    [House Hearing, 118 Congress]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                      A COUNTRY WITHOUT BORDERS: HOW BIDEN-
                       HARRIS' OPEN-BORDERS POLICIES HAVE
                       UNDERMINED OUR SAFETY AND SECURITY

    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                         COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY
                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                        ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                                 SECOND SESSION

                                   __________

                               SEPTEMBER 18, 2024

                                   __________

                               Serial No. 118-78

                                   __________

           Printed for the use of the Committee on Homeland Security

    [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

            Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.govinfo.gov

                                   __________

                       U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
    59-863 PDF                  WASHINGTON : 2025

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                        COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY

                     Mark E. Green, MD, Tennessee, Chairman

    Michael T. McCaul, Texas             Bennie G. Thompson, Mississippi,
    Clay Higgins, Louisiana                  Ranking Member
    Michael Guest, Mississippi           Eric Swalwell, California
    Dan Bishop, North Carolina           J. Luis Correa, California
    Carlos A. Gimenez, Florida           Troy A. Carter, Louisiana
    August Pfluger, Texas                Shri Thanedar, Michigan
    Andrew R. Garbarino, New York        Seth Magaziner, Rhode Island
    Marjorie Taylor Greene, Georgia      Glenn Ivey, Maryland
    Tony Gonzales, Texas                 Daniel S. Goldman, New York
    Nick LaLota, New York                Robert Garcia, California
    Mike Ezell, Mississippi              Delia C. Ramirez, Illinois
    Anthony D'Esposito, New York         Robert Menendez, New Jersey
    Laurel M. Lee, Florida               Thomas R. Suozzi, New York
    Morgan Luttrell, Texas               Timothy M. Kennedy, New York
    Dale W. Strong, Alabama              Yvette D. Clarke, New York
    Josh Brecheen, Oklahoma
    Elijah Crane, Arizona
                          Stephen Siao, Staff Director
                      Hope Goins, Minority Staff Director
                           Sean Corcoran, Chief Clerk

                               C O N T E N T S

                                  ----------
                                                                       Page

                                   Statements

    Honorable Mark E. Green, a Representative in Congress From the
      State of Tennessee, and Chairman, Committee on Homeland
      Security:
      Oral Statement.................................................     1
      Prepared Statement.............................................     3
    Honorable Bennie G. Thompson, a Representative in Congress From
      the State of Mississippi, and Ranking Member, Committee on
      Homeland Security:
      Oral Statement.................................................     5
      Prepared Statement.............................................     7

                                   Witnesses

    Mr. Aaron Heitke, Private Citizen, Former Chief Patrol Agent, San
      Diego Sector, U.S. Customs and Border Protection:
      Oral Statement.................................................     9
      Prepared Statement.............................................    11
    Ms. Patty Morin, Private Citizen:
      Oral Statement.................................................    12
      Prepared Statement.............................................    13
    Mr. Jim Desmond, County Supervisor D5, San Diego County,
      California:
      Oral Statement.................................................    17
      Prepared Statement.............................................    18
    Mr. David Hathaway, Sheriff, Santa Cruz County, Arizona:
      Oral Statement.................................................    27
      Prepared Statement.............................................    28

                                 For the Record

    Honorable J. Luis Correa, a Representative in Congress From the
      State of California:
      Article, NY Times..............................................    35
      Article, Politico..............................................    42

                                    Appendix

    Mr. Aaron Heitke, Private Citizen, Former Chief Patrol Agent, San
      Diego Sector, U.S. Customs and Border Protection:
      Supplemental Prepared Statement................................    77

    A COUNTRY WITHOUT BORDERS: HOW BIDEN-HARRIS' OPEN-BORDERS POLICIES HAVE
                       UNDERMINED OUR SAFETY AND SECURITY

                                  ----------

                         Wednesday, September 18, 2024

                 U.S. House of Representatives,
                        Committee on Homeland Security,
                                                Washington, DC.
        The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:07 a.m., in
    room 310, Cannon House Office Building, Hon. Mark E. Green
    [Chairman of the committee] presiding.
        Present: Representatives Green, Higgins, Guest, Bishop,
    Gimenez, Greene, LaLota, Ezell, D'Esposito, Strong, Brecheen,
    Crane, Thompson, Correa, Thanedar, Ivey, Goldman, Garcia,
    Ramirez, Menendez, Suozzi, and Kennedy.
        Chairman Green. The Committee on Homeland Security will
    come to order. Without objection, the Chair may declare the
    committee in recess at any point.
        The purpose of this hearing is to receive testimony on the
    Biden-Harris border policies and how they have undermined the
    safety and security of America. I now recognize myself for an
    opening statement.
        President Joe Biden, his appointed border czar Vice
    President Kamala Harris, and Department of Homeland Security
    Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas have sparked the worst border
    crisis in American history. Looking back over the nearly 4
    years, Americans have witnessed a national security, public
    safety, and humanitarian disaster at our borders, and every
    day, we continue to feel its devastating consequences.
        The flood of inadmissible aliens across our sovereign
    border has been unprecedented. Since Biden-Harris' first full
    month in office, Customs and Border Protection has recorded
    more than 10.3 million encounters of inadmissible aliens
    nationwide, compared to 3.1 million between fiscal years 2017
    and 2020. In addition, there have been more than 2 million
    known gotaways on their watch, illegal aliens who are at large
    in our communities, whose intentions and backgrounds are
    completely unknown.
        Encounters at our ports of entry have exploded from roughly
    1 million between fiscal 2017 and 2020 to more than 3 million
    since the start of fiscal year 2021. That is largely because
    the Biden-Harris administration has devised a host of unlawful
    mass parole programs that encourage otherwise inadmissible
    aliens to cross at our land, sea, and airports instead of
    between them. This solves the terrible optics problem of
    overcrowded Border Patrol facilities and overwhelmed agents,
    but the end result is the same: tens of thousands of
    inadmissible aliens released into the interior of the country
    every month against the laws passed by this institution. It is
    just a shell game, a sleight of hand to skew the numbers. It is
    like when a parent tells their children to clean their room,
    only to find the mess simply moved from the floor to the
    closet. Things might look cleaner, but the underlying problem
    has not been addressed. So it is with the Biden-Harris
    administration's border policies.
        Other numbers further highlight this crisis. Tragically,
    tragically, roughly 200,000 Americans have died from fentanyl
    that has been smuggled across the Southwest Border by criminal
    cartels. Border Patrol arrests of illegal aliens with criminal
    backgrounds have more than doubled on the Biden-Harris watch,
    from around 22,000 to more than 53,000. Apprehensions of
    Chinese nationals crossing the Southwest Border illegally
    exceed 36,000 just this fiscal year, more than fiscal year 2007
    through 2020 combined. These are major national security and
    public safety concerns.
        This unprecedented surge across our borders was made
    possible by the Biden-Harris administration. In 2019 and 2020,
    Biden and Harris both declared they supported decriminalizing
    border crossings. Biden said that suspected criminal illegal
    aliens arrested by local law enforcement should not be handed
    over to ICE, contrary to the law. Harris called building more
    border wall systems ``a stupid use of money.'' Biden encouraged
    illegal aliens to surge to our border, his word to flood our
    asylum system with illegitimate claims.
        Their open borders and anti-enforcement rhetoric soon
    became a reality. Upon assuming office, Biden-Harris worked
    immediately to end effective border security policies and to
    dismantle decades of bipartisan immigration enforcement. For
    example, Biden and Harris have gutted detention. For example,
    in fiscal year 2013, the Obama administration detained 91
    percent of all illegal aliens, 82 percent of them from the time
    they were encountered until the case was resolved. In Biden and
    Harris' first year in office, that 82 percent dropped to just
    10 percent.
        Removals have also plummeted from more than 267,000 in
    fiscal year 2019 to around half that number last year, and as
    low as 59,000 in fiscal year 2021. Even worse, removal of
    criminal aliens plummeted from around 173,000 in fiscal year
    2019 to just 70,000 last fiscal year. Just yesterday, prominent
    border correspondent Ali Bradley reported exclusive ICE figures
    showing that since the Biden-Harris administration ended Title
    42 in May 2023, the administration has only removed around 23
    percent of all inadmissible aliens encountered.
        Despite the limitations put on them by the leaders, the men
    and women of CBP and ICE have continued to perform their jobs
    above and beyond the call of duty, and I commend them for their
    unwavering service to the Nation. Yet they know it is not
    supposed to be this way. Today you will no doubt hear more
    blame shifting and excuses by my colleagues across the aisle,
    but all of it is meant to mislead. You will probably hear about
    the recent drop in illegal border crossings between ports of
    entry along our Southwest Border. However, this does not
    account for the thousands of inadmissible aliens coming in
    daily through the ports of entry under the scheme I described
    earlier. Nor does it undo the damage done by the millions that
    have come in over the past 3\1/2\ years.
        This evidence also suggests no connection between Biden's
    recent loophole-ridden Executive Order and these new numbers,
    but rather step up interior enforcement by Mexico. As we saw
    recently, that enforcement is waning with the Mexican
    government now busing CBP One appointment holders from the
    southern Mexico border straight to the southern U.S. border.
        Coming almost 4 years into this self-inflicted crisis, the
    administration's action is much too little and far too late.
    For numerous families across the country, like those of Rachel
    Morin, Laken Riley, Jocelyn Nungaray, the damage will never be
    undone. You certainly won't hear how the Senate's border bill,
    which just a single Republican helped write, would have made
    the crisis worse. It would have only allowed tough restrictions
    once encounters passed several thousand per day, mandated mass
    releases through noncustodial detention, improperly expanded
    the use of parole, and more. It was a terrible bill, one that
    would roughly--that was roundly criticized by former heads of
    CBP and Border Patrol and ICE.
        Today's hearing is about getting the unvarnished truth from
    Americans who have been forced to live out the Biden-Harris
    open borders nightmare in their own lives. This administration
    has completely undermined border security through a host of
    policies and decisions that have overwhelmed and sidelined the
    Border Patrol. Biden and Harris have gutted ICE's ability to
    conduct immigration enforcement in the interior, making it
    harder to detain and remove illegal aliens, including criminal
    illegal aliens and innocent Americans are suffering as a
    result. The story you will hear from Patty Morin today is sadly
    just one of tens of thousands of stories of pain, suffering,
    and preventable tragedy.
        What you will hear from Jim Desmond is the account of a
    major American city that has been overwhelmed and overrun. It
    does not have to be like this. Later today, my committee will
    release a comprehensive report documenting an even more painful
    objective detail how Biden, Harris, and their administration
    have thrown open borders--thrown open our borders, and the
    chaos that has resulted. I encourage all Americans to read it
    at homeland.house.gov.
        As we continue to witness Biden and Harris' resistance to
    doing anything meaningful about this disaster, we have to ask
    why? Why did they let this crisis take place and why have they
    let it continue? I hope this hearing provides some answers and
    inspires President Biden and Vice President Harris to do what
    they so far have refused to: end this crisis and secure our
    borders.
        [The statement of Chairman Green follows:]
                    Statement of Chairman Mark E. Green, MD
                               September 18, 2024
        President Joe Biden, his appointed ``border czar'', Vice President
    Kamala Harris, and Department of Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro
    Mayorkas have sparked the worst border crisis in American history.
    Looking back over nearly 4 years, Americans have witnessed a national
    security, public safety, and humanitarian disaster at our borders.
    Every day, we continue to feel its devastating consequences.
        The flood of inadmissible aliens across our sovereign borders has
    been unprecedented. Since Biden and Harris' first full month in office,
    Customs and Border Protection has recorded more than 10.3 million
    encounters of inadmissible aliens nationwide, compared to 3.1 million
    between fiscal years 2017-2020. In addition, there have been more than
    2 million known gotaways on their watch--illegal aliens who are at
    large in our communities, whose intentions and backgrounds are
    completely unknown.
        Encounters at our ports of entry have exploded, from roughly 1
    million between fiscal years 2017-2020 to more than 3 million since the
    start of fiscal year 2021.
        That's largely because the Biden-Harris administration has devised
    a host of unlawful, mass-parole programs that encourage otherwise-
    inadmissible aliens to cross at our land, sea, and airports instead of
    between them.
        This solves the terrible optics problem of overcrowded Border
    Patrol facilities and overwhelmed agents, but the end result is the
    same--tens of thousands of inadmissible aliens released into the
    interior every month. It's just a shell game--a sleight of hand to skew
    the numbers.
        It's like when a parent tells their children to clean their room,
    only to find the mess simply moved from the floor to the closet. Things
    might look cleaner, but the underlying problem has not been addressed.
    So it is with the Biden-Harris administration's border policies.
        Other numbers further highlight the crisis. Tragically, roughly
    200,000 Americans have died from fentanyl that has been smuggled across
    the Southwest Border by criminal cartels. Border Patrol arrests of
    illegal aliens with criminal backgrounds have more than doubled on
    Biden and Harris' watch, from around 22,000 to more than 53,000.
    Apprehensions of Chinese nationals crossing the Southwest Border
    illegally exceed 36,000 just this fiscal year--more than fiscal year
    2017-20 combined. These are major national security and public safety
    concerns.
        This unprecedented surge across our borders was made possible by
    the Biden-Harris administration. In 2019 and 2020, Biden and Harris
    both declared they supported decriminalizing border crossings. Biden
    said that suspected criminal illegal aliens arrested by local law
    enforcement should not be handed over to ICE. Harris called building
    more border wall system ``a stupid use of money.'' Biden encouraged
    illegal aliens to ``surge'' to our border to flood our asylum system
    with illegitimate claims.
        Their open-borders and anti-enforcement rhetoric soon became
    reality.
        Upon assuming office, Biden and Harris worked immediately to end
    effective border-security policies and to dismantle decades of
    bipartisan immigration enforcement.
        For example, Biden and Harris have gutted detention. For example,
    in fiscal year 2013, the Obama administration detained 91 percent of
    all illegal aliens--82 percent of them from the time they were
    encountered until their case was resolved. In Biden and Harris' first
    year in office, that 82 percent dropped to just 10 percent.
        Removals have also plummeted, from more than 267,000 in fiscal year
    2019 to around half that number last year, and as low as 59,000 in
    fiscal year 2021. Even worse, removals of criminal aliens plummeted
    from around 173,000 in fiscal year 2019 to just around 70,000 last
    fiscal year. And just yesterday, prominent border correspondent Ali
    Bradley reported exclusive ICE figures showing that since the Biden-
    Harris administration ended Title 42 in May 2023, the administration
    has only removed around 23 percent of all inadmissible aliens
    encountered.
        Despite the limitations put on them by their leaders, the men and
    women of CBP and ICE have continued to perform their jobs above and
    beyond the call of duty, and I commend them for their unwavering
    service to the Nation. Yet they know it is not supposed to be this way.
        Today, you will no doubt hear more blame-shifting and excuses by my
    colleagues across the aisle. But all of it is meant to mislead. You'll
    probably hear about the recent drop in illegal border crossings between
    ports of entry along our Southwest Border.
        However, this does not account for the thousands of inadmissible
    aliens coming in daily through ports of entry, nor does it undo the
    damage done by the millions that have come in over the past 3\1/2\
    years.
        The evidence also suggests no connection between Biden's recent,
    loophole-ridden Executive Order and these new numbers, but rather,
    stepped-up interior enforcement by Mexico. As we saw recently, that
    enforcement is waning, with the Mexican government now busing CBP One
    appointment holders from southern Mexico to our own Southwest Border.
        Coming almost 4 years into this self-inflicted crisis, the
    administration's action is much too little, and FAR too late. For
    numerous families across this country, like those of Rachel Morin,
    Laken Riley, and Jocelyn Nungaray, the damage will never be undone.
        You certainly won't hear how the Senate's border bill, which just a
    single Republican helped write, would have made the crisis worse.
        It would have only allowed tough restrictions once encounters
    passed several thousand per day, mandated mass releases through
    ``noncustodial detention,'' improperly expanded the use of parole, and
    more. It was a terrible bill, one that was roundly criticized by the
    former heads of CBP, the Border Patrol, and ICE.
        Today's hearing is about getting the unvarnished truth from
    Americans who have been forced to live out the Biden-Harris open-
    borders nightmare in their own lives.
        This administration has completely undermined border security,
    through a host of policies and decisions that have overwhelmed and
    sidelined the Border Patrol. Biden and Harris have gutted ICE's ability
    to conduct immigration enforcement in the interior, making it harder to
    detain and remove illegal aliens, including criminals. And innocent
    Americans are suffering as a result. The story you will hear from Patty
    Morin today is sadly just one of tens of thousands of stories of pain,
    suffering, and preventable tragedy.
        What you will hear from Jim Desmond is the account of a major
    American city that has been overwhelmed and overrun.
        It does not have to be like this. Later today, my committee will
    release a comprehensive report documenting in even more painful,
    objective detail how Biden, Harris, and their administration have
    thrown open our borders, and the chaos that has resulted. I encourage
    all Americans to read it at homeland.house.gov.
        As we continue to witness Biden and Harris' resistance to doing
    anything meaningful about this disaster, we have to ask--why? Why did
    they let this crisis take place and why have they let it continue? I
    hope this hearing provides some answers, and inspires President Biden
    and Vice President Harris to do what they so far have refused to--end
    this crisis and secure our borders.

        Chairman Green. I now recognize the Ranking Member, the
    gentleman from Mississippi, Mr. Thompson, for his opening
    statement.
        Mr. Thompson. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I welcome
    our witnesses this morning.
        But before I start, I want to begin by expressing my
    appreciation to the Secret Service for their work protecting
    President Trump over the weekend. There is no place for
    political violence in our country, and I won't--I am thankful
    former President Trump was unharmed.
        Turning to today's topic, I want to start by discussing the
    situation unfolding in Springfield, Ohio. In recent days, the
    Springfield community has received at least 33 bomb threats
    against schools, hospitals, and city facilities because of
    false rumors about Haitian immigrants abducting and eating pets
    in their community. Elementary schools have been evacuated.
    Residents are understandably shaken, and Governor Mike DeWine
    has developed--deployed State troopers to reassure the
    community. The Governor has tried to dispel the false rumors,
    saying, ``There's no evidence at all of anyone eating a dog or
    a Haitian doing any of that. These Haitians that are there are
    legal. They work every day very, very hard''. City officials
    have also repeatedly refuted the lies. Yet former President
    Trump and running mate J.D. Vance have pushed the false rumors,
    with the former President saying, ``They're eating the dogs.
    The people that came in, they're eating the cats''. Apparently,
    aware the rumors are false, J.D. Vance nonetheless tried to
    justify ``creating stories'' on the matter.
        Anti-immigrant rhetoric and racist tropes should have no
    place in our public discourse. They are un-American, and too
    often they have helped fuel real-world violence against
    immigrants and minority communities across the country. We
    recently observed the fifth anniversary of the Walmart attack
    in El Paso, Texas. A self-described white nationalist targeted
    a Hispanic community along the border, shooting and killing 23
    innocent people and injuring 22 more. Tragically, similar
    violent ideology led to deaths of 10 shoppers in a
    predominantly African-American community in Buffalo and 11
    members of the Tree of Life Synagogue in Pittsburgh. We have an
    obligation to be responsible with our rhetoric as we discuss
    border security and immigration.
        Then there is, in fact, a lot to discuss. From the Biden-
    Harris administration's successful efforts to bring down the
    number of unlawful border crossings to the on-going need for
    Congressional action to fix our broken immigration system and
    provide more border security resources. While you probably
    won't hear it from those on the other side, border encounters
    are at their lowest level in years. Since the President's
    proclamation on June 4, encounters along the border and ports
    of entry have decreased by 55 percent, with Border Patrol
    recording the lowest number of border encounters since
    September 2020.
        The Biden-Harris administration has also removed more than
    92,000 individuals to more than 130 countries and conducted
    over 300 international repatriation flights. Total removals and
    returns over the last year exceed the total removals and
    returns for any year since 2010.
        The administration has also decreased the number of people
    released from detention pending their immigration removal
    proceedings by 70 percent. Meanwhile, Customs and Border
    Protection has seized more fentanyl than in the last 5 years
    combined, keeping the dangerous drug from reaching our streets.
        None of these administration actions are a substitute for
    Congressional actions to fix our immigration system and provide
    resources to law enforcement on the border. Only Congress can
    do that, and it is our responsibility to act. Unfortunately, my
    colleagues on the other side have refused to move legitimate
    border security legislation all Congress. At the direction of
    former President Trump, Republicans blocked the Senate
    bipartisan border deal, and they are refusing to move necessary
    border security funding. Republicans don't want border security
    solutions. They want a political issue. Don't believe me. Well,
    they themselves have admitted putting partisanship over
    progress. As one GOP Member of Congress said he is not willing
    to ``do too damn much right now to help a Democrat. Why would
    I?'' That is Washington at its worst.
        Former President Trump has now called for the largest
    deportation program in U.S. history with so-called concepts of
    a plan to deport 11 million undocumented migrants ``following
    the Eisenhower model''. The Eisenhower model, more commonly
    known by a name that includes an ethnic slur, which I won't
    repeat here, was a mass deportation begun in 1954 that rounded
    up more than 1 million immigrants, as well as brown-skinned
    American citizens. The former President even suggested using
    the military to sweep people under his plan, which would cause
    chaos in border communities, destroy millions of American
    families, and leave critical sectors of our economy, like
    agriculture, without the workers they need.
        Instead of partisan fear-mongering and dystopian
    deportation plans, we need real solutions about how we can
    strengthen border security, fix our immigration system, and
    grow our economy while upholding our American values. Sheriff
    Hathaway, an enforcement officer on the border, former DEA
    agent, and a fifth-generation Arizonian, I look forward to your
    insights today. I know you take great pride in your beautiful,
    safe community and have said that the immigrants who live there
    are family-oriented people of faith. I want to hear about what
    Congress can do to support you in your work. I welcome all of
    our witnesses and thank you for being here today.
        Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        [The statement of Ranking Member Thompson follows:]
                 Statement of Ranking Member Bennie G. Thompson
                               September 18, 2024
      a party without shame: republican campaign season stunts ignore the
                 border and lead to threats on our communities
        I want to begin by expressing my appreciation to the Secret Service
    for their work protecting President Trump over the weekend. There is no
    place for political violence in our country, and I am thankful former
    President Trump was unharmed.
        Turning to the topic of today's hearing, I want to start by
    discussing the situation unfolding in Springfield, Ohio. In recent
    days, the Springfield community has received at least 33 bomb threats
    against schools, hospitals, and city facilities because of false rumors
    about Haitian immigrants abducting and eating pets in the community.
    Elementary schools have been evacuated, residents are understandably
    shaken, and Governor Mike DeWine has deployed State troopers to
    reassure the community.
        The Governor has tried to dispel the false rumors, saying ``there
    is no evidence at all of anyone eating a dog or any Haitians doing any
    of that. These Haitians that are there are legal, and they work very,
    very hard.'' City officials have also repeatedly refuted the lies.
        Yet former President Trump and running mate JD Vance have pushed
    the false rumors, with the former President saying, ``they're eating
    the dogs--the people that came in--they're eating the cats.''
    Apparently aware the rumors are false, JD Vance nonetheless tried to
    justify ``create[ing] stories'' on the matter.
        Anti-immigrant rhetoric and racist tropes should have no place in
    our public discourse. They are un-American. And too often, they have
    helped fuel real-world violence against immigrant and minority
    communities across our country.
        We recently observed the fifth anniversary of the Walmart attack in
    El Paso, Texas. A self-described white nationalist targeted a Hispanic
    community along the border, shooting and killing 23 innocent people and
    injuring 22 more. Tragically, similar violent ideology led to the
    deaths of 10 shoppers in a predominantly African American community in
    Buffalo and 11 members of the Tree of Life Synagogue in Pittsburgh. We
    have an obligation to be responsible with our rhetoric as we discuss
    border security and immigration.
        And there is, in fact, a lot to discuss--from the Biden-Harris
    administration's successful efforts to bring down the number of
    unlawful border crossings to the on-going need for Congressional action
    to fix our broken immigration system and provide more border security
    resources.
        While you probably won't hear it from those on the other side,
    border encounters are at their lowest level in years. Since the
    President's proclamation on June 4, encounters border between ports of
    entry have decreased by 55 percent, with Border Patrol recording the
    lowest number of border encounters since September 2020. The Biden-
    Harris administration has also removed more than 92,000 individuals to
    more than 130 countries and conducted over 300 international
    repatriation flights. Total removals and returns over the last year
    exceed the total removals and returns for any year since 2010.
        The administration has also decreased the number of people released
    from detention pending their immigration removal proceedings by 70
    percent. Meanwhile, Customs and Border Protection has seized more
    fentanyl than the last 5 years combined, keeping the dangerous drug
    from reaching our streets.
        None of these administration actions are a substitute for
    Congressional action to fix our immigration system and provide
    resources to law enforcement on the border. Only Congress can do that--
    and it is our responsibility to act.
        Unfortunately, my colleagues on the other side have refused to move
    legitimate border security legislation all Congress. At the direction
    of former President Trump, Republicans blocked the Senate's bipartisan
    border deal, and they are refusing to move necessary border security
    funding.
        Republicans don't want border security solutions--they want a
    political issue. Don't believe me? Well, they themselves have admitted
    putting partisanship over progress. As one GOP Member of Congress said,
    he's not willing to ``do too damn much right now to help a Democrat . .
    . why would I?'' That's Washington at its worst.
        Former President Trump has now called for the largest deportation
    program in U.S. history, with so-called ``concepts of a plan'' to
    deport 11 million undocumented migrants ``following the Eisenhower
    model.''
        The ``Eisenhower model''--more commonly known by a name that
    includes an ethnic slur, which I won't repeat here--was a mass
    deportation begun in 1954 that rounded up more than 1 million
    immigrants as well as brown-skinned American citizens.
        The former President even suggested using the military to sweep
    people up under his plan, which would cause chaos in border
    communities, destroy millions of American families, and leave critical
    sectors of our economy like agriculture without the workers they need.
        Instead of partisan fearmongering and dystopian deportation plans,
    we need real solutions about how we can strengthen border security, fix
    our immigration system, and grow our economy while upholding our
    American values.
        Sheriff Hathaway, as enforcement officer on the border, former DEA
    agent, and a fifth-generation Arizonan, I look forward to your insights
    today. I know you take great pride in your beautiful, safe community
    and have said that the immigrants who live there are family-oriented
    people of faith. I want to hear about what Congress can do to support
    you in your work. I welcome all of our witnesses and thank you for
    being here today.

