[House Hearing, 119 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
AGRICULTURE, RURAL DEVELOPMENT, FOOD
AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION, AND RELATED
AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR 2026
_______________________________________________________________________
HEARINGS
BEFORE A
SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE
COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
_____________
SUBCOMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, RURAL DEVELOPMENT, FOOD AND
DRUG ADMINISTRATION, AND RELATED AGENCIES
ANDY HARRIS, Maryland, Chairman
ROBERT B. ADERHOLT, Alabama SANFORD D. BISHOP, Jr., Georgia
DAVID G. VALADAO, California Ranking Member
JOHN R. MOOLENAAR, Michigan CHELLIE PINGREE, Maine
DAN NEWHOUSE, Washington LAUREN UNDERWOOD, Illinois
JULIA LETLOW, Louisiana MARIE GLUESENKAMP PEREZ,
BEN CLINE, Virginia Washington
ASHLEY HINSON, Iowa MARCY KAPTUR, Ohio
SCOTT FRANKLIN, Florida, DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, Florida
Vice Chair
NOTE: Under committee rules, Mr. Cole, as chairman of the full
committee, and Ms. DeLauro, as ranking minority member of the full
committee, are authorized to sit as members of all subcommittees.
Pam Miller, Elizabeth Dent, Nick Seelinger,
Judd Gardner and Sykes Connell
Subcommittee Staff
_________________
PART 2
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HOUSE COMMITTEE ON APPROPRIATIONS
----------
TOM COLE, Oklahoma, Chairman
HAROLD ROGERS, Kentucky,
Chairman Emeritus
ROBERT B. ADERHOLT, Alabama
MICHAEL K. SIMPSON, Idaho
JOHN R. CARTER, Texas
KEN CALVERT, California
MARIO DIAZ-BALART, Florida
STEVE WOMACK, Arkansas
CHARLES J. ``CHUCK'' FLEISCHMANN,
Tennessee
DAVID P. JOYCE, Ohio
ANDY HARRIS, Maryland
MARK E. AMODEI, Nevada
DAVID G. VALADAO, California
DAN NEWHOUSE, Washington
JOHN R. MOOLENAAR, Michigan
JOHN H. RUTHERFORD, Florida
BEN CLINE, Virginia
GUY RESCHENTHALER, Pennsylvania
ASHLEY HINSON, Iowa
TONY GONZALES, Texas
JULIA LETLOW, Louisiana
MICHAEL CLOUD, Texas
MICHAEL GUEST, Mississippi
RYAN K. ZINKE, Montana
ANDREW S. CLYDE, Georgia
STEPHANIE I. BICE, Oklahoma
SCOTT FRANKLIN, Florida
JAKE ELLZEY, Texas
JUAN CISCOMANI, Arizona
CHUCK EDWARDS, North Carolina
MARK ALFORD, Missouri
NICK LaLOTA, New York
DALE W. STRONG, Alabama
CELESTE MALOY, Utah
RILEY M. MOORE, West Virginia
ROSA L. DeLAURO, Connecticut,
Ranking Member
STENY H. HOYER, Maryland
MARCY KAPTUR, Ohio
JAMES E. CLYBURN, South Carolina
SANFORD D. BISHOP, Jr., Georgia
BETTY McCOLLUM, Minnesota
DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, Florida
HENRY CUELLAR, Texas
CHELLIE PINGREE, Maine
MIKE QUIGLEY, Illinois
GRACE MENG, New York
MARK POCAN, Wisconsin
PETE AGUILAR, California
LOIS FRANKEL, Florida
BONNIE WATSON COLEMAN, New Jersey
NORMA J. TORRES, California
ED CASE, Hawaii
ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
JOSH HARDER, California
LAUREN UNDERWOOD, Illinois
SUSIE LEE, Nevada
JOSEPH D. MORELLE, New York
MIKE LEVIN, California
MADELEINE DEAN, Pennsylvania
VERONICA ESCOBAR, Texas
FRANK J. MRVAN, Indiana
MARIE GLUESENKAMP PEREZ,
Washington
GLENN IVEY, Maryland
Susan Ross, Chief Clerk and Staff Director
(II)
AGRICULTURE, RURAL DEVELOPMENT, FOOD AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION, AND
RELATED AGENCIES APPROPRIATIONS FOR 2026
Wednesday, May 7, 2025.
DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
WITNESS
BROOKE ROLLINS, SECRETARY, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
Mr. Harris. The Subcommittee will come to order.
Good morning, and I want to thank all of you for being here
today for this hearing to review the budget and programs at the
U.S. Department of Agriculture.
We are pleased to be joined by the Secretary of Agriculture
Brooke Rollins. Secretary Rollins, we welcome you to the
Subcommittee. I look forward to hearing about your priorities
and the work that has been under way at USDA during the first
hundred days of the Trump Administration.
As you know, we have the most productive and efficient
agricultural producers in the world. It is critical that they
maintain access to important crop protection tools and
technology so that they can continue to feed our nation and the
world.
They also need access to land, which is why I am concerned
about solar panels being placed on prime farmland, not only in
my district but across the country. My producers are very
concerned by this, and I look forward to working with the
administration to end tax subsidizes and disincentivize such
technologies so that we can keep fertile farmland in
production.
Madam Secretary, I want to commend you for your leadership
in quickly implementing the Emergency Commodity Assistance
Program. In December, Congress enacted $31 billion in disaster
and economic relief for farmers and ranchers. Producers are
applying for the $10 billion set-aside for economic assistance,
and payments are already being made. The speed at which USDA
worked to make these funds available to farmers highlights this
administration's emphasis that our government work in a better
and more efficient manner for the American people. It also
highlights your commitment to the backs of farmers and ranchers
following several years of a poor agricultural economy.
At the same time, USDA cannot take its foot off the gas in
implementing the remaining $21 billion in disaster funds.
Producers around the country faced devastating natural
disasters in 2023 and 2024, from floods in California,
persistent drought in many of the Great Plains states, and
hurricanes across Florida and southeastern United States.
The Subcommittee held a roundtable with USDA officials at
the end of March to discuss implementing these disaster funds,
and we are anxious to hear any updates on the next steps and
timelines for delivering those funds to farmers.
I also appreciate your prioritizing USDA's response to the
avian influenza outbreak which began in 2022. This disaster has
decimated poultry flocks across the country, including broiler
flocks in my district in Maryland, and has spread to dairy
cattle nationwide. You have directed additional funding towards
combatting the disease and I look forward to an update on this
evolving situation.
As you know, poultry production is important in my
district, and I appreciate you have already made great progress
in reducing unnecessary burdens on the poultry industry by
finally addressing line speeds at processing facilities. But
the Biden Administration also pushed harmful packers and
stockyards regulations that dictate how poultry and livestock
producers raise and market their animals, and I hope those
rules will be addressed by the Trump Administration.
My district also includes the Chesapeake Bay, which has
been devastated by invasive blue catfish. Congress has provided
funding to increase processing capacity to develop a self-
sustaining market for these invasive catfish. Processors in the
Bay are lining up and eager to apply for this funding, so USDA
must move forward with the application process as quickly as
possible.
At the same time, processors have worked with the
Agricultural Marketing Service to purchase more wild-caught
catfish for the USDA nutrition programs. I would ask
specifically that you ensure that wild-caught catfish are
included in all the AMS solicitations equally with other
seafood products.
Another issue you and I had discussed, Madam Secretary, is
that the federal government should not continue to subsidize
unhealthy food in the Supplement Nutrition Assistance Program.
Over the past 20 years, cities and states have asked USDA for
the ability to restrict SNAP purchases of sugary drinks and
unhealthy food. But each time, surprisingly, those requests
have been denied. We must return SNAP, the largest food
assistance and nutrition program in America, back to its
original purpose of providing nutritious foods for
participants. I am glad to see the proactive steps you have
taken to work with states on this, and I look forward to
working with you to move the program in this direction.
Finally, on Friday, we received a high-level overview of
the Fiscal Year 2026 President's budget request. Several
programs are marked for elimination or significant reductions,
and I hope we will receive a more detailed budget request as
soon as possible. We need to understand the potential savings
and efficiencies that have been identified at USDA as we move
through our appropriations process. When this country is
running a chronic $2 trillion deficit, we have a responsibility
to spend every taxpayer dollar wisely.
Again, I appreciate your being with us for today's
discussion, Madam Secretary.
Ranking Member Bishop, I will now yield to you for any
opening remarks you would like to make.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Secretary Rollins, it is good to have you here with us
today. I recognize that you have been very busy and have had
some very urgent work to do, such as rolling out the
congressional directives including the much awaited economic
assistance of farmers and dealing with the Texas water issue.
I want to thank you for coming before the committee today
because I am concerned that the administration appears to be
operating outside the rule of law. Pursuant to its Article I
constitutional authority, Congress has passed laws establishing
a process to repurpose funding and a process to conduct a legal
reduction of force. Yet the administration has refused to
follow the law and is in the process of dismembering the
federal government at every single department without authority
to do so. We see what is happening with the Department of
Education, with FEMA, with HHS. And today, we are talking about
Agriculture.
No Fortune 500 CEO worth his or her salt would put the cart
before the horse and fire huge swathes of their employees and
then try to figure out if there were enough people left to meet
the company's needs and serve its customers. Yet that is what
USDA and other federal agencies have done or seem to be doing.
Did the administration thoughtlessly fire people working on
bird flu? Whoops. Recklessly fire those who protect our nuclear
stockpile? Whoops.
My colleague, Chairman Harris, and I both believe that good
congressional oversight means fighting fraud, waste, and abuse.
Yet the President fired the person at USDA responsible for
going after fraud, waste, and abuse, the USDA inspector
general, with no justification, and had her unceremoniously
escorted from her office.
As you know, in March, Congress passed a continuing
resolution. And in it, House and Senate Republicans required
USDA to provide this committee with a detailed plan showing how
the Department will spend taxpayer dollars. The two-page
document we received last week, late I might add, did not show
any level of detail and it fails to meet that legal obligation.
That is essentially a slap in the face to the Republican
majorities in the House and Senate who included that
requirement in the CR. Your decision to violate this
requirement demonstrates that there is a lack of accountability
to the committee, but more importantly shows a lack of
responsibility to the American taxpayers that we represent for
how you are spending their money.
The lack of detail, quite honestly, makes me wonder what is
being hidden. That is why we need hearings like this today, to
set the record straight. For example, in reading your testimony
for the hearing today, it insinuates that the National
Agriculture Statistics Service under the Biden Administration
frivolously canceled the July cattle and county estimate survey
last year. The fact is that the cancellation was due to an
insufficient funding level in the Fiscal Year 2024 bill, done
at the direction of Republicans on this committee, something to
which my staff and I repeatedly objected.
House Republicans did not enact a final appropriation until
half way through the fiscal year, a result of Speaker Johnson's
reluctance to negotiate on a top line. This is what happens
when Congress underfunds or withholds funds from USDA. Critical
functions get canceled.
When our constituents have questions, we must get answers
from you. And I would imagine my Republican colleagues, as good
representatives in this coequal branch of government feel the
same. My constituents say that USDA is understaffed. My
constituents, including entire school districts, our health
care system, and many farmers also say that they are hurting
from the cancellation of the local food agreements and from
frozen funding. Local food purchasing agreements awarded over
$900 million, in all 50 states, D.C., foreign territories, and
84 tribes. The Local Food for Schools program awarded 200
million in funds to 42 states and the District of Columbia.
Georgia has the fifth largest school nutrition program in
America. The cancellation of the Local Food for Schools program
and USDA's decision not to fund the Farm to School Grant
Program this year has hurt over 40 Georgia school districts.
Their ability to feed school kids has been severely stunted and
our farmers have lost a valuable market.
My constituents say that the President is causing
uncertainty, uncertainty as farmers wait for promised funding.
I hear that farmers and small businesses are still waiting for
their EQIP grants and their RE grants. Funds for rural
broadband, funds for agricultural research, and funds for other
programs are still frozen and people are still waiting.
Uncertainty, as USDA's priorities change, uncertainty
compounded by the lack of a Farm Bill. Uncertainty as tariff
announcements yoyo back and forth.
That uncertainty feeds fear, which is pitting farmers
against families. This does not have to be a zero sum game.
Secretary Rollins, you have a very impressive background,
ag policy development, an undergraduate foundation in the law
with your juris doctor, and clear leadership as you founded the
America First Foundation. I am hopeful that putting America
first in your job as Secretary of Agriculture will mean that
you will do all that is necessary to assure that American
agriculture will be sufficiently funded with research,
personnel, and all of the tools so that American producers can
continue to produce the highest quality, the safest, the most
abundant, and the most affordable food and fiber anywhere in
the world. But please know that that will not happen if we try
to fund agriculture for the 21st century with 20th century
levels. We must be innovative.
I look forward to working with you and your team at USDA
and with Chairman Harris and with this committee on behalf of
the American people so that all of the stakeholders of the USDA
and the American people will get all that we deserve and that
we need from that agency.
Thank you very much. I look forward to your testimony and
the questions to follow.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Mr. Harris. Thank you, Mr. Bishop. I would like to
recognize now the distinguished ranking member of the
Appropriations Committee, Ms. DeLauro, for her opening
statement.
Ms. DeLauro. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank
you to the Ranking Member, for holding what is an important
budget committee. And I want to welcome our witness, Secretary
Rollins, for appearing here this morning, and look forward to
your testimony and the opportunity to have an exchange.
