[Senate Hearing 118-626]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
S. Hrg. 118-626
A THREAT TO JUSTICE EVERYWHERE:
STEMMING THE TIDE OF HATE
CRIMES IN AMERICA
=======================================================================
HEARING
before the
COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
----------
SEPTEMBER 17, 2024
----------
Serial No. J-118-78
----------
Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
www.judiciary.senate.gov
www.govinfo.gov
A THREAT TO JUSTICE EVERYWHERE:
STEMMING THE TIDE OF HATE CRIMES IN AMERICA
S. Hrg. 118-626
A THREAT TO JUSTICE EVERYWHERE:
STEMMING THE TIDE OF HATE
CRIMES IN AMERICA
=======================================================================
HEARING
before the
COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
SEPTEMBER 17, 2024
__________
Serial No. J-118-78
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
www.judiciary.senate.gov
www.govinfo.gov
______
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
60-121 WASHINGTON : 2025
COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois, Chair
SHELDON WHITEHOUSE, Rhode Island LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina,
AMY KLOBUCHAR, Minnesota Ranking Member
CHRISTOPHER A. COONS, Delaware CHARLES E. GRASSLEY, Iowa
RICHARD BLUMENTHAL, Connecticut JOHN CORNYN, Texas
MAZIE K. HIRONO, Hawaii MICHAEL S. LEE, Utah
CORY A. BOOKER, New Jersey TED CRUZ, Texas
ALEX PADILLA, California JOSH HAWLEY, Missouri
JON OSSOFF, Georgia TOM COTTON, Arkansas
PETER WELCH, Vermont JOHN KENNEDY, Louisiana
LAPHONZA BUTLER, California THOM TILLIS, North Carolina
MARSHA BLACKBURN, Tennessee
Joseph Zogby, Majority Staff Director
Kolan L. Davis, Minority Staff Director
C O N T E N T S
----------
OPENING STATEMENTS
Page
Durbin, Hon. Richard J........................................... 1
Graham, Hon. Lindsey O........................................... 3
WITNESSES
Berry, Maya...................................................... 5
Prepared statement........................................... 45
Responses to written questions............................... 98
Goldfeder, Mark.................................................. 7
Prepared statement........................................... 66
Responses to written questions............................... 107
Stern, Kenneth S................................................. 9
Prepared statement........................................... 74
Responses to written questions............................... 115
APPENDIX
Items submitted for the record................................... 43
A THREAT TO JUSTICE EVERYWHERE:
STEMMING THE TIDE OF HATE CRIMES IN
AMERICA
----------
TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 17, 2024
----------
United States Senate,
Committee on the Judiciary,
Washington, DC.
The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:15 a.m., in
Room G50, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Richard J.
Durbin, Chair of the Committee, presiding.
Present: Senators Durbin [presiding], Whitehouse,
Klobuchar, Blumenthal, Hirono, Padilla, Ossoff, Welch, Butler,
Graham, Grassley, Cornyn, Lee, Cruz, Hawley, Cotton, Kennedy,
and Blackburn.
OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. RICHARD J. DURBIN,
A U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF ILLINOIS
Chair Durbin. This meeting of the Senate Judiciary
Committee will come to order. I first want to apologize to the
witnesses and everyone present. Annually, the Judicial
Conference of the United States meets in the Supreme Court and
invites me and others to come and say a few words in the
morning. That's where I was, so blame the Chief Justice. And I
say that facetiously. I was honored to be invited.
This hearing, A Threat to Justice Everywhere: Stemming the
Tide of Hate Crimes in America, will come to order. At the
outset, I want to acknowledge the possible attempted
assassination of former President Trump. I'm relieved that no
one was hurt, and I thank the Secret Service and their law
enforcement partners for keeping the former President safe. My
staff was briefed by the Secret Service over the weekend, and
we were asked to keep--we asked them to keep us updated on the
investigation. As we will discuss today, violence and threats
of violence are always wrong, no matter the motive and no
matter the target.
I first held hearings on the growing threat of hate-
motivated violence in 2011; again in 2012, after a white
supremacist murdered seven worshippers at the Sikh Gurdwara in
Oak Creek, Wisconsin. Since I became Chair of this Committee,
we've held several more hearings on the subject, including a
hearing after the hostage crisis at the Colleyville, Texas
synagogue, where we heard compelling testimony from
Colleyville's rabbi, Charlie Cytron-Walker.
The FBI's most recent National hate crimes statistics
document 11,634 hate crimes, the highest number since the FBI
began reporting data. And since the horrific October 7 Hamas
attack on Israel, we have seen an increase in attacks on Jewish
Americans, Palestinian Americans, Arab Americans, and Muslim
Americans. I would like to play a video now to highlight two
especially horrific incidents.
[Video eis shown.]
Chair Durbin. I'd like to acknowledge that my constituent,
Hanaan Shahin, Wadea Al-Fayoume's mother, is in the audience. I
was honored to join my colleagues Senator Tammy Duckworth and
Congresswoman Delia Ramirez, introducing a resolution honoring
Wadea. Mrs. Shahin, I'm so sorry for your devastating loss.
We are also joined by Alan Mallinger; his wife, Lauren; and
their daughter Amy Rose Mallinger. Alan's mother and Amy's
grandmother was one of the 11 congregants murdered at the Tree
of Life Synagogue, the deadliest attack on Jews in American
history. I thank these survivors personally, and their families
and friends, for joining us this morning.
Since 2000, according to Federal law enforcement, white
supremacists have been responsible for more homicides than any
other domestic extremist group. White supremacists have been
more responsible than any other domestic extremist group. And
just this month, the Justice Department arrested and indicted
the leaders of the Terrorgram Collective, a white supremacist
terrorist group that allegedly solicits attacks against
minority communities and the assassination of U.S. public
officials, including a Jewish Senator.
Free speech is sacred in America, but public officials on
both sides of the aisle have a responsibility not to fan the
flames of hatred. The former President and his Vice
Presidential candidate have both spread the lie that Haitians
in Springfield, Ohio are eating cats and dogs. Everyone in
public life should condemn antisemitic and racist language and
disassociate themselves from demagogues who traffic in it. This
type of rhetoric can have deadly consequences. In recent days,
there have been numerous bomb and shooting threats in
Springfield, Ohio, and schools and other institutions have been
forced to close.
And look at the Tree of Life Synagogue shooting. On social
media, the shooter claimed that Jewish Americans were
conspiring to destroy the white race by encouraging non-white
immigrants to invade our country. This antisemitic and racist
Great Replacement conspiracy theory was also cited by the white
supremacists who murdered 10 Black Americans at the Tops Market
in Buffalo in 2022. In recent years, it has been echoed by the
former President and other political figures. Political
leaders, both Democrats and Republicans, must condemn hate
wherever and whenever is it spewed and avoid rhetoric that
could incite violence, because hate is inconsistent with who we
are as Americans and the diversity that has always strengthened
our Nation. With that, I'll turn to the Ranking Member, Senator
Graham, for his opening statement.
STATEMENT OF HON. LINDSEY O. GRAHAM,
A U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA
Senator Graham. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Number one, as to
the recent apparent attempt on President Trump's life, I do
want to thank the Secret Service agents on the ground for
acting quickly and responsibly, but when I heard the acting
director say the system worked, I could not disagree more. It
did not work. You can't have a man camped out by the golf
course for 12 hours with an AK-47 and scope on it, and say the
system worked. We're just very fortunate he stuck the barrel
through the fence before the President got to the golf hole in
question. I want to applaud the Secret Service agent who saw
the barrel, but this could've been a completely different story
if the man had just waited, saw President Trump, then acted.
The system is just broken. I don't know if it's resources.
I asked the acting director before. He said they're fine. I
don't buy that. Agents tell me they're working tremendous
hours. I'd like to have more agents, not less. I'd like to get
the Secret Service back into Treasury, where they were more
focused, but we'll talk about that another day. I'm just glad
we didn't have a worse outcome, but I think the system is
broken.
As to our hearing today, on May the 2nd, 2024, all
Republicans wrote a letter to Chairman Durbin: we implore you
to promptly hold a Judiciary Committee hearing to confront the
flagrant civil rights violations targeting Jewish students on
college campuses across America and expose the radical Islamic
ideology infiltrating our universities. The goal was to have a
hearing about why it's so hard to go to school if you're
Jewish.
And it's really hard to go to these schools if you're
Jewish. You're being knocked down; you're being spat on. It is
just completely out of control. This is not the hearing we're
getting, so, we'll work with what we've got. The House has had
10 hearings focused on antisemitism on the rise like it was in
the 30's, in my view. We're not talking about fringe elements
within any one group or crazy people. They exist throughout
society. What happened to the 6-year-old is just horrible. The
man will get whatever comes his way, and to me it's not enough.
I'm trying to focus on a systematic problem. America has a
systematic problem on college campuses. It is being funded, the
DNI says, not by Qatar, but by Iran. So, we have to deal with
this. This Committee should act not just in general but
specifically about what it's like to be Jewish in America in
2024. And it is not a good story.
So, I want to introduce into the record the original
request, if I may, and also introduce into the record a letter
I've got from the Union of Jewish Congregations of America, if
I may introduce both letters, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Without objection.
[The information appears as a submission for the record.]
Senator Graham. Okay. Now, the problem is really unnerving.
Two point 4 percent of Americans are Jewish. Sixty percent of
all religious-based hate crimes have been directed against the
Jewish people. There's something going on here that needs to be
addressed and better dealt with, and people in charge of these
universities need to be held more accountable.
As to what I'm trying to do, I've been working since last
April with the Biden administration to find a way to normalize
between Saudi Arabia and the State of Israel. That, to me, is
the answer to many problems that we face, Israel faces. And I'm
a strong advocate for ending the Arab-Israeli conflict. And a
beneficiary of that would be a Palestinian community better
treated, not run by terrorists, with a more hopeful life and a
secure Israel. Count me in for trying to end conflict. Count me
in for trying to reconcile the Arab and Jewish communities in
the Mideast and anywhere else.
That's not what I'm talking about today. I'm talking about
a rise throughout the world, but particularly here, against the
Jewish people. Examples of what you face: Columbia University,
intifada; Stanford University, somebody wearing a Hamas
headband; Princeton University, the Hamas material; Union
Station, July the 24th, Hamas is coming. This is all over the
country right now.
And let me just say this. Hamas is a homicidal terrorist
group dedicated not to uplifting the Palestinian people but
destroying the State of Israel. So, when you write Hamas,
you're either one of two things: blatantly antisemitic or dumb
as a rock. I'll let you pick. Hamas is a terrorist
organization. Everybody should condemn Hamas, not use their
name routinely and hold up their cause throughout college
campuses in America. So, what I hope we can get started in this
country is a conversation about what should be the result of
attending a school and being picked upon simply because of your
religion: in this case, being Jewish. The next one.
One of our witnesses says calling for the genocide of the
State of Israel should not get you disciplined. It should. It
should. You know, when David Duke was on colleges' campuses in
his time, handing out Nazi stuff, he should've been
disciplined. I disagree with that. I believe in free speech,
but I don't believe in advocating for the killing of an entire
class of people. That's not free speech.
So, what we have before us today as a Nation is a moment of
choosing. We can choose to ignore this, lump it in with every
other problem we've got in the country, or we can focus on it.
I prefer to focus on it. I prefer to let the American Jewish
community know, enough is enough. We're going to be there for
you. We're going to have your back. And we're not rising to the
occasion. I would urge my friends on the other side: let's have
a hearing focused on this problem, not lumping this problem in
with every other problem we have. This is unique to the time in
which we live. It is getting out of control.
As to rhetoric, yes, we can all do better. I get that. But
this idea that one group is going to destroy America or one
person's going to destroy America needs to come to an end.
Nobody's going to destroy America. The Iranians would, if they
could. So, Mr. Chairman, I hope we can follow-up with another
hearing focused on our original request, which is combating
antisemitism on college campuses making it really difficult, if
you're a Jewish parent, to send your kid to college.
Chair Durbin. Senator Graham, you and I agree on more than
we disagree, and we certainly agree that hate crimes should be
treated seriously, whatever their origin, whatever their
purpose. They are unacceptable in this Nation of ours.
Prioritizing which group is being discriminated against the
worst I don't believe is a valid exercise of our authority
here. What we are trying to do is to identify a problem in
America that extends beyond the Jewish population to the Arab
population to the Palestinian population. All of those hate
crimes are unacceptable. All of them are unacceptable.
The letter which you asked me to enter into the record
calls on us to pass a bill that I know quite well, the Domestic
Terrorism Prevention Act. That bill passed the House of
Representatives. It was called by Senator Schumer in the
Senate. It's a bill that I sponsored. It was stopped on the
floor and filibustered by the Republican side. I don't want to
draw a conclusion about their views on hatred and violence, but
I think we all ought to acknowledge the fact that work needs to
be done, and we shouldn't tie ourselves in knots but should
work toward ending hate crimes in America.
