[Senate Hearing 118-409]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
S. Hrg. 118-409
THE STATE OF RURAL INFRASTRUCTURE: EMERGENCY RESPONSE, RECOVERY, AND
RESILIENCE
=======================================================================
HEARING
before the
SUBCOMMITTEE ON
RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND ENERGY
of the
COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE,
NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
July 10, 2024
__________
Printed for the use of the
Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Available on http://www.govinfo.gov/
_______
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
56-753 PDF WASHINGTON : 2025
COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE, NUTRITION, AND FORESTRY
DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan, Chairwoman
SHERROD BROWN, Ohio JOHN BOOZMAN, Arkansas
AMY KLOBUCHAR, Minnesota MITCH McCONNELL, Kentucky
MICHAEL F. BENNET, Colorado JOHN HOEVEN, North Dakota
KIRSTEN E. GILLIBRAND, New York JONI ERNST, Iowa
TINA SMITH, Minnesota CINDY HYDE-SMITH, Mississippi
RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois ROGER MARSHALL, Kansas
CORY BOOKER, New Jersey TOMMY TUBERVILLE, Alabama
BEN RAY LUJAN, New Mexico MIKE BRAUN, Indiana
RAPHAEL WARNOCK, Georgia CHARLES GRASSLEY, Iowa
PETER WELCH, Vermont JOHN THUNE, South Dakota
JOHN FETTERMAN, Pennsylvania DEB FISCHER, Nebraska
Eyang Garrison, Majority Staff Director
Chu-Yuan Hwang, Majority Chief Counsel
Jessica L. Williams, Chief Clerk
Fitzhugh Elder IV, Minority Staff Director
Caleb Crosswhite, Minority Chief Counsel
----------
Subcommittee on Rural Development and Energy
PETER WELCH, Vermont Chairman
AMY KLOBUCHAR, Minnesota TOMMY TUBERVILLE, Alabama
MICHAEL F. BENNET, Colorado JONI ERNST, Iowa
TINA SMITH, Minnesota MIKE BRAUN, Indiana
RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois CHARLES GRASSLEY, Iowa
BEN RAY LUJAN, New Mexico DEB FISCHER, Nebraska
C O N T E N T S
----------
Wednesday, July 10, 2024
Page
Subcommittee Hearing:
The State of Rural Infrastructure: Emergency Response, Recovery,
and Resilience................................................. 1
----------
STATEMENTS PRESENTED BY SENATORS
Welch, Hon. Peter, U.S. Senator from the State of Vermont........ 1
Tuberville, Hon. Tommy, U.S. Senator from the State of Alabama... 3
WITNESSES
Brady, Ted, Executive Director, Vermont League of Cities and
Towns, Williston, VT........................................... 6
Moore, Julie S., PE, Secretary, Agency of Natural Resources,
State of Vermont, Middlesex, VT................................ 8
Paap, Hon. Kevin, County Commissioner, Blue Earth County, Garden
City, MN....................................................... 10
Bohlin, Mark D., General Manager, Perdido Bay Water, Sewer, and
Fire Protection District, Foley, AL............................ 11
Kimbro, Brad, General Manager and CEO, Wiregrass Electric
Cooperative, Ashford, AL....................................... 13
----------
APPENDIX
Prepared Statements:
Brady, Ted................................................... 30
Moore, Julie S............................................... 36
Paap, Hon. Kevin............................................. 40
Bohlin, Mark D............................................... 50
Kimbro, Brad................................................. 98
Document(s) Submitted for the Record:
Welch, Hon. Peter:
National Association of Counties............................. 106
Question and Answer:
Paap, Hon. Kevin:
Written response to questions from Hon. Tommy Tuberville..... 114
Written response to questions from Hon. Amy Klobuchar........ 115
Written response to questions from Hon. Mike Braun........... 117
Bohlin, Mark D.:
Written response to questions from Hon. Tommy Tuberville..... 119
Written response to questions from Hon. Mike Braun........... 123
Kimbro, Brad:
Written response to questions from Hon. Tommy Tuberville..... 126
Written response to questions from Hon. Mike Braun........... 127
THE STATE OF RURAL INFRASTRUCTURE: EMERGENCY RESPONSE, RECOVERY, AND
RESILIENCE
----------
Wednesday, July 10, 2024
U.S. Senate
Subcommittee on Rural Development and Energy
Committee on Agriculture, Nutrition, and Forestry
Washington, DC.
The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:30 p.m., in
room 328A, Russell Senate Office Building, Hon. Peter Welch,
Chairman of the Subcommittee, presiding.
Present: Senators Welch [presiding], Klobuchar, Bennet,
Smith, Lujan, Tuberville, Boozman, Ernst, Braun, and Grassley.
STATEMENT OF HON. PETER WELCH, U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF
VERMONT
Senator Welch. Good afternoon, everyone. I want to call
this hearing of the U.S. Senate Subcommittee on Rural
Development and Energy to order, and I want to thank my
colleague, Senator Tuberville, Coach Tuberville. I also want to
thank our Chair, Senator Stabenow, and our Ranking Member,
Senator Boozman. It is all great to be here for a very, very
important hearing, and we have got tremendous witnesses. We
want to get to you ASAP. I do want to give an opening statement
on this one-year anniversary of the devastating floods that we
experienced in Vermont a year ago. Vermonters are still
struggling to recover from them.
It was a year ago, on July 10th and 11th, that we had the
catastrophic flood. I want to acknowledge, by the way, the
first responders, the medical professionals, the police, fire
and rescue, National Guard, relief agencies, and neighbors who
helped everyone in that moment of crisis. I want to take a
moment to acknowledge the Vermonters who lost so much: their
homes, their businesses, their farms, their communities. It is
a really a traumatic experience that lingers and is a long-term
struggle to get over.
We are going to have more of these in Vermont. We know
that. We are going to have more of these in the Nation. The
weather is changing. We do not have to argue about how, but we
cannot deny that that is happening. Texas is grappling with
devastating effects of the hurricane.
It does not matter what kind of disaster it is or what
State you are in--Hawaii, Texas, Mississippi or Alabama--it is
devastating to our towns. Those of us who represent rural
communities, where there are no resources in place to address
the long-term needs of their community, bet back on their feet,
are especially vulnerable.
You know, in Johnson, Vermont, the flooding destroyed the
town's wastewater facility, with flood waters six feet high in
the building. That facility is operating now, but at a higher
energy and labor cost, and it is kind of rickety.
In Montpelier, the State's capital, flood waters destroyed
the Federal building, shut down our post office, and a number
of our State buildings will not be back online probably until
2025. We are still waiting for the post office to open, to be
fully operational. Vermont, in our capital, we actually do not
have a post office that is fully functional.
Just two weeks ago, severe storms and deadly flooding hit
Minnesota, and as someone who has been through what Minnesota
is experiencing, I am delighted that Commissioner Paap is here.
Senator Klobuchar and Senator Smith have been informing us
about everything that is going on there, and we want to be
helpful in any way we can.
If there is one thing that these disasters have made clear
it is that we need to put resilience and the capacity of local
communities and States to essentially build back better so that
when the next storm comes there is going to be a lot less
damage, or maybe no damage at all if we do it right.
We learned that in Vermont in 2011, when we had Tropical
Storm Irene. It was the largest and most devastating storm that
we had for about 80 years. We got into a big fight, to replace
an eight-inch culvert when you need a 16-inch culvert. FEMA, at
that time, would not let us build back better. We have been
able to change that, and we have to do more of that, not just
in Vermont but in every community, in Mississippi and in
Vermont.
Responding by incorporating resilience is just a practical
and necessary step that we have to take. Last year, even though
Brattleboro got four inches of rain, the town saw much less
damage than it had in Irene, and that was because they had done
some resilience work.
Another thing is our small communities cannot do it on
their own, and I am sure this is true in Mississippi. We have
got local volunteers that are on the Select Board. They are
also part of the road crew, or they are the disaster response
coordinator, and this is in towns, you know, of 1,500 or 3,000
people. They do not have any resources in place to be able to
navigate the complexities of the Federal Government. One of the
big things we are going to talk about today is how do we
address that so those communities have the technical resources
they need from a local area that is going to allow them to get
what they are entitled to and what they need.
That is a critical part of ensuring that disaster recovery
will work and work effectively. U.S. Rural Development has been
a great partner for us, and we are going to hear from Vermont
about how we can coordinate and leverage both the local
leadership and the work of the USDA.
I want to express my gratitude to Chairwoman Stabenow who
understands the importance of rural development programs and
has included the largest mandatory funding ever proposed in
farm bill history in the Rural Prosperity and Food Security
Act. Good for her. It marks the first time that a farm proposal
had included permanent funding for the Rural Development Title.
Chairman Stabenow's Rural Prosperity and Food Security Act also
includes new funding to invest in rural capacity building. We
need that.
We need to make sure that the Federal programs are spending
money to help disaster victims, but not on administrative costs
as much but more on actual relief. We had a situation in
Vermont where there were two times the amount spent on
administration than there was on relief. Obviously we want to
turn that upside down, and that is where the local engagement
is so essential. We need to act now.
Thank you to the members in attendance today, and to the
witnesses for making the trip. I look forward to a very
productive, bipartisan hearing.
