[House Hearing, 119 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                       MARKUP OF VARIOUS MEASURES
=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                      COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                             UNITED STATES
                        HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                              HEARING HELD
                              MAY 20, 2026

                               __________
                               
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

           Small Business Committee Document Number 119-037
             Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov

                              __________
                               
                 U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
63-839                  WASHINGTON : 2026               
=======================================================================
 
                  HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS

                    ROGER WILLIAMS, Texas, Chairman
                        PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                        DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
                         BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas
                           JAKE ELLZEY, Texas
                         MARK ALFORD, Missouri
                        BRAD FINSTAD, Minnesota
                          TONY WIED, Wisconsin
                      ROB BRESNAHAN, Pennsylvania
                          BRIAN JACK, Georgia
             KIMBERLYN KING-HINDS, Northern Marina Islands
                         DEREK SCHMIDT, Kansas
                        JIMMY PATRONIS, Florida
                          CLAY FULLER, Georgia
               NYDIA VELAZQUEZ, New York, Ranking Member
                       MORGAN MCGARVEY, Kentucky
                       HILLARY SCHOLTEN, Michigan
                      LAMONICA MCIVER, New Jersey
                        GIL CISNEROS, California
                       KELLY MORRISON, Minnesota
                        GEORGE LATIMER, New York
                         DEREK TRAN, California
                       LATEEFAH SIMON, California
                       JOHNNY OLSZEWSKI, Maryland
                    MAGGIE GOODLANDER, New Hampshire

                  Sean Dillon, Majority Staff Director
                 Melissa Jung, Minority Staff Director
                            
                            
                            C O N T E N T S

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                   Page
Hon. Roger Williams..............................................     1
Hon. Nydia Velazquez.............................................     2

                                APPENDIX

Additional Material for the Record:
Text of Legislation:
    H.R. 4238 - Disaster Loan Accountability and Reform Act......    33
    H.R. 8879 - Oversight and Transparency for Small Business 
      Certifications Act of 2026.................................    47
    H.R. 826 - COVID Fraud Transparency Act of 2025..............    55
    H.R. 8880 - Small Business Cybersecurity Assistance 
      Evaluation Act of 2026.....................................    58
    H.R. 8881 - SBA Artificial Intelligence Utilization Act of 
      2026.......................................................    62
    H.R. 8882 - Main Street Competes Act.........................    66
    H.R. 915 - Small Business Technological Act of 2025..........    72
    H.R. 2804 - Protecting Small Business Competitions Act of 
      2025.......................................................    74
    H.R. 5498 - Small Business Health Options Awareness Act of 
      2025.......................................................    76
Amendments:
    ANS to H.R. 5498, offered by Hon. Van Duyne..................    79
    ANS to H.R. 4238, offered by Hon. Williams...................    81
    ANS to H.R. 2804, offered by Hon. Velazquez..................    90
    ANS to H.R. 826, offered by Hon. Williams....................    92
    Scholten Amendment, no. 1, to H.R. 5498 - Small Business 
      Health Options Awareness Act of 2025.......................    94
    Morrison Amendment, no. 1, to H.R. 5498 - Small Business 
      Health Options Awareness Act of 2025.......................    95
Support Documents:
    E-Vote Results...............................................    96
    Minority Letter of Support for H.R. 2804.....................   107
    Minority Main Street Competition Coalition Letter............   119
    Minority AI Chatbot Letter...................................   120
    Majority eHealth Letter......................................   123
    Majority NACA Letter.........................................   124
    Majority AEAW Letter.........................................   126
    Majority NVSBC Letter........................................   128
    Minority Small Business Majority Letter......................   129
    Minority Main Street Alliance Letter.........................   131
    Majority THATCH Letter.......................................   133
Votes:
    ANS to H.R. 4238, offered by Hon. Williams agreed to by voice   134
    ANS to H.R. 826, offered by Hon. Williams agreed to by voice.   135
    ANS to H.R. 2804, offered by Hon. Velazquez agreed to by 
      voice......................................................   136
    ANS to H.R. 5498, offered by Hon. Van Duyne agreed to by 
      voice......................................................   137
    H.R. 4238 - Disaster Loan Accountability and Reform Act (As 
      Amended) Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 23-0.   138
    H.R. 8879 - Oversight and Transparency for Small Business 
      Certifications Act of 2026 Ordered to be reported by the 
      Yeas and Nays: 23-0........................................   139
    H.R. 826 - COVID Fraud Transparency Act of 2025 (As Amended) 
      Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 23-0..........   140
    H.R. 8880 - Small Business Cybersecurity Assistance 
      Evaluation Act of 2026 Ordered to be reported by the Yeas 
      and Nays: 23-0.............................................   141
    H.R. 8881 - SBA Artificial Intelligence Utilization Act of 
      2026 Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 23-0.....   142
    H.R. 8882 - Main Street Competes Act Ordered to be reported 
      by the Yeas and Nays: 23-0.................................   143
    H.R. 915 - Small Business Technological Act of 2025 Ordered 
      to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 23-0..................   144
    H.R. 2804 - Protecting Small Business Competitions Act of 
      2025 (As Amended) Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and 
      Nays: 23-0.................................................   145
    Amendment #1 to the ANS to H.R. 5498 offered by Hon. Scholten 
      Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 11-12.........   146
    Amendment #1 to the ANS to H.R. 5498 offered by Hon. Morrison 
      Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 11-12.........   147
    H.R. 5498 - Small Business Health Options Awareness Act of 
      2025 (As Amended) Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and 
      Nays: 13-11................................................   148