At this point, we're going to turn to the witnesses who
appear before us. I'll introduce the majority witnesses. The
Ranking Member will introduce the minority witness. Our first
witness is Maya Berry, co-chair of the Hate Crimes Task Force
at The Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights. She is
also the executive director of the Arab American Institute. We
are also joined by Ken Stern, director of the Bard Center for
the Study of Hate. Mr. Stern previously served as director of
the Division of Antisemitism and Extremism at the American
Jewish Committee, where he worked for 25 years. Ranking Member
Graham, would you like to introduce your witness?
Senator Graham. Mr. Chairman, our witness is Rabbi Mark
Goldfeder. He is CEO and director of the National Jewish
Advocacy Center. He was appointed in 2021 to the United States
Holocaust Memorial Museum Council. He handles cases involving
antisemitism in its many manifestations and has worked with
local, State, Federal legislatures on measures to support the
Jewish community. He is also an attorney. Thank you.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Graham. After I swear in
the witnesses, each one will have 5 minutes to provide an
opening statement. There will be rounds of questions. Each
Senator will have 5 minutes, and please try to remain within
your time. So, would each of the witnesses please stand to be
sworn in?
[Witnesses are sworn in.]
Let the record reflect that both--that all witnesses have
answered in the affirmative. Ms. Berry, you may proceed with
your opening statement. Make sure your microphone is on.
STATEMENT OF MAYA BERRY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR,
ARAB AMERICAN INSTITUTE; CO-CHAIR, HATE
CRIMES TASK FORCE, THE LEADERSHIP CONFERENCE
ON CIVIL AND HUMAN RIGHTS
Ms. Berry. Good morning, Chairman Durbin, Ranking Member
Graham, and distinguished Members of this Committee. Thank you
for convening this hearing today to address the crisis of hate
crime in our country. I want to begin by offering my
condolences and support to Im [phonetic] Wadea on the tragic
loss of her son. I also want to acknowledge the members of the
Tree of Life Synagogue in Pittsburgh, who are also here, and
extend my condolences and the support to them, as well. I'm
truly sorry for your immeasurable loss, and the commitment that
we make to continue to focus on hate is rooted in the need to
address the crisis your families in pain have endured.
Understanding the nature of hate crime data, I would
suggest this room includes other victims of hate crimes: some
who have reported it, others who have not; some where the
assailant was charged with a hate crime, and others where they
were not. In all cases, it was an assault or a murder, arson or
vandalism, or a threat to commit such a crime, and the
motivation for committing the crime was based on an
individual's action or perceived personal characteristics of
the victim's identity. In all cases, it was a crime where the
immediate victim was harmed as well as others who may be like
them, their community. Hate crimes instill fear in communities,
and because the safety of us all is linked--because we are, on
a very basic level, all in one community with one another--hate
crimes impact our entire country. As we attempt to address this
hate crime crisis we are in, we are well served remembering
that.
Why do I say a hate crime crisis? Because our government's
official hate crime statistics provide the data confirming this
crisis. From 2015 to 2022, we have seen a 99 percent increase
in hate crime: 99 percent increase from just under 6,000
reported hate crimes in 2015 to 11,643 in 2022. The FBI's 2023
data has not been released yet, but based on the state data AI
has pulled in preparation for this hearing, it is likely we
will see yet another consecutive-year increase. Every single
year since the 2016 Presidential election, the trajectory has
been a dangerous increase of hate crimes in our country.
Anti-Black or African-American hate crimes continue to be a
plurality of all hate crimes reported. There were 3,424 in
2022. Anti-Asian or Pacific Islander hate crime saw a major
spike in hate, the most acute stages during the COVID-19
pandemic and its surrounding discourse by some elected
officials. Anti-Muslim hate crimes were nearly 5 percent of all
reported hate crimes during the 2016 Presidential election and
the discussions of a Muslim ban. The only year with a higher
record was 2001, in the post-9/11 backlash.
Anti-Hispanic and Latino hate crimes have shown a
persistent increase, with a record-breaking 738 hate crimes in
2022. The annual number of reported hate crimes targeting the
Latino community has increased in the last 7 years on a manner
that has outpaced the overall increase of all reported hate,
and while we've seen an increase--all of this while we've seen
an increase in anti-immigrant rhetoric and xenophobia,
particularly being experienced right now by the Haitian-
American community.
LGBTQ and hate crime almost doubled from 2015 to 2022, with
1,925 on record in 2022. And while the annual number of hate
crimes based on sexual orientation now represents a smaller
share of all the hate crimes reported each year, that is not
the case with gender identity hate crimes, which have increased
4 percent--all reported in 2022.
With regard to Arab Americans and Jewish Americans, we took
a deep dive into the data after October 7 by examining
available State-level data from 27 States and the District of
Columbia. And with all the necessary caveats about State-level
versus Federal data, here, too, the data confirms what we know.
Anti-Arab has increased from 104 in 2022 to 180 in 2023; anti-
Jewish from 1,311 to 2,073. Further, isolating our October-
December for the 21 States and DC where we could do that, it
shows about half of all of the incidents reported in 2023
occurred in the last 3 months: October, November, and December.
That's a 54 percent increase for Arab Americans. I'm sorry.
Yes, 54, and 49 for Jewish Americans.
Wadea Al-Fayoume's murder in his home in Illinois; the
attempted murder of Hisham Awartani, Kinnan Abdalhamid, and
Tahseen Aliahmad in Vermont, while three college students were
out for a walk, wearing their keffiyehs and speaking
occasionally in Arabic, is another example, as is the unnamed
25-year-old Brooklyn man attacked with a baseball bat after
being defamed. The backlash effect is real for both
communities, and the historic levels of hate crimes we're
experiencing harm individuals, communities, and our country. We
can and must respond more effectively. Thank you again for the
opportunity to testify before you today, and I look forward to
your questions.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Berry appears as a
submission for the record.]
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Ms. Berry. Rabbi Goldfeder. Would
you make sure your microphone is on? Thank you.
STATEMENT OF MARK GOLDFEDER, DIRECTOR,
NATIONAL JEWISH ADVOCACY CENTER, ATLANTA, GEORGIA
Rabbi Goldfeder. Chairman Durbin, Ranking Member Graham,
Members of the Committee, good morning. My name is Mark
Goldfeder. I'm director of the National Jewish Advocacy Center,
a nonprofit legal organization that combats antisemitism in all
of its forms. It is an honor to appear before you to address
this important topic, and I also extend my condolences to the
families of the victims. May God comfort you.
Senators, it is no secret that antisemitism has skyrocketed
since Hamas's brutal October 7 massacre. On college campuses
across the country, between hiding from mobs in libraries,
avoiding dining halls because of death threats, and removing
Nazi symbols from Chabad houses, Jewish students have been
subjected to campaigns that employ classic antisemitism tropes
and calls for them to be removed from campus if they dare
identify as Zionists, which the vast majority of Jews do. In
2023, antisemitism assault incidents increased by 45 percent,
vandalism by 69 percent, and antisemitic harassment increased
by 184 percent.
Those aren't speech incidents. Those are hate crimes. Let
me be clear. Hate speech, no matter how offensive, is protected
by the First Amendment, but assault and battery, arson,
trespassing, vandalism, breaking and entering, destruction of
property, harassment, and true threats are all examples of
unlawful antisemitic behavior and hate crimes that have
happened in the last few months and that can and should be
regulated, which brings me to the next point.
In hearing about hate crimes, why am I focusing
specifically on anti-Jewish hate crimes? Three reasons. First,
there is an acute problem taking place right now, before our
very eyes. The majority of religiously motivated hate crimes
are committed against Jewish people, and the numbers are
getting worse. We need to deal with that reality now, before
more people get hurt. Second, it's not about Jewish
exceptionalism. It's about equality. There's an equal
protection problem here, and it's definitional, and it can be
fixed.
Third, it's important to address antisemitism in the
context of the broader hate crimes conversation because what
starts with the Jews never ends with the Jews. It did not take
very long for the chants to morph from Death to Israel to Death
to America, and from spray-painting Hillel houses and
desecrating menorahs to disrupting Pride marches, defacing
George Washington's statue, and vandalizing the Freedom Bell.
Stopping antisemitic hate crimes is a matter of self-
preservation for all Americans, because even if you aren't
Jewish, they are coming for you next. Just ask them. They
aren't shy.
And so, I'd like to talk about solutions. Here are three
practical steps to stem the tide of unlawful hate directed
against Jewish Americans, to the benefit of all Americans.
First, please use your oversight powers to ensure that our laws
are enforced as written. This includes, of course, Title VI of
the Civil Rights Act, but also laws like the Immigration and
Nationality Act, that deal with foreign students providing
support to terrorist organizations. Student groups are openly
working as agents of Hamas. They are handing out recruitment
flyers on our campuses on a daily basis. My organization, NJAC,
has brought five anti-terrorist suits since October 7, to go
after some of these bad actors, but we should not have to do
that.
Second, Congress should clarify or ask the DOJ to clarify
what should be obvious: the First Amendment is not a free pass
to threaten, harass, intimidate, or otherwise violate the
rights of others. And, finally, because Jewish identity is so
multifaceted, without a standard definition for authorities to
reference when they're analyzing the intent behind illegal,
discriminatory actions--not speech--it is too easy for
antisemites to hide behind this ambiguity and commit unlawful
acts against Jews with impunity.
The Antisemitism Awareness Act solves this problem by
requiring the relevant authorities to consider, as contextual,
rebuttable evidence, the International Holocaust Remembrance
Alliance, IHRA, definition of antisemitism. And, no, the Act
does not curb speech. It's not a he-said, she-said debate. You
can go ahead and read the operative language yourself. Title VI
violations, by definition, do not include speech.
The definition also contains appropriate safeguards that
take into account the importance of nuance and context in
situations that involve allegations of discriminatory intent--
for example, the explicit caveat that all of the examples given
are not dispositive but could, taking into account the overall
context, be evidence of antisemitism. There are very few things
that the Bush, Obama, Trump, and Biden administrations have
agreed on, but the IHRA definition is one of them, not to
mention a supermajority of U.S. States that have embraced it
and the vast majority of Jewish people across every ideological
spectrum.
Of course, Jews are not monolithic, and there is a small
minority within the Jewish community that does not support it,
but they do not represent the Jewish community, which has
spoken in a loud and clear voice. Every major Jewish
organization in this country, by estimates of membership over
90 percent of American Jews, support this bill wholeheartedly.
That is more than a consensus, Senators. That is a mandate. Nor
is the bill merely symbolic. Of course, our current laws should
capture antisemitism, but in practice, they don't. I'm general
counsel to 24 Hillels in the State of Georgia. In one instance
last October, a group of students surrounded a Jewish peer,
threw him to the ground, said, we're going to kill you, your
family, and all Israelis. The boy is not Israeli, just Jewish.
Police decided it was not a hate crime because he said Israel,
not Jew.
I'll conclude by pointing out the obvious. Protecting
Jewish people does not come at the expense of any other group.
You can be vigorously pro-Palestinian without being
antisemitism. You can even be virulently antisemitic without
committing unlawful actions. But all too often, that is not
what is happening. I stand ready to work with the Committee and
any Member on this important matter and welcome your questions.
Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Rabbi Goldfeder appears as a
submission for the record.]
Chair Durbin. Thank you very much, Rabbi. Mr. Stern.
STATEMENT OF KENNETH S. STERN, DIRECTOR,
BARD CENTER FOR THE STUDY OF HATE,
BROOKLYN, NEW YORK
Mr. Stern. Chairman Durbin, Ranking Member Graham, and the
other honorable Members of the Committee, my name is Kenneth
Stern. I direct the Bard Center for the Study of Hate, and I
also worked at the American Jewish Committee for 25 years,
where I directed the Division on Antisemitism and Extremism.
I want to share a framework to think about antisemitism and
hate and hate crime and the campus and democracy. When people
hate, whether they hate people of another race, religion,
nationality, sexual orientation, or politics, they create
simplicity and certainty. They are seduced by binary good-bad
thinking and drawn to symbols. This is a human characteristic,
rooted in how we divide the world into us and them. And people
who want to combat hate--we're human, too, and not immune from
the seductive illusion and comfort of simple answers to
complicated questions.
Antisemitism is, at heart, conspiracy theory that sees Jews
as conspiring to harm humanity. It's offered as an explanation
for what goes wrong in the world. It appears on the right and
on the left. It's also the philosophical backbone of much white
supremacy. But we tend to think about antisemitism as only what
people say about Jews or Israel and not enough about how
vilification of anyone among us can create a conveyor belt to
antisemitism.
As Senator Durbin mentioned, Alan, Lauren, and Amy
Mallinger are in the audience today. Rose Mallinger, Alan's
mother, Lauren's mother-in-law, Amy's grandmother, was murdered
at the Tree of Life Synagogue. That shooting was clearly an act
of antisemitism, but the background noise to the Tree of Life
massacre was fear of immigrants. The synagogue was targeted
because it had participated in a program supporting them. But
you won't find, sitting here today, the relatives of the 23
people killed when Mexicans and Mexican Americans were targeted
at the Wal-Mart in El Paso. No one would call that an act of
antisemitism. But the two shooters had nearly identical
ideologies; they just chose different targets.
