[House Hearing, 119 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]




                   LEGISLATIVE PROPOSALS TO SUPPORT PATIENT
                        ACCESS TO MEDICARE SERVICES

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                         SUBCOMMITTEE ON HEALTH

                                 OF THE

                    COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE
                        HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________


                            JANUARY 8, 2026

                               __________


                           Serial No. 119-51






                 [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]





     Published for the use of the Committee on Energy and Commerce

                   govinfo.gov/committee/house-energy
                        energycommerce.house.gov

                               ______
                                 

                 U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE

62-884 PDF                WASHINGTON : 2026










                    COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE

                        BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky
                                 Chairman

ROBERT E. LATTA, Ohio                FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey
H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia           Ranking Member
GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida            DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado
RICHARD HUDSON, North Carolina       JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois
EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, Georgia    DORIS O. MATSUI, California
GARY J. PALMER, Alabama              KATHY CASTOR, Florida
NEAL P. DUNN, Florida, Vice          PAUL TONKO, New York
    Chairman                         YVETTE D. CLARKE, New York
DAN CRENSHAW, Texas                  RAUL RUIZ, California
JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania             SCOTT H. PETERS, California
RANDY K. WEBER, Sr., Texas           DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan
RICK W. ALLEN, Georgia               MARC A. VEASEY, Texas
TROY BALDERSON, Ohio                 ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
RUSS FULCHER, Idaho                  NANETTE DIAZ BARRAGAN, California
AUGUST PFLUGER, Texas                DARREN SOTO, Florida
DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee         KIM SCHRIER, Washington
MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa       LORI TRAHAN, Massachusetts
KAT CAMMACK, Florida                 LIZZIE FLETCHER, Texas
JAY OBERNOLTE, California            ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ, New York
JOHN JAMES, Michigan                 JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, Massachusetts
CLIFF BENTZ, Oregon                  TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
ERIN HOUCHIN, Indiana                ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey
RUSSELL FRY, South Carolina          KEVIN MULLIN, California
LAUREL M. LEE, Florida               GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
NICHOLAS A. LANGWORTHY, New York     JENNIFER L. McCLELLAN, Virginia
THOMAS H. KEAN, Jr., New Jersey
MICHAEL A. RULLI, Ohio
GABE EVANS, Colorado
CRAIG A. GOLDMAN, Texas
JULIE FEDORCHAK, North Dakota
                                 ------                                

                           Professional Staff

                     MEGAN JACKSON, Staff Director
                SOPHIE KHANAHMADI, Deputy Staff Director
               TIFFANY GUARASCIO, Minority Staff Director
                         Subcommittee on Health

                      H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia
                                 Chairman

DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee, Vice 
    Chair
GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida            DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado
EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, Georgia      Ranking Member
NEAL P. DUNN, Florida                RAUL RUIZ, California
DAN CRENSHAW, Texas                  DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan
JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania             ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
TROY BALDERSON, Ohio                 NANETTE DIAZ BARRAGAN, California
MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa       KIM SCHRIER, Washington
KAT CAMMACK, Florida                 LORI TRAHAN, Massachusetts
JAY OBERNOLTE, California            MARC A. VEASEY, Texas
JOHN JAMES, Michigan                 LIZZIE FLETCHER, Texas
CLIFF BENTZ, Oregon                  ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ, New York
ERIN HOUCHIN, Indiana                JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, Massachusetts
NICHOLAS A. LANGWORTHY, New York     TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
THOMAS H. KEAN, Jr., New Jersey      GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
MICHAEL A. RULLI, Ohio               FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey (ex 
BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky (ex              officio)
    officio)









                             C O N T E N T S

                              ----------                              
                                                                   Page
Hon. H. Morgan Griffith, a Representative in Congress from the 
  Commonwealth of Virginia, opening statement....................     2
    Prepared statement...........................................     4
Hon. Diana DeGette, a Representative in Congress from the State 
  of Colorado, opening statement.................................     7
    Prepared statement...........................................     9
Hon. Brett Guthrie, a Representative in Congress from the 
  Commonwealth of Kentucky, opening statement....................    11
    Prepared statement...........................................    13
Hon. Frank Pallone, Jr., a Representative in Congress from the 
  State of New Jersey, opening statement.........................    16
    Prepared statement...........................................    18

                               Witnesses

Susan Van Meter, President, American Clinical Laboratory 
  Association....................................................    20
    Prepared statement...........................................    23
Connie Sullivan, President and Chief Executive Officer, National 
  Home Infusion Association......................................    37
    Prepared statement...........................................    39
Tom Ryan, President and Chief Executive Officer, American 
  Association for Homecare.......................................    52
    Prepared statement...........................................    54
    Additional material submitted for the record.................    64
    Answers to submitted questions...............................   314
David Lipschutz, Co-Director/Attorney, Center for Medicare 
  Advocacy.......................................................    82
    Prepared statement...........................................    84

                             Legislation\1\

H.R. 1703, Choices for Increased Mobility Act of 2025
H.R. 2005, DMEPOS Relief Act of 2025
H.R. 2172, Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act
H.R. 2477, Portable Ultrasound Reimbursement Equity Act of 2025
H.R. 2902, Supplemental Oxygen Access Reform (SOAR) Act of 2025
H.R. 5243, To amend title XVIII of the Social Security Act to 
  increase data transparency for supplemental benefits under 
  Medicare Advantage
H.R. 5269, Reforming and Enhancing Sustainable Updates to 
  Laboratory Testing Services (RESULTS) Act of 2025
H.R. 5347, Health Care Efficiency Through Flexibility Act
H.R. 6210, Senior Savings Protection Act
H.R. 6361, Ban AI Denials in Medicare Act

                           Submitted Material

Inclusion of the following was approved by unanimous consent.
List of documents submitted for the record.......................   150
Letter of January 6, 2026, from Daniel Buning, Chief Executive 
  Officer, TridentCare, to Mr. Guthrie, et al....................   153
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Dominick V. Spatafora, President, 
  Neuropathy Action Foundation, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette..   155

                              ----------

\1\ The bills have been retained in committee files and are available 
at https://docs.house.gov/Committee/Calendar/
ByEvent.aspx?EventID=118798.
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Marc Yale, Research and Policy 
  Advisor, International Pemphigus & Pemphigoid Foundation, to 
  Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette...................................   157
Statement of AHIP, January 8, 2026...............................   159
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Anders Gilberg, Senior Vice 
  President, Government Affairs, Medical Group Management 
  Association, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette...................   162
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Wayne Grau, Executive Director, 
  National Coalition for Assistive & Rehab Technology, to Mr. 
  Griffith and Ms. DeGette.......................................   164
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Beth Gore, Chief Executive 
  Officer, Oley Foundation, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette......   166
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Luba Sobolevsky, President and 
  Chief Executive Officer, and Amy E. Clarke, Chief Clinical 
  Officer, Immunoglobulin National Society, to Mr. Griffith and 
  Ms. DeGette....................................................   167
Letter of January 7, 2026, from the Council for Quality 
  Respiratory Care to Mr. Guthrie, et al.........................   169
Letter January 7, 2026, from Tom Ryan, President and Chief 
  Executive Officer, American Association for Homecare, to Mr. 
  Griffith and Ms. DeGette.......................................   173
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Sara Struwe, President and Chief 
  Executive Officer, Spina Bifida Association, to Mr. Griffith 
  and Ms. DeGette................................................   175
Letter of January 7, 2026, from the Academy of Cardiovascular & 
  Pulmonary Physical Therapy, et al., to Mr. Griffith, Ms. 
  DeGette, and Subcommittee Members..............................   177
Statement of the American Lung Association by Harold P. Wimmer, 
  President and Chief Executive Officer, January 8, 2026.........   180
Statement of the Advanced Medical Technology Association, January 
  8, 2026........................................................   182
April 1, 2025, letter from the Independence Through Enhancement 
  of Medicare and Medicaid (ITEM) Coalition, to Mrs. Miller-
  Meeks, et al...................................................   184
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Shane Bare, Roan Mountain, TN, to 
  Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette...................................   187
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Alicia Barron, Executive 
  Director, Infusion Access Foundation, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. 
  DeGette........................................................   189
Letter of November 19, 2025, from Alliance for Aging Research, et 
  al., to Hon. Mike Johnson, Speaker of the House, et al.........   191
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Jen Brull, Board Chair, American 
  Academy of Family Physicians, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette..   194
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Brian Scarpelli, Executive 
  Director, Connected Health Initiative, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. 
  DeGette........................................................   202
Letter of January 8, 2026, from Tom Kraus, American Society of 
  Health-System Pharmacists, to Mr. Griffith and Ms. DeGette.....   206
Article of December 4, 2025, ``2025 KFF Marketplace Enrollees 
  Survey,'' by Lunna Lopes, et al., Kaiser Family Foundation\1\
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Nancy A. LeaMond, Executive Vice 
  President and Chief Advocacy & Engagement Officer, AARP, to 
  Hon. Mike Johnson, Speaker of the House, and Hakeem Jeffries, 
  House Minority Leader..........................................   210
Article of September 30, 2025, ``ACA Marketplace Premium Payments 
  Would More than Double on Average Next Year if Enhanced Premium 
  Tax Credits Expire,'' by Justin Lo, et al., Kaiser Family 
  Foundation.....................................................   212
Statement of the American College of Physicians, January 8, 2026.   221
Press release of December 10, 2025, ``ACS CAN Urges Congress to 
  Immediately Extend the Enhanced Premium Tax Credits to Avoid a 
  Health Care Affordability Crisis,'' American Cancer Society 
  Cancer Action Network..........................................   223
Article of September 11, 2025, ``Congress Must Preserve Access to 
  Affordable Marketplace Coverage,'' by Lindsay Copeland, 
  Medicare Rights Center.........................................   224
Article of October 15, 2025, ``Damage From Inaction On ACA Tax 
  Credits Has Begun And Will Grow With Further Delays,'' by Jason 
  Levitis, et al., Medicare Policy Initiative....................   229

                              ----------

\2\ The article has been retained in committee files and is included in 
the Documents for the Record at https://docs.house.gov/meetings/IF/
IF14/20260108/118798/HHRG-119-IF14-20260108-SD003.pdf.
Article of October 2025, ``Eligibility Cliff on ACA Tax Credits 
  Would Make Health Care Unaffordable for Middle-Class 
  Families,'' by Jason Levitis, et al., Urban Institute..........   239
Fact Sheet of the Center for Medicare Advocacy, ``The Affordable 
  Care Act (ACA) Helps Medicare''................................   247
Fact Sheet of the American Hospital Association, ``Enhanced 
  Premium Tax Credits,'' July 2025...............................   248
Article of November 3, 2025, ``Health Insurance Premium Spikes 
  Imminent as Tax Credit Enhancements Set to Expire,'' Center on 
  Budget and Policy Priorities...................................   250
Letter of January 7, 2026, from Elizabeth S. Watson, Director of 
  Federal Government Affairs, American Federation of State, 
  County and Municipal Employees, to Representatives.............   263
Article of December 4, 2025, ``How to Evaluate Proposals to 
  Address Expiring Premium Tax Credit Enhancements,'' by Jennifer 
  Sullivan, Center on Budget and Policy Priorities...............   264
Article of December 12, 2025, ``Older Adults Face Spike in Health 
  Insurance Costs as ACA Tax Credits Expire,'' AARP..............   267
Letter of September 15, 2025, from American Medical Association, 
  et al., to House Speaker Mike Johnson, et al...................   276
Article of July 29, 2025, ``Marketplace Enrollees Tell Congress: 
  Extend the Enhanced Premium Tax Credits,'' by Claire Heyison, 
  Center on Budget and Policy Priorities.........................   279
Letter of November 18, 2025, from Jon Godfread, President, 
  National Association of Insurance Commissioners, et al., to 
  Senate Majority Leader John Thune, et al.......................   283
Article of October 30, 2025, ``Older Adults at Risk if ACA 
  Subsidies Expire,'' by Lindsey Copeland, Medicare Rights Center   285
Article of January 5, 2026, ``Policy Changes Bring Renewed Focus 
  on High-Deductible Health Plans,'' by Michelle Long, et al., 
  Kaiser Family Foundation.......................................   289
Article of December 4, 2025, ``Poll: 1 in 3 ACA Marketplace 
  Enrollees Say They Would `Very Likely' Shop for a Cheaper Plan 
  If Their Premium Payments Doubled; 1 in 4 Say They `Very 
  Likely' Would Go Without Insurance,'' Kaiser Family Foundation.   300
Letter of August 21, 2024, from Alpha-1 Foundation, et al., to 
  House Speaker Mike Johnson, et al..............................   305
Letter of December 11, 2025, from Ramsey Alwin, President and 
  Chief Executive Officer, National Council on Aging, to Hon. 
  Lisa Blunt Rochester, et al....................................   308
Article of November 5, 2025, ``The Importance of Premium Tax 
  Credits: Affording Health Insurance Coast to Coast,'' Families 
  USA............................................................   312









 
                  LEGISLATIVE PROPOSALS TO SUPPORT PATIENT
                       ACCESS TO MEDICARE SERVICES

                              ----------                              


                       THURSDAY, JANUARY 8, 2026,

                  House of Representatives,
                            Subcommittee on Health,
                          Committee on Energy and Commerce,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10:20 a.m., in 
the John D. Dingell Room 2123, Rayburn House Office Building, 
Hon. H. Morgan Griffith (chairman of the subcommittee) 
presiding.
    Members present: Representatives Griffith, Harshbarger, 
Bilirakis, Carter of Georgia, Crenshaw, Joyce, Balderson, 
Miller-Meeks, Cammack, Obernolte, Bentz, Houchin, Langworthy, 
Kean, Rulli, Guthrie (ex officio), DeGette (subcommittee 
ranking member), Ruiz, Dingell, Barragan, Schrier, Trahan, 
Veasey, Fletcher, Ocasio-Cortez, Auchincloss, Carter of 
Louisiana, Landsman, and Pallone (ex officio).
    Also present: Representatives Evans, Matsui, and McClellan.
    Staff present: Christian Calvert, Press Assistant, Press; 
Jessica Donlon, General Counsel; Sydney Greene, Director of 
Finance and Logistics; Jay Gulshen, Chief Counsel, Health; 
Annabelle Huffman, Clerk, Health; Megan Jackson, Staff 
Director; AT Johnson, Special Advisor; Sophie Khanahmadi, 
Deputy Staff Director; Sarah Meier, Counsel and 
Parliamentarian; Joel Miller, Chief Counsel; Seth Ricketts, 
Special Assistant; Chris Sarley, Member Services/Stakeholder 
Director; Timothy Trimble, Staff Assistant; Matt VanHyfte, 
Communications Director; Nick Wooldridge, Professional Staff 
Member, Health; Lydia Abma, Minority Policy Analyst; Jacquelyn 
Bolen, Minority Counsel; Keegan Cardman, Minority Staff 
Assistant; Tiffany Guarascio, Minority Staff Director; Jackson 
Hall, Minority Intern; Perry Hamilton, Minority Deputy 
Director, Member Services and Outreach; Brent Langellier, 
Minority Health Fellow; Una Lee, Minority Chief Counsel, 
Health; Andrew Souvall, Minority Director of Communications, 
Outreach, and Member Services; Hannah Treger, Minority Staff 
Assistant; and Laurel Uhomba, Minority Health Fellow.
    Mr. Griffith. The subcommittee will come to order.
    The Chair recognizes himself for 5 minutes for an opening 
statement.

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, A REPRESENTATIVE 
         IN CONGRESS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF VIRGINIA

    In today's hearing, we will discuss 10 bills aimed at 
improving patient access in Medicare. As our population ages, 
it is critical that Medicare policies keep pace with patient 
needs. Ensuring beneficiaries can obtain timely, cost-effective 
services is essential to fulfilling Medicare's promise.
    A handful of bills we are discussing today help increase 
access to durable medical equipment, or DME, which include 
wheelchairs, oxygen equipment, walkers, diabetic supplies, just 
to name a few. However, the way Medicare reimburses for these 
products can be improved.
    Dr. Joyce from Pennsylvania is leading H.R. 1703, the 
Choices for Increased Mobility Act, which creates a new billing 
code to improve Medicare coverage for ultra-lightweight 
wheelchairs, particularly those made from titanium or carbon 
fiber. Currently, an individual must pay full price for the 
upgrade to a lighter, more functional wheelchair and then hope 
to get reimbursed by Medicare later. This bill would allow 
Medicare to cover a portion of the cost upfront to ease the 
financial burden on individuals.
    Another bill, H.R. 2477, the Portable Ultrasound 
Reimbursement Equity Act, led by Representative Van Duyne from 
Texas, provides Medicare reimbursement for portable ultrasound 
transportation and services, which will help seniors get the 
care they need.
    Representative Miller-Meeks from Iowa champions H.R. 2005. 
The DMEPOS, also known as DMEPOS Relief Act, would establish a 
fairer rate for DME supplies. The way DME products get priced 
is through a process known as competitive bidding. This is 
where DME suppliers bid to be the sole contractor in a certain 
area of the country, with the winning bid prices used to 
determine supplier reimbursement. These prices are not one-
size-fits-all, and suppliers, especially in some areas, 
struggle to stay open due to these low rates. This bill aims to 
help mitigate that impact.
    The last bill in the DME space is H.R. 2902, the 
Supplemental Oxygen Access Reform Act, led by Representative 
Valadao from California. Among other things, this bill removes 
supplemental oxygen and its supplies from the competitive 
bidding program, and creates a new reimbursement rate for 
supplemental and liquid oxygen.
    We will also be considering H.R. 2172, the Preserving 
Patient Access to Home Infusion Act, led by Representative 
Buchanan from Florida. This bill would make updates to the home 
infusion therapy benefit and support patient access to this 
benefit. The current reimbursement structure is not aligned 
with how these therapies are currently administered in the 
home. This bill will modernize the model, ensure adequate 
provider reimbursement, and support patient access to home 
infusions.
    Another bill being considered today is H.R. 5269, the 
Reforming and Enhancing Sustainable Updates to Laboratory 
Testing Services Act, led by our own Richard Hudson from North 
Carolina. This bill would update how CMS establishes 
reimbursement rates for clinical laboratory services paid under 
Medicare Clinical Lab Fee Schedule. This important bill aims to 
create a less burdensome process for CMS to determine private 
payer-based rates for lab services.
    A few other bills being considered today include H.R. 5243, 
led by Representative McClellan from Virginia, that brings more 
transparency in the supplemental benefits provided by Medicare 
Advantage plans.
    The Healthcare Efficiency Through Flexibility Act, also led 
by Representative Buchanan--this bill would extend certain 
methods for collecting Accountable Care Organizations' quality 
measurement data as well as establish a digital quality measure 
pilot program.
    H.R. 6210, the Senior Savings Protection Act, led by 
Representative Matsui from California, reauthorizes and funds 
certain programs under the Medicare Improvements for Patients 
and Providers Act. These programs help low-income beneficiaries 
understand and access their benefits.
    Lastly, we will discuss H.R. 6361, the Ban AI Denials in 
Medicare Act, led by Representative Landsman from Ohio. This 
bill prohibits the Center for Medicare and Medicaid Innovation, 
or CMMI, from implementing the Wasteful and Inappropriate 
Service Reduction model, or the WISeR model. While I understand 
the concerns around AI and prior authorization, the CMMI 
statutory mission is to lower healthcare costs and improve 
outcomes for patients. The WISeR model does not change Medicare 
coverage policy but will focus on ensuring that, for a set of 
nonemergency services, seniors are getting safe, effective, and 
appropriate care.
    I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today and 
working to advance these bills to a markup.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Griffith follows:] 

[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

    Mr. Griffith. I now recognize the subcommittee ranking 
member, Representative DeGette, for 5 minutes for an opening 
statement. Representative DeGette.

 OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. DIANA DeGETTE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN 
              CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF COLORADO

    Ms. DeGette. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. And I will 
say I am glad that this committee is finally having another 
hearing, and I am glad we are bringing up some bills that 
overall we can agree on in a bipartisan way, but I hate to tell 
you: Rome is still burning. Alarm bells have been ringing for 
healthcare affordability for months. And with the expiration of 
enhanced premium tax credits at the end of 2025, we knew that 
premiums would skyrocket in 2026.
    Millions of Americans who get health insurance through the 
ACA were notified last year that their premiums were doubling 
or more. They are now trying to figure out how to pay for 
coverage this year or if they are going to take the terrifying 
step of going without insurance that has become too expensive, 
and they are also wondering if Congress will finally step in to 
save them from these skyrocketing premiums.
    In my district, for example, a family of four making 
$128,000 a year--this is teachers, nurses, farmers, small 
business owners--got hit with an average $14,000 increase in 
their Silver plan premiums, but the majority has done nothing 
to help.
    Now, enhanced premium tax credits aren't, on their own, the 
long-term fix for healthcare affordability that we need, but 
they have been a critical part of lowering premiums since we 
passed them during COVID, and they have expanded healthcare 
coverage even more than we expected. So, while Republicans let 
the Federal tax credits expire, States like Colorado--but not 
all States--have stepped in with a short-term fix. But States 
like Florida and Texas, they might be forced to pay more than 
20 percent of their income in healthcare premiums, if they keep 
insurance at all.
    This crisis did not appear overnight. For over a year, the 
Democrats on this subcommittee and everyday Americans have been 
warning Donald Trump and the majority about the healthcare 
affordability crisis and the impending expiration of the tax 
cuts. We asked for hearings to consider legislation and to do 
something--anything--to be able to help people afford their 
health insurance.
    But rather than have a serious conversation about 
affordability, the majority wasted precious time on legislation 
that will only raise costs and kick people off their coverage. 
Instead of extending premium tax credits, meaningfully lowering 
healthcare costs, or expanding access to affordable coverage, 
Republicans' Big, Bad Bill that they spent the first half of 
the year passing sent 15 million people to cause their health 
insurance--to lose their health insurance so that they could 
pay for tax breaks for the ultra-wealthy. And now the 
Republicans are doing everything they can to ignore the 
necessity of extending ACA premium subsidies and lowering 
costs.
    Democrats literally had to force the majority to bring up 
the tax credit extension for a vote this week because--at the 
same time Republicans are bringing up bills to police shower 
heads. Also, they are trying to change the subject to House 
savings accounts and, really, abortion restrictions. For once, 
I would encourage the majority to take Donald Trump's advice.
    Just this week, Donald Trump implored congressional 
Republicans to, quote, ``be flexible on abortion restrictions 
so we can actually focus on lowering costs.''
    Only time will tell if the majority will listen, but I am 
not too hopeful. They have completely avoided the topic of 
affordability, canceling town halls, holding as few Health 
Subcommittee hearings as possible, and simply allowing the 
crisis to unfold, which is why Democrats, with the help of four 
GOP members who are actually listening to the three-quarters of 
Americans who support extending the tax credits have stepped up 
to bypass the Speaker and put a 3-year enhanced ACA subsidy 
extension on the House floor which will be voted on later 
today. The extension will cut premium spikes by 80 percent on 
average. It will wipe out increases for lower-income families. 
It will save 5 million people from losing their insurance. 
While short term, it is a straightforward fix.
    To those watching at home, I will say this: If your 
Representative truly wants to lower your healthcare costs, they 
will vote in favor of this bill on the floor later today. If 
your Senators truly want to lower your insurance premiums, they 
will vote in favor of this bill when it goes to the Senate. And 
if President Trump truly wants to put money in your pockets, he 
will sign this bill into law. Republicans refused to act last 
year, and now we will see if they have the backbone to truly 
help lower costs.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. DeGette follows:] 

[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

    Ms. DeGette. I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the chairman of the full committee for 5 
minutes for an opening statement, Mr. Guthrie.

 OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BRETT GUTHRIE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN 
           CONGRESS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF KENTUCKY

    Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the 
recognition, and I want to thank all of our witnesses for being 
here today to this hearing. Today's hearing is important. We 
will explore potential solutions to strengthen the Medicare 
program and enhance seniors' access to care.
    For example, in 2014 Congress enacted Protecting Access to 
Medicare Act, which reformed Medicare payments for lapsed 
services, but it has become clear the law is not exactly 
operating as intended, and Congress has frequently modified or 
delayed aspects of this reform. Today, the subcommittee will 
examine potential solutions for payment stability and 
consistency for lapsed services, encourage innovation in 
diagnostic lab testing, and protect seniors' ability to receive 
these services, all while ensuring Federal taxpayers' dollars 
are used responsibly and sustainably.
    The subcommittee will also hear testimony about several 
bills related to durable medical equipment, or DME, and home 
infusion therapy. These are critical items and services for 
seniors, particularly for beneficiaries in rural and 
underserved areas. We will also examine the WISeR model, which 
is focused on promoting high-quality care for medical 
beneficiaries by ensuring that certain services are provided in 
alignment with existing CMS coverage policies.
    While I know many patients and providers have frustrations 
with the traditional prior authorization processes, I also 
appreciate that our current Medicare spending trajectory is 
unsustainable. CMMI was created for the express reason of 
trying new payment models that might make our healthcare 
programs more efficient and effective. Therefore, we must think 
creatively to see how CMMI can harness cutting-edge 
technologies that aim to help beneficiaries avoid unnecessary 
care.
    Despite all these reservations, I look forward to a robust 
discussion on all of the bills before us today, but our work 
cannot just end here. As we look forward to all the important 
work we have coming this year, we do need to take a broad 
examination of healthcare costs. As members of this committee 
know well, we do not shy away from tackling tough issues within 
our wide-ranging jurisdiction. And I am pleased to announce 
that, over the next few months, we will hold a series of 
hearings to examine healthcare affordability.
    While some want to talk solely about a small subset of the 
population, I believe we have to take a broader look as to what 
is driving costs for all Americans. On January 22, we will hold 
a Health Subcommittee hearing with CEOs of some of the largest 
health insurance companies representing a cross section of the 
marketplace.
    I am hopeful that we can have a productive discussion about 
what is truly driving increased healthcare costs and premiums 
for everyone.
    From there, we need to look at the entire healthcare 
system, why prices and costs are going up, and what we can do--
hopefully, much of it in a bipartisan way--to address these 
issues. We have the greatest healthcare system in the world. We 
just need to examine how we can make it more affordable for all 
Americans.
    I thank the witnesses for their participation today, and I 
will yield back.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Guthrie follows:] 

[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back. I agree with him, 
and glad we are doing a lot of hearings on affordability.
    And I will take a point of personal privilege and recognize 
the former chairman of this committee. Mr. Walden is in the 
room. We appreciate him being here.
    For those who don't know, it is not a mirror. That is his 
portrait. That is him.
    I now recognize for an opening--I now recognize for 5 
minutes for an opening statement the ranking member of the full 
committee, Mr. Pallone, for an opening statement.

OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. FRANK PALLONE, Jr., A REPRESENTATIVE 
            IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY

    Mr. Pallone. The former chairman still looks good. He looks 
like the portrait.
    Anyway, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Today, committee Republicans are holding a hearing on 
Medicare to supposedly strengthen the program and enhance 
access to care. Yet, congressional Republicans have spent the 
last year decimating our healthcare system, cutting more than 
$1 trillion for the Medicaid program, and--the biggest cuts in 
this country's history, and all to fund giant tax cuts for big 
corporations and billionaires.
    At the same time, Republicans refuse to extend the 
Affordable Care Act's enhanced premium tax credits that help 
low- and middle-income Americans afford their healthcare 
coverage. And last year, Democrats repeatedly pressed 
Republicans to take action, but they refused, and so the tax 
credits expired at the end of 2025. Now, here we are on January 
8 with insurance premiums skyrocketing by two, three, and even 
four times for 24 million Americans.
    This is a major failure of leadership to address the 
affordability crisis. In fact, it is such a failure that even 
members of our own party have joined--of their own party, the 
Republican Party--have joined Democrats in forcing a vote on 
the House floor to extend the tax credits through the discharge 
petition that we are going to be voting on, or we are voting on 
this week.
    Rather than addressing the healthcare affordability crisis 
that seniors and all Americans are facing, Republicans are 
holding this hearing on Medicare bills that will mostly raise 
payment rates for certain classes of providers in Medicare. 
Now, some of these bills, like the RESULTS Act and the 
Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act, address known 
payment issues in the Medicare program that we need to fix. 
And, while I support these efforts, I also believe that fixing 
minor payment issues in Medicare does nothing to fix the 
broader crisis Americans are facing in paying for healthcare 
and their rising cost of living across the board.
    The failure to extend the enhanced premium tax credits are 
particularly harmful to older Americans preparing for 
retirement. Over half of all enrollees who are losing all 
support to purchase ACA coverage are between the ages of 50 and 
64. Take, for example, a 60-year-old couple in Texas with a 
household income of $85,000. They rang in the new year facing a 
more than $26,000 premium increase just to keep their 
healthcare. Undoubtedly, older Americans like them will either 
go without coverage or they will purchase worse coverage that 
leaves them on the hook for thousands of dollars of medical 
costs when they get sick or need routine medical care. And, 
without these enhanced tax credits, they will become less 
healthy and face the possibility of financial ruin.
    And the failure to extend these tax credits is compounded 
by the devastating cuts in the Big, Ugly Bill that rips 
healthcare away from 15 million Americans, increases out-of-
pocket costs for millions of Americans, and is already forcing 
hospitals, maternity care units, and clinics across the country 
to close their doors and cut services. The Big, Ugly Bill even 
directly attacks seniors and people with disabilities who rely 
on Medicare. The Republican law makes it harder to enroll in 
coverage for programs like the Medicare Savings Program that 
make it possible for seniors struggling to afford healthcare 
costs to pay for their prescriptions and doctors' visits.
    So we must do better for the American people, Mr. Chairman. 
Fortunately, today, we can support an extension of the premium 
tax credits by passing Leader Jeffries' discharge petition. If 
Republicans are serious about making healthcare more affordable 
and ensuring access to care, they will support the discharge 
petition today.
    And with that said, I support some of the bills we will 
discuss today, including H.R. 5243, led by Representative 
Jennifer McClellan--I mean, by Representative McClellan--H.R. 
6210, led by Representative Matsui, and H.R. 6361 led by 
Representative Landsman of our committee as well.
    Representative Landsman's bill would prohibit the Trump 
administration from implementing its so-called WISeR model, 
which would impose prior authorization in traditional Medicare 
by allowing for-profit companies to use AI to perform prior 
authorization reviews and then give them a cut of the savings 
if care is denied. And this model threatens beneficiaries' 
access to timely and necessary medical care, and that is why I 
support this legislation to halt it and any future model that 
imposes this type of coverage restrictions on seniors who rely 
on traditional Medicare to get the care they need.
    They don't need to face even more barriers. There are 
enough barriers out there without having to deal with this kind 
of a barrier as well.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Pallone follows:] 

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    Mr. Pallone. And, with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back the 
balance of my time.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    We now conclude with Members' opening statements. The Chair 
would like to remind Members that, pursuant to the committee 
rules, all Members' opening statements will be made a part of 
the record.
    We want to thank our witnesses for taking their time to 
testify before the subcommittee. Although it is not the 
practice of this subcommittee to swear in witnesses, I would 
remind our witnesses that knowingly and willfully making 
materially false statements to the legislative branch is 
against the law under Section--Title 18, Section 1001 of the 
United States Code.
    You will have the opportunity to give an opening statement 
followed by questions from Members.
    And our witnesses today are Susan Van Meter, president of 
American Clinical Laboratory Association. Welcome.
    Connie Sullivan, president and CEO of National Home 
Infusion Association. Welcome.
    Mr. Thomas Ryan, president and CEO of American Association 
for Homecare.
    And David Lipschutz, attorney and codirector of law and 
policy, Center for Medicare Advocacy.
    Per committee custom, each witness will have the 
opportunity for a 5-minute opening statement followed by a 
round of questions from Members. The light on the timer in 
front of you will turn from green to yellow when you have 1 
minute left, and, of course, from yellow to red when your time 
is up.
    Mr. Griffith. I now recognize Ms. Susan Van Meter for her 5 
minutes to give an opening statement. Ms. Van Meter.

  STATEMENTS OF SUSAN VAN METER, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN CLINICAL 
 LABORATORY ASSOCIATION; CONNIE SULLIVAN, PRESIDENT AND CHIEF 
  EXECUTIVE OFFICER, NATIONAL HOME INFUSION ASSOCIATION; TOM 
     RYAN, PRESIDENT AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, AMERICAN 
    ASSOCIATION FOR HOMECARE; DAVID LIPSCHUTZ, CO-DIRECTOR/
             ATTORNEY, CENTER FOR MEDICARE ADVOCACY

                  STATEMENT OF SUSAN VAN METER

    Ms. Van Meter. Chairman Griffith, Ranking Member DeGette, 
Vice Chair Harshbarger, Ranking Member Pallone, thank you for 
the opportunity to testify today. My name is Susan Van Meter. I 
am the president of the American Clinical Laboratory 
Association. ACLA is a trade association representing leading 
laboratories that develop and deliver essential diagnostic 
tests for patients and providers across the country.
    Ensuring innovation in diagnostics and broad patient access 
to necessary testing requires a Medicare payment system that is 
fair, accurate, and predictable. Regrettably, the Clinical 
Laboratory Fee Schedule, the only Medicare payment system which 
statute requires be based on commercial market rates, suffers 
from significant foundational flaws. Current payment rates are 
inaccurate, artificially low, and still based on incomplete 
data from 2016.
    We are now 23 days away from Medicare cuts to about 800 
tests--of as much as 15 percent--hitting laboratories across 
the country, impacting most significantly routine tests used 
every day to care for Medicare patients. ACLA strongly endorses 
the RESULTS Act as a commonsense, smart-policy approach to 
reforming the Clinical Laboratory Fee Schedule and preventing 
deep Medicare cuts from taking effect January 31.
    America's clinical laboratories are an indispensable part 
of the healthcare system, delivering tremendous value to 
patients and clinicians. Laboratory tests screen for disease, 
prevent diagnostic--or provide diagnostic information that 
informs clinical care, support increasingly personalized 
medicine, contribute to the discovery of new therapies, and 
help identify emerging pathogens. From routine tests used to 
diagnose and monitor a wide range of diseases, to biomarker 
testing that enables clinicians to better target treatments, 
particularly in cancer care, laboratory testing helps patients 
avoid ineffective therapies while improving outcomes and 
reducing unnecessary costs.
    Laboratory test results serve as the GPS for healthcare 
decision making, informing roughly 70 percent of medical 
decisions, while payments to the Clinical Laboratory Fee 
Schedule account for less than 1 percent of total Medicare 
spending, or approximately $8 billion annually.
    Despite this value, the Clinical Laboratory Fee Schedule 
lacks the stability and predictability laboratories need to 
maintain access to testing services that are relied upon by 
millions of patients and clinicians and continue investing in 
innovation.
    The primary challenges lie in the foundational flaws of the 
Protecting Access to Medicare Act, or PAMA. When PAMA became 
law in 2014, Congress intended Medicare laboratory rates to 
reflect the commercial market by using a weighted median of 
private payer rates reported to CMS. However, the goal was not 
achieved.
    PAMA's challenges fall into three core areas.
    First, CMS lacks access to timely and comprehensive 
commercial market data that reflect all segments of the 
laboratory market--hospital outreach, independent, and 
physician office laboratories--resulting in rates based on 
incomplete and outdated information. During the only data 
collection period since enactment of PAMA, CMS based rates on 
private payer data reported by fewer than 1 percent of 
laboratories. Hospital and physician office laboratories were 
significantly underrepresented, resulting in Medicare payment 
rates that did not accurately reflect the broader market, and 
absent further congressional action, laboratories soon will be 
required to report private payer data from 2019. Those data, 
collected before the COVID pandemic, will be used to set the 
Clinical Laboratory Fee Schedule for rates for 2027 through 
2029.
    Second, because of flawed data, Medicare payment reductions 
have been far greater than Congress intended, and current law 
allows those reductions to continue. Between 2018 and 2020, 
Medicare payments to laboratories were cut by nearly $4 
billion. That is about four times the $1 billion reductions 
projected by the Congressional Budget Office for that period. 
Congress has appropriately delayed further reporting 
requirements and additional cuts several times, for which the 
ACLA is grateful, but without further intervention, deep cuts 
begin again on January 31.
    Third, reporting requirements impose a significant 
administrative burden on both laboratories and CMS, 
discouraging participation of reporting and contributing to 
low-quality data. PAMA requires clinical laboratories to report 
each and every payment rate from each private payer and the 
associated volumes for all 1,600 codes on the CLFS. The RESULTS 
Act fixes these problems. It would base CLFS rates on current, 
comprehensive, and representative commercial market data, 
establish guardrails to mitigate rate reductions, and prevent 
deep destabilizing payment cuts while dramatically reducing 
administrative burden on laboratories and CMS.
    I thank you for the opportunity to testify. The ACLA looks 
forward to continuing to work with this committee to advance 
commonsense legislation that ensures Medicare beneficiaries 
continue to have access to the diagnostic services they rely on 
every day. I welcome your questions.
    Thank you.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. Van Meter follows:]

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    Mr. Griffith. I thank the gentlelady for yielding back.
    I now recognize Ms. Sullivan for her 5 minutes of 
testimony. Thank you.

                  STATEMENT OF CONNIE SULLIVAN

    Ms. Sullivan. Chairman Griffith, Ranking Member DeGette, 
and members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity 
to testify today. My name is Connie Sullivan, and I serve as 
the president and CEO of the National Home Infusion 
Association, and I am also a licensed pharmacist.
    NHIA represents pharmacies that coordinate and deliver home 
infusion care to patients across the country. Home infusion is 
the mainstream part of modern healthcare delivery. Every year, 
over a million patients rely on home infusion to treat serious 
infections, immune disorders, cancer, heart failure, and other 
complex conditions.
    Home infusion is strongly preferred by patients because it 
helps them get the IV medications they need with the least 
disruption to their daily lives, allows earlier discharge from 
the hospital, and lowers the risk for complications, such as 
drug-resistant infections.
    Despite these well-established benefits, home infusion has 
largely been out of reach for patients with traditional 
Medicare. The Medicare home infusion benefit only covers a 
handful of available drugs and is limited to a set of 
professional services that occur face to face in the home. As a 
result, Medicare beneficiaries remain significantly underserved 
compared to these insured under commercial or other government 
plans.
    Despite clear evidence of safety, patient preference, and 
systemwide cost savings, Medicare's restrictive and incomplete 
benefit design impedes access to home infusion. This assessment 
was confirmed in a 2010 study conducted by the Government 
Accountability Office. Their report accurately summarized the 
differences between Medicare and the commercial market and is 
still relevant today.
    Today, I am here to urge your support for H.R. 2172, the 
Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act. This bill 
matters because Medicare still does not have a complete home 
infusion benefit, and this bill addresses a real access problem 
for America's seniors and people with disabilities.
    Without home infusion access, seniors must travel back and 
forth to facilities or extend their hospital stay to receive 
these necessary and often lifesaving treatments. Here is a 
common example. A patient develops a serious infection due to 
an injury and is hospitalized. After a few days of IV 
antibiotics, the patient stabilizes and is ready to be 
discharged but must finish the 14-day course of daily IV 
antibiotics to ensure the infection doesn't reoccur.
    If this patient has commercial insurance, they would most 
likely be discharged to home because it is a safe, effective 
way to finish therapy using the least intensive medical 
resources. For Medicare beneficiaries, discharge to home, 
especially for IV antibiotics, is more difficult because the 
Medicare structure does not support the home-based model.
    As a result, patients are directed to higher-cost 
institutional pathways, having to make daily trips back to a 
hospital for infusions, or be admitted to a long-term care 
facility for the duration of therapy, even when the patient has 
the appropriate caregiver support to complete that treatment at 
home.
    This challenge is especially notable in rural communities, 
where the closest facility that can perform infusions may be 
hours away. For many patients, daily travel may be unrealistic, 
especially for someone who is medically fragile, has mobility 
issues, or is dependent on a family member for transportation. 
Without a workable home option, rural patients may be more 
likely to end up in a long-term care facility simply because 
there is no alternative supported by Medicare.
    The Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act fixes 
this coverage gap by modernizing the Medicare benefits so that 
more patients can access home infusion. The bill addresses gaps 
in the current Medicare benefit by establishing appropriate 
coverage for the supplies and full scope of professional 
services needed to support home infusion care. The bill also 
expands coverage for home infusion of IV anti-infectives, which 
represent by far the most common situation where home infusion 
can prevent avoidable facility use. With these changes, more 
home infusion providers will be encouraged to participate in 
the benefit, which would then expand access across the country 
for patients with a variety of needs.
    In closing, the Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion 
Act is a commonsense solution that strengthens access for 
Medicare beneficiaries, supports rural and underserved 
communities, and avoids unnecessary facility-based care.
    Thank you for your attention to this issue. I appreciate 
your consideration of this important legislation, and I look 
forward to your questions.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. Sullivan follows:]

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    Mr. Griffith. I thank the gentlelady. She yields back.
    I now recognize and welcome Mr. Thomas Ryan for his 5-
minute opening statement.