 
                       MARKUP OF VARIOUS MEASURES

                              ----------                              


                        WEDNESDAY, MAY 20, 2026

                  House of Representatives,
               Committee on Small Business,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Committee met, pursuant to call, at 2:08 p.m., in Room 
2360, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Roger Williams 
[chairman of the Committee] presiding.
    Present: Representatives Williams, Stauber, Meuser, Van 
Duyne, Ellzey, Alford, Finstad, Wied, Bresnahan, Jack, King-
Hinds, Schmidt, Patronis, Fuller, Velazquez, McGarvey, 
Scholten, McIver, Cisneros, Morrison, Latimer, Tran, Simon, 
Olszewski, and Goodlander.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The committee will now come to order. 
Without objection, the Chair is authorized to declare a recess 
of the committee at any time. As required by House rules, a 
copy of the legislative measures have been made available to 
Members and the public at least 24 hours in advance. Without 
objection, the committee will vote electronically in accordance 
with committee rules and regulations developed by the House 
Committee on rules and administration. I now recognize myself 
for opening remarks.
    Good afternoon and welcome to everyone. Today we will mark 
up the important bills that support all businesses and reflect 
a consistent message that main street deserves a government 
that is transparent, accountable, and invested in its success. 
As Chairman, I am proud of the work this committee is doing to 
ensure that small businesses remain a key engine of the 
American economy, driving growth and opportunity to communities 
across the country. Together with the Ranking Member, my 
friend, we have continued to work on legislation that reflects 
our commitment to rooting out fraud, strengthening oversight of 
the SBA programs, and ensuring that small businesses have the 
tools and the resources they need to thrive.
    Several of the bills we will consider today address 
accountability and transparency within the SBA. Among them are 
bills that would impose stronger reporting and budgeting 
requirements on the SBA's disaster loan program, strengthen 
reporting requirements on COVID-era loan fraud, and ensure the 
SBA certification programs are delivering for small businesses 
they were designed to serve. We also will consider legislation 
that ensures small businesses can fairly compete for federal 
contracts by codifying the Rule of Two, as well as legislation 
that examines impacts of federal antitrust agencies' 
enforcement decisions on the small business community too.
    Rounding out today's markup are bills that modernize the 
SBA's lending practices by clarifying the flagship 7a loan 
program, covers technology and software investments, increasing 
oversight of the SBA's use of artificial intelligence, and 
examining the effectiveness of federal cyber resources for 
small businesses. As we continue to grow in a digital economy, 
we cannot let success to capital--or access to capital impair 
Main Street America. And finally, we will consider a bill to 
enhance awareness of healthcare coverage options through the 
SBA's existing outreach program.
    Small businesses employ nearly half the American workforce 
and drive innovation coast to coast and all states in between. 
They deserve a federal government that works as hard as they 
do, and the committee has a responsibility to deliver on that. 
The legislation before us today is a direct reflection of that 
commitment, and I am proud of the bipartisan effort that has 
brought us to today's markup, and I look forward to working 
with my colleagues to advance meaningful legislation that 
empowers small businesses and strengthens the communities they 
serve. With that, I yield to my friend and the distinguished 
Ranking Member from New York, Ms. Velazquez, for her opening 
remarks.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for convening this 
markup today. Let me begin by thanking you for adding H.R. 
2804, the Protecting Small Business Competition Act, to the 
agenda today. The Rule of Two is critical to preserving 
competition and allowing small business contractors to 
successfully enter, compete, and remain in the industrial base. 
H.R. 2804 is a priority for me, and I look forward to working 
with you to get it enacted into law before the end of the 
session.
    I plan to lend my support to all but one bill, under 
consideration today. Five of the bills under consideration will 
arm our Committee with more information to oversee the SBA and 
ensure program integrity. I applaud Members for working 
together on these bills, which will increase reporting, improve 
accountability, and ensure policymakers have information to see 
how the agency is operating and serving entrepreneurs. On one 
hand, we have these bipartisan bills calling studies and 
reports, but on the other, we are doing very little to address 
the real concerns of small businesses.
    President Trump's failed economic agenda is leaving small 
businesses with mounting anxiety, uncertainty, and economic 
pain. They're struggling with tariffs, higher borrowing costs, 
and surging food and gas prices. I want to make it clear that 
Democrats on this committee stand ready to conduct oversight of 
the SBA and work together to address the needs of small 
employers, entrepreneurs, and the communities they support. 
That is where our focus needs to be, delivering real results 
for small businesses. Thank you again, Mr. Williams. I yield 
back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Does any 
other Member seek recognition for the purpose of making an 
opening statement?
    All right, seeing none, we will move to the consideration 
of the first bill.
    H.R. 4238
    All right, the committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 
4238, the Disaster Loan Accountability and Reform Act, 
introduced by Representative Tim Moore from the great state of 
North Carolina, with Representative Goodlander as the committee 
co-lead. The clerk will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 4238. A bill----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 4238 is 
considered as read and open for amendment. I have an amendment 
in the nature of a substitute at the desk. The amendment has 
been distributed in advance. The clerk will report the 
amendment.
    The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 
4238.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment will be 
considered as read and will serve as the base text for the 
purpose of further amendment. I now recognize myself for 
remarks as the--as on the bill and the amendment.
    I would first like to thank our colleague Mr. Moore from 
the great state of North Carolina for introducing this bill. 
During the 2024 hurricane season, the SBA Disaster Loan Relief 
Program under the Biden administration exhausted its funding 
entirely for the first time since the program's inception. And 
this has forced a pause on new loan disbursements while 
thousands of Americans were actively recovering from Hurricanes 
Milton and Helene. Survivors across impacted communities were 
left waiting for help, not because help was unavailable, but 
because Biden's SBA failed to properly and timely notify 
Congress of a funding shortfall. And that's unacceptable, I 
think we all agree, and it cannot happen again.
    So H.R. 4238, the Disaster Loan Accountability and Reform 
Act, responds directly to that catastrophe by strengthening 
oversight and transparency, improving budgeting requirements, 
and building greater accountability into the disaster lending 
process. This bill ensures the program can keep pace with the 
scale of modern disasters we see. It reflects our commitment to 
helping families, homeowners, and small businesses recover and 
rebuild, and it also gives Americans the confidence that when a 
disaster strikes their community, relief will be there. I urge 
my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 4238 as amended, and I yield 
back.
    I now recognize Representative Goodlander from the great 
state of New Hampshire to speak on the bill and the amendment.
    Ms. GOODLANDER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ranking Member 
Velazquez, thank you for your leadership. I am very proud to be 
leading our bipartisan Disaster Loan Accountability Reform Act 
alongside two great colleagues from the state of North 
Carolina, Tim Moore and Don Davis. Congressman Davis represents 
communities in eastern North Carolina that were among the 
hardest hit by Hurricane Helene. We saw in that moment what it 
looks like when our government falls short of our people when 
they need us most. And our bipartisan bill is an answer to 
those preventable failures.
    So here is what happened. In 2024 disaster struck. 
Hurricane after hurricane made landfall across the United 
States. Communities were devastated. Families lost their homes. 
Small businesses, they watched their livelihoods wash away. And 
this was precisely the moment that the Small Business 
Administration's disaster loan program was made for, low-
interest loans to help businesses reopen, to help homeowners 
rebuild, to give the American people a fighting chance. But on 
October 15th, 2024, right in the midst of this crisis, the SBA 
announced that its disaster loan account was empty, exhausted, 
gone. It couldn't approve new loans. It couldn't disburse money 
to people who were waiting. That lasted for more than 2 months 
while Congress scrambled to act. Two months for families 
sleeping in FEMA trailers, for small businesses who had just 
enough hope left to fill out an application and wait.
    Now, here is the part I think for all of us who believe in 
accountability, and in this Committee I know we do, this lapse 
was not inevitable. It was not caused by some unprecedented 
force of nature or disaster beyond imagination. It was caused 
by preventable failures. I think the lesson of 2024 is simple. 
Disaster response cannot be opaque and reactive. It must be 
transparent and accountable. The SBA didn't meet its 
requirements, and by the time the authorizing committees found 
out that there was a problem, there was no time left to act. 
You know, in New Hampshire, we are not strangers to disasters. 
Severe flooding, nor'easters, ice storms that shut down roads 
and destroy infrastructure. Our farmers up in our Upper Valley, 
our producers up in our North Country, our growers in the 
Monadnock region, they face weather events that can wipe out 
literally generations of work.
    When disaster strikes, SBA's disaster loans are often 
genuinely the first and only lifeline available. It is the 
difference between rebuilding and closing for good. So our 
bipartisan bill will make sure that America's small businesses, 
our family farmers, never have to face a moment where they're 
told, ``We're sorry, we ran out of money, and nobody told 
Congress in time to fix it.'' So here is what our bill does. It 
requires the SBA to report monthly on the status of the 
disaster loan account, not when disaster has been declared, but 
continuously, so that here in Congress we always have current 
information. It requires the SBA to alert us here in Congress 
within 24 hours when the account falls below 10 percent of the 
10-year average, and it requires separate budget line items so 
that we can see exactly what's being requested and, and why.
    It also directs the Government Accountability Office to 
conduct two what I think are important studies that will 
examine administrative changes that were made to the disaster 
loan program in 2023 and 2024, changes that may have 
contributed to the faster than expected depletion of the 
account. We've got to understand what happened. We need the 
data. We need the accountability.
    And there is one more provision I want to highlight in this 
bill. Until the SBA administrator submits the required monthly 
report to Congress, the administrator cannot engage in official 
travel. So this may sound like a small thing, but I think it is 
a meaningful accountability mechanism to be sure that we've got 
the information we need. This, at the end of the day, reporting 
what we learned in 2024, is not a bureaucratic box-checking 
exercise. It is a basic obligation of an executive branch 
agency to be accountable to the legislative branch and the 
people we represent. So I am very proud to be leading this 
bipartisan bill. I am really grateful for the work of all of 
our colleagues to make sure that when Americans need help in 
the midst and after a disaster, we are ready with funds in the 
account and with Congress fully informed. So I urge my 
colleagues to support the amendment in the nature of a 
substitute and the underlying bill. And with that, I yield 
back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Are there 
any other Members who wish to be recognized for a statement on 
this bill?
    I now recognize the Ranking Member to speak on the bill and 
the amendment.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I support H.R. 
4238, the Disaster Loan Accountability and Reform Act, as 
amended. The SBA disaster loan program, which provides long-
term, low-interest direct loans to homeowners, renters, small 
business owners, and nonprofits after declared disasters plays 
a critical role in the federal government's direct disaster 
response efforts. The SBA failed to properly alert Congress of 
its impending budget shortfall, which led to a lapse in program 
funding and a prolonged delay in much-needed relief to affected 
communities. While the SBA cannot effectively address our 
changing climate, it can do a better job at updating Congress 
about the status of the disaster loan account. That is why I 
support H.R. 4238, the Disaster Loan Accountability and Reform 
Act, or DLARA.
    This bill requires common sense reporting from the SBA and 
transparency from the White House when they submit their annual 
budget request. It also requires the administrator to notify 
Congress when program funds run low and directs the GAO to 
