[Senate Hearing 118-339]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]



                                                        S. Hrg. 118-339



                            BUSINESS MEETING

=======================================================================

                                MEETING

                                 of the

                              COMMITTEE ON
                      ENVIRONMENT AND PUBLIC WORKS 

                          UNITED STATES SENATE

                    ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                              MAY 1, 2024
                               __________

  Printed for the use of the Committee on Environment and Public Works 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
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                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 

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               COMMITTEE ON ENVIRONMENT AND PUBLIC WORKS

                    ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                  THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware, Chairman
          SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West Virginia, Ranking Member

BENJAMIN L. CARDIN, Maryland         KEVIN CRAMER, North Dakota
BERNARD SANDERS, Vermont             CYNTHIA M. LUMMIS, Wyoming
SHELDON WHITEHOUSE, Rhode Island     MARKWAYNE MULLIN, Oklahoma
JEFF MERKLEY, Oregon                 PETE RICKETTS, Nebraska
EDWARD J. MARKEY, Massachusetts      JOHN BOOZMAN, Arkansas
DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan            ROGER WICKER, Mississippi
MARK KELLY, Arizona                  DAN SULLIVAN, Alaska
ALEX PADILLA, California             LINDSEY O. GRAHAM, South Carolina
JOHN FETTERMAN, Pennsylvania

               Courtney Taylor, Democratic Staff Director
               Adam Tomlinson, Republican Staff Director 
               
















               
                            C O N T E N T S

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                                                                   Page

                              MAY 1, 2024
                           OPENING STATEMENTS

Carper, Hon. Thomas R., U.S. Senator from the State of Delaware..     1
Capito, Hon. Shelley Moore, U.S. Senator from the State of West 
  Virginia.......................................................     2

                              LEGISLATION

PN1569, Nomination Reference and Report, Christopher T. Hanson, 
  of Michigan, to be a Member of the Nuclear Regulatory 
  Commission.....................................................    12
The text of S. 3738, to reauthorize the Great Lakes Restoration 
  Initiative, and for other purposes.............................    13
Committee Resolution to rescind approval of the proposed lease 
  prospectus of the General Services Administration, Lease, 
  Federal Bureau of Investigation, Greater Metropolitan 
  Cleveland, Ohio Area, POH-01-CL22..............................    15

 
                            BUSINESS MEETING

                              ----------                              


                         WEDNESDAY, MAY 1, 2024

                                       U.S. Senate,
                 Committee on Environment and Public Works,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:49 a.m., in 
room 406, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Thomas R. Carper 
(Chairman of the Committee) presiding.
    Present: Senators Carper, Capito, Cardin, Merkley, Markey, 
Stabenow, Padilla, Fetterman, Lummis, Ricketts, Boozman, and 
Sullivan.

          OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. THOMAS R. CARPER, 
            U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF DELAWARE

