    [Senate Hearing 118-767]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                                                            S. Hrg. 118-767

                                BUSINESS MEETING

    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                                  COMMITTEE ON
                          ENVIRONMENT AND PUBLIC WORKS

                              UNITED STATES SENATE

                        ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                                 SECOND SESSION

                                   __________

                               NOVEMBER 20, 2024

                                   __________

      Printed for the use of the Committee on Environment and Public Works

    [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

            Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.govinfo.gov

                                    __________

                       U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
    62-614                  WASHINGTON : 2026

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                   COMMITTEE ON ENVIRONMENT AND PUBLIC WORKS

                        ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
                                 SECOND SESSION

                      THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware, Chairman
              SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West Virginia, Ranking Member

    BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, Maryland         KEVIN CRAMER, North Dakota
    BERNARD SANDERS, Vermont             CYNTHIA M. LUMMIS, Wyoming
    SHELDON WHITEHOUSE, Rhode Island     MARKWAYNE MULLIN, Oklahoma
    JEFF MERKLEY, Oregon                 PETE RICKETTS, Nebraska
    EDWARD J. MARKEY, Massachusetts      JOHN BOOZMAN, Arkansas
    DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan            ROGER WICKER, Mississippi
    MARK KELLY, Arizona                  DAN SULLIVAN, Alaska
    ALEX PADILLA, California             LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina
    JOHN FETTERMAN, Pennsylvania

                   Courtney Taylor, Democratic Staff Director
                   Adam Tomlinson, Republican Staff Director

                            C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                                  ----------
                                                                       Page

                               NOVEMBER 20, 2024
                               OPENING STATEMENTS

    Carper, Hon. Thomas R., U.S. Senator from the State of Delaware..     1
    Capito, Hon. Shelley Moore, U.S. Senator from the State of West
      Virginia.......................................................     2

                              ADDITIONAL MATERIAL

    Letter of support to Senator Carper for the nomination of Matthew
      Kaplan, of Maryland, to serve as Federal Co-Chairperson of the
      Great Lakes Authority from Senator Stabenow....................    10

                                  LEGISLATION

    PN1694, Nomination Reference and Report, Matthew Kaplan, of
      Maryland, to serve as Federal Co-Chairperson of the Great Lakes
      Authority......................................................    11
    PN1980, Nomination Reference and Report, Matthew James Marzano,
      of Illinois, to be a member of the Nuclear Regulatory
      Commission.....................................................    12
    Fifty-three Committee Resolutions to closely examine the needs of
      our Federal agencies in order to provide the adequate repairs,
      upgrades and modernizations while removing any excess waste in
      our Federal buildings portfolio................................    13

                                BUSINESS MEETING

                                  ----------

                          WEDNESDAY, NOVEMBER 20, 2024

                                           U.S. Senate,
                     Committee on Environment and Public Works,
                                                        Washington, DC.
        The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:50 a.m. in room
    406, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Thomas R. Carper
    (chairman of the committee) presiding.
        Present: Senators Carper, Capito, Cardin, Sanders,
    Whitehouse, Merkley, Markey, Stabenow, Kelly, Padilla,
    Fetterman, Mullin, Ricketts, Boozman.

              OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. THOMAS R. CARPER,
                U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF DELAWARE