study how past rulemaking has affected the speed of that 
process. This bill adds transparency to the process to ensure 
disaster-affected communities never have to face a lapse again. 
I thank all the sponsors, including Ms. Goodlander, Ms. King-
Hinds, and Mr. Meuser, for their work.
    This is a very important legislation. I know because I 
lived through Sandy in New York and Maria when it struck Puerto 
Rico. This is a very important disaster program, and it is one 
of the most important programs. You know, there is nothing more 
important than when natural disasters strike to immediately 
work to make families whole that are suffering. And even so 
many lost their lives. So thank you for the work that you've 
done in a bipartisan way.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Does anyone 
wish to offer an amendment?
    Seeing none, the question now occurs on the adoption of the 
amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 4238.
    All in favor say aye.
    All opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it. The 
amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 4238 is 
adopted.
    The question now comes on ordering H.R. 4238 as amended to 
be reported favorably to the House.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it. H.R. 4238 is 
agreed to.
    Ms. KING-HINDS. Mr. Chairman, I request for a recorded 
vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A Member has asked for a recorded vote. 
A vote has been requested and a roll call vote is ordered. 
Pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and House Rule 11, further 
proceedings on the bill are postponed.
    H.R. 8897
    The Committee now moves to the consideration of H.R. 8897, 
the Oversight and Transparency for Small Business 
Certifications Act of 2026, introduced by Representatives 
Olszewski and Wied. The clerk shall report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 8879, a bill to amend the Small Business--
--
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 8879 is 
considered as read and open for amendment. I now recognize 
Representative Olszewski from the great state of Maryland. For 
a statement on the bill.
    Mr. OLSZWESKI. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, Ranking 
Member Velazquez, and to all of my colleagues here today. I 
want to begin by thanking Representative Wied for his 
partnership and his leadership on this important effort. I am 
proud to help lead this bipartisan bill because I believe that 
we can and we should always work harder to ensure that federal 
programs work efficiently for the American people. Congress 
created the three small business contracting programs this bill 
impacts; the Women-Owned Small Business Program, Historically 
Underutilized Business Zone Program, and the Service Disabled 
Veteran-Owned Small Business Program. These programs help our 
government recruit and retain quality small businesses while 
also leveling the playing field for them to enter, compete, and 
to have success in the federal market.
    In the past years, each program has had its own online 
certification platform and designated staff within the SBA's 
Office of Government Contracting and Business Development. As a 
result, small businesses had far different certification 
experiences. For example, in 2023, service-disabled veterans 
seeking an SBA certification were served by 20 dedicated SBA 
staff and 54 contractors who processed their applications in 
about 3 weeks. The women-owned small business program 
applicants, however, were served by 8 SBA staff and 2 
contractors, resulting in a backlog of roughly 7,000 
applicants, with an average wait time of almost a year. 
Ensuring fairness and promoting efficiency for all small 
business owners is an overarching goal of all Members of this 
committee.
    Our bill will require the SBA to provide greater detail in 
their budget justification documents regarding their 
certification processes, infrastructure, and timelines, as well 
as participants' backlogs and wait times for small business 
applicants. That will allow this committee to more effectively 
conduct oversight and to identify issues with the certification 
process and SBA portals in a more timely manner for American 
small business owners across this country. I urge my colleagues 
to support this legislation, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize Representative Wied from the great state of 
Wisconsin for a statement on the bill.
    Mr. WIED. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Our bipartisan 
legislation, H.R. 8879, the Oversight and Transparency for 
Small Business Certifications Act will require the SBA to 
report on the certifications and contract awards for its small 
business programs. SBA programs, including the Service Disabled 
Veteran-Owned Small Businesses programs, are important to 
ensure all entrepreneurs are given a chance to succeed. By 
improving the transparency of programs like these, Congress can 
ensure that the appropriate measures are taken to certify or 
decertify firms to help root out waste, fraud and abuse. I am 
proud to co-lead this bill alongside my friend and colleague 
Representative Olszewski, and I encourage my colleagues to 
support this common-sense bipartisan legislation.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. Are there any 
other Members who wish to be recognized for a statement on the 
bill? All right.
    Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member 
to speak on the bill.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the 
work of my colleagues, Representatives Olszewski and Wied to 
move this bill forward. Our committee's ability to assist small 
businesses depends in part on our ability to conduct 
appropriate and effective oversight of SBA. Unfortunately, we 
do not always receive sufficient or timely responses to 
inquiries and what should be routine reporting is often 
delayed, sometimes past the point of relevancy. For example, 
under the previous administration, both Chairman Williams and I 
raised concerns about whether the committee had a full picture 
of the Unified Certification Platform's challenges, and I 
frequently heard from women-owned businesses about the backlog 
of WSB applications.
    Currently, SBA is not forthcoming with any information. 
They do not respond to specific requests, nor provide regular 
reports and data that have been routinely provided in the past. 
This bill will ensure we have consistent information on one of 
the SBA's core missions: certifying small business federal 
contractors. Current and aspiring government contractors 
Already face challenges in the federal market. Unnecessary time 
or added hurdles, just to get a certification before they can 
even compete for contracting opportunities, should not be one 
of them. I urge my colleagues to vote yes, and I yield back my 
time.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Thank you.
    I now recognize myself to speak in support of this 
legislation.
    As the Trump administration continues to focus on 
government efficiency and eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse in 
the federal programs, Congress needs the necessary information 
about where these programs are succeeding and where they need 
improvement. H.R. 8879, the Oversight and Transportation--or 
Transparency for Small Business Certifications Act of 2026, 
requires the SBA to annually report to Congress on 
certification activities across the SBA's small business 
contracting programs. This bill would provide Congress with 
detailed information and certification granted or denied, of 
application processing times, and overall program 
participation. I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 8879, 
and I yield back.
    Does anyone wish to offer an amendment? Seeing none, the 
question now occurs on ordering H.R. 8879 reported favorably to 
the House. All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair the ayes have it. H.R. 8879 
is----
    Mr. WIED. Mr. Chairman, I ask for a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote has been requested. A 
roll call vote is ordered. Pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and 
House Rule 11 further proceedings on this bill are postponed.
    H.R. 826
    The committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 826, the 
COVID Fraud Transparency Act of 2025, introduced by 
Representative Latimer and Representative Bean, Representative 
Mfume, and myself, and the clerk will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 826, a bill to require----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the H.R. 826 is 
considered as read and open for amendment. I have an amendment 
in the nature of a substitute at the desk. The amendment has 
been distributed in advance. The clerk will report the 
amendment.
    The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 
8----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection the amendment will be 
considered as read and will serve as base text for the purpose 
of further amendment.
    I now recognize myself for remarks on the bill and the 
amendment.
    First, I would like to thank Representatives Latimer, Bean, 
and Mfume for introducing this bill with me last year. The SBOA 
IG estimates that roughly $200 billion in potentially 
fraudulent relief funds were discharged through COVID-19 relief 
programs. Earlier this year, the SBA under the Trump 
administration referred more than 562,000 suspected fraudulent 
loans totaling approximately $22 billion to Treasury for 
further action, and that is a disturbing amount to anyone.
    Even the 5 years following the pandemic, we are still 
working to highlight the need for continued transparency and 
oversight of fraud investigations and recovery efforts. H.R. 
826, the COVID Fraud Transparency Act of 2025, recognizes the 
importance of remaining responsive and informed as those cases 
continue to be investigated and resolved. By implementing more 
comprehensive reporting and oversight requirements, Congress 
can better understand the methods and categories of fraud that 
occurred during the pandemic, therefore strengthening 
safeguards to protect taxpayer dollars in future emergency 
relief programs. I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 826. 
I yield back.
    I now recognize Mr. Latimer from the great state of New 
York to speak on the bill.
    Mr. LATIMER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I want to express 
my appreciation for your leadership on this bill, along with 
colleagues, Congress Members Bean and Mfume. This bill is a 
bipartisan effort to deal with the disbursement of SBA loan 
products, which we saw during the COVID-19 pandemic totaled 
$1.2 trillion in Economic Injury Disaster Loan and Paycheck 
Protection Program. Those are significant amounts of dollars 
that affected small businesses that were adversely impacted by 
the crisis. But as always, when there is any federal program, 
there are bad actors. And so the SBA Inspector General, in 
coordination with other federal agencies, has worked to 
investigate those cases of fraud and hold those bad actors 
accountable.
    This Congress provides, in this bill, Inspector Generals 
with the funding and the resources necessary to combat fraud, 
and I am very proud to co-lead this with Chairman Williams and 
his leadership. This bill requires the SBA Inspector General to 
issue quarterly reports to Congress on the number of borrowers 
engaged, and that will help us detect the fraud factors. I 
encourage my colleagues to support this common-sense bipartisan 
bill, and once again, thank the Chairman and our Ranking Member 
Nydia Velazquez for their leadership in this moment. Mr. 
Chairman, I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
    Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a 
statement?
    All right, seeing none, I would like to recognize the 
Ranking Member to speak on the bill.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate your 
efforts alongside Mr. Latimer to enhance reporting on pandemic 
fraud. The COVID Fraud Transparency Act will further enable 
this committee to carry out its oversight responsibilities 
effectively. During the global COVID-19 pandemic, the Small 
Business Administration stepped in and served as critical 
lifeline to small businesses. The SBA distributed more than 
$1.2 trillion in economic aid and executed 14 years of lending 
in 14 days. In an effort to disburse funds quickly, SBA 
weakened and removed its internal controls. Organized crime 
syndicates, transnational gangs, and other criminals 
exploitated these weakened controls and stole billions from the 
American people.
    The legislation we are considering today will provide the 
Committee with better data. H.R. 826 will require the SBA 
Inspector General to send periodic reports to this Committee 
for the next 2 years with detailed information regarding the 
number of fraud cases and the types of fraud, as well as the 
number of cases that has been resolved. In closing, I want to 
underscore the importance of continued oversight and 
transparency as we work to safeguard taxpayer resources and 
strengthen accountability. The single most effective way to 
combat fraud is to provide full funding for the Inspector 
General, and so that he has the infrastructure he needs in 
order to conduct the type of oversight that is important and 
necessary. We don't know when the next pandemic will strike. We 
have to be ready, and we need to learn the lessons of the past. 
I urge my colleagues to support H.R. 826 as amended, and I 
yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back, and thank 
you.
    And does anyone wish to offer an amendment? Seeing none, 
the question now occurs on the adoption of the amendment in the 
nature of a substitute to H.R. 826.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it. The 
amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 826 is adopted. 
The question now occurs on ordering H.R. 826's amendment to be 