We are in the middle of a cost of living crisis today. It
is directly hurting farmers. And the Trump Administration has
unlawfully frozen and impounded congressionally appropriated
funds for agencies, programs, and services that assist American
farmers. Understand that the power of the purse resides in the
U.S. Congress. That is in the Constitution. And while we might
play fast and loose with the Constitution, we have to abide by
what it says. That is who we are as a nation.
Let me just tick off for you for a second here the programs
that have been frozen or canceled or cut in some way.
National Institute of Food and Agriculture, frozen. Local
Food Purchase Assistance Cooperative Agreement, canceled,
terminated. Local Food Schools Cooperative Agreement Program,
canceled, terminated. EQIP, Environmental Quality Incentives
Program, frozen. Conservation Stewards Program, frozen.
Agriculture Conservation Easement Program, frozen. Regional
Conservation Partnership, frozen. Conservation Technical
Assistance, frozen. Technical Assistance for Underserved
Farmers, Ranchers, Foresters, frozen. Watershed programs,
frozen. ReConnect Broadband Loan and Grant Program, frozen. The
Emergency Food Assistance Program, TEFAP, canceled or
terminated.
And I might add the administration has indiscriminately
fired thousands of civil servants who help administer these
programs and ensure funding goes where it is intended.
The President is not laser focused on the cost of living
crisis. He is actually making it worse. He promised to fight
for the working class and for farmers but instead put Elon Musk
and billionaires in charge of the government. This
administration is attacking farmers to pay for tax cuts for
billionaires.
The White House has halted over $600 million in funding
promised to rural business and farmers through the Rural Energy
for America Program and other vital programs. They stole from
the farmers and rural businesses who took the deal that the
government offered them to invest in renewable energy, raising
their energy costs, increasing economic stress, and in turn
they raised the costs on the American people in the middle of a
cost of living crisis.
Likewise, when the administration froze the Environmental
Qualities Incentives Program, they left farmers and producers
who invested in conservation projects, they left them out to
dry. They canceled over $1 billion in funding for programs that
helped schools, food banks purchase food directly from local
farms, threatening the livelihood of farmers and the
nourishment of children and families reliant on this
assistance.
By cutting these funds, the administration prioritized
corporate interests over the hardworking farmers who need these
supports to continue operating.
I have always been focused on the needs of small and
medium-sized farmers because they are the backbone of our
country and, quite frankly, the backbone of my state of
Connecticut. And I would like to recognize one in the room
today, who traveled from Connecticut, 79 hours, Willie
Dellacamera. Willie, a small specialty crop farmer from my
district, experienced a severe storm last December. He did
everything right, everything right, and had insurance coverage,
but was still left with over $200,000 in losses.
In response, with his help, we created a path to farm
recovery and support block grant, a program that is tailored to
the needs of small and medium-sized farmers, which removed the
barrier of crop insurance requirements, allowed flexibility for
states in response to extreme weather events. New England
farmers depend on this grant and I will work with you to make
sure that this support gets out as the Congress intended. To
date, Willie Dellacamera has not received one dime.
And also here is another Connecticut farmer in attendance,
Robert Chong, who was talking about the need for this $220
million. There is Robert right back there.
And the gentleman sitting next to Willie was here in the
'70s, when the farmers came down with tractors and made their
case. And we say thank you for that. And if we have to have the
tractors back here again, we will do it, and we will be with
you on that.
Even though we received Trump's concepts of a budget plan
on Friday, we are now into May without a real budget from the
White House, though I am eager to know about why we have chosen
to eliminate funding for the Food for Peace Program, the
McGovern-Dole programs, and gut funding for the Commodity
Supplemental Food Program. Not only will this take food from
the mouths of millions at home and abroad, including seniors
who face hunger and starvation, it will harm American farmers
who will no longer see proceeds from producing this urgently
needed food.
Thanks to the administration's lawless funding freeze and
the dismantling of agencies without congressional involvement,
hundreds of thousands of pounds of food grown by American
farmers has sat in warehouses or gone to waste. Local food for
schools and local food purchase assistance were ended by USDA
earlier this year, meaning not only did the administration
determine that feeding our children was not a priority, they
decided the farmers who produce the food for these children
were not a priority either.
Connecticut is expected to lose nearly $4 million in
funding from these two programs alone, $4 million in support
that goes directly to purchasing locally grown fresh fruits and
vegetables.
I understand the administration is eager to pass tax breaks
for billionaires. But doing so by stealing from hungry people
and farmers is indefensible. Next, Republicans in Congress and
the White House will target our safety net programs for hungry
people, including children, WIC and SNAP, or food stamps, to
pay for their billionaire tax break.
Madam Secretary, this administration's abandonment of
farmers is not creating efficiency, and you know that. It is
not helping farmers nor consumers save money. In fact, the
President's trade war, which he has admitted puts farmers on
the front lines, will cost taxpayers billions of dollars in
bailouts to shield farmers from the consequences of this
President's agenda. Farmers and the American people need
immediate answers as to how you plan to fix the mess that this
administration is creating for them.
Thank you for being here. I look forward to your testimony.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much, and I will recognize the
chairman of the whole committee when he arrives for his
remarks. But until then, thank you, Ms. DeLauro.
Secretary Rollins, without objection, your entire written
testimony will be included in the record. And after your
statement, we will proceed with questions.
As the first reminder, because I want to remind members
again before we start questioning, we have a hard break at noon
for the Secretary, so we will have to abide by the five-minute
rule for questions.
Secretary Rollins, you are now recognized for your
statement.
STATEMENT OF BROOKE ROLLINS
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, sir. Chairman Harris, Ranking
Member DeLauro, Ranking Member Bishop, and obviously when Chair
Cole gets here as well, and distinguished members of this
Subcommittee, I am so grateful for the opportunity to be here
before you and to share what we have been doing at this USDA
over the last 83 days since I walked in that front door, and
also President Trump's vision over the last 100-plus days.
I look forward to answering your questions, many of them
have already been outlined, as we move over the next few hours,
and welcome the opportunity to do so. When farmers prosper,
rural America prospers. And I want to thank all of you for your
shared commitment to ensuring our farmers, ranchers, and our
rural communities thrive.
During my confirmation testimony, I quoted Thomas
Jefferson. We talk a lot about Thomas Jefferson at the USDA,
one of the original American farmers. His 1787 letter to
another original American farmer, George Washington, in which
President Jefferson said, agriculture is our wisest pursuit,
because it will in the end contribute most to real wealth, to
good morals, and to happiness.
I have had the distinct privilege of serving American
farmers and ranchers for the last 83 days, and I can tell you
that our farmers--and all of you know this as well, you are on
this committee--continue to embody the ideals and the passion
for America and our land, just as Thomas Jefferson described
over two centuries ago. And serving as their champion today
continues to be my highest and greatest honor.
As the thirty-third Secretary of Agriculture, I have made
it my mission to reconstitute, to rebuild, and to revivify the
United States Department of Agriculture. And that includes a
budget that reflects the priorities as mandated by the American
people in November of last year.
The President's fiscal year 2026 discretionary budget
identifies the priorities of our administration. And for the
Department of Agriculture, that means prioritizing food safety,
rooting out wasteful spending, restoring federalism by
empowering the states to best serve their communities, and
above all putting farmers and ranchers first in America.
Notably, of USDA's $215 billion annual budget, today we are
talking about the discretionary part of that budget, which is
$30 billion, 14 percent of the annual budget at USDA is
discretionary. Of that 14 percent of our annual budget, the
discussion today surrounding around some increased but mostly
decreases in that 14 percent of the discretionary budget. Our
cuts suggest about 21 percent cuts of the 14 percent of the
$230 billion budget. So let's just be clear on the numbers.
We at the Department of Agriculture have wasted no time in
implementing President Trump's bold policy agenda. I want to
touch on a few highlights here, and I appreciate Chairman
Harris but also Chairman Bishop, Sanford, and others mentioning
this already. Upon taking office, I was asked by President
Trump to address the avian bird flu and to lower the cost of
eggs in the short term.
In February, at the direction of President Trump, I
announced a significant five-point plan--I think I was on the
job about 10 days at that point--to meet this challenge head
on. I am proud to report that since the plan was introduced,
the wholesale price of eggs has decreased 56 percent, with
retail following.
In taking on this position, I fully understood that
American agriculture is facing one of the most economically
challenging times in our history. For generations, American
producers and consumers enjoyed the fruits of an agricultural
trade surplus. But under the four years, the last four years of
the Biden Administration, our farmers and producers were forced
to endure a trade deficit that again, when leaving the last
White House which I was a part of with President Trump, when we
walked out, there was a zero dollar trade deficit. Today, we
are reaching more than $50 billion in trade deficit. We will
talk about how to fix that today, if questioned.
President Trump and I know this problem will not solve
itself. He is taking bold action to address our imbalanced
trade commitments. And I am working to promote American
agriculture products around the world.
In April, we launched USDA ag trade promotion programs for
Fiscal Year 2026, and we are currently accepting applications
for significant, in fact almost--more than four export market
development programs. As part of this effort, I will be
traveling to seven countries in the next few months, leaving
Sunday for the U.K. I will be there next week. And soon after,
all over the world. India, East Asia, et cetera. Where I will
ensure our trading partners around this world know that
American agriculture is the crown jewel of all American
production.
We are also streamlining unnecessary regulations and
cutting red tape for agricultural producers and industries so
they can continue the work they do every day to feed, to fuel,
and to clothe the nation and the world. To that end, our team
has sought to eliminate waste, fraud, and abuse in all USDA
programs, including SNAP, Food Stamps, improper payments,
fraud, and programs that fail to fulfill USDA's basic mission
of putting farmers first.
Our team is meeting daily with our partners at the
Department of Government Efficiency to ensure we are doing
right by the American taxpayer, while also protecting critical
USDA programs.
Also of paramount importance, Chairman Harris, is the
Department's mission to make America healthy again, in
partnership across the federal government, and with our
partners in the states. We have been taking major steps to
fulfill this mandate by accepting SNAP waivers and encouraging
healthier behaviors, and working with governors, both
Republican and Democrat, across this great state. I would love
to get into that if anyone wants to talk about it.
The MAHA movement at USDA has also supported major
voluntary changes, including our friends at the International
Dairy Foods Association's most recent announcement related to
dyes in school lunch dairy products.
Finally, I was proud to last week stand with Charles and
Heather Maude, a South Dakota family with a small cattle and
hog operation, fifth generation, who endured a senseless
politically motivated prosecution by the last administration
over 25 acres of forest land and a fence that had been in place
since 1910. The criminal charges against the family are now
dropped. And to prevent further injustices against American
farmers and ranchers, we have launched a significant effort,
including a portal at USDA, where we have asked similarly
situated farmers and ranchers to report similar injustices. To
date, we have received over 100 stories since first announcing
last week.
To be clear, the Maude family was charged criminally, a
SWAT team appeared at their door. They were told their children
would need to find someone else to raise them and that they
were going to lose everything.
During my first 83 days as Secretary of Agriculture, I have
visited 15 states. If I have not been to your state yet, I am
coming soon. I have attended over 100 events, given dozens of
keynote speeches all across the country, talking about the
vision and putting farmers and ranchers first. And I have met
with nearly 1,000 agricultural stakeholders, farmers and
ranchers and producers, as we continue to reorient the
Department of Agriculture.
American agriculture does not rest, and I can assure you
that under my tenure at USDA that neither will we. I am proud
to be at the helm of the people's department, as Abraham
Lincoln so aptly launched and named it in 1862, at the table
with President Trump, and fighting for the most American of all
Americans, our farmers, ranchers, and our agriculture
communities.
Thank you so much.
[The information follows:]
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Mr. Harris. Thank you very much, Secretary Rollins. And
again, we are going to start the questions. And just a
reminder, simple math is that if all 17 people ask a question,
we are going to come in right on time at noon. So I am going to
be--I am going to use the gavel when necessary for that timing.
I will start off. I will tell you that, congratulations on
the job with eggs. Because I went shopping last week and they
finally went under $4 a dozen with the limit removed, which was
nice.
Secretary Rollins. Yes.
Mr. Harris. Which was nice. And thanks for doing a job with
that.
I will talk a little bit about the nutrition programs. I
want to thank you for doing what we thought the secretary
always had the authority to do, which is to grant those
waivers. I have no idea why previous secretaries did not think
they had the authority. It made sense, and I am going to
congratulate you on that.
You do mention the trade deficit, which is important, is
overcoming that trade deficit. And just to remind people again,
during the first Trump Administration, there was no trade
deficit. Now there is a $50 billion trade deficit, a lot of it
in products that had been grown in the United States but are no
longer grown because of trade policies and other things.
So I will suggest--and I want to thank you again for the
nutrition, and this committee has heard plenty from me on why
we have to get the SNAP program back to nutrition. But I want
to talk about one other thing we can do that can help that
trade deficit, help our farmers, and that is a buy American
requirement in SNAP.
The bottom line is that there is nothing that we cannot
grow in--maybe bananas, okay. But besides that, there is
nothing that we cannot grow in this country if we provide the
incentive. And the order of magnitude with regards to--because
we heard criticisms of these programs. You know, a hundred
million there, 200 million there to help farmers do this and
that. The order of magnitude, if you just look at transferring
sugary beverages, I will not even talk about other things,
sugary beverages, where the American farmer gains very little.
