    [House Hearing, 119 Congress]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                       AI IN MANUFACTURING: SECURING AMERICAN
                       LEADERSHIP IN MANUFACTURING AND THE
                       NEXT GENERATION OF TECHNOLOGIES

    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                         SUBCOMMITTEE ON COMMERCE, MANUFACTURING,
                                   AND TRADE

                                     OF THE

                        COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE
                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                        ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                                 FIRST SESSION

                                   __________

                          WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 12, 2025

                                   __________

                                Serial No. 119-5

         Published for the use of the Committee on Energy and Commerce

     [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                       govinfo.gov/committee/house-energy
                            energycommerce.house.gov

                                    __________

                       U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
    59-655 PDF                  WASHINGTON : 2025

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                        COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE

                            BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky
                                     Chairman
    ROBERT E. LATTA, Ohio                FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey
    H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia           Ranking Member
    GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida            DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado
    RICHARD HUDSON, North Carolina       JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois
    EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, Georgia    DORIS O. MATSUI, California
    GARY J. PALMER, Alabama              KATHY CASTOR, Florida
    NEAL P. DUNN, Florida                PAUL TONKO, New York
    DAN CRENSHAW, Texas                  YVETTE D. CLARKE, New York
    JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania, Vice       RAUL RUIZ, California
        Chairman                         SCOTT H. PETERS, California
    RANDY K. WEBER, Sr., Texas           DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan
    RICK W. ALLEN, Georgia               MARC A. VEASEY, Texas
    TROY BALDERSON, Ohio                 ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
    RUSS FULCHER, Idaho                  NANETTE DIAZ BARRAGAN, California
    AUGUST PFLUGER, Texas                DARREN SOTO, Florida
    DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee         KIM SCHRIER, Washington
    MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa       LORI TRAHAN, Massachusetts
    KAT CAMMACK, Florida                 LIZZIE FLETCHER, Texas
    JAY OBERNOLTE, California            ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ, New York
    JOHN JAMES, Michigan                 JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, Massachusetts
    CLIFF BENTZ, Oregon                  TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
    ERIN HOUCHIN, Indiana                ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey
    RUSSELL FRY, South Carolina          KEVIN MULLIN, California
    LAUREL M. LEE, Florida               GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
    NICHOLAS A. LANGWORTHY, New York     JENNIFER L. McCLELLAN, Virginia
    THOMAS H. KEAN, Jr., New Jersey
    MICHAEL A. RULLI, Ohio
    GABE EVANS, Colorado
    CRAIG A. GOLDMAN, Texas
    JULIE FEDORCHAK, North Dakota
                                     ------

                               Professional Staff

                         MEGAN JACKSON, Staff Director
                    SOPHIE KHANAHMADI, Deputy Staff Director
                   TIFFANY GUARASCIO, Minority Staff Director
               Subcommittee on Commerce, Manufacturing, and Trade

                           GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida
                                     Chairman
    RUSS FULCHER, Idaho, Vice Chairman   JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois
    DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee           Ranking Member
    KAT CAMMACK, Florida                 KATHY CASTOR, Florida
    JAY OBERNOLTE, California            DARREN SOTO, Florida
    JOHN JAMES, Michigan                 LORI TRAHAN, Massachusetts
    CLIFF BENTZ, Oregon                  KEVIN MULLIN, California
    ERIN HOUCHIN, Indiana                YVETTE D. CLARKE, New York
    RUSSELL FRY, South Carolina          DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan
    LAUREL M. LEE, Florida               MARC A. VEASEY, Texas
    THOMAS H. KEAN, Jr., New Jersey      ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
    GABE EVANS, Colorado                 KIM SCHRIER, Washington
    CRAIG A. GOLDMAN, Texas              FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey (ex
    BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky (ex              officio)
        officio)
                                 C O N T E N T S

                                  ----------
                                                                       Page
    Hon. Gus M. Bilirakis, a Representative in Congress from the
      State of Florida, opening statement............................     2
        Prepared statement...........................................     4
    Hon. Jan Schakowsky, a Representative in Congress from the State
      of Illinois, opening statement.................................     7
        Prepared statement...........................................     9
    Hon. Brett Guthrie, a Representative in Congress from the
      Commonwealth of Kentucky, opening statement....................    10
        Prepared statement...........................................    12
    Hon. Russ Fulcher, a Representative in Congress from the State of
      Idaho, opening statement.......................................    15
        Prepared statement...........................................    16
    Hon. Frank Pallone, Jr., a Representative in Congress from the
      State of New Jersey, opening statement.........................    17
        Prepared statement...........................................    19

                                   Witnesses

    Jason Oxman, President and Chief Executive Officer, Information
      Technology Industry Council....................................    21
        Prepared statement...........................................    23
    Elisabeth B. Reynolds, Ph.D., Professor of the Practice,
      Massachusetts Institute of Technology..........................    36
        Prepared statement...........................................    38
    Jeff Kinder, Executive Vice President, Product Development and
      Manufacturing Solutions, Autodesk..............................    51
        Prepared statement...........................................    53
    Barbara Humpton, President and Chief Executive Officer, Siemens
      USA............................................................    65
        Prepared statement...........................................    67

                               Submitted Material

    Inclusion of the following was approved by unanimous consent.
    List of documents submitted for the record.......................   115
    Report of the National Association of Manufacturers, ``Working
      Smarter: How Manufacturers Are Using Artificial Intelligence,''
      May 2024.......................................................   116
    Statement of the National Association of Manufacturers, February
      12, 2025.......................................................   132

    AI IN MANUFACTURING: SECURING AMERICAN LEADERSHIP IN MANUFACTURING AND
                      THE NEXT GENERATION OF TECHNOLOGIES

                                  ----------

                          WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 12, 2025

                      House of Representatives,
    Subcommittee on Commerce, Manufacturing, and Trade,
                              Committee on Energy and Commerce,
                                                        Washington, DC.
        The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 11:07 a.m., in
    the John D. Dingell Room 2123, Rayburn House Office Building,
    Hon. Gus M. Bilirakis (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.
        Members present: Representatives Bilirakis, Fulcher,
    Harshbarger, Cammack, Obernolte, James, Bentz, Houchin, Fry,
    Lee, Kean, Evans, Goldman, Guthrie (ex officio), Schakowsky
    (subcommittee ranking member), Castor, Soto, Trahan, Clarke,
    Dingell, Veasey, Kelly, Schrier, and Pallone (ex officio).
        Also present: Representative Joyce.
        Staff present: Ansley Boylan, Director of Operations;
    Jessica Donlon, General Counsel; Sydney Greene, Director,
    Finance and Logistics; Natalie Hellman, Professional Staff
    Member, Commerce, Manufacturing, and Trade; Megan Jackson,
    Staff Director; Daniel Kelly, Press Secretary; Sophie
    Khanahmadi, Deputy Staff Director; Alex Khlopin, Clerk,
    Commerce, Manufacturing, and Trade; Giulia Leganski, Chief
    Counsel, Commerce, Manufacturing, and Trade; Joel Miller, Chief
    Counsel; Brannon Rains, Professional Staff Member, Commerce,
    Manufacturing, and Trade; Evangelos Razis, Professional Staff
    Member; Chris Sarley, Member Services/Stakeholder Director;
    Kaley Stidham, Press Assistant; Matt VanHyfte, Communications
    Director; Hannah Anton, Minority Policy Analyst; Rasheedah
    Blackwood, Minority Intern; Keegan Cardman, Minority Staff
    Assistant; Tiffany Guarascio, Minority Staff Director; Perry
    Hamilton, Minority Member Services & Outreach Manager; Lisa
    Hone, Minority Chief Counsel, Commerce, Manufacturing, and
    Trade; Mackenzie Kuhl, Minority Digital Manager; Phoebe Rouge,
    Minority FTC Detailee; and Andrew Souvall, Minority Director of
    Communications Outreach and Member Services.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The committee will come to order. Good
    morning, everyone.
        The chairman recognizes himself for 5 minutes.

    OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. GUS M. BILIRAKIS, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
                   CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF FLORIDA

        First of all, I want to say ``Happy birthday'' to one of
    our greatest Presidents, if not the greatest President we ever
    had: Abraham Lincoln. Today is the 12th, right? Absolutely.
        And then also I want to make sure I remember this. One of
    my staffers who has been with me about 10 years, including the
    internship, he has made me a better Member, and he has worked
    really hard on healthcare but also this committee, this
    particular committee. He is assigned to be my staffer for this
    committee.
        And I tell you what, he has made me a better Member, and I
    want to congratulate him for all his work. His name is Jim--
    excuse me--Chris Jones, and he will be going over to the other
    side, but you know what--not the Senate--but he deserves a lot
    of credit. I think we have done a lot in this committee. And I
    tell you what, we have terrific staff.
        But thank you very much, Chris, for all your hard work.
    Congratulations and God bless you.
        [Applause.]
        All right. So good morning, everyone, and welcome to the
    first Commerce, Manufacturing, and Trade Subcommittee hearing
    of the 119th Congress.
        I would like to express my sincere congratulations to my
    good friend, the chair, Mr. Guthrie, on his appointment to the
    powerful Energy and Commerce Committee, the oldest standing
    legislative committee in the House--I don't care what Ways and
    Means says--and the best darn committee in Congress, by far.
        I also want to thank the chair for putting his faith in me
    to lead this important subcommittee, which has broad
    jurisdiction over a great many important matters. This will be
    a busy Congress, and I am excited to lay the groundwork to
    accomplish a robust legislative agenda.
        I would be remiss if I didn't identify and welcome to this
    wonderful panel the new members of the Energy and Commerce
    Committee: Mr. Bentz from Oregon; Ms. Houchin from Indiana--we
    will be working closely together; Mr. Fry from South Carolina;
    Ms. Lee from the great State of Florida is a great friend of
    mine, and go Gators; and Mr. Kean from New Jersey, Mr. Evans
    from Colorado, and Mr. Goldman from Texas. Welcome. Welcome.
        I also want to thank my very good friend Russ Fulcher from
    the great State of Idaho. He will be serving as my vice chair.
    He is going to do an outstanding job. So it is either Gus or
    Russ. That is what he says.
        And, finally, it is good to be sitting next to my good
    friend Ms. Schakowsky from Illinois. I am greatly looking
    forward to working with you again and all the Members on this
    particular subcommittee.
        Now on to the business at hand. I am excited to kick this
    Congress off with an educational hearing examining the state of
    American manufacturing and how it can be revolutionized with
    the use of artificial intelligence.
        We know generative AI is currently dominating the headlines
    for its specific use case of AI, such as how DeepSeek is
    capturing warranted attention with their collection of
    Americans' personal data and subsequently sharing it with the
    Chinese Communist Party.
        But I think we must remember that generative AI--and, of
    course, you know, has some positive aspects, there is no
    question. But generative AI is only a specific use case of this
    technology, and AI's applications are much broader than what
    has claimed the spotlight recently.
        We have seen how AI applied to vehicles is paving the way
    for the next generation of vehicles that will drive themselves.
    I tell you what, it is very, very exciting, particularly with
    someone with disabilities such as myself.
        These autonomous vehicles promise to greatly improve auto
    safety, which is the most important thing, and provide vast
    mobility benefits to every American, including those with
    disabilities.
        We have also seen how the technology holds the power to
    completely revolutionize American manufacturing and bolster our
    supply chain. By integrating AI and machine learning into
    supply chain systems, we can better predict constraints and
    find potential weak points, which can be used to prevent shocks
    that disrupt entire industries.
        Our committee has led on supply chain mapping and
    monitoring legislation before and empowering companies to
    deploy emerging technologies like AI to better understand our
    supply chains. It could help us protect against the next
    pandemic or the next major labor shortage, and that is huge.
        We need to send that legislation--and I know Representative
    Bucshon, Dr. Bucshon, had it last session, but he is no longer
    on the committee, unfortunately, but he will be helping us.
    But, anyway, we ought to send it to the President's desk as
    soon as possible so we can begin work on making America
    resilient.
        Industries can also utilize the power of AI in our
    manufacturing ecosystems to find where redundancies exist and
    reduce waste in the developmental pipeline. To bring this
    country back to the forefront of what made it great, we need to
    reduce unnecessary waste and optimize our building
    capabilities.
        We know the American people are the most innovative in the
    world. Our job here in Congress will be to provide a pathway
    for these innovators to succeed. This is exciting stuff, folks.
    America's global leadership in the 21st century will be
    contingent on our ability to promote emerging technologies and
    establishing a pathway to unleash them throughout American
    manufacturing.
        We have a great panel of witnesses today to share examples
    of how AI is actively being used in manufacturing and supply
    chains. I want to thank them for being here today, particularly
    with this bad weather. Thanks for coming in. I think the
    chairman did a great job in giving us an extra hour to get
    here, so we appreciate that very much. I didn't run Greek time
    today because I had that extra hour.
        So, in any case, I yield back.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Bilirakis follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. And before I yield back, though, I want to
    recognize my good friend, the ranking member, Ms. Schakowsky,
    for 5 minutes for her opening statement. You are recognized.

     OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. JAN SCHAKOWSKY, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
                  CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF ILLINOIS

        Ms. Schakowsky. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. And I just
    want to really welcome you back. I am wearing my Valentine's
    Day----
        Mr. Bilirakis. I appreciate that.
        Ms. Schakowsky [continuing]. For you. And I just wanted to
    say that we have been working on this committee for 12 years.
    We have really been partners here. And I want to say just at
    the beginning we have a lot of wonderful things that we have
    done for consumers.
        We have made life better for many children by protecting
    them. And, you know, we almost made it to the TICKET Act. So
    there are still things that are left undone that we want to do,
    and I know that we want to work on them together.
        So we are focusing today on the--we are focusing on AI, and
    we are focusing on manufacturing, and this is all very
    important. Let me just say that we saw, under President Biden,
    that, after many years of outsourcing, we saw a focus on
    providing wonderful things in the United States and a lot more
    building of things and doing of things here. But, you know, we
    have a long way to go to make sure that all the manufacturing
    is brought to the United States of America.
        And I wanted to talk a little bit about AI. You know, we
    have not done in this subcommittee a lot of work on holding
    tech accountable. And we made it partway to protect privacy. We
    have talked a lot about caring for children and protecting
    their privacy, but actually, when it comes to the dramatic
    improvements or increases you would say for tech companies, we
    really haven't done enough to count on them.
        What is really important, I believe, is that the tech
    companies right now have had a free rein from the beginning,
    and we have done so little to really make sure that consumers
    are considered all the time on what these tech companies are
    able to do.
        And I think we still are at the place that people feel that
    their most private information, their children's information,
    is not reined in. And I think it is time for us to take a look
    at what Big Tech is doing and if there are things that we might
    want to change and take them under control.
        So AI, I think what we have to make sure is that AI, which
    will certainly increase the volume of work that we do, that we
    are able to bring about in manufacturing, but what I am
    concerned about is that ordinary workers are also going to be
    considered when we talk about AI, and that they are not going
    to be--because there is going to be a lot more manufacturing
    that is done with AI, but what is going to happen to everyday
    Americans? So I think that has to be part of the consideration.
        I also just want to say that I am concerned about the
    Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. And I know that I am out
    of time, but I am very disappointed that that agency which
    protected consumers--did a great job, $20 billion returned to
    consumers because of what they do. So we need to do more of
    consumer protection, and I hope we will.
        And with that, I yield back. Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Ms. Schakowsky follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the gentlelady.
        And now I will recognize the chairman of the full
    committee, my good friend from the State of Kentucky, the great
    State of Kentucky, Mr. Guthrie. You are recognized for 5
    minutes for an opening statement, sir.

     OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BRETT GUTHRIE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
               CONGRESS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF KENTUCKY

        Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And as my friend the
    ranking member from Evanston, Illinois, may have on her car
    ``Land of Lincoln,'' February 12th in 1809, he was born in
    Hodgenville, Kentucky, in the great Commonwealth of Kentucky,
    so lived there until he was a young boy. So you can come visit.
    National Park has a great service there. So thanks.
        It is important to be here today. And I just want to say
    that my path to the middle class as a family, my family's path
    is right through the factory floor. My dad worked for a big
    automotive foundry and worked his way into management from the
    union floor to management.
        And then, when I was in high school, they announced they
    were getting out of the foundry business and closed the
    foundry. So I saw the disruption that happens when that
    happens. I saw my dad being--he moved up into management, kind
    of became the leader of saving the plant. So we were kind of at
    our kitchen table where people gathered to try to--how are we
    going to try to keep the plant open? And I saw grown men that
    had coached me in Little League crying because they don't know
    how they are going to feed their families.
        So things are disruptive. And what we have to remember is
    that--I will never forget this lesson--when people in authority
    make decisions, it does affect real people. And what my friend
    the ranking member talked about, and we have to factor that in.
    I like to say what we do in the people's House affects people
    in their homes. So we have to be mindful.
        But, having said that, we know that we have to be more
    productive and continue to be more productive, and AI gives us
    the opportunity to be more productive. We have to outpace our
    competitors, and particularly in Asia and China, and AI gives
    us a great opportunity to do so.
        And we have to remember that we have to improve the
    fundamental skills of the people that work in manufacturing so
    they can take advantage of AI to become more productive. As AI
    gets more involved in the manufacturing process, people who
    know how to program it, people who know how to fix it and
    repair it and do all of the things make far more money than
    people who just operate.
        And that is what we need to focus on, and I think it will
    lift everybody--a more productive society is more beneficial
    for everyone, so we need to look and focus in on that. And I do
    believe by utilizing AI, the U.S. can return to its rich
    history of global leadership in manufacturing.
        So I appreciate this hearing. This is a subcommittee that
    is dear to me since I worked in--my dad, after the plant
    closed, started his own business, and I worked with my
    brothers. And some of the men who had coached me in Little
    League moved to Kentucky to work together and build a
    successful foundry.
        So this is near and dear to my heart, because I know that
    it is the pathway for a lot of families to the middle of the
    middle class.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Guthrie follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Guthrie. And I will yield the remainder of my time to
    the vice chair, Mr. Fulcher from Idaho.

      OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. RUSS FULCHER, A REPRESENTATIVE IN
                    CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF IDAHO

        Mr. Fulcher. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to you
    and to the subcommittee chair for the honor to serve here. It
    is truly an honor, and I am thankful for that.
        We were talking about President Lincoln, and most people
    don't realize there is also a connection to Idaho with
    President Lincoln. It was Abraham Lincoln who established the
    Idaho Territory in 1863, and that was the precursor to our
    statehood in 1890. So there is an honored connection there.
        Mr. Chairman, manufacturing is the core of our economy. It
    contributes to more applications, is more sophisticated, and
    operates in a highly competitive environment with countries
    like China. China's manufacturing value-add and contribution to
    global GDP continues to outpace the United States', and China
    produces more goods than the U.S. in 9 of the top 11
    manufacturing industries. But the U.S. could outcompete and
    outperform China or any other country if we fully utilized our
    technologies, resources, and personnel.
        For example, in my home State of Idaho, global food
    manufacturers locate there because of our agricultural
    resources. And we have other manufacturers fulfilling contracts
    on major weapon systems, like the F-35 aircraft. We have major
    semiconductor producers developing chips for the next
    generation of mobile logic and industrial computing needs.
        But, in all these cases, innovation and production,
    identification of defects, ordering parts for machines before
    they fail, helping workers improve safety and productivity are
    all crucial. Speaking for myself and I think for most of my
    other colleagues here, we need to learn how AI can help improve
    the production process, empowering the line worker to catch
    defects, innovate processes, and improve safety.
        We need to know how AI can help predict machine failures
    better to prevent production interruptions. We need to
    understand how to provide for data sharing for these needs
    while ensuring privacy among our end users.
        And, finally, we need to find ways for the Federal
    Government to properly optimize its position to enable
    manufacturers to recruit, train, and reskill new and existing
    people. That is our challenge, but it needs to be in the
    appropriate fashion.
        Thank you, and I yield back.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Fulcher follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the vice chairman. I look forward to
    working with you, sir.
        Next, we have the ranking member of the full committee, Mr.
    Pallone, a good friend of mine from the great State of New
    Jersey.
        You are recognized for 5 minutes for your opening
    statement, sir.

    OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. FRANK PALLONE, Jr., A REPRESENTATIVE
                IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY

        Mr. Pallone. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        I want to thank the witnesses for taking the time to
    testify this morning.
        But, to the Republican majority, I want to express extreme
    frustration that we are not addressing the fact that the Trump
    administration has given billionaire Elon Musk and his young,
    anonymous henchmen unfettered access to government systems
    containing vast amounts of incredibly sensitive personal data
    about all Americans.
        Musk and his team have access to all the data of the
    Department of Health and Human Services and the Centers for
    Medicare and Medicaid Services, and that means that they can
    access and may be able to delete, modify, and transfer for
    their own purposes detailed healthcare information about tens
    of millions of Americans, including virtually all of our
    Nation's seniors.
        And they also have access to Treasury Department data that
    includes Social Security numbers, tax returns, payment
    information, all tied to names, addresses, phone numbers, and
    email addresses.
        And, for decades, we have had strong privacy and data
    protection laws in place that govern access to these government
    records to protect Americans' privacy and the security of their
    personal information. But, with the full support of President
    Trump and House Republicans, Musk and his minions have ignored
    those protections, and civil servants attempting to protect
    Americans' data from Musk's unauthorized access have been
    fired.
        If a foreign adversary or a domestic hacking group got
    access to any one of these government systems containing
    Americans' sensitive personal information, we would consider it
    a major data breach, a privacy disaster, and a consequential
    national security incident.
        And State's attorneys general, public interest
    organizations, and the courts are doing their part to put a
    stop to the Trump administration's decision to hand over
    Americans' most sensitive data to the richest man in the world
    and his cronies.
        But Congress and this subcommittee in particular should be
    using all of the tools at our disposal to protect Americans'
    privacy. Unfortunately, instead of expressing outrage or
    holding hearings and demanding accountability for Musk stealing
    Americans' personal information, my Republican colleagues have
    chosen silence. And so I urge my Republican colleagues to raise
    their voices to protect Americans' personal health and
    financial data and all of the other sensitive personal data
    that is now in the hands of Elon Musk and his henchmen.
        Now, turning to today's hearing, Mr. Chairman, a strong and
    technologically advanced manufacturing base creates a healthy
    economy that uplifts hardworking middle-class Americans, lowers
    the cost of American-made goods, and bolsters our national
    security and promotes global leadership.
        And yet, in just the first few weeks of the Trump
    administration, Republicans have turned their back on American
    families by attempting to illegally steal resources being put
    to work to grow and modernize the manufacturing sector. The
    CHIPS and Science Act made a transformative $52 billion
    investment to develop the advanced infrastructure and workforce
    needed to build critical semiconductors here in America. And
    this will reduce the cost of American-made semiconductors and
    end our dangerous dependence on foreign manufacturers.
        The Inflation Reduction Act recharged our domestic energy
    sector by providing $369 billion to lower energy bills for
    American families and grow our economy so we can lead the
    global clean energy transition.
        And Republicans say they want to foster innovation and beat
    China, support American workers, and lower costs. Yet they are
    choosing to look the other way as President Trump steals money
    from the American people, businesses, and communities. American
    companies are being put at a disadvantage by President Trump's
    constant chaos. It is simply not realistic to expect American
    manufacturers, especially small- and medium-size companies, to
    confidently make investments in their future when they are at
    risk of having to confront a senseless trade war or having
    Federal funding they rely on illegally stripped away.
        This is not a recipe for success. In my opinion, if
    Republicans are actually interested in securing American
    leadership in manufacturing and the next generation of
    technologies, they should work with us to defend the programs
    that are bolstering American manufacturing and the dedicated
    civil servants who work tirelessly to implement them.
        So it is time for Republicans to stand up to the senseless
    Trump chaos that threatens American workers and small
    businesses and our economy.
        And, with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Pallone follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. Well, I guess I thank the gentleman. Thank
    you very much. But the honeymoon is over.
        But I will say this. I think. respectfully, because he is a
    great guy and a good friend: I think the President is doing
    exactly what he said he was going to do, and so far, so good.
    So, anyway, let's get on to it.
        Our witnesses today are Mr. Jason Oxman, president and CEO
    of Information Technology Industry Council; and we have Dr.
    Elisabeth B. Reynolds, Professor of Practice at MIT; and then
    we have Mr. Jeff Kinder, executive vice president, Product
    Development and Manufacturing Solutions, Autodesk; Ms. Barbara
    Humpton, the president and CEO of Siemens Corporation.
        I want to welcome all of you, and thank you very much for
    your patience this morning. And this is going to be a great
    hearing. We are going to learn so much.
        So I want to recognize Mr. Oxman. You are recognized, sir,
    for 5 minutes, please.

       STATEMENTS OF JASON OXMAN, PRESIDENT AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE
    OFFICER, INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY INDUSTRY COUNCIL; ELISABETH B.
       REYNOLDS, Ph.D., PROFESSOR OF THE PRACTICE, MASSACHUSETTS
    INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY; JEFF KINDER, EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT,
    PRODUCT DEVELOPMENT AND MANUFACTURING SOLUTIONS, AUTODESK; AND
    BARBARA HUMPTON, PRESIDENT AND CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, SIEMENS
                              CORPORATION

                        STATEMENT OF JASON OXMAN

        Mr. Oxman. Thank you, Chairman Bilirakis and Ranking Member
    Schakowsky. It is an honor to be here with you at the first
    hearing of the 119th of this subcommittee.
        I am Jason Oxman, president and CEO of the Information
    Technology Industry Council, or ITI. Thank you for inviting me
    to testify today in a period of remarkable and dynamic change
    in the U.S. economy and in global competition for artificial
    intelligence.
        Technology is key to our Nation's continued growth. And
    manufacturing is the economic lifeblood of the communities that
    this subcommittee's members represent, and manufacturing
    increasingly is powered by artificial intelligence. AI, as with
    all technology, requires digital innovation, but it also
    requires hardware, networks, infrastructure, energy. In other
    words, AI requires manufacturing innovation.
        As the trade association of the technology industry, ITI
    represents the entire AI ecosystem, including Siemens here
    today and other global innovators that are investing in AI to
    drive manufacturing and to solve industry's biggest challenges.
    Indeed, ITI, as a trade association, in its 109-year history
    has represented the largest manufacturers in the world.
        Now, today ITI member companies manufacture and build the
    digital infrastructure that powers the AI economy, including AI
    models and software, memory, semiconductors, networking
    equipment and servers, cooling systems, infrastructure, power,
    data centers, and much more.
        Now, for the manufacturing sector, AI means increased
    efficiency, productivity, safety, and innovation. For example,
    AI in manufacturing today includes predictive maintenance,
    where AI can analyze in real time, using sensor data, the
    manufacturing equipment that may need predictive maintenance
    and also analyze predictive equipment failure; supply chain
    management, where AI can optimize operations by analyzing data
    from multiple sources, including demand forecasts, inventory
    levels, and logistical constraints; and digital twinning, an
    AI-powered digital representation of physical assets or a
    process that can allow virtual planning in advance of actual
    manufacturing.
        Now, these innovations and investments, among others, will
    greatly benefit the manufacturing sector and the U.S. in
    maintaining its competitive edge. We appreciate that this
    committee is focused on harnessing U.S. opportunities for
    investment in AI to the benefit of the U.S. economy and job
    creation, and we also appreciate that the new Trump
    administration is focused on advancing U.S. AI leadership
    internationally, as the Vice President just returns from the
    Paris AI Summit.
        Now, reaching these clear goals will require close
    collaboration between the private sector and government. And I
    would like to offer the committee five specific recommendations
    on areas where we can ensure a bright future for AI
    manufacturing in the U.S.: First, create an enabling
    environment for innovation to allow manufacturers to realize
    the full benefits of AI through competitive tax measures, such
    as the advanced manufacturing investment credit and restoring
    the immediate deduction of R&D expenses; second, accelerate the
    adoption of AI in manufacturing by developing a skilled AI
    workforce that can leverage these new capabilities and create
    new jobs; third, maintain a data policy environment that
    enables private sector innovation by increasing access to
    Federal datasets, by unlocking the data necessary to create new
    AI solutions for manufacturers; fourth, continue public and
    private partnerships that spur private-sector investment in AI
    and manufacturing, such as supply chain security through the
    Promoting Resilient Supply Chains Act, a bipartisan bill that
    originated in this subcommittee; and, fifth, remove barriers to
    U.S. manufacturers' ability to compete in global markets by
    advancing digital trade agreements and by revisiting hastily
    drafted policies from the prior administration, like the AI
    Diffusion Rule.
        We see increasing global competition for AI development and
    deployment. For America to win, we must get these policies
    right. We are keen to work with you to unleash the power of AI
    to expand domestic manufacturing, to ensure that the United
    States builds on its competitive lead in AI, and enable AI to
    transform all sectors of the economy and generate economic
    growth and job opportunities that benefit manufacturers,
    workers, and consumers.
        Thank you again for the opportunity to be here today, and I
    look forward to your questions.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Oxman follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much.
        Now I will recognize Dr. Reynolds. You are recognized for 5
    minutes, and we appreciate you being here.

               STATEMENT OF ELISABETH B. REYNOLDS, Ph.D.

        Dr. Reynolds. Good morning and thank you, Chairman
    Bilirakis, Ranking Member Schakowsky, Chairman Guthrie, Ranking
    Member Pallone, and members of the subcommittee. It is an honor
    to be here with you this morning and speak about a topic that
    is of the utmost importance to the country's national and
    economic security.
        My name is Elisabeth Reynolds. I am a professor of practice
    at MIT and former special assistant to the president for
    manufacturing and economic development in the National Economic
    Council in 2021 and 2022.
        I am also originally from Manchester, New Hampshire, home
    of the Amoskeag Mills, the largest textile mills in the world
    at one point and now the center of global research on
    regenerative medicine.
        Rebuilding the U.S. industrial base using AI and advanced
    manufacturing technologies is an urgent priority. We are in the
    midst of the next industrial revolution, one where the U.S. has
    the opportunity to catch up and rebuild its manufacturing
    capacity and capabilities.
        The U.S. has made significant gains in the past few years
    in rebuilding these capabilities as a result of largely
    bipartisan government investments in areas critical to the
    country's industrial base: semiconductors, critical minerals,
    defense, and energy infrastructure.
        Recent legislation has led to several positive
    developments: A tripling of manufacturing construction spending
    since 2021; $450 billion of private-sector investments in
    semiconductor production across over 40 facilities; over $80
    billion of private sector investment in clean energy-related
    production across over 200 manufacturing facilities, including
    over $5 billion invested in each of Georgia, Michigan,
    Tennessee, North Carolina, and Ohio.
        These energy investments in particular are essential to
    ensuring energy security, particularly when the rise of AI and
    data centers will only increase energy demand. The leverage of
    these public dollars is significant. Roughly between four to
    seven private dollars invested for every Federal dollar spent.
        All of these steps underscore there is an important role
    for the Government to play in catalyzing economic growth,
    prosperity, and innovation. My written testimony has a complete
    list of my recommendations, but I am going to focus on several
    areas right now.
        First, we need to focus on increasing adoption of new
    technology by small and medium-size enterprises, SMEs, to
    increase productivity and wages. U.S. manufacturers are behind
    in technology adoption. Many SMEs, the backbone of our
    industrial base, are hesitant to change existing manufacturing
    processes, despite the return on investment associated with
    digital technologies that can increase both productivity and
    wages.
        Several steps could be taken to encourage adoption of AI
    and advanced manufacturing, including providing Federal
    matching funds to State-led programs that offer incentives,
    like programs in Indiana, Massachusetts, and Michigan;
    incenting large manufacturers that have contracts with the
    Federal Government to support AI adoption and digitalization in
    their suppliers; and modernizing the manufacturing extension
    partnership to work with SMEs to focus on promoting lean
    principals while also supporting digitalization.
        Two, we need to increase investment in manufacturing
    workforce training and education. It is estimated the U.S.
    could face a shortage of nearly 2 million manufacturing workers
    by 2033. We must both upskill current workers with digital
    skills as well as attract a new generation into the sector. AI
    can play a positive role in this process by augmenting the
    skills of frontline manufacturing workers and democratizing the
    technology so workers are part of continuous improvement. The
    process can lead to improving manufacturing wages, which today,
    on average, are less than the average all-industry hourly wages
    for nonsupervisory workers. Several steps also can be taken
    here, including creating robust preapprenticeship and
    apprenticeship programs, identifying the most successful
    training programs in the country, encouraging 4-year
    institutions of higher education to partner with community
    colleges to advance digital skills, and increasing the number
    of women working in manufacturing, who currently represent
    about 30 percent of the manufacturing workforce.
        Three, we need to accelerate innovation and scale up. The
    U.S. is the envy of the world and is renowned as the startup
    Nation, but we must now become the scaleup Nation. Because of
    their often large capital requirements and longer time
    horizons, manufacturing startups have challenges attracting
    growth capital from investors, who prefer asset-light
    investments. We must develop financing models that are helping
    with the missing middle capital gaps. This could include
    Federal procurement, such as advanced market commitments,
    providing tax incentives for startups that are building their
    first manufacturing facility, exploring the role of the Federal
    Industrial Finance Corporation that could operate like the
    Development Finance Corporation, and expanding the role of
    Manufacturing USA Institutes.
        Fourth, we must invest in the research and development and
    deployment of advanced manufacturing technologies.
    Historically, U.S. Federal R&D institutions have underinvested
    in advanced manufacturing processes. Additional RD&D funding is
    required in emerging advanced manufacturing technologies to
    help the U.S. stay ahead in such areas as biomanufacturing,
    quantum, energy, defense, critical minerals, robotics and
    additive manufacturing.
        Through investments in scientific and engineering
    breakthroughs, the U.S. can leapfrog current standard
    manufacturing processes and lead the world in advanced
    manufacturing.
        In conclusion, I will thank the committee for the
    opportunity to speak, and I hope that my remarks have
    underscored the importance of U.S. advanced manufacturing
    agenda to the country and the urgency with which we must
    address these issues. Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Dr. Reynolds follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Doctor. Appreciate it very much.
        Now, Mr. Kinder, you are recognized for 5 minutes for your
    opening statement.