        Chairman Green. Thank you, Ranking Member. Other Members of
    the committee are reminded that opening statements may be
    submitted for the record.
        I am pleased to have an important panel of witnesses before
    us today, and I ask that our witnesses please rise and raise
    your right hand.
        [Witnesses sworn.]
        Chairman Green. Let the record reflect that the witnesses
    have answered in the affirmative. Thank you. Please be seated.
        I would now like to formally introduce our great panel of
    witnesses. Aaron Heitke served as an agent with the United
    States Border Patrol for over 25 years before retiring in July
    2023. During his time with the Border Patrol, he was stationed
    in Arizona, Minnesota, Maine, Washington, DC, Montana, North
    Dakota, and California. He held multiple positions to include
    patrol agent in charge, associate chief and deputy chief patrol
    agent before finishing his career as chief patrol agent of
    Grand Forks sector and San Diego sector. Mr. Heitke earned a
    bachelor of science degree in criminology from the University
    of Minnesota at Duluth and a juris doctorate degree from the
    University of North Dakota School of Law.
        Ms. Patty Morin was born in New York City and has 6
    children. She was a stay-at-home mom for 25 years and
    homeschooled her children. She returned to the work force after
    the oldest child graduated high school and entered the mortgage
    banking industry for 6 years. She then pivoted and spent 10
    years in retail management until she retired. She is currently
    retired and works part time as an office administrator for a
    church while living in Maryland. She is the mother of Rachel
    Morin, who was tragically murdered August 2023.
        Mr. Jim Desmond is a San Diego county supervisor, a U.S.
    Navy veteran, and a retired 33-year Delta Airlines pilot and
    captain. San Diego County Board of Supervisors oversees a
    region that spans over 4,200 square miles and includes 70 miles
    of Pacific coastline and shares a 60-mile international border
    with Mexico. With a population exceeding 3 million, San Diego
    County is the fifth-most populous populace in the United
    States, presenting diverse challenges and opportunities. As
    supervisor, Jim plays a crucial role in shaping policies
    impacting the county's urban and rural communities. Prior to
    serving as county supervisor, Mr. Desmond served for 12 years
    as the mayor of San Marcos, California, in San Diego County. He
    has served on many local communities and commissions in his
    roles as county supervisor and mayor.
        Sheriff David Hathaway is the sheriff of Santa Cruz County,
    Arizona. After graduating from the University of Arizona, he
    started his law enforcement career as a deputy sheriff with the
    Santa Cruz County Sheriff's Office. He then embarked on a
    Federal law enforcement career and worked in multiple DEA
    offices in the United States and in foreign countries where he
    occupied various supervisory positions. His last assignment
    before retiring was as the head of the DEA office in Nogales.
        I thank all our witnesses for being here today, and I now
    recognize Mr. Heitke for 5 minutes to summarize his opening
    statement.

    STATEMENT OF AARON HEITKE, PRIVATE CITIZEN, FORMER CHIEF PATROL
      AGENT, SAN DIEGO SECTOR, U.S. CUSTOMS AND BORDER PROTECTION

        Mr. Heitke. Mr. Chairman, distinguished Members, thank you
    for this opportunity. The only true consequence we have to slow
    down and discourage people from coming into the United States
    illegally is sending them back to their country of origin.
    Throughout the first 3-plus years of this administration, I saw
    a steady decrease in the countries we could send people back
    to. For the first time in my 25 years and under 5 different
    administrations, whether through neglect or on purpose, I saw a
    large-scale lapse in our ability to return people to their
    country of origin.
        The inability to send people home meant that most people
    being arrested for illegal entry would either have to be
    detained or released. The current administration, however, from
    Day one, made a point of decreasing the amount of detention
    space available nationwide. Immigration and Customs
    Enforcement's funding for detention has steadily been cut, and
    private detention eliminated.
        The fact that so many illegal aliens are being released
    into the United States spread world-wide very quickly. As this
    happened, the numbers the Border Patrol encountered illegally
    crossing the border increased exponentially. The impact to me
    and my agents were significant. Sectors were ordered to take in
    and process all the illegal aliens encountered on the border.
    The Border Patrol saw groups of hundreds and thousands coming
    into the United States and turning themselves in. These numbers
    pulled 80, 90, sometimes 100 percent of the agents on duty away
    from the border. Border Patrol zones across Texas, Arizona, and
    California had no agent presence for weeks and months at a
    time. Those who did not want to be caught could simply walk in.
    We have no idea who and what entered our country over this
    time.
        Throughout 2022 and 2023, I sent agents to Texas and
    Arizona to count gotaways. Those sectors could not even put
    enough agents in the field to see what they've missed.
    Simultaneously, in San Diego, we had an exponential increase in
    significant interest aliens. These are aliens with significant
    ties to terrorism. Prior to this administration, the San Diego
    sector averaged 10 to 15 SIA arrests per year. Once word was
    out, the border was far easier to cross. San Diego went to over
    100 SIAs in 2022, well over that in 2023, and even more than
    that registered this year. These are only the ones we caught.
        At the time, I was told I could not release any information
    on this increase in SIAs or mention any of the arrests. The
    administration was trying to convince the public there was no
    threat at the border.
        Fentanyl is another issue. The San Diego area sees between
    80 and 90 percent of the methamphetamine and fentanyl seizures
    annually for our entire country. With little enforcement at the
    border, these drugs were coming through en masse. During my
    last year in San Diego, the price for a single pill of
    fentanyl, for example, went from $10 to 25 cents. To make
    matters worse, during 2022 and 2023, I had to shut down San
    Diego traffic checkpoints, which are critical for drug
    interdiction, because the resources had been diverted to the
    process-and-release mission.
        The large numbers also had, and still have a negative
    impact on the San Diego community. I had to release illegal
    aliens by the hundreds each day into communities who could not
    support them. To quiet the problem, 2 flights a week were
    provided from San Diego to Texas. These flights simply brought
    aliens that would have been released in San Diego over to
    Texas. Each flight cost approximately $150,000. This was the
    administration's way to try and quiet the border-wide crisis.
        Once these flights were stopped and the releases continued,
    California saw the true economic impact. I received calls from
    the Governor's office, local mayors, and hospital
    administrators asking me if we could keep injured aliens in
    custody so the Federal Government would pay the medical bills.
        Through pressure from the administration, my headquarters
    became more interested in the fiction that was being portrayed
    in the media and not at all concerned with reality. Each time
    we asked for help in dealing with a new issue, it fell on deaf
    ears. At times in San Diego, we had 2,000 or more aliens
    sitting in between the fences asking to turn themselves in. I
    was told to move them out of sight of the media.
        Meanwhile, Border Patrol agents are continually forgotten
    and neglected by the media and this administration. These
    agents deal with death; women and children that have been
    raped, abused, trafficked, bought, and sold; families that have
    spent months in terrible conditions; sickness and despair. If
    you look at the dramatic rise in the number of suicides within
    the Border Patrol, it is directly correlated with the migrant
    surge. The agents have been pushed beyond their limit and this
    has greatly impacted their physical and mental health.
        While current numbers of aliens crossing our border are
    lower in comparison in recent months, there's a reason for
    this. After nearly 4 years, this administration finally started
    to ask Mexico for help in slowing down the traffic through
    their country. This and other actions make a difference, but
    why has it taken so long? All of these tactics were being used
    before this administration took office, but this administration
    stopped or greatly limited them. I'm also concerned this will
    not be maintained.
        The problems we are facing at the border have solutions.
    These solutions can be quite simple and cost far less than the
    mess currently occupying so much time and money. The return to
    a policy of enforcing the law and returning illegal aliens to
    their home countries is required. Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Heitke follows:]
                       Prepared Statement of Aaron Heitke
        Mr. Chairman, distinguished Members, thank you for this
    opportunity.
        The only true consequence we have to slow down and discourage
    people from coming to the United States illegally is sending them back
    to their country of origin.
        Throughout the first 3+ years of this administration, I saw a
    steady decrease in countries we could send people back to. For the
    first time in my 25 years and under 5 different administrations,
    whether through neglect or on purpose, I saw a large-scale lapse in our
    ability to return people to their country of origin.
        The inability to send people home meant that most people being
    arrested for illegal entry would either have to be detained or
    released. The current administration, however, from Day 1, made a point
    of decreasing the amount of detention space available nationwide.
    Immigration and Customs Enforcement's funding for detention space has
    steadily been cut and private detention eliminated.
        The fact that so many illegal aliens were being released into the
    United States spread world-wide very quickly. As this happened the
    numbers the Border Patrol encountered illegally crossing the border
    increased exponentially.
        The impacts to me and my agents were significant. Sectors were
    ordered to take in and process all the illegal aliens encountered on
    the border. The Border Patrol saw groups of hundreds and thousands
    coming into the United States and turning themselves in. These numbers
    pulled 80-90 percent, sometimes 100 percent of the agents on duty away
    from the border. Border Patrol zones across Texas, Arizona, and
    California had no agent presence for weeks and months at a time. Those
    who did not want to be caught could simply walk in. We have no idea who
    and what entered our country over this time. Throughout 2022 and 2023 I
    sent agents to Texas and Arizona to count gotaways. Those sectors could
    not even put enough agents in the field to see what they had missed.
        Simultaneously, in San Diego we had an exponential increase in
    Significant Interest Aliens. These are aliens with significant ties to
    terrorism. Prior to this administration, the San Diego sector averaged
    10-15 SIAs per year. Once word was out that the border was far easier
    to cross, San Diego went to over 100 SIAs in 2022, way over 100 SIAs in
    2023 and more than that this year. These are only the ones we caught.
    At the time, I was told I could not release any information on this
    increase in SIA's or mention any of the arrests. The administration was
    trying to convince the public that there was no threat at the border.
        Fentanyl is another issue. The San Diego area sees between 80-90
    percent of the methamphetamine and fentanyl seizures annually for our
    entire country. With little enforcement at the border these drugs were
    coming through in mass. During my last year in San Diego the price for
    a single fentanyl pill, for example, went from $10 to 25 cents.
        To make matters worse, during 2022 and 2023 I had to shut down the
    San Diego traffic checkpoints, which are critical for drug
    interdiction, because resources had been diverted to the process and
    release mission.
        The large numbers also had and still have a negative impact on the
    San Diego community. I had to release illegal aliens by the hundreds
    each day into communities who couldn't support them. To quiet the
    problem 2 flights a week were provided from San Diego to Texas. These
    flights simply brought aliens that would have been released in San
    Diego over to Texas. Each flight cost approximately $150,000. This was
    the administration's way of trying to quiet the border-wide crisis.
    Once these flights stopped and releases continued, California saw the
    true economic impact. I received calls from the Governor's office,
    local mayors, and hospital administrators asking if we could keep
    injured aliens in our custody so the Federal Government would pay the
    bills. Through pressure from the administration, my headquarters became
    more interested in the fiction being portrayed in the media and not at
    all concerned with reality. Each time we asked for help in dealing with
    a new issue it fell on deaf ears. At times in San Diego, we had 2,000
    or more aliens sitting in between the fences asking to turn themselves
    in. I was told to move them out of sight of the media.
        Meanwhile, Border Patrol agents are continually forgotten and
    neglected by the media and this administration. These agents deal with
    death, women and children that have been raped, abused, trafficked,
    bought and sold, families that have spent months in terrible
    conditions, sickness, and despair. If you look at the dramatic rise in
    the number of suicides within the Border Patrol it is directly
    correlated with the migrant surge. The agents have been pushed beyond
    their limit and this has greatly impacted their physical and mental
    health.
        While current numbers of aliens crossing our border are lower in
    comparison to recent months and years, there is a reason for this.
    After nearly 4 years this administration finally started to ask Mexico
    for help in slowing down traffic through their country. This and other
    actions make a difference but why has it taken so long? All of these
    tactics were being used before this administration took office, but
    this administration stopped or greatly limited them. I am also
    concerned they will not be maintained.
        The problems we are facing at the border have solutions. These
    solutions can be quite simple and cost far less than the mess currently
    occupying so much time and money. The return to a policy of enforcing
    the law and returning illegal aliens to their home countries is
    required.

        Chairman Green. Thank you, Mr. Heitke.
        I now recognize Ms. Morin for 5 minutes to summarize her
    opening statement.

               STATEMENT OF PATTY MORIN, PRIVATE CITIZEN

        Ms. Morin. Thank you, Chairman, Ranking Members, and
    Congressmen. I appreciate this opportunity to tell Rachel's
    story.
        It started August 6, 2023. I was in Kentucky. We had a
    grandbaby that had just passed away from sudden infant death.
    We got the phone call and the phone call went something like
    this. Hello, Mom? There's somebody here that'd like to speak to
    you.
        OK. Hello?
        Hello, Mrs. Morin, this is Detective so-and-so. There's no
    easy way to tell you this. We found your daughter's body.
        I had just learned a few hours earlier that she was
    missing. We didn't know she was missing. She went on a trail in
    our town that's very public, very small, and we've walked it
    for over 25 years. She grew up walking this trail. An illegal
    immigrant that was a gotaway from El Salvador had waited for
    her on the trail. I was told that they grabbed her, dragged her
    through the woods, raped her, strangled her, murdered her. We
    were told that her body was blanketed in bruises. I can tell
    you from looking at her when I went to the funeral home that it
    was probably the most graphic thing that I've ever seen. These
    murders are very horrendous. He then stuffed her into a drain
    pipe. So when the detective called and he said, Mrs. Morin, we
    found your daughter's body, you know that she's dead. It was
    such a complete shock to our whole family.
        It took 10 months for them to find this suspected illegal
    immigrant. They used DNA because this man had attacked a 9-
    year-old and her mother in Los Angeles. If they had done the
    border protocols that were in place, but was set aside, of just
    a simple DNA swab they would have known that he had an INTERPOL
    warrant for murder in his home country. That's why he was
    fleeing to the United States.
        They say that the borders are safe. We live 1,800 miles
    away from the Southern Border. They're not safe. They're not
    safe. If you have a sanctuary city in your State, you're not
    safe.
        I just traveled up to New England, that's where I hail
    from, so I could just go get some rest. I was surprised by the
    amount of immigrants from the Sudan and Congo. Tens of
    thousands that are up there. We have them coming in our
    Northern Border. We're not safe. I just hope and pray that you
    will listen to what we have to say.
        I'm trying to make my statement as short as I can so I
    don't cry. I just--Rachel was--when she was a little girl, she
    was like a little spitfire. Tiny little redhead. As an adult,
    she was this, like, vibrant, vivacious, outgoing person.
    Everybody just loved to know her. She was so compassionate and
    kind. She had a stammering problem, so she understood what it
    was like to be made fun of as a kid, so she was very
    compassionate toward people.
        She was a mom to 5 children. She was a businesswoman. She
    liked to exercise. She's the American mom. She's not the only
    one in our cities that have been murdered. There was another
    murder by an illegal immigrant from El Salvador that happened a
    year before, and that person was--just pleaded guilty to 4
    murders, 2 rapes, and numerous other crimes.
        They are bringing criminals into our country. They are
    allowing them into our smallest towns, and our people are
    dying.
        There is a video that we'd like to play. I'll just finish
    my statement. Apparently, it's not working. So I just want to
    take the time to thank you for allowing me to be here and to
    speak my daughter's story. I had planned other things, but it
    is what it is.
        [The prepared statement of Ms. Morin follows:]
                       Prepared Statement of Patty Morin
        Chairman, Ranking Members, and Members of Congress: Good morning!
        My name is Patricia Morin. Thank you for this opportunity to speak
    on behalf of my family and my daughter Rachel Morin, who was brutally
    raped and murdered at the hands of an illegal immigrant. This is her
    story.
        The American people need to hear, know, and understand the truth of
    the horrendous war zone we call the Southern Border.
        President Joe Biden and Vice President Kamala Harris's open border
    policy is having a devastating impact across our great Nation. I live
    1,800 miles from the Southern Border in a small town in northern
    Maryland. Yet a man who was wanted for murder in El Salvador made his
    way to my community . . . and ambushed my daughter on a quaint walking
    trail in broad daylight.
        I'm here today to make sure that my daughter is remembered as more
    than a victim. I hope that her story will be the wake-up call that this
    country needs to secure its borders and protect American citizens.
        As a child, Rachel was imaginative, kind, and upbeat--qualities she
    brought with her into adulthood. She was a loving daughter and formed
    strong bonds with her siblings. She was funny and exuberant, with an
    infectious laugh.
        Life wasn't always easy for Rachel. She had a speech impediment
    growing up, which led to a lot of bullying. She did not let that
    challenge slow her down or define her worth. It made her even more
    sensitive and loving toward others who felt unloved.
        As a mother, Rachel was playful and silly. She often laughed,
    joked, and played with her kids like she was a kid, too. This is pretty
    remarkable when you consider that Rachel was a mother of 5, which is a
    tremendous responsibility.
        Holidays and celebrations were very important to Rachel. She went
    all out to decorate and create memorable and magical moments for her
    children. Those efforts are especially meaningful now since memories
    are all that her children have left of their mother.
        Rachel created meaningful connections with her kids through every-
    day activities as well. She believed in health and movement. Walks,
    swimming, working out, and bike rides were always part of Rachel's
    routine.
        She grew up walking the quaint ``Ma & Pa'' trail near our house. We
    always thought of the trail as a safe haven to get outside and find
    peace in nature. It never occurred to us that a predator would target
    Rachel while she was jogging on that bright, sunny day in August 2023.
        The circumstances of Rachels's death triggered extreme shock and
    denial for our family.
        We felt heartbroken at the severity and cruelty of the crime.
        We experienced extreme terror and nightmares for months. To this
    day, we still do not feel completely safe in our own homes and
    community.
        We are grieving the loss of Rachel's life and the future that was
    taken from her. That trauma is different for every member of the
    family. I lost my daughter, and I am heartbroken for her children.
    Rachel's siblings are mourning the bright light that Rachel brought to
    our family. The most traumatic impact is on Rachel's 5 children, each
    of whom is struggling to figure out how to cope without their mom.
        Rachel's eldest daughter is pregnant and will soon have a daughter
    of her own. She is navigating that path into womanhood and motherhood
    without her own mother. Her baby's birth is another milestone Rachel
    can't share with us, and that sadness underscores every life event now.
        The circumstances of Rachel's death compounded our grief. It took
    months for investigators to find Rachel's killer. While that process
    played out, our family endured false accusations and assaults on our
    character. Instead lifting us up, some community members froze us out.
    Relatives lost jobs because some community members thought it was bad
    business to mix with a family amid a murder investigation.
        We felt helpless and defeated as the months passed without an
    arrest. Finally, police released a sketch of the suspect, which renewed
    our hope. We made commercials, distributed flyers, and did countless
    interviews to bring attention to the case. The nationwide manhunt
    ultimately led police to an El Salvadoran national. This suspected gang
    member was arrested at a bar in Tulsa, Oklahoma, and extradited to
    Maryland.
        We felt relieved when the suspect was finally caught. But that
    relief quickly turned to horror and outrage when we learned that the
    suspect was an illegal immigrant. This man was wanted for killing a
    woman in his home country when he walked into ours.
        What's worse is that Border Patrol would have known that if they
    had followed the law and swabbed him for DNA the first 3 times he tried
    to get into this country. They just turned him around and allowed him
    to come back again and again until he finally got through the border.
        Border Patrol let a man with an open interpol warrant for murder
    walk right into our country to continue his crime spree. The open
    border policy of Joe Biden and Kamala Harris caused my daughter's
    death. It allowed a dangerous man to flee his home country to avoid
    capture and bring his reign of terror to American citizens. Not only
    did this man brutalize my daughter. He's also accused of attacking a 9-
    year-old girl in California. Who knows what else he did while traveling
    from coast to coast?
        American citizens are not safe because Joe Biden and Kamala Harris
    removed the policies and safeguards that keep criminals out of our
    country. Their failed open border policies have led to two murders by
    illegal immigrants in my small town alone.
        I really want you to hear my words and take to heart what I and
    other families across America are saying. Please hear our cries for
    help! You each have taken an oath . . . an oath to serve our Nation and
    the citizens who make it great. Protect Americans by securing our
    borders.
        We are losing American mothers, daughters, and children to
    criminals. These deaths are 100 percent preventable. Let's use our
    resources to protect Americans and welcome immigrants who choose to
    enter our country legally. This makes much more sense than spending
    taxpayer money to feed, house, and provide medical care to illegal
    immigrants.
        The Biden/Harris administration has turned a deaf ear to the people
    they swore to protect. Please don't do the same. It's common sense to
    screen the people entering our country to ensure that they are here to
    contribute to our society rather debase it and harm our citizens.
        Do this for Rachel. Please.
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Chairman Green. Well, hopefully we get it. Are we close to
    getting it figured out here, team? We will definitely do that.
        Ms. Morin. OK. Thank you very much.
        Chairman Green. Yes, we will get it played here. Hopefully
    they will figure that out.
        Ms. Morin. OK. Thank you very much.
        Chairman Green. Yes. Thank you, Ms. Morin.
        I now recognize Mr. Desmond for 5 minutes to summarize his
    opening statement.

