[House Hearing, 117 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                    UNSAFE AND UNTENABLE: EXAMINING
                       WORKPLACE PROTECTIONS FOR
                           WAREHOUSE WORKERS

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                         SUBCOMMITTEE ON WORKFORCE 
                                PROTECTIONS

                                 OF THE

                    COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR
                     U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

           HEARING HELD IN WASHINGTON, DC, NOVEMBER 17, 2022

                               __________

                           Serial No. 117-59

                               __________

      Printed for the use of the Committee on Education and Labor
      
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]      


        Available via: edworkforce.house.gov or www.govinfo.gov
        
                                 __________

                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
60-497 PDF                  WASHINGTON : 2025                  
          
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------     
       
                    COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR

             ROBERT C. ``BOBBY'' SCOTT, Virginia, Chairman

RAUL M. GRIJALVA, Arizona            VIRGINIA FOXX, North Carolina,
JOE COURTNEY, Connecticut              Ranking Member
GREGORIO KILILI CAMACHO SABLAN,      JOE WILSON, South Carolina
  Northern Marina Islands            GLENN THOMPSON, Pennsylvania
FREDERICA WILSON, Florida            TIM WALBERG, Michigan
SUZANNE BONAMICI, Oregon             GLENN GROTHMAN, Wisconsin
MARK TAKANO, California              ELISE M. STEFANIK, New York
ALMA S. ADAMS, North Carolina        RICK W. ALLEN, Georgia
MARK DeSAULNIER, California          JIM BANKS, Indiana
DONALD NORCROSS, New Jersey          JAMES COMER, Kentucky
PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington          RUSS FULCHER, Idaho
SUSAN WILD, Pennsylvania             FRED KELLER, Pennsylvania
LUCY McBATH, Georgia                 MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa
JAHANA HAYES, Connecticut            BURGESS OWENS, Utah
ANDY LEVIN, Michigan, Vice Chairman  BOB GOOD, Virginia
ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota                LISA McCLAIN, Michigan
HALEY M. STEVENS, Michigan           DIANA HARSHBARGER, Tennessee
TERESA LEGER FERNANDEZ, New Mexico   MARY MILLER, Illinios
MONDAIRE JONES, New York             VICTORIA SPARTZ, Indiana
KATHY MANNING, North Carolina        SCOTT FITZGERALD, Wisconsin
FRANK J. MRVAN, Indiana              MADISON CAWTHORN, North Carolina
JAMAAL BOWMAN, New York              MICHELLE STEEL, California
MARY PELTOLA, Alaska                 CHRIS JACOBS, New York
MARK POCAN, Wisconsin                BRAD FINSTAD, Minnesota
JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas                JOSEPH SEMPOLINSKI, New York
MIKIE SHERRILL, New Jersey
ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
KWEISI MFUME, Maryland

                   Veronique Pluviose, Staff Director
                  Cyrus Artz, Minority Staff Director
                                 ------                                

                 SUBCOMMITTEE ON WORKFORCE PROTECTIONS

                 ALMA ADAMS, North Carolina, Chairwoman

MARK TAKANO, California              FRED KELLER, Pennsylvania,
DONALD NORCROSS, New Jersey            Ranking Member
PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington          ELISE M. STEFANIK, New York
ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota                MARIANNETTE MILLER-MEEKS, Iowa
HALEY M. STEVENS, Michigan           BURGESS OWENS, Utah
MONDAIRE JONES, New York             BOB GOOD, Virginia
MARY PELTOLA, Alaska                 MADISON CAWTHORN, North Carolina
ROBERT C. ``BOBBY'' SCOTT, Virginia  MICHELLE STEEL, California
                                     VIRGINIA FOXX, North Carolina (Ex 
                                         Officio)
                        
                        C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                              ----------                              
                                                                   Page

Hearing held on November 17, 2022................................     1

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

    Adams, Hon. Alma, Chairwoman, Subcommittee on Workforce 
      Protections:...............................................     1
        Prepared statement of....................................     5
    Keller, Hon. Fred, Ranking Member, Subcommittee on Workforce 
      Protections:...............................................     6
        Prepared statement of....................................     8

                               WITNESSES

    Kaoosji, Sheheryar, Executive Director, Warehouse Worker 
      Resource Center............................................    10
        Prepared statement of....................................    12
    Frumin, Eric, Director of Health and Safety, Strategic 
      Organizing Center..........................................    18
        Prepared statement of....................................    20
    Rath, Manesh, Partner, Keller and Heckman....................    27
        Prepared statement of....................................    30
    Caicedo, Janeth, Sister, Sister of Edilberto Caicedo.........    41
        Prepared statement of....................................    44

                         ADDITIONAL SUBMISSIONS

    Jayapal, Hon. Pramila, a Representative in Congress from the 
      State of Washington:
        Article dated December 1, 2022, from The Intercept.......    60

                        QUESTIONS FOR THE RECORD

    Responses to questions submitted for the record by:
        Ms. Janeth Caicedo.......................................    88
        Mr. Eric Frumin..........................................    91
        Mr. Sheheryar Kaoosji....................................   141

 
                    UNSAFE AND UNTENABLE: EXAMINING
                       WORKPLACE PROTECTIONS FOR
                           WAREHOUSE WORKERS