The amount of farm product in a soda can is miniscule. That is
about $12 billion a year. I do not know how much we buy
overseas products in the SNAP program. But my estimate is that
if you are buying seafood on it, the statistic is that the
overwhelming majority of our seafood is overseas. Does not need
to be, could be here. We could substitute it with American
proteins, livestock, whatever. Let's say it is another $5
billion. That is $17 billion a year that would be going into
the pockets of American farmers that is not going into the
pockets of Americans. This dwarfs any of the farm subsidy
programs that we have. And I think it is a great start.
So I will look forward to working with my colleagues on
both sides of the aisle to say, look, it is about time for not
only healthy, nutritious products, but American products, when
we look at a program that spends $120 billion.
With regard to trade barriers, it has always bothered me
that our trading partners, you know, we go to countries, like
in Europe, and they say, well, we have no real trade barriers.
And ask them, well, what about GMO products? Do you buy our GMO
commodity crops to feed to your children, because we feed it to
our children here. Are we going to be able to make progress on
those, breaking some of those trade barriers that will help our
farmers immensely?
Secretary Rollins. Well, yes, sir, I believe so. Very
quickly on SNAP, it is remarkable to me that the number one
purchaser with taxpayer dollars in the supplemental nutrition
program is sugary drinks. It is almost, to your point, $12
billion of $113 or $115 billion program. It has been really
encouraging.
Within an hour of walking in the doors at USDA on February
13, a letter went out to every single governor in the country
saying, send us your waiver. Sarah Sanders in Arkansas sent a
waiver in. Kim Reynolds in Iowa, Jared Polis of Colorado, some
others I am working with almost daily directly, not our staffs
but directly to push this forward.
And Sarah's point, Governor Sanders, she obviously moved
the sugary junk food out. But rotisserie chicken was not even
covered under SNAP, so those are the sorts of things we are
doing.
On the trade deficit and the trade realignment that is
happening, I have never been more encouraged at what is going
to happen. The deals will begin to be announced very soon.
Well, it may be private, but we have got several of our Cabinet
secretaries heading out across the world, not just myself with
the U.K., the President is heading to the Middle East, our
Secretary of the Treasury is headed out, our Secretary of
Commerce is headed out, and we are very, very close to
significant trade agreement announcements to your question. And
no one will benefit more than our farmers and our ranchers, as
not only we are renegotiating with partners that have treated
our products so poorly for decades, but we are also opening up
markets.
So stay tuned for that. And I think everyone on both sides
of the aisle will be very pleased with what is coming.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much, Madam Secretary, and the
tariff policy has been brilliant so far, is all I can say. We
are bringing trillions of dollars of investment, and some of
that investment will be in American farms because of our tariff
policy.
Secretary Rollins. That is right.
Mr. Harris. In the last few remaining seconds, I have
spoken to you about solar panels on Class 1 and Class 2 soils.
We should figure out every--there should be no Class 1 or Class
2 soil in this United States that has a solar panel on top of
it. That is the bottom line.
Secretary Rollins. I agree.
Mr. Harris. We have to just break our dependence on that.
We talked about catfish processing. We will talk more with
you and your staff individually.
And finally, on foreign ownership of ag lands, this is
probably one of the number one things that, when I talk to
farmers in my district, they are just incensed that the Chinese
can come in and buy our farmland.
Secretary Rollins. 350,000 acres, 350,000.
Mr. Harris. We have to deal with it. And this committee's
leadership, and I want to commend Mr. Newhouse for taking
leadership on that, and we will work with you to make sure that
you get on CFIUS, a role in CFIUS, so that we can stop that.
Anyway, with that, let me recognize Mr. Bishop.
Secretary Rollins. Yes, sir. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Secretary Rollins, with respect to the trade deficit,
question. I remember very, very vividly the first Trump
Administration when the tariffs on China were imposed. And, of
course, our cotton farmers in America suffered a great loss in
their market. In fact, now, that market has not come back.
Brazil is now selling the cotton to China.
The same thing happened with our pecan farmers. We worked
for six years, trying to get China to lower the tariffs and
accept American pecans. And when they finally did and started
shipping them over there, we had the tariff policy from
President Trump that put them--they lost a tremendous market
there. And, of course, they have not recovered that market. And
we are, of course, hoping to get India's market.
But let me ask you about the----
Secretary Rollins. May I respond to that? It will take five
words. The reason China phase one did not meet the marks, the
metrics--maybe 15 words--is because the Biden Administration
did not continue to enforce it, sir. That went into effect at
the end of term one, and the Biden Administration USDA did not
enforce it. I would love to continue that conversation, but
that is a really important point.
Mr. Bishop. The farmers were bailed out, thanks to
Secretary Perdue, by taking money from the CCC, which
ultimately drained the CCC and we had to replenish it in the
next appropriations cycle, to make up for the revenues that
they lost when they lost that China market, both pecans and
cotton.
But let me change the subject.
Secretary Rollins. Yes, sir.
Mr. Bishop. I want to talk about the FSA county offices and
staffing. I want to ask you about the staffing and closures at
FSA county offices.
I recently heard from a constituent that, following the
first round of deferred resignations, nearly a quarter of the
over 2,000 producer-facing FSA offices had two or fewer staff
as of March 23 of this year, including over 100 offices that
had no staff at all. They also told me that there are offices
where FSA employees work where leases are being terminated. But
because the lease is held by NRCS or another agency that co-
locates with FSA, it appears that it is the agency's office
that is closing and not FSA's. They also said that GSA was
shuttering these offices without notifying the agencies at
USDA.
How can you assure us that FSA can continue to serve
farmers when there are offices with literally zero staff and
there are offices that are closing without the department's
knowledge?
Secretary Rollins. Sir, thank you for that. The FSA office
remains one of the--FSA offices remain a top priority at USDA.
That interfacing with the farmers is really important, along
with APHIS and a couple of the other programs.
It is our understanding that if, in fact, some of these
offices have closed, I need to get the list of that, because we
are working office by office, 4,500. So if you will let us know
where that is and the offices that you are being told are
understaffed, again, this is a high priority. Under our
deferred--by the way, no one was fired. It was all through
deferred resignation. I realize, sir, maybe for you that is a
distinction without much of a difference. But from us, no one
was ever fired from USDA, it was always deferred resignation.
But in the last round, we did not accept any DRPs from
anyone in FSA offices or APHIS offices or state veterinarians,
the key critical components.
But I would love to work with your office. We can work
together to address that.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you for that.
At the Commodity Classic on March 3, you said that today I
am happy to share, we have completed our review and released
funds for the Environmental Quality Incentive Program, EQIP,
the Conservation Stewardship Program, and the Agriculture
Conservation Easement Program. Since the delay in releasing the
funds was a huge national issue, we expected to start hearing
from offices that the farmers had received the money, but we
did not hear anything. So we asked USDA about this. And the
Department told us in late April, quote, ``No new EQIP RA
financial assistance is being obligated currently. NRCS is
awaiting guidance from the Secretary on new obligations. New
obligations of RFSA are still paused. No new obligation of RATA
technical assistance cooperative agreements is moving
forward.''
So can you explain how this is consistent with your
announcement in March that the funds have been released?
Secretary Rollins. We have about $20 billion in funds that
were frozen. All but $5 billion have been line-by-lined and
unfrozen. It could be that part of the $5 billion, we are
frantically working to get through it. But again, if you will
send us directly, and send it to me, who it is you are speaking
with--of course, we reoriented some of those programs to make
them more farmer, less climate and DEI. But having said all of
that, for the most part, most of that has been addressed. But
again, please send us--me directly--anyone that has not so that
I can address.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you. My time has expired.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
I want to recognize the gentleman from California, one of
the farmers on our committee.
Mr. Valadao. Thank you. Thank you, Secretary Rollins, for
making some time for us today. I appreciate you being here.
I will talk a little bit about tariffs quickly. Since the
reciprocal tariff announcement last month, there have been
several officials that have stressed how these tariffs are
going to play out. We have heard that it could take weeks or
months to understand the impact moving forward, and many
farmers and exporters in my district have already lost some
business or contracts due to trade uncertainty. And as we
harvest this summer, there is some more concern, as you, I am
sure, are well aware.
Secretary Rollins. Yes.
Mr. Valadao. Has the Department had any conversation about
standing up any trade assistance program for the impacted
farmers as this plays out?
Secretary Rollins. We have, and the conversations are
continuing. Our goal is that it will not be necessary, that
these trade deals are moving so quickly. And not one trade deal
with China, but dozens and dozens. When the President says we
are in conversations with more than 100 countries, that is
actually true, and a really important point in all of this.
But, having said that, if it is necessary, we will ensure--
the President has made very clear that he has got the farmers'
and ranchers' backs, and we will stand up a program again if
necessary.
Mr. Valadao. Before my time in office, as a farmer, I used
to come here quite a bit and knock on a lot of members' of
Congress's doors, and I would complain about the unfair trade
practices that we used to deal with on a regular basis, so it
is nice it is being addressed, so thank you.
I also want to briefly touch on disaster assistance. For
context, my Central Valley dairy farm has suffered major losses
in 2023 from flooding that displaced families and their cows. I
made sure in last year's disaster aid package to include $2
billion for livestock and made dairy and livestock producers
eligible for support for the flood losses.
I am aware that yesterday you told Senator Hoeven and the
Senate Ag Committee that you expect disaster assistance will be
going out by the end of the month. What steps is the Department
taking to ensure livestock producers are reimbursed fairly from
this pot of money, specifically those who suffered losses from
those floods?
Secretary Rollins. Thank you. And if I could, I will
quickly address something that was said by I think it was Mr.
Bishop. But we have moved so quickly on ECAP, it went out in
three months. And in the last--the Vilsack administration, the
average implementation time was over one year to move those
funds out. So I just--I want to give my team credit for working
around the clock, seven days a week, to get that out ahead of
the statutory deadline, and within three days as the
applications moved in, we were moving money out.
We now, obviously, in the last few months have turned to
the disaster relief, to your point specifically livestock is
your question. And I think it is important to note that that is
a lot more complicated, because they are block grants and they
have to be moved and agreed to by the states. But we are very
close. And in fact, later today at a press conference--I will
preview it since you asked--but we will be announcing the exact
dates that the portals open, that the agreements are reached,
and that the money will begin to move. But basically, by the
end of this month, money will begin moving out.
I know in New England, for the Connecticut, Maine, et
cetera, farmers, this is a really important question, too. I
had a great conversation with this amazing patriot over my left
shoulder yesterday. And we are doing everything we can, I think
hopefully as quickly as humanly possible to do it right, do it
intentionally, but to get it to these poor people who need it
right now or last week or last year.
Mr. Valadao. Yeah, I appreciate you taking over this issue
that we have been dealing with from the previous
administration, where they were pretty slow getting to us and
the previous secretary was not as helpful, so I appreciate
that.
I am very supportive of the Administration's efforts to
secure the southern border. Ensuring Americans are safe, and
removing violent criminals from our communities is a top
priority. I am also glad that President Trump has been vocal in
finding a solution for our ag workforce and providing
undocumented farmworkers with an opportunity to continue
contributing to our nation's agriculture sector. It is
estimated that 70 percent of the farmworkers are immigrants,
with 40 percent being undocumented. And we need to work
together to ensure our agriculture economy continues to thrive.
What involvement has USDA had with the administration to
craft immigration policies that keep these facts in mind?
Secretary Rollins. If you missed it, I believe it was a
very important moment in not our last Cabinet meeting but the
one before. We have had five Cabinet meetings, which is sort of
stunning if you think about it, in just a couple of months. But
the one before, the President himself brought up this issue.
And he and I have talked about it at length from the first
administration to this one. And he is very, very resolute that
we have to fix the labor issue.
And obviously, we needed to secure the border first. That
has been done. But in that Cabinet meeting, he himself lined
out how we could do it and how we could do it quickly. I am
working very closely with Lori Chavez-DeRemer, our Secretary of
Labor, not only to reform the H-2A program, which I think is of
vital importance. I am from Texas. I understand very deeply how
important that is. But also the larger effort to reform our
immigration system to better serve our farmers and our ranchers
is a priority.
Mr. Valadao. I appreciate that. My time has almost expired,
so I just wanted to follow up on the USDA FSA offices. We have
some issues as well. Would love to communicate with your office
on that. So thank you for that.
And then will Regional Conservation Partnership Program
contracts that have been approved to support dairy
environmental stewardship get their allocated funding? Are you
familiar with that one?
Secretary Rollins. I am not. But let me look into it today
and we will circle back right away.
Mr. Valadao. Thank you, and I yield back.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
Ms. DeLauro.
Ms. DeLauro. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Just a
couple points before I get to my questions.
The proposals, I understand, in reconciliation is a $200
billion cut to the food stamp program. So it remains to be seen
how we are going to really maintain that effort to feed hungry
people in this country.
A tax on sugary beverages, I have introduced that
legislation, the Sweet Act, many years ago. It is one way in
which we can address the issue of nutrition and food. Let's
talk to those who are profiting and talk about putting that tax
that can be used for health purposes.
I would hope in the nature of nutrition, that you would
look at what was just taken out before, the cash value voucher
for fruit and vegetables. It is my hope that you can support
that effort.
