    [House Hearing, 119 Congress]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                 MARKUP OF: H.R. 5763, MAIN STREET PARITY
                   ACT; H.R. 5788, 504 PROGRAM RISK OVER-
                   SIGHT ACT; H.R. 3496, NORTHERN MARIANA
                   ISLANDS SMALL BUSINESS ACCESS ACT; H.R.
                   5764, AI FOR MAINSTREET ACT; H.R. 5784,
                   ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE WISDOM FOR INN-
                   OVATIVE SMALL ENTERPRISES (AI-WISE) ACT;
                   H.R. 5778, IMPROVING SBA ENGAGEMENT ON
                   EMPLOYEE OWNERSHIP ACT; H.R. 4305, DE-
                   STROYING UNNECESSARY, MISALIGNED, AND
                   PROHIBITIVE (DUMP) RED TAPE ACT OF 2025
    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                          COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                 UNITED STATES
                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                        ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                                 FIRST SESSION

                                   __________

                                  HEARING HELD
                               NOVEMBER 18, 2025

                                   __________

    [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILBLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                Small Business Committee Document Number 119-022
                 Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov

                                   __________

                        U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
    62-202                    WASHINGTON : 2026
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                       HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS

                        ROGER WILLIAMS, Texas, Chairman
                            PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                            DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
                             BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas
                               JAKE ELLZEY, Texas
                             MARK ALFORD, Missouri
                             NICK LALOTA, New York
                            BRAD FINSTAD, Minnesota
                              TONY WIED, Wisconsin
                          ROB BRESNAHAN, Pennsylvania
                              BRIAN JACK, Georgia
                             TROY DOWNING, Montana
                 KIMBERLYN KING-HINDS, Northern Marina Islands
                             DEREK SCHMIDT, Kansas
                            JIMMY PATRONIS, Florida
                   NYDIA VELAZQUEZ, New York, Ranking Member
                           MORGAN MCGARVEY, Kentucky
                           HILLARY SCHOLTEN, Michigan
                          LAMONICA MCIVER, New Jersey
                            GIL CISNEROS, California
                           KELLY MORRISON, Minnesota
                            GEORGE LATIMER, New York
                             DEREK TRAN, California
                           LATEEFAH SIMON, California
                           JOHNNY OLSZEWSKI, Maryland
                            HERB CONAWAY, New Jersey
                        MAGGIE GOODLANDER, New Hampshire

                     Lauren Holmes, Majority Staff Director
                     Melissa Jung, Minority Staff Director
                                C O N T E N T S

                               OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                       Page
    Hon. Roger Williams..............................................     1
    Hon. Nydia Velazquez.............................................     3

                                    APPENDIX

    Additional Material for the Record:
    Text of Legislation:
        H.R. 5763 - Main Street Parity Act...........................    32
        H.R. 5788 - 504 Program Risk Oversight Act...................    34
        H.R. 3496 - Northern Mariana Islands Small Business Access
          Act........................................................    39
        H.R. 5764 - AI for Main Street Act...........................    41
        H.R. 5784 - Artificial Intelligence Wisdom for Innovative
          Small Enterprises (AI-WISE) Act............................    44
        H.R. 5778 - Improving SBA Engagement on Employee Ownership
          Act........................................................    53
        H.R. 4305 - Destroying Unnecessary, Misaligned, and
          Prohibitive (DUMP) Red Tape Act of 2025....................    56
    Amendments:
        ANS to H.R. 3496, offered by Ms. King-Hinds..................    59
        ANS to H.R. 5764, offered by Mr. Alford......................    61
        ANS to H.R. 4305, offered by Mr. Wied........................    64
        Amendment #1 to the ANS to H.R. 4305 offered by Mr. Cisneros.    68
        Amendment #1 to the ANS to H.R. 4305 offered by Ms. Scholten.    73
    Support Documents:
        E-Vote Results...............................................    74
        OpenAI Letter................................................    83
        INTUIT Letter................................................    85
        Coalition for Sensible Safeguards (CSS) Letter...............    87
        National Association of Development Companies (NADCO) - H.R.
          5763 Letter................................................    89
        National Association of Development Companies (NADCO) - H.R.
          5788 Letter................................................    90
        The National Cooperative Business Association (NCBA) Letter..    91
        Small Business & Entrepreneurship Council (SBE) - H.R. 5764
          Letter.....................................................    93
        Small Business & Entrepreneurship Council (SBE) - H.R. 4305
          Letter.....................................................    94
        Small Business & Entrepreneurship Council (SBE) - H.R. 5763
          Letter.....................................................    95
    Votes:
        H.R. 3496 - ANS offered by Ms. King-Hinds agreed to by voice.    96
        H.R. 5764 - ANS offered by Mr. Alford agreed to by voice.....    97
        H.R. 4305 - ANS offered by Mr. Wied agreed to by voice.......    98
        H.R. 5763 - Main Street Parity Act Ordered to be reported by
          the Yeas and Nays: 27-0....................................    99
        H.R. 5788 - 504 Program Risk Oversight Act Ordered to be
          reported by the Yeas and Nays: 27-0........................   100
        H.R. 3496 - Northern Mariana Islands Small Business Access
          Act (As Amended) Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and
          Nays: 27-0.................................................   101
        H.R. 5764 - AI for Main Street Act (As Amended) Ordered to be
          reported by the Yeas and Nays: 27-0........................   102
        H.R. 5784 - Artificial Intelligence Wisdom for Innovative
          Small Enterprises (AI-WISE) Act Ordered to be reported by
          the Yeas and Nays: 27-0....................................   103
        H.R. 5778 - Improving SBA Engagement on Employee Ownership
          Act Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 27-0......   104
        Amendment #1 to the ANS to H.R. 4305 offered by Mr. Cisneros
          Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 12-15.........   105
        Amendment #1 to the ANS to H.R. 4305 offered by Ms. Scholten
          Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 12-15.........   106
        H.R. 4305 - Destroying Unnecessary, Misaligned, and
          Prohibitive (DUMP) Red Tape Act of 2025 (As Amended)
          Ordered to be reported by the Yeas and Nays: 18-9..........   107

     MARKUP OF: H.R. 5763, MAIN STREET PARITY ACT; H.R. 5788, 504 PROGRAM
    RISK OVERSIGHT ACT; H.R. 3496, NORTHERN MARIANA ISLANDS SMALL BUSINESS
      ACCESS ACT; H.R. 5764, AI FOR MAINSTREET ACT; H.R. 5784, ARTIFICIAL
      INTELLIGENCE WISDOM FOR INNOVATIVE SMALL ENTERPRISES (AI-WISE) ACT;
      H.R. 5778, IMPROVING SBA ENGAGEMENT ON EMPLOYEE OWNERSHIP ACT; H.R.
     4305, DESTROYING UNNECESSARY, MISALIGNED, AND PROHIBITIVE (DUMP) RED
                                TAPE ACT OF 2025