                    STATEMENT OF THOMAS RYAN

    Mr. Ryan. Thank you. Chairman Griffith, Ranking Member 
DeGette, and members of the subcommittee, thank you for the 
opportunity to testify today. My name is Tom Ryan, and I serve 
as the president and CEO of the American Association for 
Homecare. Before joining AAHomecare, I spent 25 years running a 
home medical equipment company in Long Island, New York, so I 
know firsthand how Medicare policy affects patients, families, 
and the small businesses that they serve.
    AAHomecare represents the Nation's home medical equipment 
suppliers and manufacturers--most of them are small 
businesses--who support millions of Americans with oxygen 
therapy, mobility equipment, hospital beds, diabetes supplies, 
home infusion, and other essential medical products. Home 
medical equipment is a critical part of the care continuum. It 
keeps people healthier, more independent, and in the setting 
that they overwhelmingly prefer, their homes, while reducing 
costly hospitalizations and emergency room visits.
    Today, I want to speak to three bipartisan bills that are 
essential to protecting Medicare beneficiaries' access to care: 
H.R. 1703, H.R. 2005, and H.R. 2902. But first, I must raise 
serious concerns about CMS' recently announced plans for the 
next round of competitive bidding. CMS is proposing to include 
ostomy and neurological supplies in competitive bidding, 
despite clear congressional intent that these items should not 
be included. CMS also plans to include new technology, like 
continuous glucose monitors, and change their payment category 
in a way that will sharply reduce reimbursement. This threatens 
beneficiary access and undermines innovation in diabetes care.
    Even more troubling, CMS intends to reduce the number of 
suppliers of these key product categories to fewer than 10 
nationwide. This would devastate small businesses, it will 
destabilize the national home medical equipment infrastructure 
that patients rely on. And, finally, the proposed bidding 
methodology will artificially drive payment rates to 
unsustainable levels, leaving too few suppliers to meet the 
needs of our Medicare beneficiaries.
    Now, I will discuss the bills. H.R. 1703 addresses a 2016 
policy that effectively eliminated beneficiaries' ability to 
upgrade to titanium or carbon fiber wheelchairs unless they pay 
the full cost out of pocket. This is contrary to long-standing 
Medicare policy that has severely restricted access to these 
lighter, more durable chairs. The bill restores the ability for 
the beneficiary to pay the difference for the upgraded 
materials without adding any cost to Medicare. Individuals with 
disabilities deserve the ability to choose the equipment that 
best supports their mobility needs and their quality of life. I 
want to thank Representatives Joyce, Buchanan, and Schrier for 
their leadership on the support and legislation.
    Next is H.R. 2005, relief for nonbid, nonrural areas. Since 
2016, CMS has applied competitive bidding rates that never 
participated in competitive bidding to these areas. These cuts 
often were more than 50 percent. They have been devastating, 
especially in rural and suburban communities. Congress has 
repeatedly stepped in with temporary relief, most recently 
through the 2022 omnibus bill, but that relief expired at the 
end of 2023. As a result, suppliers in these areas are, again, 
facing cuts of more than 30 percent.
    H.R. 2005 restores a 75/25 blended rate for nonbid, 
nonrural areas through 2025. We are going to work with the 
committee on changing that, obviously. This is essential to 
maintaining access to home medical equipment and preventing 
further supplier choices. We appreciate the bipartisan 
leadership of Representatives Miller-Meeks, Tonko, Feenstra, 
and Panetta, and we look forward to working with the committee 
to update the timeliness as this bill advances.
    And finally, H.R. 2902, the Supplemental Oxygen Access 
Reform Act. Finally, H.R. 2902 addresses long-standing access 
problems in the Medicare oxygen benefit, especially for 
patients who require liquid oxygen. Competitive bidding has 
produced savings, but it has also pushed reimbursement for 
liquid oxygen far below the cost of providing it. As a result, 
many patients cannot get the type of oxygen systems that their 
physicians prescribe. The bill creates a sustainable payment 
methodology for liquid oxygen, strengthens program integrity 
for a national electronic template, recognizes the essential 
role of respiratory therapists, and, of course, reimbursing the 
services for individuals with COPD, pulmonary fibrosis, heart 
disease, and other diseases. We strongly support this 
legislation and thank Representatives Valadao, Brownley, Smith, 
and Evans for championing it.
    In conclusion, home medical equipment keeps people safe, 
independent, and in their home, and it saves Medicare money. 
These three bipartisan bills before you today--H.R. 1703, H.R. 
2005, and H.R. 2902--are practical, targeted solutions that 
will protect access to care for millions of Medicare 
beneficiaries. AAHomecare really looks forward to working with 
the committee to move these bills forward.
    Thank you very much.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Ryan follows:]

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    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize Mr. David Lipschutz--welcome--for his 5 
minutes for an opening statement.

                  STATEMENT OF DAVID LIPSCHUTZ

    Mr. Lipschutz. Thank you. Chairman Griffith, Ranking Member 
DeGette, Chairman Guthrie, Ranking Member Pallone, and 
distinguished members of the committee, thank you for the 
invitation to testify today. My name is David Lipschutz, and I 
am director--codirector of the Center for Medicare Advocacy. We 
are a national, private, nonprofit, nonpartisan law 
organization that works to advance access to comprehensive 
Medicare coverage and quality healthcare. Our policy work is 
based on the real-life experiences of the beneficiaries and 
families we hear from every day. We appreciate the committee's 
focus on improving access to care for Medicare beneficiaries.
    I would like to express support for three bills at issue in 
this hearing today which I will discuss in turn.
    First, H.R. 6210, the Senior Savings Protection Act, would 
provide a 5-year reauthorization of critical funding for State 
Health Insurance Assistance Programs, Area Agencies on Aging, 
Aging and Disability Resource Centers, and the National Center 
on Benefits Outreach and Enrollment.
    First established under the Medicare Improvements for 
Patients and Providers Act, or MIPPA, since 2008 this funding 
has provided essential outreach and enrollment assistance for 
millions of low-income older adults and individuals with 
disabilities, including help with enrollment into programs 
which provide assistance with Medicare premiums and costs. 
Reauthorizing funding for 5 years will help ensure the 
community-based organizations can continue their important work 
helping older adults and individuals with disabilities access 
needed care and lower their healthcare costs.
    This critical work includes helping people enroll in 
Medicare Saving Programs, or MSPs, in the Part D Low-Income 
Subsidy. MSPs are Medicaid programs that help with Medicare 
costs for those who qualify. These programs, though, are 
significantly underutilized, with roughly half of individuals 
eligible actually enrolled. The need for education about and 
assistance with enrollment in MSPs is even more important 
following passage of H.R. 1, which delays implementation of a 
rule streamlining eligibility and enrollment in MSPs, which 
will result in fewer people accessing this financial help. 
Reauthorization of MIPPA funding will help these vital 
community organizations, SHIPs, AAAs, ADRCs, and others 
continue to provide needed assistance in their communities.
    Second, we offer our support for H.R. 5243 to amend Title 
18 of the Social Security Act to increase data transparency for 
supplemental benefits under Medicare Advantage. Due to 
significantly higher payment to Medicare Advantage plans that 
Medicare spends on enrollees in traditional Medicare, virtually 
all Medicare Advantage plans provide supplemental benefits: 
items and services that are not covered in the traditional 
program. However, such benefits are not standardized and vary 
considerably by plan.
    Research demonstrates that, while beneficiaries value 
supplemental benefits in theory, and these benefits are a major 
driver in planned marketing and beneficiary selection, many 
enrollees do not utilize the full range of supplemental 
benefits available to them. The data collection outlined in 
this bill--particularly at a granular enrollee level--along 
with the required public reporting requirements would make 
available essential information about how specific supplemental 
benefits vary across plans, how and whether they are used, and 
how much they cost enrollees. With more than half of Medicare 
beneficiaries enrolled in MA plans, this bill would provide 
needed transparency and oversight of the MA program.
    Finally, we offer our strong support for H.R. 6361, the Ban 
AI Denials in Medicare Act. This bill would prohibit HHS from 
proceeding with the Wasteful and Inappropriate Services 
Reduction, or WISeR, model, which began in six States just last 
week and would also prohibit the implementation of payment 
models testing prior authorization in traditional Medicare.
    Currently, prior authorization requirements are applied to 
a very limited set of services in traditional Medicare, while 
virtually all Medicare Advantage enrollees are subject to prior 
auth, particularly for more expensive services. Extensive 
research and studies and our own experience have found that 
prior authorization requirements can result in inappropriate 
denials and delays in obtaining medically necessary care. When 
appealed, over 80 percent of MA denials are partially or fully 
overturned, but too few people appeal, meaning millions of 
beneficiaries are forgoing their right to appeal and going 
without necessary care.
    In recent years, problems with prior authorization in 
Medicare Advantage have been exacerbated by insurance companies 
or their vendors using AI or algorithmic software to aid their 
decision making. The WISeR model borrows some of the worst 
elements of Medicare Advantage with respect to accessing care 
and injects them into traditional Medicare.
    The model employs private vendors using AI or algorithmic 
tools to review and approve or deny coverage. Such vendors are 
compensated in part based on a share of averted expenditures--
in other words, a reduction in improved services creating 
financial incentives to deny care.
    Prior authorization is often dangerous for beneficiaries, 
far too burdensome from providers, and has no place in 
traditional Medicare. We strongly support this legislation that 
would halt the deeply flawed WISeR model and prohibit future 
models that would incorporate harmful prior authorization 
requirements in traditional Medicare.
    Thank you again for the opportunity to testify, and I look 
forward to your questions.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Lipschutz follows:]

