[Senate Hearing 118-689]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
S. Hrg. 118-689
HOLDING RUSSIAN KLEPTOCRATS
AND HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATORS
ACCOUNTABLE FOR THEIR
CRIMES AGAINST UKRAINE
=======================================================================
HEARING
before the
COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
APRIL 19, 2023
__________
Serial No. J-118-12
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
www.judiciary.senate.gov
www.govinfo.gov
______
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
60-848 WASHINGTON : 2025
COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois, Chair
SHELDON WHITEHOUSE, Rhode Island LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina,
AMY KLOBUCHAR, Minnesota Ranking Member
CHRISTOPHER A. COONS, Delaware CHARLES E. GRASSLEY, Iowa
RICHARD BLUMENTHAL, Connecticut JOHN CORNYN, Texas
MAZIE K. HIRONO, Hawaii MICHAEL S. LEE, Utah
CORY A. BOOKER, New Jersey TED CRUZ, Texas
ALEX PADILLA, California JOSH HAWLEY, Missouri
JON OSSOFF, Georgia TOM COTTON, Arkansas
PETER WELCH, Vermont JOHN KENNEDY, Louisiana
LAPHONZA BUTLER, California THOM TILLIS, North Carolina
MARSHA BLACKBURN, Tennessee
Joseph Zogby, Chief Counsel and Staff Director
Katherine Nikas, Republican Chief Counsel and Staff Director
C O N T E N T S
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OPENING STATEMENTS
Page
Durbin, Hon. Richard J........................................... 1
Graham, Hon. Lindsey O........................................... 3
WITNESS
Monaco, Hon. Lisa O.............................................. 5
Prepared statement........................................... 43
Responses to written questions............................... 55
APPENDIX
Items submitted for the record................................... 87
HOLDING RUSSIAN KLEPTOCRATS
AND HUMAN RIGHTS VIOLATORS
ACCOUNTABLE FOR THEIR
CRIMES AGAINST UKRAINE
----------
Wednesday, April 19, 2023
United States Senate,
Committee on the Judiciary,
Washington, DC.
The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10 a.m., in Room
216, Hart Senate Office Building, Hon. Richard J. Durbin, Chair
of the Committee, presiding.
Present: Senators Durbin [presiding], Whitehouse,
Klobuchar, Blumenthal, Hirono, Padilla, Ossoff, Welch, Graham,
Grassley, Cornyn, Lee, Cruz, Hawley, Cotton, Tillis, and
Blackburn.
OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. RICHARD J. DURBIN,
A U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF ILLINOIS
Chair Durbin. This meeting of the Senate Judiciary
Committee will come to order.
More than a year ago, Vladimir Putin unleashed his unlawful
war of aggression against Ukraine. During that year, the world
has watched with horror as Russian forces have engaged in
rampant, systematic war crimes and crimes against humanity:
bombing schools, hospitals, homes, churches; shooting unarmed
men and women and children in the streets; going house to
house, raping and torturing those who live there.
Last week brought fresh horror as a video surfaced online,
appearing to show a Russian soldier mercilessly beheading a
Ukrainian prisoner of war, cutting his head off with a knife
while he was still alive.
Responding to that video, Ukrainian President Zelensky
called on the world to act, and to act now. To President
Zelensky, and to all Ukrainians fighting for their survival,
for global peace and freedom, let me start by saying this: This
Committee stands with you. We support you.
We are compiling evidence of war crimes even as the war
unfolds. Yesterday, Senator Graham and I met with the
prosecutor general from Ukraine. In real time, in horrid
detail, he is compiling evidence of these crimes. And we must
not rest until the perpetrators of more than 77,000 war crimes
that have been documented to date in Bucha, Izium, and beyond
are held to account.
Before we proceed, I'd like to share a video, a few
minutes, to understand what the people of Ukraine have been
enduring since February of last year.
[Video is shown.]
Chair Durbin. Last fall, this Committee held a hearing on
the importance of defending an American legacy that began with
the Nuremberg trials in 1945, bringing war criminals and
perpetrators of crimes against humanity to justice.
Sadly, in more recent decades, our Nation has not always
lived up to this legacy. As a result of glaring gaps in our own
criminal law, many human rights violators have evaded justice.
Some have even, shockingly, found safe haven on American soil.
But since Putin's invasion began, lawmakers on both sides
of the aisle have recognized that Russia's aggression is not
just against Ukraine but against the entire free world. That's
why, since day one of this war, Congress has provided
unwavering support to Ukraine: munitions, tanks, intelligence,
and more to support the rule of law.
During President Zelensky's historic visit to Washington in
December, the Senate passed the Justice for Victims of War
Crimes Act with unanimous support. Thanks to this law, war
criminals who come to our shores, from Russia or from anywhere
else, will no longer find refuge in the United States.
I want to thank Senators Grassley, Graham, Coons, and
Tillis, and many others, for joining me in introducing this
measure. Together, we've sent a clear message to our allies and
our adversaries: America will keep the promise we made at
Nuremberg to defend human rights and the rule of law.
But our work is far from finished. Yesterday, Ranking
Member Graham and I hosted a meeting for Committee Members with
Prosecutor General Kostin. His team has gathered evidence,
painstakingly put the effort together, risking their own lives
to exhume bodies from mass graves and sift through the rubble
of flattened schools and hospitals.
Here in America, we need to do our part to support these
investigations and to address any remaining gaps in the law
that enable impunity. To that end, we must finally--finally
enact a crime against humanity statute. I urge my colleagues on
both sides of the aisle to join me in closing this gap in the
law.
And we need to lead our allies in forming a special
tribunal to hold Russia's leadership accountable. We must also
ensure that the world's preeminent law enforcement agency, the
United States Department of Justice, deploys every resource at
its disposal to hold Putin and those who enable him
accountable.
Today, we'll have a chance to hear directly from the
Justice Department leadership and learn more about how they're
keeping up the pressure on Russia.
At this very moment, heroic Ukrainians are risking life and
limb to defend the same freedoms and values that America is
founded on. In their struggle, we see our own history, as well
as our highest aspirations: service, sacrifice, selflessness.
It's now our turn to live up to those values.
With that, I turn to Ranking Member Graham.
OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. LINDSEY O. GRAHAM,
A U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA
Senator Graham. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman.
We have enjoyed bipartisan support since the invasion. I
hope that continues. I believe it will. Just sort of an
observation: When all this is said and done, if Putin is still
standing and is not held accountable for the barbaric invasion
of Ukraine under his watch, then you're going to get more of
this, not less. If Putin's given a pass, then everything we've
talked about since the end of World War II to make sure that
never happens again becomes all talk.
This is a moment of testing for the international order. It
is an opportunity for us to reassert who we are and what we
believe. In that regard, this Committee can lend its voice. We
can change our laws, and we can help the Ukrainians in many
ways without putting American boots on the ground.
So, I want to compliment the Department of Justice for
taking an aggressive approach to seizing Russian assets in the
hands of oligarchs who support Putin and transferring that
money to the Ukrainian people. We've been able to accomplish,
in a bipartisan manner, a change in U.S. law.
While we're not members of the International Criminal
Court, we have made a change to allow U.S. intelligence to be
shared with the ICC to help prosecute Russian war criminals in
Ukraine. That does not in any way jeopardize our soldiers. It's
a very narrow change to the law. And Prosecutor Khan of the ICC
said he believes it would be a game changer in his ability to
bring justice against Russian war criminals.
The Department of Justice has been great. The Department of
Defense has been terrible. I have called more than once to try
to get an accounting of what's going on with the Task Force--
and the White House, and I get the same answer every time.
The reservations of the Department of Defense are holding
back the transfer of information that would be vital to
allowing the ICC to be more aggressive in their prosecutions.
If you get nothing else out of this hearing, I am tired of
that, and I think there's a bipartisan support for the idea
that the law we pass should be honored.
I've been a military lawyer for most of my adult life. We
have done nothing to jeopardize or put in motion jurisdiction
of American troops by ICC. Nothing at all. We have made a
decision as a nation to help the ICC prosecute one of the most
brutal invasions of the 21st century--may I say, in modern
history.
We also passed a law, Mr. Chairman, to allow a
KleptoCapture Task Force to be created, seizing assets from
Russian oligarchs and, along with Senator Whitehouse and
everybody in the Senate, those proceeds can be transferred to
Ukraine to help them stabilize their country.
Over a half a million dollars has been seized as a result
of Ms. Monaco and her team's work: a $90 million yacht called
the Tango; another one, $300 million, called Amadea; $100
million in real estate assets; two condos in Beverly Hills;
three luxury properties in New York and DC; an apartment on
Park Avenue in New York City; a $45 million Boeing 737 owned by
a Russian energy company; two airplanes worth over $400 million
owned by Russian oligarchs; $90 million Airbus. The list goes
on and on and on.
So, I want to applaud you. Go after their assets, follow
them to the ends of the earth, take their ill-gotten gain, and
give it to the long-suffering Ukrainian people.
I'll wrap this up very quickly. The hope here is that we
can give the Department of Justice and the Ukrainian prosecutor
all the assets they need--reasonably need, to keep the front in
the courtroom open.
We have a front on the battlefield where Ukrainians are
fighting and dying for their freedom.
I think it is in Americans' interest to make sure that
Putin, who now has an arrest warrant issued by the ICC for his
war crimes--that we do not forgive and forget, as a nation, and
we help the international community.
With that, the State Department has been reluctant--dare
say I, refused to designate Russia a state sponsor of
terrorism. What more do they have to do to become a terrorist
state under U.S. law?
Mr. Chairman, the Senate, 100-to-nothing, urged the
Department of State to designate Russia a state sponsor of
terrorism under U.S. law.
As the offensive begins this spring on the battlefield in
Ukraine to evict the Russian invaders, I hope we can find
momentum among ourselves here in Washington to label Russia as
a state sponsor of terrorism, because with that designation,
they become even more radioactive.
It's just a matter of time till China tests us. I think
China is very seriously considering providing lethal aid to
Russia. And if they do, I would like them to run into the
sanctions that would come from helping a state sponsor of
terrorism.
We have a chance to deter China by designating Russia a
state sponsor of terrorism. I want to do that now, sooner
rather than later, to avoid the mistakes of the preinvasion,
where we sent the wrong signals to the Russians.
I don't want to send the wrong signal to the Chinese. I
want China to know under U.S. law Russia is a state sponsor of
terrorism, and you help them at their own peril. Thank you.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Graham.
Today we welcome Deputy Attorney General Lisa Monaco. Ms.
Monaco is the 39th Deputy Attorney General of the United
States. As the Deputy, she is the Department's second-ranking
official, responsible for overall supervision.
After we swear her in, she'll have 5 minutes to provide an
opening statement. Then each Senator will have 5 minutes each
to ask questions, and I urge my colleagues on both sides to
focus their questions on the topic of our hearing.
Could the witness please stand to be sworn? Could you
please raise your right hand?
[Witness is sworn in.]
Chair Durbin. Let the record reflect that she answered in
the affirmative. Now, Ms. Monaco, you are invited to proceed
with your opening statement.
STATEMENT OF HON. LISA O. MONACO, DEPUTY ATTORNEY GENERAL, U.S.
DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, WASHINGTON, DC
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you very much, Mr.
Chairman, and Ranking Member Graham, and Members of the
Committee.
I am honored to appear before you today to discuss how the
Justice Department is working to hold Russia accountable for
its brutal and unprovoked invasion in Ukraine.
I want to thank the Members of the Committee for their
bipartisan leadership and support of the administration's
response to Russian aggression.
The Department of Justice welcomes the opportunity to work
with the Committee on additional authorities, including
conferring Federal criminal jurisdiction over certain crimes
against humanity, increasing the range of assets that we can
seize and transfer for the rebuilding of Ukraine, and expanding
the Department's authority to prosecute acts of torture
committed against U.S. nationals abroad. These additional tools
will strengthen our response.