With regard to the price of eggs, Cal-Maine, which is one
fifth of the market on egg production, $500 million in profits,
three times what they made last year. If you are going to talk
about egg prices, you have got to talk about price gouging, and
I do not know what the Administration is doing about that.
Let me just talk about the safety net which leaves New
England and specialty crop farmers with few resources to recoup
losses, forcing them to make very difficult decisions that put
their livelihoods in danger and community food systems at risk,
one of the primary reasons that Connecticut has lost 460 farms
over the last five years, the reason I created the new $220
million block grant, the Farm Support and Recovery Block Grant,
specifically tailored to the needs of small and medium-size
farmers in last year's disaster supplemental. I know our
commissioner is going to be here a little bit later, and I know
how excited that we are about this program and farmers are
excited about this program.
Specialty crop farms have a hard time receiving crop
insurance because of the lack of availability of coverage for
diverse and specialty crops. One of those farmers who you just
mentioned is in the room today, and that is Will Dellacamera.
Now let me just ask a series of questions, which are really
yes or no answers.
Would you agree that we have a lot more work to do to
improve our federal farm safety net to better support small and
medium-sized farmers?
Secretary Rollins. It is very important.
Ms. DeLauro. Okay. Will you commit to getting disaster aid
in farmers' pockets as soon as possible?
Secretary Rollins. Yes, ma'am. We are working 24 hours a
day on that.
Ms. DeLauro. Will you ensure that this $220 million grant
covers the losses it intended to cover, including crop and
livestock losses?
Secretary Rollins. We will do everything we can. It is my
understanding it may not be enough, that in fact the losses are
bigger than the $220 million.
Ms. DeLauro. What I want to know is, because I mentioned
all kinds of programs that have had funds frozen, terminated--
--
Secretary Rollins. Well, you are talking about the $220
million from Congress. So are we talking about that, or are we
talking about bigger things?
Ms. DeLauro. I am talking about specifically today. I
understand more. But we have $220 million right there now that
farmers can get access to it. And Will Dellacamera cannot get
the funds that he needs----
Secretary Rollins. Ma'am, it was three months ago. The last
administration took more than a year. This is extremely
complicated. I just said that by the end of the month----
Ms. DeLauro. So I do not have your commitment--I do not
have a commitment----
Secretary Rollins. By the end of the month, the money will
begin to move, which is at rapid pace.
Ms. DeLauro. The $220 million block grant?
Secretary Rollins. Yes, ma'am.
Ms. DeLauro. So by the end of the month, that money is
going to flow?
Secretary Rollins. And you know this, that we have to have
agreements with every state. It is not that USDA by ourselves
sends a check out.
Ms. DeLauro. I know this. The states are to send it----
Secretary Rollins. So we are working diligently with the
states. Your ag commissioner is coming in today to talk about
it----
Ms. DeLauro. Excuse me--Madam Secretary--right, exactly.
Secretary Rollins. I think I have given a lot of confidence
that we are working really hard on that and doing everything we
can.
Ms. DeLauro. It is not about hard work, Madam Secretary. It
is about the commitment to what was passed in the Disaster
Relief Act of $220 million that is going to farmers, and when
will that money flow. You just said it is the end of the month.
Secretary Rollins. For the tenth time since I started 40
minutes ago, it will begin to flow by the end of the month.
Ms. DeLauro. Okay. We will hold you to that effort.
Let me then ask about this, a concern about nutrition. The
real concern about nutrition, which we all have concerns about.
On a bipartisan basis for 25 years, administrations and members
of Congress have provided enough funding to WIC to serve all
eligible families who seek assistance and provide them with
full food benefits.
I appreciate your commitment to WIC yesterday on the Senate
side. And we anticipate that that will continue. But will you
also commit to funding the cash value voucher for fruits and
vegetables at the current level?
Secretary Rollins. Well, we will take a look at that. I am
not going to commit to it today. In the grand total of the
vision here, we are doing everything we can.
But what is so important is we spend $400 million a day on
the 16 nutrition programs across USDA, $405 million a day.
Ms. DeLauro. I'm running out of time----
Secretary Rollins. So there is plenty of money in the
system for priorities.
Ms. DeLauro. The voucher, we had to reinstate it because it
was eliminated the last go-round. We cannot afford to do that.
Because if we are concerned about nutrition, fruits and
vegetables and the cash value voucher are central to that
effort.
Secretary Rollins. I am glad to keep talking to you about
it. Thank you.
Ms. DeLauro. Thank you. I yield back.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
Mr. Moolenaar.
Mr. Moolenaar. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And with your
permission, I would like to yield to Dan Newhouse. He has
another committee meeting.
Mr. Harris. Mr. Newhouse.
Mr. Newhouse. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Moolenaar,
I appreciate your deference. Ranking Member, thanks for holding
this hearing today. And, Madam Secretary, pleasure to have you
here.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Newhouse. If I could just real quickly, I will also
give a shout out to the farmers that are in the room today. As
a farmer, I appreciate your attendance and the attention. It is
critically important to us.
Also, sir, you were here back in the '70s with the tractors
that made the rounds? I was here, too. I was just taking
pictures; I was not driving my tractor. It is too far to take
from Washington State. But good for you.
Madam Secretary, I just wanted to start off by thanking you
for working so hard to get the marketing assistance for
specialty crops out the door as quickly as possible.
Comparatively, lightning speed, so appreciate your dedication
to getting all of that done. As you know, they are critically
important to specialty crop producers, particularly in my
district. And I cannot express enough how important that is.
I wanted to go back to something that the Chairman brought
up, and that is the issue of purchases of domestic farmland by
foreign countries, particularly China. I should thank you for
your staunch support of American farmers in that sentence. But
farmland purchases by the CCP, as you have noted, has increased
substantially over the past decade. And I guess my question
summarized is just if you have any updates? Can you fill us in
on some of the conversations that you are having and directions
that you are taking in order to stop this really concerning
trend that we are seeing?
Secretary Rollins. That is right. And I think it is clearly
bipartisan. It is not one side or the other.
Mr. Newhouse. Sure.
Secretary Rollins. In the great pause, which I call the
time between Trump One and Trump Two, I actually worked very,
very--a lot of time on this, China purchasing of farmland, in
working with the states. And then Governor Kristi Noem of South
Dakota, Governor Sarah Sanders of Arkansas, Governor Glenn
Youngkin of Virginia, and currently working with other
governors around the country, because they can address it at
the state level, too. So while we are building out the federal
solution. And, sir, to your question, we are building out the
federal solution. I will be making an announcement on that in
the next couple of weeks of what that looks like, and would
love your help, and any others that are interested in that
issue specifically.
We do need to have an all-of-government approach to this.
It is a national security issue of the greatest priority from
my perspective. And so working with the states, ensuring they
are getting what they need to pass the legislation. And again,
three states already have. But having a federally driven effort
is of key importance and a priority for us.
Mr. Newhouse. As a member of the Select Committee on China
and sitting right next to the chairman of the Select Committee
on China, that is really good to hear that commitment. So thank
you.
Switching to agricultural research, in the State of
Washington, we grow over 300 different kinds of specialty
crops. We are the number one producer of apples. Maybe you have
heard of Washington apples. Hops, blueberries, sweet cherries,
a diverse range of crops that are so important to our
agricultural economy.
Innovation is what truly supports our nation's farmers
there. And so I just wanted to bring up the issue of the
cutting edge research that we are very fortunate to have
through Washington State University, Pacific Northwest National
Laboratory, Bioproducts Science and Engineering Laboratory.
So I just wanted, I guess, Secretary Rollins, ask you about
USDA's continued support for programs that provide critical
research to----
Secretary Rollins. And a shout out to Washington State. I
would love to come visit. That is a really premier institution.
Mr. Newhouse. You have got it. You have got an invitation
right there.
Secretary Rollins. I know, I am a product of a land grant,
Texas A&M, so I really realize their importance.
Just very quickly on ARS, hopefully to provide some
confidence. We remain very committed to the cutting edge
research at USDA. Of the $160 million that is being cut, but I
want to put in context for you, the current budget is $2.1
billion. We are taking that down to $1.9 billion. That is just
a 7 percent decrease, and it is specifically focused on
underutilized and out-of-date, a handful of facilities around
the country. So that is not an across-the-board cut. We will
continue to focus with everything we have on important
research.
Mr. Newhouse. Cool. In the 30 seconds I have left, I just
wanted to underscore, Mr. Valadao brought it up, the issue of
ag labor. I think this is an opportune time. Like you
mentioned, the President's comments are very positive. I think
we have got a commitment on both sides of the aisle to move
forward with reforms that are needed to the H-2A visa program.
So we would love to have your commitment there.
And then also just learning about some of the issues with
the potential infestation of the screwworm that is coming up
from down south and look forward to working with you on
whatever we can do to stop that pest from entering the United
States.
Secretary Rollins. As you know, I have been very, very
clear with the country of Mexico on the importance of their
partnership. We maybe were not getting as much as we needed.
And just yesterday, the Secretary of Agriculture of Mexico flew
to Washington, and we had a very productive conversation on
that specific issue. I have already visited in south Texas and
other areas, where it is really--it would be devastating for
our livestock. So we are on it and hopefully are able to solve
for it.
Mr. Newhouse. Great. Again, thank you. Thank you, Mr.
Chairman. And Mr. Moolenaar.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
I now recognize the gentlelady from Maine, who probably has
a different idea on blueberries from Washington than the
gentleman from Washington.
Ms. Pingree. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Thank you
for understanding the supremacy of Maine blueberries----
[Laughter.]
Which I have proven to the Committee many times. If you are
around, I bring in blueberry pies every year to the Approps
Committee so that they can taste the qualitative difference in
our blueberries.
Secretary Rollins. Blueberries. I love it. I love it.
Ms. Pingree. Secretary Rollins., thank you so much for
being with us here today. I appreciate your time. I had a
chance to watch the Senate hearing yesterday online and was
very pleased to hear your exchange with Senator Collins about
the PFAS issue. I hope you will bring your mother to visit us.
I am excited to hear she is a PFAS--a Texas legislator who came
because of PFAS.
Secretary Rollins. Yes.
Ms. Pingree. So I know we will be talking about that much
more. But thank you for that.
Thank you also during that committee for hearing your
commitment to staying in touch with us. You have to understand
that one of the big challenges for us in this unconventional
cutting phase of this administration is cuts have been made
through the DOGE, not through the USDA. We normally would have
recissions or RIFs, so we would have far more information to
deal with. That is why many of the questions are before you
today. So I hope you will keep up that commitment to stay in
touch with the House as well as the Senate. Those are very
important conversations that we have with you.
I also noticed that many of my colleagues talked about the
LFPA program. And I just want to clear up a few of my concerns.
I am really devastated to see this program be cut. That was
such an important way to get more healthy fruits and vegetables
into our school lunch, and to our feeding programs for people
in our food banks. My understanding of one of the arguments
that you made is it is a COVID-era program. I was there when we
put together this program. Well, that was because we had empty
shelves and problems with our supply chain. Really, the COVID
taught us you cannot depend on international and national
travel, that you need to buy more locally. So this was an
important program to turn to our local farmers, and how we
would change some of the ways to support small to medium-size
farmers, which I have heard you commit to.
The fact is, in our state, we do not have a lot of money
sitting around of the $2.6 million. We only have $164,000. So
saying that this money is sitting around, I do not know what is
wrong with the other states. For some of them, I think it is
the reimbursement process. It takes many months to get the
invoices out there. Also, it takes a while to develop these
relationships with farmers. But now that they have them, we are
going to lose them when you cut down this program.
It is CCC funding. I know that is often controversial. But
I am worried that you are taking back the CCC money because
there is only less than $5 billion in there, and last time
Trump had to pay out $29 billion--President Trump did, on the
tariffs. So those tariffs are costly, and I do not want to see
this money just going to pay off bad tariffs. I am excited to
hear you got some good information coming on that.
But I want to clear up any misconceptions there. Farmers
are mad that their contracts were cut. We had our first tractor
rally in the state capital in Maine, and farmers were showing
up because they were not getting their RE grants, they were not
getting their EQIP grants, but they were mad about those broken
contracts. And our state is worried about losing those
relationships. So just want to clear that up.
Also with RCPP program, I know you are working to get that
money out and I heard you say to Jeanne Shaheen yesterday you
are going to check on one of her programs. I have $15.5 million
out to our wild blueberry growers for the impacts of climate
change. We can pretend it is not real, but we have extreme
drought in our state, and that money is going 75 percent to
farmers, 25 percent to engineers. So if you could check on
that?
Secretary Rollins. What was the name of it again?
Ms. Pingree. It is the RCPP grant for Maine wild
blueberries, $15.5 million. And happy to send a pie so you know
how delicious those blueberries are.
Secretary Rollins. That might be necessary----
[Laughter.]
Ms. Pingree. Staffing cuts--I am sorry I am talking so
fast, but I have so much to say.
We are very worried about our local offices. I know that
people--you say staffing cuts were voluntary. Well, we got rid
of all the probationary employees. Then we were told there was
going to be administrative review. Some of them would come
back, some of them did not. Let's face it, a lot of people were
out of work. They were not sure what was going to happen. And
they took the deferred resignation. And we lost, I think, four
engineers in that process because we paid no attention to what
their job was in the first round of those layoffs. And many of
those people did not come back, so now we have severe staffing
losses at those offices, and it is critically important.
I am going to run out of time. But I just want to say, most
of this has been about the challenges we were already facing.