reported favorably to the House.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it, and H.R. 826 
as amended is agreed to.
    Mr. FULLER. Mr. Chairman, I ask for a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A Member asks for a recorded vote, and a 
recorded vote has been requested. A roll call vote is ordered. 
So pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and Rule 11, further 
proceedings on this bill are postponed.
    H.R. 8880
    The committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 8880, the 
Small Business Cybersecurity Assistance Evaluation Act of 2026, 
introduced by Representatives Simon and Bresnahan. The clerk 
will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 8880, a bill to require----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection H.R. 8880 is 
considered as read and open for amendment. I now recognize the 
fast-moving Ms. Simon from the great state of California to 
speak on this legislation.
    Ms. SIMON. Well, thank you, Chair. I cannot believe I made 
it. Thank you also our Ranking Member Velazquez and, and thank 
you to Congressman, my colleague, Bresnahan for co-leading with 
me this extremely important, I would say critical, bipartisan 
effort. I am proud to speak in support of the Small Business 
Cybersecurity Assistance Act. Now, we know that small 
businesses are relying more and more on digital tools to reach 
customers and access capital. In fact, the United States 
Chamber of Commerce estimates that 99 percent of small 
businesses use at least one technology platform. And at the 
same time, cyber threats are becoming more sophisticated and 
damaging, especially for the smallest businesses that are most 
likely to not be able to recover from these attacks. From 
phishing to ransomware, these attacks to insurance fraud and 
data breaches, small businesses are increasingly being targeted 
by bad and criminal actors. For a small business owner, a 
single attack can mean not just lost revenue, but interrupted 
operations or even closure. We've seen this.
    Our bill is simple. It would direct the Government 
Accountability Office to conduct a comprehensive assessment of 
the cybersecurity threats and vulnerabilities facing our small 
businesses. The GAO would also identify existing federal 
programs, initiatives, and capital resources available to help 
entrepreneurs prepare for and mitigate and defend themselves 
every single day against these attacks. Now, this bill is about 
ensuring that we have the best data available to craft 
effective policies that protect small businesses from these 
attacks. Small businesses drive innovation. They create jobs, I 
am speaking to the choir here, and support communities in every 
corner of this country. Especially as artificial intelligence 
continues to evolve we must make sure that small businesses are 
not left behind, that they are not vulnerable, that they are 
equipped and ready to defend themselves.
    And I want to thank Chairman Williams and Ranking Member 
Velazquez for including this bill in today's markup and for 
their continued leadership on behalf of our country's small 
businesses. And I want to thank you, and I urge all of my 
colleagues to support our important legislation. And I yield 
back, sir.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize Mr. Bresnahan from the great state of 
Pennsylvania to speak on this legislation.
    Mr. BRESNAHAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to 
the Ranking Member. I rise today alongside Representative Simon 
in support of the Small Business Cybersecurity Assistance 
Evaluation Act of 2026. This bipartisan legislation directs the 
GAO to study the effectiveness of existing federal 
cybersecurity assistance resources available to small 
businesses and identify where improvements are needed. In the 
United States, small businesses are 210 percent more likely to 
experience cyber incidents compared to larger companies, a 
challenge Congress can no longer afford to overlook. By 
evaluating gaps in current federal programs, this bill will 
help ensure small businesses have better access to the tools, 
training, and resources they need to defend themselves against 
cyberattacks. As cyber threats continue to evolve, our support 
system for small businesses must evolve as well. I strongly 
urge my colleagues to support this legislation. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. Are there any 
other Members who wish to be recognized for a statement?
    Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member 
to speak on the bill.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank 
Representatives Simon and Bresnahan for their leadership on 
this important issue. According to the U.S. Chamber of 
Commerce, 99 percent of small businesses use at least one 
technology platform, with most using at least four. Yet only a 
quarter of small businesses use cybersecurity and malware 
detection tools. That is because small businesses lack the 
time, skills, and resources to adopt effective cybersecurity 
measures compared to their larger competitors. Cybercriminals 
are well aware of these vulnerabilities and exploit them at 
main street's expense. A single cyberattack could pose an 
existential threat to a small business.
    The federal government has multiple cybersecurity resources 
for small businesses, but they are spread across agencies 
rather than provided by the expert in small business outreach, 
the SBA. The Small Business Cybersecurity Assistance Evaluation 
Act will direct the GAO to study and report to Congress the 
state of federal small business cybersecurity assistance and 
make recommendations to optimize their impact and use by main 
street entrepreneurs. I urge all colleagues to vote yes. With 
that, I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Thank you.
    And I now recognize myself to speak in support of this 
legislation.
    Small businesses are increasingly vulnerable to 
cybersecurity threats that negatively affect the business 
operations, profit margins, and reputation. From ransomware to 
fraud, bad actors have been targeting main street, and yet many 
businesses lack the resources necessary to defend themselves. 
Many federal agencies have cybersecurity assistance programs, 
tools, and resources for small businesses, but these efforts 
are often difficult to navigate, underutilized, or outdated, 
usually, and that is what H.R. 8880 aims to address. This bill 
will help expose where cybersecurity assistance is lacking. 
H.R. 8880, the Small Business Cybersecurity Assistance 
Evaluation Act of 2026, directs the Government Accountability 
Office to evaluate the cyber-attacks threatening small 
businesses and the effectiveness of federal programs in 
preventing them.
    Now, this bill would also require the GAO to evaluate the 
effectiveness, coordination, and awareness of existing federal 
cybersecurity assistance programs for small businesses. The 
legislation takes a practical approach by evaluating what works 
and what does not, ensuring the small businesses have the tools 
and information needed to protect themselves. So I urge my 
colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 8880, and I yield back.
    Does anyone wish to offer an amendment? Seeing none, the 
question now occurs on ordering H.R. 8880 reported favorably to 
the House. All in favor say aye.
    All opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it, and H.R. 
8880 is----
    Mr. BRESNAHAN. Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes, sir. What purpose do you seek?
    Mr. BRESNAHAN. I ask for a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A Member has asked for a recorded vote, 
and a recorded vote has been requested. A roll call vote is 
ordered, and pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and House Rule 11, 
further proceedings on this bill are postponed.
    H.R. 8881
    The committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 8881, the 
SBA AI Utilization Act of 2026, introduced by Representatives 
Finstad and Latimer. The clerk will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 8881, a bill to amend----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 8881 is 
considered as read and open for amendment.
    I now recognize Mr. Finstad from the great state of 
Minnesota to speak on this legislation.
    Mr. FINSTAD. Thank you, Chairman Williams. I am happy to 
speak today in support of my bill, the SBA Artificial 
Intelligence Utilization Act. I also serve on the Ag Committee, 
and AI on the Ag Committee means something very different. So I 
am going to make sure I have my talking points right here for 
the SBA. The artificial intelligence and machine learning 
continue to revolutionize the way businesses conduct 
themselves, and it is important that the federal government, 
including the Small Business Administration, look into the 
benefits that can be gained from incorporating these 
technologies. There is an opportunity here. AI could be a 
useful tool for the SBA to improve its information processing 
capabilities, ease its administration, and better assist the 
entrepreneurs and small businesses of America.
    However, like any new technology, it raises questions about 
transparency, reliability, oversight, and risk. This bill will 
simply mandate that the SBA report to Congress annually about 
the use of AI and machine learning by the SBA. What benefits or 
risks may result from this technology, and how the SBA assesses 
the appropriateness, effectiveness, and the value of using 
these technologies. This is a common-sense oversight measure. 
It does not mandate the use of AI, nor does it prohibit 
innovation. Instead, it ensures Congress has the visibility 
into these new tools that are being used and whether they are 
helping the SBA better fulfill its mission for small 
businesses.
    As technology evolves, Congress has the responsibility to 
ensure federal agencies are using it responsibly, 
transparently, and effectively. This is a bipartisan bill, and 
I want to thank Congressman Latimer for his work on this. I 
appreciate the committee's consideration of this bill, and I 
urge my colleagues to support it. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. I now recognize Mr. Latimer from the 
great state of New York, to speak on this legislation.
    Mr. LATIMER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, 
Congressman Finstad, for your leadership on this bill. It is a 
bipartisan, common-sense bill. It reflects that we as a nation 
are dealing with the growth of AI with potential uses that 
carry great benefit, potential benefit, and great potential 
risks. And there is questions of accuracy and data privacy that 
affect all of us across the aisle, on both sides of the aisle. 
I am pleased to co-lead this bill with Congressman Finstad 
under the leadership of Chairman Williams, and then also 
Ranking individual, Nydia Velazquez.
    This bill directs SBA to report on the steps the agency can 
take to identify and manage the benefits and risks posed by 
these AI use cases. And we think this is an important step for 
our small businesses. I support the bill. I hope we all will 
support the bill. And Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
    Are there any of the Members who wish to be recognized for 
a statement? All right.
    Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member 
to speak on this bill.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I commend 
Representatives Finstad and Latimer for their leadership on 
this bill. In October of 2023, New York City launched a first-
of-its-kind artificial intelligence chatbot. It was meant to 
answer the questions of entrepreneurs about opening small 
businesses, local small business services, regulatory 
compliance, and business planning and strategy. On day one, I 
spotted issues with the accuracy of the chatbot's outputs and 
its ability to answer questions. In response, I led a letter to 
the White House urging the consideration of common sense 
safeguards in any AI tool used by the federal agencies. Mr. 
Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to insert the letter into the 
record.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. So agreed.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. According to an investigation by a local 
news outlet, my concerns were very real. The investigation 
determined that the chatbot was consistently hallucinating and 
encouraging small business owners to break laws and 
regulations, which led it to be shut down.
    AI has the incredible potential to revolutionize the way 
the government works, but it also holds incredible risk. As the 
committee overseeing the SBA, we have a duty to ensure the 
agency considers and uses these tools responsibly and 
effectively. This bill directs the SBA to report annually on 
its AI use, the benefits and risks, and effective risk 
mitigation measures. With that, I urge all colleagues to vote 
yes, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Thank you. I now recognize myself to 
speak on the bill. Businesses across the country adopting 
artificial intelligence, which is reshaping how they operate, 
detect fraud, improve customer service, and process 
information. And there is no reason why the SBA cannot also 
benefit from these efficiencies. In the SBA artificial--The 
Artificial Intelligence Utilization Act of 2026 is a forward-
looking bill introduced by my colleagues Representative Finstad 
and Latimer. H.R. 8881 requires the SBA's report on how it is 
using AI to modernize its technology and improve operations.
    As the federal government works to prevent fraud in 
taxpayer dollars, AI tools can help the SBA better identify 
suspicious activity, detect improper payments, and strengthen 
oversight of the agency programs. By reporting the SBA's use of 
artificial intelligence, this bill will help promote a smarter, 
more efficient government while supporting innovation, 
protecting taxpayers' dollars, and improving services for Main 
Street America. So I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 
8881. I yield back.