       STATEMENT OF JIM DESMOND, COUNTY SUPERVISOR D5, SAN DIEGO
                           COUNTY, CALIFORNIA

        Mr. Desmond. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman, for the
    opportunity to speak today.
        From September 2023 to June 2024, over 155,000 adults,
    predominantly males between the ages of 18 to 35 who crossed
    our border illegally were bussed and dropped onto the streets
    of San Diego County. That's an average of almost 600 per day, 7
    days a week for 9 months. No community, no county, no country
    can sustain that type of an invasion, an invasion of people
    crossing our borders illegally and being released into our
    communities without proper screening or vetting.
        I saw first-hand large vans and buses driven by Border
    Patrol agents pull into a San Diego County transit station and
    unload hundreds of people at a time, people who had just hours
    ago illegally crossed our borders, stepped off a shuttle, and
    were free to go into our communities ahead of anyone legally
    trying to enter our country. The first question for many people
    that I approached at the transit stations was, where am I? How
    do I get to Virginia, New York, or Denver?
        In Jacumba, California, a small border community about 50
    miles east of San Diego, I came upon an early morning
    encampment of approximately 50 people who illegally crossed the
    border the night before. They were waiting for the Border
    Patrol to pick them up and process them and then potentially be
    dropped in our streets. One man from India traveling with his
    friends said he paid $8,000 to an entity in India for the
    unimpeded passage across our Southern Border.
        That same morning in Jacumba, a Border Patrol agent told us
    that a group was coming across the border within the next half
    an hour. Soon, a black Suburban on the Mexico side of our
    broken fence sped across a dirt road, stopped, and dropped off
    about a dozen people, and then sped away. Men, women, and
    children wearing backpacks and pulling luggage crossed our
    border illegally, merely walking through a hole in the fence,
    approached the Border Patrol agent, and asked for asylum.
        Our Border Patrol has been reduced to processing agents
    standing by, watching people break our laws. One officer told
    me with deep frustration that his orders from the Federal
    Government were clear. Stand down. Do not engage, just process.
        What's more alarming is what teams saw later, was dozens of
    Chinese nationals dragging luggage down dirt roads at night.
    This is not an isolated incident. This is a daily reality in
    San Diego County. Border Patrol has become their Uber driver
    from the border into the city of San Diego, and San Diego
    County has become their nationwide travel agents at the
    taxpayers' expense.
        San Diego County itself, we spent $6 million to set up a
    migrant receiving center to assist those dropped here to move
    them more quickly to other parts of the country. These were
    local dollars that could have been spent on roads,
    infrastructure, and parks. Migrants slept in San Diego Airport.
    They stay in our homeless shelters, and our hospital and health
    care systems are strained.
        But what concerns me even more is our safety as a community
    and a country. Border Patrol agents do not have the time or
    resources or the ability to properly vet millions coming across
    our borders. I have witnessed and have brought samples of torn
    and shredded legal ID cards and passports that Mexico requires,
    and we do not. These remnants and ID cards are left on the
    ground within the first few steps into the United States. With
    no documentation our agents cannot be sure of their countries
    of origin, restricting background checks and jeopardizing our
    safety.
        What really keeps me up at night are the gotaways, the one
    who illegally cross our borders, who don't ask for asylum. They
    bypass our Border Patrol. They come onto our shores smuggling
    children and drugs by jet skis and boats. Boats are literally
    driven onto our beaches, abandoned, and the occupants run into
    our communities unimpeded because we are a sanctuary State. We
    have no idea who they are, where they're going, what their
    intentions are. They come and, poof, disappear, making our
    county and our country unsafe.
        I want to close with a warning for those here today. Most
    of the people crossing the border illegally do not stay in San
    Diego County. We're the doormat. They disperse across the
    country. They are headed to States and cities across the United
    States with potentially very dangerous nationwide implications.
    The Biden-Harris administration created this mess, and they
    refuse to acknowledge it. The administration is not properly
    vetting the millions of people led into our communities, and
    they are making our border counties and our Nation unsafe.
        Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Desmond follows:]
                               September 18, 2024
                       Prepared Statement of Jim Desmond
        On December 24, 2022, San Diego was caught off guard by the news
    that Border Patrol, overwhelmed by the surge of migrants, would begin
    releasing them at transit stops across the county. This unexpected
    decision required an immediate response to prevent our transit hubs and
    homeless shelters from being overwhelmed by the influx of people
    seeking refuge.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        This marked the beginning of a broken immigration system playing
    out in San Diego County. From September 2023 to June 2024, more than
    155,000 adults, predominantly males between the ages of 18 to 35,
    illegally crossed our border and were bused into the streets of San
    Diego County. That averages 17,000 per month--almost 600 per day. No
    community, county, or country can sustain this kind of on-going influx.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        I witnessed, first-hand, large vans and buses, driven by Border
    Patrol agents, pulling up to San Diego transit stops and unloading
    hundreds of migrants at a time. Many of these individuals, with nothing
    more than a small backpack, had no idea where they were or what to do
    next. The first question many asked me when I approached them was,
    ``Where am I?'' This level of disorganization exemplifies the lack of
    competence and control at our border.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        The process essentially goes like this: ``Welcome to America. Here
    are papers that allow you to stay. Show up to your court hearing--
    scheduled for 2030--in whichever city you claim you are headed to. In
    the mean time, we're dropping you at a trolley stop.''
        The situation extends beyond the city limits. In Jacumba, CA, a
    small border community 50 miles east of downtown San Diego, I
    encountered an early morning encampment of around 50 migrants who had
    crossed the border the previous night. They were waiting for Border
    Patrol to pick them up, process them, and then release them onto our
    streets. One man from India told me he paid $8,000, in his home
    country, for passage across our Southern Border.
        That same morning, a Border Patrol agent informed me that another
    group was crossing the border within the next 30 minutes. Soon enough,
    a black SUV sped down a dirt road on the Mexican side, dropped off a
    dozen migrants, and sped away. These men, women, and children, carrying
    backpacks and luggage, walked through the gaping hole in the fence,
    approached Border Patrol, and asked for asylum.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Even more alarming was what my team witnessed later: dozens of
    Chinese nationals, dragging luggage down dirt roads at night. This
    isn't a one-off occurrence; this is a daily reality for San Diego
    County. Border Patrol has essentially become an Uber service for
    migrants, and San Diego County has become their travel agent.
        Our Border Patrol agents have been reduced to mere processing
    agents, standing by as our laws are broken. One officer, speaking with
    deep frustration, shared that their orders from the Federal Government
    were explicit: ``Stand down.''
        San Diego County spent $6 million in local funds to establish a
    migrant receiving center to assist in quickly relocating these
    individuals to other parts of the country. That's $6 million that could
    have been used for roads, infrastructure, and parks.
        Migrants now sleep in the San Diego Airport and occupy homeless
    shelters, while our hospital and health care systems are stretched to
    their limits. Dr. Jay Doucet, division chief of trauma and surgical
    care at UC San Diego Health, described the situation as a public health
    crisis. ``People are being severely injured or dying at the border, and
    this is impacting trauma care availability for San Diegans.''
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        The local financial toll is staggering, but the national security
    threat is even more concerning. Our Border Patrol agents don't have the
    time or resources to properly vet the individuals crossing. Many
    countries don't share criminal databases with the United States,
    leaving us in the dark about who we are admitting.
        This is not just a broken system--it's a threat to our national
    security.
        San Diego now accounts for 85 percent of all ``Special Interest
    Aliens''--individuals with known ties to terrorism. And over the past
    year, we've seen an unprecedented number of 30,000 Chinese nationals
    enter our region.
        California has become a magnet for illegal immigration,
    incentivized by free health care, in-State tuition, and now efforts to
    provide home loans and taxpayer-funded legal services for deportation
    cases. But make no mistake--San Diego County is just the doorstep.
        In fact, local law enforcement cannot cooperate with Federal
    officials in California. California maintains Sanctuary State laws
    that, for example, forbid local law enforcement from communicating and
    cooperating with Federal Immigration agents.
        I have witnessed and brought samples of torn and ripped legal
    documents, that Mexico requires, but the United States does not, left
    on the ground as they cross our borders. With no documentation, our
    agents can't be sure of countries of origin, and certainly can't do
    proper background checks.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        What's worse are the ``got-aways''--those who bypass Border Patrol
    entirely. Whether they come ashore by boat or cross the border by other
    means, they vanish without a trace. On April 13, 2024, in broad
    daylight, a boat carrying a dozen migrants washed ashore in Carlsbad,
    North County San Diego. They ran into affluent beach neighborhoods,
    where black SUVs waited to take them further into the country. These
    individuals chose to evade Border Patrol altogether, leaving us with no
    information about their identities or intentions.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Even though the street releases have stopped, the chaos at the
    border continues. Border Patrol facilities remain over capacity,
    forcing the Federal Government to fly illegal immigrants from San Diego
    to McAllen, Texas.
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        For decades, the focus has been on Arizona and Texas, but San Diego
    has now become the epicenter of illegal immigration, placing an
    unsustainable burden on our local communities and endangering
    neighborhoods. However, this is not just a San Diego problem. Most
    illegal immigrants don't stay in border towns; they disperse across the
    country. This is a national crisis.
        The Biden-Harris administration created this mess, and now they
    refuse to acknowledge it. In the end, it's counties like San Diego, and
    the entire Nation, that are left dealing with the fallout.

    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Chairman Green. Thank you, Mr. Desmond.
        I now recognize Sheriff Hathaway for 5 minutes to summarize
    his opening statement.

       STATEMENT OF DAVID HATHAWAY, SHERIFF, SANTA CRUZ COUNTY,
                                ARIZONA

        Mr. Hathaway. Thank you, Chairman Green and Ranking Member
    Thompson, for inviting me to testify to your committee.
        I am the sheriff of a county in Arizona, a border county.
    My county has the largest ports of entry with Mexico of all the
    border counties in Arizona: a large commercial port of entry, 2
    large pedestrian ports of entry, a passenger vehicle port of
    entry, a railroad port of entry. So we have the largest volume
    of movement of any border county in Arizona. Our community is
    very safe. Crime rates are low. Crime rates are lower than the
    average for the State of Arizona, lower than Tucson, lower than
    Phoenix.
        But I do have concern over the growing police state and
    surveillance state in the United States. The Border Patrol has
    what is called extended border search authority. We call this
    the Constitution-free zone. Any area within 100 miles of the
    international border, Border Patrol does not need to have
    probable cause to search, to detain you, to interrogate you.
    This includes two-thirds of the population of the United
    States, cities like San Francisco, Los Angeles, New York,
    Seattle, Washington, DC, Miami, Houston.
        But, you know, our border community is safe. But there are
    things that Congress can do, and you need to act. If you don't
    act, Presidential administrations will use Executive action to
    solve these problems. In the current and the former
    administration, the Executive branch is incentivized to come up
    with solutions because Congress has not acted. We have talked
    for years about comprehensive, you know, immigration reform.
    There are things that can be done.
        First of all, we need to have a robust guest worker
    program. You know, Title 8 needs to be revamped. Title 8 is the
    umbrella United States Code that covers all aspects of
    immigration, asylum, visas. I have empathy for our Federal
    partners because they don't know what they're allowed to do.
    They don't know, do we still have work visas, student visas,
    you know, tourist visas? All the protocols with everything to
    do with the border are unclear. This is something Congress
    needs to define, make these hard decisions.
        The asylum program is not the answer. Asylum was meant to
    be a little piece of the pie of Title 8, you know, for rare
    circumstances. You know, asylum, it's become the de facto way
    of issuing work permits. But asylum seekers can't even work for
    the first 6 months they're in the country. Canada is smart and
    they've realized, hey, they've imported tens of thousands of
    cleared asylum seekers into Canada to work there because they
    can't work here. They have the same problem we do. They have an
    aging population. They lack younger workers, and they've taken
    advantage of this kind of broken system to get more workers
    into their countries.
        So I want to keep my 5 minutes simple here. Two things, 2
    clear takeaways that I think Congress needs to do so that the
    Executive branch isn't incentivized to take action.
        One is a guest worker program. Make that clear. Articulate
    that. Figure that out. Consider things like the Farm
    Modernization Act that has languished for years. There has been
    pressure from the business community on both sides of the
    aisle, Republican and Democrat, to pass the Farm Modernization
    Act that would allow more H-2A agricultural visas. My family is
    a ranching family. We've been on the border of Arizona for 5
    generations. It was a lot easier for my grandfather to hire
    somebody from Mexico if American workers weren't available. But
    now it's unclear what the protocols are for getting work
    permits.
        Another thing that's needed, and this was in the bipartisan
    border bill that wasn't passed, is immigration judges right at
    the border. This was in the bill. There were some things in
    that bill I did not agree with. But if we're going to be, you
    know, infatuated with the idea, everyone needs a piece of paper
    approved before they can do a voluntary interaction with an
    American, well, get the officials right at the border that can
    make those decisions. The bipartisan border bill actually had
    in it the paralegals, the immigration judges, and the staff, so
    that people can come up to the border, present their piece of
    paper, make their claim, and if the answer is yes, it's yes; if
    the answer is no, it's no.
        This is not a Democrat versus Republican issue. In the
    1980's, 1990's, and 2000's, you had record years, over a
    million. This included Democrat and Republican administrations.
    Then there was a 14-year lull after that that included all 8
    years of Obama, last 2 years of Bush Junior, and all 4 years of
    Trump. So this is a cyclical thing, and I think it's
    disingenuous to try to paint it as a Democrat versus Republican
    thing.
        My time's up. So thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Hathaway follows:]
                      Prepared Statement of David Hathaway
        Both political parties share the blame for the lack of coherent
    policies when the United States interacts with visitors or immigrants
    from foreign countries. The resultant chaos can then be packaged and
    described as a crisis for the benefit of political actors. The blame
    lies with Congress as the branch of Government tasked with making laws.
    This is not an area that should be left to the Executive branch which
    then tries to fabricate solutions through ad hoc Executive action. The
    reality is simple. Border areas are safe and we, the residents of
    border areas, don't want to turn them into a police state or a war
    zone. My wife and I live near the border and we walk every night along
    the border. My county has the largest ports of entry with Mexico of all
    Arizona border counties. It is peaceful and safe. The vast majority of
    people coming to the United States are coming to work. It is
    disingenuous to conflate people coming to work with drug dealers or
    criminals. They come to improve their lives. Statistically, it has been
    shown that migrants are less likely to commit crimes than native-born
    Americans. They are also less likely to go on welfare or to receive
    public assistance than native-born Americans. They often pay in to
    systems like Social Security and never take out benefits. They
    contribute productivity to the economy which reduces price inflation.
    We have an aging population in the United States and we need younger
    workers. It makes me laugh when people talk about ``fighting-age
    males'' coming to the United States as if they are staging an army
    here. Throughout time, men have gone to where the jobs are and have
    sent money back to their families. There are ``help wanted'' signs
    everywhere. There needs to be an easier way for people to come here to
    work.
        Asylum seekers that are granted entry while awaiting a future
    hearing are not allowed to work for 6 months. We need to stop looking
    to the asylum process as a solution for the lack of workers. And many
    countries, such as our neighboring Mexico, are largely ineligible for
    asylum claims since the United States does not recognize political
    persecution as a factor in certain countries, like Mexico. Yet, Mexico
    is a very important trading partner with 80 percent of its external GDP
    involving trade with the United States and its geographically
    accessible work force. It is ridiculous to make a requirement for a
    migrant to express ``credible fear'' before they can come to the United
    States to work. But, that is the system we have created, so migrants
    learn that they must articulate fear in order to come to the United
    States to work. We need to re-establish a robust guest worker program
    as existed in the past. My family has lived for 5 generations on the
    U.S./Mexico border in Arizona coming in the 1800's before Arizona
    became a State. It used to be much easier for my grandfather to hire
    workers from Mexico if needed. Ranchers and farmers have been clamoring
    for years for the passage of The Farm Workforce Modernization Act which
    would allow American employers to hire needed agricultural workers via
    H-2A visas, but that Act has languished despite pressures on Congress
    from the business community.
        If anyone from Washington ever asks me what we need on the border .
    . . First of all, I say we don't need more ``photo ops'' from
    politicians who want to get their ``street cred'' by posing next to the
    wall so they can say, ``been there, done that.'' What we really need is
    something that was in the Border Bill that was killed for obvious
    political reasons. There was a provision in there for immigration
    judges and staff to be placed right on the border where decisions need
    to be made. We need the judges that can make those decisions at the
    border. Then, people wanting to come into the United States can present
    their documents and if the answer is yes, it's yes. If it's no, it's
    no. It is not working to avoid these issues and to kick the can down
    the road forever. Congress needs to make decisions to update Title 8 to
    allow decisions to be made at the border that benefit our country with
    workers and foreign trade that we need.
        This is not a Democrat versus Republican thing. Southwest Border
    numbers were high under both Democrats and Republicans for a 24-year
    period in the 80's, 90's, and 2000's including the administrations of
    Reagan, Bush Sr., Clinton, and Bush Jr. Then, there was a 14-year lull
    in Southwest Border encounters under both Democrats and Republicans
    that included all 8 years of Obama, the Trump years, and the last 2
    years of Bush, Jr. with none of those years approaching a million and
    most of them under half a million.
        And certain policies smack of racism. For example, a wall was never
    suggested for the Canadian/U.S. border. Title 42, a COVID policy, was
    never implemented aggressively at the Northern Border to keep
    foreigners from making claims. And it is odd to me that it has become
    fashionable to talk of walls, tariffs, and isolationism. Reagan was not
    a fan of walls. When the Soviet Union suggested that they were
    embracing freedom in the late 1980's and early 1990's, Reagan told them
    to prove it by tearing down the Berlin Wall. Reagan was also not a fan
    of tariffs. And yet now, we have outbound inspections of Americans by
    U.S. officials at our borders as Americans leave the country. This is
    happening in my town now as standard policy. Americans are now being
    searched and having their money seized as they leave the United States!
    This really smacks of totalitarianism and is reminiscent of East
    Germany. I don't think Ronald Reagan would have ever anticipated that
    we would reach a point in time when we would be in a wall-building
    frenzy and a tariff frenzy and when we would search and interrogate our
    own citizens at internal checkpoints and as they leave the country.
    When I grew up, I was told that we don't do that in America. Well, we
    do now. We might as well tear down the Statue of Liberty and throw it
    into the ocean.

        Chairman Green. Thank you. Members will be recognized by
    order of seniority, with an exception granted due to some
    scheduling issues today, as necessary for their 5 minutes of
    questioning. An additional round of questioning may be called
    after all Members have been recognized. I now recognize myself
    for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Heitke, you served as, the last job, you were the
    sector chief of 1 of our 9 Southwest Border sectors. I think
    you said you worked for 25 years in the Border Patrol under 5
    different administrations. Looking at your statement, you said,
    ``This was the first time under 5 administrations, whether
    through neglect or on purpose, I saw large-scale lapses in our
    ability to return people to their country of origin.'' You then
    went on and talked about detention and how detention bed space
    was intentionally decreased and private detention was
    essentially done away with. You said that that word got out and
    then the masses came essentially. I am paraphrasing you.
        But I want to go back to your comment about whether it was
    neglectful or purposeful, because if you intentionally stop
    returning people, that is not something you just, oh, well, you
    neglect, and you intentionally decrease detention, those things
    that actually decrease the incentive for people to come here,
    that sounds purposeful to me. So would you answer? I mean, do
    you think it is neglect or do you think it is this was
    purposeful, designed to be this way?
        Mr. Heitke. I believe that the actions were purposeful,
    yes, sir. Many people don't understand that we can't simply
    fill a plane full of nationals from a certain country and fly
    them home. It takes agreements with that country. It takes
    diplomacy with the State Department to make those arrangements,
    and they're long-term arrangements. It takes diplomacy over
    months and years.
        Chairman Green. But purposeful.
        Mr. Heitke. But purposeful.
        Chairman Green. Purposeful. OK. So you mentioned, too, that
    there were massive periods of time when the border was just
    left completely open because the agents had to be pulled and
    you were directed to do this. How long were those agents just
    completely off the border and miles of the border wide open?
        Mr. Heitke. There were weeks and even months at a time
    between Texas and parts of Arizona and California.
        Chairman Green. I assume that is--you know, we want to look
    at these 8 ISIS folks that were caught in New York. I guess
    some of them actually crossed at a crossing. They filled up the
    CBP One app, 3 of them, and came into the country and were
    going to blow up an LGBTQ place in Philadelphia. But, I mean,
    those people that crossed during that time, any guarantees that
    they are not out there to do harm to the country?
        Mr. Heitke. No, sir, no guarantees.
        Chairman Green. Yes. You agree with the FBI director then.
        You mentioned twice in your testimony, too, I find it
    fascinating, that because it was overwhelming, San Diego, the
    administration actually created, for the cost of $150,000,
    plane flights to Texas of all these people as a way to keep it
    quiet. Then you mentioned, too, there was one point where you
    had, like, 2,000 aliens, and the administration directed you
    to, like, move them out of sight of the media. Can you kind-of
    clarify that a little bit?
        Mr. Heitke. Yes. So groups were coming in to turn
    themselves over faster than we could keep up. We only had so
    much space. We keep people within our stations. There's no
    other place to put them while they're being processed. They
    were building up, the media was showing them sitting in between
    the fences, and it looked bad and they wanted them moved. I had
    no place to put them. So they simply told me----
        Chairman Green. Why would they want to hide that? Why
    wouldn't they want the world to know what is going on? Why
    would they want to hide that? Why would they want to spend
    $150,000 to fly them to Texas to keep people from seeing the
    mass waves? Why?
        Mr. Heitke. It looks bad. I was--when I asked about the
    flights to Texas, I was very specifically told, there's a
    problem in Texas. There isn't a problem in California.
        Chairman Green. Wow. So purposeful policies wreaking havoc
    on the community, and we will just hide it. Perfect. Thank you.
        Ms. Morin, you have previously said that President Biden
    hasn't really showed any concern for anything the American
    people have voiced on this issue. It is like he is sitting in
    an ivory tower and we are just down here. He is not connected
    with the every-day person. Can you talk more about your
    frustrations with the administration and their handling of the
    border?
        Ms. Morin. Yes. Since my daughter's death, but also since
    we learned that it was an illegal immigrant that they've
    accused of murdering her, the Biden-Harris administration has
    not reached out to our family to offer condolences. I've
    noticed that when speaking about the border policy, they would
    rather look in the other direction. Kind-of like a little kid,
    you know, if I don't see you, you don't see me. I think that
    they are trying to avoid admitting that there is an issue even
    though tens of thousands of people a day, women and children
    are being attacked. Not all of them are in the news because
    some of them are not being murdered, they're just being
    attacked.
        I have people come up to me all the time because I know I'm
    Rachel's mom and they'll say, you know, a guy came up from
    behind me, grabbed me around the neck, and tried to pull me
    down to the ground. But I got away and I went to the police and
    I told the police. When they arrested the person, they found
    out that he had already attacked several other women. So it's
    happening on a daily basis. Not all of it is in the news. So
    this issue is bigger than people think.
        It's not just the Southern Border, because we're almost
    2,000 miles from the Southern Border. It's every State, every
    county, every city. People are living in fear. Just because you
    ignore it and don't acknowledge it doesn't mean that it's not
    true.
        Chairman Green. Thank you. I yield to the Ranking Member
    for his 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Thompson. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
        Sheriff Hathaway, can you expound a little more on how you
    see the use of people coming to this country being integrated
    into the economy of our country and whether or not you have
    seen a positive impact from their coming to this country?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, definitely, I'd be glad to. The people
    coming across are coming across to work. They're not coming as
    an invasion, to import an army, to have a secret army embedded
    in the United States to attack America and attack American
    values. They're coming here to work. They're people of faith.
    You know, a lot of them that I see are from Latin America, very
    family-oriented people.
        They actually reduce price inflation. When you add
    productivity to the economy, you see Help Wanted signs all over
    the United States. If you add productivity to the economy, it
    makes the economy more productive and price inflation is
    reduced.
        So it is definitely a benefit, overall net benefit to our
    country. I hate to say that--you know, I hate to use the R
    word, but it's the 800-pound gorilla in the room, the racism
    word. There's a xenophobic aspect to this. There was never a
    proposal to build a wall on the Northern Border, on the
    Canadian border. There was never any intent to aggressively
    enforce Title 42 on the Canadian border. So, you know, there is
    this kind-of racist component to it that we kind-of all ignore,
    but it's there smoldering in the background.
        Mr. Thompson. So I represent an agricultural district, and
    if it were not for immigrant labor in that district, we would
    have difficult times. The majority of the farmers who utilize
    that labor, law-abiding citizens, but they will tell you that
    we can't gin the cotton, we can't harvest the potatoes, we
    can't plant the seedlings for trees. They are just tough labor.
    My contractors tell me that the labor necessary to do roofing
    and other carpentry kind of skills, it is difficult to get
    regular people. So I think we have to put some kind of
    comprehensive immigration package together.
        In the interim, we have to protect our citizens, and I
    agree with that. The Senate took the leadership to try to
    fashion a bill that I referenced in my opening statement. We
    didn't even get a chance to consider it. That is so
    unfortunate. The legislative process says you agree, disagree,
    and somewhere in the middle is an agreement. We didn't get to
    that point.
        Just for the record, let me say that in the last
    appropriation bill, we had 22,000 Border Patrol agents in
    there. A majority of the Democrats on this committee voted to
    support that. However, my Republican colleagues didn't have. I
    just think that if we want to help, let's give the men and
    women who work the border every day the resources they need. We
    continue to do that. We continue to support it.
        All of us have been adversely impacted by the criminal
    element. I was a county supervisor before I came to Congress. I
    understand the burdens you have, but I also understand that
    Federal, State, and locals working together can overcome it.
    Immigration is primarily a Federal responsibility, and we have
    to do what we need to do to make that happen. Some of us vote
    to put the resources there at every opportunity, but the
    politics override reality, and that is the challenge that a lot
    of us have.
        So I look forward to legislation being put forward to this
    body that we can continue to address the fentanyl challenges
    that come. My sheriffs talked to me about it, but we have to
    put things in place to offset it.
        Mr. Heitke, the challenge for removal is we are a nation of
    laws, as you know. You work in the department. You just can't
    stop people and send them back. You got to give them that. We
    sent back more people during this administration than in recent
    memory, so we are trying. But if there are some things we can
    do, I look forward to working with my Republican colleagues on
    trying to make it happen.
        I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. D'Esposito, out of order by request,
    due to his time constraints, for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. D'Esposito. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. If I may, I think
    the video that Ms. Morin wanted to play is available. I would
    like to yield her 30 seconds of my time.
        [Video shown.]
        Chairman Green. Reset the clock to 5 minutes. That was
    really the committee's fault for not allowing her to play that.
        Mr. D'Esposito, I don't expect you to yield that. That was
    our failure. You are now recognized.
        Mr. D'Esposito. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Chief, I know that was mentioned in your opening statement
    about human tragedies that have been experienced by migrants on
    their journey to the border. I would like to specifically talk
    about those, especially the female migrants, the ones that have
    been taken over by gangs and others trying to get them across
    the Southern Border. You said that, quote, ``It's very common
    that female migrants are raped during the process. Most of them
    believe it's just part of the payment as they go up. It's
    unfortunately very regular within the population.''
        Can you describe to the committee your interactions with
    migrants over the past 3\1/2\ years and share with us some of
    the most shocking things that you have learned or are willing
    to share?
        Mr. Heitke. There's a number of them that I would. One of
    the key ones from San Diego is that when we had a large amount
    of undocumented minors coming into the country, we started to
    see recruiters in Mexico that would go around within the
    Tijuana area because the migrants would stage in Mexico before
    they came into the United States. Recruiters would go around
    within Tijuana and recruit teenage women to come to the United
    States, and then they would leave their families. Oftentimes
    they had traveled to Tijuana with their families, they would
    leave their families behind, come to the United States, claim
    they were unaccompanied minors, and they would be put up in the
    facilities that the charities had set aside for them in San
    Diego.
        Once they had been put up, they're not held in detention.
    It's just a room. They were given a phone number to call, and
    then a recruiter would come down, often from Oakland or Los
    Angeles, and pick them up. These young women were then brought
    up and forced into prostitution, oftentimes in the Oakland and
    Los Angeles area and other places within the country.
        We had active cases going on, but because we did not have
    the resources, because we were inundated with so many people,
    we couldn't follow up. This was actively going on within our
    area during the time frame.
        Mr. D'Esposito. How many years did you spend in the Customs
    and Border Patrol?
        Mr. Heitke. Over 25.
        Mr. D'Esposito. In those 25 years, is this the worst that
    you have seen in the last 3\1/2\ years?
        Mr. Heitke. Yes.
        Mr. D'Esposito. So it is safe to say that the disastrous
    policies that were implemented by both Joe Biden and Kamala
    Harris have led to some of the really most disgusting actions
    against women migrants along our Southern Border?
        Mr. Heitke. It has taken so much time away from the agents
    that they can't deal with those issues.
        Mr. D'Esposito. Obviously, there is a negative impact to
    the agents when they are dealing with situations like this as
    well?
        Mr. Heitke. Yes, dealing with the absolute despair and the
    misery. The vast majority of the people coming are good, normal
    people that have gone through extremely bad situations.
        Mr. D'Esposito. So Ms. Morin mentioned in her opening
    statement that she lives 1,800 miles from the Southern Border,
    and she said that in the country that we live in right now, if
    your city is a sanctuary city, these are her words, not mine,
    but I agree with them, that you are not safe. She said that if
    a city is a sanctuary city, you are not safe. Eighteen hundred
    miles she lives from the border. We have heard the terrible
    story of the murder of her daughter. Every State a border
    State. Every city a border city.
        We just commemorated the 23rd anniversary of the September
    11 attacks. You mentioned, Chief, in your statement, the Border
    Patrol zones across Texas, Arizona, California had no agent
    present for weeks and months at a time. Those who did not want
    to be caught could simply walk in. We have no idea who and what
    entered our country over this time. Throughout 2022 and 2023, I
    sent agents to Texas and Arizona to count gotaways. Those
    sectors could not even put agents in the field to see what they
    missed.
        What information do we have on the millions of known
    gotaways that have entered this country?
        Mr. Heitke. None.
        Mr. D'Esposito. Zero information of millions of people,
    some of which have found to be on the terror watch list. We
    have zero information.
        Mr. Heitke. Correct.
        Mr. D'Esposito. Thank you, Chief. Thank you all for being
    here.
        Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentleman yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Correa, the gentleman from California,
    for his 5 minutes of questions.
        Mr. Correa. I want to thank our witnesses for being here
    today. Mr. Chairman, I want to take a moment to also thank our
    Secret Service for protecting former President Trump. I serve
    on the select committee investigating the assassination
    attempt. I can tell you right now that I want to make sure that
    all candidates running for Presidency are well-protected.
        According to the FBI and DHS, the biggest issue right now
    is domestic terrorism in this country. I have a chart here that
    shows all of the domestic terrorism attacks in this country
    today.
        For the record, Mr. Chairman, I also have a couple of
    articles. One, just think today from the New York Times saying,
    ``Second Apparent Assassination Attempt on Trump Prompts Alarm
    Abroad.'' People around the world are concerned that our
    American democracy is at a breaking point. Another one here
    from Politico this morning, ``Russian Election Interference
    Targeting Harris Campaign.''
        Chairman Green. So ordered.
        [The information follows:]
       [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                                    ------