To fight antisemitism and any form of hate requires a wide
lens to understand these movements and what draws people to
them, not simple filters that may be comforting. Strong
democratic institutions, including the protection of free
speech, are also important. That doesn't mean ignore hateful
speech. It means we don't use levers of the state to chill or
suppress speech we don't like, creating free-speech martyrs in
the process.
There have been antisemitic attacks on campus and, of
course, as we know, hate directed at Palestinian, Arab, and
Muslims, too. But there's a distinction being lost in much of
this debate. No student should be the victim of bullying and
harassment, intimidation, true threats, or discrimination, but
there's an unfortunate expectation that a student should be
protected from hearing things that cut them to their core. A
university must be a place where students expect to be
physically safe, not intellectually safe; where they're helped
to ponder why that otherwise friendly student has views seen as
ignorant at best, evil at worst.
The questions we should be asking are, how do we improve
the campus to encourage the intellectual imagination and
emotional empathy? How do we use the tools from the academy to
break down the us-versus-them problems outside the campus, too?
There's an elephant in the room: the IHRA definition. And I'm
happy to discuss why I believe codifying it will harm the fight
against antisemitism, but let me conclude with things that I
believe will help reduce antisemitism and other forms of hate.
First, increase academic focus, both in teaching and
research, on human hate and what to do about it. There are a
number of hate study centers, but there should be more. Two,
provide more funding to OCR and for the National strategy on
antisemitism. Three, we need better data on hate crimes.
Four, we also need data on the cost of hate crimes. Hate
crimes don't only have a moral cost. They don't only traumatize
families and communities. They cost each of us a veritable hate
tax. My Bard colleague Mike Martell created an economic
template to estimate the costs of hate crime, using the 2012
murder at the Sikh temple in Wisconsin as a case study. And
we're working with laypeople from the EDL in Phoenix to
approximate the cost of hate crime there. Why isn't the
government computing these costs?
And, finally, the other day I was explaining a project
we're developing with Boston University to help victims of hate
crime find support, whether it be how to report a hate crime or
counseling or other resources, using AI and social media to
help them. We're in discussions with the Eradicate Hate Global
Summit to see if they can incorporate some aspects of the
planning into their work. The person asked, why isn't Congress
figuring out creative ways to help more victims of hate crime,
instead of you? It's a good question. Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Stern appears as a
submission for the record.]
Chair Durbin. Thank you all for your testimony, and I'm
sure there are some questions coming from my colleagues here. I
guess one of the fundamental threshold questions is whether we
can segregate--I hate to use that word--whether we can separate
one type of hate crime and say, this is the worst; this is the
priority; to the exclusion of the others, we're only going to
deal with one. Ms. Berry.
Ms. Berry. Thank you, Senator. My position is, I think not.
We've worked collectively as a community to understand the
nature of these hate crimes. As you said in your opening
remarks, we have the highest number ever reported since the FBI
started collecting the data in 1991. And the response has to be
one that acknowledges all targeted communities are being
impacted. So, our response has to be one that acknowledges that
and, as a result, understands that singling out any one
community doesn't actually get us all safer. I certainly agree
that different communities are targeted at different times and
perhaps for different reasons, but the underlying issue is one
of hate and a crime, and we must respond accordingly.
Chair Durbin. Rabbi, do you believe that language being
used by politicians that dehumanize certain groups adds to this
atmosphere of hate crime?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Thank you, Senator, for the question. I
think that all extreme political rhetoric is dangerous. Just
look at the two recent attempts on President Trump's life. And
I think that both sides should absolutely do their best to tone
it down.
Chair Durbin. And do you believe that, as politicians, if
we set out to dehumanize groups like immigrants, does that have
an impact on the conversation about hate crimes?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Thank you, Senator. I think no group
should ever be dehumanized, period.
Chair Durbin. I couldn't agree with you more. Mr. Stern,
you give the example of the El Paso Wal-Mart and the Pittsburgh
synagogue and believe that, though the targets were different,
the motivation was the same. Explain that.
Mr. Stern. Well, and you had mentioned, Senator, the
Buffalo shooting, too. If you look at the ideologies of the
three shooters, they were a combination of seeing--hating
immigrants, seeing people of color as a threat, and believing--
as my colleague Eric Ward, you know, articulated very well in
an article called Skin in the Game, the white supremacy--the
backbone of it is antisemitism. So, you can't really separate
them all as saying, well, this is a problem only in one sense;
this is a problem in another sense. They feed on each other.
And I agree with the rabbi that, you know, antisemitism is
a threat to democracy, a miner's canary, and so forth. But the
flip side is also true: that vilifying anyone among us is a
conveyor belt to antisemitism and helps people see the world
as, why are we losing? Why were people at Charlottesville
talking, Jews will not replace us? Because they saw that they
were losing a place in society, they felt--and they thought
that Jews were behind it. Again, antisemitism is Jews
conspiring to harm humanity and giving an explanation for what
goes wrong in the world. So, that's how I see these things as
related.
Chair Durbin. Ms. Berry, how do you draw the line--the
conversation in a free society like America, when it comes to
how far you can go? Can I disagree with Bibi Netanyahu and
still stand up for Israel?
Ms. Berry. That's entirely up to you, Senator, and I think
the answer would certainly be yes. The issue is not the matter
of speech, in terms of if it's objectionable or not, but why
are you targeting an individual, and are you committing a crime
in the process of targeting that individual? If you're
targeting a person because of a protected category, that's a
hate crime.
And the importance of the point you're making about
dehumanization and speech I think is absolutely critical,
because, for example, I might say something, but that's
entirely different than you would, Senator, the Chair of the
Judiciary Committee saying something. Your standing in our
society is such that you hold a certain importance as an
elected official, and when our elected officials are engaging
in dialog--again, not about policy disagreements, because you
can have policy disagreements. It's when you target specific
communities as the source of those problems; that's where we
find ourselves in the place that we are, which is that we see
spikes in hate against specific communities after comments are
made.
Our communities are targeted. We saw it during the
pandemic. We see it now when we talk about immigrants the way
that we do. We certainly see it across the board. I'm going to
remind us again that anti-Black racism as an issue is the
reason we continue to have a plurality of all hate crimes
targeting the Black community.
And the final point I would make is that since the hate
crime data was collected, the anti-Jewish category in religion
has always been the top category. There is undoubtedly a
problem of antisemitism in this country. That goes without
saying, and the data has verified that. It's, what are we doing
to respond to it in the whole-of-society approach that is
correctly focused on the actual problem?
Chair Durbin. Thank you very much. Senator Graham.
Senator Graham. To each witness--start with you, Ms. Berry.
Do you believe it's very difficult right now for Jewish
students to attend colleges in America?
Ms. Berry. I think it can be for individual Jewish
students.
Senator Graham. No, I said, is it?
Ms. Berry. It can--it depends on the individual students
and----
Senator Graham. Well, okay.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. What they're encountering, yes.
Senator Graham. Rabbi, do you think it is?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes, almost impossible.
Senator Graham. Mr. Stern.
Mr. Stern. Senator, it depends on the campus. For many,
absolutely so, but I would also add one other thing: that there
are some Jewish students who are anti-Zionists, whose Judaism
leads them to that position, and they are also getting----
Senator Graham. Mr.----
Mr. Stern [continuing]. Spat on.
Senator Graham. I'm trying to establish a baseline. The
reason we wrote the letter is so we see playing out before our
eyes just an assault on Jewish students in colleges. I'm
looking at systems, here. Does anybody--let me ask you. DNI
said Iran--we have observed actors tied to Iran's government
posing as activists online, seeking to encourage protests and
even providing financial support to protesters. Does anybody
doubt that? Okay. Mr. Stern, is it Hamas's goal to destroy the
Jewish state?
Mr. Stern. Absolutely. Hamas is----
Senator Graham. Is it Hezbollah's goal to destroy the
Jewish state?
Mr. Stern. Absolutely.
Senator Graham. Is it Iran's goal to destroy the Jewish
state?
Mr. Stern. Yes.
Senator Graham. Okay. Ms. Berry, do you agree with that?
Ms. Berry. I think these are complicated questions. I
really don't want----
Senator Graham. No, it's not. There's nothing----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. To talk about foreign policy.
Senator Graham [continuing]. Complicated about it. That's
the most----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Graham [continuing]. Ridiculous testimony----
Ms. Berry. Senator----
Senator Graham [continuing]. Ever given in this Committee.
Ms. Berry. Yes. So----
Senator Graham. If you think it's----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. All of those----
Senator Graham [continuing]. Complicated to figure out that
Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran wants to kill all the Jews----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Graham [continuing]. I should not listen to
anything else you've got to say.
Ms. Berry. Okay. May I----
Senator Graham. And I won't.
Ms. Berry. Senator----
Senator Graham. Rabbi----
Ms. Berry. If I may, Senator----
Senator Graham. Rabbi--Rabbi----
Ms. Berry. I think we started----
Senator Graham [continuing]. Do you believe--do you believe
that Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran are out to kill all the Jews
and destroy Israel?
Rabbi Goldfeder. I believe they're out to destroy the
Jewish state and kill all the Jews----
Senator Graham. Okay.
Rabbi Goldfeder [continuing]. Both.
Senator Graham. So, I do, too. And I believe Iran's behind
this. And what I would like this Committee to do is deal with
the systematic problems that exist regarding what's going on on
American colleges today. What's going on on colleges today?
There's an organized effort to intimidate, harass, and
physically assault Jewish students. What's going on today is an
effort on multiple fronts to wipe Israel off the map. This is
not an academic discussion. As to what should happen, Mr.
Stern, if a student on a college campus uses the N-word against
African-American students, should they be expelled?
Mr. Stern. I think if a student goes and harasses another
student, says that to their face, that could be absolutely a
matter for discipline.
Senator Graham. Yes.
Mr. Stern. However, I think if they're just standing up
there with a sign or saying, this is what I think or a word I'm
choosing, and not threatening somebody----
Senator Graham. Yes.
Mr. Stern [continuing]. And not harassing----
Senator Graham. Yes.
Mr. Stern [continuing]. Then that should be deplored----
Senator Graham. But----
Mr. Stern [continuing]. But it should not be the subject of
discipline.
Senator Graham. But do you agree with me it's--if African-
American students are being called the N-word and harassed and
belittled by other students, those students should pay a price
for that?
Mr. Stern. I think if there's any type of harassment.
Doesn't matter the word.
Senator Graham. Yes.
Mr. Stern. But if students are being harassed----
Senator Graham. Well, the word does matter, if you're
African American.
Mr. Stern. Well----
Senator Graham. Let----
Mr. Stern [continuing]. What I'm saying is that no
harassment should be tolerated----
Senator Graham. Well, right. There you go. That's good. So,
the idea that you could hold somebody accountable for using
words makes sense to me, because free speech is a concept that
we all hold near and dear, but words start wars. Words can
incite violence. You can't yell fire in a theater. So, what I
would say that's going on here is that we have to deal with the
problem at its roots, first identifying it. America has many
problems. There are people hateful to each other. That's been
with us since there's been a country. We live in a unique
moment in America, I think--and I'm trying to get us to focus
on that moment--about not only a rise of antisemitism but an
effort by agents of Iran and other powers to divide us here at
home.
What's so sad is that October the 7th was designed to
destroy the reconciliation between Saudi Arabia and Israel. All
the intel shows us that Iran struck Israel in such a vicious
way to stop the reconciliation between Saudi Arabia and Israel.
I believe that with all my heart. I don't want them to win. I
want to normalize between Saudi Arabia and Israel. I want a
better life for the Palestinian community. And it can never
happen without Hamas being destroyed and never coming back. It
can never happen without Hezbollah and Iran being contained. It
can never happen without security for the state of Israel.
So, what I would say without any hesitation--that what's
going on in America on our campuses is worthy of a discussion
all of its own. We need to get to the bottom of it and start
holding people accountable who run these schools. Thank you.
Chair Durbin. Senator Whitehouse.
Senator Whitehouse. Thanks very much, Chairman. Let me
start by agreeing with Senator Graham that the peace framework
that is being developed in the Middle East would be the very
best outcome both for Israel and for the Palestinian people;
that there are deliberate efforts out there to try to interfere
with the conclusion of that piece, framework; and we're simply
going to need to fight our way through those to achieve that
goal. I would also concur with his statement that there are
people hateful to each other in this country, but Ms. Berry,
I'd like to ask you, in addition to people hateful to each
other in this country, is there also strategically deployed
misinformation and disinformation designed to accelerate and
foment that hatefulness? And could you talk a little bit about
that behind-the-scenes or backstage effort to make the
hatefulness of some people worse and draw others into it?