    Senator Carper. Good morning, everyone. I am pleased to 
call our business meeting to order today.
    Today, as you know, we are going to be considering a 
nominee for the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. We are going to 
be considering a bill to extend authorization of the Great 
Lakes Restoration Initiative, and we are going to be 
considering a committee resolution related to General Services 
Administration.
    When we have a quorum of, I think 10 members, we will 
actually move to the business at hand, but in the meantime, I 
will make some comments and then turn it over to Senator 
Capito.
    Let me take a minute to just discuss the three issues that 
are before us today. First, we are going to consider the 
nomination of Christopher T. Hanson to serve an additional 5 
year term as Commissioner of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission. 
Mr. Hanson is a dedicated public servant who has thoughtfully, 
and, I believe, skillfully led the Nuclear Regulatory 
Commission during his tenure as its chair.
    Throughout his time on the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, 
he has demonstrated his commitment to ensuring the safety and 
the security of our Nation's use of nuclear energy. Chair 
Hanson has also bolstered America's energy security and 
advanced our efforts to slow climate change by leading the 
commission to establish a regulatory framework for the safe 
licensing and operation of new, carbon free technologies. That 
includes the next generation of nuclear reactors and fusion 
energy systems. I believe that we are at a crucial moment, and 
I think a promising moment, for the Nuclear Regulatory 
Commission and the future of nuclear energy.
    The Nuclear Regulatory Commission is most effective and 
efficient when it has a full slate of commissioners to carry 
out its mission and provide certainty to the industry, and, 
frankly, to the rest of us. With all of this in mind, I am 
pleased to support Chair Hanson's nomination. I urge our 
colleagues to do the same.
    The second piece of business today, as you know, the 
Committee will consider legislation introduced by our colleague 
Senator Debbie Stabenow of Michigan and cosponsored by a number 
of members of this Committee to reauthorize the Great Lakes 
Restoration initiative. Since its inception in 2010, this 
successful bipartisan program has protected or enhanced 
hundreds of thousands of acres of wildlife habitat and 
accelerated the cleanup of polluted sites in the Great Lakes 
region.
    Extending the Great Lakes Restoration Initiative will 
ensure the continued restoring and protecting of the Great 
Lakes ecosystems. The legislation before us today reauthorizes 
the program for an additional 5 years through fiscal year 2031 
and increases its authorized annual funding level to $500 
million. That is up from currently $475 million.
    Finally, we will consider a resolution on a General 
Services Administration prospectus for two Federal Bureau of 
Investigation leases that are currently located in Cleveland, 
Ohio. As our colleagues know, under the Public Buildings Act, 
this Committee and the House Committee on Transportation and 
Infrastructure must approve General Service Administration 
lease prospectuses before they can be funded. Our Committee 
approved this prospectus in November 2022, but the House 
Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure has not acted on 
it.
    This year, our Committee has heard new objections to the 
original prospectus from the Ohio congressional delegation and 
the Cleveland community. After further discussion with the 
General Services Administration and stakeholders on the 
prospectuses, our Committee has concluded that additional GSA 
review of the proposed FBI lease prospectus in Cleveland is 
needed to ensure that, among other things, the leases optimize 
taxpayer dollars and consider community input.
    Today, we will consider a resolution to rescind our 
approval of the 2022 prospectus to ensure that the General 
Services Administration works with stakeholders on these issues 
raised before this Committee.
    With that said, let me recognize the Ranking Member, 
Senator Capito, for her opening remarks.
    Senator Capito.

        OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, 
         U.S. SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA

    Senator Capito. Thank you, Chairman Carper. Thank you for 
holding this business meeting.
    As you have said, we are considering the nomination of 
Christopher Hanson to serve another term as a member of the 
Nuclear Regulatory Commission. We all know that we will need 
significantly more reliable electric generation with the 
projected rapid growth in energy demand. Our energy utilities 
will be challenged to meet these known energy needs.
    However, as again was shown last week with the onslaught of 
anti-energy regulations, the Biden administration continues to 
advance a climate agenda to close down reliable, dispatchable 
fossil fuel fired power plants. The combined impact of these 
regulations will weaken America's energy security, increase 
costs on families and businesses, and reduce grid reliability.
    As I have previously stated, we should focus on increasing 
the supply from baseload reliable power sources like nuclear 
energy. That will necessitate an efficient, predictable, and 
timely nuclear safety regulatory process. The NRC Chairman's 
leadership is central to achieving that goal.
    The Chairman is tasked to direct and supervise the staff, 
who are responsible for day to day activities that enable the 
safe use of nuclear power. Chair Hanson must lead the NRC to 
ensure that the NRC staff is prepared to meet this critical 
moment.
    During Chair Hanson's confirmation hearing, I raised 
concerns about some of the ways that he managed the NRC and the 
need to establish an effective, timely, and affordable 
licensing review process. I would like to thank Chair Hanson 
for the commitments to address some of these concerns, such as 
directing the staff to get the subsequent license renewal 
review and approval process back on track.
    In light of these commitments, I will support Chairman 
Hanson's nomination. I will also monitor the agency's progress 
as these commitments are implemented. There is still more work 
to be done until the NRC can and should strive to do better. I 
will continue to work to give the NRC the tools and direction 
to fulfill its mission by working with Chairman Carper to get 
my bipartisan nuclear bill, the ADVANCE Act, signed into law.
    The NRC, under the direction of its Chairman, must be 
prepared to implement the bill's policies and effectively carry 
out the agency's core licensing and regulatory oversight 
responsibilities during this vital time for the nuclear 
industry.
    Today, we will also consider S. 3738, the Great Lakes 
Restoration Initiative Act. This bipartisan bill, led by 
Senators Stabenow and Vance, reauthorizes the EPA's Great Lakes 
Restoration Initiative. This initiative supports important 
activities to address environmental challenges facing the Great 
Lakes in coordination with non-Federal partners. I am pleased 
to support this legislation.
    Senator Carper. Thank you for those words, and thank you 
for your partnership.
    I believe we have 10 people. I think we are in a position 
where we can actually go for it and start voting.
    I see that a quorum is present. As we proceed, I would ask 
Senators to hold your statements on the bill and the Committee 
resolution until after the voting is completed. I know a number 
of you would like to speak.
    First, I want to call up Presidential Nomination No. 1569 
for Christopher Hanson of Michigan to be a member of the 
Nuclear Regulatory Commission for a term of 5 years, expiring 
on June 30th, 2029.
    I move to approve and report the nomination favorably to 
the Senate. Is there a second?
    Senator Capito. Second.
    Senator Carper. Thank you very much.
    The Clerk will call the roll.
    The Clerk. Mr. Boozman.
    Senator Capito. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Ms. Capito.
    Senator Capito. Yes.
    The Clerk. Mr. Cardin.
    Senator Cardin. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Cramer.
    Senator Capito. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Fetterman.
    Senator Fetterman. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Graham.
    Senator Capito. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Kelly.
    Senator Carper. Senator Kelly is a yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Ms. Lummis.
    Senator Lummis. No.
    The Clerk. Mr. Markey.
    Senator Markey. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Merkley.
    Senator Merkley. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Mullin.
    Senator Capito. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Padilla.
    Senator Padilla. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Ricketts.
    Senator Ricketts. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Sanders.
    Senator Carper. Mr. Sanders, yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Ms. Stabenow.
    Senator Stabenow. Aye.
    The Clerk. Mr. Sullivan.
    Senator Capito. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Whitehouse.
    Senator Carper. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Wicker.
    Senator Capito. Yes, by proxy.
    The Clerk. Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Carper. Aye.
    The Clerk. Chairman, the yeas are 18, the nays are 1.
    Senator Carper. With that, the nominee is favorably 
reported.
    I now call up S. 3738, the Great Lakes Restoration 