                        STATEMENT OF JEFF KINDER

        Mr. Kinder. Thank you, Chairman Bilirakis, Ranking Member
    Schakowsky, for holding a hearing on this important, timely
    topic and inviting me to testify today.
        My name is Jeff Kinder, and I oversee design and
    manufacturing at Autodesk. Autodesk is an American company that
    designs and makes software, spanning product design and
    manufacturing, architecture engineering and construction, and
    media and entertainment.
        I am also proud to have grown up in Indiana, the State
    where President Lincoln, by the way, spent his formative
    teenage years. I grew up in a family of factory workers. I
    studied engineering in college on an ROTC scholarship and then
    became an officer in the U.S. Navy.
        Following my service, I went on to lead digital
    transformations for several technology companies. This is a
    dynamic time in the manufacturing industry. We face supply
    chain disruptions, skilled labor shortages, inflation, and a
    changing geopolitical and economic landscape, yet the demand
    for products isn't slowing down.
        Autodesk believes the U.S. is poised for growth in
    manufacturing. Reshoring initiatives and a reimagining of
    supply chains have led to a surge in new factory starts. But
    the manufacturing industry has a capacity challenge to meet
    this growth opportunity.
        To increase our capacity, to innovate, and to compete on a
    global scale, we need new technologies such as AI.
    Manufacturers are ready, and it is in our national interest to
    help. And while cutting-edge technologies have historically
    advantaged larger manufacturers, we are democratizing access by
    offering manufacturers of all sizes the same advanced
    capabilities at a fraction of the cost. We believe empowering
    small and medium-size manufacturers with technology like AI is
    key to unleashing a renaissance in American manufacturing.
        Autodesk began investing in AI research more than 10 years
    ago. We are the world's leading publisher of peer-reviewed
    original research on AI models trained for computer-aided
    design, and we are focused on developing pragmatic AI
    capabilities that help product designers and manufacturers do
    their work more productively.
        We have three primary areas of focus with AI: First,
    augmenting creative exploration. Take, for example, our work
    with Stewart-Haas racing team. Using AI-enabled design,
    Stewart-Haas were able to reduce the weight in the brake pedal
    of Cole Custer's number 41 Mustang, resulting in a reduction of
    the pedal that was 32 percent lighter and 50 percent stiffer,
    reducing weight without sacrificing safety.
        Our second area of focus is reducing repetitive and tedious
    tasks. Manufacturers design products in 3D, but they still need
    to translate those to 2D for documentation. Skilled engineers
    spend as much as 40 percent of their time doing this manually.
    Now, with the click of a button, Autodesk AI creates those 2D
    drawings automatically, freeing up time for more creative and
    more productive work.
        Our third area of focus is accelerating time to production.
    Computer numerical control, or CNC machines, are automated
    manufacturing machines that perform precise and complex
    operations. Programming code for these machines can take hours
    or even days.
        By using AI to generate machining strategies, we save
    manufacturers hundreds of production hours a year. Autodesk is
    also dedicated to equipping educators, students, and workers
    with the tools and curricula they need to learn the
    manufacturing skills of the future.
        We provide free access to most of Autodesk's portfolio of
    professional software. We also partner with institutions like
    the University of Florida, where we are establishing the
    world's first-ever industrialized construction program,
    bringing manufacturing methods to construction.
        My testimony offers recommendations for the committee to
    consider on how to foster AI in manufacturing. This includes
    bringing together tech companies and manufacturers to develop
    national strategies that elevate the importance of AI in
    manufacturing, providing tax credits and access to low-cost
    capital to small and medium-size manufacturers, and digital
    skills training for the manufacturing workforce.
        We have a tremendous opportunity to realize our collective
    mission to revitalize American manufacturing. Embracing AI will
    increase innovation and productivity, strengthen the
    competitiveness of American manufacturing, and fuel long-term
    economic growth and prosperity. Autodesk is eager to help you
    realize this vision.
        Thank you, and I look forward to answering your questions.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Kinder follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you so very much.
        Now I will recognize Ms. Humpton. You are recognized for 5
    minutes for your statement.