Before I begin, Mr. Chairman, I want to recognize that
today marks the 28 years since the Oklahoma City bombing, 35
years since the deadly siege at Waco. And just earlier this
week, we recognized the 10th anniversary of the Boston Marathon
bombing. We remember and honor the innocent lives lost, and we
also are reminded, when we think about these tragic events, of
why each of us swore an oath to protect this country and the
freedoms for which it stands. I'm mindful of that oath when I
appear before this Committee.
Two years ago, as a nominee, I pledged to protect our
national security and uphold the democratic and rule-of-law
values that define us as Americans. Those values, and the
Justice Department's mission to uphold them, are what bring me
back before this Committee today.
For over a year now, Russia has deliberately and
unilaterally inflicted horror upon Ukrainians. Its brutal,
unprovoked, and unlawful invasion of Ukraine poses a serious
threat to global peace and stability. Its forces have targeted
and viciously attacked civilians by bombing hospitals and
apartment buildings; by committing sexual violence against
women, men, and children, including girls who the United
Nations estimates could be as young as 4 years old; by carrying
out execution-style murders, including of children; and by
illegally removing thousands of Ukrainian children to Russia or
Russian-occupied territory.
The facts, Mr. Chairman, are clear. Russia has committed
war crimes and crimes against humanity in Ukraine. We cannot,
we will not, let war criminals escape accountability for the
aggression and atrocities they have committed.
The Justice Department has a clear message for those who
have committed these crimes and who think they can get away
with it: You will face justice. Our long history of holding
Nazis and terrorists accountable shows that the women and men
of the Justice Department never forget and never give up in the
pursuit of justice.
I was reminded of this resolve in February when I traveled
to Nuremberg, Germany, to visit the courtroom where the United
States and Allied partners prosecuted Nazi leaders for the
atrocities they committed in World War II. Through principled
adherence to the rule of law, former Attorney General Robert
Jackson and other prosecutors sought justice and accountability
on behalf of millions of victims.
Today, this Justice Department and our partners around the
world are answering history's call. Using every tool at our
disposal, we are committed to holding the perpetrators and
enablers of these atrocities accountable, no matter how long it
takes.
We're working closely with our Ukrainian partners, and on
Monday, the Attorney General and I met with Ukrainian
Prosecutor General Kostin to discuss our work together to
investigate Russian aggression and war crimes and to hold
accountable all those responsible.
Every day since February 24th, 2022, the men and women of
the Justice Department have responded to Russian aggression by
pursuing accountability for war crimes, striking back against
malign cyber activity, and by using every available tool to
limit Russia's access to the global financial system and
degrade its ability to fuel its war machine.
In that time, we have restrained over $500 million--that's
half a billion dollars in assets of Russian oligarchs and
others who unlawfully support the Russian regime and evade U.S.
economic countermeasures.
We've indicted over 30 individuals accused of sanctions
evasion, export control violations, money laundering, and other
crimes. And we've arrested defendants in over half a dozen
countries around the globe.
We are grateful for the tools that Congress--and this
Committee, in particular--has provided to the Department to
hold Russia accountable. And we look forward to working
together to expand those tools to close loopholes and to stay
one step ahead of those who would try to escape justice. Thank
you, and I look forward to the Committee's questions.
[The prepared statement of Deputy Attorney General Monaco
appears as a submission for the record.]
Chair Durbin. Thank you very much.
In addition to the critical investigations and prosecutions
that are ongoing in domestic courts, the International Criminal
Court has a key role to play in ensuring accountability. The
ICC has already issued an arrest warrant for Vladimir Putin for
the war crime of forcibly transferring Ukrainian children into
Russia. The Court continues to investigate other war crimes and
crimes against humanity in Ukraine.
Senior administration officials, yourself, and the Attorney
General have repeatedly expressed support for the ICC's Ukraine
investigation.
Congress has made its support clear, as well, by passing
provisions last Congress, that Senator Graham alluded to, on a
bipartisan basis that provide the executive branch with greater
flexibility to provide evidence and other forms of support to
the Court in relation to Ukraine. Yet, I understand that the
administration still has not provided this assistance because
of objections by the Department of Defense.
As I hear the reports of Russian soldiers beheading
Ukrainian prisoners, raping 4-year-old girls, I am stunned to
hear that this is still being debated in Washington. There is
simply no debate about the right and moral course of action at
this moment. That is why Ranking Member Graham and I led a
bipartisan letter to President Biden last month urging him to
be on the right side of history.
I ask you this: Is the Biden administration and all the
Departments of this Government united in this effort?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, first of all, let
me say we are absolutely united in ensuring there is
accountability for the atrocities that you've laid out, that
this video laid out, and I talked about in my opening
statement. There must be accountability for all of those
responsible.
And we are grateful for the work that this Congress did in
passing the law that Ranking Member Graham and you have
referenced, that provides a narrow ability and a clear ability
for the United States to provide assistance to the ICC for
investigations of foreign nationals arising from the situation
in Ukraine.
The discussions about how to use that authority are, as you
noted, ongoing. But there is absolute unanimity in ensuring
accountability across this Government and using all of the
tools that we can bring to bear, to bring about accountability.
Chair Durbin. You know that the debate on the United States
and its relationship with the International Court has been
long-standing and heated and sometimes emotional. That's why
we've tried to take steps to say that we can cooperate by
providing evidence and support with the ICC without
compromising our position as to membership. Do you have any
doubt in your mind that we have sufficient legal protection to
proceed with cooperating at this level?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I don't, Senator. And this
is why we're very grateful for the work we were able to do with
you and your staffs in formulating the statute that you've
referenced, that the Congress passed late last year, to provide
this cabined, narrow ability for us, as a Government, to
provide assistance to the ICC in this limited circumstances
where it's of investigations of foreign nationals arising from
the situation in Ukraine. And we were grateful to be able to
work with you to provide that narrow capability.
Chair Durbin. So you have established, in your answers to
these two questions: First, that this administration is bound
and determined to help in any effort to prosecute war crimes
against Vladimir Putin, and second, that doing so will not
compromise our Government, or our military, or a branch of our
Government and can be done under existing law. Is that a fair
conclusion?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I think that's a fair
conclusion, Senator. I know there's also some historical
precedent for our being able to provide assistance to the ICC
in very targeted ways with respect to prior proceedings. So,
again, I think the statute and the way the Congress approached
this--and again, we were grateful to be able to work with the
staff on having this ability be cabined in the way that I've
described.
Chair Durbin. Well, I'm going to conclude by asking my
colleague if we could join in another effort, perhaps a letter
to the Department of Defense, specifically, and to the
President, based on what the testimony has brought forth this
morning. I now yield to Senator Graham.
Senator Graham. Thank you. Just to put a fine point on
this, is it DOD? Is it--are they the problem?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, as I
indicated, I think the discussions about how to use the
authority----
Senator Graham. No.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. That
Congress----
Senator Graham. No.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Has given----
Senator Graham. Nope, nope, nope, nope. You're going to
answer this question. Is DOD the problem?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I really don't think,
Senator, respectfully, it's appropriate for me to comment on
internal discussions.
Senator Graham. We have a law on the books. I've been told
by people who care that the intel is not flowing, as Senator
Durbin described, because of the Department of Defense. I think
you need to answer that question.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, what I could
tell you is I'm aware of long-standing concerns, based on prior
positions that I've held, that the Department of Defense----
Senator Graham. I share----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Has raised.
Senator Graham [continuing]. Senator Durbin's view that
we've done this the right way. I understand his historical
precedent. We're not jeopardizing any American soldier.
We're talking about evidence involving foreign nationals in
a specific theater of operation. Every law we've passed has
been completely bipartisan. We're 400 and some days into this
war and I'm going to ask you again, is the Department of
Defense the holdup?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, I know the
Department of Defense has had long-standing concerns about our
engagement. The Department----
Senator Graham. I don't care what their concerns are. They
can share them with me. We've got a law on the books. Do you
feel like you need to follow the law when you're told to do it?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, Senator.
Senator Graham. Okay, so we'll take this up with the
Department of Defense. Do you believe that China is watching
what's happening in Russia and Ukraine?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, Senator. I do.
Senator Graham. Okay. There's reports that China may be
considering providing lethal aid to Russia. Have you seen those
public reports?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I've seen public reports in
that regard, Senator.
Senator Graham. Don't you think we should do everything we
can to deter China from helping Russia with their barbaric
invasion of Ukraine?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. There is no doubt that
rogue nations of the world, including China, are watching and
learning from what is going on.
And as I laid out in my opening comments, and as both the
Chairman and you, Mr. Ranking Member, have laid out, what
Russia is doing in Ukraine poses a threat to global peace,
global stability, precisely because if it goes unchecked, if
there is not accountability, there is no deterrent. There will
not be--there will be license for that type of unlawful
aggression. And----
Senator Graham. Well----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. We have to
make sure that that price is quite steep.
Senator Graham. To those of us on this side who object to
defunding the police, I think you're right to do so. When you
give the streets to the crooks, you're going to get more crime.
So, I would say that when you allow Putin to get away with
rape and murder and pillage, you're going to get more of the
same. This is not a territorial dispute between Russia and
Ukraine, is it?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I think this is Russia
trying to project its power in a brutal way----
Senator Graham. Are you aware that Putin has said he would
like to reconstruct the former Russian empire or Soviet Union?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely, and we know----
Senator Graham. Are you aware of the fact that the
Ukrainians, in the mid-'90s, gave up 1,700 nuclear weapons as
part of an agreement with Russia, the United States, and Great
Britain that their sovereignty would be honored if they gave
the nukes back to Russia?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, Senator.
Senator Graham. Is it fair to say that Putin has torn that
agreement up, by his actions?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Putin is acting in a
lawless way in violation of anything----
Senator Graham. Is it fair to say that if you want people
to have less nuclear weapons, you need to honor agreements when
they give up the nuclear weapons they possess?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely. It's what the--
our international order is----
Senator Graham. Do you agree----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Based on.
Senator Graham [continuing]. With me? If Ukraine could go
back in time, they would keep the nukes?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Can't speculate on that,
Senator.
Senator Graham. Yes, I think they would. So, to those who
think--the border is broken, they ought to fix it.
To those who think what happens in Russia doesn't matter,
regarding China, you're just--you've missed all of World War
II.
To those who believe that if Putin gets away with this, it
won't matter, you're going to get more of it from other people.
The ICC has issued an arrest warrant for the president of
Russia. Are you aware of that?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, I am.
Senator Graham. If Interpol would issue a Red Notice for
the arrest of Putin, would we honor it?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, I think that
presumes, which I think is a vanishingly slim possibility,
that----
Senator Graham. No, I got it, but----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Putin would
come here.
Senator Graham [continuing]. The point is, would we
consider him a criminal and honor the Red Notice, if issued?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, we certainly consider
him a criminal. We consider him a war criminal. As you know,
Senator, the arrest warrant----
Senator Graham. Do you know what a Red Notice is?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Senator Graham. Okay. Do you think it would be justified
for Interpol to issue a Red Notice against Putin?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I think it's certainly
justified. I think what it would do is have to go through the
process. The ICC, I think, as a practical matter, could ask for
Interpol to issue that----
Senator Graham. Would you----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Red Notice.
Senator Graham [continuing]. Support them asking for it?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I think they're a party to
Interpol, and they can use the--they've got an agreement to----
Senator Graham. Thank you.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Use those
mechanisms.
Senator Graham. And thank you. The KleptoCapture Task Force
has done an amazing job. Well done.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you very much,
Senator. They've been working very, very hard.
Chair Durbin. Thanks, Senator Graham. Senator Whitehouse.
Senator Whitehouse. Thank you, Chairman.
Let me pick up where Senator Graham left off. I
wholeheartedly endorse his pressure on you to try to sort out
within the administration--whatever is blocking cooperation
with the International Criminal Court needs to be corrected so
that the administration is in compliance with the law that
Congress passed.
To me, it's as simple as that. And the sooner we can get
that sorted out, I think, the better.
