[Senate Hearing 117-]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


 
     DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR, ENVIRONMENT AND RELATED AGENCIES 
                  APPROPRIATIONS FOR FISCAL YEAR 2022

                              ----------                              


                        WEDNESDAY, MAY 26, 2021

                                       U.S. Senate,
           Subcommittee of the Committee on Appropriations,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The subcommittee met at 10:31 a.m.., in room SD 138, 
Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Jeff Merkley (Chairman) 
presiding.
    Present: Senators Merkley, Feinstein, Heinrich, Murkowski, 
and Hyde-Smith.

                      UNITED STATES FOREST SERVICE

               OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR JEFF MERKLEY

    Senator Merkley. Ranking Member Murkowski and Chief 
Christiansen and other colleagues and constituents joining us 
in person and remotely. Welcome to this Appropriations hearing 
on budgeting for the future of forest management. While we 
eagerly await the release of the details of President Biden's 
first budget request, we still have plenty to discuss today 
about the impact that funding for the Forest Service makes in 
forests and communities in Oregon, in Alaska, and in every 
State across the United States.
    Chief Christiansen, thank you for joining us today. As a 
Washington State native and with your 26 years in the State 
Department of Natural Resources, you are well versed in the 
issues and ecosystems of the Pacific Northwest and the dangers 
of climate chaos to our forests and future generations. Forests 
are integral to the identity of my home State of Oregon. We 
value forests as the headwaters for our State's clean drinking 
water, the genesis of our salmon runs, and the backbone of our 
outdoor recreation and rural economies. The Forest Service and 
the dedicated professionals that make up its ranks are critical 
to the State, our people, and our economy.
    The 2020 wildfire season was one of the most destructive in 
Oregon history. Fires devastated the towns of Detroit, Gates, 
Phoenix, and Talent. I will never forget visiting those towns 
and seeing the incinerated remains.
    The fires burned more than a million acres and took the 
lives of 11 Oregonians. Last summer, I drove from the Northern 
boundary to the Southern boundary of the State and back, more 
than 600 miles, and was never out of the smoke of the fires. It 
is clear from the science that we need to restore our forests 
because they play a significant role in curing the climate 
crisis. I am ready to help the administration provide the 
resources the Forest Service needs to improve forest management 
practices, stop the incidence of catastrophic fire, and invest 
in the small towns and rural areas that anchor our Nation's 
natural resource and outdoor recreation economies.
    One tool I have long supported for that goal is the 
Collaborative Forest Landscape Restoration Program in Oregon. 
We have seen successful collaborative work to reduce the risk 
of fire, bringing together all the stakeholders from across the 
spectrum, restoring habitats, improving recreational 
opportunities, and at the same time creating and maintaining 
jobs.
    It is critically important that the Forest Service 
prioritize reducing the backlog of approved fuels management 
projects that are sitting on the shelf in Oregon. There are 
more than 2 million acres that have completed NEPA review and 
are ready to be implemented. And I would really like to work 
with you, Chief Christiansen, to reduce this backlog and 
jumpstart these projects today as we examine the challenges and 
opportunities for budgeting for the future of forest 
management.
    I am proud to say that the funding landscape has recently 
changed significantly for the Forest Service. In less than 2 
years, we have passed several landmark achievements that will 
have lasting positive impacts on conservation, the health of 
our forests, and management of public lands. First, the 
wildfire suppression cap adjustment became operational in 
fiscal year 2020, providing a funding stream outside regular 
discretionary budget to protect the Forest Service from the 
ruinous practice of fire borrowing. Fire borrowing, is that 
situation when terrible fires occur and the budget exceeded, 
the Forest Service has to borrow from all its other programs in 
order to fight the fires, disrupting those critical other 
programs.
    But then we have a challenge because the budget caps are 
expiring, and so the foundation of that solution also expires, 
and we will have to come together and work to create a similar 
pool of funds to turn to when the ordinary budget is exceeded. 
If we fail, fire borrowing will come roaring back doing major 
damage to the Forest Service and I don't think any of us want 
to see that happen again.
    In fiscal year 2021, the Forest Service proposed, and 
Congress enacted a significant reorganization of its budget 
structure. This restructuring created a new appropriations 
account for general operations and consolidated personnel 
costs.
    This sounds a little bit like a sleepy accounting issue, 
but these changes will improve workforce planning and foster 
better understanding of forest activities, actual costs, and 
help us target the appropriations where funds are needed most.
    And last year we enacted the Great American Outdoors Act, 
which provides permanent mandatory funding to the Land and 
Water Conservation Fund. This monumental legislation will allow 
the Forest Service to assist States in keeping working forests 
as forests through the Forest Legacy Program championed by 
Chairman Leahy and bring into Federal ownership special places 
that deserve preservation. The Act also provided a 5 year 
mandatory funding stream for deferred maintenance at our land 
management agencies, of which the Forest Service will receive 
$285 million per year for a total of $1.4 billion by fiscal 
year 2025.
    I am pleased, of course, that there are several Oregon 
projects on the inaugural list of projects like replacing the 
boiler at the historic and iconic Timberline Lodge. Yet that is 
only one of the several very expensive repairs needed, at Mt. 
Hood and across Forest Service lands, in the State, and across 
the Nation. So I look forward to hearing about the process for 
prioritizing future projects.
    Chief Christiansen, there is a lot of work to do, and I 
look forward to your presentation today and how the Forest 
Service plans to undertake these enormous responsibilities. And 
with that, I would like to turn to Ranking Member Murkowski for 
any comments she would wish to make.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good morning, 
and Chief, good morning. It is good to see you. Thank you for 
the conversation that we had. Greatly appreciate it and looking 
forward to the exchange here this morning. As we gather to 
discuss how to make our forests healthier and more resilient, 
you can't help but reflect on how that has always been the 
goal, but the means and impediments to achieving that goal have 
changed and in some ways seem like a moving target.
    Now, with the availability of the fire fix and efforts to 
modernize the Forest Service budgeting process, both the Forest 
Service and Congress have the ability to identify long standing 
gaps that stand in the way of the progress that we all want. 
And while the process has sometimes been uncomfortable, on 
balance, it is good for the agency, and I am grateful for the 
continued collaboration to build on these efforts. Regardless 
of the issues that we discuss whether it is wildland, 
firefighting hazardous fuels management, special use permitting 
and beyond, issues surrounding agency capacity are cited as 
barriers to success.
    So I am glad to hear that the Forest Service is taking the 
need for human capital planning seriously. We had an 
opportunity to speak to that. In some cases, lack of capacity 
is directly linked to funding, and in others it is a function 
of priority. Ensuring that the agency has the right people in 
place to carry out a prioritized and coordinated strategy to 
improve forest health is not going to happen overnight. But if 
the Forest Service makes it a priority, it will yield important 
benefits. I know that COVID presented additional challenges for 
the Service, so I am going to look forward to hearing from you 
on what you have learned from that and how it will impact the 
long term thinking of the agency.
    Last year, Alaska was spared the catastrophic fires that we 
have seen in the lower 48 States, and certainly, Mr. Chairman, 
in your State, that in Senator Feinstein and so many States. It 
was just a devastating, devastating year. In Alaska, we are 
increasingly concerned about the fire potential in areas with 
severe spruce bark beetle outbreaks. I know that my colleagues 
in the lower 48 are dealing with drought and other tree 
mortality issues. So I am going to look forward to hearing from 
you, Chief, about wildfire planning for the remainder of the 
year.
    As I mentioned, we have got our first notable fire in 
Alaska. It is in the newspaper today. And oddly enough, it is 
out in the Bristol Bay region. This is an area where we don't 
have big trees, they are almost more shrub like and it is a 
very, very wet, almost wetlands environment in many parts of 
it. So it speaks to, I think, some of the impacts that we are 
seeing from climate change, just warming temperatures in these 
areas. And so how we address this, how we respond is important. 
I was in Iceland last week at the Arctic Council Ministerial, 
and it is fascinating to me that in the conversations that we 
have among the Arctic nations, we are talking about the impact 
from significant wildfires.
    We saw the fires out of Russia these past couple seasons 
and the impact that these fires have and then moving, literally 
moving that ash and that cinder throughout the jet stream 
there. So wildfires are significant for us throughout the 
country and really throughout the world. It is no secret that 
the Forest Service plays an outsized role in Southeast Alaska's 
economy. Chief, I know that you are very aware of the 
complexities associated with activities in the Tongass, and I 
know that this administration is taking a different approach in 
the Tongass than the previous one.
    I am disappointed that rather than building on all of the 
good work done over the past few years to evaluate the impact 
of the roadless rule on the Tongass and the Tongass dependent 
communities, that the administration has kind of hit the pause 
button on all of this. And this is disheartening to those who 
are involved with timber harvest. The timber program transition 
from old to young growth timber in the forest is one that has 
been underway. It hasn't been easy for a lot of folks to 
accept, but many who have were hopeful, but they are losing 
faith as the old growth bridge that was promised has failed to 
materialize. Those that took a leap of faith and invested early 
in the transition have also been disappointed by the Service's 
lack of action.
    And we had an opportunity to speak about the other issues 
as they relate to tariffs and the impact that that has had. As 
you know, the Roadless Rule in the Tongass is not just about 
timber. The Roadless Rule has been the single largest 
impediment to economic access in Southeast because it affects 
all sectors of the economy, including mining, renewable energy, 
and recreation and tourism. We don't have to choose between a 
healthy forest and a healthy economy in the Southeast.
    So I am certain that in a nearly 17 million acre forest, we 
can find a way to have both. So I would hope that we can work 
together, and you will work with me to provide some kind of 
relief to the folks in the Southeast. Chief, I know we are 
waiting to see the final outlines of the President's budget, 
but I am looking forward to your testimony this morning as you 
inform us of your vision on how we can improve resiliency in 
our Nation's forest.
    With that, Mr. Chairman, I thank you and I am looking 
forward to the conversation.
    Senator Merkley. Great. Thank you very much, Senator 
Murkowski. And I know Alaska and Oregon and California and New 
Mexico, represented by Senators who are present in the room, 
all States that have a lot of issues connected to forests. We 
are going to turn to question periods now. And because of 
Senator Feinstein's other commitment, we will turn to her 
first.
    Senator Feinstein. I am sorry, I missed what you were 
saying. That you are turning to me for----
    Senator Merkley. For your first question period.

