[House Hearing, 118 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                         LEGISLATIVE HEARING ON
              H.R. 6452; H.R. 6531; H.R. 6538; H.R. 6874;
              H.R. 6947; H.R. 7342; H.R. XXXX; H.R. XXXX;
                             AND H.R. XXXX

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                       SUBCOMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND 
                              INVESTIGATIONS

                                 OF THE

                     COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS

                     U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED EIGHTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                        THURSDAY, MARCH 21, 2024

                               __________

                           Serial No. 118-58

                               __________

       Printed for the use of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs
       
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]       


                    Available via http://govinfo.gov
                    
                                __________

                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
55-495                    WASHINGTON : 2025                  
          
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------                    
                   
                     COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS

                     MIKE BOST, Illinois, Chairman

AUMUA AMATA COLEMAN RADEWAGEN,       MARK TAKANO, California, Ranking 
    American Samoa, Vice-Chairwoman      Member
JACK BERGMAN, Michigan               JULIA BROWNLEY, California
NANCY MACE, South Carolina           MIKE LEVIN, California
MATTHEW M. ROSENDALE, SR., Montana   CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire
MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa       FRANK J. MRVAN, Indiana
GREGORY F. MURPHY, North Carolina    SHEILA CHERFILUS-MCCORMICK, 
C. SCOTT FRANKLIN, Florida               Florida
DERRICK VAN ORDEN, Wisconsin         CHRISTOPHER R. DELUZIO, 
MORGAN LUTTRELL, Texas                   Pennsylvania
JUAN CISCOMANI, Arizona              MORGAN MCGARVEY, Kentucky
ELIJAH CRANE, Arizona                DELIA C. RAMIREZ, Illinois
KEITH SELF, Texas                    GREG LANDSMAN, Ohio
JENNIFER A. KIGGANS, Virginia        NIKKI BUDZINSKI, Illinois

                       Jon Clark, Staff Director
                  Matt Reel, Democratic Staff Director

              
              
              SUBCOMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND INVESTIGATIONS

               JENNIFER A. KIGGANS, Virginia, Chairwoman

AUMUA AMATA COLEMAN RADEWAGEN,       FRANK J. MRVAN, Indiana, Ranking 
    American Samoa                       Member
JACK BERGMAN, Michigan               CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire
MATTHEW M. ROSENDALE, SR., Montana   SHEILA CHERFILUS-MCCORMICK, 
                                         Florida

Pursuant to clause 2(e)(4) of Rule XI of the Rules of the House, public 
hearing records of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs are also 
published in electronic form. The printed hearing record remains the 
official version. Because electronic submissions are used to prepare 
both printed and electronic versions of the hearing record, the process 
of converting between various electronic formats may introduce 
unintentional errors or omissions. Such occurrences are inherent in the 
current publication process and should diminish as the process is 
further refined.
                        
                        C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                              ----------                              

                        THURSDAY, MARCH 21, 2024

                                                                   Page

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

The Honorable Jennifer A. Kiggans, Chairwoman....................     1
The Honorable Frank J. Mrvan, Ranking Member.....................     2

                               WITNESSES

Mr. John W. Boerstler, Chief Veterans Experience Officer, Office 
  of Human Resources and Administration/Operations, Security, and 
  Preparedness, U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs..............     4

        Accompanied by:

    Ms. Tracey Therit, Chief Human Capital Officer, Office of 
        Human Resources and Administration/Operations, Security, 
        and Preparedness, U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs

    Mr. David Perry, Chief Officer, Workforce Management and 
        Consulting, Veterans Health Administration, U.S. 
        Department of Veterans Affairs

    Mr. Charles Worthington, Chief Technology Officer, Office of 
        Information Technology, U.S. Department of Veterans 
        Affairs

Ms. Joycelyn Westbrooks, RN, Secretary-Treasurer, AFGE Local 
  1633, U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs......................     6

                                APPENDIX
                    Prepared Statements Of Witnesses

Mr. John W. Boerstler Prepared Statement.........................    21
Ms. Joycelyn Westbrooks, RN Prepared Statement...................    29

                       Statements For The Record

American Association of Nurse Anesthesiology Prepared Statement..    33
United Nurses Associations of California/Union of Health Care 
  Professionals Prepared Statement...............................    36
National Federation of Federal Employees, and Service Employees 
  International Union Prepared Statement.........................    37
Paralyzed Veterans of America Prepared Statement.................    39
Senior Executives Association Prepared Statement.................    41
The Honorable Matt Cartwright, U.S. House of Representatives, 
  (PA-8) Prepared Statement......................................    43
The Honorable Brandon Williams, U.S. House of Representatives, 
  (NY-22) Prepared Statement.....................................    43
The Honorable Michael Turner, U.S. House of Representatives, (OH-
  10) Prepared Statement.........................................    44

 
                         LEGISLATIVE HEARING ON
              H.R. 6452; H.R. 6531; H.R. 6538; H.R. 6874;
              H.R. 6947; H.R. 7342; H.R. XXXX; H.R. XXXX;
                             AND H.R. XXXX

                              ----------                              


                        THURSDAY, MARCH 21, 2024

             Subcommittee on Oversight and 
                            Investigations,
                    Committee on Veterans' Affairs,
                             U.S. House of Representatives,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 5:22 p.m., in 
room 360, Cannon House Office Building, Hon. Jen Kiggans 
[chairwoman of the subcommittee] presiding.
    Present: Representatives Kiggans, Radewagen, Rosendale, 
Mrvan, Landsman, and Pappas.
    Also present: Representatives Franklin, Stefanik, Valadeo.

      OPENING STATEMENT OF JENNIFER A. KIGGANS, CHAIRWOMAN

    Ms. Kiggans. Good afternoon. Thank you to our witnesses for 
being here today. I would like to thank the members who have 
sponsored bills on today's agenda who will be joining us.
    Before we proceed further I ask unanimous consent for 
Representatives Greg Landsman, Chairwoman Elise Stefanik, 
Representative Scott Franklin, and Representative David Valadao 
to participate in this hearing.
    The purpose of this hearing is to learn from stakeholders 
with expertise on each of these proposals so that we can make 
informed decisions about whether to move this legislation 
forward to improve the delivery of services at the Department 
of Veterans Affairs (VA).
    The invaluable insight provided by these members, 
stakeholders and agencies is essential to the work of this 
subcommittee.
    In today's hearing we will examine a variety of bills 
including bills that impact the VA's accessibility, pay and 
accountability.
    The agenda includes the Veterans Scam and Fraud Evasion 
Act, sponsored by Chairwoman Stefanik which would codify an 
office much needed to fight against scammers who target 
veterans, the VA Correct Compensation Act sponsored by Ranking 
Member Takano, which would attempt to ensure bureaucracy does 
not get in the way of paying medical professionals what they 
are legally owed, the Veterans Accessibility Advisory Committee 
Act sponsored by Representative Valadao, which would ensure 
veterans with disabilities have a seat at the decision-making 
table, and the VA Political Performance Disclosure Act 
sponsored by General Bergman, which would ensure our committee 
has full oversight of VA political appointee performance.
    I am eager to hear more from our members and witnesses 
about these bills and I want to thank our witnesses again for 
being here today and I look forward to our discussion.
    Now I recognize Ranking Member Mrvan for his opening 
remarks.

      OPENING STATEMENT OF FRANK J. MRVAN, RANKING MEMBER

    Mr. Mrvan. Thank you, Chair Kiggans. I am pleased that the 
subcommittee is considering several pieces of key legislation 
that will take steps toward ensuring that the VA workforce is 
supported and has the tools they need to provide world-class 
care our veterans.
    Today we are considering H.R. 6538, the VA Correct 
Compensation Act of 2023, a bill championed by Ranking Member 
and full committee Congressman Takano. I am proud to cosponsor 
this important piece of bipartisan legislation.
    This bill protects Title 38 VA employees' right to 
collectively bargain over issues with their pay. For instance, 
currently if a Title 38 VA nurse works overtime and that 
overtime is not reflected on their paystub the VA can limit 
that nurse's ability to grieve that error through the 
bargaining unit.
    The VA Correct Compensation Act is a critical tool to help 
with employee retention. Employees know they have the path to 
be made whole when there is an issue with the compensation.
    For years we have been hearing from Title 38 nurses and 
other critical medical center staff about how they are denied 
the collective bargaining rights that their Federal health care 
worker counterparts are afforded under the law.
    The last Congress, we came together to pass the VA 
Employees Fairness Act out of the House of Representatives. 
That bill addresses the limits the Secretary's authority to 
deny collective bargaining and grievance right for Title 38 VA 
medical professionals, including the employees who care for our 
veterans every day like Registered Nurses (RN) and Certified 
Registered Nurse Anesthetist (CRNA), physicians and physician 
assistants, dentists and more.
    Currently these frontline employees are prevented from 
raising grievances about issues such as professional training 
and patient safety policies that undermine patient care.
    There is still substantive policy disagreements among 
Members of Congress as to fixing this issue but I look forward 
to working with Ranking Member Takano to reintroduce the VA 
Employee Fairness Act soon and restore full collective 
bargaining rights for the VA Title 38 health care 
professionals.
    In the meantime, the VA Correct Compensation Act is an 
opportunity to make a bipartisan meaningful impact on union 
rights for VA medical professionals in the near term.
    What the VA Correct Compensation Act does is simple but 
incredibly important. This bill ensures there is a fair process 
that Title 38 VA employees can access to make them whole when 
there is an error in their pay. I appreciate the work done thus 
far from our union partners on this bill as well as the support 
of the Veterans Service Organizations (VSO).
    This bill is endorsed by the Service Employees 
International Union (SEIU), National Federation of Federal 
Employees (NFFE), the American Federation of State, County and 
Municipal Employees (AFSCME), the American Association of 
Nurses, and the Senior Executive Association.
    I would like to specifically thank the American Federation 
of Government Employees or the AFGE for their support and 
continued partnership with our committee to bring us issues and 
solutions to those issues the VA employees face.
    I would like to extend a warm welcome to Ms. Joycelyn 
Westbrooks, who is representative the AFGE today. Ms. 
Westbrooks has served as a registered nurse for the VA for 40 
years. Thank you for caring for our veterans, thank you for 
advocating for your fellow VA staff and thank you for being 
here.
    Throughout the AFGE's testimony we will hear that 
unfortunately errors in employee pay at the VA is a common 
problem and one that has affected far too many of their 
dedicated health professionals.
    In many instances VA has miscalculated or failed to pay 
staff for overtime, holiday work, or weekend shifts. In some 
cases, it has taken months for VA to get those employees the 
pay they have earned and are rightly owed.
    It is easy to imagine how errors in pay can affect an 
employee's livelihood and their morale. The VA Correct 
Compensation Act rectifies this inequity and I hope to see in 
advance--see it advance through this committee as soon as 
possible.
    I am also glad we are considering H.R. 6531, the Train VA 
Employees Act, introduced by former chairman of this 
subcommittee, Representative Pappas. This bill will--would 
improve the substandard management--the sub-standardized 
management training to all levels of supervisors and executives 
across VA, one of the core deficiencies my staff identified 
throughout this committee's investigation into sexual 
harassment at VA.
    I am proud to cosponsor the Train VA Employees Act and look 
forward to improving the text based on some of the testimony we 
received for this hearing. This committee has always held VA to 
the highest standard for the quality of care for veterans and 
should receive.
    We must also push VA to provide these same standards for 
the quality of work of the workforce and environment of the 
workplace. VA employees, many of whom are veterans as well 
deserve these rights and resources. The VA Correct Compensation 
Act and the Train VA Employees Act are steps in the right 
direction.
    As our recent joint VSO hearings highlighted education is a 
vital step in ensuring veterans and their families are aware of 
the resources available to them at the VA.
    The Veterans Affairs Centennial and Heritage Act of 2024, 
H.R. 6947, is a step in the right direction as it creates a VA 
history office in Dayton, Ohio.
    This bipartisan bill is cosponsored by my committee 
colleague, Representative Greg Landsman and would provide an 
outlet to recognize the critical work of VA and its employees 
over the last 100 years.
    I want to mention my concerns with H.R. 7734, the Required 
Notation Investigation and Personnel File Act. This bill would 
completely evade due process by requiring VA to annotate the 
personnel paperwork for employees who resign from their 
position amid an investigation before the investigation 
concludes and findings are made.
    By statute, VA is already required as all Federal agencies 
to permanently annotate a former employee's personnel file if 
that person leaves their position while under investigation and 
that investigation results in adverse findings. The current 
U.S. code also affords these former employees' appeal right as 
due process requires.
    It is unclear to me why this bill takes such an extreme 
approach that would duplicate existing law and add language 
that would likely result in years of litigation. Chair Kiggans, 
I hope our staffs can work together to address policy concerns 
with these pieces of legislation. I hope can advance the other 
bipartisan bills we will consider today.
    I yield back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Ranking Member Mrvan. Before we get 
to testimony I will introduce the witnesses on today's panel.
    On today's panel representing the Department of Veterans 
Affairs we have Mr. John Boerstler, VA's chief veterans 
experience officer. He is accompanied by Ms. Tracey Therit, 
VA's chief human capital officer, Mr. David Perry, chief 
officer for workforce management and consulting within the VA's 
Veteran Health Administration and Mr. Charles Worthington, 
chief technology officer for the VA's Office of Information 
Technology.
    Also, on our panel representing the America Federation of 
Government Employees we have Registered Nurse Joycelyn 
Westbrooks who is both the Secretary and Treasurer for AFGE 
Local 1633.
    I will ask the witnesses in our panel to please stand and 
raise your right hand to be sworn in.
    [Witnesses sworn.]
    Thank you. Let the record reflect that all witnesses 
answered in the affirmative. You may be seated.
    Mr. Boerstler, we will start with you. You are recognized 
for 5 minutes to provide your testimony.