Normally, this would be a hearing about the budget, about the
skinny budget, which is not enough, but what the problems are
that we see going on in the future.
And I just want to say, one of the real concerns for me is
that you have eliminated so much in rural development on
housing. Single family direct housing loans, self-help housing
grants, rural housing vouchers, rural business programs which
are not housing but could have a ripple effect. I am just
saying those are severe cuts. Now, you say they are
duplicative, too small. You know, but I think those are going
to have a huge impact, especially if this administration cuts
HUD.
Also, I just want to quickly say you have committed to
saying that you believe in buying from local farmers, enhancing
our local economy. Healthy fruits and vegetables is a big part
of MAHA. So if you go ahead with these MAHA boxes, which are
also in the plan, I want to know if you will commit to making
sure that we buy locally, that we put fresh and healthy food in
there. You said our food banks do not give people healthy food.
That is in the justification of that. But the fact is, you are
taking away the program that allowed them to give fresh,
healthy food.
Secretary Rollins. I am so excited about the MAHA box
opportunity. And without being the person packing the box, it
is hard to say exactly what to commit to. But believe me, I
will ensure and do everything I can to make sure those boxes
are sourced locally, that they are nutrient-dense foods, and
that we are doing everything that we can to help those with the
least among us, frankly.
Ms. Pingree. Great. If you commit to that, we will be
anxious to work with you.
I am sorry for going over, Mr. Chair. I tried to talk as
fast as I could.
Secretary Rollins. But I can't answer them. But I would
love to continue the conversation and that is true for
everybody anytime.
We would appreciate the follow-up.
Secretary Rollins. Yeah. Thank you.
Mr. Harris. Mr. Moolenaar.
Mr. Moolenaar. All right. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And Madam Secretary, it is great to have you with us and
really appreciate the work you are doing and the commitments
you are working on as well. I appreciated your statement about
when farmers prosper, rural America prospers.
I see that in spades in Michigan. And as I am sure you are
aware, Michigan is one of the most agriculturally diverse
states. I represent a very active agriculture district in
Michigan. My constituents represent a broad range of the issue
from row crops to blueberries to cherries, apples, dairy, and
livestock.
Each of these sectors has their own unique challenges, as
you know. But one thing I have heard from all farmers across
all types of agriculture is the hurt that the previous
administration inflicted on them through extreme increases in
the adverse effect wage rate.
In fact, I asked your predecessor from the Biden
Administration about that when he was sitting in that very
chair and talked with him about fifth and sixth generation
farmers going out of business. And I was very disappointed with
his response.
It was basically, well, farms have always gone out of
business. In Michigan we are now paying more than $18 an hour
for H2-A labor and that, not to mention housing,
transportation, application costs. And this is unsustainable
for our family-owned farms and it is in urgent need of
correction.
And I want to compliment you because you have already been
talking with Secretary of Labor and working on this. And I also
want to thank your staff because I participated in a phone call
with them and the Department of Labor staff to discuss this
issue.
I have introduced legislation, many of our folks here on
this Committee have co-sponsored it, that would pause the
increase in the adverse effect wage rate and freeze it at the
2023 levels just to give some breathing room because it is in
dire situation. But we do need a longer-term fix and I believe
it needs all hands-on deck, team approach.
Secretary Rollins. Agree.
Mr. Moolenaar. And I believe you are the ideal person to
help lead that.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Mr. Moolenaar. And so I guess what I am asking for is your
commitment to work with us on this. And you have already
started that process and we would very much like to be at the
table and helping advocate for our farmers. And I also want to
personally invite you to Michigan.
Secretary Rollins. I will be there. I am coming. Listen,
this is of utmost priority coming from the state of Texas and
hearing that our citrus farmers down in South Texas spend on
average $23 an hour under exactly the outline that you
committed, including housing and some other things. And then
right across a mile across the border, the country of Mexico
for the exact same labor is spending $2 an hour, maybe at the
most. Our farmers can't survive that. There is no possible way.
And so I don't agree obviously with my predecessor,
Secretary Vilsack. We have got to fight for every single
farmer, every single small farmer. We have got to open up
access to get new people into farming. We lose our country if
we can't support these smaller farmers.
And that is again top of the list for me. Later today I
have a roundtable with about 20 small farmers from around the
country. We are going to be rolling out a policy portfolio just
focused on the small farmer. I have got four Amish farmers
coming from Pennsylvania, farmers coming from Utah. I think I
have got a couple from your state. And so this is a very piece
of solving for that very significant problem.
Mr. Moolenaar. Thank you very much. And I want to switch
gears and talk a little bit about MAHA. Thank you for your
sharing your insights on that.
The role that milk and dairy products play in a healthy
diet is to me indisputable. But in the prior administration,
when they finalized a food package with Women, Infants and
Children Program, it reduced the eligible dairy allotment that
could be purchased by a family each month.
And it was even more troubling that they finalized this
change because considering that in the Fiscal Year 2024
spending agreement we included a bipartisan directive for them
not to do so. Knowing that dairy remains under consumed and yet
is a source of three key nutrients of public health concern are
you open to exploring whether this change can be reversed
administratively or if it can't, will you work with us to fix
the problem legislatively?
Secretary Rollins. Yes, sir, 100 percent. And I think an
important part of this is dietary guidelines. Secretary Kennedy
and I are working on that together as we speak.
We got a 400 and I think 53-page new set of dietary
guidelines from the last administration. I won't say that we
are starting from scratch because I think a lot of well-
intentioned people did a lot of good work on that. But you will
see, by the end of this year hopefully early fall, the new set
of dietary guidelines coming out from our two agencies. And I
think you will be very, very pleased.
It will be very simple. It will speak directly to the
American family. It will support our local farmers and
producers and it will ensure that the incredible product of
milk is right up there at the top.
Mr. Moolenaar. Wonderful. Thank you and I yield back, Mr.
Chairman.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
Ms. Underwood.
Ms. Underwood. Hi. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Trump tariffs have been a hot topic this year and the
family farmers I represent, well, they are just terrified that
their farms and their bank accounts won't survive the Trump
presidency.
The farmers I represent in DeKalb, LaSalle, Mendota, and
across northern Illinois are hardworking and resilient. They
grow pumpkins and horseradish and asparagus and all kinds of
fresh produce. And I know that farming is hard work, and they
take its challenges in stride. However, each year, small family
farms are shut down while the big corporate farms get even
bigger.
Listen, the family farmers I am worried about aren't the
ones who have lobbyists roaming the halls here in D.C. and
right now, Donald Trump is hurting these small family farms. To
be very clear, this isn't the same trade war that we saw in his
first term, where soybean growers were hit the hardest. This
one is bigger, it is costlier, it is more chaotic.
Secretary Rollins, I know that you don't set tariff policy,
but you are responsible for helping farmers respond to it. So
what is USDA doing to support all farmers, not just the biggest
and most well connected through these challenges?
Secretary Rollins. Well, I hear you and I agree with you,
and I think that is why today we are going to--we are launching
the effort to start focusing more on the smaller farms moving
forward. So I would love to work with you on that, if you are
willing to do that.
At the end of the day, I have taken a different approach,
perhaps, than prior agriculture secretaries, I think, both
Republican and Democrat. In the past, it was more of a, I don't
want to say defensive mode, but more of a wait and see what
happens and then be there to sort of pick up the pieces and
figure out how to solve for some of the potential, at least
short-term damages and long term.
My approach has been different. My approach is to be in
constant daily contact with Secretary Lutnick, Secretary
Bessent, Jamison Greer, our USTR, and the President and the
Vice President.
Ms. Underwood. Right, but this is about the small family
farmer who doesn't have that straight line to any of those
cabinets administration.
Secretary Rollins. That's my point. But that is my point,
on behalf of those small family farms, ensuring that it is
understood the potential implications and that agriculture is
in the room with every decision that is being made.
And as I mentioned earlier, the announcements that are
coming are extremely positive and all of the farmers, but
especially the smaller family farmers, will be really, really
happy.
Ms. Underwood. Well, we are not happy yet, because Illinois
leads the nation in pumpkin production, ma'am. And unlike big
corporate farms, our pumpkin growers do not have the resources
for high-powered lobbyists or trade groups. And we are not
seeing the support. We are not.
Secretary Rollins. Well, I disagree.
Ms. Underwood. The corn growers are not seeing the support.
Secretary Rollins. And I think the farmers disagree.
Ms. Underwood. Ma'am. I didn't ask--that wasn't a question.
Secretary Rollins. Well, no, it is a question though. We
have got a poll from yesterday that says 70 percent of farmers
approve and support the President's tariffs.
Ms. Underwood. Mr. Chairman, this is my time. Mr. Chairman?
Mr. Chairman?
Thank you. It is not just the rising cost of fertilizer,
farm equipment and land that is hurting family farmers. It is
the uncertainty. Farmers are the backbone of our rural economy.
They need stability for their business and for their future.
And right now, they are being crushed by a tariff whiplash,
a financial system that holds them back and USDA that often
puts big corporations ahead of family farms.
Secretary Rollins. That is not true.
Ms. Underwood. When the tariff policy swings widely,
farmers struggle to secure the loans that they need to plant
their crops and keep their farms running. Banks then refuse to
lend. They jack up interest rates and they demand more
collateral and leave family farmers drowning in debt while the
biggest ag giants take in record profits.
Farmers can't invest and grow their operations because they
don't know if they will survive the next year, let alone turn a
profit. And they can't trust that the system works for them.
But it is not just this harmful tariff policy that is crushing
our family farmers. It is also the USDA policies under your
watch.
The USDA's decision to slash $1 billion from programs like
the Local Food Purchase Assistance Program is a direct assault
on family farmers. This program supports small farmers. It
strengthens local economies and feeds families in need,
everything that we should be championing.
Cutting this program doesn't make America healthy, period.
It doesn't support farmers. It doesn't save taxpayers money. It
doesn't make the government more efficient. What it does do is
it pushes more small farmers out of business. And for what? To
help pay for tax cuts that benefit Trump and Musk and the
biggest corporate farms for sure, while the hard-working
farmers in DeKalb and Mendota and La Salle, Illinois are left
behind.
It doesn't matter how much USDA spends a day on nutrition
if those dollars are stripped from the programs that support
local farms. We send billions of dollars to the agriculture
industry every year but where those billions of dollars go
tells a different story.
And right now I am concerned that this Administration's
priorities are not with the small family farms in my district.
They are with the big Guys, the ones who already have the
system rigged in their favor. And it is time for that to
change. I yield back.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
The gentlelady from Louisiana, Ms. Letlow.
Ms. Letlow. Thank you----
Secretary Rollins. I am sorry I couldn't answer all those
questions, but I would really like the opportunity to have a
later discussion.
Ms. Letlow. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you, Madam
Secretary, for being here today. It is encouraging to see
someone with your background sitting in that chair and your
leadership and I would just like to give you some kudos because
you recently just named as FSA director for Louisiana Craig
McCain.
Secretary Rollins. Yes.
Ms. Letlow. It took you three months to do that. The last
administration, we didn't have an FSA director for over a year
and a half.
Secretary Rollins. Wow.
Ms. Letlow. Thank you.
Secretary Rollins. I will let the team know. Thank you for
that, Congresswoman.
Ms. Letlow. It means a lot to our farmers. And I would like
to also give you kudos for ECAP to get that funding to our
small farmers. I had a small farmer call me last night and say
because that money came in so quickly that it saved his farm.
He was able to get the funding that he needed and the credit
that he needed to be able to plant again. He was a small
farmer. It saved his farm because of your leadership.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Ms. Letlow. Thank you. Also, I want to thank you for
continuing to spread your message across the country. And I
know you haven't made it to Louisiana yet. We are so excited to
have you there to deliver your keynote speech and your vision
for what agriculture will look like through USDA and how we
will partner together in Congress and work together to deliver
for our farmers.
So my first question is an absolute softball question to
you. But if in the meantime I can share with those concerned
farmers who had to endure the Great Pause, as you call it, and
have had a really rough last four years, what can you share
with them right now that I can go back and also tell them until
you make it to Louisiana to deliver those keynote addresses?
Secretary Rollins. Well, thank you for that and thank you
for the shout out to the team. I get too much credit. I think
they have been a lot of them sitting behind me have just been
extraordinary. So I so appreciate that.
It has been a seven day a week, 18/20 hour a day effort for
a couple of months. What I would say is this, that the American
agriculture economy is suffering perhaps like never before with
a $50 billion trade deficit just over the last four years,
likely to reach 63 billion based on numbers from last year very
quickly.
Number two, the cost of inputs increased 30 percent during
the great pause under the last administration. 30 percent. So
while our farmers and our ranchers are facing margins of
profitability of almost zero, many of them, like never before,
while being hit with trade deficits, while being hit with the
cost of inputs, while being hit with, frankly, an
administration that didn't fight for them, not just the big
farmers, but the small family farms too. And that is such a big
priority of mine.
But help has arrived as we look at cutting taxes and
deregulating and opening up markets and realigning the trade
regime around the world to not just allow American products to
participate, but for American products to win.
I believe that American agriculture is moving into an era
of prosperity unlike they have seen in our lifetimes. That is
my fervent hope, prayer, and work every day toward.
