[Senate Hearing 118-528]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
S. Hrg. 118-528
OVERSIGHT OF THE UNITED STATES
CAPITOL POLICE
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HEARING
before the
COMMITTEE ON RULES AND ADMINISTRATION
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 11, 2024
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Rules and Administration
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Available on http://www.govinfo.gov
______
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
57-902 WASHINGTON : 2025
COMMITTEE ON RULES AND ADMINISTRATION
SECOND SESSION
AMY KLOBUCHAR, Minnesota, Chairwoman
CHARLES E. SCHUMER, New York DEB FISCHER, Nebraska
MARK R. WARNER, Virginia MITCH McCONNELL, Kentucky
JEFF MERKLEY, Oregon TED CRUZ, Texas
ALEX PADILLA, California SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West
JON OSSOFF, Georgia Virginia
MICHAEL F. BENNET, Colorado ROGER WICKER, Mississippi
PETER WELCH, Vermont CINDY HYDE-SMITH, Mississippi
ADAM SCHIFF, California BILL HAGERTY, Tennessee
KATIE BOYD BRITT, Alabama
Elizabeth Farrar, Staff Director
Jackie Barber, Republican Staff Director
C O N T E N T S
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Pages
Opening Statement of:
Hon. Amy Klobuchar, Chairwoman, a United States Senator from the
State of Minnesota............................................. 1
Hon. Deb Fischer, a United States Senator from the State of
Nebraska....................................................... 5
J. Thomas Manger, Chief of Police, United States Capitol Police,
Washington, DC................................................. 7
Prepared Statement of:
J. Thomas Manger, Chief of Police, United States Capitol Police,
Washington, DC................................................. 22
Questions Submitted for the Record:
Hon. Amy Klobuchar, Chairwoman, a United States Senator from the
State of Minnesota to J. Thomas Manger, Chief of Police, United
States Capitol Police, Washington, DC.......................... 28
Hon. Michael F. Bennet, a United States Senator from the State of
Colorado to J. Thomas Manger, Chief of Police, United States
Capitol Police, Washington, DC................................. 33
OVERSIGHT OF THE UNITED STATES
CAPITOL POLICE
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WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 11, 2024
United States Senate
Committee on Rules and Administration
Washington, DC.
The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:49 p.m., in
Room 301, Russell Senate Office Building, Hon. Amy Klobuchar,
Chairwoman of the Committee, presiding.
Present: Senators Klobuchar, Fischer, Warner, Padilla,
Welch, Schiff, Capito, and Britt.
OPENING STATEMENT OF HONORABLE AMY KLOBUCHAR,
CHAIRWOMAN, A UNITED STATES SENATOR FROM
THE STATE OF MINNESOTA
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Good afternoon. I call to order this
hearing on Oversight of the Capitol Police. As noted, this is
our final Rules Committee hearing this Congress, and it is a
fitting one as so much of the work that we have done, that I
have done with Senator Fischer, as well as before that Senator
Blunt, has been focused on public safety and especially over
the last four years.
I would like to thank Chief Manger who came to us out of
retirement, thank you, for the work you have done to support
the Department's workforce, and to make the needed security
improvements we are here to discuss today.
I would also like to again express my gratitude to the
brave men and women of the Capitol Police for the work that
they do every day, and thank you, Gus, for your leadership of
the union, and just thank you to all of those involved in
public safety.
I would like to thank Senator Fischer for her partnership
in the last two years. Deb, I have appreciated the opportunity
to work with you. We have tried so hard to, I think, positively
realize that this Committee's jurisdiction is a little
different than some of the others, and it is more important
than ever that we work together.
If we have disagreements, we work them out, and that we, I
think Roy always used to say, are the mayors of the Capitol. We
get a lot of interesting requests, as do our wonderful staffs.
I specifically want to thank Elizabeth Farrar, my Staff
Director, for her incredible work.
I would like to congratulate our incoming Chair, Leader
McConnell, as well as I believe Senator Padilla--is going to be
taking over our side in this Committee, and to thank the Rules
Committee Members for their work. We welcome our newest Member,
Senator
Schiff. You know, we have two Californians on this Committee
right now.
This hearing is a time to look at the progress the Capitol
Police have made in the last four years and under the
leadership of the Chief since July 2021. In that time, the
Department has made necessary enhancements impacting all
aspects of its work, including many recommendations in the
original bipartisan security report that came out of this
Committee, as well as Homeland Security. It was a work of, I
would say, a lot of hard work of staff and a lot of willing to
compromise on behalf of Senator Blunt, Senators Peters and
Portman, and myself. Coming out of those recommendations is the
legislation that I led with former Senator Blunt, which is now
law, to allow the Capitol Police to immediately request
assistance from the National Guard in an emergency.
Critically, the Department has greatly improved under Chief
Manger its handling of intelligence and how it shares
information with rank and file officers, including by creating
a centralized intelligence bureau, prioritized operational
planning by requiring plans for all large scale events, and
taking steps to ensure officers have the training and equipment
to do their jobs.
Notably, all 103 recommendations that the Department's
Inspector General issued in the series of reports after January
6th have now been implemented. I cannot tell you how many
times--I think we have had eight hearings on oversight of the
police. We have gone through the 103 recommendations and gone
through the numbers, and I truly appreciate the public
transparency and accountability.
We also had with Congressman Steil the first joint
oversight hearing since 1945 of the security in the Capitol. We
are really pleased with that, as well in your responsiveness,
as well as Sergeant at Arms Gibson.
Here are some other examples of what this progress has
looked like over the past four years. We know we have
challenges, but I do think it is important to acknowledge the
progress. The Department now has an additional 360 sworn
officers on duty, from 1,842 to 2,202. There has been a 60
percent increase in the number of threat assessment agents.
Four years ago, the Department did not maintain a dedicated
Civil Disturbance Unit Program, and today it has six platoons
totaling more than 225 officers. While only 25 percent of
officers had access to riot gear on January 6th, something we
will never forget, locked on a bus, now every officer has this
equipment.