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    Mr. Griffith. Thank you very much.
    We will now begin our questioning period. I ask that 
Members not begin a new question to our witnesses as their 5 
minutes expire and would encourage Members to submit written 
questions for the record if they have additional questions when 
their time is up.
    I now recognize myself for 5 minutes.
    Let me start with some good news. We always need some good 
news. I was able to attend a ribbon cutting on Monday for the 
Stuart Community Hospital in Patrick County, Virginia. It was a 
reopening of one of my rural hospitals that had previously 
closed down back in 2017, and that is just really good news. I 
was very, very pleased to be there.
    All right. Ms. Van Meter, I have concerns, particularly 
about routine tests that patients rely on every day. In your 
testimony, you mentioned one such test, a complete blood count 
test that regularly is furnished by these smaller labs. That is 
currently reimbursed under the Clinical Lab Fee Schedule at 
$7.77. However, you say that it is scheduled to be cut by 11 
percent on January 31, absent a change in the law.
    What does this mean for patient access to this test and 
others like it if we don't take action?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the question. 
CBC is a very commonly ordered test. It can tell us quite a lot 
about monitoring a patient's condition, diagnosing it, the 
health of their immune system. It can also be the first sign 
that there may be a blood cancer like a leukemia.
    You are exactly right. The Medicare program currently 
reimburses $7.77 for this extraordinarily valuable test. That 
means the blood draw, the transportation to the laboratory, the 
medical laboratory professionals who assess that sample, run 
the test, and deliver the results to the patients and their 
clinicians, and that is done for $7.77. It is a perfectly 
illustrative test of the value of clinical laboratories.
    Now, that test is among the most common tests ordered, and 
common tests are subject to a disproportionate level of 
reductions under PAMA. Those cuts take place on January 31. For 
smaller laboratories in rural or frontier communities, for 
example, that have more narrower menus that focus really on 
those essential common tests, we have significant concerns 
about them being able to weather these deep Medicare cuts, 
again, that are disproportionately hitting those common tests 
that Medicare beneficiaries rely on every day.
    Mr. Griffith. And let me see if I--correct me if I have got 
my translation wrong, but if you are in a big city and you are 
doing a thousand of those tests a day, you might be able to 
justify the 7.77--maybe a little bit of a cut, but if you are 
in a rural area where you are doing five of those tests a day, 
there is no way you can possibly manage it for that amount of 
money.
    And so you have either got to decide whether you close up 
shop or whether you just stop doing that test. Is that what I 
am hearing?
    Ms. Van Meter. Well, I think the impact could be profound 
for smaller laboratories in particular, but I must say, even 
larger laboratories, whether it be in urban areas or small 
communities--there can be large laboratories in small 
communities--it is extraordinarily difficult to have the 
professional laboratory and staff and the infrastructure--these 
labs run 24/7--to be able to carry out that service in a timely 
fashion for $7.77. They are committed to doing so. ACLA members 
are committed to doing so, but we worry profoundly about the 
impact of those reductions.
    Mr. Griffith. All right. I appreciate that.
    Mr. Ryan, I appreciate you being here today. You raised a 
couple questions in your testimony, but I want to go to my 
second question first, and then we will see if we have time to 
get to the others.
    My district is considered very rural by many metrics. I 
represent southwest Virginia and Southside Virginia, the 
Appalachian region of the commonwealth. According to the 
competitive bidding process that CMS implements, CMS determined 
that a good portion of my district is nonrural. Can you briefly 
explain how CMS decides this designation? Because I am looking 
at the map here of what is considered nonrural, and I can't 
figure it out.
    Mr. Ryan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. A lot of people can't 
figure that out. Medicare uses a set of ZIP Codes, and in the 
ZIP Codes they chose what areas of the country were going to be 
competitively bid to see the areas of the country--what areas 
of the country would be rural areas of the country and then 
what areas of the country would be nonbid, nonrural areas.
    So your district probably has a lot of these nonbid, 
nonrural areas. Obviously, H.R. 2005 would help with that. The 
SOAR Act would help with that, because you get increased 
reimbursement for those product categories if that, in fact, 
comes into play. But that is a common question that is asked, 
and people are questioning CMS' methodology on that ZIP Code 
application, and it is just one of the flaws of the program.
    Mr. Griffith. Well, and I will have to check into that 
further. And I appreciate your answer because I have got a 
couple of counties--some of them, I understand, but then I have 
got a couple of counties and a couple of communities that I 
just can't figure out how Duffield or New Castle in Craig 
County, a county that has about 4,000 people and is owned by 
the National Forest Service--about half of it is owned by the 
National Forest Service--how that is not rural. I don't 
understand that, but c'est la vie.
    For the people back home, can you please explain what has 
already been done to help rural areas subject to competitive 
bidding?
    Mr. Ryan. Yes. We have worked with Congress in the past, 
and we have enacted the 75/25 blended rate, which I said was in 
effect essentially until the end of 2023, and we have also 
worked with Congress and worked with the administration. And in 
that rural area of America, which originally was being 
reimbursed at 110 percent, we made it--well, it is not 
permanent. Nothing with CMS is permanent. But we have a fix now 
that we get paid a 50/50 blended rate. Now, these percentages 
we talk about are essentially the adjusted amount or the bid 
amount and the unadjusted amount, so----
    Mr. Griffith. All right. I appreciate it.
    Mr. Ryan [continuing]. This needs some help.
    Mr. Griffith. I will apologize to the committee. I violated 
my own rule and asked a question as time was running out but 
didn't realize it until after I asked the question. So I 
apologize for that, and I will have more questions for the 
record.
    I now recognize the ranking member, Ms. DeGette, for her 5 
minutes of questioning.
    Ms. DeGette. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman.
    I want to thank all of the witnesses for coming today, and 
I particularly want to single out Ms. Sullivan because she is 
my neighbor to the north in Lyons, Colorado, and--welcome--and 
also because the home infusion benefit in the bill that she is 
talking about was originally in 21st Century Cures Act that 
was--and anybody who was here then voted for that bill, and it 
allowed beneficiaries to be administered infused drugs in a 
home setting to begin with. So this is a commonsense expansion 
of that, and I want to thank you.
    One of the themes that goes through all of these bills is 
an attempt to reduce costs for beneficiaries and for Americans, 
and so I just want to talk about one thing the Democrats have 
done to bring down costs.
    On January 1, thanks to our bill that we passed under the 
Inflation Reduction Act, negotiated drug prices went into 
effect under Medicare Part D, and now Medicare is going to 
negotiate the prices of certain high-cost drugs.
    Mr. Lipschutz, what reduction in list price did this first 
round of negotiations achieve?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Thank you, Ranking Member. When the prices 
were first announced, the discounts depended on the drug and 
ranged from roughly 40 percent to 80 percent discounts.
    Ms. DeGette. Because of the negotiations?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Exactly.
    Ms. DeGette. And how much is this projected to save people 
on Medicare?
    Mr. Lipschutz. It is projected to save Medicare 
beneficiaries about $1.5 billion in out-of-pocket expenses this 
year.
    Ms. DeGette.Wow. Now, that is tangible savings that 
American seniors will feel in their pocketbooks.
    In the meantime, President Trump threatened extreme tariffs 
on drug companies if they didn't make deals with him. So let me 
ask you--this is a little out there, but does that sound sort 
of like extortion to you?
    Mr. Lipschutz. It kind of sounds like it, yeah.
    Ms. DeGette. And why is that?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Well, it is--I believe the negotiation 
tactics were exchanging the lack of pursuing tariffs in order 
to extract promises from different companies.
    Ms. DeGette. Now, are the deal details public that you know 
of?
    Mr. Lipschutz. No.
    Ms. DeGette. And companies that have made deals with the 
Trump administration, they haven't significantly revised their 
revenue projections so far. Does that seem like the behavior of 
companies that have agreed to take a revenue hit in this 
country?
    Mr. Lipschutz. It doesn't sound like it.
    Ms. DeGette. No. OK. So I want to say that what we need to 
do--as we are reforming healthcare in this country and looking 
at lowering costs, we need to do things that actually will 
lower costs, like this Medicare price negotiation. And if the 
majority really wanted to truly bring down costs for consumers, 
they would vote to extend enhanced premium tax credits and to 
strengthen the model of negotiating drug prices as well as 
other issues. I know Congressman Carter has worked on PBM 
reform and many, many other issues that we could work on to 
actually reduce the price of healthcare in this country.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the vice chairwoman of the Health 
Subcommittee, Mrs. Harshbarger of Tennessee.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Thank you to the witnesses for being here today, and I want 
to turn to you first, Ms. Sullivan.
    Being a pharmacist myself, we know how important it is for 
patients to get care in the right setting, and for many 
patients, especially in rural areas like mine in east Tennessee 
and Chairman Griffith's in southwest Virginia, you know, home 
infusion can improve outcomes and the quality of life while 
avoiding unnecessary trips to the hospitals or extended 
facility stays. Because I have done this home health, I have 
done hospice respiratory companies, I have done it all as a 
pharmacist. So that is why I helped introduce the Preserving 
Patient Access to Home Infusion Act, and this bill updates 
Medicare's home infusion benefits so the patients can actually 
receive the care they need at home when appropriate.
    Before I get to my questions, though, I wanted to ask 
unanimous consent to submit into the hearing record this letter 
from one of my constituents, Mr. Shane Bare, who stands to 
benefit from this legislation.
    When you have people with chronic debilitating disease 
states, the best remedy for them most of the time is to be at 
home when they get immunoglobulin therapy or whatever. So, if 
we could do that, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Griffith. And the date of the letter is?
    Mrs. Harshbarger. January the 8th.
    Mr. Griffith. January the 8th. Without objection, so 
ordered.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Thank you, sir.
    When a Medicare patient needs IV antibiotics after 
discharge, what happens today if home infusion isn't an option, 
and how would this bill change that for rural patients and 
families?
    Ms. Sullivan. Thank you, Vice Chair, for the question and 
for acknowledging our patient that has been very supportive of 
this bill and illustrates how important this service is for 
patients like him who--he is bound in a wheelchair and relies 
on these services----
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Absolutely.
    Ms. Sullivan [continuing]. And for lifesaving treatment.
    Basically, what happens today, unfortunately, is that if a 
patient needs IV antibiotics, the first question that is asked 
by the physician or the discharge planner is not what does this 
patient prefer, or is this patient safe to be at home. The 
first question is, Does this patient have Medicare?
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah.
    Ms. Sullivan. Because it completely rules out home 
infusion, in most cases, for those particular patients. If the 
patient has commercial insurance, they work through the process 
of establishing the proper treatment in the home setting 
whenever possible. Unfortunately, because that is not available 
to Medicare patients, they start looking at the alternatives 
and what is going to be workable for that patient. Do they have 
someone that can drive them? In some cases, in Mr. Bare's case, 
it would be several hours through the mountains----
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah.
    Ms. Sullivan [continuing]. In inclement weather to reach an 
infusion center, which is a very difficult thing for a lot of 
patients to do, particularly our seniors and those with 
disabilities.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Totally. And, you know, he is in a 
wheelchair. I mean, not only do you fight the weather and 
everything else when you are in a mountainous region, but you 
have to deal with the prior approvals from the insurance or the 
out-of-pocket costs. It is ridiculous. And I have had to deal 
with all that in the pharmacy, so thank you for that answer.
    Mr. Ryan, I am a cosponsor of H.R. 2005, the DMEPOS Relief 
Act, and I know that when patients can't get timely access to 
oxygen, mobility equipment or diabetes supplies, their 
conditions will worsen. And so how do these reimbursement cuts 
undermine Medicare's goal of keeping safely at home and 
avoiding costly emergency room visits and hospital stays, 
especially in rural communities with limited hospital access?
    Mr. Ryan. Well, the service model has changed over the 
years because the reimbursement model has been devastating.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah.
    Mr. Ryan. It has been cut by over 60 percent since 
competitive bidding came into place. And we have thwarted 
technology. We have seen that technology has really gone down 
over the years. Patents decreased significantly, so innovation 
has been problematic.
    The service model has changed tremendously. When I was a 
respiratory therapist back in the 1980s and the 1970s, we would 
be in patients' homes following up on oxygen therapy and some 
of the things that the SOAR Act would offer.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah. Absolutely.
    Mr. Ryan. But the reimbursement has changed that dynamic, 
and patients are getting their equipment later. Repairs have 
gone up significantly because the quality of the equipment is 
not the same. And the reality is these--the H.R. 2005 and the 
SOAR Act, you know, essentially put some of those savings back 
in place that makes some sense, particularly for access to 
liquid oxygen, which has been devastating.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah.
    Mr. Ryan. These patients who are on high-flow oxygen need 
to have this technology. It is actually old technology. One 
cubic foot of liquid oxygen converts to 860 cubic feet of 
gaseous oxygen. So, with a very small container, you could have 
a much greater amount of oxygen.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah. True.
    Mr. Ryan. When I was a therapist, we put liquid out all the 
time, but the Medicare reimbursement system taking oxygen and 
making it modality-neutral essentially--getting one payment 
model for different types of oxygen therapy that are very 
different--that whole infrastructure and that whole drug has 
gone away. It seems like an orphan drug now.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, they used to be able to do a 
nebulizer and the breathing medication that went in at the--the 
respiratory therapy companies used to be able to do that. Then 
they said, ``No, we are not going to do it,'' so they had to 
get the medication at a pharmacy or a different place. It is 
just----
    Mr. Ryan. Right. It is all about reimbursement. When I was 
at my company in New York for 25 years, we had a different 
model.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. You can't keep up with the change. I 
gotcha. I feel your pain. I understand. I have had to deal with 
that too.
    Let me go to Ms. Van Meter. In your testimony, you warned 
that sustained Medicare cuts threaten not only testing capacity 
but also skilled laboratory workforce, and you also note that 
CMS has provided little education to laboratories about the 
mechanics and requirements for reporting their data.
    Absent statutory reform, do you expect the next data 
collection cycle to be materially better or more representative 
results than the last one, and why or why not?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you, Vice Chair, for the question. It 
is a terrific question. I mean, a fundamental flaw within PAMA 
right now has to do with CMS' lack of access to robust and 
representative commercial market data. And if we were to move 
forward with that data reporting period come February 1, it is 
data from 2019 that labs would have to report for every payer 
with whom they do business, for every test on their menu, what 
those rates are, and the associated volumes.
    Not only are systems old--computer systems from which those 
data would have to be gathered, and that is a fundamental 
challenge--but you are exactly right. The training on what data 
and what mechanics need to be used to get those data in have 
not really been done in any sufficient way, so we are 
tremendously concerned that the reporting would be lackluster. 
The first time the data were reported--2016 data--fewer than 1 
percent of laboratories across the country reported data, and 
those data were used to set rates.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yeah.
    Ms. Van Meter. So, without that comprehensive, robust, you 
know, representative data, you have got artificially low data 
that we have been living with.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, I have got more questions, and I 
know my time is up, so I yield back. Thank you so much.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize Dr. Schrier of Washington for her 5 minutes 
of questioning.
    Ms. Schrier. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Ranking 
Member DeGette. Thank you to all of the witnesses for this 
really--for being here for this interesting hearing.
    I just want to note before we get into today's topics that 
we are ignoring some gigantic elephants in the room right now. 
On Monday, Secretary Kennedy's CDC gutted the childhood 
immunization schedule recommendations without any substantive 
evidence or recommendations. He shocked CDC career staff and 
scientists. And, in fact, his changes were so radical that he 
even did a runaround his own handpicked vaccine advisory 
committee that is stacked with antivaccine activists. That is 
how extreme this was.
    And I have to just say, again, as the only pediatrician in 
Congress, that this decision is going to harm children, it is 
going to cost lives, and it is going to make their families 
sicker as well. And I have asked again and again to hold an 
oversight hearing about Secretary Kennedy's recklessness and 
antivaccine and antiscience decisions.
    And I just want to remind our chairman, you are not 
powerless here. You can call a hearing. We can do oversight. 
And if you really care about children, I will urge you to do a 
hearing on this issue.
    Turning to today's hearing, I consistently hear a couple 
things from my constituents. First, I just hear that healthcare 
is unaffordable, health insurance is unaffordable. And I also 
want to remind my colleagues that today we will have an 
opportunity to vote to extend the tax credits that help people 
afford health insurance, and I would urge my Republican 
colleagues to vote with us for that bill.
    Now, the other thing I hear constantly from constituents is 
that the health insurance that they do have, that they pay a 
lot of money for, is not holding up their end of the bargain, 
and that their insurance companies are delaying or denying care 
due to, really, abuse of prior authorizations. And I hear the 
same thing, by the way, from physicians and from hospitals, and 
they are forced to hire more staff to deal with this 
bureaucracy and appeals than nurses.
    And the most egregious of these is Medicare Advantage, 
which is a type of Medicare plan, as you know, that contracts 
with private insurance companies to deliver care. About half of 
seniors are enrolled in Medicare Advantage because they are 
often a bit more affordable. And they seem great until a 
patient gets sick and then can't get the care that they need.
    In 2023, traditional Medicare beneficiaries, the usual kind 
of Medicare, saw about 40,000 prior authorization requests. In 
that same year, Medicare Advantage beneficiaries saw nearly 50 
million prior authorization demands. And I want you to keep in 
mind that this is about a 50/50. Half of seniors choose 
Advantage and half choose traditional.
    So this seems so egregious. And then on top of that, the 
use of AI by insurance companies, you can dial that to deny 
more or to approve more. And it is causing more abuses and more 
denials. And healthcare decisions, as I said many times, should 
be guided by doctors and worked with patients and not be 
decided by insurance companies.
    And so, I am so supportive of Representative McClellan's 
bill to increase data transparency in Medicare Advantage and 
Representative Landsman's bill to stop the use of AI and prior 
authorization and the expansion of that true traditional 
Medicare. Our seniors deserve better.
    Mr. Lipschutz, in your testimony, you point out that 
Medicare is projected to spend about 20 percent more for 
Medicare Advantage enrollees than it would spend if those 
enrollees had traditional Medicare, and yet Medicare Advantage 
plans say that they have to use all of this prior authorization 
in order to keep costs down.
    Can you explain that contradiction, please?
    Mr. Lipschutz. I don't know if I can.
    Ms. Schrier. I don't know if I can either.
    Mr. Lipschutz. Medicare Advantage plans have the ability to 
employ prior authorization, ostensibly to weed out medically 
unnecessary care. But in our experience, far too often they 
weed out medically necessary care. And as cited in my written 
testimony, plenty of studies, including the HHS Office of 
Inspector General, have found widespread problems with 
inappropriate denials. And their own assessment of claims 
found, I think, an inappropriate denial rate, about 13 percent 
of claims that were denied that, in fact, were medically 
necessary in their estimation.
    Ms. Schrier. That is right. I believe 95 percent of the 
appeals are ultimately approved. It is just that that care was 
delayed, and so it is unnecessary. It is denying care. Our 
seniors deserve better. We need further oversight of this too.
    So thank you. I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the chairman of the full committee for 5 
minutes for his questioning, Mr. Guthrie of Kentucky.
    Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I appreciate that.
    And questions--Ms. Van Meter, how are you today? In 2014, 
Congress passed reforms to Medicare's clinical APV schedule to 
help lower costs, basing Medicare rates for those services on 
private market rates because, at the time, Medicare rates were 
significantly exceeding the private market. Under current law, 
CMS is required to collect data from laboratories about what 
they are paid by private payers.
    Can you describe the data collection and reporting process 
for lab? And how does this administrative burden ultimately 
affect the accuracy of private payer-base Medicare payments?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you for the question, Mr. Chairman. 
And I would say that the original data upon which that 
assumption that Medicare rates were significantly higher than 
commercial market rates was--there was a dearth of data to 
suggest such system analysis looking at three FEHBP plans and 
only 20 tests.
    Be that as it may, the collection of comprehensive 
commercial market data that is also representative of the three 
segments of the market--that is, physician office labs, 
hospital outreach labs, independent labs--is critical to 
ensuring that CMS actually understands commercial market rates 
and can appropriately set the Medicare rates based on those 
commercial market data.
    The RESULTS Act would be the step in the right direction to 
ensuring that CMS actually had access to that commercial market 
data. Without it, you cannot accurately set Medicare rates.
    Mr. Guthrie. Thank you. And so there is legislation 
considered in this hearing, the RESULTS Act, which would 
require CMS to contract with an independent claims database to 
obtain private payer data to calculate the Medicare payment 
rates.
    Can you speak to this idea of using independent claims 
database? And how would it improve accuracy?
    Ms. Van Meter. Yeah. Certainly. Thank you.
    The legislation would request that CMS contract with an 
independent, not-for-profit database that has privacy and 
security policy in place, and that--the data would be--come 
directly from private health plans. It would be claims data 
with volumes associated. It would be representative of the 
entire laboratory field: physician office, hospital outreach, 
and independent laboratories.
    That would give CMS tremendously robust data for the most 
widely available tests. Under the bill, widely available tests 
comprise 98 percent of the volume of tests paid for by the 
CLFS.
    One database that could meet the criteria is the FAIR 
Health Database out of New York State. Currently, 20 States 
across the country use the FAIR Health database for any number 
of reimbursement-related policies, including no surprise 
billing, for example. And CMS considers the FAIR Health 
database, which has 54 billion claims in it, to be a qualified 
entity and have statistically significant data across the 
country.
    Mr. Guthrie. You know, the most important thing for us in 
solving this issue is how it affects the patient.
    Ms. Van Meter. Yes.
    Mr. Guthrie. That is how the patients get the care that 
they deserve. And so, as more personalized and targeted 
treatments come to market, can you discuss the importance of 
innovation in the clinical space and how payment reform impact 
will affect the patient's access to care and innovation?
    Ms. Van Meter. Absolutely. Innovation and diagnostics is 
really driving personalized medicine. It is changing healthcare 
as we know it. Diagnostics are truly the GPS of healthcare. We 
are able to determine in a cancer, for example, exactly the 
mutation that a patient may have in a solid tumor, to determine 
precisely the right therapy for that patient and to monitor 
that treatment. That is because there has been longstanding 
innovation, investment, and research and development.
    With an unstable payment system and a threat of reductions 
that constantly hangs over the head--hangs over the head of 
clinical laboratories, you compromise the capacity to have 
long-range R&D. And while labs are investing today, if we were 
able to move towards the RESULTS Act, you would take away that 
threat of constant reduction and uncertainty, and thereby allow 
for greater investment and more advances to benefit patients.
    Mr. Guthrie. OK. Thank you. And then I will close with 
this. I appreciate Dr. Schrier bringing it up--preauth. We have 
to figure that out. I've sat with providers. I am not a doctor, 
and I know you are doctors, so you can read the information but 
I can't. But they presented to me cases that got approved and 
cases that didn't get approved. And from what I could tell, 
there was little difference between what was approved and what 
wasn't approved.
    And so, some of the muses, well, why have preauthorization 
at all because--if the doctor makes the decision, let them make 
it. What we do have to be concerned about, people setting up 
entities and taking advantage of not having any 
preauthorization whatsoever.
    So that is something we have to get right, though, because 
people are being denied care they will get eventually, or 
people--providers are denied payment that they will get 
eventually because of this process. And so, I know Texas has 
done something called the gold standard. As long as you operate 
within parameters--there's ways to fix it.