                                  ----------

                           TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 18, 2025

                      House of Representatives,
                   Committee on Small Business,
                                                        Washington, DC.
        The Committee met, pursuant to call, at 9:54 a.m., in Room
    2360, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Roger Williams
    [chairman of the Committee] presiding.
        Present: Representatives Williams, Stauber, Meuser, Van
    Duyne, Ellzey, Alford, LaLota, Finstad, Wied, Bresnahan, Jack,
    Downing, King-Hinds, Schmidt, Patronis, Velazquez, McGarvey,
    Scholten, McIver, Cisneros, Morrison, Latimer, Tran, Simon,
    Conaway, and Goodlander.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Before we get started, I want to
    recognize Representative Meuser from the great state of
    Pennsylvania to lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance and a short
    prayer.
        Mr. MEUSER. Will you please stand and bow your heads? Dear
    God, we appreciate this day bringing us together back here in
    Washington, doing the best work we can for a great nation. And
    we thank you for helping be creative. Give us the wisdom. We
    ask for this often, but please give it to us to focus on the
    greater good, to truly put you and country ahead of self.
        And there is a biblical verse that is known as blessed are
    the meek for they will inherit the Earth. The meek, of course,
    are those that are humble, have humility, and appreciate the
    people and the world around them most. They will inherit the
    Earth. Allow us to follow this line from Scripture.
        In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Ghost, God be
    with you. Thank you. Amen.
        We will now do the pledge.
        ALL. I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States
    of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one
    nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for
    all.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The Committee will now come to order and
    a quorum is present. Without objection, the Chair is authorized
    to declare a recess of the Committee at any time.
        As required by the House rules, a copy of the legislative
    measures have been made available to Members and the public at
    least 24 hours in advance. Without objection, the Committee
    will vote electronically in accordance with the Committee rules
    and regulations developed by the House Committees on Rules and
    Administration.
        I now recognize myself for opening remarks.
        Today we will mark up seven important bills that support
    small business across the country. These bills reflect the
    commitment to equipping entrepreneurs with the tools they need
    to innovate, grow, and compete in our ever-evolving economy.
    From the expanding access to artificial intelligence resources,
    strengthening oversight, removing outdated barriers to capital,
    and tackling burdensome regulations, each of these bills will
    support Main Street America in a meaningful way.
        As Chairman, I am proud of the network--or proud of the
    work being done in this Committee to support the
    administration's efforts and ensure that small businesses
    remain at the forefront of the American economy. These bills
    represent the Committee's bipartisan commitment to fostering an
    environment where small businesses can grow, innovate, and
    invest in their communities.
        Several of the bills we are considering today focus on the
    transformative role of artificial intelligence and ensure that
    small businesses have access to resources and training to help
    them utilize AI. Our bills today will also bring greater
    accountability and oversight of the SBA 504 loan program and
    improve access to SBA lending by all types of industries. We
    will also consider a bill that would finally bring SBA
    microlending to the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana
    Islands.
        I appreciate the Ranking Member and the Committee staff who
    have supported the Committee's effort over the years on this
    issue. Another bill will require the SBA to implement
    requirements for the fiscal year 2019 NDAA to provide
    information and outreach about employee ownership for small
    businesses. And finally, we will consider a bill that empowers
    small businesses to report burdensome regulations by codifying
    the SBA Office of Advocacy's Red Tape Hotline.
        I am proud of the continued bipartisan efforts that have
    resulted in today's markup. These efforts have led to the
    passage of 18 small business bills out of the House this year,
    which now await Senate consideration. I look forward to working
    with my colleagues so we can continue to pass meaningful
    legislation that empowers small businesses and strengthens our
    communities.
        Now, with that, I look forward to today's markup and I
    yield to the distinguished Member and my friend, the Ranking
    Member from New York, Ms. Velazquez, for her opening remarks.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for convening this
    markup today.
        As we consider legislation to shape the future of small
    businesses across the country, it is important to address both
    the opportunities and challenges facing small businesses today.
    I plan to lend my support to the six bipartisan bills under
    consideration and I will lay out my concerns with the last
    bill. And I appreciate the Chairman's efforts to mark up a fair
    ratio of Republican and Democratic bills. I am encouraged to
    see us working together on commonsense, bipartisan bills that
    provide more opportunity for small businesses because expanding
    opportunities shouldn't be a partisan issue.
        With that said, we need the SBA to be a more accountable
    partner. Ignoring congressional oversight letters and requests
    for meetings undermines trust. It needs to change and my hope
    is that you will join me in ensuring the agency is more
    responsive to this Committee.
        And I am hopeful we can work together on issues that really
    matter: lowering costs for small businesses. These critical
    employers who account for a large portion of jobs in this
    country are not hiring because they are grappling with
    inflation and escalating costs. According to the Center for
    American Progress analysis, more than 5 million self-employed
    small business owners have health insurance coverage through
    the ACA. We cannot allow these tax credits to expire, causing
    premiums to double for millions of Americans. And our ranchers
    and farmers are reeling from decisions on tariffs and beef
    purchases that have been unilaterally made by this
    administration. I urge you to schedule a hearing so we can hear
    directly from small businesses about these important issues.
        Thank you again, Mr. Williams, and I look forward to a
    productive markup. I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The lady yields back. And does any other
    Member seek recognition for the purpose of making an opening
    statement?
        Okay. Seeing none, we will now move to consideration of the
    first bill.
        H.R. 5763
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 5763, the
    Main Street Parity Act, introduced by Chairman, myself, and
    Representative Simon. The clerk will report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 5763, a bill to amend the Small Business--
    --
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 5763 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        I now recognize myself for a statement on the bill.
        Most small business owners applying for 504 loans must
    contribute 10 percent as a form of down payment. However, if
    their loan involves a limited purpose property, such as bowling
    alley, dairy farm, or doctor's office, they must contribute an
    extra 5 percent, a total of 15 percent down. And everyday
    businesses on main street like these are unfairly burdened with
    this extra equity requirement that is based on outdated,
    inaccurate assumptions that these kinds of businesses pose a
    greater risk to the program. So most of the loans in these
    affected industries, like bowling alleys, hospitals, and
    wineries, perform better on average than the entire 504
    portfolio.
        So this bill will remove unnecessary burdens for
    entrepreneurs who are seeking loans for these special purpose
    buildings and will put them on equal footing with their peers.
    This change will support the countless small businesses at the
    center of our communities and drive the economy. And it is time
    to bring parity back to main street.
        So I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 5763. And I
    yield back.
        And I now recognize the bill's cosponsor, Representative
    Simon from the great state of California for her remarks.
        Ms. SIMON. It is Simon. But I really like----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Simon.
        Ms. SIMON. But I like Simone. It sounds a lot more
    dignified.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. She is my friend. I was just checking
    her out. Thank you.
        Ms. SIMON. Simone gives it a little French flair. My family
    is from Louisiana, sir.
        Thank you so much. And it has been an honor to work with
    you on this bill together, you and I, championing this bill and
    others. It has been a real honor. And I want to thank our
    Ranking Member Velazquez for really lifting up the freshman
    Members of this Committee to ensure that we are a part of this
    legislative process full scale.
        The Main Street Parity Act is a simple way to support a
    broad range of small businesses in this country, not just the
    ones with standard commercial property. So right now,
    businesses in my district and in districts across the country
    operate in what is called a special purpose property and they
    are being penalized simply for having unique construction or
    building needs. You referenced bowling alleys, and you are
    absolutely right. These include places, not just bowling
    alleys, but car washes and marinas and funeral homes and
    recreation centers. These are the kind of small businesses in
    our community that serve local families, that create real jobs,
    and keep our communities running.
        The Main Street Parity Act lowers the equity requirement
    for these borrowers to the same 10 percent required for
    everyone else. This is definitely a commonsense bill that
    supports small business owners throughout the country. This
    bill is a simple fix. It is nonpartisan and it really does what
    our constituents have asked us to do, making small business
    work on main street in rural and in urban communities
    throughout this country. It is about promoting fair, inclusive
    economic growth and recognizing that opportunity should not
    depend on something as small as the type of building your
    business happens to own or run in.
        I urge all of my colleagues today to support the Main
    Street Parity Act and ensure fair capital access across all
    small business industries in our great nation.
        Thank you, sir, and I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. I thank Congressman Simon for that.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement on the bill?
        I now recognize the Ranking Member to speak on the bill.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I support H.R.
    5763. This bill makes important adjustments to improve SBA 504
    CDC program. I applaud Chairman Williams and Representative
    Simon for their leadership on this issue.
        The 504 CDC program has long supported small businesses in
    accessing capital for the development of major fixed assets,
    ensuring that these businesses have the resources they need to
    be successful and support thousands of jobs across the country.
    As part of the 504 CDC program, loans are guaranteed for so-
    called special use properties, like bowling alleys, car washes,
    and marinas. Since the special use designation was created in
    1996, businesses developing these properties have been required
    to pay a special use penalty when accessing 504 CDC loans. The
    additional equity requirement was put in place by Congress
    because of the belief that these special use properties will be
    challenging to repurpose, shrinking the market pool of
    potential buyers and making them more difficult to sell,
    thereby posing a higher risk to the SBA loan portfolio if one
    of these businesses ever faced financial hardship and needed to
    be sold.
        However, in almost 30 years since the designation was
    created and the penalty was put in place, many of these
    properties have been successfully repurposed for alternative
    uses. More importantly, the shut-off rate since that time is
    substantially similar to standard 504 CDC loans, demonstrating
    that this loan poses no greater risk than standard loans.
    Therefore, it is time to remove the special use penalty and
    lower the equity barrier these properties face when accessing
    capital through the 504 CDC program.
        This bill reduces the minimum equity requirement for
    special use property to at least 10 percent, in line with the
    requirement for standard loans under the 504 CDC program. It