None of this would be possible without the officers who
stand in defense of the Capitol every day and who have risen to
the occasion as various threats have confronted Members of
Congress at the Capitol and beyond. In recent years, these men
and women have worked significant overtime, had vacations
canceled, family events canceled, while the Department worked
to add more officers. We thank them deeply for their service. I
commend the Chief's commitment to ensure the Department has the
personnel it needs, including offering hazard pay, retention
bonuses, and tuition support, and for exceeding the goal of
hiring 280 additional officers this year--that was the goal but
instead hired 315 officers.
Thank you again, Gus, for being such a strong advocate for
the officers. I know there are always disagreements. We are
well aware. At the same time, you have also been an advocate
for hiring and for the benefits for the officers.
We owe it to these officers to show them that they have our
full support. This includes continued funding for the Howard C.
Liebengood Center for Wellness--and I would like to recognize
the dedication of Dr. Serena Liebengood, the widow of Officer
Howard C. Liebengood, or Howie as he was known by so many of
you, the 15 year veteran of the Department who tragically died
in the days after January 6th and for whom the center is named.
Since its founding, the center has started a chaplain
program, created 24/7 support resources, and trained over 50
officers as peer support specialists.
At the same time we look at all of the good work that has
been done, we must be clear eyed about emerging demands on the
Department's expanding operations that we need to confront head
on. In addition to the security challenges we have seen here at
the Capitol, there has been a disturbing and unprecedented rise
in threats targeting Members of Congress from both parties, and
the ongoing volume and severity of those threats has posed new
challenges for the Capitol Police and local police Departments
across the country.
The Department reported over 8,000 of these threats just
last year and we expect to exceed that this year. This is four
times over the number that we have received in not that far
away years of the past. Members have been targeted with bomb
threats, subjects of cyberattacks, had their homes swatted, and
more.
We must keep striving to ensure the Capitol Police can
respond effectively to risk to Members' safety, including
prioritizing hiring of additional threat assessment agents and
building on efforts through the Department's field offices and
agreements with local law enforcement to ensure Members are
safe beyond the Capitol complex.
Finally, as we look ahead, I know work is well underway to
prepare for the events that will take place at the Capitol, the
Joint Session of Congress to certify the results of the
election on January 6th of this coming year, and also of course
the inauguration that Deb and I are working on together with
the Joint Inaugural Committee.
Both events have been designated as national special
security events, which will provide federal agency resources to
support the Capitol Police. While we will not get into law
enforcement details today, it is crucial that the Department is
ready to support these events, and are at the very heart of our
democracy, and I look forward to hearing the Chief's comments
on these efforts.
Before I turn it over to Senator Fischer, I would like to
make a few remarks to recognize what we have gotten done on the
Committee in the last few years, even beyond the major law
enforcement changes and the hiring of Chief Manger.
What may be our most lasting contribution to the Senate and
the country will be on display next month when we convene to
certify the results of the election in line with the
significant reforms to the Electoral Count Act, which passed in
this Committee on a bipartisan vote of 14 to 1 and will ensure
the will of the voters prevails in this and in future elections.
We will do so with key security improvements in place
thanks in large part to Chief Manger and Sergeant at Arms
General Karen Gibson.
Beyond this work, we passed bipartisan legislation into
law. I led this bill to improve accountability and empower
Congress to appoint and remove the Architect of the Capitol.
That was a major change. The President had always been able to
do that. I am not going to go into the issues of the past, but
we were very pleased to get that authority. We should own this,
and we should, as we just did, made a decision across party
lines, and across House and Senate, and joined together to
appoint our new Architect, Tom Austin, with unanimous
bipartisan and bicameral support.
During my time at the Committee, we have taken on a whole
host of issues to improve the work for this Senate for those
who work and visit here, reopening the buildings after the
pandemic, reforming the outdated process of reporting and
handling sexual harassment claims on Capitol Hill, and making
closed captioning available for all Senate committee hearings.
We worked to ensure that people visiting the Capitol see more
statues of women.
It is not just about what paintings and statues you take
away. It is what statues and paintings you put up. We were
really pleased to work on a bipartisan basis to get the new
statues with Senators Murkowski, Collins, and Sinema, two
former trailblazing Supreme Court Justices, Sandra Day O'Connor
and Ruth Bader Ginsburg, and we doubled the number of rooms
named after women in the Senate.
Okay, I think there was just like zero before, but okay,
now we doubled it. All right. We also have the bust of the
author of the Dred Scott decision removed, and it will be
replaced by the one of Justice Thurgood Marshall. When our
restaurant workers unionized, we made sure that they had a fair
contract, and Senator Blunt and I worked together to negotiate
that.
We also updated the rules, one of my favorite fun things
that we did, to ensure that babies can come on the Senate
floor. When I promised Senator Duckworth I would get it done
and she kept, by surprise, getting more and more pregnant and
asking me what was happening. That was a proud day when she
brought that little baby, Maile Pearl, all six pounds of her
onto the floor, wheeling her in on her wheelchair, a change
finally on the Senate floor.
Of course, we have not lost sight of the fact that we must
protect our free and fair elections so that people can make
their voices heard in our democracy. This is a commitment that
we must carry forward on this Committee.
I am grateful to my colleagues on both sides of the aisle
who I have worked with to get this done. I especially want to
thank Senator Fischer and her great staff and look forward to
working with them in whatever capacity in their new jobs. I
want to thank her very much for her leadership as well. Thank
you, Deb.
OPENING STATEMENT OF HONORABLE DEB FISCHER, A UNITED STATES
SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF NEBRASKA
Senator Fischer. Thank you, Chair Klobuchar, for holding
this hearing with the United States Capitol Police,
particularly as we reach a time of multiple high profile events
taking place on our Capitol campus. The Rules Committee has
jurisdiction over the day to day operations of the Senate and
the wider Capitol complex. One of our most important duties is
working with Capitol Police to support their efforts to keep
our community safe for our Members, our staff, and our
visitors.
We owe a debt of gratitude to the dedicated officers who
have sworn to protect us, and I am thankful to Chief Manger for
his leadership. The Capitol Police's duties are broad, from
patrolling the Capitol complex to providing security details to
Members as they travel across their districts and the country.