Initiative Act of 2024 and the committee resolution to rescind 
approval of a lease prospectus by the General Services 
Administration identified as POH-01-CL22.
    There is a modified version of the committee resolution 
that was circulated yesterday in order to correct a date. 
Without objection, we will consider that version as the text 
for the purposes of this business meeting.
    Members have had the opportunity to review both S. 3738; 
many of you cosponsored it, and the resolution. I believe that 
they are not controversial, so without objection, we are going 
to consider them en bloc by voice vote. Is that OK? All right.
    Senator Cardin. Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Carper. Yes, please.
    Senator Cardin. Senator Boozman is here. He might want to 
be recorded in person, rather than proxy on the last vote, if 
there is no objections.
    Senator Carper. All right. Good.
    Welcome, and thanks.
    With that in mind, we have members who had the opportunity 
to review both bills, 3738 and the resolution, I believe they 
are not controversial, so without objection, let us consider 
them en bloc by voice vote.
    I therefore move to report favorably S. 3738, the Great 
Lakes Restoration Initiative Act of 2024, and the committee 
resolution to rescind approval of the lease prospectus of the 
General Services Administration, again, identified at POH-01-
CL22. All in favor, say aye.
    [Chorus of ayes.]
    Senator Carper. All opposed, say nay.
    [No audible response.]
    Senator Carper. In the opinion of the Chair, the ayes have 
it. The legislation and committee resolution are favorably 
reported.
    I note, for the record, that a quorum of the Committee is 
present. I want to thank everybody for being here.
    That concludes the Committee's votes of the business 
meeting today. I want to thank you all for your participation. 
I want to thank our staffs for helping to set this up for 
success.
    With that, I am going to recognize members who would like 
to speak on any of the items we have voted on today.
    Senator Stabenow, would you like to go first, our lead off 
hitter?
    Senator Stabenow. Well, thank you so much, Mr. Chairman.
    I really do want to thank Chairman Carper and Ranking 
Member Capito for bringing up and allowing us to pass the Great 
Lakes Restoration Initiative Act out of Committee. I want to 
thank Senator Vance for his partnership on this effort. This is 
really important to all of us in the Great Lakes.
    The GLRI, as we call it, which I originally authored in 
2010, is the most important tool we have to restore and protect 
our Great Lakes. The program has been a major success story. 
Since its inception, GLRI has spurred a fivefold increase in 
the successful cleanup and delisting of areas of concern, kept 
over 2 million pounds of phosphorous runoff from reaching our 
Great Lakes, reducing the threat of harmful algae blooms, and 
protected, restored, and enhanced about a half a million acres 
of habitat.
    This is why the program shares such strong bipartisan 
support. It works, but there is still a lot more left to do. 
That is why today's bill is so important. It ensures that the 
program will continue to restore and protect our Great Lakes 
for years to come.
    I want to thank my colleagues for their support. I look 
forward to getting this bill over the finish line on the floor 
in the Senate, and we have the same strong bipartisan support 
in the House.
    Again, Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member, I really do 
appreciate your bringing this bill up today. Thank you.
    Senator Carper. We appreciate all of your work.
    Senator Stabenow and I are very much in the mode of running 
through the tape as we head for the end of our service here in 
the U.S. Senate on high noon on January 5th, I think, January 
3rd, 2025. But in my conversations with you, I know how 
important this issue is to you and to your constituents. We are 
delighted to be able to move the legislation today.
    Senator Lummis. Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Carper. Please.
    Senator Lummis. Thank you.
    Senator Stabenow, before you leave the room, and of course, 
Senator Carper, thank you for your service to your States and 
to our country.
    Chairman Carper and Ranking Member Capito, Wyoming and 
other western States have enormous interests at stake in NRC 
approvals. It involves both nuclear power and the handling of 
nuclear materials.
    In the leadup to this Committee vote, I have to say that 
while I appreciate meeting with Chairman Hanson, I have been 
very underwhelmed with Chair Hanson's posture regarding the 
remediation of abandoned uranium mines. His response to my 
letter, which was cosigned by other Senators, including both 
parties, received a form response. And I expect more from the 
Chairman of the Nuclear Regulatory Commission.
    Since then, our discussions have led me to believe that 
there is just no enthusiasm at the agency to prioritize AUMs or 
a genuine aspiration to address the 15,000 abandoned mines out 
West. The NRC has already had a remediation technology under 
review for over 10 months, and the technology was known to the 
NRC before that. I can't imagine what more information is 
required at this stage.
    Further, I am concerned that Chair Hanson's recent hearing 
