    a Governor, and thank you for that. I can't comment until I get
    in to see what the situation is, but I can commit to be an
    advocate for the great men and women working across the
    Department of Energy in the areas where I will have
    responsibility, if confirmed, especially at NREL, where we have
    some of the best scientists in the world working to solve the
    world's biggest problems.
        Senator Hickenlooper. Well, I couldn't agree more, and I
    appreciate that. Well spoken. I will just put in there, I mean,
    we are going to see this massive surge in demand that I think
    each of you have recognized and described, and it's hard to
    imagine bringing online more natural gas, more coal, more
    almost anything in the short term in the next five years, and
    yet we do have a huge inventory of solar, but electricity can
    be generated from wind and solar, increasingly geothermal, as
    you have all recognized. I think 95 percent of all the projects
    in the queue are either, you know, solar, wind, or storage. And
    I would like to ask each of you just to, because you each--
    well, maybe not the mining reclamation, I will pass on that.
    Although, I am--I will not have time to ask questions on the
    mining. I will come back for a second round of questions on
    that and get to that.
        But 95 percent of the energy that's available is solar,
    wind, and batteries. Do you think we should prioritize that and
    really push that through? And I am going to start with Ms.
    Robertson.
        Ms. Robertson. Senator Hickenlooper, thank you for the
    question, and it is the question. I mean, a large-scale data
    center consumes the same amount of electricity as two million
    homes. And we will have to produce a lot of electrons in order
    to meet that demand. But the question of how do we prioritize
    it? We have to prioritize reliable, secure, and affordable
    power in that equation. I think you mentioned NREL earlier,
    grid modernization, new technologies to help reduce the loss of
    electricity within the process. I do believe we will be able to
    bring online very successful, innovative energy sources, like
    geothermal, hopefully small modular nuclear, in a much shorter
    period of time than previously envisioned, even 12 months ago.
        Senator Hickenlooper. Right, well, I am out of time, but in
    the meantime, we are going to have some real pressure on us for
    these five years before we get to the small nuclear and being
    able to scale up some of those other things. And I think, you
    know, the budget that has been put out there is cutting the
    Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy 62 percent
    below 2019 levels. So long before President Biden was in
    office, that budget was much more robust than it is now. So,
    you are probably going to have to elbow your way in to some
    making sure that those funds are not all eliminated because you
    are going to need some of that money, I think.
        I yield back to the Chair.
        The Chairman. Great, thank you.
        All right, let's go ahead and begin our second round.
        Mr. Erdos, I would like to start the second round with you.
    You know, you began your career as an environmental technician
    reviewing mine data and maps for accuracy. Since then, you have
    had years of experience working with environmental agencies and
    related stakeholders, as well as on abandoned mine lands
    (AML)--I am always cautious when I say mine lands to not say
    land mines because it turns out they mean very different
    things--reclamation efforts, and funding disbursement. How does
    the coal industry contribute to AML funding and remediation
    efforts?
        Mr. Erdos. Well, there are two streams of funds that go
    into AML. One is fee-based. It's how the industry contributes.
    So currently, I believe it's 22.4 cents for surface coal that's
    not lignite, 9.6 cents for underground coal not lignite, and I
    want to say 6.4 cents for lignite coal. So it's based on
    tonnage produced, and they pay that fee on that tonnage. It
    goes into that particular pool of money for the AML program.
    And then you have the IIJA, which is a whole different issue.
    So you have those two streams.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Ms. Robertson, let's talk about appliance regulations.
    There are a series of regulations that are implemented and
    enforced by the Department of Energy's Office of Energy
    Efficiency and Renewable Energy. Some of these regulations, one
    might say, impose pretty costly burdens on all Americans and
    they certainly reduce market choices. Some would say that in
    many instances they have, in the name of efficiency, just
    produced products that don't work as well and that end up
    having to be used two or three cycles at a time instead of one,
    perhaps resulting in no net energy savings at all, but making
    appliances less reliable, harder to use, more expensive, and
    more difficult to repair, and they affect almost all appliances
    in American homes, from refrigerators, dishwashers, clothes
    washers, clothes dryers. Now, the process rule and its product
    class protections, which allow for separate regulations for
    different product features, were overwhelmingly ignored by the
    previous administration, and this has stopped the development
    of helpful features on appliances and essentially killed
    certain appliances or household goods, like the incandescent
    lightbulb, which itself is a different thing. Sure, we have
    other types of lightbulbs available, but for the most part, you
    can't get incandescent lightbulbs anymore, and that is a
    different product, and sometimes you need those.
        And so, this is somewhat concerning. Will you commit, if
    confirmed, to assisting the Secretary to ensure that product
    classes are used to protect features on appliances that are
    important to American consumers?