As such, they face unique challenges as a law enforcement
entity, and I am eager to learn more about how they approach
their mission. This Committee has heard from Chief Manger about
staffing shortages in the past, but I am encouraged by recent
recruiting levels as it seems that the Department is on track
to--near their currently authorized maximum employment levels.
As the Capitol Police progresses beyond its staffing
shortages concerns, it will be important to address other
issues that are facing the Department. I hope to see a focus on
developing clear communications with the congressional
community, especially as the Department looks to utilize new
technologies to keep our community safe.
We continue to see ever rising threats against elected
officials and their staff, including recent abhorrent bomb
threats against Cabinet Members and nominees. I encourage the
Capitol Police to continue its relationship building efforts
with state and local law enforcement, and to support
collaborative efforts that keep people safe in their home
districts, as well as here in Congress.
As we approach the start of the 119th Congress, the
Electoral College Vote Count, and the Presidential
Inauguration, it is imperative that the Capitol Police balance
individuals' First Amendment right to free speech with keeping
the Capitol complex safe so that Members of Congress can
fulfill their Constitutional duties.
It is more important than ever that the Capitol Police
remain a dynamic force, able to adapt to new and emerging
threats as well as persistent difficulties. Chief Manger, I
look forward to hearing more about how you and your agency plan
to meet the needs of this community as we move into the
beginning of the new Congress.
Finally today, this will be my last hearing as Rules
Committee Ranking Member. I am grateful for Senator Klobuchar's
partnership and friendship. I have enjoyed working these past
few years to make this institution a better, safer place for
all of our Members to do the people's business.
I am especially thankful for my staff, without whom none of
our work would have been possible. Jackie, Nichole, Allison,
Sophie, Kasey, and Chris, thank you for your professionalism
and your tireless work. In the months and years to come, I look
forward to continuing our work to safeguard this institution
that we all hold so dear. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Thank you, Senator Fischer. Okay, any
other comments before we go with the Chief ? Okay.
Senator Britt. Can I say something real quick?
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Yes.
Senator Britt. I would just like the opportunity to say
thank you to both of you. I mean, the way that you have chosen
to lead this Committee has been a model for how you do things,
how you tackle really hard things in a bipartisan way. Thank
you for the way you have led, for your team who we know does
the hard work.
Thank you for making sure that we could have a successful
tenure here in this Congress on the Rules Committee. I would be
remiss if I did not say, Chief Manger, thank you for what you
do, and the men and women who serve in the Capitol Police, not
only safeguarding our Capitol complex and making sure that the
people who work here and visit here can do so safely.
You all leave the safety of your home every single day so
that we can return to ours and you ensure that this is a place
where work can get done for the American people. The men and
women who serve do not just serve as an institution and pillars
of safety.
They have become our friends and our family as we walk the
halls and we come in, and I see Officer Burke coming in out of
the garage or whatnot, or this week they have been giving me a
really hard time about Alabama not making the college football
playoffs.
Some sparring has been going on as well. Just know that we
stand with you, and we are so grateful for what you do.
Anything that we can do to help you elevate your game or the
men and women who serve under you, count us in.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Thank you. Thanks, Senator. Senator
Padilla.
Senator Padilla. Yes, Senator. Thank you, Madam Chair. I
too want to take a moment to reflect on the hard work that the
Committee has done, and all that the Committee has accomplished
under your leadership.
I recall, it seems like so long ago, but in 2022 when we
passed the Electoral Count Reform Act, which you referenced
earlier, truly landmark legislation that modernized and secured
Congress's process for counting the votes for President.
We worked together to also introduce the Freedom to Vote
Act with all of our colleagues on this side of the aisle, which
seeks to make our elections not just safe and secure, but as
inclusive as possible as well.
As we are doing today, we have conducted oversight of the
Capitol Police, but not just the Capitol Police, the
Smithsonian, the Architect of the Capitol, and more. That does
not even begin to describe the work that you do behind the
scenes to help keep the buildings functioning and the many
employees that work at the Capitol running so that Congress can
do the people's business.
I can go on and on. I just wanted to take a moment to thank
you, Senator Klobuchar, for your tireless efforts and
leadership of the Committee. As we look ahead at the work that
we still have yet to do, I am just grateful to have you for an
example of how to get it done.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Well, thank you. Thank you, Senator
Padilla. I was thinking of all those times. I am looking at,
you know, your colleague from California is too new but two of our
best attenders, beside Senator Merkley, are you and Senator
Welch.
Needless to say, Senator Fischer and I need people here and
we have got many committees going on at the same time. I have
truly appreciated not just the support and the votes. We are on
a committee, the only committee that Senator Schumer and
Senator McConnell are on, which always makes it interesting.
You have really been a great leader on this, and I am
looking forward to handing over the reins on our side to you.
Thank you. Senator Welch.
Senator Welch. No, thank you. It has been a pleasure to be
on this Committee, one of five that I am with Senator
Klobuchar. She is watching me. Senator Fischer, it has really
been wonderful to see the way the two of you work.
Actually, that has been so pleasing to me. We have had a
recitation of the things that gotten done, and they are really
important obviously, the Electoral Reform Act, and also the
oversight of these magnificent institutions. You know, I would
like to see this Committee get jurisdiction for just about
everything, the way our two leaders work. It has been a
pleasure to serve on this Committee.
I do want to thank the Capitol Police. You know, it is such
a hard job. There were--we lost officers. We had injured
officers, what happened four years ago, and the challenge that
I see every day for officers who have to be totally vigilant to
protect us, keep us safe.
At the same time, have to be always polite and courteous to
the public who is coming in, oftentimes under a fair amount of
stress. The capacity for self-control and discipline that I see
every day among the Capitol Police is really--is quite
admirable.
I know how much that means to you, Senator Klobuchar and
Senator Fischer. You know, when she talks to us, Amy, and I
have had several discussions about the Capitol Police, but that
is literally top of mind in her concerns.