    Does anyone wish to offer an amendment? Seeing none, the 
question now occurs on ordering H.R. 8881 reported favorably to 
the House. All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it, and H.R. 
80----
    Mr. FINSTAD. Mr. Chair?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes, sir?
    Mr. FINSTAD. I would ask for a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. All right, a Member has asked for a 
recorded vote. A recorded vote has been requested. A roll call 
vote is ordered. Pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and House Rule 
11, further proceedings on this bill now are postponed.
    H.R. 8882
    The committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 8882, the 
Main Street Competes Act, introduced by Representatives 
Scholten and Schmidt. The clerk will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 8882, a bill to amend----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 8882 is 
considered as read and open for amendment.
    I now recognize Ms. Scholten from the great state of 
Michigan to speak on this legislation.
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. I am so 
thrilled to speak in support of my bill, the Main Street 
Competes Act. While small businesses are the true powerhouses 
of our economy, they're often left to compete against a handful 
of large corporations. Without a level playing field, this can 
lead to higher prices for consumers and small businesses alike. 
Not to mention an increase in predatory pricing and other 
exclusionary practices. When industry consolidation goes too 
far, innovation is stifled, and markets become difficult for 
small businesses to enter. The price we all pay for unfair 
monopolistic conduct is real and it needs to be addressed.
    My bill would do just that by directing the SBA's Office of 
Advocacy to work with the FTC and the Department of Justice to 
examine the gaps in our antitrust laws. Our Office of Advocacy 
is main street's voice within the federal government, and it is 
only right that they're in lockstep with our nation's top 
antitrust enforcement agencies. This bill will not only enhance 
collaboration between these agencies on behalf of small 
businesses, it will also require advocacy to submit a report to 
Congress detailing antitrust violations reported by small 
businesses. By ensuring main street has a seat at the table, we 
can build an economy that creates opportunity for everyone. I 
want to thank my colleague, Representative Schmidt, for working 
with me on this legislation. I strongly urge my colleagues to 
support this bill.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. I now 
recognize Mr. Schmidt from the great state of Kansas to speak 
on this legislation.
    Mr. SCHMIDT. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I want to thank 
my colleague for her longstanding leadership on this issue. I 
am glad to join in this bipartisan effort this year. The only 
thing I would add to the conversation, I worked a little bit on 
the antitrust enforcement side, both under state law and also 
under federal law, and one of the things that's challenging is 
that these investigations and enforcement actions, when 
appropriate, they can be very resource-intensive. And 
historically, they are focused very much consumer-focused 
matters. We don't want them to be less consumer-focused. But we 
do want to recognize that small businesses are a critical 
player who have a stake in the outcome of antitrust enforcement 
and investigation decisions and in the deployment of scarce 
resources in those actions.
    And the reporting requirements in this bill will ensure 
that small business has a voice at the table and that this 
committee and our colleagues have the information that we need 
to make appropriate policy judgments to be sure that those 
marketplaces that benefit all of us when they're competitive 
are properly served from the vantage point of small business, 
as well as the vantage point of consumers, and the vantage 
point of overall public policy and structured markets. So I 
want to thank my colleague for her work on this. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman, for scheduling this, and I encourage all of our 
colleagues to support this measure. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. Are there any 
other Members who wish to be recognized for a statement?
    Ms. GOODLANDER. Mr. Chairman, if I may?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes, ma'am.
    Ms. GOODLANDER. I want to just say, I want to say that I 
strongly support this bill. I am really grateful to my 
colleagues for their leadership on it. As someone who came to 
this committee from the Department of Justice, where my job was 
to enforce our federal antitrust laws, this piece of 
legislation is near and dear to my heart. What I saw on the 
front lines of the fight to enforce these laws, which for far 
too long have not been enforced, is consolidation like never 
before across our economy.
    We see it from the big ag corporations who are screwing 
family farmers, the mega-merge grocery chains that are 
squeezing family-owned independent grocers. I just sat with 
many of them a few minutes ago before this hearing. We see what 
consolidation is doing. And I am a proud capitalist, but I am a 
capitalist who really believes that capitalism without 
competition is not capitalism. It is a form of exploitation 
that is making business impossible for our small businesses. So 
this, this is a common-sense bill that really will fill gaps. I 
wish that this bill had been law when I served in the Justice 
Department, because when you're in the federal executive 
branch, you can often be far too removed from the communities 
who you're proud to serve.
    And this is going to create the connective tissue that we 
need between Congress and our antitrust enforcers, and 
ultimately the connective tissue and the information flow that 
we need from small businesses who are on the front lines of 
this fight. So I thank my colleagues for their leadership on 
this bipartisan bill, and I urge all of our colleagues to 
support this. Thank you, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Are there 
any other Members who wish to be recognized for a statement? 
All right, seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking 
Member to speak on this bill.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. For the last half 
century, agencies tasked with maintaining a competitive 
environment and a level playing field have neglected to enforce 
the laws on the books. As a result, our economy has grown 
increasingly consolidated. One study has found that 75 percent 
of industry have become more concentrated since the mid-1990s. 
Firms who garner market power often use that power against 
their competitors in the form of anti-competitive practices 
like price discrimination or self-preferencing. These practices 
increase the barrier to entry for small firms or use their 
software as a digital tool for accessing markets.
    The SBA is a critical part of our nation's pro-competition 
toolkit, supporting small business creation and growth, but it 
cannot bolster small businesses alone. Strong antitrust 
enforcement has a real role to play in protecting a level 
playing field for small businesses. This bill makes perfect use 
of our Office of Advocacy, asking it to monitor the actions of 
other agencies and how their actions affect small businesses 
while leveraging their economic analysis to help Congress 
understand the structural issues small firms face when 
competing in the market and developing recommendations for how 
we can address those issues. I want to thank Representatives 
Scholten and Schmidt for their work on this bill. I encourage a 
yes vote, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Thank you.
    And I now recognize myself to speak on this bill.
    Competition is a key tenant of capitalism. It allows 
consumers to choose with dollars between their business that 
will offer the best product, price, or service. Without 
appropriate competition, innovation in the U.S. economy will 
suffer. And H.R. 8882, the Main Street Competes Act, aligns 
with the SBA's mission to preserve free competitive enterprise 
and strengthen the small--the overall economy of our nation by 
requiring the Department of Justice and the Federal Trade 
Commission to provide data on the SBA Office of Advocacy on 
antitrust complaints, investigations, and enforcement actions 
involving small business.
    It also detects advocacy to evaluate these trends and 
provide recommendations to Congress on ways to improve 
competition and address harmful anti-competitive conduct. This 
bill takes a targeted, data-driven approach to better 
understand those competitive pressures and determine whether 
current antitrust enforcement efforts adequately protect small 
businesses. So this bill will ensure that policymakers have the 
information they need to support a competitive marketplace for 
main street businesses can grow and can succeed. So I urge my 
colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 8882, and I yield back.
    Now, does anyone wish to offer an amendment? All right 
seeing none, the question now occurs in ordering H.R. 8882 
reported favorably to the House.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it.
    And each Member will seek recognition.
    What is it?
    Mr. SCHMIDT. Mr. Chairman, I would request a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote has been requested. A 
roll call vote is ordered. Pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and 
House Rule 11, further proceedings on this bill now are 
postponed.
    H.R. 915
    The committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 915, the 
Small Business Technical Act of 2025, introduced by 
Representatives Alford, Lee, and Mrvan, with Representative 
McGarvey as the committee co-lead. The clerk will report the 
bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 915, a bill to authorize----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 915 is 
considered as read and open for amendment.
    I now recognize Mr. Alford from the great state of Missouri 
to speak on this legislation.
    Mr. ALFORD. Well, thank you, Mr. Chair and Ranking Member. 
Thank you for excusing my absence from most of this. We've been 
across the hall in Appropriations Markup. This bill is very 
important to me. Small businesses are the backbone of our 
economy. They create jobs, they strengthen local communities, 
and drive innovation across this country. But in today's 
economy, a small business cannot compete without access to 
modern technology and digital tools. Whether it is cloud-based 
accounting software, payroll systems, cybersecurity 
protections, inventory management platforms, or emerging AI 
tools, technology is no longer a luxury for small businesses.
    It is essential to ensuring that main street keeps up with 
Wall Street. Unfortunately, Mr. Chairman, under the SBA's 
flagship 7a loan program, there have been unnecessary ambiguity 
surrounding whether these types of tools qualify as eligible 
business expenses. And that uncertainty creates confusion for 
lenders and limits access to capital for entrepreneurs simply 
trying to modernize their operations. While I am grateful that 
Administrator Loeffler quickly amended the SBA standard 
operation procedure to add clarity to these products that are 
allowed, it is still important for Congress to do our job and 
to make sure that such clarity is done with the force of law.
    The Small Business Technological Advancement Act provides a 
simple, common-sense fix. Our legislation clarifies that SBA 7a 
loans may be used for business software, cloud computing 
services, and other technologies that facilitate business 
operations, including tools powered by artificial intelligence. 
This bill does not create a new program, and it does not 
increase the size or scope of the 7a program. It simply updates 
SBA policy to reflect the realities of today's economy. And it 
gives small businesses the certainty they need to invest in the 
tools required to grow and to compete.
    You know, for many main street businesses, technology 
adoption can mean the difference between expanding or falling 
behind. A small manufacturer may need software to improve 
logistics and inventory tracking. A local retailer may rely on 
cloud-based payment processing and cybersecurity tools. These 
are practical investments that help small businesses operate 
smarter and compete with larger firms that already have access 
to these resources.
    Quite simply, at the end of the day, this bill is about 
making sure that America's small businesses are not left behind 
in an increasingly digital economy. And if we want small 
businesses to succeed, which we all do here, to create jobs, to 
remain competitive, we need to make sure that federal programs 
keep pace with modern business practices.
    So, Mr. Chairman, I urge my colleagues to support this 
bipartisan legislation, and I look forward to continuing to 
work with this committee to advance it. Thank you so much, and 
I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize Mr. McGarvey from the great state of 
Kentucky to speak on this legislation.
    Mr. McGARVEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman, Ranking Member Velazquez, for including your this 
bill and for your support in this markup. You know, look, a lot 
has changed in the last 25 years. My kids have never seen a 
phone book. In fact, when they come here, one of the things 
they like to do is see the phones that are still in the 
cloakroom because they're not used to seeing a landline either. 
We can't pretend that technology is, is going to take over how 
we operate our businesses. Technology has taken over and 
changed how we operate our businesses. And what we have to do 
is make sure that the rules and regulations keep up with that 
technology.
    That's why I am proud to work with my friend Congressman 
Alford from the great state of Missouri on this smart piece of 
legislation. The Small Business Technological Act, it is just a 