                              ----------                              


                      Thursday, November 17, 2022

                  House of Representatives,
             Subcommittee on Workforce Protections,
                          Committee on Education and Labor,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:25 a.m., 
2175 Rayburn House Office Building, Washington, DC, Hon. Alma 
Adams (Chairwoman of the Subcommittee) presiding.
    Present: Representatives Adams, Takano, Norcross, Jayapal, 
Omar, Scott (Ex Officio), Keller, Stefanik, Miller-Meeks, 
Owens, Steel, and Foxx (Ex Officio).
    Staff present: Brittany Alston, Operations Assistant; Ilana 
Brunner, General Counsel; Rasheedah Hasan, Chief Clerk; Sheila 
Havenner, Director of Information Technology; Eli Hovland, 
Policy Associate; Yameen Ibrahim, Staff Assistant; Stephanie 
Lalle, Communications Director; Kevin McDermott, Director of 
Labor Policy; Kota Mizutani, Deputy Communication Director; 
Veronique Pluviose, Staff Director; Dhrtvan Sherman, Staff 
Assistant; Robert Shull, Labor Policy; Michele Simensky; Banyon 
Vassar, Deputy Director of Information Technology; Sam Varie, 
Press Secretary; ArRone Washington, Clerk/Special Assistant to 
the Staff Director; Cyrus Artz, Minority Staff Director; 
Caitlin Burke, Minority Professional Staff Member; Michael 
Davis, Minority Legislative Assistant; Cate Dillon, Minority 
Director of Operations; Trey Kovacs, Minority Professional 
Staff Member; Hannah Matesic, Minority Director of Member 
Services and Coalitions; Audra McGeorge, Minority 
Communications Director; Eli Mitchell, Minority Legislative 
Assistant; Ethan Pann, Minority Press Assistant; Gabriella 
Pistone, Minority Staff Assistant; Krystina Skurk, Minority 
Speechwriter; Katy Roberts, Minority Staff Assistant; Kelly 
Tyroler, Minority Professional Staff Member; Joe Wheeler, 
Minority Professional Staff Member.
    Chairwoman Adams. Good morning. We are ready to begin. I 
will countdown from five and then we will start. Five, four, 
three, two, one. The Subcommittee on Workforce Protections will 
come to order. I want to welcome everyone, and I do note that a 
quorum is present.
    Before we move into the hearing, I want to thank Mrs. 
Cherfilus-McCormick for serving on this subcommittee during her 
tenure with the Committee on Education and Labor. We wish her 
well, as she leaves us to go to Foreign Affairs. I would like 
to also welcome today Mrs. Peltola to the Committee and the 
Subcommittee on Workforce Protections.
    The subcommittee is meeting today to hear testimony in a 
hearing entitled Unsafe and Untenable: Examining Workplace 
Protections for Warehouse Workers. This is a hybrid hearing 
pursuant to House Resolution 8 and the regulations hereto.
    All microphones, both in the room and on the platform will 
be kept muted as a general rule, to avoid unnecessary 
background noise. Members and witnesses will be responsible for 
unmuting themselves when they are recognized to speak, or when 
they wish to seek recognition.
    When members wish to speak or seek recognition they should 
unmute themselves and allow a pause of 2 seconds to ensure that 
the microphone picks up their speech. I also ask that members 
please identify themselves before they speak. Members who are 
participating in person should not be logged onto the remote 
platform in order to avoid feedback, echoes and distortion.
    Members participating remotely shall be considered present 
in the proceeding when they are visible on camera, and they 
shall be considered not present when they are not visible on 
camera. The only exception to this is if they are experiencing 
technical difficulty and inform committee staff of such 
difficulty.
    If any member experiences technical difficulty during the 
hearing, you should stay connected on the platform, make sure 
you are muted, excuse me, and use your phone to immediately 
call the committee's IT director, whose number was provided in 
advance. Should the Chair need to step away for any reason, 
another majority member is hereby authorized to assume the 
gavel in the Chair's absence.
    In order to ensure that the committee's 5-minute rule is 
adhered to, staff will be keeping track of time using the 
committee's digital timer on the remote platform. For members 
participating in person, the timer will be broadcast in the 
committee room on the television monitor, as part of the 
platform gallery view, and visible in its own thumbnail window.
    The committee room timer will not be in use. For members 
participating remotely, this will be visible in gallery view in 
its own thumbnail window on the remote platform. Members are 
asked to wrap up promptly when their time has expired.
    Finally, while the recent guidance from the Office of the 
Attending Physician has made mask-wearing optional at this 
time, please know that we have in our midst at both the member 
and staff levels, individuals who are immune compromised, and 
who will have immediate family members maybe, who are immune 
compromised as well, and who are not vaccinated, either due to 
medical reasons or because the vaccine is not yet available to 
children under 6 months of age.
    Therefore, the committee strongly recommends that masks 
continue to be worn out of concern for the safety of 
unvaccinated and immune compromised committee members and staff 
and their families. Pursuant to Committee Rule 8(c), opening 
statements are limited to the Chair and the Ranking Member. 
This allows us to hear from our witnesses sooner, and it 
provides all members with adequate time to ask questions.
    I now recognize myself for the purpose of making an opening 
statement. Today we are meeting to examine the workplace safety 
crisis in warehouses, and our responsibility to protect the 
health and safety of all workers. The demand for warehouse work 
is rapidly increasing. Between 2000 and 2017, warehouse jobs 
increased by 90 percent, and the rise of Amazon and the COVID-
19 pandemic have only accelerated this growth.
    Since January 2020 alone, the number of warehouse workers 
in the United States grew by more than a third, to 1.8 million 
workers. To meet the growing demand for warehouse work, 
unscrupulous warehouse employers have pushed workers to their 
limits, and prioritized productivity and speed over safety.
    As a result, warehouse workers today face greater danger in 
workplaces that were already precarious. For example, after 
Walmart failed to meet OSHA standards, a 40-foot shelf fell on 
top of a warehouse worker and caused her severe neck and back 
injuries.
    Workers in a Rite-Aid distributor center along the Mohave 
Desert worked without air-conditioning, leading to several 
cases of heart-related illness. Warehouse workers across the 
country lacked adequate protections from COVID-19, despite the 
essential role they played during the pandemic.
    These tragedies are not isolated incidents. In 2020, the 
warehouse and storage industry in the U.S. suffered an injury 
rate nearly double the rate among all private industries. 
Industry rates at Amazon warehouses are especially alarming. 
According to a recent report from the Strategic Organizing 
Center in 2021, the series injury rate for workers at Amazon 
warehouses was more than double the rate at non-Amazon 
warehouses.
    This injury rate has a direct impact on workers. At the 
Amazon warehouse in Staten Island, workers face back-breaking 
work, 60-hour plus work weeks, 10-hour shifts with mandatory 
overtime, and dehumanizing working conditions. During a 3-week 
period in the summer of 2022, four Amazon workers died at four 
separate warehouses.
    Nearly a year ago, six employees were threatened with 
termination if they stopped working to seek safety during the 
tornado. Clearly, something is wrong. Worse still, these 
incidents represent only a fraction of a larger, under reported 
problem. Companies across the country contract, and subcontract 
with staffing agencies that place temporary workers in 
warehouses.
    The workers are usually placed in more dangerous conditions 
than permanent workers. Safety training is insufficient or 
nonexistent. Host employers typically treat temporary employees 
as expendable. This was the case where Edilberto Caicedo, a 
temporary worker who died after his skull was crushed on the 
job. His sister is with us today to tell his story.
    We should all agree that warehouse workers like Edilberto 
should not have to risk their lives to provide for themselves 
and their families, and we must ensure that employers are held 
accountable when tragedies do occur. To that end, the 
Department of Labor must continue oversight of unsafe working 
conditions and warehouses.
    Congress must continue working to protect the health and 
safety of all workers. I want to thank Congressman Norcross for 
his continued advocacy on behalf of warehouse workers in New 
Jersey, and across the country. His leadership and his 
subcommittee's work are particularly important as our economy 
rapidly modernizes and demand for warehouse work continues to 
increase.
    While the 117th Congress is coming to a close, I look 
forward to working with my colleagues in a bipartisan way to 
ensure every worker comes home safely at the end of their 
shift. I now recognized the distinguished Ranking Member for 
the purpose of an opening statement. You are recognized sir.
    [The statement of Chairwoman Adams follows:]
    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]    

    Mr. Keller. Thank you, Madam Chair, and I would like to 
thank our witnesses for being here today. The risks of working 
in a warehouse are real, and you know, one witness here today 
has lost a loved one due to an accident. We offer our sincere 
condolences and assure you that we are committed to the laws 
mandating safe working conditions, not just in warehouses, but 
all across our great nation.
    You know over the past decade employment in the warehousing 
and storage sector has grown rapidly, as warehousing and 
delivery companies are expanding business operations to meet 
increased demand for online merchandise, the millions of 
Americans, you know, rely on that for delivery of goods and 
service for whatever reason.
    This was certainly highlighted during the pandemic. The 
efforts of the warehouse workers are invaluable. Under the 
Occupational Safety and Health Act, all workers have the right 
to a safe and healthy workplace. Through my experience in the 
private sector, I have seen first-hand that the vast majority 
of America's job creators, our constituents, the people we 
represent, are committed to ensuring that the people that work 
on their teams, that come to their business every day, go home 
to their families each night safe and healthy.
    Private sector businesses are embracing new technologies, 
and best in class safety innovations to protect their workers 
from occupational hazards in warehouses. The Federal Government 
should be supportive of these efforts. The Democrats refuse to 
recognize that the vast majority of job creators, the people we 
represent, are dedicated to improving health and safety for 
warehouse workers.
    Attacking the industry after it stepped up to the plate 
during the pandemic is dangerous and grossly unfair. Sending 
OSHA, with its aggressive playbook, after business owners will 
not make warehouses safer, but it will harm our economy and 
workforce. Democrats, the so-called solution to warehouse 
safety are misguided, more punishment, more unions, and more 
Federal control is not the answer.
    In fact, you know, talk about Federal control, I walked 
through the capitol, I see numerous OSHA violations right here 
in this building where fire extinguishers are covered with 
things sitting in front of them. We as Congress, ought to make 
sure that we are leading by example.
    Whether it is a warehouse, whether it is a factory, no 
matter where it is, people deserve to have a safe working 
environment, and most of our job creators are committed to that 
endeavor because the people that come to work as part of their 
team are family. They are friends, they are members of the 
community. They need to be safe and healthy for everyone to 
succeed.
    Democrats continued use of OSHA to export more top-down 
Federal control over the workplace is authoritarian, and if we 
are going into a recession, as some experts predict, then this 
is the worst time for the Federal Government to tighten its 
grip on any industry.
    Furthermore, demonizing job creators, again the people for 
which we work, as well as their employees, is no way to keep 
workplaces safe. If Democrats were serious about improving 
workplace safety and warehouses, they would adopt policies to 
collaborate with employers to prevent accidents before they 
happen.
    Vilifying employers who share the common goal of keeping 
their workers safe is counterproductive. The best way to 
increase safety in warehouses is through increased compliance 
assistance, partnership programs, and education. Why are 
democrats not focused on this? Workers' safety is not the 
democrats true focus or end goal.
    Democrats' real priority in going after warehouses is mass 
unionization. Democrats are intent in driving all workers into 
unions regardless of their preference. By mischaracterizing 
employees' safety records, and cherry-picking data, democrats 
hope to get away with exerting more Federal control, and more 
union control over business owners.
    While we support common sense safety precautions in the 
warehouse industry, and in the workplace overall, Democrats are 
taking this a bridge too far. As Republicans we believe in 
private enterprise should dictate productivity and the pace of 
warehouse work, not Washington bureaucrats.
    The bottom line, ensuring safe workplaces is a priority for 
job creators and this committee. More punishment, more unions, 
and more Federal control will not achieve our shared goal of 
worker safety. They will, however, hurt opportunities for job 
creators to grow their businesses and hire new workers.
    Again, I would say that if we are truly concerned about 
workplace safety, we would lead by example right here in the 
United States Capitol and make sure that the employees who work 
here are not exposed to hazards. Thank you, and I yield back.
    [The statement of Ranking Member Keller follows:]
    [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]    

    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. Without objection, all 
other members who wish to insert written statements into the 
record may do so by submitting them to the committee clerk 
electronically in Microsoft Word format by 5 p.m. on December 
1. I would now like to introduce the witnesses.
    Mr. Sheheryar Kaoosji is the Executive Director of the 
Warehouse Workers Resource Center. Mr. Eric Frumin is the 
Director of Health and Safety Center of the Strategic 
Organizing Center. Mr. Manesh Rath is a partner at Keller and 
Heckman. Mr. Rath represents clients in matters related to 
occupational safety and health law, litigation, wage and hour 
and class action litigation.
    Janeth Caicedo is the sister of Edilberto Zamora Caicedo, a 
forklift operator who died due to a workplace accident in a New 
Jersey warehouse in 2019. Since his death, Ms. Caicedo has 
engaged in advocacy to raise awareness of the hazards and 
minimal protections that temporary workers face in the 
warehousing industry.
    We appreciate the witnesses for participating today. We 
look forward to your testimony. Let me remind the witnesses 
that we have read your written statements, and they will appear 
in full in the hearing record.
    Pursuant to Committee Rule 8(d) and the committee practice, 
each of you is asked to limit your oral presentation to a 5-
minute summary of your written statement.
    Before you begin your testimony, please remember to unmute 
your microphone. During your testimony staff will be keeping 
track of time, and the timer is visible to you at the witness 
table, or on screen in gallery view. Please be attentive to the 
timer, wrap up when your time is over, and remute your 
microphone.
    We will let all of the witnesses make their presentations 
before we move into member questions. When answering a question 
please remember to unmute your microphone. The witnesses are 
aware of their responsibility to provide accurate information 
to the subcommittee, and therefore we will proceed with their 
testimony.
    I would like to first recognize Mr. Kaoosji. Mr. Kaoosji we 
will hear from you now.