It is really quite a thrill to be sitting in this chair and
seeing public servants who work hard and have to endure a lot
of difficult challenges and do it well and consistently. Thank
you. Madam Chair and Vice Chair, thank you very much for your
work.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. All right. Well, thank you. Thank
you, Senator Welch, for being such a great mentee and getting
on all five committees so that we have this sudden huge power,
and no one schedules both of our committees at once anymore
because we are like, it is not one, it is two. With that, we
turn it over to you, Chief Manger. Thank you for your
leadership.
OPENING STATEMENT OF J. THOMAS MANGER, CHIEF OF POLICE, UNITED
STATES CAPITOL POLICE, WASHINGTON, DC
Mr. Manger. I want to thank you, Chairwoman Klobuchar,
Ranking Member Fischer, for your leadership. I, you know, I
practiced my remarks about five times today and I was always
kind of right at the edge of my time, but I am going to
completely go off script. I thank you for your leadership and I
want to also--you know, we have accomplished a lot, and we are
going to talk about that here this afternoon.
There is still more work to be done. We are going to talk
about that. The fact is that this Committee and all of its
Members have helped us, and but it has been a team effort, and
the team goes beyond just us. I wanted to thank you and Ranking
Member Fischer, you thanked your staff. I wanted to thank
Elizabeth, and Jackie, and Nichole, and Ben. They are with us
every month, every step of the way.
I want to thank my team that is here as well. My assistant
chiefs, my leadership team, both sworn and civilian. This has
been a team effort over the past four years to get where we are
today.
This did not just happen. I appreciate the fact that Gus is
here. Gus has been--he wanted many of the same things that I
wanted in terms of improvements for the Department. If there
were two things that I was trying to do--I mean, we can list
all of the accomplishments that the Department has, but if
there were two things that I wanted to do, it was first to
restore the sense of safety to the people who worked here, who
live and work around--on this campus, around this campus.
Also to regain the confidence of the men and women of the
Capitol Police in the Department, because I think both of those
things were harmed and in fact destroyed four years ago. It has
been a team effort, and I feel very fortunate to have such a
strong team around me to get these things done.
Both of you listed many of the accomplishments we had. I
think one of the things that has restored the sense of safety
in large part is our ability to respond quickly to whatever
happens here on the campus, whether it is 300 people sitting
down in the Cannon Building or, you know, another group, you
know, running the halls over in the Hart Building, you know,
creating disruptions.
Our ability to respond to those things, and get them under
control, and resolve them quickly is one of the things I think
that has helped us give people that sense of security here. We
have had large events that we have had to prepare for and
planned for. I think the visit from the Prime Minister of
Israel was a really good test for us, where you had thousands
of protesters who were just as angry as any group of protesters
that I have seen in my nearly four years here.
The operational planning that was done, the things that
were put into place, the resources that we had all kept that
protest not only kept the people on campus safe, but it kept
the folks that were trying to--that attempted to break the law,
that did break the law, it kept them from being able to disrupt
anything that was going on in this campus.
That I think was--not only was that a good test for us, but
it demonstrated really the template that we are using from, you
know, that we have been using and we will use going forward to
deal with large demonstrations that we anticipate could have
problems associated with them.
You know, we have talked about so many of the things that
went wrong four years ago, and we do have a world class
intelligence bureau now. We do have a Civil Disturbance Unit
that can handle any disruptions, any disorderly crowds, and do
it safely and effectively.
Our wellness center, we have got folks in our wellness
center that are trauma informed counselors who can deal with
officers who have been through really difficult situations.
Then we have got all the wellness and other specialists who can
provide just about an exhaustive list of resources to our men
and women.
I will just finish with, you know, one of the two big
things, and I think Senator Klobuchar you mentioned them, was
the fact that a law was passed that I have the ability to call
out the National Guard, and that has been a great help for us.
We have used that. We have that. As we talk more and answer
questions, I will talk about how we--that has assisted us and
how it has helped--been a part of our planning for the upcoming
electoral count as well as the upcoming inauguration, and then
the mutual aid. I mean we--one of the biggest issues that we
are dealing with now are issues that go directly to the
security--the safety and security of Members.
You talked about the fact that threats are--have quadrupled
since from just a few years ago. They have also, the strategies
that some of these folks that would do us harm are using have
escalated. It used to be that if, you know, when you went home,
you might be able to relax a little bit.
Well, those days are gone. I mean, Members of Congress, we
have--just in the last month, we have had over 50 Members of
Congress swatted. We have got to look at what we can do to
enhance people's security, not only when they are here on
campus, but when they are off campus and in their home
districts.
The ability to have this mutual aid and to be able to
reimburse local departments for their assistance has allowed us
to do so much, and I thank you for that, because without that,
I think we would not be able to do half the things that we are
able to do now.
There is a lot--I know you all have questions and there is
a lot more that I can talk about, improvements that we have
made, but I will turn it back to you for questions.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Manger was submitted for the
record.]
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Okay. Talk about the officers. You
know, I remember when the force had been--a lot of people had
left, a lot of morale issues, the whole thing. I remember
someone telling us, one of our Members, oh, we should have a
pizza party. Like a pizza party is not going to fix this right
now.
Could you talk about how you managed to exceed your goal of
280 new officers a year this time? What are the most effective
tools for recruiting, retaining officers, so key? As you know,
local departments are having issues all over the country, from
small rural areas to big metropolitan departments.
We still know we need to hire new officers here. I just
want to get your views as a law enforcement leader on what we
can do better.
Mr. Manger. One of the things that really got us
jumpstarted was the fact that there were changes made in our
salary structure, and we have a very competitive starting
salary. That certainly gets people's attention. Then you look
at our ability to give retention bonuses, which we have done.
That has kept our retention rate lower as well as gotten,
you know, more people interested in the Capitol Police. We have
other benefits like the student loan repayment program. I think
what really gets people's attention and gets people here and
wants them to stay here is the fact that we have got so many
opportunities here, you--to be able--to look at career
advancement through promotions.