common-sense step towards ensuring that small businesses are 
able to take on modern day problems with modern day solutions. 
This bipartisan bill clarifies that small businesses may 
continue to use 7a loans to finance business software, cloud 
computing services, and other technologies that support their 
day-to-day operations.
    And I say continue because we want to make sure they can 
continue to do this because this works. We have seen how 
successful making technological programming an eligible use of 
funds in the 7a program has been, and I fully support this bill 
giving small businesses the certainty they need to continue 
doing so. Small businesses are the backbone of the American 
economy. If we want them to stay that way, then we are going to 
have to make sure we are doing what we can to put them in a 
position to succeed. This bill continues to do that. It is why 
I support it. I encourage my colleagues to support it, and I 
yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
    Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a 
statement?
    Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member 
to speak on the bill.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just want to 
thank Representative Alford, McGarvey, and Lee for their work 
on this matter and send a message to the financial institutions 
that partner with SBA and SBA that the intent is clear. The 7a 
loans can be used to finance digital tools. And with this 
change, it is my hope we will track an increase in its usage 
regarding digital tools. So I urge my colleagues to support 
this bill, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize myself to speak on the bill.
    I would like to thank my friend Representative Alford for 
introducing this bill earlier this Congress. From inventory and 
payroll to customer service and payment processing, modern 
business software is essential to the daily operation of main 
street businesses across this country. And H.R. 915, the Small 
Business Technology Act of 2025, provides an incredibly 
important clarification and removes any ambiguity by explicitly 
permitting small businesses to use SBA 7a loans to purchase and 
upgrade technology systems and business software, including 
those that utilize artificial intelligence to support their 
daily operations. This vital step to allow small business to 
fully utilize the SBA's flagship 7a loan program is another way 
to make sure that main street does not get left behind. This 
common-sense clarification will provide main street with 
financing needed to operate, modernize, and compete in the 
modern economy. So I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 
915, and I yield back.
    Now, does anyone wish to offer an amendment? All right, 
seeing none, the question now occurs on ordering H.R. 915 
reported favorably to the House.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it, and H.R. 915 
is agreed to.
    Mr. ALFORD. Mr. Chairman?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Member seeks recognition. For what 
purpose?
    Mr. ALFORD. I ask for a recorded vote, please.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote has been requested. A 
roll call vote is ordered.
    Pursuant to Committee Rule 13 and House Rule 11 further 
proceedings on this bill are postponed.
    H.R. 2804
    The committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 2804, the 
Protecting Small Business Competitions Act 2025, led by the 
Ranking Member and myself. And the clerk will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 2804, a bill to amend----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection H.R. 2804 is 
considered as read and open for amendment. The bill's sponsor, 
Ranking Member Velazquez, has an amendment in the nature of a 
substitute at the desk. The amendment has been distributed in 
advance. The clerk will report the amendment.
    The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 
2----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment will be 
considered read and will serve as the base text for the purpose 
of further amendment.
    I now recognize the Ranking Member to speak on her 
legislation and the amendment.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Chairman Williams. I appreciate 
your work to reach an agreement on this bill, and thank you to 
Representative Cisneros and Chairman Williams for your support 
and efforts to move it forward. When the administration began a 
review of the government's procurements regulations last year, 
retaining and codifying a critical small business requirement 
known as the Rule of Two became a top priority. The Rule of Two 
is the foundation for small business participation in the 
industrial base. It is simple and effective. A contract must be 
set aside for a small business only competition if there is an 
expectation that small businesses will bid and can do the work.
    This long-established policy was put in place in 
recognition that if small firms were required to compete 
against large corporations it would be unlikely they will ever 
win a contract. With the Rule of Two in place, well over $100 
billion is awarded annually to small businesses through 
contracts set aside for small business competitions. In fiscal 
year 2024 alone, $72 billion was awarded through general small 
business set-asides. That does not include contracts awarded 
through one of SBA procurement programs, which my legislation 
protects and enables.
    I want to be clear about why we need to pass my bill and 
what it does and doesn't do. Small government contractors face 
an increasingly hostile federal marketplace. As consolidation 
puts more opportunities out of reach for small firms, we need 
to have policies in place to ensure contracts that can be 
performed by small businesses are actually awarded to small 
businesses. The Protecting Small Business Competition Act 
retains one of these key policies and puts into law a current 
regulatory requirement. It does not expand the Rule of Two past 
its current application. We do not require all contracts to be 
awarded based on competition or override mandatory sourcing, 
contracting officer discretion, choice of vehicle, and so 
forth. We are preserving the CAM process that triggers small 
business competition. That is why there is strong support among 
the small business community. Hundreds of firms and 
organizations are urging support for my bill, and I ask 
unanimous consent to insert letters into the record, Mr. 
Chairman.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. So moved.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. When it was clear the Rule of Two was in 
jeopardy last year, the small business community rallied, made 
their voices heard, and secured its extension. We need to do 
our jobs now and codify it. I urge all my colleagues to vote 
yes, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize myself to speak on this bill.
    For decades, the Rule of Two has been one of the most 
important safeguards to ensure small businesses can fairly 
compete in the federal marketplace and the industrial base. And 
for so many small businesses, especially service-disabled 
veterans, these contracting opportunities are critical to 
creating jobs, growing their business, and continuing their 
service to their country.
    H.R. 2804, the Protecting Small Business Competitions Act, 
as amended, is a bipartisan bill that codifies the Rule of Two 
into law. To be clear, the Rule of Two was implemented in 
regulation over 40 years ago, and this bill does not change the 
current procurement process. This is an important point that I 
really want to, to highlight. And the Trump administration 
reaffirmed the importance of this policy for small businesses 
by preserving the Rule of Two in the revolutionary FAR 
overhaul, by restoring certainty back to small businesses that 
rely on it most. This bill guarantees that contracts above the 
simplified acquisition threshold must be set aside for small 
businesses whenever a contracting officer expects at least 2 
qualified small businesses to compete.
    This bill, as amended, mirrors the administration's effort 
to restore predictability for small businesses competing in the 
federal marketplace and reserve opportunities for main street 
job creators, innovators, and veteran entrepreneurs. So over 
340 small businesses and associations, including veterans and 
tribes, support this legislation. So as we move this bill to 
the House floor, I am committed to working alongside the 
Ranking Member and all federal contractors to strengthen 
opportunities that small businesses will have, ensuring outside 
organizations are not unintentionally impacted by this policy.
    Now I would like to thank the Ranking Member for working 
with me on this bill, and that to protect small business 
success. I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 2804, and I 
yield back.
    Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a 
statement?
    Mr. CISNEROS. Mr. Chairman, I wish to be recognized.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. I now recognize Mr. Cisneros to speak on 
this bill and the amendment.
    Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I am proud to 
stand with you and Ranking Member Velazquez and hundreds of 
small businesses and stakeholder groups across the country to 
safeguard small businesses and protect the right to compete for 
government contracts. I applaud the leadership and persistence 
of the Ranking Member towards codifying the Rule of Two.
    The Rule of Two gives small businesses a fighting chance 
and prevents large corporations from boxing them out of 
competition. At a time when our industrial base is shrinking, 
it is exactly the type of bipartisanship that our small 
businesses need from Congress to support the continued access 
and entry into the federal market and to compete for federal 
contracts. We heard as much at our contracting and 
infrastructure subcommittee hearing, where one of the witnesses 
put it bluntly: It has been such a priority for our small 
businesses that I had to ask the SBA administrator about it the 
only time she joined our full committee nearly a year ago. The 
advocacy of the small business community helped retain the Rule 
of Two in the recent overhaul to the Federal Acquisition 
Regulations. However, there is a 4-year sunset provision that 
makes the future retention of the Rule of Two less secure. That 
is why I urge my colleagues to support H.R. 2804 and codifying 
the Rule of Two. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who wish to 
be recognized for a statement? All right. Does anyone wish to 
offer an amendment to the amendment in the nature of a 
substitute?
    Seeing none, the question now occurs on the adoption of the 
amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 2804. All those 
in favor say aye. All those opposed say no. In the opinion of 
the Chair, the ayes have it. The amendment in the nature of a 
substitute to H.R. 2804 is adopted.
    The question now occurs on ordering H.R. 2804 as amended to 
be reported favorably to the House.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it.
    Mr. STAUBER. Mr. Chair?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The Member will seek recognition for 
what purpose?
    Mr. STAUBER. I ask for a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Ask for a recorded vote. A recorded vote 
has been requested and a roll call vote is ordered. Pursuant to 
Committee Rule 13 and House Rule 11, further proceedings on 
this bill are now postponed.
    H.R. 5498
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The committee now moves to consideration 
of H.R. 5498, the Small Business Health Options Awareness Act 
of 2024, introduced by Representatives Van Duyne, Tenny, and 
Hern, and the clerk will report the bill.
    The CLERK. H.R. 5498, a bill to require----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection H.R. 5498 is 
considered as read and open for amendment. The bill sponsor, 
Ms. Van Duyne, has an amendment in the nature of a substitute 
at the desk. The amendment has been distributed in advance. The 
clerk will report the amendment.
    The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 
54----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection the amendment will be 
considered as read and will serve as to the base text for the 
purpose of further amendment. I now recognize Ms. Van Duyne to 
speak on her legislation and the amendment.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Small 
businesses drive innovation and they create jobs and they 
strengthen communities across the country, but too often 
they're forced to navigate a confusing and expensive healthcare 
system without clear information about all of the options that 
are available to them. In North Texas, I regularly hear from 
small business owners who want to provide quality health 
coverage for their employees, but they simply don't have the 
time or resources to sort through every possible option while 
also trying to keep their businesses running. And that's why 
the Trump administration's creation of Individual Coverage 
Health Reimbursement Arrangements, or ICHRAs, was such an 
important step forward.
    ICHRAs give employers a flexible, tax-advantaged way to 
help employees purchase the health coverage that works best for 
them and their families. They reduce administrative burden on 
employers, they expand choice for workers, and they create a 
more modern and affordable approach to employer-sponsored 
coverage. The problem is not that they don't work. The problem 
is that many small business owners don't even know that they 
exist. So my bill, the Small Business Health Options Awareness 
Act, is a common-sense effort to fix that problem by ensuring 
that the Small Business Administration actively shares 
information about ICHRAs through its district offices, its 
small business development centers, websites, social media, and 
other outreach tools already used to communicate with job 
creators across the country.