    also maintains the discretionary authority to require higher
    equity requirements of the borrower if the CDC so chooses.
        I want to thank my Republican colleagues for their
    collaboration on H.R. 5788, which we are also discussing, that
    increases the SBA reporting requirements to Congress for 504
    CDC loans, including for special use properties, so that we can
    continue to monitor the changes we are making in this bill in
    the future. This bill is supported by the National Association
    of Development Companies.
        I urge my colleagues to support the bill and I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        And does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Okay. Seeing none, the question now occurs on favorably
    reporting H.R. 5763.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it. H.R. 5763 is
    agreed to.
        Ms. KING-HINDS. Mr. Chairman, I would like to request a
    recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote has been requested. A
    roll call vote is ordered. Pursuant to Committee rule 13 and
    House rule XI, further proceedings on this bill are postponed.
        H.R. 5788
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 5788, the
    504 Program Risk Oversight Act, introduced by Representative
    Tran and Patronis. The clerk will report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 5788, a bill----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 5788 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        I now recognize the bill's sponsor, Representative Tran
    from the great state of California for a statement on the bill.
        Mr. TRAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the opportunity to
    discuss an essential piece of legislation today, the 504
    Program Risk Oversight Act. The 504 Program Risk Oversight Act
    would require the SBA to conduct an annual risk assessment of
    the 504 CDC program and provide Congress with a report
    containing the results by December 1st each year.
        The 504 Loan Program is SBA's premier economic development
    program providing low-cost, fixed-rate capital to help small
    businesses expand. Since its inception in 1986, the program has
    provided approximately 400 billion in total project financing
    and created over 3.3 million jobs. In California, that
    translates to 95 billion in total capital and the creation of
    over 715,000 good paying jobs.
        The SBA's 504 program is central to long-term business
    growth and competitiveness for many small business owners.
    However, as small business grow and take on larger and more
    complex projects, I have heard from my constituents that the
    limitation in SBA's 504 financing imposes unnecessary
    constraints on the organic and profitable growth of their
    business. Many times I have heard that a limitation they faced
    was when their financing needs were more than what the SBA
    could lend due to the loan limits. That is why I support
    increasing the maximum loan size for 504 to allow the program
    to have a bigger impact and adjust the loan limits which have
    not been changed since 2010. However, it is also important to
    ensure program performance remains a top priority and the 504
    program stays healthy for its long-term availability to small
    businesses.
        Currently, SBA is not required to conduct an annual
    portfolio risk analysis of the 504 program and provide Congress
    with a detailed report containing the results. This bipartisan
    bill will address the problem and help more Americans launch
    and grow small businesses by improving oversight and risk
    assessment of the 504 program. Transparent data is the
    cornerstone of a productive partnership between the SBA,
    Congress, and the industry and the work we do to modernize the
    504 loan limit for all borrowers while keeping the program
    healthy.
        I am proud to lead this bill and I want to thank my
    colleague Representative Jimmy Patronis for his partnership in
    co-leading this important piece of legislation with me.
        I urge my colleagues to support this important bipartisan
    bill. Thank you and I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        I now recognize Representative Patronis from the great
    state of Florida for a statement on the bill.
        Mr. PATRONIS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate my
    colleague Congressman Tran's work on this good bill. I am
    pleased also to be a original cosponsor on this legislation.
        Transparency and responsible government is key to an
    effective government. This bill is an example of just that. As
    a former CFO of the State of Florida, I was responsible for
    overseeing the state's investments, especially in the
    retirement space. We must ensure that the taxpayers' dollars
    are being used effectively and not set on fire. This bill will
    make sure that there is always risk analysis being done on 504
    program activities.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Are there any of the Members who wish to be recognized for
    a statement on the bill?
        Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member
    to speak on the bill.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Let me start off by
    thanking Representatives Tran and Patronis for working together
    on a bipartisan basis to introduce this important bill.
    Information and transparency are central to ensuring the proper
    operation and functioning of the SBA lending programs,
    including the 504 CDC program. And this bill will help our
    Committee carry out our oversight responsibility.
        For months I have investigated and warned about the rising
    default levels in the SBA other main lending program, the
    flagship 7(a) program. Federal law requires the SBA Office of
    Credit Risk Management to conduct an annual portfolio risk
    analysis of the 7(a) program and provide Congress with a
    detailed report of the results. It is this report that has
    helped our Committee examine the 7(a) program's rising defaults
    and tailor our actions accordingly. The report provides
    detailed information on the program's overall risks set forth
    by industry concentration, risks created by individual lenders,
    enforcement actions that have been taken, and other important
    data points.
        Unfortunately, a similar statutory requirement does not
    exist for the 504 CDC program. H.R. 5788 will fix that by
    compelling the SBA to conduct an annual risk analysis of the
    504 CDC program and provide Congress with the results tailored
    to meet the 504 CDC program's unique features. This bill will
    require the SBA to provide many of the same data points on the
    504 CDC program as it is currently providing us on the 7(a)
    program.
        Let me be clear, loan defaults do not currently seem to be
    a concern in the 504 CDC program. Publicly available
    information demonstrate responsible operation of the program,
    but this bill will give us information we need to monitor the
    program now and in the future so its zero subsidy requirement
    is maintained.
        Finally, H.R. 5788 will require that the 504 CDC risk
    report also be posted on the SBA website and made available to
    the public. H.R. 5788 is supported by the National Association
    of Development Companies.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back, and thank
    you.
        And I now recognize myself to speak in support of this
    legislation.
        The SBA's 504 loan program plays a crucial role in
    financing fixed assets for small businesses through community-
    based partners. While these loans help local small businesses
    grow, there is a clear lack of reporting on the health and risk
    within the 504 portfolio. So as Americans and policymakers need
    a clear timely information on the program to ensure that
    taxpayer dollars are protected, we need to know that the
    program is sustainable and effective for small businesses
    nationwide.
        The 504 Program Risk Oversight Act ensures that Congress
    can carry out its constitutional duty of oversight by requiring
    annual data-driven reports from the SBA on the health of the
    504 loan program. By enhancing transparency and insight, this
    legislation will help Congress identify and mitigate risk
    early, strengthening the long-term viability of the 504 loan
    program and ensuring continued support for American
    entrepreneurs.
        So I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 5788, and I
    yield back.
        Does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Okay. Seeing none, the question is now on favorably
    reporting H.R. 5788 to the House.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and H.R. 5788
    is agreed to.
        Mr. PATRONIS. Mr. Chairman?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes.
        Mr. PATRONIS. I would like to request a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. We have got a recorded vote has
    been requested. A roll call vote is ordered. And pursuant to
    Committee rule 13 and House rule XI, further proceedings on
    this bill are postponed.
        H.R. 3496
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 3496,
    Northern Mariana Island Small Business Access Act, introduced
    by Delegate King-Hinds and cosponsored by Representative
    Conaway. And the clerk will report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 3496, a bill to amend the Small Business--
    --
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 3496 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        The bill sponsor Delegate King-Hinds has an amendment in
    the nature of a substitute at the desk. The amendment has been
    distributed in advance. The clerk will report the amendment.
        The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R.
    34----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment is
    considered as read and the substitute will be considered as a
    base text for the purpose of further amendment.
        I now recognize the bill's sponsor, Delegate King-Hinds
    from the Great Northern Mariana Islands, for a statement on the
    bill and the amendment.
        Ms. KING-HINDS. Thank you, Chairman Williams and Ranking
    Member Velazquez, for agreeing to include my bill, H.R. 3496,
    the Northern Mariana Islands Small Business Access Act, in
    today's markup. H.R. 3496 would include my district, the
    Northern Mariana Islands, in the Small Business
    Administration's Microloan Program. The Microloan Program
    issues loans of $50,000 or less at low interest rates to help
    small businesses that may be unable to access capital
    elsewhere, grow their businesses, or create jobs.
        Since the program became operational in 1992, it has issued
    over 69,000 loans totaling over 900 million and supported over
    250,000 American jobs. Despite the program's impressive impact
    for Americans across the country, the Northern Mariana Islands
    is the only state or territory not explicitly included under
    the law. This bill would simply add the CNMI to be eligible for
    the program alongside every other territory.
        I thank my co-lead on the bill, Representative Conaway, for
    his best support and Congressman Cisneros for cosponsoring this
    legislation as well. Again, my bill simply adds my district to
    the Microloan Program that is already available to all other
    Americans. I urge my colleagues to support this bipartisan,
    commonsense, no-cost bill.
        Thank you. I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        I now recognize Representative Conaway from the great state
    of New Jersey for a statement on the bill and the amendment.
        Mr. CONAWAY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to echo
    support for H.R. 3496, the Northern Mariana Island Small
    Business Access Act, along with my colleague, Congresswoman
    King-Hinds.
        As has been said, the Commonwealth of Northern Mariana
    Islands, you know, I don't say that very often, Northern
    Mariana Islands is one of the six territories in the U.S. and,
    despite its status as a territory, the Northern Mariana Islands
    have been excluded from certain small business programs. This
    is important legislation that would ensure that there are
    expanded access to SBA's Microloan Program to small businesses
    on the Northern Mariana Islands.
        As you know, access to capital is vital for success and
    stability of small businesses. The SBA's Microloan Program is
    designed to assist women, low-income persons, veterans,
    minority entrepreneurs, and small business owners. And said
    loans can be used for a myriad of purposes, including working
    capital, inventory, supplies, furniture, fixtures, machinery,
    and equipment. Ensuring that the Northern Mariana Islands has
    better access to this important SBA program is very important
    and I urge all of my colleagues to support this important piece
    of legislation.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlemen yields back.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement?
        Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member
    to speak on the bill and the amendment.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to express
    my support for H.R. 3496, as amended. I commend Delegate King-
    Hinds and Dr. Conaway for reintroducing the bill we have worked
    on for several years now.