                   FEDERAL FIREFIGHTER PAY DISPARITY

    Senator Feinstein. Oh, alright. Thank you. My main concern, 
Mr. Chairman and distinguished Senator from Alaska, is the 
salary situation. And let me put it right on the table. We have 
19 million acres under Federal jurisdiction. State pay is 
$70,000. That is what Cal Fire pays to a State firefighter. The 
United States Forest Service pays $38,000. That is the 
differential. That is the problem. And the loss in fire is just 
tremendous.
    I think that we have to move some way in a bill to make 
that change, and I would like to turn to ask the question of 
the leader of the Department. Chief, do you believe that this 
inequity in pay makes a big difference in California, which has 
19 million acres of Federal fire land?
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you, Senator. Good morning. Thank 
you so much for the question and for acknowledging what is a 
real gap in competitive pay. It is very acute in California, 
but we have competitive pay issues when those are compared to 
State, local, and even the private sector. You named it average 
for a U.S. Forest Service firefighters is $38,000 a year. 
State, local, and private entities can range from $70,000 to 
$88,000 a year and their benefits are better.
    We have folks that are absolutely committed to the mission 
of the Forest Service. But at that wage--that gap in the wage, 
they are going on to work for other entities. So we really 
appreciate working with you to bridge this gap and to discuss, 
we need more of a year-round workforce as well.
    Senator Feinstein. Well, thank you, Chief. Thank you very 
much for that, because I have been around a long time, was a 
mayor for 9 years of the city, and I have never seen a pay 
differential this stark as the difference between Federal 
firefighter pay and State firefighter pay. And California is 
paying with 19 million acres that burned last year, 10,000 
structures burned, and half of those were homes. So the reason 
I am here is to say we need to move and do something about it. 
So let me ask another question, do you have the mobility, 
Chief, to make the necessary moves to prevent this inequity 
from showing in actual firefighting?
    Ms. Christiansen. Senator, thank you. We certainly can 
bring a strong voice to this problem, but we have to work 
across the Federal Government with the Office of Personnel 
Management and with, of course, other agencies, with the 
Federal wildland firefighters, Department of Interior being the 
largest with the U.S. Forest Service. Secretary Vilsack has 
made a commitment to bring leadership to this, and we really 
look forward to working with you here in Congress to address 
this issue.
    Senator Feinstein. Thank you. I don't want to take more 
time, but I hope the Members of this subcommittee can see this 
differential, a starting salary of $38,500, as opposed to 
California foresters being paid $70,000 and having a State 
where 58 percent of the forest is under Federal jurisdiction. 
That is the situation, those are the actual numbers, so it is a 
real problem, and I would hope the subcommittee would work with 
me and others and try to solve it.
    Senator Merkley. Thank you very much, Senator, for making 
that important point. And we will now turn to an opening 
statement from Chief Christiansen.
STATEMENT OF HON. VICKI CHRISTIANSEN, CHIEF, UNITED 
            STATES FOREST SERVICE
    Ms. Christiansen. Chairman Merkley and Ranking Member 
Murkowski and Members of the subcommittee, thanks for the 
invitation. Today, I will highlight the work we are doing to 
serve the American people and steward the Nation's forests. I 
will share how this work lines up with the new administration's 
highest priorities. Specifically, I will detail how the Forest 
Service is backing the effort to end the COVID pandemic. I will 
share our resolve to employ science to tackle climate change, 
fight wildfires, and sustain productive, resilient forests.
    We are also doing our part to spur job growth, boost 
economies, and rebuild infrastructure. Lastly, I will touch on 
our staunch commitment to advance racial equity as we create an 
inclusive workplace where every employee feels respected and 
valued. Controlling the COVID-19 pandemic. I am proud to say 
last year, despite the pandemic as well as historic natural 
disasters, the Forest Service rose to the challenge. We hosted 
200 percent more visitors on the national forests as they 
sought respite from the surge of the pandemic.
    In the last 4 months, the Forest Service played a sizable 
role in helping USDA administer well over 2 million COVID 
vaccines across the United States. But the long term challenge 
we must confront is the crisis facing America's forests and 
grasslands. The crisis results from a changing climate. It 
induces severe wildfires, droughts, insects, disease and 
invasive species infestations. And the severity and the 
frequency of our wildfires is increasing, significantly 
impacting our Nation's forests at an unprecedented rate and 
destroying homes and businesses. The 2020 fire year became a 
call to action. We saw the most acres burned on the Forest 
Service lands since the big burn of 1910.
    In many places, forests will not come back on their own, 
which impacts the potential for carbon storage and limits the 
land's capacity to further mitigate climate change. Despite the 
pandemic, the Forest Service sustained our hazardous fuels 
reduction work. But we know it is not enough. We need a 
paradigm shift. Under the President's jobs plan, President 
Biden is calling on Congress to significantly invest in 
protection from extreme wildfire after confronting record 
wildfires last year, we expect another long and arduous fire 
year in 2021. We are prepared, but we remain deeply concerned 
about the welfare and the pay of our thousands of firefighters. 
We are grateful for your help in finding solutions that address 
pay equity, fatigue, and the mental well-being of our 
firefighters.
    Just this Monday, a Forest Service firefighter was 
seriously injured in New Mexico. He is a smoke jumper from 
Montana. And this demonstrates the seriousness of this 
business. Our thoughts and prayers are with him and his family, 
as I know yours are as well. You know, our infrastructure needs 
are pressing, as are the economic needs of Americans. When we 
improve the infrastructure of the national forests by upgrading 
roads, trails, and recreation sites, it spurs job growth and 
boost economies. Thanks to the Great America Outdoor Act, we 
expect to create an additional 4,400 jobs and contribute an 
estimated $420 million to the GDP annually. And I understand 
the expectations that come with the fire funding fix, which 
went into effect this fiscal year, or fiscal year 2020. And I 
want to assure you that the Forest Service remains a good 
investment.
    We understand congressional expectations for increasing 
accountability and oversight of fire spending. And during 
fiscal year 2021, we did transition to the new budget structure 
that helps us increase the transparency of our spending. 
National forests and grasslands belong to every American. There 
should be equal access, and every American must feel a personal 
invitation and a connection to their lands.
    Every American deserves to have a motivated workforce that 
reflects our values, provides exemplary service, and mirrors 
our population. We are committed to both starting in our own 
house. The Forest Service continues to work hard to end 
harassment, manage conflict, and create a work environment 
where every employee feels safe, valued, respected and has a 
sense of belonging. Thank you so much. I look forward to your 
questions.