    This legislation does not create a new program or a mandate 
or a bureaucracy. It simply ensures that small businesses have 
access to information about an option that could help them 
provide more affordable and flexible health benefits to their 
employees. I hope my colleagues on both sides of the aisle can 
agree that small businesses deserve to know all the tools that 
are available to help them compete and grow and support their 
workers. And I urge support for this legislation, and I yield 
back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Are there 
any other Members who wish to be recognized for a statement?
    Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member 
to speak on the bill and speak on the amendment.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Well, I agree with 
my colleagues that it is important to provide more information 
to small businesses so that they can better meet the healthcare 
needs of their workers. I unfortunately cannot support this 
legislation for a number of reasons. First, the bill would 
require the SBA and the SBDCs to distribute materials only on 
individual coverage health reimbursement accounts, often 
referred to as ICHRAs. Over half of all Affordable Care Act 
marketplace enrollees are small business owners, employees, or 
self-employed. By directing the SBA to provide information only 
on ICHRA without requiring information on the ACA Marketplace 
creates a significant gap in the guidance available to small 
businesses.
    Many employers rely on the SBA and SBDC as a trusted 
resource and presenting only one option risks limiting their 
understanding of the full range of choices. To make informed 
decisions, small businesses need a complete overview of all 
options available to them. With that said, ICHRAs need fixing 
to truly offer quality health care. ICHRAs can be used by 
employers to discriminate against certain classes of workers by 
shifting older or sicker employees, for example, into the 
individual marketplace, which in turn raises premiums and 
increases overall risks.
    A Brookings Institution analysis found that allowing 
employers to offer ICHRAs alone with a group health plan could 
increase premiums anywhere from 16 to 93 percent. And if an 
employee is offered an ICHRA, they are not eligible for 
subsidized marketplace coverage unless their share of the 
premium is less than 10 percent. For many low-wage workers, 
they will be better off without an ICHRA.
    Put simply, it doesn't make sense. And even more baffling, 
This bill forces SBDCs to spread the word while the President's 
budget eliminates their funding and SBA refuses to pay them on 
time for services rendered. The Colorado SBDC hasn't received 
their first quarter payment of $742,000, which is typically 
awarded in early February. Because of the delays, services have 
been cut, employees may be furloughed, and centers may close. 
Relying on SBDCs when they are being cut shows a clear lack of 
understanding of the entire situation at hand. Instead of 
pushing a partisan devices bill, we should be working together 
to conduct oversight of the SBA and ensure our resource 
partners are getting paid on time for the counseling services 
they provide. We can also work together to offer a 
comprehensive slate of healthcare information to ensure 
employers and the workers can make informed decisions. To truly 
help with the affordability crisis, every option should be 
provided to businesses because doing so could mean the very 
survival of the operation, and doing so should be a shared 
priority. Unfortunately, this is not the case.
    Instead, the Trump administration is bilking taxpayers to 
bankroll a billion-dollar ballroom. And rather than lowering 
costs and making life better for small businesses, the Trump 
administration is making life harder and more expensive. They 
have ripped healthcare from millions, cut food assistance for 
kids, veterans, and seniors, and raised prices on everything 
from groceries to utilities. And let's not get started on the 
price of gas. Republican policies spike premiums during an 
ongoing affordability crisis, rip health coverage away from 
millions of Americans, to pay for tax cuts for the rich. And 
this, this is your plan for healthcare? The bottom line: this 
is a messaging bill that won't accomplish anything. The SBA 
already has the authority to do it if it chooses. In reality, 
it is just an opportunity for Members to talk about healthcare 
and give the appearance of taking action. I urge my colleagues 
to vote no. I now yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    I thank you, and I now recognize myself to speak on the 
bill and the amendment.
    One of the biggest challenges facing small business today 
is the rising cost of providing employee healthcare benefits. 
In the first Trump administration, individual coverage health 
reimbursement arrangements, known as ICHRAs, were made 
available to employers to offer flexible tax-advantaged health 
insurance coverage by allowing them to reimburse employees for 
the cost of premiums for their individual health coverage. 
Offering flexible, affordable healthcare insurance plans will 
increase the attraction of small businesses when competing with 
larger companies for talent. And even at the state level, 
lawmakers today are incentivizing small businesses to adopt 
ICHRAs.
    H.R. 5498, the Small Business Health Options Awareness Act, 
is a common-sense bill that enhances the Trump administration's 
efforts to expand affordable healthcare options to small 
businesses by leveraging existing outreach programs to educate 
small business on how ICHRAs offer competitive health benefits. 
This bill supports the administration's efforts to increase 
affordability in all sectors by giving employees of small 
businesses affordable healthcare options. I urge my colleagues 
to vote yes on H.R. 5498 as amended, and I yield back.
    Does anyone wish to offer an amendment to the amendment on 
the nature of a substitute?
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. I do, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. For what purpose does the gentlelady 
seek recognition?
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. I have an amendment at the desk.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. There is an amendment at the desk. We 
will briefly pause while staff distribute the amendment. Okay, 
the clerk will report the amendment.
    The CLERK. Amendment to the amendment in the nature of a 
substitute to H.R. 54----
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection the amendment is 
considered as read. I now recognize Ms. Scholten from the great 
state of Michigan for 5 minutes on the amendment.
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. Mr. Chairman, thank you so much. I couldn't 
agree more with your statements. Back home in Michigan too, the 
number one thing that I hear about when visiting from small 
businesses is their deep concerns over the costs of healthcare, 
especially employee-provided healthcare. Finding the right 
health insurance can be incredibly complicated. Having the 
wrong health insurance is costly. Small businesses should have 
access to every tool, every option available to them and their 
employees so that there is no question that the Small Business 
Administration should be playing a role in educating business 
owners about their coverage. I like this idea.
    However, the approach taken in H.R. 5498, the Small 
Business Health Options Awareness Act, emphasis on options is 
incomplete. The bill would require the SBA to provide 
information on one and only one healthcare option: the 
Individual Coverage Health Reimbursement Accounts, or ICHRAs. 
Through ICHRAs, employers can reimburse their employees for 
qualified healthcare costs. While this option may be useful for 
some employers, it is by no means a silver bullet to the larger 
problem within our healthcare system.
    For example, some individuals who, who may qualify for 
ICHRAs would be ineligible for other healthcare coverage such 
as the Affordable Care Act premium tax credits. By requiring 
the SBA to inform entrepreneurs about this option at the 
expense of other coverage plans, this bill pushes a program 
that won't work for many entrepreneurs. As a Member of this 
committee, we are all too familiar with the pitfalls of a one-
size-fits-all approach, and we should be wary of legislation 
like this that stands no chance of addressing the diverse 
challenges that small businesses face.
    So let's, let's do it. Let's have the SBA inform small 
business owners of their options, all their options, when it 
comes to healthcare. And if this program is the best, if it is 
one that all the employers want to choose, then there would be 
no problem. We'll see how great it is and undoubtedly how many 
will choose it. My amendment is simple. It would require the 
SBA to share information on healthcare options in general 
without putting one particular plan over the other. It is 
because our business owners deserve options that work best for 
their unique needs. And I think we all hear from businesses in 
our district that are struggling to care for their workers and 
sustain this operation.
    So let's focus our efforts on giving our small businesses 
the flexibility and the options the information that they need 
to choose what's best for them. I urge my colleagues to support 
this amendment, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Is there 
further debate on the amendment?
    Ms. Van Duyne, recognized for 5 minutes.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. I very much appreciate that. Again, you 
know, the amendment that is being put on the table basically 
guts my original bill by removing the entire focus on the 
ICHRAs and replacing it with vague healthcare outreach 
language. The purpose of this legislation is to address a 
specific awareness gap for small businesses about the ICHRAs, 
not create a broad new healthcare communications mandate for 
SBA. ACA exchanges and Medicaid already receive extensive 
federal outreach and taxpayer-funded promotion. It is already 
happening. It is been happening for years. ICHRAs do not, which 
is exactly why this bill was introduced. I urge my colleagues 
to support the bill, and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    Is there further debate on the amendment?
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. Mr. Chairman, I would just like to add that 
if we are going to urge the SBA into a brand new arena of 
informing small businesses about their healthcare options, the 
bill's title needs to live up to its name and provide all of 
those options to small businesses. Currently, the SBA is not 
involved in informing their partners, their participants, about 
healthcare options. Forcing it to only inform them about one 
option does not give them the full picture.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    Is there further debate on the amendment?
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Mr. Chairman?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Ranking Member is recognized for 5 
minutes.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. I support Ms. Scholten's amendment. I think 
that is straightforward. Why are people so afraid of providing 
information and let the people that are going to be benefiting 
from it, the ability to make an informed decision by explaining 
what are the options that they have in front of them? Why do we 
have to push for only one option? That could be--that will make 
some of them ineligible. So I ask my colleagues to support the 
amendment. Thank you.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Is there 
further debate on the amendment?
    Mr. STAUBER. Mr. Chair?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Mr. Stauber is recognized for 5 minutes.
    Mr. STAUBER. I want to yield some of my time to 
Representative Van Duyne.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you very much.
    Ms. Scholten, I would be more than happy to entertain if 
you want to change the name of the bill. I would have loved to 
have changed the name of the bill of the Affordable Care Act, 
which is anything but, or the Inflation Reduction Act, which 
was anything but. So if you would like to support a different 
name for the bill, let me hear it. Thank you. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    The gentleman yields back?
    Mr. STAUBER. I yield back, yes.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back. Is there 
further debate on the amendment?
    Mr. CISNEROS. Mr. Chairman, I would like to be recognized.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman's recognized.
    Mr. CISNEROS. I would like to yield some time, yield my 
time to Ms. Slotkin. Scholten, sorry.
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. Happens all the time. If the title is what 
you're concerned about, Ms. Van Duyne, we can change it to the 
ICHRA Information Act, which would be a more apt description of 
what you're trying to do here. But I think the overall purpose 
of what you're trying to accomplish is actually noble. And as 
the number one issue that small businesses are struggling with 
right now, healthcare affordability, we absolutely should be 
encouraging the SBA to provide them with all options, but 
that's not what this bill does. And so it is confusing, it is 
misleading to our small businesses, and that's not what we 
should be in the business of doing. The amendment is very 
simple. Let's just provide it with all the options and they can 
choose the best one for them. Thank you.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back?
    Mr. CISNEROS. I would just like to say, Mr. Chairman, that 
I too, also support this amendment. And again, if it is 
important for us to provide everybody with all the information 
possible on all the health care plans available. So why not? 
You know, if the SBA is going to provide information on this, 
provide all the information that's out there possible to all 