        The Northern Mariana Islands Small Business Access Act is a
    straightforward but important bill that expands access to the
    SBA Microloan Program to small businesses in the Commonwealth
    of the Northern Mariana Islands. The program has been hugely
    successful.
        With that said, small businesses in the Northern Mariana
    Islands face unique challenges as geographic isolation leads to
    higher costs for goods and services, and their economy is
    heavily reliant on tourism, which can ebb and flow with economy
    and natural disaster. Having access to affordable credit gives
    small businesses the ability to weather the storms and economic
    uncertainty and fully prepare for the next opportunity.
        I worked to ensure the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana
    Islands had access to the Microloan Program as part of a more
    comprehensive bill to improve the Microloan Program. Despite
    passing the House, that bill was not considered in the Senate.
    While I would prefer to handle this issue in a more complete
    review of the program to make much needed improvements, I am
    willing to set aside those concerns today to ensure that small
    business owners in CNMI have access to the SBA Macro Loan
    program, and I urge my colleagues to support this bipartisan
    measure.
        I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Thank you.
        I now recognize myself to speak in support of this
    legislation.
        The SBA Microloan Program offers entrepreneurs access to
    small dollar loans through intermediaries. By statute, the SBA
    portions Microloan Program funding to each state and territory
    except for the Commonwealth of Northern Mariana Islands. This
    exclusion makes it more challenging for small businesses in the
    Northern Mariana Islands to access capital. And the Northern
    Mariana Island Small Business Access Act amends the Small
    Business Act to include the Northern Mariana Islands in the
    program's geographic coverage.
        Expanding microloan eligibility will spark
    entrepreneurship. It strengthens that local economy for all
    states and territories and further assisting constituents of
    our colleague, Delegate King-Hinds, to access opportunities to
    grow.
        I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 3496, and I yield
    back.
        Does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Seeing none, the question now occurs on the adoption of the
    substitute amendment offered H.R. 3496 by Delegate King-Hinds.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it, the
    amendment in the nature of a substitute H.R. 3496 is adopted.
        Okay. The question is now on favorably reporting H.R. 3496,
    as amended, to the House.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and H.R.
    3496, as amended, is agreed to.
        Ms. KING-HINDS. Mr. Chairman.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. For what purpose does the gentlelady
    seek recognition?
        Ms. KING-HINDS. I would like to request a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. A recorded vote has been
    requested. A roll call vote is ordered, and pursuant to
    Committee rule 13 and House rule XI, further proceedings on
    this bill are postponed.
        H.R. 5764
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 5764, AI
    for Main Street Act, introduced by Representatives Alford and
    Scholten. The clerk will report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 5764, bill to amend the Small Business----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 5764 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        The bill sponsor, Representative Alford, has an amendment
    in the nature of a substitute at the desk. The amendment has
    been distributed in advance. The clerk will report the
    amendment.
        The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R.
    57----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment is
    considered as read and the substitute will be considered as
    base text for the purpose of further amendment.
        I now recognize the bill's sponsor, Representative Alford
    from the great state of Missouri, for a statement on the bill
    and the amendment.
        Mr. ALFORD. Well, thank you, Mr. Chair. And thank you,
    Ranking Member Velazquez, for holding this hearing today. It is
    so good to see everyone on both sides of the aisle.
        This Committee exists in Congress to champion main street,
    to ensure that the small businesses that employ about half of
    all Americans can continue to thrive. As we all know, the AI
    revolution is not coming. It is already here. And if any
    company from main street to wall street is not adapting, they
    will be left behind. This is why I was proud to introduce the
    AI for Main Street Act along with Congresswoman Scholten.
        This bill directs Small Business Development Centers to
    help small businesses evaluate and adopt artificial
    intelligence by providing guidance, training, and outreach. It
    builds on existing efforts, like America's SBDC AIU program. I
    urge all of my colleagues to support this important legislation
    to ensure that main street gets the counseling they need to
    survive and thrive during the AI era, which is not going away
    anytime soon.
        And with that I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        I now recognize Representative Scholten from the great
    state of Michigan for a statement on the bill and the
    amendment.
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. I have been
    so proud to partner with Rep. Alford to lead the AI for Main
    Street Act.
        He said it so well and this Committee has recognized the
    absolute revolutionary power that AI can have for so many of
    our small business owners. Yet far too many don't know how to
    access its power in a responsible way. This bill will help
    small businesses get quality guidance on how to adopt
    artificial intelligence into their operations.
        At a time when AI tools are becoming more accessible, but
    also more complex, small business owners need trusted local
    resources to help them navigate this new terrain. We have seen
    firsthand in our district how cutting-edge AI help from Small
    Business Development Centers can be just an absolute game-
    changer, and that is where the AI for Main Street Act comes in.
    Our bill will direct Small Business Development Centers to
    provide guidance, training, and outreach to small business
    owners so they can evaluate the use of AI for their businesses
    and implement it according to their unique needs.
        SBDCs are already a lifeline for small businesses, places
    where they turn to for help, practical expertise, and real-
    world solutions. By equipping these centers with AI-focused
    training, we are meeting small business owners where they are
    and giving them tools that they can put to work immediately.
        In our increasingly connected world, AI presents major
    changes to our economy and our way of life, from streamlining
    bookkeeping to managing inventory to improving customer
    outreach. AI can help small businesses save time, cut cost,
    stay competitive, but only if they have the knowledge how to
    use it effectively. That makes it all the more important that
    small businesses have the right resources. The AI for Main
    Street Act gives small businesses, again, the key word is
    trust, that trusted place to turn as they decide how to use AI
    to serve their goals.
        I urge my colleagues to support this bill, and I yield the
    remainder of my time.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement on the bill?
        Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member
    to speak on the bill and the amendment.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am really pleased
    to support the AI for Main Street Act, which would allow the
    Small Business Development Centers to assist small business
    owners on how to evaluate artificial intelligence. I commend
    Mr. Alford and Ms. Scholten for working together on this
    bipartisan legislation.
        Among other things, AI has the potential to boost
    productivity, enhance customer service, and save costs, but
    small businesses must learn to use and manage AI tools
    effectively. If they don't, it can backfire and cause serious
    problems. We all heard the story of the Chevy dealership in
    Watsonville, California, that deployed an automated customer
    service chatbot that was manipulated into offering a Tahoe for
    a dollar and stating the deal is legally binding.
        As AI advances, so do the inherent risks. That is why it is
    important for SBA and its entrepreneurial ecosystem to help
    small businesses make the most of this technology. And it also
    makes sense to further empower the national network of SBDCs to
    guide and train small businesses for the future. I urge my
    colleagues to vote yes.
        I yield back my time.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back, and thank
    you.
        And I now recognize myself to speak in support of this
    legislation.
        Evolving artificial intelligence tools are transforming the
    business world and reshaping how entrepreneurs and small
    businesses operate and compete. While larger corporations are
    already harnessing new technologies, many small businesses are
    struggling to help keep up due to limited resources, lack of
    training, and concerns about cybersecurity. But the AI for Main
    Street Act addresses this gap by directing the SBA Small
    Business Development Centers to provide training, coaching, and
    ongoing support for integrating AI responsibility into small
    business.
        SBDCs are a crucial public-private partnership that operate
    in every state to assist all small businesses, whether they are
    just starting or fully established. Ensuring that these
    resource partners can provide AI education will give small
    businesses the proper tools and safeguards to compete in
    today's economy. As AI becomes an integral driver of
    productivity and competitiveness across the economy, small
    businesses must not be left behind. Technology won't wait for
    small business to catch up and Congress must help bridge that
    gap to help close the innovation divide.
        I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 5764, and I yield
    back.
        Does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Okay. Seeing none, the question now occurs in the adoption
    of the substitute amendment offered to H.R. 5764 by Mr. Alford.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and the
    amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 5764 is
    adopted.
        The question is now on favorably reporting H.R. 5764, as
    amended, to the House.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        The opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and H.R. 5764,
    as amended, is agreed to
        Mr. ALFORD. Mr. Chair?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. For what purpose does the gentleman seek
    recognition?
        Mr. ALFORD. I request a recorded vote, please.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote has been requested. A
    roll call vote is ordered. Pursuant to Committee rule 13 and
    House rule XI, further proceedings on the bill are postponed.
        H.R. 5784
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 5784, the
    Artificial Intelligence Wisdom for Innovative Small
    Enterprises, or AI WISE Act, introduced by Representatives
    Scholten and Downing. And the clerk will report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 5784, a bill to amend the Small Business
    Act----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 5784 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        I now recognize the bill's sponsor, Representative Scholten
    from the great state of Michigan, for a statement on the bill.
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. You are
    sensing a theme today. And I am so glad that this Committee
    takes the inclusion and implementation of AI in the small
    business arena seriously. It is absolutely critical.
        As we know, artificial intelligence is rapidly shaping
    industries across the globe. But small businesses, who are the
    backbone of our economy, often struggle to keep up with fast-
    paced technological change. My--oops, sorry, hold on. I think I
    got the wrong--this is the AI for main street. Sorry, I was
    like that sounds really familiar. AI WISE. We can vote on that
    one now, too. We are on AI for main street--we are on AI WISE.
    We are on AI WISE. Yes. Okay, sorry. Apologies. This is when
    you get all these great AI bills.
        The AI WISE Act requires the SBA to create AI literacy
    resources tailored specifically to small businesses. Through
    the SBA's e-learning platform, entrepreneurs and small business
    owners will be empowered with clear, actionable information on
    how to leverage AI in their operations, whether that is through
    automating tasks, improving customer service, or making smarter
    decisions using data.
        According to the U.S. Census Bureau, nearly one in four
    businesses do not know whether they will use AI in production
    within the next 6 months. They just don't know if it is going
    to be a part of their business or not. That is untenable in a