    STATEMENT OF MR. SHEHERYAR KAOOSJI, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, 
                WAREHOUSE WORKER RESOURCE CENTER

    Mr. Kaoosji. Thank you. Chair Adams, Ranking Member Keller, 
thank you for having me today for this important hearing. My 
name is Sheheryar Kaoosji, and I am the Executive Director of 
the Warehouse Worker Resource Center. For over a decade, I have 
worked supporting warehouse workers in southern California, as 
an organizer, researcher, and policy analyst.
    The Warehouse Worker Resource Center is a non-profit 
organization based in San Bernardino County, California. We 
support non-union workers who face dangerous and exploitive 
conditions in the warehouses of the most powerful companies in 
the world.
    Over 40 percent of freight that enters the United States 
comes in through the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach. A 
large percentage of these goods are transported to our region 
with their stored package then shipped out to the Nation. Over 
300,000 people in southern California, and over 1.7 million 
people nationwide work in these warehouses.
    This sector has grown rapidly in just the past 10 years. In 
January 2012, there were just over 500,000 people employed by 
warehousing nationwide. Now it is well over 1 and one-half 
million. Much of this increase has been in the last couple of 
years and has been just by the growth of Amazon's employment.
    This industry includes a significant number of workers who 
are employed through staffing agencies at low wages. This issue 
leads to significant problems across our communities. Insecure 
economic conditions for workers, insecure economies for our 
region.
    Workers who are employed through staffing agencies are more 
desperate for work, and know they can lose their job any day, 
if the warehouse operator, or the temp agency says they just do 
not need them anymore. These millions of temporary and 
contingent workers tend to be disproportionately people of 
color, immigrants and women.
    According to research by the National Employment Law 
Project that came out this year, wage theft, workplace 
injuries, and retaliation are endemic in temp jobs, including 
warehouse jobs. We have good joint employment laws here in 
California, and believe they have been critical of holding 
employers accountable to the law.
    We know that the NLRB is currently reviewing joint 
employment standard. U.S. Department of Labor reinstated joint 
employment standards last year. These rules create strong 
disincentives to excessive use of subcontracting and staffing 
agencies and pushes accountability closer to the decisionmakers 
and the parties that really have the power.
    As the warehouse sector has changed over the past decade, a 
key influence on this sector has been Amazon. Amazon opened 
their first warehouse in California in San Bernardino in 2011, 
just as that city was entering bankruptcy. The community was 
excited about a big named employer moving into one of the 
poorest cities in the Nation.
    The community soon saw that when Amazon hired a lot of 
people, those jobs turned over quickly, due to dangerous 
conditions, insecure hours, and most of all, a high pace of 
work. In Amazon facilities and other warehouses, workers are 
pushed to move as quickly as possible in order to keep up with 
the rapid pace of one-or 2-day delivery.
    Amazon has accelerated these forces, moving workers rapidly 
through their facilities in order to keep up with the rapid 
pace of their operations. Amazon's intention is not to store 
products, but rather to keep them moving and flowing through 
their system. This is now the state-of-the-art, and the rest of 
the industry is working to match it.
    When you order a product to arrive in 24 or 48 hours, there 
is no magic robot or process that makes that happen. The 
product moves fast because people are running. People move 
quickly and get injured. Completely avoidable and tragic 
injuries happen every day to workers due to the high pace of 
work.
    In response to these facts, in 2021 last year, California 
Assembly member Lorena Gonzalez introduced and passed Assembly 
Bill 701, the bill that restricts the warehouse employer's 
ability to discipline workers for not keeping up with quotas 
and requires employers to provide basic information about 
quotas to the workers and to the State.
    We believe such policies are beneficial to workers across 
the Nation. Another common issue in warehousing as the industry 
is growing as climate change is accelerated is heat. In 
Southern California, this past summer temperatures reached up 
to 121 degrees outside. This results in hazards for workers 
across the State, both indoors and out.
    The combination of heat and high production quotas make 
warehousing an especially dangerous job, and one that calls out 
for attention from regulators. In response, in 2016 we worked 
with California State Senator Connie Leyva to pass AB 1167, a 
bill that established indoor heat protections, like extra 
breaks, water, and training.
    We believe these kinds of policy protections, especially 
when aligned with workers organizing to protect themselves, can 
save lives and make warehouses more productive by keeping their 
workers healthy. Amazon is now the largest warehousing company 
in the country, one that practices high turnover and high pace 
of work, making that the industry standard.
    This is unacceptable. Workers are standing up. In San 
Bernardino where workers are organizing as Amazon Workers 
United, and other facilities across the country. The Department 
of Labor has a key role in making this sector accountable, and 
we thank you and the State and the government for making this 
industry accountable. Thank you.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Sheheryar Kaoosji follows.]
   [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]    

    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. I would like to recognize 
now Mr. Frumin. You are recognized sir for 5 minutes.

 STATEMENT OF MR. ERIC FRUMIN, DIRECTOR OF HEALTH AND SAFETY, 
                  STRATEGIC ORGANIZING CENTER

    Mr. Frumin. Chair Adams, Ranking Member Keller, the SOC 
greatly appreciates the opportunity to testify today. We cannot 
have a serious conversation about workers' safety in the 
warehouse industry without focusing on the enormous toll of 
serious injury and disability that threatens hundreds of 
thousands of Amazon workers every single day.
    This threat has long since reached crisis proportions, in 
fact as of last year Amazon caused more serious injuries to 
warehouse workers than all the rest of America's warehouses 
combined. In 2021, Jeff Bezos and his managers allowed the 
serious injury rate to jump by 20 percent. The typical Amazon 
warehouse worker with a serious injury is away from their 
regular job for almost 9 weeks.
    These horrendous results were a predictable outcome of the 
company's business model, which prioritizes speed, production, 
and profit over workers' safety. Amazon optimizes its 
production system to put worker's bodies under extreme levels 
of stress, while constantly reminding them that Amazon will 
fire them if they do not keep up with the inhumane pace of 
work.
    Amazon knows how to stop this. In 2020 as the COVID crisis 
became full-blown, the Amazon temporarily eased its work speed 
pressures by suspending disciplinary action based on production 
metrics, and the company's injury rate in 2020 dropped 
significantly.
    However, as soon as Prime Day approached in October 2020, 
Amazon reimplemented its work rate requirement and sure enough 
the injury rate in 2021 jumped up again. This brutal system is 
not only harmful to workers, it violates Federal law. Earlier 
this year Washington State OSHA inspectors found ``a direct 
connection between Amazon's employee monitoring and discipline 
system,'' and workplace injuries.
    They found that Amazon's ``very high pace of work,'' is a 
so-called willful violation of the OSHA law. Willful violations 
are very rare. They require that a company either 
``intentionally disregard, or be plainly indifferent,'' to the 
requirements of the OSHA law.
    If any employer deserves that description today, it is 
Amazon. Sadly, this business model is also becoming the norm 
for the warehouse industry in general. Amazon's system must be 
stopped before it destroys even more workers' bodies and their 
livelihoods.
    Throughout this crisis, Amazon's executives have repeatedly 
blamed the severity of the injury crisis at the company, and 
tried to--excuse me, they denied it, and tried to blame others, 
including their own workers. They have severely misrepresented 
their own injury records to investors, journalists, and the 
public, claiming that these outrageously high injury rates are 
``about average'' within the relevant industries.
    The SOC has called on the Securities and Exchange 
Commission to investigate Amazon's CEO Andy Jassy's public 
statements. In response to this copious evidence of both 
rampant injuries at Amazon, and management's utter failure to 
address the problem, OSHA offices around the country are 
launching investigations.
    The State OSHA agency in Amazon's home State of Washington, 
and more recently Federal OSHA have undertaken detailed 
investigations of these abusive practices, the most 
comprehensive national workplace inspections in OSHA's 52-year 
history. What has been Amazon's response? More denial and 
deflection.
    Following the violations in Washington State, Amazon has 
dragged its feet and failed to fix the violations as required 
by OSHA. The warehouse near Albany, New York, is currently 
under investigation by Federal OSHA where Amazon reported the 
highest injury rate of any primary Amazon warehouse in the 
Nation, 20 serious injuries per 100 workers per year.
    For the members of this Committee, that rate of injury 
would mean that eight of you would have been injured badly 
enough over the last 2 years to be unable to do your own jobs. 
On behalf of Amazon workers throughout the Nation, we demand 
that Amazon stop denying the dangers, stop opposing OSHA's 
interventions, and comply with the orders to fix these hazards.
    Andy Jassy could issue a directive this afternoon to stop 
firing workers whose bodies just require a break from the 
pressure, nothing is preventing him from doing so. We urgently 
request that the committee continue to focus its own attention 
on this crisis, including urging Secretary Walsh to continue 
the administration's full support for OSHA's interventions to 
improve safety conditions in the warehouse industry, including 
these investigations.
    Alerting the leadership of the Nation's warehousing 
companies to the dangers of the Amazon business model and 
demanding that Amazon fulfill its legal mandate to protect 
workers. Thank you very much again for the opportunity to 
testify today, and happy to answer any questions.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Frumin follows.]
   [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]    

    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. I now recognize Mr. Rath.