To be able to say, well, I want to do--want to be a K-9
officer. I want to be a motor officer. I want to be a dignitary
protection agent. There are so many different opportunities
within the Department for folks that it I think that is a great
attraction to bring people here. We have, again, been very
successful in being able to get folks here and keep them here.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Right. I know the Department has
taken significant steps to address the equipment shortage, also
maintenance of equipment. I think our report found that 75
percent of the officers on January 6th defended the Capitol in
their regular uniforms. They could not access riot shields.
Some of them were locked on a bus. Obviously you were not
in charge back then. Can you talk about, or can you confirm
that the Department is fully equipped with the equipment that
they need now for any kind of large scale threats or
demonstrations?
Mr. Manger. Yes, I can confirm that. We are. Officers are
equipped with state-of-the-art equipment for civil disturbance.
It is great to have the equipment. It is great to have officers
that, you know, are willing to do it. It is the training. It is
the practicing that we have done that really has our folks
ready.
I think there is a level of confidence in our officers,
especially our CDU officers that they are ready for anything
and that when they are really being tested, they will look to
the left, they look to the right and--see that they have
adequate resources, adequate people there to accomplish
whatever we need to accomplish in keeping this campus safe.
They have, again, have the equipment, the training, the
less lethal, which was an issue four years ago, less lethal
munitions. All of those things have been addressed and we are
ready to go.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Could you talk about the key ways the
Department has improved the sharing of information with
officers on the front lines. Since that time, that was one of
our recommendations.
Mr. Manger. It was. I think we did--four years ago, we were
not doing a good job at getting information out to the rank and
file. One of the things--one of the first things that was done
was that everybody got a phone. We push this information out
every day. All the updated intelligence information, we put out
briefing sheets every day. We have intelligence briefings every
day.
That information is getting out. We also, Chief Gallagher
and I just did roll calls for just about every officer on the
Department. We went to different roll calls to give a briefing
about what is going on--what we have got planned for January
6th and for the inauguration. Chief Gallagher is going to do
another round of interviews or another round of briefings and
all the roll calls I think next week.
We want to make sure that everybody has confidence in our
plan, and everybody knows what the plan is.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Very good. Just quickly, my last
question, turning to Members' security. I know you rely on
partnerships with local law enforcement. Your testimony
mentions the Department's new protective intelligence operation
center to enhance the Department's ability to respond to
threats.
How do you expect the center to improve the investigation
of threats when, as we know, so many of them are made away from
the mothership of the Capitol?
Mr. Manger. I just want to say for the record that the
Protective Intelligence Operation Center, or the PIOC, is a
work in progress. It--we have stood it up. It is doing a great
job in terms of coordinating everything to making sure that
when we get these threats that come in, that it gets the proper
attention and the proper coordination with all of the
Department's resources.
We want to make sure that we are working hand in hand with
the Sergeant at Arms, and so that we--you know, when you get
8,000 threats a year, you have got to triage them and determine
which are the ones that require immediate attention and which,
you know, might not be as urgent. The PIOC helps us do all of
that.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Very good. Thank you. Senator
Fischer.
Senator Fischer. Thank you, Senator Klobuchar. Chief, just
to follow up here on Chairwoman Klobuchar's question to you
about the Protective Intelligence Operations Center.
When we are looking at how Members receive verified
information of possible threats out there or actions that are
taking place, I think it is really important it come from you
and not from the media. Do we have a written policy on that, on
how the communication goes out?
I know we get alerts quite often on our text and on our
email, but do we have a written policy on that?
Mr. Manger. We do with our social media where we put
information out. When we--when our public information office
puts information out. We have--we do have a policy about that.
There is always a balance in terms of what information that we
want to put out.
You do not want to harm an investigation, but at the same
time, I think the public wants to know, especially if there is
something that--in and around this campus that might be a
danger to other people, we want to make sure that we get
information out. There is a balance there that we are trying.
Senator Fischer. Is there an approval process that you have
to follow on just how and when those alerts go out? If so, how
long does that take? Is that part of a written policy?
Mr. Manger. For the--most of the alerts come out from the
command center.
Senator Fischer. Okay.
Mr. Manger. That we have--we try to be consistent to make
sure that the--and again this is the balance. We want to get
information out quick, but we want it to be accurate.
You ask any police officer, and they will tell you that the
first information you ever get in a crisis is always not quite
accurate. You know, it has got a little something wrong with
it. We are trying to get that balance where we get the
information out quickly, but make sure it is accurate as well.
Senator Fischer. Okay. In your opening statement, you
referenced mutual aid and being able to work with local law
enforcement and state law enforcement. Do you think those
relationships are sufficient to meet additional protective
needs? Do you anticipate any increase in mutual aid funding?
Mr. Manger. I do. Now, I think, you know, the first
allotment of funding was pretty significant, and I think we are
still able to do what we need to do. This is going to be, I
think for the foreseeable future, we are going to need the help
of these local law enforcement agencies in people's home
districts.
We are using them not only in relationship to protection
duties, but we are also when any Member, you know, is having a
town hall meeting and they expect to have some protesters there
or whatever.
Our ability to contact that jurisdiction and say, can you
have a couple of officers, you know, stand by during this town
hall meeting, and by the way, we will reimburse you for their
time, because typically many jurisdictions will say, well, we
really do not have the staffing to do it.
If they can pull somebody in off duty, if they can pay some
of the overtime to assist us with that, it is a win-win. I--not
only for our protection operations, but just for the safety and
security of, you know, the folks when they are in their home
districts, it has been invaluable.
Senator Fischer. Off the top of your head, do you have any
idea how many times you have used that in the last year or two,
to be able to contact local law enforcement?
Mr. Manger. I would say hundreds. Hundreds. Now we have,
sometimes it is a last minute thing, but we also have a
memorandums of agreement with a fair number, dozens of police
agencies that we seem to call on over and over. It has been--we
use it all the time.
Senator Fischer. Yes. Good. Thank you. A few questions on
training for the officers. Are training requirements in place
so that officers know how to respond to specific types of
emergencies?
Mr. Manger. Yes. Yes. I mean, that's part of the basic
training that they get at--not only at the FLETC training
academy down in Georgia, but we have our own academy in
Cheltenham.
