[Senate Hearing 117-358]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]





                                                        S. Hrg. 117-358
 
              RICHMOND, STACHELBERG, AND BERHE NOMINATIONS

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                              COMMITTEE ON
                      ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES
                          UNITED STATES SENATE

                    ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS

                             FIRST SESSION

                                   to

 CONSIDER THE NOMINATIONS OF GERALDINE RICHMOND TO BE UNDER SECRETARY 
FOR SCIENCE, DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY; CYNTHIA WEINER STACHELBERG TO BE AN 
 ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR (POLICY, MANAGEMENT, AND BUDGET); 
   AND ASMERET ASEFAW BERHE TO BE DIRECTOR OF THE OFFICE OF SCIENCE, 
                          DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY

                               __________

                             AUGUST 3, 2021

                               __________
                               
                               
                               
                               
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             U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 
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               COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES

                JOE MANCHIN III, West Virginia, Chairman
RON WYDEN, Oregon                    JOHN BARRASSO, Wyoming
MARIA CANTWELL, Washington           JAMES E. RISCH, Idaho
BERNARD SANDERS, Vermont             MIKE LEE, Utah
MARTIN HEINRICH, New Mexico          STEVE DAINES, Montana
MAZIE K. HIRONO, Hawaii              LISA MURKOWSKI, Alaska
ANGUS S. KING, JR., Maine            JOHN HOEVEN, North Dakota
CATHERINE CORTEZ MASTO, Nevada       JAMES LANKFORD, Oklahoma
MARK KELLY, Arizona                  BILL CASSIDY, Louisiana
JOHN W. HICKENLOOPER, Colorado       CINDY HYDE-SMITH, Mississippi
                                     ROGER MARSHALL, Kansas

                      Renae Black, Staff Director
                      Sam E. Fowler, Chief Counsel
             Richard M. Russell, Republican Staff Director
              Matthew H. Leggett, Republican Chief Counsel
                     Darla Ripchensky, Chief Clerk
                     
                            C O N T E N T S

                              ----------                              

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                   Page
Manchin III, Hon. Joe, Chairman and a U.S. Senator from West 
  Virginia.......................................................     1
Barrasso, Hon. John, Ranking Member and a U.S. Senator from 
  Wyoming........................................................     2
Wyden, Hon. Ron, a U.S. Senator from Oregon......................     4

                               WITNESSES

Richmond, Dr. Geraldine, nominated to be Under Secretary for 
  Science, Department of Energy..................................     5
Stachelberg, Cynthia Weiner, nominated to be an Assistant 
  Secretary of the Interior (Policy, Management, and Budget).....    10
Berhe, Dr. Asmeret Asefaw, nominated to be Director of the Office 
  of Science, Department of Energy...............................    16

          ALPHABETICAL LISTING AND APPENDIX MATERIAL SUBMITTED

American Fly Fishing Trade Association et al.:
    Letter for the Record........................................    29
Barrasso, Hon. John:
    Opening Statement............................................     2
Berhe, Dr. Asmeret Asefaw:
    Opening Statement............................................    16
    Written Testimony............................................    18
    Responses to Questions for the Record........................    73
Manchin III, Hon. Joe:
    Opening Statement............................................     1
Richmond, Dr. Geraldine:
    Opening Statement............................................     5
    Written Testimony............................................     8
    Responses to Questions for the Record........................    50
Stachelberg, Cynthia Weiner:
    Opening Statement............................................    10
    Written Testimony............................................    12
    Responses to Questions for the Record........................    61
Wyden, Hon. Ron:
    Introductory Statement.......................................     4


              RICHMOND, STACHELBERG, AND BERHE NOMINATIONS

                              ----------                              


                        TUESDAY, AUGUST 3, 2021

                                       U.S. Senate,
                 Committee on Energy and Natural Resources,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:07 a.m. in 
Room SD-366, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Joe Manchin 
III, Chairman of the Committee, presiding.

 OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. JOE MANCHIN III, U.S. SENATOR FROM 
                         WEST VIRGINIA

    The Chairman. The Committee will come to order. We are 
meeting today to consider three pending nominations. The three 
nominations are Dr. Geraldine Richmond to be the Under 
Secretary for Science at the Department of Energy (DOE); Ms. 
Cynthia Stachelberg to be the Assistant Secretary of the 
Interior for Policy, Management, and Budget; and Dr. Asmeret 
Berhe to be the Director of the Office of Science at the 
Department of Energy. I want to welcome all three of you. Thank 
you very much for being here. We also want to welcome each of 
your family members that are with you and thank them for 
attending, or if they are virtual, we appreciate that.
    The office of Under Secretary for Science, to which Dr. 
Richmond has been nominated, was established by the Energy 
Policy Act of 2005 in recognition of the important role that 
science and scientific research plays within the Department of 
Energy. The Under Secretary for Science serves as the 
Secretary's principal advisor on science and technology, 
monitors the Department's wide-ranging research and development 
programs, and oversees the management of the national 
laboratories. By law, the Under Secretary for Science must have 
an extensive background in science or engineering. Dr. Richmond 
very clearly meets this test. She holds a Doctorate in physical 
chemistry from Berkeley; she has been a Professor at the 
University of Oregon for the past 26 years; she is the author 
of more than 200 scientific papers; and she has received dozens 
of honorary awards, medals, prizes, degrees, and other honors 
in recognition of her scientific achievements. If confirmed, as 
I am sure she will be, Dr. Richmond will be only the fifth 
person, and the first woman, to hold this important office.
    Our next nominee is Winnie Stachelberg, who has been 
nominated to be the Assistant Secretary of the Interior for 
Policy, Management, and Budget. The office of an Assistant 
Secretary for Administration was originally established by 
President Truman and did not require Senate confirmation. 
Congress created the current statutory Assistant Secretary in 
1971, in recognition of the importance of the office's 
functions and to increase its stature and effectiveness.
    In some respects, the Department of the Interior (DOI) is a 
collection of separate bureaus. The Assistant Secretary for 
Policy, Management, and Budget helps cement them together by 
developing policy, managing operations, and formulating budgets 
across the breadth of the Department. The Assistant Secretary 
serves as the Secretary's principal policy advisor and the 
Department's chief financial officer. She oversees a diverse 
collection of offices ranging from the Budget Office to the 
Wildland Fire Office and from the Office of Native Hawaiian 
Relations to the Office of Natural Resources Revenue.
    It is an important job, and I am pleased to see that Ms. 
Stachelberg has a graduate degree in public administration and 
has worked as a budget analyst at the Office of Management and 
Budget.
    Our third nominee, Dr. Berhe, has been nominated to be the 
Director of the Office of Science. Although the Department is 
named the Department of Energy, science has always been at the 
core of the Department. As a seedbed of science, the Department 
has given us the technologies to increase our energy production 
and use our resources in a cleaner way. It has given us 
supercomputers and nuclear deterrence without testing. It has 
even helped developed the internet.
    The Office of Science lies at the heart of the Department's 
science mission. The Office's mission, by law, is to deliver 
the ``scientific discoveries, capabilities, and major 
scientific tools to transform the understanding of nature and 
to advance the energy, economic, and national security of the 
United States''. That is no small task.
    Judging from the list of scientific papers you have written 
and the list of academic honors and awards that you have 
received, Dr. Berhe, it is clear that you have the scientific 
credentials the job requires.
    Again, I want to extend a warm welcome to all three of our 
distinguished nominees, and I want to thank you for being here 
this morning and for your willingness to undertake these 
important positions.
    At this point, I will recognize my friend, Senator John 
Barrasso, for his opening statement.

               STATEMENT OF HON. JOHN BARRASSO, 
                   U.S. SENATOR FROM WYOMING

    Senator Barrasso. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 
I also want to welcome and congratulate the nominees, Dr. 
Richmond, Dr. Berhe, and Dr. Stachelberg. Welcome to the Senate 
Energy and Natural Resources Committee. Congratulations on the 
nominations.
    If confirmed as Under Secretary for Science and Energy, Dr. 
Richmond, you would have an important responsibility spanning 
the Office of Science and the Department applied energy 
offices. You have been a chemistry professor for over 40 years, 
including the last 35 years at the University of Oregon, served 
in leadership positions on numerous boards, received many 
awards and honors, as the Chairman just mentioned, all related 
to the Department of Energy and the scientific community with 
which it collaborates. You appear to be highly qualified to 
serve as the Under Secretary of Science and Energy.
    I cannot say the same for Dr. Berhe's specific 
qualifications to serve as Director of the Office of Science at 
the Department of Energy. Dr. Berhe has been a Professor of 
soil biogeochemistry at the University of California, Merced 
for over a decade and has focused her research on soil 
management and sequestering carbon in soil. Her background and 
experience appear to have very little to do with the Department 
of Energy's main scientific focus and the scientific community 
with which it collaborates.
    In a May 9, 2021 op-ed in the Wall Street Journal, a 
theoretical physicist noted, ``Ms. Berhe's research program on 
soil chemistry, exploring the capture of carbon dioxide, is 
relevant to climate change policy, but her research expertise 
is not in any of the Office of Science's major programs and she 
has no expertise as a scientific administrator and minimal 
experience with the Energy Department itself.'' This continues, 
``Past directors have been established researchers from one of 
the major fields supported by the Department or they have 
administered large, private laboratories, such as Bell Labs, in 
line with the demands of the job. It is hard not to wonder 
whether Ms. Berhe is the right choice for the leadership role 
at the Department of Energy.''
    Certain public positions Dr. Berhe has taken and endorsed 
are also concerning. On February 18th of this year, she 
retweeted the statement, ``I'm just going to propose that a 
nation that can land an SUV-sized rover in an ancient lake on 
another planet can build an electrical grid that is f-ing 
useless because of slavish devotion to the free market''. F-ing 
useless because of slavish devotion to the free market.
    On May 7th of 2015, she wrote in ``Science'' that, ``The 
practice of farming is to blame for climate change.'' The 
practice of farming is to blame for climate change.
    Mr. Chairman, I am also concerned about Ms. Stachelberg's 
qualifications to serve in the position to which she has been 
nominated. The Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and 
Budget plays a central role in policy development, 
organizational management, and fiscal stewardship at the 
Department of the Interior. Ms. Stachelberg appears to have 
little, if any, background or experience in public lands, in 
natural resources, in energy, or other policy issues managed by 
the Department of the Interior.
    For the past 25 years, Ms. Stachelberg has worked as a 
political activist at the Center for American Progress and the 
Human Rights Campaign. The only issue she appears to have 
focused on, and even remotely within in the realm of the 
Department of the Interior, is gun control. While I am a 
supporter of the Second Amendment and the sportsmen and women 
that rely upon it, I do not believe that gun control advocacy 
is a helpful qualification for the job at the Department of the 
Interior.
    Again, welcome to each of the nominees. I look forward to 
hearing more about your qualifications, your policy views, and 
your plans for ensuring the work of the Departments of Energy 
and the Interior, how that could benefit all Americans, 
including those in my home State of Wyoming.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. The rules of the 
committee, which apply to all nominees, require that they be 
sworn-in in connection with their testimony. So if you all will 
please stand and raise your right hand. Do you solemnly swear 
that the testimony you are about to give to the Senate 
Committee on Energy and Natural Resources shall be the truth, 
the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
    Dr. Richmond. I do.
    Dr. Berhe. I do.
    Ms. Stachelberg. I do.
    The Chairman. Thank you. You may be seated. Before we begin 
your statements, I am going to ask three questions addressed to 
each nominee before this committee. Will you be available to 
appear before the committee, and other Congressional 
committees, to represent Department positions and respond to 
issues of concern to the Congress?
    Dr. Richmond. Yes.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes.
    Ms. Stachelberg. I will.
    The Chairman. Are you aware of any personal holdings, 
investments, or interests that could constitute a conflict of 
interest, or create the appearance of such a conflict, should 
you be confirmed and assume the office to which you have been 
nominated by the President?
    Dr. Richmond. No.
    Dr. Berhe. No.
    Ms. Stachelberg. No.
    The Chairman. Are you involved or do you have any assets 
held in a blind trust?
    Dr. Richmond. No.
    Dr. Berhe. No.
    Ms. Stachelberg. No.
    The Chairman. We are going to start with our first witness, 
Dr. Richmond. But first, we have a very dear Senator who had 
conflicts, but he is virtually with us, and he wants the 
privilege of introducing you. Senator Wyden.