        Ms. Robertson. Chairman Lee, thank you for that important
    question. And absolutely, I think I am here--and I believe my
    panelists here alongside me--we are here because we love
    America and we love Americans, and putting burdensome, costly
    regulations in place that don't have a net benefit to
    individual Americans can price people out of the American
    dream, depending on appliances, building standards. It's an
    area within the EERE that I am very much looking forward to
    working with, and I look forward to working with you and your
    staff on any specific issues or things that we should be
    advancing.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Mr. Erdos, let's go back to you for a moment. Can you speak
    to the relationship between states with primacy under SMCRA and
    OSM?
        Mr. Erdos. Thank you for the question, Senator. Certainly.
    So there are 24 states that currently have primacy, or they
    have approved state programs. They are the primary regulators
    within their borders. OSM is an oversight program relative to
    those states. OSM is the primary regulator on Indian tribes,
    and there are a few others where OSM has a federal program, but
    only one actually produces coal, and that is Tennessee. The
    primacy states, within their borders, they are the primary
    regulators. OSM is an oversight program. It's a partnership,
    really, but deference should be given to the states, and it is
    given to the states.
        The Chairman. Do you think the 10-day notice rule overwrote
    the authority of the state mining offices?
        Mr. Erdos. Somewhat, it did. The 2020 and the 2024 rules
    were significantly different. So the 2020 rule required OSM to
    work with the states. So if they received a citizen complaint,
    they were required to coordinate with the state prior to acting
    on that citizen complaint, which makes a lot of sense. I am a
    state guy. I come from a state, I worked there for 31 years,
    and I was on the other end of those 10-day notices. So it makes
    sense for OSM to work with the state and gather as much
    information as they can prior to acting on that. So the 2024
    rule took that away, which is pretty significant to me.
        So to answer your question, I think, to some extent, it
    did.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Senator Murkowski, you are up to bat.
        Senator Murkowski. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Thank you for your willingness to step forward in these
    important positions. We appreciate that.
        Ms. Robertson, I wanted to ask a question of you first
    here. I come from a state where, when we say all-of-the-above
    energy policy, we really mean it, not because it's a good
    catchword, but because we are islanded. This huge state, our
    energy system is all islanded in the sense that we have very
    little when it comes to the grid beyond the Railbelt there. So
    people think about Alaska as oil and gas. It's great. It's
    important. Significant for us. It's important for the country
    and the world. But we can't do it without also tapping into
    those resources that happen to be right there where that
    community is. And so, that means a little bit of solar. It
    means a little bit of wind. It means maybe we can really do
    something bold like geothermal.
        And so, the position that you are nominated to as Assistant
    Secretary of Energy for Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy
    is important. I have communities that are reliant right now on
    diesel-powered generation. That's how they stay warm. That's
    how they keep the lights on. And so, when the barge doesn't
    make it in, or when the price of fuel goes through the roof, it
    squeezes everything else that these individuals have available
    to them for their families.
        And so, I look at some of the things that we are doing here
    to help facilitate some of these smaller microgrid solutions as
    vitally, vitally important. We had a debate, certainly, before
    the Senate last week when it came to certain of the tax credits
    for our solar and wind projects. We negotiated a little bit
    longer runway for wind and solar tax credits in reconciliation.
    It wasn't much, but it's going to help allow for the
    facilitation of a couple of projects--maybe a good handful of
    projects to proceed--and then, we just see at the beginning of
    this week an executive order coming out of the White House
    that, as I read it, really, really guts the effort for a
    compromise that we were able to secure within that
    reconciliation bill. So, I don't really like it. I will just be
    blunt. I don't really like it at all. And I don't like it
    because, not only does it undercut the arrangement that we were
    able to work, but also because it leaves these communities that
    I represent with no solution other than barging in or flying in
    more diesel to keep the lights on and to keep them warm.
        So I acknowledge and appreciate the role that the Office of
    EERE has played in really being this partner to promote energy
    security for rural communities that experience limited access
    to these alternate baseload energy resources. So I just need
    your commitment that you will work with us to understand what
    the local solutions are and help to facilitate them, because
    what happens back here in Washington, DC isn't going to
    translate to these rural communities that I have in my state.
    So can you commit to me that you are going to work with us on
    some of these solutions?
        Ms. Robertson. Senator Murkowski, first of all, I love
    Alaska. I have spent lots of time in Alaska, and I ardently
    believe that energy in rural communities and in isolated
    communities has many different constraints than the energy we
    are talking about to power a data center in Arlington. And
    energy is everything, and delivering energy to a remote
    community in Alaska may look very different than the energy
    solutions we would work toward in other communities in other
    places in the United States.
        I have particular experience with this. I have built a
    company in rural New Mexico, and we didn't have any power. We
    did not have access to the power--to Xcel in New Mexico. They
    gave us a three-year wait list, a three-year timeline. So we
    decided that we needed to take matters into our own hands and
    we had novel solutions to treating field gas onsite to using
    our own gas-fired turbines, and we built our own microgrid.