    [The statement follows:]
            Prepared Statement of Hon. Victoria Christiansen
    Chair Merkley, Ranking Member Murkowski, and Members of the 
subcommittee, thank you for inviting me here today to testify on the 
President's fiscal year 2022 budget for the U.S. Department of 
Agriculture (USDA), Forest Service.
    Over the past year, the coronavirus pandemic brought human loss and 
suffering to untold numbers of American families. Job losses, 
challenges with social distancing, separation of loved ones, telework, 
and virtual schooling, all impacted our society and agency workforce. 
In response, the Forest Service found new and imaginative ways of 
performing our mission-critical work, including suppressing wildfire 
with minimal risk of spreading the coronavirus (COVID-19); safely 
working with partners to improve forest conditions; and hosting 
unprecedented numbers of visitors on the National Forest System, 
enabling them to safely enjoy their public lands. All while keeping 
fiscal accountability and employee well-being as a foundation for our 
work.
    Given the challenges of the pandemic, we were able to complete and 
sustain forest treatment work on the ground. The Forest Service 
continued its focus to improve forest conditions to reduce wildfire 
risk to communities on over 2.65 million acres. These actions included 
removing hazardous fuels like dead and downed trees, and combating 
disease, insect and invasive species infestations. We also improved 
more than 443,400 acres through watershed restoration, with many of 
these projects designed to improve climate resiliency, improve passage 
for aquatic wildlife, or protect sources of drinking water on National 
Forest System lands. The Forest Service moved nine watersheds to an 
improved condition by completing all the essential projects in the 
respective Watershed Restoration Action Plans. The Forest Service also 
focused on providing jobs and stability for local economies through a 
year of historic timber production, selling more than 3.2 billion board 
feet of timber, the second highest level in 20 years.
    In fiscal year 2021, we have treated nearly 1.1 million acres to 
reduce wildfire risk and improve forest conditions. We have had great 
success in implementing prescribed fire projects thus far , and the 
agency is on track to meet the goal of 3.5 million acres treated by the 
end of the fiscal year. These prescribed burns are low-intensity 
surface fires that release substantially less carbon dioxide than 
wildfires of the same size.
    The Forest Service is doing its part to support jobs and aid the 
economic stability of communities and municipalities where citizens 
have suffered significant economic downturns resulting from the ongoing 
pandemic. Specifically, the Forest Service has invested CARES ACT 
funding to create and sustain jobs in rural communities, including 
opportunities for university STEM students, hiring field crews and 
increasing funding in contracts and agreements with States to hire 
field crews to conduct catch-up surveys of Forest Inventory and plots. 
Plot surveys fell behind in fiscal year 2020 because of extreme 
wildfires in the West and because of the pandemic. This additional 
investment alone created more than 50 jobs. Moreover, the Forest 
Inventory and Analysis program's data and analyses provide essential 
information to industry to inform mill location and to guide business 
planning in the forest products sector by monitoring and projecting 
wood volume and supply. This enhances the viability and profitability 
of the entire sector, directly affecting tens of thousands of jobs. 
Over 900 timber sale contracts have been extended, providing additional 
time for purchasers to harvest timber.
    We are also working to sustain rural small businesses and 
industries by relying on local communities to fulfill logistical 
firefighting personnel needs rather than outsource to larger cities, 
keeping communities open by supporting lodging, restaurants, grocery 
stores, and hardware suppliers.
    In a year where demand for outdoor recreation reached record levels 
during the pandemic, we expect a modest rise in spending from $9.5 
billion in 2019 to just under $10 billion in 2020 and economic 
contributions to the Gross Domestic Product to rise from $11.4 billion 
to $12 billion with over 148,000 jobs supported. We have helped 
families that depend on firewood to meet both heating and cooking needs 
by issuing free firewood permits in times of public disaster or 
emergencies to assist those impacted by the COVID-19 pandemic.
    I will now discuss how our ongoing work to implement the fiscal 
year 2021 budget aligns with the Biden administration's priorities for 
fiscal year 2022, including helping to control the COVID-19 pandemic; 
tackle climate change; provide economic relief through job creation; 
advance racial equity; and further improve our work environment.
                   controlling the covid-19 pandemic
    Last year, despite the coronavirus pandemic as well as historic 
natural disasters and civil unrest, the Forest Service rose to the 
challenge. Our responsibility as an employer, a service provider to the 
public, and a manager of Federal recreation sites, is to ensure the 
safety of our employees, contractors, and the public. This is our top 
priority. That is why agency policy requires our employees, contractors 
and visitors to wear a mask, maintain physical distance, and have 
access to essential Personal Protective Equipment.
    Our 2021 field work and fire seasons are currently underway. In 
accordance with the administration's priority in Executive Order 13987 
to halt the spread of COVID-19, by relying on the best available data 
and science-based public health measures, the Forest Service will 
continue to follow guidance in USDA's Workplace Safety Plan This Plan 
is a detailed, data-driven COVID-19 workplace safety plan that 
prioritizes the health and safety of our Federal employees and 
contractors--whether they work in offices or out in the field. National 
Forests are evaluating local conditions and mitigating risks ahead of 
reopening more visitor centers, recreation sites and other public 
venues. We are working to continue the successes achieved last year in 
wildfire suppression response in maintaining the safety of our 
employees, contractors and partners in shared quarters and fire camps.
                        tackling climate change
    Today, the need to address the climate crisis is more urgent than 
ever. Fire seasons are longer with wildfires occurring outside the span 
of historic fire seasons in different parts of the country. Other 
climate change threats include regional drought, invasive species, and 
major outbreaks of insects and disease. The Forest Service stands ready 
to meet these challenges and advance the administration's climate 
goals. These challenges include researching the vulnerability of water 
supplies and watersheds to a changing climate; conducting assessments 
and providing tools such as the National Insects and Disease Risk Map; 
and identifying optimal fuel treatment practices and accelerating the 
pace and scale of prescribed fire.
    Wildfire Management.--The 2020 fire year was unprecedented in many 
ways. Not only did we fight fire during a global pandemic, but more 
acres burned on Forest Service-managed lands than in any previous year 
since the historic Big Burn of 1910. The increased frequency of 
wildfires in the wildland-urban interface continues to impact more 
homes and communities than ever before, with more acres burned in 
California than in any previous year on record. In 2020, wildfires 
destroyed nearly 18,000 homes and outbuildings (structures).
    In 2021, we are anticipating and are prepared for another long and 
arduous fire year. We continue to invest in pre-planned response using 
risk assessments and analytics to inform fire managers about resource 
allocations needed and used on fires. We are also investing in several 
key technology and modernization portfolios; including, Data 
Management, Enhanced Real Time Operating Picture, Decision Support 
Applications, and Modern Tools for a Modern Response. Additionally, 
implementation of the Large Fire Assessment process, as directed by the 
Consolidated Appropriations Act, 2021 (Fiscal Year 2021 Omnibus), is 
helping us better account for our actions while fostering a learning 
culture. Cooperation with partners at the Federal, State, and local 
levels also ensures we have a strong workforce of firefighters and 
equipment to provide for safe and effective wildfire response 
throughout the year.
    Climate Adaptation and Mitigation.--In line with Executive Order 
(E.O.) 14008, Tackling the Climate Crisis at Home and Abroad, the 
Forest Service is using science to advance climate-smart land 
management, restoration, fire management, and science innovation and 
delivery for the benefit of current and future generations. We are 
building on past work by leading USDA's Climate Hubs. These Hubs 
provide practical, proactive tools informed by science for landowners 
and land managers. Maintaining climate-resilient landscapes is central 
to virtually all Forest Service research and land management activities 
and goals. For example, we are implementing acquisition of conservation 
easements on private lands and increasing capacity for carbon 
sequestration through reforestation and production of woody biomass for 
forest products. All these activities are furthering the goals of E.O. 
14008 to conserve 30 percent of U.S. lands and waters by 2030. We are 
also coordinating with the Department of the Interior to support a 
strategy for creating a Civilian Climate Corps, drawing on the agency's 
unique expertise and history that builds on the legacy of the New Deal 
Civilian Conservation Corps. Through the Climate Conservation Corps, we 
will work to deliver forest and watershed health and resilience, carbon 
sequestration, wildfire risk reduction, innovation in science and 
science delivery, and improvements in sustainable operating 
infrastructure. In addition, a Civilian Climate Corps will provide 
career opportunities for a diverse generation of Americans in critical 
work to promote environmental sustainability.
    Restoration and Reforestation.--Natural resource challenges are 
best met with collective action. Stakeholders of the Forest Service 
broadly agree on the need for active measures to address the threats 
across many of the landscapes we manage. Congress is doing their part 
as well. The Forest Service has plans for the reforestation of over 1.3 
million acres of National Forest System land. These plans address only 
one third of National Forest System reforestation needs, which are 
estimated at 4 million acres. Wildfires create over 80 percent of 
reforestation needs, including approximately 1 million acres from the 
2020 wildfire season. The Forest Service is also placing special 
emphasis on planting the right species, in the right place, under the 
right conditions, so forests will remain healthy over time.
    Moving forward we will maintain our Shared Stewardship approach of 
working together in an integrated way to make decisions and take 
actions on the land. With this shared approach, the Forest Service is 
working more closely than ever with States, Tribes, and other partners 
on priority projects across landscapes and across all land ownerships. 
We are sharing decisions and risks and achieving measurable outcomes 
that we mutually define. This strategy is dependent on our employees--
our largest and most important investment. The successful delivery of 
services and work starts with a highly skilled, motivated workforce. 
They are essential to confronting the climate-related challenges facing 
America's forests and grasslands; they are integral to the services and 
experiences we offer to citizens, local communities, and our partners.
    The administration has also placed a priority to restore nature-
based infrastructure including our lands, forests, wetlands, 
watersheds, and other natural resources. As part of the American Jobs 
Plan, the administration is calling on Congress to invest in protection 
from extreme wildfires and the restoration of major water and land 
resources. To accomplish this, the plan empowers local leaders to shape 
these restoration and resilience project funds in line with the Outdoor 
Restoration Force Act.
                       providing economic relief
    The fiscal year 2021 Omnibus authorized the Secretary of 
Agriculture to use up to $200 million to provide financial relief to 
timber harvesting and timber hauling businesses that have experienced 
financial losses due to COVID-19. Timber harvesters and haulers are 
critical to forest management across the country. COVID-19 relief 
assistance is a top priority of the Biden administration, and Forest 
Service staff are coordinating with USDA Farm Services Agency staff to 
implement this provision and get financial assistance to timber 
harvesting and hauling businesses as soon as possible.
    The Forest Service will also make positive impacts on State and 
local economies thanks to the innovative authorities Congress provided 
in the recently enacted Great American Outdoors Act. This significant 
legislation will enable us to repair and upgrade vital infrastructure 
and facilities in our national forests, and permanently funds the Land 
and Water Conservation Fund (LWCF), investing in conservation and 
recreation opportunities on public and private lands. Projects will 
enrich the lives of current and future generations by improving 
landscape resiliency and increasing access. Recent investments in these 
areas are an indication of Congress' expectations and trust in us, and 
I look forward to continuing to work with you to meet those 
expectations and trust. There is much more work to be done, and we are 
committed to doing the right work in the right places at the right 
scale.
             fiscal accountability and the fire funding fix
    In fiscal year 2021, the Forest Service has transitioned to a new 
budget structure that will help us increase transparency of our 
spending over time. It also will result in enhanced budget discipline, 
such as better planning to fund fixed costs and help overcome 
longstanding systemic challenges without negative impacts to programs 
that benefit the public. We are experiencing some growing pains and 
learning from them. Realignment of the budget structure is illuminating 
the need for changes to some of our business and cultural practices. We 
are stewarding the Forest Service through this change with strategic 
workforce planning and collaboratively managing all operations within 
our allocated budgets. This requires making difficult decisions and 
strengthening internal control to mitigate overspending.
    At the beginning of fiscal year 2021, fire activity was at its peak 
with most resources committed throughout the country. In prior years 
the end of the most severe part of the fire season typically occurred 
in early to mid-September. This year, however, there were more than 
24,000 firefighters engaged nationally on October 1, at the start of 
the new fiscal year, which is substantially more than the early October 
average of approximately 3,600. Pushing the severe part of the fire 
season more than a month later into fiscal year 2021 shifted the high 
spend rate the agency typically incurs in August and September into 
October and November. As a result, the agency transferred $1.8 billion 
from the Wildfire Suppression Operations Reserve Fund (Fire Funding 
Fix), to fund wildfire suppression operations in fiscal year 2021. We 
understand congressional expectations for increasing accountability and 
oversight of fire spending that come with the Fire Funding Fix. We will 
continue to closely monitor and report on the status of spending to 
ensure judicious use of suppression funds during the fiscal year.
       advancing racial equity and improving our work environment
    It is essential that we create a work environment that promotes the 
safety of our employees and fosters equity and inclusion for all 
people. USDA is committed to ensuring equity across its agencies, 
removing barriers to access, and building a workforce more 
representative of America. To that end, the Forest Service strives to 
maintain a work environment that is equitable, respectful, and free of 
harassment and bullying of any kind. The Forest Service has taken 
significant steps to improve policies, raise accountability, upgrade 
reporting systems, and conduct training focused on workplace 
environment to stop harassment, bullying, and retaliation. We are 
working to permanently change our culture. I am committed to ending 
discrimination in all its forms wherever it exists. The Forest Service 
is continuing the hard work that creates the work place our employees 
deserve and building an organization where every individual, inside and 
out of the agency, is treated with respect and dignity.
    In closing, we are always mindful of the need to demonstrate to 
Congress and the public we are striving to do our part to spend 
taxpayer dollars as they are intended--to address the serious 
challenges facing our land managing mission today. The President's 
fiscal year 2022 budget request for the Forest Service will position us 
to fulfill our mission and invest in the administration's immediate 
priorities. I look forward to working with this subcommittee to fulfill 
the President's goals and our key responsibilities for the long-term 
benefit of the Nation's forests and grasslands, and for all Americans. 
I welcome your questions.

