[House Hearing, 119 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                           COMBATING EXISTING AND EMERGING 
                               ILLICIT DRUG THREATS

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                         SUBCOMMITTEE ON HEALTH

                                 OF THE

                    COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE
                        HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                             FIRST SESSION

                               __________

                            FEBRUARY 6, 2025

                               __________

                            Serial No. 119-4
                            
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]                            


     Published for the use of the Committee on Energy and Commerce

                   govinfo.gov/committee/house-energy
                        energycommerce.house.gov
                        
                                __________

                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
59-561 PDF                  WASHINGTON : 2025                  
          
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------     
                        
                    COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE

                        BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky
                                 Chairman
ROBERT E. LATTA, Ohio                FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey
H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia           Ranking Member
GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida            DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado
RICHARD HUDSON, North Carolina       JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois
EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, Georgia    DORIS O. MATSUI, California
GARY J. PALMER, Alabama              KATHY CASTOR, Florida
NEAL P. DUNN, Florida                PAUL TONKO, New York
DAN CRENSHAW, Texas                  YVETTE D. CLARKE, New York
JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania, Vice       RAUL RUIZ, California
    Chairman                         SCOTT H. PETERS, California
RANDY K. WEBER, Sr., Texas           DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan
RICK W. ALLEN, Georgia               MARC A. VEASEY, Texas
TROY BALDERSON, Ohio                 ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
RUSS FULCHER, Idaho                  NANETTE DIAZ BARRAGAN, California
AUGUST PFLUGER, Texas                DARREN SOTO, Florida
DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee         KIM SCHRIER, Washington
MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa       LORI TRAHAN, Massachusetts
KAT CAMMACK, Florida                 LIZZIE FLETCHER, Texas
JAY OBERNOLTE, California            ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ, New York
JOHN JAMES, Michigan                 JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, Massachusetts
CLIFF BENTZ, Oregon                  TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
ERIN HOUCHIN, Indiana                ROBERT MENENDEZ, New Jersey
RUSSELL FRY, South Carolina          KEVIN MULLIN, California
LAUREL M. LEE, Florida               GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
NICHOLAS A. LANGWORTHY, New York     JENNIFER L. McCLELLAN, Virginia
THOMAS H. KEAN, Jr., New Jersey
MICHAEL A. RULLI, Ohio
GABE EVANS, Colorado
CRAIG A. GOLDMAN, Texas
JULIE FEDORCHAK, North Dakota
                                 ------                                

                           Professional Staff

                     MEGAN JACKSON, Staff Director
                SOPHIE KHANAHMADI, Deputy Staff Director
               TIFFANY GUARASCIO, Minority Staff Director
                         Subcommittee on Health

                   EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, Georgia
                                 Chairman
NEAL P. DUNN, Florida, Vice          DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado
    Chairman                           Ranking Member
H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia         RAUL RUIZ, California
GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida            DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan
DAN CRENSHAW, Texas                  ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
JOHN JOYCE, Pennsylvania             NANETTE DIAZ BARRAGAN, California
TROY BALDERSON, Ohio                 KIM SCHRIER, Washington
DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee         LORI TRAHAN, Massachusetts
MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa       MARC A. VEASEY, Texas
KAT CAMMACK, Florida                 LIZZIE FLETCHER, Texas
JAY OBERNOLTE, California            ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ, New York
JOHN JAMES, Michigan                 JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, Massachusetts
CLIFF BENTZ, Oregon                  TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
ERIN HOUCHIN, Indiana                GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
NICHOLAS A. LANGWORTHY, New York     FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey (ex 
THOMAS H. KEAN, Jr., New Jersey          officio)
MICHAEL A. RULLI, Ohio
BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky (ex 
    officio)
                             C O N T E N T S

                              ----------                              
                                                                   Page
Hon. Earl L. ``Buddy'' Carter, a Representative in Congress from 
  the State of Georgia, opening statement........................     1
    Prepared statement...........................................     3
Hon. Diana DeGette, a Representative in Congress from the State 
  of Colorado, opening statement.................................     6
    Prepared statement...........................................     9
Hon. Brett Guthrie, a Representative in Congress from the 
  Commonwealth of Kentucky, opening statement....................    12
    Prepared statement...........................................    14
Hon. Lori Trahan, a Representative in Congress from the 
  Commonwealth of Massachusetts, opening statement...............    17
    Prepared statement...........................................    19

                               Witnesses

Raymond Cullen, Family Advocate..................................    22
    Prepared statement...........................................    25
Sheriff Michael Bouchard, Vice President, Government Affairs, 
  Major County Sheriffs of America...............................    30
    Prepared statement...........................................    32
    Answers to submitted questions...............................   231
Timothy W. Westlake, M.D., Emergency Physician, Oconomowoc 
  Memorial Hospital, ProHealth Care Medical System...............    43
    Prepared statement...........................................    45
Regina M. LaBelle, Professor of Addiction Policy, Georgetown 
  University Graduate School of Arts and Sciences................    58
    Prepared statement...........................................    60
    Answers to submitted questions...............................   233
Deepa Camenga, M.D., Chair, Committee on Substance Use and 
  Prevention, American Academy of Pediatrics.....................    65
    Prepared statement...........................................    67
    Answers to submitted questions...............................   236

                           Submitted Material

Inclusion of the following was approved by unanimous consent.
List of documents submitted for the record.......................   144
Letter of January 29, 2025, from William J. Johnson, Executive 
  Director, National Association of Police Organizations, to 
  Senator Bill Cassidy and Mr. Griffith..........................   145
Letter of January 31, 2025, from Association of State Criminal 
  Investigative Agencies, et al., to House Speaker J. Michael 
  Johnson and Mr. Griffith.......................................   146
Letter of February 5, 2025, from American Academy of Pain 
  Medicine, et al., to Mr. Carter of Georgia and Ms. DeGette.....   148
Article of February 3, 2025, ``B.C. organized crime expanding 
  export of fentanyl and other drugs,'' by Kim Bolan, Vancouver 
  Sun............................................................   151
Letter of February 6, 2025, from Tom Kraus, Vice President, 
  Government Relations, American Society of Health-System 
  Pharmacists, to Mr. Guthrie, et al.............................   153
Letter of February 6, 2025, from Sandra Faeh, President, American 
  Veterinary Medical Association, to Mr. Guthrie and Mr. Pallone.   160
Article of February 5, 2025, ``DOGE Aides Search Medicare Agency 
  Payment Systems for Fraud,'' by Anna Wilde Mathews and Liz 
  Essley Whyte, Wall Street Journal..............................   162
Article of February 3, 2025, ``Elon Musk's Blitz Shakes U.S. 
  Government as He Sweeps Through Agencies,'' by Jonathan Swan, 
  et al., The New York Times.....................................   165
Letter of February 6, 2025, from Susan Ousterman to Mr. Guthrie 
  and Mr. Pallone................................................   184
Letter of February 3, 2025, from Brian Hurley, President, 
  American Society of Addiction Medicine, to Hon. Chuck Grassley, 
  et al..........................................................   187
Letter of February 3, 2025, from ACLU of Nevada, et al., to 
  Senate Majority Leader John Thune, et al.......................   193
Letter of February 4, 2025, from Jesselyn McCurdy, Executive Vice 
  President of Government Affairs, The Leadership Conference on 
  Civil and Human Rights, to House Speaker Mike Johnson and House 
  Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries................................   201
Article of December 9, 2023, ``How a factory city in Wisconsin 
  fed military-grade weapons to a Mexican cartel,'' by Sarah 
  Kinosian, Reuters..............................................   204
Article of April 16, 2024, ``How the United States Arms the 
  Mexican Cartels,'' Rolling Stone, book excerpt by Ieva 
  Jusionyte......................................................   217
Memorandum of January 21, 2025, ``Interim Policy Changes 
  Regarding Charging, Sentencing, And Immigration Enforcement,'' 
  Acting Deputy Attorney General, Department of Justice..........   225
Report, ``PART VII: Firearm Commerce, Crime Guns, and the 
  Southwest Border,'' National Firearms Commerce and Trafficking 
  Assessment (NFCTA): Protecting America from Trafficked 
  Firearms, Volume Four, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and 
  Explosives \1\
Article of February 4, 2025, ``Virginia community health centers 
  close over federal funding access,'' by Adrienne Hoar McGibbon, 
  VPM News.......................................................   228

----------

\1\ The report has been retained in committee files and is included in 
the Documents for the Record at https://docs.house.gov/meetings/IF/
IF14/20250206/117857/HHRG-119-IF14-20250206-SD003-U1.pdf.

 
          COMBATING EXISTING AND EMERGING ILLICIT DRUG THREATS

                              ----------                              


                       THURSDAY; February 6, 2025

                  House of Representatives,
                            Subcommittee on Health,
                          Committee on Energy and Commerce,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10:00 a.m., in 
the John D. Dingell Room 2123, Rayburn House Office Building, 
Hon. Earl L. ``Buddy'' Carter (chairman of the subcommittee) 
presiding.
    Members present: Representatives Carter of Georgia, Dunn, 
Griffith, Bilirakis, Crenshaw, Joyce, Balderson, Harshbarger, 
Miller-Meeks, Cammack, Obernolte, James, Bentz, Langworthy, 
Kean, Rulli, Guthrie (ex officio), DeGette (subcommittee 
ranking member), Ruiz, Dingell, Kelly, Barragan, Schrier, 
Trahan, Veasey, Fletcher, Ocasio-Cortez, Auchincloss, Carter of 
Louisiana, and Landsman.
    Also present: Representatives Latta, Tonko, and McClellan
    Staff present: Ansley Boylan, Director of Operations; 
Jessica Donlon, General Counsel; Kristin Fritsch, Professional 
Staff Member, Health; Sydney Greene, Director, Finance and 
Logistics; Jay Gulshen, Chief Counsel, Health; Calvin Huggins, 
Staff Assistant; Megan Jackson, Staff Director; Sophie 
Khanahmadi, Deputy Staff Director; Chris Krepich, Senior 
Communication Advisor; Brayden Lacefield, Special Assistant; 
Joel Miller, Chief Counsel; Emily Hale, Staff Assistant; 
Jackson Rudden, Staff Assistant; Chris Sarley, Member Services/
Stakeholder Director; Emma Schultheis, Clerk, Health; Kaley 
Stidham, Press Assistant; Lydia Abma, Minority Policy Analyst; 
Sam Avila, Minority Health Fellow; Shana Beavin, Minority 
Professional Staff Member; Rasheedah Blackwood, Minority 
Intern; Keegan Cardman, Minority Staff Assistant; Waverly 
Gordon, Minority Deputy Staff Director and General Counsel; 
Tiffany Guarascio, Minority Staff Director; Una Lee, Minority 
Chief Counsel, Health; and Hannah Treger, Minority Intern.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The subcommittee will come to order.
    The Chair recognizes himself for 5 minutes for an opening 
statement.

     OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, A 
      REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF GEORGIA

    Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for being here today as we 
gavel in the first Energy and Commerce Subcommittee on Health 
hearing.
    American families across the country continue to suffer 
from the failures of the Biden-Harris administration's 
disastrous 4 years and its inability to address one of the 
greatest public health threats of our lifetimes: the illicit 
drugs pouring over our borders. Under the previous 
administration, the United States experienced a historic rise 
of drug overdoses and poisonings driven by an increased supply 
of synthetic opioids such as illicit fentanyl and its analogs. 
Last fiscal year, Customs and Border Protection confiscated 
over 21,000 pounds of fentanyl at our borders. That is enough 
fentanyl to kill every American several times over, and that is 
just the drugs we know about.
    Under the Biden-Harris administration we saw rates of 
overdose and poisoning deaths skyrocket, peaking at nearly 
108,000 in 2023, driven by the surge of fentanyl coming across 
our borders. Illicit fentanyl overdoses are now the number 1 
cause of death among adults 18 to 45. Each year, more Americans 
are dying from illicit fentanyl than the number of Americans' 
lives lost during the Vietnam War.
    However, I believe we have a great opportunity to make 
significant and sustainable progress in combating this crisis. 
To do so we must continue to expand availability of overdose-
reversible treatments like naloxone, removing the stigma 
associated with curing it and making it as common as a fire 
extinguisher. Every school in America should have access to 
naloxone.
    We must secure our borders to stop the scourge of illegal 
drugs, especially poisons like illicit fentanyl. President 
Trump has already made progress to address the fentanyl crisis 
by forcing Mexico and Canada to come to the negotiating table. 
With President Trump's leadership, we must continue to crack 
down on China, Mexico, and anyone who smuggles fentanyl and 
other synthetic drugs across our borders with the sole 
intention of preying on Americans.
    Additionally, this committee is already taking action to 
help keep illicit fentanyl out of our communities and save 
lives. Later today, the House will vote on a bill developed by 
this committee, the Halt All Legal Trafficking of Fentanyl Act, 
which will take the critical step of permanently scheduling all 
fentanyl-related substances as schedule I drugs under the 
Controlled Substances Act.
    These tools and solutions address today's problem, but like 
the evolution of the opioid crisis from the overprescribing of 
OxyContin to today's scourge of synthetic opioids like 
fentanyl, we must prepare for what is next.
    In this hearing we will hear from our witnesses not just on 
the illicit drugs threatening our communities today but 
potential new threats that if left unaddressed will be driving 
this crisis tomorrow. I look forward to that testimony and 
working alongside my colleagues on addressing these issues.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Carter of Georgia follows:]
    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
    
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. At this time I would like to yield 1 
minute to the gentleman from Pennsylvania, Dr. Joyce, for a 
statement.
    Mr. Joyce. Thank you, Chairman Carter, and thank you for 
holding this important hearing.
    I want to take this opportunity to introduce Mr. Ray 
Cullen, who is here with his wife, Deb. They come from 
Pennsylvania's 13th Congressional District, and they tragically 
lost their son to fentanyl poisoning. Zach was out with 
friends, and they were sold drugs laced with fentanyl. And on 
that tragic night, Zach stopped breathing.
    The compelling story that they brought to me and have 
continued to advocate specifically for this HALT Fentanyl piece 
of legislation is not only important to them individually, them 
as a family, but is important to all of America. And I am proud 
that both Ray and Deb Cullen have brought this story to the 
halls of Congress to be able to share it with us today.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Thank you, Dr. Joyce.
    I would now like to yield 1 minute to the gentleman from 
Michigan, Representative James, for his statement.
    Mr. James. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Today I have the distinct honor and privilege of 
introducing a friend, outstanding servant in southeast 
Michigan, law enforcement hero, Pam's husband, and brother 
Rice, class of 1999 commencement speaker, Sheriff Mike 
Bouchard.
    I am so proud that he is from my district. And as our 
Nation is facing an all-out assault on cartels and adversaries 
like CCP, the illicit drug epidemic is devastating our families 
and communities, and Sheriff Mike Bouchard and his team on the 
front lines. He knows firsthand what is going on in our 
communities, and he has been successful leading southeast 
Michigan. In May 2024, 500 grams of cocaine, 50 grams of 
fentanyl and OxyContin were seized. April 2024, $20,000 in 
cocaine, fentanyl, and other drugs confiscated. March 2023, 
41.5 kilos of fentanyl, enough to kill all 10.3 million 
Michiganders, were confiscated because of the leadership of 
Sheriff Mike Bouchard and his phenomenal team.
    I am grateful to him for his leadership. I am grateful for 
his friendship, and I am excited to hear about his leadership 
and lessons learned today.
    Mr. Chairman, with that, I yield.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Thank you, Representative James.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from Colorado, 
Representative DeGette, for 5 minutes for an opening statement.

 OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. DIANA DeGETTE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN 
              CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF COLORADO

    Ms. DeGette. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. I am very 
happy to be the ranking member on this committee, and I am 
looking forward to working with you and all of our colleagues 
on both sides of the aisle to advance strong bipartisan 
solutions to the issues we face. And I, of course, join you in 
saying we need to be safe from dangerous drugs like fentanyl.
    I do, regrettably, have to correct the record already, even 
though it is just my first opening statement.
    Under the Biden administration, the Biden administration 
was also working hard to curb fentanyl, and that is why last 
year, the deaths from fentanyl were below 90,000, which was a 
decrease from 128,000 just the year before. So I hope we can 
continue this, but I think demagoguing on the Biden 
administration's success and saying that deaths were higher is 
inaccurate.
    Something else I want to talk about is the developments 
that we have seen in the last couple of weeks under the new 
Trump administration. Donald Trump kicked off his term with 
actions that led to a daylong freeze of Medicaid funds for 
every one of our States. Last Monday, Denver Health, which is 
our safety net hospital that serves a regional area in the 
Rocky Mountains, called saying all of their Medicaid funds had 
been frozen and they couldn't provide medical services to 
thousands of people.
    Now, in response to Donald Trump's Executive orders then, 
CDC removed from its website the guidance that doctors rely on 
to treat patients every day and data researchers use to improve 
public health.
    I got a call from my daughter. Some of you guys know my 
daughter, Raphaela. She is an internal medicine doctor at UCSF 
in San Francisco. She told me that they couldn't get the CDC 
guidance on birth control or on vaccines, and as of 2 days ago 
they still couldn't get the guidance on birth control. And, of 
course, there is no available guidance for healthcare for LGBTQ 
individuals anywhere.
    Also, NIH grantmaking for critical biomedical research is 
at a dead stop with no end in sight. I got calls from some 
researchers at Anschutz Medical Center, which does important, 
lifesaving research, and they were unable to access their grant 
dollars for some time last week. And now a 23-year-old SpaceX 
intern has been given access to systems containing sensitive 
information about Medicare and Medicaid.
    So Mr. Chairman, I was just saying to you my constituents 
are terrified about what Elon Musk and his lawless DOGE are 
going to do with that access. I had over 500 phone calls in my 
office in the last 2 days, many of the individuals who were 
sobbing. So as Donald Trump ground NIH to a halt and disrupted 
funding for safety-net healthcare, where is the outrage there 
on the other side? I have only heard Democrats speaking up. Are 
all of you afraid of Donald Trump? Do you agree with this 
lawless assault on science?
    The Constitution obliges the President to faithfully 
execute the laws that Congress creates, and Article I of the 
Constitution gives Congress that authority. So why aren't we 
exerting it? The Founders envisioned the checks and balances in 
our Constitution as necessary to curb abuses in the Government. 
Quote, ``Ambition must be made to counteract ambition.'' That 
is from James Madison. And the Government must be obliged to 
control itself. We need to assert Congress' authority. It is 
shameful that Republicans have sat by while Congress, the first 
branch of government and the voice of the people, has been 
silenced in this diminished state and allowed the executive 
branch and somebody who is not even elected or appointed to 
office to ignore the law.
    So let me assure you, our constituents are watching what is 
happening. They are not happy. In the midst of this 
lawlessness, this dangerous agenda to take healthcare away from 
hardworking Americans is not going to go. We are going to fight 
with every fiber of our being to make sure that that happens.
    So that is pretty much how I am feeling this morning. And I 
am going to tell you, if you try to cut $2 trillion to Medicaid 
in order to pay for tax cuts for the wealthiest in this 
country, this is not going to fly. We need to have quality 
healthcare for every American. We need to have biomedical 
research that will find cures for the diseases that we all care 
about, and we need to continue to have adequate and full 
information so that everybody can get the quality healthcare 
that they need.
    So I guess I look forward to working with you. It is going 
to be a long 2 years. I yield back.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. DeGette follows:]
    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
    
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. And with that, the lady yields back.
    I now recognize the chairman of the full committee, 
Chairman Guthrie, for 5 minutes for an opening statement.

 OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BRETT GUTHRIE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN 
           CONGRESS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF KENTUCKY

    Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, Chairman Carter, for bringing us 
together on this important hearing. And today we will hear from 
a diverse panel about existing and emerging drug threats that 
are infiltrating our communities. Thank you to all of the 
witnesses for joining us today to talk about this.
    Unfortunately, most Americans have a family member, as we 
have before us today, a friend, or a neighbor who has been 
impacted by illicit drugs. This could include anything from 
opioids such as heroin, illicit fentanyl, fentanyl-related 
substances, to stimulants such as cocaine and methamphetamine.
    We have all heard heartbreaking stories--and we are going 
to hear today--which are truly heartbreaking, about the toll 
that illicit fentanyl and fentanyl-related substances are 
having on our communities, and the rate at which Americans are 
dying from fentanyl poisoning is just staggering. In 2023 
alone, the DEA seized over 390 million lethal doses of illicit 
fentanyl in the United States. That is more than enough to kill 
every American. We have learned that most of the illicit 
fentanyl trafficked into the United States is being produced by 
transnational criminal organizations in Mexico from chemicals 
sourced from China. It is then coming across our southern 
border in mass quantities and brought into our communities.
    This is why we must work together to finally get the HALT 
Fentanyl Act signed into law. The HALT Fentanyl Act sponsored 
by our good friend, Rep. Griffith, is on the floor today, and I 
encourage all of colleagues on both sides of the aisle to vote 
for this. It is vitally important legislation.
    On top of the increased presence of synthetic opioids, 
xylazine, or tranq, is continuing to emerge as a significant 
drug threat. Individuals who use xylazine may be at a higher 
risk from suffering from fatal drug poisonings because overdose 
reversal medications cannot reverse its effects. There has been 
bipartisan interest in making xylazine a schedule III 
controlled substance, which will help DEA crack down on 
criminals who traffic the substance and hope to continue this 
momentum in Congress.
    We hear from families every day, families who have lost a 
child, a brother, or a sister, and they don't want anyone else 
to experience their pain. We owe it to them to do what we can 
do to prevent others from experiencing this loss. We should be 
working together to punish those who make and import and 
distribute these poisons and help those with substance use 
disorder find treatment and recovery.
    I appreciate the witnesses for being here, and I will now 
yield the remainder of my time to my good friend from Florida, 
Vice Chairman Dunn.
    Mr. Dunn. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I am grateful to 
be serving as the vice chair of this Health Subcommittee in 
this Congress, and as a doctor I look forward to contributing 
my expertise for more than 40 years of practicing medicine in 
the Army and in private practice to the success of the 
committee. I am excited especially to work with Chairman 
Carter, and all of my colleagues on the committee, to find 
solutions that make the United States the healthiest country in 
the world, and that work begins today in this hearing.
    Illicit drugs are one of the most serious issues facing the 
country, and there are numerous contributing factors to the 
opioid and addiction crisis, from open borders to weak-on-China 
policies from our prior administration. I would like to 
underscore the latter. We are in serious competition with the 
Chinese Communist Party, and we have to take seriously what 
they are doing to infiltrate our healthcare system.
    I thank the witnesses for being here, and I am hopeful that 
we can use your unique insights to craft effective policies to 
curb this epidemic.
    And with that, I yield back.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Guthrie follows:]
    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
    
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair will now recognize the gentlelady from 
Massachusetts, Ms. Trahan, for 5 minutes for an opening 
statement. For those you who are unaware, there was a coup last 
night and the ranking member of the new committee is now 
Representative Trahan.
    Ms. Trahan. Oh, no, no, no.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Frank Pallone is history.
    Ms. Trahan. Don't get me in trouble.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Just kidding. Thank you.

  OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. LORI TRAHAN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN 
        CONGRESS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF MASSACHUSETTS

    Ms. Trahan. Thank you. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you, 
Ranking Member DeGette and our panel of witnesses today.
    Today we are discussing existing and emerging drug threats 
while one existing and emerging threat--unelected and 
unconfirmed billionaire Elon Musk--is creating chaos throughout 
the Federal Government. President Trump has handed control of 
all Federal funds over to Elon Musk. This is illegal. It is 
dangerous.
    I ask for unanimous consent to enter into the record a New 
York Times article entitled, ``Inside Musk's Aggressive 
Incursion Into the Federal Government.'' According to this 
reporting, Elon Musk has unilaterally seized control of the 
Treasury payment systems which distributes more than $5 
trillion in payments annually, including Social Security, 
Medicaid, and Medicare benefits. He has no legal authority to 
unilaterally seize government payment systems and records nor 
the private information of U.S. citizens.
    I am extremely concerned by a recent article in the Wall 
Street Journal that Elon Musk has now gained access to the 
Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services System which help 
facilitate payments and help provide healthcare coverage for 
over 160 million Americans. I ask for unanimous consent to also 
enter into the record the article entitled, ``DOGE Aides Search 
Medicare Agency Payment Systems for Fraud.''
    Musk has already gained unlawful access to the personal 
information of hundreds of millions of Americans, and now their 
healthcare information, what medical conditions they have, 
where they receive their healthcare, and what drugs they take. 
This is apparently being done by some 20-something-year-old 
lackeys of Elon Musk whose identities are being shielded from 
the public and who apparently only go by their first names.
    Musk and his minions are stealing the American people's 
personal information. For what? To benefit his companies? To go 
after Trump's political enemies? This is corruption, plain and 
simple, and it is utterly bewildering and disappointing that my 
Republican colleagues are silent while Elon Musk sifts through 
the private data of our constituents. Silence is complicity, 
and I urge them to join us in condemning these unlawful actions 
and work with us to rein in the Trump administration's actions.
    Turning to the topic of today's hearing, our ongoing opioid 
overdose crisis. Public health experts and providers know that 
we must do more than incarcerate our way out of this crisis. 
They implore us to remove barriers to prevention and treatment 
programs for substance use disorder in partnership with other 
tools to crack down on illicit drug trafficking. For example, a 
public health success story is the widespread availability of 
the opioid overdose reversal medication, naloxone, and 
increasing access to fentanyl test strips are another means of 
reducing deaths.
    Last week the Trump administration froze virtually all 
Federal funding, stealing billions of dollars in funding for 
critical opioid prevention, treatment, and recovery programs. 
Clinicians have been left wondering if they would receive a 
paycheck for their work. Patients have been left worrying about 
whether their access to treatment and recovery have been cut 
off indefinitely.
    The Trump administration halted $6.5 billion in funding for 
programs that support a wide range of naloxone programs, 
treatment services, and prevention efforts, and it halted 
nearly $1.5 billion in funding to conduct research on 
substance-use disorder in addition to improving public health. 
I am bewildered by statements from my Republican colleagues 
about saving lives while there are still real concerns about 
Federal funding not getting out the door to help us combat the 
drug overdose epidemic.
    And Republicans are also looking to undermine our efforts 
to combat the overdose crisis as they consider trillions of 
dollars in cuts to Medicaid so that they can give tax breaks to 
billionaires, like Elon Musk and big corporations.
    Medicaid covers nearly 40 percent of all people with opioid 
use disorder. Republicans' plan to cut Medicaid will further 
limit access to care for substance use disorders, leading to 
more deaths. It doesn't have to be this way.
    At the end of the last Congress, we negotiated in good 
faith with the Republicans on an end-of-year package that would 
have reauthorized funding for the SUPPORT Act. This bill funds 
opioid overdose programs, first responder training, and 
enhances access to substance use disorder treatment. However, 
after one tweet from Elon Musk, the House Republican leadership 
went back on their promise and tanked the deal. It is clear: 
Republicans are not focused at all on addressing this crisis. 
Instead they are abdicating their responsibility to Elon Musk.
    Thank you. I yield back.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. Trahan follows:]
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    Mr. Carter of Georgia. I believe the gentlelady had asked 
for unanimous consent to insert in the record two articles. 
Without objection, that will be the order.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. This concludes Member opening 
statements.
    The Chair would like to----
    Mr. Griffith. Mr. Chairman, what are the articles on?
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. I am sorry.
    Ms. Trahan, Representative Trahan, the articles that you 
asked to have inserted into the record?
    Ms. DeGette. Looks like the New York Times and the Wall 
Street Journal.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Do you want to hold off until you 
can look at it?
    Mr. Griffith. Yes.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. OK. We will hold off until we can 
look at it, and we will move on.
    OK. This concludes Member opening statements. The Chair 
would like to remind Members that, pursuant to committee rules, 
all Members' opening statements will be made part of the 
record.
    I want to start and thank all of our witnesses for being 
here today, taking the time to testify before the subcommittee. 
I want to introduce our witnesses now. All of you are 
important. Thank you for being here, and thank you for sharing 
your stories and your expertise.
    Mr. Raymond Cullen, who is a family advocate. Mr. Cullen, 
your courage is certainly admirable, and thank you for being 
here. We appreciate it very much.
    Sheriff Michael Bouchard, the vice president of government 
affairs for the Major County Sheriffs Association, thank you 
for being here, Sheriff.
    Dr. Timothy Westlake, an emergency medicine physician at 
ProHealth Care Memorial Hospital.
    Ms. Regina LaBelle, professor and director at the master of 
science and addiction policy and practice at Georgetown 
University. Thank you for being here.
    And Dr. Deepa Camenga, the chair of the Committee on 
Substance Use and Prevention at the American Academy of 
Pediatrics. Thank you for being here.
    Per committee custom, each witness will have the 
opportunity for a 5-minute opening statement followed by a 
round of questions from Members. The light on the timer in 
front of you will turn from green to yellow when you have 1 
minute left.
    I recognize now Mr. Cullen for 5 minutes to give an opening 
statement.

STATEMENTS OF RAYMOND CULLEN, FAMILY ADVOCATE; SHERIFF MICHAEL 
  BOUCHARD, VICE PRESIDENT, GOVERNMENT AFFAIRS, MAJOR COUNTY 
   SHERIFFS OF AMERICA; TIMOTHY W. WESTLAKE, M.D., EMERGENCY 
PHYSICIAN, OCONOMOWOC MEMORIAL HOSPITAL, PROHEALTH CARE MEDICAL 
    SYSTEM; REGINA LABELLE, PROFESSOR OF ADDICTION POLICY, 
 GEORGETOWN UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF ARTS AND SCIENCES; AND DEEPA 
     CAMENGA, M.D., CHAIR, COMMITTEE ON SUBSTANCE USE AND 
           PREVENTION, AMERICAN ACADEMY OF PEDIATRICS

                  STATEMENT OF RAYMOND CULLEN

    Mr. Cullen. Thank you, Chairs Guthrie and Carter and 
ranking members--I have Pallone, but I----
    Ms. DeGette. You need to push that button.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The microphone.
    Mr. Cullen. Can you hear me now?
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. There you go.
    Mr. Cullen. I am sorry.
    Thank you, Chairs Guthrie and Carter and Ranking Members 
Pallone and DeGette for having me here today to speak at this 
hearing, which, based on the events transpiring this week, is 
very timely. I would also like to thank Congressman Joyce for 
his support and friendship over the past few years.
    I am here today to discuss the fentanyl epidemic which has 
been targeting the young people of our country and discuss some 
things that we would like to see done so that some other 
parents do not receive a visit from the police informing them 
that their child is dead.
    This is what happened just under 2\1/2\ years ago. The 
State police knocked on our door and informed me that our son, 
Zachary, was dead, presumably from an overdose. He was the 
youngest of our three boys, and he died just 9 days after his 
23rd birthday.
    Zachary was a wonderful young man who was in college 
studying business, had been working at Papa John's delivering 
pizzas for 4 years, and was developing a technology company on 
the Blockchain platform. That was his dream. That was his 
passion. His other love was basketball, especially playing a 
game of pickup in the driveway with me and his brothers. His 
last year at school his intramural team won the championship, 
and he was so excited.
    But even more impressive was his kind and compassionate 
heart. Zachary helped numerous people during his short 23 
years. His last summer at the beach he saved a friend who was 
caught in a rip current and on the verge of drowning and held 
him up until the lifeguards got there. Another time one of his 
coworkers mentioned that he was behind on his rent and was 
afraid that he and his family were going to be evicted. Having 
just received money from his grandfather at Christmastime, Zach 
found out from his manager how much money was needed and 
anonymously placed that amount of cash in an envelope and 
slipped it into his car. That was our son. He loved his family, 
he loved his friends, and he loved life.
    Zachary did not suffer from substance use disorder. He was 
not an addict. However, following his death, we did learn that 
he had used cocaine on occasion at college. We were told that 
cocaine is a commonly used recreational drug on campus. 
However, Zachary did not die at school. He and a couple of 
friends were in Harrisburg celebrating a birthday. We were told 
by the detective that they were not in a bad area of town nor 
were they seeking out drugs. They were downtown at a few 
restaurants and bars eating, drinking, and having fun. The 
detective also told us that he believes the boys were targeted 
by the dealer. Why we do not know, but they made the decision 
to purchase some coke. That, in and of itself, was a poor 
decision but not one that should have cost him his life. 
Someone intentionally laced that cocaine with fentanyl. Our son 
did not accidently overdose. He was poisoned. There is a 
difference. Actually, we personally feel that he was murdered.
    We beg of you to get the word out about illicit fentanyl to 
everyone. This is urgent and must be done immediately because 
we know we need to slow down the rate at which other families 
are losing their loved ones. We feel this crisis should be 
attacked with the same vigor and intensity that COVID was, and 
people need to know the statistics. More than 110,000 people 
died from overdoses in 2024, and of those, the majority 
involved illicit fentanyl. It only takes 2 milligrams of 
fentanyl to kill, about the size of 10 to 15 grains of salt. 
One packet of Sweet'N Low that is filled with fentanyl is 
enough to kill 500 people. Let me repeat that: A Sweet'N Low 
packet filled with fentanyl can kill 500 people. So based on 
those metrics, the 43 pounds of fentanyl seized coming in from 
Canada in 2024 would be enough to kill just under 10 million 
people.
    Parents need to know that these drugs are not just the ones 
being bought on the streets through dealers or from their 
child's friends or acquaintances but also through social media 
platforms such as Snapchat. Most kids are not addicts. They are 
stressed out, depressed, and anxious kids looking for something 
to help calm them down, to help them sleep or to help them 
focus so they can study. They have no idea that 70 percent of 
all drugs bought either from a dealer, a friend, or online are 
laced with enough fentanyl to kill them. It is a real-life game 
of Russian roulette, and most of them don't even know that they 
are playing.
    While we understand that there have been some efforts to 
combat the scourge, we find it difficult to understand why it 
took so long and why combating it would be so controversial or 
political.
    Some have said there is a stigma attached to those 
overdosing on fentanyl, that they are just drug addicts who 
will eventually die of an overdose of something at some time.
    While Zach did not suffer from substance abuse disorder, 
the lives lost of those who were are just as valuable to their 
parents and loved ones as Zach is to us.
    ``So what do you want us to do?'' is the question we have 
heard from Members of Congress before. Our answers are, and 
have been, education and awareness. We feel strongly for PSAs, 
parent-focused on mainstream media, young-adult-focused on 
social media. Make fentanyl awareness part of high school 
assemblies and college freshmen orientation. And we really need 
to distinguish between poisoning versus overdose. The other 
side is treatment, access to treatment and rehabilitation 
facilities for those already entangled in SUD.
    I would like to, once again, thank this body for taking on 
such a crucial topic that has forever impacted our lives, our 
family's lives, and the lives of hundreds of thousands of other 
devastated families as well.
    And if you will indulge me, I would like to close with a 
prayer that I wrote which was read by my youngest sister at 
Zachary's funeral service.
    ``You have broken me. I am disfigured beyond all 
recognition. How can You put me back together with such a vital 
piece missing? I will wait.
    ``And, as if You need any help from me, might I offer the 
following: Less artificial anxiety, less wearisome worry, less 
insidious selfishness, less foolish pride. And while You are at 
it, add more love, add more compassion, add more empathy.
    ``I get it now, less of me and more of You.
    ``And one last nonnegotiable. I need the memory of Zachary 
Matthew Cullen knit as close to my heart as possible. Period. 
Amen.''
    I thank you for your time.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Cullen follows:]
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    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Thank you, Mr. Cullen.
    Sheriff Bouchard, we recognize you for 5 minutes.

                 STATEMENT OF MICHAEL BOUCHARD

    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you, Chair Carter, Ranking Member 
DeGette, members of the subcommittee, thank you for allowing me 
to testify today. I am Michael Bouchard, sheriff of Oakland 
County, and I represent Major County Sheriffs of America, MCSA, 
which includes the largest sheriffs' offices across the 
country. Our members collectively serve over one-third of 
America's population, and as such, we are on the front lines of 
the opioid crisis, the deadliest drug epidemic in American 
history.
    In 2023, nearly 100,000 Americans lost their lives to 
overdose, with fentanyl as the primary driver. The emergence of 
synthetic opioids and analogs is worsening the crisis. Law 
enforcement, public health officials, and communities need to 
have a coordinated, comprehensive response.
    In Oakland County, Michigan, where I serve, we are seeing 
very concerning new trends. Fentanyl remains a significant 
problem as we test these samples in my lab. We have also seen 
an alarming rise of xylazine, a potent tranquilizer, and more 
cases of para-fluorofentanyl, which is far stronger than 
fentanyl. These substances are often mixed with other drugs 
like heroin and cocaine, as we just heard, making them harder 
to detect and increasing the risk of overdose.
    To address these threats, we have been implementing 
innovative solutions. We started a crisis response unit. The 
team responds to individuals in crisis due to substance use and 
mental health issues. We follow up with people that have been 
saved from overdoses to connect them to treatment, ensuring 
they receive the help they need. We actually did one such visit 
and saved a person a second time as he was actively overdosing.
    We have also prioritized our coresponder program in 
partnership with mental health professionals. We respond to 
crisis situations, deescalating and connecting individuals with 
appropriate services while ensuring the public safety.
    We were the first in Michigan to equip patrol cars with 
Narcan, and in 2023 we became the first in the Nation to deploy 
Opvee, a Federal FDA-approved nasal spray that can counter 
synthetic and nonsynthetic opioids.
    Since 2015 through the end of January of this year, my 
agency alone has saved 827 lives. That is sad, but it is 
important. Every life does matter, and that gives them a second 
chance.
    Our jail is one of the first in the country to implement a 
medically assisted treatment program for incarcerated 
individuals struggling with substance use disorder, offering 
personal treatment and connecting them to care after release.
    We also have a longstanding initiative, like Operation 
Medicine Cabinet, which helps prevent prescription drugs by 
providing safe disposal sites for used medication as well as 
Rides to Recovery, which offer immediate transportation for 
individuals seeking help.
    But as much as we can do at the local level, law 
enforcement cannot do this alone. We need Congress to support 
us by passing critical legislation, specifically permanent 
fentanyl scheduling. The HALT Fentanyl Act would permanently 
classify fentanyl analogs as schedule I substances, helping to 
curb the influx of these legal drugs.
    Congress needs to reauthorize High Intensity Drug 
Trafficking Areas, known as HIDTA. HIDTA is vital for targeting 
trafficking routes and dismantling criminal networks. It needs 
authorization, increased funding, and continue to be 
administered by the Office of National Drug Control Policy.
    We need stronger regulations on pill presses. Counterfeit 
pills laced with fentanyl are a growing threat. We must tighten 
regulations around pill presses and increase the penalties for 
their illicit use.
    We need more support for reentry programs. Many people 
lapse into criminal behavior due to lack of substance use 
treatment and support as they reenter society.
    We are urging Congress to pass the Second Chance 
Reauthorization Act to help former offenders get the treatment 
they need.
    In many areas, funding for drug enforcement has been 
defunded. Congress must provide necessary resources to help us 
fight fentanyl trafficking effectively. It is impossible for us 
to tackle this crisis without a comprehensive approach that 
combines strong law enforcement with effective programming.
    Finally, to combat the flow of fentanyl and other illegal 
drugs, we need to secure our borders. Strengthening border 
security and improving cooperation with law enforcement 
agencies will help disrupt the transnational drug trade.
    In conclusion, the opioid crisis, particularly the surge in 
fentanyl, requires a united and a comprehensive approach. With 
your leadership, we can make those significant strides and help 
combat drug trafficking, improve public health, and save lives.
    I urge Congress to act swiftly, and I thank you for your 
attention to these critical issues so that we don't have any 
more members to a club no one ever wants to join.
    [The prepared statement of Sheriff Bouchard follows:]
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    Mr. Dunn [presiding]. Thank you very much, Sheriff.
    I now recognize Dr. Timothy Westlake for 5 minutes for his 
opening statement.

             STATEMENT OF TIMOTHY W. WESTLAKE, M.D.

    Dr. Westlake. Thank you, Chairman Dunn, Ranking Member 
DeGette, distinguished members of the committee. Thank you for 
inviting me to testify and for your leadership.
    Before I dive into the topic, I wanted to tell you about 
the last time I used Narcan. It was just days ago. It was a 
quiet night shift in the ER. I was mulling over my testimony 
when I had to rush out to a car that screeched into the 
ambulance bay. It was driven by the girlfriend of a patient who 
took what he thought was a Percocet. It was actually a lethal 
dose of fentanyl. He wasn't breathing and was about to go into 
cardiac arrest. We pulled him out and quickly resuscitated him 
with Narcan. Within a minute, he went from being blue and 
pulseless to wide awake. He was lucky this time and went home 
with his family. Far too often the outcome is different. 
Fentanyl poisoning deaths are a scourge in this country and 
will require all of us working together to solve it.
    I want to share my perspective informed by 25 years on the 
front lines of emergency medicine and over a decade in medical 
regulation and policy work. I was chairman of the Wisconsin 
Medical Examining Board, led the Wisconsin prescription opioid 
reform strategy, and originated the idea of fentanyl class 
scheduling. I see lethal drug vats as a fire hydrant with many 
spigots. They include, but are not limited to, prescription 
opioids, xylazine, nitazenes, illicit fentanyl, and fentanyl-
related substances, or FRSs. Different tactics and strategies 
may be needed to be deployed to shut down each of the spigots. 
Unfortunately, when one is shut down, either another one gets 
more powerful or a different one opens up.
    I would like to clarify what FRSs are and why permanently 
scheduling them as a class is a critical policy tool. FRSs are 
highly active opioids almost identical to fentanyl except for a 
tiny difference in their chemical structure created by changing 
a single ingredient during synthesis. The result of this tweak 
is a new potent opioid with the same deadly effects as 
fentanyl, and without class scheduling would be legal until 
causing numerous deaths.
    Class scheduling simply removes the incentive to create new 
FRSs and has been proven to do what it was designed to do: halt 
their very creation. Some who oppose class scheduling point to 
deaths from illicit fentanyl as proof it doesn't work, but that 
is a misunderstanding of the facts. FRS scheduling does not 
address illicit fentanyl. It was never intended to do so. There 
is no quick or easy solution to the scourge of illicit 
fentanyl, but the solution to the spigot of FRSs is a simple 
legislative fix. It is one the House is considering this week 
and voting on this afternoon, the HALT Fentanyl Act.
    If schedule I penalties were removed for FRS trafficking, 
like some have proposed, it would reincentivize their creation 
and significantly weaken the law's most powerful proactive and 
preventative effects. There is a time and a place for criminal 
justice reform, but FRS scheduling is not it.
    Some suggest FRS scheduling would have a negative impact on 
research. While theoretical, it has been addressed with 
stakeholder input and is supported by the very agencies and 
organizations representing academic scientific research, 
including the NIH, HHS, FDA, and the National Institutes of 
Drug Abuse. The HALT Fentanyl Act would significantly loosen 
restrictions into studying all schedule I substances, not just 
FRSs, and open up promising areas of research into substance 
abuse.
    Let me also speak about the threat of nitazenes. They are 
opioids as deadly as fentanyl. They have recently been 
implicated in hundreds of deaths across the country, emerging 
as the new spigot that opened up after FRS class scheduling was 
implemented.
    Since 2020, DEA has scheduled 10 different bioactive 
nitazenes and, due to the creation of new variants, has 
encountered and is in the process of scheduling multiple 
others. This is eerily reminiscent of what we saw with FRSs 10 
years ago prior to class scheduling. I support working with DEA 
and taking a closer look at implementing class scheduling for 
nitazenes due to their extreme lethality.
    Xylazine is a potent animal tranquilizer and sedative used 
in cattle and horses that has not been scheduled federally, and 
can currently be bought legally online. It is used in 
veterinary medicine only and not approved for use in humans. It 
is often combined by cartel chemists with illicit fentanyl in 
order to amplify sedation and euphoria but also causes strong 
respiratory suppression, increasing overall overdose risks and 
lethality. There is an urgent need for Federal legislation to 
control it and to protect the public.
    It is time for common sense to prevail and for Congress to 
take action, pass the HALT Fentanyl Act, and permanently close 
the spigot of FRSs. You cannot die from ingesting something 
never created, nor can you be incarcerated for trafficking 
something that does not exist. That is the beauty and 
simplicity of FRS class scheduling.
    Thank you again, and I look forward to answering all of 
your questions.
    [The prepared statement of Dr. Westlake follows:]
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    Mr. Dunn. Thank you, Dr. Westlake.
    I now recognize Ms. Regina LaBelle for 5 minutes for an 
opening statement.

                 STATEMENT OF REGINA M. LaBELLE

    Ms. LaBelle. Chairman Dunn, Ranking Member DeGette, and 
members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to 
testify today on this important topic.
    I am Regina LaBelle. I am professor of addiction policy at 
Georgetown University. There I direct the master of science and 
addiction policy and practice, and the Center on Addiction 
Policy at Georgetown Law's O'Neill Institute. I am really 
pleased to be joined here today by some of my students who are 
here to learn how to develop a bipartisan approach to reducing 
overdoses and improving the lives of people who have substance 
use disorder, or who are affected by addiction. I also serve on 
the National Advisory Council on Drug Abuse at the National 
Institutes of Health. However today, I speak to you in my 
personal capacity.
    So for over 15 years I have worked on drug policy in both 
government and at Georgetown, and I have seen bipartisan 
efforts lead to meaningful action. And I have also seen 
firsthand the impact of the overdose crisis. The grieving 
families who have lost loved ones remain always present in our 
mind as we work on these issues. I have also celebrated with 
those in recovery, witnessing the power of resilience, strong 
support systems, and effective policies.
    And we know that, since 2000, over 1 million Americans have 
died from overdoses, and recent data from August of 2023 to 
August of 2024 shows a 20 percent decrease. This is still 
unacceptably high. Overdose deaths are still increasing among 
Black, indigenous, and Hispanic communities, and the majority 
of these deaths as we are talking about today involve synthetic 
opioids like fentanyl often mixed with dangerous substances 
like xylazine. So obviously, you have to take decisive action 
on this issue.
    Addressing the threat of synthetic drugs requires a 
comprehensive strategy. First, transnational efforts, 
strengthening law enforcement cooperation to disrupt 
transnational criminal organizations. Illicit fentanyl is 
manufactured using precursor chemicals from China and processed 
in Mexico and then transited into the United States. Disrupting 
these supply chains requires international collaboration, 
counternarcotics cooperation, and aggressive prosecution of 
financial crimes that sustain the drug trade.
    Public health, expanding access across the continuum of 
care, prevention so that we can equip parents and communities 
with the tools to recognize early signs of mental health and 
substance use, expanding access to naloxone that saves lives. 
So we know that States like Tennessee have documented over 
103,000 overdose reversals through naloxone distribution.
    Federal investment in evidence-based treatment that 
includes medications for opioid use disorder is essential, and 
Congress took an important step by passing in a bipartisan 
manner the Mainstreaming Addiction Treatment Act. It removed 
outdated barriers to medication access, but more work obviously 
is needed.
    And our criminal justice system is part of the solution. 
The Federal approval of Medicaid 1115 waivers allows States to 
use Federal Medicaid matching funds to treat people before they 
are released from a jail or prison, and this improves reentry 
outcomes.
    The workforce, investing in workforce and identifying, 
tracking emerging drug threats. So we have to equip our public 
health and law enforcement agencies with the ability to detect 
and respond to new synthetic drug threats. States like Rhode 
Island and North Carolina are leading the way with drug 
monitoring programs that identify emerging substances and issue 
public health alerts.
    Continued support for the Federal workforce, including CDC, 
State Department, the Drug Enforcement Administration, and the 
Office of National Drug Control Policy is also critical to 
ensuring a whole-of-government response.
    The best way to address this issue is through an all-of-
the-above strategy, and one that integrates law enforcement, 
public health, and the workforce investment. By working 
together, we can disrupt illicit drug supply chains, expand 
treatment and recovery services, and look around the corner so 
we are prepared for the next emerging threat.
    This is a bipartisan issue, and it affects every one of our 
communities, and solutions have to be pursued with urgency and 
unity.
    Thank you very much for your time and commitment to 
addressing this epidemic.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. LaBelle follows:]
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    Mr. Dunn. Thank you, Ms. LaBelle.
    I now recognize Dr. Camenga for her 5-minute opening 
remarks.