Ms. Berry. Thank you, Senator Whitehouse. You're absolutely
right. And I regret that Senator Graham has left the room,
because what I would've added was that the point he's making
about foreign actors attempting to sow division in our country
is quite real. Certainly, Iran was that. We saw a lot of it
happening during the 2020 election, as well, where a particular
line of potential division would then be inundated on the
various social media platforms with fake--disinformation and
misinformation targeting those communities, just literally to
spread the hatred. So, an individual may or may not have taken
that position at all, but rather all of a sudden inundated with
these memes that are reinforcing this small potential idea I
had, and I'm running with it. And it's----
Senator Whitehouse. And our intelligence----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Highly problematic.
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Services have pointed also
to Russia as an agent of----
Ms. Berry. That's correct.
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Disinformation and
misinformation intended to interfere with and disrupt our
elections to the point where the Department of Justice has
announced criminal allegations. So, what would your
recommendations be for going directly at that problem of
strategic and, particularly, foreign misinformation and
disinformation designed to damage our democracy using hate as
its tool of destruction?
Ms. Berry. The good news is that the Department of Justice,
I think, is taking this very seriously and has. The challenge
for us is that we continue to be in this space with the social
media platforms not, frankly, responding adequately to the
spread of hate on their sites. So, until we have a better sense
of how we can address that, one would argue actually that
Twitter--X, formerly known as Twitter, has now taken us to a
place where it's gotten considerably worse; where even the
other social media platforms, for example, who had complete
programs in place to address the 2020 election have not
prepared those same programs to protect us from disinformation,
because I think the landscape has changed dramatically.
Senator Whitehouse. Would it be helpful to better
understand the financing of these groups and to have better
resources to trace back from the domestic attack----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. On our democracy using
hatred back to the foreign interests that finance this, likely
through multiple intermediary shell organizations, to try to
obscure their hand in that glove?
Ms. Berry. I think that's exactly why the Department of
Justice is such a critical player in this space: the need to
address this. It's different than maligned actors who kind of
put this information out. There's clearly an agenda in play
here, and I would suggest part of the--excuse me, Senator, for
this point, but part of the reason it was difficult to address
the first question sort of correctly is what I was trying to
say is that we have state actors that are attempting to
influence our democracy in a very harmful way. To suggest that
a national movement and a national organic student movement
that's come together to support Palestinian human rights is the
same thing is really highly problematic. And the final point I
would--if I may, I would make--what I was saying was the part
that's complicated----
Senator Whitehouse. Well, my time's about to----
Ms. Berry. I apologize.
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Run out, so let me----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Just make my last point,
which is that they call these covert operations for a reason,
and I think we'd all be better off if there were much more
visibility into the financial links behind these front groups
that propagate this kind of poison, so that press, public, not
just the technical money laundering experts at the Department
of Justice, but more spotlights of American democracy can be
put on these schemes. Thanks very----
Ms. Berry. Thank you.
Senator Whitehouse [continuing]. Much. My time is expired.
Ms. Berry. Thank you.
Chair Durbin. Senator Grassley.
Senator Grassley. Yes. Mr. Chairman, before I ask
questions, I have two articles. One highlights actors with ties
to Iran attempting to influence and finance anti-Israel
protests in our country. This other article mentions that
Russia is also trying to exploit divisions over the Israel-
Hamas conflict. Rabbi----
Chair Durbin. Without objection, they'll be entered in the
record. Proceed, Senator.
[The information appears as a submission for the record.]
Senator Grassley. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Are some of the
higher education institutions, either wittingly or unwittingly,
shielding or even fostering antisemitism in the United States
today, Rabbi?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Thank you, Senator, for that question.
Yes. I'll point you to a study done by the Institute for the
Study of Global Antisemitism and Policy which found that at
least 100 American colleges and universities illegally withheld
information on approximately $13 billion in undocumented
contributions from foreign governments, many of which are
authoritarian. The study found higher levels of antisemitic
incidents reported on those campuses from 2015 to 2020.
Institutions that accepted money from Middle Eastern donors
had, on average, 300 percent more antisemitic incidents on
campus than institutions that did not. And campus-level
antisemitic incidents, by the way, forward predict county-level
antisemitic incidents, including hate crimes.
Senator Grassley. Further question, Rabbi. Have the
Department of Justice and Department of Education in this
administration done enough to address epidemics of hate speech
and antisemitism on the college campuses? And if the answer is
yes or no, what more should the administration do, from your
opinion?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Unfortunately, they have done nowhere near
enough. They should enforce the laws as written, including
Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. If the words of Title
VI mean anything, it talks about, you know, behavior that is
severe and pervasive enough that it interferes with a person's
education. They have to mean something. That has to include
what's happening to Jewish students on campus right now. And we
have seen zero universities lose their funding, even as these
encampments literally force Jews out of parts of the school.
So, no, they have not done more, and they should also enforce
laws like the Nationality Act, which prohibit foreign students
from providing material support to terrorism.
Senator Grassley. Yes. You gave some evidence about the
amount of money being spent by terrorist groups, but what have
you discovered about Hamas's potential funding of college
protests, and what evidence have you relied on to form your
opinion?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Well, it actually goes beyond funding,
Senator. Going back to the Supreme Court case in Holder v.
Humanitarian Law, in 2010, it's not just money that counts.
It's services, as well. And unfortunately, these student groups
on campus are literally acting as the PR agents of Hamas. Some
countries spend up to $200 million a year on PR firms. Hamas
can't, because they're an FTO, but immediately after October 7,
some of these groups, like the National Students for Justice in
Palestine, came out and said, we are not just in solidarity
with this movement; we are part of this movement. They chanted,
we are Hamas. And when a group tells you that they are trying
to provide material support to terrorists, you should believe
them. And so, it's not just an exchange of money. It's a
coordination with Hamas that is a terrible problem.
Senator Grassley. In the same vein as my question just
asked, there've been media reports citing Iran, Russia, and
other International actors as taking advantage and stoking
civil right unrest here. What do you think--Rabbi, what do you
think can be done to counter this malignant influence?
Rabbi Goldfeder. I think in general, Senator, we need
better tracking of the kind of donations that are coming from
overseas, whether it's to 501(c)(3)'s that are, in theory,
acting as charities but are actually, you know, as in the case
of the Palestine Chronicle, for example, literally paying money
to a terrorist that was holding four hostages in his house--
three hostages in his house. I think that it would behoove the
U.S. Government to remove the tax status of any charity that
provides material support to terrorists.
Senator Grassley. Yes. And I think you've talked around
this next question I have, but I'd like to ask it more
directly, Rabbi. What has allowed for the recent rise of
antisemitism and hate in our communities?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Senator, that's a very hard question to
answer. It is really difficult to talk about why antisemitism
persists. It's the kind of thing that is a mutating virus.
Different parts of society hate Jews for being whatever they
don't like. So, Jews are at the same time too strong and too
weak; they're parasitic and overpowering; they are superhuman,
like in the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, or they're
subhuman, like in Nazi ideology. What has led to the problem
and the infestation of antisemitism is the fact that we don't
have clear definitions that authorities can use to rely on when
they're trying to assess the intent behind antisemitic crime.
So, for example, everyone here knows that if you attack a
Chinese person because you think they have unfair trade
policies, that is ethnic or national origin discrimination. If
you attack a Russian person because you think Russia should not
have invaded Ukraine, that is national origin or ethnic
discrimination. But if you attack a Jewish person because you
hate Israel, for some reason there's some confusion. We need
clear definitions, and that will do the job.
Senator Grassley. Thank you.
Senator Klobuchar. Okay. Thank you very much, Senator
Grassley. Thank you to our witnesses and to the Chair and
Ranking Member for holding this important hearing. I'm a former
prosecutor; enforced some of our State hate crimes laws put
in--Andy Luger, our U.S. Attorney, who has been--enforced those
laws on the Federal level, as well. And I think that's a big
piece of this.
Another piece of this--coming from a State that has a large
Jewish population, the country's largest Somali population,
second-largest Hmong population, and one of the largest
Ethiopian populations, I believe that we also have to do
everything that we can on the local level to stand above the
hate that we're seeing on the internet and the hate that we're
seeing across the world right now. And I always remember the
story of when a threat was made, a serious threat, on our
Jewish Community Center and all the kids had to run out, in
their swimming suits in the middle of the winter, of the
Center. When they got back to the Center, the first call,
message for them, was from the neighboring Islamic center that
offered them a place to go if they could not return to their
own community center.
So, I think a lot of this is going to be on all of us to
stand above this, and I appreciate it very much, the discussion
today. I guess I'd start, Ms. Berry--we have, I know, in our
State, just last year, as many as 25 Jewish schools and
religious facilities receiving bomb threats. We had a serious
case of white supremacists bombing an Islamic center in
Bloomington, Minnesota that was investigated and, in fact,
prosecuted on the Federal level. We have seen on the national
level all this has been discussed--388 percent rise in
antisemitic incidences since this time last year and 216
percent increase in requests for help and reported bias against
Muslims since October 7.
Your testimony goes into recent data on hate crimes. Can
you talk more about the threats that we have seen since October
7 and also if there's an actual underreporting of this; that
the numbers might even be worse than what we're hearing?
Ms. Berry. Thank you, Senator. I would start on your--what
you concluded with. Without a doubt, there's a massive and
chronic underreporting problem with regards to all hate crimes
in our country. On--the highest on record was last year, with
11,000-plus. Based on the Bureau of Justice Statistics at the
Department of Justice, the estimate is that we capture about 1
percent of actual hate crimes that occur. So, even that we went
through and pulled the data for the 27 States plus the District
of Columbia and have already arrived at higher numbers than--
the year is not complete--higher numbers than we saw the year
prior, I would suggest that those are dramatically
underreported.
And you represent, as you said, a state of--a wonderful,
diverse State that--actually, one of the top ten States in the
country in terms of Arab Americans who live in your State,
there. There are also different barriers that show up for
reporting that I think we have to address. Specific communities
sometimes have concerns that are related to law enforcement,
the relationship with it, that may be a barrier. The issue of
training of law enforcement is also critical. My fellow witness
gave an example of someone being targeted and the idea that
Israeli is the reason they weren't charged with a hate crime--
that, to me, strikes me as a deeply problematic training
problem, if you--Israeli is national origin. If a person was
targeted because of their national origin, that's a hate crime
and should be treated as such.
In terms of the post-October 7 situation, as our data has
sort of demonstrated--is that we are seeing, without a doubt,
an increase for both communities. And it continues to be one
where, frankly, the challenge has been that we're not having
the conversation about the hate crimes. We're having
conversations about speech and how you define this; how do you
do that--when the reality is, we're already seeing a dramatic
increase. And students are being targeted. The FBI released a
report that looked at the increase in hate crimes on college
campuses recently, and it's one we ought to pay attention to.
It's just needing to keep the focus on the hate crime issue.
Senator Klobuchar. I just--thank you. Appreciate it. I want
to get some other answers, but I also would add, as I was
specifically focused on some of the religious institutions and
what we're seeing, we have this program, bipartisan basis, that
we put forward for these security grants for religious
institutions that I know, in my State, five million alone,
especially after some of the threats that we've seen, that I
think have been helpful, and I hope that we will continue to
fund this in this budget coming at the end of the year.
One thing that we haven't talked about, Rabbi--and I
appreciate your words on the laws and what we need to do; I
truly do--is just online and what's been going on there. A
number of us on this Committee have focused on these issues
with putting some rules of the road in place on tech. Not going
to go into that right now, but examples of how people have
become arguably radicalized by what they've seen on the
internet: attacks against the Jewish community in Colleyville,
Texas; Black community at Emmanuel AME Church in Charleston;
Hispanic community in the Wal-Mart in El Paso; LGBTQ community
in Colorado Springs. So, you could just go through all of it.
And do you believe that's been part of this? And how would you
fix it? Because you have 1 minute, you know. I'm kidding. Go
ahead.
Rabbi Goldfeder. Thank you, Senator, for the question.
Absolutely. It's an absolutely appalling and terrible problem.
In the weeks after October 7, for instance, the phrase Hitler
was right was trending on Twitter, which is an incredible,
incredibly thing. Unfortunately, I think the best option here
is education, and our kids aren't getting it. So, you know, for
example, in the first month after October 7, I was dumbfounded,
and I said, would these people online have actually supported
Al Qaeda? And then a month later, it turns out, they would. And
guess whose letter was trending? Bin Laden. We need better
education about what they're posting, and it's not going to
start online. It has to start way before that. It has to start
in K through 12, at the university level, before they get
online.
Senator Klobuchar. Okay. Thank you very much. Do you want
to add anything, Mr. Stern?
Mr. Stern. Yes. To that I would add that I think there's
lack of focus on the flip side of it, so the dangers of social
media--how to use it more effectively against hate is something
that I think should concern this Committee and it should
support. On campus, for example, there's an AI program that
someone named Simon Cullen, who's a professor at Carnegie
Mellon, developed, called Sway. And it encourages students and
anybody who has different points of view, whether it's
abortion, Israel-Palestine, to moderate it, and it basically
flags ad hominem attacks; it flags things that are hateful and
says, would you want to rephrase it this way? It takes away the
eye rolling; it takes away the anger and the steam. And it's
sort of like John Stuart Mill, you know, on AI. And I think
things like that will help in this process, too.