comments just don't move things forward. He suggested a pilot 
program or an EPA Superfund process. And those are really 
disappointing recommendations. They have the technology under 
review at the agency.
    So, neither of those suggestions recognized the attributes 
of a working technology already studied. We would be looking at 
more delays, more paperwork, and licensing hurdles.
    Now, we know an EPA study highlighted a technology that 
resulted in over 90 percent success rate for uranium 
remediation with no adverse impacts on surface water or 
groundwater, 90 percent success rate. Most of us would take yes 
for an answer with results like that, and yet, the agency 
remains unconvinced.
    So, in closing, I am voting no on this nominee. I am not 
seeing leadership to embrace new technologies or the resolve to 
remediate AUMs in the American West. Many of the mines are on 
the Navajo Reservation in Arizona, and having a process that 
could remediate 90 percent of the problem and have an agency 
fail to advance that kind of success rate, in my opinion, 
merits a no vote at this time. We will see what happens on the 
floor.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Thank you, Ranking Member.
    Senator Carper. Thank you for your comments. Always 
thoughtful, always thoughtful. We appreciate that very much in 
serving with you.
    I understand Senator Sullivan may be on his way. Can 
somebody confirm that for us please? Anybody from his team?
    Senator Sullivan, the man of the hour.
    Senator Sullivan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Carper. You are recognized. Thanks for joining us.
    Senator Sullivan. I am just here to voice a concern with 
the Committee and how it is working. You know, you got some 
text messages from me last night. I am getting tired of my 
State being singled out by this staff, Democrat staff, on 
everything, with no data, with no heads up to me. It is 
happening all the time, and I am tired of it.
    We worked on the FAA bill for months. We had a provision on 
this aviation gas issue to have an implementation that would be 
a longer implementation for Alaska. This goes to safety; this 
goes to the huge challenges in my State, which is so big; this 
goes to protecting Native people. We worked on this for months.
    Your staff, with Pallone over in the House, at the last 
minute, comes and says, you know what, we are just going to cut 
that in half, or maybe we are going to not have the EPA 
involved, which is essentially gutting. This is Maria Cantwell 
was 100 percent on board, Ted Cruz 100 percent on board. This 
is FAA aviation safety.
    Once again, because it is Alaska and because the radical 
environmental groups love to shut down my State, screw the 
Native people, this staff, on this Committee, with no data, no 
nothing, cuts this in half.
    And the whole time, I am negotiating, Cantwell is 
negotiating, and they are telling me, Mr. Chairman, that it is 
a priority of yours. OK, a priority of yours. I am wondering 
why; it shouldn't be. I would never do this to Delaware.
    When you and I called last night, no offense to you, you 
didn't know anything about it, so it wasn't a priority of 
yours. It was your staff. Negotiate with me and Maria Cantwell 
on a safety issue that we worked out for months in the FAA 
bill, and all of a sudden, Carper's staff, by the way, I want 
to know who it is on Carper's staff, it is just like, you know 
what, we are going to cut this in half. OK, based on what data?
    I have been studying this. Maria Cantwell was fighting for 
this agreement. On what data? I want to know what data. This 
goes to safety of my constituents, and you guys jump in at the 
last minute, and I am so God damned sick of it. Anything that 
deals with Alaska, you feel it is open season, because the 
radical environmental groups want to shut my State down.
    It is wrong, and I expect Senatorial courtesy, not dealing 
with your staff, but dealing with you on an issue that is 
really important to me. It wasn't just important to me; it was 
important to Maria Cantwell.
    So, I am really pissed, because we had to cave. Your staff 
got its implementation of this to cut it in half. Based on what 
data, I want to know. I want to know your staffer who did this. 
What data did you use? None. You just came up with it. You 
pulled it out of your you know what, and it is wrong, Mr. 
Chairman.
    If Delaware had a big issue that dealt with safety, Native 
people, and my staff was like, hey, I am going to go screw with 
Carper's provision, and I am going to tell him that Senator 
Sullivan really cares and Senator Sullivan doesn't even know 
about it, I would never do that to you, sir. I would never do 
that to you.
    Democrats, and it is Democrats, always feel, hey, it is 
Alaska. The radical enviros love to shut us down. We get money 
from the radical enviros, so we will go do what they want. It 
is wrong, and I expect Senatorial courtesy, not me and Cantwell 
and Ted Cruz and Mary Peltola, a Democrat Congresswoman from 
Alaska who is Native, we are working this the whole weekend, 
and we are told that Carper really wants this.
    OK. I respect Tom Carper. I will call Tom Carper. When I 
called you, you didn't know anything about it, so it wasn't 
you. It was your staff, and I don't like this at all. I would 