                 STATEMENT OF HON. RON WYDEN, 
                    U.S. SENATOR FROM OREGON

    Senator Wyden. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank 
you for you thoughtfulness in giving me this opportunity. We 
Oregon Ducks really appreciate your incredible sendoff for Dr. 
Richmond this morning. Your words really summed it up, and I am 
not going to give a filibuster this morning.
    I will say, though, you touched on her many scientific 
honors since she has been teaching. If I were to list them all, 
Mr. Chairman, you would be here until tomorrow morning going 
through this. She has an extraordinary record. And for my 
personal involvement, I have known about her expertise for some 
time and, frankly, we feel it would be impossible to have too 
many Oregon Ducks serving in key Administration roles.
    I would also like to note, as we get started, that she has 
been recognized by President Clinton, President Obama, and 
President Reagan for her scientific expertise. And it will 
surely be needed right now, in her position at DOE, because 
with her expertise in drought she can help us develop a 
scientific response to drought, which is one of the real keys 
to reducing fire risk. I will just close by way of saying, we 
are really going to need Dr. Richmond to focus on that.
    Just last month, my hometown saw record hot temperatures, 
with some as high as 116 degrees. Mr. Chairman, you have been 
very helpful to me, as Chairman of the Finance Committee, 
because we got a law passed so that Medicare advantage plans 
could provide air conditioning and air filtration systems for 
seniors with chronic conditions who are just trying to breathe 
in these conditions. A very significant portion of the deaths 
we had during our record heat dealt with elders who clearly 
were suffering those kinds of health problems.
    Finally, I think her expertise in drought and its 
relationship with the fire risk is going to be of huge help to 
us because we are still dealing with the Bootleg fire at home, 
and that is going to be an enormous concern of Westerners 
through the months ahead.
    Finally, she has some real expertise in another set of 
important issues with alternative energy being an area that 
will go front and center in her work in her days ahead at the 
national labs. And the West, and all of America, cannot wait to 
act on climate. We are seeing the effects of inaction now. Dr. 
Richmond is exactly the right kind of person, at the right 
time, for the Office of Science, and we could not admire her 
more for her scientific achievements and her professional 
analytical skills. Mr. Chairman, to have you give us this big 
sendoff for her, along with Presidents Clinton, Obama, and 
Reagan and the past statement--I think I will quit while we are 
ahead, because this is an exceptional individual.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. And to all three of our 
witnesses, before you give your testimonies, if you have family 
or friends that are here for support and you want to recognize 
them, please feel free to do so. We are happy to have them. We 
are going to start with, Dr. Richmond, you first. If you have 
any of your family here, please feel free to introduce them.
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you, Senator Manchin, I do. I have my 
husband of over 40 years here, Dr. Steve Kevan.
    The Chairman. Good to have you, sir.

  STATEMENT OF DR. GERALDINE RICHMOND, NOMINATED TO BE UNDER 
          SECRETARY FOR SCIENCE, DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY

    Dr. Richmond. Chairman Manchin, Ranking Member Barrasso, 
and the distinguished members of the committee, thank you very 
much for the opportunity to appear before you today. I am so 
honored to discuss my nomination to serve as Under Secretary 
for Science and Energy at the Department of Energy.
    As a research scientist, I have had a long association with 
DOE, starting with a summer research internship at Lawrence 
Berkeley National Laboratory when I was 21. Later I received 
DOE funding for my own research, and I have served in 
leadership roles on many of the Department's basic and applied-
sciences advisory boards. From my visits over the years to many 
of the DOE laboratories, I know firsthand that they are indeed 
the crown jewels of the nation's research and innovation 
domain. These labs, along with thousands of initiatives funded 
by competitive DOE grants, are achieving the groundbreaking 
discoveries and breakthroughs that long have made the United 
States the envy of the world in science and engineering.
    Now, myself, growing up in Kansas on a farm, I could never 
have envisioned the career opportunities I've experienced over 
the years through science. In fact, as a little girl, I could 
dream no bigger than just going to college, which was my 
parents' aspiration for me because the Depression had deprived 
them of that dream. My gift for math opened up possibilities in 
science and, beginning with my undergraduate studies at Kansas 
State University in chemistry and graduate work at Berkeley, my 
world and my worldview have been expanding ever since.
    In my laboratory at the University of Oregon, my students 
and I use lasers to study issues relevant to energy production, 
environmental remediation, and atmospheric chemistry, including 
carbon capture. Our work has resulted in many publications and 
many great students and, as noted, I've been honored with many 
awards.
    But science has also given me countless opportunities to 
serve on national advisory boards, as president of scientific 
societies, as U.S. State Department Science Envoy, and as 
founding director of a grassroots organization that has helped 
over 25,000 women and minority scientists and engineers around 
the globe. These experiences have provided me with a deep 
understanding of the scientific enterprise of this country and, 
even more, its power to solve our problems and improve our 
lives.
    I come before you today as the scientific challenges for 
our nation and our world have never been greater. I believe the 
magnitude of the solutions outweighs even the Manhattan 
Project, as climate change poses an existential threat to the 
entire planet. I have been to all 50 states. I've worked in 
countries on every continent, including over a dozen in Africa. 
I have seen the human cost of climate change, the growing 
shortage of clean water sources, job displacement, and 
inequities in access to energy. But I also have experienced the 
boundless energy and creativity of our human resources and I 
deeply understand our capabilities, and I know solutions are 
within reach.
    If I am confirmed to lead DOE's science and innovation 
ecosystem, I plan to set several priorities that will muster 
our resources and place the United States at the forefront of 
these solutions. First, I want to assure you that we will 
continue our preeminent role in every step of the process of 
innovation--from making fundamental discoveries, to developing 
new energy technologies, to ramping up the scale to mass 
production and deployment. This is not like a relay race where 
the baton is passed off from one stage easily to the next. As 
challenges arise along this journey, we need the discovery 
science to be ready to intercede in the technological 
development and deployment. DOE's national laboratories, user 
facilities, Frontier Energy Research Centers, 
ARPA-E, and others are uniquely situated around the country for 
such long-haul mediating efforts.
    Second, I want to strengthen partnerships with other 
federal agencies, as well as private technology and energy 
enterprises in this country and around the world. With the 
urgency of the task before of us, we must resist the impulse to 
compete against one another and develop collaborations that 
will move us faster and farther together. I have been honored 
to serve as chair of the DOE's Basic Energy Sciences Advisory 
Committee, and as an appointee by both President Obama and 
President Trump to the National Science Board and have worked 
with leaders in the laboratories and offices of the Departments 
of Defense and Commerce. I look forward to using these 
leadership experiences to strengthen the connections among our 
vast national community of innovators.
    And finally, if confirmed, I also will foster a dynamic 
science and technology workforce that reflects the diversity of 
our population and geography, both urban and rural. I have a 
deep understanding and a passion for what is needed to 
identify, train, and support the best and the brightest among 
us. I look forward to ensuring that DOE laboratories and the 
programs the Department funds become a model for diversity.
    We are stronger, smarter, and simply better when we all 
seize the possibilities together, and there is no better place 
on this planet for scientific discovery and innovation than a 
country built on the premise of joining forces.
    Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to appear before 
you today, and I do look forward to your questions. Thank you.
    [The prepared statement of Dr. Richmond follows:]
    
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    The Chairman. Thank you, Doctor. Now we will hear from Ms. 
Stachelberg. If you have anybody you want to introduce, feel 
free to do so.
    Ms. Stachelberg. I want to recognize my partner, Vicky 
Phillips, who is here today. Thank you so much.
    The Chairman. Thank you for coming.

  STATEMENT OF CYNTHIA WEINER STACHELBERG, NOMINATED TO BE AN 
 ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR (POLICY, MANAGEMENT, AND 
                            BUDGET)

    Ms. Stachelberg. Chairman Manchin, Ranking Member Barrasso, 
members of the committee, it is a privilege to be here today 
and to be considered as the President's nominee to be the 
Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management and Budget at the 
United States Department of the Interior. I want to take this 
moment, not only to recognize my partner, Vicki, who is here, 
but my sons, Will and Charlie. They could not be here today, 
but they make me all the more driven to play a small part in 
making a brighter future.
    President Biden and Secretary Haaland have given me a great 
honor by nominating me for this role. It is a post at one of 
the most important departments, at one of the most challenging 
of times, and the prospect of taking on this position is more 
than a job to me.
    Like many of you, and many Americans, I have always loved 
the outdoors and, in particular, the sheer beauty of what this 
country has to offer. I have been a lifelong angler and boater, 
and I credit my parents for instilling in me a love for nature 
and our place in it. Henry David Thoreau, the great writer and 
naturalist, once wrote, ``heaven is under our feet as well as 
over our heads''. And I think that just about sums up the 
feeling of being in one of our national parks or incredible 
monuments and taking in the marvel of what is around you.
    I remember being a 9-year-old city kid, wide-eyed, with my 
jaw to the floor at the sight of the Grand Canyon. And as a 
young adult, I went diving and took in the sheer wonder of the 
Buck Island Reef National Monument. And more recently, I took 
my kids to visit the Ding Darling National Wildlife Refuge to 
see the white pelicans making their trek from east of the 
Rockies to Florida.
    I am also very aware of what lands mean to western states 
where large percentages of their area are managed by the 
Department of the Interior. This includes millions of acres of 
multiple-use lands where it is imperative for the Department to 
work with states, tribes, and a diverse group of stakeholders 
to strike the right balance.
    As we do so, it is imperative that we take action to 
address the threat climate change poses to communities across 
the United States, and in the West in particular, which is in 
the throes of unprecedented drought and devastating wildfires.
    We also face important questions when it comes to clean 
energy and wildlife conservation, fishing and hunting, and 
access to our public lands and heritage. How we address these 
challenges will have far-reaching ramifications. I sit here 
mindful that, if I have the privilege of being confirmed as 
Assistant Secretary, I will dedicate myself fully to working 
with this committee to meet those challenges.
    The role of Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management and 
Budget requires me to be a leader. It will require me to guide 
programs with national and international concern across bureaus 
and offices, to lead an inclusive workforce to optimize the 
mission of the Administration, and to spearhead budget 
formulation, to make key decisions when it comes to priorities 
and goals, and to ensure that the Department complies with 
statutory and regulatory requirements.
    For more than two decades, I have helped lead organizations 
and developed the skills necessary to fulfill these functions. 
As a senior leader at the Center for American Progress and the 
Human Rights Campaign, I have been key in developing and 
driving strategy. I have also had the honor of managing a large 
number of driven, dynamic staff tackling a whole range of 
issues, and I have exhibited steady leadership when it has come 
to personnel and human resource challenges--challenges that 
include addressing diversity and equity issues to ensure that 
wherever I serve there is a workplace culture where employees 
can thrive and grow.
    At both of these organizations, I have also executed cross-
cutting personnel and policy efforts, managed complex budget 
and financial projects, and collaborated with key stakeholders 
often with differing perspectives.
    I take pride in the fact that I have worked with Members of 
Congress on both sides of the aisle to achieve results and make 
progress. I have worked with organizations like the American 
Enterprise Institute, the Chamber of Commerce, the Bipartisan 
Policy Center, and the McCain Institute, to name a few. I also 
have a strong record of success. And I say all of this is, that 
I believe I have the experience and the acumen to take on this 
role, and I am ready to get to work.
    Thank you for inviting me to be in front of this committee 
today. Thank you for the opportunity to discuss my nomination. 
I look forward to your questions.
    [The prepared statement of Ms. Stachelberg follows:]
    
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    The Chairman. Thank you, Ms. Stachelberg. Now we will hear 
from Dr. Berhe. Doctor, if you have someone you want to 
introduce, you are more than welcome to.
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator. I would like to acknowledge 
my husband and my kids, who are virtually joining the event 
today. Thank you.
    The Chairman. Thank you.