                  STATEMENT OF JOHN BOERSTLER

    Mr. Boerstler. Well good afternoon and howdy. Thank you, 
Chairwoman Kiggans, Ranking Member Mrvan, and members of the 
committee. I appreciate the opportunity to represent the 
Department of Veterans Affairs and appear before you today to 
discuss these 9 bills.
    I am accompanied today by Ms. Tracey Therit, chief human 
capital officer, Human Resources and Administration/Operations, 
Security, and Preparedness, Mr. David Perry, chief officer 
workforce management and consulting, Veterans Health 
Administration, and Mr. Charles Worthington, chief technology 
officer, Office of Information Technology.
    We have provided detailed comments in the full testimony to 
include areas of support and concern noting certain provisions 
that could benefit from certain--from some clarification or 
amendment. We are thankful for your time today and look forward 
to working with the committee on these important bills.
    VA supports H.R. 6452 with amendments and subject to the 
availability of appropriations. This bill compliments the 
Veteran Scam and Fraud Evasion or VSAFE task force, an 
administration--which is an administration initiative launched 
in December 2023. Our suggest, our suggested amendment would 
support standing up a VSAFE office versus the creation of just 
one VSAFE officer billet.
    In line with H.R. 6452, VA announced our Fiscal Year 2025 
legislative proposal that seeks to codify the larger Veterans 
Experience Office, otherwise known as VEO, within which the 
VSAFE program operates.
    Codifying VEO permanently within statute would ensure that 
the veteran has a voice in policy formation and the decision-
making process permanently. VA supports H.R. 6531, the Train VA 
Employees Act subject to amendments and availability of 
appropriations.
    VA cites concerns with H.R. 6538, the VA Correct 
Compensation Act of 2023, but would be happy to work with the 
committee on an alternative approach that would require VA to 
establish an internal process whereby Title 38 employees could 
pursue allegations of compensation errors in violation of the 
law, rule, regulation, or policy outside the scope of 
collective bargaining.
    VA appreciates the intent of H.R. 6874, the VA Web Act, but 
cites concerns. While VA supports the intent of this bill, we 
believe that many have--many performance accountability 
mechanisms are in place already and that the types of system 
monitoring required by the bill are a natural part of software 
development.
    We are concerned with the implications of some of the 
bill's definition and reporting requirements which are 
discussed further in our written testimony.
    VA supports H.R. 6947, subject to the availability of 
appropriations. This bill could codify VA's establishment of a 
history office and provide clear authorities and statute that 
advance VA's effort to preserve its history formally to this 
office.
    VA does not support H.R. 7342, the Veterans Accessibility 
Advisory Committee Act of 2024. We believe this effort is 
duplicative of the efforts of numerous existing VA advisory 
committees. VA would welcome the opportunity to work with the 
committee to determine how we would address Congress's 
underlying concerns in the existing Federal advisory 
committees.
    VA supports the draft VA Medical Center weapons detection 
technology bill which would authorize the Secretary to carry 
out a pilot program to use weapon detection technology at the 
primary entrance of VA medical centers subject to the 
availability of appropriation.
    The VA supports the draft Required Notation of 
Investigation in Personnel Record File Act if amended and 
subject to appropriations. The bill would require a notation in 
the personnel record file of VA employees who resign from 
government employment prior to the resolution of associated 
personnel investigation.
    Our suggested amendments would seek to clarify and conform 
which employees are covered by the bill and to ensure that the 
required due process and appeal rights are afforded.
    Last, VA does not support the draft Reporting Performance 
Plans for VA Political Appointees Act, which would require the 
blanket submission of political appointee performance plans.
    VA administers a performance management system that holds 
all political appointees accountable for individual and 
organizational performance. We are concerned with this bill's 
exclusive focus on political appointees as well as the 
challenge of balancing accountability with the confidentiality 
of personnel records. We welcome the ability to have further 
discussions with Congress to meet your needs while balancing 
these requirements.
    The Department of Veterans Affairs remains steadfast in our 
commitment to keep veterans and their families at the center of 
everything we do. Thank you all for the opportunity to discuss 
the legislation before the committee. We look forward to 
working with you and to addressing any questions you may have.

    [The Prepared Statement Of John Boerstler Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Mr. Boerstler.
    The written statement of Mr. Boerstler will be entered into 
the hearing record. Ms. Westbrooks, you are now recognized for 
5 minutes to provide your testimony.

                STATEMENT OF JOYCELYN WESTBROOKS

    Ms. Westbrooks. Good afternoon, Chairwoman Kiggans, Ranking 
Member Mrvan, and members of the subcommittee, thank you for 
inviting AFGE to today's hearing. My name is Joycelyn 
Westbrooks and I am the secretary-treasurer for AFGE Local 1633 
at the Michael E. DeBakey VA Medical Center in Houston, Texas.
    For the past 40 years I have had the honor of serving our 
Nation's veterans as a registered nurse at the VA, the Nation's 
best healthcare system. On behalf of AFGE and its national VA 
council representing over 300,000 VA employees including 75,000 
Title 38 employees, I am here today to strongly endorse H.R. 
6538, the VA Correct Compensation Act, or VACCA. This 
bipartisan bill is also endorsed by our sister unions NFFE, 
SEIU, and AFSCME, as well as the nurse anesthetists and our VSO 
partners, Disabled American Veterans (DAV), Paralyzed Veterans 
of America (PVA), and the American Legion.
    The legislation will limit the agency's power to deny 
grievances challenging routine payroll errors affecting Title 
38 clinicians. Since the enactment of 7422 in 1991, the VA has 
used this authority to deny grievances related to the 
establishment, determination, or adjustment of employee 
compensation.
    For years, this committee has examined ways to amend 7422 
including the VA Employee Fairness Act. I raised this bill 
because through spirited debate a census--consensus emerged 
that the VA has misused its authority under 7422 to routinely 
not pay payroll errors.
    Chairman Bost and Ranking Member Takano have built on that 
common ground and crafted a bill that we can enact this 
Congress. The fruit of that labor is VACC, a technical 
correction to the 7422 statute that defines the compensation 
exception in 7422 and explicitly prevents the VA from denying 
grievances contesting that a covered employee has received a 
correct compensation as required by law, rule, regulation, or 
binding agreement.
    This commonsense bill will allow employees to file a 
grievance and have a fair process to make themselves whole. 
Unfortunately, payroll errors are a common problem at the VA.
    Too often the VA fails to accurately calculate if a covered 
employee worked overtime, the night shift, weekend shift or 
holiday. If the affected employee is a Title 38 hybrid, that 
employee could easily file a grievance and receive the money 
they are owed under the law.
    However, if an employee is a pure Title 38 employee the VA 
threatens and does invoke 7422 to deny the grievance with the 
employee losing the ability to receive the compensation they 
are rightfully owed.
    In practice that means that an RN does not have the rights 
as an Licensed Practical Nurse (LPN), an optometrist does not 
have the same rights an audiologist, and a psychiatrist does 
not have the same rights as psychologist. Beyond this 
inequality over 30 years the VA's use of this authority has 
discouraged employees from even filing grievances to correct 
their pay and that harms retention.
    A clear example of this arises from the Asheville, North 
Carolina VA where AFGE filed a grievance on behalf of the 
nurses claiming the VA failed to pay the nurses night 
differential and weekend pay. An arbitrator ruled in favor of 
AFGE but the VA refused to pay citing 7422. The undersecretary 
for health reaffirmed its use of 7422 denying the grievance.
    In 2007 the VA failed to accurately pay for overtime in 
Buffalo, New York. The VA chose nurse practitioners to work 
eight Saturdays to address a backlog. That year United American 
Nurses (UAN) and National Nurses United (NNU) filed a grievance 
alleging that management owed the employees Saturday premium 
pay in addition to the overtime pay. The VA invoked 7422 
denying the grievances.
    Beyond these examples I want to share why this bill hits 
home for me. My dad was a decorated Army veteran. He passed 
away at 52 from cancer. My family and I forever appreciate the 
VA for the instrumental part it played in his final days. When 
my dad needed more intensive care then could be provided 
locally, they VA airlifted him to a regional hospital to 
receive that care. Those nurses and doctors who cared for him 
are our sheroes and heroes.
    Title 38 staff in VA hospitals across America are answering 
the call for so many families in meeting the demands and needs 
of our veterans. We have a basic responsibility to correctly 
compensate these providers as we do other staff. Congress never 
intended for 7422 to permit the VA to deny grievance over 
routine payroll errors and unlawfully without the compensation 
due to its employees.
    When I grew up you pay people what they are owed for an 
honest day's work. This is not Democratic or Republican, but 
American, and not complicated, but common sense. By passing the 
VA Correct Compensation Act, Congress can prevent problems and 
force the VA to pay Title 38 clinicians what they are owed 
under law. Thank you and I am happy to answer any questions.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Joycelyn Westbrooks Appears In 
The Appendix]