    These were solutions that we needed to come up with because we
    faced a challenge. I understand that the rural communities in
    Alaska face challenges, and I absolutely commit to you to work
    as a partner in figuring out the right energy solution for that
    very unique environment.
        Senator Murkowski. Well, I appreciate that. I look forward
    to working with you on that, whether it's wind, solar, whether
    it's geothermal. We have had some good engagement with our
    tribal communities on the geothermal side. I am also concerned
    about the President's budget proposal on elimination of the
    weatherization program. Again, whether you are from Alaska,
    where it's cold, or New Mexico, where it's hot, weatherization
    is going to be key for us as well.
        My time is expired, but I appreciate the opportunity to
    work with you on some of these very important issues and to the
    rest of you as well. We have some good projects, Mr. Eisner, I
    will probably want to talk to you about our Alaska natural gas
    opportunities and Arctic energy as well in the international
    space.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Senator Padilla.
        Senator Padilla. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
        Good morning to all of you. I am going to focus my
    questions--surprise, surprise--on EERE. The U.S. Department of
    Energy's Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy has
    had a strong connection and collaboration with the State of
    California for many, many years. California prides itself on
    being on the forefront of energy innovation. This partnership
    supports the state's growth to advance new and innovative
    energy technologies, including in areas of research and
    development, demonstration projects, and financial incentives
    as well, particularly in areas like energy efficiency,
    renewable energy sources and biofuels, and the storage
    technologies and capacity it has to accompany some of the newer
    technologies to address concerns about intermittency and
    beyond. So all of these represent key efforts, not just to
    reduce emissions, but ultimately to also lower electricity
    bills and make energy more abundant.
        With that being established, a question for Ms. Robertson--
    if you are confirmed, will you commit to honoring the
    previously awarded grants and funding that have been already
    acted upon with the State of California?
        Ms. Robertson. Thank you, Senator Padilla, for the
    question.
        I am not yet in the office. What I can confirm to you is
    that I will follow the law and the commitments of the U.S.
    Government as is my intention if I am so fortunate to be in
    that role.
        Senator Padilla. Okay.
        Ms. Robertson. I do know that the Office of Energy
    Efficiency and Renewable Energy has over 2,000 active projects,
    and that the review of those projects is something Secretary
    Wright has initiated as an ongoing matter, and if I am so
    fortunate to be confirmed sometime this year, I would
    absolutely love to look at those and be happy to work with you
    and your office on those that touch California.
        Senator Padilla. Okay. So again, just, I prefaced my
    question with if you are confirmed, so I am not getting ahead
    of myself, but again, these are projects that are not under
    review, not recently applied for, these were applications that
    have been reviewed and awarded. I just want to make sure that
    those awards are honored going forward.
        I will give an example. One of the awards was to help fund
    cutting-edge marine pumped hydroelectric storage systems at the
    Port of Los Angeles. You may be familiar with the Port of Los
    Angeles. The Port of Los Angeles and Long Beach combined
    represent 40 percent of the commerce coming in out of the
    United States in that one port complex alone. Would you be
    supportive of innovative energy technologies like EERE's Water
    Power Technologies Office?
        Ms. Robertson. Thank you, Senator Padilla. I am very
    excited to learn more and participate in the Water Power
    Technologies Office. I think that is an exciting area of EERE,
    and one I am, if I am so fortunate to be confirmed, I am very
    excited to work in.
        Senator Padilla. Good. Well, I highlight this one because I
    wasn't physically present for your opening remarks. I did catch
    it from my office. I also have seen your written testimony as
    well, and you are excited, you are committed. I am excited and
    I am committed. But we also have the new challenge of meeting
    these objectives, striving for these goals with a President's
    budget proposal that would cut EERE's resources by more than
    half. So we are going to have to figure out how to square
    those--do more with less.
        Another award from EERE was a demonstration project in
    California to support new load growth through grid innovations
    and to support the ability of energy providers to right-size
    grid investments for future load growth. As electricity demand
    grows and we seek to meet that demand, both because of our
    growing population as well as our growing economy, this is not
    the time to stop funding grid innovation, but the
    administration, the Trump administration, has been very vocal
    about meeting the projected growth in electricity demand, but
    proposes a 74 percent budget cut to EERE. How do you do that?
    How do you go about that, if you are fortunate enough to be
    confirmed?
        Ms. Robertson. I think it's a matter of austerity across
    the Federal Government and having to do more with less. I don't
    think that changes the President's bold agenda for energy and
    grid enhancements. Grid innovation is a component of President
    Trump's vision of how we create a more secure America. We have
    a very fragile grid, and it's not just within EERE that issues
    of the grid are tackled and are challenged, it is across our
    national labs. It is in the Office of Electricity in the Grid
    Deployment Office. There are multiple touchpoints within the
    Department that, if I am fortunate enough to be confirmed and
    be in the building, I look forward to a lot of cross-
    collaboration to solve these issues because those are big
    issues.