With respect to forfeitures, the law that we passed
regarding transfers to Ukraine is now starting to flow. You've
had at least one transfer from KleptoCapture to Ukraine. I
appreciate that and commend you on that success. If there is
more support that KleptoCapture--and particularly the Marshals
Service, that has to deal with these oligarch assets--needs,
will you be sure to let us know, particularly the really big
shots right here who are Appropriators, as well?
Dealing with a megayacht is not a simple task, and dealing
with assets----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. You're----
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Of the magnitude that we
are seizing, and frankly, with a good deal more to be seized, I
think--what do we need to do--question for the record: What do
we need to do to step up and support the existing KleptoCapture
effort, and with specific regard to one matter, administrative
forfeiture proceedings against oligarch assets?
If you're an American citizen, the Department of Justice
can seize an asset of yours in essentially an in rem
proceeding, in which it's ``United States v. Shoebox Full of
$450,000.'' But that is only up to $500,000, and then that
authority stops.
What we do not have is authority over $500,000 for these
foreign oligarchs. So that puts you in the difficult position
of having to parse through all of the multiple screens that
they've used, the Cypriot bank accounts, the Cayman Islands
shell corporations, to try to figure out who owns what, whereas
if you could proceed in rem and just have it be ``United States
v. Yacht--Megayacht,'' that cuts all that crap out and it
reverses the polarity so it's now the true owner who has to
show up and identify themselves.
And as you know, when you've done this with botnets and
other things like that, the true crooked owner usually does not
show up because they would leave the proceedings in handcuffs.
So, I think you need that authority. Please make sure that
the Department of Justice is supporting the bipartisan bill
that would give you that authority against these over-$500,000
oligarch assets. Are you comfortable with that?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, first, Senator, let
me thank you for your incredible leadership on this issue and
making sure we got the transfer authority that we have now to
use to transfer to Ukraine. We absolutely want to work with you
on this in rem idea. I think it could help us streamline
matters, as you suggest.
Senator Whitehouse. Well, it's not just an idea. It's how
you actually operate right now with----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. That----
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Respect to American
citizens for property under half a million dollars in value.
Correct?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. That's exactly right. But
one thing I want to make clear: Given the oligarchs that we are
going after, given the byzantine financial structures they are
able to create and the shell companies and the holding
companies, and the--you know, putting----
Senator Whitehouse. It becomes all the more important, I
think, to have this capability.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. It does; however, I would
say these are folks who are litigating through any means
possible. So, I think we will see litigation in these types of
cases, no matter what. What----
Senator Whitehouse. I get it.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. And so we need to make sure
we are producing a good factual record so we prevail in those
proceedings.
Senator Whitehouse. I get it.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I've got all the faith in
the world in our prosecutors, so we could use more of those
resources.
Senator Whitehouse. Yes.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. So, that's a plug right
there.
Senator Whitehouse. A tip, say, from the captain of the
boat, could give you plenty of predication to proceed, so--
well, my time is running out, so let me ask a couple more
questions.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Sure.
Senator Whitehouse. Again, given the little time, these
will be questions for the record.
You are providing existing support to Prosecutor Kostin. Is
there more that we should be doing to support his criminal
prosecution efforts?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes. In fact, we are--we
just met earlier this week, as I mentioned. We are adding more
resources to our work with Prosecutor General Kostin. We're
adding more FBI resources. We've just added--pledged a----
Senator Whitehouse. Just keeping track of evidence is a
pretty substantial proposition.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely, and helping
prioritize which are going to be the most likely cases to move
the most quickly.
Senator Whitehouse. So, here's the last one I'll ask you.
Again, question for the record--two questions for the record.
One, what is the Department's position on what an
international aggression tribunal should look like? What are
you arguing for, and why?
And second, the prosecutor general is going to have to deal
with massive Ukrainian civil relief. And to accomplish that, I
think he believes that he's going to have to set up a 9/11-type
fund, that litigating one by one is just impossible, so you
have to set up a fund and let people apply to it. The obvious
place to fund that fund is with Russia's sovereign funds that
we have now frozen.
I think it's important for the Department to let us, on
this Committee, know what you think the avenues are to deploy
those sovereign funds to Ukrainian relief, under what terms or
through what devices or with what caveats.
And if we don't do that, how else does the relief fund for
the Ukrainians who've lost their homes, lost their loved ones--
for the civil damages that they're entitled to, how else does
that get funded? And I've gone over, and I apologize to the
Chairman, but I appreciate your work and your answer to those
questions.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you, Senator.
Chair Durbin. Those are questions for the record?
Senator Whitehouse. Yes, sir.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator. Senator Grassley.
Senator Grassley. Thank you. Thank you for being here.
We learn a lot when we follow the money, and we're talking
about money today. And I want to start with this fact that
Garcia Luna was convicted January the 17th. You know, he worked
with the drug cartels in Mexico.
And I'm trying to get some information. I'm worried that
U.S. funds are being misused to enable human rights violations.
On February the 22nd, I sent a letter to DEA and FBI requesting
documents about their relationships and knowledge of this
corrupt Mexican official. When can I expect the documents that
I requested from the Justice Department?
I did get a letter from Justice confirming receipt of my
letter, but we want those discovery files, and we don't have
any problems with the defense counsel for Garcia Luna letting
us have them. So, when may I receive those discovery files?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, I'm not certain
about when you'll be able to get those files, but I'm happy to
go back and understand what we're doing to respond to that.
Senator Grassley. Well, you understand it's pretty darned
important for us to understand what's going on between the
United States and all this money that we gave to the Merida
Initiative that we had there. Several million dollars went into
it, and obviously he was connected with that 3\3/10\ millions
dollars.
But I'll take your good-faith effort to get us an answer
when we'll get those discovery files. And it doesn't seem to me
we should have any problems when we have the defense lawyer
saying we can have them.
On another matter, the Justice Department can give Ukraine
disgorged assets from the Russian criminal files under the
December 2022 Omnibus Appropriations bill. In the past, the
United States gave funds to foreign partners who supported
major criminal cartels.
What is the Justice Department doing to ensure that these
disgorged funds don't end up in the hands of bad actors like we
had with the experience in Mexico under that Initiative I just
mentioned?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, first, we are using,
as the Chairman said, the authority that the Congress has
provided us, when we are able to seize and forfeit the assets
we get from these oligarchs, to transfer them to the benefit of
Ukraine.
We frankly would like to be able to expand that authority,
Senator. Right now, we're leaving a lot of money on the table
for the benefit of Ukraine because we only have a limited
ability to transfer assets that are attributable to sanctions
evasion for a particular Executive order.
So, for instance, the millions we're seizing and forfeiting
because of export control violations--we can't transfer those
proceeds to Ukraine. And we would of course have--and there's
measures for accountability to make sure that those assets that
get transferred--and this is a State Department role, to make
sure that they are going to the appropriate places in Ukraine
that can be used for the benefit of Ukrainians.
Senator Grassley. Okay. Well, what's the process, then, for
providing that information to the State Department? And I
assume you'd be willing to provide it to the Congress of the
United States. What is that process?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I'm sorry, Senator. The
process for ensuring controls on the money that goes to the
benefit of Ukraine?
Senator Grassley. Or if you find that bad actors are
receiving the funds.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, certainly there's
Inspectors General who would review that and also, ultimately,
our own. We have a long history in the Justice Department for
investigating--and prosecute fraud in Government programs, and
fraud for contractors abroad, and the like. So, our prosecutors
would be looking at that. But I'm happy also to work with
colleagues at State Department to get you a more precise
answer.
Senator Grassley. For my last question, and let me go to
this--we have a lot of bad actors other than just Russia and
Ukraine and the Mexican cartels.
So, I want to go to another bad actor, Venezuela. In 2009,
then-Vice President Biden told Russia it's time to press the
reset button. Given that we're having our second hearing on
Russian war crimes in Ukraine, I think we can all agree that
that was a big mistake.
Like Russia, the United Nations has accused acting
Venezuelan government of crimes against humanity. President
Biden has again, quote, unquote, ``pressed the reset button''
and unfrozen $3 billion to Venezuelan assets and allowed
Chevron to drill there.
Does the Justice Department still consider Nicolas Maduro a
fugitive of U.S. justice? And if so, is the Justice Department
still committing to pursuing his arrest?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, we're
absolutely committed to pursuing justice in cases that we have
indicted and brought. The Venezuela example is a very good
example for why we need a crimes against humanity statute.
Right now, we cannot pursue the type of lawless activity
that you've referenced that has gone on in Venezuela, the types
of atrocities that have been committed by the Chinese against
the Uyghurs--we can't pursue that type of justice here in U.S.
courts without a crimes against humanity statute.
So, that's why, in my opening statement, in my statement
for the record, I am urging this Committee and this Congress to
fill the gap that the Chairman referenced, and giving us that
authority.
Senator Grassley. Okay. So, you do still consider Maduro a
fugitive of U.S. justice?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, Senator.
Senator Grassley. Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Thanks, Senator Grassley. Senator Klobuchar.
Senator Klobuchar. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, for
holding this important hearing. Welcome, Deputy Attorney
General Monaco.
I think I'll start with something that I'm not certain has
been raised, and that is about what's happening to journalists
right now. And I think one of the reasons that we know about
these Russian atrocities in Ukraine is in large part because of
the extensive reporting.
Many journalists who have worked to expose Putin's
brutality have been killed, as we know, while covering the war,
including American journalist Brent Renaud.
And now Russia has wrongfully detained Evan Gershkovich of
The Wall Street Journal, an American reporter. I just saw that
horrible vision of him in that glass box last night on the
news.
Without getting into any specific case, can you speak to
the Department's efforts to investigate the killing and
wrongful detention of journalists by the Russian Federation?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you, Senator. And let
me say, my heart goes out to the Gershkovich family, and I want
to echo Secretary Blinken's call for him to be immediately
released.
It's outrageous what has happened to him and, of course, to
Paul Whelan, who remains unjustly detained by the Russian
government.
You are quite right, and as the video that the Chairman
started this hearing with--the only reason we really are able
to see the atrocities and the horror that is happening is in
large part because of brave journalists who are going into
harm's way to document what we are witnessing and are able to
witness the horror that is happening.
And that's why we are so grateful for our ability to deploy
what we have called the War Crimes Accountability Team. This is
a group of prosecutors that Attorney General Garland designated
last year, led by a seasoned prosecutor who was--built our
capability to go after and hunt Nazi war criminals.
We're using all of that expertise now to investigate and
prosecute the war crimes that are being documented by brave
journalists, and the types of cases that we are investigating
are exactly what you laid out, Senator--journalists, U.S.
journalists who come into harm's way and are victims of Russian
atrocities on the ground. And unfortunately, we have seen
examples of that.
So, we have active investigations that are moving just as
fast as we can possibly move them. And we've got prosecutors
and investigators who are working day and night to bring about
that accountability.
Senator Klobuchar. Okay. Very good. Along those same lines,
like many of my colleagues, I visited Ukraine right before the
war started and then with Senator Portman last August, and I
talked to President Zelensky directly about this. We went to
the grave with Senator Portman--I did in Bucha. And it rang
true to me when President Zelensky spoke about the importance
of holding Russia accountable for its crimes and said revenge
cannot do what justice can do.
And to me that's nowhere more apparent than the detention
and forced reeducation of Ukrainian kids. Thousands of them
have been separated from their families, held in camps where
they are vulnerable to abuse and exploitation.
Senator Graham and I just introduced a resolution
condemning Russia's kidnapping of Ukrainian children. Could you
talk about what the Justice Department is doing to ensure that
those responsible for the kidnapping and forced reeducation--I
don't even like to use the word--of Ukrainian children are held
accountable for their actions?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I've seen that resolution,
Senator, and I commend you for putting it forward. What we are
seeing is nothing less than Ukrainian children being
disappeared by Russian actors and by the atrocities that Russia
is perpetrating.
Our investigators and prosecutors are pursuing all avenues
of war crimes investigations, including what is happening for
the removal--the forcible removal--forced removal of children
from Ukraine.