  STATEMENT OF DR. ASMERET ASEFAW BERHE, NOMINATED TO BE THE 
    DIRECTOR OF THE OFFICE OF SCIENCE, DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY

    Dr. Berhe. Chairman Manchin, Ranking Member Barrasso, and 
members of the Committee on Energy and Natural Resources, thank 
you for the opportunity to appear before you today. It is my 
great honor to appear before this Committee as President 
Biden's nominee for Director of the Office of Science at the 
Department of Energy. I thank the President and Secretary 
Granholm for trusting me to help lead the next chapter in the 
great scientific success story of the Office of Science.
    Allow me to acknowledge my family and friends whose love 
and support I am fortunate to have, especially my husband, 
Professor Teamrat Afewerki Ghezzehei, our children Essey and 
Elilta, and my parents, Ghidei Woldeslassie Ketema and the late 
Asefaw Berhe Hagos.
    I was born in the horn of Africa, in Eritrea. I grew up in 
a wonderful family with two great parents and role models who 
not only were first-generation middle school graduates but also 
received college degrees while working to support their 
families and raising six kids. The fact that I am appearing in 
front of you here today is a testament to the incredible power 
of education to transform a person's life. My parents instilled 
in me the value of education and respect for knowledge and 
ignited my love of science and the natural environment. I am 
now fortunate to be a professor at the University of 
California, Merced, an institution with a genuine commitment 
and demonstrated success in serving communities that have 
historically been underserved.
    I am an earth scientist and educator. I am passionate about 
soil, the thin veil of loose material covering the land surface 
that has an outsized role in regulating life as we know it. 
Soil is the most complex biomaterial that we know of. It 
regulates the earth's climate, it is home to the most abundant 
and diverse forms of life on the earth system and is 
foundational to human and national security. Because of the 
complexity of soil, scientific investigations that seek to 
unravel the physical, chemical, and biological processes that 
take place in the soil system and the energy systems that 
support said processes require advanced experimental, 
observational, and computational tools and interdisciplinary 
perspectives. This is why earth scientists, including me, have 
had career-long ties to the Department of Energy, the national 
labs, and the advanced facilities the Office of Science 
manages.
    As a soil and global change scientist who has studied and 
worked in public institutions of higher learning, I have always 
taken my responsibility to serve the public very seriously. I 
believe publicly funded science and technology are critical for 
inspiring the next generation of scholars. Scholars have a 
responsibility to equitably serve the diverse communities of 
taxpayers that make our scientific careers and love of 
scientific research possible, and work to cultivate society's 
trust in science.
    I approach my nomination to serve as Director of the Office 
of Science with the expertise of an earth system scientist that 
works across and synthesizes knowledge from multiple scientific 
areas and teams. The integrative systems perspective that I 
would bring, if confirmed, is uniquely suited for this role, 
especially for the current time when we need to urgently 
address multiple issues that are critical for not just pushing 
the frontiers of science but also to address the ongoing 
climate emergency, the need for workforce development, and to 
promote better understanding and trust in the scientific 
process.
    It is evident that no one person can be an expert in the 
entirety of the wide-ranging portfolio of scientific endeavors 
the Office of Science supports. My experience with scientific 
investigations across multiple disciplines, covering spatial 
scales ranging from the molecular to the global and processes 
that occur from seconds to geologic timescales, is an asset as 
we seek to address fundamental processes that hold the key for 
the environmental, energy, and national security challenges of 
our time.
    It has never been more critical that we employ a systems 
approach to support scientific endeavors that push the 
frontiers of knowledge. The nation's response to the COVID-19 
pandemic has clearly demonstrated what is possible when we 
continue to fund basic science and then allow scientists from 
across multiple fields to work in the most advanced scientific 
facilities, including facilities the Office of Science manages, 
to enable timely discoveries.
    If I am confirmed, my vision for the Office of Science is 
to ensure that I support and enable the Office's mission to 
deliver scientific discoveries to transform our understanding 
of nature and advance the energy, economic, and national 
security of the United States. I am committed to fostering a 
supportive scientific enterprise for staff and researchers from 
across all fields to ensure that U.S. science and technology 
remains pre-eminent, well-supported, at the cutting edge, and 
continues to inspire and inform decisions in society.
    If I am confirmed, I commit to you that I will provide 
strong leadership for the Office of Science's mission.
    Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before you 
today. I am happy to answer any questions you may have.
    [The prepared statement of Dr. Berhe follows:]
    