    rapidly evolving technological landscape where small businesses
    cannot afford to be left behind. This bill will level the
    technological playing field for small businesses, providing
    them the tools they need to thrive in an ever-changing global
    economy.
        AI isn't just for the tech giants. It is for everyone,
    especially small businesses. Whether we are talking about a
    local bakery, a landscaping company, or a digital startup, AI
    has the potential to increase productivity, reduce costs, and
    open up new growth opportunities. The AI WISE Act gives our
    small businesses the knowledge they need to embrace AI and
    remain the top job creators in our country.
        I want to express my gratitude to Congressman Downing for
    joining me in leading this bill. And I ask unanimous consent to
    insert into the record letters of support for the AI WISE Act
    from Intuit and OpenAI. I urge all of my colleagues to support
    the AI WISE Act. The future of our economy depends on helping
    small businesses harness the power of emerging technologies
    like AI and this bill will help make that a reality.
        I yield the remainder of my time.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, we will accept your
    papers.
        I now recognize Representative Downing from the great state
    of Montana for a statement on the bill.
        Mr. DOWNING. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to my
    colleague, Representative Scholten, for the work on this bill.
        You know, over the course of the last several years, we
    have seen incredible advancements in the development of AI
    technology. AI capabilities, like machine learning, language
    processing, these will play a critical role in our economy
    moving forward. Businesses across our country are rapidly
    incorporating AI to streamline key operations, like workforce
    recruitment, marketing, strategy development. However, like any
    emerging technology, businesses with substantial and stable
    access to capital tend to be better positioned for technology
    adoption and dealing with its ramifications. Small businesses,
    on the other hand, including businesses in rural communities
    like in my home district of central and eastern Montana, often
    lack the resources and information needed to facilitate
    technology adoption.
        Now, according to a 2025 report from the U.S. Chamber of
    Commerce, 59 percent of Montana small businesses have adopted
    AI into their operations. While this figure is significant, it
    pales in comparison to the near universal adoption of AI that
    we have seen with Fortune 500 companies. This is why I am proud
    to co-lead H.R. 5784, the AI WISE Act, with my colleague
    Representative Scholten.
        The AI WISE Act directs SBA to establish educational
    resources on AI for small businesses through its online
    learning program. In doing so, this legislation seeks to
    provide small businesses with the technical and practical
    knowledge needed in order to best navigate AI adoption.
        To assemble this information, this legislation directs the
    SBA to work in coordination with the National Institute for
    Standards and Technology, NIST, as well as an advisory working
    group of public and private sector partners. The scope of this
    new AI educational material will include resources for small
    businesses on how AI models work, best practices for
    coordinating with third-party providers of AI tools, and how
    businesses can identify tasks that AI can reliably and
    effectively perform.
        I would like to again thank my colleague Representative
    Scholten for co-leading this legislation with me. The AI WISE
    Act will ensure SBA provides small businesses with the
    information that they will need to most effectively utilize AI
    to bolster their business.
        I urge all my colleagues to support this legislation, and,
    Mr. Chair, I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Are there any of the Members who wish to be recognized for
    a statement on the bill?
        Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member
    to speak on the bill.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am pleased to
    support legislation to create artificial intelligence literacy
    resources at the SBA and the resource partners. I thank Ms.
    Scholten and Mr. Downing and the numerous AI and small business
    stakeholders for working with me to develop this bill over the
    last 2 years.
        I has captured the imagination, excitement, and anxiety of
    Main Street America and Congress since the launch of ChatGPT
    just 2 years ago. While AI has the potential to make small
    businesses more efficient and competitive, it also has risks
    associated with its use. The AI WISE Act will empower America's
    small businesses with the skill needed to evaluate and adopt AI
    in this challenging landscape. It requires the SBA to create an
    online AI literacy resource for small businesses and allow
    their resource partners to build upon it with specialized and
    localized resources to better serve their communities. As AI
    revolutionizes our way of life, it is critical to ensure small
    businesses are not left behind by the larger firms better
    equipped to adopt the technology.
        With that, I urge my colleagues to vote yes, and I yield
    back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back. Thank you.
        And I now recognize myself to speak in support of this
    legislation.
        As we talked about today, nearly half of small businesses
    are using the AI in some form, and more are exploring ways they
    could make their businesses more efficient. As AI adoption
    accelerates, it is critical that small businesses have the
    tools and knowledge to stay competitive and thrive in the free
    market. The AI WISE Act directs the SBA to establish
    educational resources and online learning tools to help small
    businesses understand the benefits and risks of integrating AI
    into their operations.
        This bill brings together the SBA, the National Institute
    of Standards and Technology, and AI leaders to leverage
    existing AI resources and develop educational tools that don't
    just focus on the potential risks. It includes information
    about how AI could enhance operations, customer service, and
    productivity across main street's businesses. The AI WISE Act
    puts the SBA at the forefront of streamlining information
    directly for the many small businesses that don't know where to
    access materials they need to fully scale their businesses
    while leveraging AI.
        I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 5784, and I yield
    back.
        Now, does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Seeing none, the question is now on favorably reporting
    H.R. 5784 to the House.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and H.R. 5784
    is agreed to.
        Mr. DOWNING. Mr. Chair?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman is recognized.
        Mr. DOWNING. I request a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman requests, a recorded vote
    has been requested. A roll call vote is ordered. Pursuant to
    Committee rule 13 and House rule XI, further proceedings on the
    bill are postponed.
        H.R. 5778
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 5778, the
    Improving SBA Engagement on Employee Ownership Act, introduced
    by Representatives McIver and Bresnahan and Ranking Member
    Velazquez. The clerk will report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 5778, a bill to direct the administrator--
    --
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 5778 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        I now recognize the bill's sponsor, Representative McIver
    from the great state of New Jersey, for a statement on the
    bill.
        Mrs. MCIVER. Thank you so much, Chairman. And thank you to
    our Ranking Member for holding this markup today. I would like
    to speak in strong support of my bill, H.R. 5778, the Improving
    SBA Engagement on Employee Ownership Act, a bipartisan bill
    that I am proud to lead with my colleague, Congressman
    Bresnahan, there we go--sorry for butchering that--of
    Pennsylvania and Ranking Member Velazquez of New York.
        Employee ownership is one of the most powerful tools we
    have to help working people build real wealth and strengthen
    local economies. When employees become owners, whether through
    employee stock ownership plans or cooperatives, they share in
    the profits, have a voice in decision-making, and gain direct
    stake in the success of the business. These are concrete
    pathways for everyday people to obtain financial security and
    stable jobs and to increase community investment. We have seen
    it through data and through real-world stories. Programs like
    this help our communities and economy.
        Employee ownership has made a difference for people like
    Emilio in my district at the Urban Agriculture Cooperative in
    Newark, New Jersey. The Urban Agriculture Cooperative operates
    a food hub, distributing healthy New Jersey products through
    farmers markets and wholesale. Most recently, they provided
    high-quality, local-grown produce to families in need during
    the SNAP crisis. As a cooperative, like those my bill would
    further support, they help employees build retirement savings
    and keep businesses rooted in the neighborhoods they serve.
    Employee owners like Emilio give so much to their workplace and
    with this model, they get something positive in return.
        Yet for far too long, the Small Business Administration has
    not met its obligation to support these models. Despite the
    proven benefits of ESOPs and cooperatives, SBA lending
    programs, especially the flagship 7(a) program, have reached
    only a tiny fraction of employee-owned businesses. In fact,
    over the last several years, the SBA approved just five 7(a)
    loans for SOPs or ESOPs and fewer than 100 for cooperatives,
    serving only a silver of the thousands of employees--a sliver,
    excuse me, serving only a sliver of the thousands of employee-
    owned businesses operating nationwide. That is not because the
    models don't work. It is because the federal government has not
    kept up with the growing demand of broad-based ownership.
        My bill changes that. The Improving SBA Engagement on
    Employee Ownership Act ensures that the SBA finally does its
    job to support employee-owned businesses. It requires the
    agency to show up consistently and at the highest levels in
    federal discussions and about employee ownership and
    cooperative development. It expands SBA outreach, especially
    through the SBIC program, so lenders, investors, and
    entrepreneurs understand how to use SBA tools to finance
    transitions to employee ownership. And it directs the SBA to
    finally start up the Small Business Employee Ownership and
    Cooperatives Promotion Program, I must need another cup of
    coffee, which Congress required 6 years ago, but has yet to be
    implemented.
        These are practical, commonsense steps that will help real
    people, the blue collar worker at a manufacturing plant trying
    to buy the business before it closes, the single mother working
    at a home care agency who wants to keep serving families in her
    community, or the young entrepreneur building a cooperative
    that offers good jobs and share prosperity for their neighbors.
    This bill helps them access capital, receiving technical
    assistance, and navigate the federal programs that exist to
    support them.
        Employee ownership is critical to worker dignity and shared
    success. It is about making sure workers are treated as
    partners, not just laborers, and building an economy that
    rewards hard work and not just wealth. I urge my colleagues to
    support this bipartisan effort by improving SBA's engagement
    with employee-owned businesses and cooperatives. We are
    protecting good jobs, ensuring working people have a fair shot
    at wealth. This is how we build a more inclusive economy for
    all.
        With that, Chairman, I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        I now recognize Representative Bresnahan from the great
    state of Pennsylvania for a statement on the bill.
        Mr. BRESNAHAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. So great to be
    back. And thank you to my colleague Rep. McIver for leading
    this important piece of legislation.
        ESOPs are a proven asset to help workers become successful
    partners in their businesses. When employees share in
    ownership, they share in achievement, creating a workplace that
    promotes personal investment and a group cooperation to grow a
    business successfully. That is why I am proud to co-lead the
    Improving SBA Engagement on Employee Ownership Act.
        This legislation will strengthen the Small Business
    Administration's ability to work with cooperative and employee-
    owned businesses to enrich local economies and provide business
    owners with critical assistance to preserve jobs and promote
    broad-based ownership. I am looking forward to seeing this bill
    passed through committee, so we can continue to support the
    small businesses and strengthen their impact on our
    communities' economic stability.
        And with that, I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement on the bill?
        Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member
    to speak on the bill.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I support H.R.
    5778, and I want to thank Representatives McIver and Bresnahan
    for their leadership on this issue.
        Employee-owned businesses are a valuable model that
    empowers workers and create strong American businesses.
    Employee-owned businesses, like ESOPs, and other common control
    enterprises, like co-ops, play a significant role in the U.S.
    economy. As of 2022, there were more than 5,500 ESOPs holding
    more than $1.8 trillion in assets and approximately 65,000 co-
    ops generating more than $324 billion in revenue.
        These businesses need the backing of the products and
    technical training that SBA provides in order to reach their
    full potential. These businesses have had only limited access
    to the SBA products, including the flagship 7(a) loan program.
    Technical support for employee-owned businesses has also been
    limited. The SBA has acknowledged these shortcomings and during
    the Biden administration began to engage with ESOPs and co-ops
    more directly. But more needs to be done. This bill will build
    on the progress made by providing a framework for increasing
    engagement between the SBA and other executive branch agencies
    currently developing policies and regulations related to ESOPs
    and co-ops.
        I want to thank Representatives McIver and Bresnahan for
    working on this bipartisan legislation and I encourage my
    colleagues to support the bill. I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back, and thank
    you.
        And I now recognize myself to speak in support of this
    legislation.
        For some entrepreneurs, employee ownership and cooperative
    business models can offer opportunities to empower their
    employees and share the success of the company. The Improving
    SBA Engagement on Employee Ownership Act requires the SBA to
    finally implement requirements passed in the fiscal year 2019
    NDAA to offer information and technical assistance on employee
    ownership. It also gives the SBA a seat at the table where
    other agencies are discussing these types of business models.
        I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 5778, and I yield
    back.
        Does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Seeing none, the question is now on favorably reporting
    H.R. 5778 to the House.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and H.R. 5778
    is agreed to.
        Mr. BRESNAHAN. Mr. Chairman, I ask for a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. The gentlemen asks for recorded
    votes. It has been requested. A roll call vote is ordered.
    Pursuant to Committee rule 13 and House rule XI, further
    proceedings on the bill are postponed.
        H.R. 4305
        The Committee now moves to consideration of H.R. 4305,
    Destroying Unnecessary, Misaligned, and Prohibitive Red Tape
    Act of 2025, or the DUMP Red Tape Act, introduced by the
    Representative Wied. The clerk report the bill.
        The CLERK. H.R. 4305, a bill to direct the chief----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, H.R. 4305 is
    considered as read and open for amendment.
        The bill sponsor, Representative Wied, has an amendment in
    the nature of a substitute at the desk. The amendment has been
    distributed in advance. The clerk will report the amendment.
        The CLERK. Amendment in the nature of a substitute to
    H.R.----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment is
    considered as read and the substitute will be considered in
    base text for the purpose of further amendment.
        I now recognize the bill's sponsor, Representative Wied
    from the great state of Wisconsin, for a statement on the bill
    and the amendment.
        Mr. WEID. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. After suffering through
    4 years of regulatory onslaught by the Biden administration,
    totaling nearly 1.8 trillion in new costs and requiring an
    additional 360 million hours to comply with these new
    regulations, small businesses are desperate for regulatory
    relief. In response, earlier this year, the Small Business
    Administration created the Red Tape Hotline under its Office of
    Advocacy. This hotline gives small businesses a seat at the
    table to highlight the prohibitive red tape regulations from
    across federal agencies that hurt their ability to grow and
    compete.
        My bill, H.R. 4305, the Destroying Unnecessary, Misaligned,
    and Prohibitive Red Tape Act, codifies the SBA's Red Tape
    Hotline. It also requires annual reports to Congress from the
    Office of Advocacy detailing the most burdensome regulations
    for small business owners and what the steps the SBA has taken
    to advocate on their behalf. This bill is a commonsense way to
    gather input directly from the people most harmed by
    overregulation. I urge all of my colleagues to support this
    important piece of legislation and stand with America's small
    businesses.
        And with that, I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement on the bill?
        Mr. MEUSER. Mr. Chairman?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Representative Meuser, Pennsylvania,
    recognized.
        Mr. MEUSER. May I be recognized? Thank you. Thank you, Mr.
    Chairman. H.R. 4305, the DUMP Red Tape Act, I commend my
    colleague, Mr. Wied, for introducing. I do think, however, it
    should have been named the DUMP Blue Tape Act.
        Anyway, we would require--it requires the SBA Office of
    Advocacy to codify the Red Tape Hotline and submit an annual
    report to Congress and Administrator Loeffler. This will
    provide small businesses with an outlet to report arbitrary and
    unnecessary regulations, as stated, directly to Congress and
    the public.
        Small businesses are the backbone of the U.S. economy,
    generating 44 percent of economic activity and employing over
    60 percent of the workforce. Yet under the Biden
    administration, small businesses were forced to navigate a
    complex regulatory landscape, resulting in $1.7 trillion in new
    regulatory costs and over 300 million hours of paperwork. These
    burdens ultimately fell on small businesses, limiting their
    ability to innovate, grow, and compete.
        So the Red Tape Hotline demonstrates that the Trump
    administration and Republicans want to hear directly from small
    businesses about the regulatory challenge they are facing.
    Unlike the Biden administration, we will continue delivering
    for small businesses by increasing transparency, promoting pro-
    growth policies, and streamlining communications.
        I urge my colleagues to support the bill, and I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement on the bill?
        Seeing none, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member
    to speak on the bill and the amendment.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to express
    my opposition to H.R. 4305. While this bill is less
    objectionable than other anti-regulatory bills we have
    considered this Congress, it is simply not necessary.
        To begin with, a deregulatory hotline already exists on
    regulations.gov. Establishing another creates duplication and
    drains SBA resources.
        More concerning the proposal hasn't been vetted properly.
    In the first 100-day report, Advocacy indicated there were 96
    small business submissions. Yet despite repeated requests for
    more detailed information, Advocacy has failed to provide any
    specific information about this request. We have no way of
    knowing if the submissions are related to rules. They could
    have easily been about tariffs or unpaid invoices to
    contractors. That is why I cannot support it. We have no
    information and the bill is more slogan than substance,
    ignoring other federal actions that are harming small
    businesses.
        We have heard testimony that small businesses are not
    talking about regulations. It ranks near the bottom of their
    list of concerns. Inflation, tariffs, and finding good
    employees are some of the top challenges facing small
    businesses. Take a walk down main street and you will hear the
    same concern from small business owners up and down the block.
    The uncertainty and rising costs tied to the Trump tariffs are
    crushing their small businesses, plain and simple.
        And to the best of my knowledge, Advocacy has not weighed
    in with the administration, which raises concerns over their
    lack of independence from the administration. I recall the many
    times the administrator from the Biden administration came here
    to testify and, you know, she was castigated, asking her if she
    talked to Joe Biden, the President, about the impact of taxes
    on them. Well, now my question is, is the administrator
    discussing with Donald Trump the impact that tariffs is having
    on small businesses. Or healthcare subsidy expirations, how
    will that impact small businesses?
        Instead of looking for ways to address inflation, tariffs,
    and labor shortages, this bill is narrowly drafted to focus on
    rolling back rules that protect our health, environment, and
    safety. Turning to the specifics, the bill lacks adequate
    reporting mechanisms to identify who is making the submissions,
    leaving it vulnerable to abuse. Advocacy has come under fire
    for doing the bidding of big businesses in the past, and they
    are not reporting a requirement in this bill to distinguish
    between a small business, trade association, or law firm. And
    the bill focuses only on the cost of regulations, not the
    benefits, which is only one-half of the equation.
        We need to look at both sides of the ledger, and by doing
    so, we will see that the benefits of the rule greatly outweigh
    the costs. For this reason, I plan to oppose the bill.
        With that said, if we can get the specific information from
    Advocacy as to what small businesses are actually submitting on
    the hotline and a better understanding of the mechanics of the
    hotline to ensure independence between SBA and Advocacy, I may
    be then willing to work with you on this bill.
        I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        Are there any other Members who wish to be recognized for a
    statement on the bill?
        Mr. STAUBER. Mr. Chair?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Recognized.
        Mr. STAUBER. Thank you very much. I support this bill. I
    think the intentions are pure.
        And whenever we have had witnesses in this Committee, we
    have asked how many of you want more bureaucrat issues, more
    regulations, more rules, more redundancy, more impact on small
    businesses? Every one of them said the federal government, stay
    off our backs, get out of our pockets, let us live the American
    dream and work in our communities. Mr. Wied understands that in
    his town of Wisconsin. I understand that in northern Minnesota.
    This bill is a very good bill. It is a good start to make sure
    that they have the opportunity to succeed.
        And the gentlelady, the Ranker, talks about, you know,
    asking small businesses beforehand. Well, I say the
    Unaffordable Care Act, you never ask small businesses. They are
    damaged because of that.
        Mr. Wied, this is a very good piece of legislation and I
    support it. I commend you for bringing it up. This is what the
    small business is for, to make sure that the men and women
    across this nation who risk everything to succeed.
        This is one of those pieces of legislation that I am in
    favor of, and I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        I now recognize myself to speak in support of this
    legislation.
        H.R. 4305, the DUMP Red Tape Act, codifies the Red Tape
    Hotline launched by the SBA Office of Advocacy on March 10,
    2025. The hotline gives small businesses a direct line to SBA
    Advocacy to report burdensome regulations that are holding them
    back and further enhances our ability to combat job-crushing
    red tape by requiring the Office of Advocacy to bring this
    feedback straight to Congress. And by empowering small business
    to speak up to federal agencies accountable, this bill will
    strengthen our commitment to pro-growth, pro-innovation
    economy. It is necessary to get the government out of the way
    so that our small business owners can do what they do best.
        I urge my colleagues to vote yes on H.R. 4305, and I yield
    back.
        Now, does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Mr. CISNEROS. Mr. Chairman?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. So moved. You are recognized.
        Mr. CISNEROS. I have an amendment at the desk.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. There is an amendment at the desk.
    We will briefly pause while staff distributes the amendment.
        Okay. The clerk will report the amendment.
        The CLERK. Amendment to the amendment in the nature of a
    substitute to H.R. 43----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment is
    considered as read.
        And I now recognize the Representative Cisneros for 5
    minutes on the amendment.
        Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I want to thank
    you and the Ranking Member on the great bipartisan work you