                STATEMENT OF DEEPA CAMENGA, M.D.

    Dr. Camenga. Good morning, Chairman, Ranking Member 
DeGette, and members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the 
opportunity to be here today to discuss the impact of current 
and emerging illicit drug threats on children, adolescents, and 
young adults.
    My name is Dr. Deepa Camenga, and I am chair of the 
American Academy of Pediatrics' Committee on Substance Use and 
Prevention. Today I am here representing the AAP, a nonprofit, 
professional medical organization representing over 67,000 
pediatricians.
    As a physician board certified in pediatrics and addiction 
medicine, I have spent nearly 20 years caring for teens. I 
provide primary care and also care for young people who have 
overdosed, have opioid use disorders, or who have started to 
try to use alcohol and drugs. I am experienced in prescribing 
medications for the treatment of opioid use disorder and 
conduct research on adolescent substance use prevention and 
early interventions.
    Today, I will talk about the importance of focusing on 
teens when addressing the ongoing overdose crisis, the role 
pediatricians play in prevention and treatment, and offer 
suggestions on how we can make progress with the help of 
Congress.
    Every day, pediatricians see how the illicit drug epidemic 
harms young people. Today's adolescents are growing up amidst 
the most potent and lethal illicit drug supply in human 
history. The science is clear: Trying substances during 
adolescence increases the risk of addiction due to ongoing 
brain development during this period. The widespread 
contamination of the drug supply with fentanyl, the emergence 
of counterfeit pills, and the low availability of treatment for 
teens, are continuing to fuel the opioid overdose and poisoning 
crisis.
    Some of the most important things we can do today are to 
prevent young people from illicit drug exposure and to treat 
teens with substance use disorders. Pediatricians are an 
essential workforce for delivering prevention interventions and 
recognizing the early signs of substance use.
    I would like to describe some of the way pediatricians 
today are addressing the illicit drug epidemic in the 
healthcare setting.
    First is through screening, brief intervention, and 
referral to treatment. For some young people, a pediatrician 
may be the first person to provide accurate information about 
the potential harms of substances. SBIRT is an evidence-based 
approach that we use in our offices. We use validated screening 
tools, brief counseling techniques, and refer teens with 
substance use disorders to treatment. Unfortunately, in many, 
many communities this treatment is very hard to find.
    Second, it is by talking to patients and their families 
about naloxone and prescribing it for overdose prevention.
    Third is by linking patients and family with community-
based prevention programs.
    And finally, pediatricians help young people receive 
evidence-based treatment. The AAP recommends buprenorphine for 
the treatment of opioid disorder. Of note, adolescents with 
opioid use disorder often need mental health treatment 
alongside lifesaving medications. Integrating behavioral health 
into primary care helps young people receive these treatments.
    Congress has an important role in strengthening access to 
evidence-based prevention, early intervention, and treatment. I 
will share four of AAP's core recommendations.
    First, Congress can take up legislation to ensure private 
health insurance, Medicaid, and publicly supported substance 
use services stay in place and better support youth prevention, 
early intervention, and treatment needs.
    Second, Congress can provide funding for workforce 
development and training so pediatricians and other people who 
work with young people can better meet the demand for care in 
their communities.
    Third, Congress can incentivize the creation of integrated 
behavioral health models, strengthen payment, and eliminate 
barriers to integrated care.
    And finally, Congress can expand broad-based prevention 
programs, support public health campaigns to educate about the 
risks of counterfeit pills and fentanyl, and bolster drug-use 
monitoring and surveillance efforts like the Youth Risk 
Behavior Survey. Healthcare professionals need access every day 
to this vital data and research to respond to current and 
future drug threats efficiently and swiftly.
    Thank you for the opportunity to testify today. I look 
forward to answering your questions and working with you to 
protect young people from the current and emerging drug 
epidemic.
    Thank you.
    [The prepared statement of Dr. Camenga follows:]
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    Mr. Carter of Georgia [presiding]. Thank you, Dr. Camenga. 
And thank you, all of you, for your testimony. We appreciate 
it.
    We will begin now questioning, and I will recognize myself 
for 5 minutes.
    Again, thank you all for being here. Thank you for your 
testimony. We all understand what is going on here. We have got 
a poisoning problem here in America. I won't bother to inundate 
you with all of the facts and figures. We all know what is 
going on. Customs and Border Protection seized more than 21,000 
pounds of fentanyl at our borders and enough fentanyl to kill 4 
billion people.
    I do want to share a personal story with you. 
Professionally, I am a pharmacist, and I was at a town hall 
meeting, and I was addressing that town hall meeting, and we 
were talking about fentanyl. And we were talking about the 
problems that we are having, and I made a mistake. I referred 
to it as fentanyl addiction. And a mother stood up, and she 
corrected me--as she should have--and she said, ``No, sir, it 
is not fentanyl addiction.'' She said, ``It is fentanyl 
poisoning.'' She said, ``My son took one pill, and he is dead. 
That is poisoning.''
    She was right, and I was wrong. It is fentanyl poisoning, 
and it is a problem. It is a serious problem, a leading cause 
of death for Americans between the ages of 18 and 45. And 
everyone in this room, whether you are up here on this dais or 
whether you are out there in the audience, everyone in this 
room knows someone or has a family member who has been impacted 
by this. Everyone here has.
    Folks, we have got to do something about this.
    Sheriff Bouchard, I wanted to ask you: Do you recognize 
individuals who die because of fentanyl poisonings as victims 
of a crime?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
    Yes, we actually have prosecuted successfully individuals 
for murdering the individuals that they supplied the drugs to 
in the past.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Thank you for that.
    And, you know, we know that the opioid epidemic is still 
negatively affecting too many Americans, but we are encouraged 
that the numbers are going down, and we are encouraged that we 
are making progress, and that is important. However, we can't 
stop. We can't stop until we completely eradicate this.
    We also know that fentanyl remains a threat as it crosses 
the border of millions of Americans, and that naloxone, that is 
now available over the counter--I have got to share this with 
you. I am often critical of the FDA--as I think I should be--
but I do applaud them for making naloxone over the counter. We 
wrote a letter asking them to do that, and they responded, and 
they did do it, so kudos to them. It ought to be available. I 
have said all along it ought to be just like fire 
extinguishers, and wherever you see a fire extinguisher, you 
ought to see naloxone available. I carry it in my backpack 
everywhere I go. Thank God, I have not had to use it, but I 
have got it if I need it. It is a lifesaving drug. And we need 
to have it.
    Sheriff Bouchard, what role do you see for naloxone in 
protecting those who are interdicting illicit drugs as well 
with Americans?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Well, we are on the front lines. We are 
typically the first to receive the call. Typically we often 
beat the medical providers as well, and so it is important for 
us to have the tools to be able to save that life in those 
critical moments. It actually took me almost 2 years to get our 
State legislature to allow us to even carry and use Narcan at 
the time, and now we have added Opvee to our tool chest as well 
because we are seeing such strength in the synthetic realm that 
sometimes it takes three, four, and five doses, and Opvee has 
allowed us to have that extra tool that has reversed some of 
those. So the front lines is really what we are seeing.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. OK. Dr. Westlake, would you agree?
    Dr. Westlake. Absolutely.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. OK. You know, there was a December 
2024 DEA report that found that more than 107,000 people lost 
their lives due to drug overdoses in 2023, with nearly 70 
percent of that being attributed to opioids such as fentanyl. 
Naloxone saves lives. We have been able to get some of the 
companies, some of the manufacturers to donate it, and we have 
been sending it to schools and making sure that they have it. 
Naloxone should be in every school in America. Every school in 
America should have naloxone. It should be available.
    Dr. Westlake, what steps would you take to increase access 
and awareness of a lifesaving drug like naloxone?
    Dr. Westlake. Well, I think the key is for a lot of the 
interventions necessary in this space is through education, and 
I think a lot of that has happened already. I mean, when I 
started the work in opioid prevention awareness 10 years ago, 
it was very little of it around, and now it seems to becoming a 
thing that is much more acceptable and understood. And I think 
a lot of physicians--I, myself, in the ER, prescribe it when I 
send someone home after an opioid----
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. We are getting rid of that stigma?
    Dr. Westlake. Exactly.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. And it is safe. You can use it. You 
are not going to hurt somebody with it.
    Dr. Westlake. Exactly. I never understood why it was 
controlled before, why you needed a prescription to use it.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Exactly. Good. Well, again, thank 
all of you for being here. Appreciate this very much.
    And I will yield, and now at this time I will recognize 
Ranking Member DeGette for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Ms. DeGette. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. And just to 
let you know, I carry naloxone in my car in Denver and have for 
quite some time.
    Mr. Cullen, I just want to say to you on behalf of every 
single Member of Congress up on the dais, thank you for coming 
today and sharing your story and your picture of your beloved 
son, Zachary. All of us are committed to ending this scourge, 
and we want to work together to do it.
    Ms. Cullen. Thank you.
    Ms. DeGette. Mr. Chairman, I want to talk some more, 
though, about what has been going on because I think this 
relates to whether we can all--whether we really are committed 
to taking this all-of-the-above approach.
    On Tuesday, January 2l, HHS Secretary Dorothy Fink sent a 
memorandum to HHS employees directing a communications freeze. 
And then on Monday, January 27, the Office of Management and 
Budget sent a memorandum across the executive branch directing 
a funding freeze. Now, this OMB freeze would have frozen a lot 
of the programs that our panelists have been talking about here 
today, naloxone programs, treatment programs.
    Dr. Camenga--is that how you say it--you said in your 
testimony four things that we needed to expand and do. All of 
those things, the existing programs in those areas all would 
have been frozen in this OMB judgment. You are nodding. Does 
that mean you agree?
    Dr. Camenga. Yes, I agree.
    Ms. DeGette. Yes. So all of those things would have been 
frozen. Now, thankfully, the U.S. District Court in the 
District of Columbia and Rhode Island granted temporary 
restraining orders of the freeze on Federal disbursements and 
OMB rescinded the order, but it is still having impacts. For 
example, Colorado's State Office of Rural Health told me 
earlier this week that the critical grant funds that they 
usually get the first or second day of the month still hadn't 
come through. You are also nodding to this. Have you seen 
experience with this, these kinds of funds as well, Doctor?
    Dr. Camenga. I am hearing that in my local community as 
well, in towns that people are not able to do their jobs and 
are kind of confused as to what is going on.
    Ms. DeGette. People are not able to do their jobs doing 
what?
    Dr. Camenga. Helping people get to treatment, helping 
people give treatment to others.
    Ms. DeGette. So as a result of this Trump-Musk freeze, 
people who are supposed to be doing drug treatment programs are 
not able to get their resources. Is that right?
    Dr. Camenga. That is a possibility.
    Ms. DeGette. OK.
    Dr. Camenga. I have been hearing anecdotally that.
    Ms. DeGette. You have been hearing it?
    Dr. Camenga. Yes.
    Ms. DeGette. Yes. And my people are telling me that too.
    Ms. LaBelle, I want to ask you, you serve on the National 
Advisory Council on Drug Abuse, is that right?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes.
    Ms. DeGette. Now, what is the function of that advisory 
council?
    Ms. LaBelle. So we have final signoff on grants that are 
going out to researchers nationwide above a certain amount of 
money.
    Ms. DeGette. OK.
    Ms. LaBelle. And it is the end of a long process.
    Ms. DeGette. Now these are grants in drug treatment?
    Ms. LaBelle. They are grants for a number of areas of drug 
treatment.
    Ms. DeGette. And when was the most recent meeting of that 
advisory council supposed to take place?
    Ms. LaBelle. So we were supposed to have a meeting on 
Tuesday and----
    Ms. DeGette. What happened about that?
    Ms. LaBelle. I received an email at 8:00 a.m. saying it was 
canceled.
    Ms. DeGette. And do you know why it was canceled?
    Ms. LaBelle. We were not given a reason.
    Ms. DeGette. And do you know when it is going to be 
rescheduled?
    Ms. LaBelle. We have not heard anything.
    Ms. DeGette. What is the impact of that advisory council 
not meeting?
    Ms. LaBelle. Well, it will delay sending out these needed 
research dollars to researchers who can do good work on many of 
the issues we are talking about.
    Ms. DeGette. And what are they researching?
    Ms. LaBelle. They are researching what treatment works. 
They will research how to use naloxone better. All of those 
types of things are funded by the Federal Government.
    Ms. DeGette. So that is not happening now because the 
meeting was canceled?
    Ms. LaBelle. At this time there is a delay on it, right.
    Ms. DeGette. Thank you.
    Now, in the conclusion to your written remarks, you say the 
best approach to addressing synthetic drug treatment is an all-
of-the-above strategy, one that integrates law enforcement, 
public health, and workforce investment.
    I just want to ask you: Does simply rescheduling fentanyl 
without doing all of the rest of the things you talked about 
going to have a significant impact on reducing this crisis?
    Ms. LaBelle. There is no one answer to this, and I think we 
can all agree to that.
    Ms. DeGette. OK. Now, one last--I have one last thing, and 
that is, I want to close to say I am disturbed that we are 
having this hearing when Republicans failed to live up to a 
bipartisan, bicameral agreement to reauthorize and strengthen 
the Support for Patients and Communities Act. This is why I 
asked you, Ms. LaBelle, this question, is because we need a 
comprehensive approach. And I said this the other day in the 
Rules Committee when we talked about this bill coming up: Just 
rescheduling fentanyl is not going to solve the problem, but 
what is really going to worsen the problem is when the Trump 
and Musk administration freezes the resources to go out, the 
training, the research dollars.
    I hope we can all work together to make sure this never 
happens again. And I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentlelady yields. The Chair now 
recognizes the chair of the full committee, Representative 
Guthrie from Kentucky, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, and recalling Dr. Westlake's 
testimony before, scheduling illicit fentanyl, it doesn't solve 
all the problems. But absolutely your testimony before was it 
does solve the problem of illicit fentanyl, and being able to 
schedule it. So it is part of the fight that we have against 
these drugs coming into our country.
    And speaking of that, Sheriff Bouchard, I have said earlier 
that we had enough doses of fentanyl to kill Americans captured 
last year. Thirty-seven percent of that was found to be laced 
with xylazine as well.
    In April of 2023, the Office of International Drug Control 
Policy designated fentanyl adulterated with xylazine as an 
emerging drug threat that indicated that people who ingest 
fentanyl mixed with xylazine may be at higher risk of suffering 
deadly drug poisoning because it is not reactive to Narcan and 
the others that we have seen.
    So, Sheriff Bouchard, how can Congress and our Federal 
partners be more proactive about combating emerging drug 
threats before they have infiltrated our communities in mass 
quantities?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you, Mr. Chair. As the doctor 
mentioned, you know, scheduling or blocking the things that are 
being developed, it is important for us to be nimble because 
what they typically do as soon as you schedule very--with 
specificity, a particular kind of drug, then they change one 
component in the lab, and then it begins to be mailed in.
    In fact, I talked to our narcotics commander by email last 
night, and he said we are having a huge rise in the amount of 
things that coming via postal and other package ships--
companies across the country are coming in via that. They 
changed one thing, and then it is no longer illegal. Xylazine 
is an example. I have been trying for almost a year and a half 
to get that scheduled in my State. And we are seeing huge 
numbers of that in my lab in all of the different samples that 
we're testing in other kinds of drugs.
    Mr. Guthrie. So in the last hearing we had--but mine isn't 
the same as Dr. Westlake, but it is testimony that is still in 
my mind, and I don't think it will leave my mind--we had 
someone from the administration, the last administration in 
DEA, that said that they didn't want to schedule this as 
fentanyl because they wouldn't--what if--they need to check it 
every time it changes because what if it's as safe as water?
    Have you ever seen any fentanyl, illicit fentanyl, that 
showed up in our country that is safe?
    Dr. Westlake. No, to date, as far as substances that have 
been encountered by law enforcement, every single one has been 
bioactive--most of them as potent as fentanyl, one of them is 
7,000 more times potent than morphine. So there have been no 
bioactive fentanyl-related substances encountered today.
    Mr. Guthrie. And his point--he didn't use that example--his 
point was if it has been adulterated, how do we know it has got 
less safe--and he said safe as water--or more safe, or could be 
essentially placebo. Or could it be more deadly? But my point 
in scheduling this, people aren't sending stuff less deadly 
into the country.
    I guess they could have fought--gone that direction, but I 
don't think that is why they sent it in here, to give up 
placebo.
    So, Dr. Westlake, whatever takes someone down in this 
situation where they have substance abuse disorder issues, 
whatever starts that pathway is sad, and it is something we 
want to address.
    But just, specifically, I had a case of a mom back home in 
my district that had lost her daughter. It was a soccer injury. 
She had ACL surgery and then becomes--as far as she knew, that 
is what led to her substance abuse disorder, from routine 
prescription from surgery.
    And so we just saw the other day there is a new class of 
pain medicine that has been approved for nonopioid pain. So 
hopefully we can get there. And it has been a bipartisan effort 
to get to that.
    And so my question is, in your experience, can opioid 
exposure after an injury or surgery lead to misuse of 
prescription? Comment on what I just said about that. And then 
is it important for physicians to have--to try to stay away 
from opioids and go these new class of drugs when they become 
available?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, that is a great question, Chairman. 
There is a study out of University of Michigan that shows that 
one out of 16 kids that are exposed for the first time to 
Vicodin or hydrocodone after wisdom tooth surgery are using it 
a year later.
    So when I explain this to parents when they have a 20-year-
old that come in with a wrist fracture, that I am not going to 
be prescribing hydrocodone because there is a 1 in 16 chance 
that they will still be on it and become addicted. And that is 
the pathway to this, I think, this fentanyl crisis that we are 
seeing now. Fentanyl poisoning is the initial opioid 
overprescribing that happened.
    I think we have addressed that in medicine, in-house 
medicine. I think, you know, in Wisconsin we implemented the 
reforms and gave the physicians the tools and strategies.
    Mr. Guthrie. In just a few seconds, what about this new 
drug? What do you think? I just have a few seconds left.
    Dr. Westlake. It is fantastic. I mean, there is a study 
that shows----
    Mr. Guthrie. Is it as effective as opioid?
    Dr. Westlake. From what I understand, yes. It is brand new.
    Mr. Guthrie. OK. Thanks. I am out of my time, it has 
expired. I appreciate your time. And I will yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields. The Chair now 
recognizes the gentleman from California, Dr. Ruiz, for 5 
minutes of questions.
    Mr. Ruiz. Thank you very much. And thank you to the 
witnesses for being with us today for this important 
discussion.
    It continues to be mind-boggling to me that we are having 
this hearing today while the Trump administration continues to 
dismantle the very systems that exist to combat the opioid 
epidemic.
    For example, the Substance Use Block Grant administered by 
SAMHSA is the cornerstone of States' prevention, treatment, and 
recovery systems. It gives States the flexibility to tailor 
their services to meet the needs of the populations in their 
States.
    The most recent data shows that this block grant allowed 
over 1.6 million people to access treatment. Now this crucial 
source of funding is endangered, and access to treatment is 
being jeopardized all because of the Trump administration's 
absurd power grab.
    Ms. LaBelle, thank you for sharing your testimony with us 
today and for your expertise. I have several questions for you. 
What impact would a wide-reaching Federal funding freeze have 
on Federal, State, and local efforts to combat the opioid 
epidemic?
    Ms. LaBelle. Well, it would be devastating to States, 
certainly, and local governments. The grant program you 
mentioned is the number one source of funding for prevention in 
every single State in the country. That leaves a huge gap.
    Mr. Ruiz. OK. And can you provide examples of how 
administrative actions like this hamper both upstream and 
downstream approaches to combating illicit drugs?
    Ms. LaBelle. I mean, I mentioned the research piece, which 
is very important. I also think I want to emphasize how 
important it is that we have a trained workforce. And, you 
know, a lot of Federal workers are kind of in limbo right now. 
We need to bring people in, not only retain the people who are 
good at their jobs, who do a good job across the continuum and 
work in law enforcement, but also make sure that they have the 
skills and ongoing training that they need to address this 
issue.
    Mr. Ruiz. We heard just yesterday in a news article in VPN 
news entitled ``Virginia Community's Health Centers Close Over 
Federal Funding Access'' as a result of President Trump's 
funding freeze that 16 Federal qualified house centers in 
Virginia have been unable to access Federal funding. And many 
are closing their doors.
    Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to insert this 
article into the record.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Are we OK--we will look at it.
    Mr. Ruiz. Yes, it is right there. Usually, it is custom to 
just accept it into the record.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. I understand. We didn't have it 
beforehand, though, so we are just going to look at. We will be 
right back with you.
    Mr. Ruiz. OK.
    Ms. DeGette. I can see why you guys might not want to put 
it in. It criticizes the administration.
    Mr. Ruiz. I will get back to my----
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. We will look at it.
    Mr. Ruiz [continuing]. Time. And just--you know, Tuesday at 
the Rules Committee hearing, my colleague, Mr. Griffith, said 
while, quote/unquote, ``inartful,'' these administrative 
actions were necessary for the incoming administration.
    So with all due respect to my friend, the gentleman from 
Virginia, I am not sure that people in his district who are 
served by two FQACs that closed and now must drive miles upon 
miles, even up to 2 hours, for care will think that these 
actions are inartful, but just downright harmful and costly.
    Ms. LaBelle, what unique role do FQACs play in combating 
substance abuse disorders in rural and underserved communities. 
And how will closing them as is done in Virginia impact 
partnerships between law enforcement, providers, and patients 
trying to get appropriate care?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes, it affects--the FQACs are a critical 
component of the healthcare continuum for people in rural 
communities, in particular. And it is the place they can go to 
get the type of services that they need to address their 
substance use disorder. And without those, we could see 
increased overdoses.
    Mr. Ruiz. In fact, we have discussed here previously during 
the Republican effort to dismantle Medicaid as we know it that 
70 percent of those who seek treatment for opioid use disorder 
use Medicaid.
    And so dismantling block granting, limiting Medicaid, and 
attack on Medicaid also reduces access to care. Reducing access 
to care, either through funding freezes or going after 
Medicaid, makes Americans unhealthy again, and it raised costs 
for everyone.
    Mr. Chairman, I think the points made here by the witnesses 
point out the hypocrisies in the President's actions and the 
real impact on the tools our Nation needs to stay ahead of bad 
actors and protect our communities. Thank you, and I yield 
back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman had asked for--the 
gentleman yields, and he had asked for an article to be 
inserted into the record. Without objection, it is approved.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The Chair now recognizes the 
gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Griffith--OK. The gentleman, Mr. 
Griffith, from Virginia is recognized for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Griffith. I appreciate that, and I am hopeful that my 
team has given three letters that I would like to submit for 
the record to our friends on the other side of the aisle. But 
if not, I will certainly tender those so they can take a look 
at them. But I would ask unanimous consent for these three 
letters to be introduced. One letter is spearheaded by 
neurosurgeons, anesthesiologists, pain physicians, spine 
doctors, orthopedic surgeons, and others. These physician 
organizations have been great stewards of the Controlled 
Substances Act and mentioned that the temporary scheduled 
classification of the illicit analogs is not a sustainable or 
rational approach. In other words, not doing it temporarily is 
not rational.
    The other two letters are support letters from law 
enforcement agencies and urge passages of the HALT Fentanyl 
Act. So after our colleagues have had a chance to take a look 
at that, I would ask for unanimous consent.
    That said, let me also set the record straight on something 
that was just said. And while it is of concern that health 
centers in Virginia may have closed, my understanding is all 
that is getting worked out. But further it was said that two in 
my district had closed. That is not accurate. And I just want 
to get the record straight.
    We have been monitoring that situation. One of my health 
centers did report that they had had some difficulty accessing 
a site, but it did not cause closure. And we believe that they 
should have that resolved shortly. But no closure had resulted 
that I am aware of in my district. And so if somebody has 
better information, please provide it to me.
    Dr. Westlake--and then, Sheriff Bouchard, I am going to 
come to you--I am switching gears from what I was talking 
about. So I have concerns. My wife is a juvenile domestic 
relations district judge in the Commonwealth of Virginia, she 
is seeing concerns. So I want to know what your concerns are in 
your lines of work about the impact of unregulated, 
intoxicating hemp products on our kids. And a followup would 