   STATEMENT OF MR. MANESH RATH, PARTNER, KELLER AND HECKMAN

    Mr. Rath. Good morning, Chair Adams, Ranking Member Keller, 
members of this subcommittee. I am grateful for the opportunity 
to appear and participate in this hearing. I am Manesh Rath. I 
am a partner at the law firm Keller and Heckman, here in 
Washington, DC.
    For the past 27 years, I have dedicated myself to working 
with employers to improve the workplace, including the field of 
workplace safety and health. In my testimony today, I am 
expressing only my own understanding of the fields of 
occupational safety and health law and administrative law, and 
I am not here as a representative of my firm, of its clients, 
or of any other interest.
    The employers with whom I have worked, some of them are 
among the largest operations in the world, are all sincerely 
dedicated to the goal of reducing, and hopefully eliminating 
workplace injuries, illnesses, and fatalities. Warehouse and 
distribution is a complex operation. Products are coming in, 
being sorted, stored, picked, and moved out constantly.
    It is a 24-hour operation in some cases. Employers in the 
warehouse and distribution sector, with whom I have worked, 
have been dedicated to trying to understand the incidences of 
injuries and illnesses in their workplace, trying to identify 
potential hazards, and to developing improvements in the 
workplace to make it a better place for the field of workplace 
safety and health.
    These employers have successfully driven injury and illness 
rates down through careful examination of their operations, and 
forceful, creative interventions to reduce injuries and 
illnesses. I say successfully, because that is the unmistakable 
conclusion drawn by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics.
    The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported that warehousing 
had a rate of 9.5 non-fatal occupational injuries per 100 full-
time employees in the year 2003. By 2017, employers have driven 
that rate down to 5.0 of non-fatal occupational injuries for 
100 full-time equivalent employees.
    There is still more work that can be done, and the 
employers with whom I have worked are dedicated to that work of 
driving additional safety and health improvements. How have 
warehouses and distribution employers achieved this impressive 
improvement in workplace safety? In my observations, some of 
the safety and interventions the warehouse industry employers 
have introduced in their workplaces include acclimatization 
programs to address musculoskeletal disorders.
    Increased and improved education programs, so that 
employees can share in the common goal of being responsible 
through their own conduct for everyone's safety. Implementing a 
buddy system, pairing experienced employees with less tenured 
workers to teach, oversee, and reinforce sound safety 
practices.
    Intensive adaptations to the physical work plants and 
equipment, designed to improve the ergonomic interface between 
workers and their tasks, such as weight-bearing hoist arms, 
hydraulic lifts, hydraulic work tables, hydraulic and powered 
forklifts and scissor lifts, and the introduction of robotics, 
and other forms of automation.
    As I mentioned, these interventions have led to a 
statistical improvement in injury and illness rates in 
warehouses, and the distribution centers. While I recognize the 
misapprehension that increased work speed can lead to increased 
injuries, this is not an unavoidable, or inescapable causal 
relationship.
    Increases in product speed should not, and need, not come 
at the expense of safety. Increased production speeds may be 
accommodated by additional safety adjustments to for example, 
machine guarding, personal protective equipment, and forms of 
automation that may allow increased production speed while 
actually reducing injuries and illnesses at the same time.
    Certainly, this appears to have been the case, and the 
conclusion drawn in a study in the poultry industry involving 
over 20 plants--20 plants, I apologize. While improvements in 
safety in warehouses has been driven by dedicated employers, 
OSHA can play a valued role as well. The agency can revitalize 
its consultation program, which has been long underutilized. 
The agency can publish guidance documents as well.
    When the pandemic struck OSHA issued over 20 guidance 
documents in a matter of months. By contrast, rulemaking can 
take a couple of years or longer. OSHA can develop an alliance 
program with warehousing and distribution industry groups as it 
has with other industry groups in order to share successful 
interventions.
    This Subcommittee can rightly applaud the significant 
safety successes of employers in warehousing distribution, and 
can encourage OSHA to participate in that process 
collaborative, rather than as an adversary in order to improve 
the safety in warehouses. Thank you for the opportunity to 
appear before you. I look forward to addressing any questions 
you may have.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Rath follows.]
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    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. We will now hear form Ms. 
Calcedo. You are recognized now for 5 minutes.