    have done today on so many of these amendments.
        My amendment would build on the ability of small businesses
    and entities to not only report on potentially erroneous and
    burdensome regulations, but to report rules that help safeguard
    small business interests and competition. My amendment also
    expands the hotline to better listen to small business concerns
    on other government actions that impact them, such as tariffs,
    healthcare, and immigration enforcement.
        What I hear the most from small businesses is that they
    need relief from tariffs and the uncertainty around them. If we
    truly want to support small businesses, we need to provide them
    with an avenue to express their grievances and truly hear what
    they need and to act on it. Some Members of this Committee plug
    their ears and close their eyes when tariffs are mentioned. But
    that is what small businesses are overwhelmingly sharing as
    their main concern right now. If the Office of Advocacy won't
    advocate for small businesses regarding tariffs, who else in
    our federal government will? Where can small businesses share
    their concerns?
        The Office of Advocacy is meant to advocate for small
    businesses, period. Assertions about their limitations are a
    fabrication of this administration and a byproduct of Project
    2025. If you truly believe that Advocacy cannot advocate
    against policies like tariffs that negatively impact small
    businesses, then I am open to working with you to expand the
    mandate to ensure small businesses have a voice in government
    that advances their views and concerns before Congress, the
    White House, across federal agencies, and the courts, as
    appropriate.
        The unfortunate thing about this hotline is that we have
    not had anyone from the Office of Advocacy come to publicly
    testify before this Committee, much less share what small
    businesses have raised so far. So my amendment would require
    more transparency from the Advocacy through the information it
    needs to report to Congress. My amendment would do this by
    ensuring Advocacy provides Congress information on all the
    government actions small businesses are raising, the
    recommendations for the actions to minimize those burdens, a
    summary of actions taken by Advocacy, and a type of entity that
    is making no submissions.
        We all want to unleash the innovations and level the
    playing field for our small businesses. I hope my colleagues
    across the aisle will join me in supporting my amendment to
    ensure that our small businesses truly have their voices heard
    throughout the federal government.
        And I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Is there further debate on the amendment?
        Mr. Wied, you are recognized.
        Mr. WEID. I noticed you even want to change the name of our
    bill from DUMP Red Tape Act to Cut the Burden, Keep the
    Benefits. Translation: Keep the red tape. But here is the
    thing. Small businesses don't benefit from more bureaucracy.
    They benefit when we actually cut the red tape holding them
    back, which is exactly what my bill does.
        This amendment tries to capture all federal actions,
    including presidential actions, but that is far beyond the
    scope of the SBA statutory mission. The SBA's Office of
    Advocacy was created to be the voice of small businesses in the
    regulatory process, not a catch-all for every executive or
    presidential action. If you expand the scope of the Red Tape
    Hotline, you will drown out legitimate small business concerns
    in a sea of unrelated political disputes.
        Ironically, this amendment adds layers of bureaucracy by
    requiring SBA to track and report on presidential action,
    something outside its expertise. That means more paperwork,
    more delays, and fewer resources devoted to actually helping
    small businesses. Our bill is about streamlining, not expanding
    government paperwork.
        I urge my colleagues to vote no on this amendment.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Is there any further debate on the amendment?
        Okay. The Ranking Member?
        Mrs. MCIVER. Chairman?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes, ma'am.
        Mrs. MCIVER. I would like to yield some time to my
    colleague.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. And Mrs. McIver, you are recognized.
        Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you, Ms. McIver, for yielding me my
    time--this time. Just to answer back, you know, to my colleague
    over there, this bill has no way of expanding red tape at all.
    It actually simply, I think, helps make your bill better by
    requiring the Small Business Association, the Office of
    Advocacy, to actually come to us and report and share what they
    are hearing from these small businesses, which only helps us be
    more impactful in helping support their small businesses.
        Really, that is simply all that we are asking. And we are
    asking that they, you know, kind of broaden their scope as to
    what, you know, as to what the small businesses can report.
    Right? Whether it is tariffs, healthcare, other issues, you
    know, collecting this information and then reporting what this
    information is, what are they gathering, and bringing that to
    us. That in no way increases the amount of red tape or anything
    that we are asking for. We are just asking them to report on
    what is being reported to them and sharing that information
    with us, which helps us better help the small businesses.
        And with that, I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Is there any further debate on the amendment?
        Okay. Seeing none, the Ranking Member is now recognized to
    speak on the amendment.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I lend my support
    to the amendment being offered by my colleague, Mr. Cisneros.
        The amendment will make a number of improvements to the
    underlying bill. First, it strengthens the legislative text by
    refining the definitions and scope to better align with
    Advocacy's role and the requirements set forth in the
    Regulatory Flexibility Act. The gentleman said that this
    amendment is out of the scope of Advocacy. That is not true. So
    let me read the statute. ``The Office of Advocacy should also
    perform the following duties on a continuing basis: serve as a
    local point for the receipt of complaints, criticism, and
    suggestions concerning the policies and activities of the
    administration, including the current administration and any
    other federal agency which affects small businesses.''
        Second, the amendment allows small entities to weigh in on
    executive orders and other actions being taken by the
    administration, and, more importantly, requires Advocacy to
    report on the actions taken. This provision is particularly
    critical now as the Trump tariffs are generating widespread
    confusion and uncertainty and inflicting onerous burden on
    small businesses. You don't want to talk about tariffs and the
    impact that it is having on small businesses. You want to talk
    about regulations. But when you go and walk down the street and
    talk to small businesses, small farmers, they are all raising
    the issue of the impact of tariffs in their businesses.
    Surprisingly, or maybe not surprisingly, the Office of Advocacy
    has been eerily silent on this topic as well as this Committee.
        Finally, the amendment will strengthen the reporting
    requirements and rename the bill to the Cut the Burden, Keep
    the Benefits Act. Advocacy will be required to report on the
    benefits of the rules, which must always outweigh the causes.
    Mr. Cisneros is offering a commonsense amendment. I urge all my
    colleagues to support this amendment.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        I now recognize myself to speak on the amendment.
        After only 50 days of opening the hotline earlier this
    year, the SBA Advocacy received 96 red tape hotline inquiries
    from small businesses across the country. Small businesses have
    been taking advantage of the hotline and Congress needs to
    ensure stability by codifying the hotline. We need to focus on
    how we can provide main street with the best avenues to reach
    regulatory relief, and that is through the original amendment
    in the nature of a substitute provided by Representative Wied.
        I urge my colleagues to vote no on this legislation. Vote
    no on the amendment on this legislation.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Mr. Chair?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Yes, ma'am.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. You know, you said just now that there has
    been 96 submissions. Since our side has not been given the
    opportunity to look at those submissions, have you seen those
    submissions? Are they related to regulation?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. We can--I mean, what we can--we can find
    out. I have not seen them. No. Okay?
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. I rest of my case.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. All right.
        The question now occurs on the amendment offered by
    Representative Cisneros.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the noes have it.
        Mr. CISNEROS. Mr. Chairman, I ask for a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. A recorded vote has been requested and a
    roll call vote is ordered, so further proceedings on the
    amendment are postponed.
        Does anyone wish to offer an amendment?
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Mr. Chair?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. There is amendment.
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Yes. Mr. Chair, sorry, I have an amendment at
    the desk.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Oh, so moved. There is an amendment at
    the desk. We will briefly pause while staff distributes the
    amendment.
        Okay. The clerk will report the amendment.
        The CLERK. Amendment to the amendment in the nature of a
    substitute to H.R. 4305, offered by----
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Without objection, the amendment is
    considered as read.
        And I now recognize Representative Scholten for 5 minutes
    on the amendment.
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Thank you, Mr. Chair. One of the best parts
    of the Small Business Committee is how often Democrats and
    Republicans can come together to solve real problems facing
    main street. Small business owners don't cut corners to get
    results and, most of the time, neither do Members of this
    Committee. Unfortunately, with the DUMP Red Tape Act, Committee
    Republicans have rushed a flawed bill to solve a problem we
    could be addressing on a bipartisan basis.
        Small businesses are the backbone of our economy. It has
    been said several times today. If there is no greater bedrock
    in this Committee, it is that. And we all agree that they need
    support in navigating the complex web of challenges that they
    face every day. Maintaining a hotline that will help small
    business owners report some of their most significant hurdles
    is a good idea. It is already in practice and something that
    Democrats and Republicans can continue to do in a bipartisan
    fashion.
        The problem with today's bill is that Committee Republicans
    are trying to codify a hotline where it seems that anyone,
    small business or not, can register a complaint. And that is
    because they get reported to Congress anonymously, and the
    complaint has to be about a specific regulation. So the real
    problem is individuals from lobbying firms, attorneys
    representing major businesses can register complaints here
    anonymously under the guise of being a small business. Large
    businesses themselves can come here and register these
    complaints anonymously. Is this really about helping small
    businesses or is this a suggestion box for billionaires?
        If we are going to spend taxpayer money on running this
    hotline, it is our job to make that hotline help real small
    businesses with real challenges. The DUMP Red Tape Act needs
    significant changes to meet that bar, and today I am offering
    an amendment to get us one step closer to legislation that is
    worthy of the small businesses in our districts.
        My amendment addresses a concern I hear from so many
    business owners in West Michigan. Running a business is
    challenging, and doing so in an unpredictable economic
    landscape is even more difficult. President Trump promised to
    lower prices starting on day one, but instead he has
    implemented a series of tariffs that have created chaos and
    real costs for entrepreneurs. As the cost of materials have
    jumped across the board, small businesses have borne the brunt
    of these policies. I know my Republican colleagues have heard
    it, too.
        As currently written, the hotline under the DUMP Red Tape
    Act permits submissions on burdensome rules and regulations,
    but it does not allow for submissions on executive actions like
    tariffs. My amendment to the DUMP Red Tape Act will allow small
    businesses to submit concerns to the hotline about executive
    orders and proclamations relating to tariffs. We should not be
    afraid to receive this feedback. We should not be limiting the
