[Senate Hearing 118-767]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                                                        S. Hrg. 118-767

                            BUSINESS MEETING

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                              COMMITTEE ON
                      ENVIRONMENT AND PUBLIC WORKS

                          UNITED STATES SENATE

                    ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                           NOVEMBER 20, 2024

                               __________

  Printed for the use of the Committee on Environment and Public Works
  
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]


        Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.govinfo.gov
        
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                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
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               COMMITTEE ON ENVIRONMENT AND PUBLIC WORKS

                    ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
                             SECOND SESSION

                  THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware, Chairman
          SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West Virginia, Ranking Member

BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, Maryland         KEVIN CRAMER, North Dakota
BERNARD SANDERS, Vermont             CYNTHIA M. LUMMIS, Wyoming
SHELDON WHITEHOUSE, Rhode Island     MARKWAYNE MULLIN, Oklahoma
JEFF MERKLEY, Oregon                 PETE RICKETTS, Nebraska
EDWARD J. MARKEY, Massachusetts      JOHN BOOZMAN, Arkansas
DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan            ROGER WICKER, Mississippi
MARK KELLY, Arizona                  DAN SULLIVAN, Alaska
ALEX PADILLA, California             LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina
JOHN FETTERMAN, Pennsylvania

               Courtney Taylor, Democratic Staff Director
               Adam Tomlinson, Republican Staff Director
                        
                        C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

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                                                                   Page

                           NOVEMBER 20, 2024
                           OPENING STATEMENTS

Carper, Hon. Thomas R., U.S. Senator from the State of Delaware..     1
Capito, Hon. Shelley Moore, U.S. Senator from the State of West 
  Virginia.......................................................     2

                          ADDITIONAL MATERIAL

Letter of support to Senator Carper for the nomination of Matthew 
  Kaplan, of Maryland, to serve as Federal Co-Chairperson of the 
  Great Lakes Authority from Senator Stabenow....................    10

                              LEGISLATION

PN1694, Nomination Reference and Report, Matthew Kaplan, of 
  Maryland, to serve as Federal Co-Chairperson of the Great Lakes 
  Authority......................................................    11
PN1980, Nomination Reference and Report, Matthew James Marzano, 
  of Illinois, to be a member of the Nuclear Regulatory 
  Commission.....................................................    12
Fifty-three Committee Resolutions to closely examine the needs of 
  our Federal agencies in order to provide the adequate repairs, 
  upgrades and modernizations while removing any excess waste in 
  our Federal buildings portfolio................................    13

 
                            BUSINESS MEETING

                              ----------                              


                      WEDNESDAY, NOVEMBER 20, 2024

                                       U.S. Senate,
                 Committee on Environment and Public Works,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:50 a.m. in room 
406, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Thomas R. Carper 
(chairman of the committee) presiding.
    Present: Senators Carper, Capito, Cardin, Sanders, 
Whitehouse, Merkley, Markey, Stabenow, Kelly, Padilla, 
Fetterman, Mullin, Ricketts, Boozman.

          OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. THOMAS R. CARPER, 
            U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF DELAWARE

    Senator Carper. Good morning, everyone. I am pleased to 
call this meeting to order this morning. I want to thank those 
who are already here, some of whom have changed their schedules 
dramatically to be here. Thank you so much. Others will be 
joining us shortly.
    Today, as you may recall, we will be considering a nominee 
for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, a nominee for the Great 
Lakes Authority, and a number of committee resolutions 
approving General Services Administration prospectuses.
    Before we do that, though, I want to take a moment to 
briefly discuss each of these items. First, we are going to 
consider the nomination of Matthew Marzano to serve as a Member 
of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. Matt understands the 
importance of deploying more safe and clean nuclear power. He 
has demonstrated his commitment to maintaining the public's 
trust and confidence in the Nuclear Regulatory Commission's 
work. He has extensive technical expertise gained over the 
course of a decade in the nuclear industry.
    Matt worked tirelessly with us, I think on both sides of 
the aisle, actually, with the Minority staff as well, in order 
to move the ADVANCE Act through the Senate and on to the 
President's desk which was signed into law a month or two ago.
    No other commissioner has the unique and credible and 
valuable set of credentials that Matt possesses. I strongly 
believe that he would be and will be, if confirmed, a 
tremendous asset to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission as it 
implements this critical bipartisan law which we all voted for.
    I believe, as do many of us here, that we are at a crucial 
moment for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and the future of 
nuclear energy. The Nuclear Regulatory Commission is most 
effective and efficient when it has a full slate of 
commissioners to carry out its mission and provide certainty to 
the industry.
    With all of this in mind, I am pleased to support Matt's 
nomination. I urge all of our colleagues to do the same.
    Second, the committee is considering the nomination of 
Matthew Kaplan to be the Federal Co-Chairperson of the Great 
Lakes Authority. The Great Lakes Authority will promote 
economic development, domestic manufacturing, and job creation 
while restoring and protecting the Great Lakes. It will provide 
grant funding to clean and review projects as well as water and 
broadband infrastructure projects.
    In March of this year, Congress appropriated funding for 
the Great Lakes Authority for the first time. Mr. Kaplan will 
be responsible for standing up this brand-new regional 
commission. I believe he is up for the challenge.
    Finally, we will consider a number of resolutions to 
approve General Services Administration prospectuses throughout 
our Country. It is our committee's responsibility to approve 
these prospectuses before Congress can approve funds for these 
projects. Members have had the opportunity to review these 
documents and I believe the resolutions are non-controversial.
    With that, I am pleased to recognize the Ranking Member, 
Senator Capito, for any remarks that she has this morning.

        OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, 
          U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA

    Senator Capito. Thank you, Chairman Carper, for holding 
this hearing, and thanks for the witnesses that are coming 
before us today. I am pleased that the business meeting on 
October 11th marked the 50th anniversary of the signing of the 
Energy Reorganization Act of 1974, and this landmark law was a 
turning a point in how our Nation approached nuclear safety 
issues.
    Establishing the NRC, Congress preserved the Atomic Energy 
Commission's basic structure: five commissioners sharing equal 
responsibility to oversee the civilian use of nuclear power and 
radioactive materials. This five-member commission structure 
has served this Country well. Each member contributes through 
their diverse background and experience. Previous nominees to 
serve as NRC commissioners have had exemplary careers leading 
large organizations in the legal field, deep policy 
backgrounds, or impressive scientific and technical 
credentials, each diverse perspective making the value of the 
commission greater than the sum of each member.
    The commissioners are responsible for leading the 
organization, making regulatory decisions, and setting policy. 
Given the crossroads that the NRC is facing and the nuclear 
industry and Congress' clear interest in changing the agency's 
culture from the status quo, it is imperative that we take into 
consideration the breadth and depth of this nominee's 
background. I believe that the White House has sort of 
exaggerated Mr. Marzano's experience in the nuclear energy 
industry, although I do recognize his training and time working 
at a power plant. As I stated as his confirmation hearing, 
demonstrating a capacity to follow procedures is fundamentally 
different than a commissioner's role in setting policy, 
promulgating regulations, and adjudicating significant legal 
issues.
    We must consider the totality of Mr. Marzano's background 
and depth of his experience, particularly at this moment of 
tremendous importance.
    The overwhelming passage of the ADVANCE Act was a clear 
message from Congress that the NRC, with the leadership, 
support and direction of commission can and should do better to 
enable the safe use of nuclear technologies. Despite this clear 
direction, Chair Hanson has stated that he views the ADVANCE 
Act as an endorsement of the work that the agency is already 
doing, communicating his position to the staff, the NRC 
licensees and applicants, and to Congress, that the status quo 
is acceptable.
    It appears that the NRC staff has followed the 
commissioner's lead. The NRC staff's recommendation to update 
the agency's mission statement as the ADVANCE Act requires the 
commission to do rationalized really doing just the bare 
minimum to comply with the law. Those recommendations missed 
the mark, and I expect the entire commission will unanimously 
support a more ambitious mission statement than the lackluster 
staff paper. The ADVANCE Act was not an endorsement of the 
status quo.
    After considering Mr. Marzano's responses to my questions 
for the record, I do not have confidence that he has the 
necessary background and experience to be that agent of change 
at the commission, or to set the commission up for the agency's 
next 50 years as Congress just envisioned in the ADVANCE Act. I 
will be voting no on Mr. Marzano's nomination.
    As Congress continues to consider the candidates for this 
vacancy, the commission must continue to work efficiently.
    As the Chairman mentioned, we have 53 resolutions, GSA 
resolutions before us. I ask my colleagues to support these. 
There is one in there for West Virginia, a prospectus for 
repairs and alterations to the IRS Enterprise Computing Center 
in Martinsburg, West Virginia. The approval of this prospectus 
will allow for much-needed improvements to the roofing system 
and other upgrades necessary for the building's continued 
operations. We certainly do not want anybody's tax return to 
get lost or missed or changed because we have not modernized 
our IRS computing system.
    I also will be supporting Matthew Kaplan to be the Federal 
Co-Chairperson of the Great Lakes Authority. I have heard very 
positive feedback on him. Thank you, and I yield back to the 
Chair.
    Senator Carper. Senator Capito, thank you for those words. 
Thanks for working with us, you and your team, working with us 
and getting us ready for what is going to be a busy and a full 
day.
    I believe we have a voting quorum present. As we proceed, I 
would ask Senators to please hold your statements until after 
the voting is completed.
    I now call up Presidential Nomination 1694 for Matthew 
Kaplan of Maryland to be Federal Co-Chairman of the Great Lakes 
Authority. I vote to approve and report the nomination 
favorably to the Senate. All in favor, say aye.
    [Chorus of ayes.]
    Senator Carper. All opposed, say nay.
    [No audible response.]
    Senator Carper. In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have 
it. The nominee is favorably reported. I note for the record 
that a quorum of the committee is present.
    I call up no and move to approve en bloc the 53 committee 