    Senator Merkley. We will now turn to questions from Senator 
Murkowski.

         TOURISM IN ALASKA--ENSURING ACCESS VIA SUP PROCESSING

    Senator Murkowski. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And Chief, 
thank you. Thank you for your comments. I want to start my 
questions in this first round with some more parochial issues, 
some of which you and I had an opportunity to discuss this 
week. But as I mentioned to you, the roadless rule has had an 
impact on our ability to do more in the Tongass area. We had 
great news at the beginning of the week when President Biden 
signed into law the Alaska Tourism Restoration Act that will 
allow us to get some tourists back up into the State through 
Southeast. That is going to be very, very helpful.
    But when the tourists come, they want to be able to access 
the opportunities that we have there in the Tongass. All of 
Southeast is part of the Tongass National Forest. And so the 
issue of special use permits is important. Last year with 
COVID, we just didn't see the visitors, so we didn't have that 
need to really handle many of the use permits. So if you can 
explain or provide to me this morning information on what the 
Forest Service is doing to prepare for visitors to both the 
Tongass and the Chugach National Forest this summer.
    We have talked yesterday or the day before yesterday about 
the Forest Service enterprise approach to provide for 
additional support for the special use permitting program. You 
have made it through some of the backlog, but what else do we 
have to do to address the matter of special use permits?
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, thank you, Senator. And certainly 
put an emphasis point on how important tourism is for Southeast 
Alaska, Tongass being--Tongass National Forest being a central 
part of that. And let me just say, during last year, during 
COVID, the region really worked on helping the business 
opportunities, particularly for the outfitter and guides that 
no longer had tourists to take out. You know, we worked to help 
mitigate their hardships, putting--delaying, building or 
billing or actually putting their special use permits into 
abeyance. And then where we could, we hired them as contractors 
to do some very important maintenance work so that at least 
they had employment.
    That got us through 2020. With the great news of the--the 
cruise ships will be returning. You know, after you and I 
talked on, I believe, Monday, I called our regional forester up 
because he was so excited about the cruise ships coming back. 
And I said, okay, Dave, you are ready, right? We can activate 
all those permits. We can get access everywhere. And he says, 
Chief, we are ready, and we have our arms open and really 
excited to get tourists back in to Southeast and work with, you 
know, the businesses that are so important.
    In regards to our special use permitting, yes. You know, 
our workforce planning is really pointing to our need to have 
surge capacity where we have special emphasis. And an example 
of that is we have an enterprise program that we can deploy to 
any of our regions for special needs. And then the Chugach 
particularly, there are several needs there on being more 
responsive, as well as being more efficient with how we do our 
special use permit. So there is some enterprise team resources 
on the Chugach. In March, we issued three heli-skiing special 
use permits that had been long worked on and we will add extra 
capacity. Overall, we have reduced the backlog over special use 
permits by over 40 percent.
    We are putting a new system in place where we will be able 
to map all these special use permits spatially and provide more 
electronic services for those vendors that so want to choose to 
work electronically in those special use permits. Those are 
just a few of the top lines of what we are doing.

                  PEST INFESTATIONS AND FOREST HEALTH

    Senator Murkowski. Good. Let me ask, in the short time I 
have remaining, we discussed a little bit before the hearing 
here the spruce bark beetle infestation that we have in Alaska. 
It is in other parts of the country, and a real concern as we 
are thinking about the impact of a fire and the spread, the 
greater risk for wildland fire. I just--I want to make sure 
that we are doing everything that we can, monitoring, public 
education, and also making sure that we have adequate resources 
provided for this Western Bark Beetle initiative, working with 
the Alaska Division of Forestry.
    But making sure that we are doing all that we can to help 
facilitate robust tree removal and fuel breaks, and 
implementing the community wildfire protection plans in these 
spruce bark beetle impacted communities. Again, this is a big 
issue in so many different areas. So this is not just of 
interest to me, but to so many other colleagues.
    Ms. Christiansen. It is, Senator. And I will just say we 
are working very closely with the State of Alaska. We put it 
through our State and private forestry--forest health funds. We 
put extra dollars into the effort there in Southeast because it 
is all of those components of preparedness and of, you know, 
corralling where the spruce--the spruce the worm is at.
    And our science is playing a critical role in helping to 
develop pheromones that can attract the beetle into one place 
for more easier treatment. So there is a lot going on and we 
have several good neighbor agreements as well. So we are 
working across boundaries there.
    Senator Murkowski. Okay, you mentioned Southeast. I don't 
think that we have got the spruce bark beetle in Southeast----
    Ms. Christiansen. No, I misspoke. Thank you for correcting 
me.
    Senator Murkowski. Yes, I was going to say please keep it 
out of the Tongass.
    Ms. Christiansen. No, not it is not--it is not.
    Senator Murkowski. Alright. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

                      FIRE HAZARD POTENTIAL REPORT

    Senator Merkley. Thank you, Senator Murkowski. And Chief 
Christiansen, the President's American jobs plan prioritizes 
investments in protecting communities from wildfires, which is 
great, and that means hazardous fuels reduction. The fiscal 
year 2021 Interior Bureau bill directed you to provide Congress 
an estimate of the Federal investment required to treat and 
restore Federal and non-Federal acres classified as high risk 
for wildfire. How are we doing on getting that report to 
Congress?
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, thank you, Senator Merkley. The fire 
hazard potential report you are referring to and you know, 
that's with Department of Interior, the report is in its final 
clearance, and it really has activated our collective science 
on this paradigm shift of what we really have to do to 
strategically treat at least two to four times more than what 
we do now if we are going to--we have a scale mismatch and we 
have to match the treatments for the needs on the landscape. So 
you will be seeing it very soon after it makes it out of 
clearance.
    Senator Merkley. So I am almost happy with your answer, but 
not quite, because the date in law was to deliver it by March 
27. Very specific. Can you make calls and get that out of 
clearance? We need to have it in order for this subcommittee to 
be able to do its work to determine can we, do we need to 
advance far more funds for forest treatments, which I think we 
all believe we do. But we need--we really need the analysis. 
Can you make sure we get that by the end of this month, a few 
days from now?
    Ms. Christiansen. I will do everything I can. I really hear 
you on the need, Chairman.
    Senator Merkley. Thank you very much, because I think 
understanding the scope of the challenge is essential for us to 
act appropriately.

                                FIRE FIX

    Now we have the fire fix problem in which we had this pool 
of funds that was outside of the Interior subcommittee's 
regular discretionary funding, so essentially the equivalent of 
a FEMA fund to cover the expenses if we had a terrible fire 
year so you didn't have to do fire borrowing.
    Now because the Budget Control Act expires for fiscal year 
2022, we have the situation where we no longer have the 
underlying foundation on which that fix existed. So have you 
already connected to the Secretary of the Interior and OMB 
about the importance of reestablishing the fire fix by having 
an appropriate fire emergency fund?
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, Senator, I will say affirmatively, 
but I just need to emphasize the importance of the fix. So you 
said it, you know, it froze the rising 10 year average for 
our--covering suppression from our regular budget and it 
prevented the fire borrowing. Those are huge and really 
important. USDA and OMB are aware of the situation as well.
    Senator Merkley. Great. Well, I am happy to engage in 
conference calls or anything else to make sure that this is 
understood because we cannot fail in order to support your 
agency, the Forest Service, we cannot fail to end fire 
borrowing and let that return to be the norm in fiscal year 
2022.