        Senator Padilla. I am glad to at least hear you say the
    grid is fragile in so many ways in so many areas, in large part
    because it's an old grid.
        Ms. Robertson. Yes----
        Senator Padilla. So if you are going to address deferred
    maintenance, if you are going to modernize, if you are going to
    add capacity, if you are going to add efficiency and improve
    performance, these are all objectives that require investments,
    not cuts.
        Thank you.
        The Chairman. Senator Cortez Masto.
        Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Welcome, congratulations to all the nominees. Welcome to
    all of your family members. It's always fun to be here on the
    first day. It's the second or third day that we will have
    conversations about, but thank you so much.
        I want to start off by talking a little bit about Nevada
    because Nevada has done an incredible job leaning into the
    potential for energy, and particularly around solar,
    geothermal, and hydro. I mean, there is so much happening in
    Nevada right now, and it is an example of what our future can
    be if we want to be energy independent, including, I want to
    say, battery storage.
        Ms. Robertson, I invite you to come to Nevada to see what
    is happening with battery storage there because it is part of
    the baseload, and it's happening right now. My frustration is
    that, unfortunately, under this administration, we are picking
    winners and losers. And we are saying to states like Nevada,
    based on our geography and our opportunities, that even though
    solar is one of our number one commodities, that we shouldn't
    even look at it anymore. And I think an all-of-the-above energy
    approach should be based on what each state is capable of doing
    based on their geography, their minerals, whatever is available
    for them. And I am here to tell you, in Nevada, it really is
    around solar, geothermal, hydro, and there is so much more
    happening there, but that's different than the New England
    states. That's even different than Texas. So I am not about
    picking winners and losers, I am looking for a balanced
    approach here, and I am just disappointed that this
    administration and some of my colleagues have gutted and cut
    wind and solar and now are doing the same around battery
    storage, electric vehicles, and critical minerals.
        And we are going to talk about this because critical
    minerals are key to our technology future. And if we're not
    also leaning in and making sure that this country is capable of
    producing those critical minerals, we are going to be left
    behind in our energy independence, as well as our national
    security. But I want to start with Ms. Robertson, with you.
    According to recent projections from the U.S. Energy
    Information Administration, retail energy prices will continue
    to increase beyond 2026, and additional reports have assessed
    that cuts to clean energy tax credits, like those made in the
    recently enacted GOP reconciliation law, could result in
    Americans paying as much as $110 more on their utility bills.
    And despite these increased energy rates, the administration
    has proposed to zero-out crucial energy assistance programs in
    their Fiscal Year 2026 budget, including EERE's Energy-to-Grid
    Integration Program.
        And so, I want to talk to you about that. Can you explain
    the benefits that cutting grid energy programs or even energy
    assistance programs provides for Americans? I mean, is this
    where we should be going if we are looking at integrating our
    grid with all of the potential energy sources that are out
    there? And I appreciate your comments that there are trade-offs
    with all of them, but why pick winners and losers?
        Ms. Robertson. Senator Cortez Masto, I don't believe in
    picking winners and losers. I do believe that energy is about
    science and energy is about numbers. And I don't have any
    feelings or belief structures around energy. It is--they are
    equations, and delivering for the American people is going to
    require us to be thoughtful and tactical. It's going to lean
    into the science and try to advance some of the technologies
    that, frankly, Nevada is leading in. You have one of the
    leading geothermal potentials, and an existing share of your
    utility comes from geothermal.
        Senator Cortez Masto. But for that reason, energy grid
    integration is so important, wouldn't you agree?
        Ms. Robertson. I agree with the importance. You asked a
    question specifically about the budget. It is very difficult
    for me to comment on how the budget is allocated, how it works
    today. I am not in the building. I am still living in Colorado.
    This is not exactly an area where I have oversight or domain
    knowledge, but I do know that grid integration is a component
    of the Department of Energy across multiple departments, across
    multiple national labs, and it's a priority for the President
    and it's a priority for Secretary Wright, because without the
    grid, we don't have energy distribution.
        Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you. I have about 30 seconds
    left and I want to just get this question in. The rest I will
    submit for the record. Thank you all for being here.
        But Mr. Walsh, it goes without saying, but timely and
    transparent communication is crucial to the success of DOE's
    environmental management program in Nevada. I welcome you to
    come out there and take a look at what's going on. If
    confirmed, do I have your commitment to prioritize an open
    relationship with myself and our state officials on all DOE
    environmental management activities in Nevada?
        Mr. Walsh. Yes, Senator Cortez Masto----
        Senator Cortez Masto. And will you pledge to uphold all
    existing agreements and contracts with the State of Nevada?
        Mr. Walsh. Yes, as President Trump and Secretary Wright
    reinforce, we're not going to force nuclear waste on Nevada.
        Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you.
        Thank you, Mr. Chair.
        The Chairman. Thanks.
        Senator Cantwell.
        Senator Cantwell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I congratulate
    all the nominees.