Senator Klobuchar. Okay. Thank you very much. Thank you,
Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Senator Cornyn.
Senator Cornyn. Rabbi, when we requested this hearing, we
asked to focus on antisemitism, but I just want to ask you--if,
in fact, antisemitic conduct and behavior is tolerated on
college campuses or in our society in general, does that make
it more likely that other religious or ethnic groups will also
be treated in a similar abusive manner?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Thank you, Senator, for the question.
Absolutely. Again, Jews are often called the canary in the coal
mine of intolerance. What starts with the Jews never ends with
the Jews, and it hasn't taken long already for the public cries
for Death to the Jews to become Death to America and burning
flags on our campuses, as well.
Senator Cornyn. So, if this sort of behavior is tolerated,
it's a threat to all minority groups?
Rabbi Goldfeder. It's a threat to our entire democracy,
Senator.
Senator Cornyn. Well, I want to talk specifically about the
problems that some of the university presidents had in
condemning antisemitism and enforcing their own rules against
demonstrations on campus and the like. Harvard; University of
California, Berkeley; Columbia; University of Pennsylvania;
NYU; and Carnegie Mellon apparently all had difficulties
drawing the line between permissible speech and impermissible
conduct. But one university seems to stand out, and I'm proud
of the fact the University of Texas, when this happened on
campus--that a number of people not even affiliated with the
university threatened to occupy the buildings at the campus and
ignored officials' continued pleas for restraint, to
immediately disperse--the university actually enforced its own
rules. And is that the difference between what we saw in so
many other places, that they simply tolerated this conduct, and
the University of Texas did not, by enforcing its own rules?
Rabbi Goldfeder. In short, yes, Senator. There has been a
complete abdication of authority when it comes to the First
Amendment. And university presidents and law school deans that
unabashedly explain that the First Amendment is hard to
understand and they can't possibly enforce its limits don't
belong running universities or law schools. The First Amendment
is not a free pass to threaten, harass, intimidate, or
otherwise violate the rights of others. There are limits to
what constitutes speech, and there are rules for when it
crosses over into actionable conduct. And if you can see those
rules when it applies to racist, sexist, homophobic, and
misogynistic speech but not when it comes to antisemitism
speech, your problem is not with that line. Your problem is
with antisemitism.
Senator Cornyn. So, normalizing this sort of antisemitism
and the behavior that has been tolerated at so many of these
universities is a threat to our society as a whole,
specifically minorities, but if you see university leadership
like that at the University of Texas actually enforcing its
rules and taking action, that can help define what the
community standards are and help protect all minorities.
Correct?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Absolutely.
Senator Cornyn. So, I was intrigued by what you were
discussing in terms of foreign countries contributing
significant sums of money to colleges and universities and
perhaps that having some influence on their policies. We have
something called the Foreign Agents Registration Act, which
Senator Grassley and others of us have been trying to reform,
because we know that foreign countries actively hire lobbyists
here in Washington, DC to lobby Members of Congress on
legislation, without Members of Congress's knowledge that they
are actually not--they're functioning on the part of foreign
governments and not on behalf of their constituents, the
American people.
Could you explain a little bit more about the nature of
that challenge? And do you support legislation that would
tighten the disclosure requirements, in particular, so that we
could know that foreign governments are actually the prime
actors and funders of this activity, as opposed to some
American?
Rabbi Goldfeder. I absolutely support such legislation, and
I will tell you that the problem actually goes further. You
see, on campuses across the country--I don't know if any
Senators have spent time inside any of these encampments or
protests. I have. And if you walk to the center, you'll notice
something fascinating, which is that, charitably, 20 percent of
the people there know what river and what sea. Most of them are
there for the pizza or because they have been genuinely misled
into thinking that they are on the right side of history. And
that is important because not only do they not know what
they're doing; they don't know that they're actually in bed
with terrorists.
And that's why, again, our group, along with our partners
at Greenberg Traurig, Holtzman Vogel, and others, brought the
lawsuit against National Students for Justice in Palestine, to
try and help draw the line, because maybe, maybe, if we could
expose that, maybe the 80 percent would walk away from the 20
percent of extremists, and we'd save 80 percent of our
citizens, of our future Congressmen, Senators, and Presidents.
And so, it's a deeply problematic issue that sometimes even the
unfortunate useful idiots are not aware of.
Senator Cornyn. Thank you.
Chair Durbin. Thank you. Senator Blumenthal.
Senator Blumenthal. Thanks very much, Mr. Chairman, and
thank you for having this hearing, and thank you to our
witnesses. I think we're all repulsed by the skyrocketing hate
crimes that have occurred across the country. Connecticut is no
different. There have been a number of very concerning hate
crimes against both Muslim Americans and Jewish Americans in
Connecticut over the past few years. In fact, we've seen 158
anti-Muslim hate crimes reported in 2022, up from 2021, and
according to the Anti-Defamation League, there's been a huge
increase in antisemitic incidents within Connecticut,
specifically since 2020. At the University of Connecticut
alone, this past year, 76 bias complaints were filed by both
Jewish and Muslim students, detailing incidents of
discrimination and hate speech since the conflict in Gaza began
on October 7, 2023.
The numbers reflect only a small part of the problem,
because there has also been a failure or a lapse in reporting
hate crimes. And I know that our witnesses have called
attention to that problem. There is a real need for more robust
data in reporting hate crimes, and the reality is that the
government's--it's really failed to give us a full picture.
With your invaluable help, Ms. Berry, we've begun to make
progress on this problem since 2021, and the Jabara-Heyer NO
HATE Act--I led that effort in the Senate with Senator Moran.
Key provisions of that act provide for grant programs, as
you know, to incentivize State and local law enforcement
agencies to better adopt hate-crimes reporting measures that
align with best practices. And yet, despite these efforts, we
still see insufficient data related to hate crimes on campuses
as well as in the community in general. So, my question to you,
with my thanks for your cooperation and your help on these
measures--what can we do to support law enforcement's effort on
reporting and build on the work that we started with the NO
HATE Act?
Ms. Berry. Thank you, Senator Blumenthal, for the
incredible work that you and your staff did on securing passage
of the COVID-19 and Jabara-Heyer NO HATE Act.
Senator Blumenthal. Thank you.
Ms. Berry. As you said, it made a significant improvement.
Three years later, we are seeing additional community-based
grants being issued by the Department of Justice that are
attempting to address the problem of underreporting. Grants
that are going to law enforcement agencies--100,000 or more--
have you reported hate crimes? Have you not? It's the issue of
addressing affirmative zero. It's hard to believe the number of
municipalities and States in our country where they report that
not a single hate crime has occurred.
So, all of that, I think, has been tremendous progress, but
you are correct in noting we're nowhere near where we need to
be. And I think one of the most important things that we can
do--and this is actually a change since we originally did the
Jabara-Heyer NO HATE Act, to where we are now--is that there's
an increase in supporting the measures of getting to mandatory
reporting. How do we get to meaningful mandatory reporting? Can
we tie it to funds that are already received by local law
enforcement, so that we can make sure participation in this is
possible?
The second part of this is we've also had a transition in
the way that we report hate crime. And I--I can't stress enough
the importance of NIBRS, our new National Incident-Based
Reporting System. It really does allow a local agency to go in,
having reported a hate crime and perhaps missed it, to then
upload it and be able to include it in that. So, the importance
of that is tremendous. The issue there is, are we getting all
of the agencies to participate? And, regrettably, we continue
to see not enough agencies having fully transitioned to that.
Senator Blumenthal. Do any of the other witnesses have any
thoughts or perspectives on reporting?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Thank you, Senator, for that question.
Yes. I think one challenging aspect to reporting involves the
lack of clear definitions. A recent study found, for example,
that almost half of adult Americans don't know what the word
antisemitism means, and those are the people willing to admit
that in a survey. So, I think the importance of clear
definitions would only help with reporting.
Senator Blumenthal. Thank you.
Mr. Stern. Yes. And, Senator----
Senator Blumenthal. My----
Mr. Stern. Oh, oh.
Senator Blumenthal. Go ahead.
Mr. Stern. Yes. I just think also it needs to--online and
other ways to make it so that people understand not necessarily
the road of definitions but the tools, the support, the--you
know, Meta is one of the people working with us on this
Eradicate Hate potential project, the clearinghouse idea, that
people can find information from social media if they say, oh,
I've been a victim of a hate crime, to get the resources. And I
think the easier we make it for people to get the resources
they need, the more reporting we'll see.
Senator Blumenthal. Thank you. My time has expired. This
topic is hugely important and complex and challenging, and I
want to thank all of you for being here. Again, my thanks to
Ms. Berry in particular for your tremendous work on this issue.
Thanks, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Blumenthal. Senator Lee.
Senator Lee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thanks to all of you
for being here and for participating in this hearing. It's
significant that, at least until today, no Senate hearing has
been held regarding the unprecedented rise of antisemitism on
college campuses throughout America, especially since the
October 7 Hamas attacks on Israel. It's also significant--I'm
very glad that we're holding this hearing, and it's significant
that the major overwhelming focus of it is antisemitism, but
it's odd that the title of the hearing doesn't even reflect
that focus.
And I think it's unfortunate that we're not having a
hearing that is overtly, by name, focused on this specific
topic, because we've got a problem here. We've got these once
respected academic institutions of--you know, institutions of
higher education that have suddenly found themselves
transformed into these seething hotbeds--hotbeds of
antisemitism. We see universities sitting sometimes idly by, or
at least passively by, as Jewish students are threatened, are
assaulted, are intimidated from attending class or just
accessing facilities at the university, prevented from doing
the very things that a college or university student is
supposed to do while attending school.
Even cases of students being stalked or assaulted simply
for wearing symbols associated with their faith have been
astoundingly common. And then, just yesterday, I read a report
of a student just outside the University of Michigan who was
approached by a group of men and asked whether the student was
Jewish. And when the student responded in the affirmative, they
beat him up, and he ended up having to go to the hospital. This
is really significant, and it's becoming stunningly common.
So, look, I understand the First Amendment protects the
freedom of speech. It also protects the right of the people
peaceably to assemble. It does not protect acts of violence. It
does not protect people in their efforts to stop a Jewish
student from attending class or approaching his or her
dormitory or anything else on a university campus or elsewhere.
That's not what the First Amendment is about.
Now, one of the things that's so troubling is that there
are tools that are ready and available, both within
universities and from the standpoint of the Federal Government,
to step in and stop this nonsense. And yet we've seen little
intervention to protect students. The executive branch of the
Federal Government has the authority to enforce Title VI of the
Civil Rights Act to protect Jewish students and ensure that
universities do the same, to make sure that they have
consequences when they don't do it. And yet little action has
been taken by the executive branch to make sure that this
happens.
One of the things that's so galling about this is that
students and parents and those who are supporting these
students are sending perfectly good money to these
universities, specifically so that students can get an
education, so that they can attend class, live in the
dormitories, go to the bookstore, the library, anywhere else
that they need to go. And yet these same universities can't
even be bothered to use the vast resources at their disposal on
their university, whether it's through their university police
or otherwise, to make sure that students aren't inhibited in
their ability to walk from one side of the campus to the other,
to do something as simple as go to class or go back to their
dorm or go to their library.
Keep in mind, simply as a matter of contract law, before we
even get to all of our civil rights protections that we have in
law--protections that are not being enforced by this
administration--before we even get to that, these people have a
basic contractual right and a legitimate expectation that they
will be able to access what they paid to be able to access.
They didn't pay the university these ridiculously large sums of
money simply so that they can wear a shirt with the logo of
that university on their shirt. No. They paid for access to an
education, an education that they're being denied, in many,
countless cases, simply because they are Jewish.
Look, this is unacceptable. And it is stunning to me that
many of the universities that have been most brazenly unwilling
to protect Jewish students are some of the same universities
who are charging the most money. We can do better. These
universities can do better. And if they don't, they're going to
face some very unpleasant consequences, and we will make sure
of that. Thank you.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator Lee. Senator Hirono.
Senator Hirono. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all for
coming to testify. I would ask that our testifiers speak
directly into the mic. I'm having a little trouble hearing you.
As we sit here listening to your testimony and the
questions being asked--perhaps this is for Mr. Stern and Ms.
Berry--is the kind of hate that we're talking about today,
whether it's anti-Jewish hate, sexual orientation hate crimes,
anti-Hispanic, anti-Black, anti-Muslim, anti-Asian American,
Native Hawaiian, Pacific Islander, anti-Haitians--is this kind
of hate learned? Mr. Stern.
Mr. Stern. Yes. Yes, and--but it also is not just that
people are being polluted. Part of the challenge is that, as
human beings, we're sort of ordained--our brains function to
see who's us and who's them. And sometimes the dehumanization
and demonization of that becomes, you know, problematic in
terms of particular groups. It can lead to genocide. It could
lead to the types of hate crimes we're seeing. So, you know, I
think that the more that we focus on that this is a normal
human reaction, whether it's on politics, too--the better able
we're going to be able to handle situations like this.