I will now turn to Coach Tuberville for any opening
comments he would like to make. Thank you, Coach.
STATEMENT OF HON. TOMMY TUBERVILLE, U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE
OF ALABAMA
Senator Tuberville. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for having
this. This is well needed. Thanks to the witnesses for being
here. It is going to be very informal. Obviously we do not have
a lot of Senator here. There is a vote going on. They will be
here soon. Actually both of us have to go vote and we will be
in and out. Thanks to all the witnesses.
You know, today's discussion is on a very important issue
for my constituents in Alabama. We are on the Gulf, and we are
obviously in the tornado fly away, as we call it, down South.
We live in a very vulnerable area of need a lot of times.
You know, the state of rural infrastructure during national
disasters a lot of times is lacking, and we all know that. I
still have farmers that are still struggling from a hurricane
that we had five, six years ago, that have not gotten the need
that they are supposed to have.
Communities never expect to have this happen to them. When
a tornado, hurricane, or flood unexpectedly strikes, they
quickly have to figure out what to do and how to rebuild,
usually on their own, a little bit from the county, city,
State, and usually the last one to show up is Federal, and that
needs to change.
This is a topic all my colleagues should be able to agree
on because it is not partisan. Access to affordable electric,
water, and wastewater infrastructure is essential for survival
in any place in the country now. Because there seems to be more
and more, whether it is fires, whether it is floods, whether it
is tornadoes. Of course, we all know we have hurricanes.
Disaster resiliency, community safety, and rapid recovery
are critical to all Americans impacted by natural disasters,
but this is especially in the rural areas. Rural areas are
usually the last ones to get any relief. Just this week,
Hurricane Beryl has wreaked havoc across Texas and brought high
winds and torrential rain to Arkansas, Missouri, and the
Midwest.
Alabama, my State, is all too familiar with natural
disasters due to its proximity to the Gulf of Mexico, making
the State more prone to tropical storms, hurricanes, and
extreme weather. Over the past few years, Alabama has suffered
through its fair share of natural disasters such as Hurricanes
Michael, Ivan, Sally, and numerous tornadoes. Storms like these
highlight the significant need to prioritize investments in
rebuilding and hardening critical infrastructure that provide
water and electricity, especially in the rural communities.
Our rural communities often struggle. They often struggle
to compete for Federal grants to help recovery efforts from
natural disasters due to lack of full-time grant riders,
attorneys, and experts who are able to identify available
relief resources.
Unfortunately, they are oftentimes ill-equipped to navigate
the maze of bureaucracy and complex application process. On top
of that, I routinely hear about work force challenges, in my
State of Alabama and across the Nation.
Our rural areas struggle, really struggle, to recruit and
maintain qualified technical assistant experts, certified
operators and technicians, placing them at a competitive
disadvantage compared to their urban counterparts. Many
certified water and electrical operators across the country are
aging toward retirement without enough qualified applicants to
backfill their positions.
Considering the numerous challenges already faced in rural
areas, the last thing we need is more burdensome government red
tape, which seems to be more and more every year. As
policymakers, we need to ensure applying entities should not
have to wait an average of seven years to navigate the Federal
permitting process of jumping through various environmental and
climate hoops. States and local entities must, they must, have
the flexibility to implement funding as they see fit.
Just as each community is unique, so are natural disasters,
which is why States and local entities must have the
flexibility to implement funding as they see fit. A one-size-
fits-all approach does not work. We found that out. What works
in one town or State may not work in another.
We need to get the government out of the way and reduce
regulations to make it easier for our rural communities to
stand on their own. I look forward to today's witnesses and
hearing their experiences and trying to find some solutions for
the future for people that live in rural areas.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Senator Welch. Thank you, Senator Tuberville. I understand
that Chairwoman Stabenow and Ranking Member Boozman will not be
giving opening statements, so we will now move to introduce the
witnesses.
Ted Brady is the Executive Director of the Vermont League
of Cities and Towns. He served here for many years for the
Senator who is looking at us right now, from his picture on the
wall, to maybe his C-SPAN view in Burlington, Vermont, and that
is, of course, our wonderful friend and former colleague,
Senator Leahy. Mr. Brady served as the Vermont State Director
of USDA Rural Development, and as I mentioned a decade working
for Senator Leahy. Welcome.
Julie Moore serves as the Vermont Natural Resources
Secretary in the Scott administration. She has worked to shape
Vermont's environmental agenda, focusing on greenhouse gas
mitigation and climate resilience, water quality, the forest
economy, and the importance of conservation. She is a highly
respected leader in Vermont, and we are delighted to have you.
Senator Klobuchar wanted to be here but as Senator
Tuberville mentioned she can't be, with the vote. Oh, she is on
her way. You know, somehow she manages to get to the three
different places she is supposed to be at once. It is another
Klobuchar miracle, so I am going to wait so that she can
introduce her wondaful Minnesotan.
I am going to recognize you, Senator, because I understand
you have got some reputable people here from your home State.
Senator Tuberville. I would not go that far, reputable.
[Laughter.]
Senator Tuberville. Thank you, and we do have two good
witnesses here from my State of Alabama. Mr. Mark Bohlin I am
proud to introduce from Foley, Alabama, who serves as the
General Manager of the Perdido Bay Water, Sewer, and Fire
Protection District in Bowen County. Mr. Bohlin has served as
general manager for the district for over 25 years. He is Grade
4 water operator with the State of Alabama and a State-
certified electrician. In addition, Mark has served on the
Alabama Rural Water Board of Directors since 2009, and is
currently the association's president.
Prior to joining the Perdido Bay District he served in
several different technician, electrician, and operator roles
across the country, including the United States Air Force.
Thank you for your service. Thanks for being here today, Mark.
Thank you.
Keep going? Okay.
Senator Welch. Go ahead.
Senator Tuberville. Our next distinguished guest, Mr. Brad
Kimbro, our next witness, from the Wiregrass in Ashford,
Alabama. He is the General Manager and CEO of Wiregrass
Electric Cooperative. Mr. Kimbro has three decades of
experience--I know you don't look that old, but three decades--
in electric cooperative industry, and has been with Wiregrass
Electric Co-op since 2006. Within the co-op he has served as
Director of Member Services Chief Operating Officer, prior to
assuming the General Manager position. He is actively involved
with Alabama Rural Electric Cooperative Association and the
National Association NRECA, and with numerous volunteer roles
around the Wiregrass and southeast Alabama.
Brad, thanks for being here today.
Senator Welch. Senator Klobuchar is in the building, and
almost here. Well, she is literally coming in. I think so.
[Applause.]
Senator Welch. There she is.
Senator Klobuchar. Thanks for filibustering.
[Laughter.]
Senator Welch. Well, it is wonderful to have Senator
Klobuchar join us, and she is going to take a minute but then
is going to be----
Senator Klobuchar. I am all ready.
Senator Welch. You always are. I will let you introduce
your witness. Thank you very much.
Senator Klobuchar. All right. Well, thank you to the Chair
and Ranking Member for this important hearing, and I am so
honored to introduce my friend, Kevin Paap, because we like a
lot of drama, you know. He is Chair of the Blue Earth County
Board of Commissioners. If any of you saw that dam on national
TV, the Rapidan Dam, that is in his county, in his district,
and he has been on the front line making sure we are either
going to get that repaired, get it replaced, it kind of looks
like to me. It is just one example of the work and the
challenges that we have.
He is a county commissioner, a farmer, and a lifelong
Minnesotan. He has used his skill in building partnerships to
help solve difficult problems. He was first elected to his post
in 2020, and he has been able to use his experience as a farmer
and the former President of the Minnesota Farm Bureau, which he
ran for 16 years, to really make the case on the local level
about what we need to do to move ahead in rural America.
He is a fourth-generation farmer. I have been to his farm,
and with his neighbors. My favorite memory is one of his
neighbors, who had watched Meet the Press for three weeks
because I was coming over, so he felt that would prepare him
for having a hamburger with me. He enjoys time with his family,
his wife Julie, of 40 years, two grown sons, and two grandsons.
We welcome Kevin Paap to the Committee. Thank you very
much.
Senator Welch. Thank you, Senator Klobuchar.
I will now turn to Mr. Brady. You are recognized for five
minutes.
STATEMENT OF TED BRADY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, VERMONT LEAGUE OF
CITIES AND TOWNS, WILLISTON, VT
Mr. Brady. Thank you so much, Chairman Welch, Ranking
Member Tuberville, and members of the Committee for having me
here today, and more importantly, for bringing attention to and
helping rural communities prepare for and respond to and be
more resilient to future natural disasters.
I am the Executive Director of the Vermont League of Cities
and Towns, which is a municipal association that every one of
your States has in it. We exist to serve and strengthen local
government, to help them solve problems.
As Vermont's own Calvin Coolidge said, ``Local self-
government is one of our most precious possessions. It is the
greatest contributing factor to the stability, strength,
liberty, and progress of the Nation.'' I urge Federal lawmakers
to consider partnering with us in the Federal, State, and local
partnership to try to solve this Nation's most vexing problems.
Today I am asking you specifically, and asking Congress, to
consider improving the way that it helps local governments
invest in infrastructure, both physical and civic
infrastructure, and specifically as it relates to natural
disasters. The need for this capacity improvement escalated
quickly one year ago today when we received as much as nine
inches of rain, a full season's worth of rain in one day, which
in Vermont we have these things called mountains that don't let
the rain settle. It all comes rushing down into our valleys.