Senator Fischer. How many trainings are provided to all
officers versus those in special units like the Civil
Disturbance Unit?
Mr. Manger. Everybody--all recruit officers, go through six
months of training just recruit training and then after that,
they go through a few months of field training, and then they
are put out on their own.
Every officer has to go through--a certain amount of in-
service training every year, whether it is firearms, whether it
is--and typically we will do something different each year but
have just retraining on critical issues. Officers have to go
through about a week's worth of in-service training.
Senator Fischer. Is that pretty standard with other law
enforcement across the country?
Mr. Manger. Yes. Yes.
Senator Fischer. Thank you.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Very good. Senator Padilla is next,
but I think Senator Warner is just not going to ask questions
but say something briefly.
Senator Warner. Well, thank you, Madam Chairwoman, and
thanks to Senator Padilla and Senator Schiff. I am in the
middle of an Intel Committee, and I am chairing it, so you
never get me off the remaining days with the gavel.
I wanted to come over and thank both the Chair and the
Ranking Member for their leadership on the Rules Committee. It
has been bipartisan. I want to particularly thank my friend Amy
Klobuchar for the work she did in the aftermath of January 6th
when working with a bipartisan group of us we came up with the
Electoral Count Act that is now law of the land that tried to
make sure on a procedural basis there was no ambiguity.
I appreciate the fact that she helped select the new chief.
I appreciate the fact that you worked on--with your colleague,
our friend Roy Blunt, on, you know, through HSGAC making
processes better, trying to see where the mistakes made on
January 6th. I am grateful for that.
I am grateful for what you both did in terms of getting the
Capitol reopened post-COVID. Those--it seemed like forever ago,
but it was candidly not that forever ago, and how we deal with
the public's need to get in and see us but also to keep not
only us, but our staffs safe.
I also just, you know, this is not a committee that always
gets a lot of attention, but for so many of the ways that the
Members and their staffs operate--you know, Senator Klobuchar,
you have always been an advocate for making sure that folks are
treated fairly and, you know, that we try to, in a challenging
circumstance, do our jobs better, but also do our job safer.
I am grateful for that. I will not impugn on my jumping
line other than to leave as a parting thought, if I was going
to ask a question--.
[Laughter.]
Senator Warner. He is not going to answer. It would just
be, Chief Manger and I went through--we went through hell and
back with the sniper back 25 years ago when he was in Fairfax,
and I was the Governor.
I am still astonished that more folks' heads are not
exploding around Salt Typhoon, or the Chinese are into our
telecom networks on a cyber attack and candidly have the
ability to listen to every one of us on a real time basis. My
hope is, Chief, and I will get another time that you can get me
the answers, is just how do we make sure our cyber protections
are better?
I can assure you, you know, they have gone after not just
Members, they have gone after staff. This is an ongoing
problem. As I have said repeatedly, the barn door is still
open, and how we do a better job protecting and how we
particularly recognize that all of us up here, regardless of
the role we play, are targeted by our adversaries, is
critically important.
I look forward to hearing more about what Capitol Police in
particular are doing on cyber. Again, my thanks to my great two
California colleagues for--first and last time I will ever jump
line on you.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Okay.
Senator Warner. I do believe that.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Very good. We will make sure he
reenters cyber later, but thank you, Senator Warner. Senator
Padilla.
Senator Padilla. Thank you, Senator Klobuchar. Out of
respect to our colleague, Senator Warner, Chief, if there is
any initial comments or response to the topic Senator Warner
laid out, feel free.
Mr. Manger. Yes. I think one of the--I think we all need to
be concerned about the cyber threats. We do work--the Capitol
Police works very closely with the Senate Sergeant of Arms on
those kinds of cyber threats.
Our intelligence bureau has--one of our agents is assigned
to an FBI task force, a cyber security task force. They are
able to not only take the lead on some of those investigations,
but they have the resources of the entire FBI being on that
task force.
That has been very helpful for us. I think the other issue
really is how artificial intelligence, it can be a great help,
and it can also increase threat activity. We are seeing both of
those things.
I mean, we provide information on a pretty regular basis to
our oversight committees about how we use artificial
intelligence. I think that the concern from a threat standpoint
is that artificial intelligence can really facilitate the more
traditional kind of threats, but it also brings also some new
challenges for us.
Just having bad actors, the ability to more easily generate
and disseminate propaganda, oftentimes using it to get their
followers all geared up, you know, for--on some issue. It is a
real concern for us, and it is something that I think all of
law enforcement is really struggling with at times because as
quickly as we sort of get up to speed on one challenge, then
there's something brand new.
I think that this Committee and Members of Congress in
general certainly are aware of how disinformation can--and
especially with the people's ability to use a Member's
likeness, that disinformation can be used really maliciously
and that is a huge problem for all of us.
Senator Padilla. As technology continues to evolve, this
conversation will continue to evolve. We will put a pin in that
and say it is to be continued. I want to preface my next
question with a little bit of context.
My career started in local government. I have served in
State Government and now I am here at the Federal Government.
While I appreciate the uniqueness of the mission for United
States Capitol Police, right, this is our Nation's Capitol, and
all that you do not just to keep Members safe, staff safe,
visitors safe because this is the people's Capitol after all.
I want to spend a moment on some of the fundamentals that I
think are consistent across police departments and agencies,
large and small, urban, rural across the country. We can engage
in conversations about use of force or patrolling issues,
investigation and technology issues, information sharing, and
community based policing initiatives and beyond.
None of that is possible without a strong, reliable police
force. From my early days, I knew the importance of
recruitment, retention, and morale of the rank and file. You
have described in your testimony, your written testimony, the
difficulties with recruitment, retention, morale during the
COVID-19 pandemic, and certainly the unique challenges posed by
January 6th of a few years ago.
You spoke earlier briefly about some of the improvements on
the recruitment side given salary levels, changes to benefits,
etcetera. Can you speak for a minute on the retention side,
what is working, what is not working, how are we doing? On the
morale side, what is working what is not working, how are we
doing?