 STATEMENT OF MS. JANETH CAICEDO, SISTER, SISTER OF EDILBERTO 
                            CAICEDO

    Ms. Caicedo. Good morning members of the Workplace 
Protection Subcommittee of the House Committee on Education and 
Labor. I would like to thank Chair Adams and Ranking Member 
Keller for the invitation to share my story today of the 
importance of health and safety protections to warehouse 
workers.
    I am here to testify about the importance of workplace 
safety standards for warehouse workers. I cannot explain why it 
seems that our society sees it as normal that the workers who 
get paid the least to do the most physically demanding jobs, 
and they are expected to risk their health and safety at work.
    We need to change this expectation. Warehouse and logistics 
workers are truly essential to our economy, and the health and 
safety risks they are subject to must be exposed. This summer, 
three New Jersey Amazon workers died on the job within 3 weeks 
of each other. It hard to believe that it is just a coincidence 
that these workers passed away during one of the busiest times 
of the year, Prime Day.
    Perhaps not everyone can understand what it's like for 
families like these to suffer a loss due to health and safety 
risks at their job being ignored. Unfortunately, I can.
    On August 19, 2019, my brother came to my bedroom door, and 
he yelled to me, ``Hey, Monster, it's time to go to work. I'll 
see you at five.'' He headed out to his assignment at TI 
Logistics in Kearny, New Jersey, a company that managed 
warehousing and distribution of products for companies like CVS 
and American Eagle.
    The reason I said this assignment, rather than his job, is 
because my brother was a temp worker, employed via a licensed 
staffing agency. Warehouse workers employees via staffing 
agencies in New Jersey and elsewhere are much more likely to 
risk serious injury than even the already dangerous jobs 
performed by direct hire warehouse workers.
    At nine, I received a call that my brother Edilberto was at 
the hospital with a very, very dangerous injury in his brain. 
He died 4 days later. It was a drastic change in my life, in my 
family's life, and nothing, nothing has been the same again.
    My mom, who is 93 years old, still feels that he will come 
1 day to tell her what happened. I think the accident was the 
company's fault. The company did not follow OSHA regulations. 
There was no interest in keeping a safe workplace at all. The 
company was accepting contract after contract, and piling 
people inside the warehouse without maintaining any type of 
safety protocols.
    The equipment was also unsafe. The company did not keep up 
the machines, and did not provide adequate training. These 
conditions would end up killing my brother. The conditions in 
my brother Edilberto's workplace were not safe at all. The 
managers focused only on adding customer after customer, and 
though they continued piling people inside the warehouse, they 
never paused to make sure that there were reasonable safe 
working conditions that would allow workers to go home at the 
end of the day to their families.
    Equipment was not maintained and continued to be used when 
it was not working properly. Temporary warehouse workers like 
my brother could not speak up about safety risks and expect to 
keep their jobs.
    Whether from the staffing agencies themselves, or the 
companies that contract with them, when temporary workers speak 
up, they are retaliated against. They are removed from their 
assignment, taken off the schedule, or fired. As the other 
witnesses have explained, the warehousing and logistics 
industry is rife with safety risks.
    Imagine what this means for workers employed in warehouses 
via staffing agencies, which by design shield companies from 
responsibility for the working conditions of the workers they 
employ. Temporary warehouse workers like my brother, do not 
worry that they will face retaliation for raising safety 
issues, they know they will.
    To even call my brother a temp worker is not entirely 
accurate. After my brother's death, I began to look more 
closely at the industry he worked in, and particularly into 
staffing agencies' role in health and safety at warehouses in 
New Jersey. I learned about a study from 2015 that showed that 
nearly half of all New Jersey warehouse workers are ``temporary 
workers''.
    The majority of these temporary workers, work at the same 
assignment for more than 2 years. Temporary workers, in 
addition to the outsized risk to their safety, generally do not 
qualify for health benefits, often have their wages stolen, are 
subject to predatory fees, and are threatened when they try to 
take legally allowed time off. That is certainly the case in 
New Jersey.
    Chairwoman Adams. Would you please wrap up your comments. 
We are over time.
    Ms. Caicedo. Sure. After checking a lot of cases that I 
noticed about the safety of the security of the job place, I am 
sure that there are--that you, the Representatives, will make 
the difference. I think that all the workers deserve respect 
and dignified treatment and a safe workplace. Please be fair 
to----
    [The prepared statement of Ms. Calcedo follows.]
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    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, ma'am. Thank you, ma'am, we 
have got to move on. Thank you. Under Rule 9(a), we will now 
question witnesses under the 5-minute rule, and I will be 
recognizing the subcommittee members in seniority order. Again, 
to ensure that the member's 5-minute rule is adhered to, staff 
will be keeping track of time. Please be attentive to the time, 
wrap up when your time is over, and remute your microphone.
    I am going to recognize myself as Chair for 5 minutes. Mr. 
Frumin, the Strategic Organizing Center's report spoke about 
the pace of work being a contributor to workplace safety 
concerns in warehouses. Can you please speak to how businesses 
can create a healthy balance between fulfilling orders for 
customers and ensuring that the pace does not endanger workers?
    Mr. Frumin. Thank you very much, Chair Adams. The pace of 
work is a fact of life for many jobs, including certainly 
warehouse workers, and there is nothing to say that in and of 
itself a particular job is going to be dangerous or not based 
on simply the pace of work. We want to be realistic about this. 
However, what is apparent is that if you do not pay attention 
to how fast you, as an employer, are pushing people, you could 
easily push them far too fast.
    At a certain point, and that can be very quickly in the way 
managers treat people, you can be pushing them far beyond the 
ability of their bodies to handle it. How do you judge what is 
appropriate? Well, first of all you listen to workers and their 
complaints, and Amazon workers have been complaining about this 
for years publicly, to OSHA ,to their managers with no success.
    However, also, you can apply simple basic principles of 
ergonomics to say well, we know from prior experience that in 
this type of job you can predict that at this pace of work the 
job is going to be far too dangerous and needs to be slowed 
down until we can figure out a different way to do it that 
makes it safer to work quickly, so there are different ways to 
manage it, thank you.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. Thank you. My next 
question is to Ms. Caicedo. Before I begin, I wanted to tell 
you how first of all deeply sorry I am for your loss. Thank you 
for joining us to share your story. Is there anything you would 
like to tell us about the kind of person your brother was, and 
how we can make sure his memory is honored appropriately?
    Ms. Caicedo. I could define my brother as a generous 
person. He was always generous with the time, with the service. 
He was so generous that when he died he was an organ donor. 
Always, 15 days before he died, he said it is important to give 
life to others, and I think that this is the way to honor him. 
To work to give life to others.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, ma'am. My final question, Mr. 
Frumin and Mr. Kaoosji. The reports that we have heard about 
excessive heat in warehouses is quite disturbing. Can you 
discuss briefly what is being done, or what could be done 
better to ensure proper temperature control in these 
warehouses, Mr. Frumin?
    Mr. Frumin. Sorry. Well, certainly, one thing to do is to, 
you know, give, take accurate real time temperature 
measurements, and make sure workers know about it. Make sure 
workers are trained to understand when those conditions 
approach danger and what the warning signs are so that they can 
make sure that they are reporting any symptoms, and that 
managers know how to respond to it.
    It is a combination of controlling the temperature and the 
conditions but making sure that workers have actionable rights 
to be protected from those conditions if they are having any 
symptoms, and beyond that you know, to pay attention to the 
law. Unfortunately, what we have seen, and Mr. Kaoosji can 
comment on this in more detail, is companies repeatedly 
ignoring, even where it is a legal requirement, to protect 
workers from excessive, dangerous heat exposures.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. Mr. Kaoosji, would you 
like to comment please?
    Mr. Kaoosji. Yes, thank you. Here in California, we have an 
interesting situation where we have an outdoor heat standard 
that has existed since 2006 and applies to a lot of workers who 
work out in docks and stores and warehouses and ancillary 
places.
    We see how that works, and it works when you know the 
employer proactively is required to (inaudible). Sorry, 
effectively give workers extra breaks and rest when the 
temperatures are above a certain temperature. We are hoping 
that that is something that can establish in the indoor heat 
standard situation as well. That is the kind of situation that 
we, you know, are working toward with the establishment of the 
indoor heat standard here in California.
    Chairwoman Adams. [Inaudible.]
    Mrs. Foxx. I ask for a point of personal privilege to begin 
my comments. I want to thank Congressman Fred Keller for the 
tremendous service he has done for our country, for his 
constituents and for this committee. One thing I have learned 
about Fred while serving with him in Congress is that he is 
someone who always shows up, who has always prepared to work on 
behalf of job creators and workers.
    Who is as committed to upholding the Constitution as one 
can be. Saying Fred will be missed is an understatement. He is 
the embodiment of a public servant, and of a statesman, someone 
who always puts the work first. He did not come to Congress for 
the spotlight. He came to Congress to make a difference.
    I can definitely say he has accomplished that goal. Well 
done Congressman Keller. We wish you the best in your future 
endeavors, knowing that whatever you do next, will be in 
further service to your community and to this country. Thank 
you, Madam Chairman. Now I am prepared to ask my questions.
    Chairwoman Adams. Yes ma'am, you are recognized for 5 
minutes, thank you.
    Mrs. Foxx. Thank you, Madam Chairman. While the topic of 
today's hearing is theoretically occupational safety in 
warehouses, it appears the Democrats real goal is to bash job 
creators and promote policies that drive all workers into 
unions, regardless of their preference.
    Democrats so-called solutions to warehouse safety are 
misguided. In fact, nothing in the written testimony shows that 
unionized warehouses are safer than non-unionized facilities. 
Mr. Rath, returning to the topic of today's hearing, what are 
some of the key factors to ensure workers' safety in 
warehouses?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for your question. The first process, 
which employers have to engage in, is to understand where 
injuries and illnesses are occurring, and then to try to 
intervene with the appropriate remedial devices, and this could 
involve changes to equipment, automation, it could involve 
mechanization of tasks that are more likely to cause injuries 
or have historically caused those injuries.
    Then a testing and evaluation of those inventions to find 
out what works, and how those can be refined and improved upon.
    Mrs. Foxx. Thank you very much. Another question Mr. Rath, 
on October 31, National Labor Relations Board General Counsel 
Jennifer Abruzzo, issued a memo urging the Board to adopt a new 
framework requiring an employer to prove its employee 
monitoring, or management practices are narrowly tailored to 
address a legitimate business need, and outweigh employees' 
rights to organize under the National Labor Relations Act.