                      STATEMENT OF BARBARA HUMPTON

        Ms. Humpton. Chairmen Guthrie and Bilirakis, Ranking
    Members Pallone and Schakowsky, and to all of the members of
    the committee, thank you for the invitation to be here.
        I serve as president and CEO of Siemens USA. Siemens is a
    leading technology company pioneering a new industrial tech
    sector. We were founded during Abraham Lincoln's lifetime, I
    will note, and have been building our American business for
    more than 160 years.
        Today, the U.S. is our largest market. We have more than
    45,000 people and 12,000 suppliers nationwide. In recent years,
    we have invested more than $650 million, expanding our own U.S.
    manufacturing plants.
        Since 2007, Siemens has invested $10 billion in U.S.
    software companies to strengthen our digital capabilities, and
    we recently acquired Michigan-based Altair Engineering, adding
    another $10 billion of investment in U.S. software. We did this
    to make American industry more state of the art and
    competitive. We did this to help regrow domestic manufacturing,
    which brings us to today.
        Siemens is a world leader in industrial AI. This is
    different than consumer AI. Industrial AI uses controlled data
    from the manufacturing environment to help manufacturers create
    business value. Think better products, more efficient
    operations, a more prepared workforce. Think about a safer
    automotive industry.
        Using industrial AI, Siemens built a predictive maintenance
    model for a major automotive OEM. Instead of manually analyzing
    data from 10,000 machines, the company uses AI to help workers
    detect machine failures up to 6 months in advance. Or what
    about a more innovative aerospace industry? Consider startup
    JetZero. With our AI-enabled software, JetZero is using real-
    time data and virtual simulations to design the next generation
    of ultraefficient commercial aircraft. And when their first
    factory opens, Siemens Industrial AI will optimize their
    operations, electrifying and automating the manufacturing
    process.
        This is just the beginning. Industrial AI is transforming
    construction for commercial and residential buildings. It is
    addressing national energy challenges by managing electricity
    use and data centers. It is improving energy efficiency in
    semiconductor factories to help expand American chip
    production.
        Now, of course, technological leaps like this raise
    questions for workers. Will technology replace people? No.
    Industrial AI expands what is humanly possible. It will create
    more opportunities for workers at all stages of their career.
    This is even more true with the introduction of generative AI.
        GenAI is making technologies more intuitive, letting
    workers speak to machines using natural language instead of
    code. Siemens has led the industry in this area, deploying the
    first GenAI-powered assistant. We call it an industrial
    copilot. What it does is improve worker productivity by
    managing repetitive tasks. It helps people start manufacturing
    careers without specialized skills.
        We are going to need this to help fill more of America's
    500,000 open positions in manufacturing. We continue to
    encourage government to guide AI development in a way that
    balances innovation and safety.
        Like this committee, at Siemens we recognize the advantage
    that industrial AI leadership will bring to American
    manufacturing. Industrial AI will enable all companies, from
    startups to small and medium enterprises to industrial giants,
    to thrive in this new era of American manufacturing.
        I will finish with a quick example of how industrial AI is
    supercharging the growth of U.S. manufacturing. In 3 weeks,
    Siemens will celebrate the opening of a new manufacturing
    facility in Fort Worth, Texas.
        To build the factory, we used industrial AI to develop a
    digital twin of the factory's product as well as its production
    lines. To staff the facility, we created 480 new jobs, with
    another 320 to come next year. To train workers, we recruited
    former high school teachers to develop a program for people
    with no manufacturing experience.
        And, when that facility starts operations, it will produce
    the electrical components that power American data centers, the
    very foundation of AI. Fort Worth shows what industrial AI can
    do for U.S. manufacturing. With these technologies, we can
    boost economic growth, create jobs, empower innovation, and
    secure the next generation of American industrial leadership.
        Thank you, and I look forward to your questions.
        [The prepared statement of Ms. Humpton follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much. Very informative. I
    thank all of you for your testimony.
        And now I will recognize myself for 5 minutes for
    questioning.
        So we will start with Ms. Humpton. AI has already enveloped
    itself into the manufacturing ecosystem, and it is creating
    more efficient systems to build here in America. We need to do
    more to encourage this type of growth here at home.
        As I mentioned in my opening statement, AI and its
    applications are incredibly broad and can't let generative AI
    control how the world sees AI in its entirety. So I am glad you
    gave that example, though. That is good.
        What is important to view AI in manufacturing in a
    different lens than generative AI?
        Ms. Humpton. Mr. Chairman, thank you for the question. And
    industrial AI is really quite different from consumer AI. Let's
    think first about the data that is used. In generative AI in
    the consumer applications, we have seen the use of large swaths
    of data from many, many sources.
        In a manufacturing environment, what we are typically doing
    is gathering data from multiple sensors in a very controlled
    environment, in fact, so controlled that many manufacturers
    don't want that data shared with anyone. This is a competitive
    advantage they have, being able to own and manage their own
    data.
        That is why they trust a company like ours. They trust
    Siemens to build the AI tools that will operate in a secure
    environment using what we have learned over decades with
    machine learning, with deep network, neural networks, to be
    able to take advantage of that data and draw conclusions that
    would literally be impossible for any one of us to do if we
    were standing on that floor.
        I mentioned the automotive manufacturer. Imagine the
    question of, how do we ensure the quality of doors as they are
    coming off a production line? Well, it is really difficult to
    do with the human eye, but with a sensor, with a sensor and
    machine learning, we are able to define perfect, what does
    perfect look like, and then compare every door that is produced
    to that standard, identifying defects earlier and taking action
    to correct the manufacturing process.
        The difference with industrial AI is the data it operates
    on, the environment in which it is used, and the tools that are
    applied. Trust will be the foundation of our future work in
    this area.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much. Excellent.
        Mr. Oxman, the National Association of Manufacturers found
    that, after deploying AI in their manufacturing operations, 72
    percent reported reduced costs, improved operational
    efficiency, 51 percent reported improved operational visibility
    and responsiveness, and 41 percent reported improved process
    optimization and control. These statistics show just how
    beneficial AI can be in the manufacturing sector.
        Can you provide examples of use cases that may be
    attributed to these statistics, please?
        Mr. Oxman. Thanks, Mr. Chairman. It is not surprising to
    hear those statistics that you cited about the importance of AI
    to manufacturers. Just to give one example from across the ITI
    membership: Ericsson, one of our member companies that is the
    reason that we have the robust mobile networks that we have in
    the United States.
        Ericsson has a 5G smart factory in Texas. And what they
    have done with that smart factory, to your point about the
    importance of AI-enabled manufacturing, is they use advanced
    analytics for machine learning. And they do predictive
    maintenance, as Ms. Humpton was talking about. They deploy
    autonomous robots to help with the manufacturing process,
    particularly areas that would be too dangerous for human
    beings. They do process automation. They do demand prediction.
        So a huge number of what I will call intelligent automation
    tools that are made possible by AI. They don't replace humans,
    but they take areas where human error could be dangerous or
    could be inefficient, and they make humans better in their
    deployment.
        And the stats are remarkable: 120 percent improvement in
    output per employee and a 65 percent reduction in manual
    material handling at that Ericsson USA 5G smart factory in
    Texas.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much.
        Mr. Kinder, whenever we talk about the greater adoption of
    sophisticated technologies, I think it is equally critical to
    talk about protecting these systems. Can you walk us through
    how Autodesk addresses this question of cybersecurity for AI
    manufacturing?
        Mr. Kinder. Sure. Thank you for your question, Chairman.
        Cybersecurity is paramount. And, as a company, we
    prioritize this, and we work continually to evolve our
    processes to mitigate any vulnerabilities. Our approach is--and
    our chief trust officer is fond of saying this: Build secure,
    run secure, and stay secure. And that is integral to
    engendering customer trust.
        And what we mean is, ``build secure'' is using secure
    methods in software development right from the beginning, ``run
    secure'' is implementing security controls across the platform,
    like identity and access management, encryption, and ``stay
    secure'' is continually assessing the products for
    vulnerabilities and any compromises.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much.
        And I will yield back the rest of my time. I don't have any
    left. But, in any case, we will have the ranking member. You
    are recognized for your questioning, 5 minutes of questioning,
    please.
        Ms. Schakowsky. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        I have two questions for you, Dr. Reynolds. One is,
    yesterday I met with a manufacturing company, but they also are
    engaged in getting young people more engaged in manufacturing.
    So I asked them, so how many of those students that are signing
    up and want to do this, how many are women? And they said,
    ``Well, I know there is at least 13 percent or something.'' It
    was a low number.
        And you had mentioned trying to engage more women in
    manufacturing. I am just wondering if just the name
    ``manufacturing'' sounds like a guy. And how can we get more--
    certainly, there is a lot of room for women. What are you doing
    to make that happen?
        Dr. Reynolds. Thank you very much for that question. And it
    is very important, particularly given the shortage of workers
    we have just been talking about, half a million currently and
    close to 2 million within 10 years. We need to bring everybody
    into the manufacturing workforce, including women, who
    represent about 30 percent of the workforce today, which is
    underrepresented, given that they are 46 percent of the total
    workforce in the country.
        So I think there are a number of things that we could be
    doing. The first point is to say that the kind of manufacturing
    we are talking about now with AI and automation and all of the
    developments we are talking about really should change the view
    of manufacturing in this country.
        Historically, we think of it as dirty, dull, physically
    laborious. That is completely gone now in the 21st century. And
    I think that will be helpful in terms of attracting the next
    generation into manufacturing, particularly also new
    technology. This next generation is much more interested in
    working with advanced technologies than working with older
    industrial systems.
        Right now, we know that women who are working in
    manufacturing earn, on average, 16 percent more than the median
    income for women nationally. So this is attractive from a wage
    point of view.
        It may be less attractive from a flexibility point of view,
    and that is one area that I think we could hopefully see
    manufacturers work toward attracting more women into the field
    is whether, given childcare responsibilities, et cetera, can we
    see more flexibility in the workweek? But we really need to get
    the next generation in, particularly starting in high school.
        Ms. Schakowsky. I hope so. I wanted to also mention I am
    concerned about manufacturing jobs and when wondering how AI is
    going to fit into this, is there some reason to worry for
    everyday workers that their jobs will begin to disappear
    because of AI, a different way to get the technology out?
        Dr. Reynolds. So I think it is always important to look at
    the impact of technology on work and on workers, because we
    know that technology has had an effect on increasing inequality
    in this country and hollowing out a lot of our middle-class
    jobs, because it replaces workers.
        The important way to address that is, when we use
    technology to enhance and augment workers, how do we make the
    technology a tool for workers so that they themselves can
    benefit from its use? That has often been tracked by the level
    of education that jobs have and the level of routine operations
    that we have in jobs.
        The important opportunity with AI is that, while it may
    reduce waste and get rid of some of the automated work that is
    quite tedious, it does have a chance to really augment the
    skills of our workers and particularly lower-skilled, lower-
    educated workers, who can use AI, as described earlier, as a
    copilot, where it is actually helping guide workers who don't
    necessarily have the skills.
        And this is the opportunity for digitalizing our workforce.
    And I think we have to look and work very hard to make sure
    that AI is the tool and provides the opportunity right now for
    bringing workers who have actually perhaps less education, less
    skills, into career paths and into promising, well-paying jobs.
        Ms. Schakowsky. Thank you for that, because I think it is
    really important that we consider that not only really highly
    educated people but the many people who are right now involved
    in technology that there is going to be a place for them and
    not just for the most educated and, it turns out, the
    wealthiest either. So thank you.
        And I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the gentlelady.
        I now recognize the vice chair of the full committee, Vice
    Chairman Fulcher. Thank you. You are recognized for 5 minutes.
        Mr. Fulcher. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Ms. Humpton, most of my private-sector life was in the
    semiconductor industry with Micron Technology, and at the
    time--I am dating myself here--but Siemens AG was a competitor
    in the memory component, D-RAM, business, and so--I know that
    is not your focus. I am not even sure that they are in that
    anymore, because it was years ago.
        But you were talking about your involvement with generative
    AI--and I have been out of this for a while--and you mentioned
    about the potential to--the use of these copilots in speaking
    to machines and whatnot.
        Where is this going to go? I mean, are we talking about
    when you are speaking to machines? Is this mirroring human
    interaction? Just talk a little bit more about this. Where is
    this going?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you so much, Vice Chairman, and I want
    to first comment, we did sell the semiconductor business. It
    became Infineon.
        But today we have a fantastic EDA component so we are using
    exactly these technologies to help semiconductor manufacturers
    work their design and plan out their factories. So it is an
    exciting time for the semiconductor industry.
        But the question you ask really ties to the conversation we
    have just had about workforce. Where is this going? What I am
    excited about is that, for the first time, we have a technology
    that actually comes to the people instead of forcing them to go
    to school, learn more, et cetera.
        And I am going to tell you just my personal experience with
    this. I went to a recent tech show, and my team was there
    showing what they are doing with industrial AI.
        And they said, for instance, the programming of robots for
    a factory floor, they said this would typically be done by an
    individual who would get on a bicycle and ride along the floor
    because you had to go to each machine, you had to know the
    programming language.
        Instead, I stood in front of a laptop and texted in,
    ``Please sort the following items by size.'' The computer
    generated the code, and the machinery was then commanded to do
    the sorting.
        The team looked at me and said, ``By the way, do you enjoy
    writing comments for the code that you have to write?'' It is
    just one of--it is drudgery. And I said, ``Oh, I hate that.''
        They said, ``Well, press this button,'' and 5 seconds
    later, I had all of the commentary that was required to go with
    that code.
        I am telling you, this is going to be such a cool era
    because, yes, we can bring young people in. If you can play a
    video game, you will be able to----
        Mr. Fulcher. So is verbal interaction next?
        Ms. Humpton. Verbal interaction is already here. Verbal
    interaction is already here. I encourage anyone who would like
    to visit us at the Hanover Fair that is coming up next month,
    we will be demonstrating much of this technology right here,
    right now.
        So I think we have the opportunity to see it and be able to
    envision the future today.
        Mr. Fulcher. Thank you for that.
        Mr. Oxman, I didn't know about the word ``reskilling''
    until I was going through some of this testimony, and I would
    like to flesh out your thoughts on the reskilling component
    here.
        We have got a lot of middle-aged workers, we have got older
    workers that change is always a challenge, and trying to
    recruit young people at the same time.
        Talk about recommendations for reskilling, and understand
    that you are talking to a congressional panel here, so in the
    sense of--talk about recommendations for reskilling, and what
    might be the proper role of the Federal Government in that
    effort?
        Mr. Oxman. It is a great question, and I do think that the
    role of the Federal Government is to partner with industry to
    make sure that we are working on STEM education and reskilling
    wherever it can benefit the workforce.
        Mr. Fulcher. Keeping in mind, we don't want to be where we
    are going to hinder, but----
        Mr. Oxman. Absolutely.
        Mr. Fulcher [continuing]. Let industry be industry, but--go
    ahead, I am sorry.
        Mr. Oxman. No, that is absolutely right. You know, for
    example, in Boise, where ITI member company Applied Materials
    is very active, they are working in partnership with local
    community colleges on reskilling, to train the workforce that
    is necessary.
        Meta is currently investing in an $800 million data center
    in your district, or adjacent to your district, and needs the
    workers for that data center.
        So the kind of public-private partnership I am talking
    about is the Government making sure that local educational
    institutions have the resources they need and the training
    programs they need, and making sure that workers have the
    opportunities they need to get the skills necessary to get the
    jobs of tomorrow.
        As Ms. Humpton mentioned, 500,000 open jobs in the
    technology industry. We need to find those workers with the
    skills that they have and fill those positions.
        Mr. Fulcher. Great. Thank you for that.
        Mr. Chairman, I do have a question for Mr. Kinder on
    interoperability standards, but I know I am out of time, so----
        Mr. Bilirakis. Go ahead.
        Mr. Fulcher. So, Mr. Kinder, briefly, please, it sounds
    like, when you are talking interoperability standards, it
    sounds like you are talking about the sharing of data, having
    the ability to adapt new technologies to improve productivity
    in the overall manufacturing process.
        Do I read you correctly on that? Is that your intent with
    interoperability standards?
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you for the question, Vice Chairman. Yes,
    it is. The interoperability of data, as you heard in all of our
    testimony, data is critical for training AI models. With
    interoperability across different software applications, we
    will have more data, and it will be smarter on how the whole
    system operates.
        Mr. Fulcher. Great. Thank you very much.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The gentleman yields back.
        Now I recognize the gentlelady from the great State of
    Florida, from the great city of Tampa.
        Ms. Castor. Thank you.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Representative Castor has been--we have
    worked on several issues together on this subcommittee. I have
    enjoyed working with you. Thank you.
        Ms. Castor. Yeah, Chairman Bilirakis. It has been a
    pleasure working with you. Congratulations on leading the
    subcommittee again.
        Thank you for recognizing Chris, your aide. I am sorry to
    see him go. He was instrumental in helping us get out of the
    committee the Kids Online Safety Act and the Kids Online
    Privacy Protection Act.
        Unfortunately, they didn't get across the finish line.
        Mr. Bilirakis. We are going to do it this year.
        Ms. Castor. That is good to hear your commitment on that.
        Mr. Bilirakis. We are going to get it done this year. Top
    priority.
        Ms. Castor. There were a number of things out of the
    committee that did not, that were stripped out at the last
    minute, and I hope that we can get back to working on those
    expeditiously.
        But I know we are gathered here today to talk about AI and
    advanced manufacturing, and it seems like it is vital that we
    continue to build on the success of the past few years. And Dr.
    Reynolds highlights a lot of the progress in her testimony.
        She says, ``The U.S. has made significant strides in the
    past few years to rebuild these capabilities with largely
    bipartisan support'' in ``semiconductors, critical minerals,
    defense, and energy infrastructure'' and that the Bipartisan
    Infrastructure Law, the CHIPS and Science Act, the Inflation
    Reduction Act has led to manufacturing construction spending
    having been tripled since 2021, $450 billion of private-sector
    investment in semiconductor production, over 40 facilities,
    approximately $80 billion of private-sector investment in clean
    energy across 200 manufacturing facilities, particularly
    batteries, a crucial area for U.S. leadership in the future,
    and investments going to all sorts of States.
        I wish there were more in Florida, but a lot are going into
    the battery belt in the Midwest, and so that is so important to
    see because of the drain in jobs and offshoring of jobs over
    the past decades.
        But this hearing does seem like a big disconnect today
    because of, right at the outset of the new Trump
    administration, they threw a wrench into so much of the
    progress that we have been making.
        They illegally shut down loans and grants that, you know--I
    focus a lot on on the Department of Energy--the Executive
    orders and the default on grants and loans have thrown a lot of
    the manufacturing sector into chaos.
        Just yesterday I had a critical mineral developer in my
    office. They do not--they cannot get answers from the
    Department of Energy because of the halt in payments. We have
    had a Federal court say, ``You must continue to disburse these
    moneys.''
        So we are seeing layoffs, business capital pulling back
    already. So, Dr. Reynolds, are you hearing these same stories
    here just over the past few weeks?
        Dr. Reynolds. Thank you for that question and for raising
    what is a very concerning situation right now in the country.
    As you said, we have had significant investment, looking at
    over $1 trillion over the next decade across physical
    infrastructure, across our digital infrastructure, if you will,
    and with our energy infrastructure.
        But these latest steps by the current administration are
    very concerning, I think first and foremost, because what we
    have are contractual obligations, with the backing of the
    Federal Government in many of these cases, for funds that are
    expected to flow in many important projects.
        Right now, there are approximately over 400 clean-energy
    projects that have been announced. They have not yet broken
    ground, but those plans are in motion, and those companies have
    been banking on a lot of that funding that is supposed to be
    coming.
        A lot of this is really about what we see today, but I
    think we have to also think about what is potentially lost if
    these investments do not flow as they have been intended, and
    also passed by Congress.
        Right now, what some estimates are, certainly recently by
    Johns Hopkins, is that if the IRA pulls back on a lot of these
    investments, what we are going to see is foreign companies--
    foreign countries, including China, stepping in, and that U.S.
    companies, and the U.S. as a whole, are at risk of losing
    approximately $50 billion in annual lost exports, et cetera. So
    the stakes are enormous.
        We have already got tremendous momentum, and as you said, a
    number--many States across the country who are benefiting from
    these investments, communities benefiting as well as the
    workers.
        So I hope that we are going to see some common ground and
    an understanding that really we need to maintain some order and
    continue those investments as we passed them in the past.
        Ms. Castor. Thank you. I agree. I think China is cheering
    this on. Any wrench that is thrown into building up our
    advanced manufacturing and AI and progress is to the detriment
    of our people.
        Thank you. I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The gentlelady yields back.
        Now I will recognize my favorite pharmacist on the
    committee--I know Buddy is going to kill me for this.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. You are just----
        Mr. Bilirakis. Anyway, I am telling the truth.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Thanks, Gus.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I recognize you for 5 minutes.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to
    the witnesses for being here. I don't have an Abraham Lincoln
    story, but Davy Crockett is from my district, FYI.
        Mr. Bilirakis. And so is----
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Stop it, stop it.
        Well, let's just get back to the crux of this. Ms. Humpton,
    your company has a digital industry design and testing facility
    in my district that employs 202 Tennesseans, and my question to