Ms. Letlow. Thank you. You can feel it. I will share that
with them for sure.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Ms. Letlow. I have one last follow-up question. During the
last administration, I repeatedly raised concerns, both in
hearings and in discussions with the USDA officials about how
existing disaster programs like the 22 Emergency Relief Program
and other RMA products have failed to adequately capture
quality losses for my farmers.
Despite Congress clearly stating that quality losses of
crops should be covered, many producers in my district saw
little to no relief under past assistance for programs. Under
the first Trump Administration, the USDA worked with our
farmers to create the Quality Loss Adjustment Program and it
delivered meaningful assistance where ERP fell short.
Madam Secretary, is the USDA currently considering
rebooting the Quality Loss Adjustment Program under the
upcoming round of assistance? And if not, what alternative
methodologies are you considering to ensure that quality losses
are accurately captured in this next phase of assistance?
Secretary Rollins. Yes, we are looking at that very closely
and would love your help. And specifically, and this is true
for everybody, any farmers or ranchers in your district, I say
send us their stories of too much paperwork, of too much
regulation, of too much slow, whatever it is. We can't make
change without fully understanding the challenges. But we would
love to work with you and your team on that.
Ms. Letlow. Absolutely. I will send you a story of soybeans
over the last couple of years. It was pretty rough, but I look
forward to working with you. Thank you so much for being here.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, Congresswoman. Thank you.
Ms. Letlow. I yield back.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much, Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Secretary, for being here. So I represent
Southwest Washington. We are a big shellfish, timber and we
have a lot of small and very small farms. Average size is about
60 acres. Filberts, blueberries, and some dairy still. And it
is in many ways like we have persisted in these smaller farms
not being consolidated. People really working to try to get
food to their communities. And I guess one of the things that I
have heard from some of my shellfish growers, you know, they
have suffered terribly under a regulatory burden, you know,
doing anything in water, right? It has been difficult for them.
But during these reductions in force during the DOGE, what they
told me was that, look, they fired the guy that does our water
quality testing, but they still have somebody tweeting, they
still have a comms director.
Could you talk to me about how you are you know, who is
this? Like, where are we going?
Secretary Rollins. Right. No, I would be happy to. And in
fact, I am happy, so excited to use my chart. I wasn't sure I
was going to get to use that, but I think it is important. My
handy dandy chart, chart here.
When we left, before the last administration came in, USDA
was staffed at about 97,000 employees. In the last four years.
When we came back, we were closer to 113,000 employees.
So the staffing up in the last administration, using mostly
IRA and IIJA funding, the infrastructure and the Inflation
Reduction Act money that was supposed to be spent over 10
years, was actually under Secretary Vilsack infused in a
massive amount as the staffing up happened and happened and
happened, and you can see it was absolutely unsustainable.
We don't and can't keep up the money. To answer your
question, though, to be fair, on the FSA side and the specific
offices, we are going office by office. So if you, and if your
farmers are in a position where you have got a comms person,
but you don't have anyone that is interacting with those
farmers, would you please let us know and let us work to solve
for that?
I think that as we move forward, the intentionality of what
we are doing becomes more hyper focused on those priority
areas, as I mentioned at the beginning of the hearing, and that
is important.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. It does feel to a lot of us like it
is not addressing this balance of work boots to clipboards of
spreadsheets to work boots.
Secretary Rollins. Well, that is why we need your
partnership.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. And you know, people say, well, I
don't know why these loggers can't trust, you know, trust the
science. Well, because in living memory we were told to, you
know, bring a bulldozer to the stream beds, take all the woody
debris out. And now they are, you know, now they are
helicoptering in root wads when we don't have air conditioning
in our schools, when we haven't had SRS reauthorized.
Secretary Rollins. Yeah.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. They are firing all the para
educators. They are still tweeting like----
Secretary Rollins. Well, no one has been fired, but I hear
you. And these are the sort of stories that we need to hear,
and that would be really, really helpful.
And I know we have worked on timber a lot, which hopefully
your smaller timber guys can feel some positivity from that but
would love to continue that conversation.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. You know, it is we have fought hard
and, and I--one of the most haunting memories I have from
being. You know, I used to run an auto repair shop. This is new
to me. And the most haunting memory was a farmer. He is like a
grown man, like, crying, starting to cry. Like, I don't know if
I can get this farm to the fifth generation.
And like the suicide rate, like, I think there is a lot of
useless metrics, and I think one metric I would really ask you
to focus on is, is the suicide rate.
Secretary Rollins. Mental health.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. It is three and a half times higher
than any other population. What the fuck are we doing?
Secretary Rollins. Other than our veterans, you are right.
Our veterans and our farmers.
Ms. Gluesenkamp Perez. It is profound. And I think what I
hear is that why is it so difficult for me to just sell food to
the school? My smaller schools, they can't go through the
regulatory burden of getting in those programs.
What my farmers want is guaranteed market access. They want
to be able to know that they can grow real food and bring it to
our schools. And a lot of these programs, we are starting to
crack that door open. And as you are rebuilding, like, the
bigger question has to be like, can people just do the thing
that is right?
Are we empowering our farmers to stand up to the
consolidation, to stand up to the foreign land ownership and
just be able to sell food to their schools?
Secretary Rollins. I agree. I agree with that really
quickly, though, on the local food, because I think it is
important that when that money was pulled back, your state of
Washington has 7 million of $11 million left in that fund.
And so part of the reason that that was really became a
conversation piece and a part of the decision making is because
many of the states, not Maine, but many of the states had so
much money left, they couldn't spend it quickly enough.
And so while we are looking at the $405 million dollars a
day we are spending in nutrition just from USDA, there has got
to be a better way to balance the taxpayer interest with the
interest that you just outlined.
So I look forward to working on that. Hopefully expanding
the markets worldwide will help but understanding with your
local farmers, these programs and continuing to build those
partnerships with local and state help is really important.
Thank you.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much. Iowa, where agriculture I
hear is a little important.
Ms. Hinson. We grow and raise a few things in Iowa.
Thank you so much Madam Secretary for coming today. And I
want to start off by thanking you for coming to Iowa. We were
one of the first states that you came to visit. You visited a
hog farm in our state.
Secretary Rollins. I feel a little like I am having to pick
my favorite child of my four. I have got four teenagers. I feel
like I am having to, who is your favorite? But I had an awesome
day.
Ms. Hinson. I get to brag that because you came to Iowa. So
thank you so much. Really appreciate the conversations that you
had on the ground.
And you have really, you did really hit the ground running.
You know, I have two teenage boys, so I am particularly
thankful for what you have done on egg prices because we were
like having to go to market rate. We were like, you know, you
can only have one today. Very, very rationalized.
You are protecting conservation, the assistance programs. I
mean you have really done all this while still respecting
taxpayers in this process, which I really appreciate. But I
want to hit on Prop 12, as you probably know, based upon your
conversations in Iowa with our hog farmers, you know, this
policy out of California, Massachusetts had question three.
They have really created significant challenges for our
producers. And I really appreciate your commitment to examining
laws like this. But can you talk about some of the consequences
for our farmers and producers if policies like this that you
know, are really state-by-state really start to flow down and
impact interstate commerce issues?
Secretary Rollins. I think it is really important. And no
one is a bigger believer in federalism and the 10th Amendment
and allowing the blue states and the red states and the purple
states to be the laboratories of democracy.
I think that is one of the geniuses of our founding fathers
vision when they wrote the Constitution. But when a state like
California or other states passes laws that have significant
impact outside of their state border, then that is not
sustainable.
And specific to Prop 12. We have understood that, we see
it. I think it is pretty bipartisan, maybe not 100 percent, but
very bipartisan across both sides of the aisle. That that is
not--it is just not sustainable.
So having a federal approach to that, ensuring that we are
protecting our pork producers, especially some of our other
livestock producers underneath the regime of Prop 12 is
important. So we will keep working on that together, and I
really look forward to it.
Ms. Hinson. Well, and certainly I appreciate your
commitment to federalism, because we believe in that too,
right? We want California to be able to regulate its own
producers, but we don't want them to be able to tell Iowa
farmers how to raise our animals and do their jobs.
And we have heard a lot about that high cost associated
with that, about $4,000 per sow. So then you think about other
state laws kind of coming into the mix, and that creep that can
happen is something we certainly have to fix.
Do you believe that that kind of patchwork policy, whether
it is Prop 12 or other, you know, other policies that could
come down the pipeline, could put small family farms out of
business if that is allowed to continue?
Secretary Rollins. I do. And I think, again, speaking
across the party line, across the aisle, that we are all
focused on small family farms, regardless of what the lady
said.
I think that we all understand and agree that is the
backbone of America, and there is no America if they continue
to go out of business and not be able hand off their farms to
their children and their grandchildren.
And when we put so much burden on them, now we are talking
about regulation specifically, but other burdens along the way,
it becomes an unsustainable way of life, and that is what we
have to really target.
We have already begun the deregulation effort, not just
across the government, but specific to USDA with line speeds
and some other decisions that we have made. And you will see a
much bigger package coming out soon to get the government off
the back of our farmers.
Ms. Hinson. Love hearing that. I know our farmers love
hearing that red tape is being cut every single day. So thank
you for your work and leading on that.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Ms. Hinson. And in the time I have remaining, I want to
touch on an issue critical for national security. We already
talked about China and the land ownership issues, but I want to
talk about our ag supply chain for food, because you look at--I
was just recently on the ground at a mill in Iowa, and some of
the food, their feed, right, they are trying to put together
animal feed, and many of the bags had, you know, Chinese
characters. They are coming from China, right? All these
additives.
China does control the majority of the world's amino acids
and vitamins. So what risks would our producers continue to
face if we continue to have that reliance on foreign
adversaries?
You know, hopefully we get these trade deals done and
things normalize, but realistically, we could be in some
tumultuous times ahead.
Secretary Rollins. We could be. And I think that is why
President Trump's vision is so important, that if we continue
down the trajectory of relying on other countries and other
countries coming into America and buying our farmland, this is
no longer just about protecting those who feed, clothe, and
fuel the nation in the world, like some of the guys sitting
behind me, it now becomes about national security.
America will no longer be able to protect ourselves, be the
world's economic superpower if we can't stop relying on
international and other countries to help feed and clothe us.
And that becomes extremely important.
And I think one of the most important visions of President
Trump that we have to effectuate if we want an America to give
to our future children and grandchildren.
Ms. Hinson. Well, I look forward to working with you on how
we can bring that supply chain home as much as possible to
protect those who, as you said, feed, fuel, and clothe the
world. So thank you, Madam Secretary.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Ms. Hinson. I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Harris. Thank you.
The gentlelady from Florida is recognized.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary,
it is good to see you. You too. I appreciate the opportunity to
talk with you.
I want to raise the deep concerns that many of us have
about the over $5 billion in USDA program funding that remains
frozen under this Administration. That is funding that farmers,
food producers, and rural communities were told that they could
count on. And in many cases, these are not speculative awards
or pending applications, these are signed agreements, binding
contracts between the federal government and farmers where the
terms were agreed to, budgets were made, and in some cases
planning or construction even has already begun.
Farmers in Florida and across the country invested real
money and made huge business decisions based on these
commitments. That includes producers participating in USDA's
conservation programs, REAP energy projects, and food purchase
agreements with schools and food banks. And now they are only
getting silence, or worse, cancellation notices.
And this funding freeze is not just a bureaucratic delay.
You can't tell me well, this is just all under review. It has
been reviewed by Congress. It is law. These are programs and
funding that these farmers have counted on. Purchase agreements
with schools and food banks. And it is a breach of trust.
I have heard from Florida citrus growers, specialty crop
farmers and small agricultural businesses who feel abandoned.
They don't know if they will be reimbursed for expenses they
sunk into these projects or if they will need to lay off
workers and they are left with one simple devastating question.
Can I still trust the federal government to honor its word?
So can you explain why these agreements remain frozen? What
authority the department has to delay these payments and how
USDA plans to repair the damage to your credibility among
farmers?
We have courts that are ordering this Administration to
unfreeze these funds and you are not doing so and choosing to
violate the law. Are you going to abide by the law or are you
going to listen to Elon Musk?
Secretary Rollins. Well, oh, there is so much there. So
thank you for the opportunity to talk about this.
First of all, at the very top, what I would ask is any
specific contracts that you are getting feedback from your
constituents or others on, would you send those to us?
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Sure. There are a lot.
Secretary Rollins. Great. The second thing I will say is
the 20 billion that was frozen has all been reviewed and
released down to the final five billion. I understand five
billion, still a lot of money, but we have made progress. The
rest of that will be finished.
It is happening daily, but by the end of the month, a lot
of it we have reconstituted. Obviously, the last administration
had very different priorities than we do at USDA. There was a
lot of effort put on diversity, equity, and inclusion on
climate programs and we have reorganized now that to support
the family farm and the farmer.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Okay. Madam Secretary, if I can
interrupt you for a moment.
Secretary Rollins. Yes, please.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. I understand that you might have
different priorities between administrations. That doesn't
change the fact that these are programs that are law. That it
is funding that was appropriated by Congress and that was in
process for delivery.
And just because the new administration has different
priorities doesn't mean that you can freeze those funds and
block access to them or cancel those programs.
Secretary Rollins. Well, I disagree. Well, the premise is
correct, but the facts are wrong.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Well, the court disagrees with the
administration.
Secretary Rollins. Well, we have abided by every court
order. There is not one court order we have not abided by. So
please let us know if you know differently, if your staff sees
differently. But the court we can take off the table.