        Senator Carper. Good morning, everyone. I am pleased to
    call this meeting to order this morning. I want to thank those
    who are already here, some of whom have changed their schedules
    dramatically to be here. Thank you so much. Others will be
    joining us shortly.
        Today, as you may recall, we will be considering a nominee
    for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, a nominee for the Great
    Lakes Authority, and a number of committee resolutions
    approving General Services Administration prospectuses.
        Before we do that, though, I want to take a moment to
    briefly discuss each of these items. First, we are going to
    consider the nomination of Matthew Marzano to serve as a Member
    of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. Matt understands the
    importance of deploying more safe and clean nuclear power. He
    has demonstrated his commitment to maintaining the public's
    trust and confidence in the Nuclear Regulatory Commission's
    work. He has extensive technical expertise gained over the
    course of a decade in the nuclear industry.
        Matt worked tirelessly with us, I think on both sides of
    the aisle, actually, with the Minority staff as well, in order
    to move the ADVANCE Act through the Senate and on to the
    President's desk which was signed into law a month or two ago.
        No other commissioner has the unique and credible and
    valuable set of credentials that Matt possesses. I strongly
    believe that he would be and will be, if confirmed, a
    tremendous asset to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission as it
    implements this critical bipartisan law which we all voted for.
        I believe, as do many of us here, that we are at a crucial
    moment for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and the future of
    nuclear energy. The Nuclear Regulatory Commission is most
    effective and efficient when it has a full slate of
    commissioners to carry out its mission and provide certainty to
    the industry.
        With all of this in mind, I am pleased to support Matt's
    nomination. I urge all of our colleagues to do the same.
        Second, the committee is considering the nomination of
    Matthew Kaplan to be the Federal Co-Chairperson of the Great
    Lakes Authority. The Great Lakes Authority will promote
    economic development, domestic manufacturing, and job creation
    while restoring and protecting the Great Lakes. It will provide
    grant funding to clean and review projects as well as water and
    broadband infrastructure projects.
        In March of this year, Congress appropriated funding for
    the Great Lakes Authority for the first time. Mr. Kaplan will
    be responsible for standing up this brand-new regional
    commission. I believe he is up for the challenge.
        Finally, we will consider a number of resolutions to
    approve General Services Administration prospectuses throughout
    our Country. It is our committee's responsibility to approve
    these prospectuses before Congress can approve funds for these
    projects. Members have had the opportunity to review these
    documents and I believe the resolutions are non-controversial.
        With that, I am pleased to recognize the Ranking Member,
    Senator Capito, for any remarks that she has this morning.

            OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO,
              U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA

        Senator Capito. Thank you, Chairman Carper, for holding
    this hearing, and thanks for the witnesses that are coming
    before us today. I am pleased that the business meeting on
    October 11th marked the 50th anniversary of the signing of the
    Energy Reorganization Act of 1974, and this landmark law was a
    turning a point in how our Nation approached nuclear safety
    issues.
        Establishing the NRC, Congress preserved the Atomic Energy
    Commission's basic structure: five commissioners sharing equal
    responsibility to oversee the civilian use of nuclear power and
    radioactive materials. This five-member commission structure
    has served this Country well. Each member contributes through
    their diverse background and experience. Previous nominees to
    serve as NRC commissioners have had exemplary careers leading
    large organizations in the legal field, deep policy
    backgrounds, or impressive scientific and technical
    credentials, each diverse perspective making the value of the
    commission greater than the sum of each member.
        The commissioners are responsible for leading the
    organization, making regulatory decisions, and setting policy.
    Given the crossroads that the NRC is facing and the nuclear
    industry and Congress' clear interest in changing the agency's
    culture from the status quo, it is imperative that we take into
    consideration the breadth and depth of this nominee's
    background. I believe that the White House has sort of
    exaggerated Mr. Marzano's experience in the nuclear energy
    industry, although I do recognize his training and time working
    at a power plant. As I stated as his confirmation hearing,
    demonstrating a capacity to follow procedures is fundamentally
    different than a commissioner's role in setting policy,
    promulgating regulations, and adjudicating significant legal
    issues.
        We must consider the totality of Mr. Marzano's background
    and depth of his experience, particularly at this moment of
    tremendous importance.
        The overwhelming passage of the ADVANCE Act was a clear
    message from Congress that the NRC, with the leadership,
    support and direction of commission can and should do better to
    enable the safe use of nuclear technologies. Despite this clear
    direction, Chair Hanson has stated that he views the ADVANCE
    Act as an endorsement of the work that the agency is already
    doing, communicating his position to the staff, the NRC
    licensees and applicants, and to Congress, that the status quo
    is acceptable.
        It appears that the NRC staff has followed the
    commissioner's lead. The NRC staff's recommendation to update
    the agency's mission statement as the ADVANCE Act requires the
    commission to do rationalized really doing just the bare
    minimum to comply with the law. Those recommendations missed
    the mark, and I expect the entire commission will unanimously
    support a more ambitious mission statement than the lackluster
    staff paper. The ADVANCE Act was not an endorsement of the
    status quo.
        After considering Mr. Marzano's responses to my questions
    for the record, I do not have confidence that he has the
    necessary background and experience to be that agent of change
    at the commission, or to set the commission up for the agency's
    next 50 years as Congress just envisioned in the ADVANCE Act. I
    will be voting no on Mr. Marzano's nomination.
        As Congress continues to consider the candidates for this
    vacancy, the commission must continue to work efficiently.
        As the Chairman mentioned, we have 53 resolutions, GSA
    resolutions before us. I ask my colleagues to support these.
    There is one in there for West Virginia, a prospectus for
    repairs and alterations to the IRS Enterprise Computing Center
    in Martinsburg, West Virginia. The approval of this prospectus
    will allow for much-needed improvements to the roofing system
    and other upgrades necessary for the building's continued
    operations. We certainly do not want anybody's tax return to
    get lost or missed or changed because we have not modernized
    our IRS computing system.
        I also will be supporting Matthew Kaplan to be the Federal
    Co-Chairperson of the Great Lakes Authority. I have heard very
    positive feedback on him. Thank you, and I yield back to the
    Chair.
        Senator Carper. Senator Capito, thank you for those words.
    Thanks for working with us, you and your team, working with us
    and getting us ready for what is going to be a busy and a full
    day.
        I believe we have a voting quorum present. As we proceed, I
    would ask Senators to please hold your statements until after
    the voting is completed.
        I now call up Presidential Nomination 1694 for Matthew
    Kaplan of Maryland to be Federal Co-Chairman of the Great Lakes
    Authority. I vote to approve and report the nomination
    favorably to the Senate. All in favor, say aye.
        [Chorus of ayes.]
        Senator Carper. All opposed, say nay.
        [No audible response.]
        Senator Carper. In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have
    it. The nominee is favorably reported. I note for the record
    that a quorum of the committee is present.
        I call up no and move to approve en bloc the 53 committee
    resolutions for the prospectuses listed in the notice for this
    business meeting. All in favor, say aye.