We are also working with our Ukrainian partners. I
mentioned our work with the prosecutor general. This includes
investigating what is happening to children, including the
bombing of maternity wards--is also what we have seen, again,
documented by brave journalists.
So, all of our war crimes investigation activities
encompasses the atrocities that are being perpetrated against----
Senator Klobuchar. One----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Children.
Senator Klobuchar. One last question.
One of the things we've seen is that the Russian government
denies any responsibility for actions in places like Bucha.
Instead, they make false--completely false claims that the
bodies and images were planted, that it's fake. How is the
Justice Department working to counter Russian disinformation,
both as it relates to hampering prosecutorial investigations
and to distributing propaganda?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, I put zero stock
in what Russian propaganda arms and Russian officials are
saying about what's happening in Ukraine. And we are working
tirelessly to--and meticulously document and gather the
evidence that can be put forward in these cases and that can be
shared with our Ukrainian and other European partners to bring
forward their cases to make sure there's accountability.
Senator Klobuchar. Thank you. I think we kind of defied
what people would expect, in the way that President Zelensky
was able to harness social media and the internet to get his
people with him and the world with him.
And part of that was our ingenuity. I know that, but we
just have to--and I know you are doing this, but we have to
just continue, also, the counteroffensive on the internet with
what they're doing. And that's been the thing that's emerging
now. So, thank you.
Chair Durbin. Thanks, Senator Klobuchar. Senator Lee.
Senator Lee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Deputy
Monaco, for being here, and thanks for your service.
In early March, we had Attorney General Garland before this
Committee, and I asked him a series of questions about 18
U.S.C. Sec. 1507 and specifically why no arrests have been made
at the homes of Supreme Court Justices in violation of that
statute, which prohibits people from protesting or
demonstrating outside the home of a Supreme Court Justice or a
judge or a juror or other officer of the court with intent to
influence any court proceeding.
His answer was succinct but amounted to the effect that the
Marshals are on the ground and the Marshals have full authority
to arrest under any Federal statute, including Section 1507.
About 3 weeks later, my friend and colleague from Alabama,
Senator Katie Britt, before another Committee, asked Attorney
General Garland about a slide deck that she had discovered that
was being used to train the U.S. Marshals who were performing
their protective detail duty at the homes of Supreme Court
Justices.
These slides seemed to contradict what Attorney General
Garland had told me 3 weeks earlier. They contradicted in
several respects.
First of all, the slide number 4 says that in order to make
an arrest there, they really need to be looking at something
that demonstrates, quote, ``the intent of influencing any
judge--language thus logically goes to criminal threats and
intimidation, not First Amendment protest activities.''
Now, I personally--as I pored through that statute, I don't
see that as an element of the offense. It's not an element of
the offense. There's nothing in there that requires it to have
this separate, nonspecified element within 1507 about the
intent being something amounting to criminal threats and
intimidation. That's not in there.
Just as troubling, maybe even more so, is slide number 5,
cited by Senator Britt at that same hearing, where it says
that, quote, ``Any contemplated U.S. Marshals Service
enforcement action under 1507 should be coordinated in advance
with the appropriate U.S. Attorney's office.''
And as if that were not enough to discourage the Marshals
from making arrests under Section 1507, in this circumstance,
it goes on to say that it is counterproductive to make probable
cause arrests on cases that the U.S. Attorney's office will not
charge and prosecute.
So, I've been wondering, how exactly is it considered to be
the full authority to arrest people under Section 1507, as the
Attorney General has described, if you have to get preclearance
first to do it, and if you're adding an additional element, one
not found in the United States Code?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, I know the
Attorney General has spoken quite directly to this about the
direction that he has given and has repeatedly given to the
Marshals Service, and the Marshals Service Director spoke
very----
Senator Lee. When he was asked about these slides, by the
way, he was not aware of them. Were you aware of them? Were you
aware of them before they were given to the Marshals Service to
train Marshals on how to protect the homes of Supreme Court
Justices?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. No, Senator, but I also
know that the Marshals Service Director has been very clear
that he is--will regularly review the training provided to the
Deputy U.S. Marshals who continue, to this day, to provide 24/7
protection for the Justices, their homes, their property, at
the unprecedented direction of Attorney General Garland last
year. This has never happened before in the history of the
Department----
Senator Lee. I----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Where----
Senator Lee. I----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. These----
Senator Lee. I understand that, but I'm asking about the
enforcement of Section 1507. Now, you're the Deputy Attorney
General. Under the organizational chart of the Department of
Justice, you have supervisory authority, oversight over the
U.S. Marshals Service. Is that right?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. That's correct.
Senator Lee. And so you're saying you had not seen these
slides before the Marshals were trained on it?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. That's correct.
Senator Lee. I assume you've reviewed them since then?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I've seen the slides that
you referenced that Senator Britt showed to the Attorney
General.
Senator Lee. And have you discussed them with Attorney
General Garland?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I have not, Senator, but I
would like to make very clear: The direction the Attorney
General gave to the Director of the U.S. Marshals Service, who
himself has indicated that he has been told repeatedly by the
Attorney General that he has full authority to enforce all
Federal laws, including 1507, as long as--and as long as he's
prioritizing and the Deputy U.S. Marshals are prioritizing the
life, the safety, the protection of the property of the
Justices, which is----
Senator Lee. Under any of the other Federal statutes under
which they're authorized to make an arrest on the ground, have
they added an additional nonstatutory element to the offense,
or have they required preclearance with the U.S. Attorney's
office prior to making a probable cause arrest?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, without
necessarily adopting your interpretation of the slides, the
Director of the Marshals Service has been very clear he's going
to regularly review that training. He's got all the authority
repeatedly given to him and directed by the Attorney General to
enforce Federal law.
His priority, however, and that of the Deputy U.S. Marshals
who are providing that security and that protection, is for the
property, the life, the safety of the Justices and their
families----
Senator Lee. And yet, since this slide was revealed to the
public, he hasn't either corrected his statement or gone back
to the Marshals Service and asked that the additional
nonstatutory element be removed or asked that the preclearance
from the U.S. Attorney's office be approved prior to the making
of a probable cause arrest under Section 1507.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. The statement by the
Attorney General was very clear and not in need of correction.
He was very----
Senator Lee. No, it wasn't.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Clear about
the direction that he has given to the Marshals Service.
Senator Lee. He had no idea what direction had been given
to the Marshals Service. No idea whatsoever. So, we can say a
lot of things about it. It was not clear, and he hasn't cleared
it up, and it's rather inconsistent with what he told us in
front of this Committee.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Respectfully, Senator, the
Attorney General was clear. His direction to the Marshals
Service, to the Marshals Service Director, was to prioritize
the life, safety, and protection of the property of the
Justices, to have the full authority to enforce any Federal
law----
Senator Lee. With preclearance----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. But to----
Senator Lee [continuing]. And with additional elements not
found in the statute.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Respectfully, Senator, that
was not the Attorney General's testimony. That was not his
statement, his direction to the----
Senator Lee. Well, he wasn't aware of it.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Director.
Senator Lee. It couldn't be in his statement. He didn't
know about it. Not when he talked to me, not when he talked to
my colleague, Katie Britt. I see my time has expired. Thank
you, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Lee. Senator Blumenthal.
Senator Blumenthal. Thanks, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very
much for being here, Deputy Attorney General Monaco. And thank
you for the work of the KleptoCapture Task Force and for
Attorney General Garland's very clear, unequivocal commitment,
as he expressed after signing a Memorandum of Understanding
with Prosecutor General Kostin the other day. He was certainly
very forceful in his commitment.
The KleptoCapture Task Force is pursuant to sanctions that
have been imposed according to law. I want to join my
colleagues in saying that, in a very bipartisan way, we want an
all-of-Government commitment, including the Department of
Defense, whatever obstacles there may be to its participating.
I would like you to provide some briefing to us in another
setting, if necessary. I understand your reluctance to do it
here.
Let me ask you, is there any legal obstacle, in your view,
to declaring Russia a state sponsor of terrorism? This body,
after the Initiative that Senator Graham and I did, voted
unanimously in favor of the United States declaring Russia a
state sponsor of terrorism. I know the State Department has
raised reservations. I don't believe they're legal in nature.
Are there any legal obstacles?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, I'm not
aware of legal obstacles. I do know, though, the first analysis
that would be done in that regard would be by the State
Department. But I also know that the President has indicated
that he would disfavor such a move----
Senator Blumenthal. But----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. For the----
Senator Blumenthal. But there are no legal obstacles?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I haven't personally done
the analysis, but I'm not aware of them.
Senator Blumenthal. Let me ask you--you know, we're all
focused on KleptoCapture. The real money is in the sovereign
funds that have been frozen. But as to those funds, as well as
the yachts and other assets that you have seized, do you need
more authority to transfer the proceeds to the Ukrainian
government so that it can use those moneys to rebuild the
country?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. So, the seizure of
sovereign assets has now occurred in jurisdictions around the
world, and we have come together, the United States, with the
G7 to be very forceful, I think, in saying that those assets
that are currently immobilized, both here and in multiple
jurisdictions around the world, must be and remain immobilized.
And we have a pledge amongst the G7 to do that. The question of
how to then use those to the benefit of Ukraine and transfer
them is, I think, a very complicated set of legal questions.
But we certainly need to make sure, Senator, that as we
come together, and have--and the G7 has been forceful on this,
as well, that Russia must be the ones to pay for the
rebuilding. They must be accountable for the rebuilding of
Ukraine. We have to act collectively and in a united way to put
those assets to use, because, frankly, if we don't act together
as an international community on those assets, there will be
seepage and there won't be----
Senator Blumenthal. But to the----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. As much----
Senator Blumenthal. To the extent----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Force
directed----
Senator Blumenthal [continuing]. The United States has
immobilized or frozen those assets--we have them?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes.
Senator Blumenthal. We have a legal right to them,
they're----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes.
Senator Blumenthal [continuing]. Under both international
and our national law? Do you need more authority, the
Department of Justice, to transfer assets that we control to
the Ukrainians so they can be used for humanitarian purposes
and possibly also military purposes?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. We may well--and I'd like
to come back to you on the domestic legal authority issue,
which is, of course, what this body can provide. I think there
are other very complicated issues of international law----
Senator Blumenthal. Well----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. And work----
Senator Blumenthal [continuing]. International law has
always been, in my view, complicated. Ever since I went to law
school, I have never fully understood international law. It
seems like a very kind of putty-like set of principles.
But what I'm interested in doing is making sure that you
have the authority to transfer to Ukraine real money, because
we have a lot of real money in those sovereign funds that can
be used by Ukraine to rebuild.
And certainly everyone would agree with you that Russia
ought to pay for the damage that it's done. I visited the mass
grave sites in Bucha. I have been to Ukraine three times, twice
with Senator Graham. The video that was played at the beginning
of this session was graphic but failed to do justice to the
incredibly horrific crimes against humanity that have been
committed. And I think we all agree that, in principle, those
assets should be going to Ukraine, to rebuild.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. If I might, Mr. Chairman,
just make one more response and put another plug in for
authorities. I understand your point about our domestic law
with respect to the sovereign assets. It is very important that
we act as an international community because the vast majority
of those sovereign assets are not within the United States.
And so I think we want to proceed in a way that makes sure
that we bring everyone together, if we really want to have the
impact--and I share your concern about having the impact--that
we want to have with those sovereign assets.
Second, with respect to the KleptoCapture efforts, again,
let me stress, we are leaving money on the table if we don't
expand our ability to use the forfeited assets that we gain
from enforcement of our export control violations and expanding
the sanctions regimes that that transfer authority is
applicable to. So, I urge the Congress to give us that
additional authority, so we can make the oligarchs pay for
rebuilding Ukraine, as well. Thank you.
Senator Blumenthal. Thanks. Thanks, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Senator Cotton.
Senator Cotton. Like the other Members of the Committee, I
think there's little doubt that war crimes have been committed
by Russians in Ukraine. I have to say, though, I think there's
an element of putting the cart before the horse here.