               COLLABORATIVE FOREST LANDSCAPE RESTORATION

    Turning to collaborative forest landscape restoration, CFLR 
projects. We have four them in Oregon. They are incredibly 
effective at bringing people together across the spectrum, from 
the timber side to the environmental side, work out 
prescriptions for the forests for thinning and for treatments, 
making the forest more fire resilient, producing sawlogs, 
producing jobs. That is my opinion. What is your opinion? The 
CFLR program--is it working?
    Ms. Christiansen. It is very much working. It is--it has 
outsized itself in the results for the investments. You know, 
there is 11 percent treatable national forest acres and just 9 
percent of the agency's spending went to CFLRP. And with that 
11 percent of the funding, 19 percent of the agency's total 
hazardous fuels were accomplished through CFLRP, 15 percent of 
our timber volume, and 15 percent of our habitat enhancement 
was accomplished.
    Senator Merkley. So given it is so successful, we have 
already authorized doubling the size of the program. I think it 
is time we try to fund the doubling of the size to $80 million. 
My understanding is we currently have 24 projects across the 
country. With double the funding, can we get to 48 projects? I 
think there are plenty of candidates being submitted.
    Ms. Christiansen. There are. There are very much.

          CONTRACTING TRANSPARENCY--DOMESTIC LABOR PREFERENCE

    Senator Merkley. Great. Look forward to working with you on 
that. And when we do this work in the forests, we have had a 
challenge in which the Forest Service has not been completely 
transparent about its contracting process and the role of 
domestic American workers versus crews brought in from out of 
country. This was an issue that came up in 2009 when Senator 
Wyden and I and others pushed for a big increase in funding for 
hazardous fuels reductions. And the contracting process was one 
in which crews were recruited out of State, required out of 
country, required foreign languages, never consulted with the 
5,000 people who were on the list who want to do this work 
inside Oregon. We need to make sure that H2B is a backup for 
workers when Americans are not ready to fill these jobs. Can we 
get full transparency from the Forest Service on this issue?
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, sir. We are happy to work with you 
on this and we are already providing information. I--you know, 
I am really drilling into the implementation of the Great 
America's Outdoors Act. And 70 percent of that work will be 
done through contracts and agreements. But we have a special 
focus on small businesses and minorities and in the local area. 
And the other piece of the work through the agreements is some 
really important work being done by the Civilian Conservation 
Corps or the Conservation Corps. So we are working with NGOs 
there. So I will be happy to track with you how we are doing on 
GAOA as well, Senator.
    Senator Merkley. Thank you. And one aspect of this that I 
want to emphasize is the possibility of having firefighters 
become year round crews where they turn from firefighting to 
forest restoration, which could be great as family jobs, really 
pillars in our forest communities. I come from Douglas County. 
It is one of the most timber intensive counties in the entire 
United States. People are kind of born, let's say, with a 
chainsaw in their hand, ready to do work in the woods. Want to 
make sure they are never unaware of opportunities to pursue 
that work. We will now turn to Senator Hyde-Smith.

             MASTER PLAN FOR THE HOMOCHITTO NATIONAL FOREST

    Senator Hyde-Smith. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for 
convening today's hearing and to discuss the President's budget 
here for the United States Forest Service. And I would like to 
thank Chief Christiansen for appearing before the subcommittee 
and walking us through these highlights. Enjoyed my visit with 
you prior to the meeting. And I look forward to a thorough 
review of the President's request when it is released later 
this week. The first question that I have, Chief, I was pleased 
to hear in your testimony that the Forest Service is finding 
new and innovative ways to host more visitors to the national 
forest system.
    And I am also glad to hear that the service is focused on 
providing jobs, additional outdoor recreation opportunities, 
and stability for rural and local economies. Mississippi is a 
rural State and that is really important to us. And as we 
discussed, we are a wood basket in Mississippi. And have raised 
this issue before with the Forest Service, but I want to raise 
it again because it is really important and significant to 
rural communities in my State, to the rural economic 
development in Southwest Mississippi, which is really one of 
the prettiest parts of our States.
    That is what we can capitalize on, is the forest there. And 
it just has tremendous potential. Section 8631 of the 2018 Farm 
Bill is the amendment that I got in there to authorize the 
transfer of 150 acres on the Homochitto National Forest from 
the U.S. Forest Service to the Scenic Rivers Development 
Alliance, which is a regional organization dedicated to rural 
economic development and outdoor recreation there in Southwest 
Mississippi. The land surrounds Oxalate Lake. It is a 1,075 
acre recreational lake for fishing, boating, picnicking and 
swimming, and it is just absolutely beautiful. Unfortunately, 
the lake alone is not doing very much for the surrounding rural 
communities. We spent a lot of money developing that lake, but 
it is just not offering enough because there is nowhere to stay 
there or the surrounding areas for overnight visiting. But the 
provision that's in the 2018 Farm Bill was included 
specifically to support that rural economic development in the 
areas around the lake so we can truly capitalize on the 
investment that we spent in developing it.
    The Forest Service has worked very well with scenic rivers 
and that transfer is nearly complete. They tell me the deed is 
in the mail, but the development plan for the lake, it includes 
a lifestyle hotel, a conference center, and several other 
amenities to attract visitors to this remote, underserved 
region of our State. And an updated Forest Service master plan 
for the Homochitto National Forest could really complement 
Scenic Rivers development plan in a very significant way. It 
would provide additional hiking, bike trails, picnic areas, 
swimming areas, and many other things to really enhance what we 
are doing there to try to create jobs in that area of the 
State.
    And it has just kind of been an issue of getting them to 
really get engaged on giving us this plan. So my question is, 
should Congress provide additional funding and direction in 
fiscal year 2022 for the Forest Service to update and improve 
its master plan for the Homochitto National Forest?
    Will you help to ensure the Forest Service works closely 
with Scenic Rivers Development Alliance to ensure the maximum 
benefit from this rural economic development project that 
everybody in Mississippi is excited about? But we really do 
need your help in getting that plan.
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you, Senator, and thank you for 
describing that very special place in Mississippi. I understand 
it is a really a fisherman's paradise and I am a fisher person, 
so I want to go there. Yes, and thank you for recognizing the 
limited resources on our capability. We will be happy to work 
with you at the will of Congress. We will certainly engage in 
how we can help with the economic development there. I think we 
all know that we have a backlog of $5.9 billion of our current 
infrastructure and of course, great American Outdoors Act at 
$285 million a year for the next 5 years will go a long way. 
That is where we are really focusing on the job creation. But 
doing a master plan, working across boundaries for a special 
place in the forest in Southwest Mississippi, we will certainly 
do everything that we can with the right resources.

  COVID RELIEF AND RESPONSIVE ACT PROVISION TO PROVIDE RELIEF TO THE 
                            TIMBER INDUSTRY

    Senator Hyde-Smith. Thank you. I so much appreciate that. 
My second question, since I have some time left, is as we 
discussed, Mississippi has 19.7 million acres of forest land. 
And in a pretty small State, less than 3 million people, we 
have 125,000 forest landowners. In good years, forest related 
economic activity in Mississippi can generate 60,000 jobs and 
nearly $3 billion in income. And like many other States, 
production was down in Mississippi in 2020 for obvious reasons.
    And the fiscal year 2021 Omnibus and COVID Relief and 
Responsive Act enacted last December, provides $200 million for 
the Secretary of Agriculture to provide relief to timber 
harvesting and timber hauling businesses that experienced 
revenue losses during the pandemic, which was very significant. 
And I was a strong supporter of this provision, and I am really 
pleased that the timber industry is now actually eligible for 
this relief. Can you give us the status of the implementation 
of this provision? And how has the Forest Service been working 
with the USDA Farm Service Agency to ensure that we can get 
relief to timber harvesting and hauling businesses as quickly 
as possible?
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you. Thank you, Senator. USDA writ 
large, we take this very serious to get this relief out. And, 
you know, we don't advise on annual crops very much, but when 
it comes to forests and the timber sector, the Farm Service 
Agency has reached out to us and we have a strike team, quite 
frankly.
    We are the subject matter experts working with FSA because 
the vehicle is through their processes, of course, to allocate 
all of the recovery across the Ag sector, but very much 
inclusive of the forest--of the needs in the forest sector as 
well. It will be sometime mid to late summer that those moneys 
will be available, as I understand it. But we will keep your 
office updated if that changes.
    Senator Hyde-Smith. Thank you very much, and I really look 
forward to working with you.
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you.
    Senator Merkley. Thank you, Senator. Senator Heinrich.

          RETIRE GRAZING PERMITS BUT KEEP FAMILY BASE PROPERTY

    Senator Heinrich. Thank you, Chairman. Chief, welcome.
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you.
    Senator Heinrich. Across the west, you know, balancing the 
multiple use mandate of the Forest Service can be very 
challenging. And one of the places we have seen this in the 
Southwest is where we have occasionally had livestock wildlife 
conflicts, particularly with bighorn sheep, native cutthroat 
trout, and endangered Mexican gray wolves. And one of the tools 
to resolve wildlife, livestock conflicts that has been 
successful in a very limited number of cases, but quite 
successful, is the voluntary retirement of grazing allotment 
permits. And it has provided quite a bit of economic certainty 
to individual producers.
    I have heard from several livestock producers in New Mexico 
who would like to retire their permits and also very much want 
to keep their families based property because so many family 
memories are tied up in those places. But there is really no 
clear process for doing this, even in cases where there is a 
very obvious and demonstrated sort of local conflict that we 
are trying to resolve.
    So can you explain why there is not a clear administrative 
procedure for the Forest Service to accept and retired grazing 
allotments at the request of the permit holder as a way to 
resolve some of these long term resource conflicts?
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, I think--but there is two issues 
that need to be responded to. First, a permitee may choose to 
waive their grazing permit back to the Forest Service at any 
time. That is--there is no prohibition on that. The decision to 
actually close the grazing allotment is made by the Forest 
Service and it is guided by the goals and the objectives of the 
land management plan of that particular forest. But then you 
mentioned, you know, different conflicts. So that would be a 
part of the decision evaluation that the Forest Service would 
make.
    Senator Heinrich. I think this is a place that warrants 
additional focus, and particularly the idea of making sure that 
families can keep their base properties as well as part of the 
process of resolving some of these conflicts. And certainly, I 
look forward to working with you on these----
    Ms. Christiansen. Would be glad to do that. Yes, thank you.