The result was more than $200 million of FEMA public assistant
eligible damage to municipal infrastructure, from roads to
bridges to wastewater systems to town halls. Like in Minnesota,
our stress on dams, as well.
We have firsthand experience assessing those damages. We
are an insurer. We provided $10 million of payouts to
municipalities as a result of that. We see a huge problem as
these events occur more and more often. About 15 percent of all
the infrastructure we insure at VLCT, about $500 million sits
in FEMA high-hazard flood zones, which will only grow as new
FEMA maps come about.
Hundreds of mayors, select board members, and others
contacted us starting the moment the flooding started. At first
they asked us for help accessing mutual aid from neighboring
towns, called us for help looking for how to reach the
Emergency Operations Center. In the days following the flood we
became a central clearinghouse. Since then, we have answered
hundreds of questions about FEMA public assistance eligibility,
with a lot of questions about what kind of procurement policy
do you need to qualify for FEMA, and perhaps more disturbingly,
how much do we have to pay a consultant to do this FEMA work
for us, because we can't handle it ourselves.
While our Regional Planning Commissions, our Emergency
Management Office are the primary players, VLCT has had to step
in to help with capacity. The State of Vermont, USDA Rural
Development, along with other have held disaster preparedness
calls weekly and disaster recovery calls weekly. In these calls
we have found that the fundamental thing that we need to do
differently is that municipalities need to have a better grasp
on municipal finance operations and management practices before
the storm.
You may know this, that wonderful thing called USDA Rural
Development that you have jurisdiction over is one of the only
Federal programs that provides capacity to rural communities.
Through its Rural Community Development Initiative it provides
technical assistance funding to spur community and economic
development in rural places. All 20,000 cities, towns, and
villages in Vermont, as well as tens of thousands of
nonprofits, compete for a whopping $5 million in that program
this year.
Fortunately in Vermont, our USDA Rural Development Office
was there for us after the disaster. They are not a primary
response agency, but they are a support agency. They identified
$1 million in the RD Disaster Assistance Fund that helped us
enter into a cooperative agreement, where we are supporting
municipalities with direct one-on-one technical assistance in
times of need and to help them apply for Federal resources.
This is flexible funding.
There is an old saying in community and economic rural
development, ``Once you've seen one rural community, you've
seen one rural community.'' I don't think that can be better
explained than the fact that Commissioner Paap and I are
sharing this table. We don't have county government in Vermont.
They have a very functioning county government in Minnesota.
This difference is sometimes not articulated well in the
policies that come out of Washington because it is so
different, and that one-size-fits-all thing threatens effective
disaster preparedness and recovery.
This cooperative agreement has a long list of things in
that we are doing at RD. I am happy to answer those questions.
I have also submitted what we are doing in my full written
testimony.
Rural municipalities know how to work with RD. RD has staff
in our communities that build trusting relationships. Using
those relationships to prepare and respond to a disaster are
really important. I have to put a plug in. Our RD Office is
down 30 percent in staff.
On behalf of every city, town, and village leader in
Vermont, thank you for taking the time to consider how to make
these programs work better for us, to prepare for and respond
to disaster.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Brady can be found on page
30 in the appendix.]
Senator Welch. Thank you, Mr. Brady. Now I recognize Ms.
Moore.
STATEMENT OF JULIE S. MOORE, PE, SECRETARY, AGENCY OF NATURAL
RESOURCES, STATE OF VERMONT, MIDDLESEX, VT
Ms. Moore. Good afternoon and thank you, Chairman Welch,
Ranking Member Tuberville, and the members of the Subcommittee.
I am Julie Moore, the Secretary of Natural Resources for
Vermont, and have served in this capacity for about eight years
now. By training I am a civil engineer and registered
professional engineer in Vermont, and I mention that because
I'm going to talk a lot about water and wastewater
infrastructure.
I appreciate the opportunity to offer my perspective on
these critical infrastructure needs facing Vermont's rural
communities, which are being driven by concurrent challenges of
aging systems, a shrinking user base, and the impacts of a
changing climate. Today's hearing is particularly timely, as
you alluded to Chairman Welch, in that one year ago today
Vermont watched a storm system drop as much as nine inches of
rain across the State, which caused massive flooding, hundreds
of millions of dollars in damages, and impacted liberally
thousands of homes and businesses, damaged municipal and State
infrastructure, caused landslides, and compromised dams.
While that widespread damage from the July 2023 storms
attracted significant national attention, the fact of the
matter is since 2010 Vermont has had 22 flood-related Federal
disaster declarations, nearly two per year, and up from an
average of one every other year throughout the 1960's, 1970's,
and 1980's. Clearly, more frequent and more severe storms are
our new normal, including today, with Vermont forecasts calling
for multiple inches of rain as the remnants of Hurricane Beryl
pass over the Green Mountains.
I see the key to building resilience as consistent
investment and municipal water infrastructure, and let me tell
you why.
First I think it is important to frame the issue and some
of the challenges we are facing. Small rural States like
Vermont are challenged to fund essential investments in water
infrastructure without our Federal partners, especially in and
immediately following natural disasters. For perspective,
Vermont has 417 community water systems serving just about half
our State's population, 300,000 Vermonters, but almost 75
percent of those 417 systems serve a population of less than
500 people. Most have volunteer boards with volunteer, part-
time operators. During the July 2023 storms, 18 systems,
serving about 40,000 Vermonters, sustained significant impact
to their drinking water infrastructure or operation that
required Boil Water notices or Do Not Drink notices.
The story was even more challenging the wastewater side.
Vermont has 92 municipal wastewater facilities that serve
mainly small rural communities. About two-thirds are permitted
to treat less than 100,000 gallons a day, which I see as an
indicator of the small rural population they serve. More than
one-third of these facilities, 33 in total, sustained damage
during last July's floods, totaling more than $75 million.
Three facilities, including the one you mentioned, Chair Welch,
in Johnson, will require extensive rebuilding and possibly even
relocation. Unfortunately, most of these small utilities do not
have capital available within their annual budget to make these
kinds of significant, unanticipated repairs.
While ultimately a significant share of the cost of the
infrastructure repairs following a natural disaster is covered
by insurance and FEMA reimbursement, there is an upfront cost
to this work which can be substantial, and immediate cash-flow
is critical, helping ensure communities make decisions around
recovery and reinvestment based on what will serve them best in
the long term, as opposed to being limited by what they can
afford in the immediate.
I saw this firsthand in the weeks following last July's
floods. In speaking with leaders in some of the most flood-
ravaged communities, it was clear that they were leveraged to
the hilt and had exhausted market-rate private capital
available to them to make emergency repairs and restore
services, limiting the resources needed to plan for how they
can build back smarter.
In response, I convened a Funder Summit involving my staff
responsible for administering Vermont's State Revolving Fund
programs, the Vermont Municipal Bond Bank, State Treasurer's
Office, and USDA Rural Development. Over a period of weeks we
cobbled together a complicated and tenuous funding stack to
meet the same need that would be better addressed, I believe,
through the Rural Recovery Act and the enhancements it would
make to the Disaster Assistance Fund.
I cannot overstate the importance of having available,
flexible, low-cost or no-cost money that can be deployed
quickly following a disaster. There simply isn't time to wait
for Congress to designate and appropriate additional disaster-
related funds to support the work that needs to happen on the
ground in those moments of need.
Ideally, a robust Disaster Assistance Fund would include
budget authority, provide flexibility around RD's water and
environmental programs immediately following a disaster.
Changes would also be helpful to increase RD's authority to
issue waivers, to expedite funding to meet real-time needs and
streamline procedures that can be extremely difficult for
smaller communities.
In closing, one of the most important collaborative
relationships my agency has in the drinking water and
wastewater space is with USDA Rural Development. Rural
Development supports cost-effective investments in community
infrastructure and partners with us on long-term disaster
recovery. The Rural Recovery Act would establish and expand
this essential partnership, helping ensure that immediate
financial challenges following a disaster don't perpetuate
vulnerabilities and increase long-term costs, but instead
support our rural communities in developing and implementing
considered and durable solutions in the wake of natural
disasters.
Thank you for your consideration.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Moore can be found on page
36 in the appendix.]
Senator Welch. Thank you very much. I recognize Mr. Paap.
I am going to have to go vote, and I am going to ask
Senator Smith if she would chair in my absence. Thank you.
STATEMENT OF THE HON. KEVIN PAAP, COUNTY COMMISSIONER, BLUE
EARTH COUNTY, GARDEN CITY, MN
Mr. Paap. Chairman Welch, Ranking Member Tuberville, and
members of the Subcommittee, thank you for holding today's
hearing. My name is Kevin Paap. I have represented the National
Association of Counties.
As a Blue Earth County Commissioner, fourth-generation
farmer, emergency medical services instructor, past volunteer
firefighter, and Minnesota Farm Bureau President, I have
witnessed firsthand the impacts of natural disasters on rural
communities. As a farmer, whether it is a fence or a farm bill,
farm building, I think about four corner posts. Please consider
these four corner posts in the county's role in disaster
planning, response and recovery, in how Federal policy can
building resiliency to natural disasters in rural America.