                    Article Submitted by Hon. J. Luis Correa
       russian election interference efforts targeting harris campaign,
                                microsoft finds
    Story by Maggie Miller, Politico
        Russian government-linked efforts to interfere in the upcoming U.S.
    Presidential election have increasingly shifted to target the
    Presidential campaign of Vice President Kamala Harris, Microsoft
    reported in findings published Tuesday.
        The new effort, which involves spreading fake videos discrediting
    Harris and her campaign, is the latest foreign interference linked to
    Russia in recent weeks, and shows a speedy pivot by foreign adversaries
    to targeting the Harris campaign after she replaced President Joe Biden
    on the ticket.
        Microsoft found evidence that two ``Kremlin-aligned'' groups have
    in recent weeks spread videos including those showing Harris supporters
    attacking supporters of former President Donald Trump, and another
    video that used an actor to pose as Harris in a fictitious hit-and-run
    incident. Each of these videos received millions of views, according to
    Microsoft, and one of the videos was put out through a fake San
    Francisco news outlet, in an attempt to give the video more
    credibility.
        The groups also posted videos to social media platforms X and
    Telegram showing a fake New York City billboard with false Harris
    policies. Microsoft found that this video received more than 100,000
    views on X in the first hours after being posted.
        The findings from Microsoft were announced 2 weeks after the
    Justice Department removed more than 30 websites linked to Russian
    election influence efforts. Microsoft experts said Tuesday that they've
    already seen efforts by this influence operation to create new sites,
    and move content there.
        ``The shift to focusing on the Harris-Walz campaign reflects a
    strategic move by Russian actors aimed at exploiting any perceived
    vulnerabilities in the new candidates,'' wrote Clint Watts, general
    manager of Microsoft's Threat Analysis Center, in a blog post on the
    findings.
        Russia is not alone in its activity. Microsoft also saw efforts by
    a China-linked group, known as Storm-1852, spreading content on social
    media critical of both Harris and Biden. However, Microsoft found that
    many of the individuals posting for the group went silent after this
    content was spotted. Chinese influence groups were identified earlier
    this month spreading content exploiting divisiveissues in U.S. society.
        Microsoft warned that this type of activity is likely to continue
    ahead of November, particularly from Russia, with the company
    predicting that Moscow will use hacking groups to boost its messages
    online, which may include propaganda created by artificial
    intelligence.
        This is the latest threat report released by Microsoft in regards
    to the upcoming U.S. elections. The company last month blamed Iran for
    targeting a U.S. Presidential campaign, which POLITICO reported was
    Trump's campaign.