    And hopefully, Dr. Schrier, all of us can work together to 
figure that out, because we want patients to get the care that 
they need that the providers determine they need, and providers 
get paid for doing the care. So hopefully there will be 
opportunity--we have insurance agent--managers--or CEOs in 
front of us recently--to bring that up as well.
    So thank you for bringing that up, and it is something we 
need to deal with. I am sorry. My time is expired.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from California, Dr. Ruiz, 
for his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Ruiz. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    This is the first time this subcommittee has met in months. 
Months. And while I don't want to underplay the importance of 
the bills under consideration today, I think we need to first 
acknowledge how out of touch it is that while our constituents 
are suffering from the Republican-fabricated healthcare 
affordability crisis, they refuse to hold a hearing about it. 
Many of my constituents have been faced with overwhelming 
spikes in their ACA premiums because this Republican-majority 
Congress refuses to extend the enhanced premium tax credits.
    This politicking impacts real people. In fact, I am going 
to read you a letter from my constituent, Frank--who wrote to 
me--that shows the kind of affordability crisis Americans are 
facing across the country. Here is Frank's story from Indio, 
California.
    Quote: ``For my family, the change is immediate and severe. 
Our marketplace monthly premium would jump from $704.20 to 
$1,869 for the highest deductible, least desirable coverage 
available. That kind of increase forces families like mine to 
make impossible choices.''
    You know, Frank is not alone. His story is reflected in the 
stories of millions of people across our country. And we have 
to put people over politics. We have to put people--we have to 
take care of them right now.
    So getting back to the focus of this hearing, I would like 
to express my support for the bipartisan H.R. 2172, the 
Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act, which is 
sponsored by Representatives Buchanan and also Dingell and 
Harshbarger here in this committee.
    This bill removes the physical presence requirement for the 
Medicare Part B home infusion benefit and acknowledges the full 
scope of professional services provided in home infusion into 
the reimbursement structure. I cosponsored this bill because of 
its potential to improve access to care for seniors and help 
keep them in their own homes and out of nursing facilities.
    I represent a large rural area of southern California where 
many patients have to travel up to an hour or more to receive 
medical treatment. And like many underserved communities, 
transportation and geographic distance are considerable 
barriers, including the lack of nursing facilities in these 
communities. If a patient has to travel back and forth to a 
facility every day or every week for IV therapy, that barrier 
can be the deciding factor that pushes a patient into a nursing 
home, or leads them not to receive care at all. But receiving 
treatment in their own home is a game changer.
    Ms. Sullivan, from your perspective, what does that look 
like for patients and families on the ground? And how would 
this bill, the Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act, 
make home infusion a more dependable option for Medicare 
beneficiaries, reducing repeated travel, caregiver strain, and 
unnecessary time in facilities?
    Ms. Sullivan. Thank you so much, Congressman, for the 
question.
    You state the problem very clearly. And I wish I could say 
it was a rare problem, but it is not. Every home infusion 
company throughout the country gets a call every day from a 
physician or a hospital saying, ``I have a Medicare patient. I 
really need them to get home infusion because I don't know how 
else they are going to get this treatment.''
    And it just puts everyone in an impossible position. 
Families have to then make decisions about whether to be 
separated by hours from a loved one who needs to go to a 
skilled facility. And physician--you know that when you need an 
IV therapy, you need an IV therapy. There is not simply an 
easier oral option that will take care of the problem. These 
issues are more urgent, more critical, and the IV is necessary.
    And so, home infusion simply removes those barriers. It 
removes that stress. It removes the burden on the family to be 
able to bring that care to the home and provide all of the 
services that make it possible for that family to perform the 
infusions confidently, safely, and effectively and cost 
effectively.
    Mr. Ruiz. Thank you very much. I yield back my time.
    Mr. Griffith. I thank the gentleman. The gentleman yields 
back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from Florida, Mr. Bilirakis, 
for his 5 minutes of questions.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thanks for 
convening this very important hearing.
    Improving Medicare is such a pressing issue for seniors in 
Florida and across the country, obviously. I am proud to 
support many of the bills on the agenda today, including the 
Senior Savings Protection Act, which reauthorizes critical 
programs for low-income Medicare beneficiaries. I have heard 
testimony from volunteers and program participants, and the 
impact of the Medicare improvement program is felt in my 
district.
    I also colead the RESULTS Act with Mr. Hudson, of course 
Mr. Peters as well, and other cosponsors. Strong clinical 
laboratories are vital to delivering high-quality care, 
especially for seniors who depend on timely testing to maintain 
their health.
    I am glad we are discussing this key legislative initiative 
to protect access to essential clinical laboratory testing, 
services and help ensure that families in Florida and, of 
course, across the country have the benefit of the crucial 
information those test results offer.
    You all know that one of my top priorities, of course, is 
improving access to cutting-edge medical innovation. So my 
first question is, Ms. Van Meter, your testimony speaks to the 
importance of clinical lab tests and delivering care.
    Can you elaborate more on this role, particularly for 
patients with rare diseases, please?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you, Mr. Bilirakis.
    Yes. Absolutely. It is incredibly important that a patient 
and their physicians have access to a comprehensive set of 
tests. That does, of course, include routine tests but also 
tests for rare diseases.
    Let me give an example of a disease--rare disease: 
autoimmune encephalitis. A patient that has autoimmune 
encephalitis may present with symptoms of confusion, memory 
loss, maybe psychiatric symptoms. Those types of symptoms 
really clearly mimic common conditions like a dementia, for 
example. But that patient with autoimmune encephalitis, that 
is, an autoimmune-triggered swelling of the brain, that is a 
disease that is treatable. And if that patient gets steroids 
and other therapies, they can overcome that disease. If they 
don't get that rare disease test, they aren't clearly 
diagnosed, that disease can be fatal.
    Other examples of rare disease testing that apply to 
Medicare beneficiaries but also our youngest patients include 
rapid whole genomic sequencing. These types of technologies are 
uniquely situated to discern, diagnose unique and rare 
conditions. Rapid whole genomic sequencing can diagnose 
hundreds, thousands of conditions, can help patients and their 
family end diagnostic odysseys. And this yields actionable 
results in 50, 60 percent of the time. That is the kind of 
information that patients and their families deserve.
    So testing for rare disease is extraordinarily important, 
and we worry about innovation being curtailed by deep and 
persistent reductions.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you. Well put.
    Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to enter into the 
record a letter from over 30 leading organizations representing 
patients with cancer, diabetes, kidney disease, sepsis, 
autoimmune disorders, and a myriad of other conditions, urging 
Congress to act, stating that access to timely and accurate 
diagnostic information is foundational to patient healthcare 
and well-being, of course.
    So thank you, and I ask for this to be admitted into the 
record.
    Mr. Griffith. Does the gentleman have a date on the letter?
    Mr. Bilirakis. Yeah. It is November 19th, 2025.
    Mr. Griffith. Without objection, so ordered.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you. And I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize Ms. Barragan for her 5 minutes of 
questioning--of California.
    Ms. Barragan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Lipschutz, I want to start with you. First of all, 
thank you for the work that you do for the Center for Medicare 
Advocacy.
    Last year, Republicans' priority was to give tax cuts to 
the rich and take away healthcare through Medicaid. And even 
though the bill doesn't mention the word ``Medicare,'' 
according to the Congressional Budget Office, absent future 
congressional action, the bill will trigger $490 billion in 
cuts to Medicare from 2027 to 2034 due to the Statutory Pay-As-
You-Go Act of 2010.
    Can you talk about what it will mean for recipients of 
Medicare if there are $490 billion of cuts to the program?
    Mr. Lipschutz. That would be a significant cut. That would 
require, perhaps, cuts to benefits, cuts to provider payments, 
reorganization of the way people access healthcare.
    If you will permit me, I would like to address the impacts 
of H.R. 1 on Medicare. In addition to the cuts that providers 
will face as a result of significant cuts to Medicaid--the same 
providers that treat Medicare beneficiaries--and in addition to 
potential cuts that States will have to make to their Medicaid 
programs because of these cuts, services that people who are 
duly eligible for Medicare and Medicaid both use, H.R. 1, for 
the first time, strips away Medicare eligibility and coverage 
for entire groups of people.
    Now, undocumented individuals have never been eligible for 
Medicare. But this bill strips away eligibility and coverage 
for groups of lawfully present individuals regardless of how 
long they have worked and paid into the system.
    As previously mentioned, this bill also delays changes that 
were meant to streamline enrollment and accessibility for the 
Medicare Savings Programs, which helps people afford their 
Medicare programs to the tune of, according to CBO, $66 billion 
in savings, which is money that otherwise--going to come out of 
people's pockets.
    In addition, if you will permit me one more point about 
H.R. 1, it also has an impact on Medicare prescription drug 
negotiation. The Inflation Reduction Act exempted certain 
orphan drugs from negotiation. H.R. 1 expands that exemption so 
that the Medicare program will be paying an estimated extra $8 
billion over the next 10 years as a result of that change.
    Ms. Barragan. Thank you.
    The other topic, of course, that everybody has been talking 
about, except for Republicans, has been the Affordable Care Act 
tax credits expiring and people losing their coverage. So I 
want to echo the concerns that have been raised that we haven't 
had a hearing in this committee for months. And instead of 
having a hearing on what we can do to make sure more people 
have access to healthcare and keep their healthcare, we are 
talking about Medicare, which is also, again, very important. 
But what is before people right now is their inability to 
afford their healthcare.
    Mr. Lipschutz, I want to follow up with you. Nearly one-
fourth of the ACA enrollees are at least 55 years old. Many are 
early retirees who have to purchase insurance on the 
marketplace because they are not yet eligible for Medicare.
    If older Americans are forced to delay care because they 
can't afford it, doesn't that mean they are going to be more 
sick and in need of more expensive care by the time they need 
Medicare?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Very likely. Right now, the expiration of 
the enhanced subsidies, 50 percent of the people who will lose 
it are between the age of 50 and 64, which means their premiums 
are skyrocketing, particularly compared with other groups of 
people. So yes, more people will go uninsured or underinsured, 
will delay care, will defer care, will go into debt, and will 
face bankruptcy because of healthcare costs.
    Ms. Barragan. Thank you.
    I would also like to--important bill I think is missing 
from today's hearing called the Promoting Access to Diabetic 
Shoes Act. This bill would authorize nurse practitioners to 
certify a Medicare patient's need for diabetic shoes and refer 
them to a podiatrist so patients with Medicare can more easily 
get the care necessary to prevent diabetic foot ulcers and 
other conditions. That is why I hope we can consider this 
legislation and have a hearing on it, including--included on--
at a hearing I am proud to colead with Representative LaHood in 
a hearing soon.
    And with that, I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back. I now recognize 
the gentleman from Georgia, Mr. Carter, for his 5 minutes of 
questioning.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank all 
of you for being here. We appreciate it very much.
    And, Mr. Chairman, I want to thank you for holding this 
legislative hearing on proposals to support patient access to 
Medicare services, something that we are very dedicated to and 
working diligently on.
    There are, however, two bills that are noticeably absent 
today that I want to mention because I believe they are 
essential to ensuring Medicare beneficiaries have access to 
critical services. One is called ECAPS, Ensuring Community 
Access to Pharmacist Services Act, which will allow seniors to 
access testing and treatment for common respiratory illnesses 
at the most convenient and accessible site of care for many 
Americans, and that is their local community pharmacy.
    The bill does this by establishing permanent reimbursement 
for pharmacists under Medicare in States where scope-of-
practice laws already allow pharmacists to deliver such 
services. And this is very important because in many States 
where such services are allowed under State scope of practice, 
when scope of practice is determined by the States, the only 
patients currently without coverage are seniors under Medicare. 
And the very patients most likely to have severe cases of 
common respiratory conditions are these patients.
    Secondly, I want to mention the Preserving Patient Access 
to Long-Term Care Pharmacies Act, which is a bipartisan piece 
of legislation that provides a critical fix so seniors can 
continue to access the safe, reliable, long-term-care pharmacy 
services they deserve.
    Again, let me remind you, these bills are especially vital 
for seniors in rural areas. Pharmacists are the most accessible 
healthcare professionals in America. Ninety percent of all 
Americans live within 5 miles of a pharmacy. But many in the 
rural areas have to drive long distances to the closest 
physician office or emergency room, both which are much more 
expensive and less accessible points of care.
    Keep in mind, we all want the same thing whether you are 
Republican or Democrat. You want accessible, affordable, 
quality healthcare. That is what we are trying to achieve here.
    Mr. Chairman, I know that you are a supporter of both of 
these bills. In fact, you are a cosponsor of both of these 
bills, and I appreciate that very much. But I want to just ask, 
please, if we could have these two bills considered in the very 
near future, in the next relevant legislative hearing, and then 
in the next markup as well.
    Mr. Griffith. Mr. Carter, I look forward to working with 
you on both of those bills, and hopefully we will be able to 
get a hearing set up soon.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 
Again, I appreciate your support of this, and I know you are a 
cosponsor on both of them.
    Ladies and gentlemen, as a pharmacist, I always try to pull 
the conversation back to what patients deal with after they 
leave the hospital, because treatment doesn't end in discharge. 
We all know that. Many still need infused treatments. And the 
question is, Where do they finish them and how hard is it on 
the patient and the family?
    Home infusion is about safe care at home, not just drug 
delivery. But Medicare patients often struggle to access it, 
pushing them back into hospitals or facilities, and that is not 
what we want, options that are tougher on seniors and families 
and use more resources than needed.
    Ms. Sullivan, I want to ask you, can you describe what home 
infusion pharmacies do to ensure patients receive safe support 
at home over the course of treatment?
    Ms. Sullivan. Thank you, Congressman Carter. I appreciate 
the question. I am always happy to talk about the important 
work that pharmacists across this country are doing on behalf 
of patients.
    You know, the Medicare benefit today has an unusual 
restriction that does not exist in the commercial market, which 
has a robust home infusion benefit. Medicare restricts the 
services payments only to those that take place face to face in 
the home, which essentially is nursing. But without the 
essential pharmacy services that occur in the background in the 
pharmacy, home infusion is just simply not available.
    I like to kind of describe it as the Medicare benefit for 
home infusion is kind of like a car without an engine. The 
pharmacy is what makes home infusion actually a functioning 
benefit. The pharmacy designs a plan of care that the patient 
can do and the family can support on their own, with supportive 
nurses when it is needed. But they also provide that continuous 
support and 24/7 availability to answer questions, serve as a 
point of contact for physicians, and ultimately prevent 
patients from returning to the hospital or needing to visit the 
emergency room for support.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Good. We are considering now today 
the Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act.
    Would that make home options better? Would that improve the 
system?
    Ms. Sullivan. It will change patients' lives dramatically 
today that have Medicare. They simply do not have the same 
benefit that everyone else in the country essentially enjoys 
and has access to when they might need a home IV therapy 
unexpectedly.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Mr. Chairman, I just want to point 
out, make sure committee members understand that what she is 
saying here is that most of the private insurance are covering 
this, but Medicare is not. And that is a big gap and something 
we need to fill in. So thank you for pointing that out, Ms. 
Sullivan. I appreciate it.
    Again, we all want the same thing: accessible, affordable, 
quality healthcare. Accessibility is extremely important.
    So thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. I thank the gentleman for yielding back.
    I now recognize Mrs. Fletcher of Texas for her 5 minutes of 
questioning.
    Mrs. Fletcher. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to 
all of the witnesses for your testimony here this morning. I do 
appreciate this hearing today and the hearings that have been 
announced this morning, but I do want to echo the concerns of 
many of my colleagues that have already been raised about this 
committee and this Congress's failure to address the healthcare 
affordability crisis.
    And it is important that we also understand how we got 
here, because we have to connect the dots in this committee 
that a driver of this affordability crisis that we are now 
talking about comes from decisions that this Congress has made. 
Cutting Medicaid funding and eliminating the Affordable Care 
Act enhanced premium tax credits are a huge part of it. They 
are not the only drivers, but they are important ones. And they 
are things that we can actually change in here.
    And so I really think it is important, as Mr. Pallone has 
mentioned, as several other people mentioned in here today, we 
could vote to restore those premium tax credits today, this 
afternoon, and I intend to do that. And I think this is an 
important hearing. And I think that, you know, as we talk about 
improving patient access to Medicare services, we have to 
understand what Mr. Lipschutz was talking about a little while 
ago, that the cuts that are being made by this committee, by 
this Congress right now. are also impacting Medicare 
recipients, and they are--they are affecting their access to 
Medicare services as well.
    Cutting access to healthcare for millions of Americans, 
which is indisputably what is happening right now, is 
increasing costs for everyone across the country, and it is 
hurting Medicare recipients.
    So I have the privilege of representing many people who 
work in the Texas Medical Center, the world's largest medical 
complex, and many of the more than 120,000 people who work 
there live in my district and have warned me about how 
disastrous the actions of this Congress are for patients across 
the healthcare system, and in this case letting the premium tax 
credits expire.
    Now, Texas already has the highest uninsured rate in the 
country. It is estimated that Texas will experience the highest 
coverage loss of any State with the expiration of the tax 
credits. And last fall, when we were still working on this, the 
Texas Medical Center institutions and our local Chamber of 
Commerce, the Greater Houston Partnership, sent letters to me 
and to everyone in our delegation outlining the impact that 
that loss is going to have on our constituents. It is a 
bipartisan concern in the medical community and the business 
community and across our community that people are losing 
access to healthcare that they desperately need.
    And so, I know most people in this room know how all that 
works, but the idea that hospitals are going to be forced to 
reduce services and staff, that patients are going to have to 
wait longer--this applies to Medicare recipients too. And so I 
appreciate the importance of what we are talking about here, 
expanding access to Medicare services. That is what we should 
be doing. But we can't have this conversation without 
acknowledging the harm that is currently being done by 
decisions that are being made by this current Congress and 
limiting access to healthcare for all Americans.
    So Mr. Lipschutz, I appreciate the work that the Center for 
Medicare Advocacy does to promote access to quality healthcare 
for Medicare beneficiaries. I appreciated your answers earlier. 
And I just want to know if you can talk about, with the time we 
have--I will have another question to submit, I think, to you 
for the record at the rate I am going. But could you discuss 
how this increase and the overall number of people across the 
country who are not insured impacts access to care for Medicare 
beneficiaries?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Well, if you have a significant group of 
people that don't have insurance at all, it is going to be 
unaffordable for them. And many people will defer care until 
they absolutely need it. It will--it will increase pressure on 
emergency rooms. It will increase pressure on, you know, 
frontline providers. It affects the entire healthcare system 
when you have people who are uninsured and underinsured. It 
adds pressure across the board, including the providers who 
provide care to everybody, not just Medicare beneficiaries or 
Medicaid beneficiaries.
    Mrs. Fletcher. OK. So it looks like you are going to give 
me time to ask you my other question, but I may have to take 
the answer off the record--or for the record. But I do want to 
acknowledge one of the issues that you raised in your testimony 
about the WISeR model because that is one of the things I have 
heard about ever since I have been here from the physicians in 
my district, are about the problems with prior authorizations 
and prior authorization in Medicare Advantage in particular and 
how it really slows down access to appropriate care, forcing 
physicians to spend a ton of time on the phone with insurance 
companies instead of caring for their patients. And they are 
really concerned about the implementation of the WISeR model, 
which is being implemented in Texas.
    So I am going to submit a question for you on that for the 
record. But I appreciate your insights. I appreciate all of 
your time here today and all of the work that you do.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back. I now recognize 
the gentleman from Pennsylvania, Dr. Joyce, for his 5 minutes 
of questioning.
    Mr. Joyce. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you for 
including my legislation, H.R. 1703, the Choices for Increased 
Mobility Act, in this hearing. This is commonsense legislation. 
It would give greater access to Medicare beneficiaries to 
titanium and to carbon fiber wheelchairs.
    There is one keyword in this legislation, and that is 
``choice.'' This bill allows Medicare patients the opportunity 
to decide whether a titanium or a carbon fiber wheelchair is 
the right choice for them. And if it is, then patients with 
Medicare B have the ability to pay out of pocket for wheelchair 
upgrades if they so choose.
    Mr. Ryan, with your background, can you speak to some of 
the benefits that these lighter-weight wheelchairs will offer 
for those with disabilities?
    Mr. Ryan. Certainly. Thank you.
    Yeah. These patients who are using these type of 
wheelchairs are not just, you know, broken leg. These are 
patients with serious diseases, spinal cord disease, and they 
ambulate on their own the best they can if they have the 
ability. And just the wear and tear on them, on their 
shoulders, on their arms, trying to get around and be about and 
lead a mobile life is just, you know, unfair.
    Other insurances cover this. We haven't gotten Medicare to 
cover it yet. But the ability to the patient if they have the 
means to at least pay the upgrade amount makes perfect sense. 
And that is the way it had been in Medicare previously, but 
through subregulation, they made a change and is no longer in 
effect.
    Mr. Joyce. You bring out a great point. That is previously 
what Medicare patients had the capabilities of having, to have 
a lightweight wheelchair. And this legislation once again will 
provide that for the patients. Thank you for those statements.
    I urge all of my colleagues to support this commonsense, 
zero-cost measure, which passed unanimously out of this 
committee last Congress, so that it may be signed into law.
    I would now like to turn to H.R. 5269, the RESULTS Act. As 
a doctor, I know firsthand that accurate diagnostic testing is 
critical for the precise patient care. And that is why I 
strongly support the RESULTS Act, to improve patient access to 
these necessary services. This is bipartisan legislation, and 
it provides for stability, and it provides for predictability 
and ensures that CMS has a comprehensive cost data for the 
market-based Medicare payment structure that was originally 
intended under PAMA for clinical laboratory services.
    Since the passage of PAMA, we have seen drastic cuts in 
reimbursement for lab tests, with cuts as high as 30 percent 
from previous rates. These cuts across the board impact testing 
for everything from a skin biopsy to a complete blood count. 
This underreimbursement is a dire threat to access for seniors 
across our country. And there are more cuts slated to occur if 
we in Congress fail to act.
    The payments reforms in the RESULTS Act has strong support 
from a diverse coalition that includes doctors, laboratories, 
hospitals, and diagnostic manufacturer organizations. I urge 
all of my colleagues to support this legislation.
    Ms. Van Meter, thank you for your testimony and your 
leadership on this bill and building such broad consensus. I 
would also like to thank Representative Hudson for his 
leadership on this legislation. I urge the committee to advance 
the reforms of the RESULTS Act and provide the relief for 
compounding payment cuts.
    Ms. Van Meter, can you speak briefly to the impact that 
these sustained cuts will have on access?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you, Dr. Joyce, for your question.
    Yes. We are tremendously concerned that these sustained 
cuts in an unstable payment system can lead to longer 
turnaround time for patients to get the results they deserve, 
to have test menus curtailed for those laboratories that 
focused on the most common routine tests that are essential to 
everyday care. Those tests disproportionately get cut. We worry 
about the viability of those laboratories.
    And then there is innovation. Innovation is tremendously 
important in diagnostics to help reduce costs overall and to--