    How would such a policy chill the use of innovative, 
wearable technology that improves safety in the workplace?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for your question. The first response 
that I think that employers should make is that safety and 
health in the workplace is a legitimate business necessity. 
Nobody should question that. Second of all, the problem with 
the National Labor Relations Board's opinion is that safety and 
health and the employer's ability to pursue improvements to 
safety and health, should be unfettered by the challenge 
presented to the employee's National Labor Relations Act 
rights.
    The safety has to come first. The idea of wearables is 
employed for safety. One example would be in geofencing to keep 
employees out of unsafe areas. Another would be proximity 
sensors that manage safely the distance and space between 
workers and for example, motor vehicles, or powered industrial 
trucks, forklifts, et cetera.
    This has nothing to do with privacy--an employee's privacy, 
and that is not a consideration that should be taken into 
account when safety and health is involved.
    Mrs. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Rath. The private sector has been 
rapidly innovating to improve workplace safety in warehouses. 
What could the government do to encourage these efforts? 
Conversely, what current or proposed government actions could 
impede these innovations?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for your question. The question of 
government involvement necessarily requires that we understand 
that all improvements in workplace safety and health must be 
implemented by the employer, therefore it is important for 
government to play a collaborative role with employers, and for 
employees, to play a collaborative role with employers, rather 
than an adversarial one.
    Some of the collaborative approaches that the Occupational 
Safety and Health Administration has taken in the past include 
the issuance of guidance documents. During the pandemic the 
last administration's Occupational Safety and Health 
Administration issued 20 guidance documents in a matter of 
months, much more rapidly than it could have developed or 
promulgated a rule under traditional rulemaking.
    The same goes for alliance programs. Programs that 
associate with industry groups in order to understand what best 
practices have been working. Finally, their consultation 
program has been long underutilized and could be revitalized 
for the purpose of improving safety and health for example, in 
warehouses and distribution centers.
    Mrs. Foxx. Thank you so much, Mr. Rath. I just want to add 
to what Mr. Rath is saying. I know of no employer in this 
country who will knowingly put workers at risk anywhere, 
leastwise in warehouses. Employers care about their employees, 
personally, furthermore, they have much invested in them, and 
want to keep them safe.
    It is a shame to not have more collaboration and to look 
toward helping keep individual employees safe, instead of just 
trying to unionize them. I yield back.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, thank you. I want to yield now 
to California, Mr. Takano, you are recognized sir for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. Takano. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Kaoosji, if 
possible, I would like to show you a chart, the group Warehouse 
Workers for Justice provided. If the staff could put that chart 
up please. The Warehouse Workers for Justice provided a chart 
of Walmart's import distribution center in Elwood, Illinois. 
This chart shows a network of relations between a lead 
retailer, and a third-party logistics company, and various 
chains of subcontracted staffing companies.
    Mr. Kaoosji, you should have this chart in your possession 
for your review. Is this structure of employment common in the 
industry?
    Mr. Kaoosji. Thank you, Mr. Takano. Yes, it absolutely is. 
This is a similar structure that Walmart had here in Riverside 
County as well, close to your district near the Mira Loma area. 
About 10 years ago, we dealt with Walmart and Schneider 
Logistics, specifically around staff development safety issues, 
and they have with Walmart, Schneider, and Rogers Premier were 
a part of that.
    We continue to see a lot of big retailers like Walmart use 
subcontracting of the warehouse operation, but especially the 
subcontracting of staffing operations for a few reasons. Often, 
reduce their own liability directly, around health and safety 
or wage theft issues that occur, but also to be able to turn on 
and off the labor spigot very quickly, to say we do not want 
workers tomorrow and quickly be able to you know cutoff the 
labor.
    That is kind of the structure, but it is very common here 
in California, across the country.
    Mr. Takano. Well, the significance of this sort of 
structure is that these subcontractors, who actually contract 
with the labor, insulate the main beneficiary, which is 
Walmart, or whoever is the big retailer from liability. You 
know, if the wage theft is happening at the subcontractor 
level, this sort of structure insulates Walmart legally, to 
some extent.
    Mr. Kaoosji. To some extent. It depends on where the law is 
at, and this has been a constant fight and dispute at different 
levels. Here in California, we have established over the last 
10 years some pretty good joint employment laws around both 
health and safety and wage theft. When we are engaged with the 
similar structure with Walmart and Schneiders in Riverside, the 
lawyers were able to show that Walmart actually was, you know, 
aware of what was going on in that facility and attempted to 
add them to the lawsuit.
    On a national level we have seen the U.S. DOL under, you 
know, the current administration has taken a more appropriate 
approach toward joint employment, and taking you know not just 
the direct employer of record, which would be the staffing 
agency, but also the operator into account, and keeping this 
viewed constantly.
    Mr. Takano. Well, thank you. The point is that we have had 
a lot of discussion in committee and hearings about joint 
employer and the necessity to have good joint employer 
regulations, and in law, so that companies like the top 
companies, the top retailers are not able to escape liability 
for health and safety violations, and for wage theft that are 
committed by the subcontractors.
    Now over the last 2 years several states across the 
country, such as California, New York, and Minnesota, have 
either enacted, or advanced legislation which would require 
employers in the warehouse industry to provide advance and 
detailed notices of new productivity or output requirements to 
their workers.
    In many states, legislation also prohibits management from 
enforcing quotas that conflict with a worker's earned rest, 
meal breaks, or ability to use the restroom. Can you explain 
why these pieces of legislation are needed to protect warehouse 
workers?
    Mr. Kaoosji. Yes. When workers are working on a rate, when 
workers are not represented by a union, they often work, and 
they have to work every day to show that they are productive 
and valuable to the company, whether they are directly 
employed, or sometimes through a staffing agency you have to 
show that you're productive in order to make sure that the 
company keeps you.
    Workers will push through a break, will push through lunch 
in order to show that they are keeping up with their rate 
because they know if they do not keep up they will not have 
work the next day. Those protections proactively coming down 
from the State is really important because otherwise workers 
are incentivized essentially by those quotas to work through 
those mandated breaks and lunches, those sorts of things.
    Mr. Takano. Well, thank you sir, my time has run out. Madam 
Chair, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank sir. I want to recognize Mr. 
Keller, 5 minutes sir.
    Mr. Keller. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Rath, time and time 
again we have heard the Democrats in this committee demonize 
employers and their commitment to keeping their workers safe. 
In my experience, this cannot be farther from the truth. I 
would like to ask you, do employers in the warehousing industry 
care about the health and safety of their workers?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for your question. With respect to the 
employers that I have worked with, every single one of them, 
they have not only been fully dedicated to improving workplace 
safety, but they have experienced actual improvements in 
workplace safety through their own innovations, through their 
own devices, and through their own investments.
    I will add one more thing. When consulted as to the 
requirements of the Occupational Safety and Health Act, or any 
other safety law, employers have consistently that I have 
worked with, gone above and beyond those requirements 
voluntarily in order to optimize safety, well beyond what the 
laws would have expected of them.
    Mr. Keller. OK. You say they have improved safety. Do they 
record like their incident rates?
    Mr. Rath. Yes. The question of the Occupational Safety and 
Health Act's recordkeeping rule yes, an injury or an illness 
that's work related would be recorded.
    Mr. Keller. You would not happen to know what any of those 
are would you? The people you have worked with that have 
improved their safety?
    Mr. Rath. I do not typically have an access to their injury 
and illness rates unless it becomes a specific question of law 
that I am asked to opine on.
    Mr. Keller. OK, OK, because my experience having worked in 
private industry in a factory, in a lumber warehouse sometimes, 
I know that employers care about the team of people that come 
to help make them successful. This has turned into wage theft, 
and joint employer, when we are supposed to be concerned about 
people's safety.
    We talk about Walmart and Amazon, but the Federal 
Government runs the United States Postal Service, which 
performs the same services that warehouses do, delivering 
packages and moving goods as Amazon and Walmart. My point is, 
if we were truly concerned with making sure people were safe, 
rather than cherry-picking statistics, and certain employers, 
we would take a look at the whole industry, everyone that 
handles goods and provides services in warehousing and 
delivery, would we not, in your opinion?
    Mr. Rath. Yes. The example of the post office exemplifies 
the complexities associated with these kinds of operations.
    Mr. Keller. Yes. It is sad when anybody gets injured at 
work. I am going to say that right now. I will tell you what, 
there probably is not anybody that feels worse, than the 
employer. You do not want to see somebody get hurt. People want 
their team that makes them successful to be safe.
    You know we talk about wage theft. That even came into this 
hearing. Quite frankly, we call it wage theft and every other 
thing except when we raise taxes. We raise taxes on people, and 
we do not call that wage theft. We probably should. This is a 
hearing on safety.
    I am committed to making sure that the people I represent 
are treated fairly, and we have true measurables that improve 
that safety for everyone. One other thing I did want to 
question because Mr. Rath, during the Obama administration, 
OSHA tried to discourage post-accident drug testing in the 
workplace by amending its injury and illness reporting rule.
    The Trump OSHA later issued a memo clarifying that the 
agency's regulations do not prohibit the post-action drug 
testing. Is drug testing a critical tool to keep warehouses 
safe?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for this question. The largest body of 
data to support an answer to your question comes from the 
insurance industry that receives all workers comp claims, and 
the insurance industry has weighed in unequivocally that they 
support the use of drug and alcohol testing in the workplace as 
a mechanism for driving down injuries and illnesses.
    It was unfortunate, therefore, that any fraction of the 
government, including the Occupational Safety and Health 
Administration, would have been opposed in any degree to the 
use of alcohol and drug testing in the workplace knowing what 
the insurance companies have reported that it has a positive 
effect on driving down injuries and illnesses.
    Mr. Keller. You know I would say that the Federal 
Government recognizes the importance of making sure people 
operating machinery are not intoxicated, or under the influence 
of drugs because CDL drivers, you know, take in some cases, you 