never do this to you, and I wouldn't do it, and your staff is 
handing you stuff for talking points. I get it, right? It is 
bullshit.
    I am really mad about it, and I am sick of my State being 
the target for radical Democrats who feel they can legislate on 
anything just because it is Alaska. By the way, it always hurts 
the Native people. Oh, we care about indigenous people, people 
of color; no you don't. I am getting ready to go talk to our 
Alaska Federation Native groups; all our Native people are in 
town.
    But as you can tell, I am really mad about this, and I am 
tired of it. So, I want a commitment from you, Mr. Chairman, if 
there is anything dealing with my State again, I want to go you 
and me, OK, Senator to Senator, not being told by your staff 
that Carper really cares. Tom Carper, whom I respect 
tremendously, you know how much I respect you, but I am 
fighting for my constituents right now.
    Tom Carper didn't know one damned thing about this issue, 
and I have been working on it for almost a year. Because here 
is the thing: People are trying to get off leaded aviation gas. 
OK, I agree with that. My State has 233 communities that are 
not connected by roads. Everybody flies, everybody, OK?
    Guess which State has the highest aviation death rate in 
America by far? My State. Guess which State has the highest 
crash rates by far? My State. This is about safety. Making sure 
the timeline of the implementation of this rule gives my State, 
which is gigantic, as you all know, the ability to do it.
    It is about safety, and I got a 4 year carveout, which 
isn't much. My State probably won't be able to implement this 
rule for 20 years, just incapable. It is too big. Everybody 
uses airplanes. They are old airplanes, and now your staff 
comes in and says no, we want to cut that in half.
    Why? What data? Whose idea was this? Guess what I had to 
cave to this morning on the FAA bill? The Carper staff. It 
wasn't you, Mr. Chairman. The Carper staff compromise. It 
wasn't a compromise; it was shoved down my throat. It is 
bullshit.
    And I want a commitment, any more legislating on Alaska, if 
you are going to legislate on Alaska, if I legislated on 
Delaware, I would go to you. Here is why I am doing this.
    I don't get that courtesy, and I am tired of it. I am 
really mad, because guess what? If there are more plane crashes 
in my State, I am going to come to your staff and say, you are 
killing people in my State, God damn it. And there is no data.
    I would like to hear your staff right now say what was the 
data in the basis of saying, the 4 year carveout in the FAA 
bill, EPW demanded that it be 2 years. What is the data on 
that? I want to know. I want to know right now.
    Which staffer was negotiating this? Who was it? It wasn't 
you, Mr. Chairman, I know that, because you and I talked about 
it yesterday, and you didn't know anything about it. Who is the 
staffer, and what is the data?
    Why are you doing it, and did you weigh anything, anything, 
dealing with the safety of rural Alaska pilots in your 
insistence that my carveout, that Maria Cantwell not only was 
fine with, she was fighting for it? She tried to call you. So, 
I would like to know what the data was, right now, from your 
staff. And I would like to know which staffer of yours was the 
one saying Carper cares, because you didn't care. You didn't 
even know about it.
    Who was it? I am the Senator, and so are you, but who is 
the staffer? Give me the data right now. I want to know. I am 
really upset.
    Senator Carper. Let me just say that----
    Senator Sullivan. I am legitimately upset, and I don't 
treat anyone else like you, and I certainly don't treat you, 
because I respect you, but I would never treat you like this.
    Senator Carper. You and our colleagues have heard me invoke 
in this room more times than I can count the Golden Rule: Treat 
other people the way I want to be treated. I try to make that 
clear to my team----
    Senator Sullivan. I wasn't treated that way.
    Senator Carper [continuing]. And I tried especially to you. 
You and I enjoy a special bond by virtue of our service in 
uniform.
    Senator Sullivan. I like you a lot, Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Carper. If I had known--as you know, the breadth of 
the issues that we cover in this Committee are enormous. It is 
impossible for any of us to fully master each of them.
    Senator Sullivan. I know, but usually when a Senator is 
legislating on his own State----
    Senator Carper. You have talked. Let me just, if you had 
said to me a day, 2 days ago or whatever, how important this 
was, what the issues are on a personal basis, it would have 
made me focus on it. I just didn't hear from you until, like, 
late yesterday.
    Senator Sullivan. You guys got involved yesterday.
    Senator Carper. And so, I would say there is a lesson here 
for both of us, and one of those is to make clear I am always 
ready to take your calls, your meeting, whatever you want and 
engage.
    In this case, if you did it, I just missed a signal on it, 
and I regret that. Having said that, it is still morning in 
America, and I think we have an opportunity to make this right. 
We are not going to give up as long as there is daylight today, 