        [Chorus of ayes.]
        Senator Carper. All opposed, say nay.
        [No audible response.]
        Senator Carper. In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have
    it. These resolutions are approved.
        Senator Padilla, thank you for joining us today. You are
    recognized for your remarks, please.
        Senator Padilla. Thank you, Mr. Chair, colleagues. I just
    want to take a moment to register some disappointment that my
    bipartisan, bicameral Wildlife Corridors bill with Senators
    Hoeven and Congressman Zinke were not included in today's
    markup, despite the overwhelming support from the wildlife
    conservation community and the sportsmen's and hunting groups
    in a number of States.
        It was almost exactly a year ago that we held a
    subcommittee hearing to receive testimony from wildlife experts
    on the challenges and solutions to facilitating wildlife
    migration. We heard overwhelming support for codifying a Trump-
    era secretarial order on wildlife movement, which is what my
    bill would effectively do.
        Together, we worked with private landowners, State wildlife
    agencies and sportsmen's groups and crafted a bill that would
    build off the success of that secretarial order and further
    encourage voluntary efforts--let me emphasize voluntary
    efforts--to support wildlife movement, particularly for big
    game species. Earlier this year, Representative Zinke, who
    sponsored the companion bill in the House, and issued the
    secretarial order when he was Interior Secretary during the
    Trump Administration provided compelling testimony for the bill
    during a House Natural Resources Committee hearing, where it
    received bipartisan praise.
        This bill remains a high priority for prominent sportsmen's
    and wildlife groups, such as Back Country Hunters and Anglers,
    the Boone and Crockett Club, the congressional Sportsmen's
    Foundation, and the Theodore Roosevelt Conservation
    Partnership, as well as the Association of Fish and Wildlife
    Agencies, which represents our State wildlife agencies.
        I have tried to negotiate in good faith and to be very
    accommodating to my colleagues on the other side of the dais. I
    have to say, though, Mr. Chairman, it was a little frustrating
    that we could not get a final yes and a final agreement on
    language.
        I raise this in hopes that in the coming weeks we can
    continue our efforts across the aisle. I ask that my colleagues
    across the aisle continue to work with me in good faith to
    advance this common sense bipartisan bill. There is still time.
        Senator Carper. Thank you, Senator Padilla. Thank you very
    much for those comments.
        Senator Cardin, you are recognized, please.
        Senator Cardin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As you were
    approving the nominee on the Great Lakes, it just reminds me of
    the work of this committee, and being so proud to be on this
    committee. You and I are in our last couple of weeks on the
    Environment and Public Works Committee.
        Senator Carper. I do not know about you, Ben, but almost
    every day, even on the train coming down today, people say, how
    do you like being retired?
        [Laughter.]
        Senator Carper. I say, well, if you want to know the truth,
    I am not. If you looked at my schedule today, you would say,
    well, he should be paid overtime. It is a very full day, as my
    colleagues know.
        Senator Cardin. Right. I do not think we envisioned, when
    we made our announcements that we were not seeking re-election,
    that we would have such a busy end to our term.
        Senator Carper. Do you find that people are just being
    incredibly kind to you?
        Senator Cardin. Yes, people who have never voted for me
    tell me that they like me.
        Senator Carper. If I had known people were going to be this
    nice to me, I would have quit a lot sooner.
        [Laughter.]
        Senator Cardin. I do not know if I agree with that
    statement. I just really wanted to compliment our Chair and
    Ranking Member. It is helpful to have the Chair and Ranking
    Member in the Chesapeake Bay watershed. I just marvel at the
    way we have been able to work together in a bipartisan manner
    in this committee.
        I know there are days we have some differences, but by and
    large we have worked as a team. I think about the Water
    Resources Development Act, I think about so many bills that
    have moved through this committee that are now the law of the
    land that have benefited all our States in a way that is
    consistent with the mission of this committee.
        I just really wanted to take a moment, if I might, to thank
    Senator Carper and Senator Capito. You have continued the great
    tradition of this committee.
        I sought to get on this committee my first year in the U.S.
    Senate. It is a committee I asked to serve on. It is a
    committee that I have been very proud to be a part of. I can
    name a lot of different aspects that we have been able to move
    forward, and I think the legacy of this committee is
    tremendous.
        It has been an honor to serve on this committee.
    Congratulations to our two leaders.
        Senator Carper. Thank you for those kind words. It is an
    honor to be here. We sit next to each other on two committees,
    and he is my neighbor right across the Bay. What an honor.