be, what do you think we need to do to create a regulatory 
framework to allow lawful products to come to market? I have 
been working with the FDA on that, so I have got some ideas 
there. But I just want to know what you all have seen about 
these unregulated, intoxicating hemp products on our children.
    Sheriff Bouchard. We have not seen a huge number of hemp 
products now since we have legalized marijuana in our State. 
But what we have seen is an adulteration of marijuana products, 
and prior to that hemp, with other kinds of synthetics and 
other kind of drugs, like fentanyl. So we have actually found 
outside of our supply chain, if you will, the legal supply 
chain of marijuana in our State, illegal marijuana has been 
tampered with and has fentanyl in it. And so, we have seen all 
of these things really need a regulated, inspected process. And 
I would encourage that to happen both with hemp and with 
marijuana.
    Mr. Griffith. Let me do a followup before I go to you, Dr. 
Westlake. Let me just do a quick followup. So one of the 
problems we have seen in our region is THC gummy bears, or 
gummy bears that are supposed to have CBD, and then there is an 
unregulated, unknown amount of THC in there. And kids get ahold 
of them and they think they are candy, and then they overdose. 
And then when I say overdose, I am not talking about deaths at 
this point, but there may have been some indications, there may 
have actually been some brain damage. Are you all not seeing 
that in your region? Is that just a Virginia problem?
    Sheriff Bouchard. No, no, we are actually seeing that as 
well. In fact, there's PSAs in our region and among a number of 
States that have legalized marijuana and components like 
gummies, advising kids and parents about that and how to store 
it and the dangers of it. And there's some discussions about 
trying to make some of these gummies not look like little 
characters that attract the kid or the packaging that attracts 
children because they think it might be candy or it might be 
vitamins but, in fact, it has a drug component.
    Mr. Griffith. And it really would be helpful for you to get 
guidance from the FDA, wouldn't it?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Griffith. Dr. Westlake, the same questions.
    Dr. Westlake. Great. I personally saw some marijuana 
poisonings last week from gummies. I have seen it in the past, 
and two or three episodes last week alone. It is illegal in 
Wisconsin but comes up from Illinois and from Michigan and from 
around.
    The other part we see is the fentanyl-laced marijuana. I 
have had overdoses from that. And we are also seeing that with 
what you are talking about with, like, CBD that is unregulated. 
People come in and they don't know what is going on, and it 
turns out that they are intoxicated from marijuana that they 
thought they were just taking because there is no quality 
control or oversight over that.
    Mr. Griffith. All right. I appreciate that.
    Dr. Westlake, can you--I am switching back now to HALT 
Fentanyl--can you explain, because we have heard about 
scheduling side--and there is some disagreement on that? I 
really like the part--of course, so it is my bill, so it is 
natural I would like for it to have--but I like the part that 
allows for research to go on almost 4,800 estimated analogs or 
fentanyl-related substances. Can you tell us what you think 
about that, and how you think that we ought to go forward with 
that?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, I think it is a huge--and thank you for 
your leadership on the bill. It is a huge benefit to have to 
open up schedule I research. I think there has not been a lot 
of schedule I research on schedule I drugs because of that. So 
this will be a huge boom to that. And that is why it was signed 
off on by NIH and HHS and FDA.
    On here, there are some initial concerns about whether it 
would be too restrictive. But because of the way we design the 
language, it really has only affected those that are 
bioactively, you know, would structure relationships 
bioactively, likely to be active.
    Mr. Griffith. I really appreciate it. It is part of why I 
really like the bill. I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields back. The 
gentleman had asked for three articles to be inserted into the 
record. Without objection, that will be the order.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Can I have Members' attention for 
one second? Y'all please try to get these to us before the 
meeting so that we don't have to be interrupted with this and 
don't have any controversy about it. OK? Thank you.
    At this time, the Chair will recognize Representative 
Dingell for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Dingell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The opioid epidemic 
has ravaged families across the country, and quite frankly, has 
touched many of us, if not all of us, personally. It is an 
issue that requires serious bipartisan attention, and we have 
to work together because we know too many people are dying of 
it.
    Mr. Cullen, I join my colleagues in thanking you for having 
the courage to tell your personal story.
    I want to start by thanking Sheriff Bouchard for being here 
with us today. Mike has been a friend for a decade. John James 
and I both share him. He is the sheriff in my district. But 
more importantly, when my sister died of a drug overdose and I 
didn't understand it, I didn't understand what was in her 
blood, I didn't understand how she got it, where it came from, 
was there something more that I can do--Mike Bouchard was there 
for me. So I have lived this personally with the sheriff that 
is with us today.
    Sheriff Bouchard, the drug chemistry section of Oakland 
County's Forensic Science Laboratory analyze samples submitted 
by various law enforcement agencies for controlled substances 
and illegal drugs. I introduced legislation to reauthorize the 
SUPPORT Act's lab pilot program to improve coordination between 
public health laboratories and those operated by law 
enforcement to better detect fentanyl and other synthetic 
opioids.
    Can you tell us more about the Oakland County lab's effort 
and ability to detect fentanyl, fentanyl analogs, and the 
emergency threat of the xylazine, and what challenges come up 
in conducting this testing, and what Congress can do to provide 
further support?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. And I appreciate our 
friendship too. In terms of our lab, you know, sometimes we are 
not even aware of some of these changes that are being seen 
from the street, and we hear about it from the medical 
profession or elsewhere. So I have learned about xylazine 
happening, I believe, in the State of Pennsylvania was where 
some of it really started to catch fire. So I asked our lab to 
figure out a way to test for it and then come back and tell me 
what they were seeing. And I was shocked as they were how much 
were in all of the test samples that were on their bench.
    So the communication between public health and crime labs 
is very helpful for us to know what we are looking for and what 
we should be anticipating on the street and what our folks that 
are touching and coming into contact that would need to be 
aware of. You know, we had to change all of our field-testing 
kinds of things because just coming into contact with certain 
drugs has, as you know, caused overdoses for police agencies in 
those situations. So I think that would be very helpful and 
important.
    Mrs. Dingell. Thank you. In your testimony, you mentioned 
Oakland County's Crisis Response Unit and the Cosponsor 
Program, which both partner healthcare providers and law 
enforcement to implement preventative measures, find treatment 
sources, and deescalate crisis situations.
    Can you tell us more about the success of your partnership 
with the Oakland Community Health Network, the importance of a 
comprehensive approach that includes both law enforcement and 
healthcare providers? And are you being impacted by current 
potential Federal grant nonpayments.
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. At this point, none of our 
staff have said they are having any interruption. But the 
partnership is critical. We work hand in glove with our health 
department with the community of coalitions, a group that 
focuses on substance use disorder, and all of the associated 
preventative, both educationally, free Narcan kits, visits to 
school. I go to schools with this one group called Fentanyl 
Fathers that tragically are in that club they never want to 
join. One father talked about his daughter taking what she 
thought was a half an Adderall pill, and it had fentanyl, and 
it killed her. And so that is why we adopted The One Pill Can 
Kill. And in some of our discussions--and the pill press thing 
is very front and center with us as well.
    I think it is important that, you know, we do those 
preventative things in partnerships with all of those agencies. 
We are not going to arrest our way out of it, but we can punish 
the folks that are profiting from the suffering and the death 
of others.
    Mrs. Dingell. Thank you. We know more than when my sister 
died. But, Dr. Camenga, your work focuses specifically on 
addressing substance use and substance use disorders. Your 
research has explored development of novel technology, enhanced 
interventions to reduce drug use in adolescents and young 
adults.
    Can you share more about the status of these interventions 
and their funding sources?
    Dr. Camenga. As part of my research, I develop 
interventions for vaping prevention in middle school students. 
Students love technology. It is a way to communicate important 
education to them. We have been developing these interventions 
for years. Right now, we are on hold not knowing, you know, how 
to continue to build them out until we understand funding a 
little better.
    Mrs. Dingell. Thank you, we need funding. I yield back, Mr. 
Chair.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentlelady yields back. The 
Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Florida, Dr. Dunn, for 
5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Dunn. Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Thank you, again, 
to our witnesses for being here with us today. I am gravely 
concerned with the illicit drugs that have been pouring across 
our southern border for years. It is clear that this problem 
requires significant attention to resources from us.
    For years, the drug cartels have exploited our southern 
border, and they are working with the Chinese Communist Party 
to poison Americans. But alarmingly, recent reports show that 
these cartels are mobilizing along our northern border as well. 
They are creating super labs to illegally distribute drugs 
throughout our communities.
    I would like to submit an article for the record that 
highlights these crimes titled, ``British Columbia organized 
crime expanding export of fentanyl and other drugs,'' published 
in the Vancouver Sun. And, yes, it was submitted earlier. So 
thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Sheriff Bouchard, can you speak to how the drug cartels 
actually move drugs across our border, specifically, how drugs 
get from their facilities into the hands of our citizens?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. They move it in a variety of 
ways. They are much like any private company that is looking 
for efficient, effective routes. Sometimes it is muled across 
the border and then has transportation routes up into every 
community. And other times, we see it shipped in or come across 
in different fashions. We have seen it both in parcels and in 
vehicles moved across the border.
    Mr. Dunn. So in followup to that question, have you seen 
the cartels adjusting their operations in response to how we 
adjust at the border?
    Sheriff Bouchard. One hundred percent, yes. They are very 
nimble. They look for everything that we do. They look for 
countermeasures. One of the largest seizures in the history of 
our State happened in a dump house where they were storing 
drugs about a mile from one of our substations. And we took 
over policing that community. And within a month, we found 
that, and it was staggering the amount of drugs. And it was 
definitely directly tied to cartel activity.
    Mr. Dunn. I appreciate your insights as critical. We do 
everything we can, and we need to know those things that you 
know to respond intelligently.
    Dr. Westlake, as a medical doctor, I am interested to hear 
from you as to how this issue presents in the emergency room. 
You speak from your own experience, how the presentations of 
drug overdoses have evolved over the last few years.
    Dr. Westlake. I am sorry. I didn't understand the question.
    Mr. Dunn. How have the presentations in the emergency room, 
how are they changing over the last few years?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, so I think when we kind of saw the 
start, and it was with prescription opioid epidemic, and there 
were overdoses on prescription pills because of the 
overprescribing issue, that has pretty much--at least in 
Wisconsin, and my understanding across the country--it has 
pretty much stopped, and now it has moved on to the illicit 
substances. And then once they became the counterfeit 
substances, you know, initially, it was people that knew they 
were using and was taking risks, and now it has moved to people 
that don't even know that they are using.
    And the majority of overdoses that I see are people that 
are not aware that they are taking fentanyl. The last 10 
overdoses that I have seen in the last couple of months all 
thought they were taking heroin. And when we tested it, there 
was no opioid, it was all pure fentanyl that they were 
overdosing from. So it has been a huge shift.
    Again, it is fire hydrants taking it more soft into 
different things.
    Mr. Dunn. So I think that it is an important key point 
there. People think they are taking something else. They even 
think they are smoking some marijuana or something. And what 
they get exposed to is a really, really dangerous substance. 
And even microscopic amounts of it can kill.
    So that is a--thank you very much. This threat is obviously 
to all of us. We can't sit back and watch the cartels poison 
our society. So I look forward to working with all of you and 
all of my colleagues here to address these problems. Thank you 
very much, Mr. Chair. I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields. Is there a 
question on the article to be inserted into the record?
    Ms. DeGette. Mr. Chairman, what is source of this article?
    Mr. Dunn. The Vancouver Sun.
    Ms. DeGette. Thank you. I have no objection.
    Mr. Dunn. The Vancouver Sun. It is a regular newspaper.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. Without objection, the article is 
included in the record.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The Chair now recognizes the 
gentlelady from Washington, Dr. Schrier, for 5 minutes of 
questioning.
    Ms. Schrier. Thank you, Chair Carter. And thank you, 
Ranking Member DeGette. And thank you to our witnesses today.
    In my State of Washington, like every other State, fentanyl 
and other illicit drugs have had a profound and devastating 
impact.
    Last Monday, Washington State had a $155.6 million 
disbursement frozen due to President Trump's halt of fentanyl 
spending--excuse me, of Federal spending. And to be clear, that 
amount of money included grants for SAMHSA, which is the 
Federal agency responsible for substance abuse prevention and 
treatment. And I just have to point out the real ramification 
of Trump's Federal spending freeze--not opposed by a single 
Republican so far--has on overdose deaths in this country.
    I know everyone here is committed to stemming the flow of 
illicit fentanyl and other drugs, that supporting a funding 
freeze that guts substance use prevention and addiction 
treatment programs is antithetical to solving this problem and 
is absolutely reckless.
    Mr. Cullen and others sitting in this room are family 
members of people who have died from fentanyl poisoning. And 
freezing treatment programs will only add more grieving 
families.
    I want to pivot to xylazine. It was later in coming to the 
State of Washington. I am hearing our State narcotics 
investigators that this use of xylazine as a cutting agent in 
fentanyl is very much increasing locally. There is currently no 
known treatment for xylazine overdose. And so Narcan, of 
course, if you have a mixed overdose, may not save a life in 
that case.
    Ms. LaBelle, in light of the recent OMB funding freeze, I 
wondered if you could speak to the impact of withholding NIH 
funds, especially when it comes to developing xylazine 
detection tests and potential xylazine reversal agents.
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes, I mean, there--I can't speak to specific 
grants that we have approved at NIDA, or will approve at some 
point, but I know that having worked closely with people in the 
University of Washington, there is a lot of ongoing research 
that has to be funded. And the only people who have that type 
of funding is the Federal Government through the National 
Institute on Drug Abuse.
    Ms. Schrier. That is right. Thank you very much. To pivot 
to China's role in all of this, the People's Republic of China 
shipped the precursor chemical needed to make fentanyl to 
Mexico, the United States, or elsewhere in the world where that 
has been assembled into fentanyl and fentanyl analogs by 
criminal groups. And then it floods into the U.S. market.
    I grilled representatives from the Chinese embassy about 
this, and they so proudly claimed that they were addressing 
this problem seriously. But then I pressed them on this, and it 
turns out that, while they are supposedly curtailing the 
shipments to Mexico, they are sending fentanyl precursors to 
very suspect places around the world.
    For example, they showed me a list. They are sending to 
clinics and to hospitals. And as a physician, I can assure you 
that there are no clinics or hospitals in this country 
manufacturing fentanyl. It is still making its way to the 
cartels.
    So, Sheriff Bouchard, I was wondering what steps you think 
the Federal Government should take to stem this flow of 
fentanyl precursors from China.
    Sheriff Bouchard. Oh, obviously, that is solely within the 
purview of the Federal Government, is pressure on nation 
states, especially ones that are dealing this into our country, 
obviously, intentionally. And I think that great pressure has 
to be brought to bear because they are the origin of a lot of 
what we are seeing across the country in terms of death and 
misery.
    Ms. Schrier. Any specific recommendation that you would 
make?
    Sheriff Bouchard. That would get into policy things on how 
the Federal Government deals with a nation state. You know, I 
again go back to anything that would strongly enough discourage 
them or let them know there would be consequences for them to 
continue to traffic this into our country. I mean, you can get 
xylazine mailed to you direct right now from China.
    Ms. Schrier. It certainly is to their advantage to weaken 
the United States, and this is part of what will do that. 
Absolutely.
    I just want to mention in these last 30 seconds, I am a 
pediatrician, and so I am very concerned about the poisoning of 
kids. They think they are buying something else, and 60 percent 
is tainted with fentanyl, and so many of these are deadly 
amounts. We have so many youths who overdose. They are now 
filling our emergency rooms. There aren't enough treatment 
facilities for them.
    And so just a last quick question. I don't have time to ask 
the question, but I will just point out that Dr. Camenga and I 
both know that we need more resources for kids and treatment. I 
yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentlelady yields. The Chair now 
recognizes the gentleman from Florida, Mr. Bilirakis, for 5 
minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for holding our 
first healthcare subcommittee hearing on this very critical 
topic, the illicit drug threats that are plaguing our 
constituents through fentanyl-related substances that have 
flooded through our borders, unfortunately.
    I am thankful that President Trump has taken quick action 
to address the border crisis. I am proud to join with 
Representative Griffith and Latta in support of the HALT 
fentanyl Act, which would finally classify fentanyl-related 
substances as a class I drug and give law enforcement the 
certainty it needs to fight back against drug traffickers. It 
is long overdue.
    And while we are trying to keep pace with this evolving 
landscape, new threats continue to emerge, unfortunately. I am 
proud to colead the Combating Illicit Xylazine Act with my good 
friend, August Pfluger, and Jimmy Panetta, which would schedule 
xylazine as a schedule III drug under the Controlled Substances 
Act.
    While the animal or--drug xylazine has horrific side 
effects in human use, it prolongs the effects of fentanyl, 
making it extremely dangerous on the streets. Our bipartisan 
legislation strikes a key balance to provide more tools while 
maintaining legitimate use for veterinarians and others to use 
this drug safely without diversion in large animals.
    So my first question is for Sheriff Bouchard. You touched 
upon the emerging threat of xylazine and other new drugs in 
your testimony.
    Can you elaborate why it is critical from a law enforcement 
perspective to keep, as you say, and I quote, ``a more agile 
regulatory framework'' so we can address these threats faster 
and more effectively?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. Well, I guess it also touches 
on what we just talked about. When you have a nation state 
involved that has the resources and the capability to create 
laboratories and factories that can quickly change one 
component of what they are making in a lab and then suddenly 
make it legal or have a different kind of thing that they can 
send in, suddenly we are dealing with something we are not 
aware of because they changed in the lab, and it is landing in 
our laps. And that is how I found out about xylazine hitting a 
different State and asked our lab, and it was already there. 
And that is the kind of nimbleness we need to be capable of 
dealing with when you have somebody that is intentionally of a 
nation state status allowing that to occur.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you very much. Over the years during 
this overdose crisis, we have sadly seen time and time again 
parents were prescribed opioids for legitimate purposes--I said 
parents, I meant patients. But still parents and kids, what 
have you--like a surgery or an injury, but often go down on 
paths towards illicit or diverted pills, and even fentanyl once 
they are addicted. And this is the majority of the cases, in my 
opinion.
    Our committee has worked on policies that incentivized 
nonopioids. And I have long been interested in encouraging 
alternative therapies to pain management. I am glad to see that 
last week, the FDA approved the first in-class nonopioid 
alternative for acute pain.
    So, Dr. Westlake, you testified about your inspiration 
after the tragedy of your friend's son who was a victim of this 
trend of getting hooked on legitimate prescriptions, which led 
to worse illicit options, such as heroin. I believe this 
contributes to further illegal fentanyl crossing our southern 
border. And we should work towards methods to cut off the 
demand here wherever plausible.
    Would you agree that patient access to additional pain 
management tools beyond opioids are an important component of 
addressing the illicit drug threats in a comprehensive way? And 
we have made some changes in the VA, but we have got to do 
more. So if you can answer that question, I would appreciate 
it.
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, absolutely. I think opioids should not 
be the last medication you use. I used to normally tell my 
patients to, you know, use Tylenol and ibuprofen and 
prescription strength, which has been shown as effective as 
oxycodone for acute fracture pain. And then at nighttime only 
to take opioids if needed if they are going to be pain from the 
surgery or from the fracture--got to kind of get through that, 
but they don't want to get hooked on opioids. Half of the 
people that got hooked on opioids didn't start by trying to get 
it.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, sir. Mr. Cullen, thank you for 
being here to tell about your story. I am so sorry to hear 
about Zachary. I want to highlight an important part of your 
testimony when you say most kids are not addicts. I believe 
that they are stressed and anxious and that social media 
provides a platform for kids to easily purchase drugs online, 
which get laced with fentanyl and lead to overdose poisoning.
    I am committed to holding Big Tech social media accountable 
for enabling this on their platform. Can you share your 
perspective on this and what suggestions you might have to curb 
this horrific trend? Because we are going to refile COSA, and I 
want as much input as possible, please.
    Mr. Cullen. Yes, thank you for your question. Yes, we 
talked to several of Zach's friends afterwards, and they told 
us how easy that it could be, that you could order 
prescription-strength pills off Snapchat, TikTok, Instagram, 
that sort of thing, delivered right to your house.
    I think what I spoke about in my testimony was that we 
would like to see PSAs. But the PSAs need to be directed at the 
platforms that they are utilizing, not ABC News, NBC News. That 
is not where they are getting their information from. I think 
it needs to be targeted. And I have seen some Ad Counsel ads 
for drunk driving in the past week or so. I think that it needs 
to be--something that needs to be elevated.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Good suggestion. Thank you very much. I 
yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields. The Chair now 
recognizes the gentlelady from Massachusetts, Representative 
Trahan, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Ranking 
Member. Thank you especially to our witnesses. I appreciate the 
subcommittee's focus on an issue that affects Americans across 
geography, demographics, and politics.
    However, I would like to understand how broad funding cuts 
backed by my Republican colleagues would undermine the efforts 
to combat this addiction overdose crisis.
    Overdose trends show a rise in fentanyl mixed with 
xylazine, a powerful animal sedative known as tranq dope. First 
responders in my home State of Massachusetts have seen it 
spreading across communities. And what is particularly 
concerning is that experts warn that Narcan is ineffective 
against xylazine. And the FDA had stated it is unclear if 
today's Narcan can reverse its effects. We can't be caught 
flat-footed when the next dangerous substance like xylazine 
emerges.
    Additionally, the recent drop in overdose deaths is largely 
due to increased Narcan access, which has been critical for 
those with opioid use disorder.
    So, Ms. LaBelle, how does significant NIH research funding 
cuts undermine our ability to develop more effective overdose 
reversal medication and keep pace with evolving overdose 
crisis?
    Ms. LaBelle. NIDA is the number 1 source of funding for 
research worldwide. There is no philanthropy that can make up 
for that. So it could have a devastating impact.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you, Mr. LaBelle. It seems that we all 
agree that strong support for the research landscape is key to 
finding new treatments and lifesaving anecdotes.
    The opioid crisis continues to devastate communities across 
the country, and Medicaid has been a vital lifeline for those 
struggling with substance use disorder, providing access to 
essential treatment and recovery services.
    However, my Republican colleagues support Medicaid 
proposals that would cut Federal funding, especially in 
Medicaid expansion. Many individuals with SUD could lose access 
to critical care at a time when they need it most.
    Ms. LaBelle, again, how would cutting Federal funding for 
Medicaid expansion affect individuals with substance use 
disorder who are already in a vulnerable situation without the 
critical care that they rely on?
    Ms. LaBelle. One good example is treatment, in carceral 
settings, when people are leaving incarceration and need to be 
connected to care. And about 15 States have been approved for 
using Federal funds, Federal Medicaid funds. So cutting back on 
that would devastate a population that is at heightened risk of 
overdose.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you. Sheriff Peter Koutoujian, the 
Sheriff of Middlesex County in my State of Massachusetts, has 
been a leader in tackling the opioid crisis through initiatives 
like the Sheriff's Outreach and Recovery Program, which helps 
individuals access treatment and support.
    Sheriff Bouchard, could you just share an example of how 
you collaborate with the Drug-free Community Grant Program? 
Additionally, how would the potential loss of nearly 670,000 in 
Federal funding as outlined in the OMB memo on behalf of the 
President impact your work and the communities that you serve?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. I can speak to the partnership 