        Thank you, Mr. Walsh. My line is a little more detailed on
    this question about commitments to the Hanford cleanup mission,
    and that is one of the key responsibilities you will have. This
    means over the next 15 years removing and treating 56 million
    gallons of nuclear waste. So hardly something that I would call
    an ongoing thing that people, you know, certainly the State of
    Washington has a consent decree with the DOE because we want to
    see it cleaned up, not because we want it to continue.
        Mr. Walsh. Yes.
        Senator Cantwell. And so, the notion that somebody would
    suggest that somehow we want this to continue, we have a
    mission and we want to move on. And so, we are happy to move on
    from that, but we also can't do it on the cheap. And oftentimes
    people look at the budget and they are like, oh, let's do it on
    the cheap or, you know, when we had cleanup all around the
    United States, people came together and said, oh, let's always
    get that budget. But as Colorado and South Carolina and other
    places that were easy to clean up got done, then everybody all
    of a sudden said, well, maybe we can do this on the cheap in
    the Northwest. So you can't. You have got to get it done right,
    and we want to make sure that already leaking storage tanks get
    the priority that they deserve.
        So the major understanding here is the Tri-Party Agreement
    and consent decree milestones that basically say these are the
    milestones that need to be met in cleaning up 586 square miles
    of Cold War era nuclear contaminants. That is literally just
    what it takes. You have to make these investments and continue.
    So do you commit to upholding the Tri-Party Agreement and the
    consent decree milestones that are a part of this process?
        Mr. Walsh. Yes, thank you for that question, Senator
    Cantwell, and you know, I really look forward to getting out to
    Hanford, meeting you out there, and digging into this. It's a
    critically important mission. The people of Washington State,
    and indeed, all Americans deserve to live in a safe, clean
    environment. I know this has been an ongoing process----
        Senator Cantwell. Well, this is a federal responsibility,
    right?
        Mr. Walsh. It is.
        Senator Cantwell. So it's the Federal Government's
    responsibility. We just are a little more of a watchdog just
    because we are there.
        Mr. Walsh. Yes.
        Senator Cantwell. And we have to be.
        Mr. Walsh. And I am a man of action. I understand the
    consent agreement. I understand the Tri-Party Agreement. It has
    outlined the framework of the cleanup and responsibilities it
    has. It's a living document that has been modified a few times
    over the last 20 years. And you have my commitment that we are
    going to work together, and that it's going to be a priority in
    the Office of Environmental Management.
        Senator Cantwell. Well, what nuclear waste understanding
    and technical expertise would you bring to the situation?
        Mr. Walsh. Well, I can tell you that I am a quick learner.
    I have an engineering background. I am sort of an engineering
    geek. And like anything I have accomplished in my life, whether
    it was building a complex semiconductor plant, you rely on the
    experts. And I think what the Hanford site needs is really
    leadership and a good, solid plan that is well executed, and
    that is what I intend to bring.
        Senator Cantwell. Thank you. Thank you for that.
        Ms. Robertson, could you talk about the budget cuts to
    EERE?
        Ms. Robertson. Thank you, Senator, for the question.
        I am not in the Department, so it's very difficult for me
    to talk specifically about decisions that have been made in the
    Department at this time.
        Senator Cantwell. What do you think, I mean, we have
    projects that are already underway, and you are talking about
    significant cuts to things like the Battery500 Consortium. Do
    you believe in those kinds of activities?
        Ms. Robertson. I am not familiar with the Battery500
    Consortium.
        Senator Cantwell. Okay, so you are trying to get a job with
    this level of oversight on energy efficiency and renewable, and
    this is probably one of the labs in the nation's biggest effort
    on storage, bringing grid-scale storage, so.
        Ms. Robertson. Is this at PNNL?
        Senator Cantwell. Yes, yes.
        Ms. Robertson. Okay. I'm sorry, I didn't know that was what
    it was referring to. I am well aware of their activities in
    both grid--they have released a big report this week in both
    grids and battery innovation. My perspective on the budget, as
    an outsider and a civilian----
        Senator Cantwell. I am just asking you about this idea that
    we should be investing and trying to testbed to try to get to a
    higher level of battery technology--I mean battery mass--you
    know, grid-scale storage, whether you support that concept.
        Ms. Robertson. I support battery technology and innovation
    as a very important function of the Department of Energy,
    absolutely.
        Senator Cantwell. And funding things like that at the
    national lab?
        Ms. Robertson. Funding at the national labs, again, not
    being in the building, not understanding all of the demands on
    the budget, it's very difficult for me to speak about a
    specific program when I am not in a position to evaluate all of
    the demands on the Department.
        Senator Cantwell. Okay, thank you.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Thank you.
        Senator Barrasso.
        Senator Barrasso. Thanks so much, Mr. Chairman.
    Congratulations to all of you. I appreciate your time and
    willingness to serve.
        Mr. Erdos, thanks so much for visiting with me.