       COLLABORATIVE FOREST LANDSCAPE RESTORATION PROGRAM BACKLOG

    Senator Heinrich [continuing]. Through some these. You 
heard a lot about CFLRP. And, you know, one of the challenges 
we have--we all recognize how many acres of forest need to be 
treated right now, both with hazardous fuels and more broadly 
towards a goal of restoration. And in New Mexico, we have a 
large backlog of already NEPA already permitted projects where 
the backlog is not delays because of environmental permits, 
NEPA processing, or lawsuits, just because we have not 
adequately funded these projects and because of staff 
constraints. So I wanted to get your thoughts on the need for 
increasing the scale of some of these programs that we know 
work and that all of us, if you listen to, you know, 
Republicans and Democrats from the West on these issues, we 
know we need to do more. So is the biggest solution available 
to us just scaling up those existing programs like CFRP?
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you, Senator. I could--yes, and 
those CFLRP, good neighbor agreements, stewardship contracting, 
they are all really important tools and to leverage in the 
right place and we have to look at the whole landscape. And we 
use what we do best, right. But the States have some resources. 
They are good at some things. The Forest Service might be a 
good at some other things. The Tribes bring incredible 
traditional knowledge. I mean, we need to work on the whole mix 
on the landscape. And all those tools are important. And the 
State forest action plans. And New Mexico has just completed 
their State forest action plan.
    And it calls for significant increase. But it is not just 
an increase. It is strategically placing those treatments. You 
know, we have, our scientists have mapped the fire spreads 
across the whole country. We know where the highest priority 
fire sheds are that transmit the most fire, and if we can treat 
strategically 40 percent of that landscape, we can bring it 
back into balance.
    So we need to be strategic, and we need to up our game two 
to four times more than what we do now already. And that is 
going to take resources and that is going to take significant 
resources and significant staffing capacity.
    Senator Heinrich. Chairman, you heard two to four times 
what we are doing now, and I think that is something we should 
all be supporting. I think your concept of marrying up the need 
for firefighters throughout much of the year now, if not the 
entire year, with restoration as well, so that we can get the 
forests back in a condition where prescribed fire can actually 
be used much more readily to maintain that forest condition, is 
a path to a lot more sustainable and healthy forests in the 
future.
    Senator Merkley. Thank you very much, Senator. And I look 
forward to exploring that idea thoroughly with the Forest 
Service. I think that that has a lot of potential value. 
Senator Murkowski.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just to follow 
up on the comments from the Senator from New Mexico and what 
you have mentioned, Chief, about the local knowledge that we 
have. Again, I mentioned my time in Iceland last week, and in 
the conversation about wildfires in the Arctic, a good 
discussion with some of the permanent participants. These are 
the indigenous peoples from different parts of the Arctic. And 
there is a working group that is focused on wildland fires that 
the permanent participants are involved with. A discussion 
about how, not necessarily applicable to New Mexico, but how 
you can safely do prescribed burns in not in the summer, but in 
this spring where you still have protective layers of snow, or 
the roots of the trees are still frozen.
    And so you can do some pretty impressive management without 
the risk. But it is--these are ways of management that have 
been in practice for many, many years by local people on the 
ground who know and understand. So tapping into some of that as 
a resource, I think is wise for us.

                    PRE-COMMERCIAL THINNING BACKLOG

    I wanted to ask about pre-commercial thinning and 
recognizing the value that we certainly see for healthy forests 
and for wildlife habitat, as well as to grow the economic 
timber stands.
    The scale of timber harvest during the pulp mill era, that 
is, you know, decades ago, back in the 60s to the 90s, resulted 
in just a proliferation of young growth that is now in 
significant need of thinning. You know Chief because you have 
seen it yourself. It is approximately 85,000 acres across the 
forest. But I think we recognize, you have got a window of time 
in which you can actually have thinning be effective. After 
they get too big, thinning is not a viable strategy.
    So to do this, to address PCT backlog, Forest Service needs 
to treat about 6,000 to 8,000 acres per year. There is so much 
support among the stakeholders to do this work, but we are not 
seeing that level of activity happening. So, Chief, can you let 
us know what is going on with regards to addressing this 
backlog in the pre-commercial thinning? And what more do you 
need to be more effective here?
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you. Thank you so much, Senator. 
You know, I am not a forester from Alaska, but the closest 
State, next Washington State, so you are bringing back, you 
know, practices that are near and dear to my heart. And pre-
commercial thinning is really important to grow those 
structures of the mature forests that we need for habitat and 
other critical benefits that flow from the forests. You know, 
it is--we would be glad to work with you. There are needs.
    And, you know, it is prioritization and resources. So it is 
a part of the young growth transition strategy that we create 
some structure in these young growth forests, and that includes 
these entries are called pre-commercial prior to the commercial 
entry. So we would be glad to work with you and the 
subcommittee on what we need to accelerate those efforts.

                       TARIFFS ON LUMBER EXPORTS

    Senator Murkowski. Well, I would like to explore that 
further. I have raised with Secretary Vilsack, you know, it was 
it was really during his tenure that there was this big push to 
do this transition from old growth to young growth. And so, 
again, it was hard to do. Not everybody embraced it. But we are 
now trying to move to that, and so if we want to have 
opportunity for good habitat, we want to have opportunity for 
some economic benefit there, making these investments, 
prioritizing the pre-commercial thinning, I think, is going to 
be an important part of fulfilling that plan, that vision for 
the Secretary.
    I raised with him as I raised with you the concern that we 
are seeing right now from the Chinese tariffs on the spruce and 
hemlock coming out of Southeast. Those who made the investment 
to move to young growth, at considerable expense to themselves, 
developed and created that market over in China, and then they 
get hit with these Chinese tariffs that have literally crippled 
the efforts that they had made with regards to any form of a 
timber industry there.
    So I raised with you this week the possibility of perhaps 
expanding the COVID timber program to recover losses that we 
saw as a result of these tariffs. That is something, again, I 
would ask that you work with us to see if there aren't any--if 
there isn't anything more that we can do to help in this 
regard. But trying to deal with the impacts of these Chinese 
tariffs on region 10 has just been really hard. We have asked 
for help nicely and politely. But in fairness, people are 
really quite anxious and many quite angry. So we need some 
relief here.
    Ms. Christiansen. We will absolutely work with you, 
Senator. Thank you for highlighting those important issues.
    Senator Murkowski. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

                         FUEL REDUCTION BACKLOG

    Senator Merkley. Thank you. Chief Christiansen, as you and 
I have discussed, there is a significant backlog of fuel 
reduction projects in Oregon that already had their 
environmental reviews. I was interested to hear Senator 
Heinrich say that they also have a backlog of acres ready in 
New Mexico. What does it take to get these projects that have 
already cleared the environmental controls underway? Is it a 
single limitation? Is it just money or is it anything else?
    Ms. Christiansen. It is--it certainly is resources. And if 
you think about environmental clearance, you know, we take 
whole projects, right, of everything that really needs to be 
done from restoration to timber harvest to maybe some 
recreation upgrades. And some of those activities, such as 
timber sales, we can begin immediately. While others we don't 
have the resources, the money, or the service contracts that 
are needed and that takes resources in place. So as a result, 
we have to be opportunistic about doing the right resources and 
the right match for these projects. So we are leveraging a lot 
more work on the ground through our good neighbor agreements, 
through stewardship contracting----
    Senator Merkley. I am going to have you shorten it a little 
bit there. I think your answer was essentially, yes, it is 
funds.
    Ms. Christiansen. It is funds, but there is always things 
we can do to prove how we get work done on the ground. But it 
is funds at the end of the day, absolutely.
    Senator Merkley. Twenty-five percent of that backlog in 
Oregon is of high hazard, and I am going to want to see how 
those acres correspond to the woodland, urban interface so that 
we can really understand where we can get the maximum effect on 
protecting the towns that fear the kind of results that we had 
last September when towns were burned to the ground.

                WILDFIRE RECOVERY/DISASTER SUPPLEMENTAL

    I want to turn to recovery from those 2020 wildfires. The 
damage on Forest Service lands alone are estimated to be $100 
million of infrastructure and $1 billion of forest restoration 
work. That is some big numbers. Is that disaster restoration 
something that you are tracking both on the need for 
infrastructure and natural resource restoration?
    Ms. Christiansen. Oh, we most certainly are, Chairman 
Merkley. The impacts from the 2020 fire year, and we had 
significant impacts from the hurricanes as well in the 
Southeast. We have tracked--we are always ready for the 
questions when asked to what were the impacts. So we have all 
that data. What are we--you know, without supplemental funds, 
we are, quite frankly, we are prioritizing our appropriated 
funds to get the most critical hazardous fuel--hazardous trees 
and recovery done where we can.
    Senator Merkley. So I heard that magic word, supplemental. 
And I think that is something very important for the Senate to 
take a look at, a disaster supplemental to address that 
devastating destruction and the backlog of unfunded restoration 
projects. Is that something that the administration can 
support?
    Ms. Christiansen. Senator, what I can say is that we can 
give you the effects on the ground and what is needed to get 
the right restoration. I absolutely can say that with a firm--
affirmatively.