    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Ms. Westbrooks.
    The written statement of Ms. Westbrooks will be entered 
into the hearing record.
    We will now turn to questions and I yielded to Chairwoman 
Stefanik 5 minutes.
    Ms. Stefanik. Thank you, Chairwoman Kiggans, for the 
opportunity to join the VA committee today for this important 
legislative hearing and while I do not serve on this committee, 
this hearing as all VA hearings are critical for veterans both 
across my district in New York 21, home to the largest number 
of veterans in New York State and across this country.
    My bill is one of the bills under discussion today and it 
addresses a matter that affects all of our Nation's veterans, 
the rise of fraud and scams targeting those who have bravely 
served our country. The statistics are staggering and we have 
worked with many constituents who have faced these frauds and 
scams.
    According to the Federal Trade Commission (FTC), over 
74,000 military retirees and veterans reported instances of 
fraud or identify theft in 2023 alone, resulting a collective 
loss of 350 million hard-earned dollars. These scams came in 
various forms including fake debt collectors, credit card 
fraud, benefits fraud, and fake job opportunities just to name 
a few.
    Criminals often exploit veterans trust by impersonating 
government officials or representatives of well-known financial 
institutions making it difficult for our veterans to discern 
the truth from deceit. We must act to better protect our 
veterans against these malicious actors.
    That is why I introduced the bipartisan Veterans Scam and 
Fraud Evasion Act knows as the VSAFE Act. I appreciate those 
supportive comments, Mr. Boerstler. This significant bill aims 
to permanently establish an office within the VA dedicated to 
leading all fraud prevention efforts.
    Currently the VA lacks a centralized approach codified in 
law to combat fraud with various offices operating in a 
decentralized manner. My VSAFE Act bill will rectify this by 
providing oversight and coordination of all fraud prevention 
efforts within the VA ensuring these activities are coordinated 
across the entire department.
    My bipartisan bill, H.R. 6452, the VSAFE Act represents a 
crucial step toward safeguarding our Nation's veterans from 
fraudulent activities by codifying into law a dedicated 
organization within the VA and fostering collaboration across 
government agencies. We can and we will better protect those 
who have sacrificed so much for our country.
    I thank the Chair for holding this hearing and I urge my 
colleagues to support this bipartisan bill as we work it 
through the legislative process through the committee and on 
the floor.
    My question is for you, Mr. Boerstler. Can you tell me why 
the VSAFE Act that I have introduced, why it is important to 
have a one stop shop for veterans where they can go to in times 
of crisis as they are facing this unprecedented threat of 
frauds and scams?
    Mr. Boerstler. Well yes, and thank you, Congresswoman, for 
your support and for introducing the bill. I think it is 
incredibly important and for many different reasons and the 
$350 million metric you mentioned a second ago, that is just 
what has gone reported. We have no idea how many more millions 
have impacted our military, our veterans and----
    Ms. Stefanik. Good point.
    Mr. Boerstler [continuing]. families. We do need a 
centralized effort here not only within the Department of 
Veterans Affairs but within the broader Federal landscape 
because there are many different agencies that have enforcement 
authorities and reporting authorities and we want that one 
central phone number for veterans and their families to call, 
one website to go to so that they cannot only identify ways to 
protect themselves against different scam and fraud efforts but 
also report these efforts so that we can track them down and 
prevent it from happening to other veterans and families.
    Ms. Stefanik. Well thank you. Thank you for your support of 
the legislation. I know you have some recommendations from the 
VA. We look forward to working with you on some of those 
recommendations as we move this process forward. With that I 
yield back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Chairwoman Stefanik. I will now 
yield myself 5 minutes for questions.
    Mr. Boerstler, this question is for you. As a geriatric 
nurse practitioner, it was not uncommon for me to hear about 
patients and veterans who were targeted by fraudsters and it 
was very stressful for these guys. They had a hard time using 
computers anyway or using their phones or tablets and when they 
were victim to a--either a phone call or something that 
appeared on their, on their computer it was very stressful and 
often times resulted in the loss of a lot of money and an 
invasion of their privacy.
    How will the VSAFE office, which I am very excited about 
and very supportive of specifically combat fraud against older 
veterans and how will you be able to get that message of what 
you are offering in that office, you know, to your patients and 
to our veterans?
    Mr. Boerstler. Well, thank you, Chairwoman, and especially 
our elderly veterans and their families are being specifically 
targeted by many of these predatory actors and we have 
identified many different types of pension poaching or identity 
theft or romance schemes that have specifically targeting them.
    What we are planning to do and we are already doing is not 
only identifying which offices can provide more information to 
these individuals but more specifically reach out in the 
channels that are available to us via letter, via phone call, 
via text message, via email, however we can it in the hands of 
our veterans and their caregivers and families.
    It is critically important that they know not only as I 
mentioned a second ago how to identify these types of scam and 
predatory actors and attempts but where to report, to which 
Federal agency has which--has jurisdiction and they should not 
have to figure that out themselves. We should make it much 
easier for them.
    I think the VA and having VA.gov especially as a, as a 
trusted website that veterans already go to and 1-800-MYVA411 
is a trusted number for veterans to call and their families to 
call. We want to be that coordination entity and help our 
Federal partners in engaging and protecting more veterans.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you. A good PR campaign enlisting local 
media and let us know how we can help spread that word so they 
know that resource is available to them too.
    Mr. Boerstler. Thank you.
    Ms. Kiggans. For me living in the Commonwealth of Virginia 
and representing Virginia Beach, we have so much great history 
especially in the Commonwealth and I am a history buff. I am 
also the wife of an Ohio Navy veteran, so I am very excited the 
VA is planning to preserve our Nation's history in Ohio. Mr. 
Boerstler, how does the VA's history office plan to collect and 
preserve artifacts?
    Mr. Boerstler. We are--we have done a tremendous amount in 
the past many years of collecting and preserving artifacts and 
I think we have bolstered those efforts with the VA history 
office in particular by hiring folks that have these specific 
skillsets and to really bring it up to par to other Federal 
agencies and their permanent, permanent history offices.
    I think the fact that the museum itself will be eventually 
located on campus at the Dayton, Ohio VA Medical Center, and 
it, throughout its history is one of the National Old Soldiers 
homes is incredibly important and so the--Mike Visconage and 
the VA History Office team has already done a great job to 
collect and identify these artifacts.
    More importantly preserve them for future generations of 
not only veterans but Americans and I think and it cannot be 
understated how important this is for employee experience, for 
us as VA employees and the many, many hundreds of thousands who 
serve our veterans and families can see themselves reflected in 
this effort.
    Ms. Kiggans. Very much so. When I worked at the VA hospital 
in Hampton, Virginia for a short time I remember on my 
lunchbreak I would go to the front to--we had a very old part 
of the hospital was a Civil War hospital and they had a very 
small, just a museum but it was fascinating to see the pictures 
and to recognize the different parts of the hospital that were 
still there and to have that history preserved. Thank you very 
much for preserving that for us.
    Mrs. Therit, as chairwoman of the subcommittee I witnessed 
instances where VA employees have prioritized politics over 
serving our veterans. How is the Department making sure that 
political appointees annual performance plans keep them 
accountable to the veterans they serve and keeps hyper 
partisanship out of serving our veterans?
    Ms. Therit. Chairwoman Kiggans, thank you for that 
question. VA looks forward to working with the committee on the 
political performance plan bill and making sure that we 
strengthen the bill to ensure that it reflects the work that we 
are doing to make sure political appointees as well as career 
senior executives are held to the same performance standards.
    Currently we have 38 USC 725. In that bill we are required 
to make sure that our Schedule C appointees as well as our 
political appointees are on performance plans. We use an 
enterprise-wide performance management Information Technology 
(IT) system to track those plans, to track the evaluations that 
our careers and our politicals receive.
    We are also under OPM regulations, the Office of Personnel 
Management to have a certified performance management system 
that meets all the criteria for General Schedule (GS) as well 
as political appointees. We have a lot of internal controls in 
place.
    We are making sure that political appointees are held to 
the same standards as our career employees. You have two 
examples sitting in front of you. Mr. Boerstler is a non-career 
Senior Executive Service (SES). I am a career SES.
    We go through the same process. Our plans, our end of year 
appraisals go to a performance review board and then they go to 
the secretary of the Department of Veterans Affairs for 
approval. We have internal controls. We follow the guidance 
from the Office of Personnel Management to make sure that those 
processes are in place and that they are fair and equitable and 
everybody is being held accountable.
    Our concern with the bill as drafted--and we welcome the 
opportunity to discuss these concerns--is the exclusive focus 
on political appointees. We want to be able to balance the need 
for accountability with the need for protecting the 
confidentiality of these personnel records that are private and 
sensitive in nature.
    We look forward to working with the committee to ensure 
that the intent and the goals that you have whether through 
data, through reports or other mechanisms are met by the 
Department of Veterans Affairs.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you for comments. My time has expired 
and I now yield to Ranking Member Mrvan for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Mrvan. Thank you, Chairwoman. Ms. Therit or Mr. Perry, 
thank you for your testimony on the VA Correct Compensation Act 
ensuring VA Title 38 employees have access to the same 
collective bargaining rights as their hybrid VA other Federal 
agency employee peers is a priority for me.
    VA's testimony states that you are actively focused on 
correctly paying employees and plan to seek input from labor 
partners on a new internal process.
    Can you please describe what this internal process will be 
and how it will be different or it will differ from the current 
grievance procedure for hybrid employees?
    Mr. Perry. Thank you, Representative Mrvan for that 
question. The internal process that we are referring to would 
be a new process to establish a review to allow us to address 
errors when they do occur.
    Title 38 as you mentioned is covered currently under 7422, 
which does not have that ability now. This process would be a 
joint effort that increases the transparency so when errors do 
occur that are pay impacting we have that review process that 
gets adjudicated to ensure that those corrections do occur.
    Title 38 hybrids do cover--or fall under the GS or the 
general schedule provisions now so they do have the ability to 
grieve errors which is different than what the Title 38 
employees currently have. This internal process seeks to 
address that to give more parity along with fixing errors when 
they do arise.
    Mr. Mrvan. How does the VA position on the VA Correct 
Compensation Act square with the statement of the 
administration policy issued by President Biden in 2022 in 
support of the VA Employees Fairness Act?
    Mr. Perry. I think our position on that bill is again, we 
seek for the same goal. We do want to make sure that we do not 
allow errors to occur and when they do we get those fixed 
promptly.
    I think the legislation that we are seeing--that we have in 
front of this draft we support the intent, like I mentioned, 
but we do need some modifications and want to work with the 
committee on those modifications.
    As written now it actually allows for the negotiability and 
grievance of pay setting and pay change, so when we make 
changes to rates of pay. That is different than when errors 
occur and so that is what we want to work with the committee on 
to get those modifications addressed so we can get to the 
intent of what this legislation is seeking to fix which is the 
pay errors that need to be corrected.
    Mr. Mrvan. Just off the cuff, the new process in what you--
what you are speaking of, nurses who are working overtime who 
are not paid, what does that mean to them as far as the 
timeline, even though you have this new process and you use 
term promptly, what should they be looking at as far as when 
that will be corrected and when they will actually get paid?
    Mr. Perry. Yes, sir, and I think that is where we are 
looking to work collaboratively with our labor partners to 
establish what those timelines should be so that it is done 
expeditiously. I think we want to get them fixed as quickly as 
possible.
    As Ms. Westbrooks had testified to, we absolutely know that 
employees deserve to be paid and compensated for the work they 
have done and so we want to work collaboratively to set up what 
that timeframe should be to get to the resolution of pay 
errors.
    Mr. Mrvan. Okay. Ms. Westbrooks.
    Ms. Westbrooks. Yes.
    Mr. Mrvan. Thank you again for being here today and for 
your tireless commitment to caring for our Nation's veterans as 
the VA nurse.
    In recent congresses this committee has taken up pieces of 
legislation that would ensure key bargaining rights to the 
Title 38 VA medical staff. Some members of this committee have 
argued that providing these rights would affect patient care. 
However, I am glad that many of us on both sides of the aisle 
agree that the VA medical professionals deserve the pay that 
they have earned.
    Can you describe the impact the VA Correct Compensation Act 
will have on the VA's ability to recruit and retain the best 
workforce to care for our Nation's veterans and does this issue 
matter to your membership?
    Ms. Westbrooks. Thank you Ranking Member for that question, 
Mrvan, thank you so much. Yes, actually this is very important 
to our clinicians, our Title 38 at our VAs. I understand what 
you are saying about another process, but we are asking that 
the process be the process that is already in place for the 
hybrid Title 38s.
    I have nurses that onboard, physicians, physician 
assistants that onboard with the wrong salaries, with--they do 
not get their--the nurses they do not get their differentials, 
their holiday pay, their weekend pay and presently they do not 
have the ability to grieve these instances as the hybrid Title 
38s.
    Unfortunately, some will stay. We try to work with the 
agency to work through them. The process can be sometimes a 
year or 2 years getting settled because nurses, doctors, 
physician assistants, hybrid practice, podiatrists, they have 
many, many choices. A lot of times they will not stay.
    This is what I say. I have been with the VA a long time and 
I believe in its mission but if we say that we want to take 
care of America's heroes then we have to retain the best and 
the brightest.
    You will never pay them what they are worth. There is no 
salary. They should be paid what they are due. They should be 
paid what is--what we say that we owe them and they should not 
have to fight about it.
    I understand about doing things expeditiously but that does 