--
    Mr. Joyce. And you and I recognize it, that innovation is 
the cornerstone of American medicine. Thank you.
    I would also be remiss if I didn't mention the compounding 
cuts and underpayments under the Medicare physician fee 
schedule that have continued to negatively impact seniors' 
access to their doctors and have forced more consolidation and 
even higher costs in our healthcare system. I have also become 
very concerned over the utilization of tools like AI going 
beyond the already onerous prior authorization process in both 
Medicare Advantage and Part D delaying and restricting 
necessary care. I look forward to working with my colleagues to 
address these pressing issues in a bipartisan process.
    And with that, my time has expired, and I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from New York, Ms. Ocasio-
Cortez.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you 
to our witnesses for being here today.
    I want to expand a bit on Representative Schrier's point 
earlier. It is so important that we acknowledge what is 
happening right now, particularly in the area of health. Just 3 
days ago, Secretary Kennedy stopped recommending life-saving 
childhood vaccines across the United States. And this includes 
hepatitis A, hepatitis B, and other vaccinations, including 
rotavirus, the leading cause of hospitalization in U.S. 
infants.
    Millions of babies across the United States are going to be 
at greater risk now than they were 3 days ago. And, in fact, we 
are already seeing the results of this. In 2025, just wrapping 
up the end of this last year, the United States has recorded 
more cases of measles than any year since 1993, in over 30 
years.
    And later this month, the United States in general may lose 
its official measles elimination status. It is back. And yet we 
are only cutting more vaccinations to allow increases and risk 
in increases in hepatitis A and B in babies across the country.
    These cuts are deeply concerning. But then on top of that, 
Secretary Kennedy is instituting some of the most devastating 
cuts to scientific research that we have ever seen. Independent 
scientific research is what provides us with new medical 
technologies and treatments and is critical to getting harmful 
products off the market, products that corporations will 
sometimes sell to consumers despite the fact that there are 
serious safety and health concerns.
    Mr. Lipschutz, you are a patient advocate, correct?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Correct.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. And I imagine that patients you have 
worked with have shared instances where corporations and 
healthcare conglomerates have not always acted in their best 
interests in mind, correct?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Correct.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. And we have seen large circumstances of 
this. And I want to break down why corporations stand to profit 
from RFK's cutting scientific research.
    Let's look at Johnson & Johnson, for example. They are 
known to manufacture talcum powder, more commonly known as baby 
powder. As early as 1971, top J&J executives knew that their 
talcum powder contained asbestos, a carcinogen that can cause 
ovarian cancer. But because they wanted to continue to profit 
off this product, the company hid the evidence.
    Or we can look at DuPont, which was dumping cancer-causing 
chemicals into our drinking water. These chemicals contained--
these chemicals caused cancer and birth defects.
    And both of these companies worked successfully to keep the 
public in the dark from scientific research proving their 
harms, all to protect their bottom line.
    Mr. Lipschutz, are you aware that J&J released falsified 
studies and suppressed and discredited research finding their 
product could be dangerous?
    Mr. Lipschutz. I am.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. And in 1976, Johnson & Johnson lied to 
Federal regulators stating their talcum powder was not toxic.
    And I use these examples because we even have instances of 
this that may be going on today. In fact, RFK himself had a 
personal history--allegedly had a personal history going after 
Monsanto around Roundup and pesticides.
    However, just after giving a closed-door--after giving 
closed-door listening tours where his only guests were biotech 
and pharma CEOs with products awaiting FDA approval, giving 
them private access instead of patients with doctors. On top of 
that, his AI-generated MAHA report has turned around on his own 
personal history on Roundup and instead parroted pesticide 
industry talking points rather than include any proposals to 
hold chemical companies accountable.
    He surrounded himself with top advisors who come from the 
for-profit wellness industry that set up the same exact 
conflict of interests that he says that he is rooting out.
    So in other words, he has done nothing except completely 
dismantle the system that provides independent public research. 
RFK is not cutting these cancer research and purging these 
scientists because they are corrupt. He is purging these 
scientists because he is.
    And I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Balderson, for 
his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Balderson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you all 
for being here this morning.
    My first question is for Mr. Ryan. I have heard from 
constituents and stakeholders alike that there is often 
difficulty in finding an oxygen supplier that carries the 
equipment and supplies for liquid oxygen, particularly portable 
liquid oxygen. While patients may still be able to obtain 
different equipment, they are often unable to leave their home 
except for a very limited period. Some do not have the 
appropriate equipment that would allow them to travel, even for 
something like a doctor's visit.
    Can you discuss how the SOAR Act would help address this 
problem?
    Mr. Ryan. Yes, certainly. And you are correct. Usage of 
liquid oxygen has gone down significantly over the years. 
Portable liquid oxygen is down 77 percent. Stationary liquid 
oxygen is down 80 percent.
    And the reason for this is the reimbursement. Reimbursement 
under the competitive bidding program would not allow suppliers 
to provide liquid oxygen. And there are a certain subset of 
patients that have high-liter flow needs that cannot be met 
with traditional portable oxygen concentrators, and certainly 
they have a high-liter flow need, it couldn't be met with the 
gaseous tanks. Those tanks wouldn't last quite as long.
    The SOAR Act would take all oxygen out of competitive 
bidding, which would be very helpful to get more technology in 
the sector, and it would treat liquid oxygen differently, and 
it would give it a much higher rate that would hopefully add to 
some expansion of the product category if necessary, set up a 
group that would kind of look together to see how this should 
be reimbursed in the future.
    It is a small group of patients, but these patients are the 
most, you know, fragile, and they can't get out and about, and 
they are--sometimes they are very young--even a younger 
population--pulmonary fibrosis requires such a high-liter flow 
that it can't be met. So they are tethered to their home.
    The SOAR Act would make an effort to take that away, give 
liquid a separate reimbursement, figure out what is the best as 
it goes in the future. And who knows? If we took oxygen out of 
competitive bidding like the SOAR Act is saying, we might put 
more technology back in that sector and have the technology in 
years to come with a portable oxygen concentrator provide 
higher-liter flow. So it is an excellent bill.
    Mr. Balderson. I agree. Thank you.
    My next question is for Ms. Van Meter. Thank you for being 
here this morning today.
    According to the Department of Health and Human Services 
Office and Inspector General, Medicare paid between 18 and 30 
percent more than other insurers for 20--for 20 high-volume 
and/or high-expenditure lab tests in 2011. I apologize. The 
Protecting Access to Medicare Act and its reform to the 
clinical laboratory fee schedule adjusted the rates to stop 
this excessive Medicaid spending. The RESULTS Act would address 
concerns with the underlying data collection and rate 
adjustment.
    If we continue to postpone data collection and 
reimbursement adjustments, do we risk returning to a situation 
like 2011, where Medicare is paying significantly higher rates 
for clinical tests than other insurers?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you for your question.
    That OIG report focused on, as you mentioned, 20 high-
volume tests, but looked at only three plans within the FEHBP. 
I would suggest that is a dearth of data from which we could 
draw broad generalizations about the differentiation between 
rates between Medicare and private payers.
    What the RESULTS Act would effectively do is establish 
reforms to the current CLFS and allow CMS to pull in 
comprehensive commercial market data, representative of all 
three segments of laboratory industry to give a much greater 
picture about if there is any difference between the Medicare 
rates and the commercial market rates and allow for Medicare 
rates to be more appropriately and accurately set.
    Mr. Balderson. Thank you. I will follow up with you. Rural 
hospitals act as a backbone for thousands of seniors living in 
the district that I--the 12th congressional district that I am 
fortunate enough to represent, providing them with timely, 
accessible, and affordable care. The RESULTS Act would prevent 
a 15 percent Medicare reimbursement cut for nearly 800 common 
clinical laboratory tests.
    How could this 15 percent cut in reimbursement impact rural 
hospitals and patients around the country? I have 30 seconds 
left.
    Ms. Van Meter. It would dramatically curtail access, reduce 
the--or increase turnaround time, and suppress innovation. But 
particularly for communities like the ones that you were 
mentioning, we worry significantly about any reduction in 
access to those patients within those communities that are 
served by rural hospitals. That infrastructure will be harmed 
by persistent reductions of that magnitude.
    Mr. Balderson. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman of Texas, Mr. Veasey, for his 
5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Veasey. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    And I am going to pivot away from these bills for a moment 
because I want to ask a question that Donald Trump posed to my 
colleagues yesterday: What have you done for America's health 
lately? The President asked my colleagues to look in the mirror 
and ask themselves, ``What have you done lately on 
healthcare?''
    Well, I am going to answer it for them. Just this week they 
stood by while RFK Jr. unilaterally revoked recommendations for 
vaccines against deadly diseases like flu, hepatitis, and 
meningitis. Even the very conservative Review and Outlook in 
the Wall Street Journal talked about some of these crazy moves 
that RFK is making.
    These are deadly diseases, and yet my colleagues have let 
the lunacy of pseudoscience overtake long-standing, objective 
medical truth, and that is the truth that children will die 
without these vaccines.
    And they are doing this as Texas and other States battle 
the worst measles outbreak that we have seen in decades, with 
more than 2,000 cases in 2025 alone. And this outbreak has 
killed children.
    Also this past week, Donald Trump--they allowed Donald 
Trump to freeze more than $10 billion in childcare funding. Not 
because of waste, not because of fraud, but because daycare 
workers refused to let a YouTuber harass babies and toddlers. A 
YouTuber. Damn. Let that sink in. Working families across the 
country won't be able to take their kids to daycare because of 
a YouTuber trying to be an influencer so they can put some 
money in their pocket. That was just this past week.
    Last year they terminated dozens of billions of dollars in 
cancer research. Then they led the charge and gleefully gouging 
more than $800 billion in Medicare dollars from children, 
mothers, and working families. And as if this weren't enough, 
my colleagues refuse to negotiate to lower insurance premiums 
for more than 22 million Americans. Add to that the reckless 
Medicaid cuts, and Republicans have robbed Americans blind of 
almost $1 trillion in healthcare dollars.
    And these are not coincidences. This is not incompetence. 
This is a Republican-manufactured health crisis. And let me be 
clear: This crisis was manufactured by my Republican 
colleagues, decision by decision, vote by vote.
    Now, despite my colleagues' obstruction, this afternoon 
Democrats will vote to protect the Affordable Care Act's 
premium tax credits because healthcare is not a game. Repeat: 
This is not a game. We have children's lives that are at stake.
    So I have to ask, how can we sit here today and talk about 
how Congress should support Medicare while Republicans do 
everything in their power to make sure America's children don't 
live long enough to even become Medicare beneficiaries?
    I appreciate that we are here to talk about serious 
policies that will improve Medicare for our seniors, but I 
can't separate that work from the reality that Republicans are 
actively undermining our healthcare system. Republicans are 
dismantling the system dollar by dollar, program by program, 
piece by piece, and it seems they won't be satisfied until 
nothing--nothing--is left.
    These assaults on America's healthcare are antichild. They 
are antifamily. They are anti-American. And so when the 
President told you to ask yourselves what have you done lately, 
I hope you will look hard in the mirror and that you are honest 
with yourselves about the reality of why we are here. You 
created this crisis, and American children are paying the 
price. American families are paying the price.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, witnesses, for bearing 
with me. I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from Iowa, Dr. Miller-Meeks, 
for her 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you 
to the witnesses for testifying before this subcommittee today. 
I appreciate the Health Subcommittee's focus on ensuring 
Medicare beneficiaries have reliable access to durable medical 
equipment, prosthetics, orthotics, and supplies, commonly known 
as DMEPOS, because for millions of patients, these items are 
essential to daily living and ongoing care.
    As a physician and nurse, I have seen firsthand how 
critical, timely access to oxygen equipment, mobility devices, 
and home medical supplies is to keep patients healthy and out 
of hospitals. When access to these services is disrupted, 
patient outcomes suffer and costs to the healthcare system 
increase. That is why I introduced H.R. 2005, the DMEPOS Relief 
Act. D
    MEPOS supplies, particularly small, independent providers 
and those serving rural communities, are under growing 
financial pressure due to inflation, workforce shortages, 
supply chain disruption, and Medicare reimbursement rates that 
have not kept pace with real-world costs. In many cases, 
suppliers are being forced to limit services or exit the 
Medicare program altogether, leaving beneficiaries with fewer 
options and longer wait times. The DMEPOS Relief Act provides 
targeted temporary payment relief to stabilize the supplier 
market and preserve beneficiary access without undermining 
program integrity or patient protection.
    The goal is simple: to ensure seniors and individuals with 
disabilities can continue receiving the equipment and supplies 
they need, where and when they need them.
    Today's hearing is an important opportunity to hear 
directly from providers and experts about how current payment 
policies are affecting patients and care delivery. I look 
forward to hearing more from our witnesses and how Congress can 
act responsibly to address these challenges and prevent further 
erosion of access, especially in rural and underserved areas.
    I hope this discussion will help inform bipartisan 
solutions that protect patients, strengthen home-based care, 
and ensure Medicare policies that reflect the realities facing 
providers and beneficiaries alike.
    Mr. Ryan, from the perspective of home medical equipment 
suppliers across the country, particularly small, independent 
providers and those serving rural communities, how are current 
Medicare DMEPOS reimbursement rates affecting beneficiary 
access to care? And how would targeted relief in H.R. 2005, the 
DMEPOS Relief Act, help stabilize access for patients who 
depend on these services?
    Mr. Ryan. Yeah. Thank you, Congresswoman.
    Let me just say, you know, when those rates cuts came into 
effect, again, we did a survey around the country of our 
membership, and some of the key findings were finding out that 
65 percent of the companies reduce the amount or type of 
products they offered, 46 percent reduced their service areas, 
53 percent laid off staff, 35 percent used personal savings to 
maintain that business. I know that route, did that myself. And 
over one in 10 surveyed said they will be out of business 
probably within a year.
    So those areas of the country, the nonbid, nonrural areas 
of the country, they woke up overnight and got a significant 
decrease, a 30 percent decrease, without getting an increase in 
market share.
    When I had my company in New York, I bid responsibly, and I 
lost 32 contracts and essentially went out of business. But at 
least when I bid, I had the option of potentially getting more 
market share. These areas of the country, those suppliers of 
the country didn't get any increased market share. In fact, 
competitive bidding for those legacy items is not, at this 
point, in effect. But they see these tremendous rates.
    So what has to happen is they have to look for less 
expensive equipment. Technology is going to be thwarted. At the 
end of the day, we are taking the patient-preferred, cost-
preferred setting in the home and bringing it down to a 
commodity. We used to spend 2.2 percent of Part B on DMEPOS. 
Now we are 1.3 percent.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, sir.
    Mr. Ryan. That number should be higher.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you. I have a question for Ms. 
Sullivan on H.R. 2172, Preserving Patient Access to Home 
Infusion Act, that I will submit for the record for you to 
answer. And also one on Medicare reimbursement rates affecting 
timely access to diagnostic testing for beneficiaries.
    Mr. Lipschutz, you were asked some questions about the ACA 
premium. So let me ask you, are the premiums for those who are 
not on the ACA exchanges, are those premiums increasing for 
those 130 to 160 million Americans?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Well, Congresswoman, I am more of an expert 
on Medicare than I am on the ACA----
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. The ACA is Medicaid and not Medicare, 
but the answer to that question would be yes. And so can you 
tell me the COVID-enhanced era tax credits with no income 
limits with subsidies that are going directly to profitable 
insurance companies--do extending those COVID-era tax credits 
lower premiums for those 130 to 160 million Americans?
    Mr. Lipschutz. I think it should be Congress's goal to 
lower premiums for people across the board and----
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. I wholeheartedly agree with you. Our 
goal should be to lower premiums. It is why we passed Lowering 
Health Care Premiums for All Americans Act, which my colleagues 
on the other side of the aisle voted against and, while in 
control of government for 4 years, did nothing to pass 
legislation to lower premiums for Americans. So the answer to 
the question is no, it does not lower premiums for 130 to 160 
Americans not on the ACA.
    With that, Mr. Chair, I yield. Thank you.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back. I now recognize 
the gentleman from Massachusetts, Mr. Auchincloss, for his 5 
minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Auchincloss. Thank you, Chairman. I want to begin by 
lifting up the poignant remarks from the gentleman from Texas, 
Mr. Veasey, about this committee's failure to do one of its 
fundamental jobs, which is to exercise oversight and 
accountability over Secretary Kennedy and Health and Human 
Services.
    We are whistling past the graveyard right now. He is, as he 
said he was going to do--there is no surprise here--gutting the 
childhood vaccination schedule. This will lead to an increase 
in morbidity and mortality from infectious disease for 
children. This is preventable. This is predictable. And it is 
going to be a tragedy.
    Shame on this committee for not acting. We have requested 
repeatedly oversight hearings over the Secretary, over FDA, 
over his actions with ASIP. There has been nothing. That needs 
to change in 2026.
    There is action that we can take, though, that is immediate 
and bipartisan, including with Secretary Kennedy, and that is 
on community health center funding. The community health 
centers are bipartisan priorities. And they are struggling 
through a period of acute financial uncertainty, with their 
Federal funding scheduled to expire in just 22 days on January 
30th, repeated short-term funding extensions that limit 
community health centers' ability to plan for their patients' 
needs and exacerbate the difficulty of working on already very 
tight margins.
    I know that this is true for Members on both sides of the 
aisle, that we value the work of our community health centers 
in our districts and we should take action to ensure they have 
the funding they need to be successful. And indeed we should be 
working on legislation to expand that funding and help them 
triple their reach across the United States. I hope we can work 
in a bipartisan way to provide long-term health center funding 
that protects patients' access to comprehensive primary care 
before the January 30th deadline.
    Moving to the issues at hand with this hearing: Mr. 
Lipschutz, I want to address my questions to you. You have 
talked in depth in both your written and oral testimony about 
the use of AI, how it can be instrumental and lifesaving, also 
dangerous if used inappropriately or excessively, and that is 
the case with the use of AI to evaluate prior authorization 
requirements. There's ongoing class action lawsuits from Cigna, 
UnitedHealthcare, and Humana about improperly denying claims, 
which is why I am working on legislation that would place 
guardrails around the use of AI for prior auth determinations 
in Medicaid-managed care plans and Medicare Part D plans.
    My legislation would require these plans to establish an 
electronic prior auth program, enabling them to meet the new 
timelines--timeliness--excuse me--requirements for plans' prior 
auth determinations. It would require full transparency about a 
plan's prior auth requirements and the clinical criteria used 
for decision making with public reporting to ensure audit 
capabilities and annual review of plans' utilization management 
trends.
    It will eliminate unnecessary prior auth reviews for 
certain providers, items or services for patients with 
conditions that require ongoing care. And it would implement 
guardrails by requiring only qualified physicians to make prior 
auth determinations, prohibiting retroactive denials, requiring 
a standardized appeals process, and mandating a 60-day advance 
notice for any changes in prior auth requirements.
    Mr. Lipschutz, recognizing your expertise in Medicare and 
understanding that you haven't been able to review the text of 
what I am proposing, but just hearing those broad outlines, do 
you think that could be an effective addition to prior auth 
legislation for Medicaid MCOs and Medicare Part D?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Yes. It would be an important start in 
trying to rein in inappropriate use of AI.
    Mr. Auchincloss. Anything I am missing that I should be 
considering?
    Mr. Lipschutz. I think we should ask the question of 
whether or not these tools actually do learn from their own 
mistakes. I can elaborate unless you have further questions.
    Mr. Auchincloss. If I could, let me try to--what I think I 
hear you saying is whether the models are purely tokenized LLMs 
where they are making just predictions or whether they actually 
have a worldview, whether they are world models that actually 
feel like they have inherent logic and are learning.
    Mr. Lipschutz. Let me give an example. So, in the Medicare 
Advantage context, we often see plans deny care--ongoing care 
in a skilled nursing facility. Say, initially, care is 
authorized. The plan will come back and prematurely terminate 
coverage. A person, if they appeal--they often win, but then 
the next day or a few days later, they get another denial----
    Mr. Auchincloss. So it is just a----
    Mr. Lipschutz [continuing]. And no change in condition. So 
we are unconvinced that the machine learning tools are learning 
from their own mistakes and accounting for them.
    Mr. Auchincloss. Helpful. Thank you, sir.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from Louisiana, Mr. Carter, 
for his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Carter of Louisiana. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank 
you to the witnesses for participating today.
    We are in this committee today discussing various proposals 
that would improve access to healthcare services covered by 
Medicare while seniors, families, and small business owners 
across the country saw their premiums skyrocket last month 
after Republicans failed to extend the ACA tax credit--premium 
tax credits before January 1. These tax credits are a lifeline 
and help make healthcare coverage affordable at times when the 
cost of living continues to climb.
    I stand with Leader Jeffries and my Democratic colleagues 
on this committee as we continue to fix and fight for an 
extension of the tax credits to make healthcare affordable for 
all Americans--and I underscore all Americans. Not Democrats, 
not Republicans, not independents, but all Americans. The 
fallacy that this only impacts some and doesn't impact others 
is something that we must at all costs dismiss.
    Mr. Lipschutz, thank you for joining us. Louisiana has one 
of the highest percentage of MA enrollees in the country, many 
of whom live in my district. Given how many of my constituents 
get their healthcare through MA plans, it is important to me 
that they have the information they need to make the best 
decision about their healthcare, which also includes choosing 
the supplemental benefits that best meets their needs.
    Can you talk more about how collecting supplemental benefit 
data from MA plans help seniors and why it is important for 
these plans to notify beneficiaries of their benefits?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Thank you for the question. So Medicare 
Advantage plans use their considerable payments in part to 
offer supplemental benefits to their enrollees. They often use 
these supplemental benefits heavily in marketing to try to 
entice people to enroll. Oftentimes, for example, we will hear 
about people drawn to so-called flex cards that are essentially 
debit cards that, among other things, could be used to purchase 
over-the-counter items.
    And we hear stories of people contacting the SHIP programs, 
State Health Insurance Assistance Programs, asking what plan 
will give them the highest-value card while disregarding all 
the more important considerations like do my doctors contract 
with the plan, what services are covered, what kind of prior 
authorization will I be subject to?
    We also hear from folks who are drawn to supplemental 
benefits--say, a dental benefit, for example--but when they are 
enrolled in the plan, they find out that they have trouble 
getting--finding a provider that will take their plan, or their 
services are capped at a far lower level than they believed.
    So what this bill would do would help gather information to 
give the public and give the Medicare program a better idea of 
what services are being offered, who is using them and to what 
extent, how much it is costing folks, and if people are 
actually getting value out of these services for which we pay 
plans considerably.
    Mr. Carter of Louisiana. So how do we better educate? 
Because we know that many people are either hoodwinked into 
going into, as you suggested, a plan that has greater variables 
that may not very well be the best fit for their true medical 
coverage. How do we--listening from this committee and working 
with our other agencies back home, how do we do a better job at 
making sure that we educate people on these MA options?
    Mr. Lipschutz. So we just discussed one of the bills being 