        You know, the previous administration sought to delay and
    deny efforts to expand coal mining. This had a profoundly
    destructive impact on Wyoming, on families, in our communities.
    I think it also had a significant impact, destructively, in
    terms of our energy security as a nation. If confirmed, how are
    you going to change the course of OSM?
        Mr. Erdos. Well, I think what we need to do is look at
    NEPA. So there was decision that came down from the Supreme
    Court recently in regards to NEPA, and I think it was very
    telling. From what I recall reading, the idea is to focus NEPA
    on the areas to be affected, not so much upstream/downstream,
    substantial deference to the reviewing agency, and I think that
    goes a long way in ensuring that those NEPA reviews are done
    timely, we get EISs approved and records of decision out
    quickly. So I think that is one thing we look at is NEPA. I
    think that is a big deal. I think program amendments is
    another. I spoke to that earlier. I think we have to look at
    that. There are probably 30 to 35 program amendments sitting at
    OSM right now. That has a significant effect on the states and
    how they do business. So we need to look at that too.
        Senator Barrasso. Well, and to your point, in terms of the
    decision by the U.S. Supreme Court, it was an 8-0 decision. I
    mean, we're not talking about something that was close at all.
    And Justice Kavanaugh wrote the report. NEPA is a procedural
    cross check, not a substantive roadblock. The goal, he said, of
    the law, is to ``inform agency decision-making, not paralyze
    it.'' So I am very glad that you pointed out the Supreme Court
    ruling, and it is going to help influence your ability to get
    things done effectively and quickly.
        You know, one of the successes of that office that you are
    going to be holding, hopefully after your confirmation, depends
    on strong relationships with the states that execute things
    like the mine programs, both for mine development and for
    cleanup. States need clear guidance and an open line of
    communication to carry out these shared goals. So, if
    confirmed, how will you approach strengthening the cooperation
    between the Federal Government and the states?
        Mr. Erdos. We will do exactly what we did under the first
    Trump administration, Senator. I had scheduled meetings with
    the state folks. I scheduled meetings with the Interstate
    Mining Compact Commission, who represent most, if not all, of
    the states that have primacy across the country that actually
    mine coal. So you have to communicate with the states. If
    you're not communicating, if you not talking, you're not moving
    forward. If you're not talking, you are going backward. So it's
    all about communication. I represented Ohio for a decade on the
    IMCC--Interstate Mining Compact Commission--so I have many
    relationships across the country with all the state regulators.
    So we will continue to do that. That will serve us well.
        Senator Barrasso. Ms. Robertson, the Energy Efficiency and
    Renewable Energy Office is in charge of investing in innovative
    ideas and the way to give you the best chance of success with
    all of those. So how do we ensure that our limited funding is
    spent on the highest priority work?
        Ms. Robertson. Thank you for the question, Senator
    Barrasso.
        I think the President's priorities have been to create
    reliable, affordable, secure energy, and through that lens, we
    must make decisions regarding allocation of funds to ensure
    that the American taxpayer dollars are invested in the
    programs, projects, and advancements that will create the most
    meaningful impacts to the United States. And I think--I am not
    sure if that answers your question.
        Senator Barrasso. Yes, you know, because we have limited
    money and we want to make sure we get the best bang for the
    buck.
        Ms. Robertson. Absolutely.
        Senator Barrasso. Senator Cantwell just asked about a
    specific project, and I just thought, overall, I would give you
    an opportunity to talk about----
        Ms. Robertson. Thank you. And I do believe that there are
    11 offices within EERE, and the pioneering technologies that
    are happening in geothermal, in bioenergy, in water power--
    there are a lot of exciting developments that don't violate the
    laws of nature or thermodynamics and have real potential.
        Senator Barrasso. Let me go to Mr. Eisner. Ms. Robertson
    just said ``that don't violate the laws'' and ``that have
    potential.'' So with your role, if confirmed, you are going to
    lead the office that oversees our participation in the
    International Energy Agency. In recent years, the IEA has
    changed its focus away from analyzing the world as it is, and
    has sought to project the world with its policy preferences in
    mind. If confirmed, how will you work with the IEA to get the
    agency back to providing unbiased analysis?
        Mr. Eisner. Thank you, Senator, for that very important
    question. I enjoyed serving as a keynote speaker at the Rockies
    Petroleum Conference with you last year in Laramie, Wyoming. I
    think that the key to effective advocacy and effective
    diplomacy really is leadership and good data, and I very much
    look forward to--having had much experience in my career
    working with heads of state, government ministers, and
    diplomats--I feel like I can be a very effective advocate of
    the U.S. position and the President's energy agenda in all of
    the bilateral and multilateral forums that I will have the
    honor, if I am confirmed, to participate in.
        Senator Barrasso. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Senator Daines.