    you is, When you train your employees to use AI, do you offer
    that training for advanced engineering staff or to all the
    employees?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you so much, and I am going to tell you,
    we actually have 219 in Johnson City.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Johnson City. Well, dang, I didn't--let
    me correct the record.
        Ms. Humpton. Yes. This business is growing and thriving,
    and we have made the AI training within the Siemens Corporation
    available to all. We actually have a learning platform that
    uses AI so that an individual learner can come in, give a
    little bit of information about where they are with their
    knowledge base, and have recommendations made.
        Now, we are going to take this one step further because
    what we recognize is that everyone needs to be able to learn
    these skills. So we are working now on a project to make this
    training available on a platform publicly so that anyone who
    wants to get engaged would be able to understand the
    technologies we are implementing at Siemens and be able to get
    on that learning ladder themselves.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, that is fantastic. You talked about
    predictive maintenance, and I thought that was very
    interesting, where you could--it helps manufacturers identify
    machines that might break down 6 months ahead of time.
        So can you give us a couple other examples for the
    committee, where it shows this predictive maintenance and what
    role AI plays with that?
        Ms. Humpton. Yes, I am happy to describe this. This is
    really interesting. I mean, how do you know when something is
    going to break down? It is a little bit like the door example I
    gave before, that to the human eye, you may not notice a change
    in vibrations, a change in the noise that is being made by a
    machine.
        I think we all know that in any business, there are those
    savants, the experts who actually can smell it in the air when
    something is wrong. But we can't all be as smart as that
    individual.
        What we are able to do with our predictive maintenance
    tools is use sensors of all kinds--sound, sight, smell, et
    cetera--to give us those indicators of when something isn't
    performing as expected. That alerts people in the loop to
    figure out, is this something that we need to take action on
    now.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. You always need a human component--smell.
        Ms. Humpton. We absolutely do.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Unless you come up with something on AI.
    OK. Thank you, ma'am.
        Mr. Oxman, you spoke a little bit about the President's
    recent Executive order and that it will develop an AI action
    plan that will chart the course for the new industry.
        So my question to you is, What details do you think the
    administration should consider which would benefit innovation
    and growth in American manufacturing?
        Mr. Oxman. We absolutely--thank you, Congresswoman, for
    that question. We absolutely do appreciate President Trump's
    Executive order on AI, and particularly because he is focused
    on input from industry, to make sure that the regulatory
    roadmap is appropriate for continued AI leadership in the
    United States. So we are looking forward to providing that
    input.
        The Vice President, as I mentioned, was in Paris yesterday
    at the AI summit, and he noted that the regulatory environment
    is really going to control who wins. And so, in this Executive
    order, our hope is the President advances a public-private
    partnership that focuses on industry, voluntary standards, and
    not taking an overly regulatory approach as some other
    jurisdictions like Europe have done, that has hindered their
    leadership on AI.
        So I think we have a real opportunity here, and we are
    grateful to the President.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, continue to give him input.
        Mr. Kinder, you know, I am a compounding pharmacist--Gus
    didn't tell you that--but that is what I am, and I understand
    how critical it is to strengthen the resilience of our domestic
    healthcare supply chains and stop the dependence on foreign
    adversaries.
        Can you share with me how AI technology is used in
    healthcare manufacturing, sir?
        Mr. Kinder. Sure, thank you for your question,
    Congresswoman. Pharmaceutical companies use Autodesk software
    to build their factories, to produce medicines, and to produce
    the packaging that the medicines they come in.
        Our tools help ensure that the entire supply chain stays
    connected and optimized. I can give you an example. One of our
    partners saved over $350 million annually by using a fully
    integrated digital twin model of their factories, and, you
    know, these twins help with renovations, with space and
    resource allocation, and energy consumption.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. OK. I just have one other question and 5
    seconds. NASCAR----
        Mr. Bilirakis. Go ahead.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. OK. Well, it is just a fun one. NASCAR,
    how in the heck did you get that lightweight brake past the
    specs? Because I have Bristol Motor Speedway in my district,
    and you got to go through a lot to make sure they meet the
    specs.
        So how did you get that through tech, is my question. Did
    you do that before, or did you even do that? Do they even know
    about this brake?
        Mr. Kinder. I don't think it is a secret. But it did pass--
    --
        Mrs. Harshbarger. OK. Just checking, because he won the
    championship.
        Mr. Kinder [continuing]. It did pass the weight test for
    the car.
        Mrs. Harshbarger. OK. I am just checking. You know, we have
    got to keep it above board now. OK? Thank you, sir.
        I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
        Mr. Bilirakis. All right. Very good.
        I recognize my good friend Darren Soto from the great State
    of Florida. You are recognized for 5 minutes for your
    questioning.
        Mr. Soto. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and congratulations on
    your new granddaughter. We are so happy to see that amazing
    addition.
        You know, it wasn't that long ago we saw a chips shortage
    because of the pandemic, and it raised the prices of vehicles,
    of appliances, of computers, and many Americans found out chips
    are in everything nowadays.
        And so we came together to pass the CHIPS Act, all the
    Democrats and some of the Republicans. We appreciate their
    support on that. And it has been a big help for Florida's Ninth
    Congressional District.
        We are home to the biggest CHIPS Act project in the State
    at NeoCity, near St. Cloud in Kissimmee, and we just welcomed
    our next fabricator, ELSPES, which is going to be working on
    capacitors that work directly on lowering energy for AI
    technology.
        We also saw the Inflation Reduction Act be a huge help for
    central Florida--Green Garden Village, where we are going to be
    making solar panels as well as EV charging stations;
        We are going to see the largest solar plant in North
    America in south Osceola County, thanks to Florida Power &
    Light; the largest, fast-charging station, thanks to Tesla
    going to Yeehaw Junction in the south part of my district; and
    the first used electric vehicle dealership, also by Tesla.
        We have seen, because of the CHIPS Act and because of the
    IRA, factory construction has surged and manufacturing capacity
    is expanding, both in Florida and across the Nation.
        Many of you may be surprised to know that Florida has the
    second-most electric vehicles of any State in the Nation, even
    though we are the third-most populous State, so just after
    California. Just another interesting example from the Sunshine
    State.
        And so we are concerned that President Trump, with his
    freeze order, could stop some of these projects from going
    through, whether it is the CHIPS Act, whether it is projects
    under the Inflation Reduction Act.
        And then what is this going to do? It is going to raise
    costs, it is going to raise pollution, and it is going to limit
    our competitiveness at a time when China and so many other
    countries are trying to advance these issues.
        We just filed a letter today taking on President Trump's
    attempt to take back the national EV charging station
    infrastructure we see across the Nation.
        This is going to affect rural areas. This is going to
    affect a lot of urban areas. We need to make sure our Big Three
    remain competitive, knowing that EVs and hybrids are a big part
    of this future transition that we see.
        And then I am concerned about the reconciliation package
    that will attempt to gut these programs for more oil. You know,
    we are already at record production right now. And so we need a
    balanced approach.
        And all this is at the backdrop of an inflation report
    where we saw inflation is now at a 6-month high, tariffs,
    deportations, division, chaos, the four horsemen of
    Trumpflation that could get worse.
        It doesn't have to be this way. We could work together, and
    this committee has a long history of doing that. We need a
    balanced approach where we continue with electric vehicle
    progress, continue to work on the CHIPS Act, keep oil
    production steady, to keep gas prices affordable, and have a
    transition over time.
        Ms. Humpton, thank you so much for being here. We
    appreciate Siemens' great investment in Orlando in partnership
    with University of Central Florida, focusing on energy systems,
    sustainable energy solutions.
        How critical is it for us to continue to be competitive in
    clean energy and to have workforce development programs to meet
    this demand?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you, Congressman. It is vitally
    important that we attend to the mega trends that have driven us
    for such a long time. And in fact, what is so exciting about
    where we are in this moment is that it is, in fact, the private
    sector who has stepped up to the plate.
        Many statistics have been shared this morning about the
    level of investment, first being made by the Federal Government
    as a down payment, but pouring--the private sector funds that
    have been pouring in.
        Our customers are demanding the kinds of technologies that
    we as a Nation have been focused on these last few years.
        What is exciting is that industrial AI can contribute to
    our progress overall. You see, the same technologies that help
    us address the goals that we have had for sustainability, et
    cetera, also make us more efficient. They make our businesses
    more productive.
        We really can have it all in this moment by deploying
    technology to make American manufacturing cleaner, smarter, and
    more cost-effective, competitive on the world stage.
        Mr. Soto. And we appreciate Siemens' contributions to this
    factory renaissance, this manufacturing renaissance, that has
    been pushed onward because of the IRA, CHIPS Act, and many
    other private-sector companies coming together.
        Thanks, and I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The gentleman yields back.
        Now I will recognize the gentleman from California, Mr.
    Obernolte, for his 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Obernolte. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Congresswoman
    Harshbarger recommended that I continue her line of questioning
    about NASCAR brake pedals, but instead I am going to focus on
    something else she was asking about.
        Mr. Oxman, you and she were talking about regulation and
    the executive branch and the President's Executive orders.
    Could I follow on to that discussion with a question about what
    we, in Congress, should be doing to establish a regulatory
    environment that, as you say, encourages innovation and the use
    of AI in the manufacturing space?
        Mr. Oxman. Well, thank you, Congressman Obernolte. As the
    AI scientist on the panel, you have been very focused in the
    last couple of years on legislative solutions that we have been
    proud to support, ranging from the Center for AI Advancement
    and Reliability, to the CREATE AI Act.
        And of course, we are starting over in the 119th, but the
    work that you have been focused on, encouraging public and
    private partnerships, I think, is the shortest answer to your
    question. That is where we really need to be focused.
        We need to be focused on how the Government can partner
    with research institutions, not only on the reskilling issues
    that we have been talking about, but organizations like the
    NAIRR, the National AI Research Resource, that you have been
    very vocal and supportive, and we have as well.
        That is the kind of public-private partnership I think we
    need to be focused on, not focusing on the regulations so much
    as how can government and the private sector partner together
    to make these investments a reality. That is where I think the
    focus really should be.
        Mr. Obernolte. Right. Well, obviously I completely agree
    with you about NAIRR and Create AI and the AI Advancement and
    Reliability Institute. You know, I think that those would be
    really vital public-private partnerships in that sense.
        I am hopeful that you read our AI Task Force report, and I
    am wondering, what do you think we got right and wrong in our
    approach to regulating the use of AI in manufacturing?
        Mr. Oxman. Yes, and congratulations to you and Mr. Lieu,
    your cochair in that effort, on a remarkable task force
    initiative. It was a--I did read the report. It was very long,
    very comprehensive.
        The things you got right in there, I think, were a focus on
    what the Vice President talked about in Paris, which was those
    jurisdictions that have taken a regulation-first approach, like
    Europe, are now behind in the race to dominate globally.
        I also really appreciated the focus on the competition that
    we face internationally and how other countries are looking to
    lead the way, and if we are not making the right kind of
    focused investments and not ensuring that the regulatory
    environment is appropriate to investment, we are going to fall
    behind.
        We have got a lead now, but that lead is by no means
    guaranteed to lead to future success.
        I also appreciated your focus on training, workforce
    development in the report and ways in which investment in those
    kind of initiatives can also lead to further U.S. leadership in
    AI.
        And finally, I think the focus of the report on encouraging
    Congress to hold hearings to better inform itself, like this
    hearing today, about what is necessary for congressional
    solutions, if any, to the challenges that we face in AI,
    particularly in manufacturing. I think that is important as
    well.
        Mr. Obernolte. Is there anything that you think we should
    have focused more on?
        Mr. Oxman. I think if I had to pick one area that more
    focus could have been on, it would be on how we can solve
    energy issues. I think you certainly touched on it in the
    report, but I think we have seen just in recent months since
    the report came out that energy issues have become more
    prominent, particularly for data center construction.
        And I think we have an opportunity to look at this not only
    from the energy pathway side, but also the regulatory side,
    about permitting and the way in which energy is authorized for
    use for data centers for AI.
        I think that is going to be an issue for U.S. leadership
    going forward, and I think that is going to be an important
    issue for Congress to focus on as well.
        Mr. Obernolte. Yes, I agree with you.
        Ms. Humpton, I was very interested in the distinctions that
    you highlighted between industrial AI and consumer AI, and I
    really hadn't done a lot of thinking about this, but it
    certainly seems to me that the regulatory approach to those two
    technologies should be probably pretty different, given the
    differences and how tightly curated the trading data is for
    industrial AI and the more limited operating environment. It is
    much more controlled.
        So what can you think--what would you say would be the
    differences in our regulatory approach to those two
    technologies? How is industrial AI different?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you, Congressman. As I mentioned
    earlier, we really do need to look at those key distinctions.
    It is going to be very tempting for the public to take one big
    paintbrush and sweep all of this into the category of AI.
        If we can be very clear on those definitions, we can
    actually think through the key questions of trust and risk.
    What do we need to secure in order to maintain and build trust?
    Where do we see the risk areas?
        We all know that consumer AI, we are running dramatic risks
    across our entire society. But with industrial AI, we have a
    very unique, controlled environment. I would be delighted for
    my team to further engage with you and your staff as----
        Mr. Obernolte. Great.
        Ms. Humpton [continuing]. As you work forward.
        Mr. Obernolte. I would welcome that. Well, thanks to our
    witnesses. It has been a fascinating hearing.
        I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The gentleman yields back.
        Now I will recognize Representative Clarke from the State
    of New York for your 5 minutes of questioning.
        Ms. Clarke. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and I thank
    our ranking member. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you to
    our witnesses for being here to testify. I know it may not have
    been easy to navigate through DC in this weather and political
    uncertainty.
        I believe, as many of my colleagues on this committee do,
    that it is in our best interest to support the adoption of
    emerging technologies, like AI, in the manufacturing sector and
    that we should make the critical hardware that power AI tools,
    like chips, at home, right here in the United States.
        That is why, unlike many of my colleagues on the other side
    of the aisle, I was proud to support President Biden and
    Democrats in passing the CHIPS and Science Act, a $53 billion
    investment in bringing semiconductor supply chains back to the
    United States.
        All over the country, we have seen the benefits and
    successes of the CHIPS Act, not only supporting manufacturing
    and innovating at home, but also with the creation of over
    115,000 jobs as of last summer.
        My home State of New York has been a leader in the
    semiconductor manufacturing industry, and the benefits are
    showing. Thanks to CHIPS and Science Act, 34,000 New Yorkers
    are employed by semiconductor and supply chain companies.
        The importance of supporting the domestic manufacturing of
    AI tools is undeniable and essential to our workforce and
    economy, and that is why I remain committed to supporting the
    implementation and disbursement of CHIPS funding that uplifts
    the industry, national security, and our workforce.
        While I am disappointed, I am not surprised to see the
    chaos of the current administration giving way to an unstable
    business environment that undermines the progress that we have
    seen in the American semiconductor manufacturing.
        Illegal freezes, tariff threats undermine the work
    Democrats have done to modernize critical domestic
    manufacturing sectors.
        Dr. Reynolds, can you speak to the steps Congress can take
    to support stability in the industry and further the progress
    we have already made?
        Dr. Reynolds. Thank you, Congresswoman, for that question,
    and for also underscoring the importance of the CHIPS Act and
    its impact already on the U.S. economy and U.S.
    competitiveness.
        I will mention as well that we now see that TSMC in Arizona
    is manufacturing four nanometer chips, frontier chips, out of
    Arizona for the first time in American history.
        And this is a very exciting time for building the
    semiconductor industry in the country and ensuring that we have
    global competitiveness going forward and are not at the mercy
    of foreign adversaries and other countries.
        In terms of how we take this work forward, I think first
    and foremost, as we have discussed, is we want to see the
    obligations that have been made already followed through and
    supported over time.
        So while perhaps these obligations have not been expended
    yet, we know that we have important taxpayer interests involved
    in the payment of these CHIPS Act grants, the importance of the
    tax incentives.
        We want to make sure that all of these important parts of
    the legislation passed in the last few years continue forward
    under the intention of Congress.
        I think also that we are seeing, as you said, an enormous
    amount of momentum already at the State level. Whether that is
    in the CHIPS Act, around a number of places around the country,
    whether that is in the clean energy space, whether that is in
    other areas of manufacturing, it is very important for the
    Federal Government to be a partner in ensuring that those
    investments continue and that those partnerships help us in
    building out those investments and those clusters of
    excellence.
        I think the importance of the U.S. strategy under this
    legislation was not just about a few projects here and there,
    but creating critical mass, and with that critical mass we
    develop globally competitive industries.
        And our goal, of course, is to not only develop the
    expertise and provide the quality jobs but to export and to
    become a world leader in many of these areas, and we are on
    that path.
        And through the creation of these new factories and
    facilities, using new technology that we have just discussed,
    we are now in a position to really be leaders in areas that we
    have not been and where we have been lagging in the past--so
    semiconductors, EVs, batteries, all of these areas where now
    the U.S. is really in a competitive position.
        We may have lost in many ways on the generation--on the
    first generation of technology. You know, invented the
    technology here, it went elsewhere.
        But now we are in a different position. Now we are in a
    place where the U.S. can actually compete and lead. And so that
    requires that we maintain these investments, that we support
    them on the ground, and that we build through a new generation
    for U.S. manufacturing.
        Ms. Clarke. Very well. Thank you so much for your response,
    and I thank all of our witnessesfor bringing the expertise to
    the table.
        With that, I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The gentlewoman yields back.
        Now I will recognize Mr. James from the great State of
    Michigan. You are recognized for 5 minutes of questioning, sir.
        Mr. James. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would be remiss if I
    didn't recognize you for your leadership and also bestowing on
    me the very high honor of leading supply chain and
    manufacturing policy for the subcommittee in the 119th
    Congress.
        So I look forward to working to make this committee proud
    and make America strong and great again.
        I would also like to give Chairman Cruz a shout. I was
    pleased to hear the Senate Commerce Committee approved the
    Promoting Resilient Supply Chains Act, and I look forward to
    leading this bill in the House.
        And I recognize the grand opportunity that we have in front
    of us to pass real, substantive policy to benefit the American
    people as it pertains to AI and manufacturing.
        If we don't lead in AI, the Chinese Communist Party will
    have all the brainpower because they have stolen our IP. And
    they will have all the manpower because they are using slave
    labor to end western civilization without firing a shot.
        It is simply not enough to close our eyes and hope for the
    best. We are in global competition with communist regimes that
    are hell-bent on building their economy on the backs of ours.
        AI in manufacturing here means not relying on goods made
    with slave labor, on brainpower stolen from Americans.
        It means predictive modeling to reduce costs and risk in
    supply chains.
        It means minimizing supply chain disruptions before they
    occur.
        It means making people more productive, allowing them to
    upskill and businesses to upscale into the future.
        This Congress I am also going to be launching bicameral and
    bipartisan Reindustrialize Caucus. This new caucus will serve
    as a natural convening body for Congress to engage with the
    broader ecosystems of sectors vital to national security,
    economic resilience, and global competitiveness, taking
    feedback from industry leaders and experts such as yourself.
        We will increase manufacturing in a smart way. We will
    industrialize, and we recognize that folks are not afraid of
    the future, but we demand to be a part of it.
        So in that vein, I am very concerned about our supply
    basis--our supply basis and the ability to keep up. Forty-seven
    percent of manufacturers view data fragmentation as a major
    obstacle to effectively implementing AI, while small and
    midsized manufacturers, which make up 98.6 of U.S.
    manufacturing firms, often lack the capital to invest in AI.
        Can you speak, Ms. Humpton, on some of the suppliers who
    you rely on, the important nature for them to help you
    accomplish your mission, and also what the R&D tax credit would
    do for you and your suppliers' survival?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you, Congressman James, for the
    question, and I am going to share with everyone that Siemens
    USA has been localizing its supply chain for quite some time.
        You may know us as the manufacturers of America's high-
    speed rail when Brightline West proceeds, and what we have
    built is a very robust supply chain that activates across 40
    States whenever we build a train, as an example.
        But we also believe that there is a trend going on here
    that we want to share with everyone: ``glocalization,'' the
    idea that we can take advantage of global innovation but
    actually build and perform locally, closer to the point of
    demand.
        And this is going to be a key concept for strengthening us
    here in the United States. The idea of incentivizing research
    and development is key because it is here that we are able to
    bring these concepts together. Now, one----
        Mr. James. So R&D tax credits are vital?
        Ms. Humpton. Excuse me?
        Mr. James. The R&D tax credits are vital?
        Ms. Humpton. We are looking forward to having tax credits
    that actually make the U.S. a net exporter to the rest of the
    world in innovation.
        Mr. James. Perfect. I would like to piggyback on another
    one. You operate the largest digital twin in the world for the
    Navy. Can you tell me a little bit more about that and how AI
    will help address the bottlenecks in the defense industrial
    base, in about 30 seconds, please?
        Ms. Humpton. In 30 seconds, what I can tell you, the
    world's largest digital twin is the digital twin of the Navy's