Mr. Manger. I have been a police officer for 46 years and I
spent most of my career in local policing. I will tell you
about morale, morale is in the eye of the beholder. If a chief
sits in front of you and tells you morale is just fine, well,
there is some officers that their morale is great.
There is some that the morale is not so good. Then you have
got the 80 percent in the middle that on any given day could be
good or bad. I think what we need to do is make sure we are
treating our officers fairly.
That when we recruit, we are recruiting the right people
for this job. I think if you look back--and I started policing
in the 70's and there were--I do not know what the, you know,
characteristics they were looking for in a good police officer
back then, but I will tell you, we do a thousand times better
today at selecting the right people for the job.
Investing in their training throughout their career. Not
just in the academy, but throughout their career. Then holding
everybody accountable, from me down two to the last, you know,
newest recruit. Everybody is going to be held accountable to do
their job the way it is supposed to be done.
If you are fair, and you are consistent, and you show, and
people--and officers believe they are appreciated in what they
do, that is about the best you can do in terms of morale. We
had--the officers in this agency lost confidence in the
Department and in the Department's leadership four years ago.
I completely understand that. We have tried to regain that
and restore their confidence in the Department. I think we have
done--I think it is better. I will not speak for, you know,
2,000 of my cops but I will tell you that I talk to them--I do
not pass a police officer without talking to them. Most will
acknowledge that things are much better than they were. That
is--we just got to keep going with that.
The other thing, and I will finish with this. You know, at
local government, you know that you are--a local police
department, if they feel like the elected officials appreciate
what they do and the public appreciates what they do, they--it
is good for their outlook.
One of the things about this, this is my third police
department, and the culture here is one where these cops know
that the people who work here and, you know, are on Capitol
Hill appreciate what they do.
I am not saying, you know, there is not some exceptions.
There are always some exceptions. The cops here know that
people appreciate what they do and that provides a pretty good
culture in this police department, and I am very proud of that.
Senator Padilla. Thank you.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Okay. Very good. Senator Schiff.
Senator Schiff. Thank you, Madam Chair. Senator Padilla was
asking me if this has sunk in yet that I am here in this body
and on this Committee, and I thought it had but I look at my
nameplate and it still has not. I am not used to seeing that R-
E-P on the nameplate, but I am really thrilled to be on your
Committee and appreciate this opportunity.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Thank you, Senator Schiff.
Senator Schiff. Thank you so much for your service and for
all the people in the Department. Really appreciate it. Many of
us that were here on January 6th owe our lives and safety to
the brave work that the folks in your Department have done. I
want to begin by thanking you and thanking everyone who works
with you.
I want to raise an issue that I have not had a chance to
raise before and let me preface it by saying how much I
appreciate how much your Department works with my office and
with the other Members, and I know how taxed you are in terms
of capacity and resources.
I think we are doing a much better job protecting the
building and I think--and the people who work in the building.
I appreciate all the reforms you have undertaken based on the
earlier recommendations. I remain--I continue to be concerned,
though, about whether we are doing enough vis-a-vis the staff
and Members outside the building, particularly in our states.
We are seeing, and you are seeing this dramatic rise in
threats and swatting attacks. Certainly my family, and myself,
and my staff, and really all of us have experienced that to an
extraordinary degree.
I am not sure that we are going to do anything about it in
the Congress unless you come and tell us that in your
assessment we are not doing enough to protect the Members. In
order to do it, we are going to have to make a substantial
investment in personnel to do it outside of the Capitol
grounds.
I would ask you, what is your assessment of the security of
Members and staff, particularly in our states and our
districts? What more should we be doing? What kind of a budget
would you need to make that happen?
Mr. Manger. Well, thank you for asking that. Thank you for
acknowledging that things have changed here on the campus. That
was the number one priority when I took over, is that we had to
restore people's sense of safety. We had to get things under
control here. I think we in large measure, we have accomplished
that. We still need to pay attention to it, but we are in a
good place.
Who knew that threats would go through the roof, the number
of threats. Who knew that the tactics that folks that want to
disrupt the lives and disrupt the work of Members of Congress
would do--you know, would result in people--you know, having,
you know, 50 people swatted in the last month. Had people
disturbed in the middle of the night in their homes because
there is people out banging on pots and pans.
That and just the heightened threat level in this country
has not gone down. We do need additional resources for exactly
what you describe whether it is in the dignitary protection
division, where as you know the leadership gets protection
details. Woefully understaffed. Woefully understaffed. I mean,
we have got officers--we provide the protection at the level it
needs to be, but you do that through officers working double
shifts and averaging--our DPD agents average 50 hours of
overtime every pay period--50 hours.
We have got to get--we have got to, you know, 200, 250
somewhere in there, additional DPD agents. It needs to be 500.
It needs to be doubled. That way we can provide--and not only
can we provide protection for the leadership 24/7, but when we
have people that have threats against them that require us to
stand up temporary details, we can do that.
Because right now, when we do it, we are robbing Peter to
pay Paul. We are yanking somebody off another detail to stand
up the detail to help someone for a temporary threat situation.
I could just give you example after example where we would, if
we had the staffing, we would be able to do a better job in
terms of protecting people when they are not on this campus.
The threat agents.
We had in November--over 700 threats came in the month of
November, and we have maybe 20 some threat agents, threat
investigation agents. That needs to be doubled. You know, and
we are going to add another--I think we are adding another
eight, you know, that are just getting out of their basic
investigations training this week. There is help on the way,
but even that is not enough. We have got to continue.
The DPD, the threat agents, the intelligence operation we
have--I mean, we have such a great intelligence bureau, but we
still have agents that are doing the work that analysts should
do. We can hire an analyst, a civilian analyst to sit in front
of a computer and go--and do the investigative work on the
computer. Let the agent be out in the field, locking people up,
knocking on doors to do interviews and doing the work that only
those agents can do.
I could--I have a simple recipe to get this done. We have
gotten to where we are today by having 12 recruit classes, one
a month, and of 25 officers, that 288 number. Let's continue
that through the next calendar year and maybe the next calendar
year after that. Right now we would need our authorization
raised and we would need our appropriation raised in order to
be able to do that for the next year.