not happen unfortunately. We lose wonderful staff because of it 
and I have seen it over these 40 years time and time again.
    Mr. Mrvan. Thank you, Ms. Westbrooks. With that I yield 
back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Mr. Mrvan. The chair now yields 5 
minutes to Representative Rosendale.
    Mr. Rosendale. Thank you very much, Chairwoman Kiggans for 
holding this hearing. During the 118th Congress in my role as 
the chairman of the Technology Modernization subcommittee, we 
have had two hearings on the problems with VA.gov. They were 
major problems and we have had to shed light on the negative 
impacts they have caused for our veterans
    In January 2023, the VA notified the Veterans Affairs 
Committee that roughly 31,000 veterans had been identified 
whose disability compensation claims submitted to the VA.gov 
were rejected due to processing errors going back to November 
2018.
    Worse yet the website did not notify the veterans of their 
failed submissions leaving them in them in the dark about not 
receiving their benefits. It is actually quite disappointing 
that the veterans would wait so long, months, 6 months, a year, 
not even recognizing that their benefits had not been 
registered for because they are so conditioned to having these 
delays to receive any kind of information, communication, or 
benefit from the VA. Think about that. That is how conditioned 
that the veterans have become. That is disappointing.
    During the week of August 7, 2023, approximately 5,600 
veterans received an error message on VA.gov that their 
submissions did not go through. This was the last week for the 
veterans to submit intents to file under the The Sergeant First 
Class Heath Robinson Honoring our Promise to Address 
Comprehensive Toxics (PACT) Act that we had a lot of discussion 
about earlier today. Upon learning of this I immediately worked 
with Secretary McDonough to move back the deadline a week 
allowing more veterans to get the retroactive benefits that 
they deserve.
    On September 5, the VA disclosed that roughly 56,000 
veterans request to add or remove dependents were not processed 
potentially causing them to be underpaid or overpaid going back 
to 2011, causing major problems in either direction.
    These errors by the VA are unacceptable and have caused a 
lot of stress to veterans and their families. Our veterans 
should not be having difficulty accessing benefits that they 
have earned because of failures by VA.gov.
    My bill H.R. 6874, the Watching Over Electronic Benefits 
Act, would address these problems by requiring the VA to 
implement a process to actively monitor the VA.gov website for 
any adverse events that would impact the facilitation, 
maintenance, or receipt of the VA benefits. The legislation 
would ensure that the errors are identified and improve 
Congress's ability to conduct proper oversight.
    Additionally, my legislation would require a testing 
strategy by the VA to reduce the number of adverse events that 
happen by improving testing for each modification or software 
update to anything that might impact the facilitation, 
maintenance, or receipt of the benefits. This would get to the 
crux of the issue by preventing problems before they occur and 
create the potential harm for our veterans. We owe it to our 
Nation's heroes to have the VA.gov website that is easy to use 
and mistake free.
    Mr. Worthington, it is good to see you again here today. I 
am glad the VA supports the intention of my bill and I am 
willing to work with you to refine the definitions and refine 
these timeframes to make sure that we can find something that 
actually works.
    The testimony provided by the VA states in part, the 
Department has many performance accountability mechanisms in 
place but we still have a lot of errors that are going on. Do 
you think the current mechanisms are adequate or is there room 
for improvement helping us to reduce these errors which deny 
the benefits delivery?
    Mr. Worthington. Thank you, Congressman, for the question. 
As you know we definitely agree with you that the errors 
encountered earlier this year are unacceptable and we are 
working hard to make sure that nothing like that would happen 
again.
    I think that the--we would love to work together on 
refining those definitions. I think that the ability to 
identify problems is much stronger than it was earlier this 
year in part thanks to the oversight work that you all did with 
us. I think that the main, as you mentioned, the main concerns 
we want to work through with you are refining those reporting 
requirements so that we are really focusing our teams on those 
most important issues that are really impacting veterans as 
they were by those earlier incidents.
    Mr. Rosendale. Okay. Again definitions to me are critical. 
In any kind of legislation that we develop at all, it really 
needs to be, to be a very objective and refined to the point 
that everybody understands that they are talking about the same 
thing and the timeframes again I am willing to work with.
    Identifying a problem, this timeframe should be very, very 
short. Notifications should be very, very short and then 
response, we have to, have to work on. Thank you very much. 
Madam Chair, I yield back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Mr. Rosendale. The chair now yields 
5 minutes to Representative Landsman.
    Mr. Landsman. Thank you, Madam Chair, for this hearing and 
the opportunity to participate. I want to thank my neighbor and 
colleague, Representative Mike Turner, who represents the 
future VA history center in Dayton. He introduced this 
legislation on the House side. He has done a lot of work as you 
all know in securing the funding and private sector support to 
allow the project to succeed.
    I just wanted to say a few words on behalf of the bill. I 
also want to thank Senator Sherod Brown for taking the lead on 
the Senate side along with Senator Vance and for always keeping 
us organized and working together for Ohio.
    The Dayton VA is one of three historic VAs in the country. 
It was one of the branches of the National Home for Disabled 
Veteran Soldiers and is older than the VA itself, the 
Department of VA. In fact, several of the buildings were 
actually built by Union war veterans who lived there after the 
war.
    Today the facility serves thousands of veterans on its 
unique campus including many of my constituents in Warren 
County. Many additional constituents of mine travel from the 
district to work at the Dayton VA campus.
    Once completed the history center will house a VA museum, 
event center, education center, archives, and research 
facility.
    The VA Centennial and Heritage Act would ensure that VA 
employees, veterans and their families have access to Southwest 
Ohio's rich history with the VA for years to come. It is a 
bipartisan, bicameral bill and it would establish a veterans 
affairs history office within the VA to coordinate and build 
ongoing--this ongoing effort.
    The bill gives the secretary of the VA also--it also gives 
the secretary of the VA the authority to accept gifts and 
donations and work with nonprofits to help fund the office and 
carry out its mission.
    It is my hope that the VA history center will help educate 
Americans on the history of the VA and remind them of the 
importance of delivering for those who have served our country. 
I also hope that the centralized archives will serve as a 
helpful resource for veterans and those who have loved ones who 
served and have enrolled in the VA system.
    Ultimately we believe that this will help increase 
awareness of VA programs and benefits and will help bring more 
and more VA--veterans into the VA family and being the VA 
closer to communities and with that I just want to say thank 
you again, Madam Chair and I yield back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Mr. Landsman. The chair now 
recognizes Representative Franklin for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Franklin. Thank you, Madam Chairman. My bill H.R. 7734, 
requires transparency in how the VA records disciplinary action 
against retiring or resigning personnel under investigation for 
inappropriate behavior. Specifically, it directs the VA to make 
permanent notation of any investigation and its findings in the 
permanent record of employees.
    This is especially important in cases involving staff who 
resign or retire to avoid scrutiny or evade repercussions. In 
2016, House Veterans Committee hearing, this panel discussed a 
troubling recurring practice at the VA. The VA often enters 
settlement agreements with resigning employees or those under 
review for disciplinary actions instead of following 
established procedures through completion.
    Between 2014 and 2016, the committee reviewed more than 200 
settlements provided by the VA of personnel who resigned while 
under investigation. Shockingly in 96 percent of these 
settlements, the disciplinary action proposed or taken against 
the employee did not appear anywhere in their permanent record 
form.
    More recently in September 2023, my colleagues and I 
learned of allegations of sexual misconduct at the VA by 
credible whistleblowers who did not trust the VA's internal 
investigations process. On November 13, 45 days after the 
committee initially contacted Secretary McDonough about these 
allegations, the alleged perpetrator and staff believe to have 
knowledge of the incidents were either reassigned by the VA or 
allowed to retire. That is unacceptable.
    The VA staff should never be allowed to hide behind 
settlement agreements, resign or retire to evade accountability 
for their misconduct. I fully believe in due process but the VA 
is not exercising due process. Cutting deals sweeps potential 
wrongdoing under the rug. Our veterans and all Americans 
certainly deserve better than that and I urge colleagues to 
support my bill to close this loophole and hold VA personnel 
accountable. Thank you, Madam Chair and I yield back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Representative Franklin. The chair 
now yields 5 minutes to Representative Radewagen.
    Ms. Radewagen. Talofa, thank you, Chairwoman Kiggans, and 
Ranking Member Mrvan for holding this hearing. Thank you to the 
panel for your testimony.
    Ms. Westbrooks, what challenges and problems do you hear 
from your members about the management style of their 
supervisors? Do you believe the workplace culture is dependent 
on good leaders?
    Ms. Westbrooks. Thank you for that question. Some of the 
challenges that we face with supervisors and managers is that 
we need to do more joint trainings, more partnerships so that 
everybody understands the master agreement, we are all in 
congruency with how things are supposed to go because that 
makes for a better working atmosphere.
    At the end of the day, AFGE as well as the agency wants the 
veteran to have the best experience that they can have. I 
believe that we have the same mission but a lot of times we get 
supervisors that are not trained, that do not know anything 
about the procedures and policies of the VA or the master 
agreement and so it creates an atmosphere that does not have to 
exist because we are on the same page, if we can stay on the 
same page. Sometimes they do not know where the page is and so 
that is where we come into play.
    I--at Houston I can tell you though our leadership, they 
are partners with us. We have a partnership across the board 
and then we even have a nursing partnership there. We are very 
proactive but that is not the case across the Nation. I think a 
lot of times we get a lot done.
    Houston is large. We are complex. We understand, you know, 
that there are going to be issues but we also want to come to 
the table to resolve the issues at the lowest level possible 
and to make sure that the veteran is always the center of what 
we do. That is what I tell the staff. We are going to always do 
what is best for that patient.
    Ms. Radewagen. Thank you. Ms. Therit, does VA often suspend 
an investigation when the subject of that investigation resigns 
or retires? Mr. Franklin talked about that a little bit.
    Ms. Therit. Representative Radewagen, VA supports the bill 
on annotating personnel records when an individual is under--
during a personnel investigation. We currently are looking at 
ways that we can work with the committee to strengthen the bill 
as well as to look at the legislation, regulations, and statute 
that is currently on the books.
    We mention 5 USC 3322. That is currently in place and how 
that works is that when an individual resigns during a pending 
investigation as defined in the legislation an annotation is 
made in their record.
    We also have mechanisms that the Office of Personnel 
Management has given us to the question that you mentioned 
about suspensions. If a suspension or a removal is proposed 
there are ways that an individual's record can be coded with an 
lieu of involuntary action coding.
    When we look at the bill as it is written we want to make 
sure that we clarify the intent and understand how it compares 
to things that we already have in place or how it adds to those 
things that we have in place.
    Some of the ways in which we would identify strengthening 
the current bill are making sure that it covers hybrid Title 38 
employees, making sure that it covers senior executives as 
written. We also acknowledged that I think as written it covers 
resignations. We also want it to reflect retirements and 
transfers between Federal agencies.
    Ms. Radewagen. Right.
    Ms. Therit. And the due process provisions that are in 5 
USC 3322 as well.
    We also want to make sure that we are clear in terms of 
what personnel investigations would fall under the legislation 
so that we can comply and we can meet the intent of the law 
with the resources that are needed to be able to do that.
    Ms. Radewagen. If ongoing investigations are not annotated 
in an employee's permanent file is not there a risk that the 
employee could come back to VA or another Federal agency a few 
years after they have resigned or retired?
    Ms. Therit. I know as a hiring manager I would want to know 
that information as I am considering someone for a position. I 
think the key is to be able to understand as Representative 
Rosendale mentioned earlier, what is the definition of a 
personnel investigation? What is the expectation of the VA in 
annotating that record either during the investigation or after 
an adverse action has been proposed or after somebody leaves 
the agency, so I think seeking clarification so that we are 
clear in the law as written and that we can meet those 
expectations that you and the other members of the committee 
have.
    Ms. Radewagen. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. Yield back.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Mrs. Radewagen. The chair now 
recognizes Representative Valadao for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Valadao. Thank you, Chairwoman Kiggans, Ranking Member 
Mrvan and all members of the subcommittee for your time today.
    Our veterans sacrifice so much for our Nation and we owe it 
to them to provide the highest quality of care. Sadly, many of 
our disabled veterans in my district and across the country are 
facing barriers in accessing the critical services they need.
    From struggling with physical infrastructure at VA 
facilities to navigating the red tape in the benefits process, 
disabled veterans are getting left behind. Doorways are too 
narrow, elevators that are constantly out of service and exam 
rooms that are not big enough to accommodate wheelchairs are 
just a few of the obstacles veterans face when trying to 
receive care.
    Serving disabled veterans is a critical part of the VA's 
mission but they need to do more to ensure unique needs of 
disabled veterans are being heard. By establishing a permanent 
advisory committee within the VA, this bill ensures disabled 
veterans have a seat at the table in providing feedback so they 
can easily access the benefits, services, and facilities they 
have earned.
    We cannot leave our disabled veterans behind. I urge all 
members of this committee to support this legislation. Thank 
you.
    Ms. Kiggans. Thank you, Mr. Valadao. The panel is now 
excused from the witness table and let us see, thank you again 
to our witnesses for being here today. I ask unanimous consent 
that all members shall have 5 legislative days in which to 
revised and extend their remarks and include any extraneous 
materials. Hearing no objections so ordered, this hearing is 
now adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 6:15 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]        
    