    shipyards.
        How do we get a bigger Navy? We do it by making sure that
    ships spend less time in repair, maintenance, and overhaul.
        How do we do that? We have to redesign the process in the
    shipyards. The digital twin that Siemens has been supporting
    the Navy with, at first look, there were notions about what do
    we need to do to fix the problem.
        By using a digital twin, the team was able to discover that
    what they thought were the bottlenecks were not. We would have
    spent billions of dollars solving a problem that didn't solve
    the bottleneck problem. The digital twin----
        Mr. James. Perfect. Sounds like a great technology to bring
    to Michigan to help us build ships.
        Mr. Oxman, we hear the demand for more computing power and
    data center processing to service AI is going to increase. Can
    you give us a heads up on permitting reform, all-of-the-above
    energy production, and maybe cite a couple of the unworkable
    environmental regulations that might hinder the energy required
    for this AI revolution?
        Mr. Oxman. Thanks, Congressman James, we definitely need an
    all-of-the-above energy solution for data centers. Data centers
    power the AI revolution that is taking place in the U.S., and
    you are absolutely right to highlight hindrances to the rollout
    of energy to supply those data centers.
        An all-of-the-above energy solution will support the
    construction of data centers and make sure that there is not
    too much of a burden on the existing grid.
        The biggest obstacle by far is the one you highlighted--the
    local, the State, the county permitting requirements that hold
    up the deployment of energy. And we are looking forward to
    working with you on making sure that those challenges can be
    addressed so we can move forward with the energy solutions that
    data centers need.
        Mr. James. Thank you.
        Mr. Chairman--and I don't have a Lincoln story as well--but
    my youngest son turns 6 today, so I am going to go FaceTime
    with him.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Oh, happy birthday.
        Mr. James. Thank you so much for your leadership. I yield.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Great. Thank you.
        All right. Now we will recognize Representative Dingell for
    her 5 minutes.
        Mrs. Dingell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I look forward
    to working with you, Ranking Member Schakowsky, and all the
    members of this subcommittee on this issue because it really is
    one of the most important issues facing us in this country--how
    do we ensure that America stays at the forefront of innovation
    and technology?
        And I want to thank the witnesses, many of whom I have
    worked with, some who have workers in my district, and I want
    to increase those workers and keep them building.
        Over the last several years, we have made real progress
    advancing policies that strengthen our manufacturing sector,
    foster innovation, and create jobs.
        I am deeply concerned about where things are headed,
    though, in this Congress. It is only February, and we have
    already seen too many actions that have been done by this new
    administration, and maybe Mr. Musk, seem an attempt upon
    dismantling our Federal Government and ceding American
    leadership to our adversaries.
        This is more than troubling, and I hope my colleagues will
    help us keep the United States at the forefront of
    manufacturing innovation on the global stage before it is too
    late.
        Last Congress, this committee worked in a bipartisan manner
    on supply chains. We passed the Promoting Resilient Supply
    Chains Act in the House, which included several provisions I
    helped colead, and we reached bipartisan, bicameral agreement
    on a supply chain provision to be included in the end-of-the-
    year continuing resolution, which has been removed when Mr.
    Musk tweeted his opposition to that very carefully negotiated
    bill.
        Strengthening our supply chains is critical for our
    industrial base, for our economic security, and our national
    security. The Federal Government must have the tools to prevent
    vulnerabilities from escalating into full-blown crises.
        I am also concerned about efforts to roll back investments
    from the Inflation Reduction Act, especially the 45X tax
    credit, which has been vital in driving domestic manufacturing
    and innovation, and where I come from, particularly in the auto
    industry.
        Everyone--everyone--has told me that these incentives are
    critical for our global competitiveness. One of the backbones
    of American manufacturing is the auto sector.
        We have seen the devastating consequences of uncertainty
    and divestment on manufacturers and suppliers. We have got to
    bring our supply chains home--and not just steel and aluminum
    and autos as we are talking about, but pharmaceuticals and many
    others.
        We should not be producing 80 to 90 percent of our
    medicines overseas. That is a national security issue.
        For decades, poorly negotiated trade deals, the outsourcing
    of jobs have hollowed out our industrial base, and at the same
    time the rise of automation has cost many workers their
    livelihoods.
        Yes, innovation is critical, and we have got to lead, but
    we have to be honest about the impact on workers and ensure
    that progress does not come at the expense of the middle class.
    We cannot leave labor behind.
        As we look to the future of advanced manufacturing, labor
    must have a seat at the table and have access to the training
    and tools necessary to develop the skills they need to help the
    companies they work for compete in the world of advanced
    manufacturing.
        And we, as the Federal Government, have a duty to protect
    American manufacturing and its workers. As we have seen, doing
    so is instrumental to our national security and economic
    vitality.
        Mr. Kinder, can you speak to the importance of passing
    bipartisan Federal supply chain legislation in this Congress?
    And fast, because I went too long.
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you, Congresswoman Dingell, and thank you
    for representing so many of our employees in your district.
        We are--I don't know what you are specifically referring to
    on supply chain legislation. Like I say, the supply chain--and
    particularly small and medium-sized manufacturers who populate
    that supply chain--are the backbone of the manufacturing
    industry. They create jobs in every district.
        Those manufacturers struggle to make investments in digital
    transformation and in AI. And to the extent that, you know,
    this subcommittee and to the extent that Congress can come
    together to help strengthen that segment of the supply chain,
    that is going to be positive for the manufacturing sector.
        Mrs. Dingell. Thank you.
        Dr. Reynolds, tell us how important labor is in the
    advanced manufacturing conversation.
        Dr. Reynolds. Thank you, Congresswoman. Well, of course,
    labor is essential. We are unable to make any of these
    products. A lot of people like to talk about the lights-out
    factory, but what we say at MIT is a lights-out factory really
    can't innovate. We need our workers to be able to do that.
        Currently manufacturing jobs represent just under about 10
    percent of all jobs in the economy, but they come with a very
    large multiplier effect, very important for the economy.
        And they are also tied to technologies and industries of
    the future, and they underpin the economic growth and
    prosperity for the country. Whether that is in transportation,
    in energy, or in manufacturing, we see our industrial systems
    really throughout the economy relying on our workers.
        And we know that manufacturing can provide career paths and
    quality jobs. Our challenge in this country has not been about
    creating new jobs and the quantity of jobs. It has been about
    the quality of jobs.
        And so I think that the fact that we are thinking about and
    talking about how can AI augment workers and support workers is
    really the first step to making sure this technology helps
    workers through increasing productivity, which can also lead to
    increasing wages.
        As it stands right now, our small and medium-sized firms
    are struggling to adopt this technology, to find workers, to
    pay their workers, and we can find a path forward that invests
    both in technology and in workers for the country.
        Mrs. Dingell. I obviously yield back. I would like to
    submit some questions for the record, Mr. Chairman.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Next, we will recognize Mr. Fry from the
    great State of South Carolina. Thank you again, and welcome to
    the committee.
        Mr. Fry. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for your
    leadership on this issue.
        Good afternoon to our witnesses. I really appreciate the
    professional discussion in which you are informing us. I think
    that partnership is absolutely needed as we launch into this
    brave new world called AI.
        Back home in my district in Florence, South Carolina, GE
    HealthCare manufactures some of the best MRI machines and
    systems in the world. These systems are used to provide high-
    quality patient care in the U.S. and around the world, and they
    leverage AI to enhance imaging speed and quality, helping
    doctors make faster and more accurate diagnoses.
        But AI's impact extends far beyond just healthcare. It is
    improving forecasting, planning, and process optimization at GE
    HealthCare's manufacturing facilities, ensuring efficiency from
    the production line to the supply chain.
        And it is not just changing manufacturing. It is really
    redefining our economic future, as you have testified to. It
    offers unprecedented opportunities to strengthen American
    industry, enhance our global competitiveness, and secure our
    technological future.
        But to fully realize these benefits I think we must ensure
    that policies support rather than stifle AI innovation. And as
    we discussed today, I look forward to hearing from our
    witnesses on how we can do that.
        Ms. Humpton, thank you for being here today. Siemens has
    operated not only across the U.S., but really in a global
    market and across the globe.
        Do you find--with all the States and all the different
    countries and all the different approaches in which they are
    treating AI, do you find that regulatory uncertainty or
    fragmented legal requirements, do you find that to be
    cumbersome for U.S. manufacturers to adopt AI?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you for the question, and I think my
    team, who has joined me here today, would tell you they are
    burning a lot of calories trying to track everything that is
    happening at the Federal, the State, the local level, and with
    regulation, you know, obviously regulation being formed all
    around the world.
        This is why we are thrilled that the Congress has invited
    industry to the table. We really believe that, as responsible
    businesses, if we raise our voice in this environment, we can
    help the Congress understand what we know.
        But the thing that we really appreciate from the Congress
    is a better understanding of the risks we face as a Nation. So
    this sharing of information is vitally important right now.
        Mr. Fry. Absolutely. Thank you so much.
        Mr. Oxman, you have discussed how AI could strengthen our
    supply chain resilience and improve operational efficiency for
    our manufacturers.
        But the regulations like the Bureau of Industry and
    Security's AI diffusion rule have raised concerns about
    unintended consequences on U.S. innovation and global
    competitiveness.
        How should Congress and the administration approach AI-
    related regulations to protect our national security without
    hindering that very vital private-sector innovation?
        Mr. Oxman. Thanks, Congressman Fry. I am glad you mentioned
    that AI diffusion rule, because that is something we were very
    disappointed to see happen in the waning days of the Biden
    administration.
        The good news is, there is an opportunity, there is an open
    rulemaking, and the Trump administration can make that rule
    better.
        These are complicated issues. Protecting national security
    is obviously vital as we look at opportunities to continue
    global leadership by the U.S. in AI.
        So our hope is that the industry collaboration that we will
    see in the coming weeks and months will lead to a better rule
    than was adopted the first time around, and that is
    particularly important because, as you noted, these supply
    chain issues are also supply chain security issues.
        So we need to make sure that American manufacturers have
    access to everything they need to build and grow the economy
    here, but we also need to make sure that vital American
    national security interests are protected overseas.
        And we are looking forward to working with the
    administration on striking that balance and working with
    Congress to make sure that there's proper analysis here as well
    to make sure that balance is struck.
        Mr. Fry. Thank you for that.
        Mr. Kinder, you talked about this with my colleague, Mrs.
    Dingell. What do you think the biggest challenges are for SMEs
    right now as it relates to AI?
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you for the question.
        Small and medium-sized enterprises, you know, they face
    global competition, and they need to invest to stay
    competitive.
        They need to be able to invest in digital transformation,
    they need to be able to invest in AI, and, you know, switching
    costs are high. So they have systems that are in place now that
    they are using. Those switching costs are high.
        The thing that can help them most is support from Congress,
    either whether it is access to capital, whether there could be
    some incentives or tax credits. It would help them to make that
    investment, be willing to make that investment, to leapfrog and
    be competitive.
        Mr. Fry. All right. Thank you.
        Mr. Kinder. As long as they are competitive, the even
    larger manufacturers they work with will benefit.
        Mr. Fry. Great, thank you, and just to wrap up, what is
    Autodesk doing? I think one of the concerns that I hear from my
    constituents is bias that might be in AI.
        What is Autodesk doing to ensure that AI is safe and not
    biased?
        Mr. Kinder. Yes. I mean, similar to, I think, what Siemens
    is doing on industrial AI, we train on very specific datasets
    that are around the manufacturing process. We don't run into
    some of the probably--the concerns around bias of large, public
    datasets where you don't know where that may be coming from.
        Mr. Fry. Thank you for that.
        Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the gentleman and now recognize Mr.
    Veasey from the great State of Texas. You are recognized for 5
    minutes for questioning.
        Mr. Veasey. Mr. Chairman, thank you.
        You know, one of the great things that have happened in the
    Dallas-Fort Worth area is that we have really emerged as
    leaders in this area, to lead manufacturing facilities and
    operations in this new cutting-edge technology that we are
    seeing.
        And I think it is really part of a generational shift when
    it comes to the future of domestic manufacturing, and it is
    amazing to see it right in your own backyard.
        And I think that long-term that we are going to see
    continued investments in the DFW area that are going to make
    the United States keep its competitive edge in innovation
    against global competitors, and obviously artificial
    intelligence is going to be a really big part of that.
        However, we also have to acknowledge that there are some
    risks involved with AI that we need to continue to be talking
    about, that we are not mentioning enough.
        And if we think that social media is out of control, I can
    tell you that AI will even be more dangerous if we don't make
    sure that we are taking these protective measures to make sure
    that middle-class, hardworking Americans don't become left
    behind.
        And, unfortunately, one of the things I am worried about is
    President Trump's recent Executive order, titled, ``Removing
    Barriers to American Leadership in Artificial Intelligence,''
    because I think that has undermined some essential AI
    protections that are accelerating the unchecked spread of AI
    across the country.
        And so I wanted to ask Dr. Reynolds, what measures do you
    think Congress should take to mitigate the increased risk of
    cyber attacks and other threats to our national security as
    manufacturing increasingly adopts to AI without sufficient
    regulation?
        Dr. Reynolds. Thank you very much for the question,
    Congressman. Certainly the concerns about cybersecurity have
    been around for several years and have been escalating, and
    particularly in our manufacturing base, which has been most
    directly attacked.
        So I think that the issue has been elevated, and I think
    there is bipartisan concern about how we address this.
        How actually we go about doing that is another question,
    and I think you have heard a range of comments here this
    afternoon about exactly what the role of government should be.
        My hope is that we find a path forward that is going to
    accelerate our investigation and our research in this area but
    also find a pathway forward in which cybersecurity is front and
    center, but also the issues you raise--whether it is privacy,
    protection of minors, security of information for the consumer,
    et cetera--those are critical issues.
        And I think at this point in time, we have had a lot of
    discussion and debate, but we need to find a collaborative and
    bipartisan path forward which is going to protect not just the
    consumer and the worker but also our manufacturing base.
        Mr. Veasey. Yes. No, absolutely. And also, I want to talk
    about energy use--AI and energy use. That has gotten a lot of
    attention, and it should.
        Last year I visited Siemens. They have a new facility in my
    district in Fort Worth, and I understand that Siemens' digital
    twin offerings can provide real-time insights into the energy
    usage of various components in the data center.
        But I am worried that if we don't reform our permitting
    process to allow energy of all forms to be generated and put
    onto the grid, that there are going to be risks to constituents
    in the manufacturing sector.
        I wanted to ask particularly, Ms. Humpton, do you think
    that that is something that we should be concerned about?
        Ms. Humpton. Congressman Veasey, we were thrilled to host
    you at Fort Worth, and I have been bragging today about this as
    a real illustration of the power of AI in not only building but
    in staffing, training our staff, and bringing people from
    outside the manufacturing world into manufacturing in Fort
    Worth.
        The power that is going to be required for AI is absolutely
    essential, and actually technologists like us, but in
    particular Siemens has been working in the field of electricity
    management for almost our entire existence.
        And what we have right now is a brilliant opportunity to
    use AI as we solve this problem. We do need to use new
    techniques like microgrids, the ability for people to generate
    power onsite, perhaps sell it back to the grid when they are
    not using it, the ability to control those microgrids for
    maximum up time.
        The AI that is available now in the energy sector is very
    exciting, and we have been working with--very closely with the
    Department of Energy and with several administrations to make
    sure that we are making these things visible and available.
        So I do believe that we need to consider both the AI itself
    as well as the power provision.
        Mr. Veasey. Thank you very much.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Mr. Bilirakis. All right. Thank you, Mr. Veasey. I
    appreciate he yields back, and now we will recognize Ms. Lee
    from the great State of Florida, Tampa Bay area. And she is
    doing a great job representing my former constituents. So I
    will recognize you for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Ms. Lee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It is, indeed, big shoes
    to fill in Pasco County.
        Ms. Humpton, thank you very much for being here today and
    for providing your testimony. Your perspective on artificial
    intelligence empowering employees really resonates, I think,
    with many of us on this committee. There is a fear that AI will
    replace the American employee, but I agree with you that we
    need to look at AI as an assistant to the American manufacturer
    rather than its replacement.
        Can you provide some examples of how Siemens is using AI in
    manufacturing and supply chains to help its workers do their
    jobs more effectively and productively?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you, Congresswoman Lee. And, yes, this
    is really fun, because there are a couple of fantastic stories
    here.
        Imagine a couple of engineers thinking that they want to
    design a light motor to be used in aviation, electric aviation.
    What you have to do is take weight out of the motor. How are
    you going to do that?
        What these engineers did is they collaborated. They were
    debating back and forth. They were going to have votes on the
    team of who had the better design for one element.
        And one member of the team said, ``Well, why don't we ask
    our generative design assistant?'' And it turned out that
    assistant drew a picture that was unlike what either of the
    expert engineers had come up with, and in fact its performance
    was better than what could have been designed using paper and
    pencil.
        Now, let me tell you another funny story. We work with
    battery manufacturers all the time, and I met with one startup
    about 18 months ago. And the president of the company was
    telling me about his new U.S.-based factory that he was getting
    ready to build.
        I asked him if he had used a digital twin to plan that
    facility. And he said, ``No, I have done something even better.
    I am actually building a scale model. We are going to have just
    one-line, small-scale production."
        I saw that same CEO several months later. And he said,
    ``Barb, I should have gone the digital route. When I built it,
    I forgot to put in any overflow area, and so anytime one part
    of the line stopped, we had a mess on our hands."
        These are just examples of the kinds of things that come up
    where the use of AI can actually elevate the results that we
    get. And that is not to mention the things that are happening
    every day.
        We have operations that require intensive stocking and
    restocking, and, frankly, that is drudgery. But the ability now
    to use artificial intelligence to help us plan that work, plan
    the movement of goods through our factories, we are making our
    own factories safer, more productive and, frankly, just plain
    more fun to work in.
        Ms. Lee. Thank you, Ms. Humpton.
        Now, Mr. Kinder, I want to first congratulate you on the
    grant that Autodesk received from my alma mater, the University
    of Florida, to advance the field of industrialized construction
    engineering.
        As I understand it, this work will dramatically reduce
    construction cost while doubling the speed of construction, and
    I look forward to seeing what this partnership can accomplish.
        Could you tell us about how Autodesk's software makes
    manufacturers more resilient and ready to adapt to supply chain
    disruptions, inflation, and other things?
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you for your question, Congresswoman Lee.
        We are incredibly excited about the project with the
    University of Florida. Industrialized construction is something
    that we have supported for a long time. It is basically
    bringing manufacturing practices and the efficiencies of that
    into the construction process, which does save time and money.
        When you talk about industrialized construction, we are
    talking about building some things off site and then bringing
    them and assembling them on site. We talk about taking
    software, including AI, and bringing manufacturing software,
    the HVAC system in the building, you know, into the
    architectural software and combining those. Historically, those
    have been very disconnected.
        So all of this drives efficiency. And, when you add AI on
    top of that and digital twins, it becomes a much more efficient
    process.
        Ms. Lee. And in addition to the added efficiencies that you
    describe, how can the use of artificial intelligence in this
    way also foster innovation?
        Mr. Kinder. We have a capacity challenge in the U.S. in
    terms of a shortage of skilled labor and manufacturing jobs
    that are unfilled.
        AI, by taking some of the drudgery, as described or some of
    the more mundane or tedious, low-value-added tasks, by
    automating those, you augment the worker. So you are augmenting
    the worker, freeing up some of their time so they can focus on
    much more creative and more productive tasks.
        Ms. Lee. Thank you.
        And, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the gentlewoman.
        I now recognize Representative Trahan for her 5 minutes of
    questioning.
        OK. Well, Ms. Kelly will go first. Thank you. You are
    recognized.
        Ms. Kelly. Thank you, Rep. Trahan. And thank you to the
    chair and ranking member for holding this very important
    hearing to discuss the importance of AI's role in the future of
    American manufacturing.
        Last Congress, I joined former Rep and now U.S. Senator
    Lisa Blunt Rochester and Reps Dingell and Wild in coleading
    multiple bills to make up the supply chain act, which garnered
    the support of over 160 stakeholders.
        These vital bills would have established a new office
    within the Department of Commerce charged with monitoring
    supply chains, identifying supply chain gaps and
    vulnerabilities, as well as addressing supply chain risks.
    Unfortunately, many of these critical provisions were pulled
    from the bipartisan continuing resolution that failed to
    receive a vote.
        Dr. Reynolds, based on your experience with the supply
    chain shock during the pandemic, do you agree that it is
    important that the Federal Government take a leading role in
    mapping and monitoring supply chain vulnerabilities?
        Dr. Reynolds. Well, thank you, Congresswoman. It is an
    important question and one that I lived and breathed for my
    couple of years in the White House. I still have PTSD, I think,
    from the experience.
        But what we learned from that experience at the beginning
    of the COVID crisis was that, in fact, maybe the U.S.
    Government did not have sufficient information--we knew that--
    about supply chains2, but what was more disturbing is that the
    private sector didn't have the information either.
        When the semiconductor crisis hit and we brought in a lot
    of the semiconductor companies or leaders in auto and medical