evaluated today that would increase requirements for collection 
of data on supplemental benefits. I will pivot to the other 
bill that would extend MIPPA funding for key community health 
organizations like State Health Insurance Assistance Programs, 
AAAs, ADRCs, and others. Part of that funding goes exactly 
towards trying to provide people with information about their 
Medicare coverage options primarily through the SHIP programs.
    The best way, in my view, to help educate people is to 
invest even more into the SHIP program, which is really the 
only source of pure, unbiased information where counselors--
they have no stake in someone's decision. They have no 
financial stake.
    Contrast that with the billions of dollars spent annually 
on marketing and commissions all aimed to try to convince 
people to enroll in certain plans to the benefit of the people 
who are paying those commissions and ads but not necessarily to 
the benefit of enrollees.
    So we need more unbiased, neutral information that can help 
people understand their options, and that is where I would 
suggest Congress focus its attention.
    Mr. Carter of Louisiana. Hence the transparency measure 
that my dear colleague Jennifer McClellan will be offering, and 
I fully support the Representative's effort because it makes 
all the sense in the world to create--we talk about 
transparency all the time, but it seems to be more selective 
than it should be.
    Transparency should be universal. This measure will, in 
fact, do that. It will save lots of money and opportunities for 
people to be better educated and have the healthcare more 
accessible.
    Thank you very much. My time is up. I yield.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Landsman, for 
his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Landsman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member, for 
this hearing. I thank all of you for being here and offering 
your expertise. A lot of good bills.
    I want to give a little bit of context for our bill. As you 
know, Medicare provides healthcare for tens of millions of 
seniors. It is one of the most significant things we do as a 
community of Americans, is provide healthcare in general but in 
particular to our seniors. And it is an earned benefit. Folks 
pay into the system.
    The WISeR pilot picked six States--Ohio included--to test 
whether or not the following is a good idea: To use AI to deny 
healthcare to seniors. Now, this is the first time to my 
knowledge that Medicare is using AI for anything. And I have 
been sitting here listening to all of you thinking of all kinds 
of great uses of AI, the paperwork and billing and all kinds of 
other things that would help you all provide better healthcare. 
The first time they are going to use AI is to deny healthcare 
to seniors.
    And they will say, well, this is the low-hanging fruit, it 
is really basic stuff, to which I would say, then why do you 
need AI? Why not just say this is low-hanging fruit and we are 
going to make these changes? There is something very suspicious 
going on, which is to say they are going to use AI in this 
context, hoping that no one would notice because it is low-
hanging fruit, and then expand it to the kind of healthcare 
decisions that will lead to life-and-death decisions or 
situations.
    And that is why this is being called by many, many people 
these AI death panels because AI is going to make decisions on 
whether or not somebody gets the healthcare they need, and that 
decision may lead to that person losing their life.
    So, on top of that, there is an incentive to deny care that 
for-profit companies get. They are going to get a percentage of 
the money saved when they deny it. So very perverse. Very 
problematic.
    My bill prohibits HHS from doing WISeR, from testing WISeR, 
using AI to deny care in Medicare. There is immediate confusion 
and concern, just so you know, not surprisingly. There is no 
transparency, or little transparency. So the big pieces here 
are the financial incentive model. No one knows what is in it. 
They do know that the burden will be on the provider.
    So here I am a doctor and I am providing healthcare to a 
senior using Medicare. It gets denied. I am now on the hook. So 
you are going to have all these doctors who just stop providing 
certain care.
    And then the lines of code that will be deciding whether or 
not somebody gets healthcare--which is insane--there is no 
transparency for that either. We don't know whether or not it 
is a learning model or if it is just, you know, pretty basic 
stuff that is just denying what it is going to--what it has 
been told to deny.
    In any event, the--you know, one of the things that came up 
is just how often people get denied claims wrongfully. Why not 
use AI to stop that, to stop the wrongful, you know, denials of 
claims? Instead, they are using AI to deny healthcare.
    I would encourage all of my colleagues to think about how 
important this is to bring this bill to the floor or to this 
committee up for a vote and to make it unanimous, bipartisan. 
There are lots of ways to deal with the denial situation. 
Adding AI and for-profit companies and these financial 
incentives is a disaster, and we should stop it.
    I would ask any of you if you know of the coding or the 
financial modeling behind this. I mean, is there--does anyone 
know? Because my providers have no idea what is going on.
    Mr. Lipschutz. Congressman, I think the only thing that we 
do know is that these vendors that have been hired to 
participate in the WISeR model, as you noted, have a financial 
stake in denying care. They benefit when care is withheld, 
which is exactly the wrong model to be using in healthcare, 
particularly with the Medicare population.
    Mr. Landsman. I couldn't agree more, and I yield back. 
Thank you.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from New Jersey, Mr. Kean, 
for his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Kean. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate this 
committee's efforts to educate all of us on legislation that 
could help our seniors who rely on Medicare. I support H.R. 
5269, the RESULTS Act.
    The bill has been introduced by my colleague from North 
Carolina, Representative Hudson. This bill would make vital 
reforms to Medicare's Clinical Lab Fee Schedule, which pays for 
lab tests New Jersey seniors rely on for routine care and for 
diagnosis of more complex conditions like cancer. In New 
Jersey, there are over 2,300 laboratories. In my district, 
there are over 200.
    Ms. Van Meter, can you articulate the urgency of reform 
needed for Medicare's Clinical Lab Fee Schedule?
    Ms. Van Meter. Yes. Thank you, Congressman. On January 31, 
about 800 tests will get cut by up to 15 percent. The cuts are 
going to hit tests that are among the most routine that 
Medicare beneficiaries rely on every day. Those kinds of 
reductions will have an impact on beneficiary access to 
services and will also stifle innovation in the next generation 
of diagnostics those same patients need and deserve.
    Mr. Kean. Thank you. In New Jersey, as a followup on this, 
we have several companies with great employees who are 
developing new diagnostics to ease the process of diagnosing 
suffering patients. These include companies like WuXi 
Diagnostics or Thermo Fisher.
    In your testimony, you mentioned innovations in biomarker 
testing or rapid whole genome sequencing. First, can you 
explain to us the exciting hope that these new tests can 
promise patients, including those with rare diseases?
    Ms. Van Meter. Absolutely. Biomarker tests can be used in a 
variety of conditions and diseases--cardiac, neurological, 
cancers, many others--and it is the foundation for precision 
medicine; in other words, being able to plot a personalized 
course for patients on the best medicines and best treatments 
for their particular condition. We are seeing tremendous growth 
in this field bringing treatments and improvements and saving 
lives for patients.
    With rapid whole genome sequencing, that technology is 
uniquely situated to diagnose rare diseases. Thousands of rare 
diseases can be diagnosed using this technology that is 
essential for patients who are living with such diseases and 
conditions.
    Mr. Kean. And can you explain how the current Medicare 
Clinical Lab Fee Schedule under PAMA is affecting the 
development of these tests and the ability of these patients to 
access them?
    Ms. Van Meter. The key to ensuring that we have long-range 
research and development is a stable and predictable Medicare 
payment system, and we do not have that right now under PAMA. 
There are years of cuts that have taken effect, and there is a 
constant threat of deep reductions over the field.
    While innovation has been happening, with that threat of 
constant cuts, looking out for long-term research and 
development certainly is compromised, and that includes the 
work that we can do in biomarker testing and beyond.
    Mr. Kean. So, currently, CMS would rely upon data from 7 
years ago, 2019, to determine the reimbursement rates for lab 
tests. In your testimony, you write that around one-third of 
lab testing codes are new since 2019.
    Without some type of changes to the current system, could 
you give us your thoughts on how realistic it would be to 
expect CMS to gather stakeholder input individually to 
determine the price of each one of these codes, and what impact 
would further delays on these repricings have?
    Ms. Van Meter. It is an excellent question. So, yes, 
because there is constant innovation, there's been hundreds of 
new codes that have been established since the last data 
collection period, but that would not be captured within the 
2019 data that labs are due to report come February 1, and CMS 
will not have any commercial market data upon which to make any 
changes to those rates for those tests that have been 
established since 2019.
    We have consulted with CMS. We have encouraged them to use 
the rates that have been set to date. We think it is beyond the 
scope of what is reasonable for the agency to do to really 
update those rates. They should be maintained. But, most 
importantly, if we move forward with the RESULTS Act, that 
becomes a moot issue.
    Mr. Kean. Thank you to all of our witnesses for being here 
today and your valuable insights.
    I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Griffith. I thank the gentleman for yielding back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from Massachusetts, Mrs. 
Trahan, for her 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to the 
witnesses for being here today.
    You know, it is refreshing that this subcommittee is 
finally doing the work that the American people expect us to 
do. The last time that we met was September 18, 112 days ago. 
Even as families were staring down the barrel of a healthcare 
price hike that was entirely created by Republicans' failure to 
meaningfully extend the ACA premium tax credits--nothing, not a 
single official action from this subcommittee with direct 
jurisdiction over Americans' healthcare, even as RFK Jr. puts 
our children at risk of death, hospitalization, and illness as 
he dismantles vaccine policy in our country.
    Instead, House Republicans passed a bill to make this 
crisis that they created even worse, increasing premiums for 
millions of Americans, raising the number of uninsured by an 
average of 100,000 people each year, according to CBO, and 
ignoring the ACA tax credits altogether.
    You know, Mr. Chairman, in 2025, 24 million individuals 
obtained health insurance through the ACA marketplace, and it 
is estimated that 22 million of them received tax credits that 
helped reduce costs. Without these subsidies, premiums are 
skyrocketing, increasing by an average of 114 percent. That is 
hundreds or even thousands of dollars every month. And, like 
all of my colleagues, my office is being inundated with 
messages from constituents facing that massive sticker shock.
    A 54-year-old woman on disability says that her cheapest 
plan is jumping from $250 to $570 a month, forcing her to 
considering dropping her coverage. A 61-year-old forced into 
early retirement says his family's premiums are already $1,600 
a month and rising another 11 percent next year with a $3,000 
deductible on top of that, making healthcare his largest 
household expense before he reaches Medicare age. And one 
constituent who relies on premium tax credits says their 
premiums are set to triple, from $300 to $900 per month.
    This is all on top of the more than $1 trillion in Medicaid 
cuts Republicans already passed last summer to pay for tax cuts 
for the wealthy, cuts that will push millions off coverage and 
make it harder for seniors, people with disability, and low-
income families to get the care they need.
    So, Mr. Chairman, we all know that these policies will not 
only push people off coverage, but it also exacerbates our 
physician shortage and accelerates hospital closures. That is 
why the authors of the Big Ugly Bill included a $50 billion 
rural health fund to try to offset the expected 137 billion 
reduction in Federal Medicaid spending in rural communities. 
That is the very definition of a Band-Aid on a bullet wound.
    And, if it hasn't been made clear already, it should be 
now. House Republicans have shown that protecting Americans' 
healthcare is just simply not a priority. Policies are pushing 
people off coverage, driving up their costs, and destabilizing 
the very providers that our communities rely on.
    With that reality in mind, I want to turn to a couple of 
specific Medicare payment policies where decisions we make in 
this room in this committee can help stabilize care. The PURE 
Act aims to improve access to portable diagnostic imaging for 
seniors and medically fragile patients who can't easily travel 
for care. These services allow clinicians to evaluate serious 
conditions directly at the bedside. But, unlike portable x ray, 
Medicare does not reimburse transportation costs for portable 
ultrasounds, making it harder to bring timely diagnoses to 
patients or provide diagnostics to patients.
    Mr. Ryan, how important is timely access to diagnostic 
services for seniors and medically fragile patients, 
particularly when it comes to catching problems early, avoiding 
unnecessary hospitalizations, and reducing long stays?
    Mr. Ryan. Yeah. It is obviously very, very important. As I 
continue to talk about today, care in the home is extremely 
important. It is where the dollars should be going these days. 
It is where the infrastructure should be building up. And, 
certainly, knowing travel time and what it costs to do travel 
time and using it as an example for, you know, repairing 
wheelchairs, where you get wrench time, you only get paid for 
the time you are in the home and actually fixing the chair. I 
can certainly empathize with that industry for wanting to get 
some sort of a reimbursement for that travel time.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you. Seniors and other Medicare patients 
must continue to have that access to vital testing used to 
diagnose, monitor, and manage diseases such as diabetes, heart 
disease, and cancer.
    Ms. Van Meter, I am not sure if you will have time to 
answer, but I will get my question on the record. Under current 
law, Medicare reimbursements for lab testing continues to face 
significant downward pressure.
    How have those cuts already affected laboratories' ability 
to serve seniors, and how would the RESULTS Act help protect 
access to diagnostic tests patients rely on to detect and 
manage disease?
    Mr. Griffith. If you can do it quickly.
    Ms. Van Meter. It is compromising access and stifling 
innovation. Having a stable payment system that the RESULTS Act 
would bring to bear would do a tremendous amount to ensure that 
patient access.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you.
    I yield back, Chair.
    Mr. Griffith. I thank the gentlelady. She has yielded back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from New York, Mr. 
Langworthy, for his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Langworthy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    For millions of our seniors, access to Medicare services is 
only as good as the payment policies behind them, and when 
those policies fail to keep pace with modern care delivery, the 
patients feel it first through delayed services, fewer provider 
options, and reduced access to care in their communities. 
Across the country, providers are telling us the same thing: 
Outdated reimbursement rules and rigid payment schedules are 
making it harder to deliver care where patients need it the 
most, which is at home, close to family, and outside of 
institutional settings.
    And, with that, Ms. Sullivan, my district covers a large 
stretch of rural communities where a simple infusion 
appointment could easily turn into an all-day ordeal for 
patients and caregivers, family that have to be responsible for 
transportation, and in the winter especially. You know, I 
represent western New York and the southern tier of New York, 
where it is a harsh winter.
    Weather and road conditions can make repeated trips to a 
hospital outpatient department unrealistic. And missing doses 
isn't just inconvenient. It can derail the treatment plan of a 
patient. When Medicare doesn't make the home option dependable, 
the system too often defaults patients into a more inconvenient 
setting simply because it is the only workable way to complete 
their treatment.
    Ms. Sullivan, can you explain how the Preserving Patient 
Access to Home Infusion Act would help keep Medicare patients 
on track with treatment for patients that are a long ways away 
from their next hospital campus or infusion center, so that 
their care isn't determined by weather or logistics but by what 
their doctor believes is safest for them?
    Ms. Sullivan. Thank you, Congressman, for the question. 
Home infusion operates on a model that is incredibly efficient 
in that we rely on the pharmacy to provide that support and the 
continuity of care for patients so that they can independently 
infuse their medications at home. They don't rely on a nurse 
regularly.
    The nurse visits periodically to make sure things are on 
track, to lay eyes on the patient. Maybe they have a wound or 
something that needs to be assessed to make sure it is healing 
properly. But the support really comes from the pharmacy on a 
daily basis and largely happens behind the scenes.
    The Medicare program's benefit is so fragmented, which was 
confirmed by the GAO report that I mentioned in my opening 
remarks, that they pay for only the services that happen in the 
home, which are the most infrequent of the services that occur 
with a home infusion patient. So the pharmacy is working behind 
the scenes, communicating with the physician, monitoring the 
labs, making sure everything is working properly for that 
patient and can communicate with them without the patient 
needing to travel, without needing to send resources to the 
home. So it is an efficient model that has been widely adopted 
in the commercial market.
    And you would think with almost a million beneficiaries 
under the Medicare program being sent to hospital outpatient 
departments for these infusions, the hospitals would not want 
to lose that. In fact, most health systems have signed letters 
of support of this particular legislation because they 
recognize these are not patients that need to be there, that 
they have other patients that are--that would better benefit 
from their resources. And so it is one of those commonsense 
solutions that helps patients, helps our health systems, and 
uses appropriate resources.
    Mr. Langworthy. The keyword is common sense.
    Ms. Van Meter, as you know, Medicare lab payments are still 
based on outdated data that fails to reflect real costs, and in 
just 25 days labs could be hit with payment cuts of up to 15 
percent across hundreds of tests, making it harder to deliver 
timely and accurate care. What are some of the unique 
challenges that these payment cuts create for labs serving 
rural communities or other vulnerable populations like those in 
nursing homes?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you for the question. The 
infrastructure that exists in rural or frontier communities may 
not be as robust as is ideal. Right now, we have patient 
service centers, there are hospital laboratories, physician 
office labs, and obviously large commercial labs that have 
capacity to move samples around the country, but if the cuts go 
into effect we worry that that infrastructure will be 
compromised: fewer patient service centers, smaller menus, 
longer turnaround time.
    We need those tests to be timely in order to make clinical 
judgments about the right pathway for care. So we are concerned 
about patient access to those services across the country but 
certainly in rural and frontier communities.
    Mr. Langworthy. Thank you. I am a proud cosponsor of the 
RESULTS Act, which is a commonsense fix to prevent these 
payment cuts while reducing the administrative burden on 
laboratories and CMS.
    And, finally, Mr. Ryan, last year AAHomecare conducted a 
survey on the impact of the 2024 payment cuts on durable 
medical equipment. Could you briefly summarize your findings in 
the remaining time?
    Mr. Ryan. Well, we discussed this earlier today, Mr. 
Congressman. But, certainly, when those 75/25 rate cuts went 
into effect--again, this is in the nonrural, nonbid area of the 
country that--when they woke up overnight and just saw a 50 
percent cut, a 75 percent cut, and we had Congress intervene 
twice to make sure those cuts were not in place and the 75/25 
rate remained in place.
    Well, since they have stopped, the key findings are that 65 
percent of the products have been reduced. The companies are 
offering fewer products. Forty-six percent reduced their 
service area, 53 percent laid off staff, 35 percent used 
personal savings to maintain the business, and one in 10 
surveyed said they would be entirely out of business within a 
year.
    Mr. Langworthy. Well, thank you. Thank you for bringing 
that up, and I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    We now enter into the next phase, where we go to Ms. Matsui 
for her 5 minutes of questioning.
    Ms. Matsui. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I want to 
thank the witnesses for being here today.
    I am glad to be here discussing this bipartisan slate of 
bills. I am especially excited to discuss my bill, the Senior 
Savings Protection Act, but I would like to echo my colleagues. 
This hearing misses the point. We are in a full-blown 
healthcare crisis.
    On January 1, over 20 million Americans saw their premiums 
skyrocket. They are facing a dire choice: Pay crushing premiums 
or risk going without coverage to afford other basic 
necessities. They have been begging Congress to act. Instead, 
House Republicans have refused to extend premium tax credits 
and pushed a sham of a bill that would cut even more people off 
care. That managed for what we are discussing today.
    My bill focuses on helping Medicare beneficiaries afford 
their care, but we can't ignore the millions of older Americans 
who aren't yet eligible for Medicare. Nearly 5 million older 
Americans age 50 to 64 rely on the ACA marketplace for their 
healthcare. In my jurisdiction, a 60-year-old couple making 
$150,000 annually just saw their premiums jump from about $800 
a month to over $2,500 a month. Where are they supposed to find 
another $20,000 a year to afford healthcare?
    When premiums skyrocket, despite--when premiums skyrocket, 
people just delay care. That means a sicker Medicare 
population, more preventable ER visits, and higher costs down 
the line. It is all connected, and we all need to govern like 
it is, but Republicans are intent on ripping benefits from 
hardworking Americans. It is even more important that we ensure 
people maximize the benefits available to them.
    That brings me to my bill, the Senior Savings Protection 
Act. Congress has created programs to help low-income Medicare 
beneficiaries afford their care. The IRA expanded and added new 
programs to support seniors, but millions of Medicare 
beneficiaries eligible for these programs aren't enrolled in 
California, especially--I will bring that up because there are 
over 2.3 million Medicare beneficiaries eligible for Extra 
Help, but less than 300,000 are enrolled.
    Mr. Lipschutz, how do programs like the Low-Income Subsidy 
or Extra Help and the IRA smoothing provision help seniors 
afford their healthcare?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Thank you for the question, Congresswoman. 
As you noted, Congress created these programs to help Medicare 
beneficiaries afford some of their healthcare expenses. Part D 
Low-Income Subsidy for those who meet the income and asset test 
is able to pay for Medicare premiums and much of the cost 
sharing under the Part D benefit. The smoothing provision that 
you mentioned from the Inflation Reduction Act allows 
beneficiaries to spread their prescription costs over the 
course of the calendar year. It is most helpful for people who 
have high out-of-pocket expenses earlier in the year.
    Ms. Matsui. Right.
    Mr. Lipschutz. I would add to that list the Medicare 
Savings Programs as well----
    Ms. Matsui. Yes. Right.
    Mr. Lipschutz [continuing]. For folks who qualify for them.
    Ms. Matsui. Well, that is why I introduced the Senior 
Savings Protection Act along with Congressman Bilirakis. This 
bipartisan bill reauthorizes funding for outreach in their own 
activities to help low-income Medicare beneficiaries understand 
all their options and enroll in the plan that works for them.
    Mr. Lipschutz, how do State- and community-based 
organizations use these funds to help low-income Medicare 
beneficiaries?
    Mr. Lipschutz. The MIPPA funds is spread between SHIP 
programs--HICAP in California--AAAs, ADRCs, and benefit 
enrollment centers. What these programs do is try to connect 
people in the community with Federal, State, and local programs 
that can help them pay for their daily needs.
    Ms. Matsui. Right.
    Mr. Lipschutz. That ranges from assistance with cost 
sharing like the Medicare Savings Programs and Part D LIS, and 
some of these other entities also help evaluate eligibility for 
LIHEAP services, heating and cooling, and SNAP benefits.
    Ms. Matsui. Well, absolutely. And programs like this are 
really the only nonbiased way of--source of medical enrollment 
assistance and especially as there is a lot of misleading and 
fraudulent advertising that runs rampant.
    I really, really do emphasize, Mr. Chair, how important a 
bill like this is in order to make sure that Medicare 
beneficiaries are protected and understand what their resources 
are.
    So thank you, Mr. Chair. I hope we can advance this 
critical bipartisan bill to a markup soon, and I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Crenshaw, for 
his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Crenshaw. Thank you. Thank you all for being here.
    I will start with Mr. Ryan. You know, in a State like 
Texas, there is a large share of nursing homes and assisted 
living facilities located in rural areas. How does portable 
ultrasound help ensure seniors receive that timely diagnostic 
care without being transported long distances?
    Mr. Ryan. I mean, I don't know much about your bill. I am 
sorry, Congressman. But I, again, believe in care in the home. 
I think it is, you know, patient preferred, cost effective. So 
having the ability to have portable, you know, imaging in the 
home would be something that is very, very important.
    Mr. Crenshaw. OK. I thought you would have more of an 
answer for that. Would you think that being able to bring it to 
the patient would bring costs down?
    Mr. Ryan. I am sorry. Could you repeat that, sir?
    Mr. Crenshaw. Bringing this kind of technology to the 
patient, would that overall bring costs down?
    Mr. Ryan. Newer technology that could be done in a home 
care setting, I think, at the end of the day, should certainly 
be able to bring costs down, not being a subject matter on this 
particular product.
    Mr. Crenshaw. No problem.
    Ms. Van Meter, what differences do you see in how current 
payment policies affect hospital-based laboratories, physician 
office laboratories, and independent laboratories, and why does 
that matter for patients?
    Ms. Van Meter. Well, the current Medicare payment system, 
the Clinical Laboratory Fee Schedule, has suffered from years 
of deep reductions. It is the only Medicare payment system that 
is designed to be based on commercial market rates but has 
failed to do so because it has collected lackluster data. Only 
1 percent of laboratory data was used to set rates, and we are 
still living under data that is from 2016.
    So it has a compromising effect in terms of long-range 