I think it has to be done because we--it is the critical
need for our protection services bureau requires that we
continue to train those recruits, get them out in the field.
There is a ton of people that you see on these posts,
especially the young ones. All they want to do is become
agents.
They want to join a dignitary protection. They want to be a
threat agent, you know, investigation agent. As those--we can
move them over there when we backfill, you know, when we
backfill with new recruits. We have got to keep the recruit
classes going.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Thank you very much. Do you have some
more questions?
Senator Fischer. If I could follow up.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Yes, go ahead.
Senator Fischer. Chief, I just wanted to follow up on the
staffing levels that we have. Congratulations again on almost
reaching the staffing level. I look forward to that continuing
to improve.
A couple of things. What benefits do we as Members and
would our staff see as those levels are increased? Are we going
to have less wait lines to get in the building? Are we going to
see other entrances open? Is that something that you are
looking at? Because as you know, Senator Klobuchar and I hear
about that a lot.
Mr. Manger. There is--I think that is always something that
we are looking at. I mean, I know that there were a couple of
doors over in the House side, and I think one or two doors on
the Senate side that we said, you know, when we get enough
people, we are going to reopen that door.
A couple of--and we have done a couple of them but there is
probably more that we would like to do and can add to people's
convenience. I am more looking at some of the--those are nice
to haves, and I do not mean to diminish them, but those are
nice to haves. I have got have to haves.
Senator Fischer. Yes.
Mr. Manger [continuing]. you know, as well which I just
described to Senator Schiff with--in terms of getting the
caseload manageable for our threat investigation agents and
restoring some ability to have a work life balance with our
dignitary protection agents who are working 50 hours of
overtime every----
Senator Fischer. I would like to follow up with Senator
Padilla when he brought up your retention. You know, the
importance of that. I have a good relationship with law
enforcement across Nebraska.
I worked with the Omaha Police Department to be able to
have not just a recruitment bill here, but also have a
retention bill. Do you have specific examples of what you feel
your Department needs in order to retain veteran police
officers, but also the new recruits that you have, so we do not
see the change in the employees?
Mr. Manger. I think it is a three pronged answer here. One,
we have a very competitive starting salary. I can tell you that
Secret Service and a bunch of these other agencies are saying,
oh, look, Capitol Police is not having any trouble hiring
people. We got to do what they are doing.
We are getting people that are, you know, they are giving
us competition in terms of our starting salary, and pay rates,
and that sort of thing. The retention bonus, we have given a
retention bonus every year for the last three years, and it
has--when you look at our attrition rate, it has dropped
because people saying, you know, I will take the retention
bonus.
I will stay here. Then the third issue is, and I will speak
because I represent the senior population, our mandatory
retirement age in Federal--for Federal law enforcement is 57
years old. That is shameful, shameful. We have people that are
in the prime of their career at that age and they got to go.
You know, I have been able to get the Capitol Police Board
to agree to extend it to age 60. I have had--I have several
officers that have spoken with just in the last month who are
hitting 60 years old and they said, Chief, I do not want to go.
You look at them and they look like they are 35 and they
certainly can still do the job physically, mentally, and they
are some of the best cops you would ever want to work with.
There is no--I have no ability to hold on to them.
Now, the Secret Service had a legislative tweak that just
impacts the Secret Service where they have the option of
keeping people to their 65. Okay, let's just add one phrase in
there, Secret Service and United States Capitol Police. I do
not know that everybody is going to stay till 65, but I know
there are some that would, and oftentimes they are some of the
best cops that you have.
Senator Fischer. Thank you.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Very good. Well, I want to thank you,
Chief. Believe it or not, we are having our staff holiday party
in this room, and in 1 hour, all your notes will be replaced by
eggnog. I am aware of our time limits here, but I want to thank
you and the officers for your work. I am sure a few of the
Members may have some questions in writing. I am excited to
remain on this Committee, as I know Senator Fischer is.
We are going to be very close by and continue to be a part
of the management of this Capitol and all the work that you do,
and hopefully our knowledge will be helpful to those running
the Committee. I want to especially thank my staff, as Deb
thanked hers, for their just unbelievable, diligent, consistent
work over the years.
Elizabeth Farrar who has been with me a long--when you go
in the way back zone before I was chair to Lizzie Peluso. As
well as Lindsay Kerr, who all helped me manage this Committee--
Gus is nodding his head remembering all these days. I also want
to thank Steve Spaulding, who has done incredible work on our
election work.
Ben Driscoll, our Chief Counsel. Kristin Mollet, who has
just done really, really good work in the Capitol. Allison
Hunn, same thing. Kulani Jalata, and Khalil Lee who I have
known for quite a while. I also want to thank our clerks, Cami
Morrison and Kasey Jones, who has a great name, let's face it.
Thank you to all of them for their work, as well as the
rest of the Rules Committee staff, not just Deb's staff, but
also the nonpartisan staff that works here that makes this
Capitol work. We are eager for what is to come.
It is not every job you can feel like, okay, we left this
in a better place than when we came in, but because of your
good work and all the officers, we firmly believe that, not
only with law enforcement, but also with a number of other
things that came under our jurisdiction in the Capitol.
We did it without a lot of fanfare or fights or public
humiliations, which seem to go with the work of elected
officials these days. We did it the right way, working with the
leaders on both sides of the Capitol. I cannot think of a
better way to go out, and look forward to continuing to work
with you, Chief.
Mr. Manger. Thank you. I will--one comment, one question.
My comment is, when you were here with Senator Blunt, I did not
think it could get any better. Clearly, I was wrong.
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Well, we just will not tell Senator
Blunt.
Mr. Manger. Do not tell him. My question is, I believe I
understood you correctly when you said that we were all invited
to this holiday party.
[Laughter.]
Chairwoman Klobuchar. Yes. The whole police force. Okay.
With that, we will keep the record open over the next week for
any additional questions from Senators, and the hearing is
adjourned. Thank you.
[Whereupon, at 3:53 p.m., the hearing was adjourned.]
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