        Senator Daines. Chairman Lee, thank you. Congratulations to
    the nominees for considering these important roles. I also want
    to invite each of you to come visit Montana. The rest of the
    world is coming to see us, you might as well join the rest of
    the world and enjoy the great outdoors we have there in our
    great state.
        Mr. Erdos, in 2020, you were reported out of this Committee
    unanimously and similarly confirmed by the Senate by voice
    vote, and it's our aspiration and goal that we can do it again
    this time around. Unfortunately, under the Biden
    administration, the Office of Surface Mining refused to grant
    permits for three Montana coal mines. Thankfully, the Trump
    administration has reversed course and has now approved the
    Bull Mountains mine permit and the Spring Creek mine permit,
    and we expect to have a permit for the Rosebud coal mine very
    soon. Further, on the Fourth of July, President Trump signed
    the One Big Beautiful Bill into law to specifically authorize
    coal mining at the Bull Mountains mine. I want to thank the
    Chairman of the Committee for fighting for that important
    outcome and win in that piece of legislation. This was a big
    win for a lot of hardworking folks in Montana and for these
    rural Montana communities that don't have the elaborate
    lifestyle that you see on the show Yellowstone. More of Montana
    is struggling day in and day out to pay the bills every month.
        Mr. Erdos, when confirmed, will you prioritize reviewing
    and completing mining permits and implementing the new coal
    provisions signed into law in the Big Beautiful Bill?
        Mr. Erdos. Yes, certainly, Senator, and thank you for the
    question. You and I actually talked about those permits a few
    years ago, and obviously, OSM and BLM have got those through
    the system relative to NEPA reviews and finalized those, so
    that's great. Certainly, yes, I think provisions in the Big
    Beautiful Bill, there are some in there--the leasing part is
    not OSM, that's BLM, so we don't lease coal, but BLM does, but
    as far as the other provisions, royalties--that's a big deal--
    12-and-a-half to 7 percent. So you have a coal operator out
    there that looks at 20 million tons of coal, and at 12-and-a-
    half percent, the numbers don't work. But he looks at it at 7
    percent, and the numbers do work. So you mine that 20 million
    tons of coal at 7 percent, you have those revenues coming back
    into the country. So at 12-and-a-half, you get zero revenue.
    And at seven percent, whatever that number is, you have coming
    into the country.
        So I am excited about that. I think it will actually
    incentivize the industry to buy more coal and provide more
    revenue for the country.
        Senator Daines. Right, well the revenue piece is so
    important, but I will tell you, we need more baseload power. We
    need more energy. I mean, this is----
        Mr. Erdos. Absolutely.
        Senator Daines. This is an existential threat to the future
    in terms of our competitiveness and so forth as we think about
    where we are headed here in the next several years.
        By the way, Mr. Erdos, Montana recently passed House bill
    587 to update our mine reclamation laws. It's my understanding
    that the Office of Surface Mining now needs to approve those
    updates, and that mines in Montana need that approval
    immediately. Will you ensure that these approvals aren't held
    up by bureaucracy and are issued without delay?
        Mr. Erdos. Absolutely, yes. I spoke to this earlier in
    regard to program amendments. It's an issue. I understand it's
    an issue at OSM. We will work on that right away and make sure
    that those move through the system as they should.
        Senator Daines. Thank you.
        Mr. Erdos. So the short answer is yes.
        Senator Daines. Appreciate that.
        Mr. Eisner, as Assistant Secretary for International
    Affairs, your role will be to advocate for U.S. energy
    dominance around the globe. We have a very important mine in
    Montana called the Stillwater Mine. It's one of the only
    primary producers of platinum and palladium in the United
    States--in fact, it is the only--just on a very short list of a
    few around the world that do such. We have already lost
    hundreds of jobs because of Russian dumping. We must reverse
    this course.
        Mr. Eisner, when confirmed, will you advocate for the
    Stillwater Mines and their employees--some 700 employees were
    laid off recently--and work with your colleagues throughout the
    administration to take action against unfair Russian trade
    practices?
        Mr. Eisner. Thank you for that question, Senator Daines.
        I feel like one of my primary responsibilities as the
    Assistant Secretary for International Affairs will be to
    advocate for American energy and American critical minerals,
    both in bilateral as well as multilateral organizations, and I
    don't know the specifics about Stillwater or what the
    priorities of the Department and Secretary Wright are at this
    point, but I will always defend and advocate for America's
    product, and I will always advocate against unfair trade
    practices, should they exist with the Russians or with anyone
    else.
        Senator Daines. Mr. Eisner, thank you.
        One final follow-up question, and I am out of time. I want
    to bring up the--this is getting into the weeds here in
    Montana--it's just probably one you can take notes on and
    follow up, but it's the Montana Alberta Tie Line. It is a vital
    interconnector that allows for energy exports into the Canadian
    marketplace. Unfortunately, Alberta has levied a number of
    rules and regulations that discriminate against Montana
    electricity producers and ultimately undermines the stability
    of our grid. As you know, managing a grid is very, very dynamic
    and very important. You have maximum flexibility. This is a
    problem.