The first corner post. Natural disasters have become more
frequent, more severe, and more costly. Last year, 849 counties
experienced at least one federally declared major disaster.
Minnesota has not been immune to these trends. We have been
impacted by seven separate billion-dollar disasters in 2023.
Corner post No. 2. County governments are on the front line
of disaster response and recovery. County governments are
responsible for local emergency response, with county-elected
officials and emergency managers leading these efforts. We also
support the operation of hospitals, maintenance of public roads
and bridges, and invest significant funds in building public
infrastructure and maintaining and operating public works. To
protect our investments, county must develop preventive plans
to mitigate risk and determine how to respond when a disaster
unfolds.
Water and wastewater infrastructure are critically
important, and particularly vulnerable during natural
disasters. During the recent flooding in Blue Earth County, our
county-owned Rapidan Dam infrastructure failed, causing
significant damage to public and private property along the
Blue Earth River. Thousands of aging rural infrastructure
projects like our Rapidan Dam pose a threat to communities in
future disasters without adequate support.
Corner post No. 3. Natural disasters not only disrupt the
lives and livelihoods of our residents but also put heavy
burdens on rural counties. Rural counties are often hindered in
our ability to manage emergency response and recovery efforts
due to limited personnel and limited funding. These capacity
challenges can lead to prolonged disruptions to infrastructure
and services as well as extended recovery periods and economic
loss for residents. Addressing these issues by building rural
capacity through technical assistance or direct funding can
help protect residents and promote long-term prosperity.
Existing USDA Rural Development programs, such as the
Community Facilities Program and the Emergency Water Assistance
Grants Program are important for supporting rural communities
during and after natural disasters. While these programs can be
a lifeline for rural areas hit by disaster, consistent funding
shortages at Rural Development mean that these programs may not
be able to help as many communities as needed.
Corner post No. 4. The farm bill provides a unique
opportunity to improve rural disaster resilience. NACo urges
the following provisions be included in the 2024 Farm Bill to
bolster rural capacity building:
The Rural Partnerships Program, which would provide
flexible grants to rural communities to help them respond to a
wide variety of urgent needs, including disaster preparedness.
By improving the capacity of rural communities, the program can
make sure rural counties are better equipped to protect
residents from natural disasters.
Permanent authorization for the Rural Partners Network.
This USDA-led initiative places Federal employees in rural
communities to improve collaboration with our Federal partners
and help the local governments navigate Federal funding
opportunities. Although it is a small program, it has managed
to turn its $11.5 million budget into over $3 billion in
Federal investments in participating rural communities since
its creation in 2022.
Passage of the streamlined Federal Grants Act. This bill
would make it easier for local governments, including rural
communities, to access Federal resources and grant
opportunities by simplifying the Federal grant administration
process.
Chairman Welch and Ranking Member Tuberville, thank you for
inviting me to share Blue Earth County's story. Counties look
forward to working with you to build a stronger, more resilient
rural America. I appreciate the opportunity to testify, and
look forward to your questions.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Paap can be found on page 40
in the appendix.]
Senator Smith. [Presiding.] Thank you very much, commission
Paap, and we will now hear from Mr. Bohlin for five minutes.
STATEMENT OF MARK D. BOHLIN, GENERAL MANAGER, PERDIDO BAY
WATER, SEWER, AND FIRE PROTECTION DISTRICT, FOLEY, AL
Mr. Bohlin. Good afternoon, Chairman Welch, Ranking Member
Tuberville, and members on the Committee. I am deeply honored
to be here today. I would like to extend my personal gratitude
to Senator Tuberville for his invitation and stalwart
leadership for Alabama's rural water and wastewater sector.
I am the General Manager of the Perdido Bay Water, Sewer,
and Fire Protection District and serve as the President of the
Alabama Rural Water Association, where I represent Baldwin,
Mobile, and Washington counties, serving a population of over
630,000 Alabamians.
Perdido Bay is a nonprofit organization that was
incorporated in 1973 to deliver drinking water to the
communities of Lillian and Perdido Beach. We started with 600
customers, with direct assistance from the Farmers Home
Administration, the precursor of Rural Development.
Fast forward almost 50 years and Perdido Bay continues to
take advantage of the affordable low interest rates provided
through Rural Development. If I may, I would like to express my
gratitude to this Committee for its unwavering commitment to
the success of these initiatives.
There is sentiment that billions from the American Rescue
Plan Act and the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act will
meet industry needs, but much of this funding benefits larger
systems. The Alabama Department of Environmental Management has
done great work supporting rural communities. However, this
positive trend in Alabama is not seen nationwide. Predominantly
rural States like Alabama benefit from a political landscape
that directs more funds to rural areas.
It is critical to emphasize that these additional funds are
not permanent, and small and rural communities heavily depend
on Rural Development to maintain and enhance their utilities
and affordable services. According to the most recent EPA
drinking water survey, a 20-year capital improvement assessment
for both urban and rural communities totaled $625 billion in
needs. Currently, we face challenges including PFAS treatment,
cybersecurity upgrades, work force development, and compliance
with Federal mandates like the Lead and Copper rule. Inflation
and supply chain issues also heavily impact small water
utilities.
We urge the Committee to ensure USDA's Rural Development
program has the resources needed to help rural communities
address these challenges now and into the future.
During my 25-year tenure serving as General Manager of my
utility I have experienced numerous storms and two direct hits
by Hurricanes Ivan and Sally. During Hurricane Ivan, we did not
have resources and manpower to adequately respond. For
Hurricane Sally, we relied on the direct assistance from ARWA
to fill this void. In cooperation with National Rural Water
Association and other State Rural Water Associations, Alabama
Rural Water Association brought in emergency response trailers,
generators, and manpower. They set up a command center at my
utility where they coordinated with Alabama's Emergency
Management Agency, deploying staff and resources to surrounding
water and wastewater systems. Within a week, operations were
restored to normal.
For decades, NRWA and State Rural Water Associations have
served as the leaders in disaster recovery in many States.
Unfortunately, there has been no dedicated Federal funding to
enhance or expand this activity beyond the limited assistance
currently provided under the Circuit Rider Program.
Preventative measure and post-disaster assistance are equally
important. Having dedicated, onsite, and experienced full-time
staff will greatly improve services for rural utilities.
We are grateful that Congress responded with pending
bipartisan legislation in both the House and Senate. The Rural
Water Systems Disaster Preparedness and Assistance Act, if
enacted, this approach will fund and authorize pre-and post-
disaster activities. This includes creating vulnerability
assessment, disaster action and mitigation plans, geographic
mapping and hardening facilities. Post-disaster support will
help with applying for Federal and State funding and meeting
reporting requirements necessary for reimbursement and other
needs.
After the devastating impact of Hurricanes Katrina and
Rita, NRWA established a permanent standing Emergency Response
Committee. This committee meets regularly to coordinate and
review response efforts nationwide.
In summary, I firmly believe that with additional Federal
authorities, effective collaboration, thoughtful planning, and
mutual aid, we can address the challenges of emergencies and
enhance the response, recovery, and resilience of rural water
and wastewater systems nationwide. Our State Rural Water
Association stands ready to continue providing these services.
Thank you for the opportunity to testify. I am ready to
answer any questions you may have.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Bohlin can be found on page
50 in the appendix.]
Senator Smith. Thank you, Mr. Bohlin. Now we will turn to
Mr. Kimbro for five minutes of testimony. Thank you.
STATEMENT OF BRAD KIMBRO, GENERAL MANAGER AND CEO, WIREGRASS
ELECTRIC COOPERATIVE, ASHFORD, AL
Mr. Kimbro. Thank you. Chairman Welch, Ranking Member
Tuberville, and members of the Subcommittee, thank you for the
opportunity to testify today. On behalf of Wiregrass Electric's
roughly 18,000 consumer members we sincerely appreciate the
Committee's interest in natural disaster and rural
infrastructure issues.
Wiregrass Electric Cooperative (WEC), is a distribution
electric cooperative in its 84 years of operations, providing
affordable, reliable electricity to homes, farms, businesses in
the Wiregrass region in southern Alabama. As a cooperative, we
are member owned and controlled. The cost of running our
electric utility is shouldered by our member owners.
Electrification of the Wiregrass region was only possible
because the Federal Government offered low-interest loans
beginning in the 1930's. Fast forward to today, WEC continues
to borrow money through the Rural Utility Service Electric Loan
Program in order to keep the lights on, and at a price that
families can afford.
Roughly 25 percent of our consumer members struggle to pay
their electric bill each money. Low-interest RUS electric loans
help us keep costs affordable. Our job is to reliably deliver
affordable electricity to our consumer members 24 hours a day,
7 days a week. During thunderstorms, windstorms, floods,
hurricanes, and other weather event we work hard to keep the
lights on, and in the event of an outage, our mission is to
safely restore service in the most timely fashion.
In my 30 years in the electric utility cooperative industry
I have witnessed and managed recovery efforts for over a dozen
hurricanes and tropical storms. This includes powerful Category
5 Hurricane Michael that hit our WEC service territory in
October 2018. Hurricane Michael resulted in $8 million in
additional costs for WEC. We were able to work through our
already approved RUS workplan to respond and rebuild after this
storm. Unfortunately, not every co-op can continue to work
under their co-op's current RUS workplan after this type of
storm events.