Before there can be accountability for these crimes, there
has to be victory in the war. And we're not on the verge of
victory in the war because Joe Biden has been pussyfooting for
the last year, not providing Ukraine with the weapons that they
need to win this war.
In fact, not providing the weapons they need to defend the
territory where some of these crimes have been committed before
Ukraine took that territory back.
So, rather than continuing to say that we're going to
support Ukraine for as long as it takes, we should be focused
on helping them win as quick as we can.
Now, Ms. Monaco, I know you're not in charge of the conduct
of our policy of the war but rather on the crimes itself. But I
just want to make that point that until the war is won, there's
very unlikely to be accountability for these crimes. I want to
turn my attention to something for which you do have
responsibility, though.
There's a statute, a criminal statute, Section 1512,
entitled Tampering with a Witness, Victim, or Informant. Most
of that statute focuses on the altering, destruction, or hiding
of records to be used in an official proceeding. Ms. Monaco,
are you aware of this statute?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes.
Senator Cotton. Do you know when it was adopted?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. It was adopted, if memory
serves, after the financial collapse of Enron and other
corporate malfeasance.
Senator Cotton. In 2002, after the Enron scandal and a law
called the Corporate Fraud Accountability Act of 2002. It also
includes a catch-all phrase prohibiting not just the
destruction and hiding of evidence, but also any acts that,
quote, ``otherwise obstruct, influence, or impede an official
proceeding.'' The Department is currently using that catch-all
provision to prosecute hundreds of Americans for their actions
on January 6th, 2021, on the grounds of the United States
Capitol.
I want to be clear, I'm not talking here about persons who
committed violent acts against law enforcement officers or
destroyed property--there's plenty of Federal crimes that cover
their actions--but rather this catch-all phrase for people who,
in some cases, were merely present on the Capitol grounds,
maybe not even aware that that had been cordoned off earlier in
the day. Are you aware of a case called U.S. v. Fischer, in the
D.C. Circuit, Ms. Monaco?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I'm not specifically
familiar with the facts of it, but I think it's one of the
cases brought in relation to the events at the Capitol----
Senator Cotton. Yes, it was----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. On January
6th.
Senator Cotton [continuing]. Decided a couple weeks ago, on
a sharply divided panel in which the Department almost lost, in
which there was strong dispute on what that catch-all phrase
meant--about otherwise obstructing or influencing an official
proceeding----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Mm-hmm.
Senator Cotton [continuing]. And it allowed the case to go
forward but said that they have to prove corrupt intent.
There's a strong dissent that said clearly the items in
that law that precede the catch-all phrase, like destroying or
concealing documents, should limit the meaning of otherwise
obstructing or influencing a proceeding.
I'm following the case closely. I wouldn't be surprised to
see if the Supreme Court reverses it on review or if the
Department can't prove the mental element of corrupt intent.
Your Department of Justice argued, though, that corrupt, quote,
``encompasses all forms of obstructive and influencing
behavior.'' That's a pretty sweeping interpretation of the law.
Just this week, the House Judiciary Committee held a
hearing in New York City, and it's been reported that a
Democratic mob was in the hallway trying to get into the doors
and stop that hearing from proceeding. Has your Department
begun to investigate this effort to obstruct or influence the
official proceeding of the House Judiciary Committee in New
York City?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, I'm not aware of
those events, although I do know that that hearing took place.
I'm not going to comment on--as you rightly pointed out, that
statute and those cases, and indeed the Fischer case, is one
that is moving through the courts. I'm not going to comment on
the application of it to those particular facts or more
broadly, precisely because those are cases that are moving
through the courts and----
Senator Cotton. Well, let----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Are
important----
Senator Cotton. Let me ask you----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Cases.
Senator Cotton. Well, there's no case in New York moving
through, and I'm simply asking if the Southern District of New
York has stood up a task force to investigate all these people
who corruptly influenced and obstructed a proceeding of the
House Judiciary Committee?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. The men and women of the
Justice Department that have been pursuing and bringing the
cases of the events that occurred in the Capitol have been
doing incredible work. This is the most far-reaching----
Senator Cotton. I didn't ask about----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Wide-ranging----
Senator Cotton [continuing]. That task--I asked about a
task force in New York.
Let me ask you about another one. What about in Tennessee?
A Democratic mob obstructed the Tennessee Legislature recently
to such a severe extent that the Legislature expelled two of
its members. Is the Department of Justice investigating all
those protesters who disrupted the official proceeding of the
Tennessee Legislature?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I'm not aware of any such
investigation, but I also wouldn't be able to comment on it if
there was one.
Senator Cotton. Can you see where I'm----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator----
Senator Cotton [continuing]. Going with this? Like Senator
Lee----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I do, Senator.
Senator Cotton. Like Senator Lee said, they're also--your
Department directed Marshals not to arrest Democratic mobs
outside the homes of conservative Supreme Court Justices,
specifically--specifically directed them not to conduct any
arrests, even though they were clearly violating the
blackletter of the law. There's no dispute that they were
clearly violating the blackletter of the law. In case after
case after case, the Department enforces the law against its
political opponents and does not enforce the law against
favored political interest groups.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Respectfully, Senator, the
Attorney General was very clear. He directed the Marshals
Service----
Senator Cotton. The Attorney General----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. To----
Senator Cotton [continuing]. Very clearly lied, in that
Committee, as Senator Britt demonstrated later by the slides
that she produced.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Respectfully, Senator----
Senator Cotton. The----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. The----
Senator Cotton. The Marshals----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Attorney
General----
Senator Cotton. The Marshals were directed not to arrest
protesters outside of the homes----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Respect----
Senator Cotton [continuing]. These were not criminal
masterminds. They broadcast on social media when they are going
to be violating the law, and there's not a single arrest, much
less a prosecution. Meanwhile, you've stretched--you've
stretched the meaning of a corporate document retention law to
prosecute hundreds of people who were merely present on Capitol
grounds on January 6th, 2021.
[Gavel is tapped.]
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator----
Chair Durbin. Senator Hirono--would you like to respond?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I would like to respond,
Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
The Attorney General was forthright, was clear about the
direction he gave to the U.S. Marshals Service. The Marshals
Service Director was also clear that he received--has received
that direction, repeatedly. So I wanted to put that on the
record.
I also would like to point out that the men and women of
the Justice Department who are investigating acts of violence,
especially that occurred at the Capitol, are doing so at
sometimes a great personal sacrifice and peril to themselves,
and I'm proud to serve with them.
Chair Durbin. Senator Hirono.
Senator Hirono. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Because there are some concerns raised about the authority
of the U.S. Marshal to do his job, I'd like to read into the
record a statement from U.S. Marshals Director Ron Davis
regarding what he was told by Attorney General, quote, ``He''--
the Attorney General--``has also, from the beginning, made
clear that we''--the U.S. Marshals--``have the full authority
to enforce any Federal statute, including 1507.'' I'm quoting
the Director of the U.S. Marshals Office.
Thank you very much for coming to testify, Deputy Attorney
General Monaco. My colleagues--I'm sorry, human trafficking is
an issue that should be of concern to all of us, and I'd like
to ask you about it in the context of Russia's invasion of
Ukraine.
Since the invasion last year, over 8 million refugees have
fled Ukraine. The vast majority of these refugees are women and
children. Most have crossed the Ukrainian border without
resources or a place to go.
We know that traffickers target women, children, and those
without resources, so Ukrainian refugees are extremely
vulnerable to trafficking. Can you review for us the general
tools the Department uses to combat human trafficking and
explain how those tools can be used to protect Ukrainian
refugees?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you, Senator Hirono.
You're quite right. We have a number of statutes that our
expert prosecutors and investigators who focus on human
trafficking--and we have a dedicated group of prosecutors who
focus on human trafficking crimes. And we have a set of
statutes that they are putting to work every day, including on
these issues that you so devastatingly recount.
The trafficking and the forcible removal of children from
Ukraine are amongst the crimes that we ourselves are
investigating as part of the war crimes investigations and
human trafficking investigations that we're doing. And it's
also what we are working alongside our Ukrainian partners to
help them build and collect the evidence doing the painstaking
work of gathering the forensic evidence and information to
build these cases.
This is not easy, as you might imagine. These are not
territories that it's easy to get into. But we are working with
our Ukrainian partners to build their capacity, as well, to
collect the evidence to both build their cases as well as ours.
Senator Hirono. Do you have enough legal tools to pursue
these prosecutions and investigations?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, particularly with
respect to something like human trafficking or forced labor,
when it comes to children, this here, again, is an area that a
crimes against humanity statute would be especially important
to have.
We cannot get at, as I mentioned before, the types of
crimes, widespread systematic crimes like forced labor of
children, human trafficking and kidnapping of children in areas
that aren't gripped by a wartime conflict but are nonetheless
visiting horrors upon children in vulnerable populations. We
need a crimes against humanity statute to be able to prosecute
those crimes.
Senator Hirono. Thank you. Russia has reportedly become the
second largest miner of cryptocurrency in the world. We know
that through techniques like chain hopping and tumbling--I know
you know what those words mean--bad actors can launder
cryptocurrency potentially to evade sanctions or move assets.
Indeed, when the Department announced the KleptoCapture
Task Force last year, its mission included, quote, ``targeting
efforts to use cryptocurrency to evade U.S. sanctions, launder
proceeds of foreign corruption, or evade U.S. responses to
Russian military aggression,'' end quote.
Can you give us an update on the efforts or the specifics--
if the specifics would be too sensitive in this context, can
you give us an overview of the Department's cryptocurrency
successes and challenges, generally?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thanks, Senator. We have
stood up something we're calling the National Cryptocurrency
Enforcement Team, precisely because we are seeing
cryptocurrency being used in all manner of illicit ways,
whether it's the facilitation of ransomware attacks and
payments, whether it is the laundering of money when it comes
to the oligarchs hiding their ill-gotten gains.
So--and we, of course, see it in the terrorism context.
So, increasingly, malicious actors are using cryptocurrency
to both facilitate and hide their criminal activity. So, we set
up a dedicated effort, the National Cryptocurrency Enforcement
Team, and they are working alongside the Task Force
KleptoCapture, to go after and literally use our old-school
methods of following the money and doing it in this new way.
And one, I think, notable example of this is when, in the
wake of the Colonial Pipeline attack, we were literally able to
follow the ransomware payment because of, quite frankly, the
cooperation of the victim company in that case, who
courageously came forward and worked with us. We were able to
follow the money and the cryptocurrency through the blockchain
and seize it back for the benefit of the victim in that case.
So, we are doing more and more of that. And when it comes
to the way illicit actors are using cryptocurrency, we are very
much on our front feet to go after that.
Senator Hirono. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Hirono. Senator Cornyn.
Senator Cornyn. Ms. Monaco, the--you've had a long and
distinguished career in national security matters and at the
Department of Justice, more generally.
I want to ask you about some of the authorities that are
used to collect foreign intelligence, namely Section 702 of the
Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. As you know, that
authority is scheduled to expire at the end of this year, and
so we are undertaking some consideration of that
reauthorization request and what changes, if any, are necessary
to that in order to protect the privacy of American citizens
who are not engaged in any sort of nefarious activity.
General Nakasone, head of the National Security Agency, has
called Section 702 irreplaceable, and he has said that without
Section 702 we lose critical insights into the most significant
threats to our Nation. Can you tell us, for example, whether
Section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act has
been productive in yielding valuable information related to the
conflict in Ukraine?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely, Senator. First,
let me agree wholeheartedly with General Nakasone--702 is an
absolutely indispensable national security tool. I have seen
the value of it in every job that I have had, and you mentioned
my prior roles in national security.
I see it when I review the President's Daily Brief--a
significant portion of that vital intelligence that we get is
derived from 702. It gives us insights into cyber threats,
helps us prevent ransomware attacks from foreign actors.
But when it comes to this conflict and what Russia is doing
in Ukraine, it has proved vitally important. Indeed, 702 has
helped us uncover gruesome atrocities committed by Russia in
Ukraine, including the murder of noncombatants, the forced
relocation of children from Russian-occupied Ukraine to Russia,
and the detention of refugees fleeing violence by Russian
personnel.