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    The Chairman. Thank you. Thank you all for your statements. 
I appreciate it very much. We are going to start with our 
questions now. If you can, in your answers, try to be as direct 
and brief as you can, so we are able to hear more and learn 
more about you and have more dialogue. Thank you so much.
    I will start the questioning. Dr. Richmond, the Department 
of Energy Organization Act vests the Department's function in 
the Secretary and gives her broad authority to delegate those 
functions and organize the Department as she thinks best. 
Secretary Moniz gave the Under Secretary of Science 
responsibility not only for science but for most energy 
programs including fossil energy, nuclear energy, energy 
efficiency, renewable energy, and electricity. That was undone 
in the last Administration and then reinstated in February, 
before Secretary Granholm was confirmed.
    So my question would be, have you discussed your portfolio 
with Secretary Granholm? Will you oversee the Department's 
energy programs, as well as its science programs?
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you, Senator Manchin. It is indeed a 
big task to take on, and I'm ready for it. I indeed have 
discussed this with the Secretary. I understand what the role 
is. I've had many briefings and am learning a lot but also 
realize that my expertise that I have to address some of the 
most important issues that are on the table, I'm ready to take 
on. I must say, the nice thing about this particular position 
is the integration of the science and applied research. I look 
forward to that.
    The Chairman. I would say, to follow up on that, do you 
agree that your principal task, if confirmed, will be to foster 
scientific discovery and technology innovation, and how do you 
plan to go about that?
    Dr. Richmond. Yes, absolutely. As I said, I have several 
priorities, but one particular to that issue is to make sure 
that as we go from discovery research to going all the way to 
where we develop technologies and deploy them and also create 
jobs, to help make that as seamless as possible. To break down 
silos and make sure that we can work effectively--that is my 
role, and I will take that on.
    The Chairman. Thank you very much. Ms. Stachelberg. As I 
mentioned in my opening remarks, the Assistant Secretary for 
Policy, Management, and Budget has a very broad portfolio and 
authority over more than two dozen different program offices 
ranging from Native Hawaiians to natural resource revenues, 
invasive species to wildland fires, and law enforcement to 
hearings and appeals. No one can give equal attention to the 
daily operations of all these offices. The Assistant Secretary 
is aided by five deputies and, of course, individual offices' 
directors, enabling the Assistant Secretary to focus on the 
issues that need your attention most.
    So where do you see yourself, if confirmed, focusing most 
of your attention, and where do you think most of the attention 
needs to be focused?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Chairman Manchin, thank you so much for 
that question. You are exactly right that the breadth of the 
Assistant Secretary's portfolio is wide, and I'm looking 
forward to getting to the Department, if I'm confirmed, to 
tackle these challenges.
    I see a couple of areas of focus to start out. I think one 
of the first is really ensuring that the Department is fully 
staffed. Really focusing on ensuring that the Department of the 
Interior has the appropriate staff to address the challenges 
that you mentioned.
    A second priority area is the wildland fire program. We see 
drought and severe fire, especially in the West. That seems to 
be an area of what I'd like to spend increased attention on.
    And then, finally, priorities that have to do with 
management and budget--something I've been doing my entire 
career. Working to address and develop and promulgate budgets.
    I look forward to, if confirmed, working on those issues.
    The Chairman. Thank you. Dr. Berhe, we passed the Energy 
Act at the end of last year. It authorized over $35 billion to 
invest in innovative energy solutions like CCUS, advanced 
nuclear, renewables, and energy storage, just to name a few. 
This was the first significant update to our energy policy in 
13 years, and it was incredibly bipartisan, with close to 70 
senators sponsoring or co-sponsoring pieces of legislation. In 
addition, earlier this year, the Senate passed the Endless 
Frontier Act, which will make additional funds available to the 
Office of Science.
    So how will you, if confirmed, ensure the additional sums 
made available to the Office of Science are wisely spent to 
fund the basic research and provide the greatest possible 
return, in terms of scientific discoveries and technological 
innovation?
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Chairman Manchin. Let me start by 
thanking the committee and the senators that work on both of 
those acts--very important indeed.
    I think it's extremely important that we are not just 
working on--we're trying to innovate the newest technologies 
and advance cleaner energy options, but as you stated, carbon 
capture technology is an important part of that equation. I've 
spent a big part of my life, in particular, on natural 
solutions for carbon capture. But there are also a number of 
engineered approaches there. I'm committed to making sure that 
all those resources are spent wisely, to make sure that they 
are helping us push again the frontiers of the science in this 
area, but at the same time, see also a very smooth transition 
to having these technologies applied and help address the 
energy and climate-related challenge. And all of that's super 
helpful.
    I look forward to the opportunity to talk to you. Thank 
you.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Doctor. And now, Senator Barrasso, 
for your questions.
    Senator Barrasso. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. 
To the three of you, I'm sorry I have to ask the question of 
all these nominees. But prior to this hearing, each of you has 
sworn, under oath, that your answers to the committee's written 
questionnaires are current, accurate, and complete. So would 
each of you just please verbally affirm that your answers to 
the questionnaire are current, accurate, and complete?
    Dr. Richmond. Yes.
    Ms. Stachelberg. Yes.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes.
    Senator Barrasso. Thank you. Have any of you ever 
threatened the physical safety of federal officials verbally or 
in writing?
    Dr. Richmond. No.
    Ms. Stachelberg. No.
    Dr. Berhe. No.
    Senator Barrasso. Have any of you ever been affiliated or 
collaborated with an organization that uses violence against 
fellow Americans?
    Dr. Richmond. No.
    Ms. Stachelberg. No.
    Dr. Berhe. No.
    Senator Barrasso. Thank you.
    Ms. Stachelberg, I have a series of short questions for you 
and since your job is at the Department of the Interior, you 
quoted Henry David Thoreau, ``Walden''. It is during his 
``Walden'' years he has written, ``I went to the woods because 
I wished to be there deliberately''. So can tree spiking kill 
or maim loggers, mill workers, and firefighters?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, thank you for your question. I'm 
here to discuss my nomination and not anything about that. So I 
don't understand the context----
    Senator Barrasso. So can tree spiking kill or maim loggers, 
mill workers, and firefighters? It is a simple yes or no 
question.
    Ms. Stachelberg. As a general matter, yes.
    Senator Barrasso. Okay. And it is a crime on federal lands?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Yes.
    Senator Barrasso. Thank you. Individuals who are aware of 
spiked trees, they should inform and cooperate with law 
enforcement?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I certainly will cooperate with 
law enforcement. Have done so----
    Senator Barrasso. So somebody that was aware of that should 
as well?
    Ms. Stachelberg. If you're asking me the question about me 
and how I would handle that, I will cooperate with law 
enforcement, as I have done my entire life.
    Senator Barrasso. Should individuals who disagree with 
federal policies threaten the physical safety of federal 
officials?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, if you're asking me the question 
of whether I have ever done that, I have never threatened 
federal officials or anyone else.
    Senator Barrasso. Should individuals who plan or are 
otherwise involved in tree spiking incidents and threaten the 
physical safety of federal officials, should they expect to be 
hired by the Department of the Interior, which you have been 
nominated to?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, again, I'm here to discuss my 
nomination for the Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, 
and Budget and am interested in answering questions about my 
nomination and my past actions and my vision for this position, 
which is critically important. We have so many important 
challenges, climate change being one of them. And I really look 
forward to working with you and this committee in a bipartisan 
fashion to address those issues.
    Senator Barrasso. So you agree that tree spiking can kill 
or maim loggers, mill workers, and firefighters?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, again, I really wish to address 
questions that have to do with my portfolio and the challenging 
job that I've been nominated for. And if I'm confirmed, I'd be 
happy to work with you and others on the committee to address 
those issues.
    Senator Barrasso. Dr. Berhe, you clearly are a very well-
respected scientist. But your expertise is in soil science, not 
physics or energy generation. This has led to some criticism of 
your selection to head this specific office at the Department 
of Energy. The majority of the Office of Science's research is 
in areas of physics, high-performance computing. Do you have 
any experience managing programs in these areas?
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator, for your question. Yes, my 
background is in soil science, biogeochemistry, and I'm an 
earth system scientist. So I have not worked in the areas of 
physics, but I assure you that if I were to be confirmed for 
this position, no area of focus within the DOE's vast research 
portfolio would be short-changed in any way.
    As you know, these research priorities for DOE are set in--
with a very deliberate and thoughtful, you know, discussions 
and consultation with Congress and the scientific community. 
And I abide by those in making sure that the science remains 
highly supported.
    Senator Barrasso. So the Office of Science has an annual 
budget of more than $7 billion. The Director of the Office 
leads over 800 federal employees, oversees 10 national 
laboratories with more than 26,000 employees. What kind of 
management experience do you have that would prepare you for 
this role?
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you again, Senator. I'm an academic by 
training and my areas of expertise have, so far, been in the 
areas of academic research, science and technology, and 
workforce development. So clearly this is a slightly different 
approach, but my work so far in pushing not just the scientific 
advances in multiple areas of research but also workforce 
development and consultation with multiple national and 
international efforts are well recognized. And I believe I 
bring an earth systems sciences perspective that allows me to 
expand and work on these important issues. Thank you.
    Senator Barrasso. Ms. Stachelberg, you just talked about 
working in a bipartisan way on climate change. In a 2016 
interview with C-SPAN, you stated that Republicans are 
``climate deniers''. Your statement, C-SPAN, all Republicans, 
climate deniers. Do you stand by that characterization today?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I'm not familiar with that quote, 
but I certainly have worked with Republicans and Democrats, not 
just on climate change but a range of issues. And so, I have 
worked in a bipartisan fashion and if I spoke about the 
Republican Party, I may have been talking about particular 
senators. But I have a career of working in a bipartisan 
fashion and with organizations that I don't always see eye to 
eye in.
    I will say that the position for which I've been nominated 
at the Department of the Interior is a different position from 
the ones that I have held. Being a public servant is different 
from being at an organization with ideological views, and I 
understand that distinction.
    Senator Barrasso. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    The Chairman. Senator Cantwell.
    Senator Cantwell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Stachelberg, 
if confirmed, you will have a key role in stewarding our public 
lands. I want to ask you about the failed oil and gas sale 
lease earlier this year and rights to drill in the Arctic 
Wildlife Refuge. I say failed because you know that the lease 
sale brought in a paltry $6 million to the Treasury. That is 
0.67 percent of the $1.1 billion estimate that was used to 
justify opening this pristine wildlife refuge in 2017. In fact, 
the Trump Administration spent more on preparing for the failed 
lease sale than what they raised.
    So to me, they didn't count a lot of associated costs and 
harms and impacts to communities. I understand that in the last 
hour, the Department of the Interior announced they will 
conduct a new environmental review of the Arctic Wildlife 
Drilling program that will include consideration of greenhouse 
gas impacts.
    How do you think the newly announced environmental review 
will help us get a more accurate cost for Arctic drilling?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Thank you, Senator, for your question. I 
am not familiar with the recently issued review. I will say 
that your point does show the limited commercial benefits and 
interest. I am not currently at the Department, but if I'm 
confirmed, I look forward to working with you and others on the 
committee and receiving a briefing on that really important 
issue.
    Senator Cantwell. But you do agree that you need accurate 
cost and cost assessments?
    Ms. Stachelberg. I absolutely believe that you need 
accurate costs, and I look forward to working with you and 
others at the Department of the Interior to assess and gather 
those accurate costs.
    Senator Cantwell. Thank you. Ms. Richmond, on the efforts 
of our national labs and R&D, some people have already 
mentioned USICA and our efforts to increase the R&D budget. 
With the support of many of my colleagues, we were able to 
authorize $17 billion in that. Do you support an increase in 
funding for the Department of Energy?
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you for that question, Senator 
Cantwell. Yes.
    Senator Cantwell. Okay. Do you support a doubling of DOE's 
innovation budget? Or I guess I could broaden the question to 
say, if we actually doubled that, we would see an additional 
$40 billion. What kind of results do you think we could expect 
from that kind of initiative? I am referring to a report that 
was done by the National Academy of Sciences, the Bipartisan 
Policy Group, and the Breakthrough Energy Institute on some of 
the findings in that report about what we would then be able to 
achieve.
    Specifically, what I am after here is, the dynamics have 
changed. This is not even really on my mind now, about carbon. 
It is not. This is about what energy economies are you going to 
chase? And if you do not do the R&D, we are going to fall 
behind on these energy economies. In the rest of the world, 
everybody has all decided. The consumer has decided. Other 
countries have decided. Everybody is moving off of carbon.
    So what are we going to do to chase those economies and 
those solutions? Because if we do not, we are going to be 
without a lot of jobs. The report characterized this very well. 
What are you thinking--more investment on the R&D side would 
help in doing this?
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you, Senator Cantwell, for that really 
important question. We are the envy of the world when it comes 
to fundamental science and discovery science, and we have the 
potential of falling behind if we don't continue to invest and 
increase our investments in the basic sciences. That's where we 
will continue to win if we continue to provide support for 
them, at our DOE laboratories, in particular, and our 
facilities. Our facilities have just been critical for many of 
the advances that we have had in the past and that we need to 
go forward. But we need funding for those facilities in 
addition to our laboratories and our research scientist ran.
    Now how could we make that change to where we really are 
going to have an impact? I think we do it by funding these 
activities, things like ARPA-E, our energy research centers 
that are really working very hard to go from discovery to 
technology and then further to deployment to create jobs. Those 
kinds of programs and others that the Department of Energy is 
launching, I think, are going to be game changers with regard 
to the ability to get to the endpoint that we need to have.
    We cannot lose this race. We cannot lose this race. So the 
funding is critical to make sure that we can provide the 
technologies that are the technologies of the future, to keep 
jobs going, as we make the changes and advances in our energy 
technologies.
    Senator Cantwell. Thank you. Ms. Berhe, I will ask you a 
question for the record, but it is a similar question, where 
the economics just lose if we don't get it right, and that is 
in that coastal region. It is 17 percent of U.S. land, but they 
are more than half the population and wealth of our natural 
resource economies. If we do not do good coastal zone 
management, we are vulnerable to the seas and surges and 
tsunamis, and understanding this, we are going to have a 
problem. So I look forward to your work on soils and coastal 
issues and getting an answer for the record.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator.
    The Chairman. Senator Lee.
    Senator Lee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Stachelberg, we 
will start with you. On March 22d of this year, you tweeted, 
``Pass universal background checks and ban assault weapons and 
high-capacity magazines. Deliver solutions and results. That's 
what voters want.'' So it appears that you advocate banning 
certain kinds of firearms and magazines. Let's start with the 
firearms. Just, as briefly as you can, tell me what you define 
as an assault weapon.
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I just want to start out by 
saying, like President Biden, I believe we have too much gun 
violence in this country.
    Senator Lee. Sure, I get that. I am just wondering what you 
define as an assault weapon, because you want to ban them. We 
want to know what you mean by that.
    Ms. Stachelberg. In my position at the Center for American 
Progress, I hold certain positions. I have been nominated to be 
the Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and Budget and 
will follow the President's policies. I just also want to say 
that I am a supporter of the Second Amendment to the 
Constitution and believe that hunting, recreational shooting on 
public lands should be followed.
    Senator Lee. I get that. I appreciate all of that. We are 
on a tight time constraint. I have only got a few minutes. So 
just tell me what you mean by assault weapon. Something you 
want to ban. I just want to know what you mean by that.
    Ms. Stachelberg. You know, what I said, as a Center for 
American Progress employee was to reduce gun violence, getting 
assault weapons, AR-15s, out of the hands of people that 
shouldn't have them. And I believe that gun violence is a 
problem in this country, along with President Biden. But as I 
said, I'm a believer in the Second Amendment----
    Senator Lee. Okay. So you mentioned AR-15s. Any other type 
of weapon you would want to ban? What do you define as the--as 
the weapon you want to define? You have said assault weapons. 
The only weapon you have mentioned so far is the AR-15. Is that 
the only gun you want to ban?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I was speaking in a certain 
context, as working at the Center for American Progress. That 
is not the position that I've been nominated for now, and I 
will follow the laws that are passed by Congress----
    Senator Lee. Does the Second Amendment confer an individual 
right to bear arms?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Yes.
    Senator Lee. Do you support the Department of the 
Interior's current positions and policies allowing concealed 
carry and allowing hunting on federal public lands subject, of 
course, to compliance with state law?
    Ms. Stachelberg. I will support all the laws of this land, 
including those that you just mentioned, yes.
    Senator Lee. Now, the wild horse and burro program has been 
struggling for years to bring herds to appropriate management 
levels. This has led to a massive humanitarian concern and 
immense suffering among our equine friends that are part of 
this program.
    How do you believe we can better use fertility treatments 
to get us to sustainable levels on the range?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Wild horses and burros populations, as you 
know, can double in size. It is a difficult issue because it 
puts stresses on landscapes and other species, and I am 
committed to humane treatment and understand that the 
Administration has proposed an increase in the budget to 
address this issue. And if I am confirmed, Senator, I look 
forward to working with you and others on this committee, to 
address this issue.
    Senator Lee. Thank you. I appreciate that. Now, the 
President has stated his strong support for extending federal 
recognition to the Lumbee Tribe of North Carolina. Can you tell 
me why the Administration supports the Lumbee recognition when 
they have not proceeded through the Office of Federal 
Acknowledgment?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I'm not familiar with that 
particular example. I would like to learn more about that, 
spend some time learning about that issue.
    Senator Lee. Okay. I ask about this because the Obama-era 
updates to regulations governing federal acknowledgment of 
Tribal entities significantly eased requirements for 
petitioning for these groups. Do you feel like they should be 
eased further to facilitate acknowledgement of groups like the 
Lumbee?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, recognition of Tribes is 
incredibly important. I know it is a priority of this 
Administration and of Secretary Haaland. I'm not currently at 
the Department, but if I am confirmed, I look forward to 
working with you and others on this committee to ensure that we 
have proper recognition of Tribes and have really enhanced the 
sacred trust that we have with Native Americans.
    Senator Lee. The Endangered Species Act is also something 
that plays a significant role in the operation of the 
Department of the the Interior. The Endangered Species Act has 
often been interpreted and applied in ways that have prevented 
forest management activities of the sort that are necessary to 
reduce the risk of wildfire and, ironically, this in turn, 
presented greater threats to wildlife.
    Unfortunately, when forests are not managed, they can 
become more dangerous for the endangered species that exist 
there. How do you think we can better implement forest 
management to prevent wildfires and protect species?
    Ms. Stachelberg. I just want to say, at the outset, I want 
to note that I don't believe that there's a choice. I think 
it's a false choice between wildfire and the economy and 
species. I do want to work with you and others on the committee 
to ensure that the Endangered Species Act is implemented 
correctly. I think it's been a success. We just have to look at 
the bald eagle, or the American alligator to ensure that.
    As I noted in my opening, wildfires are a growing problem 
with severe drought and the prevalence of them. I look forward 
to working with this committee to ensure that we address not 
just endangered species, but our forests as well. I was 
heartened to see in the bipartisan infrastructure deal, as it's 
been reported, that there is money for additional support for 
wildland fires. I'm looking forward to, if I'm confirmed, 
working at the Department to bring those disparate and often 
distinct bureaus and divisions at the Department of the 
Interior together to address not just endangered species but 
forest management.
    One of the things that I've done throughout my career is 
work with local stakeholders to ensure that we come up with 
solutions that are durable. I think forest management, 
wildfires, and endangered species, and addressing those 
challenges are among the things that will require that kind of 
ability to bring different stakeholders from the local level--
from private landowners to ranchers to farmers and others.
    Senator Lee. Thank you. I see my time has expired. I agree 
with you that the Endangered Species Act has, in many ways, 
been a success to those species, and to those humans whose 
habitats have been destroyed through mismanagement and 
misapplication of the Act. When we can see harm coming, fuel 
building up and a refusal to treat them, that is less than a 
success and I look forward to working with anyone within the 
Department who can help address that.
    Thank you.
    Senator Barrasso [presiding]. Senator Heinrich.
    Senator Heinrich. Thank you, Ranking Member Barrasso. 
Ranking Member Barrasso, I have a letter here supporting Ms. 
Stachelberg's nomination that I would like to ask unanimous 
consent to enter into the record. It is signed by groups 
ranging from the American Sportfishing Association to the 
Archery Trade Association to the Hispanic Access Foundation, 
the Mule Deer Foundation, Outdoor Industry Association, and 
dozens and dozens of additional stakeholders in our public 
lands.
    Senator Barrasso. Without objection.
    [The letter referred to follows:]
    