To obtain a new RUS electric loan a co-op is responsible
for submitting extensive paperwork and go through lengthy
approval processes. For this reason, obtaining a new RUS
electric infrastructure loan for rebuilding after these type
storms is usually not a viable option. Instead, many electric
cooperatives need quick financing after natural disasters, so
they turn to a private lender or draw down an existing line of
credit to pay for storm response and infrastructure repair.
These loans come with higher interest rates often.
While electric cooperatives are eligible for 75 percent
reimbursement under FEMA's Public Assistance Program, our
members, after Hurricane Michael, still had to absorb the
remaining 25 percent, or around $2 million. Additionally,
recouping the interest accrued on those loans or lines of
credit just adds to the financial burden.
Thankfully, which Hurricane Michael public assistance
process was relatively smooth, that is not always the case for
every cooperative. I am aware of other electric cooperatives
still dealing with reimbursement issues related to Hurricane
Michael. The same is true with other storms that hit the Gulf
Coast in the last five years. The longer reimbursement takes,
the higher the interest expense, which is ultimately passed on
to the cooperative's consumer member.
Also it is important to remember that responding to a
disaster is not just about physical damage. These storms take
an emotional toll. We are a co-op of around 60 employees. Our
linemen perform dangerous work during these times, when their
families' well-being and financial situations are uncertain.
This impact is really difficult to measure.
In closing, Wiregrass Electric is dedicated to delivering
affordable, reliable electric service to Alabama households,
businesses, farms, and our communities. Nearly 900 electric
cooperatives across the country have similar community-focused
missions for the areas they serve. As this Committee works on
rural infrastructure issues, I look forward to continuing to
work with you toward our shared goal of improving life in rural
America.
I am happy to answer any questions you all may have. Thank
you.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Kimbro can be found on page
98 in the appendix.]
Senator Smith. Thank you very much. Thanks for all your
testimony.
While the Chair is returning from voting we will begin our
round of questioning, and I will start. Oh good, here is the
Chair.
I want to thank Senator Welch and also Ranking Member
Tuberville for holding this hearing right now. As Commissioner
Paap indicated, in June Minnesota was hit by very heavy rains.
I know these also affected Iowa. Senator Ernst, I was talking
with Senator Grassley about this, as well, heavy flooding.
Senator Klobuchar and I led a delegation letter to the
President asking for major disaster declaration. I know that
the USDA has offered disaster assistance to Minnesota
producers.
The Federal response to helping Minnesota is at the top of
my mind right now in the wake of these floods. As Commissioner
Paap said, the Rapidan Dam, which is in Commissioner Paap's
county, was breached during this heavy rainstorm, and 11.6
cubic yards of sediment were released, overtaking a house and
power infrastructure. It was really quite incredible. This was
a 100-year-old dam and in need of repair, major repair, even
before the flooding, that closed it in 2020.
I think the story and the experience of Blue Earth County
is a good story for us to be thinking about as we consider the
burden that falls on counties as we are responding to these
disasters all over the country.
Commissioner Paap, let me just ask you a question about
this. Can you just talk a bit more about why it is so important
to help rural communities that might not have the staff power,
rural communities and rural counties that might not have the
staff power to go after Federal grants and resources in ways
that much larger, better staffed, I would say, urban counties
might have. What does that mean in terms of your resilience
when it comes to these disasters?
Mr. Paap. Madam Chair, thank you for that question. You
learn a lot after a disaster. Thankfully, we do not have them
every day so we do not become that well versed. There are many
times, especially with smaller communities, smaller counties,
local governments, you do not have the capacity, whether it is
personnel, whether it is resources. Quite frankly, you do not
know what you do not know.
We need that help to do that, and not only is responding,
certainly with the Rapidan Dam, our No. 1 goal was the safety
and the health of our residents, and that is the No. 1 goal of
all local governments.
As we get through that and respond and go through the
process we need assistance. We do not know what we do not know.
We have maybe never done this before. Many counties do not have
the expertise. They do not know what is available.
I guess I would just ask that we all work together the best
we can. You know, as a farmer you learn at an early age, from
your dad or really probably from your grandpa, that working
together works. I would just ask that whether it be the
Federal, State, or the local governments we do as good a job as
we can to work together.
When a disaster strikes, the rest of the activities in the
county do to come to a standstill.
Senator Smith. That is right.
Mr. Paap. We had county employees that went above and
beyond, spent days and days onsite. There are still other
things going on in that county that have to be covered.
Certainly a thank-you to all of our Blue Earth County employees
for the great job they did and all over the country.
We really need some assistance because we do not know
sometimes what is available or we do not have the resources to
access that technical assistance.
Senator Smith. Right. Well, thank you very much. I really
appreciate your comments. I want to just point out, and then I
am going to wrap up my questions, Mr. Chair, I want to point
out that a propos what you are talking about, the farm bill
framework and proposal that Chair Stabenow has put out includes
the Rural Partnerships Program, which is this public-private
partnership to help rural areas apply for and access Federal
money. I think this is very important. I think this is a
strength of the Chair's proposal over the House proposal, and I
hope that we can keep that in mind as we think about what we
can do to support rural communities as they are seeking Federal
funds to help them do their jobs.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Senator Welch. [Presiding.] Thank you. The Chair recognizes
Senator Tuberville.
Senator Tuberville. I would like to pass my time to Senator
Ernst.
Senator Welch. The Chair recognizes Senator Ernst.
Senator Ernst. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Ranking
Member. I certainly appreciate it. I want to thank all of our
witnesses for being here today, as well. Now more than ever, as
you have seen, just disasters across the United States. I can
say that your testimoneys, and, of course, the challenges that
have been described are shared among many of my Iowa
communities. Again, thank you so much.
Just a couple of weeks ago, as Senator Smith had
referenced, we saw a lot of flooding coming through the
northwest corner of my State. We saw heavy rainfall that caused
major flooding up and down the Missouri River. Of course, it
did impact Minnesota. It impacted North Dakota, South Dakota,
Nebraska, Iowa. In a matter of hours we saw hundreds and
hundreds of families that had their homes destroyed. We saw
helicopter rescues. We had boat rescues in communities. We had
just so many small businesses that were in total ruin. The
roads and bridges completely swept away. Water and electrical
systems ceased operations, and, of course, Iowa, known for its
crops, we had a significant amount of crop damage under feet of
flowing water.
Large portions of western Iowa saw similar destruction
earlier this spring when we had tornadoes. Iowa seems to have
been the epicenter this year for so many different events. We
had a number of communities that saw 60 percent or more of
their homes destroyed by tornadoes. Following each of these
disasters I was able to go out and visit with our
constituencies, the Iowans, and personally hear their
testimoneys.
In previous disasters, having served in the National Guard,
had deployed to many of those types of events through the
years, and we really are Iowa strong. I certainly saw the best
of our communities.
Anyway, Mr. Paap, thank you, and thanks for being here. I
know that you have seen so many of these similar situations and
a lot of swift response from those local emergency management
teams. What I would like to do is just dive in a little bit
different. You have mentioned access to resources,
understanding where and how to go about getting those
resources. Have any of the farmers that you have worked with
faced challenges when they do go to the USDA or the Small
Business Administration? Maybe walk me through gaining access
to some of those larger Federal agencies.
Mr. Paap. Mr. Chairman and Senator Ernst, thank you for
that. As you look at agencies in agriculture, of our 128-year-
old family farm, probably the best relationship is always USDA
because that is the agency that is used the most in agriculture
every year, through farm programs or whatever it would be.
As you broaden out to Rural Development and then into the
other agencies you do not have that relationship, and many
times, quite frankly, you do not have that local, that county
FSA office where you know the folks there. Even if you do not
know what you do not know, you know who to ask.
As we get into disasters and other things and programs,
sometimes people just aren't sure who the right person is, so
that is why we really feel it is important to get that
information out to those ag producers, and not just the farmers
and ranchers but those rural communities that have been
affected by that weather.
I think agriculture, like everything else in life, we can
always do better. We want to work on continuing improvement. I
think there are many things we can improve on in that
coordination. Really the key to coordination is communication,
and we can always do better communicating with those rural
residents.
Senator Ernst. Yes, agreed. Then responsiveness, once you
have found the go-to person, whether it is at the FSA or any
other local agency, maybe even in your capital city, or
responding here in Washington, DC, the response times, do you
find that those Federal agencies get back to you in a
reasonable amount of time?
Mr. Paap. Well, serving on a local ambulance and fire
department for 29 years, nobody ever said you got there too
soon. You know, ``What took so long?'' I think that is the
case, as well.
I do think as we look at this process, whether it is
applications, whether it is limiting the number of pages that
are involved, or if it is response time how any days, we want
to know what that timeline is. We know things cannot happen
overnight, but when can we, or should we, expect an answer.
Again, I would go back to continual improvement. I believe this
process can and should be improved.
Senator Ernst. Thank you, and thank you, Mr. Chair. I think
Mr. Paap gets quote of the day. Thank you. Thanks to all of
you.
Senator Welch. Thank you, Senator Ernst. I want to
recognize our Ranking Member. Thank you for all the great work
you have done on this Committee and the support you have given
me and Senator Tuberville on this Committee, as well.