can do pre-employment drug screening and random, whereas states 
require random drug screening for that.
    I think it is a matter of safety. If we really want to get 
to the issues let us stop talking about all of these other 
things, and let us talk about everyone's safety. Thank you and 
I yield back.
    [Ranking Member Fred Keller (R-PA) will enter in the record 
a letter from the National Retail Federation.]
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. Let me recognize Mr. 
Norcross, you have 5 minutes sir.
    Mr. Norcross. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman and Chairman 
Scott for putting together this hearing, incredibly important. 
Three times in my career as an electrician I was on a site 
where a colleague was killed.
    Nothing prepared you for something like that. I remember 
hearing, I remember seeing one of those times. The shock that 
came over me. To watch somebody, die in front of you on the 
job. I think we all are concerned about workers safety no 
matter where you work, that is a given.
    An employer and an employee work together, and they all 
want to be safe, but the numbers do not lie. This is not about 
Amazon. This is not about Walmart. This is not about anything 
but workers' safety. We have to look into it a little bit.
    This year New Jersey, within a 3-week span on the job, 
three employees died. Three different warehouses, one common 
element was they happened to be in Amazon warehouses. That 
caught my attention. I started looking into it. Safety is 
critical, I worked onsites, safety is job one.
    When problems start, it is generally speaking when it is 
not job one, and when people are lax about safety. That is when 
people get hurt, that is when people die. OSHA encourages 
working together voluntarily putting these things together, but 
we need to do better when you hear some of the statistics. We 
are not cherry-picking anything.
    Amazon claims to be earth's safest place to work. It might 
be true for some of the white-collar jobs, but the numbers are 
not lying to us. We are not looking to unionize, we are not 
trying to beat up Amazon, we are trying to keep people from 
being hurt and dying. They are humans here. Their families care 
when they do not come home.
    That is a big deal. It is not about the profit, it is about 
keeping people alive. Mr. Frumin, the strategic organizers have 
released this report this April showing that despite employing 
only 33 percent of the Nation's warehouse workers, they 
represented 50 percent of the injuries. This is the largest 
employer of warehouse workers. We are not cherry-picking, they 
are No. 1.
    Happen to be the biggest injury rate. These are recorded 
injuries by OSHA standards, which are reported by Amazon. Not a 
third party. Amazon actually reports it. It also concluded that 
the serious injury rate of lost time at work, serious injury, I 
am not talking about breaking a fingernail here.
    In Amazon warehouses is 88 percent higher than the serious 
injury rates at non-Amazon warehouses, apples to apples. Amazon 
generally had new, advanced facilities, somewhere around 5 
years old as an average. High tech company. I have had ongoing 
conversations trying to dig into this to find out what is going 
on that people are being injured at Amazon much higher than any 
other warehouse.
    That is what I am asking. When we look at the statistics, 
it is not lying. It is a straight-out number of people being 
hurt, and these are serious injuries. What conclusions have you 
found, or led to believe why this is happening? Why in only 
their warehouses and not others, you could answer that.
    Mr. Frumin. Mr. Norcross, thank you very much for that 
question. I will try to be brief. The two things that Amazon 
does to distinguish itself is push people harder through you 
know algorithms, computerized monitoring, that no other company 
does to that extent.
    Second, they use robots to make the jobs even worse. The 
injury rates in their robotic facilities are much higher than 
they are in their regular warehouses. They distinguish 
themselves by using advanced technology that they are such 
experts at, to injure their own workers, thank you.
    Mr. Norcross. Thank you. Let us make it the safest place to 
work. I yield back the balance of my time.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. I want to yield now to 
Ms. Miller-Meeks, you have 5 minutes ma'am.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Madam Chair, and Mr. Rath, 
just watching your body language during the last question, do 
you have any comment on the previous question that was posed 
about the Amazon warehouse?
    Mr. Rath. Well, I think that any given employer, and I am 
not here to represent Amazon or any other specific interest, 
but any given employer that has experienced an above-average 
injury or illness really than their sector, has an opportunity 
to understand why that is happening, and to develop solutions, 
and intervene, and then test and evaluate those proposed 
solutions and refine them.
    I would also add that when you look at a company that has 
been rapidly developing, or has been introducing new 
facilities, or new automation, that an increase in injuries or 
illnesses may not be happening in spite of that newness, but it 
may be happening specifically because of those disruptions, and 
that that needs to be examined and refined.
    That we have to understand that growth sometimes disrupts 
the ongoing progress that an employer can make in the field of 
safety and health.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. My understanding is that while the 
warehousing and storage sector has rapidly grown over the last 
decade, the total number of fatal injuries in warehouses has 
remained relatively the same over time, so does this data 
indicate that the fatality rate has been decreasing over time 
in the warehousing and distribution sector?
    Mr. Rath. For the sector generally it does seem to indicate 
that. In the past decade, or about the past decade that sector 
has doubled in its workforce population, while the fatalities 
have remained very low, about 30. That is an increase from 21, 
it is about a 33 percent increase, but as a rate it certainly 
would reflect a decline in fatality rate, even though the 
population of workers in that sector seems to have doubled.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. My colleagues have certainly mentioned 
that you know has there been cherry-picking of data from 2020 
and 2021 in an attempt to show dramatic increases in workplace 
injury and illness rates. How are the data from these years 
potentially skewed, and therefore less relevant when examining 
warehouse safety?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for your question. Your question was 
with respect to the years 2020 and 2021, and I would observe 
that certainly the COVID pandemic would have a disruptive 
effect in the management of injury and illness rate and 
fatalities because OSHA specifically had asked that COVID 
cases, positive cases be presumptively treated as work-related 
in the absence of any clear and convincing evidence that the 
case was not work-related, or induced from societal exposures.
    That would for years to come we will now look back at data 
from those years and have to accommodate for OSHA's request 
that it be overinclusive.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. I can tell you as a physician, and as a 
former director of the Department of Public Health, and having 
done vaccine clinics at jobsites throughout my district, I am 
talking about all of our public health. You know, a majority of 
the cases were acquired in non-workplace settings.
    The fact that that data is skewed in that direction does 
make it questionable going forward. Mr. Rath, in 2001 Congress 
repealed OSHA's ergonomics standard through a congressional 
Review Act resolution of disapproval. Why did this standard 
receive such strong opposition from Congress and the regulated 
community?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for that question. I began my time with 
Keller and Heckman 20 years ago during the ergonomics 
rulemaking, and I can share that the proposal that OSHA had 
promulgated was that any single incident of musculoskeletal 
disorders would have required vast and expensive engineering 
controls to the work facility, even at the expense of 
rechanneling those resources where they could have achieved 
greater reductions, more meaningful reductions in other areas 
of workplace injuries and illnesses--slips, trips, falls, 
struck by injuries, et cetera.
    That that was outside of the scope of OSHA's authority 
being an authority to promulgate rules where there are 
significant health concerns, not a single musculoskeletal 
disorder. That was problematic to Congress at the time.
    Mrs. Miller-Meeks. Thank you very much. I yield back my 
time.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you very much. Ms. Jayapal, you 
have 5 minutes ma'am.
    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Madam Chair. I am the very proud 
Representative for Washington's 7th congressional District. 
That is the headquarters of Amazon, and I am very proud that 
Amazon started in my district. It went from being a garage 
project, to being one of the largest economic engines in the 
country, very, very powerful.
    I am very proud that my constituents, many of whom, a big 
majority of whom actually work for Amazon, have voted me in in 
the most recent election, with the largest margin, with the 
most votes of any Member of Congress in the country. That is 
because they care that their employer is an employer who is 
going to really protect all workers.
    Many of the workers in my district are not working in the 
warehouses. I do have a warehouse south of Seattle, which I'm 
going to talk about, but what I want to say is that if you are 
a large driving economic engine, which Amazon is, then you have 
even more responsibility to protect and chart the most optimum 
course for the workers who are giving you that success.
    I am proud of a lot of the Amazon workers in Seattle who 
have stepped up, whether it is on climate change, or protecting 
warehouse workers despite many of them fearing losing their 
jobs and losing their jobs. It is important for them to know 
that they are working for an employer who has the power to 
chart a different course for one of the largest employers in 
the country.
    I wanted to direct a couple of questions to Mr. Frumin. In 
2020, the Washington Department of Labor and Industries began 
an investigation into two Amazon warehouses located in Dupont, 
which is just south of Seattle. Mr. Frumin, you have spoken 
about this in your testimony, and I wanted to give you an 
opportunity to speak more about this intentional disregard, and 
what the investigation found in terms of the results.
    Mr. Frumin. Thank you, Ms. Jayapal. Yes, in 2020 the 
Washington Department of Labor and Industries went into the 
Amazon warehouse in Dupont, south of Seattle, which for that 
year was having the highest rate of injuries of any Amazon 
warehouse in the entire country, about 20 percent, over 20 
percent, extraordinarily high.
    After a few months and talking to workers and observing the 
conditions with their own experts, yes, they found you know 
some very serious violations. They issued that citation, and it 
covered the most, some of the most common jobs in the warehouse 
like loading trucks and unloading trucks. I am sure they hoped 
that Amazon would respect their findings, and accept them 
because the problems were obvious, and that the company would 
then go about the business of fixing them.
    Sadly they did not. A few months later in response to a 
worker complaint, they went to the other big warehouse near 
Seattle in Kent, found the same kinds of violations, the same 
kinds of problems, also very high injury rates, and then issued 
a second set of citations with the violations that they then 
had to call willful because the company was, as I have said 
before, denying the severity of the problem.
    Denying that the problem even existed. We have seen this 
unfortunate pattern of the company failing to accept you know 
the facts, their own facts, their own evidence, and making it 
difficult for OSHA to force them to clean up their act.
    Ms. Jayapal. According to Amazon's website, it has a health 
and safety workforce of 8,000 people worldwide. At what point 
did Amazon deploy these personnel to address the crisis in the 
Dupont warehouse?
    Mr. Frumin. Well you would have thought that they would 
have done it years before when the injury rates were already 
very high. It turned out from what the inspectors noted, that 