    devices, they themselves were not clear what their supply chain
    looked like and what the semiconductor industry, you know, in
    supply was facing.
        So it really underscored the role of government here, that
    there is an important role for the Federal Government to play,
    to try and collect the data, obviously, in a way that is
    respecting privacy, to disseminate the data, and be able to
    look around the corner at what the next vulnerability will be.
        And so, while we have really made, I think, significant
    progress on that, we have to realize there is a long way to go.
    And I applaud the work that you have done and the creation of
    more capabilities at the Federal Government level to do this.
        If we think about the recent crisis we had after Hurricane
    Helene hit and all of a sudden the one facility that produced
    IV fluids in this country was wiped out, was that something we
    could have predicted ahead of time? Would we have known that
    that was a challenge? And, in fact, I think AI, generative AI
    will be helpful for us to understand our supply chains and our
    vulnerabilities.
        So I think it's an incredibly important area. I think we
    now look at the U.S. economy in a way that we never did before,
    through the lens of supply chains, and I applaud that work.
        Ms. Kelly. Thank you. Illinois has a history of
    manufacturing, as one of the largest manufacturing centers in
    the Midwest. Chicago and other parts of my district became a
    hub for trade and commerce due to its access to strategic
    waterways and railroads.
        I believe that Illinois' history, coupled with existing
    infrastructure to accommodate large industrial sites of
    manufacturing facilities, will ensure the State has a major
    role in the U.S.' effort to increase domestic manufacturing.
    But to accomplish this goal, we must ensure that small and
    medium-size manufacturers can compete.
        And, Dr. Reynolds, in your written testimony, you mention
    that there are 250,000 small and medium-size manufacturers in
    the U.S. and that we need financial incentives to help them
    make the leap into digital manufacturing.
        What are your best arguments for why, in this budget-
    constrained environment, we should invest more Federal funds in
    small and medium-size manufacturers?
        Dr. Reynolds. Yes. We have been talking about the role of
    the SME as the backbone of manufacturing for this country. And
    I bring that statistic forward, the 250,000 small and medium-
    size firms in the country. If we just wanted 20 percent of
    those to be digitally advanced and leading the country, that is
    50,000 small and medium-size firms. And right now we have no
    way of reaching those firms through any direct mechanisms.
        So what we have to really think is creatively, how do we
    try and support those firms at scale? And I think the argument
    here is that we know that our small and medium-size firms are
    less productive than our larger firms.
        And the positive spillover effects that happen if we can
    get them to become more productive are important not just for
    national security, which would be the first argument you made.
    We have a shrinking supply chain base, and our defense
    industrial base is really suffering from that.
        To the extent that the DoD highlighted in its national
    industrial strategy report last year, supply chain resilience
    among our SMEs is critical for them. But we need that not just
    for defense and national security purposes but also for the
    supply chain resilience.
        As we are looking at ways in which we are trying to invest
    in resilience, not just efficiency, we really have to see how
    our small and medium-size firms play into that and how we can
    support them in being more resilient.
        Ms. Kelly. Thank you. And I am out of time. I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the gentlewoman.
        Now I will recognize Representative Kean for his 5 minutes.
    Welcome to the committee.
        Mr. Kean. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        And thank you to our witnesses for being here today.
        In an era of innovation driven by emerging technologies
    such as AI, it is essential that the Federal Government support
    equally innovative policy solutions to maximize the benefits of
    this technological growth but also allow businesses to innovate
    to stay competitive.
        A successful program in New Jersey has been the
    Manufacturing Extension Partnership. This public-private
    partnership with centers in all 50 States was dedicated to
    helping small and medium-size manufacturers grow and to
    compete.
        Ms. Humpton, as a large manufacturer provides critical
    technologies and tools to a company, what policy tools should
    Congress consider prioritizing the needs of smaller and medium-
    size manufacturers who need access to AI-enabled technologies
    to optimize their operations and to drive their long-term
    success?
        Ms. Humpton. Congressman Kean, thank you. And we are so
    proud that our research headquarters are located in Princeton,
    as well as many of our headquarters functions are in the Iselin
    area.
        The role today of public-private partnership is key. How do
    we reach those small and medium enterprises at scale? We know
    that we have a lot of people, you know, working on that
    problem.
        I believe the work of the manufacturing institutes has been
    critical to progress. And so we alone participate in six or
    seven of the manufacturing institutes, with the goal of
    bringing technologies into an environment where others,
    including small and medium enterprises, can actually experiment
    and adopt.
        One of the things that business can do is to actually look
    at the way technology is provided. We have done an analysis and
    have determined that we need new licensing structures, for
    instance, for small and medium enterprises so that they can
    afford the entry level, you know, to get into the same toolsets
    that large enterprises are using.
        I do believe that a critical piece, then, to cap all of
    this and tie the workers back in is the network of community
    colleges across the United States can be an excellent partner
    in scale.
        Mr. Kean. They are crucially partners in that regard. I
    agree with you on that.
        Mr. Oxman, as you know, there have been ample conversations
    regarding preparing the AI workforce. What do you recommend
    that we as Congress do to position ourselves to better remain
    competitive amidst the growing technological landscape?
        Mr. Oxman. Thank you, Congressman Kean. And I also want to
    thank you for your sponsorship to the LIFT AI Act, which is
    focused entirely on this very important issue. The technology
    industry is laser focused on finding top talent and filling
    hundreds of thousands of open roles and making sure that
    American workers are trained for those opportunities.
        And what we look forward to working with you on in the new
    Congress is opportunities to partner industry and government
    together. The LIFT AI Act, what was great about that is it was
    focused on the National Science Foundation funding research
    opportunities, grant opportunities, educational opportunities
    for STEM education.
        And we would like to work with you on that as well again,
    because that is the important key to making sure we have an
    educated, AI-enabled workforce.
        Mr. Kean. And thank you for that partnership, and look
    forward to continuing to work with you.
        Last month, several of your member companies announced a
    multibillion-dollar investment in a Stargate project over the
    next 4 years to build AI infrastructure, which will power
    future-generation AI technologies here in the United States.
    This is an exciting development for job growth, future
    innovation, and shows another example of U.S. leadership in AI
    development.
        Can you discuss how this project will catalyze U.S.
    economic and AI growth, and what are the direct impacts on U.S.
    manufacturing?
        Mr. Oxman. This is such an exciting announcement. It
    happened on just the second day of the Trump administration.
    The President had leaders from three ITI member companies--
    OpenAI, Oracle, and Softbank--at the White House to announce
    it.
        It is a multihundred-billion-dollar investment in building
    these incredible data center campuses. The first one that has
    been announced has been in Texas, but there are announcements
    pending in multiple States around the country.
        This is going to cement AI leadership in the United States,
    and it is going to create just in the first announced campus
    40,000 jobs. That is what OpenAI predicts will happen. And it
    is going to be a partnership across the entire AI ecosystem
    that will eventually create hundreds of thousands of jobs.
        And, as I mentioned, they are targeting $500 billion worth
    of investment in the United States. So this is a great
    opportunity, another great example of how AI and manufacturing
    together can really partner and grow the U.S. economy and
    create incredible jobs.
        Mr. Kean. Thank you. And I yield back my time.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I thank the gentleman.
        Now I will recognize the ranking member of the full
    committee, Mr. Pallone, for his 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Pallone. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am deeply concerned
    that the chaotic and destructive environment being created by
    President Trump and congressional Republicans is costly for
    consumers and for businesses, including manufacturers.
        American manufacturers are working hard to modernize their
    facilities by adopting AI and other new technologies and
    training their workforce to meet the demands of advanced
    manufacturing. And many of them rely on Federal financial
    support, tax incentives, and other Federal programs to make
    this transition possible.
        But, instead of continuing to promote our vital
    manufacturing sector, President Trump and his billionaire
    friends are sowing seeds of destruction, illegally halting
    Federal funding across the Government, and thrusting our Nation
    into nonsensical trade wars with our allies.
        So, Dr. Reynolds, I have three questions. I will try to get
    them in the 4 minutes.
        How have the programs, investments, and tax credits created
    by the Inflation Reduction Act, CHIPS and Science Act, and the
    Bipartisan Infrastructure Law enabled American manufacturers to
    compete in the global economy, if you will?
        Dr. Reynolds. Thank you, Congressman.
        And I agree with you that, for all of the great investments
    and the progress we are making in our advanced manufacturing,
    we also have experienced in the last few weeks a lot of
    uncertainty. And uncertainty is bad for business, it is bad for
    planning, it is bad for U.S. manufacturing.
        But these investments that have come through the different
    parts of legislation have really sown enormous amounts of
    investment and opportunity going forward. Particularly the use
    of tax incentives, I think, has encouraged private-sector
    investment and leveraged numbers that we have discussed already
    that have been very important.
        Those investments are just getting underway. We have at
    least a decade ahead of us of watching them come to fruition
    and bring jobs and investment in communities across the
    country.
        And I think it is in industries that not only are important
    for the country in terms of national security and supply chain
    resilience but also in terms of export opportunities, places
    where the U.S. can lead globally and where we haven't
    historically.
        Our companies have been put between a rock and a hard place
    over time, over decades. On one side, we have actors, such as
    China, who are engaged in sort of nonmarket activities that
    have made it very hard for our manufacturers to compete. On the
    other hand, we have investors who are looking for short-term
    returns from our manufacturers without a long-term view.
        We now have an opportunity through this legislation in
    which we have invested in the long-term capabilities of
    manufacturing in the U.S. And this is an inflection point, a
    moment for the U.S. in which we can lean in and lead globally
    in these areas.
        Mr. Pallone. Well, I am going to compress my last two
    questions into one. You mentioned tariffs, and this is, of
    course, one of my concerns, that the President and Republicans
    are raising costs for American families who are already
    struggling by throwing the United States into trade wars with
    these tariffs for our closest allies: Canada, Mexico, European
    Union.
        So can you discuss the importance of preserving trade
    relationships with our close allies for access to intermediate
    goods and external markets for finished products, if you will?
        Dr. Reynolds. Well, of course, there are appropriate places
    for tariffs, when it comes to national security, when it comes
    to unfair trade practices.
        But, when it comes to our largest trading partners and
    allies, it is really not the right place for the use of these
    tariffs. I think it raises a number of issues. First, of
    course, it creates this enormous amount of uncertainty. We have
    seen our manufacturers have to, you know, have whiplash over
    whether they were going to see major tariff impositions on
    Mexico and Canada, and then to have that paused. It is costly
    to the economy, it is costly to our manufacturers.
        Second, as you said, it raises the price of intermediate
    goods, and it is not just for some industries. It is for all of
    our manufacturing industries. And so that kind of cost not only
    makes them less competitive, it also puts at risk our
    manufacturing jobs.
        Third, I think it is important for us to recognize that we
    have had trade agreements that we have all come around with our
    allies, Mexico and Canada, and that, if you break those trade
    agreements, you are losing the trust and you are losing
    credibility long term. I think it also makes it harder for us
    to sell our end products, our finished goods in those markets.
        And it is important to understand as well that we have
    built a manufacturing ecosystem that not just ends at our
    borders, it is a North American innovation ecosystem, and it is
    one that the auto industry in particular benefits from.
        Just as a reminder: Mexico supplies about 42 percent of our
    intermediate goods in our auto industry, and Canada supplies
    around 13 percent. So it is very hard to imagine that you are
    putting tariffs on some of these partners who actually are part
    and parcel of our auto industry.
        Mr. Pallone. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Appreciate it very much. The gentleman
    yields back.
        Now I will recognize Representative Evans from the great
    State of Colorado. Welcome to the committee. And, also, I
    enjoyed our conversation on this very subject yesterday. So I
    recognize you for 5 minutes for questioning.
        Mr. Evans. Thank you so much for that, Mr. Chairman. I
    enjoyed the conversation as well.
        Thank you to the ranking member. And thank you, of course,
    to all of our witnesses for coming on this snowy day to have
    this conversation.
        Mr. Oxman, I will start with you first. We have talked a
    lot about competition with China and the CCP. In my district, I
    have a company that uses AI both in the manufacture and the
    deployment of technology that is used to stabilize suspended
    loads. So, right now, it is predominantly used for helicopter
    rescue hoists, military search and rescue, things like that.
        But this technology can also be applied to critical
    infrastructure around, for instance, cranes, port cranes,
    cranes for construction. And so I think most of us are probably
    familiar with some of the risks of the U.S. relying on Chinese
    cranes for that critical infrastructure.
        And so my question to you is, what role does AI play, both
    in being able to protect and harden some of our critical
    infrastructure from malicious attacks abroad, and how can we
    best protect and promote that intellectual property rights and
    keep that from being compromised by some of our foreign
    competitors?
        Mr. Oxman. Thank you, Congressman Evans, for the question.
    This is actually the topic that I think the Trump
    administration is spending some of the most time on, with the
    very early release of the AI Executive order and the recent
    announcement from the Office of Science and Technology Policy
    opening a request for input, for inquiry from industry into AI
    rulemaking.
        We are very pleased to see this early attention to this
    issue because, as you noted, there are critical national
    security implications of making American AI technology
    available internationally. But we have to balance that with the
    need to address international markets and give American
    companies the opportunity to sell around the world to the 95
    percent of the people who live on the planet who don't live in
    the United States.
        So you are right that these are critically important
    issues. And that balance of national security and economic
    interest is one that is very important and very challenging,
    because we do want to make sure that these use cases of AI that
    we have talked about today are available here and also
    available to our allies.
        As you noted, AI can be a critical tool in cybersecurity
    defenses, for example, augmenting human capability and making
    sure that we are hardening our networks and our infrastructure
    against potential adversaries.
        So I think all of these issues are critically important. It
    is heartening to see the Trump administration paying such close
    attention and soliciting industry input, and we look forward to
    working with you on these important issues as well.
        Mr. Evans. Thank you.
        Moving on to Mr. Kinder, in your testimony you talked a lot
    about the use of AI in manufacturing. And we oftentimes hear
    when we are having this conversation that oil and gas levels in
    the U.S. are at record level productions. But I know from
    conversations with my local electric utility that we are going
    to need--at least in my area, we are going to need three times
    as much electricity as currently produced right now to meet
    some of the growing demands for digital and for AI purposes.
        And so my question to you is specifically with regard to
    energy availability, what can Congress do to help ensure that
    the United States and not our foreign adversaries remains the
    global leader both in AI and also in the manufacturing that AI
    supports?
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you for your question, Congressman Evans.
    With respect to energy, AI will use a tremendous amount of
    energy.
        I think what Congress can do is to both strengthen the
    grid, establish policies to help us to strengthen the grid, and
    also help us to find all sources of energy production--
    renewable, nonrenewable--to be able to power.
        Now, I would also add that we are in a stage right now
    where I believe chips will get more efficient. I believe the
    training of models will become more efficient, and the energy
    use will become more efficient in AI. We are still in early
    days in terms of training a lot of these models.
        Mr. Evans. Thank you.
        And then last question to Ms. Humpton. You brought up one
    of my favorite topics, which is microgrids and using AI to be
    able to implement. We were just talking about that all-of-the-
    above energy policy.
        So can you just talk a little bit more about how AI can be
    used when you have rooftop solar panels that are feeding
    electricity into the grid. Then the cloud cover rolls over, the
    temperature drops. Now the heaters kick on, and in the space of
    just a few minutes, now you have electrons flowing the other
    way to now powerhouses that used to be powering the grid, but
    now it is going the other way.
        Can you talk about the complexity of managing the grid and
    AI?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you, Congressman. This is my favorite
    topic. I actually think this is the most exciting segment of
    the U.S. economy right now, is the grid edge, right, where the
    old-fashioned grid and its transmission and distribution meets
    all those users. Well, now all those users of electricity can
    also produce electricity, everything from our cars to our homes
    to our carports.
        So the idea of using the power of software, with large
    utilities now using software to manage the flow across their
    distribution networks to even now the smallest users.
        My mom put rooftop solar on her house. She sells back to
    the utility when she has extra and she buys when she needs to,
    and she has the lowest electricity bills she has ever had.
        These are simple concepts, but they are complex when they
    come together into basically what the National Academy of
    Engineers called the greatest invention of the last century:
    the grid. It is a very complex organism.
        So I think the work of Congress to ensure that we support
    the administration in finding ways to trim back regulation that
    prevents us from being able to make changes, the attention to
    technologies and the ability to educate policymakers--and, by
    the way, Siemens stands ready to work side by side with you.
    This is exciting times.
        Mr. Evans. Thank you so much. I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. The gentleman yields back.
        Now I will recognize Representative Trahan for her 5
    minutes of questioning, and I appreciate her patience.
        Mrs. Trahan. Thank you, Chair Bilirakis.
        Good afternoon, everyone. Although I am not sure that we
    are always going to reach agreement in this committee on a
    whole host of issues, I think everyone in the room absolutely
    agrees that America needs to lead the world on advanced
    manufacturing and artificial intelligence, especially with the
    constant geopolitical threats to our supply chain.
        Stability and reliability in public-private partnerships is
    vital to ensure that American businesses can plan for the long
    term and trust that the Government will be there to build out
    programs to foster these types of partnerships, the CHIPS and
    Science Act, the Infrastructure Law, the Inflation Reduction
    Act.
        You know, in my district in Massachusetts, I have seen the
    powerful impact that those strong public-private partnerships
    can have on stimulating the local economy and onshoring high-
    paying jobs. And, when done together with groundbreaking
    research institutions, like UMass Lowell, those programs are
    one of the best ways legislators can work to increase American
    competitiveness.
        Dr. Reynolds, how does direct investment in public-private
    partnerships accelerate the onshoring of manufacturing? I know
    you have answered this question, but I wanted to set the stage.
        Dr. Reynolds. Sure. Thank you very much. It is a great
    question, and appreciate that, particularly coming from the
    State of Massachusetts, which is really a leader in these kinds
    of partnerships.
        What we have seen, of course, is that some of our best
    innovation is coming out of the university partnership that
    occurs between universities and investors and basically the
    larger ecosystem in a place like Massachusetts.
        And those innovations are leading to some of the most
    advanced new technologies as well as startups. And our hope in
    developing that kind of investment and building up that
    pipeline is that in fact we grow these companies, we grow these
    technologies, and they become global leaders for the country
    and for export.
        So we have a lot of great examples of how we do this. I
    think the investments that we have seen to date in university
    research, in early stage research, is critically important for
    driving some of the later developments. We saw it, of course,
    with the COVID vaccine.
        Mrs. Trahan. Absolutely. I don't know if you could just
    follow up. How are those manufacturers affected when sudden
    changes, like a blanket Federal funding freeze, are announced?
    I mean, I am hoping that you can just describe the impact that
    that kind of unpredictability has on the investments in these
    partnerships or deter even private-sector engagement in those
    ongoing efforts.
        Dr. Reynolds. Well, I think that we have talked to date
    about the importance of certainty and predictability in the
    business context and what it means for firms as they decide
    what to invest in and when to make those investments that they
    can see ahead. And it certainly has been an uncertain few weeks
    here in the United States.
        I think that is also the case when it comes to
    collaborators and partners like universities. Budgets are laid
    out years in advance. The importance of building up labs and
    building up the knowledge base and capabilities in a lab does
    not happen overnight. It happens over years. It is also very
    expensive to build that kind of capability.
        And so having some predictability on budgets is something,
    of course, everybody in this room can appreciate how that helps
    us deliver the important outputs we are looking for.
        Mrs. Trahan. Thank you, Dr. Reynolds. I can tell you that
    manufacturers in my district and across Massachusetts are
    deeply distressed when they hear the President threaten to take
    those funds away. In some cases, it will be catastrophic. And
    even the threats weaken America as a place to do business.
        Mr. Kinder, you mentioned in your testimony that the U.S.
    manufacturing sector has 622,000 unfilled jobs. And you
    highlighted the critical role of STEM education from K through
    12, technical training, apprenticeship programs in addressing
    this gap.
        This administration is threatening to cut those very
    educational programs, even going so far as dismantling the
    Department of Education. The development of our technical and
    manufacturing workforce would be decimated.
        How would you, how would Autodesk have to adjust as an
    employer to meet that demand in workforce if that was to
    happen?
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you for your question. We work with the
    education community at length. We have over 19,000 institutions
    from kindergarten all the way through graduate schools,
    vocational schools, to provide free software to be able to
    train that next generation.
        We think that is absolutely critical, and we will be
    training them in tools that include AI going forward, helping
    to upskill that workforce.
        Mrs. Trahan. Well, thank you. I know I have run out of
    time. I will submit my other questions for the record.
        Thank you, Mr. Chair.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much.
        Now I will recognize Mr. Goldman for his 5 minutes of
    questioning.
        Mr. Goldman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, very much.
        Mr. Oxman, Lockheed Martin and other defense manufacturers
    in my district use AI into their assembly lines and supply