        When confirmed, would you commit to working with the
    relevant agency partners to ensure that our Montana energy
    producers operate on a level playing field in the Canadian
    markets?
        Mr. Eisner. Senator, as you know, a centerpiece of the
    President's economic agenda is the creation of a level playing
    field for U.S. exports around the world. And so, I have no
    doubt that a situation as you have described would be something
    that I would be eager to take a look at very early on in my
    tenure, should I be confirmed by the Senate.
        Senator Daines. Mr. Eisner, thank you.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Senator Heinrich.
        Senator Heinrich. We had a little bit of a discussion
    around incandescent and solid-state lighting earlier. So I
    thought I would take the opportunity to give some credit where
    credit is due. Our national labs are the envy of the world, and
    Sandia National Lab, in particular, played a key role in the
    creation of solid-state lighting. So I pulled up some numbers
    off the internet from the Department of Energy and some other
    think tanks that have analyzed the benefits of that, and I
    thought it was interesting that the cost to run a LED light
    bulb for 1,000 hours is $1.32, and the cost to run an
    incandescent light bulb for the same amount of hours is $6.60.
    So there is actually an 80 percent savings over that first
    thousand hours.
        The other interesting statistic that I was able to pull up
    is that most incandescent light bulbs burn out after 1,000
    hours. I can tell you, with my old pick-up truck, this happens
    to the brake lights all the time. It's a pain in the something.
    And so, when you replace that incandescent with a LED, you
    actually get 25 times the life, and we have our national labs
    to thank for that.
        Mr. Erdos, I wanted to ask you a particular tribal
    question. The Office of Surface Mining is responsible for
    permitting oversight for all coal mines on tribal lands, and
    that includes four sites right now on the Navajo Nation. So
    when we are talking about operations on tribal land,
    consultation is a legal requirement. It's not, in my view,
    adequate. So I wanted to ask you, if confirmed, would you not
    just engage in consultation, but really engage in active
    collaboration with the Navajo Nation and Navajo communities
    when making decisions about mine operations and reclamations on
    Navajo Nation land?
        Mr. Erdos. Yes, absolutely, Senator. I am certainly
    committed to doing that. As I said before, earlier, if you
    aren't communicating, you're not moving forward. So I look
    forward to doing that, actually.
        Senator Heinrich. Do you have some experience working with
    tribal governments?
        Mr. Erdos. I did back when I was here the previous time,
    yes.
        Senator Heinrich. Great. I look forward to engaging with
    you on that as well. I think it's really important for your
    success as well as for those communities.
        Ms. Robertson, I wanted to ask you about something that has
    been raised to me, and I wanted to give you a chance to speak
    to it, that Franklin has had a number of both Clean Air Act
    violations and spills in the State of New Mexico, several dozen
    spills, in fact. And what would you just say to my constituents
    that are concerned about that record in the Permian?
        Ms. Robertson. Senator Heinrich, happy to speak to that.
    Franklin Mountain Energy is now sold. But we built this company
    from a few barrels a day to over 65,000 barrels of day of oil
    production. Growing an organization from raw BLM leases in
    Southeast New Mexico to running five rigs at one time is a
    massive, 24/7 manufacturing operation for which our team has an
    outstanding safety record and an outstanding EPA air quality
    record. We did have a number of violations that were cited. The
    vast majority of those were remedied within a day or two. The
    majority of those issues came from third-party equipment that
    was on our facilities.
        We take great pride in both building and operating some of
    the most remarkable oil and gas facilities in the United States
    and in the great State of New Mexico. So I guess having spills
    is part of running a big, complicated business. There is not an
    oil and gas company that can move the amount of fluid, gas, and
    people that we do without having an occasional spill, but our
    record within the community is outstanding and I am very proud
    of them.
        Senator Heinrich. I appreciate your response to that. I
    think that while these impacts are a reality, they also have
    very real impacts on my constituents. And so, I think the goal,
    as challenging as it is, should be zero. But I appreciate your
    focus on that and your response to those questions.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        The Chairman. Thank you very much.
        I want to thank the witnesses for their testimony and I
    want to thank all the Senators for their cooperation this
    morning.
        Questions for the record of this hearing will be due by
    6:00 p.m. tomorrow, Thursday, the 10th of July.
        The record of the hearing will remain open for statements
    until 6:00 p.m. on Wednesday, July 16.
        Thanks to the members of the Committee and the staff for
    getting this put together.
        On behalf of the Committee, I am pleased to congratulate
    each and every one of you on your nomination. I look forward to
    working closely with each of you and helping to get your
    nominations advanced to the floor. I hope every member of the
    Committee is willing to work with me to encourage leadership on
    both sides of the aisle to bring these nominations to the floor
    as soon as possible.
        Today's hearing is adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 11:24 a.m., the hearing was adjourned.]

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