Senator Boozman. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have got
to run. I just want to thank you two. This is really what the
Ag Committee is all about, and this hearing is excellent. You
all have done a tremendous job.
You know, we hear all about the rancor up here and the this
and that, but this is just everybody working together, trying
to figure out a solution to a really significant problem.
Thank you for your testimonies. Very, very helpful, very
incisive. I am going to get out of your way so you can actually
get some good things done. I do want to compliment you two and
your leadership, and example. I know it is hard with Senator
Tuberville.
[Laughter.]
Senator Boozman. We appreciate you.
Senator Welch. Thank you, Senator, and thank you, Senator
Ernst. The Chair will recognize himself.
Mr. Brady, what was the biggest challenge that the rural
communities that you work with throughout Vermont face in
identifying and applying for Federal Disaster Assistance funds,
including the funds from USDA RD?
Mr. Brady. Thanks for asking, Mr. Chairman. Simply put, it
is capacity. In Vermont, of the 247 cities and towns and
another 31 or so villages, less than half, about 40 percent,
have professional career staff to help manage the town, which
means the person writing the grant application is oftentimes a
Select Board member who works in a garage, works on the farm,
you name it. They are doing it after hours. That means 60
percent of Vermont does not have professional capacity to deal
with these things. When the Federal Government stands up a
grant program that needs to be applied for, and you need to
follow the rules to apply, then administer, and then follow the
reporting requirements, you know, 60 percent of the time it
does to work every time in Vermont. It is really overwhelming.
A quick couple of stories. Marshfield, Vermont, population
1,583. Last July's flooding resulted in $4 million worth of
damages. Their budget is $1 million. Their annual budget is $1
million. They do not have a career manager, which meant it was
up to the elected town clerk, whose town has nothing to do with
disaster management, to manage a disaster. She called us and
said, ``I need to write an RFP. I need an engineer. I need a
consultant. I don't know how to do this. None of my Select
Board members know how to do this. Where do I go for help?''
Down the road in Cabot, Vermont, the Governor yesterday was
at a fire station that was destroyed, red-tagged by public
safety after the July flooding. The chairman of that Select
Board came to us and said, ``How do we afford to hire help? We
don't have any money. Who is going to actually do all of this
work for us?'' They had no capacity.
The town of Weston, population 566, famous for the Weston
Playhouse, a wonderful, bucolic, incredible little town in
south central Vermont. They faced the fact that the Select
Board, Jim Linville, called us and said, ``We are overwhelmed.
We are a tiny town. Our volunteers are exhausted. We don't have
any expertise. Who are the consultants we can work with?''
Jamaica, Vermont, southern Vermont, population 1,030. The
2023 floods resulted in $1.6 million in damage. That does not
sound like a lot. You know what is a lot? That $1.6 million was
in 77 different FEMA public worksheets. They have very little
professional capacity in Jamaica.
Senator Welch. Thank you, yes.
Mr. Brady. Who is going to do those?
Senator Welch. Thank you. Thank you very much. Those are
very vivid and very real, and I have got to take the Ranking
Member to some of those towns.
I want to ask Ms. Moore, the last major flooding was during
Hurricane Irene, I mean, preceding last year. We did some
resilience work in that. I want you to just describe how those
investments in resilience--not just building back the same
built building back better, with the threat of another storm--
how did those investments help the State's infrastructure
withstand flooding last year?
Ms. Moore. I think they were critical. I want to highlight
two specific examples of investments Vermont made following
Tropical Storm Irene.
The first was more generally in enhancing what we refer to
as our codes and standards, and that governs the sizing of
culverts and bridges as they are replaced around the State of
Vermont. We modernized our codes and standards to reflect the
kinds of rainfall patterns we are seeing in the 2020's as
opposed to what we were seeing in the 1960's, which had been
the rainfall data driving much of our design.
As a result, structures that were replaced following
Tropical Storm Irene, with appropriately sized structures for
our current climate, only one was lost during the 2023 floods.
The overall damage to our road and bridge infrastructure was
significantly lower than it was. Some of that is a reflection
of the type of storm we saw last July, but I think a lot of
that is a reflection of changes we have made and how we size
our infrastructure.
The other one I would point to is our Waterbury State
Office Complex. This is a building that houses over 1,000 State
employees and was closed for literally six years following
Tropical Storm Irene, when the Winooski River flooded the
complex and frankly filled the basement of that building with
water. We rebuilt, filling the basement with flowable fill,
elevating all of the building's utilities. The Winooski River
flooded again last July, but the damage was really limited to
the parking lots, and that facility was reopened within two
weeks' time. It is just such a night-and-day difference how
strategic investments in hardening as well as resiliency can
help us withstand a wider range of weather events.
Senator Welch. That is very helpful. Based on your
experience do you have some suggestions on what steps Congress
can take to ensure that USDA RD resources help communities
rebuild in the wake of disasters.
Ms. Moore. Yes. I think, as I alluded to in my remarks,
that immediate cash-flow is really important. It is very hard
to go to the communities that Ted just described with his
examples, in the throes of a disaster, and suggest what they
really need to do with a planning study or an engineering
assessment.
RD has the technical know-how and capacity to support
communities in thinking through what the best long-term
decisions are, as well as the ability to bring contracted
resources to bear that oftentimes these communities do not know
where to start.
It is a partnership, but just knowing where to turn with
those important questions, being able to not just react in the
moment but think for the long term, and having partners that
stand ready and available to provide that kind of support in
the moment is really essential.
Senator Welch. Thank you very much. That is very helpful.
I recognize Senator Tuberville.
Senator Tuberville. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Bohlin, work force is going to play a large role in the
next few years, decades, especially in our rural areas. Now my
understanding is you have an apprenticeship program in your
water area. Could you tell us a little bit about that?
Mr. Bohlin. Thank you for the question, Senator. As you
mentioned, we are members of apprenticeship program that is
provided through Alabama Rural Water that they have put
together with the Labor Department.
First off I would like to say, you were talking about the
aging work force, I am one of them. I am getting to an age
where I am looking at retirement. Our system currently, right
now, has six certified operators. Of those six certified
operators, four of us are at retirement age or quickly
approaching. In fact, I have got one operator that is retiring
this month.
It is imperative that we can get young people involved,
hired, in the system, and get them trained, provide the proper
training. We have found out, by partnering with the Alabama
Rural Water Association and the apprenticeship program, that
they can provide an avenue that we can get our employees
classroom time to get the education that they need in order to
pass the certification, State certification, so that they can
become licensed to operators. It is also hands-on, work under a
mentor type program.
I am proud to say that right now, we have got one employee
that is in the apprenticeship program. He is fixing to finish
it. He has already acquired his Alabama State certification. We
have got another employee we are fixing to put in there. I
would also like to mention that the employee that we have in
the apprenticeship program right now that is finishing up will
be the first graduate in the State of Alabama in the
apprenticeship program.
I feel that it is very important, Senator, that we look out
for young people and try to bring them into the field and get
them involved and that we have ways to get them educated, and
also give them the tools that they need so that they can go out
and make the taps, put in the services.
Senator Tuberville. Do you have any recommendations for the
farm bill that we are putting together for work force
development?
Mr. Bohlin. Yes, sir. As you know, the apprenticeship
program was started with Rural Development funds back in 2018.
Coming forward, anything that we can get in to help with the
technical assistance and training that is in the farm bill, if
we can get any more help in there I honestly believe that that
would be of great benefit to us.
Senator Tuberville. Mr. Kimbro, Do you have any work force
development in your area?
Mr. Kimbro. Yes, sir, Senator, we do. We work with our
local and regional, State, to do that. Yes, sir, sure do. They
are successful at it. You know, the success of businesses
moving in is to have the people to employ, and that is very
critical.
Senator Tuberville. You know, most people don?t know where
your region is in your part of Alabama. You are not actually on
the Gulf, but you do see quite a bit of devastation from
tornadoes to hurricanes as we saw a few years ago.
Mr. Kimbro. Right.
Senator Tuberville. You have huge problems with electric
and water anytime that we have this devastation. Speak to the
importance of being able to utilize all energy sources, like
natural gas. Tell me about your experiences with that.
Mr. Kimbro. Yes, sir. Well, as CEO of Wiregrass Electric
Cooperative, I am concerned about reliability and
affordability. They are both important. We would like to see an
all approach, where one size does not fit all. We certainly
depend on a lot of generation resources, and we need that
capacity. Certainly, after these storms, the reliability is
very, very critical, and having access to that affordability
and reliability is critically important as we move forward in
this country.
Senator Tuberville. Yes, I would like to ask all of you
this question, if you want to add in onto this. What problems
do you see with smaller water systems as compared to larger
water systems, Mr. Bohlin, we will start with you, in terms of
getting funding. How do we fight that problem for rural areas?
Mr. Bohlin. Thank you for the question, Senator. Going
through the RD apply process can be very tedious and
cumbersome. I have done it myself before, and it takes time.
You have to provide engineering reports, as a lot of these
other people have testified today. You have to fill out all
their paperwork, get budgets together. They want 5-year capital
improvement budgets, and they want your audited reports. There
is a lot that goes into it, and fortunately we have got enough
people at our system that I could do it myself and work through
the process, along with our engineering firm.