All of that we were able to see, thanks to 702, and that
information and other information helped--has helped us as a
country and as a national security community, galvanize
accountability efforts regarding Ukraine by allowing us to
confidently and accurately speak with the international
community about Russian atrocities.
So, Senator, I think one of the most important things that
this Committee and this Congress can do to help us push back
against Russian aggression is reauthorize 702.
Senator Cornyn. Well, thank you. On a recent congressional
delegation that I participated in when we traveled to Panama,
Colombia, Argentina, and Brazil, we heard, time and time again,
testimonials about how important that authority is for our
Government representatives in those places, monitoring the
activities of Russian and Chinese intelligence officers and
other activities.
One question that came up is whether Executive Order 12333,
which, as you know, is a broad long-standing Executive order
authorizing a lot of our intelligence-gathering capabilities--
whether that is an adequate substitute.
One of the things that occurred to me is that Section 702
is a law passed by Congress on a bipartisan basis and signed
into law.
The Executive order obviously is a unilateral act by the
Chief Executive of the United States. But is 12333, in your
opinion, an adequate substitute?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I don't believe so,
Senator. And I agree with the distinction you made. It is
also--702 is an authority that is overseen by all three
branches of Government. And I would also say that it has helped
us really understand the strategic calculations of nations like
Russia, like China, like Iran and how they are approaching and
evolving on major issues like the war in Ukraine.
So, again, it's an indispensable tool and one that I think
is singular and irreplaceable.
Senator Cornyn. My last question has to do with the Foreign
Agents Registration Act. As you know, this is a long-standing
law, requirement that agents of foreign governments have to
register under the law because, frankly, Congress needs to know
whether the lobbyist that's coming in to talk to them is
advocating on behalf of American citizens or on behalf of
foreign interests. So, we're continuing to work on that. We're
hopeful to be able to make some progress.
But in the interim, you know, there's been a lot of
discussion about TikTok. And one of the pieces of legislation
that I've introduced, called the PAID OFF Act, which required
TikTok to register as a foreign agent.
As you know, Russia Today--RT--and Sputnik have both
registered as foreign agents, and appropriately so, since
they're the arm of the Russian Federation, the Russian
Communist Party.
Do you think it would be appropriate for Congress to pass a
law requiring TikTok, as a owned--Chinese-owned company, to
register as a foreign agent--particularly in light of the fact
that this is a very convenient vehicle for the Chinese
Communist Party to engage in disinformation campaigns in
pursuit of their agenda?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, I'd want to
look at the legislation you referenced. I apologize, I haven't
reviewed it. I am very concerned about foreign-sourced
technology like TikTok, and I've spoken about this before,
about the threat that it poses.
And I will put in a plug here for other legislation that I
have also become familiar with and that I have issued
statements in support of--and that's the RESTRICT Act, which I
think would give us a rules-based approach to address foreign-
sourced technology like TikTok--like the next TikTok, like
Huawei, and the Kaspersky Lab, the increasing prevalence of
foreign-sourced technology, and the threats that they pose by
doing business here and having millions and millions of users.
We need the type of approach that is put forward in the
RESTRICT Act to address those.
Senator Cornyn. Thank you very much.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Cornyn. Senator Welch.
Senator Welch. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Deputy Attorney General, I want to ask a couple of
questions about war crimes and pursuing war criminals and the
role that the United States can play in that--savage crimes,
obviously, in Ukraine. At some point--hopefully soon, but no
one's optimistic--that war will end, but the prosecution of
those criminals must be continued.
We've played an active role, our country, in pursuing war
crimes and the people who have perpetrated them, even decades
after the violence has ended. Can you tell us how the DOJ has
worked with the international partners in the past to pursue
those who are responsible for crimes against humanity?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, we have a long
history, and unfortunately, history has required us, on some of
the atrocities that have previously been committed--has
required us to develop this expertise.
And we have a group of prosecutors in the Justice
Department, the Human Rights and Special Prosecutions Section,
who gained notoriety and expertise by literally hunting down
Nazi war criminals for decades--dozens of them, for decades and
decades.
And we have shown that our memory is very long and we will
go wherever it takes to amass the evidence and to find these
perpetrators.
Thankfully, because of the work this Committee and this
Congress did, we now have the ability to ensure--and the tools
that we need to ensure that war criminals, including those from
the current atrocities being perpetrated in Ukraine, will not
find safe haven here in the United States.
Senator Welch. And you're talking now specifically, as
well, about Russian nationals who are responsible for many of
these war crimes?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely. So, thanks to
the work of this Committee and this Congress, that gave us
what's called ``present in'' jurisdiction, a war criminal
likely after the conflict cannot find safe haven here in the
United States.
A Russian war criminal will not be able to burrow in and
find refuge here in the United States like some Nazi war
criminals were able to do. So, thanks to that authority, we
will be able to bring those prosecutions, and we've got
dedicated investigators and prosecutors who are more than up to
the task.
Senator Welch. Thank you. I want to ask you a little bit
about sharing highly sensitive and classified information with
allies. That was very, very helpful at the beginning of the
Ukraine war, when, in fact, our intelligence showed that there
was going to be an effort on the part of Russia to do false
flag propaganda. And by sharing it, it really busted that open.
I want to ask you, just in general, how you are working
with the Intelligence Community and interagency partners to
determine what information may be shared with coalition
partners.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, Senator, as you point
out, we really did, in the Intelligence Community and our
national security community, really kind of change its
orientation in the lead-up to the Russian aggression and
continues to this day to be more transparent with our partners
about what we're seeing.
I mentioned to Senator Cornyn what we were able to glean
from Section 702 collection about atrocities happening in
Ukraine and being able to then share that with our partners, to
galvanize them to come together with us. We have changed our
orientation and being more transparent with our partners. The
Justice Department, with the FBI being part of the Intelligence
Community, are part of those discussions.
Senator Welch. So, you've always got to make a tradeoff--
what's the gain, what's the loss--when it comes to some of the
sensitive intelligence that you have to decide, share or not
share? Can you just give us some indication of how you go
through that calculation?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, this is obviously not
in my current hat. In my prior roles as the President's
Homeland Security and Counterterrorism advisor, I would be part
of those discussions. And I think you want to weigh the ability
to bring our partners along, share information with them so
that they can take action, and also make sure that we are not
jeopardizing sources and methods that could prove more helpful
in the long run.
Senator Welch. Okay. Thank you very much. I'll yield back----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you.
Senator Welch [continuing]. Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Senator Blackburn.
Senator Blackburn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for
being here with us today.
I want to talk with you just a little bit. Just looking at
Vladimir Putin, Ukraine, what is going on there, I think we all
know that he is a thug and a war criminal.
And you look at the atrocities that have been committed in
Ukraine, and we also know that you've got other bad actors--
China, North Korea, Iran--that are watching very closely.
And when you see this, when you see the genocide that China
is carrying out against the Uyghurs, what they've done to the
Hong Kong freedom fighters in brutalizing them, their history
and continued brutalization of the Mongolians and the Tibetans,
and now you look at the bullying they're doing to Taiwan, and
to the island nations, and the Philippines, and--then what I
would like to know is what your coordination is, what you're
doing in conjunction with other agencies that are focused on
these human rights abuses.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, I quite agree with
you that Russia--I'm sorry, China and Iran and other states--as
I said to Senator Graham--I think are watching what Putin is
doing in Ukraine. And that's why, of course, there must be
accountability.
When it comes to China and other states who are projecting
power and perpetrating human rights abuses, as you laid out, we
are using our authorities to hold them to account, whether it's
malicious cyber actors, whether it's--and I would point to a
case that we just announced earlier this week, where we've
indicted dozens of Chinese nationals for brazenly perpetrating
a campaign of intimidation by setting up police stations in
Downtown Manhattan.
Senator Blackburn. Yes. We've talked a lot about that
lately. Are you focused on the Wagner Group----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, Senator.
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. And what they're doing?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely.
Senator Blackburn. Okay. Because you continue to hear
about--they're trying to branch out----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Mm-hmm.
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. And, of course, the abuse
they're carrying out there--I think we want to know about that.
Do you feel that the Biden family engagement with China has
compromised the position that this administration is able to
take against China, to really hold them to account?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, this
administration, this Justice Department is giving no quarter to
China's----
Senator Blackburn. Okay.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Malicious
activities. We have brought cases against malicious cyber
activities, including members of the PLA, the People's
Liberation Army----
Senator Blackburn. Okay.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Perpetrating
aggressive acts in the cyber realm----
Senator Blackburn. Right.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Those who are
perpetrating human rights abuses.
Senator Blackburn. Okay. Let me ask you about Ukrainian
children. I'm from Tennessee, and we have several churches in
the Nashville area, my church being one of them, that have
ministries in Ukraine. And I have a good friend who has a
program for orphans there in Ukraine.
And, of course, we've heard just horrific stories about the
Russians kidnapping children and taking them to reeducation
camps in Russia.
Senator Peters and I introduced a resolution, actually
reintroduced it, condemning this action, and I know that others
are looking at this.
So, would you classify what they're doing to these children
a war of genocide, the things that are being carried out
against not only the Ukrainian people but also specifically
against the children? How do you classify that?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, I think the
Russians and the Russian war machine is perpetrating war
crimes, crimes of aggression, crimes against humanity,
specifically when it comes----
Senator Blackburn. Genocide?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. To children.
Genocide, Senator, requires a specific intent. I'm going to be
a little lawyerly with you, I'm sorry. But to----
Senator Blackburn. I think this----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Show that
you're trying to----
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. Is a pretty specific
intent, when you look at what they are doing and you look at
the human rights abuses. And I do think it needs our
attention----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. If I may, Senator, I quite
agree with you. We should leave--and we will leave nothing on
the table. We've got a genocide statute. If we develop
competent evidence to be able to pursue that, we certainly
should do it.
Senator Blackburn. Are you putting the same attention to
the kids that are being trafficked at the Southern Border?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Senator, we are putting our
resources also on human trafficking, as I talked with Senator
Hirono about. Indeed, we established a task force specifically
about the human trafficking----
Senator Blackburn. Well, my----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. And smuggling.
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. Time has expired, and I
have to tell you, people are getting so tired, they're
exhausted, and just--their hearts break for what they see on
news reports and footage, whether it is coming at the Southern
Border, whether it's what is happening in Ukraine, whether it's
the stories about these reeducation camps and the way these
children are being treated. And the fact that it is just
something up for discussion is really disappointing. We need
action.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I agree, Senator. I hope
you'll support our request for a crimes against humanity
statute, which would allow us to bring accountability for
exactly the types of crimes you're talking about.
Chair Durbin. Senator Tillis----
[Voice heard off microphone.]
Chair Durbin. I'm sorry, Senator Padilla's returned.
Senator Padilla, I'm not sorry you returned. I'm happy you
returned.
Senator Padilla. You sure about that? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco, I want to join the chorus
of my colleagues here, thanking you for joining us today to
discuss efforts to hold Russian war criminals and kleptocrats
accountable during this unlawful invasion of Ukraine.
I certainly appreciate your work and the work of the
Department and look forward to assisting in any way possible to
ensure that Ukrainian victims of war receive the justice they
deserve.
Now, I understand--the KleptoCapture Task Force was brought
up earlier in the hearing. I understand that it's responsible
for assisting the enforcement of sanctions, export
restrictions, and economic countermeasures that the U.S.
imposed in response to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
In February, the Task Force unsealed two cases charging
various crimes involving counterintelligence operations and
violations of U.S. export laws. Can you describe how the
creation of the Task Force has improved the administration's
abilities to enforce sanctions against Russia and hold bad
actors accountable?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, the Task Force
KleptoCapture--first of all, I appreciate the kind words for
the leadership of the Justice Department, but it's the men and
women who are doing the investigating and the prosecuting who
really deserve the kudos. They have been working flat out since
the brutal invasion over a year ago.