of the actual grants and who gets them, whether it is our 
agency or our partners. It probably is more my CFO. But as it 
relates to the partnership, it is critically important that we 
are hand in glove. And a lot of those programs that we have, 
our crisis response unit is in partnership with those folks and 
with the grants. And having that capability to work together to 
intervene, then connect them with the resources--as I said, in 
one of those house visits after we had saved the individual 
once, they were checking up on them and found them overdosing 
again. Saved their lives. So to connect those resources in a 
partnership is critically important so that we can not only 
save lives but put them on a different path.
    Mrs. Trahan. Thank you. Thanks so much again. I yield back.
    Mr. Dunn [presiding]. The gentlelady yields back. I now 
recognize the gentleman from Texas, Representative Crenshaw.
    Mr. Crenshaw. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you for holding 
this important hearing today. And thank you to our panel of 
witnesses for being here.
    I know we focused on this issue as a committee before. I am 
sure it won't be the last time, and I am glad we talked about 
it again. This is an easily bipartisan issue.
    I wish some of my colleagues weren't wasting time talking 
about a so-called funding freeze that is not even in effect. 
That is a fact: It is not. The distraction from the fact that 
fentanyl is pouring across our southern border, it is 
trafficked by Mexican drug cartels, and it is laced into street 
drugs that is killing our kids.
    This isn't just a drug problem, this is a deliberate act of 
poisoning against the American people, and cartels are the 
culprit. As chairman of the Cartel Task Force, I have 
introduced real bipartisan solutions to battle the cartels. We 
have a lot of work to do to dismantle this terrorist insurgency 
that is destroying both Mexican and American societies.
    This is a supply problem. Whether someone is addicted or 
whether they were just partying and got a pill that was laced 
with fentanyl, the fact is they would have never gotten 
fentanyl without the supply from cartels. Supply creates the 
demand. It creates the addiction. That is a fact.
    Another fact that deterrence matters. Criminals and cartels 
will be less inclined to traffic fentanyl and deal it to kids 
if the penalty is high enough. This is also a very simple 
concept.
    So I would like to start with Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you 
for being here. In your line of work, how often do you come 
across counterfeit pills?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Regularly, sir.
    Mr. Crenshaw. And let's talk about how these pills are 
getting made.
    How often are the cartels getting their hands on pill 
presses, and who sells them?
    Sheriff Bouchard. It is a big problem. Our narcotics team 
and teams across the country and our Association of Major 
County Sheriffs of America are seeing more and more pills that 
look like something they are not that have fentanyl as a 
component or are all fentanyl.
    Mr. Crenshaw. Do you have any idea of where they are 
getting them, who makes them? Is it just that, or is it just 
extremely easy to get them so we don't know?
    Sheriff Bouchard. It is extremely easy to get them right 
now. They are not serialized, or there is not any kind of 
registration requirement. So it is, in essence, you know, super 
easy, and it is a pathway to bring something in under the guise 
of something else. It is a Trojan horse that is killing a lot 
of kids.
    Mr. Crenshaw. So it would be helpful to serialize them and 
be able to track these pill presses.
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Crenshaw. I appreciate that. And that is one of the 
reasons I have bipartisan legislation that requires the 
serialization of pill presses. Because we need to cut off the 
cartel's access to the tools they use to manufacture this 
poison and trick kids into taking something that they think is 
something else, but it is not in the place of fentanyl.
    Senator Cornyn also has this legislation in the Senate. I 
would encourage everyone to get on this. Again, it is 
bipartisan.
    Sheriff, do dealers generally understand the danger of the 
counterfeit pills they are pushing?
    Sheriff Bouchard. The dealers do, but the kids don't. That 
is why it is so deadly.
    Mr. Crenshaw. But the dealers do.
    Sheriff Bouchard. Absolutely. Understanding that fentanyl, 
in even small doses, can kill people. And there has been kind 
of a paradigm change over time where the old dealers of all 
that have been in this business a long time, used to start you 
with a little bit to get you to be a regular customer. Today, 
they don't care how many people they kill.
    Mr. Crenshaw. I agree with you. I think the dealers 
absolutely know what they are doing. You know, in Texas, I 
think we got it right, although I think we could even make this 
law better. We passed the law to enhance penalties for fentanyl 
distribution, giving law enforcement the ability to go after 
these criminals with murder charges.
    Since that law went into effect, overdoses in Texas are 
down 56 percent. That was pretty good progress. The U.S. 
Sentencing Commission data for fiscal year 2021 released last 
year shows that the average for fentanyl trafficking was just 
over 4 years--4 years, that is less than some people get for 
robbery. Does that seem right?
    Sheriff Bouchard. No, sir, because, you know, they are 
spreading that pain well across your population before they 
actually got successfully prosecuted for the one they did.
    Mr. Crenshaw. I mean, you would agree that perhaps--would 
there be an argument for a similar law at the Federal level to 
put it on the dealers, that dealing fentanyl knowingly could 
occur to a murder charge?
    Sheriff Bouchard. I think that would send a very strong 
message.
    Mr. Crenshaw. It certainly would. Again, incentives matter. 
I am nearly out of time on--in your experience as well, would 
you say that cartels are exploiting the fact that fentanyl 
analogs are not criminally classified as schedule I substances?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes.
    Mr. Crenshaw. Have you seen a decline in fentanyl overdoses 
since Congress extended the temporary scheduling order?
    Sheriff Bouchard. We have seen a decline in deaths, but not 
necessarily overdoses because they keep changing.
    Mr. Crenshaw. Well, I hope that as we vote on that today, 
that we do make it permanent. Thank you, and I yield back.
    Mr. Dunn. The gentleman yields back. And I recognize 
Representative Veasey from Texas.
    Mr. Veasey. Absolutely. Thank you very much. I want to 
thank--I know that Chairman Carter had stepped away, but I want 
to thank him and everyone on this panel, the way that they have 
been addressing the grieving parents that are here and other 
people that have experienced loss due to fentanyl.
    In the '80s and '90s, people just used to talk about people 
that have become addicted to drugs or were using drugs, just 
talked about them like they were dirt and garbage.
    And I am just happy that there seems to be a bipartisan 
sense in this committee that we need to get beyond that and 
actually try to help people do better, whether or not we 
disagree on their approaches. I think the language that has 
been used here today is really encouraging.
    And I want to thank Mr. Cullen for sharing a story about 
his son. I have an 18-year-old son that is a freshman at 
college. And I was talking to my wife the other day, and I 
said, you know, even if your kids aren't on drugs, they are 
saying that you should keep a can of Narcan at your house just 
in case one of your friend's kids come over. And it might not 
even be something that is drug-related.
    A lot of the pressures that high school and college 
students are under today to keep up will oftentimes send them 
onto the black market for Adderall and ADHD-related drugs. And 
sometimes they are fake pills that are laced with Adderall. So 
it may not be anything that is cocaine or heroin or I-want-to-
get-high related. It may just be someone just trying to keep up 
in what is a very competitive universe in our college campuses, 
and they are absolutely victims.
    But I want to be clear, when we discuss solutions here 
today. President Trump just illegally seized $8.6 billion in 
Congress-approved opioid funding. And the fallout has been an 
unmitigated disaster, I think, due to the chaos that was 
unleashed by the Government freeze.
    And I want to just, you know, say something that my 
colleagues said that there ended up not being a Government 
freeze. But before the 5 p.m. deadline, there were federally 
qualified healthcare centers across Texas that couldn't get 
into the database. So they couldn't treat people for things 
like what we are talking about here today.
    And there is a federally qualified healthcare center in 
Virginia just this past Tuesday that announced the closure of 
several locations because they still cannot access their 
funding to help the people that you are here talking about 
today and that other people are here talking about today. And 
so this isn't some sort of a game. This is serious, and lives 
are at stake.
    And so I wanted to ask the sheriff, Trump's illegal funding 
freeze put critical programs like high-intensity drug 
trafficking area programs at risk, programs that help law 
enforcement, including your own, in the fight against fentanyl 
in high-risk areas. And even the Office of National Drug 
Policies web page has been wiped by President Elon.
    And so, Sheriff, can you confirm, yes or no, that the 
programs like HIDTA and other Federal grants are essential for 
reducing the supply of fentanyl in your community?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes, HIDTA is very important, not only 
for your coordination but deconfliction and partnership.
    Mr. Veasey. So you agree that a funding freeze or any 
attempt to freeze these funds or cut resources directly 
endangers Americans by weakening our efforts in the fight 
against fentanyl?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Well, as I said earlier, my staff hasn't 
told us there has been any shutdown in terms of our operations 
that we are aware of, but obviously, it is an important 
program.
    Mr. Veasey. Yes, well, thank you very much.
    This is for the professor. Last year, there was a 
bipartisan Senate bill that would have delivered critical 
resources to the border to combat fentanyl trafficking and 
funding that law enforcement and public health officials agreed 
was desperately needed to stem the flow of drugs into our 
country.
    But instead of putting public safety first, the President 
and the Speaker of the House decided that for political gain, 
that we would slow the immigration bill. And now a year later 
we are still waiting for any meaningful action from colleagues 
to help stop the pour of fentanyl into our legal ports of 
entry.
    And given this failure, what sort of resources are most 
urgently needed to strengthen interdiction efforts and disrupt 
the supply of fentanyl and other dangerous substances at our 
ports of entry?
    Ms. LaBelle. So I think there are three pieces. First is 
investing in our workforce so they are trained. The second is 
intelligence sharing. And lastly, the technology, so we have 
the best technology to identify drugs that may be coming in 
over the border.
    Mr. Veasey. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I 
yield back.
    Mr. Dunn. The gentleman yields back. I now recognize Dr. 
John Joyce from Pennsylvania for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Joyce. Thank you, Chairman. And thank you for holding 
this hearing. And thank you to all the panel for taking out of 
your busy schedules to be with us. I also want to acknowledge 
and thank Chairman Griffith for his incredible work on the HALT 
fentanyl Act, a bill that I am proud to be a cosponsor. And 
look forward to see its passage through the House of 
Representatives this week.
    Since the inauguration of President Trump, we have seen 
President Trump take immediate action to combat the growing 
threat of illicit fentanyl flowing through our borders. He 
designated the cartels in Mexico as a foreign terrorist 
organization and reached an agreement with the Mexican 
President to deploy her country's National Guard to help stop 
the transport of this deadly drug into our country.
    Unfortunately, these positive steps come only a few years 
after the inaction of the Biden administration. And because of 
that delay, fentanyl poisoning has risen dramatically, with 7 
out of 10 illicit fentanyl pills tested by the DEA in 2023 
containing a potentially lethal dose of fentanyl. That is 7 out 
of 10. And go back just 2 years before that, it was only 4 out 
of 10. Why would I say ``only'' 4 out of 10 deadly pills?
    Ray Cullen, thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing 
the story of your son, Zach. Can you talk about how fentanyl 
poisoning is distinct from an accidental overdose?
    Mr. Cullen. Yes, thank you for the question. So, in my 
opinion, an accidental overdose is when someone takes 
something, whether prescribed or not, more of what they were 
supposed to than the body could handle. A poisoning to me means 
that someone took something that had something in it that they 
were not expecting.
    So in our case, Zach purchased cocaine. Bad decision. But 
the coroner told me that there was more fentanyl than cocaine 
in his system. So he did not die because he took too much 
cocaine.
    Mr. Joyce. So the accidental deaths that we are seeing 
because of this poison being mixed in to other street drugs is 
causing the increase of the fentanyl deaths that we are seeing 
in the United States. And many of these are fentanyl analogs--
fentanyl analogs laced into, as you mentioned, cocaine that are 
being created by the Mexican cartels. And they use precursor 
drugs that are created by the Chinese Communist Party. And 
those are shipped to Mexico, where the cartels, in their labs, 
mix these drugs up, or use these pill presses, or mix them up 
with other drugs, as simple as marijuana as well.
    These are multinational organizations. They are sending 
thousands of pounds of deadly drugs into the United States to 
kill our friends, our neighbors, our children.
    Mr. Cullen, with all of this in mind, do you agree with 
President Trump's classification of the cartels as foreign 
terrorist organizations?
    Mr. Cullen. One hundred percent. This was something that we 
brought up at the roundtable about 2 years ago, where that was 
one of the things that we would like to have seen happen, along 
with the declaring fentanyl a weapon of mass destruction.
    Mr. Joyce. Dr. Westlake, as an emergency physician, can you 
speak to how continued emergence of new, deadlier illicit drugs 
make it more difficult for you, when you are in the emergency 
room, which you were just this week, and patients that come in, 
do you have to use higher doses to reverse the overdoses that 
you are seeing?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes. Thanks for the question, Congressman. It 
kind of depends. So Narcan works, and it works well. But the 
problem isn't that there isn't a potent enough Narcan, although 
that may be partially the problem. The problem is that people 
are exposed to these poisons to begin with. The prevention of 
stopping them from existing is critical.
    I also want to point out one thing going back to weapons of 
mass destruction. Fentanyl is more deadly than Sarin nerve gas. 
It is easier to die from Sarin nerve gas than from fentanyl. 
The lethal dose is higher in Sarin. So it is a chemical-
weapons-based created poison.
    Mr. Joyce. As we sit here and discuss the threat the 
cartels are working, this multinational and described as being 
a nimble group by the sheriff here, they are working to create 
cheaper and deadlier drugs to smuggle across our borders.
    We have responsibility here in this committee and in 
Congress to protect our communities from these ongoing and 
emerging chemical threats. While the passage of the HALT 
Fentanyl Act will represent a great start, I remain personally 
committed to combating the production and sale of all of these 
illicit substances.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I yield back.
    Mr. Dunn. The gentleman yields back. I now recognize the 
gentlelady from New York, Ms. Ocasio-Cortez.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Thank you all, to all of our witnesses here today, sharing 
their expertise and their story.
    And, Mr. Cullen, thank you for sharing your son's story 
with us here in the committee. And I think it is tremendously 
important that we communicate to you that what happened to your 
son will not happen in vain and that we are going to fight to 
make sure that there is real change that happens to ensure that 
victims across the country are protected from this happening 
ever again.
    I represent the South Bronx, and the South Bronx, 
historically, if it were its own State, would have the second-
highest per capita rate of overdoses in the entire country, 
second only to West Virginia. And so this is a well-known issue 
in our community.
    I, like the ranking member, keep Narcan in my car. We have 
communities that have been ravaged by fentanyl. And one thing 
that is also in New York's 14th Congressional District is 
Rikers jail.
    We have seen the impacts of schedule I on certain drugs and 
substances, and these scheduling differences matter, schedule 
II, schedule I, schedule III, et cetera. When we look at the 
impacts of these things, what I think is very important when we 
look at schedule I is the presence of mandatory minimums. And 
what happens in mandatory minimums is that many of the victims 
of fentanyl distribution, drug distribution, themselves become 
incarcerated, while many of the upstream distributors go off 
scot-free.
    If we want to address this issue, we need to look at 
financial crimes. And, in fact, many of the industries 
responsible for supercharging the distribution of fentanyl are 
getting off without enforcement, and one such industry is 
crypto. And I think it is very important that if we want to 
make sure that we take an important approach on this, we need 
to go after the folks who are responsible for the upstream 
distribution of this.
    But I want to put that aside. Ms. LaBelle, in your 
testimony, you named some very key different factors in this 
crisis and how we can address it. First, you named 
transnational efforts, which I think are tremendously important 
and, to that extent, addressing the financial chokepoints that 
actually reward fentanyl trafficking.
    But then, secondly, you talked about prevention and 
treatment. And one thing that I thought was very significant in 
your testimony is you naming the healthcare agencies that are 
responsible for helping reduce fentanyl and fentanyl use, and 
one of those that you named was not just the CDC, the NIH, but 
you also named Medicaid.
    Would it be fair to say that Medicaid is actually one of 
the most important and strongest protections we have in the 
opioid crisis in the United States?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes. It treats a lot of people with addiction 
who would not otherwise be able to receive care.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. And cutting off Medicaid and cutting off 
access to Medicaid could potentially increase the fentanyl 
crisis in the United States and certainly result in deaths from 
the fentanyl crisis?
    Ms. LaBelle. I have--I think it is safe to say that, if 
Medicaid were significantly reduced, more people would die of 
overdoses.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. So we are talking about the prospect of 
cutting Medicaid as exploding the fentanyl crisis in the United 
States. And I imagine you see in many communities where there 
are fentanyl--when there is widespread fentanyl use, there's 
also large interplays with the Medicaid system, correct?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. Can you explain that a little bit 
further, what you see?
    Ms. LaBelle. So, I mean, people are, especially in Medicaid 
expansion States--I mean, one area that I keep bringing up, but 
it is so important, and we have done a lot of work on this at 
Georgetown, is people upon leaving incarceration are at 10 
times greater risk of overdose. And so cutting off Medicaid for 
that population will leave them not only probably more 
mortality but also increase their risk they are just going to 
end up back in prison.
    Ms. Ocasio-Cortez. So one of the things you are saying, 
very importantly, someone leaving incarceration is at 10 times 
higher risk of overdose. Demand. And so incarcerating people 
too broadly can also create a demand on fentanyl because these 
are people who are struggling with a lot of these issues.
    And I think one of the things that is important for us to 
see here is, in those threats to Medicaid, just last month in 
our continuing resolution, we had bipartisan efforts to address 
fentanyl, including expansion of Medicaid to address the 
fentanyl crisis, treatment, that the Republican majority 
stripped on orders of Elon Musk.
    People are dying because of this, and we have to make sure 
that we are protecting our Medicaid system, not cutting it, 
because cuts to Medicaid are going to expand our fentanyl 
crisis.
    And with that, I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia [presiding]. The gentlelady yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Ohio, 
Representative Balderson, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Balderson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all for 
being here today.
    My first question is for Dr. Westlake. And Dr. Joyce 
touched on it a little bit. I know your experience is in the 
emergency room, but I am interested in hearing how Wisconsin 
has approached provider education for opioids. I know that your 
experience is largely with the ER, but I would like to ask what 
you believe can be done regarding postop monitoring to reduce 
the number of Americans that come away from surgeries with an 
opioid addiction.
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, that is a great question, Congressman.
    So I actually was a Medical Examining Board chairman and 
led the Wisconsin prescription opioid reform effort and started 
doing that in 2014, over 10 years ago. So I led, and my 
strategy was implemented and was key for there to be prescriber 
education. So we look for a cultural shift in prescribing. I 
mean, honestly, the derivation of the opioid crisis began with 
pain is the fifth vital sign. You know, mandated treatment of 
pain, patients have a right to have their pain treated, kind of 
forced our hand as physicians. And we released that, and then 
we mandated prescriber education through the Medical Examining 
Board. So we have got to be careful. Medical regulation and 
education needs to go at the State level through the Medical 
Examining Board.
    You know, the Federal Government is great at providing 
grants to the municipalities and localities that can then 
implement the strategy that they need. So education is key but 
also education of the entire populous that you don't need 
opioids for pain, and I think that that has happened, and I 
think we have seen a significant decrease.
    But you are right: We need to make sure that we don't 
overprescribe, continue to overprescribe, and use other 
treatments, other methods.
    Mr. Balderson. I can validate. I had a hip replacement and 
I have had a surgery replacement, and they cut me way back, 
so--thank you.
    Sheriff, thank you for being here today and thank you for 
your service. I represent a district in central and southeast 
Ohio which is largely rural. The opioid epidemic has devastated 
the State of Ohio and Ohio's 12th Congressional District for 
years. Ohio has the second-highest opioid overdose rate, with a 
whopping 39.2 deaths per 100,000 people. The State's opioid use 
rate is twice the national average, encompassing 1.4 percent of 
the State's population. And, unfortunately, opioid-related 
deaths have continued to increase over the past 4 years.
    Can you talk to me a little bit about what policies are 
being employed in rural areas to reduce the opioid use and 
misuse?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. Yes. You know, we have, in my 
county, both urban and rural, and so a big part of that, 
obviously, is education to try to make sure that people are 
aware of the dangers. Again, that is why we use the One Pill 
Can Kill kind of thing to explain that. So many people are 
unaware. When you tell most parents that, they get this blank 
look on their face and they are horrified. And to have that 
communication with their kids, so we try to go into schools, 
and we have a lot of our SROs, our school resource officers, 
talking to kids about that. We partner with the folks that, 
unfortunately, like Mr. Cullen is a part of a club he never 
wanted to join. We have some of those. I believe Rebecca from 
our county testified she lost two of her sons in one day. When 
you have parents that are willing to rip off the scab of 
something that is so horrific to explain it to others, it makes 
a deep impact on them.
    So we do a lot of education, partnership with our 
prevention, our coalitions, our health department. And then we 
are vigorous in our enforcement to go after those that are 
making profit off of, again, other people's misery and death.
    My daughter played soccer with a lot of girls on her team, 
and three of those girls have perished from overdoses. And it 
is primarily the pathway that they got into it was through 
sports injuries. So the paths alter and are varied, but the 
outcome is typically the same.
    Mr. Balderson. Thank you. I like the SRO, the resource 
officers in the schools.
    I have another question for you, Sheriff. In 2022, Ohio 
ranked third in the country for the highest total fentanyl 
deaths. While the number of Ohio deaths caused by fentanyl have 
decreased since 2022, there are still far too many lives lost 
at the hands of fentanyl.
    What steps, whether it be through policy or enforcement, do 
you believe must be taken to better combat the risk of 
accidental fentanyl use, both from a law enforcement and a 
public health perspective?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Well, I think the step of permanently 
scheduling is a good step, and it is important. I think a 
continuation of the partnerships with health and law 
enforcement and all across the different disciplines is 
critically important. The communication between the labs of 
trends and what they are seeing and how we get in front of it 
and prepare for it and respond to it, you know, all of those 
are critically important components. And I think a lot of the 
facts that we are seeing a reduction in deaths isn't 
necessarily because we have won, it is because we have more 
people out there with Narcan or Opvee who are saving lives and 
giving folks a second chance, and, you know, we have broad 
distribution. We have vending machines all across the county. I 
have a vending machine that is free when you leave the jail for 
Narcan in it. They can take it with them.
    Mr. Balderson. OK.
    Sheriff Bouchard. And I think that is in part why we are 
bringing it down. We definitely have not won the war on this.
    Mr. Balderson. All right. Mr. Chairman, thank you very 
much. I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Massachusetts, 
Representative Auchincloss, for 5 minutes of questions.
    Mr. Auchincloss. Thank you, Chair.
    There is no policy issue more personal than the opioid 
crisis. I think to the exhibit I went to in my own district of 
parents telling the stories of their children who had had their 
developing brains hijacked by the most addictive chemical in 
history, and hearing about these bright, promising kids who 
descended into a spiral of lying and stealing and addiction and 
broken relationships, and at the end so many of the parents 
said that their focus was on just letting their kids know that 
they were loved before they died.
    And we all have an obligation to stop this epidemic, and I 
appreciate and applaud each of the five of you for the work 
that you are doing there, and in particular you, Mr. Cullen, 
for your bravery in coming forward with your wife on this 
issue. There's none of us up here on the dais whose decisions 
as 23-year-olds would survive congressional scrutiny, and 
coming forward with this story is so powerful because the word 
you used, ``poisoned,'' is exactly the right word. He was 
poisoned.
    And it is not just the cartels, as the gentleman from Texas 
pointed out rightfully. It is also the Chinese Communist Party 
who are engaged in a state-sponsored poisoning of the American 
public. Ninety-eight percent of fentanyl precursors are coming 
from the Chinese mainland. These chemical manufacturers are 
being facilitated and subsidized by the Chinese Communist 
Party, oftentimes at a profit of individual CCP members.
    And as cochair of the Fentanyl Working Group last term, I 
introduced three pieces of bipartisan legislation to interdict 
the supply of this fentanyl directly on the Chinese mainland 
because, as all five of you have said, prevention, preventing 