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    Senator Heinrich. Ms. Stachelberg, one of the proudest 
moments that I have certainly had on this committee was passage 
of the Great American Outdoors Act. That Act provided 
guaranteed funding for the Land and Water Conservation Fund and 
to fix public lands infrastructure that has fallen into 
disrepair.
    If confirmed, are you committed to fully utilizing those 
funds in each and every Department of the Interior budget 
request?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, thank you for the question. Yes, 
I am committed to doing so. I think that the bipartisan passage 
of the Great American Outdoors Act was a crowning achievement 
last year. It is certainly one of the priorities of the 
Secretary--effective implementation of the law.
    The goal to meet the intent of Congress and reduce 
maintenance is a terribly important component of Congressional 
intent. If I am confirmed, I look forward to working with you 
and others on this committee, ensuring that maintenance 
projects are taken care of, the backlog is reduced, and that 
the bureaus and divisions charged with deferred maintenance 
have the appropriate resources, in order to do their jobs.
    Senator Heinrich. I appreciate that very much, and I would 
just point out, it is also an incredible opportunity for the 
Administration to use something we did last year to build back 
better. It is an enormous economic opportunity for the 
investments in that infrastructure.
    Dr. Richmond, in 2018 you oversaw the advisory body that 
put together that year's edition of Science and Engineering 
indicators. That is a biannual Congressionally mandated report 
that provides authoritative statistics on the status of science 
in the United States.
    According to an American Institute of Physics article 
published at the time, you expressed concern about U.S. R&D 
policies, saying that inadequate funding levels for R&D, ``Will 
continue to erode ability to be competitive to the level that 
you see other countries rising, such as China''.
    Talk to me about where you see American R&D today, what has 
changed, and what has not, and where your concerns are.
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you, Senator, for that question. This 
is important and this is timely. The way I've seen us, since 
2018--the numbers that came out in 2018, with regard to, 
basically, China starting to eclipse our capabilities was 
frightening, is frightening, especially when we think of 
ourselves as being a leader in the science and engineering 
enterprise. Looking at the funding that China is pumping into 
their technology and research is incredible.
    But you know, money is not the only thing. It's talent and 
it's our facilities and our laboratories. I worried then, and I 
still worry today that, do we have the funding that we need to 
keep our laboratories, keep our research groups going, that we 
really need to make this competitive edge?
    Where we are ahead, currently, today and hopefully for the 
future, too, really is in the basic fundamental science. We are 
the leader, especially in the physical sciences, in materials, 
in a number of different areas that I could name. We cannot 
lose that.
    Now, we can spend our time looking over our shoulder, 
worrying about China. Instead, we need to look forward, like in 
a race, and say, let's be as innovative as we possibly can. Get 
our scientists onboard to be able to make the kind of changes 
that we need in order to stay ahead and be innovators. I 
believe if we can do that we will continue to be the leader in 
the world. But there are threats. There certainly are threats 
that are worrisome.
    Senator Heinrich. I think you articulated that very well. 
Dr. Berhe, congratulations on your nomination. You are a soil 
scientist, and well-known for your climate-related research on 
soil carbon sequestration, which is becoming more and more 
recognized and relevant by the moment. I think that is a great 
background to run the Office of Science.
    Since the 1950's, actually, the Office of Science has made 
major contributions to our understanding of environmental and 
earth systems science research. For example, it was behind the 
earliest research on atmospheric and ocean circulation that 
eventually became the climate and earth system models that we 
utilize and depend on so much today.
    As you know, the President's budget requested a 10 percent 
increase for biological and environmental research at the 
Office of Science. Can you talk to us a little bit about what 
some of the vital but underfunded initiatives are that you 
might champion, if confirmed for this position?
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator. Yes, as you stated, soil 
carbon sequestration is an important area and an area that has 
been a strong focus of BER and Office of Science activities, in 
general. I think there's a number of activities that could 
benefit with an increase in budget for the BER program, in 
particular, having to do with climate change responses, in 
particular, thinking about reducing greenhouse gas emissions, 
for example, through a number of approaches.
    But as are also genome-enabled research and biology, a 
synthetic biology of multiple different areas that have only 
risen in prominence over the last several decades and have 
become even more important. You know, the facilities that 
enable that kind of research, too, as we've seen with COVID and 
the national research efforts that coordinated to understand 
the dynamics of that--you know, how the viruses were changing 
and how to even tackle that important issue.
    So there are vast areas of research that have already been 
set as priority areas for BER that would benefit and a number 
that could be added to that list with an increase in budget. 
And I appreciate your effort, and others, in helping see an 
increase in budget for those really important programs.
    Thank you, Senator.
    Senator Heinrich. Thank you, Doctor.
    The Chairman. Senator Lankford.
    Senator Lankford. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank all of you 
for going through the process and to be able to go through 
these questions and issues.
    Ms. Stachelberg, let me ask a question. What are your 
thoughts about Congress having the authority to determine the 
scope and authority of federal agencies? Does Congress have the 
authority to determine the scope and the task on federal 
agencies?
    Ms. Stachelberg. If I understand your question, Senator, I 
think that Congress, working with other entities, has the 
ability to pass laws and--if that's what you're asking me----
    Senator Lankford. Sure, yes, just trying to figure out, I 
guess, just more of a constitutional question of who sets the 
parameters for agencies? Can agencies decide what they want to 
do or are those parameters set by Congress?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I've been nominated for the 
position of Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and 
Budget and----
    Senator Lankford. Yes, but dealing with policy, yes.
    Ms. Stachelberg [continuing]. And will absolutely be 
dealing with policy. Looking forward to working with you and 
others on this committee. I think that's outside the scope of 
what I will be doing on a day-to-day basis. I know the one 
thing that I will do is that I will follow the regulations and 
the rules and the laws and work to implement the policies of 
the Secretary and the President.
    Senator Lankford. That's great. I ask--in 2016, you wrote, 
at one point, ``In the face of persistent inaction in Congress 
to close the gaps in the nation's gun laws that leave many 
communities vulnerable to near daily gun violence, today's 
comments and actions demonstrate this Administration's 
continued commitment to taking a comprehensive approach to 
addressing this public health crisis.'' Okay, no issue there. 
Then, the next statement is, ``Center for American Progress is 
eager to continue working with leaders across the country to 
follow the President's example and explore opportunities to 
take action now, without waiting for recalcitrant 
legislature''. That is one.
    In 2013, you wrote, ``There are more than a dozen 
appropriation riders passed each year, typically without any 
discussion or debate, which significantly limit the Federal 
Government's ability to regulate the firearms industry. 
Congress has interfered with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, 
and Firearms and Explosives' ability to fulfill its mission by 
enacting riders to the appropriation bills that dilute its 
power over licensed gun dealers.''
    So the reason I ask is, it is a philosophical question but 
it is a practical effect, to try to figure out just your 
perspective on whether Congress has the authority, for 
instance, to give instructions through legislation that's 
appropriation riders, is legislation to give instruction to the 
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms and Explosives to be 
able to deal with what they can do and cannot do, or to be able 
to deal with firearms, or if agencies or entities, or your 
office in the future, in dealing with firearms policy on 
Department of the Interior lands. For instance, what that's 
going to look like, how wide is that latitude, or is that set 
by Congress?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I look forward to working with 
you on further addressing this question but let me zoom out for 
just one moment and say that, absolutely, Congress passes laws 
and works with agencies. As you know, the Executive Branch has 
the ability to pass regulations. One of the things that I'm 
looking forward to, if I'm confirmed, is working with Congress 
to achieve policies that address climate change, affect 
conservation of our public lands, and that's the job that I'm, 
before you now, seeking to talk about.
    And so, if you're asking me whether agencies have latitude 
to issue regulations and Congress has latitude to pass laws and 
write appropriations riders, absolutely both of them are true.
    Senator Lankford. Yes, to me it is more of a philosophical 
conversation, trying to figure out what kind of relationship we 
would have because, constitutionally, Congress obviously writes 
the laws. Regulations are created that have to be consistent 
with those laws. A regulator cannot just create regulations 
outside of the scope of what law is already there. And so, what 
I am trying to figure out is, when you write things like, ``a 
recalcitrant Congress is not doing it, and so, the 
Administration's going to do it'', or that appropriation riders 
are limiting the actions of an agency and what they want to do, 
I am trying to figure out a philosophical basis on this.
    I do want to drill down one other issue, as well. You 
mentioned about the success of the Endangered Species Act. 
There are some species that have recovered on that, but if I 
remember correctly, it is about two percent of the species that 
have actually graduated out of being listed in the Endangered 
Species Act.
    It has been a challenge for us, in Oklahoma. For instance, 
we are dealing with the lesser prairie chicken on the western 
side of our state. We have done a lot of voluntary cooperation. 
Our farmers and ranchers and commercial entities have done a 
lot of work and when the agency steps in and says, ``Thanks for 
all your work on this but now we're going to take it from 
here'', it diminishes some of that.
    So we do have some work to be able to do to actually have 
the Endangered Species Act actually be successful, because I do 
not see a two percent graduation rate as successful. So there 
are some things that we still need to be able to do to try to 
recover these species and graduate them off.
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, if I just might comment. If I'm 
confirmed, I look forward to coming to Oklahoma and learning 
more about it. I think the partnership of ranchers and farmers 
and local communities and engaged stakeholders is essential, 
not just for the successful implementation of the Endangered 
Species Act, but for all the laws and policies that are 
promulgated by the Department of the Interior. If I'm 
confirmed, I hope I'll be able to work further with you and 
your staff on that issue.
    Senator Lankford. Great, thank you. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator Lankford. Senator 
Hickenlooper.
    Senator Hickenlooper. Great, thank you, Mr. Chair. I thank 
all of you, not just for being here today, but for your public 
service. I tremendously appreciate it.
    Dr. Berhe, I saw that you went and you got a Ph.D. in 
biogeochemistry. I want to just publicly salute you for that, 
because that has to be one of the great interconnections of 
science which, I think, if you look at where cutting-edge 
research is today, so much of it is taking place at a nexus 
like that. I have a master's in geology, but it would be 
considered primitive from anything that you have studied. I 
know that Berkeley is one of the top schools in the country. So 
again, to have dealt with what you did, what your family did, 
to come here and to achieve that is really remarkable.
    I wanted to ask you, looking at just direct capture, nature 
affords us a multitude of ways of capturing carbon and storing 
carbon. How do you think about funding that research and 
supporting entrepreneurs whose natural carbon removal 
technology, perhaps, does not get to the market for 5 or 10 
years, as opposed to being there already? I would also love if 
you could provide some examples from the soil carbon and 
mineral sequestration. I do not even know what blue carbon is, 
but one of my staff dug that up. Anyway, give us a quick answer 
on that.
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator, and I appreciate your 
comments. Biogeochemistry is, as you said, a very 
interdisciplinary area. But as, again, you correctly said, we 
have to think in those interdisciplinary perspectives if we are 
going to, kind of, keep pushing the frontiers of the science. 
And I'm a huge fan of geology, obviously, so thank you.
    Yes, just to address your question, nature, indeed, is one 
of our best allies in addressing the climate challenge. There 
are multiple solutions available. This is the area of research 