and I would ask that we just continue to engage. We will talk 
some more with you.
    Senator Sullivan. Well, I put forward a compromise which I 
didn't even like last night, 3 years, as opposed to 2, and you 
came back with this text to me, written by your staff, I want 
to know which one, ``No, we won't do 3 years.'' You wouldn't 
even compromise.
    I want to know that data based on what? I have been doing 
this. I have been working, these are my constituents. I am the 
one who is the expert. Your staff doesn't know jack about this. 
I am sorry, no offense.
    So, you wouldn't even compromise from 2 years to 3 years. 
That was directly, you to me, and it is really important to me, 
and you guys knew it. Your staff certainly knew it. I am just 
really tired.
    Senator Carper. Given how important this obviously is, my 
only regret is that we didn't have an opportunity to talk about 
it 24 hours ago. There is still daylight, it is morning in 
America. Let's continue to focus on this, you and I, and our 
staffs as well, and work with Maria, Ted Cruz, and others that 
are engaged in this, and the Administration, which has an 
interest in well to see if we can't----
    Senator Sullivan. Oh, it does? Does the Administration? I 
am sure they are out to shut down my State. That is why I am 
curious, are you guys, is your staff getting direction from the 
White House to screw my State? That is what I truly want to 
know, I really do, because why? This is the last issue in the 
FAA reauthorization, the Alaska carveout, 4 years as opposed--
again, we are not going to be able to do this for 20 years. It 
became this giant issue.
    I am like, why is it a giant issue? Geez, I know my State, 
I am legislating on it. Why is Carper, Tom Carper, so 
interested? Well, Tom Carper wasn't interested. Why is his 
staff so interested? I mean, why don't you accept 3 years right 
now? I still don't even like 3 years, but the text I sent to 
you last night was 3 years. You came back to me with a text 
saying, my staff thinks that is not a good compromise.
    Senator Carper. Well, there is a good compromise out there, 
and I think if we are smart and don't give up today, we will 
find it.
    Senator Sullivan. Well, I just want a commitment from you, 
the next time someone legislates on my State specifically, 
because every radical environmental group that controls a lot 
of the Democrats, they love to shut down Alaska. And I am God 
damned sick of it.
    So next time someone is legislating on my State 
specifically, Mr. Chairman, it shouldn't be your staff. It 
should be directly you and me, and don't let your staff ever 
say again, Senator Carper really cares about this. You didn't. 
You didn't even know about it. I still want to know what the 
data was, what the data----
    Senator Carper. Part of the responsibility is for you, lies 
with you, and for issues that are as important as this, talk to 
me on the phone.
    Senator Sullivan. Lies with me? I have been working this 
issue for 9 months. I have been working this issue all weekend.
    Senator Carper. All right.
    Senator Sullivan. You guys got involved at the last minute, 
and I want to know, what was the data that your staff used to 
go from 4 years to 2 years? What was the data? Give me the 
data, and did you consider once the safety of my constituents? 
What is the data? Can I ask your staff right now? They are the 
ones who negotiated.
    Senator Carper. No, I think this markup is coming to an 
end. Thank you for your passion, and I would ask that we spend 
the rest of this day dealing with this and seeing if we can't 
work this out. I think we can.
    Senator Sullivan. Good.
    Senator Carper. Senator Capito, any closing thought?
    Senator Capito. I will let that be the end, thank you.
    Senator Carper. Let us see what we have here.
    In closing, I want to thank our members for being here 
today, and for some final housekeeping, I have three unanimous 
consent agreements.
    First, I ask unanimous consent for members to submit their 
statements for the record on the legislation we have considered 
today.
    Without objection.
    Second, I would like to ask unanimous consent to submit for 
the record a number of letters of support for the nominee and 
legislation our committee approved today.
    Without objection.
    [The referenced information was not received at time of 
print.]
    Senator Carper. I also ask unanimous consent that our 
staffs have the authority to make technical and conforming 
changes to the legislation approved today.
    Without objection.
    I want to thank you, my colleague, our Ranking Member, and 
I want to thank our staffs for making what is usually a calm 
procedure as we report out the legislation and nominations that 
are actually widely supported. We got a little more here than 
we bargained for.
    But my hope is, on a serious note, my hope is that the 
issues we just discussed with the Senator from Alaska that we 
can keep at it today and see if we can't find a way to yes that 
is reasonable and acceptable to all of us.
    With that, thanks everybody for your participation. With 
that, this business meeting is adjourned. Thank you.
    [Whereupon, at 10:21 a.m., the business meeting was 
concluded.]
    [The referenced legislation follows:]
    
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