        Mr. Correa. Again, we thank the Secret Service, and I think
    our priorities has to be protecting our democracy here in this
    country.
        Ms. Morin, thank you for being here. I heard your testimony
    in Judiciary Committee and I mentioned to you then, as I will
    repeat now, that in my district we had a young man, an American
    citizen, that we caught. His MO was raping undocumented women
    in the local apartment complex. He raped probably 20 women that
    reported being raped before he was caught.
        You know, I am about to say something I have never said in
    public, but my spouse, my wife used to be a marathoner. A good
    5, 6 years ago, she went out for a jog at local riverbed and
    was attacked by an SOB. I got a phone call about 9:15 in the
    morning by local police saying she had been attacked. I don't
    know how she did it, but she broke loose from his strangle on
    her, on her neck, before she passed out, just enough to scream
    for help.
        Your story is one that should not be forgotten and should
    be remembered by all of us. Because when these heinous crimes
    against women, rape, murder, are perpetrated, I don't care
    which side of the party you are on, I don't care which side of
    the immigration issue you are on. We have to stop this. With or
    without documents, these individuals deserve a special place in
    hell. So thank you for being here, for sharing your story.
        Ms. Morin. Are you asking for a response?
        Mr. Correa. No. But you can if you wish. I open it up to
    you.
        Ms. Morin. Thank you. I just wanted to say at the last
    hearing, when I shared about my past, it was because I wanted
    people to understand that I know what it's like to be a victim
    of violent crime that survived. So I understand, probably more
    than anybody in this room, some of the things that my daughter
    endured.
        I also said in that statement that my grandparents
    immigrated here from Europe. My husband, his parents immigrated
    here from Europe. I don't believe that the American people are
    against immigration. We are against illegal immigration. People
    should stay in their own countries, go through the process, and
    then be allowed into this country the way that my grandparents
    and my husband's grandparents.
        Mr. Correa. I am going to put all my notes aside that I
    wanted to talk about today. I have less than a minute left. But
    suffice it to say that I am with you. I hope we can figure out
    how to address legal immigration to this country.
        Mr. Desmond, you represent an area in San Diego as a
    county. I was also a county board of supervisor in Orange
    County. We have a lot of people that have been in this country
    20, 30 years and can't find the front door. We need to come up
    with a way of processing people to make sure that the MS-13
    individuals from El Salvador don't get in. When they are
    deported, they go back to jail in El Salvador, not only in the
    United States, but that takes work from both sides of the
    aisle.
        In my opinion, there is basically 3 buckets of individuals
    right now: you have the new asylum refugees; you have people
    that have been here 20, 30 years, Dreamers, people in the
    military; and then you have people that do concern us when it
    comes to terrorism. But under the existing legal framework, we
    are not solving any of those problems.
        Mr. Heitke, I just met with the president of your local
    Border Patrol union just 2 hours ago. You know what he told me?
    He said they don't even have enough resources at the Border
    Patrol to fix their vehicles when they break down. We have a
    lot of challenges and fighting here is not going to solve them.
        Mr. Chairman, my time is up. But thank the Chair. I thank
    all of you being here today. Thank you very much.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Bishop, the gentleman from North
    Carolina, for his 5 minutes questioning.
        Mr. Bishop. Mr. Heitke, you are now able to say what you
    are saying here today because you are no longer on official
    duty, right?
        Mr. Heitke. Correct.
        Mr. Bishop. You couldn't have made these statements when
    you were sector chief, could you?
        Mr. Heitke. If asked a question, I would answer it.
        Mr. Bishop. Right. But you wouldn't be at liberty to say
    whatever you wanted to? You would have to answer questions.
        Mr. Heitke. Right.
        Mr. Bishop. Mr. Hathaway, you are a sheriff, is that
    correct?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, sir, that's correct.
        Mr. Bishop. Do you consider yourself a law enforcer or a
    lawmaker?
        Mr. Hathaway. A law enforcement officer or a lawman? In
    Arizona we're called peace officers. The certification is peace
    officers. I retired, like Mr. Heitke, as the agent in charge of
    a Federal agency. But yes, now I am the elected sheriff.
        Mr. Bishop. Did you say that if Arizonans passed their
    ballot initiative making border crossing a State law violation,
    that you wouldn't enforce it?
        Mr. Hathaway. That is correct. There's a issue ballot
    proposal on the November ballot, Proposition 314.
        Mr. Bishop. Do you consider your role as a law enforcer to
    be to decide which laws you are going to enforce and which ones
    you are not going to?
        Mr. Hathaway. In my county, 95 percent of the people are
    Hispanic. It would be----
        Mr. Bishop. I didn't ask you that.
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. Disingenuous of me to go through
    their documents and see, like----
        Mr. Bishop. I asked you about you, what you regard your
    role to be as a law enforcer. Do you believe you get to pick
    and choose which laws to enforce?
        Mr. Hathaway. A similar law was found unconstitutional in
    Arizona Senate Bill 1070. I know I would get sued----
        Mr. Bishop. Are you a judge?
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. For racial profiling.
        Mr. Bishop. Are you a judge?
        Mr. Hathaway. I know the history of the laws in Arizona and
    there was----
        Mr. Bishop. I see.
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. A similar law thrown out.
        Mr. Bishop. So you do believe you can pick and choose, even
    though you are not a judge?
        Mr. Hathaway. You have discretion. You have discretion on
    what to enforce.
        Mr. Bishop. Let me ask you this. You joined in the debate
    that I have heard the rhetoric from my Democrat colleagues
    quite a lot, and their witnesses here, who frequently assert
    that the problem with the border is that we should have enacted
    the Lankford-Mayorkas bill. Now, you said you liked some parts
    of it. You liked the fact that it would have immigration judges
    and other staff at the border to make asylum decisions. Right?
        Mr. Hathaway. Right.
        Mr. Bishop. But you also said in your testimony just now,
    if you are going to be infatuated with the idea that everybody
    needs a piece of paper, then those things would be good. So you
    don't think we should be infatuated with the idea that people
    need a piece of paper. Is that correct?
        Mr. Hathaway. I think what matters is voluntary
    transactions, no coerced transactions. If you're----
        Mr. Bishop. So, the ultimate of that would be just to let
    everybody who wants to come in come in. Isn't that right? In
    other words, why do you need a--you say we need a guest worker
    program. That is what you think is necessary. Why do we need a
    guest worker program? Why not just let everyone come in who
    wants to come in?
        Mr. Hathaway. Because the asylum program is not working.
        Mr. Bishop. Well, no. OK. So you are saying you don't want
    to be infatuated with a piece of paper at all. You want to just
    let them come in. Isn't that right?
        Mr. Hathaway. If we're going to have people doing
    processing, they should address the need before it gets worse.
        Mr. Bishop. Well, you are saying ``if''. You don't think we
    should have anybody doing processing?
        Mr. Hathaway. No. If we're going to have people doing
    processing, they should issue work permits. That's what people
    are coming in here for, is to work.
        Mr. Bishop. Ms. Morin, I am just wondering, as you sit
    there next to--the sheriff said that his community is safe.
    Well, let me ask you one more question, Sheriff. You don't
    think we have a border crisis?
        Mr. Hathaway. No. I'm investigating 3 homicides now. They
    all involve U.S. citizens are the suspects.
        Mr. Bishop. I see.
        Mr. Hathaway. My city is 95 percent Hispanic. Migrants,
    according to FBI statistics, are less likely to commit crimes
    than native-born Americans. They're less likely to go on
    welfare than native-born Americans.
        Mr. Bishop. Ms. Morin, do you agree with what the sheriff
    just said? He said that migrants are less likely to commit
    crimes than Americans. Do you believe that to be true?
        Ms. Morin. No, sir. I think it depends on where the
    migrants are coming from.
        Mr. Bishop. If a migrant comes from a country where a
    hostile or chaotic regime has recognized that the United States
    has no effective border control whatsoever by intentional act
    of the Presidential administration, and that regime decides to
    release a prison population or criminal population so that they
    will leave and go to the United States, do you think past
    statistics about the criminal disposition of migrants is likely
    to remain static, remain the same? Doesn't it make sense that
    there are going to be more criminals if those populations are
    being released because of the recognition of what the
    administration has done to border security, Ms. Morin?
        Ms. Morin. Yes.
        Mr. Bishop. I think that's common sense. I understand the
    argument is always made that we needed that Lankford-Mayorkas
    border bill. Well, here is President Trump's favorite chart, as
    he said, because as he turned his head, the assassin's bullet
    passed by looking at this. But what you see on the left is what
    President Trump accomplished, and what you see from 2021
    forward is what the current administration accomplished. I
    would suggest that anyone who says that that border bill that
    wasn't passed is cause and effect should learn what the idea of
    cause and effect means, because you can accomplish either one
    of these results with our existing law. The result of
    accomplishing what is on the right as opposed to what is on the
    left is a matter of will and a matter of people who think they
    are not law enforcers but lawmakers.
        I yield.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Ivey for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Ivey. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am not sure where to
    start.
        Wait, leave the chart there, please. I appreciate my
    friend, Mr. Bishop from North Carolina. I appreciate the
    passion and the intellect he brings to these sorts of debates
    and discussions.
        I did want to say this, though. I represent a district in
    Maryland. Ms. Moran, you and I saw each other last week, and I
    will come back to you in a moment. But a lot of my immigrants
    are from El Salvador, and I mean, thousands of them. Our
    population has grown very dramatically in Prince George's
    County with El Salvadoran immigrants. I want to challenge the
    suggestion that there are more criminal elements within the El
    Salvador immigrant community than the people who are already
    here in the United States. That has been the exact opposite of
    my experience in Prince George's County. I was the State's
    attorney there for 8 years. I mean, I prosecuted these cases.
        Ms. Morin, you may recall I talked about a RICO case I did
    jointly with Rod Rosenstein, who was a Republican U.S.
    attorney. In fact, he ended up being Donald Trump's deputy and
    then he was the acting attorney general in the Department of
    Justice. You know, there is an issue there for sure of crime
    that is committed. But I don't think it is fair to say that the
    people who are coming by and large are here to commit crimes.
        I think I recall Chip Roy saying at one of the Judiciary
    Committee hearings that his sense of it was pretty much the
    same. People are coming here to work. They are not coming for
    asylum reasons necessarily, but they are coming here to work
    and be part of the American dream and live that experience.
        So thank you for the chart. I appreciate it. But I did want
    to say this, too, the lower parts of the numbers there, and I
    don't know what the colors mean or that sort of deal, but I was
    State's attorney during the previous stretch, so not during the
    Biden-Harris administration, but during the previous period. We
    had to address criminal prosecutions during those times, too.
    Ms. Morin, you may recall, and this committee knows because I
    read Justice Kavanaugh's opinion over and over when we do these
    hearings, and that is that this system has been broken down for
    the past 5 Presidential administrations, for over 30 years. In
    fact, these issues predate the existence of this committee.
        But I do want to say this, and my colleague from North
    Carolina has left at this point, but he did raise the issue of
    the Lankford bill, and I don't think it was a cure-all by any
    stretch. I think at the last hearing when we discussed this, I
    want to say it was Chairman Jordan that raised H.R. 2. The
    problem with both of those bills is that they are not going
    anywhere. I think we have a recognition, in fact, your
    testimony of everybody on the panel is that there is a problem
    with immigration that we need to address. The problem that I am
    having with this hearing and the last hearing is that we are
    not addressing through legislation any of those concerns.
        Now, Ms. Morin, you may recall last week I said that that
    legislative hearing wasn't a legislative hearing because there
    was no legislation connected to it that was going to move and
    address the problem. I will say the same thing here.
        I want to just make this point that I didn't know last
    week. The Judiciary Committee is going to have a markup
    tomorrow on legislation that we want to move to the floor to
    address current problems. None of those bills are going to deal
    with this particular issue. I think this committee is going to
    have a markup in the near future as well, and I think the same
    is going to be true there. If you don't like the Lankford bill,
    you still have the power to bring it up and amend it and you
    can change it. As we saw with H.R. 2 when that came through,
    and H.R. 2 was the Republican bill and the fact that it is No.
    2 shows that it is one of the highest priorities for the House
    Republicans, they marked it up. They didn't accept any of the
    amendments that we offered here in the committee, even though I
    think, you know, a lot of them would have made the bill
    actually better and helped to address the problem.
        But I do want to end with this. As I said last week, I
    think that there are challenges and issues on both sides'
    positions. I think the way to address the issue is to find a
    compromise in the middle that actually moves legislation
    through. For example, at the table you are sitting at, a number
    of the witnesses said, we need more Border Patrol agents, we
    need more judges, we need more officials to process these
    things. We are not moving those things through.
        Ms. Morin, I want to, again, thank you for being the voice
    that you are being. I would like to actually meet with you and
    discuss some of these issues. I think, as I said last week, you
    have got a moral authority based on what you suffered through.
    I know you would change it in a second to get your daughter
    back. But I would like to see us get something done, and we are
    not doing it with these kind of stage performances like this.
    But you are in a position, unfortunately, where you have the
    voice that can help move things forward. I appreciate the work
    that you have done and will continue to do. I want to thank you
    for being here again today.
        Mr. Chairman, I apologize for running over, but I want to
    thank the panel as well. I thank the committee as well for
    raising this issue and continuing to look at it. But I hope we
    will be able to find a way to address it with legislation that
    is actually going to get passed and do something.
        With that, I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Gimenez, the gentleman from Florida,
    for his 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Gimenez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This, the chart here
    on my left shows the abject--the lies that are coming from the
    Biden-Harris administration as to the cause of the immigration
    issue here in the United States. It is their policy. You can
    see very clearly when policies changed, that is what happened
    to the border. There was no difference in resources, there were
    no any differences in the number of personnel. It was the
    policies, 94 different Executive Orders from the Biden
    administration that caused what is happening at the U.S.
    border.
        I want to turn my attention to you, Sheriff Hathaway. I
    believe, I actually agree with you that most of the people
    coming through the Southern Border are here to work, try to
    make a better life. But I disagree in one sense that you can't
    tell me that along with those hard-working people, there are a
    number of them that are actually hardened criminals, that there
    are a number of them that are actually terrorists. Do you
    disagree with that?
        Mr. Hathaway. No, I do not disagree.
        Mr. Gimenez. OK. So if you allow more criminals into the
    United States, you are going to have more crime in the United
    States. Correct? Because they are criminals. That is what they
    are doing. I mean, we have seen it. I have seen it in my
    community.
        Tren de Aragua. You know who Tren de Aragua is? You know
    who they are? The Tren de Aragua, do you know who they are? You
    don't. Really? You are a sheriff? You don't know what the Tren
    de Aragua is? That is one of the most violent gangs that is
    coming out of Venezuela. It is coming through your town. Those
    folks are here in the United States right now. They are
    terrorizing people or they actually kidnapped a former
    Venezuelan police officer in my town and killed him. So, yes,
    we have a problem coming through the Southern Border.
        Now, I also, you know, I also find it interesting that you
    run to the racist argument. I believe that immigration should
    be legal immigration. I disagree with illegal immigration. Do
    you think I am a racist?
        Mr. Hathaway. No. When we talk about the ballot
    proposition, if I was to enforce----
        Mr. Gimenez. I am sorry, I am asking you about----
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. Ninety-five percent of them----
        Mr. Gimenez. I am asking about me. Do you think I am a
    racist because I believe----
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. Are Hispanic. They----
        Mr. Gimenez [continuing]. In legal immigration and not
    illegal immigration?
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. Speak Spanish. They speak
    Spanish, Hispanic last names, Hispanic characteristics. It has
    been that way for hundreds of years.
        Mr. Gimenez. OK. So do you believe I am a racist? Because I
    believe it should be legal immigration? Do you know who I am?
    Do you know what my name is? Do you know where I come from? I
    come from Cuba. I am an immigrant. I am probably the only
    immigrant in this entire committee. Are you an immigrant, too?
    Congratulations. OK. All right.
        So what if I were to tell you that--oh, I am sorry, you
    are, too. Oh, there you go. OK.
        Chairman Green. Order. Order. Order. Continue.
        Mr. Gimenez. I am sorry. What if I were to tell you that 53
    percent of registered Hispanics believe in mass deportation?
    Are they racist, too?
        Mr. Hathaway. No.
        Mr. Gimenez. OK. So what I find offensive is that anytime
    that we disagree, you turn to the racist card. No, we just
    disagree. We believe in the rule of law. Actually, Hispanics do
    believe in the rule of law. We believe, the majority of us
    believe in legal immigration. We don't believe in illegal
    immigration.
        I am an immigrant myself. I love this country.
        Mr. Hathaway. Nobody proposes a wall on the Canadian
    border. Ninety-two percent of the land borders in the world
    don't have any kind of a structure.
        Mr. Gimenez. Oh, so you are still saying that we are
    racist. You are still--you are doubling down on it, that we are
    racist.
        Mr. Hathaway. Certain policies have a racist----
        Mr. Gimenez. I love it. Go ahead. Go ahead. Tell me I am a
    racist.
        Mr. Hathaway. Certain policies have a racist element to
    them.
        Mr. Gimenez. Tell me I am a racist. Go ahead.
        Mr. Hathaway. Certain suggested policies have a racist----
        Mr. Gimenez. Oh, yes, of course, because we don't agree
    with what you think. That is what disturbs you.
        Mr. Hathaway. No, we don't propose a wall on the Canadian
    border.
        Mr. Gimenez. Well, yes, you don't, but you think----
        Mr. Hathaway. They're a white country.
        Mr. Gimenez. You are still calling me a racist.
        Mr. Hathaway. We're talking about policy----
        Mr. Gimenez. Oh, we are?
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. That is racist.
        Mr. Gimenez. I am Hispanic. You are not.
        Mr. Hathaway. I didn't say anything----
        Mr. Gimenez. You are not.
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. To disparage you.
        Mr. Gimenez. You are not. So I take offense to that. You
    know what? Is my time up? No, not yet, but, you know, I think
    I've had enough. Thank you.
        Chairman Green. The gentleman yields.
        I now recognize another immigrant to this country who
    obtained a Ph.D. and is a great, great American. But legally,
    right?
        Mr. Thanedar. Yes.
        Chairman Green. So, Mr. Thanedar, you are recognized for 5
    minutes.
        Mr. Thanedar. Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Ranking Member.
        Sheriff Hathaway, in your testimony, you talked about your
    family's long history of ranching in Arizona and the importance
    of seasonal farm workers to sustaining America's farms and
    ranches. Yet Trump's Project 2025 calls for limiting seasonal
    workers' visas and the number of legal immigrants eligible for
    work authorization. This is exactly the opposite direction we
    need to go at a time when grocery store bills are a struggle
    for many Americans. We need to support our farmers, ranchers to
    make sure they have the work force they need to get their food
    into stores at a reasonable price.
        What do you want Congress to know about the work force
    shortage that Arizona ranchers and farmers are facing?
        Mr. Hathaway. I have heard directly from the farmers and
    ranchers, and bear in mind, a lot of these are Republicans and
    Democrats, that are frustrated that the Farm Modernization Act
    has not passed. It has sat there for years. It would allow more
    of the visas you are talking about, the H-2A agricultural
    visas. It hurts productivity. It raised costs. If the costs go
    up to the supplier, they go up to the retailer, the prices in
    the grocery stores are higher.
        So, as I said in my opening remarks, it helps price
    inflation to have a guest worker program, to have seasonal
    workers be able to come into the United States and help the
    farms with productivity. You know, obviously, it would be great
    if they could hire Americans, if they could find enough
    Americans to do the seasonal work.
        If that's not the case, you know, there's--you know, we
    have a border with Mexico. Mexico, for the most part, is not
    eligible for the asylum program because it is designated by
    countries. There's nothing considered to be political
    persecution in Mexico, as there is in other countries like
    Venezuela. So they're not designated for the asylum program,
    and yet we share a land border with them. Eighty percent of
    their external GDP involves trade with the United States. It
    would just make sense to focus on a guest worker program to
    help reduce cost in the United States, make the cost of living
    more affordable for all of us.
        Mr. Thanedar. Let me ask you, you know, if we create proper
    legal pathways for immigration, what would that do to the
    issues currently we are facing at border security?
        Mr. Hathaway. Well, I think it would be less pressure on
    the asylum program. There would be parameters set by Congress.
    You would have less tendency for Presidents, the Executive
    branch, to try to dictate policy to the Congress. I think
    Congress should take control of this issue, decide whatever
    they decide. You're the lawmaking body. Don't just leave it to
    the Executive branch to make ad hoc decisions on what should be
    done along the border.
        So I think this is in the hands of Congress. You should
    move with it. The time is right. We've been talking for years
    about comprehensive immigration reform. It's in the news. It's
    the No. 1 issue. When you poll Americans, what do they care
    about the most? The immigration issues. This is something that
    Congress needs to handle. It's you're the boss, you run the
    policy, and you should tell the President what to do in these
    areas.
        Mr. Thanedar. So we, the Congress, has the ability to do
    the comprehensive immigration reform that is badly needed. You
    know, this is something that we need to act on a bipartisan
    way.
        Mr. Hathaway. That's correct.
        Mr. Thanedar. Yes. Thank you. I yield back.
        Mr. Higgins [presiding]. The gentleman yields.
        The young lady representative from Georgia, Ms. Greene, the
    gentlelady recognized for question.
        Ms. Greene. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I really like this
    chart. As a matter of fact, it has become one of my favorite
    charts because not only does it speak to the truth of the
    serious daily and yearly border invasion into our country, this
    chart also saved President Trump's life when he was almost
    assassinated in a rally in Butler, Pennsylvania, when a would-
    be assassin fired at President Trump. Bullets flying into the
    crowd, killing Corey Comperatore, but also grazing President
    Trump's ear as he turned his head to look at this chart and
    inform the American people about the invasion our country has
    been under. But the American people suffering it every single
    day.
        Sheriff Hathaway, I thoroughly read and listened to your
    statement, and you have such an important job as a sheriff in a
    county that borders the United States and Mexico. I read where
    you said, ``My wife and I live near the border and we walk
    every night along the border. My county has the largest ports
    of entry with Mexico of all of Arizona border counties. It is
    peaceful and safe.''
        Ms. Morin, do you feel safe and peaceful?
        Ms. Morin. No. I actually have nightmares even still.
        Ms. Greene. I am sorry, and I am so sorry for your loss.
        Ms. Morin. Thank you.
        Ms. Greene. We mourn with you. I was appalled when I read
    that, especially given the fact with your port of entry that is
    in your county, by the way, Sheriff, let's talk about what that
    CBP One app has done. It was introduced in January 2023, and
    approximately 813 illegal aliens have been paroled into
    American communities in all 50 States, with 96 percent of the
    aliens, they are released in, 96 percent of the ones that come
    to ports of entry, by making a handy-dandy appointment on an
    app that the Biden administration has provided to anyone all
    over the world, by the way.
        We can carry on and talk about the other outrageous thing
    that helps maybe you feel peaceful at night as you and your
    wife walk along. People aren't coming across maybe on your
    land, because they are able to go to ports of entry.
        Another way they are able to get into our country is by
    flying in from other countries: 530,000 inadmissible aliens
    have flown directly into U.S. airports. Maybe that is why you
    don't see a giant flow across your land, Sheriff.
        You also said, ``It makes me laugh when people talk about
    fighting-age males coming into the United States.'' It is
    appalling that you said that, because I would have you know
    there have been at least 73,000 special interest aliens
    arrested at our border. Seventy-three thousand special interest
    aliens are from nations that promote terrorist activity,
    harbors terrorists, and pose a security threat to the United
    States. Terrorists. That is fighting-age males. Terrorists.
    Those are armies. Terrorists. Those are the same people that
    want Israel wiped off the map and would like to destroy
    America. Seventy-three thousand. Yes, Americans have a right to
    fear that. Don't laugh about that. That is extremely serious.
        Jobs. Let's talk about jobs. You were saying jobs. They
    want to come in, and they are pursuing jobs. Oh, the cartels
    are getting jobs, all right. Cartels and coyotes are currently
    making around 13 billion a year in human trafficking. Our wide-
    open border is definitely providing jobs, 26 times more than
    that of the previous administration under President Trump. The
    Mexican cartels employ an estimated 175,000 members and have
    associates, facilitators, and brokers in all 50 States in our
    country. Yes, we are having jobs provided for these people.
        You said certain policies smack of racism, for example,
    walls. I would have you know, Sheriff, there are 77 major
    border walls around the world; 45 countries are planning and
    building more. Walls are not racist. Walls keep people safe,
    and this country is not safe. People are being murdered every
    day. The woman you are sitting next to's daughter was raped and
    brutally murdered. That is not funny. Walls are not racist.
        Just within the past 2 weeks, there was an illegal alien
    driving his car over 100 miles per hour in my home town, struck
    another car, critically injuring a baby, killing the baby's
    mother and the passenger in the car. That happens almost every
    day in our country because of illegal aliens coming in. It is
    not funny. It is not racist. The American people have every
    right to be fed up, just like they are fed up and disgusted
    that our country is not keeping them safe. Guess what? They
    freaking pay for it. Their tax dollars pay for it.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield.
        Chairman Green. The gentlelady yields.
        Mr. Goldman, the gentleman from New York, is recognized for
    questioning for 5 minutes.
        Mr. Goldman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have got a lot to
    get through because we have got about 4 years to walk through.
        That chart, of course, mischaracterizes when Mr. Trump
    took--left office, but there is no question that the problems
    at our border have significantly increased over the last
    several years. We can debate the cause of that and we have
    debated the cause of that. There is unquestionably a lot more
    climate migration. There is unquestionably a lot more
    authoritarianism in Central and South America that is leading
    to political persecution and to people wanting to flee. But
    there is a problem.
        What happened is the administration began to address that
    problem as it was increasing. But Republican attorneys general
    all around the country filed lawsuit after lawsuit after
    lawsuit to stop administrative action. So in response to that,
    the Biden-Harris administration went to Congress to say, let's
    work on bipartisan legislation to try to solve our border
    crisis. Senator Lankford, the second-most conservative
    Republican in the Senate, negotiated for months with an
    Independent and a Democrat and with the administration to come
    to some sort of bipartisan resolution, which they did,
    miraculously, because this has notoriously been a very
    difficult issue.
        Now, that deal was the most conservative border security
    immigration bill that has ever been agreed to by any Democratic
    administration. It had a number of different provisions, but I
    think most importantly would have dramatically streamlined the
    asylum process.
        Let me just say something about the asylum process because
    there is a lot of talk about legal immigration and illegal
    immigration. Asylum is legal immigration. It is not illegal
    immigration. It is part of our laws that you may seek asylum
    under certain circumstances. The problem we have at the border
    and the problem we have with our asylum process is that only 20
    to 25 percent of people who apply for asylum ultimately get
    asylum. But it takes 7 to 10 years for that process to play
    out. This border security bill would have dramatically
    shortened the asylum process such that it would be over in 6
    months. The incentive for someone who knows that they do not
    qualify for asylum to come across the border would be
    eliminated. Many of those 75 to 80 percent of people who are
    not eligible for asylum would not come here and would not be
    granted work permits.
        The other thing it does is it would increase visas because
    we do have a work shortage. We have a job shortage for
    agriculture, for construction, for restaurant workers, hotel
    workers, home care, nurses, doctors, scientists. This is all
    what I hear in my district. We need to increase those quotas.
    That bill would have done it.
        We need, as Mr. Heitke said, to increase personnel at the
    border, to deal with the problems, so that we can address the
    women who are being raped, so we can address the cartels that
    are fueled by American made guns. We need more personnel. We
    need more resources. This bill would have done it.
        But what happened? Donald Trump killed the deal. He is open
    about it. You know why he killed the deal that would have
    dramatically solved our problems at the border? Because he
    cares more about his own election than he does about the
    problems facing the American people. He wanted chaos at the
    border so that he could run on it. When you watch him at the
    debate, he answers every single question, it doesn't matter
    what the topic is, by going back to immigration. That is what
    he wants to do.
        I want to put up, finally, this last quote here from James
    Lankford, who was the author of this bill and was
    understandably very frustrated that it did not pass. ``It is a
    very, very clear that the Republicans do not want to solve the
    problem at the border.''
        So what has happened since Donald Trump killed this bill
    that would have dramatically addressed the solutions at the
    border? President Biden and Vice President Harris have had no
    choice but to implement Executive actions to streamline this
    process, so that people coming in have to come in through ports
    of entry, so that those 73,000 people who are stopped at the
    border, they are not getting in, they are stopped at the
    border, have to go through the points of entry so that we can
    vet them and check them for their criminal history. That has
    reduced border crossings to a level not seen since 2019, more
    than 55 percent. But that is not the solution. The solution is
    legislation, and the Republicans will not meet in the middle.
        I yield back.
        Mr. Higgins. The gentlemen yields.
        My, my, my. So here we are, a hearing reflecting upon 3\1/
    2\ years of incredible injury that has been brought upon our
    country because of Southern Border policies enacted by the
    Biden administration White House. We had this thing under
    control, man. Two-tousand-seventeen, 2018, 2019, we learned a
    lot of lessons. But let me tell you, by the time we were deep
    into 2019, I was here, I was on this committee, before COVID,
    don't talk about COVID. In 2020--we will set that year aside--
    in 2019, we had this thing under control, America, Sheriff. It
    is the policies of the Biden and Harris administration that
    have flipped this thing.
        With no additional laws--let me say I am going to address
    the cartels who are watching. Pay attention. I am talking to
    you now. With no additional laws within 2 weeks of the
    inauguration 2025, on January 20, 2025, if President Trump is
    inaugurated, within 2 weeks, you are shut down. You will bring
    no drugs into our country. You will traffic no human beings
    into our country. You are going to have to revisit your
    business model. Take some of those billions of dollars you have
    sucked out of our country like the lifeblood of our people, and
    go build a few more mansions on the beach, because you will not
    be running human beings and drugs into our country within 2
    weeks of President Trump's inauguration next year.
        If things don't go that way, we will see. If a different
    President is inaugurated. Very likely, you will be able to
    continue your business model. Won't that be tragic for my