where I've spent a considerable part of my career. There are 
multiple areas where we are able to actually take out carbon 
dioxide from the atmosphere, for example, and store it in more 
slower cycling pools in soil. And doing so, in soil and other 
natural environments--in blue carbon even--becomes an important 
issue, as in carbon in oceans and ocean sediment--and in the 
ocean system and marine systems and aquatic systems in general.
    All of those are options that are incredible, available. 
And you know, keep in mind that the way we have used natural 
resources, historically, has caused a lot of carbon to be 
released from the natural ecosystems into the atmosphere. But 
we can, at least, reverse some of that and actually use natural 
ecosystems to sequester a significant amount of carbon from 
the--and take it out. So drill down from the atmosphere and 
reduce the atmospheric burden of greenhouse gases.
    This is a thriving area of research and also a thriving 
area that is of interest to businesses and land managers across 
the board. And I think, you know, I agree with you that 
sometimes research can be little slow, but this is in one area 
where the technology transfer and the partnerships between 
science and industry is moving at a really fast pace. And I 
think everything we could do to help in that respect, from the 
scientific standpoint, could only help address these incredible 
climate challenges that we have in front of us.
    Senator Hickenloooper. It is an exciting time. I think you 
are going to be the right person in the right place.
    I am not sure I am going to get to you, Dr. Richmond, but 
trust me, I am so impressed with all that you have done. I saw 
that you taught for five years at Bryn Mawr where my----
    Dr. Richmond. I did.
    Senator Hickenlooper [continuing]. My great-aunt went and 
so, I am a huge fan of that institution.
    Ms. Stachelberg, I want to just put in a plug and ask your 
opinion. So often when science is occurring and research is 
occurring, some of the most important work is done by the 
people that are not scientists and those who are able to keep 
an enterprise on budget and on task, and obviously, you have 
done that in number of different arenas. Is that somehow--
describe just briefly, I have used up too much of my time--that 
ability. How do you see that helping in the Department of the 
Interior and the role you are proposed for?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, thank you for that question and I 
will be brief. That is what is exciting about the Assistant 
Secretary for Policy, Management, and Budget. I've spent my 
career working to ensure that teams have the support they need, 
the budgets they need, the direction that they need, providing 
strategic guidance and leadership to teams and bureaus and 
divisions. And that's what I've done throughout my career.
    If I'm confirmed, I look forward to doing it, not just with 
scientists, not just with climate experts, not just with 
firefighters, not just with those who work on water and mines 
and Native Americans but with all of the Department assets to 
ensure that we conserve our public lands, that we ensure that 
we have an outdoor economy that is creating jobs and working 
for all of us.
    It's the kind of work that I like to do--bringing disparate 
people together, working across the aisle. If I'm confirmed, I 
look forward to working with you and others on this committee, 
to ensure that the Department is moving in the right direction.
    Senator Hickenlooper. Great, and I have firsthand 
experience of the sensitivity of scientists that is probably 
only matched by the sensitivity of Senators. Anyway, I yield my 
time--or, my lack of time--to the Chair.
    The Chairman. We are not that sensitive, sir.
    [Laughter.]
    The Chairman. We have Senator Marshall at this time.
    Senator Marshall. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and 
congratulations to our nominees.
    My first question is for Dr. Richmond. Dr. Richmond, the 
Big 12 is one of the most storied conferences in the history of 
our nation. It is known for its academic excellence and, 
obviously, the strongest basketball conference in the history 
of this nation for the last 10 years, and a top three football 
program as well. Let's assume that Texas and Oklahoma leave and 
Oklahoma State, for my colleague from Oklahoma, that they are 
out of the conference. If Kansas State was playing West 
Virginia, (a) who would you root for?
    [Laughter.]
    Senator Marshall. And (b) can you think of a funner place 
to be than a Kansas State-West Virginia football game?
    Dr. Richmond. I'd probably be watching the Ducks.
    [Laughter.]
    Dr. Richmond. How can I win by answering that correctly?
    The Chairman. Good one--that was a good answer. Good 
answer.
    Senator Marshall. Well, great answer. No, I--certainly from 
one Wildcat to another, the--what did Senator Roberts say? The 
ever-fighting, mighty Wildcats. Welcome and congratulations.
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you.
    Senator Marshall. Let's talk about something really 
important to Kansas, and that is biofuels--and I think 
important to the environmental footprint of this nation. What 
do you see for the opportunities for biofuels, and 
specifically, renewable diesel and biodiesel?
    Dr. Richmond. Well, thank you for that question, Senator 
Marshall. Let me just start by saying, on our farm, in the 
early morning years and years ago, my father got up every 
morning and shoveled coal into the furnace to get our house 
warm. And now, I know that there's a nuclear plant in Kansas 
that's providing 800,000 people with energy. What a transition 
that's made.
    Senator Marshall. Eighteen percent of our energy comes from 
that nuclear plant.
    Dr. Richmond. It's amazing. It's amazing. And so 
transitions can happen, and transitions can certainly happen. 
We can make much more progress in the bioenergy sphere. But 
again, it takes what's--we just have to make sure that we are 
doing the best research that we can, getting at tech 
technology, and getting it further. That, and any of the other 
fossil fuels, on all of these--we cannot give up on any of 
these fuels at all, because we need them to drive our economy. 
That said, we also need to make sure that we reduce our 
greenhouse gases and make sure that everything is--the 
emissions can be--not be detrimental to the climate, as they 
are right now.
    And so all of these energy sources, it's important for us 
to go forward. And nuclear, of course, in the respect of 
emissions is a good resource. But we have to work hard on the 
carbon capture in other ways, too, in order to reduce the 
greenhouse emissions.
    Senator Marshall. So I am excited to hear you talk about 
taking traditional energy and making it cleaner. That is a 
great start.
    What would the impact of year-round E15 have in this 
country, as well as the rest of the world?
    Dr. Richmond. You mean in terms of what would--if we make 
advances in these areas, how would it----
    Senator Marshall. If we were using E15 year-round, what 
impact would it have on tailpipe emissions?
    Dr. Richmond. Could you explain to me what E15 is? I'm 
sorry.
    Senator Marshall. It is an ethanol blend.
    Dr. Richmond. Oh, oh, of course.
    Senator Marshall. Of 15 percent.
    Dr. Richmond. With ethanol. Well, I think--listen, I think 
it's important for us to show that this is a very powerful way 
to generate energy for cars. Sorry, I didn't know it was called 
that. But on the other hand, it does give a message to the 
world and helps us with regard to being able to export and do 
issues in this area too. It's important. We just have to work 
some details out.
    Senator Marshall. Okay, thank you.
    Dr. Berhe, let's talk about soil carbon sequestration, just 
for a second. Certainly, I'm excited about those opportunities. 
You know, the same farmers that took 10 bushels-of-wheat land 
and turned it into 70 bushels-an-acre land could develop 
something at Kansas State University to be used in the ocean. 
We're taking plankton and teaching it how to absorb more 
carbon, which is simply photosynthesis, where we would farm the 
carbon in the ocean--the plankton in the ocean, as well.
    What do you see on the horizon? What are the opportunities 
for soil carbon sequestration? And please don't talk about no-
till farming or cover crops, which we have been doing on our 
farm in Kansas for 25 years. What is out there? What is the 
vision? What does the future look like to you?
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator, for that important question. 
Yes, this is an area that I'm very, very passionate about and, 
in addition to the really great options that are on the table, 
some of which you mentioned, I think we have an incredible 
amount of opportunity in front of us when it comes to working 
with land managers to improve soil health, which is beneficial 
for improving their productivity. But at the same time, it 
builds up carbon in soil and takes it out of the atmosphere and 
builds up in soil.
    Some of the most promising technologies out there, and 
approaches, include, for example, bioenergy crops that 
sometimes tend to be perennial and also have deep rooting 
systems that are critical for carbon sequestration. But we also 
have to bring into the mix, to a larger extent, how we can use 
carbon that is currently in waste streams and bring it back 
into the soil, which also comes with additional nutrients. And 
I'm talking about animal manure, animal waste in general, as 
well as even sometimes human and municipal waste, in the form 
of biosolids, that is now being tried across the board as an 
option for improving soil health, soil carbon sequestration and 
thereby improving activity of agricultural and working lands in 
general.
    I think there are a number of these options. In particular, 
ones that have to do with options that allow us to use waste 
and reroute waste and use it as a resource. Options that allow 
us to store carbon in deep soils, in particular, with deeper 
rooted, in particular, perennials. All of these and many, many 
more. This is a very exciting area for this field, as you can 
imagine. And I'm very passionate and excited about the 
opportunities to work with land managers and all sorts of 
stakeholders in this area because this is something that is 
happening, and I think we need to figure out a way to make sure 
that we're helping all of those that are doing the good work in 
this area.
    Thank you, I appreciate----
    Senator Marshall. Thank you so much. Chairman, I yield 
back.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. Senator Hirono.
    Senator Hirono. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I ask all nominees 
on any of the committees on which I sit the following two 
initial questions. I would like to ask all of you this en 
masse. Since you became a legal adult, have you ever made 
unwanted requests for sexual favors or committed any verbal or 
physical harassment or assault of a sexual nature?
    Dr. Richmond. No.
    Dr. Berhe. No.
    Ms. Stachelberg. No.
    Senator Hirono. Have you ever faced discipline or entered 
into a settlement related to this kind of conduct?
    Dr. Richmond. No.
    Dr. Berhe. No.
    Ms. Stachelberg. No.
    Senator Hirono. Dr. Berhe, I was very interested to learn 
of the work that you did with the ADVANCEGeo partnership that 
focuses on empowering geoscientists to respond to and prevent 
sexual harassment, discrimination, and bullying in research 
workplaces. This is an area of concern to me as we talk about 
our country's ability to compete, especially in the STEM areas 
where women and minorities drop out of these fields in droves. 
Your work in preventing sexual harassment and these kinds of 
workplace issues is really interesting to me.
    So Dr. Berhe, what have you learned working on the 
partnership, and how would you apply that learning in leading 
the Office of Science?
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you very much, Senator. You're right. This 
is a really important area if we're going to continue to 
maintain a very competitive and successful, scientific 
workforce. Ensuring the welfare of that workforce and ensuring 
that people from all walks of life can enter science and 
succeed in the scientific workforce is a really important goal. 
It's been a goal of mine in my entire professional career.
    In particular, what we've done in the ADVANCEGeo 
partnership--which is, as you know, an NSF-funded effort--is to 
make sure that we're empowering scientists to address these 
issues and prevent them from happening in the first place. 
Create workplace cultures that actually limit the occurrence of 
these incidents. You know, we have legal mechanisms to address 
them after the fact, but I personally believe that's a little 
too late a time to address them.
    So we could actually use a community model, a community 
building approach, where we're empowering scientists to work 
together to establish a culture where everyone that enters our 
academic institutions deserves to just be able to focus on 
their work, in peace, without any kind of exclusionary 
behavior. And that if we establish these shared goals and learn 
about what's right and what's not right ahead of time, I think 
we could do a lot of good. And that's one of the most important 
lessons that has come out of the ADVANCEGeo project.
    Obviously, the ADVANCEGeo project was focused on very 
different kinds of institutions--in particular, universities. 
Not necessarily the Office of Science type of scale, even 
though Office of Science funds universities, obviously. But I 
think there are important lessons of community building and 
partnerships that would allow us to prevent things.
    Senator Hirono. And are these lessons learned things that 
you will apply, heading up the Office of Science? Because I 
agree with you that prevention and education and awareness and 
creating an environment where these kinds of behaviors get 
reported and dealt with is really important. So I assume that 
you will implement or institute these kinds of practices----
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, again, Senator.
    Senator Hirono [continuing]. In your new position, should 