Every time the court has told us to do something, we have,
of course, followed. But to your point, Congress did not tell
the last USDA to spend $600,000 studying the menstrual cycle of
transgender mice. That was not a congressionally directed.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Okay. That is a preposterous
example.
Secretary Rollins. No, but it is actually an example. The.
The supporting food justice queer farmers in San Francisco.
That did not come from Congress.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Reclaiming my time. Reclaiming my
time.
Secretary Rollins. I understand, but I think that is what
you are saying is unfair.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Madame Secretary, when I say that I
am reclaiming my time, it means that I need to ask you
something else.
Secretary Rollins. Okay, well, if what you are saying isn't
factual, then I have to----
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Please pause for a moment so I can
do that because the time is mine.
Secretary Rollins. Yes, ma'am. Please go ahead.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. And if you would give me some of
that time back, I would appreciate it.
You have $2 billion in food aid that was frozen. You have
the U.S. Agency for Global Media that was frozen, $250 million.
You have AmeriCorps, state and national grant programs that
were frozen. You have Agricultural Conservation Easement
Program, $500 million that was frozen. Watershed programs, $800
million that was frozen.
And you are going to tell me all of that money has been
distributed now and the reviews are done and the grants have
been--the grant funding has been released?
Secretary Rollins. No, no, no, no, no. Of course not. All
of it has been reviewed and realigned with this
Administration's goals while complying with the law and court
orders.
Let's talk about food aid. So you are going to, I am sure
you are talking about the, oh, goodness gracious, the name
escapes me. But the big one, Food for Aid, maybe that is a
very, very big program, 240 million dollars, I believe.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Right.
Secretary Rollins. Only 37 million of that was actually
farm related. The layers of abuse and waste and bureaucracy.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. You are reclaiming my time, ma'am.
Secretary Rollins. That is what we have to realign for the
taxpayer.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Madam Secretary, reclaiming my time.
It doesn't change the fact that it is still law. It was still
appropriated funds directed by Congress in many cases with
specificity on what--no, I had about a minute and a half that
the Secretary would not give me my time back. So I would like--
--
Secretary Rollins. I would like to answer the questions,
but I hear you.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. I would like to make sure that you
answer my question----
Secretary Rollins. But I'm not--I don't have time to answer
them.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz [continuing]. On the specificity of
the programs that were appropriated by Congress within those
funds and the Department froze them and did not release the
funds. And you are not allowed, by law, to decide that because
your priorities don't line up with the way Congress
appropriated those funds specifically to just decide not to
spend them.
Secretary Rollins. We will have----
Mr. Harris. The gentlelady was recognized for an extra
minute.
The gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Cline is recognized.
Mr. Cline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I am going to give you the opportunity to respond because I
do believe that you do have the authority. If you find there to
be wasteful spending in some of these programs, fraudulent
spending in some of these programs, administration of these
programs, if you find fraud, do you find abuse of taxpayer
dollars, it is not only your ability, your right, it is your
responsibility to the taxpayers to pause those funds to make
sure that they are being administered properly.
So I commend you for what you are doing. You are looking
after the farmers of this country. You are looking after the
taxpayers of this country. So I will give you the chance to
respond before I ask you some questions about bird flu.
Secretary Rollins. Well, thank you, sir. I will just echo
what you said. Every decision that we are making is in the
interest of the taxpayer, the farmer, and the rancher, and the
agriculture producer. We are not violating any law. And if in
fact, we see law that has been violated, I would ask, the
gentlelady has now left, but I would ask her or her staff to
let us know. That is extremely important.
There was a mandate in November of 2024 to realign the
entire government around putting Americans first and not
putting bureaucrats and massive government programs first. And
that is what we are doing every day. And the people support us.
And the inflation's coming down, jobs are going up. I mean,
this is making America and American agriculture great again. So
thank you for allowing me to say that.
Mr. Cline. Madam Secretary, you are doing a great job. And
I want to highlight one area where you are prioritizing
taxpayer dollars, and that is to combat avian influenza.
The turkey industry, which is in my district in the
Shenandoah Valley, I know you know it well. You are welcome
anytime. It has been greatly impacted by avian flu. And in
addition to that, blackhead is another disease that is impacted
poultry in my district.
The Subcommittee has supported research being conducted at
USDA Ag Research Service to better understand how blackhead
colonies and turkeys and work is underway to identify potential
pathways for control of the disease.
So I would urge you to continue to prioritize this research
and staff associated with the research in their positions.
Secretary Rollins. We will definitely do that. And I have
visited a lot of our poultry producers in the last 83 days. It
has been devastating, devastating and losing entire flocks. We
just have to do better. The avian bird flu reared its ugly head
after 10 years of nothing two years ago.
The last Administration worked to mitigate and manage it,
but didn't really have a bold plan to fix it. And that is what
we are working to do.
Mr. Cline. Thank you. And I want to shift gears a little
bit. Your predecessor was--had quite a track record, and it is
not a pretty one. I questioned him last year about the Biden-
Harris USDA's $1 million ongoing collaboration with Wuhan, the
Wuhan lab's parent organization, the Chinese Academy of
Sciences.
In the project, the USDA's Ag Research Service and the
Communist Party controlled CAS were conducting dangerous
experiments to manipulate bird flu viruses using gain-of-
function research techniques to see if they could create new
strains that might infect humans.
On top of that, the CAS researcher leading China's side of
the project has listed the Wuhan Institute of Virology as one
of his affiliations. It may not surprise you that Secretary
Vilsack defended and distorted this risky project.
He denied collaboration even though that word is literally
in the project title. He also said that, quote, ``there is not
data sharing. All of this is basically walled off. So
everything we are doing stays with us. It doesn't necessarily
go to the UK or to China,'' end quote.
However, FOIA records state USDA will spend tax dollars to
visit the lab in China regularly to, quote, ``share results on
site.'' It is remarkable. Will you commit to discontinuing
funding for this project and other research with Chinese labs
while we continue to fight this epidemic, this avian flu?
Secretary Rollins. Yes. It is my understanding that those
have been discontinued just in the last few months, but we will
double check that today. If they haven't, then 100 percent yes.
And I am sure you saw that the President has also made this a
priority and is willing to take whatever measures necessary to
ensure we are protecting our people and our producers and this
country.
Mr. Cline. Outstanding. With that, I will yield back to the
Chairman if he wants the remaining minute of my time.
Mr. Harris. Thank you. Thank you very much.
I want to recognize the gentlelady from Ohio who Madam
Secretary, if you are intrigued by the idea of Buy American for
SNAP, we might have a willing partner.
Secretary Rollins. I love it. I love it.
Mr. Harris. The gentlelady is recognized.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you so much.
Ms. Kaptur. Thank you Mr. Chairman and welcome. Madam
Secretary. We have not had a chance to meet unfortunately this
morning and we got three committees, all so important, meeting
simultaneously and all of us are running around. This is not
the way Congress should operate.
I am willing to work late into the evening in order to
allow, and I am not blaming this Committee, but the process
that is been set up is very unfair to witnesses and very unfair
to members and I don't like it at all.
So I will exit immediately after questions because I have
to run to two other committees. It is not an intelligent way to
operate the country.
Secretary Rollins. Well, I am always available. So if we
don't get to it, feel free to call me personally anytime.
Ms. Kaptur. Thank you. My first question is an easy one.
Does the Department of Agriculture still permit the Virginia
and Maryland farmers to sell at the USDA Farmers Market to set
a good example for the country to support local agriculture?
Secretary Rollins. I believe the answer is yes. But let me,
that is one question I have not had in all these days. So I
will double check and get back to your office today.
Ms. Kaptur. Right. That is an important one because that is
the----
Secretary Rollins. Oh, the answer is 100 percent yes from
the smart people sitting behind.
Ms. Kaptur. Thank you. I want to help that even though I am
in competition with the Chairman of this committee because he
grows in his district too. But we, the millions of people that
go down that mall, that is our advertisement for local
agriculture.
Secretary Rollins. I love it.
Ms. Kaptur. And there is a truck they used to take around.
I don't know if they still do that but do whatever you. They
had it hidden behind some bushes the last time I was over
there. And I really think we need to showcase agriculture. And
you are in a perfect place to do it to the millions of people
that visit this city.
And I don't live here. But anyway. But that gets me to my
point. I have fought for many years for the senior farmers
market and WIC Farmers Market Program. We used to call it the
coupon program because senior citizens know what coupons are.
The younger generation's all, you know, electronics. But
seniors know what coupons are.
It was a measly amount of money, 50 bucks for those that
qualified. And our area Office on Aging conducted this program.
We used to have 22,000 seniors and this program is only a 20-
million-dollar program. It is an embarrassment, but it is in
the books.
Okay, so we had 22,000 seniors who got $50 a summer. And I
could tell you so many compelling stories of what those $50
meant and they had to buy it from local producers and what it
means to those producers.
I am so worried we will not have a follow-on generation of
farmers in this country. And there is a reason for it. Because
of conglomerate agriculture that has squeezed out these local
producers, local innovation and it is wrong. It is wrong. These
people work so hard and they have so many ideas that are fresh.
You know, the organic producers that are coming along and
so forth. So this program just in my little area, I have eight
counties, seven of them are rural. Okay? 150 farmers
registered. We actually had a registry of local farmers.
When these seniors would get these coupons they could go to
those 150 places. It was great. We had up to 150 farmers. You
show me any other district in the country that has done that
and we had 22,000 seniors and I don't know how many WIC
recipients we had, but it was a lot. They would go to the
downtown farmers market.
Anyway what USDA did, and I don't know why, and I don't
know who, but they decided to make it an electronic program. Do
you know how many seniors can't use those devices when they are
sitting alone in their home? And they--for the farmers, I went
out to one of our biggest produce stands And I said, Mr.
Bergman, where is the--he goes, I don't do that anymore. Farmer
Bergman, why? I don't want to get into that electronic stuff. I
don't have time for it.
Ma'am, this has killed the program. 22,000 people, that
doesn't count the WIC recipient, just 22,000 seniors in my
area, 135 farmers. This year, we have only had 32 farmers
register for the program.
So I am hell bent on this because if we don't do this, we
are not going to have farmers and they can farm in the city
now. We have examples of where we are doing that all the way
from Manhattan all the way to Columbus, Ohio, and Cleveland,
Chicago. Some of our new farmers are in the cities. I met a guy
yesterday from Battle Creek, Michigan. Phenomenal. He was here
with the Farmers Union.
So I am just saying I need help to help my people and to
help whether they are the farmers or whether they are the
consumers, something is really wrong in Denmark and we need
your help.
Secretary Rollins. This is the first I have heard of it,
but we will look into it and why don't you and I jump on the
phone in the next day or two and let's have a longer
conversation.
Ms. Kaptur. Thank you. That is my only question. Thank you
very much.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you so much, ma'am.
Mr. Harris. The gentleman from Florida, Mr. Franklin.
Mr. Franklin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you,
Secretary, for being here. I apologize. We have all been
bouncing back and forth. So I have got to get my head out of
Energy now and back into----
Secretary Rollins. Get to agriculture? Yes.
Mr. Franklin. I appreciate your time. And Ag is so critical
to my state. Most people assume if you live in Florida, you
either live at Disney World or the beach.
Secretary Rollins. That is right.
Mr. Franklin. And I have to tell them, you know, hey, we
have got so much agriculture. I have got one of the largest
agricultural districts east of the Mississippi and I have got
more cows than registered voters. But thank you very much for
your time here.
I know you spoke earlier and I apologize if I missed it or
if you have expanded further. But you talked about block
grants. That is an important thing to the state of Florida. We
are not as much about commodities as we are the specialty
crops.
Secretary Rollins. Right.
Mr. Franklin. And I know what we grow and do doesn't fit as
neatly into some of the other programs. It is vitally important
to us. But to add a little more, I am very excited that we have
got some more information forthcoming hopefully today and money
rolling out soon.
But since I came to Congress four years ago four hurricane
seasons ago, we have had six named hurricanes in Florida. I,
alongside our entire 28-member delegation, this is something
that we agree on, wholeheartedly supported HR662 in the 118th
Congress, would have allowed USDA to implement block grants for
the money approved for the 2020-year ag losses, passed the
House, didn't get through the Senate. We didn't get the 60
votes that we needed there. So it died.
Following Hurricanes Milton and Helene last fall, I led a
letter to Secretary Vilsack requesting that the block grants be
utilized in disaster aid for '23 and '24. Again, we got the
entire delegation on it, including now Secretary of State Rubio
and Senator Scott and again crickets from USDA. We didn't get
anything back from them.
It is vitally important to us. We have submitted a request
for two and a half billion in block grant authority on April
3rd. And I, along with Representative Cammack and Senators
Scott, Moody, have sent you a letter. So I know you have been
on the Hill testifying this week. You probably haven't seen
that yet, but again, just underscoring how important it is to
us.
I know you said specific amounts are forthcoming, but can
you comment at all about maybe how these block grants are going
to be administered? Will it be--will the state have unilateral
authority to divvy up that money? Will they be allocated to
specific crop participants or users? Anything you could give my
folks I know at home are desperate to give.
Secretary Rollins. Right. It is my understanding if I am
wrong about this, I will follow up with the entire Committee
because this affects every single person. But we have for the
last eight to 12 weeks been negotiating, negotiating is
probably a strong word, collaborating with your Ag Secretary
and with some of your leadership in your state.