    country? But she will still have the issues of me and men like
    me. Because I will be living on your 1-yard line. But if things
    go right, you are done. This will be your last Christmas
    sucking the life out of our country, dumping illegals across
    our border that you control, and flooding our Nation with the
    poisons that are killing our children to the rate of 100,000 a
    year.
        Chief Heitke, man, it is good to see you. You know, I made
    it a point in the years I have been on this committee to get to
    the border, I learned very quickly that I would have my most
    productive CODELs on my own. One afternoon a few years ago, I
    knocked on your gate, just a Congressman with a backpack, and
    you were kind enough to let me in at the San Diego sector and
    you spent several hours with me. That was one of the most
    informative days I had ever had at the border of many.
        So can you, sir, would you share with America, talk about
    the impact of the policies that were enacted beginning in
    January 2021 on the men and women of Border Patrol that were
    under your command in your own words? I will yield sufficient
    time to you, sir, just please talk about the impact of the
    policies that you felt, that your men and women felt, boots on
    the ground, on the border.
        Mr. Heitke. Ultimately, and as I mentioned earlier, with
    the detention and then sending--repatriating people back to
    their nations caused a continual release of illegal aliens into
    our country. As more and more people were released, more and
    more people came. Basically it turns the agents, the Border
    Patrol agents, into transport and care and feeding as all the
    agents have had time to do. They're well aware of what they
    miss: the zones that have been empty, the vast areas across the
    border that don't have a presence because they are sitting in
    detention processing or they are taking care of feeding people
    in processing, that constant awareness of what they're not able
    to do.
        They're not able to complete their national security
    mission. That mission is why they signed on to the job. That
    mission is what they do. They're not allowed to get out into
    the field and do that. That is what is destroying the morale
    across the Border Patrol.
        Mr. Higgins. Chief, thank you for being here today. I thank
    all the panelists. Ms. Morin, God bless you, ma'am. We are
    sorry for your pain. We feel it with you. Sheriff, thank you
    for your service.
        Gentlemen. My time has expired, but my love for my country
    has not.
        I recognize the gentleman from California, our colleague,
    Mr. Garcia, for 5 minutes for questioning.
        Mr. Garcia. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank all of
    our witnesses for being here. Appreciate your time.
        Mr. Chairman, I am wondering if I am able to see your chart
    for a minute? Do you mind if I borrow your chart for a quick
    second, Mr. Chairman? Do you mind if I borrow your chart for
    just a quick second?
        Mr. Higgins. I apologize, I had not heard you, my
    colleague. But of course, yes, sir.
        Mr. Garcia. Thank you. If I can just----
        Mr. Higgins. I only used the chart because Mr. Goldman said
    he didn't like it, so.
        Mr. Garcia. Thank you. So I just want to clarify this
    chart. I know that this chart has also been discussed by a few
    of my colleagues and Ms. Greene and the Chairman and others.
    But I just think this chart is important for us to actually
    look at this and actually be accurate.
        Right now it says that Trump left office at this point in
    the chart. That is actually not when Donald Trump left office.
    Donald Trump actually left office right here on this chart. So,
    you know, we are talking about charts, we should be very
    accurate when Donald Trump actually left office. You can see
    that the actual immigration and what was happening with border
    crossings was already going up by the time Donald Trump left
    office. So I think it is important that when we have charts,
    and I appreciate being allowed to use this one, that we are
    accurate about actually when this actually happened. So facts
    are really important.
        But I want to also add one more thing as we are talking
    about facts and things that are being said that are truthful is
    we are having a conversation about immigration and the border.
    I want to go back to what happened last week during the
    Presidential debate between former President Trump and the Vice
    President. When he was asked about his role, which was brought
    up today, about killing the bipartisan border deal in front of
    the Congress, and instead of actually discussing that, of
    course, he went, the former President, on a--what I consider a
    kind-of strange rant about Haitian immigrants in Springfield,
    Ohio. I want to repeat what actually Donald Trump said. This is
    a quote, ``They're eating the dogs. The people that came in,
    they're eating the cats.'' Continuing, ``They're eating the
    pets of the people that live here. And this is what's happening
    in our country and it's shame.''
        Now, I am a cat owner and an immigrant. I take the safety
    and security of our pets very seriously. But this notion that
    Haitian immigrants are eating pets is not only xenophobic, in
    my opinion, but has caused real harm to the people of
    Springfield, Ohio. Now, the Republican Governor of the State,
    the Republican mayor of Springfield have testified about it,
    and they agree that the story was not true. Even the woman who
    created the original Facebook post which started the rumor has
    disavowed and made up the story. In fact, today it was reported
    that she is actually apologizing for what she said. Now,
    Governor DeWine and the mayor of the city and the city manager
    of the city have all said there is no evidence for the story
    that Donald Trump discussed at the debate about immigrants
    eating cats and pets.
        Now, a better use of our committee's time would be to
    investigate the right-wing extremism in bomb threats which have
    closed middle, element-,--and elementary schools in Springfield
    and targeted local officials. People are scared in this town
    because of these threats and these attacks against immigrants.
        Now, there is a real threat directly linked to the
    extremist rhetoric we are hearing. We know this to be true. We
    know that Donald Trump is not the only Republican that is
    amplifying these claims about Haitian immigrants. J.D. Vance
    claimed, and I quote, this is just a real quote, ``Reports
    showed that people had their pets abducted and eaten''. That is
    from Senator Vance.
        He also claimed that there has been a rise of infectious
    diseases, even though the county health commissioner said, and
    I quote, ``If you look at all reportable communicable diseases
    together for the year ending 2023, you will see that we are at
    the lowest rate since 2016.''
        Now, on CNN this weekend, J.D. Vance said, again, ``If I
    have to create stories that the American media actually pay
    attention to the suffering of the American people, then that's
    what I'm going to do.'' I want to repeat that, ``If I have to
    create stories so that the American media actually pay
    attention, that's what I'm going to do.'' We are creating
    stories about immigrants eating animals, which is quite a
    shame. There are folks on this committee that continue to also
    peddle some of these, in my opinion, mistruths and attacks
    immigrants.
        Now, Donald Trump and his allies, I believe, are trying to
    make the American people think that immigrants are strange or
    harmful or dangerous. I believe this to be truly un-American as
    an immigrant myself.
        I want to also close by just saying something that a CEO in
    Springfield actually said. The CEO said, ``I wish I had 30
    more,'' in speaking about the Haitian immigrants. ``Our Haitian
    associates come to work every day. They stay at their machines.
    They achieve their numbers, and they are here to work.'' That
    is the American story. Immigrants come here to work and to
    contribute. I wish we would stop attacking this important part
    of what our country is.
        With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Mr. Guest [presiding]. The Chair now recognizes my good
    friend and the gentleman from Mississippi, Mike Ezell.
        Mr. Ezell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate your
    leadership in highlighting the Biden-Harris administration's
    failure to secure our border.
        Thank you also to the witnesses who are here today for your
    time and, Ms. Morin, for sharing your story and your daughter's
    tragic attack and murder. My condolences to you and your
    family. Unfortunately, there is a growing list of women and
    children attacked and murdered, and the current administration
    sits idly by. I agree with you that these deaths are 100
    percent able to stop.
        Chief Heitke, we have heard in each testimony today that
    border agents who fearlessly defend and support our country do
    not feel supported or equipped to do their jobs they were hired
    to do. You said in your testimony, our Border Patrol agents
    have been reduced to mere processing agents, standing by as our
    laws are broken. Can you please share some more examples of how
    our law enforcement is undermined by this administration?
        Mr. Heitke. There's, if you want, trafficking, for example,
    within San Diego sector. San Diego itself sits obviously within
    California. California has State Bill 54 which makes it illegal
    for local--State and local law enforcement to have really
    anything to do with us, whether it be immigration or to assist
    us on the border.
        I mentioned an earlier trafficking situation. Trafficking
    within California, coming through California, is a serious,
    significant issue that goes throughout our country. But because
    of State Bill 54, State and locals are not allowed to call us
    when they run into these young ladies, if they're in Oakland or
    Los Angeles, when they're trafficked up off of the border or if
    they're run into as being transported through the State.
        On top of that, when all of the agents within the Border
    Patrol are inundated with processing, they're not--they don't
    have the chance to actually talk to the people that they're
    dealing with for more than seconds at a time. We run into
    rapes, abuses that go throughout the journey when people come
    to the United States. We have the opportunity to talk to them,
    to get them help once they arrive here. The agents don't have
    time to do that.
        They don't have time to do DNA testing, for example. The
    Border Patrol is under a court order to do DNA testing on
    people who are brought into custody. We did not have the time
    or the resources through 2022 or 2023 to complete that at all
    in San Diego. The equipment didn't even arrive.
        Often cases, the money that comes from the soft-sided
    facilities is another--all of this extra funding comes out of
    the Border Patrol budget. So our computer refreshes, our
    cameras, our software systems are becoming older and older. As
    one of the representatives mentioned, money to fix vehicles is
    limited because so much money is going to care and feeding of
    masses of people. This all impacts the agents' ability to do
    their job. It all impacts their ability to complete their
    national security mission.
        On another note, many people don't realize how impactful
    Border Patrol agents are across all of the Federal and State
    and local agencies. We send tax task force officers out through
    DEA task force, Safe Streets Task Force with the FBI. In my
    time in San Diego, I had to pull all the task force agents back
    in order to complete our processing mission. They're not there.
        Spanish speakers, Spanish is required within Border Patrol
    agents. Many agencies across the Southern Border do not have
    Spanish-speaking officers. They rely on us for Spanish
    speakers, especially in task forces, to further their missions,
    whether it be drugs, even stolen vehicle task forces in San
    Diego, things like that. Those are all hampered because we've
    had to pull the agents back.
        Mr. Ezell. What's this doing to morale?
        Mr. Heitke. It destroys morale, the impact of not being
    able to do the mission that they were hired to do. Then they
    sit behind a desk in the office. Border Patrol agents come to
    the mission to be outside. It's outside, it's active, and
    they're actively completing a national security mission when
    now they sit at a desk and type.
        Mr. Ezell. Ms. Morin, how does that make you feel that our
    Border Patrol agents are not being allowed to do their job and
    the morale is low after what you've been through?
        Ms. Morin. It makes me feel very sad, sad that our
    Government, you folks that have taken an oath to protect the
    American people, to protect our right to liberty and freedom,
    and you're not, not pointing fingers, but you're not allowed to
    do that because so much money is tied up doing all these other
    things, that the things that are really necessary, protecting
    the American people, isn't being done. It gives the American
    people a feeling of hopelessness that we don't matter and that
    you folks are just going to continue with your partisan
    politics and not really take to heart the lives of the American
    people that put you in office to begin with.
        Mr. Ezell. Thank you for that. Again, I am very sorry for
    your loss. As a former law enforcement officer myself, my No. 1
    priority was protect my county and my citizens. I think our
    Border Patrol agents should be allowed to do the same thing.
    Thank you.
        With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mrs. Ramirez from the State of Illinois.
        Mrs. Ramirez. The State of Illinois and a daughter of
    immigrants, yes. So thank you, Chairman.
        Over the last few months, my Republican colleagues, you
    could tell when it happened, have transitioned from using
    Secretary Mayorkas as a scapegoat for a global migration crisis
    to now Vice President Harris, who they have wrongfully labeled
    the border czar. They claim that they want today's hearing to
    be about policies. So I want to spend time talking about
    policies, certainly not charts, because we get the dates and
    the charts wrong here.
        At the taxpayers' expense, Republicans want to use mass
    deportation to rip families apart. They want to
    unconstitutionally strip citizenship from U.S. citizens who
    have immigrant parents. They want to expand this border wall
    that has already cost about $45 million per mile. Folks, we
    have been talking about this in the last almost 2 hours here.
    None of this will fix our outdated immigration system that we
    haven't fixed since 1986 when I was 3 years old or increase our
    ability to stop fentanyl trafficking, stem the unlawful flow of
    weapons across our border, and certainly it won't dismantle
    these cartels that we should be dismantling.
        Talking about immigration specifically, we have more than
    30 years of data on enforcement-only proposals and policies
    based on deterrence work, and they simply don't work. Even
    these cruel actions of the former administration didn't
    actually reduce migration or improve order at the border.
    Instead of they have resulted in chaos and people forced to
    wait in unsafe places and women and children going through the
    worst cases and experiences, much like my own mother
    experienced when she crossed the border.
        So folks, we should be talking about creating legal
    pathways. I understand that is Committee on Judiciary and I
    wish that you and I were working on that. That is actually what
    we should be doing together, creating legal pathways. But it
    doesn't seem like that is what we want to do because vilifying
    immigrants seems to be the only priority in this committee and
    certainly with most of my colleagues on the other side.
        So, Sheriff Hathaway, I want to hear from you in the next
    minute or so. What should Congress be focusing on to secure the
    border and support border communities like yours?
        Mr. Hathaway. Well, specifically, there is a dividing line
    between Federal and State law enforcement. You know, the
    Federal agencies in my town, Federal officers outnumber 30 to
    1. There's 30 Federal officers for every 1 local officer. So
    that includes one of the largest Border Patrol stations in the
    United States and the third-largest that are both in my county;
    large contingents of CBP, OFO, those are the guys in the blue
    uniforms on the border that do the inspections at the ports of
    entry. You know, frankly, I don't want to do their job and they
    don't want to do my job.
        I do the same job as the 3,000 other sheriffs in the United
    States. There's about 3,000 counties and 3,000 elected sheriffs
    in the United States. I treat everybody the same. Our focus is
    violent crime and property crime.
        So, you know, as far as it's up to you what you decide on
    the Federal issues that have to do with the border. But to me,
    I don't see a bigger impact of, you know, crime or property
    damage with anything to do related to the border.
        So financially, I don't need more support. I don't need
    more legal support. But I do think you need, Congress needs to
    solve the issues on the border to create legal pathways for
    workers.
        Mrs. Ramirez. So, Sheriff, you think that this Congress
    should be focused on creating legal pathways, yes or no?
        Mr. Hathaway. That's correct.
        Mrs. Ramirez. You think that this Congress should do the
    thing it hasn't done in almost 40 years, which is actually fix
    the immigration system, is that yes?
        Mr. Hathaway. Fix immigration. Look at the Farm
    Modernization Act, and consider getting these agricultural
    visas in place.
        Mrs. Ramirez. Got it. Well, I agree with those two things
    here, and I think that vilifying immigrants is really
    dangerous. It actually reminds me that it reveals to me that we
    have a short memory here. In the 18- and early 1900's,
    Italians, Irish, Germans, and others from parts of Europe, who
    are the ancestors of many of the people in this room, whom you
    carry their last name now with pride, were treated as less than
    human. If our country today were to suddenly face increased
    migration from that region, I would be with you protecting them
    like hell.
        So it is really hard for me to watch the very same
    grandchildren of these people who were harmed, who were
    neglected, who were abandoned and starved, doing the same thing
    to others that were done to their grandparents. Which is why
    every single chance that I am in this committee, I am going to
    remind you of your roots, and I am going to remind you that our
    job is to create a kind of policy so that we create legal
    pathways, so that people that come to this country from Europe
    or from Latin America are able to come here, yes, the legal
    way, without experiencing the things they do at the border.
        With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlelady yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Strong, a gentleman from Alabama, for 5
    minutes.
        Mr. Strong. Thank you, Chairman Green.
        Chairman Green. Two, maybe 2.
        Mr. Strong. We will go quick.
        Chairman Green. Five minutes for his questioning.
        Mr. Strong. We will go quick.
        Mr. Desmond, you recently wrote that millions of local
    taxpayer dollars have been diverted to cover the cost
    associated with the massed immigration of asylum-seeking
    immigrants, money that could have been better spent on our
    residents and vital services. Like you, I have serious concerns
    about the burden communities face as a consequence of this
    administration's border crisis, especially small and rural
    communities.
        News outlets in Alabama have reported that several
    communities have expressed concern over a steady increase in
    Haitian immigrants, especially in rural areas which stretch
    thin resources. I have heard this very sentiment myself. There
    are countless examples of this administration's policies and
    failures that have gotten us to this point. One that has come
    to the forefront, and, of course, it is Cuba, Haiti, Nicaragua,
    and Venezuela, which at the end of July this year had paroled
    over a half a million migrants into the United States. I sent
    my concerns about the CHNV to Secretary Mayorkas over a month
    ago. I wish I had an answer to share here today, but I have yet
    to receive a response from the Secretary.
        Barring that, Mr. Desmond, you, unfortunately, have first-
    hand experience with the border crisis this administration has
    brought on all of us. Can you speak to the cost your community
    has incurred as a result of the surge of migrants and how it
    has impacted the services provided to your residents?
        Mr. Desmond. Well, thank you. The cost is kind-of hard to
    monetize because there's so many different agencies and so many
    different elements to it. But I can tell you specifically the
    San Diego County itself, we spent $6 million to set up a
    migrant receiving center for those being dropped here. We only
    had it open for 4 months because we ran out of money. Yes, that
    money could have been spent on our roads, infrastructure, and
    parks.
        But we also have our hospital systems. Many people come
    across the border, they're injured because of their long
    journey. I'm sure most of you have seen in graphic, you know,
    YouTube videos of people dropping their children or their loved
    ones over the fence. Many people have broken limbs, things like
    that. So we have many paramedic calls that actually go to the
    border.
        We also have fire calls. When people come over in the cold
    of night, they'll burn just about anything they can get their
    hands on to stay warm, which is, you know, I understand, but we
    all have fire calls and potentially fires and structures that
    catch fire along the border. Also, you know, just kind-of the
    fear factor itself of people driving boats up onto our beaches
    and just walking unimpeded into our communities.
        So monetarily, you know, also our San Diego Airport has
    migrants sleeping and staying there. So that hurts--you know,
    we're a tourist town. That hurts our tourism when you see
    migrants sleeping in the airport coming and going.
        So there's many, many factors. I don't have an exact
    number, but I know it's in the several millions of dollars that
    is costing our local taxpayers and that that money should be
    staying in San Diego County, not being spent on migrant and
    immigration issues. That's the purview of the Federal
    Government.
        Mr. Strong. I understand what you are talking about. I
    served 26 years in local government, 40 years as a firefighter
    EMT. I know first-hand what you are talking about, and I
    appreciate you being here.
        I also find it ironic that those responsible for this
    situation that you are in today, Vice President Harris,
    Secretary Mayorkas, are 2 of California's finest. It sends a
    clear message to every American that if they had allowed this
    to happen in their own communities, if they don't care about
    what is happening in their own backyards, why would they care,
    care about what is happening in Alabama? I think the evidence
    is obvious.
        Mr. Desmond, you also mentioned witnessing mass street
    releases, which buses dropped off hundreds and thousands of
    illegal aliens at a time in your communities, many of whom have
    no idea where they are or where they are going. It is not just
    happening in California. What advice would you give to other
    communities, local leaders, county commissioners, mayors, city
    councils, facing this exact situation throughout our country?
        Mr. Desmond. Well, please speak up and stop it from
    happening. I mean, there's not much we can do because we
    actually--when they started the drop-offs back in 2022, it was
    like 3 days before Christmas. We got a heads-up that the Border
    Patrol was there. We're at capacity and we're going to be
    dropping migrants at our transit stations. We had to make sure
    that, you know, our shelters nearby were not going to be
    impacted. We had to make sure local police was there. One of
    the drop-off stations didn't even have a bathroom. So we had to
    make sure all those types of facilities were there and
    available. Local communities, small business--small cities and
    communities don't have the resources to immediately write those
    kinds of checks. So beg and plead and ask, you know, the
    Federal Government to stop this.
        We all want to have an immigration system that works. I
    take offense to the sheriff's racist comments made earlier, but
    we need a system that works. I really think the focus should be
    on vetting the people that come across the border. Most people
    want to be here and they want to work here. I get that. But we
    got to be able to vet and make sure we keep the bad people out.
        Mr. Strong. Thank you. Would it be fair to say that the
    Biden-Harris administration's policies have better served the
    interests of criminal cartels than the American people?
        Mr. Desmond. Yes.
        Mr. Strong. Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Suozzi, the gentleman from New York,
    for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Suozzi. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Ms. Morin, I am so sorry. What you have been through.
    Nobody knows how you feel. Appreciate you being here and coming
    to talk to us like this. Sheriff Hathaway, thank you for your
    service. Mr. Desmond, I can only imagine how frustrated you are
    as a local official. I was a mayor, I was a county executive.
    This is all out of your control and it is being dumped on you
    and it is really frustrating. Mr. Heitke, thank you for your
    service for so many years. I know you have devoted your life to
    your job and your public service. It must be so frustrating to
    you as well to see these things happening beyond your control.
        We talk about the border crisis, but it is really a
    Washington, DC, crisis, because this is not a new phenomenon.
    This has been going on for decades. We can go back and forth
    about the numbers going up and down. You know, a big impact on
    those charts is COVID. When COVID is over, it started going
    back up again. You know, now the numbers are down. Mexico is
    enforcing its border because the President did his Executive
    Order.
        So we got to figure out how to get Democrats and
    Republicans to work together to address the very real concerns
    that every one of you have and that America--what you see in
    this room is what is happening all over America every day.
    People are just like, what the hell are you guys doing? We are
    sick of hearing you just attack each other instead of solving
    the problem.
        So it is not one thing. It is not one or the other. It is
    both sides. We got to secure the border. We have to fix the
    broken asylum system, and we got to treat people like human
    beings. I mean, those--everybody wants that. I don't care
    whether you are the Republican witness, the Democratic witness.
    Everybody wants those 3 things. Secure the border. We need more
    agents. We need more judges. We can build more wall. We can do
    more technology. We can do all the things we have heard the
    back and forth here today. We have got to secure the border.
    That is a very real thing that has to be done.
        No. 2, we got to fix the asylum system. You know, asylum
    used to be like, you know, we were happy when the Soviets
    sought asylum in America. That was like, yes, they are coming
    to us. They are not going to the other guys. Asylum, you know,
    you came from Cuba or from Soviet Union. Like, yes, asylum. Now
    it is being abused by the cartels and by the organized crime
    and the coyotes and teaching people--you know, these people are
    all coming here because they want a better life, but we can't
    just let everybody in. But people are abusing the asylum
    system, and they are gaming the system, saying the right
    keywords so they can get into this bureaucratic mess that takes
    6 or 7 years to resolve. Eighty-five percent of the people get
    denied, ultimately, but people are abusing the system.
        We got to fix the asylum system. We got to change the
    standards with asylum. We got to stop allowing asylum in
    between the ports of entry, which is what the President did in
    his Executive Order. It is what the Lankford bill that we have
    heard about today, the Lankford-Murphy bill would have done,
    but they had these--you had to get 4,500 people and then the
    President's Executive Order is 2,500 people. Got to say no,
    just no, no asylum in between the ports of entry. Just stop it.
    Make you go to a port of entry or make you go to a safe
    mobility office somewhere else in the world.
        No. 3, you got to treat people like human beings. I think,
    I don't know your politics or you know, but most people think
    the Dreamers who have been here 20, 30 years, we came as little
    kids, you know, they should have a pathway, at least to
    legalization. TPS recipients, we invited them here after an
    earthquake or a civil war. Give them a pathway to citizenship
    or don't even give them citizenship. Give them legalization so
    they don't have to worry about being deported tomorrow so they
    can go to work.
        The Farm Worker Modernization Act, it has been negotiated
    bipartisan. Let's make the deal. We got both sides worked it
    out.
        The Afghan Readjustment Act. There is so many things that
    we have worked out to say, yes, let's treat people like human
    beings. Well, we got to put these 3 things together.
        We have to stop. Every problem we face in America, and
    certainly this issue, is complicated. Nothing is simple. But
    you cannot solve complicated problems in an environment of fear
    and anger when everybody is just yelling and screaming at each
    other. You can only solve complicated problems when you get
    people on one side and people on the other side to say, I think
    this; well, I think that. Well, how about we do this? Well, how
    about we do that? You try and find a compromise somewhere in
    the middle. That is what I know all of you want to see happen.
    That is what I think most people up here want to happen.
        I heard Mr. Heitke. Nobody paid attention to what he said
    before. He said most of the people are coming over are good
    people. You know, most of them just want to go to work. So
    let's fix this broken system that we have had for decades. Stop
    the BS and try and find common ground so that people like
    yourselves who are sitting there and saying to yourselves I am
    so sick of these guys going back and forth, can't they just
    work it out? That I know you are all thinking in the back of
    your heads, like everybody in America is thinking, let's work
    it out. Let's work together, let's get it done. I am prepared
    to do it. I know lots of Republicans are. Let's try and get
    that--make that happen.
        Thank you very much. I yield back.
        I am sorry I didn't ask any questions, but I had to just
    say that. Thank you.
        Chairman Green. Thanks. The gentleman yields.
        I now recognize the Vice Chair of the committee, Mr. Guest,
    for his 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Guest. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Sheriff, I want to thank you for being with us today and
    start a couple questions with you. I see in the statement that
    you have prepared, you talk about the fact that you not only
    are an elected official there in Arizona, but live very close
    to the border, that you and your wife will often go out at
    night and walk there along the U.S.-Mexican border.
        I have before me from the CBP website some recent
    statistics about addressing border encounters along the
    Southwest Border and then breaking those border statistics down
    into certain sectors. It shows that overall, over the last 12
    months, that in many sectors we have begun to see a brief
    decrease in the number of border encounters. But the statistics
    put out by CBP show that in the Tucson sector, which
    encompasses a large portion of the Arizona border, we have seen
    a dramatic increase in the last year. The numbers for fiscal
    year 2023 were 322,000; for fiscal year 2024, it is 452,000. So
    a 40 percent increase in that sector as we have seen the
    numbers decrease in the other sector.
        So since that is an area of your State, wanted to see if
    you can shed any light before the committee as to why we have
    seen such a substantial increase. Again, that is one of the
    only 2 sectors that we have seen increased numbers over the
    last year. So do you have any insight as to why there in the
    Tucson sector we've seen a 40-plus percent increase in
    encounters within the last 12 months?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes. As Ms. Taylor Greene alluded to,
    Nogales, which is in the Tucson sector, is the designated
    reporting accumulation area for the CBP One app. So it's the
    only place, the primary place for people who are claiming
    asylum. They're told to go to Nogales. Whether they show up in
    Ciudad Juarez and El Paso or Tijuana, they're told apply via
    the CBP One app and go to Nogales. So a lot of people go there,
    then they can't get their appointment. The appointment system
    is full. They walk across and they self surrender to Border
    Patrol. So to me, that's been the main reason for the steady
    numbers in that sector.
        Mr. Guest. So they are being directed there by the
    administration, is that correct?
        Mr. Hathaway. By the administration. The CBP One app, which
    is a smartphone app for asylum seekers, is not available along
    the border, but in Nogales it is. So they're all directed
    there, whether they start out making contact in Texas or
    Southern California, they're directed to that sector.
        Mr. Guest. The testimony of Chief Heitke, he stated that
    one of the things that he thought that one of the things that
    had driven some of the surge in immigration was the decrease in
    detention beds. I know that you had mentioned in your
    testimony, Sheriff, about the need for additional immigration
    judges, which I support. I support additional immigration
    judges because I know the statistics show that in some parts of
    the country that there's a 4-5-year backlog. Individuals, once
    they come across their country, their first court date at times
    can be as long as 4 or 5 years. There is a substantial need for
    immigration judges. So I don't disagree with that assessment.
        But I also agree with Chief Heitke that detention beds are
    an important part of that solution, that as we have immigrants
    who are coming across the country, particularly many of which
    we are not, in my opinion, properly vetting, and I think that
    we have case after case of immigrants who have not been
    properly vetted, who have been allowed in the country that
    never should have been in. If we had detention beds available
    so that we could properly vet those immigrants and then have a
    process for those claims to rapidly be heard, that some of the
    situations that we see would not have occurred.
        So what are your thoughts on additional detention beds? Is
    that--and I am not saying that is the only solution. I am not
    saying that there is one silver bullet, because I don't believe
    that. I believe that there are a multitude of factors that
    Congress must take into play if we are going to try to solve
    this problem. But do you support additional detention beds for
    the proper vetting and to expedite those individuals who are
    incarcerated and in those detention beds to be quickly brought
    before an immigration judge?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes. If I can speak a little bit on behalf on
    the current sector chief and the Tucson Sector Chief Modlin, he
    has properly stated that, you know, look, my officers aren't
    trained to be detention officers and babysitters, and they've
    had to do this detention function. They've also been moved
    oftentimes on TDYs to the Rio Grande Valley and to different
    areas. So it's not really a function that Border Patrol was
    trained for. I'm sure Chief Heitke could attest to the same
    thing. It really should be handled by another agency.
        Yes, that is a valid concern, but it's not something that
    Border Patrol is trained for. Like Secretary Chief Modlin has
    always told me, I want my officers back on the line, not
    sitting here functioning as detention officers.
        Mr. Guest. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am out of time and
    now yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Brecheen for 5 minutes of questioning.
        Mr. Brecheen. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Ms. Morin, did I pronounce your name correctly? Is it
    Marin?
        Ms. Morin. Morin. It's French.