                    RESEARCH TOPICS FOR THE FORESTS

    Senator Merkley. Thank you. I want to turn to the 
importance of research on the forest. Just thinking about 
things that are going on in Oregon. We have sudden oak death, 
an invasive waterborne pathogen that is killing oak trees and 
can have a big impact on our production of shrubs for the 
landscape world, as well as the impacts on the forest. We are 
very concerned about that. We are very concerned about 
understanding exactly the role of forests in carbon absorption 
and storage or as often referred to as sequestration. We are 
very interested in the impact of fires on carbon storage and on 
forest management practices, both directly and in terms of 
their impact on the fires. So in other words, how do we really 
think about the forest in this role of carbon storage?
    Also about how different forest management practices work 
in different types of forests to increase fire resilience. We 
had the Milli Fire that was bearing down on a town in central 
Oregon, Sisters, and it came to an area where the Ponderosa 
pine had been thinned, had been mowed, had had prescribed 
burns. And the fire essentially came to a stop not only because 
the fuels were reduced, but also because the thinned forest let 
the fire fighters get access to the front line of the fire far 
more effectively.
    We want to understand how the different practices work in 
different types of forests. Do those same practices work as 
well in the West side, wetter forest, Douglas Fir forest and so 
forth, or does thinning the forest there increase the fire 
risk, affecting the amount of oxygen that is provided to the 
trees, to the fire's effect in the trees? So, because this 
sense of using forest management to increase fire resilience, 
produce sawlogs, produce jobs, just sounds like a win, win, 
win, but we want to make sure we are getting it right. And we 
also want to understand the role of mass timber products in 
sequestration of carbon and how in replacing concrete and steel 
in 4 to 14 story buildings, we can create a great market for 
our lumber products, but also do something that sounds like it 
could be very environmentally valuable as well, given the 
difference between the carbon impacts of steel and concrete 
versus mass timber.
    And we do have to--it was exciting to me to visit the first 
cross laminated timber mill in Riddle, Oregon, just south of 
Myrtle Creek, where I was born. The D.R. Johnson Company put 
together a handmade press, and Riddle was where my father was a 
millwright when I was born. So it seemed like particularly 
closing a loop. But we also have a very sophisticated, almost 
science fiction automated mass plywood mill. So there are many 
options in this mass timber role for engineered products.
    So my basic point here is we need to have the research that 
is necessary to answer these questions. And then we need to 
have it compiled into reports that are digestible to inform 
this subcommittee, to inform Congress as a whole, to inform the 
public debate. Can we work with you to make sure that the 
research is being targeted to these types of questions that are 
important?
    There are other important questions, of course, in 
different parts of the country, but then that we get the type 
of reports that will really help inform our discussion.
    Ms. Christiansen. Absolutely. Senator, we would be glad to 
let you know what we are working on. Let me just make two quick 
points. Our research stations, the Pacific Northwest Research 
Station and the Pacific Southwest, you know, where we saw so 
much fire across Oregon and California in particular. It is in 
the don't waste a crisis, what can we learn from these West 
side forests compared to the forests in the Sierra Nevada and 
the whole spectrum? It is not a one size fits all answer. And 
working with our universities and other collaborators are 
really putting together a package of what the key questions 
are.
    Relative to the innovation, you have mentioned mass timber. 
Here is a little known fact that I don't think everyone--many 
people don't realize that the Forest Service has incredible 
work in innovation, and we actually have patents, and we have 
increased the ability of patents. And these are patents for the 
public. Just in the last 3 years, we have had 24 patents just 
from our direct Forest Service scientists. And, you know, we 
work through cooperative research development agreements with 
private industry and those have led to at least 150 patents.
    And here is just a couple examples, super strong carbon 
foam, mobile biochar production unit, and non-formaldehyde wood 
adhesives for some of these mass timber and plywood products. 
Those are just examples, and the general technical reports that 
we issue are consumable for the regular practitioners. But if 
there is more we can do, we would be glad to work with this 
subcommittee.

                             MOBILE BIOCHAR

    Senator Merkley. Just one point before I turn this over to 
Senator Murkowski. And that is, you mentioned biochar, and I 
just heard from a wheat farmer about a mobile biochar unit that 
is going into the piles of leftover waste that we normally 
would just burn out in the forest, the byproducts of timber 
thinning projects or logging contracts, turning it into biochar 
and then plowing it into the soil for the wheat farms, and they 
produce the largest wheat bushels per acre and the largest 
organic content that we have ever seen. And having had this 
story told to me, I am anxious to both see the mobile biochar 
report that you referred to and to actually do a little bit of 
research to make sure to understand better the results of this 
experiment.
    Ms. Christiansen. Great.
    Senator Merkley. Senator.

           VEGETATION MANAGEMENT AND UTILITY OPERATING PLANS

    Senator Murkowski. Chief, I want to ask you about where we 
are with vegetation management issues. As you know, in the in 
the fiscal year 2018 Omnibus we included language to amend 
existing vegetation management regulations. Forest Service 
issued guidance, or proposed guidance directives in January 
that include implementing guidelines for proposed utility 
operating plans and agreements that cover the vegetation 
management, the inspection, the operation and maintenance 
activities along the power lines that are located on Forest 
Service lands.
    So the question to you this morning is, is how is Forest 
Service working with collaborating with utilities in terms of 
developing an efficient process for reviewing and approving the 
plans? And more specific to that, I worry about our smaller 
utilities. As you know, in Alaska, they are really pretty local 
co-ops.
    We don't want them to be left behind when it comes to 
taking advantage of the authorities to reduce the wildfire risk 
by managing the vegetation in the rights away. So if you can, 
speak to what is going on in working with the utilities and 
then also the level of coordination that Forest Service is 
participating in with the Bureau of Land Management to ensure 
that we have got compliance that is consistent across our 
Federal agencies.
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you for that question. And I am 
really pleased to say we have made significant progress. We 
have a very collaborative relationship working across the 
utility sectors because it is not a one size fits all. There is 
the public, the rural cooperatives. And in fact, I personally 
participate in their highest level roundtables every quarter 
because they--we want to make sure that when the leaders speak, 
that we are having the actions of this work, that we are doing 
it together on the ground.
    We did take some time to make sure we could bring, as you 
said, the Department of Interior, primarily BLM and the Forest 
Service, that we could, you know, have alignments so folks 
didn't have to do two different sets of interpretations, if you 
will. And then what is--and the practices and the learning of 
how we have these master operating agreements.
    And, you know, some places like Alaska, maybe you might 
just work on one forest. But in utilities in California, 18 
national forests, some of these very linear projects might go 
through and have to work with 18 different forests is not easy 
work. So one master agreement that then they keep the local 
relationships about, you know, what they are doing for the 
utility--the hazard treatment removals and whatnot. That is 
working really well. We have learned a lot. We are adopting 
those practices in other places as well in the Department of 
Interior.
    And then we are doing joint--now they are webinars, which 
actually can turn out better. But we were--you know, we are all 
planned for joint trainings. We switched it to virtual with our 
actual on the ground managers and the on the ground utility 
sector managers so we can understand, you know, what an issue 
might be or how do we understand, you know, the way the utility 
works in linear sectors and we work more in, you know, large 
land sector, those kinds of things.
    All of that is going really well. We have more work to do, 
but we are keeping a priority on all of this collective work.
    Senator Murkowski. Okay, well, know that that is a priority 
for so, so many. I think we recognize that this is where some 
of their frustration is, is where we see some of these fires 
that take hold, and if we had done a better job on the 
vegetation management, perhaps we wouldn't be in this place. 
And sometimes it is literally the agencies not talking the same 
language or they breakdown with the utilities. So good to know 
that you are prioritizing it.

                 CHUGACH REGION LAND STUDY/DINGELL ACT

    I mentioned yesterday or a Monday in our conversation, I 
would asked for an update on where we are with the Chugach 
Region Land Study that is required as part of the Dingell Act.
    You indicated to me that with COVID and just all that went 
on last year, that that is delayed a little bit. I don't know 
if you had an opportunity to get a better read on when we might 
anticipate the delivery of that study so that we can move 
forward with this land exchange.
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you, Senator. I have not been able 
to get a precise update. As you know, the Department of 
Interior was lead, but we were primary in working with them. So 
all the comments are in. As far as we know, it is a final 
package. And I will reach out to Department of Interior to see 
when we can expect that to get up here to the Congress.
    Senator Murkowski. Okay, I would appreciate if you can get 
back with us on that.
    Ms. Christiansen. Sure.

                           ALASKA LONG TRAIL

    Senator Murkowski. We also had a good conversation about 
one of the fun projects that I am working on, the Alaska long 
trail. So we will continue to keep close with you about what 
the agency is doing in terms of prioritizing some of the 
operations and maintenance, and a recognition about what we can 
be doing to better facilitate that.

                         FOREST SERVICE CABINS

    We also want to have further discussions, probably with 
Dave Schmidt about the situation with the Forest Service cabins 
and just making sure that this extraordinary opportunity that 
exists on our public lands, in our forest, these very--I think 
they are pretty unique and in what they provide to families, 
and quite honestly, for those who just need a safe place out of 
a storm. We want to make sure that they are maintained and that 
local residents can also feel welcomed and participate as we 
ensure that these cabins are there for years going forward.
    So we have got a few issues on our list and certainly 
welcome you up to the State at any point in time to come and 
visit and look at some of our good projects that we have 
ongoing. And I am going to hope, we are all going to keep our 
fingers crossed that this year, for purposes of a fire season, 
does not have the intensity that it brought last year.
    But give our thanks to the men and women who get out there, 
go into the fire to provide for protection of life and safety. 
We appreciate the workers and all that they do. Thank you, Mr. 
Chairman.
    Ms. Christiansen. Thank you, Senator. I will. And thank you 
for the touch back with our great employees.