innovation--or investment in innovation. We appreciate that 
Congress has stepped in and has halted reductions. We believe 
that the RESULTS Act that has been discussed today is the right 
approach to allowing there to be stability in that payment 
system to ensure patient access, to have swift turnaround 
times, innovation and testing, and broad patient access.
    Mr. Crenshaw. OK. Thank you.
    And, Ms. Sullivan, from the patients' perspective, how does 
the availability of home infusion services influence where 
seniors ultimately receive care, particularly when managing 
complex and chronic conditions?
    Ms. Sullivan. Thank you, Congressman. The range of 
medications that are available to patients in the home if you 
have commercial insurance reaches above 300 different 
individual medications. Unfortunately for Medicare 
beneficiaries, they are limited to a handful of drugs that 
are--that use the--an item of DME or an infusion pump to be 
administered. So they live with much more restricted access 
under the Medicare program.
    If they were to have access at least to IV antibiotics, we 
estimate it would change the lives of many beneficiaries and 
just open the options up for them to receive care at home 
rather than driving back and forth to facilities or being 
admitted to long-term care facilities.
    Mr. Crenshaw. Can you comment on how that might effect 
long-term cost savings? Do you think it remains neutral? Do you 
think it saves costs?
    Ms. Sullivan. Yes. Excellent question. Historically, the 
Congressional Budget Office has scored home infusion 
legislation as something that would generate savings. We are 
still waiting for an updated score on the provisions in this 
bill. However, you know, we have--when we look at care in a 
setting such as hospital admission or in outpatient departments 
or urgent cares, generally we feel confident that home would be 
a more efficient model for those patients.
    Mr. Crenshaw. OK. Thank you for those answers.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from Indiana, Mrs. Houchin, 
for her 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Houchin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to our 
witnesses for being here today to discuss a fundamental 
responsibility of this committee to ensure that the Medicare 
program actually works for patients and the providers who rely 
on it every day.
    In States like Indiana where rural hospitals and community 
health centers and independent providers are often the primary 
source of care, Medicare payment policy determines whether 
services are available at all. Community health centers and 
rural providers are often the first to feel the downstream 
effects of reimbursement cuts, the administrative burden, and 
rigid coverage rules. These pressures also trickle down to 
patients and show up in real and tangible ways,for example, 
with our durable medical equipment providers as well.
    During COVID, my State cut benefits to home health oxygen 
and cut reimbursement rates for home health oxygen during a 
time when people were required to stay home and even during 
research that suggested that putting people on ventilators in 
hospitals was maybe not the best course of treatment.
    So I want us to--I want to thank the committee and the 
chairman for bringing these issues to the attention of the 
committee in a legislative manner. I know that some colleagues 
have discussed home infusion therapy, so I want to touch on 
that a little bit.
    As we have heard, it allows seniors to receive medically 
necessary treatment safely in their homes, helping them avoid 
more costly or facility-based care. Yet the Medicare current 
home infusion benefit often falls short of supporting the kind 
of care patients deserve, much like we saw during the home 
health durable medical equipment cuts that we saw during COVID. 
Under current policy, Medicare generally only pays for home 
infusion services on days when a clinician is physically 
present in the home even though patients still require care 
coordination, monitoring, and clinical oversight on noninfusion 
days.
    Ms. Sullivan, can you explain how the Preserving Patient 
Access to Home Infusion Act helps make it more realistic for 
Medicare patients to receive infusion therapy at home when 
their doctor wants them to be treated there?
    Ms. Sullivan. Thank you so much, Congresswoman. Basically, 
the Preserving Patient Access to Home Infusion Act is going to 
do a couple fundamental things.
    Number one, it is going to eliminate some of the 
fragmentation that exists in the current benefit and remove the 
restriction for the face-to-face requirements. We find that, 
basically, those restrictions are so limiting that there are 
fewer than 70 providers across the country that are 
participating in the benefit today, which essentially means 
that patients in most areas are not accessing this benefit, and 
in some States there are no patients accessing this benefit and 
no providers offering the benefit. It is just simply 
unsustainable and is not creating access.
    Mrs. Houchin. Does that lead to--the face-to-face 
requirements, does it lead to unnecessary treatment delays?
    Ms. Sullivan. I think it is probably closer to no treatment 
versus a delayed treatment. It is so limited in terms of the 
scope that it leaves out--I have spoken a lot about IV 
antibiotics, which is the largest subset of medications that 
are the most common home infusion drugs today. Infections are 
common. They happen. And we find that because those are just 
off the table with Medicare that those patients just don't--
aren't presented with the option at all to go home, so they 
have to go somewhere else to get that care.
    Mrs. Houchin. Understood. Thank you.
    And, to Ms. Van Meter, community health centers and other 
providers in rural areas rely on local and independent 
laboratories to deliver timely diagnostic services.
    How have repeated delays and uncertainty around the 
Clinical Laboratory Fee Schedule affected labs that serve rural 
areas of the country in particular?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you for the question. For small 
independent laboratories, these are often laboratories that 
offer the most common, routine tests upon which Medicare 
beneficiaries and their physicians rely. Those are core 
services, and it is those types of tests that are going to bear 
the brunt of the next fourth round of reductions under PAMA 
that will take place on December 31--or pardon me--January 31, 
and that is after 3 years of reductions. So we worry about the 
capacity of the laboratories to have as broad a menu as 
possible and, in some cases, to really continue to operate in a 
small community.
    Mrs. Houchin. Thank you. I look forward to working when my 
colleagues to provide long-term healthcare funding that 
protects patients and their access to comprehensive primary 
care that includes home healthcare.
    Thank you so much. I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from Florida.
    She passes.
    I recognize--actually, it goes over here. I recognize the 
gentlelady from Virginia for her 5 minutes of questioning.
    Ms. McClellan. Thank you, Chairman Griffith, and to Ranking 
Member DeGette for holding this timely hearing.
    As we have already talked about, across the country 
millions of Americans are facing soaring healthcare premiums 
and higher out-of-pocket costs as the new year is beginning, 
and today approximately 22 million Americans who rely on the 
Affordable Care Act marketplace coverage have lost their 
enhanced premium tax credits that kept that coverage affordable 
due to the Republicans' refusal to act before now.
    In Virginia, this includes small business owners, their 
employees, the self-employed, farmers, retailers, 
restaurateurs, and people like my constituent Bobby Conner from 
rural Brunswick County, who is 3 years away from Medicare. Last 
year, he paid $34 a month for his premium. This year, with the 
tax credit, it would have gone to $92 a month. Without the tax 
credit, he is facing a premium that is $1,700 a month.
    Lester and Yolanda Johnson and their 3-year-old daughter, 
who are the owners of the Mama J's restaurant in Richmond, have 
gone from paying $700 a month for their family of three to now 
$1,400 a month. And this comes at the height of an 
affordability crisis in the United States as groceries, gas, 
rent, and now healthcare costs are rising, squeezing families' 
budgets and prompting impossible choices between coverage and 
basic necessities. More than half of American families lack the 
resources to live securely in their communities, with grocery 
prices up 32 percent since 2019 and the lowest-price ACA 
marketplace Silver plan up 41 percent.
    This affordability crisis isn't limited to working-age 
Americans. Seniors enrolled in Medicare Advantage, which now 
covers more than half of all Medicare beneficiaries, are also 
navigating rising costs and making difficult choices to afford 
prescriptions and provider visits.
    I am glad the committee is considering my H.R. 5243, which 
would require companies that offer Medicare Advantage plans to 
submit enrollee-level data on supplemental benefits to the 
Department of Health and Human Services, thereby increasing 
transparency around Medicare Advantage supplemental benefits 
and helping seniors make better-informed decisions amid this 
ongoing affordability crisis.
    So with that, Mr. Lipschutz, from your work with Medicare 
beneficiaries, how often do seniors choose Medicare Advantage 
plans because of promised supplemental benefits like dental, 
vision, or transportation that they have seen advertised on 
television only to later find out that those benefits are 
difficult to access or far more limited than advertised?
    Mr. Lipschutz. In our experience, quite often. Supplemental 
benefits really drive a lot of decision making when it comes to 
planned enrollment, but people don't realize that these 
supplemental benefits are not standardized, and they vary 
considerably by plan and they can change from year to year.
    So, as you note, advertisements are full of articulating 
the supplemental benefits as a means to draw people in, but 
oftentimes, when people get in the plans, they find that they 
have more difficulty than they anticipated trying to access 
those benefits.
    Ms. McClellan. And sticking with you, if Medicare Advantage 
is going to continue to grow as a major part of Medicare, what 
role should transparency and accountability around supplemental 
benefits play in ensuring the program truly serves seniors and 
not just insurers?
    Mr. Lipschutz. I think transparency and accountability are 
paramount when we look at the program. These are public dollars 
going to private plans to administer benefits for the Medicare 
population. We need a lot more accountability and transparency. 
This is a start. So thank you for introducing this bill.
    Ms. McClellan. I agree. Thank you.
    And would requiring carriers to report enrollee-level data 
on supplemental benefits to the Department of Health and Human 
Services better align advertised benefits with what seniors 
actually need and leading to greater participation, more 
meaningful coverage, and better health outcomes for 
beneficiaries?
    Mr. Lipschutz. Agreed.
    Ms. McClellan. Thank you.
    And, with that, I will yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from California, Mr. 
Obernolte, for his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Obernolte. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and 
thank you to our witnesses. This is a really critically 
important topic, and we very much appreciate you contributing 
your expertise.
    Ms. Van Meter, I would like to start with you. I was really 
interested in the part of your testimony where you were talking 
about improving Medicare's payment structure for clinical labs 
and the way that doing that could help foster innovation for 
diagnosis. I have long been interested in the application of 
artificial intelligence to that particular space.
    I chaired the House Task Force on AI last Congress. This 
is, you know, one--we always said--we had a whole chapter in 
our task force report just on healthcare because we really 
think that, of all of the applications of AI, really the low-
hanging fruit--the way it can most immediately contribute to 
the well-being of people--is through the healthcare space and 
certainly through the lab space as well.
    So can you tell us a little bit more about how AI is being 
utilized in the diagnostic lab industry?
    Ms. Van Meter. Thank you, Congressman. Really, in two key 
facets. One is to improve and create efficiencies within the 
operation of the laboratory, and that could also move into the 
business side with the administration--right--as we have to 
deal with huge volumes of claims and the like.
    But when it comes to clinical care, particularly in the 
space of genomics, leveraging AI tools to look at enormous data 
sets that can't be consumed by a human on its own allows us to 
open up discoveries both in terms of improving personalized 
diagnostics but then driving therapies on an individualized 
basis for patients. So, really, there is tremendous promise 
that exists today with AI tools and diagnostics.
    Mr. Obernolte. Sure. Well, it is interesting that that 
mirrors the use of AI in other spaces in the healthcare 
industry, where initially we are seeing the biggest returns in 
terms of improving administration. I mean,for example, 
physicians' automated note taking is the number-one way that 
they are using AI right now, which is not what you would think 
of when you first think of the application of AI to healthcare. 
But all of those other concomitant uses for AI are coming, and 
we hope they come to the diagnostic lab space as well.
    Mr. Ryan, I was really interested in the part of your 
testimony when you said that the reimbursement rates for liquid 
oxygen are far below supplier costs. Could you talk a little 
bit more about that gap between the CMS reimbursement rates and 
the actual supplier expenses? Because I am very interested in 
that.
    Mr. Ryan. You know, like I said earlier--thank you, 
Congressman, for the question--that Medicare's reimbursement 
for oxygen is based on, you know, all product categories, and 
different product categories have different cost points to 
them. Liquid oxygen is one of the most expensive product 
categories due to the nature of the FDA oversight and the 
infrastructure that the company must build to provide liquid 
oxygen.
    Back before competitive bidding, Medicare would pay per 
pound for liquid oxygen. My company probably had--when I was in 
business before competitive bidding, 30 to 40 percent of the 
patients would be on liquid oxygen. It was extremely convenient 
for the patient. They could ambulate and get out and about. You 
could fill it from your liquid canister--portable canister and 
go out and about. You know, you didn't have to be limited by 
the number of hours and limited hours of a gaseous oxygen tank.
    But the reimbursement changed drastically, and then, 
because of that, everybody--like my company, some--I didn't 
survive the competitive bidding--but they got out of the 
business. And now technology has evolved. So you do have things 
like portable oxygen concentrators where you can get, you know, 
lower-flow oxygen from a portable concentrator device that, you 
know, provides a battery, and the battery is your lifeblood. Do 
I have enough batteries to make sure I can go out and about and 
get my chores done?
    But there is a subset of patients who require a higher-
liter flow, and that higher-liter flow in today's technology is 
not able to be accomplished with a POC, and it can be 
accomplished with a gaseous tank, but the amount of oxygen that 
you would need to use--that gaseous tank would empty out in 30 
minutes.
    I said earlier that, you know, 1 cubic foot of liquid 
oxygen expands to 860 cubic feet of gaseous oxygen. So old 
technology but very, very useful for a subset of patients that 
has been completely taken off the market due to the 
reimbursement structure.
    Mr. Obernolte. Right. Well, I think sometimes we forget as 
we negotiate these reimbursement rates that the end goal is not 
just greater efficiencies for the taxpayer. We are trying to 
strike this balance between providing world-class healthcare 
with positive healthcare outcomes, you know, at the lowest cost 
to taxpayers. And achieving that balance can be tricky, but 
that is why all of you being here today is so important. So 
thanks very much for your testimony.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from Florida, Mrs. Cammack, 
for her 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Cammack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to our 
witnesses and everyone for being here today.
    I know that we are looking at several proposals that all 
point to the same reality: Medicare is struggling to keep pace 
with how care is delivered for people who live with chronic 
conditions and disabilities. For many seniors and individuals 
with complex needs, the goal is not a cure, it is a maintaining 
of their independence, whether it is staying at home and 
avoiding unnecessary trips to the hospital or ending up in a 
nursing facility. Home-based services play a critical role in 
making that possible.
    But we continue to hear from providers and patients that 
outdated payment structures and rigid policies are limiting 
access to care that is often safer and more cost effective when 
delivered in the home. So, whether it is lab testing, home 
infusion, or durable medical equipment, these services are 
essential for people who depend on them every single day.
    When Medicare does not reflect the real cost and realities 
of care delivery, providers are forced to make difficult 
decisions. In rural areas like my district, there are fewer 
options, longer delays, and tougher challenges for patients who 
already face an extraordinary amount of difficulty in accessing 
care.
    So I am going to start with you, Mr. Ryan. Your testimony 
highlights that home-based care can both reduce costs and 
improve quality of life, particularly for seniors and people 
living with disabilities and chronic conditions. I have 
introduced H.R. 3864, the Protecting Healthcare For All 
Patients Act of 2025, to address concerns that some Federal 
healthcare decision-making tools may not fully capture the 
value of care for these populations.
    From your perspective, do policy metrics such as the 
Quality-Adjusted Life Years that influence coverage and payment 
decisions across Federal health programs risk undervaluing the 
needs of patients receiving home-based services?
    Mr. Ryan. Yes. As I said earlier--Congresswoman, thank you 
for the question--we have seen actually a decrease in the 
amount of dollars put in, you know, home--for my particular 
industry--from 2.2 percent to 1.3 percent. We are continuing to 
see a downward decrease in reimbursement for programs like 
competitive bidding. And then the managed care organizations 
certainly pay a percentage of that, so we see--even see a lower 
point-of-care dollars.
    And one of the things that we have seen over this period of 
time is--again, I keep talking about the thwarting of 
technology, but it is very, very significant. When no dollars 
have been put into the DMEPOS sector, we see the 95 percent 
decrease in patents. We have seen many of our products now go 
offshore. I mean, when I--back in the day, you know, most of my 
products I bought from an American manufacturer right here in 
the United States.
    Mrs. Cammack. Just because I want to be sensitive to time, 
I just want to just really put a button on it. So things like 
QALYs, a formula that would effectively define the value of 
someone's care or life--that is a policy that we need to move 
away from in all of our Federal programs, correct?
    Mr. Ryan. That certainly is happening in my industry which 
I can speak to.
    Mrs. Cammack. OK. Perfect. And I do have a followup. Now, 
many of my rural counties cover a large geographic area, and 
suppliers often have to drive long distances to deliver oxygen 
or make equipment repairs.
    When reimbursement does not reflect those real-world costs, 
what happens to service reliability? I think we all know. So 
touch on just some real-world examples there. But then, also, 
what types of access issues do you expect to see if suppliers 
further consolidate or just leave the program?
    Mr. Ryan. The access issues--as I talked in the survey we 
have done--is that people that are living in service areas--we 
are losing suppliers. Thirty seven percent of the industry has 
gone out of business. We are reimbursing in the nonbid, 
nonrural area, which is--the chairman mentioned his district 
potentially is really, really rural. At the same rate, we are 
reimbursing for products in a competitive bid program, and that 
is unfair.
    The bill that we have out here, H.R. 2005, will put 
reimbursement back for a short period of time. I hope we can 
convince the agency like they did in the rural portion of 
America--that they determined was a rural portion--make it in 
regulation a 50/50 blended rate. Again, our bills, both H.R. 
2005 and the SOAR Act--which would take oxygen out of the 
competitive bidding and take that 50/50 blended rate and make 
it permanent but also take that 75/25 rate and make it 
permanent--would certainly be help when it comes to making sure 
we are getting the proper care and technology and outcomes that 
these patients deserve.
    Mrs. Cammack. And I just want--because when people watch 
this video clip back, I want folks at home to really 
understand. Hit that 37 percent number once again.
    Mr. Ryan. Thirty seven percent of the DMEPOS providers have 
gone out of business since 2013.
    Mrs. Cammack. That is a staggering number. Staggering. And 
so, for folks at home and people in underserved communities and 
rural communities, you need to understand that consolidation 
and services are going away. I think they are living it every 
day, but people in America need to understand that this is at a 
tipping point. Would you agree?
    Mr. Ryan. I think the unthought-out remote item delivery 
program that came out in this final rule that is looking to 
take categories like ostomy and CGMs and limit it to eight to 
10 players is going to be devastating. It is not thought out. 
It is very problematic. We have to make a change before that 
goes into effect.
    Mrs. Cammack. I appreciate your testimony and your time 
here today, and my time has expired.
    With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentlelady yields back.
    I now, at long last, recognize the gentleman from Colorado, 
Mr. Evans, for his 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Evans. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thanks for letting me 
waive on to this committee.
    Of course, thanks to my fellow Coloradoan, the ranking 
member, and to our witnesses for coming today so we can talk 
about something that is deeply personal to me and to many of my 
constituents, and that is supplemental oxygen.
    I have a bipartisan bill that I helped introduce. It is 
included in today's discussion: The Supplemental Oxygen Access 
Reform Act, or the SOAR Act. I have had family members rely on 
supplemental oxygen, and representing a State like Colorado 
where we have high altitude, we know that many of our 
constituents also rely on supplemental oxygen. House 
Republicans have been laser-focused on affordability this 
Congress, but affordability goes hand-in-hand with 
accessibility, which is the centerpiece of the SOAR Act.
    So, Mr. Ryan, I wanted to thank you and your organization 
for supporting this legislation. We know how important 
supplemental oxygen is--liquid supplemental oxygen at times--
for people battling a variety of conditions. And I actually 
wrote down the number you just threw out: 860 times more oxygen 
in the liquid form in the same volume as you get in gaseous 
form.
    Can you describe the dilemma and the real human impacts 
that patients face when the existing system that we have with 
the Medicaid--excuse me--Medicare DME program significantly 
limits access to liquid oxygen?
    Mr. Ryan. Yeah. The reality is, looking at Medicare claims 
data, the decrease in both liquid portable oxygen and 
stationary portable oxygen has been significant. It is down 80 
percent. So there, again, is a subset of patients that require 
high-flow liquid oxygen, and essentially, because of a poor 
reimbursement program, a failed competitive bid program, those 
patients no longer get that service.
    When I provided oxygen, we had a--I am a respiratory 
therapist. The SOAR Act provides a payment structure to get 
paid for respiratory therapy. I think that is important. We 
competed on service and service alone, and our standard of care 
was excellent. But compressing prices, completely compressing 
them down, again, has taken the service model and changed it 
severely. It has taken the opportunity to have a respiratory 
therapist that could go into their home and do the proper 
services it would need, it has taken it away. The SOAR Act 
could bring that back. It is concerned about our patients. It 
has got a patient's bill of rights in there.
    It is also leveraging technology. It is using something 
called e-prescribing where we could not go to the subjective 
medical record and we could simply have a template that is 
agreed upon by the pulmonary community, and it will be the 
basic components of what is a medical necessity for oxygen.
    This bill is supported by well over 30 pulmonary groups: 
American Thoracic Society, CHEST, American Association of 
Respiratory Care. We have a letter for the record that shows 
the 30 groups in the pulmonary community working hand-in-hand 
with the DMEPOS community to get this legislation passed into 
law.
    Mr. Evans. Thank you for that. I think one of the key 
phrases you used there was just the quality of care. And so we 
know that that quality of care happens when we balance 
affordability and accessibility. And a big part of that is 
making sure that these programs work, making sure that the 
money goes where it is supposed to while also rooting out the 
fraud, waste, and abuse.
    And so can you speak to the SOAR Act and specifically how 
it has some of those guardrails in place but also takes a light 
touch via the creation of a national standardized electronic 
template to appropriately balance the needs of patients, 
providers, CMS, and make sure that we are being good stewards 
of the money?
    Mr. Ryan. Yeah. Well, again, I think the current problem is 
that the Medicare program relies on medical records which are 
written to support patient followup care, not to provide the 
legal support for a Medicare claim.
    The SOAR Act would make it easier for CMS to prevent 
fraudulent and abusive claims by requiring Medicare contractors 
to adopt electronic--electronic data elements, i.e., a 
template. To date, contractors have refused to adopt this 
commonsense approach. Adopting an electronic process in lieu of 
using physician short notes would provide much more needed 
clarity and accuracy in the review process. And I think it 
would help in the fraud and abuse.
    Mr. Evans. Thank you so much for that. And again, I--
obviously I am supporting the bill. I knew it was a good bill. 
But I am just struck by that 860 number that you threw out 
there, people that need this high-flow oxygen. Sometimes there 
is really only one answer to that, and that is that liquid 
oxygen.
    And so I just want to thank you. Thank the chairman and the 
ranking member for, again, for letting me waive onto this and 
be able to talk to this issue that is so critically important 
to me, to many of my constituents, and I look forward to 
working with everybody on both sides of the aisle and the 
coalition that you mentioned to continue to advance this bill.
    And I yield back. Thank you.
    Mr. Griffith. The gentleman yields back.
    I ask unanimous consent to insert in the record the 
documents included on the staff hearing document list. Without 
objection, so ordered.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mr. Griffith. I would like to thank all of our witnesses 
again for being here today. You saw a lot of Members showed up, 
and that tells you how important this hearing was to the 
Members, and glad to have all that input.
    Members may have additional written questions for you. I 
will remind Members that they have 10 business days to submit 
those questions for the record. And I ask the witnesses to 
respond to the questions promptly. Members should submit their 
questions by the close of business on Friday, January 23rd.
    Without objection, the subcommittee is adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 1:25 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
    [Material submitted for inclusion in the record follows:]

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