resolutions for the prospectuses listed in the notice for this 
business meeting. All in favor, say aye.
    [Chorus of ayes.]
    Senator Carper. All opposed, say nay.
    [No audible response.]
    Senator Carper. In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have 
it. These resolutions are approved.
    Senator Padilla, thank you for joining us today. You are 
recognized for your remarks, please.
    Senator Padilla. Thank you, Mr. Chair, colleagues. I just 
want to take a moment to register some disappointment that my 
bipartisan, bicameral Wildlife Corridors bill with Senators 
Hoeven and Congressman Zinke were not included in today's 
markup, despite the overwhelming support from the wildlife 
conservation community and the sportsmen's and hunting groups 
in a number of States.
    It was almost exactly a year ago that we held a 
subcommittee hearing to receive testimony from wildlife experts 
on the challenges and solutions to facilitating wildlife 
migration. We heard overwhelming support for codifying a Trump-
era secretarial order on wildlife movement, which is what my 
bill would effectively do.
    Together, we worked with private landowners, State wildlife 
agencies and sportsmen's groups and crafted a bill that would 
build off the success of that secretarial order and further 
encourage voluntary efforts--let me emphasize voluntary 
efforts--to support wildlife movement, particularly for big 
game species. Earlier this year, Representative Zinke, who 
sponsored the companion bill in the House, and issued the 
secretarial order when he was Interior Secretary during the 
Trump Administration provided compelling testimony for the bill 
during a House Natural Resources Committee hearing, where it 
received bipartisan praise.
    This bill remains a high priority for prominent sportsmen's 
and wildlife groups, such as Back Country Hunters and Anglers, 
the Boone and Crockett Club, the congressional Sportsmen's 
Foundation, and the Theodore Roosevelt Conservation 
Partnership, as well as the Association of Fish and Wildlife 
Agencies, which represents our State wildlife agencies.
    I have tried to negotiate in good faith and to be very 
accommodating to my colleagues on the other side of the dais. I 
have to say, though, Mr. Chairman, it was a little frustrating 
that we could not get a final yes and a final agreement on 
language.
    I raise this in hopes that in the coming weeks we can 
continue our efforts across the aisle. I ask that my colleagues 
across the aisle continue to work with me in good faith to 
advance this common sense bipartisan bill. There is still time.
    Senator Carper. Thank you, Senator Padilla. Thank you very 
much for those comments.
    Senator Cardin, you are recognized, please.
    Senator Cardin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As you were 
approving the nominee on the Great Lakes, it just reminds me of 
the work of this committee, and being so proud to be on this 
committee. You and I are in our last couple of weeks on the 
Environment and Public Works Committee.
    Senator Carper. I do not know about you, Ben, but almost 
every day, even on the train coming down today, people say, how 
do you like being retired?
    [Laughter.]
    Senator Carper. I say, well, if you want to know the truth, 
I am not. If you looked at my schedule today, you would say, 
well, he should be paid overtime. It is a very full day, as my 
colleagues know.
    Senator Cardin. Right. I do not think we envisioned, when 
we made our announcements that we were not seeking re-election, 
that we would have such a busy end to our term.
    Senator Carper. Do you find that people are just being 
incredibly kind to you?
    Senator Cardin. Yes, people who have never voted for me 
tell me that they like me.
    Senator Carper. If I had known people were going to be this 
nice to me, I would have quit a lot sooner.
    [Laughter.]
    Senator Cardin. I do not know if I agree with that 
statement. I just really wanted to compliment our Chair and 
Ranking Member. It is helpful to have the Chair and Ranking 
Member in the Chesapeake Bay watershed. I just marvel at the 
way we have been able to work together in a bipartisan manner 
in this committee.
    I know there are days we have some differences, but by and 
large we have worked as a team. I think about the Water 
Resources Development Act, I think about so many bills that 
have moved through this committee that are now the law of the 
land that have benefited all our States in a way that is 
consistent with the mission of this committee.
    I just really wanted to take a moment, if I might, to thank 
Senator Carper and Senator Capito. You have continued the great 
tradition of this committee.
    I sought to get on this committee my first year in the U.S. 
Senate. It is a committee I asked to serve on. It is a 
committee that I have been very proud to be a part of. I can 
name a lot of different aspects that we have been able to move 
forward, and I think the legacy of this committee is 
tremendous.
    It has been an honor to serve on this committee. 
Congratulations to our two leaders.
    Senator Carper. Thank you for those kind words. It is an 
honor to be here. We sit next to each other on two committees, 