And to just, you know, piggyback on one thing that I agree
and disagree with my friend there, the Rabbi--I don't think on
the campus we're going to, you know, totally dispel this with
discipline. There are certainly places where there--you need to
have, you know, things--the police come in and so forth, but
that should be at the last--the education should be the
response to it. And one person I would suggest this Committee
hear from at some point is Michael Roth--he's Jewish, at
Wesleyan--who basically said, look, as long as you're not
harassing, you're not intimidating, you know, you're going to
be okay. You want a tent? Pitch a tent. And we're going to
bring people in there to have conversations. To me, that's a
much better approach in the long term.
Senator Hirono. I agree with you. And to the extent that
this kind of attitude--and, yes, there's a human nature aspect
to it, that maybe we're never going to be able to eliminate all
forms of racism and those kinds of attitudes, but it seems to
me that education plays a role, and one must start young at
making--at teaching against the kind of hatred that we see
around us. And as we sit here listening to anti-Jewish hate--it
was not very long ago that we were actually watching videos of
AAPI communities being attacked and even murdered, which led to
the COVID-19 hate crimes legislation, which was a bill that I
sponsored, and Senator Blumenthal's NO HATE Act was included,
which led to much better reporting, albeit it still--the lack
of adequate reporting of all manner of hate crimes is
recognized, and we can do better. And I'd like to--do you
agree, Mr. Stern, that we can do better in terms of educating
at a much younger age about the impact of hateful rhetoric and
to do something more at an early age, to address the learning
of hate?
Mr. Stern. You know--yes, I think we could do lots of
things at the early age. I think also--one of the things I put
in my written testimony is the idea of bringing people,
basically when they graduated from high school, from different
backgrounds together and sending them out to do a project for
somebody else. There's some social psychology that suggests
that that may reduce bigotry. And on the campus itself, let me
tell you, at Bard I had a colleague who saw people spitting out
words in a very hostile manner about Zionism, genocide, ethnic
cleansing, antisemitism--she said, you know, we're in a
college. Why don't we teach about it? And she put together a
course that helped students not only understand what these
terms mean but why people hear them differently.
Senator Hirono. So, are colleges creating such courses to
enhance the dialog and discussion?
Mr. Stern. That's the thing that distressed me most over
the summer. I saw a lot of reporting on what the new policies
are going to be. And I get it; administrations don't want to
get things out of control. But I would've loved to have seen,
what are the 20 new courses we're offering? What are the new
hate studies programs that we're putting together? So, why--
when I do workshops with students and faculty and others, and
they understand some of the brain science and social psychology
about how we get into these, you know, heated us-versus-them
buckets and you intellectually understand that, you're better
able to then negotiate these issues.
Senator Hirono. In the little bit of time that I have
left--I agree with you, and I hope that college administrators
and leaders are listening to you. And even as we speak, in
Springfield, Ohio, the Haitian community there is being
targeted, and the town has been targeted by hate-fueled attacks
and bomb threats, et cetera. In your studies, have you seen
minority communities being targeted like this, and can we
expect that there will be further escalation of hatred against
the Haitians in Springfield, Ohio and maybe will spread to
other communities? Can you briefly respond?
Mr. Stern. Yes. I am deeply concerned about anybody
targeting a whole community, let alone with rumors, but you
pick one----
Senator Hirono. Lies.
Mr. Stern. Yes, lies. Right. And, you know, what Mark was
saying before, too--you go and you stigmatize one entire group
because of somebody--you know, somebody that's perceived as
part of that group, and bring hate. The problem, to me--and
this I don't have a solution for--is that hate has always
worked in politics. Otherwise, politicians wouldn't use it. And
I think that the more that we stand up together and say we're
going to call it out, especially when it's from people on our
side, the less likely we'll be able to see this type of
rhetoric expand.
Senator Hirono. Thank you.
Ms. Berry. If I may----
Senator Hirono. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'm over my time.
[Applause.]
Chair Durbin. Senator Cruz.
Senator Cruz. Antisemitism is a unique historic form of
evil. And over millennia, it has manifested in violence, mass
murder, and genocide. October 7 was one of the darkest days in
human history, when terrorists murdered over 1,200 Israelis and
took 251 hostages. Women and girls were raped. It was the
single largest mass murder of Jews in a day since the
Holocaust. In the wake of October 7, we have seen antisemitism
explode across the United States and across the world, but
especially on college campuses. As the ADL has illustrated,
from 2022 to 2023, the number of antisemitic incidents more
than doubled in the United States.
But college campuses, in particular, have become vile
incubators of hatred of Jews. At Cornell University, in the
aftermath of October 7, one student made vile threats,
including statements such as, if I see a pig male Jew, I will
stab you and slit your throat. If I see another pig female Jew,
I will drag you away and rape you and throw you off a cliff. A
student organization at California State University, Long Beach
circulated a flyer calling for a, quote, ``day of resistance in
celebration of October 7.'' You will note, on the flyer is an
image of a person parachuting with a fan attached, a direct
reference to and a glorification of Hamas terrorists that used
gliders to descend upon a music festival and murder 260
innocent people and take many more hostages.
At Columbia University, the situation got so bad that the
Orthodox rabbi on campus, Rabbi Elie Buechler, had to make this
public statement: ``Columbia University's Public Safety cannot
guarantee Jewish students' safety in the face of extreme
antisemitism and anarchy. It deeply pains me to say that I
would strongly recommend you return home''--this was directed
to Jewish students--``as soon as possible and remain home . .
.'' The rabbi had every reason to be concerned. At Columbia's
campus, individuals yelled, we love Hamas. We're all Hamas.
Long live Hamas.
At the University of Washington, the granddaughter of
Holocaust survivors was told that--she was called names. She
was spit at. She was laughed at. She said she no longer felt
safe on campus, and she was told to go back to the gas
chambers. This is sick and horrific.
At Columbia, when Jewish students were engaged in
displaying the American flag and the Israeli flag, another
student wearing a mask--because these protesters are oh, so
brave, they almost always cover their face--held up a
handwritten sign saying, Al-Qassam's next target. Al-Qassam is
the military arm of Hamas. According to social media, this
particular student is a wealthy student from Georgia. She's not
Palestinian. But she has been taught lies and hatred, and she
feels perfectly comfortable advocating the murder of her fellow
students at Columbia. At MIT, students have reported they feel
unsafe to go to class, and the MIT president has said that she
would not discipline the students making those threats, because
if she did, they risk losing their visas and being deported.
Throughout all of this, the Biden-Harris administration has
been utterly absent. Does anyone doubt if the Klan were on
college campuses, terrorizing African-American students,
threatening African-American students, that we would see the
FBI there; that we would see prosecutors there; that we would
see Federal funding cutoff to universities? Of course, we
would, and we should. But when it comes to antisemitism, the
Democrats have a problem. I would note, this is occurring in
blue States with blue Governors, because the Democrat party is
terrified of the pro-Hamas wing of their party.
In States like Texas and Florida, we don't allow this. At
the University of Texas, when violent protesters threatened
Jewish students, police officers arrived and arrested them.
That's what happened when you enforced the law. Every
Republican Member of this Committee asked the Chairman to hold
a hearing on antisemitism in February, and yet we don't get a
hearing on antisemitism. We get a hearing generically on hate--
--
[Audience disruption.]
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Because this administration--and
this is the kind of anger and hate that is encouraged. You're
now seeing the hate, manifesting right here. Interestingly
enough, what----
[Audience disruption.]
Chair Durbin. Please. The Committee will come to order. The
Senator is recognized to finish his remarks.
[Audience disruption.]
Senator Cruz. So, we now have a demonstration of
antisemitism. We have a demonstration of the hate. Rabbi
Goldfeder, let me ask you, has the Biden administration cutoff
the funding of any of the colleges that have allowed this hate?
Have they indicted anyone for funding these violent protested--
protests? Have they indicted the people paying for the matching
tents? Or have they sat there silently, and have the
universities sat there silently while their students are
terrified to go to class?
Rabbi Goldfeder. They have not indicted anyone.
Senator Cruz. They have not indicted anyone. Has any
university had their funding cutoff for allowing this sort of
violent intimidation?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Not a single university.
Senator Cruz. I can tell you this. Next year, if there is
a----
Chair Durbin. Senator, your time is expired.
Senator Cruz [continuing]. Republican majority on this
Committee, you will see real leadership. And next year, if
there's a Republican administration, you will see people
prosecuted for this sort of violence. This is being tolerated
with the looking away, the blind eye being turned from this
administration and this Department of Justice. And it is
utterly disgraceful. And under Title VI, any university that
allows this should have their funding cutoff.
Chair Durbin. The Senator's time is expired. I would make a
note for the record. This hearing is about hate. It includes
antisemitism, as well as hatred toward other people. I would
also point out that the previous Chair of the Committee from
the other side of the table didn't hold a single hearing on
antisemitism or hate crimes. I've held multiple hearings
addressing this subject since becoming Chair, including a
hearing shortly after the January 15, 2022 synagogue hostage
crisis in Colleyville, Texas, which featured testimony from the
synagogue's rabbi. Senator Welch.
Senator Welch. Thank you. Thank you for holding this
hearing. The Senator from Texas, I was with you in your
indictment of all those horrendous antisemitic things that
happened. You lost me when it seemed like you veered into a
blame game. I think every single one of us here is horrified
about hatred and violence toward a person because of what they
believe or who they are.
Now, in Vermont, we're pretty proud of being a tolerant
State, but we have suffered significantly with antisemitic
activity. It's horrifying. One of the things that's really
terrifying to me is that when folks want to go to their
synagogue, they have to have police security. You know, when I
grew up going to Holy Name grammar school, we didn't know what
that was. We just went to church.
And in Vermont, we had three young Palestinian men who were
home, visiting a grandmother, for Thanksgiving. They were out
walking. They were speaking Arabic. They had on a keffiyeh.
They got shot. They got shot. I'm horrified at what has
happened to them. I am horrified at the antisemitism escalation
toward wonderful Vermonters who are Jews and what they have to
endure and the insecurity that they feel.
So, my view here is that let's acknowledge every single one
of us is horrified about the expression of hatred toward the
Jews, toward a Muslim, toward an Arab, and try to figure out
how best we can act. And that does include enforcement, but I
have observed that any issue out there that can become a
partisan issue often does. My view--that's not a solution.
You know, I speak to some Vermonters from the Jewish
community, so horrified, as we all are, about what happened,
what Hamas did on October 7. We have a teacher who had a
student and was killed on October 7, and she posted about it
and suffered enormous online harassment. But when we had these
three college boys who were just home for Thanksgiving, and
they got shot, I mean, all of us are absolutely horrified by
that. And people who commit crimes, particularly hate crimes--
they should be punished, but that should be whether it's on
campus, whether it's on the streets of Burlington, whether it's
at a synagogue. We all have that obligation, because that
hatred is so corrosive to all of us and to our society. And if
we, as a society, can't accept the collective responsibility
that we each have for the well-being of one another, then it's
not going to work.
So, Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the hearing, and I want to
thank the witnesses, because you're struggling with the day-by-
day. You're trying to help us find a way forward. But it's not
going to be just a law that we pass. It's not just an
indictment that we prosecute. And those things should be done,
but it's going to be much more a collective responsibility that
we have as citizens to one another. And let me just ask each of
you what you think, what advice you have for us.
Ms. Berry. Thank you so much for that, Senator, because I
do think it's the collective responsibility piece, and it's
something that Senator Hirono mentioned when she said, are
people taught this? Part of it, we have to understand, is the
process of dehumanization is central to people committing a
hate crime. I may have a biased view, but moving me to the
point of an actual crime, violence or the targeting of someone
or their institution, is entirely different. And part of that
requires that I don't see this person as human.
Senator Welch. Right.
Ms. Berry. So, when you talk about the cases of the
students in Vermont or we talk about what's been happening on
college campuses, part of what we have to understand is
labeling them agents of Hamas is part of dehumanizing them. You
can disagree or not agree with their speech. What I attempted
to say with the Ranking Member was that he posited a
complicated foreign policy question that I don't think belongs
at a hate crime hearing. Hamas or Hezbollah or Iran--not only
do they have views on Israel; they have views on the great
State--which is the United States.
We can have that conversation in a foreign policy context.
I just don't think that's the reason that people are marching,
Nazis are marching, saying, Jews will not replace us, and they
blame the American Jewish community for the Great Replacement
theory; therefore, they target the Tree of Life. It's not why
Nazis are marching in Disneyland. We have a very real problem,
and the center of it is understanding why people hate and what
we can do to respond.
So, the Office of Civil Rights has a budget to respond to
the increase in college campus hate that we're seeing.
Regrettably, that is not supported in a bipartisan way. So, if
we intend to actually take this seriously, it's not a
conversation about Israel and foreign policy; it's what are we
doing to understand that we must improve this response? And
that includes no longer dehumanizing Palestinians.
Senator Welch. Thank you.
[Applause.]
Chair Durbin. Senator Welch, you may conclude.