    uses of the hotline, especially when tariffs remain one of the
    biggest challenges small business owners deal with on a daily
    basis.
        The Trump administration has already set up a hotline that
    has received 96 submissions. Unfortunately, we do not know what
    these submissions are about, as the Ranking Member pointed out.
    They could very well be about tariffs, rules, or nonpayment of
    government contractors, not just burdensome regulations. This
    Committee and the people that we represent deserve to know what
    those submissions are about. If we are going to pass
    legislation to make this hotline permanent, we need to ensure
    that it can receive submissions accounting for all of the very
    real challenges of small business ownership. My amendment would
    help to do just that.
        I urge my colleagues to support this amendment. We want to
    make this hotline work and be a real tool for small businesses
    to connect and make real change.
        I yield back the remainder of my time.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        And is there further debate on the amendment?
        Mr. WEID. Yes.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Representative Wied.
        Mr. WEID. As a former small business owner for my entire
    lifetime up to this point, I would say the purpose of this bill
    is to give our hardworking small businesses a voice in, you
    know, exposing overbearing regulations that hurt our small
    businesses from growing.
        Tariffs are a matter of national trade and foreign policy
    overseen by Congress and the administration, not the SBA.
    Tariffs right now, they are used to protect American
    industries, enforce fair trade, and respond to global
    imbalances in trade. They are not red tape. They don't impose
    compliance paperwork or permitting delays that continue to hurt
    small businesses. Including presidential tariff actions, that
    would turn the hotline into a political complaint desk about
    trade policy. That undermines its credibility as a neutral,
    business-focused tool.
        Congress already has oversight mechanisms for tariffs and
    trade policy. Our bill avoids duplication by keeping the
    hotline focused on regulations. If every tariff proclamation is
    subject to hotline review, it signals to foreign competitors
    that U.S. trade policy is fragmented and negotiable. That
    weakens America's hand in trade negotiations and could harm the
    very small businesses the amendment claims to protect.
        I urge my colleagues to vote no on this amendment.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Is there further debate on the amendment?
        Mr. McGarvey is recognized.
        Mr. MCGARVEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield my time to
    Congresswoman Ms. Scholten.
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Mr. Chairman, most small business owners
    don't necessarily know the difference between a regulation, a
    point of law, or the tariffs that are harming their small
    businesses, but they sure know what is impacting their bottom
    line. This Committee should not be afraid to receive feedback
    and, further, to know what is included in those 96 complaints
    that have already been received. This is a commonsense
    amendment that would open this up for small business owners to
    be able to have the freedom to share with this Committee how we
    can best help them.
        I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Is there any further debate on the
    amendment?
        Mr. CISNEROS. Mr. Chairman? Mr. Chairman?
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Mr. Cisneros is recognized.
        Mr. CISNEROS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Look, I just want to
    address the issue we do need--the one thing that I hear from my
    small businesses in my district is just give us stability. I
    need stability. But when we have a President who makes a whim
    on a tariff and raises them for Canada because he didn't like a
    commercial that he saw during the World Series, that is no
    stability there. Right? That is not what our small businesses
    are asking for, and they need to be able to kind of make that
    complaint and bring it forward. And that is something the
    Office of Advocacy should be reporting to us in Congress, so
    that we can help address these issues.
        But with that, we just want to make this bill better. Give
    the small businesses the opportunity to report what they are
    hearing and have the SBA come to us and tell us what they are
    hearing, which is, obviously, which is not happening now with
    the way this is working now.
        And with that, I yield back.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentleman yields back.
        Is there further debate on the amendment?
        Okay. The Ranking Member is now recognized to speak on the
    amendment.
        Ms. VELAZQUEZ. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I lend my
    support to the amendment offered by my colleague, Ms. Scholten.
        The amendment would allow small businesses to submit
    concerns about tariffs and require Advocacy to report on its
    action to limit the burden. The Office of Advocacy is the voice
    of small businesses. It is not limited only to complaints about
    regulations. It is open to anything that impacts small
    businesses. The 96 submissions to the advocacy hotline could
    have easily been about tariffs, but we don't know. The Chairman
    doesn't know. I just asked him. He hasn't seen any of the
    submissions. The administration didn't provide information to
    us. So if we are here passing legislation based on what we hear
    and what the SBA wants to tell us, but not to share the
    specific information, we need to do better by small businesses.
        Tariffs, not regulations, are crushing small businesses.
    Small businesses all across the country are shouldering the
    costs of the Trump tariffs. The cost of goods is rising
    exponentially, making it harder and hard for small businesses
    to do what they do best: create jobs, innovate, and flourish.
    Despite promises made by the Trump administration to lower
    costs on day one, President Trump's policies have inflicted
    pain on every sector of the small business economy.
        And where is the Office of Advocacy when small businesses
    are under siege? Nowhere to be found.
        I strongly support the amendment, which would allow us to
    get a better understanding of how many small businesses are
    contacting Advocacy about tariffs and see if Advocacy is
    advocating for them.
        I urge my colleagues to support this amendment, and I yield
    back, Mr. Chairman.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The gentlelady yields back.
        I now recognize myself to speak on the amendment.
        As my colleague mentioned, the amendment is unnecessary
    because the Red Tape Hotline needs to be targeted to address
    the regulatory burdens main street is feeling every day, not
    what is defined in this proposed amendment. I urge my
    colleagues to vote no on this amendment.
        Now, the question now occurs on the amendment offered by
    Representative Scholten.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the noes----
        Ms. SCHOLTEN. Mr. Chairman, I request a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The Member is recognized and a recorded
    vote has been requested. A roll call vote is ordered. Further
    proceedings on the amendment are postponed.
        Okay. Now, the question now occurs on the adoption of the
    substitute amendment offered to H.R. 4305 by Representative
    Wied.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it. The
    amendment in the nature of a substitute to H.R. 4305 is
    adopted.
        The question is now on favorably reporting H.R. 4305, as
    amended, to the House.
        All those in favor, say aye.
        All those opposed, say no.
        In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have it and H.R.
    4305, as amended, is agreed to.
        Mr. WEID. Mr. Chairman, ask for a recorded vote.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay, we recognize that and a recorded
    vote has been requested. A roll call vote is ordered. And
    pursuant to Committee rule 13 and House rule XI, further
    proceedings on the bill are postponed.
        Now, the Committee will stand in recess subject to the call
    to the Chair. Members, please return, do we know 11:40? Please
    return at 11:40 to resume consideration of the bill on which
    the roll call votes were requested and postponed.
        [Recess.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. The Committee will now come to
    order.
        The Committee will resume consideration of the bills on
    which roll call votes were requested and postponed. We start
    with H.R. 5763.
        The question now is on adopting H.R. 5763 and ordering it
    favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted or wish to change their vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 27 and
    the noes are 0.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. The motion is agreed to and H.R.
    5763 is adopted and will be reported favorably to the House.
        The question now is adopting H.R. 5788 and ordering it
    favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted or wish to change their vote?
        Okay. If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk
    will report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 27 and
    the noes are 0.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 5788 is
    adopted and will be reported favorably to the House.
        The question now is adopting H.R. 3496, as amended, and
    ordering it favorably to the House. The clerk will open the
    vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted or wish to change the vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 27 and
    the noes are 0.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. The motion is agreed to and H.R.
    3496, as amended, is adopted and will be reported favorably to
    the House.
        The question now is on ordering H.R. 5764, as amended, and
    ordering it favorably to the House.
        The clerk will open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted and wish to change their vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 27 and
    the noes are 0.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 5764,
    as amended, is adopted and will be reported favorably to the
    House.
        The question now is on adopting H.R. 5784 and ordering it
    favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any of the Members who have
    not voted or wish to change their vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 27 and
    the noes are 0.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 5784 is
    adopted and will be reported favorably to the House.
        The question now is on adopting H.R. 5778 and ordering it
    favorably to the House. The clerk will open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted or wish to change their vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 27 and
    the noes are 0.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 5778 is
    adopted and will be reported favorably to the House.
        Now, we will now vote on H.R. 4305. The question is on the
    amendment offered by Representative Cisneros. The clerk will
    open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted or wish to change their vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 12 and
    the noes are 15.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The amendment is not agreed to.
        The question is on the amendment offered by Representative
    Scholten. The clerk will open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other Members who have not
    voted or wish to change their vote?
        If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk will
    report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 12 and
    the noes are 15.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Okay. The amendment is not agreed to.
        Now, the question is now, is adopting to H.R. 4305, as
    amended, and ordering it favorably to the House. The clerk will
    open the vote.
        [The vote was taken.]
        Chairman WILLIAMS. Are there any other--okay. Are there any
    Members who have not voted or wish to change their vote?
        Okay. If not, the clerk will close the vote and the clerk
    will report.
        The CLERK. Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 18 and
    the noes are 9.
        Chairman WILLIAMS. The motion is agreed to and H.R. 4305,
    as amended, is adopted and will be reported favorably to the
    House.
        Now, if there is--okay. If there is no further business,
    this concludes today's markup. I want to say I think we had a
    good markup. Bipartisanship is strong in this Committee, and we
    are getting things done.
        So, without objection, the Committee staff is authorized to
    make technically conforming changes and Members have 2 business
    days to file additional supplemental, dissenting, and minority
    views.
        I want to thank all of you for being here today. Without
    objection, the Committee stands adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 11:51 a.m., the committee was adjourned.]

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