this chemical from reaching the U.S. mainland, is the best way 
to stem this tide. And I would implore my Republican 
colleagues, instead of taking a buzz saw to SAMHSA and to 
Medicaid and to the program--and to biomedical research, the 
programs that we know help treat people with substance use 
disorder--work with us on the three pieces of bipartisan 
legislation already introduced to create a joint task force to 
counter opioids, to sanction the Chinese manufacturers of 
fentanyl, to emplace fines on Chinese shippers whose manifests 
do not recognize that they have fentanyl on these ships. These 
are things that we can work on right now if the GOP would come 
under the thumb from Elon Musk.
    Dr. Westlake, I want to transition to the other side of the 
problem, which is not on supply but on demand. A couple of 
other colleagues have mentioned Journavx, which is the new drug 
that has been introduced for acute pain that is nonopioid 
based. And this is the fruits of two decades' worth of 
biomedical research, biomedical research that my Republican 
colleagues are trying to cut. And it is going to be, I think, a 
game changer. Forty million Americans are diagnosed with acute 
pain every year. Eighty-five thousand of those develop opioid 
use disorder, and this drug is similar in its efficacy for 
treating pain without being addictive.
    Now, the problem is the commercial health plans are 
creating the generic-level copays for this drug, but on part D, 
where millions of Americans access their prescription drugs and 
where a lot of people with acute pain will get their drugs, the 
copay is at $50, more or less, whereas the opioid copay is at 
about $2.
    Based on your experience dealing with patients with acute 
pain, do you think that difference in out-of-pocket cost might 
disincent the use of the less addictive painkiller?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes. I always--when I prescribe medications 
for people, I always just start with something even more simple 
than that, than anything prescription. Tylenol and ibuprofen 
together, if you can take them, are as effective. But I think, 
yeah, definitely cost is a driver of what patients take. If 
they can get something for 2 bucks versus, you know, 50 bucks, 
there is going to be a shift towards the less expensive.
    Mr. Auchincloss. Ms. LaBelle, would you agree that a higher 
copay is disincenting exactly the behavior we want to see?
    Ms. LaBelle. Sure. I mean, you know, people are cost 
sensitive, and that is a lot of money.
    Mr. Auchincloss. That is a lot of money. And we know that 
anything particularly above $35 copay tends to really rapidly 
disincent patient adherence.
    This is an example, again, of the pharmacy benefit 
managers, the health insurance's own drug pricing middlemen not 
enacting and enforcing their formularies in a way that is 
actually helpful to public health. They are directly 
undermining public health by pushing the opioids. And by the 
way, there is huge evidence that the PBMs profited off of the 
overprescription of these opioids. They are continuing to push 
these opioids on to part D beneficiaries despite the fact that 
there is a brand drug out there that is nonaddictive that 
treats pain similarly and that they could easily put forward at 
the same copay tier if they wanted to.
    I will yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the youngest and the prettiest 
pharmacist in Congress, Representative Harshbarger from 
Tennessee.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. You are so sweet. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman.
    Thank you to the witnesses for being here today. I am the 
other pharmacist in Congress.
    And, Mr. Cullen, condolences to you and your family for the 
loss of your son, and only someone who has lost a child can 
understand what you have gone through, and I am sorry about 
that. And I am glad you gave us a list of things to look at and 
prioritize. It is going to help us quite a bit.
    I want to start with a question to Dr. Westlake. You know, 
in my view, we need to be as bold as possible when it comes to 
taking steps to protect our children and our families from 
these illicit fentanyl overdoses. And, you know, you talked 
about the FRS--the opioids, the nitazenes, the xylazines--the 
things that you are seeing in the ER. In east Tennessee I have 
talked to my healthcare providers and my law enforcement, and 
they are saying it is taking multiple doses of naloxone to 
bring these people out, because you know as well as I do, 
naloxone and fentanyl bind to different receptor sites. And I 
know they are working on some--I think it is a cannabidiol 
modifier to reverse that fentanyl.
    So I guess the thing is, my question would be, what are you 
seeing? How many doses is it taking to reverse these people 
when you see them in the ER, or law enforcement?
    Dr. Westlake. So what I see in Wisconsin is that, you know, 
again, the issue is having the Narcan in law enforcement, the 
first responders on the scene. You know, sometimes, people do 
come in, and they have too much opioid in their system, and so 
the Narcan wears off. But my experience is that the critical 
access point is getting them the intervention of the initial 
reversal agent.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. That initial dose.
    Dr. Westlake. So we are not seeing that, but that is not to 
say that that is not an issue nationally. It is just we are not 
seeing it in Wisconsin.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, Sheriff, even with some of the 
drug-sniffing dogs, they have to carry the Narcan because the 
dogs will get a--you know, they will be overdosed as well. Is 
that what you are seeing in your area?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes, ma'am. We actually have Narcan. We 
have changed our procedures for handling and evidentiary rules 
for our narcotics team and our road deputies because of the 
risk that they can overdose from mere contact with some of 
these components.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. You are probably triple-gloving, aren't 
you? Even the switch in evidence. You know, when I was on 
Homeland Security, they would have to double- or triple-glove 
just to transfer the evidence, because the skin is the biggest 
organ that will, you know, take that fentanyl up.
    I will go along with this one, Sheriff. You mentioned the 
challenges of those pill presses, those tablet machines, that 
we need better regulation around the possession of those. I am 
a compounding pharmacist so, you know, a lot of those 
compounders will use tablet presses to do, you know, 
prescription drugs. But most of those come from China, if I am 
not mistaken, when they ship those in. But it is the dyes that 
make those drugs look like the Xanax or the Percocet or the 
Adderall.
    I guess, where are you finding out--are you looking to see 
who is making those dyes for the tablet machines?
    Sheriff Bouchard. If we find them in our AOR, we are. But 
sometimes, you know, we get a bag of pills and we don't know 
where they were pressed into being, if you will.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yes.
    Sheriff Bouchard. Obviously, you know, everybody can go 
online and look up the numbers and say, ``Oh, this is a pill I 
have.''
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yes.
    Sheriff Bouchard. But that is not the pill they have.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Well, no. And they are using the fentanyl 
as fillers just to--you know, it is easier to make fentanyl 
than it is cocaine or heroin. You can make it in a few hours. 
It is easily transportable, and that is why they are--you know, 
and they sell it for 100 times more than what the cost of the 
drug is. So there you go.
    I want to continue along that line and ask about the HIDTA. 
I saw some statistics, and in 2022, we had 134 criminal 
organizations that were dismantled by HIDTA. We had over 8,700 
kilograms of drugs that were removed nationally. And the 
Appalachian HIDTA--because I am in east Tennessee--a task force 
was operating, and Tennessee was responsible for removing drugs 
off the market that had a street value of $51 million.
    And I just want you to tell us a little bit more about why 
it is important to continue that program, sir.
    Sheriff Bouchard. It is important to continue the program 
because there are so many layers to this that are outside our 
own individual circle. So I have one of the largest counties, 
but they are not just making it and distributing it in my 
county. So where it is coming from can be anywhere in the 
world, so that is why coordination and communication and 
deconfliction are all critical components, and that is where 
HIDTA comes in.
    You know, I have got people assigned to the DEA. They have 
people assigned to me, but we all have to do that systemically 
to target a problem that is coming from other countries.
    Mrs. Harshbarger. Yes. It is interagency collaboration.
    And I guess with that, Mr. Chairman, my time is up, and I 
will yield back.
    Mr. Dunn [presiding]. The gentlelady yields back.
    And I now recognize the gentleman from Louisiana, Mr. 
Carter, for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Carter of Louisiana. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank 
you to our witnesses.
    Particularly, Mr. Cullen, my heart goes out to you for your 
great loss. As a father of two sons, I could only imagine the 
pain that you and your family suffers, and know that we care 
and that we are desperately trying to find a way to address 
this epidemic that we have with fentanyl-laced drugs that are 
taking the lives of far too many of our people.
    I am concerned about the President's proposed freeze, and I 
know our colleagues suggested we shouldn't talk about the 
freeze because the freeze has been blocked because it is, in 
fact, unconstitutional. My fear is that there may be another 
attempt or another approach used to slow, reduce, or cut 
resources that would aid in the slowing and hopeful elimination 
of these uses of fentanyl.
    We know that SAMHSA, the Office of National Drug Policy, 
Federal funding makes up 60 percent of the budget in New 
Orleans, which goes a long way to addressing the concerns. It 
is important to tell the real story about the lives of people 
who are impacted by these cuts, people who depend on resources 
that will aid them in getting off of illicit drugs or having 
education so they never get on them in the first place.
    Odyssey House in Louisiana currently operates several 
SAMHSA-funded projects of regional and national significance, 
including a rural-area drug court which diverts individuals 
with drug-related offenses into treatment and case management 
aimed at reducing recidivism. Freezing or eliminating these 
grants could result in some $600,000 a year loss for the 
organization, staff reduction, and loss of vital services. This 
directly impacts the people who need the resources the most.
    I would like to ask Ms. LaBelle--and thank you for your 
testimony with us today. As a former official of ONDCP, I was 
hoping that you could speak to the negative ramifications of 
this proposed freeze or any other freeze that may take dollars 
away from this vital action.
    Ms. LaBelle. Thanks. Thank you, sir.
    So, I mean, for too long we have had a bake sale approach 
to addiction, and we have put scraps together to fund the 
Nation's addiction treatment prevention program and supporting 
recovery. Now, Congress has been very generous in the last 
several years also through Medicaid expansion to make sure that 
we no longer have to scrap for pennies to put together the type 
of comprehensive approach. So cutting it further will set us 
back.
    Mr. Carter of Louisiana. And real quickly, I have got a 
little bit of time, Dr. Camenga, I would like to thank you for 
the incredible work that you have done, as with all of the 
witnesses. Bless you for the great work that you do. This is 
really a all-hands-on-deck, bipartisan effort to cure a 
horrible ill, a horrible stain in our country. But if we were 
to look at the disturbing actions in taking down critical 
public health information on Government websites--agencies such 
as CDC have taken down pages such as the Youth Risk Behavior 
Surveillance System--how does the removal of this critical 
information impact the work of providers such as yourself? 
These are places where people can get information on how to get 
help.
    Dr. Camenga. Removal of that information really has real-
time impacts on healthcare providers as well as public health 
professionals. We look to that to say how we should be focusing 
our clinical care or how we should in communities be directing 
resources, and not having that available makes it very 
difficult for States in real time to know how to direct funding 
for programs.
    On the clinical front, the removal of clinical information, 
as was described, can have direct clinical impacts in real 
time. And the longer they are down--and I will speak from a 
different perspective--is as a medical educator, our trainees 
who will be taking care of us as physicians as we age are not 
learning that, because those are the foundational documents 
that we use to teach new healthcare providers how to provide 
care. The longer we can't access it, think about it, they may 
lose the opportunity to learn about standard evidence-based 
practices.
    So, yes, the removal of that information definitely has 
real-time clinical impacts as well as impacts on public health.
    Mr. Carter of Louisiana. And my time is up, but I will 
close real quick by saying, if ever there was an issue that 
called for a bipartisan effort to fix, the epidemic of fentanyl 
in our country certainly is that.
    Mr. Chairman, I yield.
    Mr. Dunn. The gentleman yields back.
    And I now recognize Dr. Miller-Meeks for 5 minutes for 
questioning.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. And 
thank you to the witnesses for testifying before the 
subcommittee today.
    This hearing could not come at a more important time with 
the House considering H.R. 27, the HALT Fentanyl--let me repeat 
that: ``fentan-ill,'' not ``fentan-all''--the HALT Fentanyl 
Act, which I proudly cosponsor.
    Let me also say that it is critically important that it is 
a bipartisan hearing, and it would have been very helpful to 
have bipartisan support for securing our southern border and 
reducing the flow of fentanyl, fentanyl precursors into this 
country, especially through Mexico and, as you have heard, 
incentivized by the Chinese Communist Party to send fentanyl 
precursors to this country.
    According to the CDC data, we lost more than 110,000 
Americans to drug overdose deaths in 2022. It is estimated that 
75 percent of these deaths involved opioids, meaning that 226 
Americans died every day to opioids.
    While many cases of drug-related deaths are poisoning, 
where the individual does not know the product they are about 
to use is laced with another substance like fentanyl, more 
needs to be done to prevent addiction, including minimizing 
unnecessary exposure to opioids. And as a director of public 
health and as a State senator, I was very influential in 
getting substance use disorder treatment as well as reducing 
preauthorization to medicated-assisted treatment for substance 
use disorder, as well as trying to stem the flow of opioids.
    Ninety percent of acute-pain patients receive opioids to 
manage their pain, whether they need them or not. Between 2011 
and 2019, opioid prescriptions decreased by 40 percent, from 
approximately 250 million to 150 million prescriptions 
dispensed.This is true across most payer audiences: Medicaid, 
private, and cash patients. However, among Medicare patients, 
opioid prescribing actually increased. Medicare's share of 
opioid prescribing during this time increased substantially, 
from approximately 20 percent to the country's opioid 
prescriptions in 2011 to 35 percent in 2019. This represents a 
75 percent increase in just under a decade.
    We clearly have more work to do in Medicare to make sure 
that patients have access to effective pain relief agents while 
also not unnecessarily exposing them to narcotic painkillers. 
One way to do this would be to increase access to nonopioid 
pain management medications, which I am proud to accomplish 
with my legislation, the Alternatives to PAIN Act. This 
legislation, which I thank Congresswoman Barragan for 
cosponsoring and coleading, would decrease barriers to 
accessing nonopioid pain management alternatives that are FDA-
approved.
    Dr. Westlake, thank you for testifying today. Do you agree 
that prevention needs to be part of our strategy to combat 
illicit drug use and addiction?
    Dr. Westlake. Absolutely.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Do you believe that our current 
reimbursement policies appropriately align incentives to ensure 
patients have access to opioids and nonopioid pain management 
alternatives?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, I think it is important to make sure 
that they are cost-effective solutions.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. And do providers have the education and 
resources available to know what other alternatives could be 
available?
    Dr. Westlake. I think so. I think so.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Do you agree or think that patients 
should not be forced to fail first on an opioid before being 
given the option to use a nonopioid to treat their pain if a 
nonopioid is prescribed by their doctor?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, that seems counterproductive.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. And how would you suggest Congress work 
to appropriately align incentives to ensure seniors have access 
to novel nonopioid pain management alternatives, especially in 
the postacute hospital care setting or as they are discharged 
from the emergency room?
    Dr. Westlake. I think you, again, try to encourage 
nonprescription, you know, solutions, not prescription drugs, 
but also to make sure that there is some parity in the cost-
pricing structure.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you.
    Switching gears, I would like to focus on another 
critically important issue that pertains to people purchasing 
drugs over social media applications, especially our youth. The 
U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recently 
published an analysis finding a 182 percent increase in illicit 
fentanyl poisoning or overdose deaths among 10-to-19-year-olds 
between 2019 and 2021.
    Again, our condolences, Mr. Cullen.
    Counterfeit prescription pills were present in nearly 25 
percent of deaths. The DEA released an updated public safety 
alert finding that 6 out of 10 fentanyl-laced counterfeit 
prescription pills contained a potentially lethal dose, which 
was an increase from the agency lab's analysis from 2021, when 
the rate was 4 out of 10.
    Sheriff Bouchard, as a result of online sales, do you think 
a framework like the one I outlined in platforms directing 
social media, such as the Cooper Davis and Devin Norring Act, 
would be helpful in reducing these tragic deaths?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes. I think we have to look at the 
component of what technology and social media companies are 
doing and taking part now, especially as many of them have 
moved or have already moved to end-to-end encryption. We know 
that that is a big challenge on so many levels, and many of 
them are resistant, if not outright obstructionists, to law 
enforcement, even with a valid search warrant.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you so much.
    I see my time has expired. I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia [presiding]. The gentlelady yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Ohio, 
Representative Landsman, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Landsman. I thank you, Mr. Chair. And I thank you all 
for being a part of today's hearing.
    To the Cullens, thank you for sharing your testimony. As my 
colleagues said, it couldn't have been easy sitting here today. 
I have a 13-year-old son. And I am just repeating what he said, 
which is I can't possibly imagine, but what you are doing, 
obviously, is making a difference in raising awareness and 
getting those of us who are already passionate about this even 
more passionate because of Zachary's life and you all being 
here to tell that story. So thank you.
    Couple of things. One is--and this is across the board, 
anyone can answer it. But there are, obviously, concerns, and I 
think in some ways they are bipartisan concerns, about the 
funding issues. Hopefully, they will be bipartisan concerns, 
because we have talked about all of these, you know, critically 
important investments, Federal investments, recovery 
investments.
    In Cincinnati where I represent, we have the Addiction 
Services Council. They do incredible work. So much of their 
resources come from the Federal Government. The education work 
that we have all talked about or you all have talked about. 
PreventionFIRST! in our district does incredible work. Half 
their budget is Federal dollars. We have a Quick Response Team 
that has been incredibly successful, was featured in The 
Washington Post a couple of weeks ago.
    The worry is that you had--the freeze was put on hold or it 
was stopped, but there's concerns and reporting about 
workarounds. There is also, you know, potential looming budget 
cuts. So I want to get to a place where sort of there is this 
bipartisan appreciation for what could be taken from us. And I 
was wondering if each of you could just say what the one or two 
most significant investments, Federal investments, are that we 
have to protect, starting with you, Sheriff.
    Sheriff Bouchard. I think HIDTA is critically important on 
this front, partnerships on that level, deconfliction and a 
variety of things, but also how we fund task forces and the 
kind of methodology. You know, there is a lot of discussion 
which we have been a part of, and we look forward to a 
partnership on that about forfeiture and equitable sharing. 
That does impact our work in that space. Contrary to a lot of 
information that is out there, there is no law enforcement 
agency in America that is making money on forfeiture. It just 
helps with some of the ancillary costs.
    Mr. Landsman. I am glad you brought that up because there 
is some discussion about, you know, changing those rules, but 
the forfeiture money is critically important and then, as you 
mentioned, how these task forces get set up and funded.
    Ms. LaBelle. It is hard to answer just one because I think 
they all work together.
    Mr. Landsman. Yes.
    Ms. LaBelle. But, you know, obviously, you know, the 
Affordable Care Act, Medicaid expansion, the block grant from 
SAMHSA, the SOR grant from SAMHSA, which is the State Opioid 
Response grant which provides, you know, money to every State, 
those are all critically important, and they work together.
    Mr. Landsman. There is a whole host of law enforcement 
grants and investments that go along with those too that I 
would add to the list.
    Any others that you want to point out?
    The last thing I will mention is on the budget--the policy 
questions. There, hopefully, will be a bipartisan border 
agreement, and the work to stop these drugs from coming in has 
to be way more robust than it is today.
    There is this question about getting in front of--how does 
Congress stay in front of the synthetic drugs. And you may have 
mentioned it, but I am curious, just very quickly, what is it 
that we should be doing that we are not? I mean, obviously, we 
are going to pass this bill today, but, in general, how do we--
is it just the way in which the legislation is written that 
matters most, or should we be sort of approaching this 
differently? And I have only got 20 seconds, so----
    Dr. Westlake. I think it is important to understand to make 
sure that there is no innovation that is being harmed by 
regulation. So to make sure--I know there is discussion about 
testing strips and things, and there has been--you know, to 
just make sure that the oversight that is being done isn't 
hampering the critical research, because the problem is it has 
to be nimble. Xylazine was an issue, and we talked about this 2 
years ago, and, you know, it is still an issue. I started 
fentanyl-related substances 8 years ago, and so I think that is 
the--you know, is to watch for the unintended consequences.
    Mr. Landsman. Yes, thank you.
    Before I yield back, I think that is one thing, hopefully, 
we can get after this hearing is a better sense of.
    Thank you.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognize the gentleman from Michigan, 
Representatives James, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. James. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I also appreciate 
the opportunity you gave me to introduce my friend and American 
hero, Sheriff Bouchard, and for having this hearing.
    Opioid addiction has impacted every community across 
America, and it has especially hit the residents of my district 
in Oakland and Macomb Counties. The previous administration's 
policies left a trail of destruction, heartbreak, and broken 
families in its wake, and now it is up to us to clean it up. 
Simply going from 100,000 deaths per year to 90,000 deaths per 
year is not a success we should be applauding. The number is 
zero, and we will work continuously across the aisle to 
continue to move in that direction.
    Recent data from the CDC demonstrates that in 2024, 2,931 
lives were lost in Michigan, in Michigan alone. That is the 
number of U.S. servicemembers that died in 20 years in 
Afghanistan, 200--I am sorry. 2,352 is how many people we lost 
in Afghanistan, 20 years--more than a war's worth of death in 1 
year in my State alone.
    Previous year's data shows a trend of failed border 
policies from a President that failed American families. The 
rising tide of fentanyl-related tragedies has made it evident 
that something is not working when it comes to stopping the 
flow of illicit drug trafficking. And families in Oakland and 
Macomb Counties continue to experience personal loss. 
Highlighting this urgency for innovative and investigative 
approaches is essential.
    However one feels about tariffs, President Trump is right: 
Our neighbors in Canada and Mexico must help us stop the flow 
of illicit drugs entering our borders. No amount of 
scapegoating and retaliatory tariffs is going to stop our 
people from dying.
    Sheriff Bouchard, can you please speak briefly to the 
experiences that your officers have gone through in dealing 
with the fentanyl and instances of overdoses in opioids that 
you have seen?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you. We have seen an increase in 
difficulty in bringing them back. That is part of the reason we 
added Opvee to our tool chest, because we were seeing multiple 
people we tried to resuscitate weren't responding on one or two 
or even three doses of Narcan as you wait for the prescribed 
time, things like that. We know that communication and some of 
the prevention programs have been helpful, I think, eye-
opening, especially when we are doing them in high schools.
    But it is important that we don't minimize or reduce our 
focus on holding the people that are killing people 
intentionally for profit accountable for what they do. That is 
why in that one case I mentioned earlier, we prosecuted the 
individual for causing the death, murdering the person that 
died from the overdose. It's a poisoning. It is something they 
did not anticipate, did not ask for, and did not want, and that 
is murder, in my book.
    Mr. James. One hundred percent. There are considerable 
drains on your resources which inhibit your ability to fight 
trafficking and confront emerging threats as well. What are 
some of these drains on your resources? What are some of those 
emerging threats? And what can Congress do to assist?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Well, now we are getting into a broader 
question, specifically above and beyond fentanyl, and that goes 
to counterterrorism and the threat matrix that we are facing, 
the threat picture that we see. And former Director Wray 
testified multiple times that we are seeing more bells and 
whistles now than we did on 9/10. As a member of the Joint 
Terrorist Task Force and very involved in that space, we are 
very concerned, and, obviously, that is drawing more and more 
of our resources and attention to what things we may be facing 
that we are not communicating about.
    And I would encourage all of Congress to reexamine what we 
are doing. It seems on many fronts we have lost some of the 
lessons of 9/11. We are communicating less, sharing intel less. 
We don't have a real-time ability to even communicate on it, 
even at secret level, where you have got terrorists that are 
communicating on encrypted apps and I am having to go find a 
SCIF to get a brief on something that is emerging. We need to 
figure this out and get back to understanding there is a real 
threat facing this country on lots of levels.
    Mr. James. So it is easier to conduct criminal activities 
in this country than it is to conduct law enforcement 
operations in this country?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Absolutely.