    Thank you, Ben.
        Senator Markey. Mr. Chairman?
        Senator Carper. My friend from Massachusetts.
        Senator Markey. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Mr. Chairman, you and I met 42 years ago.
        Senator Carper. We were in kindergarten, I think.
        [Laughter.]
        Senator Markey. You were a young man, a freshman
    Congressman. At that point I was in my fourth term in Congress,
    42 years ago. I always felt that he was one of the most
    talented young people that I had ever met in politics.
        I invited then-young Congressman Tom Carper to go with me
    on a congressional delegation that I had organized down to
    Nicaragua and El Salvador. I was also taking with me Ted
    Sorensen, who had been the advisor for President Kennedy during
    the Cuban Missile Crisis, and Stansfield Turner, who had been
    Jimmy Carter's head of the CIA, who had been his expert,
    President Carter's expert on Cuba and Latin American affairs as
    well.
        It was at the height of the battle between the Sandinistas
    and the Somocistas in Nicaragua. It was also at a point where
    the war in El Salvador was at a peak. We were unfortunately
    financing the generals, who were in control of the death squads
    in El Salvador.
        It was helpful for me, because I had Ted Sorensen and
    Stansfield Turner with me to give me their insights, but also
    to be talking to President Duarte in El Salvador and
    unbelievably, still true, new President Ortega. He had just
    taken over in Nicaragua.
        These two leaders, along with Tom Carper, were just so
    helpful at having a meaningful congressional delegation going
    to that region, which was troubled. To a certain extent, we
    still see the results of those wars in the migration patterns
    and even in the governmental structures in those countries.
        That is where my friendship with Senator Carper began, and
    my admiration for him is undiminished over the years, including
    the passage of historic legislation under his leadership of
    this committee, which is going to make a mark on our Country
    for decades to come.
        I thank you, Mr. Chairman, for your great leadership and
    for your friendship over all of these years.
        Senator Carper. Thank you. I would just say, the people
    say, what do you most remember from those, I remember riding in
    the CIA helicopters into contra camps right along the border
    with Nicaragua and El Salvador. It was a very, very tender
    moment for our Country and that part of the world.
        One of the reasons, and there is a connection here with
    what we are talking about here today, we need a full complement
    on the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. We need for the NRC to be
    able to do their job, continue to do their job, especially with
    a focus on safety.
        I was a Navy midshipman, spent a lot of years in the Navy,
    so has Senator Kelly. I believe that nuclear energy is not the
    whole answer, but it is a big part of the answer. If we are
    serious about addressing climate change and global warming,
    nuclear has to be a part of it. It has to be safe. It has to be
    safe. If we screw it up, if we mess it up, then heaven help us
    with respect to actually addressing climate change.
        If we want to make sure that the folks from Honduras and
    Nicaragua those countries who want to stay there where they can
    actually raise crops and not have to worry about the weather
    and drought, there is actually a connection here.
        Senator Kelly, please.
        Senator Kelly. Mr. Chairman, thank you. I certainly want to
    associate myself with the remarks of Senator Markey and thank
    you for your service. I do not know if you remember when we
    first met or what the circumstances were. I do. For some
    reason, this young Congresswoman from Arizona, after being
    elected, decided to strike up a friendship with you. My wife
    Gabby looked at you as a mentor in the Senate.
        Senator Carper. More like a grandfather.
        [Laughter.]
        Senator Kelly. Yes, grandfather, a grandfather in the
    Senate for her. She has always been incredibly fond of you.
    Then for me to have the opportunity to serve on this committee
    under your leadership for the last three and a half years has
    been a great experience for me. Also because of your career,
    and especially the Navy part. We both had the opportunity to
    serve our Country in the U.S. Navy, the finest fighting force
    on earth, even ahead of the other ones here in the U.S., in my
    opinion.
        To have this opportunity to serve with you has been a great
    honor for me, and I want to thank you for your service to this
    Country.
        Senator Carper. Thank you, and give Gabby our best, please.
    Thank you very much.
        With that, I think we are ready. I want to call up
    Presidential Nomination No. 1987 for Matthew James Marzano of
    Illinois to be a Member of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission
    for a term of 5 years, expiring on June 30th, 2028. I move to
    approve and report the nomination favorably to the Senate. Is
    there a second?
        Senator Cardin. Second.
        Senator Carper. The Clerk will call the roll.
        The Clerk. Mr. Boozman?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Ms. Capito?
        Senator Capito. No.
        The Clerk. Mr. Cardin?