In fact, within 9 days of that invasion, we stood up Task
Force KleptoCapture, bringing together expertise from across
the Department and indeed across the Federal Government,
including the Intelligence Community.
And this is something I've seen that I think is really a
game changer. We--now I get, in my morning intelligence
briefing, information from the Intelligence Community about
where some of these Russian oligarch assets are, and that
information is fed to the Task Force so they're able to go
after it. So, it has really changed our orientation and how
we're doing this type of work.
They have been unrelenting, but again I will say, we're
leaving some money on the table. We want to expand our ability
to go after and seize and forfeit, specifically, the proceeds
from export control violations, for instance, that could go to
the benefit of the Ukrainian people.
Senator Padilla. Great. Now, in a hearing here last year,
Director Adams spoke to the long-term goal of prosecuting those
who provide aid to sanctioned entities, like Russia, seeking to
evade accountability. Can you give us an overview of how the
Task Force will carry out this effort and describe how the Task
Force collaborates with foreign allies in reaching its goals?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Sure. So, the Task Force--
first, as you point out, we've been going after the oligarchs
and their assets. But, importantly, we're also going after
their enablers: the accountants, the vendors, the lawyers, the
folks who are helping them hide--the oligarchs, that is--
helping the oligarchs hide their assets, you know, under very
byzantine financial structures and to find any dark corner of
the financial system.
So, for that, we need to work with our international
allies, so we have joined forces with our European and other
allies in something called the REPO Task Force--there's a lot
that goes into the naming of these task forces--the Russian
Elites, Proxies, and Oligarchs Task Force.
That brings together all of the work and the expertise from
our international partners who are vital to us being able to
seize those private jets that Senator Graham mentioned--to
seize and forfeit those luxury properties that we're going
after. In every one of these cases, we need and have gained
vital international cooperation.
Senator Padilla. Okay. Is there any additional support you
need from the Committee or from Congress to address any issues
you have with any data collection or enforcement?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, thank you for that
offer to make my pitch, again, for ensuring that we expand our
ability to forfeit. So, right now, we are seizing assets of
named oligarchs, and if they are pursuant to the particular
Executive order that this Congress passed, an authority for us
to forfeit those assets to the benefit of Ukraine, that's
terrific.
But right now, the assets that we seize and forfeit as a
result of, for instance, export control violations, we can't
transfer those proceeds to the benefit of Ukraine, and we'd
really appreciate the broadened authority for us to be able to,
again, make these oligarchs pay for the rebuilding of Ukraine.
Senator Padilla. Okay. And in my time remaining, just one
last question.
A recent ICC report found that Russia has committed war
crimes and human rights violations, something that we've all
recognized for some time now, including attacks on civilians
and energy-related infrastructure, willful killings, unlawful
confinement, torture, sexual violence, unlawful deportations of
children. We've heard this from several Members of the
Committee.
Now, following the report, the ICC issued arrest warrants
for the Russian president and the Russian commissioner for
children's rights, for these abuses. Can you just spend a
minute talking about the significance associated with this
being the first time a global court has issued a warrant
against a leader who's also a member of the U.N. Security
Council?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Well, it's obviously a very
significant step, and it's certainly one that is justified,
based on all of the recounting that you have done, and other
Members of the Committee have recounted the atrocities being
perpetrated in Ukraine by Russia. So, it is both justified and,
I agree, a significant step.
Senator Padilla. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Chair Durbin. Senator Tillis.
Senator Tillis. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Ms. Monaco, thank you
for being here, and thank you for your responsiveness on a
number of matters my office have reached out to.
I first want to start by thanking all the law enforcement
officers in the DOJ. They're doing great work. The vast
majority of them are fantastic. There may be a few that we need
to hold accountable, but I'm wearing this shirt and this pin
today to let them know that I back them.
Quick questions. I wouldn't ask you to say this, because
you're more measured. You're an attorney. I'm a Senator. Is it
fair to say that if we go dark with Section 7 of FISA--702,
703, 704--later this year, that Putin, Xi Jinping, North Korea,
Iran are going to throw a party?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes, Senator, and on this----
Senator Tillis. Yes.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Matter, I will
not be measured. It is an indispensable tool, and we----
Senator Tillis. It would be devastating----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Have to
reauthorize.
Senator Tillis [continuing]. To some of the most malign
actors across the globe right now, if we go dark. So, that's
why I want to talk about 702 and really follow onto some of
what----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Okay.
Senator Tillis [continuing]. Senator Cornyn talked about.
Can you explain for the Committee and the public why the FBI
conducts these searches? Why are you going into that data?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Absolutely, Senator.
First of all, the FBI is the single agency that is actually
responsible for doing something about foreign threats that
reach American soil. So----
Senator Tillis. Yes.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. That's what
people need to understand. They need to be able to act on the
information that our Intelligence Community provides.
Senator Tillis. You all have implemented a lot of--I've got
limited time----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes.
Senator Tillis [continuing]. And I'm not going to go to a
7-minute round so Mr. Ossoff can speak. But can you provide
just more detail about the change I've seen--the demonstration
of some of the controls you have in place?
I would take you to task if I thought we were surveilling
American citizens. You don't want to do that.
Can you talk a little bit about the safeguards that you've
implemented and why you feel like it addresses the majority, if
not all, of the concerns expressed by Members of Congress?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Sure. Thank you, Senator,
for taking the time to come down and see the changes that have
been put in place. I would urge and invite----
Senator Tillis. I recommend it to every Member.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. All Members to
come, and we'd be happy to facilitate that. The compliance
issues that surfaced with regard to 702 are ones that the
Attorney General and I took--and the FBI Director take very,
very seriously, so we put in place a number of remedial
measures, first and foremost, making sure that analysts and
agents can't just query, as a matter of default, the 702
collection.
Senator Tillis. I think thematically--because I do want to
get to a couple of other questions, Ms. Monaco. I hate cutting
people off. But I think thematically, every Member of Congress
needs to go over there and see how the Department of Justice,
the FBI, have been responsive to our concerns, that the checks
in place are important.
I did ask a question about the demo, about what
consequences are, with all those safeguards, for a trained
person to make a mistake, there needs to be accountability
there.
I'm going to talk a little bit about that later, but----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Mm-hmm.
Senator Tillis [continuing]. We'll discuss that after this
hearing. But I think it's critically important. I think you've
been responsive, and I think our Members need to look at what
we'd lose.
I think in response to one of Senator Welch's questions,
you made reference to some of the authorities under the Justice
for Victims of War Crimes Act, basically being after--to go
after the bad actors, not provide safe haven in the United
States.
If I had time, I'd talk about--if I were one of those
people, if I were going to come to the United States, I'd pay
20--$30,000 dollars to a cartel, get the camo outfit and the
carpet booties that they put on their feet, and cross the
Tucson sector. Because that's a way to get to this country with
very low likelihood that you're going to get caught. Which is
why Border--it came up when Senator Blackburn was asking her
question.
We've got to understand there is a way for them to get here
and we won't know who they are, so there is a nexus with Border
Security. Has the Justice Department used the additional
authority under the Victims of War Crimes Act to prosecute
Russian criminals yet?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. The--not for war crimes
yet, Senator, but we are working day and night to make sure
that we hold Russian war criminals accountable, and we're
building those cases.
Senator Tillis. I think for the purposes of following the
implementation of that Act, it would be helpful to inform us,
to the extent that you can, on any prosecutions, particularly
for Russian criminals, that were enabled by any provisions that
we have in that Act. I think that'd be very----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Be happy to----
Senator Tillis [continuing]. Helpful.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Do that. We
have identified, I will say, a number of suspects in the
investigations that we are pursuing.
Senator Tillis. And, Mr. Chair, I have to ask this
question. I'm willing to go--or stick for a second round if I
must, just to ask a final question.
Okay. There are reports that the Department of Defense is
blocking the sharing of information gathered by American
Intelligence agencies with the International Criminal Court,
partly because they believe it could set a precedent that might
pave the way to prosecute Americans.
In your mind, is there a way to afford--or a solution that
could minimize the concerns raised by the DOD and the ICC, to
have this information that could be used to prosecute Russian
war criminals?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I think there's a way to do
this without creating any negative precedent. And the narrow
authority that the Congress gave us, I think, is--provides that
basis.
Senator Tillis. Okay. I've got follow-up questions on
international tribunal, a number of other gears that I think we
have to set in motion to make it very clear to Putin and any of
his supporters that they're going to--they're going to
ultimately answer for their horrific actions. Thank you, Mr.
Chair.
Chair Durbin. Thank you very much, Senator Tillis. Senator
Ossoff.
Senator Ossoff. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And, Deputy Attorney General, nice to see you again. Thank
you for your presence today.
This was addressed in your opening remarks, and several
other Senators have raised it, but I just want to return to, in
a litany of grievous crimes and instances of brutality and
atrocities, one that I think is particularly despicable, which
is the forcible removal of Ukrainian children from their
families, their apparent relocation to Russia or Russia-
controlled territory.
And I'm sure that for everyone, and in particular for any
parent in the room today, the theft of one's child by an
invading foreign power is an unimaginable and horrific thing to
contemplate, and there are thousands of Ukrainians, it appears,
who are experiencing that. So, what more can the Department do
to maximize the probability that there is personal
accountability for anyone involved in the design or execution
of that program?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. So, Senator, it is
unthinkable. It's almost unimaginable, but yet we know it's
occurring--the forcible removal, the disappearing of children
from Ukraine by Russian forces. We are doing everything we can
within the tools that we have, the war crimes investigators
that I've mentioned previously.
But the single thing I think that this Congress could do to
help us more would be to pass a crimes against humanity
statute. That would allow us to prosecute individuals--
individual accountability for widespread, systematic acts of
the type you're talking about, that we currently can't bring
prosecutions for. Widespread, systematic attacks that are
politically motivated against a population, a civilian
population--in this case, children.
We need the capability and the authority to do--to bring
those crimes against humanity, because that's what it is. It is
a crime against humanity, the most atrocious and heinous type
of crime that can be committed.
Senator Ossoff. Well, I appreciate that response, and I
know Chairman Durbin has particular interest in this matter.
And Senator Blackburn and I, who jointly lead the Human Rights
Subcommittee, have had discussions about how we can support
efforts to strengthen relevant U.S. statutes to ensure
accountability for those who engage in war crimes. And so we
will likely be, as we collaborate with the Chairman, seeking
technical assistance from the Department, as well.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Be happy to provide that.
Senator Ossoff. Thank you. What can you learn from the
experience, thus far, operating in this environment, that might
assist the Department in providing a similar service or
embarking upon a similar project elsewhere in the world, where
on any given day, tragically, there are many places where
people are being subjected to horrific crimes?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. A few things, Senator.
One, international unity and galvanized effort is
indispensable to our ability to push back on the type of
aggression and brutality that we're seeing from Russia.
So, that--that's true in our efforts to bring about
accountability for war crimes, doing so hand in hand with our
Ukrainian partners and our international partners.
That's true when it comes to trying to disrupt the whole
ecosystem that is fueling the Russian war machine, so going
after and isolating them from the global financial system,
going after the enablers who are feeding the Russian war
machine, closing off access to technology, to financial
resources that help them retool and rearm.
All of that is what we are doing to push back against
Russia, and that takes both an international effort and pooling
all the expertise across our own Government. And that's what
we've been able to do, I think quite effectively, with things
like Task Force KleptoCapture and the REPO Task Force.
Senator Ossoff. Thank you for your answer. And building on
Senator Tillis' question, do I understand there's an
interagency conversation ongoing about implementation of the
statute that authorizes some intelligence sharing for purposes
of supporting potential ICC prosecutions? Do you have a
timeline for when that deliberation may be concluded, so we can
move forward with implementation of the law?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I do not have a timeline,
Senator.
Senator Ossoff. But it's being worked through diligently?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. It is, Senator.
Senator Ossoff. Okay. Thank you very much.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Ossoff. Senator Cruz.
Senator Cruz. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Monaco, welcome.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you.