    Mr. James. And we need to fix that. I totally agree.
    What specific resources, funding streams, or interagency 
coordination mechanisms do you believe Congress should 
prioritize to strengthen fentanyl trafficking and trafficking 
enforcement, sir?
    Sheriff Bouchard. I think it is important to, again, focus 
on some of the programs that have worked. We are good with 
examining and auditing programs to make sure that the money is 
being properly and wisely spent, because in our agencies we do 
that. We know that there is a limited pool, and it has got to 
be spent appropriately and on the priority mission.
    But for us in specifically the fentanyl space, it would be 
the joint teams and HIDTA. That partnership and that 
relationship, it grants the labs that can be maybe getting out 
in front of some of these things and protocols on what our 
folks should be doing on the street not only to save people but 
how to handle anything they recover.
    Mr. James. Thank you.
    I would like a couple of seconds. I would like to recognize 
Ms. Christine Szabo, who I witnessed save a life on a Detroit 
street corner. For all of those who are invisible who are 
saving lives, we see you. We appreciate you. Thank you for your 
service.
    Thank you all.
    Mr. Dunn [presiding]. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from Illinois, Ms. Kelly.
    Ms. Kelly. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
    I want to thank Chair Carter and Ranking Member DeGette for 
holding our first subcommittee hearing of the new Congress on 
today's critically important topic. I want to thank all the 
witnesses, and like my colleagues, especially to you, Mr. 
Cullen.
    In Illinois, the leading cause of pregnancy-related deaths 
is due to mental health conditions, including substance use 
disorders, which comprise 32 percent of these deaths. The 
United States is facing a maternal mortality health crisis. 
There has been a bipartisan focus on addressing and reducing 
all causes of maternal mortality and morbidity, and I have been 
pleased to work with several of my colleagues across the aisle 
to pass important legislation to address this maternal health 
crisis.
    That is why I am deeply troubled at this administration's 
actions since last week, when we witnessed a halt on federally 
funded programs. I won't go through them because my colleagues, 
you know, have talked about them, but I did want to talk about 
my concern for deep cuts to the Medicaid program, including the 
Maternal Opioid Misuse model, or the MOM model, which is 
intended to address fragmentation in the care of pregnant and 
postpartum Medicaid beneficiaries with opioid use disorder.
    Dr. Camenga, in your work as a pediatrician, have you seen 
that fragmentation of care can contribute to obstacles for 
patients who seek recovery and support resources from opioid 
use disorder and other substance use disorders?
    Dr. Camenga. Thank you for that question.
    I have definitely seen the impact of fragmentation of care, 
both with children and teens and young adults and actually with 
mothers. You have to go one place for mental healthcare, a 
completely different system for substance use disorder care, a 
completely different system for obstetric care, and then, you 
know, a completely different system for the newborn baby.
    So, you know, as a pediatrician, I will say, access to 
resources for parents to improve their mental health is part of 
what we do. In the clinic, for example, I do have a poster in 
the clinic for our local State mental health access line for 
parents. The reason pediatricians give this information out is 
they come to us with newborns and asking us about their mental 
health, and we love being able to connect them with community 
resources.
    So having these resources available as a pediatrician we 
support because healthy moms, healthy children.
    Ms. Kelly. And access to such issues. My district is urban, 
suburban, and rural, and in some of my more rural areas, there 
is not that access, and even in some of my urban areas, but it 
is harder for people that live in rural areas to get to places. 
Whether you are in a program receiving Federal funding in a 
blue or red State, the consequences of deep cuts and funding 
freeze will be very detrimental.
    Ms. LaBelle, can you discuss what disruptions in access to 
treatment and recovery services mean for patients and 
particularly new moms?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes. Well, I mean, new moms have a higher rate 
of overdose. And, you know, it is often hard for mothers, for 
parents, to seek out treatment. So when they do, we shouldn't 
make it harder for them to access that treatment, and 
disruptions and confusion will make it harder for them to 
access the treatment.
    Ms. Kelly. And then how important is funding for HHS 
agencies like the CDC and NIH in informing our understanding 
and response to access, immediate threats as they occur at the 
State and local level?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes. I mean, these funding sources are 
lifesaving to, you know, hundreds of thousands of people, 
millions across the country.
    Ms. Kelly. I want to thank you for your responses. And, 
hopefully, my colleagues will recognize and we can work in a 
bipartisan way to make sure that the funding that is needed 
will happen.
    Thank you. And I yield back.
    Mr. Dunn. The gentlelady yields back.
    And I now recognize the gentleman from New Jersey, Mr. 
Kean, for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Kean. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to all of 
our witnesses for being here today.
    The increasing prevalence of xylazine in the United States 
is a dangerous trend. Public health officials have warned of 
the skin wounds that can occur from repeated use of xylazine 
and the risk of worse health complications if the wounds are 
left untreated.
    How much are healthcare providers aware of the dangers of 
these health complications and how best to treat them, Dr. 
Westlake?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes. So I just actually saw a patient with 
ulcers from xylazine about 2 weeks ago, and I asked him why he 
was doing it, and he knew the risks associated with it, and he 
just couldn't stop himself because he liked the high too much. 
I mean, the issue is that the xylazine is available, and, you 
know, it is not scheduled. It is legal to get it shipped in 
now, and so that needs to change, you know, whether it is 
placing it as a controlled III schedule drug or placing the 
same restrictions that schedule IIIs have on it as far as being 
imported and monitoring it. Treating it is--you know, treating 
the ulcers, it is difficult, but it is--the problem is that it 
is there, that it is happening.
    Mr. Kean. So what steps can policymakers make on the State 
or the Federal level to increase the awareness of xylazine-
associated wounds and treatment options amongst healthcare 
professionals?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, I think just encouraging the awareness. 
I think there is a pretty broad awareness of it now, but I 
think--and a way to get that done is to get it spread through 
the local, like, specialty organizations, like American Academy 
of Pediatrics, American Board of Emergency Medicine. You know, 
it is not necessarily through Federal. It is spreading it out 
through the networks that the doctors listen to.
    Mr. Kean. OK. Thank you.
    Sheriff Bouchard, in my district, the Morris County 
Sheriff's Office partners with the county health department, 
the mental health association, the Morris County Prevention, to 
operate Hope One, which is a vehicle that travels to sites 
throughout the county to provide services and support for those 
struggling with addiction. At these sites the vehicle provides 
immediate access to services, treatment facilities, and Narcan 
training and kits. In fact, at least 177 of these Narcan kits 
have been used to save a life in New Jersey. These sites are 
staffed by sheriff's officers, licensed mental health 
professionals, and certified peer support specialists.
    Can you speak to the vital role that law enforcement has in 
these holistic approaches to treatment?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes, sir. Thank you.
    It is critically important that we are all connected, 
whether it is health prevention or law enforcement. As I 
mentioned earlier, we are typically the first one on scene at 
any situation. CBS, I believe national, did a story on one of 
my deputies saving a woman in a Dollar General. You know, 
typically we are around and spread through the community. Fire 
departments or EMS comes from a station. Lots of times we get 
there first, and those first 2 or 3 minutes may be critically 
important to saving that life.
    So that partnership, and then the handoff to followup care 
and to prevention in the future, that is where our crisis 
response unit and our partnership with the health department 
comes in.
    Mr. Kean. Can you speak to how drug trafficking contributes 
to violence in communities and how law enforcement is an 
essential component in combating illicit drug threats?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes. You know, when you think about an 
establishment, let's say a McDonald's, if it is an armed 
robbery there, they are going to take the cash. When you have 
got even a legal licensed facility, whether it is a pharmacy or 
a medical marijuana or marijuana facility, they both have cash 
and drugs. And so what we are seeing is the violence that are 
directed sometimes at armed robberies or situations there are 
much more escalated.
    We had a homicide about a week and a half ago at one of our 
licensed marijuana grow operations where they came in, just 
barely creased the door and shot the individual in the face and 
killed them and then stole 50 pounds of marijuana. So they tend 
to draw attention for armed robbery and for ancillary drug 
activity.
    Mr. Kean. And earlier in this hearing you responded that 
today Americans can get xylazine mailed to their house from 
vendors in China. Can you walk me through how that process 
works or any current barriers that exist of this emerging 
danger?
    Sheriff Bouchard. At this point I am not aware of any 
barriers. We have been trying to get a State law passed to deal 
with xylazine. It is still not scheduled on the national level, 
so there is not a barrier to shipping or mailing something 
direct to an end consumer that is not prohibited by either 
State or Federal law.
    Mr. Kean. And do you have any advice for how to combat this 
international flow of xylazine in the United States?
    Sheriff Bouchard. I think it needs to be scheduled. I think 
we need a whole-of-government effort, as I said, nimble enough 
to deal now with xylazine, but what is the next iteration that 
is going to come down the pike.
    Mr. Kean. Thank you. I yield back my time.
    Mr. Dunn. Thank you. The gentleman yields back.
    And I now recognize the gentlelady from Texas, Mrs. 
Fletcher, for 5 minutes.
    Mrs. Fletcher. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    And thanks to Chairman Carter and Ranking Member DeGette. I 
am glad to be back on the Health Subcommittee this Congress.
    And I thank all of the witnesses for your testimony today. 
It has been very helpful and important, and I appreciate your 
perspectives, your passion, and your purpose. So thank you all.
    During this hearing I have heard my colleagues on both 
sides of the aisle express concerns about the overdose epidemic 
and about combating illicit drugs in this country, and I think 
that these concerns are sincere.
    Ms. LaBelle, I think you provided a really important 
overview of the interplay of complex challenges and the many 
fronts on which we must combat the existing and emerging 
illicit drug threats. But what we have seen in just the last 
few weeks from the Trump administration undermines efforts to 
address this challenge as you described them. ``Undermines'' 
isn't actually a strong enough word.
    What the administration has done in the last few weeks is 
really decimating our efforts and our ability to respond and 
address these complex challenges. Certainly, efforts to disrupt 
international supply chains requires robust collaboration with 
law enforcement partners, so firing FBI and CIA agents and 
outing them is making us all less safe and less able to combat 
these illicit drug threats. Gutting the Federal workforce, of 
course, affects not only those and other law enforcement 
officers, it also affects the entire healthcare system across 
the United States. Halting all Federal funding, including 
funding for the NIH, the largest funder of biomedical research 
in the world, which funds critical research on substance abuse 
and addiction, also impedes our ability to respond. And as Dr. 
Ruiz noted, the administration has also halted funding for 
SAMHSA, Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services 
Administration, the main government agency tasked with 
improving mental health across the country and addressing 
substance use disorders.
    And following up on some prior exchanges today, the only 
reason these funds are now available to grantees is because 
multiple Federal courts have blocked the administration's 
actions. And even though that freeze of funding has been 
blocked, we are hearing reports today that the SAMHSA website 
has been inaccessible. This website has critical resources that 
can help our constituents find the help and support that they 
need.
    And our job as Members of Congress and as members of this 
committee is to tackle these complex issues thoughtfully, to 
tackle the things that we are talking about today and craft 
legislation that helps address them, to find a legislative 
solution to address the supply of drugs entering the country 
illegally, to take measures to make the public aware of the 
threats of these illicit drugs, to address substance abuse 
disorders by expanding access to prevention and treatment 
programs, and to find research--to fund research for new 
treatments and new innovative ways to address the crisis.
    We say we are doing that today with this hearing, but what 
is this committee doing, what is this Congress doing to assert 
its authority here over congressionally appropriated funds and 
congressionally established agencies and programs as President 
Trump and Elon Musk stop payments, eviscerate programs, and 
fire qualified personnel?
    Ranking Member DeGette noted that, in the last Congress, 
Republicans failed to bring the SUPPORT Act to the floor. And 
as a reminder, the SUPPORT Act was a bipartisan agreement that 
would have extended scheduling for fentanyl-related substances 
and reauthorized programs for the prevention and treatment of 
addiction. It was included in the bipartisan continuing 
resolution last December, but then Elon Musk tweeted that he 
didn't like the CR, and that was that. There was no SUPPORT 
Act.
    So why are we here if Elon Musk can at any time substitute 
his judgment for all of ours at a moment's notice without any 
meaningful objection from the House majority? If we pass the 
bill to address the overdose crisis, or any bill, how do we 
know that the Trump administration or Elon Musk won't just cut 
off any programs for any funding that we authorize?
    I hope this committee will assert its jurisdiction to the 
executive branch. I hope that this Congress will assert its 
authority to the executive branch. As we have seen from the 
testimony today, the stakes are too high for us to do anything 
else.
    Now, with the time I have left--which isn't much--I do want 
to turn to something that we expect this committee to take up, 
and that is Medicaid. And one of the current attacks on Federal 
funding Republicans have outlined in their budget 
reconciliation is a proposal to cut $2.3 trillion in cuts for 
Medicaid.
    So, Dr. Camenga, in your testimony, you talked about how we 
should increase funding for Medicaid. Can you just discuss, 
with the time left, how you think significant cuts to Medicaid 
may harm our efforts to combat this epidemic?
    Dr. Camenga. Cuts to Medicaid harm children. That is the 
period in the sentence. Fifty percent of children are ensured 
by Medicaid. That is how they receive healthcare. So AAP is 
very concerned about cuts to Medicaid.
    Mrs. Fletcher. Thank you.
    I have gone over my time. I have a few more questions I 
will submit for the record, but I thank you all again for your 
testimony and your time here today and your work.
    Thank you. I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia [presiding]. The gentlelady yields 
back.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Oregon, 
Representative Bentz, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Bentz. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And thank you, panel, for 
your patience.
    So I have a question on demand and a question on supply. I 
will go to demand first. I am from Oregon. And in November of 
2020, Oregon passed Ballot Measure 110, which reduced the 
penalties for most possession of controlled substances down to 
a mere violation.
    Between that year, 2020, and 2022, the number of overall 
overdose deaths in Oregon increased by 75 percent, from 797 to 
1,392 people. Nationally, over the same period, overdose deaths 
grew by only 18 percent. Deaths in Oregon from opioids 
specifically increased 101 percent between 2020 and 2022, 
compared to 33 percent nationally over the same period.
    Prior to the implementation of Measure 110, emergency 
department visits for nonfatal overdoses decreased by 4 
percent. But afterwards, it was one of three States that 
reported an increase rate of such visits.
    Between February 5, 2023, and February 4, 2024, Oregon had 
a rate of nonfatal overdoses more than 200 percent above the 
national average. And Multnomah County, home of Portland, has 
the highest rate of nonfatal overdoses in the Nation.
    So, Dr. Westlake, would you recommend legalization of drugs 
as a way to address the demand issue, the demand side of the 
opioid problem similar to that in Oregon?
    Dr. Westlake. Obviously, of course not.
    Mr. Bentz. I noticed that you were on several groups that 
are trying to figure out what to do about the supply side. It 
appears that education is the answer, is that correct? Is 
education the best thing we can do?
    Dr. Westlake. It is a key component to it, definitely.
    Mr. Bentz. And you are doing that in your State?
    Dr. Westlake. Correct. Prescriber education and then just a 
cultural education. I think even more about intoxicants in 
general throughout our entire, you know, American culture, the 
way that we approach alcohol and legal drugs, illegal drugs, I 
think we have a drug issue in America that needs to be looked 
at societally.
    Mr. Bentz. You know, I am happy to say that Oregon 
recognizes that it has not done it right, but they have not 
corrected at all the damage being done by the failure to have a 
control mechanism in place that gives you some way to prompt 
people--if that is the right word--to actually go get care. 
Because we used to have drug courts. We don't anymore. We used 
to have people actually arrested. We don't anymore because the 
law enforcement justifiably says, why bother? It's supposed to 
be small amounts. No one knows, no one cares, because no one is 
going to be prosecuted for it.
    There is a law enforcement component to it, for no other 
reason than to force people to get treatment. Is that in your 
thought? Because we can't seem to get back to where we actually 
were with drug courts.
    Dr. Westlake. Many of the patients that I see that are in 
recovery are thankful that law enforcement had to intervene and 
got them to the bottom, that their bottom wasn't their death, 
but their bottom was an encounter with law enforcement and drug 
courts,.
    Mr. Bentz. Right. Well, thank you for that.
    I am going to shift back to the supply side. Sheriff, thank 
you for being here. I have the good fortune of having a younger 
brother who was sheriff in Oregon, now retired, and happy to be 
away from the politics of the office, not that that is an issue 
today before us.
    But let me just ask this question. The Trump administration 
just filed a lawsuit against Illinois and Chicago for being a 
sanctuary State and city, indicating that under the Supremacy 
Clause their sanctuary status is interfering with what the 
Federal Government needs to do.
    In Oregon, back in 2020--actually, it happens all the time, 
but I will use an event in 2020 in my district--two cartel 
member drug runners were picked up by State police and were 
held until released on bail. But they were not, the State 
police, allowed--because Oregon is a sanctuary State--to 
contact ICE. They promptly disappeared. This was the third time 
they had been apprehended. And there is no doubt they were 
arrested with drugs in their car.
    My question to you is, do sanctuary State status interfere 
with your ability to try to address this issue, drugs?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Well, I am speaking hypothetically since 
we are not one.
    Mr. Bentz. But you have some cities in your State I think 
that are, but go ahead.
    Sheriff Bouchard. So, absolutely, if someone is not 
cooperating and sharing information about who they have in 
custody, they may not know who they have in custody. We don't 
have access to some of the Federal databases, so we may not 
know, you know, what that person is or what they are wanted 
for. And that goes to my earlier comments about Homeland 
Security and communication and post 9/11, how that was one of 
the key findings of the 9/11 Commission is we have to share 
information, we have to partner better, we have to communicate 
better.
    Now, I don't think immigration enforcement is a local law 
enforcement issue, but sharing information and cooperating with 
other law enforcement agencies on their lawful mission is 
important.
    Mr. Bentz. I appreciate that.
    I yield back. Thank you.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from California, 
Representative Barragan, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Ms. Barragan. Thank you.
    Mr. Chairman, I just wanted to follow up on an exchange 
earlier with Mr. Griffith. There continues to be a concern 
about the freezing of the dollars, Federal funds that community 
health centers have--either not have access to and some that 
have shut down or reportedly shut down.
    We did followup to call the New River Valley Health Center, 
which is in Mr. Griffith's district, and we did not get an 
answer. We did hear that they were one of many health centers 
at risk of closing their doors. So just wanted to recommend 
that the Member reach out and actually connect with them to get 
that information.
    And with that, I want to turn to what we have been talking 
about here. I have the majority memo in my hand, and it says 
the hearing is to combat existing and emerging illicit drug 
threats. Part of the memo says, ``According to the DEA, the 
Mexican Sinaloa and Jalisco cartels are the transnational 
criminal organizations primarily responsible for manufacturing 
and trafficking illicit fentanyl in the United States.''
    Sheriff, do you agree with that assessment?
    Sheriff Bouchard. That they are a key component, 
absolutely.
    Ms. Barragan. Yes. And so do you think that one step to 
combat illicit drug threats like fentanyl should include 
weakening the drug cartels?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Weakening the cartels? Absolutely, yes.
    Ms. Barragan. Great. Well, thank you. Are you familiar with 
the Organized Crime Drug Enforcement Task Force, which is part 
of the Department of Justice?
    Sheriff Bouchard. I don't have anyone assigned to that, so 
I don't know the inner workings of that particular task force.
    Ms. Barragan. OK. Well, I am going to read from the 
Department of Justice website about the OCDETF, which is the 
short version of the Organized Crime Drug Enforcement Task 
Force. It is an independent component of the U.S. Department of 
Justice. It was established in 1982. It is centerpiece of the 
Attorney General's strategy to combat transnational organized 
crime and to reduce the availability of illicit narcotics in 
the Nation by using a prosecutor-led, multiagency approach to 
enforcement. And they investigate transnational organized crime 
and money laundering and major drug trafficking networks.
    It sounds to me like this would be pretty important in our 
combating the flow of fentanyl across the southern border and 
elsewhere. Yet we have--and these are going to go into evidence 
in a second, into the record--a January 21, 2025, memorandum 
from the Justice Department that is changing policy and their 
priorities. And lo and behold, this organized crime task force 
is now to prioritize immigration offenses instead of the so 
very important work of combating the drug trafficking, of being 
those that combat the transnational criminal organizations.
    So, Ms. LaBelle, despite the facts, President Trump has 
redirected Federal drug enforcement, particularly officers on 
this Organized Crime Drug Enforcement Task Force, to prioritize 
immigration offenses over gangs that deal with the drugs. How 
do you think this will impact our law enforcement's ability to 
fight the opioid epidemic?
    Ms. LaBelle. Well, when I was at the Office of National 
Drug Control Policy, we gave the grants for the High Intensity 
Drug Trafficking Areas program, and we worked very, very 
closely with OCDETF. And OCDETF is a key component of drug 
trafficking efforts in the Federal Government.
    So deprioritizing and kind of changing their priorities, 
obviously, would have a big impact on our ability to go after 
drug trafficking organizations.
    Ms. Barragan. Thank you. The other thing that I have heard 
to weaken drug cartels would be for the United States to stop 
the trafficking of guns going to the drug cartels. Because in 
Mexico it is very hard to find, and they are hard to get, 
actual arms and drugs.
    And there is article after article. And I actually even 
have a Justice Department ATF report talking about the U.S. to 
Mexico pipeline. We also have plenty of articles of how the 
United States arms the Mexican cartels.
    Sheriff, do you think the cartels would be weakened if they 
didn't have access to guns and arms?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Would they be weakened?
    Ms. Barragan. Yes, that is the question. If they didn't 
have any guns or arms, would they be weakened?
    Sheriff Bouchard. I think if you could eliminate their 
access to weapons, absolutely, they would be less lethal, but I 
am not sure----
    Ms. Barragan. Thank you, sir. That is what I was getting 
at. If you don't have access, it is another way to weaken the 
cartels.
    I just want to end--and by the way, there is no action 
being taken by my colleagues or the majority on doing just 
that, to stop the flow.
    I want to just take a moment as I end to thank 
Representative Miller-Meeks on our work together on having 
alternatives to opioids and having Alternatives to PAIN Act, 
which we are working on closely together in a bipartisan 
fashion.
    Thank you. I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentlelady yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Ohio, 
Representative Rulli, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Rulli. Well, thank you, Chairman.
    And this question will be directed at Sheriff Bouchard. And 
I appreciate you all and all the time that you donated today.
    So I have listened for the last couple of hours with all my 
honorable friends on the other side of the aisle and their 
immediate point of focus to say let's just throw a lot more 
money at this problem. It was an overall theme for the last 3 
or 4 hours. Throw more money at the problem. Throw more money 
at the problem. And Medicaid expansion was brought up.
    So I was in the Ohio Senate for almost 6\1/2\ years, and in 
Ohio we have the sixth-largest Medicaid expansion there is. We 
operate on a general assembly of about 93 to 94 billion dollars 
biannual general assembly, and about $44 billion goes to 
Medicaid expansion, and the drug problem in Ohio is running 
crazy.
    I don't think that throwing money at problems is ever the 
answer. I think you have got to get to the core root of it. And 
there is a lot of hard work that is involved with that.
    One side of my district last week, sheriffs in my district 
pulled over a man who had discovered fentanyl in his trunk that 
would be enough to kill 30,000 people. A small little county. 
It sent shock waves through the county that that much fentanyl 
was being trafficked right below their noses, to be honest with 
you. That is more than twice the population of that county.
    Sheriff, what other tools can we get to locate these drugs 
when they are moving through these small counties? And is there 
some advice that you could get with your expertise to help 
these small county sheriffs get a better grip on this and 
instruct their deputies how to proceed forward and keeping in 
mind their safety?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes, the detection is a tough one because 
of the components. They are not as prone to, let's say, a K9 
detection, and some of the things that we, say, historically 
have used on corridors of trafficking.