        Senator Cardin. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Cramer?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Mr. Fetterman?
        Senator Fetterman. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Graham?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Mr. Kelly?
        Senator Kelly. Aye.
        The Clerk. Ms. Lummis?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Mr. Markey?
        Senator Markey. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Merkley?
        Senator Merkley. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Mullin?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Mr. Padilla?
        Senator Padilla. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Ricketts?
        Senator Ricketts. No.
        The Clerk. Mr. Sanders?
        Senator Sanders. Aye.
        The Clerk. Ms. Stabenow?
        Senator Stabenow. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Sullivan?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Mr. Whitehouse?
        Senator Whitehouse. Aye.
        The Clerk. Mr. Wicker?
        Senator Capito. No by proxy.
        The Clerk. Mr. Chairman?
        Senator Carper. Aye.
        The Clerk. Sir, the ayes are 10, the nays are 9.
        Senator Carper. The nominee is favorably reported. I want
    to thank everyone for being here. I especially want to thank
    Senator Fetterman for changing his schedule, and thank you so
    much to everybody else. Senator Capito, you didn't have to be
    this cooperative. Thank you so much for being the wonderful
    colleague and partner that you have been for all these years.
        With that, that concludes the committee's votes for the
    business meeting today. I want to thank everyone for your
    participation.
        I will now recognize members who would like to speak on any
    other items on which we have voted or are about to vote today.
    Let me recognize again Senator Padilla. Thank you.
        Senator Padilla. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
        I just want to briefly join the chorus of our colleagues. I
    promise to be brief. I do want to join the chorus of our
    colleagues in thanking you for your service, for your
    leadership of this committee, and for your outreach to me when
    I first arrived in the Senate. You were not just one of the
    first members, but one of the first chairs of a committee I was
    appointed to serve on to reach out and say, how can I help you,
    how can we work together.
        I have always appreciated that. You reminded me of the
    impact that one of my predecessors, Senator Boxer, had on this
    very committee which she chaired once upon a time and was
    Ranking Member for a few years, the importance of California's
    voice on this committee. I thought I was the only one that you
    would share an occasional story of your time in the Navy with,
    your trips with your thumbs sticking out across America, your
    first visit with some of your friends here to Washington, DC.
    when they went out to meet women and you came to visit the
    Capitol and witness some of the committee proceedings. I
    thought those were exclusively shared with me, but clearly, you
    have enjoyed sharing some of that history and those experiences
    with those who also appreciate you.
        Every time you come to California, which you still do on a
    regular basis, your appreciation for my State, which has helped
    me advocate for some of the California issues with you, and
    with our colleagues here in committee. Among the things I am
    most appreciative of is how well you always welcomed and
    greeted my kids when they came to the Capitol. I shared with
    you some of the pictures from over the years, of your shaking
    their hands. You made a big impression on them, and for that I
    will always be grateful.
        Thank you, Mr. Chair.
        Senator Carper. When you talk to your kids later today or
    this weekend, please convey our thanks to them and your wife
    for sharing you with all of us.
        Senator Padilla. I appreciate that.
        Senator Carper. Barbara Boxer has said to me more than a
    few times that you are the most worthy successor to her, and
    she is right.
        Okay. Senator Capito, anything else?
        Senator Capito. No.
        Senator Carper. In closing, I want to thank our members for
    being here with all of us today. For some final housekeeping, I
    have three unanimous consent requests. First, I ask unanimous
    consent for members to submit their statements for the record
    on the items that we have considered today. Without objection.
        Second, I ask unanimous consent to submit for the record a
    number of letters of support for the nominee and resolution our
    committee approved today. Without objection, so ordered.
        Senator Carper. I also ask unanimous consent that the staff
    have authority to make technical and conforming changes to the
    resolutions approved today. Without objection, so ordered.
        [The referenced information follows:]
        [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        I want to thank everyone for your participation. Senator
    Capito, I especially thank you for your kindness and
    cooperation.
        With that, the business meeting is adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 10:15 a.m., the committee proceeded to other
    business.]

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