        Mr. Brecheen. Morin. Thank you very much for being here.
    The fact that your daughter was killed by an illegal alien,
    sexually assaulted, do you think that the media is paying
    attention to these stories to the level that they need to?
        Ms. Morin. I do not. The reason why I say that is because
    there's been 4 or 5 that have really hit the media and it's
    because there are mothers that are speaking out and not
    stopping. But there are a lot of women that are assaulted every
    day. I think because they're assaulted, but maybe perhaps
    because of shame or fear, they're not reporting the assault, or
    it's a local police matter that doesn't necessarily hit
    national news, so it might just be local news, and/or they
    don't have DNA because they're not able to track these
    immigrants that have come into the country. Because they don't
    know their name, they don't know where they're from, they
    don't--they collect DNA from the crime, but then they don't
    know where else to go with it, that they just kind-of, like,
    hang in limbo.
        But there are women that are being attacked every day. I
    get letters from across the country. Just in my own, you know,
    city, we had 2 murders by illegal immigrants from El Salvador.
        I do realize the man that was here earlier that said he was
    from Prince George's County, he was a State prosecutor during
    Trump's time in office. So he may have seen lower numbers, but
    that's not necessarily the state of the country at this moment.
    I think that--I'm trying not to take up your time.
        Mr. Brecheen. No, I appreciate your response. You know, no
    one would want to find themselves in a situation that you have
    experienced and, you know, genuine heartfelt condolences being
    extended to you. We are so sorry. This committee is so sorry.
        Ms. Morin. Can I just say one more thing?
        Mr. Brecheen. Of course you can.
        Ms. Morin. I think that they hear us speak as mothers, and
    they think because we're mothers, you know, that we're
    emotional, yes, and we're more attached. But if you actually
    saw the bodies and the crimes that are actually being committed
    against a human being, it's like an animal dragging a prey into
    the woods and attacking them. If they could see how violent
    these crimes are. I'm not saying that all immigrants are like
    this, but if people are willing to come into the country
    illegally, there's something that they're hiding because an
    upstanding person would come legally.
        Mr. Brecheen. Mr. Heitke, you--San Diego sectors, former
    Border Patrol chief there, several decades of experience. Do
    you think the American family, the average American family who
    hears these stories, has a right to feel less safe? You think
    it is justified the feeling across America, of just regular
    people sending their sons or daughters into a public space, a
    public sphere, where they are not present with that child, that
    this validates a heightened concern for their children's
    safety?
        Mr. Heitke. I do.
        Mr. Brecheen. Is this something that you experienced in
    your decades of experience, this heightened level of concern?
    Was it experienced under the Trump administration at this
    level? Or is there something to be said, direct correlation to
    this current administration's position on the border?
        Mr. Heitke. In my time with the Border Patrol, I have never
    seen entire zones that were left without agent presence. I've
    never seen that before.
        Mr. Brecheen. Mr. Desmond, you are over the San Diego
    sector. What is interesting is in 2023, with 1,200 miles of
    border wall, of a 2,000-mile border wall, Texas has more than
    the majority of the border wall. We know by reports of what
    Texas is doing to secure their border, they went from being 60
    percent of the encounters to last--first half of this year, 40
    percent, even though they have more than half. So that is being
    shifted. We know San Diego is being one of the areas that
    population is going because Texas is having to do what the
    Federal Government should be doing. You all are seeing this.
        Are people--the feel of the average American who feels less
    safe, are they misinformed?
        Mr. Desmond. No, they are not misinformed. Many of them
    see, you know, the effects of it, particularly our beach
    communities. We get 3 or 4 boats every week that just beach
    themselves and people walking into the communities, without law
    enforcement even able to do anything.
        Unfortunately, California is a sanctuary State, and our law
    enforcement, as the chief had mentioned, is prohibited from
    enforcing any immigration law. They're actually prohibited from
    even asking someone what their immigration status is. So even
    though somebody just jumped off a boat and is walking through
    your neighborhood and you know is there illegally, our local
    law enforcement can't do a thing and people are upset about it.
        Mr. Brecheen. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I yield.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize Mr. Crane, the gentleman from Arizona.
        Mr. Crane. Thank you.
        Chairman Green. From a border State, for his 5 minutes.
        Mr. Crane. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        Ms. Morin, thank you so much for coming here. I want to
    thank the panelists for coming as well.
        Ms. Morin, in your opinion, how many more beautiful young
    Americans must be brutalized, raped, and killed by people who
    weren't supposed to be here in the first place before this
    administration does anything about it?
        Ms. Morin. There should be none. They should have--my
    goodness. When, in February 2023, media blasted all over
    national TV stations, all over the United States, pictures of
    hundreds of thousands of immigrants swarming toward our
    Southern Border, Harris--the Biden and Harris administration
    could have stopped it before they even reached the border. They
    could have said, stay in your country or stay in Mexico, and
    then vet them one by one. So they saw them coming and they
    opened the doors and just allowed everyone to come in.
        Mr. Crane. Thank you. Sheriff, why do you believe that
    border walls are racist?
        Mr. Hathaway. Well, Reagan was against border walls. He
    told Mikhail Gorbachev, tear down this wall. The Soviet Union
    said they were emerging into an era of freedom, and he said,
    prove it, tear down the walls. Only 8 percent of the world's
    land borders have any structure at all. Not a wall, not a
    fence, not even a line of rocks. If you go through Europe,
    Asia, Africa, Latin America, even the Canadian border.
        Mr. Crane. That is not what I asked you, Sheriff. I said,
    why do you believe they are racist? You said in your written
    testimony, ``and certain policies smack of racism. For example,
    a wall was never suggestion suggested for the Canadian
    border.''
        Mr. Hathaway. Well, yes, the Canadian border is known as
    a--generally a white population, whereas the Southwestern
    Border is generally a brown population. So it smacks of racism.
    Title 42 was never----
        Mr. Crane. Sheriff?
        Mr. Hathaway [continuing]. Aggressively enforced on the
    Canadian border.
        Mr. Crane. Sheriff, do you think that if the mass majority
    of illegal immigration coming into the United States of America
    was coming from the Northern Border, that Americans would
    demand the same thing?
        Mr. Hathaway. I don't know.
        Mr. Crane. I think you probably do know that, sir, because
    it is not about race with the American people. Matter of fact,
    most American people support legal immigration. It is the
    illegal immigration. It has nothing to do with race.
        Sheriff, do you have a wall at your house?
        Mr. Hathaway. A what?
        Mr. Crane. Do you have a wall at your house, Sheriff?
        Mr. Hathaway. No, I do not.
        Mr. Crane. Do you have a front door on your house?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, I do.
        Mr. Crane. Why not just leave it open, Sheriff?
        Mr. Hathaway. I leave it unlocked, but, you know, I do have
    a door.
        Mr. Crane. Yes, most people have walls and doors on their
    house not because they hate the other people on the outside. It
    is because they love the people on the inside.
        Sheriff, what about prison? What about prisons, Sheriff?
    They have walls around them as well. Are those racist?
        Mr. Hathaway. No, I would say they're not.
        Mr. Crane. Yes, they are not. What about the White House?
    It has a wall around it too, as well, doesn't it? Do you think
    that is racist? Do you think----
        Mr. Hathaway. I didn't say that walls are generically
    racist.
        Mr. Crane. OK. Well, you said, ``and certain policies smack
    of racism.''
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, it does. Proposing a wall on the
    Southern Border and not the Canadian border, that's racist.
        Mr. Crane. Well, I just told you. Where's the majority of
    illegal immigration coming into the United States, sir?
    Northern or Southern Border? Go ahead.
        Mr. Hathaway. Probably the Southern Border.
        Mr. Crane. Yes, you know it is. OK. Thank you. All right.
        Sheriff, did you have to swear an oath to the Constitution
    of the United States to become sheriff?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, I have, multiple times.
        Mr. Crane. Are you familiar with Article IV, Section 4 of
    the Constitution, Sheriff?
        Mr. Hathaway. Can you remind me what it says?
        Mr. Crane. It is often known as the invasion clause. U.S.
    Government guarantees the protection of our States from
    invasion and domestic violence.
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, I've heard that.
        Mr. Crane. OK. So could it be, Sheriff, that part of the
    reason we suggested a border wall because anybody that knows
    security understands that a wall is just one part of a security
    system designed to keep our citizens safe of all races? Could
    that be it, Sheriff, and maybe not racism?
        Mr. Hathaway. No, I don't think there's an invasion.
    There's not a clause been activated in the Constitution that,
    you know, suggests that this is an invasion. It's not an
    invasion.
        Mr. Crane. OK. Yes, well----
        Mr. Hathaway. It's the same thing I've seen my whole life.
        Mr. Crane. Yes, well, I think Ms. Morin and other moms who
    have lost their children, brutally raped, murdered, dragged off
    into the woods, would highly disagree with that comment. If you
    looked at the data in the graph that has been presented here
    today, it is obviously an invasion.
        Mr. Hathaway. It's not a matter of----
        Mr. Crane. So much so--hold on, I am not done yet. So much
    so that Kamala Harris has actually changed her position now on
    border security because she realizes what a complete
    catastrophe it is.
        Mr. Heitke, you have been a Border Patrol chief. Do you
    agree with Sheriff Hathaway here that implementing a wall as
    part of a security system is racist?
        Mr. Heitke. No, I do not.
        Mr. Crane. Have you ever seen a wall that stopped one race
    of people from getting in and allowed other races of people to
    come into the country? Have you ever seen that?
        Mr. Heitke. No.
        Mr. Crane. Didn't think so.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields. I now recognize the
    gentleman from New Jersey, Mr. Menendez, for 5 minutes of
    questioning.
        Mr. Menendez. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you, Ranking
    Member. Thank you to our panelists.
        This is my first term in office and I represent a district
    where over 40 percent of the people that live there were born
    outside the country. So I care deeply about our immigration
    policy. The first trip I took as a Member was to our Southern
    Border because I care that we get it right there as well for
    our border communities and for communities throughout the
    country. I care about both parts of this conversation.
        The other week, we remembered those who were lost in 9/11.
    This was a select committee after 9/11 to make sure that we
    protect the homeland from threats, domestic and foreign. I had
    great hopes this committee would be a place that we could
    engage with our colleagues in a meaningful way to take on these
    challenges. I feel like I have tried in my individual capacity
    to do that work.
        But there is a long history on this committee, this
    Congress, of opportunities to come together where we have not
    been met halfway. We marked up H.R. 2, the Republican priority
    bill on the border, which would have caused the loss of human
    life on American soil because of the handcuffs that they would
    have put on NGO's that operate along the border to help other
    human beings.
        We have talked about the funding request the President has
    made for more CBP officers to ensure that we have the latest
    technology for fentanyl detection. It was ignored.
        I know other colleagues have talked about the Senate border
    deal that was negotiated with Republicans, one of the most
    conservative Republicans in the Senate. Never even got to the
    House.
        We had and we consumed this committee's staff with an
    impeachment of Secretary Mayorkas. I think there were 5
    impeachment reports that they put together to try to make the
    case. They didn't call 1 constitutional expert to come talk
    about high crimes and misdemeanors.
        I mean, so when we as Democrats are frustrated, we share
    the frustration with the American people who look to us and
    want us to get things done. We know we have to work across the
    aisle because we are the Minority party. That is what we came
    here to do. Every step along the way, we have been frustrated,
    even on H.R. 2.
        Blue Lotus, an administrative operation to combat fentanyl,
    I introduced an amendment to give legislative authority for
    future administrations through the same program. Not a
    Republican voted for it. On their own bill, a single amendment
    that dealt with fentanyl, not one Republican voted for it. Show
    me where the good faith effort is. Just show me, because we
    have done the work. You have listened to all of our colleagues
    who are frustrated. People in the Senate who negotiated a deal,
    didn't even get a vote on it.
        So we are frustrated. It is not partisan, it is not
    political games. It is not political theater. It is not what we
    came here to do. I almost didn't even come down to this meeting
    because I am so frustrated. I am so sorry. Especially so sorry
    for your loss and for so many like you who have experienced
    such devastating loss. I am sorry. That is why I signed up for
    this job, to try to fix the things that are broken in this
    country.
        Our immigration system is broken. We feel that no matter
    where we live. We have an obligation to do something about it.
    I want to do something about it.
        I believe we have folks who have worked in CBP. We have
    folks who are sheriffs. Do you look to Congress and us as
    legislators for solutions to some of the challenges that you're
    all facing?
        Mr. Heitke. Yes.
        Mr. Menendez. Sir?
        Mr. Hathaway. Yes, definitely. I consider that to be your
    job.
        Mr. Menendez. It is. If I were a resident where you are a
    sheriff, I would look for you to make sure that our communities
    are safe. This is a two-way street. We listen. We show up to
    these committee hearings and listen to all the things that you
    are facing, that Border Patrol agents are facing, that border
    communities are facing. We listen and I just wish we were doing
    more.
        So just know that I am committed to trying to take on these
    challenges. So many of us really are. You may not see that here
    in this committee. You may not see that today. Rest assured, we
    are going to keep trying, and we are going to try to get to
    better places for all residents, both of our districts and
    throughout the country. So thank you all for being here today.
    Thank you for all that you do to advocate for these issues.
        I yield back.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields.
        I now recognize the Ranking Member, the acting Ranking
    Member, for his closing statement.
        Mr. Correa. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. Again, I
    want to thank the witnesses for being here today.
        Ms. Morin, again, my condolences to you and your family. We
    are doing everything we can to make sure that we go after those
    animals that would do the things that were done to your
    children--to your daughter. One is way too many victims.
        Mr. Chairman, as I look at this committee, I think today is
    the last full committee hearing before the election. I cannot
    but say that I am disappointed with today's hearing because we
    are 50, 60 days away from an election and a lot of the stuff I
    heard today was really focused on the election. Their fault,
    our fault. Statistics. Back home, people want solutions from
    us. I don't hear a lot of solutions today.
        Mr. Heitke, I started talking to you a little bit, just a
    little bit, about the resources. You talked about many places
    along the border that don't have the personnel. As I told you,
    earlier today, I met with the president of one of your local
    organizations on the border. We discussed the fact that in
    about 2 or 3 years, you are going to have a tsunami of border
    agents retiring because most of them were hired after 9/11.
    There is a mandatory retirement age. I have not heard any
    discussion about how to replace them, how to hire them. We
    talked about the fact that this country has a massive debt.
    What are we going to do to increase the funding for our border
    security when we have a national debt? No solutions discussed.
        Mr. Desmond, you are a San Diego County Board of
    Supervisors. I was the Orange County Board. A lot of ag in your
    area, I think. Should we deport all those undocumented workers
    out there? The answer is probably not. But we should give them
    a pathway to citizenship or just a pathway to be able to work
    in this country because they are the ones that produce our
    food. I have not heard of any solutions to fixing the problem
    for those that have been waiting in line 20, 30 years. A lot of
    them are my constituents as well as they are yours. We haven't
    given you a solution.
        Mr. Hathaway--Sheriff Hathaway, man, I can only imagine
    what you go through at your town, 80, 90 percent Latino. I will
    give you a little secret. I know racism doesn't exist, but I
    can't tell you how many times I have been pulled over by ICE to
    demand what, you know, my citizenship was. That is OK, I will
    comply. But it is only folks that kind-of look like me that
    have that treatment. I know it is national security. It is
    nothing but that.
        But you, my friend, are responding to your constituents, to
    your taxpayers, to your voters that say we expect certain
    respect from the Government, from the sheriff. We want streets
    that are safe. We want to make sure there is a--policies that
    enable us to live like human beings and not have to fear police
    officers. We spent 20 years in the county of Orange trying to
    make sure that the people that lived in the shadows didn't fear
    reporting crimes to police. That is good policing. We are not a
    police state. The United States is not a police state. We have
    to have cooperation form our population to make sure we have
    safe streets.
        You, Sheriff, have a tough job, but you are not alone. The
    numbers, that beautiful chart out there, speaks volumes. But
    what is not on that chart is the story behind a lot of those
    numbers.
        We didn't talk about the COVID pandemic that devastated not
    only the United States, half the countries in Latin America are
    nonfunctional right now. You go to Honduras, that economy is on
    life line. Other countries in Latin America, Colombia right now
    has about 4 million Venezuelan refugees. Costa Rica, ditto
    Mexico, trying to figure out a handle to the problem.
        By the way, the other issue nobody talked about today is
    Mexico's cooperation with the United States today. They are our
    biggest trading partner and they are stepping up to the plate.
    It is never enough. But, you know, we want to work on a
    solution. For example, safe pathways to the United States to
    work and also databases that track those criminals, so Ms.
    Morin's situation is not repeated. Those are real solutions
    that we are working on and we can continue to work on.
        Dreamers. OK? That population of kids who are here, now
    adults, some of them that actually have made the ultimate
    sacrifice in the military for our country and whose families
    are still living in the shadows, it is not an issue for
    Homeland Security, but it is connected to Homeland Security.
        You know, former Secretary of Homeland Security General
    Kelly, who used to be President Trump's chief of staff, would
    say border security does not start or end at the border. If
    anything negative gets to the border, you are already too late.
    He was in charge of SouthCom, which is the Southern Command,
    U.S. military in Latin America. He understood that it wasn't
    about the border, but it was about the region. I didn't hear
    any discussion about these issues today.
        Mr. Chairman, we have got a lot of work to do. It is not
    your fault. It is not their fault. It is our job to fix these
    problems. The American taxpayers are asking us to be practical
    and do it. Sixty days out and we are talking essentially
    political rhetoric here about the election.
        You know, Senator Lankford, he's a guy I talk to a lot. He
    put his neck out in the line as an elected official to come up
    with an immigration solution. He really worked hard. I looked
    at his--and I said, Jim, you are really going to go out on the
    limb here, man? Nobody has been able to succeed for 30 years.
    He said, this is the right thing to do, an immigration
    solution, a border solution. Then former President Trump came
    out and said, kill it. He is a conservative Republican from
    Oklahoma trying to do the right thing for America, and that is
    what his reward is.
        We have to change the rhetoric. We are all Americans. We
    are all expecting our Federal Government, the U.S. Congress, to
    solve the problems. You know, most of us here are married. Do
    you ever go home and say, I get 100 percent on the decisions
    with my wife, your spouse? Of course not. You negotiate the
    deal, and if you get most of it, you have cut a good deal. You
    don't agree 100 percent with your wife, with your spouse when
    you are cutting the deals. Why do we expect to come to Congress
    and agree 100 percent with the other side?
        Hope you can move forward. Homeland Security was designed,
    this committee, that agency was designed after 9/11 to work
    together, not as a partisan committee, but as a committee that
    worked across the aisle to protect Americans from foreign and
    domestic terrorism. We have to get back to doing our job and
    doing it right.
        We have got the Secret Service that is also under our
    jurisdiction, and they are having a hell of a time protecting
    our Presidential candidates. Those 2 articles I submitted for
    the record today are a glimpse that the rest of the world is
    scared to death because they see our American democracy on the
    brink of failure. That does not speak well of the job we are
    doing here in Congress. Put partisanship aside and start
    working to stabilize this country and do what our taxpayers
    expect us to do.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I yield.
        Chairman Green. The gentlemen yields. I now recognize
    myself for a closing statement.
        I want to thank you all for attending today. A very
    important hearing, and I especially thank our witnesses: Chief
    Heitke, Supervisor Desmond, Ms. Morin, Sheriff Hathaway, your
    testimonies, they have certainly stuck with me and I know will
    continue to deeply affect the American people.
        Ms. Morin, my heart is with you and your family. I want to
    thank you for your courage today to tell Rachel's story. What
    happened is unimaginable. You are right, it was completely
    preventable. There are tons of stories like yours. Thousands of
    American families. We have to put a stop to this. To hear today
    from you that the person who did this to your daughter walked
    across our Southern Border, a policy that had been in place to
    do DNA testing would have identified him as a murderer fleeing
    his own country, a policy that was done away with by this
    administration, led to the death of your daughter. It will be
    real hard to convince me otherwise.
        Mr. Heitke, thank you for your valuable testimony. I want
    to thank you for your years of service to the country. You have
    kept our Nation safe through 5 administrations. You have got
    first-hand experience. What you said today in your 5 minutes,
    to me, is devastating to the policy decisions that this
    administration has made. You were very clear that they
    decreased returning people to other countries. They decreased
    detention. It was purposeful policy changes, intentional. It
    led to massive increases in migration to our country. Then you
    were told to hide it so the media couldn't see it.
        You shared stories of human trafficking, sex trafficking of
    little girls. Secondary to this wave because you are
    overwhelmed with resources, which was secondary to the policy
    changes. You told us today of the incredible tragic increases
    in suicides amongst Border Patrol. Your exact words in your
    testimony correlated directly to the increase in migration
    caused by those failed policies and the removal of policies.
        You know, Mr. Correa, I love this gentleman. He is a great
    man. He talked about resources is the problem. Many, many
    people here have talked about, well, we got to have----
        Mr. Correa. I am one of them.
        Chairman Green. One of many, but OK. But if you implement
    policies and refuse to let people do their job, more people
    aren't going to solve the problem. Oh, by the way, H.R. 2, the
    bill we passed, increased the number of Border Patrol agents,
    but, you know.
        Mr. Desmond, we appreciate you being here with us today as
    well. San Diego County has seen some of the worst of this
    border crisis. It does start at the top. It starts with
    President Biden and Vice President Harris. I want to thank you
    for shedding some light on the situation in California and the
    realities of this crisis.
        I really appreciated you talking about the fact that your
    State has ordered Federal people and other people not to ask
    certain legal questions that are in the laws passed by this
    body. Ignore the laws. That is like saying, you know that
    Constitution that says this body writes the law, this body
    executes the law, this body adjudicates the law? We don't care
    about that. We are just going to pick and choose which laws we
    enforce. You don't like a law, you change it. That is a threat
    to democracy as far as I am concerned.
        Sheriff Hathaway, I want to thank you for coming and for
    your service to your community. I totally disagree with you
    that the border wall is racist. I think that is absurd. I
    really appreciate the question Mr. Crane had. Is a wall going
    to pick and choose which person it blocks? I will tell you, the
    last time I was at the border, it was a group, a huge group of
    Russians coming in. They are more white than I am. Stupid
    actually, it is absolutely stupid to suggest that walls and the
    attempt to enforce our laws is somehow racist. But I do
    appreciate you coming.
        The truth is there are 2 competing visions for our country.
    That is it. On the one hand, some of us are fighting like hell
    to enforce the laws of our country, to go back to that
    Constitution that says this group writes the laws, this group
    enforces the laws, and we are prioritizing the well-being and
    the safety of American citizens. Yet, on the other hand, we
    have an administration led by President Joe Biden and Vice
    President Kamala Harris that couldn't care less about those
    laws as evidenced by their actions, pure and simple. It is
    inescapably clear that the Biden administration, and Harris
    along with him, ended effective border policies with no
    alternatives in place to secure our border. They implemented an
    unlawful policy of mass catch and release, and they gutted
    interior enforcement, casting aside their responsibility to
    enforce the laws that they swore to uphold. They have continued
    to deceive the American people about it. Let's hide these
    people. Let's fly them to Texas.
        The truth is Americans no longer feel safe in their
    communities. A little baby crawling on a floor in a VRBO in
    Florida is dead because of the fentanyl brought across our
    porous, open Southern Border that a witness today said has been
    left wide open so we can process more people into the country.
    Millions of Americans have lost loved ones to fentanyl.
    Americans who can't afford housing, whose insurance premiums
    have shot up, forced to watch as lawbreakers have been rewarded
    with free housing and benefits.
        One of our--I think it was you, Sheriff Hathaway, earlier,
    talked about not impacting inflation. I am sorry. If 12 million
    people walk into the country, we can't just suddenly make a
    dairy for milk. There is this thing called the supply-demand
    curve. Basic economics. If you increase the demand without a
    change in supply, the price is going to go up. It is just basic
    economics.
        You know, I thought spending almost 2 years investigating
    this border crisis would have more of an impact on the other
    side of the aisle. I thought laying out the human cost of this
    crisis, bringing in people like Ms. Morin, especially the cost
    of innocent women, children being trafficked, would have an
    impact. I thought telling the stories of those who have been
    victimized by criminal illegal aliens would weigh on their
    conscience. I thought bringing recognition to the memorandum
    written by the Secretary telling his people to ignore the laws
    passed by Congress and let felons into the country instead of
    detaining them would make a difference. I thought laying out
    the financial cost of this crisis to the American communities
    would make them think twice. I thought explaining how the
    crisis is overwhelming law enforcement officers would garner a
    little sympathy. I thought laying out in painstaking detail how
    this crisis is compromising our national security. Eight ISIS
    guys caught in New York, Jordanians trying to storm military
    installation, and the ISIS guys used the CBP One app. I thought
    it would be a wake-up call to the administration. I was wrong.
        Instead, we have been ignored and we have been maligned.
    This administration is just as unwilling to end this border
    crisis as it was when we began these investigations. That
    crappy bill put together in the Senate to give them
    justification, that didn't pass the Senate, by the way. So we
    talk about how, you know, we should have--it didn't even pass
    the Senate.
        Of course they bring up the cat story. You know, I don't
    care about that. I care about Laken Riley, who is dead. I care
    about your daughter, who is dead. Let's talk about that.
    Instead, they are talking about all this other stuff that just
    doesn't matter.
        It is clear to me, to this committee, to Congress, and the
    American people that Biden-Harris administration is hell-bent
    on keeping our borders wide open. This deception with the CBP
    One app just--it is not decreasing the flow. It is
    characterizing them in another way. All we are being told is
    that the crisis is somehow over because a couple of months of
    low crossing numbers, a shell game, as if that fixes the damage
    of the past 3\1/2\ years, and ignores the objective reality
    that the numbers are still at crisis levels. Millions continue
    to enter our country through illegitimate means, like these
    mass parole programs.
        From Day 1, this administration has refused to enforce the
    laws of our Nation and eliminated effective border policies. As
    a result, we have members of the most dangerous criminal
    cartels streaming into our country, linking up with gangs,
    creating a crime nexus, bringing drugs and crime with them. It
    is unsustainable. To say, well, we need guest workers, so open
    borders are OK, is absurd.
        It is also absurd, or at the very least contradictory, the
    claim that most of these immigrants are coming to work, when in
    reality, most are attempting to claim asylum. So which one is
    it? If they come and say, hey, I am here to work, well, cool,
    we have this legal pathway. No, they are saying, I am claiming
    asylum. So which is it? Are they coming out of credible fear
    for their life and safety or are they coming as economic
    migrants? You can't have it both ways.
        I honestly don't know how anyone can listen to the stories
    we have heard today and still stand by Biden-Harris
    administration's reckless policies, policies that are killing
    Americans and compromising our national security. Exactly 1
    week ago, Members of this committee went to Ground Zero, the
    World Trade Center, to remember Americans killed on 9/11 and to
    honor the first responders who gave their lives. Nineteen men,
    that all took--that is all it took to take the lives of nearly
    3,000 Americans. Yet our Border Patrol has stopped 384
    suspected terrorists trying to get in. How many more of them
    are in the 2 million gotaways? Known gotaways, not even the
    ones that walked across while chief of the border sector said
    there was nobody there watching.
        Last, let me just point out how intentional this plan is.
    Its expansion of the CBP One app funneled hundreds of thousands
    of inadmissible aliens to ports of entry and then into the
    interior of this country. This is a major end-around to our
    lawful immigration system. As NBC News recently reported, even
    individuals with terrorist connections have been allowed in
    through this program. Well, we know who those are. Some of
    them, anyway.
        Additionally, massive fraud was discovered in the Cuban,
    Haitian, Nicaragua, and Venezuelan mass parole program which
    allowed 30,000 inadmissible aliens into the country each month.
    Yet it is back up and running even after reports from the folks
    at DHS claim they knew it is against the law and after reports
    that the CHNV parolees have committed grave sexual crimes since
    arriving here.
        Simultaneously, this administration allows border wall
    materials to rust in the desert instead of choosing to build
    the wall we have already paid for. In short, the Biden
    administration, Biden-Harris administration is doing everything
    in its power to perpetuate this border crisis. Any claims to
    the contrary is misleading at its least.
        The truth is that even President Biden--even if President
    Biden shuts the border down tomorrow, it will not undo the
    damage this administration has caused over the last 3\1/2\
    years. Rachel Morin's death can't be undone. Laken Riley can't
    be brought back. The heartbreak felt by those who have lost a
    loved one because of this border crisis cannot be fixed. How
    many times have we sat here and held hearings over the
    lawlessness of this administration and its refusal to obey the
    laws and secure our borders?
        We have passed legislation only to be ignored by Democrats.
    We have held Cabinet officials accountable. Again, ignored by
    Democrats. It was brought up today by one of my colleagues
    about this impeachment. I am sorry, if you have a Cabinet
    Secretary who just gets to do whatever they want and not follow
    the laws of Congress, why do we have a Congress in the first
    place? But I guess Congress shouldn't feel--don't feel
    offended, right? Because the President was told by the Supreme
    Court he can't pay off student loans. He said, I don't care. I
    am going to do it anyway. I guess we don't need a Supreme Court
    either. We should just have a king.
        It doesn't have to be like this. It cannot continue to be
    like this. I am going to fight as long as I have the strength
    to ensure that we return to some form of law and order and
    sanity on this issue. There has to be change. Something has got
    to give. We need to secure our border and we need to do it now.
        I thank the witnesses for their valuable testimony and the
    Members for their questions on both sides. The Members of the
    subcommittee may have some additional questions for the
    witnesses. We would like to ask the witnesses to respond to
    those in writing. Pursuant to committee rule VII(D), the
    hearing record will be held open for 10 days for those.
        Without objection, this committee stands adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 1:05 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]