and he is my neighbor right across the Bay. What an honor. 
Thank you, Ben.
    Senator Markey. Mr. Chairman?
    Senator Carper. My friend from Massachusetts.
    Senator Markey. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Chairman, you and I met 42 years ago.
    Senator Carper. We were in kindergarten, I think.
    [Laughter.]
    Senator Markey. You were a young man, a freshman 
Congressman. At that point I was in my fourth term in Congress, 
42 years ago. I always felt that he was one of the most 
talented young people that I had ever met in politics.
    I invited then-young Congressman Tom Carper to go with me 
on a congressional delegation that I had organized down to 
Nicaragua and El Salvador. I was also taking with me Ted 
Sorensen, who had been the advisor for President Kennedy during 
the Cuban Missile Crisis, and Stansfield Turner, who had been 
Jimmy Carter's head of the CIA, who had been his expert, 
President Carter's expert on Cuba and Latin American affairs as 
well.
    It was at the height of the battle between the Sandinistas 
and the Somocistas in Nicaragua. It was also at a point where 
the war in El Salvador was at a peak. We were unfortunately 
financing the generals, who were in control of the death squads 
in El Salvador.
    It was helpful for me, because I had Ted Sorensen and 
Stansfield Turner with me to give me their insights, but also 
to be talking to President Duarte in El Salvador and 
unbelievably, still true, new President Ortega. He had just 
taken over in Nicaragua.
    These two leaders, along with Tom Carper, were just so 
helpful at having a meaningful congressional delegation going 
to that region, which was troubled. To a certain extent, we 
still see the results of those wars in the migration patterns 
and even in the governmental structures in those countries.
    That is where my friendship with Senator Carper began, and 
my admiration for him is undiminished over the years, including 
the passage of historic legislation under his leadership of 
this committee, which is going to make a mark on our Country 
for decades to come.
    I thank you, Mr. Chairman, for your great leadership and 
for your friendship over all of these years.
    Senator Carper. Thank you. I would just say, the people 
say, what do you most remember from those, I remember riding in 
the CIA helicopters into contra camps right along the border 
with Nicaragua and El Salvador. It was a very, very tender 
moment for our Country and that part of the world.
    One of the reasons, and there is a connection here with 
what we are talking about here today, we need a full complement 
on the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. We need for the NRC to be 
able to do their job, continue to do their job, especially with 
a focus on safety.
    I was a Navy midshipman, spent a lot of years in the Navy, 
so has Senator Kelly. I believe that nuclear energy is not the 
whole answer, but it is a big part of the answer. If we are 
serious about addressing climate change and global warming, 
nuclear has to be a part of it. It has to be safe. It has to be 
safe. If we screw it up, if we mess it up, then heaven help us 
with respect to actually addressing climate change.
    If we want to make sure that the folks from Honduras and 
Nicaragua those countries who want to stay there where they can 
actually raise crops and not have to worry about the weather 
and drought, there is actually a connection here.
    Senator Kelly, please.
    Senator Kelly. Mr. Chairman, thank you. I certainly want to 
associate myself with the remarks of Senator Markey and thank 
you for your service. I do not know if you remember when we 
first met or what the circumstances were. I do. For some 
reason, this young Congresswoman from Arizona, after being 
elected, decided to strike up a friendship with you. My wife 
Gabby looked at you as a mentor in the Senate.
    Senator Carper. More like a grandfather.
    [Laughter.]
    Senator Kelly. Yes, grandfather, a grandfather in the 
Senate for her. She has always been incredibly fond of you. 
Then for me to have the opportunity to serve on this committee 
under your leadership for the last three and a half years has 
been a great experience for me. Also because of your career, 
and especially the Navy part. We both had the opportunity to 
serve our Country in the U.S. Navy, the finest fighting force 
on earth, even ahead of the other ones here in the U.S., in my 
opinion.
    To have this opportunity to serve with you has been a great 
honor for me, and I want to thank you for your service to this 
Country.
    Senator Carper. Thank you, and give Gabby our best, please. 
Thank you very much.
    With that, I think we are ready. I want to call up 
Presidential Nomination No. 1987 for Matthew James Marzano of 
Illinois to be a Member of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission 
for a term of 5 years, expiring on June 30th, 2028. I move to 
approve and report the nomination favorably to the Senate. Is 
there a second?
    Senator Cardin. Second.
    Senator Carper. The Clerk will call the roll.
    The Clerk. Mr. Boozman?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Ms. Capito?
    Senator Capito. No.
    The Clerk. Mr. Cardin?