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                         A  P  P  E  N  D  I  X

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                    Prepared Statements of Witnesses

                              ----------                              


                  Prepared Statement of John Boerstler

    Good afternoon, Chairwoman Kiggans, Ranking Member Mrvan, and 
Members of the Subcommittee. I appreciate the opportunity to appear 
before you today to discuss pending legislation affecting a wide 
variety of administrations and program offices at the Department of 
Veterans Affairs (VA). Accompanying me today are Ms. Tracey Therit, 
Chief Human Capital Officer, Human Resources and Administration/
Operations, Security, and Preparedness; Mr. David Perry, Chief Officer, 
Workforce Management and Consulting, Veterans Health Administration; 
and Mr. Charles Worthington, Chief Technology Officer, Office of 
Information and Technology.

H.R. 6452 - Veterans Scam and Fraud Evasion (VSAFE) Act

    H.R. 6452 would establish a Fraud Evasion Officer within the 
Department of Veterans Affairs. This position would be responsible for 
scam and fraud prevention, reporting, and incident response plans at 
the Department.
    VA supports this bill, if amended, and subject to the availability 
of appropriations.
    VSAFE has existed as a cross-enterprise project team since January 
2023. At that time, it was recognized that there are a number of 
offices all doing great work in the Veteran targeted fraud space. 
However, there was opportunity for coordination of efforts, cross-
pollination, and partnered response both within VA and in conjunction 
with Federal, State, local, tribal and community partners.
    Examples of this work include robust consumer protection outreach 
efforts in all formats by the Veterans Benefits Administration, the 
Veterans Health Administration, Office of Technology, and Office of the 
Inspector General. This includes electronic media, print media, 
targeted outreach events, sharing of resources with community partners 
to get the word out, and a dedicated call center for reporting. Larger 
outreach campaigns, conducted nationwide and in concert with our 
partners, can reach up to 31 million Veterans.
    VA fraud protection and response groups also engage in advanced 
detection capabilities and proactive response wherever possible. A good 
example of proactive response comes from the Veterans Benefits 
Administration, which sent email notifications via GovDelivery to 
587,720 Veterans within 24 hours of a change being made to their direct 
deposit banking information in Fiscal Year 2023. Such alerts tell 
Veterans what to do if they did not make these changes. They also 
investigated 12,474 referrals for potential benefits fraud and provided 
one-on-one remediation support for payment redirect fraud to 1,164 
victims, protecting $847,494 of Veterans benefits from being stolen by 
fraudsters through prevention or recovery (returned by Treasury from 
the fraudulent bank account).
    The same is true for our fellow VSAFE Federal partners, to include 
the Department of Education, Department of Justice, Department of 
Defense, Social Security Administration, Internal Revenue Service, 
Federal Trade Commission, Federal Communications Commission, and 
Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. Ongoing conversations and 
partnering have resulted in simplifying navigation for Veterans and 
their families as well as creation of the ``no wrong door approach''. 
The goal has been to amplify the efficacy of outreach, detection, and 
shared response to Veteran targeting attempts by ``bad actors.'' 
Several prime examples include the most recent socialization of the 
combined tool kit resource, several jointly developed one-page consumer 
protection fliers, and jointly released blogs. These materials were 
force multiplied by sharing them with over 400 community partners, 
through the same channels just mentioned, and with Federal and 
community partners. Ongoing collaborative work will continue to hone 
this ``no wrong door'' and ``easy to find'' front door for Veterans and 
their families to find the information and support they need to 
recognize predatory activity, to protect themselves, and to get help 
when, where, and how they need it.
    While VA appreciates H.R. 6452 and its codification of a permanent 
Veteran Scam and Fraud Evasion or ``VSAFE'' program office function, VA 
seeks to further expand the language to increase the success of the 
program office and would support the bill if amended as described 
below.
    The recommendations are based in the foundational tenets of VSAFE, 
which are to simplify and coordinate the navigation of resources, and 
to enhance backstage partnership for detection and response regarding 
Veteran targeted predatory activity. It is recognized in all sectors 
that fraud is continually evolving and is more prevalent than ever. It 
is critical for organizations like VA to act as force multipliers to 
effectively fortify Veterans, their families, and caregivers against 
such predation. With that in mind, VA suggests the following revisions:

      VA recommends that the bill require the Fraud Evasion 
Officer to report to the Chief Veterans Experience Officer within the 
Veterans Experience Office. This placement would ensure appropriate 
prioritization of coordinated and unified fraud prevention and response 
internal and external to VA. Furthermore, the position would support 
partnership engagement to increase access, build trust, and participate 
in conversation at the appropriate high-level decisional tables needed 
for the program to effectively carry out initiatives across VA, 
including setting strategy, framework, policy, and other guidance for 
the Department.

      VA recommends that the Fraud Evasion Officer lead the 
recent VA-established VSAFE Program, which also resides within the 
Veteran Experience Office. This program was formally established as a 
permanent program by VA leadership on December 19, 2023.

      VA recommends that, in Section 2, the Veterans Scam and 
Fraud Evasion Officer work with all VA offices to effectively 
coordinate and disseminate Veteran fraud prevention messaging and 
resources.

      VA recommends that, in Section 5, the Veterans Scam and 
Fraud Evasion Officer develop comprehensive curriculum and training 
materials for Department employees. In VA we feel that it is all 
employees' responsibility to be able to recognize potential 
vulnerability factors, to actively monitor for any predatory activity, 
and to know when, how, and where to connect Veterans, their families, 
and caregivers with appropriate and correct support resources.

      VA recommends that, in Section 7, Tribal governments be 
included among the list of non-Federal Governments as valued partners.

      VA does not believe the authorization for only one person 
to serve the function of the VSAFE office will be sufficient; instead, 
we recommend that, in Section 7(c), up to and no more than five (5) 
full-time employees be authorized to successfully manage the VSAFE 
operations in VA and across partnering Federal agencies. Given the 
number of partners involved and the need to develop strong 
collaboration as well as backstage intervention strategies, a 
significant investment of time, attention, and expertise will be 
required. While a single officer may have significant expertise, a team 
will be needed to be able to forge the deep partnerships, insights, and 
robust communications necessary for the success of this program.

    Costs associated with H.R. 6452 - to cover salaries, administrative 
contract costs, travel, Government-furnished equipment, and 
miscellaneous expenses - are estimated to be $1.2 million in the first 
year, $6.1 million over 5 years, and $12.2 million over 10 years.

H.R. 6531 - Training Responsible and Informed National (TRAIN) VA 
Employees Act

    H.R. 6531 would require VA to develop a training program after 
consulting with heads of at least three other Federal Departments and 
agencies, including the Department of Defense, and requires all 
supervisors to complete the training no later than 18 months after 
enactment. The bill also requires VA to develop a refresher training 
program that supervisors would complete every 2 years. The bill 
requires the training be delivered by an instructor and in-person. The 
training shall focus on performance management, mentoring and 
engagement and managing misconduct and poor performance, addressing 
harassment, collaborating with human resources on hiring and 
recognition, and the overall duties and responsibilities of a 
supervisor.
    VA supports this bill, if amended, and subject to appropriations. 
VA takes seriously the responsibility to develop supervisors and 
leaders to manage the workforce to best care for our Veterans. In 
alignment with the Secretary of Veterans Affairs' priorities to invest 
in our workforce and retain the best talent in the marketplace, VA 
offers an array of training and development opportunities, including 
mandatory supervisor training. VA requires all new supervisors to 
complete 7 hours of training that focuses on many of the subjects 
covered in this bill (``Super U for New Supervisors'') supplemented by 
learning opportunities on a collaborative learning site for 
supervisors. There are segments that are asynchronous and self-paced 
online, a virtual instructor-led segment, and training that ends with a 
week of instruction for an in-person segment. VA also requires 
supervisors to complete refresher training every 4 years (``Supervisor 
Manager Refresher Training''). The training is delivered online and 
tracked in VA's Talent Management System to ensure compliance. The 
training satisfies the Office of Personnel Management's new supervisor 
requirements and complies with Federal mandates (5 C.F.R. Sec.  
412.202).
    VA supports continuing to require that supervisors complete 
training within 12 months of appointment to a supervisory position and 
can modify the requirement for refresher training from every 4 to every 
2 years consistent with this bill. As a standard practice in developing 
training, VA benchmarks with other agencies to research/share best 
practices, training models, and related information. In evaluating the 
training VA will benchmark with other Federal agencies and industry to 
ensure this training aligns with these findings as is practicable.
    VA supports the position that investing in developing our 
supervisors is critical to the organization's mission, as outlined in 
VA Handbook 5015, Employee Learning and Professional Development, and 
Veterans Health Administration (VHA) Directive 1052, Appropriate and 
Effective Use of VHA Employee Mandatory and Required Training. VA 
requests that continued flexibility in our methods of delivery be 
maintained (particularly for the refresher training requirement). The 
funding needed to meet the requirements as stated in the bill would be 
excessive and place an undue burden on the administration if enacted.
    VA further suggests strengthening legislation in this area around 
reporting, benchmarking, and evaluation. VA can provide the Committee 
with suggested language for Sections 2(a), (b) and (e) to clarify and 
strengthen these requirements but allow VA the flexibility to 
implement.
    If VA is required to change the delivery of current new supervisor 
and refresher training from online to in-person, appropriations would 
be needed to cover the costs of salaries, benefits, and travel to 
deliver the training to VA's more than 50,000 supervisors nationwide. 
In the absence of the appropriations to deliver in-person training, VA 
would propose that a test-out option be made available in place of the 
full refresher training.
    VA estimates the mandatory costs for H.R. 6531 of $4.7 million in 
the first year, $27.4 million over 5 years, and $64.4 million over 10 
years. In order to limit the travel associated with each participant, 
these costs are based on the use of decentralized teams of instructors 
who would deploy regionally, conducting training 48 weeks each fiscal 
year. There would be 4 teams comprised of a Senior Training Specialist 
and 2 Junior Training Specialists, with each team conducting 3 classes 
of up to 100 participants per week. There are no discretionary costs 
associated with the bill.

H.R. 6538 - VA Correct Compensation Act of 2023

    Under current law in section 7422(b) of title 38, collective 
bargaining (and any grievance procedures provided under a collective 
bargaining agreement) for certain employees described in section 
7421(b) may not apply to any matter concerning or arising out of the 
``establishment, determination, or adjustment of employee 
compensation'' under title 38. H.R. 6538 would amend section 7422 to 
provide for a definition of ``establishment, determination, or 
adjustment of employee compensation''. Currently, that phrase is 
understood to include all kinds of compensation decisions, including 
the initial setting of rates of pay, the determination of awards, 
adjustment of compensation such as physician market pay reviews , and 
other compensation determinations.. The proposed definition would be 
limited to the setting of a rate of pay as required by applicable law, 
rule, or regulation. The proposed definition would further specify that 
the term would not include a grievance challenging whether an employee 
described in section 7421(b) of title 38 has received ``the correct 
compensation as required by law, rule, regulation, or binding 
agreement.''
    VA cites concerns with the bill and suggests replacing the proposed 
text with a requirement to establish an internal process through which 
title 38 employees can challenge compensation errors in violation of 
law, rule, regulation, and policy. This new internal process would 
provide an enforcement mechanism for compensation errors for title 38 
medical professional employees while preserving VA's statutory 
authority for compensation decision-making.
    VA is fully invested in paying all of its employees timely and 
accurately and demonstrates this commitment by the fact that it is 
currently developing an internal process for title 38 medical 
professional employees to utilize when they believe they have not been 
paid correctly, in violation of law, rule, regulation, or policy. VA 
takes proactive steps analyzing data from our human resources (HR) 
system to identify systematic data issues which could cause employee 
pay errors. We also have quality review and auditing processes at the 
national and servicing HR level to proactively find data issues which 
may cause employee pay errors. When there are compensation errors that 
are brought forward to HR and leaders, we work to correct these errors 
and prevent future occurrence. Finally, it should be noted that title 
38 employees have access to other enforcement processes such as FLSA 
claims.
    The proposed modification of 38 U.S.C. Sec.  7422 would have far-
reaching, negative consequences on VA's ability to adjust clinicians' 
salaries in response to market conditions at the appropriate speed. In 
an ultra-competitive health care market, VA needs to retain the ability 
to be flexible and maintain independence to compete for top-level 
talent in direct patient care positions while operating in the current 
VA policy framework for title 38 compensation. The proposed definition 
of exclusions from collective bargaining for title 38 medical 
professional employees is limited to setting a rate of pay for an 
employee pay. Given the limited definition, this bill would, therefore, 
result in VA being required to bargain over the ``determination'' and 
``adjustment'' of title 38 medical professional employee compensation 
which would make decisions of management discretion in compensation--
such as the bi-annual salary adjustment amount for a physician--
negotiable and likely place such decisions in front of external impasse 
panel members and arbitrators. Currently, the bi-annual salary review 
process relies on prescribed salary ranges based on provider 
specialties and takes into account individual provider skills and 
market factors. This change could result in all facets of this process, 
to include salary ranges, being negotiable. It would also allow unions 
and employees to grieve their compensation, as well as management's 
decisions concerning employee compensation, which is not linked to 
setting a rate of pay for an employee as required by law, rule, or 
regulation. This is problematic because this would give title 38 
employees more rights than are currently provided for title 5 employees 
within VA. Unlike title 5 pay setting, title 38 pay setting is not 
standardized - and not specifically governed by law, rule, or 
regulation - in order to provide flexibility given the varying market 
conditions and skill levels of title 38 medical professionals. The 
flexibility within the current statutory framework also addresses the 
individual circumstances of a medical center and the healthcare field 
generally. Additionally, the phrase ``rate of pay'' could be 
interpreted to solely mean an employee's rate of basic pay--which would 
significantly expand topics for negotiation and grievances.
    Consequently, the proposed definition would require bargaining and 
allow for grievances over myriad pay setting and compensation decisions 
for title 38 employees that are not specifically governed by law like 
title 5. For instance, when a physician is brought on board, the 
initial salary is set considering rates paid in the local labor market 
to the same specialty, rates paid internally to the same specialty, 
board certifications the provider may hold, and any additional skills 
that will be utilized in position. Holistic compensation reviews, like 
those undertaken under title 38, do not have rigid outcomes. The 
specific framework of laws, rules and regulations in title 5 is 
replaced with analysis flexible enough to meet the varying 
circumstances of medical centers across the country. Because of this 
approach to title 38 compensation, the definitions in the associated 
bill do not specifically address the underlying premise of the bill - 
namely, compensation errors for title 38 employees.
    Moreover, limiting the proposed definition of ``establishment, 
determination, or adjustment of employee compensation'' to pay-setting 
situations limits the bargaining and grievance exclusion for 
compensation matters to situations where VA is solely establishing or 
setting pay for title 38 medical professionals and does not address the 
clear current statutory exclusion of the ``determination'' and 
``adjustment'' of title 38 medical professional ``compensation'' from 
bargaining and the negotiated grievance process in 38 U.S.C. Sec.  
7422(b)(3). After the initial onboarding of an employee, decisions to 
adjust and determine title 38 employee compensation are performed on a 
regular basis when determining promotions, awards, schedule 
adjustments, and numerous other management decisions under title 38. 
Implementing the proposed definition of compensation as drafted would 
require VA to bargain and engage in the negotiated grievance process 
over tens of thousands of routine compensation decisions. These 
provisions would impact the compensation strategy development and 
delivery across title 38 market-based pay systems. They could result in 
grievances that then go to arbitration regarding each of the 
approximately 31,000 compensation reviews conducted at least biannually 
for physicians and the approximately 6,000 Title 38 Locality Pay 
schedules reviewed annually.
    In addition to decreasing and correcting pay errors, VA is 
committed to proactively managing pay for title 38 employees. The James 
M. Inhofe National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2023 
requires Medical Center Directors to ensure competitive compensation 
for nurses and physicians assistants. Competitive pay reviews for all 
remaining title 38 occupations have been proactively directed through 
VHA's Hire Faster and More Competitively initiatives. We have also 
invested in additional technology and are actively working on the 
development of a compensation analytics module within our personnel 
system to assist approving officials in ensuring vital health care 
staff are compensated commensurate with market trends. Last year, VA 
invested in improvements to our personnel systems to automate the pay 
schedule development, approval, and processing timeframes for title 38 
locality pay schedules. This allowed VA to reduce the wait time for 
employees to see pay increases in their checks from 4 months down to 2-
3 weeks. We have concerns that adding additional process steps will 
further delay employees from receiving appropriate compensation.
    VA is actively focused on correctly paying employees and will seek 
input from its labor partners on an internal process being developed 
for title 38 medical professional employee compensation claims 
resulting from law, rule, regulation, or policy violations. This new 
internal process will provide transparent accountability and an 
enforcement mechanism for compensation errors for title 38 medical 
professional employees while preserving VA's interest in keeping our 
statutory authority for compensation decision-making, which includes 
the establishment and the determination and adjustment of employee pay. 
It would also provide trackable metrics for complaints and outcomes and 
allow VA to take a proactive approach to solving recurring issues. For 
instance, this process will cover situations such as a nurse not being 
paid time and a half overtime per the statutory requirement found at 38 
U.S.C. Sec.  7459. It will also cover a nurse being paid incorrect 
night differential per policy or any loss of pay resulting from an 
untimely promotion for a nurse. These employees would be able to submit 
a claim to correct these pay issues through this new process that VA is 
currently developing.
    VA believes that the internal process will meet the proposed 
legislative intent in creating a transparent accountability and claims 
process for our title 38 employees when they encounter compensation 
errors. Therefore, VA recommends an amendment to the proposed 
legislation which requires VA to establish an internal process for 
employees to pursue allegations of compensation errors in violation of 
law, rule, regulation or policy, outside of the scope of collective 
bargaining.
    VA cannot project the cost impact due to the complexity of 
potential complaints and uncertainty regarding the frequency and 
required review time. VA would establish and implement the process at 
national, regional, and local levels, but VA does not currently track 
the data for title 38 employees that would be required to develop a 
cost estimate.