                                A P P E N D I X

                                  ----------

                Supplemental Prepared Statement of Aaron Heitke
                               September 18, 2024
        The only true consequence we have to slow down and discourage
    people from coming to the United States illegally is sending them back
    to their country of origin. Sending them all the way back to their
    country of origin not only brings them back to their country of
    citizenship but places an enormous financial, physical, and mental
    impact on them. They will have to start all over again. That impact
    does deter people from trying again and deters those that are thinking
    about making the trip. As we have seen over the past 3+ years,
    releasing people into the United States regardless of what status they
    are released on, has the opposite effect. It encourages people to come
    and there is no end to the number of people who want to come here.
        Throughout the first 3+ years of this admin, I saw a steady
    decrease in countries we could send people back to. As I am sure most
    of you know, we cannot simply fill a plane up with citizens from X
    country and send them back. We must have an agreement with that
    country. This requires coordination with the State Department and the
    country involved. Whether purposeful or through neglect these
    agreements were allowed to lapse and few to no new agreements were
    made. Many different excuses were given for why the numbers of these
    agreements continued to decline but this was the first time in my 25
    years and 5 different administrations that I saw this large-scale lapse
    in our ability to return people to their country of origin.
        The inability to send people home meant that most people being
    arrested at the border for illegal entry would either have to be
    detained or released. The current administration has, from Day 1, made
    a point of decreasing the amount of Federal detention space available
    nationwide. Immigration and Customs Enforcement's funding for detention
    space has steadily been cut. Regardless of the reasons for the cuts in
    detention space, these losses meant that more people would have to be
    released into the United States. This administration also cut private
    detention centers that held Federal prisoners. This not only impacted
    Customs and Border Protection, but it also impacted every Federal law
    enforcement agency. Throughout my time in San Diego, I had regular
    meetings with the U.S. Attorney along with the heads of all the Federal
    law enforcement agencies. Our main topic of discussion was jail space.
    Cases would not be taken for prosecution because we could not hold the
    suspects and/or witnesses for hearings. Again, this wasn't just
    immigration cases. It had a dramatic impact on narcotics smuggling
    cases. Individuals smuggling substantial amounts of methamphetamine and
    even fentanyl were cited and released for lack of jail space.
        Information travels faster in our world now than ever before. The
    fact that so many illegal aliens were being released into the United
    States spread world-wide very quickly. As this happened the numbers the
    Border Patrol encountered illegally crossing the border increased
    exponentially. It started in Texas and spread across the entire
    Southern Border and to some extent to the Northern Border.
        With the policies put in place by this administration along with
    the systematic decrease in detention and the ability to return illegal
    aliens to their countries of origin, Border Patrol Sectors across the
    Nation were overwhelmed. To add to this problem this administration,
    along with the Border Patrol leadership, made a colossal mistake.
    Sectors were ordered to take in and process all the illegal aliens
    encountered on the border. Since there was no detention available,
    makeshift tents or soft-sided facilities were set up across the border
    to temporarily house the masses coming in. Border Patrol saw groups of
    hundreds and thousands coming into the United States and turning
    themselves in since they knew they would be released. These numbers
    pulled 80-90 percent, sometimes 100 percent of the agents on duty away
    from the field. All they had time to do was transport people from the
    border, care and feed them in detention, process them for release and
    finally release them. This went on for years and is still happening
    today.
        The major problem with this is that there is no one at the border
    trying to arrest those people who really do not want to be caught.
    Obviously, the narcotic smugglers, terrorists, cartel affiliates and
    other people with serious criminal histories do not turn themselves in.
    They know that if arrested they will go to prison. However, because
    most agents were now otherwise occupied, these criminals had free
    passage into the United States. Nationwide Border Patrol zones across
    Texas, Arizona, and California had no agent presence. Those who did not
    want to be caught could simply walk in. We have no idea who and what
    entered our country over this time. We did our best to count gotaways
    nationwide, but this is little more than an educated guess. I was
    ordered to send agents from California to Texas and Arizona to help
    count gotaways. Those sectors simply had no one to even go to the field
    and try and figure out what they missed. This occurred throughout 2022
    and 2023.
        To make things even worse, this administration ordered the Border
    Patrol to stop using force of any kind to keep aliens from entering the
    United States. This was the first time in Border Patrol history that
    force could not be used on the border to keep people out. This meant
    that agents had to stand aside and watch as thousands of people
    illegally crossed the border. The administration knew that once the
    aliens were in the United States they would have to be taken into
    custody. This blew open the already overflowing border.
        Another significant impact of having all the Border Patrol Agents
    transporting and providing care and feeding to the masses of illegal
    aliens is that secondary operations are not possible. One example of
    this is DNA testing. The Border Patrol has a court order requiring DNA
    testing among those arrested. Because of the mass amounts of people, no
    resources and Headquarters leadership being more concerned with media
    reports and idle complaints, DNA testing has not been accomplished and
    still is not today. There simply is not time, space, or money to do it.
    I sent requests for additional support and relayed that under the
    circumstances we could not test. My requests were ignored. DNA testing
    was not performed throughout 2022 and 2023, not because we did not want
    to but because we were not provided the necessary resources to
    accomplish it. The masses of aliens and lack of resources also
    prevented agents from being able to properly talk to people in custody
    to find out if trafficking was occurring or if they had suffered abuse
    along their journey. We were pushed to move them as fast as possible
    for release, which prevented agents from being able to find other
    problems and provide help to those suffering.
        While all of this was happening in San Diego we had an exponential
    increase in Significant Interest Aliens. This trend continues to this
    day. These people have potential ties to terrorism or other forms of
    organized crime or espionage. Prior to this administration, the San
    Diego sector averaged 10-15 SIAs per year. Once word was out that the
    border was far easier to cross, San Diego went to just over 100 SIAs in
    2022 and way over 100 SIAs in 2023 and more than that this year. These
    are only the ones we caught. The SIA's arrested in San Diego were
    significant people in the criminal world. They were not recruiters or
    fundraisers for terrorism, they were actual operators with histories of
    doing bad things and extensive ties to very dangerous people and
    organizations. These people were from Pakistan, Iran, Iraq, Syria,
    Turkey, Afghanistan, China, and Russia just to name a few.
        At this time, I was told I could not release any information on
    this increase in SIA's or mention any of the arrests. At the time, the
    administration was trying to convince the public that there was no
    threat at the border. To further this problem, although we continued to
    ask for help in questioning and looking more into why these people were
    coming, we received no help. As of today, this trend continues and as
    of today no help has been sent. No additional assets from the CIA, FBI,
    or any other agency. Again, this administration and current Border
    Patrol leadership would rather ignore the problem and keep it from the
    public rather than admit their mistakes.
        Many people think this is only a Border Patrol problem, that the
    other law enforcement agencies in these areas, whether local, State, or
    Federal, can pick up the slack. What they do not realize is that the
    Border Patrol provides detailed agents to task force operations across
    the country. This includes State and Federal gang task forces, DEA drug
    task forces, FBI safe streets and terrorism task forces, just to name a
    few. During my time in San Diego, I had to recall all the detailed
    agents. We were overwhelmed with sheer numbers and needed everyone we
    had. This impacted all of our partners' ability to perform their
    missions successfully. To add to this, the extra immigration traffic
    took up more of the limited detention space which meant other Federal
    agencies couldn't prosecute as many cases. Finally, the sheer numbers
    of people moving through the border area in San Diego and being
    released in San Diego itself brought with it more calls for service for
    the State and local agencies, taxing their ability to perform their
    mission.
        During my last year in San Diego, the prices of methamphetamine and
    fentanyl on the street decreased drastically. A single fentanyl pill,
    for example, went from $10 to 25 cents. This meant that the market was
    completely saturated with drugs. With most agents out of the field and
    the border being open in many areas the amount of narcotics entering
    the country skyrocketed. During my time in San Diego, I hosted United
    States Attorneys, Sheriffs, Chiefs of Police, and countless others who
    came to our area to see where the narcotics coming into their regions
    were crossing the border. San Diego has been the main crossing point
    for hard narcotics coming into the United States for many years;
    however, with few to no agents able to work the field, the amounts
    crossing skyrocketed and leaders across the West and Midwest noticed
    the difference. The San Diego area, between OFO and BP, seize between
    80-90 percent of the methamphetamine and fentanyl annually in the
    United States.
        The large numbers of aliens at the border are not only an impact to
    Border Patrol. The Office of Field Operations was inundated at San
    Ysidro and was forced to limit their inspections of both people and
    cargo while they dealt and continued to deal with the influx. OFO also
    provided support to us with help processing and holding extra people
    again limiting the amount of inspections they could do and further
    increasing the amounts of narcotics entering the country.
        To make matters worse, during 2022 and 2023 I had to shut the San
    Diego traffic checkpoints down because of lack of resources. I needed
    every agent to handle care and feeding. These checkpoints are the only
    second layer of defense to detect what is missed at the border.
        Those moving narcotics took advantage of the lack of security which
    was shown by the substantial increase in the size of the narcotic
    loads. When the smugglers feel they may lose loads they run smaller
    amounts to alleviate the risk. When they are confident, they run
    copious amounts. In San Diego and San Ysidro, we started seeing
    multiple thousand-pound loads of methamphetamine and multiple 100-
    pound+ loads of fentanyl. The smugglers have become confident because
    the enforcement is otherwise occupied.
        The large numbers also had and still have a negative impact on the
    San Diego community. When we were arresting thousands of illegal aliens
    a day I had to release them by the hundreds each day into San Diego.
    When I was releasing thousands of people into San Diego the local
    community could not handle the volume. I received calls from the
    Governor's office, local mayors, and law enforcement leaders as well as
    the heads of local charities that were trying to find accommodations
    for all these people. They all asked that I stop releasing people into
    the community. I told them I could not.
        Once a person is processed and determined to be a release it is a
    4th Amendment violation to keep them in detention. Also, because of
    appropriations law, I could not spend any Government funds to house,
    transport, or feed them once they were set for release. I then received
    calls from my headquarters telling me to stop releasing into the city.
    Again, I told them I could not for the same reasons and told them if
    they wanted to order me not to, I needed it in writing. That order
    never came. I was then told to process the aliens to 99 percent just
    leave 1 signature off so the aliens were not completely set for
    release, and we could still hold them. Again, I told them if this was
    an order, I needed it in writing. Again, that order never came as it
    would have been illegal. Since they could not make me stop releasing
    people into San Diego they started 2 flights a week from San Diego to
    Texas. These flights simply brought aliens that would have been
    released in San Diego over to Texas where they were released. Each
    flight cost approximately $150,000. When I questioned the waste of time
    and money I was told because there is a problem in Texas but there is
    not a problem in California. It was the administration's way of trying
    to quiet the border-wide crisis.
        Once the large numbers started to impact Texas, I started asking my
    headquarters why we could not identify each individual as a threat or
    not and then simply move on. As Border Patrol we have no obligation to
    process each alien encountered. The job of a Border Patrol agent is to
    identify and stop threats. If we wanted to keep doing that, we had to
    alleviate the time spent with the masses. I suggested that we easily
    could, and we would still be well within policy and law. Those aliens
    not deemed a threat would move onto ICE and Citizen and Immigration
    Services who are responsible for this portion of the process. This is
    where the Border Patrol made a huge mistake. It was decided that Border
    Patrol could handle the processing and maintain operations. The
    attitude was if not us who? I continued to press the issue as the
    numbers came across the entire border and San Diego in particular. I
    was told that if the aliens were not processed, they could not travel
    or apply for benefits. This pressure came down from the administration.
    Finally, as I pressed the issue with my headquarters, I was told that I
    could easily be replaced. My headquarters simply did not want to hear
    any alternative idea and preferred to claim they had things under
    control. Once the numbers of aliens being released in San Diego became
    more than the area could deal with the State of California and the
    Federal Government rented hotels in San Diego to house the people. One
    hotel was set up to be the intake center. At this point aliens being
    released were given rooms, money, cell phones, and put in contact with
    charitable organizations to help them. Those working the hotel refer to
    it as the ``migrant experience.'' A one-stop shop for everything the
    aliens could need. All at taxpayer expense.
        The need for the aliens to be given some kind of United States
    paperwork to help them receive assistance was so great that State and
    local agencies called me to ask if they could bring illegal aliens into
    our stations so they could be processed and given their ``travel
    document.'' This obviously violated SB54 but that was brushed under the
    rug because the people asking to bring in the aliens were the ones
    supporting the law.
        The financial cost for health care of all these illegal aliens was
    so high I received calls from State and local political offices and
    hospital administrators asking if they could bring patients into our
    stations so they could turn themselves in and be in our custody so the
    Federal Government would pay the bills. We were also asked to keep
    those people we brought to the hospital for medical treatment in our
    custody again so the Government would pay the bill.
        Through pressure from the administration my headquarters became
    more interested in the fiction being portrayed in the media and not at
    all concerned with reality. At times in San Diego, we had 2,000 or more
    aliens sitting in between the fences asking to turn themselves in. We
    were running every vehicle we had and every agent available to
    transport and process. Yet I received calls from my HQ saying that no
    alien should have to sit in the desert for more than 2 hours. This was
    not based in reality, as every available resource was being used, but
    my headquarters wanted to stem the news reports to make it look better,
    not actually make anything better. Knowing they were actually making
    things worse for all the agents in San Diego, they pushed to simply
    move people and completely disregard the border security operations.
    This also extended to our checkpoints. As I mentioned earlier, I had
    the checkpoints shut down in 2022 and 2023. As narcotics became more of
    a focus in the media and in California I was told to open our
    checkpoints. The narcotics flooding the West, and the country was in
    great part due to the overwhelming numbers of aliens at the border. I
    told them no, either we continue to transport and process the vast
    numbers of aliens and keep the checkpoints closed or I pull agents,
    open the checkpoints, and have thousands of aliens sitting in the
    desert and dying in the desert because agents were not there triaging
    the scene. However, to save face with the administration, my
    headquarters went around me and spoke to my station leadership. They
    asked my station leadership; do you have agents at the checkpoints?
    This answer was yes since we were using the checkpoints as processing
    and holding centers. Headquarters then passed word up the chain to CBP,
    DHS, and the administration that the checkpoints were open. This gave
    them the ability to make it look like they had fixed the problem to
    their bosses when in fact it was a complete fallacy.
        Border Patrol agents went above and beyond through all this chaos.
    They are also the ones continually forgotten, put out and neglected by
    the media, this administration, and Border Patrol leadership in
    Washington DC. These agents deal with death, women and children that
    have been raped, abused, trafficked, bought, and sold, families that
    have spent months in terrible conditions traveling here, sickness,
    despair and the agents are given no relief. The opposite has been the
    case. The media villainizes them; their own leadership pushes more
    overtime and guilts them into not taking vacation for the benefit of
    the leadership, not the agency, the country, the aliens, or the agents
    themselves. If you look at the numbers of suicides within the Border
    Patrol it is directly correlated with the migrant surge. The agents
    have been pushed beyond their limit and this has impacted their mental
    health. The Border Patrol attitude of if not us who is a fallacy pushed
    by a few Border Patrol leaders for their own benefit and the detriment
    of the agents.
        Each time we asked for help in dealing with a new issue it was
    ignored. When we did not have enough vehicles to transport aliens out
    of the field, we received nothing. When we did not have enough agents
    to process and patrol the border, we were required to send detailed
    agents to Texas to count gotaways. When the NGO's complained that
    aliens were sitting in the desert too long, rather than send buses
    Border Patrol leadership and the administration formed oversight
    committees and hired hundreds of extra contractors to come down to San
    Diego and look at how they might improve the situation. Simply
    providing vehicles and allowing us to keep our agents would have helped
    but instead they spent millions of dollars on committees which simply
    came down and suggested nothing, made things more difficult and
    overall, more costly and less efficient.
        When Border Patrol leadership refused to take responsibility for
    their mistake in taking on the complete care and feeding of the masses,
    they decided to put up more tents across the country to house the
    people. Hundreds of millions of dollars have been wasted on these
    facilities and they have done no good, on the contrary they have only
    caused more problems. I fought against these facilities from the
    beginning and pushed especially hard against them in San Diego.
    Eventually I was overruled, and San Diego received a large tent at the
    cost of over $1 million per month. This facility is still in use today.
    Each one of these facilities is a gross waste of taxpayer money; they
    are unnecessary and make things more difficult for the agents in the
    field.
        First, the Border Patrol is not responsible for the care and
    feeding or even the processing of these aliens. That burden was taken
    on voluntarily by Border Patrol leadership. There are many other
    agencies, both government and private, that specialize in handling mass
    movements of people particularly in cases of disasters. The Red Cross
    and FEMA are just two examples. However, Border Patrol leadership took
    on this task to try and win favor with the administration, to the
    detriment of the agents and the country as a whole.
        Second, the cost. These facilities are sold as being full wrap,
    meaning they come with staff to run them. This could not be further
    from the truth. The facilities have staff to run them, keep the lights
    on and the air conditioning working but little more. The staff are not
    allowed to interact at all with aliens, help with security or any other
    movement or care and feeding of the aliens. This means the taxpayer is
    spending a million dollars a month on a nice tent completely staffed by
    Border Patrol agents. The companies running these tents are making
    millions and providing little. I strongly suggest you look at who owns
    and runs these companies. They are mostly former DHS employees, from
    top to bottom. It is disgraceful to see those who once worked to secure
    our country using their former positions to make millions at the
    taxpayer expense especially when they are providing little to nothing
    to fix the problem. The hundreds of millions of dollars wasted on these
    tents could have been used for countless other more effective measures
    that would have helped solve the issue rather than pad the bank
    accounts of former DHS employees.
        This administration has not only neglected and vilified Border
    Patrol agents, but they have actively worked against them as well as
    the rest of law enforcement within the Federal system. As an example, I
    mention the former CBP Commissioner Chris Magnus. I hold no grudge
    against him in any way, as a person or a former commissioner of CBP. He
    was given a mission by this administration when he was hired, and he
    worked hard to complete it. My problem is what that mission was. Chris
    Magnus is and was an activist working to adversely change how law
    enforcement does their job. His goal was to remove the use of force
    from law enforcement.
        As part of completing this mission, CBP's Office of Personnel
    Responsibility was weaponized against the law enforcement employees
    within CBP. We were continually warned in meetings, OPR is looking into
    personal social media accounts, employee backgrounds to find anything
    they could to discredit the employees to make examples of them. Changes
    were made to the use of force review board. Instead of having 2 LE and
    1 civilian member on the review board it was changed to 1 law
    enforcement and 2 civilians. Use of force in the field can only truly
    be judged by someone who has walked in those shoes. Someone who sits
    behind a computer cannot understand or judge what level of force was
    reasonable. Civilian employees are not familiar with the training or
    policies of their law enforcement counterparts and aside from personal
    experience, have no background in the actual rules. This change was
    done to discipline more agents for using force and pressure the rest
    within CBP not to use force.
        Although from the outside looking in, this seems like a reasonable
    method, as is often the case, the reality of it is quite different.
    What this caused, and continues to cause to this day, is agents second-
    guessing themselves in the field. Use of force incidents happen without
    warning. The agent must decide in a millisecond. If they second-guess
    themselves, they get hurt or killed. Having those unfamiliar with what
    happens every day in the field take weeks to second-guess what an agent
    had to decide in a millisecond is ridiculous. Unfortunately, it did
    work.
        I saw the impact daily in San Diego. Agents hesitated to use force
    and were hurt; other agents were hurt, and aliens and civilians were
    hurt. A specific example of the former commissioner trying to make
    examples of agents to discourage use of force involved an individual
    case I was responsible for in San Diego. As chief of the San Diego
    sector, I was the deciding official for all termination cases involving
    San Diego-sector employees. I was scheduled to hear a termination case
    which involved a deadly shooting by an agent. As was my normal
    practice, I reviewed the entire file for the case and was to hear the
    oral reply. Two days before hearing the case I received a call from
    then-Chief Ortiz telling me that the commissioner was pulling this case
    back to CBP for a decision. The following Monday I started asking
    questions. I relayed questions to OPR, Office of Inspector General,
    Counsel, and LER. I asked first if this was allowed. The answer was
    yes. I then pressed hard for a why. I was told by multiple people that
    the commissioner wanted to pull high-profile media cases back to CBP
    and have them decided by a non-law enforcement decision maker so
    examples could be made. I pushed as hard as I could from my position to
    no avail. I can say that in retirement I testified on behalf of this
    agent in a lawsuit brought against the Government and am happy to say
    the agent has been reinstated.
        Another significant impact of the former commissioner's attempt to
    change law enforcement was that I, as chief, spent a substantial
    percentage of my time protecting my agents from our Government. The
    desire to look good in the media and otherwise chill the actions of
    agents was the priority of the commissioner and Border Patrol
    leadership followed suit. This meant that I dealt with constant
    questions from Border Patrol leadership on why agents had done certain
    things. Border Patrol leadership was more concerned with looking good
    to the commissioner and the media than supporting the agents.
        The San Diego sector is also unique among Southern Border sectors
    because it lies in California. As I stated earlier, when I repeatedly
    asked for help from my headquarters, I received none. Unlike other
    sectors, those in Texas for example, because of State Bill 54, State
    and local law enforcement are prevented from helping or dealing with us
    in any way. Because of this the BP, OFO, and ICE were left without any
    additional support from State entities.
        The current numbers of people crossing our border are low in
    comparison to recent months and years. There is a reason for this.
    After 4 years this administration finally started to ask Mexico for
    help in slowing down traffic through their country. This administration
    finally started to use foreign resources in the Darien Gap, Panama,
    Brazil, and Ecuador to slow and stop migrant traffic there. An
    Executive Order was given limiting some asylum claims. Each of these
    does make a difference but why has it taken so long to accomplish? All
    these tactics were being used before this administration took office,
    but each was stopped or limited once this administration came in. I am
    also concerned that these changes will not be maintained. I along with
    many other leaders within the Border Patrol asked for help for years,
    made suggestions on changes that would help but nothing was done. I
    personally briefed every representative, senator and staffer that came
    to San Diego on these issues. I continually passed on these requests to
    my HQ, CBP, and DHS. I know that information was here in Washington,
    but no help came. No changes came.
        During my time in the Border Patrol and San Diego sector
    specifically I met with leaders from around the world. They came to see
    how we were handling the border and what they could learn to better
    help them handle their own border. These leaders came from Poland,
    France, Great Britain, Spain, Germany, Hungary, and Israel just to name
    a few. In my discussions with them they all said the same thing. We are
    inundated with migrants, and we have no more space or resources to deal
    with them. The United States is quickly reaching the same level. At
    some point very soon world leaders are going to have to make tough
    decisions on how many people their countries can support and stick to
    them. The United States is no different. The world has more people than
    it can support. It is not nice or easy to do but at some point, each
    country will have to send people back to where they came from
    regardless of the consequences to them in order to protect their own
    people. The flow of people looking for a better life or fleeing
    political turmoil will never stop and will only get worse as the years
    pass.
        The problems we are facing at the border have solutions. These
    solutions can be quite simple and cost far less than the mess currently
    occupying so much time and money. Agreements must be made with the
    sending countries and returns must be accomplished quickly.

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