the programs that are available. And with that, I support this 
amendment and I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. Is there further debate on the 
amendment?
    Recognize Mr. Schmidt.
    Mr. SCHMIDT. No, it is fine.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay, is there further debate on the 
amendment? Okay.
    Thank you, Ms. Scholten, for offering an amendment to this 
legislation.
    However, I urge my colleagues to vote no on this amendment. 
I yield back. The question now occurs on the amendment offered 
by the gentlelady from Michigan.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the noes have it, and the 
amendment is not agreed to.
    Ms. SCHOLTEN. Mr. Chairman, I request a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote is requested, and a roll 
call vote is ordered. Further proceedings on the amendment and 
the bill are postponed. Are there additional amendments?
    Ms. MORRISON. Mr. Chair, I would like to be recognized.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. For what purpose does the gentlelady 
seek recognition?
    Ms. MORRISON. Mr. Chair, I have an amendment at the desk.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. There is an amendment at the desk. We 
will briefly pause while staff distribute the amendment. The 
clerk will report the amendment.
    The CLERK. Amendment to the amendment in the nature of a 
substitute to H.R. 5498.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment is 
considered as read. I now recognize Dr. Morrison from the great 
state of Minnesota for 5 minutes on the amendment.
    Ms. MORRISON. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. My amendment 
adds the requirement that when the Small Business 
Administration and Small Business Development Centers are 
publicizing or posting information about individual coverage 
health reimbursement arrangements or Insurance Coverage 
Replacements, or ICHRAs, on their website, they must include a 
notice explaining to small businesses that ICHRAs may prevent 
employees from accessing premium tax credits under the 
Affordable Care Act marketplace for which they would otherwise 
be eligible.
    Small businesses and their employees should be provided 
with all pertinent information so they can make informed 
choices for themselves and their families. I want to stress 
that many people receive worse health care coverage under 
ICHRAs and that their use can make people ineligible for 
premium tax credits that can be used for more comprehensive and 
affordable coverage. Additionally, ICHRAs may lead to 
healthcare discrimination against certain employees and push 
other healthcare costs even further by adding higher-risk, 
part-time, and older employees to the exchange while reserving 
better healthcare options for top executives.
    As a physician, I know how crucial having access to 
affordable health insurance is to keeping people healthy and 
the overall integrity of our healthcare system. In addition to 
ICHRAs being an unproven creation of the Trump administration 
with little initial data to support the idea that they save 
costs, with the chaos and instability caused by the so-called 
One Big Beautiful Bill, insurance markets have been further 
destabilized and premiums have skyrocketed, making ICHRAs an 
even less secure option for coverage. We should be working 
together to ensure that small businesses have access to 
information about all types of healthcare coverage so they can 
make the choice that's best for them, not putting them at 
greater risk for inadequate coverage.
    I urge my colleagues to vote in favor of this amendment to 
ensure the Small Business Administration is providing small 
businesses with the relevant information they need to make 
informed decisions about their healthcare coverage. Thank you, 
Mr. Chair, I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
    Is there further debate on the amendment?
    I now recognize Ms. Van Duyne from Texas for 5 minutes.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. This 
amendment is one-sided and extraordinarily misleading because 
it highlights only potential subsidy impacts while ignoring the 
benefits of employer-sponsored coverage flexibility under 
ICHRAS. It also implicitly pushes employees toward remaining on 
subsidized ACA coverage instead of employer-supported coverage 
options. Further, ACA premium subsidies have been repeatedly 
identified as vulnerable to improper payments, eligibility 
issues, and fraud. Congress, GAO, and the HHS OIG have all 
raised concerns about inefficient income verification and 
improper enrollment practices from the ACA subsidy structure.
    Rather than helping small businesses offer coverage, this 
amendment appears focused on steering individuals toward 
taxpayer-funded ACA subsidies, a system that has faced repeated 
concerns over improper payments, eligibility issues, and fraud. 
I urge my clients not to support this amendment, and I yield 
back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Is there any 
further debate on the amendment?
    I now recognize the Ranking Member from New York, Ms. 
Velazquez, for 5 minutes.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. No one can deny in this committee that small 
businesses are struggling with the rising cost of healthcare, 
if they can provide it. And this is a crisis that has been 
manufactured by this administration by enacting the policies 
that they have implemented. So small businesses and their 
employees are struggling with healthcare costs. And with this 
affordability crisis, small businesses and their employees need 
all the pertinent information. They need to know that their 
employees could be worse off with ICHRA, and they need to know 
that their use could make them ineligible for the premium tax 
credit that they will provide that will provide more generous 
and affordable coverage.
    By directing SBA to provide information only on ICHRAs, 
while failing to disclose that accepting an ICHRA could make 
them ineligible for Premium Tax Credit, is misleading and, 
quite frankly, problematic. Omitting that information risks 
steering small businesses away from coverage options that might 
be more affordable and generous. That is why I strongly support 
the amendment offered by my colleague, Dr. Morrison, which will 
require SBA to include a notice explaining that individuals may 
lose access to the premium tax credits in the marketplace. I 
urge all my colleagues to support it. I yield back.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Is there 
further debate on the amendment? All right. Seeing none, I 
would like to recognize myself on this amendment.
    I appreciate Dr. Morrison's amendment to this legislation. 
However, I urge my colleagues to vote no. I yield back.
    The question now occurs on the amendment offered by the 
gentlelady from Minnesota.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the noes have it.
    Ms. MORRISON. Mr. Chair, I would like a recorded vote, 
please.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A Member requests a recorded vote. A 
recorded vote has been requested, and a roll call vote is 
ordered. Further proceedings on the amendment in the bill are 
postponed. And are there any additional amendments to the 
amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 5498?
    Seeing none that concludes the consideration of legislation 
for today's markup.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Excuse me, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes, ma'am.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. I request a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote is requested, and the 
committee will stand in recess.
    Okay, the committee will stand in recess subject to the 
call of the Chair. Members, please return at 4:05 to resume 
consideration of the bills and amendments on which roll call 
votes were requested and postponed.
    [Recess.]
    Chairman WILLIAMS. All right, this committee will now come 
to order, and we will resume consideration of the bills on 
which roll call votes were requested and postponed. We will 
begin with H.R. 4238. The question now occurs in order on H.R. 
4238 as amended, reported favorably to the House.
    The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any Members who have not voted or wish to change 
their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk 
will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Motion agreed to, and H.R. 4238 is 
amended and will be reported favorably to the House.
    Question now occurs in order on H.R. 8879, reported 
favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and 
the clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay, the motion is agreed to, and H.R. 
8879 will be reported favorably to the House.
    Question now occurs in order to H.R. 1826 as amended, 
reported favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any Members who have not voted or wish to change 
their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk 
will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are zero.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 826 as 
amended will be reported favorably to the House.
    The question now occurs in order in H.R. 8880, reported 
favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    [The vote was taken.]
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any of the Members who have 
not voted or wish to change their vote? If not, the clerk will 
close the vote. What? Are there any other Members
    besides Alford who have not voted or would not change their 
vote?
    Okay, if not, the clerk will close the vote. The clerk will 
report.
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion agreed to, and H.R. 8880 will 
be reported favorably to the House.
    Question now occurs in ordering H.R. 8881 reported 
favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote, and 
the clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to, and H.R. 8881 
will be reported favorably to the House.
    The question now occurs on ordering H.R. 8882 reported 
favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and 
the clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 882 
will be reported favorably to the House.
    Question now occurs on ordering H.R. 915 reported favorably 
to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and 
the clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 915 
will be reported favorably to the House.
    The question now occurs on ordering H.R. 2804 as amended, 
reported favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote. The 
clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 23 and 
the noes are 0.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. All right, the motion is agreed to, and 
H.R. 2804, as amended, will be reported favorably to the House.
    Okay, we will now take the proposed votes on H.R. 5498. 
Okay, the question is on the adoption of the amendment to the 
amendment in the nature of the substitute offered by Ms. 
Scholten to H.R. 5498.
    The clerk will report the vote. I'm sorry, will open the 
vote.
    Are there any of the Members who have not voted? It's too 
late.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Wake up.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. It's too late. Okay. Are there any other 
Members besides Cisneros who have not voted or wish to change 
their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk 
will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 11 and 
the noes are 12.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay, the amendment is not agreed to.
    The question is on the adoption of the amendment to the 
amendment in the nature of a substitute offered by Dr. Morrison 
to H.R. 5498. The clerk will open the vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and 
the clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 11 and 
the noes are 12.
    Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Are you sure?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. You want a recount? I mean, nobody's 
voting over there on your side.
    The amendment is not agreed to.
    Okay, the question now occurs on the adoption of the 
amendment in the nature of a substitute offered by 
Representative Van Dyne to H.R. 5498.
    All those in favor say aye.
    Opposed? All those say nay.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it. The 
amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 5498 is 
adopted.
    Now the question is now on favorably reporting H.R. 5498 as 
amended to the House.
    All those in favor say aye.
    All those opposed say no.
    In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it, and H.R. 
5498 as amended----
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. Mr. Chair?
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes.
    Ms. VAN DUYNE. I'd like to request a recorded vote.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay, a recorded vote has been 
requested. A roll call vote is ordered. The clerk will open the 
vote.
    Are there any other Members who have not voted or wish to 
change their vote? If not, the clerk will close the vote and 
the clerk will report.
    [The vote was taken.]
    The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 13 and 
the noes are 11.
    Chairman WILLIAMS. All right, the motion is agreed to, and 
H.R. 5498 as amended will be reported favorably to the House.
    If there's no further business, this concludes today's 
markup. Without objection, the committee staff has authorized 
to make technical and conforming changes, and Members have two 
business days to file additional supplemental dissenting 
minority views. I want to thank all of you for being here 
today. Without objection, we live in the greatest country in 
the world. The committee stands adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 4:19 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]
                            
                            A P P E N D I X

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