    chain logistics to improve efficiency, enhance quality control,
    and more. Why is it important both to our economic and national
    security that this industry have access to cutting-edge
    technology in manufacturing?
        Mr. Oxman. Thank you, Congressman Goldman. And your
    district is, in fact, a hotbed of innovation. ITI member
    company Medtronic is also doing a lot of investment in AI-
    powered medical devices in your district as well.
        So the short answer to your question is, This is key to the
    manufacturing renaissance that is taking place in the United
    States. And what we are particularly excited about is how, as
    you hear from all the witnesses today, this is an ecosystem in
    the technology sector that is powering this.
        So you have got software companies, hardware companies.
    Data center operators is another area that is just exploding in
    Texas in particular. Semiconductor manufacturers also exploding
    in Texas right now, the investment of literally tens of
    billions of dollars in semiconductor manufacturing facilities
    in Texas.
        So all of this is taking place at a time that we are
    focused on the right solutions to power that kind of investment
    in innovation. And power is quite literally one of those areas
    that we need to focus on as well, making sure the energy grid
    can support it, that we are investing in an all-of-the-above
    energy strategy to make it happen.
        So we are very excited about working together to make sure
    that the policy environment is right. But, as you can tell, in
    Texas and across the country, this investment is taking place
    today.
        Mr. Goldman. Thank you so much.
        And, Ms. Humpton, I know you know something about not
    necessarily my district, Mr. Veasey's district, but welcome to
    Fort Worth. Siemens is opening a new facility there, exactly
    the type of activity we need to enhance our technological
    leadership and support onshoring domestic manufacturing.
        I understand that Siemens is innovating not only with
    industrial AI but is also experienced in how to drive
    efficiency and maximize operations at data centers.
        Can you please elaborate on Siemens' expertise in this
    arena and how you view data centers as critical to domestic
    manufacturing?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you so much, Congressman. And by the
    way, you would be delighted to know that our technology is also
    used by some of those other manufacturers.
        So here is the interesting thing about this technology: It
    is in and around the manufacturing life cycle. And so it is
    fascinating to think about where does a company like Siemens
    play in the data center marketplace. Not only are we helping
    the semiconductor manufacturers design their chips so that we
    can achieve that, you know, enhanced energy efficiency,
    cooling, et cetera, and enhanced performance, we are also
    helping those who are constructing the data centers to build
    their data centers and provide the critical power to them.
        So my colleagues at Siemens Energy are off generating
    power, and they put it on high-voltage transmission lines,
    medium- and low-voltage switchgear. I mean, don't get me
    started, because it is great stuff.
        But we are using those AI tools and in fact manufacturing
    them close to you at Fort Worth, all of those components that
    go into the data center. And then we ourselves are users of the
    AI that gets managed inside those data centers.
        This is truly--I heard a phrase recently that may apply
    right now: ``Partnership is the new leadership.'' That is the
    era we are in now, and I am excited about what we can do
    together.
        Mr. Goldman. We are glad to be your partner. Can you also
    describe the likelihood of autonomous manufacturing facilities
    in the short term? What are the pros and cons and which
    regulations should we consider removing or adding to facilitate
    U.S. innovation versus those we should create as guardrails to
    protect workers?
        Ms. Humpton. Well, as we have talked about today, we
    actually have a shortage of workers in manufacturing. So what
    we know for sure is that we need to make every individual who
    is in a manufacturing environment as productive as they can
    possibly be. Technology can help us do that. That is wonderful.
        We have had a little bit of conversation about lights-out
    facilities, and I don't know about many of them. Sure, there
    are many things that can be done on a lights-out basis. If we
    think about, you know, let's say the pharmaceutical production
    line, and when we get to the point of individualized medicine,
    the ability for an autonomous line to actually control and
    monitor the progress of materials that are flowing through the
    manufacturing line.
        We know that will come. But, in most cases, what we are
    really doing is making things that need to be assembled within
    a larger supply chain. There is a lot of logistics, yhere is a
    lot of tracking. People are needed in the creativity that puts
    all of those pieces together. And I think we are going to see
    that for quite some time.
        Mr. Goldman. You timed that perfectly. Thank you very much.
        Thank you, all the panelists.
        Mr. Chairman, I yield.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I appreciate it very much. The gentleman
    yields back.
        Now we are at--I believe we have Ms. Schrier.
        Dr. Schrier, you are recognized for 5 minutes for your
    questioning.
        Ms. Schrier. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you to our
    witnesses. We have heard from each of you that we need
    significantly more workers with targeted technical expertise,
    including in AI-assisted manufacturing, in order for America's
    advanced manufacturing industry to stay competitive in a global
    market.
        However, what I am hearing from the business community is
    that President Trump's erratic, emotional behavior has brought
    uncertainty and chaos to American businesses that are looking
    to invest in the future and plan and train up labor.
        My Republican colleagues have spoken at length about the
    need to protect America's competitive advantage within the
    increasingly competitive field of advanced manufacturing. And I
    agree with them. We have got to keep our competitive edge in
    every industry where it makes sense for us to be leading in
    manufacturing.
        But, at the same time, the Trump administration's recent
    governmentwide Federal funding freeze and efforts to dismantle
    the Department of Education, a career and technical information
    source, tariffs on our strategic allies--I have heard just
    radio silence from my Republican colleagues about this. And
    this is ultimately going to undermine the United States'
    competitive and educational workforce and technological
    competitiveness.
        Ms. Humpton, you are the CEO of Siemens USA, a subsidiary
    of the much larger Siemens International, based in Germany. And
    in fact your ultrasound headquarters is just down the street
    from my house in my congressional district, and I have visited
    many times and have been so impressed by the way that you have
    used AI to diagnose fatty liver disease with a simple
    ultrasound. And so thank you for using that and saving lives.
        On Monday night, President Trump issued an Executive order
    imposing 25 percent tariffs--excuse me--on steel and aluminum
    imports. Germany is one of the largest exporters of steel to
    the United States.
        And you talked about sourcing materials here, but the issue
    is complicated because, if there is scarcity here, prices go
    up, and there are retaliatory tariffs. You are going to have
    difficulty exporting--you are going to have difficulty
    exporting----
        Ms. Humpton. I wonder if I understand the question. Let me
    say this, that I don't think you will get any business to say,
    ``Yes, we want more cost in our supply chain.'' Nobody would
    say that.
        But what we do recognize is that we have an administration
    that is very supportive of manufacturing overall in the United
    States.
        We are going to stay laser focused on our customers' needs,
    make sure we are responsive to them and make sure we do
    everything we can, even as policies and regulations change, to
    make the most of American manufacturing and the opportunity
    ahead of us.
        Ms. Schrier. Thank you. I am going to yield back because of
    my cough. I apologize.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you. It happens. It happens. It
    happened to me the other day, so we understand. Thank you.
        The gentlelady yields back. Now I will recognize my good
    friend, who represents the University of Florida. I know what
    she is going to talk about, what she is going to highlight, I
    am sure. I will recognize her for her questioning, her 5
    minutes of questioning.
        Mrs. Cammack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        And, of course, go Gators, as always.
        Actually, my questions were asked earlier by my good friend
    also from the Sunshine State, Representative Laurel Lee. And so
    now that we are towards the tail end of the committee hearing,
    a lot has been discussed.
        Certainly, I wanted to talk about digital twins, the
    investments the University of Florida is making, but I wanted
    to open up the floor to each of our witnesses, because I know
    there is always something that gets left out of these hearings.
        So I am going to start with you, Ms. Humpton, if you can
    maybe speak to some of the things that you wanted to cover or
    didn't get asked in this hearing yet today.
        Ms. Humpton. This has been a phenomenal conversation. And I
    am looking down at my notes of things that I wanted to make
    sure we covered, and I am coming up empty.
        Thank you for making sure that we have a comprehensive
    dialogue. I think the thing that I hope we all leave with today
    is that industrial AI is different from consumer AI. Thank you.
        Mrs. Cammack. Absolutely. And thank you for all the work
    that you do on digital twins. It is absolutely revolutionary,
    and I am very excited for the possibilities of digital twins in
    multiple different industries and sectors. So thank you.
        Mr. Kinder, I know Representative Laurel Lee, she mentioned
    the University of Florida and the College of Engineering.
    Anything that you wanted to add as part of your response to her
    question or expand on that?
        I should clarify a little bit: more specifically, the
    importance of R&D and the investments that we have to make at
    the university level in order to continue pushing this type of
    technology.
        Mr. Kinder. Yes. Thank you for the question, Congresswoman.
    We are very excited about the Florida partnership. I think it
    is going to launch this fall, I believe is the plan for the
    degree program.
        We think bringing manufacturing techniques to the building
    sector will revolutionize how we build, especially housing, of
    which there is a critical shortage in the U.S. Our software,
    the training we provide teaches students how to reduce those
    costs by 50 percent. And this is where Autodesk brings together
    both manufacturing and architecture, engineering, and
    construction.
        We partnered with a modular construction company in
    Oakland, California, to design more than 300 AI-enabled
    affordable housing units at about half the cost and half the
    time and half of the waste in the process. So we are very proud
    of that and look forward to, you know, working with and
    partnering with universities to further that type of research.
        Mrs. Cammack. And, along with that, in Congress we are
    doing everything we can to make sure that the regulatory
    environment doesn't trip everybody up as we are innovating. And
    you guys are doing so much more with half the cost and half the
    time. We need to do it with half the regulation. So this is my
    shameless plug for the REINS Act right now. But thank you for
    that.
        Dr. Reynolds, I saw you flipping through your notes to make
    sure that there was nothing that you hadn't missed. Was there
    anything that you wanted to cover that we haven't touched on
    today?
        Dr. Reynolds. You know, I might just reinforce a few points
    that I think have been made today. The first one I want to make
    is a sense of urgency. I think that we have an understanding
    that we really need to do a collaborative project here. This is
    going to take government, it is going to take industry, it is
    going to take academia, take the civil society.
        But we have an urgent moment here, because I think the U.S.
    is at an inflection point. And we have done so much over the
    last few years to rebuild this manufacturing base, to build
    momentum.
        We now have hundreds of new facilities being built. We have
    a whole new crop of manufacturing startups that are really
    changing the face, particularly in AI. All of that momentum
    must continue. And if we can get aligned and ensure that we
    don't have too much disruption or changing of the rules
    midstream, I think that we are really going to be able to
    accelerate the work here and succeed with our tipping point.
        And so I want to also just emphasize that the path forward
    is really an investment in the technology, but it is also an
    investment in our workers, and those together will help us do
    this.
        Mrs. Cammack. Excellent. Thank you.
        The floor is yours.
        Mr. Oxman. Thank you, Congresswoman. I think the one issue
    that didn't come up today that I just want to mention is tax
    policy. And I realize this is not the tax -riting committee,
    but everyone here is going to have an opportunity to vote on
    taxes at some point.
        The expiration of the provision in the 2017 Tax Cuts and
    JOBS Act that allows companies to deduct the investment that
    they make in research and development----
        Mrs. Cammack. Absolutely.
        Mr. Oxman [continuing]. In the year in which that
    investment takes place, the expiration of that provision has
    been enormously harmful to the ability of companies to invest
    in R&D here in the U.S. Restoring that provision will be kind
    of the fuse that ignites a renaissance of investment in
    manufacturing and other industries here in the U.S. So that is
    the one thing that I would mention.
        Mrs. Cammack. And thank you for mentioning that. As someone
    who represents one of the top biotech hubs and incubators in
    the world, the R&D tax credit deduction is absolutely important
    and critical to so many industries.
        So thank you all so much for your time and expertise today.
    And the future is bright. I am so glad that we are not having a
    doomsdayer conversation today. So thank you.
        And, with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. I appreciate it very much. And that was a
    great move, Kat. Thank you for giving them the opportunity to
    elaborate on these issues. We appreciate it very much.
        Next, we have--we don't have anybody on the Democrat side.
    Dr.--oh, yes, yes. I am sorry. Mrs. Houchin. She is a great, a
    valuable member of our committee, and we are very fortunate to
    have her. And we will be working on quite a few issues
    together.
        I will recognize you for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mrs. Houchin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am pleased to be a
    member of the subcommittee.
        And thank you to the ranking member and to our witnesses
    for your testimony today.
        My home State of Indiana is one of the most manufacturing-
    intensive States in the country. According to the Indiana
    Manufacturers Association, manufacturing makes up 28 percent of
    Indiana's GDP and 17 percent of our workforce. When you account
    for the broad impact beyond the workforce that it directly
    employs, more than half of all jobs in Indiana do have a
    connection to the manufacturing sector.
        It is no secret, however, that the industry has had its
    challenges, from international competitors like China that seek
    to undermine our U.S.-based companies to the difficulties
    facing domestic supply chains. The manufacturing sector must
    have necessary tools to compete in a global economy.
        Fortunately, AI offers a potential solution to several of
    these problems. In its applications in American manufacturing,
    AI has been found to reduce costs, improve workforce
    efficiency, and make U.S. States like Indiana better places to
    do business.
        And I acknowledge that this technology is new and rapidly
    advancing. I am excited by the opportunities it presents
    manufacturers back home as we look to bring jobs back to the
    United States.
        Mr. Kinder, my question for you is, Much of the
    manufacturing that happens in districts like mine come from
    small to midsize businesses. When you are engaging and working
    with manufacturers of this size, if you could just highlight a
    few of the challenges that you think--the biggest challenges
    they face.
        Mr. Kinder. Thank you for your question, and great to be a
    fellow Hoosier.
        Small and medium-size manufacturers face global competition
    even though they may operate in, you know, Columbus, Indiana.
    And they don't want to fall behind, yet for them to be able to
    invest and keep up the pace, it is a challenge. They don't have
    the economies of scale, and they don't have, you know, a
    government that may be completely subsidizing the investments
    that they are trying to make.
        So the challenges that I see or that we hear from our
    customers, our small and medium-size customers, is they want to
    invest, they want to be as efficient as they can, but that
    requires often new processes, new equipment, new factories, new
    software. And that is an investment, a hurdle for them to get
    over to be able to invest in what we call digital
    transformation, of which AI is just another next step in it.
        Now, the promise of AI, the beautiful promise of AI is it
    can make our small and medium-size enterprises more
    competitive. It can take out some of the cost that they would
    pay, have to pay manually that larger companies or global
    manufacturers wouldn't have to.
        Mrs. Houchin. Is that something that you think the R&D tax
    credit could play a part in helping them make some of those
    investments?
        Mr. Kinder. I think tax credits that help to support
    investment in R&D absolutely can help, yes.
        Mrs. Houchin. So we want our small businesses to remain
    competitive, and you have touched on this a little bit, how
    adopting AI for technologies and processes can be helpful.
        Could you talk a little bit about Autodesk, how that helps
    manufacturers access AI? What are some of the challenges that
    are inherent in adopting that technology, and then what steps,
    if any, should Congress take to support our small and medium-
    size manufacturers in adopting AI?
        Mr. Kinder. I think what we do at Autodesk in terms of
    introducing AI is we try to solve specific problems. So we look
    at, you know, industrial-level data, constrained datasets, not
    kind of large amounts of data, that apply to the manufacturing
    process.
        And we figure out what the problems are that these small
    and medium-size manufacturers face and solve those, such as
    automated drawings. We recently rolled out automated sketch
    constraints. When you are building a table or modeling a table
    and you change the dimensions, you want the legs to move too at
    the same time. You can do all of that using AI, and it speeds
    up the overall process.
        Mrs. Houchin. Great. Well, as we work to make the United
    States the best possible place to work and build things, we
    also have to look at the resiliency of our supply chains,
    making it easier for companies to adapt when disruptions
    happen.
        Ms. Humpton, what role can AI play in the optimization of
    resources and processes within manufacturing supply chains,
    with the few seconds we have remaining?
        Ms. Humpton. What I would tell you is that we all know that
    our supply chain and logistics experts have become heroes over
    the last few years. Giving them the superpower to analyze
    networks and understand where bottlenecks are, find
    alternatives, AI can help them every single day.
        Mrs. Houchin. Thank you.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Mrs. Houchin, appreciate it very
    much.
        Now we have the vice chairman of the full committee, my
    very good friend and fellow Pittsburgh Pirate fan, Vice
    Chairman Joyce, John Joyce. Thank you, Doctor, appreciate it. I
    will recognize you for your 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Joyce. First, I want to thank you, Chairman Bilirakis,
    for allowing me to waive onto this important hearing.
        As we have covered in several hearings across multiple
    Energy and Commerce subcommittees, the AI revolution is here,
    and it will ultimately influence so many aspects of our lives
    with everything from medical services to manufacturing
    optimization. AI adds the efficiency and precision that will
    allow Americans to receive faster results and have a more
    productive and dynamic economy.
        In the changing geopolitical climate that we live in, it is
    critical that we stay ahead of our adversaries. The competition
    for the fastest and most capable AI is heating up. And China
    has made it clear of its intentions to dominate in this space.
        America and the free world can't afford to fall behind and
    allow the Chinese Communist Party to be the leader in this
    critical sector for the future of our economy and for our
    national security.
        Fortunately, America has a strong advantage. As tech
    leaders like Elon Musk have said, AI could lead energy demand
    as much as twice of what it is currently. And that energy, that
    energy that Elon Musk referenced, exists today under the feet
    of my constituents in Pennsylvania.
        The access to energy and energy infrastructure is the tide
    that will lift all boats. We have already begun to see this in
    my home State with data center agreements between AWS and Talen
    Energy at the Susquehanna nuclear generation facility and the
    reopening of Three Mile Island, thanks to a purchase power
    agreement between Constellation Energy and Microsoft.
        These deals will lead to billions of dollars of investment
    in these communities, and they will provide family-sustaining
    wages, jobs that are so necessary. They will also provide
    revenue, revenue for schools, for libraries, for police
    stations, firehouses, and hospitals.
        As we look forward to engaging not only our merchant
    nuclear assets for AI but the robust natural gas electricity
    generation we have in this country, opportunities for rural
    America will only continue to grow, and grow we must.
        AI has a large role to play in bringing back American
    manufacturing. President Trump has made it clear: In this new
    golden age of America, we need to ensure products are made
    right here and that family-sustaining jobs stay here.
        Increases in efficiency and worker productivity that the
    use of AI will give American companies the edge that they need
    to compete and they need to win. The faster that we develop AI
    and build the needed data centers, the better we can protect
    our Nation's interests and bring back the economic
    opportunities that America has not seen in the past 4 years.
        Mr. Oxman, from the AI perspective, why is getting our
    energy policy right important for securing American leadership
    in artificial intelligence?
        Mr. Oxman. Dr. Joyce, thank you for the question, and
    grateful to you for highlighting what ITI member companies like
    AWS and Microsoft are doing in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania
    to bring this energy discussion to the forefront because, to
    your question, AI is not in a vacuum. It exists because of data
    centers, and those data centers are the key to continued U.S.
    domination of AI innovation worldwide.
        Data centers do require a lot of power, like all of the
    other activities that we engage in on a daily basis. And
    finding new energy solutions, including nuclear, are key to
    continued U.S. growth and economic activity around AI.
        So thank you for raising that issue, and thank you for your
    leadership on making sure that those energy pathways for data
    centers are available.
        Mr. Joyce. Thank you for your answer.
        Ms. Humpton, in the global economy that Siemens
    participates, we have seen other countries manipulate currency,
    we have seen unfairly subsidized industry, we have seen the
    theft of intellectual property, we have seen countries ignore
    environmental regulations and use captive labor to gain
    advantages for their domestic manufacturing.
        How can large companies like Siemens that follow the rules,
    how can they invest and make sure that AI allows you to
    outcompete these known bad actors?
        Ms. Humpton. Thank you, Congressman, for that question. And
    in fact, first I will say that the U.S. is Siemens' largest
    market. I like to brag about this. We are responsible for about
    25 percent of Siemens' work all around the globe. But, as you
    say, we are a global company and working in accordance with the
    regulations and principles that truly lift up the role of
    manufacturing globally in the way it is done.
        AI, industrial AI in particular, can be essential in making
    workers in these developed and friendly countries that we work
    with so closely, to help make all of our workers more
    productive.
        When we do that, we know that we all succeed. We are in a
    moment in time when bringing back American manufacturing in
    particular and taking advantage of American workers through AI,
    we are going to be able to enhance their ability to produce in
    a much more efficient way, and that makes us far more
    competitive here and at home.
        Mr. Joyce. And that efficient way will allow so many
    Americans to appreciate the new golden age of America.
        I thank all the witnesses for being present here today.
        Mr. Chairman, thank you for allowing me to waive on. I
    yield back.
        Mr. Bilirakis. That is a good way to end it. So we
    appreciate you so very much. I think that this committee is off
    to a great start. I think my ranking member will agree.
        And I want to thank the witnesses. You did an outstanding
    job, were very informative. So we will continue this
    discussion.
        I ask unanimous consent that the documents on the staff
    document list be submitted for the record.
        Without objection, so ordered.
        [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
        Mr. Bilirakis. I remind Members that they have 10 business
    days to submit questions for the record, and I ask the
    witnesses to respond to the questions promptly. Members should
    submit their questions by the close of business February 26th.
        So, without objection, the subcommittee is adjourned. Thank
    you. Thank you, everyone, we appreciate it very much.
        [Whereupon, at 2:03 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
        [Material submitted for inclusion in the record follows:]
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