There are so many water systems throughout the State of
Alabama that do not have the people and the resources to do
that themselves, and there does need to be a vehicle where they
can assist these smaller systems. That is one of the things
that Alabama Rural Water does supply. They have people, and
they have the resources. They can go out and they can call on
these smaller systems if they have a need. If they reach out
and they say, ``Hey, we want to apply for some Rural
Development funds,'' they have got the people that can assist
them and get these applications filled out and turned in.
Senator Tuberville. Mr. Kimbro?
Mr. Kimbro. Yes, sir, Senator. Infrastructure is so
important--water, sewer, electricity, broadband, everything for
our community. In rural America, which I represent, if you do
not have those things then people are not coming, businesses
are not coming, they are not providing jobs, they are not
providing hope for quality of life for our rural America. It is
majorly important.
I would just say that the programs that are in place, like
the Rural Utility Services Program, RUS, FEMA after natural
disasters, those are really helpful programs that really help
rural America not be left behind, and that is majorly
important.
Senator Tuberville. One more question if I could.
Senator Welch. All you want.
Senator Tuberville. All I want? Good. I want everybody to
answer this. Manmade disasters, cyberattacks. Who wants to
start? Have you had any problems with it? How did you overcome
it? What do you see down the road to be able to stop it? Have
at it. Go ahead.
Mr. Bohlin. Yes, sir. Thank you for bringing up that
subject. At our water system 10 years ago we ended up getting,
I don't know, we think it came through email, but we ended up
getting ransomware-ed. They locked all of our files up. We
could not access any of our customer files. We could not get
into any of our company files.
Fortunately, this happened on a weekend, on a Friday, and
it was a long weekend. I believe it was Labor Day weekend. We
have an IT team that works with us. We were able to call them
in. They were able to come in and take all of our servers
offline. They stripped the hard drives and got everything off
of it. They reinstalled the software. They put the data and
everything back in from backups, to get us back up and running.
It is a real threat. I am afraid that it is growing right
now, and there are a lot of things that need to be done. I
think that training and technical assistance in that area is
greatly needed.
It is scary when you are in a situation like that, you
know. Fortunately I can say that none of our customers'
information was compromised, or none of our company's
information was compromised. It is scary because you do not
know what is going to happen.
The funny thing about it, when we were hacked and they got
into our files, they never sent anything wanting a ransom. They
just tied everything up. That's our experience.
Senator Tuberville. Anybody else?
Mr. Kimbro. Yes, Senator. We actually had a cyberattack hit
our system July 3rd of 2021, and we were down 4 days, mostly
without a precaution, just going through things, just making
sure we did not bring it back up before we knew we were safe.
It a real concern. Spent a lot of resources, human resources,
dollars, of course. The bad guys get smarter, it seems, every
day, and what worked today they figured out so you are
constantly chasing that.
It is a very big concern. In some cases it locks us down to
where it is not as friendly to do business with us as we would
like, like speaking credit card information over the phone you
can't do because you are not PCI compliant in those regards.
Our members, we want to make sure their information is
protected, certainly their financial information, credit card
information and so on and so forth. It is a major concern, and
we spend a lot of resources looking at it. Literally, I hope
and pray every day that nothing bad happens.
Senator Tuberville. Any other experiences? Go ahead.
Mr. Paap. From a NACo perspective, and it does not matter
which one of the 3,069 counties, parishes, or boroughs we
represent, I think we have to recognize with cybersecurity it
is not a fair fight. You know, the bad guys only have to be
right once to win. We have to be right every day, every hour to
win. There are many of those local governments that do not have
the resources, do not have the capacity to make sure that they
are state-of-the-art, and continual improvement on
cybersecurity.
I think it is only going to get worse, and it is something
we have got to recognize.
Ms. Moore. I would just offer we have been digging into
this in Vermont, as well. Frankly, one of the saving graces, if
it can be considered that, that we have discovered, is many of
our smallest State systems are not actually connected to the
outside world, and that is their best form of prevention. I do
not know that that is long-term sustainable, and certainly
comes with other costs.
We are starting from square one oftentimes for locals that
are connected to the internet, with some sort of remote access.
Oftentimes folks have not even set passwords. Thinking to the
minds of the bad guys who are constantly advancing, and we are
still at the stage where many of these systems have the default
passwords remaining in there as the access point is a
challenging set of circumstances.
There is an enormous need for education, understanding,
building that awareness. Vermont is challenged by the fact that
we do not have county government, as Ted has spoken to--250-
plus municipal entities, 450-plus public water systems.
Figuring out how to deliver those services in partnership with
Vermont Rural Water is the direction we are headed.
Senator Tuberville. Thank you.
Mr. Brady. Thank you for asking. As the insurer for most of
the State's water and sewer systems I can simply point to how
hard it is to insure these things, and they are really
uncovered. When these things do happen, oftentimes it is the
town itself that needs to shoulder the burden, the system
itself that needs to shoulder the burden, because that market
is so hard because it is such a risk.
Senator Tuberville. You cannot buy insurance for this?
Mr. Brady. In Vermont you get a very minimal amount of
coverage, not enough to restore the system in the worst-case
scenario.
Senator Tuberville. Interesting.
Senator Welch. I want to just ask one question to the
panel, and it is based on my observations of what happened to
Vermont in Irene and a year ago.
What I noticed, and this might be true in your communities
as well, FEMA was really great right after the event. They
showed up. They were responsive. They provided food, some
temporary shelter, immediate cash, and that was combined with
the extraordinary first responder response and neighbors in the
community who all came out to help the folks whose home was
flooded or business was under water.
Then they leave, and they leave because they have another
disaster--fire in Hawaii, Houston--and they have got to keep
going. In the aftermath Vermont gets back on its feet, but if
it is your home, if it is your farm, if it is your business, it
is really tough, tough, tough. It is tough emotionally. It also
really tough because then the folks who are coming to represent
FEMA are not institutionally there. There are a lot of
bureaucratic things, and this is where, Coach Tuberville, I
really agree with the opening comments you made about the
complexity of it.
My view is that FEMA is just to set up for that long-term,
follow-through situation. They have a principal job of that
immediate disaster response. What I have seen in Vermont is
that those local folks on the Select Board are totally engaged
with their community on how do we fix this bridge. They are
totally engaged with the fact that the grocery store in the
small town needs to be reopened to help folks there.
My view is that--and RD has been fantastic. The USDA has
been that institution that has been the closest to the people.
My view, and I want your reaction to this, is that we have got
to redesign so that we drive down the resources to that local
community where there are local people who are totally
committed to the reconstruction as quickly, as efficiently, and
as affordably as possible.
It suggests to me, listening to Senator Tuberville, that
this may be an area where we could provide some reform with the
goal of empowering those local communities, where we have got
the citizens who are invested in the follow-through and will
answer the tough questions.
Maybe just go down the line to get your reaction to that
sort of outline of revised approach.
Mr. Brady. Thank you for asking, Senator. What we find it
seems long-term recovery approach really does put the recovery
in the hands of local long-term recovery volunteers. It is
imperfect, at best. To what you said before, projects do not
get done in days or weeks or months when FEMA is there.
Projects get done in years.
I will give you an example. Londonderry, Vermont, down in
south-central Vermont, got a FEMA mitigation grant post-Irene.
Two weeks, three weeks, before the July 2023 flooding they
finished that project, more than 10 years after the disaster.
It was to raise a single residence house up out of the flood
zone. That system does not seem to be working well.
Killington, Vermont, paid off its last piece of disaster
debt from Irene, which was 2011, the week before the 2023
flooding. That system does not seem to be working, so we would
embrace it.
I think the Rural Recovery Act that you have proposed would
be an incredible opportunity for changing the way we do
disaster response and have RD more involved. I think the Rural
Partnerships Program that Commissioner Paap mentioned is also
important for getting ready ahead of time for disasters.
Senator Welch. Thank you.
Ms. Moore. Yes. I would echo, actually, some of the
comments Ted made in his opening remarks about the importance
of financial, operational, and managerial capacity in many of
our small rural communities, and I think that is where part of
this disconnect is. FEMA has a lot of opportunities, but they
tend to be complex and application intensive. We have a lot of
passion and commitment on the part of the volunteers and town
clerks who would go after those resources. What is needed in
between is technical assistance and expertise, and to my mind,
that is where I see the Rural Recovery Act coming in. USDA RD
has the ability to sort of work between, with a foot in each of
those worlds, and help connect that vision that the community
holds to how you actually build that project on the ground, and
that is a gap right now.
Senator Welch. Yes. Any others? Mr. Paap?
Mr. Paap. I would add that sitting in this room in the Ag
Committee and Agriculture we have got a lot of commodities that
are raised I this country. The most precious commodity we all
have is time. Whether it is during the disaster or the recovery
process, time is critical. Anything we can do to help with that
process, to help with that coordination, I think would be
important.
Senator Welch. Great. Thank you.
Mr. Bohlin. Yes, sir. Thank you for the question. As far as
FEMA goes, when Ivan came through they were great. They were
there with boots on the ground. They had appraisers coming out,
checking out properties, and trying to help get money and aid
into the community. They gave us spreadsheets where we had to
keep our force work, timesheets of employees and what they
worked. They also provided funds to pay for equipment such as
chainsaws and generators that we might need during the event,
to get us up and going.