H.R. 6874 - Department of Veterans Affairs Watching Over Electronic 
Benefits (VA WEB) Act

    H.R. 6874 would require VA to ensure the collection of select 
information about the use of VA's main website, provide notice to 
Congress within 30 days of a significant adverse event involving the 
website, and provide a detailed report to Congress within 30 days of a 
request about any adverse event. It would also require VA to provide 
Congress with a comprehensive testing strategy for all systems that 
support the website.
    We have a number of concerns about this bill. VA supports the 
intent of this bill to ensure that Congress is timely informed of 
significant Veteran-impacting adverse events that occur on VA's main 
website. With that purpose in mind, the Department has many performance 
accountability mechanisms in place, and the types of system monitoring 
required by this bill are a natural part of software development. 
However, VA cites concerns with several specific elements of the bill.
    As written, the definition of ``adverse event'' in Sec. 2(f)(1) may 
be overly broad and include events which do not have a negative impact 
on Veterans' use of a covered feature. For example, insufficient 
storage in a system component does not necessarily negatively impact 
Veterans' use of a covered feature if appropriate system redundancy 
measures are put in place. To ensure VA focuses its effort on Veteran-
impacting events, we recommend amending the definition of ``adverse 
event'' to ``(1) The term ``adverse event'' means, with respect to the 
covered website, Veteran-impacting issues with covered features, such 
as--''.
    The definitional threshold for ``adverse event'' provided in 
section 2(f) of the bill could be implicated if a single Veteran 
encountered an issue and, upon request, would require a detailed report 
to be provided. By defining an adverse event in this manner, incident 
reporting would be magnified and would likely encompass matters not 
generally intended to be considered ``adverse'' in terms of overall 
impact.
    In section 2(c)(1), the bill requires VA to provide notice to 
Congress of any significant adverse event within 30 days of the event's 
occurrence. However, in some cases it may not be possible to comply 
with this requirement as a significant adverse event may not be 
discovered until more than 30 days after its occurrence. It would be 
more effective to align the reporting requirement to the discovery of a 
significant adverse event, rather than an occurrence. In addition, 30 
days will often be insufficient time to determine the scope of any 
adverse event, determine if it meets the notice thresholds set in this 
bill, and draft and approve the appropriate notice to Congress. We 
believe 60 days would allow VA to accurately identify, analyze, and 
prepare notice for significant adverse events.
    In section 2(c)(2), the bill requires VA to provide a report to 
Congress on any adverse event within 30 days of request by Congress. It 
can take more than 30 days to gather the kinds of information required 
in this section, and this is more likely to be the case for instances 
of adverse events that did not trigger the significant adverse event 
notice requirement under section 2(c)(1). VA believes that 90 days 
would be a more achievable timeframe to respond to these requests.
    VA notes that the definition of ``significant adverse event'' 
provided in section 2(f) of the bill is sufficiently broad that VA may 
be obligated to report dozens of times per month on issues involving 
temporary unavailability of specific covered features, typically due to 
intermittent or temporary issues in a downstream system or in VA's 
networking infrastructure. Such events may be outside the core interest 
of the bill's intent. Changing the definition of ``significant adverse 
event'' to a higher volume threshold such as ``10,000 or more users'', 
or by time such as ``over a continuous period of more than 24 hours'' 
will allow VA and Congress to focus oversight and reporting on more 
significant or impactful adverse events.
    VA additionally notes that many features of the VA website are 
periodically unavailable when downstream systems are undergoing 
scheduled maintenance. Reporting on periods of unavailability due to 
schedule maintenance appears to be outside of Congress's intent with 
this bill. Therefore, VA recommends Congress exclude these periods of 
unavailability of covered features if this unavailability is due to 
planned maintenance, by amending the definition of a ``system outage'' 
as defined in section 2(f)(1)(B) to read ``system outages, excluding 
outages caused by planned maintenance.''

H.R. 6947 - Veterans Affairs Centennial and Heritage Act of 2024

    H.R. 6947 would codify the recent establishment of the VA History 
Office within the Department. Headed by the Chief Historian, the office 
would be supported by professional and administrative staff as 
determined necessary by the Secretary to carry out its purposes. The 
bill also provides additional gift acceptance authorities, enhanced 
funding mechanisms, and additional lease authorities for the Secretary, 
and it establishes an internal coordination group comprised solely of 
VA employees which will provide a logical governance protocol for what 
will likely be a VA-wide initiative (the centennial) and for management 
and resourcing decisions related to an enterprise asset (the VA History 
Office (VAHO) and National VA History Center (NVAHC)). Not later than 
180 days following enactment, the Secretary of Veterans Affairs would 
be required to submit a report to the Senate and House Committees on 
Veterans' Affairs detailing the operations of VAHO and the activities 
that will mark the centennial. The Chief Historian would also be 
required to submit yearly reports to the Senate and House Committees on 
Veterans' Affairs through December 31, 2030, detailing VAHO progress.
    VA supports this legislation, subject to the availability of 
appropriations, as development of VAHO and NVAHC are ongoing projects 
of importance to the Department. The upcoming centennial celebration 
will draw positive attention to the Department through outreach, 
events, and permanent exhibits emphasizing the Department's role in 
assisting our Veterans throughout our Nation's history.
    Since publication of VA Directive 7777, Implementation of the VA 
History Program, VA has undertaken the establishment of VAHO and has 
begun work on building a history of the Department to ensure that the 
Department, and the Veterans that we serve, are recognized and 
celebrated. The Department welcomes the opportunity to engage with 
Congress to continue to ensure that both the centennial celebrations in 
2030 and the ongoing activities of VAHO and NVAHC continue to celebrate 
the important role of Veterans to this country and the support that the 
Department has provided to those Veterans.
    By statutorily establishing VAHO, which encompasses the National VA 
History Center, Congress is recognizing the historical accomplishments 
of the Department. Authorizing the Department to ``collect, preserve, 
and provide access to relevant historical records, artifacts, and 
cultural resources of the Department [will] tell a comprehensive story 
of the Department and its predecessor organizations to Veterans, 
Government agencies, and the public.'' The bill also allows VA to 
engage in public outreach, advertising, and publication, and to 
participate in and host centennial events and public activities. VA 
Directive 7777 establishes VAHO, and this bill provides statutory 
authorities that will allow it to fully execute its stated mission.
    H.R. 6947 provides the Secretary of Veterans Affairs the authority 
to enter into partnerships and cooperative agreements; additional gift 
acceptance authority; and enhanced lease authorities in support of the 
bill's purposes. This language provides a clear path for VA to accept 
funds donated by the 501(c)(3) NVAHC Foundation for the NVAHC project 
and any donation that may be provided directly to VA for the purposes 
and activities of VAHO, which is not an uncommon process for Federal 
agency history/heritage center projects like the NVAHC. (VA does 
request clarification as to what type of Treasury fund is to be 
established. Knowing whether it would be a revolving fund, whether 
funds will remain available until expended for these purposes, and 
whether the established Treasury fund is anticipated to be the sole 
source of VA funding for the VAHO/NVAHC project will allow the History 
Office and the Department to fully exercise these authorities.)
    H.R. 6947 also provides additional construction and land 
acquisition authorities that allow for construction, renovation, 
repair, operation, and maintenance of facilities used for the 
preservation, restoration, and public access to Department historic 
materials, archives, and artifacts. These authorities are needed to 
execute the 2017 Memorandum of Agreement between VA and Dayton 
stakeholders regarding the development of plans, partnerships, and a 
pathway for development of the NVAHC. This language will allow VA to 
commit resources to VAHO and the NVAHC project without concern for 
violating existing regulations or statutes and would provide agreement 
on proceeding with certain planning and developmental tasks.
    The mandatory reporting requirements, while creating an additional 
administrative burden, will provide a consistent, scheduled reporting 
process on VAHO and the NVAHC progress, and we look forward to working 
with Congress to achieve the objectives of the VA History Office.
    Costs associated with H.R. 6947 represent funds actually spent from 
Fiscal Year (FY) 2020 to Fiscal Year 2023 ($3.6 million) as well as 
estimates for Fiscal Year 2024 to Fiscal Year 2030 based on the 
baseline functions and tasks outlined in the bill and the duties 
already specified in VA Directive 7777. Future costs are estimated to 
be $3.0 million for Fiscal Year 2024, $32.2 million over 5 years, and 
$47.9 million through Fiscal Year 2030. Note that these cost estimates 
do not include some key components such as construction of the museum 
building, final renovation cost of associated historical buildings, or 
additional centennial-specific costs, which we will not be able to 
accurately estimate without further time, research, and information.

H.R. 7342 - Veterans Accessibility Advisory Committee Act of 2024

    H.R. 7342 would establish within the Department an advisory 
committee on matters related to accessibility of the Department for 
Veterans with disabilities. This committee would be subject to the 
provisions of the Federal Advisory Committee Act, 5 U.S.C., Ch. 10. The 
committee would be comprised of 15 voting members and 4 ex officio 
members.
    VA does not support this bill. There are several existing advisory 
committees that focus on disability accessibility to VA services, 
benefits, and facilities, as well as multiple entities within the 
Department that already address accessibility to benefits, technology, 
services, and facilities.
    The bill requires the Department to abolish a discretionary 
committee that is currently inactive, consolidate two discretionary 
committees, or submit to the Senate and House Committees on Veterans' 
Affairs a recommendation to abolish an existing non-discretionary 
committee established by an Act of Congress that is also inactive. The 
Department is already required to evaluate all existing discretionary 
committees to determine an existing need for continuation and engages 
in this process biennially. Discretionary committees are terminated 
when no longer valid. The nine active discretionary committees have all 
been determined to provide necessary insight and advice to Department 
operations. There are no discretionary committees that would currently 
meet the requirements for abolishment.
    Combining an existing committee with this committee comes with 
related feasibility concerns and efficiency concerns. Existing 
committees are already providing invaluable assistance to the 
Department with their guidance and recommendations. Combining 
committees would require either including members of the current 
committee into the makeup of this committee, or completely 
reconstituting a single committee and releasing those members already 
serving on a committee. Both eventualities could impact the membership 
balance and make it more difficult to constitute the membership. 
Further, while there is admitted crossover between the work of existing 
committees and this committee, expanding the responsibilities of an 
existing committee, or incorporating the scope of work into a single 
committee, would risk diluted recommendations owing to the increased 
areas of concentration of the committee.
    The estimated cost of establishing the committee is approximately 
$600,000 per year and $6,000,000 over the initial proposed 10-year 
period of existence, unless extended by Congress.

H.R. XXXX - To authorize the Secretary of Veterans Affairs to carry out 
a pilot program to use weapon detection technology at medical centers 
of the Department of Veterans Affairs.