    In terms of education, we try to share--again, we are Major 
County Sheriffs of America, so we try to help the smaller 
agencies, whether they are a sheriff's office or a police 
department, with our partnership and with our expertise. And 
that then goes back to what we talked about, whether it is 
HIDTA or other kinds of things. We need to work together--share 
information, share resources, share capability, and technical 
knowledge. And we do that a lot. But it is such an evolving 
landscape. So sometimes they may not know what they have got.
    As I mentioned, even me being one of the largest sheriff's 
offices in the country, I heard about, a number of years ago 
now, but xylazine. And I was like, I hadn't heard about that 
and so went and had our lab go back and test things on the 
bench, and lo and behold, it was there. So that is where robust 
communication and the public health space, law enforcement, and 
cooperation, communication is critical.
    Mr. Rulli. Is there any websites or any periodicals that a 
sheriff that is in a small town in Ohio that you could 
perhaps--because I think a lot of them are watching this 
today--that you could recommend for them?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Well, I know that NSA, the National 
Sheriffs, which represents all of them, they have a 
publication. And then, again, we share information, the Major 
County Sheriffs of America. We have a website, and we partner 
and share information regardless of whether you are a member or 
not.
    So I would encourage them to either reach out to NSA or to 
check some of the resources that MCSA has.
    Mr. Rulli. Really appreciate that information.
    Now I am going to have a quick question for Mr. Cullen. The 
HALT Fentanyl Act, I support. I lost my cousin to addiction. He 
was only 23 years old. I was in a rock and roll band, I lost 
one of my bandmates to addiction. It is very personal. I can't 
find a single family in this country that doesn't have somebody 
close to them or related to them that has perished through 
this.
    Fentanyl and other opioids ravaged our district. Any 
opinions from you--and sorry for your loss, sir--that you can 
give Mom and Dad, especially when you hear, like, mom and dads 
doing testimonies on Instagram or TikTok and they are talking 
about a son of theirs that just tried to get a Percocet in the 
mail, and they checked on him in the morning, and they found 
him dead.
    Is there anything you could--my daughter is going to 
college next year. It scares us to death. Any advice for Mom 
and Dad?
    Mr. Cullen. Thanks for that question.
    So we are raising awareness as much as we can. And that is 
what we want this body to do. I have said before that I feel 
like we are screaming underwater at times because the message 
is just not getting out. We speak to people at gas stations, we 
speak to people everywhere.
    Don't be afraid to have a conversation. I think a lot of 
times parents are afraid to have a difficult conversation, but 
it could be a life-or-death conversation. So just talk. That is 
all I can say.
    Mr. Rulli. Do you think talking like, you know, having that 
adult conversation, ``Hey, you know, I know you don't want me 
to think that you are doing drugs, but even a little pill could 
literally kill you.'' That is such a different thought process 
that didn't exist 5 years ago.
    Mr. Cullen. So what I often say to a lot of parents is--or 
even to kids is, look, I don't mean to presume that you are 
doing drugs, but you are going to be in a situation, you may be 
in a situation where someone is about to do something that 
could kill them.
    So now I make it more personal, saying now it is not a news 
item. You know somebody who lost somebody. And I make it more 
personal that way. And I just tell them, I don't presume that 
you are on drugs, but you could be in a situation to save 
somebody.
    Mr. Rulli. I appreciate that. Thank you, Chairman.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from New York, 
Representative Langworthy, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Langworthy. Thank you very much to the chairman and the 
ranking member and to all of our witnesses for their incredible 
testimony here today.
    It is hard to find someone in America who has not felt the 
devastating impact of fentanyl or other synthetic drugs. 
Whether it is a family member, a friend, a neighbor, this 
poison is tearing through our communities in an unprecedented 
rate.
    I have sat and had roundtables with law enforcement 
officials and health professionals throughout my district--
which I represent the western part of New York State and the 
southern tier counties along the Pennsylvania line--and they 
all say the same thing, that we are losing ground in this 
fight.
    Police officers responding to overdoses several times a 
week, it is having a great impact on, you know, their mental 
health. Community leaders are witnessing fentanyl-laced drugs 
killing people at an alarming rate, even showing up in things 
like gummies, as you have talked about here today, poisoning 
children.
    Enough is enough, and I am very grateful that we have--
finally have someone in the White House who is laser-focused on 
securing our borders and holding foreign entities accountable 
and providing our law enforcement with the tools that they need 
to combat this epidemic. And passing the HALT Fentanyl Act 
today is a huge step in that direction.
    But with that, in the area of lab innovation, Dr. Westlake, 
last year the Biden FDA issued a final rule that would regulate 
lab-developed tests as medical devices, which would severely 
hamstring definitive drug testing by stifling the innovation 
needed to keep pace with what we are seeing in the streets.
    The additional regulatory burdens could delay the detection 
of emerging substances, allowing dangerous drugs to circulate 
longer and putting more lives at risk and potentially 
disrupting patient care. With the rapid rise of these deadly 
substances, it is critical that our labs have the ability to 
quickly adapt and stay ahead of evolving drug trends.
    So, Dr. Westlake, can you speak to the importance of lab 
tests and the innovation in this area when it comes to 
detecting novel, illicit compounds?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, I think it is critically important for 
labs and for science in general to be able to combat the new 
emerging threats. When they talked about the fire, I heard 
spigots, there's new spigots popping up all the time. If you 
have to wait and go through a burdensome regulatory environment 
to be able to detect those and to combat those, then that 
doesn't do any good.
    My experience at the State level, coming up and seeing what 
the regulatory burden at the State level is, you know, at the 
Federal level is as much or more. So I encourage any type of 
regulation that encourages innovation when it comes to that 
because it is a significant risk of delayed response, and we 
need to be nimble. We can't be--you know, you can't be a 
battleship that turns, it has got to be a speedboat.
    Mr. Langworthy. Thank you. I think it is critical that we 
don't stifle innovation. And that goes to many facets of the 
Federal Government. When we stifle innovation, we deny 
ourselves the potential of lifesaving new technology that would 
revolutionize the way we can combat this epidemic.
    Pivoting here to emergency room screening. Dr. Westlake, we 
have heard tragic stories of young people dying from fentanyl 
overdoes because they were not tested for fentanyl. The 
detection of fentanyl in overdose patients who go to the 
emergency departments is critical to saving lives and combating 
this opioid crisis.
    As an emergency medicine physician, do you agree that there 
needs to be greater use of fentanyl screening in overdose 
patients?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, absolutely. I think it pretty much 
should be the standard of care for fentanyl to be the sixth--
there used to be a five-panel drug screening for drugs that you 
would get at every facility when a patient came in if they were 
concerned with overdose. And now most of them have gone to 
fentanyl. And if they haven't, then they are behind the times, 
and they should. And that--you know, definitely, that is 
critical--the majority--I don't think I have seen a heroin 
overdose in a couple of years, but I have seen, you know, 
dozens of fentanyl overdoses that thought it was heroin. And I 
knew that because of the drug screening.
    Mr. Langworthy. Very important to know. Do you also agree 
that it would be helpful for the Health and Human Services 
Department to study the current frequency and benefits of 
fentanyl testing in the ER and provide guidance on how ERs 
implement fentanyl testing in overdose cases?
    Dr. Westlake. Yes, I would be cautious with kind of 
regulatory involvement at that, to make sure that it didn't get 
in the way of something in the future. You know, there is a lot 
of unintended consequences. But I think looking at and making 
sure that the ground level should be, you know, the state-of-
the-art science should be including fentanyl and it should be--
definitely should be reviewed.
    Mr. Langworthy. Well, thank you to all the witnesses for 
your expert testimony and the role that you all play in 
combating this opioid crisis. And my thoughts and prayers are 
with your family for your terrible loss.
    It is clear we must take a stronger action across the 
Congress, across the Federal Government to combat this evolving 
threat of illicit drugs, support our law enforcement, and 
ensure that our healthcare system is equipped to save lives.
    And with that, I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from Florida, 
Representative Cammack, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mrs. Cammack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    I would like to make a point of order and move to take down 
words spoken earlier today.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The committee will suspend. The 
gentlewoman will state the words she wishes taken down.
    Mrs. Cammack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Our colleague Mr. Veasey stated that, quote, ``the Office 
of National Drug Policy's web page has been wiped by President 
Elon.'' That was his words.
    And I would like to remind the committee, as well as the 
chairman and our colleague, that no matter what Mr. Veasey has 
read on the internet, that his statement is false. This 
committee should set the record straight. And, finally, the 
President of the United States is Donald J. Trump.
    He would be correct to state the facts instead of having 
hurt feelings.
    So with that, Mr. Chairman, I would like to have his words 
taken down.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. OK. In the gentleman's absence----
    Ms. DeGette. Point of order.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia [continuing]. I am going to 
recognize----
    Ms. DeGette. Point of order.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. In the gentleman's absence, I am 
going to recognize Representative DeGette for her response.
    Ms. DeGette. Mr. Chairman, first of all, under rule 17, 
clause 4, this motion is out of order because under that rule 
it must be made at the time.
    Secondly, I find it extremely amusing Mrs. Cammack feels 
compelled to come all the way back at the end of this very 
important hearing on fentanyl to let us know that Elon Musk is 
not, in fact, President of the United States.
    And, in fact, the rules do not allow the words to be taken 
down except for, quote, ``personal abuse, innuendo, or ridicule 
of the President.'' Well, as she herself says, Elon Musk is not 
the President, so there is no basis for these words to be taken 
down. And I would urge the chairman to overrule her.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. OK. The Chair asks the gentlelady if 
she wishes to seek unanimous consent to modify or withdraw her 
remarks.
    Mrs. Cammack. No. Mr. Chairman, no.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. No.
    The Chair is ready to rule. The Chair finds the words of 
the gentleman from Texas are not parliamentary because they 
constitute personalities toward the President. However, 
committee rule 17, clause 4 requires a point of order be made 
immediately. Therefore, I'll overrule the point of order.
    I ask that Members please remain respectful and refrain 
from this type of rhetoric.
    And I now recognize Representative Cammack for 5 minutes of 
questioning.
    Mrs. Cammack. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you for 
recognizing that this committee should be above any attacks on 
our President.
    Thank you for the opportunity to be here to discuss these 
existing and emerging drug threats. As a Representative from 
the Sunshine State in Florida, we are all too familiar with the 
consequences of open borders and how every town in America has 
been turned into a border town and State as a result of open 
borders.
    Over 100,000 individuals have lost their lives to fentanyl 
poisoning every single year. And should this have been an 
airline incident where a hundred thousand people were going 
down, it would have never taken as long in order to start 
addressing it. It is absolutely infuriating.
    And, sir, I want to express, as many of my colleagues have 
here today, our tremendous sympathies and condolences for your 
loss. Never should have happened in the first place.
    The opioid epidemic remains a persistent crisis, claiming 
lives at an alarming rate. Synthetic drugs like fentanyl have 
become increasingly potent and pervasive, exacerbating the 
public health emergency. And new substances continue to emerge, 
often faster than our regulatory and enforcement framework can 
adapt to. These substances not only threaten public health, but 
also strain our healthcare system and law enforcement 
resources. This hearing has been a fantastic opportunity to 
look at the full scope of the threats and to talk broadly about 
strategies that we can put together to address them.
    Now, my first question is for you, Sheriff. I am actually 
the wife of a first responder. My husband, Matt, is an 18-year-
career firefighter/SWAT medic, so he has been on the front 
lines dealing with this. And we collectively have understood 
for the past 10 years it is not a matter of if but when he 
himself becomes a victim of fentanyl poisoning because of how 
many people he encounters on a daily basis that are overdosing.
    So given the rapid evolution of the synthetic drug analogs, 
what technologies does law enforcement have to detect the 
substances? You can touch on that very briefly. But, more 
importantly, address if these mechanisms are sufficient to 
detect the new and emerging threats.
    As these drugs continue to evolve different strains, new 
additives, it becomes very tough to test for them. So can you 
talk about if we are keeping pace with the molecular changes in 
the drugs, and what strategies are in place or what do we need 
to adopt in order to have timely identification to keep our 
first responders safe, and then we can properly schedule them?
    Sheriff Bouchard. That is a complex, layered question. I 
think a lot of that goes to the difficulty of us understanding 
what has changed in a lab that is basically a nation-state lab 
that has abilities and facilities way beyond ours. And they are 
trying to dial in what is no longer scheduled and what they 
think will be profitable or deadly or whatever the, you know, 
adjective is.
    So I think a big part of that is for us as a country to put 
pressure on the countries in whatever way you and the President 
deem is appropriate to let them know there's consequences for 
doing that, for constantly sending things to America, whether 
it is China or through Mexico with the cartels, that there's 
real consequences for them to intentionally do that and keep 
trying to stay one step ahead of our regulating or our 
scheduling of what they just used to make a big profit on.
    In terms of the technology and equipment--and it is hard to 
say what we need because we don't know what is coming at us, 
and that is a big challenge for us on the local level. As I 
said earlier, I did not know we had xylazine in our lab until 
we specifically went to look for it because I had heard it 
being found in other States a number of years ago. So sometimes 
we don't even know what we don't know until it is upon us, 
because we have very well-funded nation-state adversaries or 
cartels that are, obviously, very flushed with cash that can do 
these things, and then they end up in our lab before we even 
know it comes down the pike.
    Mrs. Cammack. Thank you. And I am going to have a bunch of 
followup questions for you. But in the interest of time, I am 
going to turn to you, Dr. Westlake.
    Given the increasing prevalence of fentanyl as analogs and 
other synthetic opioids in overdose cases, could you discuss 
the differences in treatment protocols for fentanyl-related 
overdoses compared to other opioid analogs? And again, I know 
we need to be sensitive to fentanyl and carfentanil being used 
in medical settings, so if you could address that.
    Dr. Westlake. Sure. The receptor that--yes, antidotes use 
are the same, whether it is synthetic opioid or natural opioid. 
The problem comes when they are flooded with massive amounts. 
And in that case, you just need to use more of the Narcan.
    There sure--there is some space for a more potent antidote. 
Narcan works. You just have to get it to the person before they 
are dead from not breathing. So the issue is getting an 
interdiction of the Narcan to the patient or stopping the 
patient from taking the poison and the deadly opioid to begin 
with.
    Mrs. Cammack. Now, what challenges do emergency personnel 
face in quickly identifying the specific substances involved in 
an overdose? And how would this ultimately impact outcomes? The 
reason--where I am going with this is to our point originally. 
How can we get ahead in making sure that when EMTs, medics are 
onsite, are on scene, that if they are dealing with a patient, 
they can test quickly so they know what to test for but how 
they can best protect themselves as well?
    Dr. Westlake. At the level in the emergency department you 
just treat for the respiratory suppression that is there. A lot 
of times we don't even know what people--what people are 
overdosing from. So, you know, we treat there. We treat the 
symptoms that cause the respiratory suppression. So you just--
you treat symptomatically. So it would be difficult to--it 
doesn't kind of matter what opioid you took. What matters is 
that we got you breathing again and that we got----
    Mrs. Cammack. OK. Thank you. I yield.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentlelady yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from New York, 
Representative Tonko, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Mr. Tonko. Thank you, Chair Carter. And thank you to all of 
our witnesses for being here today. And my condolences to the 
Cullen family. You all bring an important perspective.
    We are in the midst of an overdose crisis, and we need to 
treat it as such. Now is not the time for half measures that 
make us feel good or for outdated and unsubstantiated 
stereotypes and stigmas that hold us back. It is not the time 
to freeze critical funding for treatment and prevention.
    I continue to hear from local providers that people are 
anticipating cuts and, in turn, limiting expanding programs on 
care that would offer lifesaving treatment for addiction or 
access to public health resources like naloxone or fentanyl 
testing strips that save lives.
    I have heard from programs that are afraid that funding 
will dry up and they will be forced to lay off staff and, in 
turn, serve fewer people or shut down entirely. We know that 
costs of such cuts would be lives lost, families ripped apart 
by poison seemingly beyond our control. The American people are 
watching Congress to see if we still consider treatment for 
addiction and overdose prevention a priority, and I would say a 
high priority. Let's not turn our back on them.
    So we know that our justice system is a revolving door for 
those struggling with addiction and mental health issues. Over 
half of people in State prisons and two-thirds of individuals 
in jails have substance use disorder. By allowing inmates to 
receive addiction treatment and other services before returning 
home, my Reentry Act would bring targeted treatment to those at 
the highest risk of overdose. The Reentry Act would be a game 
changer for reducing overdose deaths and suicides by allowing 
all States to provide prerelease care to Medicaid-eligible 
individuals up to 30 days prior to release from incarceration.
    I thank the Major County Sheriffs of America and the 
National Sheriffs Association for their strong support of the 
Reentry Act.
    Sheriff Bouchard, thank you for your efforts and many 
people that have joined in the effort. Many people don't think 
of sheriffs as playing a role in treatment for addiction. How 
do you approach that, the role?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Thank you, and thank you for that 
legislation. As you know, our organization does strongly 
support that.
    Mr. Tonko. We appreciate that.
    Sheriff Bouchard. You know, we have a role in treatment, 
prevention, and kind of the next path forward on lots of 
levels, because we are typically, again, the first to respond 
when someone out in the community is having an overdose. And 
then once somebody, for whatever reason, on a different level 
is incarcerated with a substance use disorder, we have 
medically assisted treatment in our facilities, we have a 
Narcan vending machine as you go out, and you can take that for 
free. We try to connect them with resources, to the extent we 
can, with programs and funding we have for aftercare. Because 
when you drop them back in the same environment, that is when 
they are most at risk to recidivism in that behavior. And as 
was mentioned earlier, the likelihood of an overdose is very 
magnified to that population when they come out without 
anything in their system, and they immediately go back 
sometimes to look for that.
    Mr. Tonko. Thank you. And I know that Oakland County Jail's 
medication-assisted treatment, MAT, program has been praised 
for its comprehensive approach to treating opioid use disorder 
in jail, including medication access, therapeutic services, and 
post-relief support.
    How has the availability of FDA-approved medications along 
with the support services impacted the effectiveness of the 
program? And what measurable outcomes have you observed in 
terms of inmate recovery and reduced recidivism?
    Sheriff Bouchard. Yes. It is helpful to have, you know, a 
continuum and choices that the medical professional can decide 
based on that individual rather than one prescribed route. And 
so we leave that to our medical professionals and the 
individual and the treatment and care that gives us the best 
path forward. And we have seen noticeable results in how 
outcomes are achieved, especially when paired with partnerships 
outside the building.
    Mr. Tonko. Thank you. I see my time is near up, and I did 
have questions for Regina LaBelle. We will forward those to the 
committee, and I appreciate your response.
    With that, I yield back, Mr. Chair.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentleman yields.
    The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from Virginia, 
Representative McClellan, for 5 minutes of questioning.
    Ms. McClellan. Thank you, Chairman Carter and Ranking 
Member DeGette, for holding this very important hearing. Thank 
you to our witnesses, particularly Mr. Cullen. I add my 
condolences. But I also want to commend you for turning tragedy 
into advocacy and make sure that no one suffers the same 
tragedy that you did. I really want to commend you for that 
today.
    We have seen in Virginia alone over 2,400 Virginians have 
lost their lives to drug overdoses each year. Community health 
centers stand on the front lines of this opioid epidemic 
response, providing essential services of preventing and 
treating substance use disorders, delivering primary care and 
dental care, offering low-cost prescription drugs. And for many 
families, especially in rural areas like the southern end of my 
district, community health centers are the only option for 
accessing healthcare and prescription--I am sorry, substance 
use disorder treatment.
    These centers can't operate without critical Federal 
funding from the Health Resources and Services Administration 
to pay their healthcare workers and keep the doors open.
    On his first day in office, President Trump issued 
executive orders silencing Federal agencies and halting all 
communal--external communication. Then, Trump and Elon Musk 
unleashed a sweepin, unconstitutional freeze on funding for 
programs, including those supporting federally qualified health 
centers. And despite several courts blocking this action, chaos 
and confusion have ensued.
    In Virginia, the funding freeze abruptly cut 16 of our 31 
community health centers off from Federal funding. Some are 
still struggling to regain access to these critical resources. 
And just yesterday, the Capital Area Health Network, which 
operates seven facilities around Richmond, was forced to 
announce the closure of at least three locations and the 
transfer of patients to other sites, increasing the workload on 
those other sites and impacting their access to care.
    This was entirely unavoidable. But Trump handed over 
control to an unelected billionaire and let him work without 
thinking through the consequences to our communities of rash 
action.
    I am glad to see bipartisan agreement on addressing the 
substance abuse disorder crisis, but we have to make sure that 
our healthcare systems have the ability to rapidly respond. We 
have to demand accountability when they can't. We have to 
assure that the damage that has been done on this important 
healthcare safety net isn't done again.
    So, Ms. LaBelle, I wonder if you could please explain the 
role that community healthcare centers play in helping patients 
access the full continuum of care, including on fighting 
substance abuse disorders?
    Ms. LaBelle. Yes, I mean, you know, nationwide we need to 
make getting care and treatment easier than getting illegal 
drugs. And that is one key role that these community health 
centers play, is that they meet people where they are, they 
provide a continuum of care for people, wraparound services, 
and, you know, play an important role in reducing overdose 
deaths.
    Ms. McClellan. And can you explain how the backlog over 
accessing payment systems paying the healthcare workers has 
impacted our community health systems and what we can do to 
address the backlog of care that patients particularly in rural 
areas need?
    Ms. LaBelle. I mean, there is obviously a real dire 
workforce shortage in a lot of parts of the country, 
particularly in rural areas. And these types of kind of starts 
and stops cause a lot more confusion. And people who could 
potentially work in those areas be recruited are likely not to 
come if there is confusion or a lack of funding for their 
services.
    Ms. McClellan. Thank you.
    And I will just note in my last 43 minutes--seconds, this 
impacts urban areas, this impacts suburban areas, it especially 
impacts our rural areas. And in my district, which is 2 hours 
end to end, many people in the southern part of the district 
have to go to the Southside Community Health Center, which now 
is closed and sending patients even further north. And trying 
to get time off from work to travel long distances to get the 
care that you need only to be told your appointment now is 
transferred further north has a real impact that we can't 
afford that kind of delay.
    I thank you for sharing the importance of community health 
centers.
    And, Mr. Chair, I yield back.
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. The gentlelady yields.
    At this time, I am going to ask unanimous consent to insert 
in the record the documents included on the staff hearing 
documents list.
    Without objection, that will be ordered.
    [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.]
    Mr. Carter of Georgia. I want to thank all the witnesses 
again for being here today. Especially you, Mr. Cullen, thank 
you so much. You and Mrs. Cullen, your bravery, your courage is 
admired. And we all extend our heartfelt condolences for your 
loss. Hopefully that your testimony today can help to save at 
least one life. And if that is the case, then it is worth it. 
So thank you very much.
    Members may have additional written questions for all of 
you. And if we do, we would appreciate it if you could get back 
with us as soon as possible with that.
    I will remind Members that they have 10 business days to 
submit questions for the record, and I ask the witnesses to 
respond to questions promptly. Members should submit their 
questions by the close of business on February 20.
    Without objection, the subcommittee is adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 1:37 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
    [Material submitted for inclusion in the record follows:]
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