When Sally hit, I called our local EMA and told them that
we had some issues and needed to talk to FEMA. I never saw
anybody.
Once the crisis was over they came back and they funneled
some money into Baldwin County, because what they are doing is
they take money and they will give a county, an area, they will
give them a lot of money. Then what we have is we have
stakeholders, and us, as a water system, in Baldwin County, we
are stakeholder in this group. If we want to get money to do
something--and all of this money is hazard mitigation, it is
not to repair or fix anything that has been damaged. It is do
something for mitigation, which is fine. It's great. I think
hazard mitigation is needed.
It becomes competitive, and we have to compete with Foley,
Robertsdale, Orange Beach, Gulf Shores, Fairhope, Daphne, to
get these funds. As a system I have to submit an RFP back to
this group of stakeholders. They review the projects that
everybody has submitted, and then they pick which projects they
want to fund or they would see funded.
Now once you do that you still have to file your project
with FEMA, and it has to be approved. I tried doing this and
going through the process. We were wanting to build a safe
house for our employees so that we could house them during a
storm. I filled out all of the paperwork, submitted it to FEMA.
I did not hear anything for over a year and a half. I finally
get a call back from FEMA, and they want to know about our safe
house project. I said, ``Well, I didn't think we got the money
because we didn't hear anything from you.'' ``Oh, no, no. We
just need you to update some paperwork.''
They sent me the paperwork with what they need updated. I
update this paperwork and I send it back to them, and I don't
hear anything for another year. Then when I hear from them
then, they have turned down the project.
Now you have got to keep in mind, too, when things take
this long the cost of what you are trying to do is going up. We
had borrowed money from RD to build a safe house several years
ago, and the pandemic hit, and then the supply chain issues
hit, and the cost of a safe house was $450,000 and went to
$850,000. By the time we worked through this process it was up
to $1.4 million. It is just a long, drawn-out process.
Senator Welch. Thank you. I do want to be brief. I just
want to able to recognize, Senator Lujan has just come in, but
go ahead.
Mr. Kimbro. Yes, sir. Real brief. We are an at-cost
provider, electrical cooperative. Our total utility plant is
$140 million. If a Hurricane Michael came through and hit our
service territory we could literally have a $40 to $50 million
expense.
FEMA is critically important for us. The only thing I would
offer about FEMA is going forward the regulations surrounding
it and the reimbursement, the process of that, just tell us
what they are. Don't keep moving the goalposts. Have that where
we can get that process known and understood and therefore
applied for quickly.
Senator Welch. Thank you very much. The Chair recognizes
Senator Lujan.
Senator Lujan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and Ranking Member
Tuberville. It is good to see both of you. Thank you for this
important conversation.
I am especially grateful for this discussion after what has
been a difficult and devastating fire season and flooding
season in New Mexico, just two years after we saw the largest
fire in our State's history, a fire, by the way, that was
started as a prescribed burn. Some folks did not see the need
to look at it with infrared technology with the burn pile, and
put a hand to it, and it was cool enough. Community after
community was devastated and destroyed, not because of Mother
Nature.
Last month two fires that started on the Mescalero Apache
reservation quickly grew out of control. Hotter and drier
conditions from climate change along with high winds helped the
fire spread and burn over 25,000 acres of land in the Village
of Ruidoso and throughout southern New Mexico. A fire that
started one afternoon, by that night the town was being
evacuated, because it spread so quickly. It was so dry.
A few weeks later we thought Mother Nature was going to
help us, and she put down some water and some rain, but it was
a little too much because of the burn scars. What the fire did
not take out, the flood did.
Hundreds of homes and buildings have been destroyed by the
fires and by the flooding, but the impacts on rural
infrastructure do not end there. The fire scar, the monsoons,
the flash flooding, the debris flows, septics, in this area
there is not a wastewater system. Families are on septics.
Those get filled up and that contaminates everything. It gets
into the water lagoons. We are talking about communities up in
the mountains. Where our water comes from is if we are blessed
with a little bit of now and it melts, and we are able to save
it in some lake and some ponds, and we can filter it and we can
get it to people to drink, that is how we survive back in New
Mexico. All of that gets ruined.
The costs can quickly become overwhelming, especially for
small rural communities that have fewer resources and less
capacity for resilience, finding and repairing damaged
infrastructure, which I appreciate every one of the panelists
today with your testimony.
Mr. Chairman, while you may be on the East Coast, and
Coach, you are down South, on the West side the smallest towns,
it is hard. They do not have the revenue base, a tax base
sometimes, to come up with the cost shares, to figure things
out based on population.
For whatever reason, you know, my ancestors and folks back
in New Mexico saw it forthright to draw our counties large. You
know, some of the Eastern States can fit inside some of our
counties in New Mexico. When that happens, based on the current
rules, if we do not hit the population density or the cost
threshold, then it is not a national disaster. It is a State
disaster.
For all my friends in the Midwest, who the size of their
counties is the size of ranches in New Mexico, they hit that
density pretty quickly. For Western States--New Mexico,
Wyoming, pick one--it is just not fair. It is not fair when we
just look at a line that was drawn over a century ago by some
folks that got together to throw some lines on a map based on
who lived where, or they could see down that way, or there was
a mountain here, or there was a creek that divided this place
from that place, or it took that many days for you to get on
horseback and ride through two towns, so that is where we are
going to drop the marker, and that is where we are going to
draw the county line.
It does not apply today with the current rules that we have
based on treating all American citizens equally. I certainly
hope that when we look at a rewrite of FEMA, some of the
legislation that you have been championing, Mr. Chairman, and
our Ranking Member, Coach, that we even think about FEMA in a
regional way across America.
Fires in the West are not just fires. It is a day or two or
a week or two of fire, and then it is a decade of flooding,
because everything that was holding up that water, it is all
gone. Any of you that have ever poured concrete, if you poured
it on an incline or decline, and a little bit of water gets on
top of it, you see how quick it runs and how it picks up steam?
Think about that on a mountain, 13,000 feet, going down to
7,000 feet pretty quickly. You think about the steam that that
water picks up. It picks up trees that have fallen, and it
turns them into torpedoes, and they go through people's homes.
It is like an explosion, when a bomb goes off and there is
shrapnel that sticks into stuff. The same thing happens with
wood and to people's homes. It is just devastating.
Mr. Chairman, I have used up all my time here. You know,
community after community, the city of Las Vegas, which is in
the heart of that fire that started with a prescribed burn,
their water treatment center, we thought it was going to be
okay after that fire a few years ago, with all the mitigation.
Then some floods came in, destroyed the reservoir again. We are
trying to get in there to help them. While that flood hit, two
other communities, one by the name of Medanales, just north of
the city of Espanola, beautiful little community, hardworking
families, a little bit of debris came down in the river, even
though it was not raining on this little town, pulled down a
bunch of water and rock, stopped the river flow. The river
picked it up itself, as it sometimes can do, went over a bank,
and took out a town. Took out a community.
The devastation was not large enough for that county. No
Federal declaration. It takes all the Fed's approval to go into
the river to take the dirt out. It takes an act of God to get
their permission to be able to go do that without a Federal
declaration.
Mr. Chairman, I cannot thank you enough for having this
conversation and bringing attention to what has been happening
not just across Vermont and Alabama and all over America but in
New Mexico. We need to find a way to work together, Democrats
and Republicans. We are one big American family here, and I
know we can do better to make sure that the smallest
communities in America get the same benefit as the biggest
cities across the beautiful country that we all home.
Thanks for the time. I yield back.
Senator Welch. No, thank you for that wonderful statement
summarizing the collective commitment we all have and whether
we are in a red State or a blue State, we love the citizens we
represent. When they get hit, when they get hurt, we want to
help. I have appreciated the support that Vermont has received
from many of my Republican colleagues, and I want to
reciprocate. I know Senator Lujan, you do as well.
This is a great hearing. You know, I go back to Senator
Tuberville's, oops, Coach Tuberville's comments about trying to
have some flexibility in local implementation. It really makes
sense. All of our communities, folks who live there, the
biggest thing in their life is their community, and let's take
advantage of that. I think with some of the legislation we have
before us we might be able to get together, hopefully work
together to improve the capacity of local people to fix their
own disasters, with the help of the Federal Government, but
with local leadership.
I really want to thank all the witnesses. This is terrific.
I mean, this is the way we should have hearings. The next step
on this would be to propose concrete legislation that
incorporates many of the recommendations that all of our
witnesses, from the great State of Vermont, from the great
State of Minnesota, and the great State of Alabama. You know,
it is great to have folks on both sides of the Mason-Dixon Line
here, speaking truth to the Senators. I look forward to
continuing to work with all of my colleagues.
I would like to submit a letter for the record, submitted
by the National Association of Counties. Without objection, to
do that.
[The letter can be found on page 106 in the appendix.]
Senator Welch. The record will remain open for five
business days for members to submit additional questions or
statements.
This hearing, this very good hearing, is now adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 4:03 p.m., the hearing was adjourned.]
=======================================================================
A P P E N D I X
July 10, 2024
=======================================================================
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
=======================================================================
DOCUMENTS SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
July 10, 2024
=======================================================================
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
=======================================================================
QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS
July 10, 2024
=======================================================================
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
[all]