    This draft bill would authorize the Secretary of Veterans Affairs 
to carry out a pilot program to implement the use of weapon detection 
technology at the main entrance of VA medical centers.
    VA supports this bill, subject to the availability of 
appropriations, which presents a crucial opportunity to enhance the 
safety and security of VA facilities. The safety of Veterans, their 
families, VA staff, and visitors is of paramount importance, and the 
implementation of weapon detection technology can play a vital role in 
mitigating potential threats and preventing violent incidents within VA 
medical centers.
    Supporting this bill aligns with the VA's mission to provide a safe 
and welcoming environment for Veterans to receive quality health care 
services. By deploying advanced weapon detection technology, the VA can 
bolster security measures and better protect the individuals who rely 
on VA facilities for their medical needs. This proactive approach to 
security aligns with the best practices of other health care facilities 
and demonstrates a commitment to ensuring the well-being of our 
Veterans, staff, and visitors.
    The proposed bill to authorize a pilot program for weapon detection 
technology at VA medical centers would merit strong support from police 
services. By prioritizing safety and security, the VA can create a 
safer environment for Veterans and health care providers while 
upholding its commitment to delivering world-class care.
    VA notes that while the Federal Acquisition Regulation (FAR) 
contemplates and permits procurements both contingent upon Support 
Anti-Terrorism by Fostering Effective Technologies (SAFETY) Act 
designation pre-award, and presuming SAFETY Act designation post award, 
such contingencies are not preferred. FAR 50.204(a)(3) states that 
``Agencies should not mandate SAFETY Act protections for acquisitions 
because applying for SAFETY Act protections for a particular technology 
is the choice of the offeror.'' There are additional factors required 
if a solicitation is contingent upon either pre-or post-solicitation 
compliance with the SAFETY Act designation. The Department seeks 
clarification as to section (e)(3)(B) to ensure compliance with the 
will of Congress as well as FAR and contracting requirements.
    VA estimates the cost for equipment and personnel for the 1-year 
pilot program to be $3.1 million.

H.R. XXXX - Required Notation of Investigation in Personnel Record File 
Act

    Similar to 5 U.S.C. Sec.  3322, Voluntary separation before 
resolution of personnel investigation, the draft ``Required Notation of 
Investigation in Personnel Record File Act'' requires VA to make a 
permanent notation in the official personnel record file of an employee 
who is the subject of a personnel investigation and who resigns from 
Government employment prior to the resolution of such investigation. 
The bill also requires an additional notation if any of the allegations 
of the investigation are substantiated.
    VA supports this bill, if amended, and subject to availability of 
appropriations. VA recommends making clarifying amendments to the bill 
to improve its applicability. Specifically, the bill does not exempt VA 
employees from the mandatory - and more comprehensive - provisions of 5 
U.S.C. Sec.  3322. Therefore, it appears that both mandatory laws will 
continue to apply to VA employees in the competitive and excepted 
service. Further, pursuant to 38 U.S.C. Sec.  7403(f)(3), VA is 
required to apply the provisions of Title 5 to employees appointed 
under 38 U.S.C. Sec.  7401(3), known as ``hybrid Title 38 employees,'' 
in specific circumstances. VA recommends clearly addressing the 
applicability of this law to hybrid Title 38 employees. Further, the 
bill does not include Senior Executive Service (SES) employees because 
it only covers competitive and excepted service employees. 
Additionally, the Bill does not apply to situations in which a covered 
employee retires; it only applies to those who resign. VA recommends 
the language in the Bill be modified to include SES employees and 
situations in which an employee retires or transfers to another Federal 
agency.
    VA is concerned that this bill, if not applied in conjunction with 
5 U.S.C. Sec.  3322, does not afford employees due process or appeal 
rights. An annotation, especially if the allegations are not 
substantiated, has the potential to impact an employee's constitutional 
rights. Thus, VA is concerned the bill will be found deficient as 
written.
    Additionally, in paragraph (b) of the proposed 38 U.S.C. Sec.  729, 
an annotation will be made in the employee's record if it is determined 
the allegations in the investigation would have been substantiated. 
This deprives the employee of an opportunity to present a defense to an 
action that can impact future employment. Therefore, VA suggests 
providing the due process and appeal rights as provided for in 5 U.S.C. 
Sec.  3322, with modification to the timeframes.
    Of note, if VA is required to query offices internal and external 
to VA at the time an employee resigns to determine if there is a 
pending investigation and to obtain the results to ascertain if any 
allegations were substantiated, this will require staff and technology 
to manage. Further, when an employee moves to another Federal agency or 
leaves Federal service, VA no longer has access to the official 
personnel record file. Determining where the record is located and how 
to make a notation in the file will require coordination in these 
instances and other options for complying with the intent of the Bill 
need to be considered when the record is no longer within the control 
of VA.
    VA looks forward to working with Congress on this bill, to include 
providing technical assistance review, and ensuring VA efficiently and 
effectively implements the levels of accountability sought.
    Given the many uncertainties associated with determining the 
presence of pending investigations and their outcomes, both internal 
and external to VA, for employees who have resigned before resolution 
of a personnel investigation (and the uncertainty of how many times 
such a scenario will occur), we are unable to provide a meaningful cost 
estimate.

H.R. XXXX - Reporting Performance Plans for VA Political Appointees Act

    The draft ``Reporting Performance Plans for VA Political Appointees 
Act'' would amend section 725 of title 38 by requiring VA to submit to 
the Committees' on Veterans Affairs of the House and Senate the annual 
performance plans of covered political appointees in VA.
    VA does not support the bill, and has a number of concerns.
    VA administers a performance management system for non-career SES 
members and Schedule C employees. VA's performance management system 
holds these individuals accountable for individual and organizational 
performance and ensures ``accountability for honest, economical, and 
efficient Government.'' 5 U.S.C. Sec.  3131.
    The VA Choice and Quality Employment Act of 2017 added section 725 
to title 38 and defined which political appointees shall receive an 
annual performance plan and the minimum contents of the plan. Further, 
VA's SES performance appraisal system is certified by the Office of 
Personnel Management with concurrence from the Office of Management and 
Budget. Certification criteria require that all SES members' 
performance plans be aligned to the agency's mission, strategic goals, 
program/policy objectives, and/or annual performance plan and budget 
priorities and that the annual summary rating be based on individual 
and organizational performance 5 U.S.C. Sec.  4311, et seq.
    VA has concerns with the annual performance plan submission 
requirements of this bill because of the exclusive focus on political 
appointees. VA welcomes the ability to have further discussions on this 
bill and to work with Congress on the best way to balance 
accountability and confidentiality of personnel records.

Conclusion

    Chairwoman Kiggans, this concludes my testimony. My colleagues and 
I are prepared to respond to any questions you or other Members of the 
Committee may have.
                                 ______
                                 

               Prepared Statement of Joycelyn Westbrooks

    Chairwoman Kiggans, Ranking Member Mrvan, and Members of the 
Subcommittee:
    Thank you for inviting the American Federation of Government 
Employees (AFGE) to participate in today's Subcommittee Hearing on 
``Pending Legislation.'' My name is Joycelyn Westbrooks, and I 
currently serve as the Secretary-Treasurer for AFGE Local 1633 at the 
Michael E. DeBakey VA Medical Center in Houston, Texas. Most 
importantly, for the past 40 years, I have had the honor of serving our 
Nation's veterans as a Registered Nurse at the VA.
    On behalf of AFGE, its National Veterans Affairs Council, 
representing over 750,000 Federal and District of Columbia Government 
workers, including 300,000 employees at the Department of Veterans 
Affairs, it is a privilege to offer insights to the Oversight and 
Investigations (O&I) Subcommittee on several of the bills it is 
considering today with a focus on H.R. 6538, the ``VA Correct 
Compensation Act.''

H.R. 6538, the ``VA Correct Compensation Act''

    The primary reason I come before the committee today is to express 
AFGE's strong endorsement of H.R. 6538, the ``VA Correct Compensation 
Act'' or ``VACCA.'' This bi-partisan legislation is also endorsed by 
our sister unions the National Federation of Federal Employees (NFFE), 
the Service Employees International Union (SEIU), and the American 
Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME), as well 
as the American Association Of Nurse Anesthesiology, and our VSO 
partners the Disabled American Veterans (DAV), Paralyzed Veterans of 
America (PVA), and the American Legion. This legislation will help the 
VA with retention by limiting the agency's power to unfairly deny 
grievances challenging routine payroll errors affecting frontline Title 
38 healthcare professionals. Across the VA, AFGE and NVAC represent 
more than 75,000 Title 38 employees.
    Since the enactment of the Department of Veterans Affairs Health-
Care Personnel Act of 1991 (P.L. 102-40) over 30 years ago and the 
establishment of 38 U.S.C. 7422 (7422), the VA Secretary has used this 
authority to liberally deny collective bargaining and grievances 
related to ``(1) professional conduct or competence, (2) peer review, 
or (3) the establishment, determination, or adjustment of employee 
compensation.''
    For years, this committee has examined various bills to amend 7422 
and limit its use. Last Congress, this committee considered H.R. 1948, 
the ``VA Employee Fairness Act'' (117th Congress), which passed the 
House of Representatives, but was not considered in the Senate. During 
the spirited debate of that legislation in this committee, in the Rules 
Committee, and on the floor of the House of Representatives, while 
there were substantive disagreements on policy, there was agreement 
that the VA had misused its authority under 7422 as it relates to 
routine payroll errors for Title 38 Employees.
    At the beginning of the 118th Congress, Chairman Bost and Ranking 
Member Takano built on that common ground, rolled up their sleeves, and 
worked together to craft a bill that could be enacted in 2024. The 
fruit of that labor is H.R. 6538, the ``VA Correct Compensation Act,'' 
a technical correction to the 7422 statute that provides a definition 
for the compensation exception in 7422, and explicitly prevents the VA 
from denying grievances contesting that a covered employee has 
``received the correct compensation as required by law, rule, 
regulation, or binding agreement.'' This is commonsense legislation 
that will give employees the opportunity file a grievance and have a 
fair process to make themselves whole and help with retaining 
clinicians at the agency.
    Unfortunately, payroll errors are a common problem at the VA. All 
too often, the VA fails to accurately calculate if a covered employee 
worked overtime, the night shift, weekend shift, or on a holiday. If 
the affected employee is a Title 38 hybrid appointed under 38 U.S.C. 
7401(3), that employee could easily file a grievance and receive the 
money they are owed under the law. However, if an employee is appointed 
as a pure Title 38 under 38 U.S.C. 7401(1), the VA can and does invoke 
its 7422 authorities to deny the grievance, with the employee losing 
the ability to receive the compensation they are rightfully owed. In 
practice, this means that a Registered Nurse does not have the same 
rights as a Licensed Practical Nurse, an optometrist does not have the 
same rights as an audiologist, and a psychiatrist does not have the 
same rights as psychologist. Beyond this inherent inequity, over 30 
years, the VA's use of this authority has discouraged employees from 
even filing grievances to correct their pay, which harms morale around 
the country.
    A clear example of this arises from the Asheville, North Carolina, 
VA Medical Center.
    In the facts shared by the VA:

        On February 1, 1999, the American Federation of Government 
        Employees (AFGE) filed a grievance on behalf of the Operating 
        Room Nurses of VAMC Asheville, North Carolina, claiming 
        entitlement to premium pay. More specifically, the Union 
        complained that the Medical Center failed to pay the Operating 
        Room Registered Nurses night differential when called in to 
        work overtime during the hours of 6 p.m. and 6 a.m., and 
        weekend pay differential when called in to work overtime on 
        Saturday or Sunday. The periods of work at issue in the 
        grievance were outside the nurses' regular work schedule or 
        tour of duty.