Senator Welch. I have concluded. I was going to offer an
opportunity but at the will of the Chairman--I am out of time.
Chair Durbin. Thank you very much. Senator Hawley.
Senator Hawley. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Berry, let me
just start with you. You said in response to a question from, I
think it was Senator Graham, you praise the protests going on
on campuses--I just want to make sure I got this right, so you
correct me now--as a National Organic Human Rights movement.
What did you mean by that?
Ms. Berry. The mass movement in support of Palestinian
human rights is happening on college campuses across the
country after students are learning more about the history of
the Palestinian-Israeli conflict and the specific targeting of
Palestinian human rights. Yes.
Senator Hawley. Okay. I just want to be clear about what
we're--what you're praising and not praising.
Ms. Berry. Well, praising----
Senator Hawley. Let's have a look here. So----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. This--long live the intifada.
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Hawley. Is this an example of the--what did you
say--National Organic Human Rights movement, that you mean?
This is a human rights movement?
Ms. Berry. I'm not sure that using the term intifada, which
literally just means to, like, shake off or get rid of, is
effective, as most Americans don't actually associate it with a
human rights issue, so I don't think that's effective. No,
Senator.
Senator Hawley. Wait a minute. You don't think it's
effective, but you would agree that this is calling for the
destruction of the State of Israel? This is after the----
Ms. Berry. No, Senator.
Senator Hawley. Oh, it's not?
Ms. Berry. I----
Senator Hawley. This isn't calling for the killing of Jews?
Ms. Berry. I don't know that person, and I don't know that
sign, so I don't----
Senator Hawley. Oh, you don't----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Know what that's calling for.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Know what this means?
Ms. Berry. I don't think----
Senator Hawley. You haven't seen this before? Did you see
these protests on--Rabbi, do you know what this means?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes. It's a call for the destruction of
the State of Israel and probably the killing of Jews
everywhere.
[Audience disruption.]
Ms. Berry. I do not agree with that, Senator.
Senator Hawley. You----
Ms. Berry. I've----
Senator Hawley. You don't think that this--you don't think
that's hate speech, right here?
Ms. Berry. Long live the intifada can mean different--as
I--see, the problem----
Senator Hawley. It can----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. With this, Senator----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Mean different things? Wait a
minute. These are----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Protests, violent protests on
campuses that targeted Jewish students, attacked them
personally, prevented them from going to camp--to class, put
them in fear of their safety after the October 7 attacks on the
State of Israel that murdered more Jews than at any time since
the Holocaust, and you're saying you think that this is an
ambiguous message?
Ms. Berry. I'm saying that any student targeted on campus,
Jewish student----
Senator Hawley. Will you condemn this, right here? Right
here. Long----
Ms. Berry. I----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Live the intifada. Will----
Ms. Berry. I'm condemning----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. You condemn that?
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Jewish students on targeted--on
campuses being targeted, and the Office of Civil Rights should
successfully be given funding in order to----
Senator Hawley. Will you----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Support them.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Condemn this as hate speech?
Ms. Berry. I think that can be hate speech, but I don't
think it's automatically hate speech. The problem is that
there's nuance, I'm trying to introduce to this conversation.
Senator Hawley. What's the nuance, when these people are
marching----
Ms. Berry. Because long live----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. And calling for----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. The intifada----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Jews to be killed?
Ms. Berry. Sir--sir, because intifada also means uprising,
for Palestinians. The way to get rid of----
Senator Hawley. Oh, so it's ambiguous, so it's hard to say.
Well, my gosh. Okay. Let's try another one. What about this?
[Audience disruption.]
Chair Durbin. Please. Audience will please----
Senator Hawley. Oh, yes, I--I mean, I--that's fine. We know
what you think. Right, exactly. I mean, I think you've made it
clear, those who were cheering earlier, when Senator Cruz was
asking about the attempts to destroy and kill Jews. Let's just
be clear about what's going on here, because here's what's
happening at this hearing. We can't talk about antisemitism
without also talking about something else. The message that's
being sent today at this hearing today is, antisemitism isn't
enough. The attempts to kill Jews on campuses--that's not a
conversation worthy of discussion. You've got to add something
else to it. So, if you want to kill Jews, oh, well, we can't
talk about that unless we also talk about 15 other things, and
now we have a witness sitting here----
Ms. Berry. Yes.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Who will not condemn the
attempts on these campuses that are blatantly antisemitic
tropes, Nazi tropes, to try and kill Jews. What about this one?
There's only one solution. Is that a National Organic Human
Rights movement?
Ms. Berry. No, sir. I trust that's in reference to the
Holocaust, and that's----
Senator Hawley. I would think----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Utterly reprehensible.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. The final solution.
Ms. Berry. Utterly reprehensible.
Senator Hawley. Okay, what about this? What about this?
Ms. Berry. But----
Senator Hawley. Glory to our martyrs.
Ms. Berry. Again, I don't understand the point of messaging
like that. I don't know what that means. All my----
Senator Hawley. Would you condemn this as antisemitic? This
was projected here in Washington, DC, on the campus, in front
of Jewish students, following the October 7 massacre.
Ms. Berry. I think that that is not appropriate speech at a
time----
Senator Hawley. This is hate speech, in the context, don't
you think?
Ms. Berry. Sure, but I----
Senator Hawley. Okay.
Ms. Berry. The point is, I would prefer to focus on the
issue of hate crime. That's the reason I'm saying that----
Senator Hawley. This is a hate crime--when you threaten to
kill Jews----
Ms. Berry. That's a hate crime.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. And destroy the State of
Israel----
Ms. Berry. No----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. That's hate speech.
Ms. Berry. No. Threatening to kill----
Senator Hawley. That's a hate crime.
Ms. Berry. Threatening to kill anyone, including Jews, is
a--is----
Senator Hawley. Yes, let's----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. A hate crime that's prosecutable.
Senator Hawley. And let's not pretend that it's ambivalent
or ambiguous or we're not sure. How about this one? Free
Palestine----
Ms. Berry. I----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. From the river to the sea.
Ms. Berry. That's not hate speech, sir.
Senator Hawley. You don't think that this is a call for the
destruction of the State of Israel?
Ms. Berry. Again, I can speak to what I think, which is
amazing, because I'd love to talk about what I think, but I
really think the focus of our hearing----
Senator Hawley. You don't think that----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Should be the growing problem of
hate crime.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. After the October 7 attacks,
when this was projected in front of a group of Jewish students
right here in the District of Columbia--you don't think that's
an attempt to intimidate them and call for the destruction of
the State of Israel?
Ms. Berry. Focusing on hate crime, I would say if that
were----
Senator Hawley. Just yes or no.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Displayed on a synagogue, then it's
a hate crime. If it was displayed on a Hillel, then it's a hate
crime. If it's displayed elsewhere, I trust it's----
Senator Hawley. Wow.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Speech.
Senator Hawley. Boy, and then we wonder why our students
are confused. Rabbi, let me just ask you, are you confused
about this message?
Rabbi Goldfeder. I'm not confused, and I'll add that even
if it was ambiguous and could mean different things to
different people--Senator, can you imagine if there was a
phrase that also meant kill all the Black people--would we be
okay with projecting it because it might also mean something
else to someone else?
Senator Hawley. No. I mean, well said. Well said. I just
have--I'm almost done, Mr. Chairman, but let me just ask, since
the witness talked about a National Human Rights movement--let
me just ask about a couple others. The University of North
Carolina chapter of Students for Justice in Palestine claim, it
is our moral obligation to be in solidarity with the
dispossessed, no matter the pathway to liberation they choose
to take. This includes violence. Would you condemn that?
Ms. Berry. I'm sorry. Was that for me?
Senator Hawley. Yes. It is our moral obligation to be in
solidarity with the dispossessed, no matter the pathway to
liberation they choose to take. This includes violence. Would
you condemn that?
Ms. Berry. I certainly condemn violence.
Senator Hawley. Good. You condemn that statement?
Ms. Berry. I condemn violence. I have no interest in
engaging in this back-and-forth about individual statements of
students. I'm saying----
Senator Hawley. Oh, I--you know what? I do have an interest
in it, and here's why. The----
Chair Durbin. Senator, your time----
Senator Hawley. What I just----
Chair Durbin [continuing]. has expired.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Read to you--the U.S. Senate
unanimously condemned this rhetoric. And unless we take a stand
now on this rhetoric, now, on this specific rhetoric out of the
mouths of these students that you have called National Organic
Human Rights movement protesters, we are going to send the
message that trying to kill Jews on campus, trying to prevent
Jews from going to class on campus, is just okay. It's just
another viewpoint.
Chair Durbin. Senator, your----
Senator Hawley. It's not just----
Ms. Berry. It's never okay.
Chair Durbin [continuing]. Time has expired.
Senator Hawley [continuing]. Another viewpoint.
Ms. Berry. Never okay.
Senator Hawley. And, frankly, what you're trying to do here
today----
Chair Durbin. No, no, no. Your time----
Senator Hawley [continuing]. I think is wrong.
Chair Durbin [continuing]. Has expired.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Deeply wrong, sir.
Chair Durbin. Senator Kennedy.
Senator Kennedy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Rabbi, do you
believe there are substantial number of people at Harvard
University who believe in diversity, equity, inclusion, and the
right to harass Jews?
Mabbi Goldfeder. I do.
Senator Kennedy. That's a yes?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. And do you believe those people have acted
on their self-anointed right to harass Jews?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. And has the administration at Harvard
University allowed that to happen?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. Is that true at University of California
at Berkeley?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. How about UCLA?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. How about NYU?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Yes.
Senator Kennedy. Lot of other universities, too. Isn't that
the case?
Rabbi Goldfeder. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. Now, Title VI says that if you receive
Federal money, you can't harass Jews. Isn't that true?
Rabbi Goldfeder. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. Has the Biden-Harris administration taken
away the money of Harvard?
Rabbi Goldfeder. No.
Senator Kennedy. How about Berkeley?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Nope.
Senator Kennedy. How about UCLA?
Rabbi Goldfeder. No, sir.
Senator Kennedy. How about NYU?
Rabbi Goldfeder. No.
Senator Kennedy. They've just talked, haven't they?
Rabbi Goldfeder. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. Okay. Do you think this condoned behavior
at these universities, this--these condoned belief at these
universities--and let me state it again. They believe in
diversity, equity, inclusion, and the right to harass Jews.
It's what they believe. What you do is what you believe.
Everything else is just cottage cheese. Do you think that is
consistent with their mission as universities?
Rabbi Goldfeder. Absolutely not.
Senator Kennedy. Okay. So, above and beyond the question of
money, it is the morality, the purpose of higher education in
America, is it not?
Rabbi Goldfeder. That is correct.
Senator Kennedy. Ms. Berry, you are the executive director
of the Arab American Institute. Is that correct?
Rabbi Berry. Correct, sir.
Senator Kennedy. Okay. And according to your website,
you're also, I'm going to quote here, ``a longtime Democratic
party activist who served as a member of the 2016 Democratic
National Convention's Platform Standing Committee,'' close
quote. Is that correct?
Rabbi Berry. That's correct.
Senator Kennedy. Okay. You support Hamas, do you not?
[Audience disruption.]
Ms. Berry. Senator, oddly enough, I'm going to say thank
you for that question, because it demonstrates the purpose of
our hearing today in a very----
Senator Kennedy. Let's start----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Effective way.
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. First with a yes or no.
Ms. Berry. Hamas is a foreign terrorist organization that I
do not support. But you asking the executive director of the
Arab American Institute that question very much puts the focus
on the issue of hate----
Senator Kennedy. Okay.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. In our country.
Senator Kennedy. Well, I----
[Applause.]
Senator Kennedy. I got your answer, and I appreciate it.
[Applause.]
Senator Kennedy. What is the--you support Hezbollah, too,
don't you?
[Audience disruption.]
Ms. Berry. Again, I find this line of questioning
extraordinarily disappointing, Senator.
Senator Kennedy. Is that a no?
Ms. Berry. That--you have----
Senator Kennedy. Or a yes?
Ms. Berry. You have Arab-American constituents that you
represent----
Senator Kennedy. But is that a----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. In your great State.
Senator Kennedy. Yes, ma'am, I understand that. But is--my
time's limited, and I apologize, but is that a yes or a no?
Ms. Berry. Yes-or-no question to--do I support Hezbollah?
The answer is, I don't support violence, whether it's
Hezbollah, Hamas, or any other entity that invokes it. So, no,
sir.
Senator Kennedy. You can't bring yourself to say no, can
you?
Ms. Berry. No, I can say no. I can yes. What I----
Senator Kennedy. But you haven't.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Can say is----
Senator Kennedy. You just can't----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Your line of questioning----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Make yourself do it.
[Audience disruption.]
Senator Kennedy. Do you----
Ms. Berry. Senator----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Support or oppose Iran and
their hatred of Jews?
Ms. Berry. Again, I'm going to emphasize, Iran, Hezbollah,
Hamas--none of them is going to----
Senator Kennedy. You can't bring----
Ms. Berry. This discussion----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Yourself to say no, can you?