              LEGACY ROADS AND TRAILS REMEDIATION PROGRAM

    Senator Merkley. Thank you. Chief Christiansen, there is 
hundreds of miles of old timber roads in our national forests 
that often are eroding and creating silt in the streams, which 
really affects our salmon runs. And so there is the Legacy 
Roads and Trails Remediation Program. Do you have a--and I 
think you are probably very familiar with this from your work 
in Washington State?
    Ms. Christiansen. You bet I am.
    Senator Merkley. Mary and I, my wife and I have really 
enjoyed just setting out on timber roads to explore and not 
knowing where they'll lead or what we will see. And sometimes 
we end up on roads that are incredibly eroded so that they are 
no longer passable, even with four wheel drive. And so I just 
want to draw attention to the importance of continuing the work 
when these roads are doing damage to the streams.
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, we totally agree, Senator.

         CLIMATE CONSERVATION CORPS/CIVILIAN CONSERVATION CORPS

    Senator Merkley. Thank you. The Civilian Conservation 
Corps, the Job Corps mission, ties into the President's plan 
for $10 billion investment in a civilian climate corps to 
mobilize the next generation of conservation and resilience 
workers. This Job Corps, Civilian Conservation Corps, the 
existing programs, which I am a strong supporter of, is a model 
that can play a significant role in guiding the development of 
the new Climate Corps. I am sure we are all going to be 
confused by the two CCCs into the future. Are you participating 
or is your leadership team participating in discussions with 
the administration on how to develop this new Climate 
Conservation Corps or Civilian Climate Corps?
    Ms. Christiansen. Yes, it does get a little confusing, 
Chairman. Yes, we are working very closely with the 
administration because Forest Service is, you know, has a 
unique expertise in history and leadership with these Civilian 
Conservation Corps dating all the way back to the original 
CCCs, which now we are a part of the Job Corps Network and 
operate 24 Job Corps that are the Civilian Conservation Corps 
and then now the 21st Century Conservation Corps.
    And the civil--excuse me, I did it. The Climate 
Conservation Corps would be additive to the great work that 
already is done, and it would bring more diverse Corps members 
that would gain these conservation skills and be conservation 
leaders and have employment opportunities for the future and 
will just be able to expand and grow to do more resilience 
related projects, including in urban areas.
    Senator Merkley. And is it the case that these CCC 
projects, both existing and the proposed--no, let me just speak 
to the existing, play a significant role in giving a lot of 
youth a second chance to get their feet on the ground, often 
finding that they have lost a sense of purpose or mission and 
joining a Corps gives them structure and purpose that can 
really put lives back on track?
    Ms. Christiansen. You said it. Spot on, Senator. You know, 
there is some highlights of this work that I do and get to the 
honor to serve as Chief. And when I get to connect with those 
kids that now have a passion and have something that they care 
about, it is the best part of this work.
    Senator Merkley. Well, I really look forward to working 
with the subcommittee and with you all to see this vision move 
to reality of the new Civilian Climate Corps.
    Ms. Christiansen. Great. I appreciate that. We look forward 
to working with you.

                             BUDGET REFORMS

    Senator Merkley. I am just going to close with asking a 
little bit about the budget reforms that I spoke to in my 
opening statement, which whenever this sort of thing occurs, it 
requires significant restructuring efforts. It is a test of 
leadership. And do you feel like the process is well underway 
in the Forest Service to implement those budget reforms?
    Ms. Christiansen. Senator, I am going to say, yes, it is 
well underway, but I am going to, you know, be frank that it 
is--it has been a challenge. It is opening up incredible 
insights and opportunities for the future. So the purpose of 
this budget reform is really good and needed. You know, I do 
many employee and partner engagements. And this is top of mind 
for many of our employees. I am not going to try to sugarcoat 
this significant of a change on how we do business. So we are 
putting a top priority. You know, we did have to manage through 
COVID this year as well.
    So I will say we had multiple top priorities. But the human 
capital planning piece of what we are looking for in this 
budget reform is very revealing. And we just completed phase 
one and we are very excited about getting after phase two so we 
can have far more transparent and coherent projections of what 
our needs are. When you ask me, Chief, what do you need? What 
is the gaps? We can be much more articulate and clear about 
what that is.
    Senator Merkley. And I think as you speak to that, it is 
really speaking to what we had in the fiscal year 2021 bill for 
a Strategic Workforce Planning Initiative, to basically help 
right-size the agency for the near years and years down the 
line. So I think that will be very valuable in your efforts to 
guide the Forest Service and our efforts to help fund what you 
need.
    Ms. Christiansen. The contemporary workforce that we need 
now and into the future. Absolutely.
    Senator Merkley. Senator Murkowski, do you have any other 
questions you would like to raise?
    Senator Murkowski. Mr. Chairman, just thank you. Good 
hearing.

                     ADDITIONAL COMMITTEE QUESTIONS

    Senator Merkley. Well, thank you very much, Chief 
Christiansen. And let me note that the hearing record will be 
open until two weeks after the arrival of the President's 
fiscal year 2022 budget request. Which day are we getting that 
on?
    Ms. Christiansen. Friday, sir.

    [The following questions were not asked at the hearing, but 
were submitted to the Forest Service for response subsequent to 
the hearing:]
           Questions Submitted to Hon. Victoria Christiansen
              Questions Submitted by Senator Bill Hagerty
  rethinking resiliency: budgeting for the future of forest management
    Earlier this year, local officials in middle Tennessee reached out 
to my office concerned about U.S. Forest Service funding for Land 
Between the Lakes National Recreation Area. There seemed to be some 
miscommunication within your Agency about the new budgeting structure 
you mentioned during your opening statement.
    I want to commend you and your staff for agreeing to meet with 
representatives from my office, Minority Leader McConnell's office, 
others from the Tennessee and Kentucky congressional delegation and 
local leaders. My office spoke with those local leaders this week and 
they tell me they are happy with the clarification provided by your 
staff and will keep a close eye on Fiscal Year 2022 Appropriations 
process as it plays out in Congress.

    Question 1. Chief Christiansen, can you go into a little more 
detail about the Forest Service transition to this new budget 
structure?

    Answer. The Forest Service's new budget structure will increase 
transparency and accountability and allow the agency to more 
effectively deliver its mission and execute priorities. The most 
significant changes to our budget are the elimination of cost pools to 
fund indirect overhead costs, the addition of the new Forest Service 
Operations Treasury symbol to establish transparent budget line items 
for such costs, and the establishment of salary and expenses budget 
line items for each of our main operational mission areas. These 
changes are intended to improve congressional oversight and help the 
Forest Service more clearly articulate resource needs and to achieve 
performance outcomes.

    Question 2. How will this transition increase transparency and what 
more can be done to educate local leaders and avoid problems like the 
ones encountered at Land Between the Lakes?

    Answer. The Forest Service's new budget structure breaks out key 
costs that generate congressional interest such as Agency personnel 
salary and expenses from program budget appropriations. One of the 
goals of the new structure is to create a transparent budget that 
depicts the amount of the Agency's fixed overhead costs (such as 
salaries, leases, and information technology) while simplifying the 
execution of the Agency's appropriations. The Forest Service has been 
working on an allocation process that will inform long- and short-term 
decisions and provide base level salary and expenses and program 
funding. The process also includes prioritization of focused 
investments. This collaborative effort is intended to include a field 
voice that helps enhance transparency and both budget formulation and 
execution.
    The Forest Service has made a significant and sustained investment 
in the Land Between the Lakes National Recreation Area (LBL) through 
annual appropriations and other sources of funding authorized for LBL. 
LBL leadership has spent several years working diligently and 
purposefully to develop open discourse between the unit and local 
leaders, including engagement and education on the unit's finances. The 
Forest Service intends to continue its investment in LBL through our 
people, funding, and the strong partnerships we have developed with 
local organizations and the communities we serve. We continue to work 
closely with local leaders and staff from the Kentucky and Tennessee 
Congressional Delegations to be transparent with financial data. We are 
committed to continuing local dialogue with county officials and 
Congressional offices around strategic investments and opportunities at 
LBL.

    Last week the Sheriff of Polk County in my State reached out 
regarding law enforcement issues he is facing. Polk County is a large 
rural county in East Tennessee and he tells me that nearly 60 percent 
of the land in Polk County is owned by the Federal Government, 
primarily by your agency, additionally, the Federal tract of land 
divides Polk County. As you can imagine, this presents unique 
challenges for the Polk County Sheriffs. Sheriff Steve Ross tells me 
that USFS's law enforcement division has been reduced over the years to 
only one agent assigned to cover over 160,000 acres of Federal land. 
Often, major crime investigations, responding to disturbances, and 
other law enforcement activities on Federal land falls on the Polk 
Sheriffs. Sheriff Ross tells me this force is already stretched thin 
and this situation also creates major jurisdictional challenges.

    Question 3. What can the USFS do to relieve a distressed county, 
such as Polk, where their responsibility to patrol Federal lands has 
greatly exhausted its law enforcement agencies?

    Answer. This is a common issue in many National Forests. Staffing 
for Forest Service law enforcement, as well as State, local, and county 
law enforcement partners, is not always adequate to meet the challenges 
of the area. Additionally, the large increase in visitation on National 
Forest System lands over the last couple of years has increased 
workloads and calls for service. The Agency's new budget structure will 
allow us to focus attention and resources in law enforcement and inform 
future investment decisions to address the adequacy of field staffing.
    In Polk County, Forest Service law enforcement is anxious to 
resolve these concerns with Polk county leaders and has proposed a 
Cooperative Law Enforcement Agreement with Sheriff Ross to more 
effectively leverage constrained Federal and county law enforcement 
resources across jurisdictional boundaries. A Cooperative Law 
Enforcement Agreement may also provide some monetary relief for Polk 
County, and the Forest Service is continuing efforts to establish such 
an agreement.

                          SUBCOMMITTEE RECESS

    Senator Merkley. Alright. We are looking forward to 
reviewing it. And thank you. This hearing is adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 11:52 a.m., Wednesday, May 26, the 
subcommittee was recessed, to reconvene subject to the call of 
the Chair.]