you be confirmed.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes, I'm looking forward to working with the 
leadership at DOE and the national labs and learning about what 
kinds of things are occurring right now in that space and 
sharing things we've learned from the AdvanceGeo and other 
opportunities.
    Senator Hirono. I am going to be interested in continuing a 
dialogue with you in these areas.
    I am running out of time, but I just wanted to mention to 
Ms. Stachelberg the important role that the Department of the 
Interior plays in serving indigenous communities, including our 
Native Hawaiian community. So I certainly look forward to 
speaking with you about this in more detail during a future 
discussion.
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I look forward to that, if I'm 
confirmed. Thank you.
    Senator Hirono. Dr. Richmond, maintaining a culture of 
scientific integrity within DOE's Office of Science is 
critically important. What steps will you take to support DOE's 
scientists and foster scientific communication with the public?
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you very much for that question. It's 
really important and also timely, Senator. My role, if 
confirmed, would be to ensure that the leadership sends the 
message strongly, down and out, that scientific integrity is 
our priority.
    As a scientist, we have ways in terms of the research that 
we do, making certain that it is valid, reproducible, and comes 
to the appropriate conclusions based on the data. We have 
checks and balances that are there in order to ensure that the 
best science gets out and gets very visible as long as we're 
sticking with the data.
    But it goes beyond that with regard to being able to 
enter--to have the public trust us, with regard to whether they 
believe what we are saying is important and the priorities that 
we are setting. And therefore, it's important that we use data 
that has the integrity that allows us to make the important 
points to move the needle on some of the important issues that 
we have in technology and also energy workforce development.
    So I can assure you that that would be a top priority for 
me and working with the Secretary to ensure that scientific 
integrity is operative at all levels and also that we provide 
the public and the taxpayers the knowledge that that's the way 
we operate.
    Thank you for that question.
    Senator Hirono. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, if you don't 
mind--I am glad that you mentioned the need to restore the 
public's trust in science and facts as a way to make decisions 
because there are major concerns that I have as to whether or 
not we do have a public that relies on facts and science for 
decision-making.
    Thank you.
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. Senator King, by virtual.
    Senator King. Mr. Chairman----
    The Chairman. Oh, I am sorry. Senator King, I am so sorry. 
I missed our good friend, way up in Alaska. I missed her. I did 
not see her over there in Alaska. Senator Murkowski, I am so 
sorry.
    Senator King. I am delighted to defer to the Senator from 
Alaska.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you.
    The Chairman. And then, Senator King, you will be next.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    The Chairman. I am sorry.
    Senator Murkowski. No, no, no, I appreciate that. I thank 
you for your willingness to come before the committee today and 
answer some questions.
    First, this is a question, I think, to both Dr. Richmond 
and to you, Dr. Berhe. I have been paying very close attention 
to the Arctic Energy Office. This is going to be playing an 
ever-increasing role in our nation's national security policy, 
as the Arctic becomes, certainly, a focal point when we look to 
geopolitics, but also, certainly in the climate space and 
initiatives, as well.
    So Dr. Richmond, Dr. Berhe, I would ask for a commitment 
from both of you today that, if you're confirmed, you will 
collaborate closely with the Arctic Energy Office, promote 
Arctic-related science issues in your positions, and ensure 
that the AEO retains its independence and its cross-cutting 
nature. I would like to know that you are going to be 
supporting that moving forward.
    Dr. Richmond. Yes, Senator Murkowski, this is an incredibly 
important issue, not just for Alaskans, but for the country. We 
stay involved in many of the things having to do with 
microgrids, and so forth, that you have in Alaska that can be 
really cross-cutting and also very forward-looking, as we go 
forward, in addition to all the other EERE activities we have 
in Alaska.
    You have a spectacular state, but you also have a 
spectacular opportunity to really lead the country in many of 
these areas. So yes.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you for acknowledging that. We do 
have a role that goes far beyond the boundaries of the State of 
Alaska, and it is very global. So we appreciate that. And my 
friend, Senator King, who deferred to me, knows that well, as 
the Co-Chair of the Arctic Conference.
    Dr. Berhe, your views, please.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes, Senator. You have my commitment. The Arctic 
is an important area for many reasons, including the beauty and 
the majestic environments. And you have my commitment that 
these are very, very important areas that I would be--look 
forward to talking to you and your staff and working with all 
the stakeholders on these important issues.
    Senator Murkowski. Yes, I would appreciate that. In 
addition to great beauty, we have really, really smart and 
innovative people. So tap into those.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes, I know that.
    Senator Murkowski. Question for you, Ms. Stachelberg. The 
Office of Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and 
Budget obviously plays a key role in the management of our 
nation's resources, including the collecting, the accounting, 
and the distribution of revenues from energy and mineral 
leases. Whether it is on our federal lands or on our Tribal 
lands, so many of our rural communities rely on these 
disbursements from the Department for everything from schools 
to community services. Many of these revenues go to pay for 
many of the conservation programs that have very broad, 
bipartisan support here.
    I know that you have not been at the Department. You 
probably have some limited insight in the current 
Administration's oil and gas lease pause. But you are here as 
the nominee for the Chief Financial Officer for the Department. 
In that prospective role, do you think that it is prudent to 
put a pause on one of the main drivers of revenue for the 
Department while the Administration is proposing a massive 
spending increase for the Department?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, thank you for your question, and 
it's good to see you again. I'm not confirmed yet, as you know. 
We've had conversations before about the incredible opportunity 
that the Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and Budget 
has in working with the career staff--incredible staff--in 
Alaska, and if I'm confirmed, I look forward to doing that.
    I am nominated by the President and follow the policies of 
the President, Secretary Haaland, and those are their policies 
and I plan to follow those.
    Senator Murkowski. Well, it is just--again, I am asking 
from the perspective of the financial management--fiscal 
management, here, and it just seems a bit incongruous that you 
would be limiting--clearly limiting the ability of receiving 
these revenues that are so key to some of, not only the 
Administration's priorities, but I think, priorities here in 
Congress.
    One last, quick question for you. As you know, I am the 
Senior Republican on the Interior Appropriations Subcommittee. 
I am very familiar with the Department of the Interior's 
budget. The President's budget includes $17.6 billion for the 
Department this year. It is a big job. It is an extraordinarily 
diverse Department, if you will, in terms budget areas. So very 
quickly, what is your experience with developing and 
implementing large budgets and your familiarity with the 
Department's annual budget process?
    Ms. Stachelberg. I am familiar with the Department's budget 
process. One of the reasons why I am eager to be confirmed is 
not only to work with this committee on so many of the issues, 
but to begin to work on the Fiscal Year budget and work with 
you on the issues that you have.
    I've spent two and a half decades working on budgets, 
finances, doing cross-cutting work at complex, large 
organizations. I have the skills to bring people together.
    I think one of the interesting and unique roles that the 
Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and Budget plays at 
the Department of the Interior is to bring sometimes competing, 
sometimes conflicting, views together, whether it's on budget, 
whether it's on management. Listening to Members of Congress on 
both sides of the aisle, listening to perspectives from people 
from Alaska--and we'll hear from Maine. Those are the kinds of 
things that I have done. As I think Senator Collins might have 
said to you, I have a track record of working across the aisle, 
working with diverse people. And one of the jobs of the 
Assistant Secretary for Policy, Management, and Budget is to be 
one of those liaisons with respect to appropriations and 
budget.
    I believe I have the skills, the temperament, and I'm 
eager, if confirmed, to work with you and others on this 
committee to ensure that the Department of the Interior's 
budget, the programs that it runs--conservation, climate, 
Western water, fire and land management--are all taken care of 
and that the departments and bureaus and divisions have the 
appropriate resources they need to do their jobs.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you for the response. Thank you, 
Mr. Chairman, and thank you to Senator King.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. And now, Senator King.
    Senator King. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
    Dr. Richmond, we have mentioned the subject of climate 
change several times. I am haunted by the experience of England 
between the World Wars, particularly in the 1930's. Winston 
Churchill wrote his first volume of the history of World War II 
called, ``The Gathering Storm'', which was about the period of 
the 1930's, when English politicians essentially denied, or 
ignored, the growing threat from a militarizing Germany.
    I wonder how we are going to be viewed 20 years from now, 
in terms of the threat of climate change. This summer has 
really brought it into stark focus, with wildfires earlier than 
ever, larger-than-ever drought, and the excessive heat in the 
Northwest. If ever we are getting a warning, it is now. Yet we 
are still sort of arguing about it and moving forward, and we 
are taking steps in various bills and legislation.
    But do you share my sense of urgency about this and that 
when the history of this period is read, I want to be Winston 
Churchill, not Neville Chamberlain. Can we do more, and should 
we do more?
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you, Senator King, for that really 
important question. You mentioned that, will we look back after 
30 years and wonder if we made the wrong decision? I'd say 
that's closer to 20, maybe 15. This is urgent. We have to take 
action now. And the Department of Energy has to be the leader 
in taking those initiatives that will make us not regret that 
we did nothing for the now, and the next even five or six 
years, whatever it is.
    And I assure you that that will be, if confirmed, a top 
priority of mine to basically save the planet. To do the 
technologies that we need to save the planet for ourselves, but 
also our children. Thank you.
    Senator King. Well, a young Harvard senior in 1940 wrote 
his thesis called, ``While England Slept''. That was, of 
course, John F. Kennedy, and I do not want somebody writing a 
book, you know, called ``While America Slept'' or ``While the 
World Slept''. We went into this really extraordinary crisis, 
the likes of which I do not think we have seen. So I look 
forward to working with you on that.
    I want to ask you a somewhat difficult question, but it 
gets at some of the questions we have had today. There have 
been questions raised about Dr. Berhe's experience and 
administrative experience. You are going to be the Under 
Secretary for Science. She is going to be the Director of the 
Office of Science. Do you have confidence in her ability to 
manage that office and to lead that office, in terms of the 
important scientific research that we must do?
    Dr. Richmond. Yes, I am fully confident that she will be 
capable of fulfilling the duties of that position, and I look 
forward to working with her to see if there is any way I can 
continue to support the efforts that she will be leading.
    Senator King. I am delighted to hear that. To go back to 
the question of climate change--you know, there were, sort of, 
Chicken Littles or Paul Reveres, whatever you want to call 
them, in the past--Malthus being one. But technology saved us 
from Malthus' predictions, and that is why I think the work 
that this office and you will be doing is so essential. Science 
must lead us out of this crisis.
    Dr. Richmond. Yes, I agree. And let me reemphasize the 
point that I made earlier, that our Department of Energy 
national laboratories are really the ones that can make the big 
difference that we need to make. We just need to make certain 
that they have the appropriate resources to be able to move 
forward. Because, again, they can take things from the 
beginning of the journey, the fundamental science, all the way 
to the end, in which it's deployed. And that is going to be so 
critical that we do that quickly, without breaking down the 
stove pipes, in order to get an answer to some of these issues 
that we so critically need to find answers to.
    Senator King. And everything from soil's ability to 
sequester carbon to carbon removal from the atmosphere to 
energy storage. I mean, all of those are scientific questions.
    Ms. Stachelberg, let me ask a completely different 
question. Senator Heinrich mentioned the Great American 