    Senator Cardin. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Cramer?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Fetterman?
    Senator Fetterman. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Graham?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Kelly?
    Senator Kelly. Aye.
    The Clerk. Ms. Lummis?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Markey?
    Senator Markey. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Merkley?
    Senator Merkley. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Mullin?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Padilla?
    Senator Padilla. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Ricketts?
    Senator Ricketts. No.
    The Clerk. Mr. Sanders?
    Senator Sanders. Aye.
    The Clerk. Ms. Stabenow?
    Senator Stabenow. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Sullivan?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Whitehouse?
    Senator Whitehouse. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Wicker?
    Senator Capito. No by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Chairman?
    Senator Carper. Aye.
    The Clerk. Sir, the ayes are 10, the nays are 9.
    Senator Carper. The nominee is favorably reported. I want 
to thank everyone for being here. I especially want to thank 
Senator Fetterman for changing his schedule, and thank you so 
much to everybody else. Senator Capito, you didn't have to be 
this cooperative. Thank you so much for being the wonderful 
colleague and partner that you have been for all these years.
    With that, that concludes the committee's votes for the 
business meeting today. I want to thank everyone for your 
participation.
    I will now recognize members who would like to speak on any 
other items on which we have voted or are about to vote today. 
Let me recognize again Senator Padilla. Thank you.
    Senator Padilla. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
    I just want to briefly join the chorus of our colleagues. I 
promise to be brief. I do want to join the chorus of our 
colleagues in thanking you for your service, for your 
leadership of this committee, and for your outreach to me when 
I first arrived in the Senate. You were not just one of the 
first members, but one of the first chairs of a committee I was 
appointed to serve on to reach out and say, how can I help you, 
how can we work together.
    I have always appreciated that. You reminded me of the 
impact that one of my predecessors, Senator Boxer, had on this 
very committee which she chaired once upon a time and was 
Ranking Member for a few years, the importance of California's 
voice on this committee. I thought I was the only one that you 
would share an occasional story of your time in the Navy with, 
your trips with your thumbs sticking out across America, your 
first visit with some of your friends here to Washington, DC. 
when they went out to meet women and you came to visit the 
Capitol and witness some of the committee proceedings. I 
thought those were exclusively shared with me, but clearly, you 
have enjoyed sharing some of that history and those experiences 
with those who also appreciate you.
    Every time you come to California, which you still do on a 
regular basis, your appreciation for my State, which has helped 
me advocate for some of the California issues with you, and 
with our colleagues here in committee. Among the things I am 
most appreciative of is how well you always welcomed and 
greeted my kids when they came to the Capitol. I shared with 
you some of the pictures from over the years, of your shaking 
their hands. You made a big impression on them, and for that I 
will always be grateful.
    Thank you, Mr. Chair.
    Senator Carper. When you talk to your kids later today or 
this weekend, please convey our thanks to them and your wife 
for sharing you with all of us.
    Senator Padilla. I appreciate that.
    Senator Carper. Barbara Boxer has said to me more than a 
few times that you are the most worthy successor to her, and 
she is right.
    Okay. Senator Capito, anything else?
    Senator Capito. No.
    Senator Carper. In closing, I want to thank our members for 
being here with all of us today. For some final housekeeping, I 
have three unanimous consent requests. First, I ask unanimous 
consent for members to submit their statements for the record 
on the items that we have considered today. Without objection.
    Second, I ask unanimous consent to submit for the record a 
number of letters of support for the nominee and resolution our 
committee approved today. Without objection, so ordered.
    Senator Carper. I also ask unanimous consent that the staff 
have authority to make technical and conforming changes to the 
resolutions approved today. Without objection, so ordered.
    [The referenced information follows:]
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    I want to thank everyone for your participation. Senator 
Capito, I especially thank you for your kindness and 
cooperation.
    With that, the business meeting is adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 10:15 a.m., the committee proceeded to other 
business.]
  

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