Senator Cruz. You have a very important job. You're the
number two person in the Department of Justice. Every U.S.
Attorney reports to you. The U.S. Marshals report to you. You
are responsible for day-to-day operations of the Department of
Justice and, in particular, the criminal justice aspects of the
Department of Justice. Is all of that correct?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. That's correct.
Senator Cruz. It is unfortunate, Ms. Monaco, that as you
look back over the last 2\1/2\ years, this Department of
Justice, I believe, has been the most partisan Department of
Justice we've ever seen. And that is directly contrary to the
mission of DOJ. DOJ is meant to be nonpartisan. It is meant to
enforce the law regardless of party.
I had hopes that Merrick Garland would actually do that,
when he was confirmed. Those hopes have been shattered.
You have been a loyal deputy, standing alongside that
partisan corruption of Department of Justice. You have been
willing to devote massive resources to targeting individuals
that are perceived to be political opponents of the White
House. And you have been willing to devote zero resources to
protecting individuals who are perceived to be political
opponents of the White House.
I want to ask you about a statute you've been asked about
already, 18 U.S.C. 1507. You're familiar with this statute?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Yes.
[Poster is displayed.]
Senator Cruz. It's a criminal statute that says, ``Whoever
. . . with the intent of influencing any judge . . . pickets or
parades . . . in or near . . . a building or residences
occupied or used by such judge . . . shall be fined''--or
imprisoned--``under this title or imprisoned not more than one
year, or both.''
Now, the entire country has seen hundreds of protesters
outside the homes of Supreme Court Justices, night after night
after night. You turn on your TV and you see----
[Points to poster.]
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Violations of this criminal
statute over and over and over again. How many prosecutions has
DOJ brought under 18 U.S.C. Sec. 1507, under your leadership?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. There are no--there have
been no prosecutions under 1507. We are pursuing an attempted
murder case against an individual who----
Senator Cruz. Zero is----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Threatened----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. The answer.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Justice
Kavanaugh.
Senator Cruz. If--I'm quite aware, and you're responsible
for that, allowing these protests night after night after
night. The violent threat of homicide of the individual who
traveled across the country, attempting to murder a Supreme
Court Justice--that was fueled by DOJ refusing to enforce this
statute.
Now, it's not an accident that DOJ refused to enforce this
statute. The U.S. Marshals put up--gave a presentation--the
general counsel's office of the U.S. Marshals. If you look at
one of the pages from that presentation, the general counsel's
office----
[Poster is displayed.]
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Stated the goals of the
residential and personal protection mission: Keep SCOTUS
Justices and their family free from physical harm; do not
interfere with lawful First Amendment protected activity;
avoid, unless absolutely necessary, criminal enforcement
actions involving the protest or protesters, particularly on
public space; and making arrests and initiating prosecutions is
not the goal of the President's--of the Marshals' presence at
SCOTUS residences.
Are you familiar with this presentation?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I am. I'm familiar with the
fact that the U.S. Marshals Service Director has been explicit,
has been clear that the Attorney General has repeatedly
directed him to enforce all Federal laws, including 1507, and
that his number one priority, and that of his many deputies
assigned to a 24/7 security presence, is to protect the life,
the safety, the property of the Justices and----
Senator Cruz. Did you----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Their----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Or anyone from the DAG's office
meet with the U.S. Marshals Service and discuss Section 1507?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I regularly meet with the
Director of the Marshals Service. The----
Senator Cruz. And----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Attorney
General----
Senator Cruz. Have you discussed 1507?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I discussed the--the
Attorney General has been quite clear, and I have been quite
clear with the Director of the Marshals Service. The----
Senator Cruz. Are you----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Attorney
General's----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Familiar with this presentation?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I've seen those slides, if
they are the ones that Senator Britt presented to the Attorney
General.
But I want to be quite clear, Senator, about the direction
given to the Marshals Service through the Director of the
Marshals Service. He has been clear that the Attorney General
directed him repeatedly to enforce all Federal laws, to make----
Senator Cruz. With respect, Ms. Monaco----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. His number one
priority----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. That is demonstrably false
because this is written instruction--making arrests and
initiating prosecution is not the goal.
That's not an instruction to enforce the law. That is
exactly the opposite. It is 180 degrees. It is instructing them
it is not the goal to arrest anybody despite the fact that the
criminal statute said they shall be imprisoned.
You made a political decision. Merrick Garland made a
political decision that, because you agree with the protesters,
you don't like the decision the Supreme Court Justices made,
the Marshals were instructed don't arrest anyone and don't
enforce Federal law. Isn't that correct?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. That is not correct because
the Attorney General and I and the Marshals Service Director
are so concerned about potential threats to the Justices, the
Attorney General directed, in an unprecedented step, 24/7----
Senator Cruz. But what this says in writing----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. 24/7----
Senator Cruz. What does this say in writing?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. I don't have the right
glasses on for that.
But, Senator, the Attorney General was very clear with the
Director of the Marshals Service, and the Marshals Service
Director has said the same thing----
Senator Cruz. The word ``not''----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. That the
number----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Is even underlined.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. The number one
priority----
[Gavel is tapped.]
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Given to the
Marshals Service for their unprecedented protection detail for
the Supreme Court Justices is to protect their life, their----
Senator Cruz. But----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Safety, and--
--
Senator Cruz [continuing]. To ignore----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. Their
property.
Senator Cruz [continuing]. 1507.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. To protect
their life, their safety----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. To ignore Federal criminal law.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Respectfully disagree with
that characterization, sir.
Senator Cruz. That's what the written instruction says--
``not'' is underlined--do not make arrests, do not initiate
prosecutions. Up is not down.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. The Director of the
Marshals Service has been very clear. The Attorney General
directed him to enforce all Federal laws, but that his number
one priority is to ensure the safety----
Senator Cruz. Ms. Monaco----
Deputy Attorney General Monaco [continuing]. And the
protection----
Senator Cruz [continuing]. What you are saying is
objectively false.
[Gavel is tapped.]
Chair Durbin. The time of the Senator has expired.
There are no further Members to ask in the 5-minute round,
and we're going to conclude the hearing. I want to thank the
Deputy Attorney General for being present.
I would like to make a couple of points, as Chair.
First, the safety and security of all, including elected
officials, is the highest priority. There is never an excuse
for violence nor destruction of property in the pursuit of any
perceived constitutional right. I think that should be agreed
on by everyone here.
We have passed legislation in this Committee specifically
to protect Federal judges and their families. The reason is,
there've been some horrible tragedies--one occurred in Chicago,
another one occurred in New Jersey, and led us to put new--
establish new standards in place for the protection of the men
and women who serve in the judiciary.
I might say that the one bill that we passed from the
Committee and sent to the floor--the Anderl Judicial Security
and Privacy Act, was held up on the floor for almost a year by
the junior Senator from Kentucky. One year.
When protection should have been issued, it was not,
because of one Senator's decision. But finally it was allowed
to move forward, and it now is the law. I'm sure--I hope I can
say that we're doing everything we can to enforce it.
Let me also say that it is interesting to listen to the
debate about exercise of First Amendment rights. It appears
that when the Department of Justice issued a memorandum
relative to school board meetings and safety at those meetings,
it became extremely controversial because some said it was
dampening or hindering parents to express themselves at school
board meetings if they disagreed with school policy. I read it:
To protect the members of the school board who, in my State and
others, have been threatened with their lives, intimidated to
the point where they resigned from the school boards because of
the coercion that was being extended toward them.
Also, I can't understand this theory that what happened in
the Capitol building on January 6th was so innocent. It was far
from innocent. I believe some 800 have been prosecuted. Does
the Deputy know the number?
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Over a thousand, Senator.
Chair Durbin. Over a thousand have been prosecuted.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Charges brought. Excuse me,
Chairman--over a thousand charges brought.
Chair Durbin. Over a thousand charges brought. It is hard
to imagine that anyone could keep a straight face and say they
stepped in through a broken window for a sightseeing tour of
the Capitol. That is incredible. What happened that day: 150
members of law enforcement were assaulted, some very seriously,
suffering injuries they're still trying to recover from. And
there was also the reality that a number of people died as a
result of that insurrection.
The fact that it happened January 6th was no coincidence.
January 6th, 2021, if I'm not mistaken--I know I'm not
mistaken--was the day chosen when we counted electoral votes to
establish who would be the President of the United States.
There was an effort by those who denied the results of that
election to question its results.
And I can tell you that that was even witnessed yesterday
by the compromise--or settlement that resulted in Fox News
paying close to $800 million as a fine to Dominion corporation
that manufactures election machinery, on the premise that there
were misstatements made on the air about what happened that
day.
I hope that this has been brought to rest, this whole
question of the legitimacy of the election in 2020, but it
still is being played out.
I'd like to say a word, if I can, about Section 702.
Section 702 is a device, or procedure used by our Government to
keep us safe. I believe that is the premise of it, to make sure
that if we suspect that someone overseas wishes us ill or is
going to do something in a negative way, we learn that ahead of
time and stop it from happening. That is a noble and proper
goal for it to pursue.
The reality is, though, in the process of intercepting
messages from foreigners, we often involve Americans in the
same conversation--millions of them. And the question is, are
they losing--are those Americans losing their constitutional
rights for due process by the 702 procedure?
I have voted against 702 consistently in the past, but I've
been assured there will be efforts made by this administration
to put in safeguards so that innocent civilians will be
protected from losing their constitutional rights in this
process. I hope we can work together on that goal ultimately to
be achieved.
So, there are many issues before us. I thank you for your
patience----
Senator Cruz. Mr. Chairman? Mr. Chairman, you have taken a
second round of questioning.
Chair Durbin. No, that wasn't a second----
Senator Cruz. I would ask for one----
Chair Durbin [continuing]. Round of questions. That was a
Chairman's statement.
Senator Cruz. Well, you also asked questions, and you
offered a moment ago an opportunity for a second round.
Chair Durbin. No, I didn't.
Senator Cruz. I would certainly----
Chair Durbin. No, I didn't.
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Appreciate that.
Chair Durbin. I did not offer for a second round.
Senator Cruz. Okay. So, your rules are you get a second
round of questioning and no one else does?
Chair Durbin. No, the rules are you don't make them up. I'm
the Chairman.
Senator Cruz. You make them up.
Chair Durbin. I appreciate the Deputy Attorney General
appearing before the Committee. I'd like to----
Senator Cruz. You're continuing your pattern, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Well, you're continuing your deportment.
I'd like to conclude today's hearing by sharing the words
of a leader I deeply admire. I had a chance to meet with him
last year. Sadly, I fear I may not have that privilege again.
His name is Vladimir Kara-Murza, a fearless Russian
dissident and a champion for democracy. On Monday, Mr. Kara-
Murza was sentenced to 25 years in prison by Russia for
speaking out against Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
Last week, The Washington Post published his final
testimony in the sham trial. Mr. Kara-Murza said, and I quote,
``I know that the day will come when the darkness over our
country will dissipate . . . when a war will be called a war
and a usurper a usurper; and when those who kindled and
unleashed this war, rather than those who tried to stop it,
will be recognized as criminals. This day will come as
inevitably as spring follows even the coldest winter.''
Mr. Kara-Murza may not live to see justice for Russia's
crimes against Ukraine, but he is absolutely right. That day
will come. It's only a question of when.
And we in the Senate have the power to ensure that that day
comes sooner rather than later. The people of Ukraine are
counting on us.
Again, Deputy Attorney General, thank you for being with us
today.
Deputy Attorney General Monaco. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
[Gavel is tapped.]
[Whereupon, at 12:10 p.m., the hearing was adjourned.]
[Additional material submitted for the record follows.]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
A P P E N D I X
The following submissions are available at:
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CHRG-118shrg60848/pdf/CHRG-
118shrg
60848-add1.pdf
Submitted by Chair Durbin:
American Bar Association (ABA), statement........................ 2
Human Rights Watch, statement.................................... 7
Scheffer, David J., statement.................................... 11
United States Department of State, Office of Global Criminal
Justice, statement............................................ 18
[all]