Outdoors Act, and I think one of the most important principles 
is that execution is as important as vision. We supplied the 
vision, and now you have to supply the execution and the 
implementation.
    I hope that you will commit to absolute transparency and 
clarity about the administration of the Great American Outdoors 
Act, especially the Restore Our Parks Act. Where the money is 
going, how it is decided where it is going, what the formulas 
are. I think that would be very important in giving us 
confidence in the administration on this important program.
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, as I said earlier, I think the 
Great American Outdoors Act certainly is one of the Secretary's 
highest priorities. It was a crowning achievement last year in 
a significant bipartisan way. You absolutely have my 100 
percent commitment on that front. In addition to committing to 
you to be transparent on this issue, that's the way I will 
work, if I'm confirmed, as Assistant Secretary for Planning, 
Management, and Budget at the Department of the Interior.
    I think it's also important, especially with the Great 
American Outdoors Act and the Land and Water Conservation Fund 
and spending the taxpayers money wisely, that we encourage 
local, community-driven conservation projects. And I'm looking 
forward, if I'm confirmed, to working with you and this 
committee, to ensure that we spend those dollars wisely, that 
we create outdoor recreation opportunities, and provide much-
needed open spaces for families and boost local economies.
    So thank you for your question.
    Senator King. Thank you, and thanks to all three of our 
nominees this morning for your testimony. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. Senator Cortez Masto.
    Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Welcome, 
congratulations to all three of you. It has been an incredible 
morning just listening to your responses to the questions 
posed.
    Dr. Richmond, let me ask you. Based on your current 
experiences with DOE, I am curious to hear more about your 
thoughts on the current status of the U.S. workforce. When it 
comes to RD&D for new technologies. Is there more that the U.S. 
Government needs to be doing to enhance STEM education in order 
to attract more scientists and researchers into this field 
knowing that the 21st century is going to take us in this 
innovation economy? I am curious about your thoughts on that.
    Dr. Richmond. Thank you, Senator, for that question. I'm as 
passionate about the workforce as I am about innovation.
    I have worked with many of the DOE lab leadership over the 
years, even doing research on issues of workforce in their 
laboratories, to try to understand how we can increase not only 
the number of women and minorities that are in their 
laboratories but also get them into leadership positions, which 
then, of course, we all know makes a big difference.
    I think there's much that we can do in the educational 
arena to increase the number of students going into STEM. But I 
must also say that one thing that I think is oftentimes missed 
is that what we really lose out on in this country is this 
retention of students that want to be scientists at 16 or 18 
and then aren't by the time they're 22 or 24. We are ranked one 
of the lowest countries in the world with regard to retention. 
That's embarrassing. We have to work harder on that retention. 
And so that's why I believe really strongly and especially for 
women and under-represented groups, because their numbers are 
the lowest.
    And so I do believe that there are things that we can do at 
the undergraduate, graduate level, and above, and of course, K-
12. But if I'm talking about retention, you know, that's where 
the problem child is.
    Senator Cortez Masto. And I agree, and I--listen, this is 
an area where, as we are looking at new legislation, whether it 
is this bipartisan legislation that we are working on now or in 
the future, the workforce is key. Bringing this workforce along 
with us, but giving them the opportunities and retaining them 
in this kind of space for innovation and science is so 
important.
    If you have ideas, I am looking forward to working with you 
around the retention issue. This is an important part of the 
legislation that I am working on to bring that workforce along, 
but really focusing on how we incentivize them. How do we 
engage? Whether it is learning for the first time around STEM, 
or retraining, or taking the skills that they have and 
transitioning them. I mean, there is a lot of work in this 
space that we need to do. Whatever ideas you have on it, I am 
open to listening to you. So I look forward to that.
    Dr. Richmond. Well, I would be thrilled to no end to work 
with you on this. I think in the sphere of community colleges, 
but in addition, thinking of graduate school. We are paying our 
graduate students, who are the seed corn of our future, at 
levels that you have to ask the graduate students why they 
would even go to graduate school, being paid at the level that 
they're being paid for five or six years in their 20s, or seven 
years in their 20s.
    We have to seriously, as a nation, look--and across the 
agencies--at how we can make sure that we are attracting the 
best and brightest and that they can afford to do the training 
to take on leadership roles.
    So I would be thrilled to work with you on any aspect of 
that.
     Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you. I appreciate that. I know 
my time is running short.
    Dr. Berhe, let me ask you about this--this is another area 
that I don't think we are as focused on as we should be, as we 
look at the global competition of renewable technologies. It is 
the standards-setting process. Standards specifications and 
defined performance requirements for materials and for products 
and services related to technologies around the world. And I 
have watched as China has already established goals to set 
global standards for emerging technologies like 5G internet, 
the internet of things, artificial intelligence, and other 
technologies that impact the energy sector.
    I am curious if you have thoughts on this. Can you discuss 
the importance of U.S. involvement in the standards-setting 
process? We cannot forget that. I would love to hear your 
thoughts.
    Dr. Berhe. Thank you, Senator. I agree, this is a really 
important area. Some of the efforts on setting standards are 
beyond the purview of the Office of Science, obviously. But if 
you think about, you know, contributions that the Office and 
the research that enables can--I mean, the best way we can make 
sure that the standards we think are important are set is to 
out-innovate and out-compete everybody in having the best 
science and technology products out there and the most 
efficient systems. And I think we could do that, and we must do 
that. We have to keep doing so if we're going to ensure U.S. 
competitiveness in a variety of areas that are related to the 
topics you discussed. I would love the opportunity--I know we 
don't have time right now, but I would love the opportunity to 
talk to you and work with you on these.
    Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you. I appreciate that. I have 
one more question, with the Chairman's indulgence, if that is 
alright.
    Ms. Stachelberg, is it?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Yes.
    Senator Cortez Masto. Let me ask you this, because this is 
another area that I have focused on. We have talked about oil 
and gas leasing in the Energy Committee ad nauseam. Let me just 
say that. But in recent years, the BLM has spent an inordinate 
amount of time and resources offering vast acreages for oil and 
gas development on land where the oil and gas industry does not 
really have a development interest and on lands that have 
little-to-no potential for development.
    What does that mean? That makes these lands available for 
leasing and only fuels the speculative industry and wastes the 
BLM resources, while locking up the land from being managed for 
other purposes like a wildlife habitat preservation, outdoor 
recreation, grazing--that happens in my state, as well.
    So I introduced the End Speculative Oil and Gas Leasing 
Act. And what it does is, it prohibits BLM from offering leases 
on lands determined to have low-or-no drilling potential, 
requiring BLM to evaluate eligible lands for the development 
potential instead.
    My question to you is, I would hope that you would have an 
open mind around this and be willing to work with me, or at 
least take a look at the legislation and give me your input, or 
the Department's input, around this legislation.
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I am familiar with your 
legislation. I think it's very interesting and I definitely, if 
I'm confirmed, look forward to working with you and others on 
this committee on reforming the leasing program. It's a 
priority of the Secretary. If I'm confirmed, it would be a 
priority of mine, as well.
    Senator Cortez Masto. Thank you. And thank you, all three 
of you.
    The Chairman. Thank you, Senator. Senator Hoeven.
    Senator Hoeven. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. For Dr. Richmond 
and Dr. Berhe, Dr. Fatih Birol, who is head of the 
International Energy Agency, has said that carbon capture 
storage is, quote, ``the most important technology that exists 
today''. And I would ask, do you agree with his assessment that 
it is the most important, or one of the most important energy 
technologies today?
    Dr. Richmond. Yes, Senator, thank you for that question. I 
agree that it's incredibly important, absolutely.
    Senator Hoeven. Dr. Berhe.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes, Senator, I also agree. It's an extremely 
important area and important technology that's out there.
    Senator Hoeven. And do you agree that global demand for 
fossil fuels, including coal, will continue to be significant, 
particularly among developing economies in the years to come? 
Same question for each of you.
    Dr. Richmond. I'm sorry, I didn't hear the first part of 
your question.
    Senator Hoeven. Do you agree that global demand for fossil 
fuels, including coal, will continue to be significant, 
particularly among developing economies in the years to come?
    Dr. Richmond. Yes, I do.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes.
    Senator Hoeven. And so then, do you think it is very 
important that we lead the way forward and really crack the 
code on adding carbon capture and storage, so that we can 
address carbon in those industries and really lead the way 
forward and get it done not only from a technological 
standpoint but from a commercially viable standpoint? Same 
question for both of you.
    Dr. Richmond. Absolutely, Senator, absolutely.
    Dr. Berhe. Yes, Senator.
    Senator Hoeven. So if confirmed, will you work with myself, 
our chairman, and others to crack the code on CCUS, 
specifically including for coal-fired electric, as well as 
renewables and others?
    Dr. Berhe. Yes.
    Dr. Richmond. If confirmed, I absolutely would be looking 
forward to working with the committee and others on this 
important issue.
    Senator Hoeven. Dr. Berhe.
    Dr. Berhe. Same answer. If confirmed, I would be very 
honored to work with you all on this. It's a very important 
area.
    Senator Hoeven. Thank you. For Ms. Stachelberg, two 
questions. One is, on the moratorium on energy development on 
federal lands, how will you approach making sure the Interior 
Department acts to comply with the court order to resume those 
lease sales?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, thank you for your question. I 
will comply with all court orders, with all Congressional 
mandates, as I have in all my previous jobs, and will wait for 
the court's decision and will work with the Secretary and 
others at the Department of the Interior on implementation.
    Senator Hoeven. Do you agree public safety in Indian 
Country is a very important issue and a big issue? Something 
that needs to be addressed?
    Ms. Stachelberg. I absolutely do. Not only public safety in 
Indian Country, but education and access to public lands, yes.
    Senator Hoeven. We are short of BIA, Bureau of Indian 
Affairs, law enforcement officers throughout reservations 
across the Midwest. We have established a training academy, 
essentially, at Spirit Lake in North Dakota. Will you work with 
me to make sure that we continue to develop that academy to 
train BIA law enforcement officers for the whole upper Midwest 
region?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, if I am confirmed, I hope to work 
with you on that issue and a range of other issues that affect 
Native Americans, the law enforcement community, and those 
interests in North Dakota.
    Senator Hoeven. We need the Bureau of Reclamation to work 
with us on water issues, certainly throughout the West but very 
much in my state. Will you commit to work with me, as well as 
my other western colleagues, to make sure that the Bureau of 
Reclamation is able to help meet the important water needs of 
the communities in our states and throughout the West?
    Ms. Stachelberg. Senator, I absolutely commit to you, if 
I'm confirmed, to working with you and others on the 
challenging issues of Western water resilience. I do want to 
just note that I was heartened to see that in the bipartisan 
infrastructure deal there is over $8 billion for repairing 
aging infrastructure, water recycling, reuse, storage planning, 
including rural water projects. And so if I'm confirmed, I 
would love to work with you and your staff on those issues.
    Senator Hoeven. Thank you. Thanks to all three of you. Mr. 
Chairman, I yield back the rest of my time.
    The Chairman. Oh, thank you, Senator. You are so kind. We 
are going to have to go vote now, but I want to thank all three 
of you. You did an excellent job. We appreciate you being here. 
And I want to thank, also, all of our participants. We 
appreciate you being here.
    Members will have until 6:00 p.m. tomorrow to submit 
additional questions for the record.
    So the committee stands adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 11:58 a.m. the hearing was adjourned.]

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