    On December 29, 1999, an arbitrator ruled in favor of AFGE and 
``granted the union's request for payment of night differential and 
weekend pay for OR nurses for these instances.'' In response to the 
arbitrators ruling, ``[m]anagement refused to comply with the award 
stating that this is a matter to be decided by the Secretary and is not 
itself subject to collective bargaining (38 U.S.C. 7422).'' In response 
to this, on March 5, 2001, the Undersecretary for Health decided that 
``Under the authority in 38 U.S.C. 7422(d), I find that the 
arbitrator's decision and subsequent ULP concerns the establishment, 
determination, or adjustment of employee compensation.'' He also wrote 
that ``Under the authority in 38 U.S.C. 7422(d), I find that the 
payment of night differential and weekend premium pay to OR nurses for 
periods of overtime work concerns or arises out of a matter or question 
of the establishment, determination, or adjustment of employee 
compensation under title 38.'' This was the final step in the denial of 
the grievance for correctly paying these operating room nurses.
    Similarly, in 2007, the VA failed to accurately pay for overtime in 
Buffalo, New York. In Buffalo, ``[i]n an attempt to reduce a backlog of 
work at the Olean Community Based Outpatient Clinic (CBOC), the 
management of the VA Medical Center Buffalo, New York (VAMC) asked for 
volunteers to see patients at the CBOC on Saturdays.'' The VA chose 
three Nurse Practitioners who proceeded to work on eight separate 
Saturdays. ``The CBOC is generally open Monday through Friday and has 
no established Saturday tour of duty. All three of the employees who 
volunteered to work the Saturdays identified above were paid overtime 
for the extra work or given compensatory time in lieu of overtime.'' 
However, this was not the totality of what was owed. ``On March 9, 
2007, the United American Nurses (UAN) [which has since merged with 
National Nurses United (NNU)] filed a grievance alleging that 
management violated 38 U.S.C. 7453(c) and VA Handbook 5007/6, Part V, 
chapter 6, paragraph 1.b. by failing to pay the three nurse 
practitioners Saturday premium pay in addition to the overtime pay they 
received for working on Saturdays.'' Despite the Union filing a 
grievance that was escalated, the VA in its recommended decision stated 
``[t]hat the grievance over three nurse practitioners' entitlement to 
Saturday premium pay for Saturday work at a CBOC having no established 
Saturday tour of duty is excluded from collective bargaining as a 
matter or question that concerns or arises out of the establishment, 
determination or adjustment of employee compensation within the meaning 
of 38 U.S.C. 7422(b).'' In turn, the VA denied the grievance and the 
nurses were not correctly paid the weekend shift differential pay they 
were owed under law.
    The VA is the Nation's best and largest health care system. VA must 
continue to recruit and retain the best employees to care for our 
Nation's heroes. Congress never intended for 38 U.S.C. 7422 to permit 
the VA to deny grievances over routine payroll errors, thereby 
unlawfully withholding the compensation due to its employees. By 
passing H.R. 6538, the ``VA Correct Compensation Act,'' this committee 
can prevent future examples of this occurring and force the VA to give 
Title 38 clinicians the opportunity to ensure they are paid what they 
are owed under the law.

H.R. 6531, the ``TRAIN VA Employees Act''

    AFGE supports the intent of H.R. 6531, the ``TRAIN VA Employees 
Act.'' The underlying goal of this legislation is to improve the 
performance of supervisors at the Department of Veterans Affairs, both 
in helping employees excel and following existing law in how to 
correctly, when appropriate, discipline employees. This would further 
improve consistency throughout the agency when it comes to evaluating 
employee performance, and help employees throughout the VA. As the 
committee studies this bill and potentially considers it in a markup 
hearing, I would like to make two recommendations to improve the clear 
goals presented in the legislation.
    The first is that in addition to supervisors, the agency allow AFGE 
officials to also receive this training, as if both employer and 
employee representatives are being trained together by the same 
trainers, all parties will be on the same page when it comes to their 
understanding and expectations of supervisors managing their employees 
and help avoid obstacles in any potential disciplinary processes.
    Second, AFGE recommends that the bill add a new component to the 
training identified in subsection (e) of the bill requiring managers 
receive training on the ``fundamentals of the collective bargaining 
agreement in the Federal Government and employee rights to union 
representation.'' This new component would give supervisors a better 
understanding of the legal role unions have within the agency, 
including in disciplinary proceedings. Furthermore, this improved 
understanding would lead to fewer supervisory errors, and hopefully, 
fewer union grievances needing to be filed.

Draft Legislation, the ``VA Security Screening Pilot Program Act''

    AFGE supports the intent of the ``VA Security Screening Pilot 
Program Act.'' This bill, in the wake of violence occurring at VA 
facilities, is a strong proposal designed to prevent violence at 
Veterans Medical Centers and protect veterans and the employees who 
serve them. To improve the effectiveness of this pilot program and 
avoid any possible unintended consequences, AFGE has several 
suggestions to improve the scope and practice of this pilot program.
    First, AFGE suggests the bill include a provision on the training 
of the VA personnel who will operate this technology to protect 
veterans. Additionally, as the bill alludes to VA Police Officers when 
discussing which facilities should be used for this pilot program, the 
only personnel who should be authorized to operate this technology are 
VA Police Officers, who have undergone crisis intervention training 
required by statute, and not third-party contractors.
    Second, as the VA determines which facilities are being used for a 
pilot program, AFGE hopes that the VA casts a broad net and is not only 
limited to Medical Centers. As the VA utilizes larger Community Based 
Outpatient Clinics (CBOCs), it is worth including them within the pilot 
to gather a broad cross-section of data. Additionally, while most VBA 
facilities have security, not all are administered by VA. Including a 
VBA Regional Office or other VBA facilities that do not have weapons 
detection technology or whose technology is equal to or less secure 
than this technology would also provide valuable data about the 
technology proposed in this pilot.
    Third, AFGE strongly encourages that in sites where this technology 
is being piloted, there are either separate screening lines or reserved 
entrances for staff. AFGE is concerned that if separate lines or 
entrances are unavailable and staff must stand in line with patients at 
a busy time, this can delay employees to arriving at work at the 
beginning of their shifts, inadvertently delaying patient care.

    H.R. 6947, the ``Veterans Affairs Centennial and Heritage Act of 
2024''

    AFGE supports the intent of H.R. 6947, the ``Veterans Affairs 
Centennial and Heritage Act of 2024.'' If enacted, this bill would 
create a VA History Office in Dayton, Ohio. This would recognize the 
critical work of the VA over the past 100 years, including the critical 
contribution of VA employees. The only additional comment AFGE wishes 
to make on this bill, is that as the staffing model is created to 
determine what permanent staff is required for this museum, is that 
these employees are part of the bargaining unit and receive the same 
protections as other VA employees throughout the Nation.
    A Draft Bill to require a notation in the personnel record file of 
certain employees of the Department of Veterans Affairs who resign from 
government employment under certain circumstances.
    AFGE opposes this draft legislation in its current form. 
Specifically, AFGE has significant due-process concerns with this draft 
bill, which would require the VA to permanently annotate the personnel 
records of employees who leave government during pending personnel 
investigations, including a unilateral and unappealable determination 
by the Secretary whether any allegations ``would have been 
substantiated.'' Such speculative and potentially biased findings 
should not be included in the official personnel files without the 
investigative, disciplinary, and appellate processes running their 
course.

                       Statements for the Record

                              ----------                              


   Prepared Statement of American Association of Nurse Anesthesiology
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

Prepared Statement of United Nurses Associations of California/Union of 
                       Health Care Professionals
[[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

  Prepared Statement of National Federation of Federal Employees, and 
                 Service Employees International Union
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

          Prepared Statement of Paralyzed Veterans of America
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

          Prepared Statement of Senior Executives Association
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                 Prepared Statement of Matt Cartwright

    Thank you, Chairwoman Miller-Meeks, Ranking Member Brownley, and 
members of the House Veterans' Affairs Subcommittee on Health, for 
allowing me to submit a statement in support of critical legislation 
that would benefit our Nation's Veterans. I write today in support of 
my bipartisan bill, H.R. 5247, the Expedited Hiring for VA Trained 
Psychiatrists Act, which would increase access to mental health 
services for our Veterans--to whom we owe a great debt.
    The Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) psychiatrists diagnose 
mental, emotional, and behavioral conditions, and provide treatment to 
our Nation's heroes after they've answered the call to uniformed 
service. Everyone knows the sobering statistic that the rate of suicide 
among veterans is almost 60 percent higher than that of civilians. 
Whether a Veteran is struggling with the aftereffects of military 
combat, adjusting to civilian life, or facing a mental illness such as 
PTSD, having access to a psychiatrist at a VA facility could make a 
world of difference in a Veteran's journey to mental health and well-
being.
    While the VA has prioritized hiring new medical staff at an 
unprecedented rate, it is still difficult to hire and retain 
psychiatrists at a level sufficient to meet the needs of our Veterans. 
The Government Accountability Office (GAO) has previously found that 
the VA does not have proper staff levels for its suicide prevention 
teams, and efforts to fill these vacancies have been significantly 
hampered by a long recruitment and hiring process. Furthermore, the GAO 
has repeatedly reported that demand for Veterans mental health services 
will only increase, exacerbating staffing shortages.
    The practical impacts of understaffing include excessive wait 
times, lack of proper follow-up care, and Veterans' inability to 
schedule appointments in a timely manner. These unnecessary hurdles to 
accessible, reliable care and treatment can have terrible consequences.
    The Expedited Hiring for VA Trained Psychiatrists Act would tackle 
the VA understaffing problem by codifying the VA Secretary's ability to 
hire psychiatrists who have completed their residency at a VA facility 
if a position has gone unfilled for at least thirty-five days.
    Many aspiring psychiatrists do at least part of their residency in 
a VA facility. These trainees gain valuable experience working with 
Veterans and are already familiar with the issues specific to this 
community. By giving the Secretary the ability to directly convert 
psychiatric residents to full employment with the VA - pending 
satisfactory completion of both the residency and all credentialing 
requirements - Congress can help make the VA a more attractive place 
for these residents to begin their careers. By reducing the time it 
takes to fill critical psychiatrist positions, my bill would reduce the 
wait times for Veterans seeking to access mental health services.
    Ensuring timely access to quality mental health care for all 
Veterans should be a priority for everyone, regardless of party. The 
Expedited Hiring for VA Trained Psychiatrists Act is commonsense, 
bipartisan legislation that would provide a fast track hiring process 
for qualified psychiatrists who train at VA facilities. I am grateful 
to my colleagues on both sides of the aisle for their support of this 
important legislation.
    Chairwoman Miller-Meeks, Ranking Member Brownley, and members of 
the Health Subcommittee, I offer my sincere thanks for your consistent 
prioritization of the issue of Veteran mental health.
                                 ______
                                 

                 Prepared Statement of Brandon Williams

    I would like to introduce H.R. 7765, the VA Security Screening 
Pilot Program Act. This legislation directs the Secretary to select one 
of its networks (VISN) to carry out a pilot program to use new weapon 
screening technology at the primary entrance of each VA medical center 
no later than a year after the legislation's enactment.
    For too long, outdated security equipment has placed unnecessary 
strain on police working at VA medical facilities nationwide, who often 
already face staffing shortages and daily challenges. The logistical 
difficulties that accompany outdated security tech force some 
facilities not to use any screening at their entrances. This 
combination of antiquated equipment and logistical difficulty puts 
employees and veterans alike at increased risk, should an emergency 
situation occur.
    And we know that, all too often, these situations do occur. Violent 
crime has more than doubled on VA medical center campuses in the last 
few years, and the tragic occurrence of veteran suicide has persisted 
over the same period of time. When I think about how much our Nation's 
veterans have done for the United States, and then I see the conditions 
they endure well after their service has concluded, it's clear to me 
that there's much more to be done. This hits me personally, as a 
veteran, myself.
    This bill will make sure that the VA has the resources it needs to 
protect its facilities from bad actors by allowing them to test 
security tech, refining their approach with feedback from security 
personnel and veterans alike, to reach an informed decision on what 
measures would be most effective in securing their campuses.
    Our veterans gave their best to this country. This country owes 
every single veteran its very best in return. It is unacceptable that 
instances of violent crime have increased so drastically in VA 
facilities, and tragic that suicide on VA campuses is as common as it 
is. Congress has a long way to go in doing right by the men and women 
who have served our country in uniform--this bill is a necessary step 
in the right direction.
                                 ______
                                 

                  Prepared Statement of Michael Turner

    I am proud to be leading the House effort to codify the National VA 
History Center (NVAHC) within the U.S. Dept. of Veterans Affairs. H.R. 
6947, the Veterans Affairs Centennial and Heritage Act of 2024, would 
codify this institution and ensure the story of America's veterans and 
the VA is preserved for future generations. This legislation is 
bipartisan and bicameral. I want to thank Rep. Landsman for his work on 
this issue, as well as Ohio Senators Vance and Brown for their work on 
the Senate companion bill.
    For decades, the Dayton VA has served the healthcare needs of over 
40,000 veterans in our community, going above and beyond to provide our 
service members with the benefits that they earned protecting our 
freedoms.
    The Dayton Veterans Affairs Medical Center is among the finest 
facilities for veterans' services in the United States, and I am 
pleased that it is the home for the future museum and archives for VA 
history. The National VA History Center currently exists only pursuant 
to VA Department Memoranda, but this legislation would codify the 
center through an Act of Congress.
    Once complete, the NVAHC will be the central location for seminal 
artifacts and archives of historic significance from across hundreds of 
VA locations. The site will provide storage, preservation, and access 
to these materials, as well as a museum and education center. The 
project will include robust online access to digitized materials for 
researchers, writers, and scholars, and virtual museum exhibits 
available to the public.
    Located on the Dayton VA Medical Center campus, the NVAHC will 
include multiple historic buildings: the Old Headquarters, the 
Clubhouse and the Putnam Library. These buildings are some of the 
oldest on the 450-acre campus, dating to 1871, 1881 and 1880, 
respectively.
    The Veterans Affairs Centennial and Heritage Act will preserve the 
Department of Veterans Affairs' history of outstanding work and 
document the special relationship between the United States and our 
veterans. I thank you for the opportunity to speak today and welcome 
any questions.

                                 [all]