Every state will look a little bit differently, which is
why this is so complicated. This isn't like ECAP where there is
one formula, you enter the portal in three days you get paid.
This is different. But I think a tremendous amount of work has
been done.
We will triple check on Florida and let you know exactly
where that is in the process. But later today, at a press
conference, I will be talking a little bit more about this. But
the most important thing is that money will begin to move by
the end of this month. And we believe everything will be paid
out within a month or two after that.
So by this summer, and that we are, again, it is very, very
complicated, but our team is working around the clock. Would
love any feedback you have on that, but again, we will follow
up directly with you and anyone else on the Committee that is
working for their constituents on this.
Mr. Franklin. All right. Thank you.
Secretary Rollins. We know there are hurting farmers that
can't pay their bills because of this money. And so if I have
to go in myself and you know I will do it.
Mr. Franklin. Unfortunately, now it is such a cash flow
issue that only those--and folks are spending their own money--
--
Secretary Rollins. That is right.
Mr. Franklin [continuing]. And are down to nothing. A lot
of them are literally selling the farm because they just can't
hold out any longer.
Secretary Rollins. That is right.
Mr. Franklin. I also want to thank you. Big shout out for
helping us fill our state FSA director. We have had a lot of
challenges. I know other states have, but in Florida, we
particularly have. And with the nature of the hurricanes and
people needing more support, we have got a great team, but they
have been overworked and undermanned. So thank you very much
for that.
Florida ranks as 16th in the U.S. for agricultural cash
receipts. I know--I think you mentioned in your Senate
testimony that you visited 15 states so far?
Secretary Rollins. Yes.
Mr. Franklin. So does that mean we may--Florida may be your
16th?
Secretary Rollins. Yeah. Well, Nebraska is Monday, but
Florida is soon after. I promise. I promise.
Mr. Franklin. Okay. You don't have to win a Super Bowl ring
to come on down.
Secretary Rollins. I know. Fair, that is fair. Yeah, we are
coming.
Mr. Franklin. Thank you, Madame Secretary.
Secretary Rollins. Well, my goal, I head to England on
Sunday as we begin the international travel to take our
agriculture products to the world as we are negotiating and
renegotiating these trade agreements.
I mentioned, I don't know that you were in here, but it is
important to underscore the President's vision on realigning
the world economy around American products. We are making so
much progress and it is all hands-on deck.
So in the coming couple of months, I will be in England, I
will be in Asia, I will be in South America, taking again our
products to the world and to the government.
I had Mexico in yesterday, so we are aggressive and we are
working around the clock to fix all that. One quick thing and
hopefully of interest, Mr. Chairman, if you don't mind, to the
letters.
I have had a lot of feedback from many people about
unanswered letters. So we are working very hard. We have had
142 hit my desk since I started 83 days ago. To date, we have
answered, I think almost 80 of those 142 being very
understaffed.
I still don't love that number, but it is--hopefully we are
making progress. My goal is to turn letters around within four
to five days upon receiving them, and hopefully we will be able
to hit that mark very, very quickly.
If you can't get us, and if it is an important issue, and
this is for everybody, not just the friends on my side, just
call us. Just call us and let's have a conversation on how we
can fix some of this.
Mr. Franklin. Great. Thank you, Madam Secretary.
Chairman, I yield back.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much. And well, if we are all
getting in the queue for the visits, Maryland Eastern Shore is
pretty close.
Secretary Rollins. And it is so much easier. I can just
drive.
Mr. Harris. It is close by, let me tell you.
Secretary Rollins. Yes, sir. I will be there.
Mr. Harris. And with that, I do want to recognize the
chairman of the full committee. And in typical style for the
Chairman, you know, we do have several meeting at the same
time. He came in late and----
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, sir.
Mr. Harris [continuing]. Told me he wants to make sure all
the members from both sides of the aisle speak and ask
questions first before he gets his turn.
But, Mr. Chairman, it is your turn.
Mr. Cole. Thank you very much. And I know you have got a
hard stop, so I will try and be as accommodating to you as I
can.
First, just one piece of unsolicited political advice. Make
Maryland your favorite state, okay?
Secretary Rollins. Yes. That is fair.
Mr. Cole. Okay. You know, word to the wise----
Secretary Rollins. That is fair. You did just get our
basketball coach from Texas A&M, so yeah, I have become much
more interested. But yes.
Mr. Cole. Well, we are, yeah, I won't even get into
basketball after what the Thunder did the night before last.
Secretary Rollins. We will move on.
Mr. Cole. Yeah. The night before. Anyway, a couple quick
things. Number one, I am not going to read an opening
statement, Mr. Chairman, if I may, I will just submit it for
the record. You don't need to hear that.
There is a couple of questions I do have but before I do, I
want to commend you for what you are doing in reviewing grants
and money out the door.
Look, every administration, I am not even saying it is the
partisans, is at the end is shoving out every dime they can and
we have had numerous examples in the billions of dollars. I
think a one to a nonprofit formed last year for $2 billion that
your colleague Lee Zelden and our former colleague pointed out
was clearly political, clearly ill advised. So you are well
within your rights.
I agree very much with what the gentle lady from Iowa had
to say about this. And so thank you for doing it. I know you
catch a lot of flak for it and I know sometimes, you know,
folks that should have got money at that it takes a little
longer and that is a problem. But you are doing the right thing
and I know you will make sure the worthy recipients get it.
But you can save the taxpayers some money. That is a good
thing, not a bad thing. Two questions I have. One is pretty
easy. Well, I hope it is easy. You know, states like Oklahoma
voluntarily established state inspection programs to better
serve our meat processors and were eligible for up to 50
percent cost share.
In the last Administration we didn't get the full 50
percent match. That has really put us in a difficult spot in
terms of meeting all the needs of our local and particularly
our smaller producers.
So if you have got a chance to think about this, will the
USDA be providing the 50 percent cost share this fiscal year
for state inspection programs? Do you know if you----
Secretary Rollins. I don't know off the top of my head but
we will get back to you today on that.
Mr. Cole. Okay.
Secretary Rollins. And I would believe that if this was,
you know, it is obviously very important to my neighbor to the
north, Oklahoma and our cattle producers that that seems
important.
Mr. Cole. Yeah, we would appreciate it if you looked at it.
And look, we also get it and I actually direct this to the
members as well, there is a lot of legitimate complaints about
how many hearings we are having and how quickly.
That is because you are a new Administration. It took a
while to get everybody in place. We don't have a full budget
yet, which I would urge, I know you are working with OMB. We
are glad we got the skinny budget, but that is not a full
budget. We need the full budget.
And I will tell this and we will talk about in full
committee to my fellow committee members. We are going to get
every one of these damn bills out of here by the August break.
So it is going to be a hectic schedule period because we have
no chance of getting things done by the end of the fiscal year
if this Committee is not able to expedite its work.
So I am going to push the members and the staff awfully
hard. The things got here, but again, this is a new
administration. Every administration in its first year goes
through this because they don't have time to get the budget
done. Takes a while to get their people through. And so just
kind of the nature of the beast.
Second question. Last year, under the last administration,
very unusual, we had a tremendous problem with Tribal Food
Distribution Programs. So much so that we actually had a
bipartisan hearing and hearing between both the Appropriations
and Ag and honestly, we had genuine bipartisan concern over
this issue, partly because all of us that represent tribal
communities had begun hearing about this a lot.
I mean, you know, these promised deliveries of food weren't
showing up, and we began hearing the complaints in April. You
usually don't get people talking in the same voice and going
after Administration.
I want to commend my Democratic colleagues on this a few
weeks before an election on something like this. But it was so
bad that people were doing it. So you have a lot. There is a
lot of, you know, the first Americans were the first farmers,
too. They are pretty good at what they do. And we certainly
have a lot of tribal farmers in Oklahoma.
We have a lot of tribal needs in terms of trust and treaty
commitments the federal government's made over the years. So I
would be curious as to if you have had a time to even look at
those programs and if you could get back to us about how are we
doing now?
Because literally last time when we went through this,
while we were hearing the complaints in April and while we know
the Ag department was hearing the complaints in April, the
Secretary, actually, your predecessor, testified that he didn't
know anything about till August.
I mean, how in the world it doesn't get from, you know, the
front door to the Secretary's desk when we are talking about
food distribution to needy senior Indians for months, you know,
tells me there is something was very wrong with the bureaucracy
and the flow of information in the Ag Department last time.
Secretary Rollins. Yeah, well, I am familiar with it. Let
me get a full update for you and I will call you later today,
if that is okay? T.W. Shannon, a great Oklahoman, is on----
Mr. Cole. He used to work for me.
Secretary Rollins. Well, he is on our senior staff focusing
on rural prosperity and certainly he is of these communities as
well.
So I will loop him in and make sure he is at least an
everyday, every minute conduit for you. But you can always call
me as well. But we will put him on.
Mr. Cole. Thank you very much.
Secretary Rollins. Yeah. Thank you, sir, very much.
Mr. Cole. Thank you, Madam Secretary.
Thank you, I yield back.
Mr. Harris. Thank you. We are going to just have brief
comment by myself and one question from the Ranking Member and
then get you out of here on time, hopefully.
Just to follow up on what the Chairman talked about, one of
the issues with those grants for the small processing--small
processors for meat brought to my attention that one problem
is, because we need to do that to get our small producers
mechanism for them to get things processed, is that for some
reason we require the slaughtering and fabrication to occur in
the same facility if it is subject to for the grant.
But in some of these cases, the slaughtering--it makes much
more sense to have slaughtering and fabrication in different
facilities and to allow for a fabrication facility or a
slaughtering facility to apply. So this just bring it to your
attention.
Last one on that Tribal Food Bank Program, that is what I
call it, the FDPIR. You ought to look into it for MAHA's sake
because the food they stock is all nutritious food. Like they
only stock low-sodium canned vegetables. They only stock good
proteins, no snack foods, no sugary sodas.
So a program already exists that I kind of think is a MAHA
program and it is actually a tribal nation program for the
tribal nation.
Secretary Rollins. That is incredible.
Mr. Harris. So anyway, with that, Mr. Bishop, you have a
quick question?
Secretary Rollins. Thank you, Dr. Harris.
Mr. Bishop. I have actually two questions, but the answers
will probably be short.
Mr. Harris. Okay.
Secretary Rollins. Perfect.
Mr. Bishop. First question has to do with----
Secretary Rollins. And I can go--sir, I can go a little
longer if anyone else has questions.
Mr. Bishop. The first has to do with SNAP waivers. And I
have heard your interest and of course I am very well aware of
the Chairman's interest in SNAP waivers for states with regard
to banning certain foods from SNAP.
But the Subcommittee had a hearing on this last year and
some of the most compelling testimony came from a grocer from
Georgia. He made two key points. One, that the government would
need to establish codes for the thousands of products carried
in grocery stores to determine what is eligible for SNAP. That
they need to completely overhaul their IT systems to enforce
the rules within their and as he put it, one to two percent net
profits.
If the waivers are granted, and seems like there is
interest in doing that, can I get your commitment that you
would consider exempting small grocers from any waiver so they
can have a chance to stay in business without having to comply
with all of that?
Secretary Rollins. I would love to learn more about that.
And 100 percent that is my commitment. I mean, bringing rural
prosperity back to every corner of America has to include
supporting our smaller businesses.
So it is not just small farmers, it is our small grocers it
is our small. I mean, just small everything. So, yeah, let me
look into that, and I would love to work with you all on that
and, in fact, even maybe talk to your grocer to give us his
story.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you. Thank you very much for that.
The second thing has to do with, and I know you referenced
it in answer to one of the questions, the study on menstrual
cycles of transgender men, mice, whatever. And you took great
satisfaction in canceling a grant to a university for the study
of menstrual cycles and transgender men, which really doesn't
sound like a USDA study and it wasn't.
But the study was actually was to research, process, and
utilize three alternative natural fibers, regenerative cotton,
regenerative wool, and industrial hemp in the development of
sustainable, reusable, and disposable feminine hygiene
products, including pads, liners, and underwear for women and
girls that could be grown in Louisiana. Which basically was to
promote the growth of agricultural products, the patents, et
cetera, in Louisiana.
Apparently, whoever read the grant--your staff obviously
misread it, and of course it resulted in a fraudulent,
sensational, and misrepresentation of what that grant was
about. So once it is read, will you reinstate that grant? It
was a small grant to one of the 1890s in Louisiana for
$600,000.
Secretary Rollins. My commitment is to go take a look at
that. I mean, it has been an interesting and fascinating effort
as we have gone through hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of
these contracts, thousands, many of them are just sort of
stunning. But, yes, sir, of course. I will go back and take a
look at that.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you.
Mr. Harris. Thank you very much.
Secretary Rollins, thank you for being here today. I think
our discussion touched on many important issues that resonate
with our nation's producers, some of whom are here today with
us and our constituents across rural America.
I look forward to working with you as we move through the
FY '26 process. As a reminder to the members, if you would like
to submit questions for the record, please submit them to the
Subcommittee staff within seven days. The Subcommittee stands
adjourned.
Secretary Rollins. Thank you. Thank you, everyone.
[Whereupon, at 12:03 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
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W I T N E S S E S
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Rollins, Brooke, Secretary, U.S. Department of Agriculture....... 7
Prepared statement........................................... 10
Answers to submitted questions............................... 51
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