Ms. Berry. Sir, I don't support----
Senator Kennedy. It's real simple.
Ms. Berry. Excuse me. I'm going to----
Senator Kennedy. And----
Ms. Berry. If I may----
Senator Kennedy. No, no----
Ms. Berry. As a Muslim----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. No.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Woman--as a Muslim woman, sir, I'm
going to tell you, I do not----
Senator Kennedy. I----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Support Iran. But what I will tell
you is that----
Senator Kennedy. You----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. This conversation----
Senator Kennedy. I'm running out of time. I'm sorry.
Ms. Berry. Okay.
Senator Kennedy. You----
[Audience disruption.]
Senator Kennedy. You called our decision----
[Audience disruption.]
Chair Durbin. Please.
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. To cut funding----
[Audience disruption.]
Senator Kennedy. You called our decision to cut--well,
first, what's the United Nations Relief and Works Agency?
Ms. Berry. It's UNRWA, which is----
Senator Kennedy. Yes.
Ms. Berry [continuing]. The institution that exists to
provide services and aid to the nearly six million Palestinian
refugees.
Senator Kennedy. And you called our decision to cut funding
for them, quote, ``an incredible moral failure,'' close quote.
Ms. Berry. That is absolutely correct. But again, I would
suggest that conversation is about----
Senator Kennedy. And we did----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Foreign policy.
Senator Kennedy. We did that because nine UNRWA staff
members were fired for actually helping Hamas on October 7.
[Audience disruption.]
Senator Kennedy. Isn't that the case?
[Audience disruption.]
Ms. Berry. I don't believe that that's correct, in terms
of----
Senator Kennedy. Let me----
Chair Durbin. The audience will please----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Ask you one more time. You
support Hamas, don't you?
[Audience disruption.]
Ms. Berry. Sir----
Senator Kennedy. You support UNWRA and Hamas, don't you?
Ms. Berry. Sir----
[Audience disruption.]
Chair Durbin. Please.
Ms. Berry. I think it's exceptionally disappointing that
you're looking at an Arab-American witness before you and
saying, you support Hamas.
Senator Kennedy. You know what's disappointing to me?
Ms. Berry. I do not support----
Senator Kennedy. You can't----
Ms. Berry [continuing]. Hamas.
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Bring yourself to say----
Ms. Berry. I do not support Hamas or any----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. You don't support UNWRA, you
don't support Hamas, you don't support----
Ms. Berry. I was very clear on my support for UNWRA.
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Hezbollah, and you don't----
Ms. Berry. I oppose----
Senator Kennedy [continuing]. Support Iran. You should hide
your head in a bag.
[Audience disruption.]
Chair Durbin. Your time is expired. Please----
[Audience disruption.]
Chair Durbin. Please, please. Ms. Berry, I'm going to allow
you to respond to any one or all of those questions, at this
point.
Ms. Berry. Senator Durbin, thank you very much for holding
this hearing and for elevating the issue of hate crime. It's
regrettable that I, as I sit here, have experienced the very
issue that we're attempting to deal with today.
[Applause.]
The introduction of foreign policy is not how we keep Arab
Americans or Jewish Americans or Muslim Americans or Black
people or Asian Americans--anybody--safe. This has been,
regrettably, a real disappointment but very much an indication
of the danger to our democratic institutions that we're in now.
And I deeply regret that, and I do hope that my testimony today
has been helpful to understanding the need to respond to hate.
[Applause.]
Chair Durbin. Over the weekend, I went to a synagogue in my
hometown of Springfield. There was a bar mitzvah for a dear
friend of mine. I couldn't help but notice the security guards
that were posted for this bar mitzvah. In addition, I went to
the meeting where a dear friend of mine, a Jewish friend of
mine in Chicago--she's been my friend and worked for me for 40
years--was almost in tears over the antisemitism that she has
witnessed. She was wearing a Star of David around her neck, and
she said, I do that because I won't give up. I won't give up.
I thought about it for this hearing, but I also thought
about Wadea, a 6-year-old boy. I have a 5-year-old
granddaughter. I love her like life itself. I cannot imagine
this poor little boy answering the door and losing his life
because he's Palestinian. My God, we can't say this, things
that I've just said in the same sentence, without some people
saying, oh, you've just chosen sides. I'm not choosing sides
here except for the side of, I hope, common decency and
democracy. We've got to have this conversation, and we've got
to do it in a civilized manner. I regret some of the things
that were said today at this hearing, but we are a free Nation,
and that's what happens in a democracy. As sad and as
disquieting as it may be, that is part of it.
The title of today's hearing was inspired by Dr. King's--
oh, I'm sorry. I didn't see Senator Blackburn. I was just
concluding. Senator, you're recognized.
Senator Blackburn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I had a feeling
you were trying to conclude and didn't realize that I was here.
But thank you very much.
Rabbi, I want to come to you, if I may. You cited a Gallup
poll that found that 60 percent of American Jews are afraid to
share their religious affiliation. And thank you for getting
that testimony in early. And that was just astounding to me.
And having friends that have felt so impacted after October 7--
and, Mr. Chairman, I wish we had had this hearing earlier. This
is the first Senate hearing that we have had dealing with
antisemitism----
Chair Durbin. No, it is not.
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. Since the----
Chair Durbin. No, it is not.
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. October 7----
Chair Durbin. Senator----
Senator Blackburn [continuing]. Attack.
Chair Durbin. Senator, I'm going to clarify the record once
and for all. I gave the date of the hearing that I had on----
Senator Blackburn. Okay.
Chair Durbin [continuing]. Antisemitism. You should've been
there.
Senator Blackburn. I'm sure I was.
Chair Durbin. Then you should----
Senator Blackburn. I make them all.
Chair Durbin [continuing]. Remember.
Senator Blackburn. I make them all. But, Rabbi, I want to
come to you. I want you to speak for just a moment about how
the protests that have carried out on the college campuses and
what we've been witnessing--how that not only is affecting the
students but how it is also affecting the Jewish people in
your--in your synagogue, in your community. If you'll just
drill down on that for a moment, for me.
Rabbi Goldfeder. Sure. Thank you, Senator, for that
question. The statistics are clear that on-campus incidents
lead to county-wide incidents and hate crimes. When you attack
a community because of who they are, it sends a message to that
entire community. In 2023, our synagogues became fortresses. In
2024, our children still go to school under armed guard,
because what starts at the universities spills out into the
streets, and when it's left unchecked, unfortunately a lot of
these bad actors see kindness as weakness and as a message that
they can do even worse and go even harder.
Senator Blackburn. You know, when you talk about the
schools, there are a couple in Tennessee, Vanderbilt and
University of Tennessee, that have really retained a policy of
institutional neutrality. And I know people have appreciated
that. So, talk a little bit about why it is important for
university leadership to support every student, instead of
catering to pro-Hamas activists.
Rabbi Goldfeder. Well, first of all, I think it's important
to clarify the record. We're not calling them pro-Hamas
activists. They're calling themselves pro-Hamas activists.
Senator Blackburn. That's right.
Rabbi Goldfeder. And they're handing out Hamas recruitment
materials. I brought some that I've already introduced for the
record. Happy to share more later. So, when people tell you
that they are working for Hamas, you should believe them.
Senator Blackburn. Right. Thank you for that. Ms. Berry, I
do want to go back to the issue of UNWRA. And I know that you
made a comment--pardon me--regarding Congress's decision to
prohibit funding for UNWRA, and I supported--pardon me--us
eliminating that funding for UNWRA, and I think Congress was
right to do that, because we were fully aware that some of
those UNWRA funds were ending up in the hands of terrorists and
UNWRA teachers and educational materials that had called for
the murder of the Jews. And yet you called that decision to
defund UNWRA and I will use your quote, ``an incredible moral
failure.'' And do you really believe that cutting off taxpayer
funds from UNWRA, when we knew that that money was--much of it
was ending up in the hands of terrorists--do you still believe
that's a moral failure?
Ms. Berry. Yes, Senator, unequivocally. And I apologize in
that, again, it's another foreign policy question, but I'll
take the opportunity to explain our position. The United
States, as well as the world, has obligations to the
Palestinian people after the creation of the State of Israel in
1948. UNWRA is part of that effort, and we support UNWRA
through our funding because it supports refugees in multiple
camps, as well as different services.
The part about the particular moral failure is that we
cutoff aid in the middle of Palestinians actually starving
within Gaza, so you had a situation where the heightened need
existed, and yet we made a move to cut the funding. And,
additionally, all the other governments that did that have
restored their funding, because it's been demonstrated that
those charges, regrettably--well, apologies, not regret; those
charges were false. So, yes, we need to be funding UNWRA.
[Applause.]
Senator Blackburn. Well, I will tell you that I think the
real moral failure is that Jewish students are not safe to walk
to and from class here in the United States. I think that that
is a travesty. I think anything that we can do to protect them,
we should be doing. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Durbin. Thank you, Senator. As I was saying, the
title of today's hearing was inspired by Dr. King's famous
letter from the Birmingham jail. Dr. King famously wrote,
injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. We are
caught in an inescapable network of mutuality tied in a single
garment of destiny. The notion of separating out statements
that are made about Palestinians, Arabs, Jews, immigrants,
Haitians--doesn't succeed in dealing with the problem directly.
[Audience disruption.]
When we lose our sense of shared humanity, it becomes--
please. When we lose our sense of shared humanity, it becomes
easier to dehumanize our fellow Americans and others and commit
horrible acts of violence. I agree with Mr. Stern that hate, at
its core, is about dividing us into groups of us and them. We
have to resist that ideology of hate. I hope this hearing has
highlighted that to all Americans. Yes, it was boisterous; yes,
it was emotional. Yes, it was democracy. The hearing record
will remain open for the week, for the submission of materials
for the record.
Chair Durbin. With that, the hearing stands adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 12:16 p.m., the hearing was adjourned.]
[Additional material submitted for the record follows.]
A P P E N D I X
Submitted by Chair Durbin:
Arab American Bar Association of Illinois........................ 135
Asian Americans Advancing Justice (AAJC)......................... 139
Assi, Lina, Written Statement.................................... 121
American Middle East Voters Alliance, Inc. (AMVOTE-PAC*)......... 145
Anti-Defamation League (ADL)..................................... 240
Anti-Palestinian Racism Survey Preliminary Report 2024........... 146
B'nai B'rith International....................................... 160
Bedrock Safety and Belonging For All............................. 155
Bend the Arc, Jewish Action...................................... 158
Bennett, James L., Testimony..................................... 363
Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR)..................... 162
Deol, Raghuvinder Singh, Letter.................................. 294
EMGAGE Action.................................................... 348
Fatal, The Resurgence of Anti-Muslim Hate........................ 308
Garcia, Sonny, Letter............................................ 338
GLAAD, Statement................................................. 231
Glckman, Audrey N., testimony.................................... 360
Hassan, Khalid, Statement........................................ 253
Hindu American Foundation (HAF).................................. 233
Hindus for Human Rights (HfHR)................................... 329
Institute for Social Policy and Understanding (ISPU)............. 318
Institute for the Understanding of Anti-Palestinian Racism....... 251
Interfaith America............................................... 247
Khalid Jabara Foundation (KJF)................................... 254
Laird, Lucille, female Muslima................................... 266
Levin, Emeritus Brian, Statement................................. 172
Life After Hate.................................................. 258
Masters, Michael, Statement...................................... 339
Muhammad, Abdul Akbar, Letter.................................... 137
Muslim Advocates................................................. 356
Muslim Public Affairs Council (MPAC)............................. 279
Muslims for Just Futures (MJF)................................... 268
NAPABA........................................................... 334
National Council of Jewish Women (NCJW).......................... 282
National Urban League............................................ 132
Parker, Channyn Lynne, Testimonial............................... 170
Polarization & Extremism Research & Innovation Lab (PERIL)....... 287
Rahman, Amina, Testimony......................................... 144
Saba, Katrina, Letter............................................ 252
Saini, Harpreet Singh, Letter.................................... 238
Shoulder to Soulder.............................................. 124
Sikh American Legal Defense and Education Fund (SALDEF).......... 126
SIKH Coalition................................................... 342
Singh, Lakhwant, Letter.......................................... 264
Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC)............................... 213
Stand Against All Hate, Honoring Wadee Alfayoumi................. 300
Tazamal, Mobashra, Fannine the Flames............................ 304
Union of Orthodox Jewish Congregations of America................ 296
Zayed, Watfae.................................................... 365
Submitted by Ranking Member Graham:
Civil Rights of Jewish Students.................................. 370
Union of Orthodox Jewish Congregations of America................ 366
Submitted by Senator Grassley:
Codifying Antisemitism, Abstract, Mark Goldfeder................. 508
Codifying Antisemitism, Mark Goldfeder........................... 379
Defining Antisemeitism, Mark Goldfeder........................... 429
Russia is trying to exploit America's divisions over the war in
Gaza, NBC News................................................ 375
The Hill......................................................... 373
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
[all]