the very first day someone from the corporate ergonomics team 
came to the Dupont warehouse was when after the inspector 
showed up, not before. Not the year before, not 2 years before, 
so this is very unfortunate.
    Ms. Jayapal. Mr. Frumin, you know, what I find very 
disappointing is that instead of paying the fine, instead of 
working with the Washington State Department of Labor and 
Industries, which has a very fine record, and making the 
necessary changes to protect workers safety, Amazon is instead 
suing the State Department of Labor and Industries, and is 
claiming it is basically just on due process violations.
    Rather than protecting the workers, they are suing the 
Department of Labor and Industries. I just have to say that it 
is disappointing to me because I know we have a new generation 
of leadership in Andy Jassy, I hope. He is a constituent of 
mine, I am very proud to represent him.
    I hope that he would use his leadership in a different way, 
to chart a different course for Amazon where this incredible 
economic engine that I am so proud of having in my district, 
can actually work for workers safety, can work to make Amazon, 
not a company that we lift up here in this committee for 
violating----
    Chairwoman Adams. The gentlelady's out of time.
    Ms. Jayapal [continuing]. Health and safety considerations, 
but one that actually is moving that forward. I thank you for 
your indulgence Madam Chair, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you. Mr. Owens, you are now 
recognized sir for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just wanted to say 
that this last year and a half I have had a chance to go 
through all my district and around the country. The biggest 
concern across the board in workforce, it seems like no matter 
which industry it is, you need to find good workers, you want 
to retain good workers.
    That is exactly, I would think that every industry out 
there, particularly warehouse industry, they are looking for 
people that they can actually hold on to, they could retain, 
pay well. It seems that it is kind of counter intuitive to me 
to want to pay more.
    By the way, the per-hour wages, the highest we have ever 
had in this country, so it is counterintuitive to see that we 
are paying people more, and appearing, according to the 
Democrats on the other side, would care less. Some kind of way 
we do not mind employees getting hurt, being disrespected. At 
the same time, we all need to have good workers.
    The solution that I am seeing as I am hearing through all 
this Committee meeting, is that the answer to all this is more 
unions. That is not what I think we should be heading to in 
that direction. Mr. Rath, in your written testimony you noted 
that some warehouses have implemented a buddy system program to 
address workforce safety.
    Can you elaborate on this further? Do you believe this 
practice has been effective in keeping warehouse workers safe?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for that question. In my experience 
working with the employers that have employed the buddy system, 
the system works because what it hopes to achieve is take 
tenured employees, and partner them with less tenured workers 
to try and share not only safe practices, but to observe and 
monitor and correct unsafe practices, and to reinforce 
education on safety and health practices.
    Then finally, the value of the buddy system is the 
imparting of a corporate culture, which should be a top-down 
culture that prioritizes workers safety. One worker's 
vulnerability to injuries and illnesses is often dependent upon 
the compliance of the workers adjacent to them, and who 
intersect with them in multiple, sometimes concordant, or at 
other times conflicting tasks.
    The buddy system is a method by which safety and health 
priorities or the culture that values safety and health first 
can be imparted by senior employees who have embraced that 
culture to junior most employees who are new to that culture.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you. You also mentioned in your testimony 
the use of robotics. I am happy to see, visiting warehouses, it 
seems to be very safe, very potential way of making things 
happen. I have heard a little earlier testimony that it seems 
to be of some danger.
    In discussing the use of robotics and other forms of 
automation for certain high-risk tasks, can you speak to the 
effectiveness of this, and experience of your clients in terms 
of the costs of some of these costly, yet effective measures 
can be implemented?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for that question. Robotics, and other 
forms of automation are extremely expensive, but employers 
embrace them as a method of achieving improved workplace safety 
and health because injuries, in particular, occur in the space 
where employees intersect with their task.
    Automation, oftentimes, improves--increases that space, or 
distances employees from dangerous tasks. In addition, if you 
eliminate motor vehicle accidents from just the warehouse and 
distribution sector, and you are looking just inside the 
warehouse, inside the plants, musculoskeletal disorders account 
for the largest fraction of injuries.
    The second and third are struck by and slips and falls. 
Automation has an effect of reducing the muscular-skeletal load 
on workers, and transferring it to machination.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you. I yield back my time.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, sir. Let me yield to the Chair 
of the full Committee on Education and Labor Mr. Scott, 5 
minutes sir.
    Mr. Scott. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Kaoosji, we 
understand that temporary workers are much more likely to get 
injured than others. Can you say what can be done to reduce the 
injury rate of temporary workers?
    Mr. Kaoosji. Thank you. We believe that you know temporary 
work is being expanded and exploited in significant ways by the 
warehousing industry and other sectors. We believe that there 
should be you know, these jobs should really be temporary if 
they are temporary.
    We should not have people working at staffing agencies for 
long periods, but rather employers should convert workers to 
direct employment as soon as they can. It is important also to 
make sure that there is good training and education for workers 
initially, their first 10 days is the most dangerous to workers 
that are new to a site should be given clear education about 
the way the place operates, given support by the employer.
    Often workers are temps, they show up in the workplace. 
They are just thrown in, just figure it out, and that is good. 
The most dangerous situation for a worker, especially a worker 
who is incentivized, like I said earlier, to work as fast as 
possible, to be able to get that permanent employment, to be 
able to even get the assignment the next day.
    We believe that a combination of things. Reduction of pace 
of work, the workers do not feel like they have to rush as 
much. Clearer protections for workers in education for workers 
in the workplace, and education when there is something about 
safety procedures. Again, the intent toward employment, 
permanent, full-time employment that workers, both the space to 
know they will be at work tomorrow.
    The ability to understand they can slow down on things.
    Mr. Scott. OK, thank you. Mr. Frumin, we are talking about 
technology, robotic technology. Exactly how does robotic 
technology affect the injury rate and why?
    Mr. Frumin. Well, what we ave observed in our analyses of 
the injury trends at Amazon is instructive. Amazon is by far 
the biggest use of robotics in the warehouse industry. They 
spent almost a billion dollars a few years ago to buy the 
biggest supplier of robotics, and maybe there was hope that it 
would eliminate the more stressful jobs, the kind of jobs that 
Mr. Rath was talking about.
    What we saw was the opposite. What we saw was robots being 
used to structure an assembly line type operation that forced 
the workers to work in a very fast pace with no flexibility in 
their jobs. They basically became extensions of a machine, of 
the injury machine at Amazon.
    This is basically turning the clock back 100 years, and 
industrial engineering, it is making workers just a total 
function of the machine pace, not relieving them of the 
dangerous jobs.
    Mr. Scott. Thank you. Now several states have passed laws 
to try to reduce injuries in warehouses. Have any studies been 
done to show which laws are effective in actually reducing 
injuries? I would ask Mr. Kaoosji or Mr. Frumin.
    Mr. Frumin. Well, I do not believe we have seen that study 
in New York, and I will let Mr. Kaoosji speak about California.
    Mr. Kaoosji. In California, the bill that passed last year 
is still just barely getting implemented, and no I do not have 
big data on injuries.
    Mr. Scott. Thank you. Mr. Rath, you saw the chart of the 
contractor, the employer, and the subcontractors. If that were 
the structure, who would actually be liable for an OSHA 
violation?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for that question, Mr. Scott. The 
Occupational Safety and Health Law as a field has adopted a 
concept called the multi-employer worksite doctrine, and so it 
could theoretically be any number of employers, including the 
employer who has control over the premises, or of the 
operations, the employer who actually directly engages workers, 
and the employer who might be associated and co-located on the 
same premises and performing other tasks.
    Mr. Scott. Is there any chance that there would not be an 
employer?
    Mr. Rath. When there is an injury or an illness, it is not 
necessarily so that the employer is responsible for that injury 
and illness, if that is your question.
    Mr. Scott. Thank you. Madam Chair, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I want to yield to 
Ms. Jayapal.
    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Madam Chair. I ask unanimous 
consent to enter into the record this article from the 
Intercept, How Amazon's Onsite Emergency Care Endangers the 
Warehouse Workers it's Supposed to Protect.
    Chairwoman Adams. So ordered.
    Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    [The information of Ms. Jayapal follows:]
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    Chairwoman Adams. I want to now recognize Mrs. Steel, you 
have 5 minutes ma'am.
    Mrs. Steel. Thank you, Chairwoman Adams and Ranking Member 
Keller. Companies all across the country are leading the way to 
keep their employees safe. Every employer I met wants to keep 
their employees safe. We have a labor shortage. Employers need 
to keep their employees healthy and at work.
    In California, we have seen port backlogs, truck shortages, 
and record smash and grabs, crime rate is very high. 
California's economy is already being attacked by California 
Dems. Continuing to put into place new burdensome regulations 
on companies driving up the cost of goods to record Democrat 
created inflation.
    In California, it is really, really getting bad. I want to 
ask a question to Mr. Rath. My home State of California 
recently passed and implemented AB 705, this law will create a 
new quota system to ensure existing health and safety 
standards. Will AB 705, increase manufacturing shortage and 
distribution cost? Will AB 705 open the door for more costly 
losses?
    Does this bill bring essential protection to employees?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for that question. It appears to me 
that your question properly belongs in the field of economics, 
and not law, and so I have to defer to any colleague who has 
more expertise in economics, with the economic effect.
    I can say this, the Occupational Safety and Health Act, at 
the Federal level was promulgated in 1970. The rates of 
reduction in fatalities in the workplace was greater prior to 
1970, and continued post-1970, indicating that employers have 
been primarily responsible for improvements in safety and 
health, and not excessive rulemaking.
    Rulemaking has acknowledged after the fact, the best 
practices from the great corporate practices that had already 
been adopted in any particular sector, and so the statistical 
case for reduction and fatalities or in injury and illnesses, 
if you extend beyond the 50 years of OSHA, reveals that it has 
been employer interventions and not regulatory interventions 
that have been the driver of those safety successes.
    Mrs. Steel. Thank you, Mr. Rath. I have a second question. 
Unions often fight against robotics and automation. We have 
seen this at the Port of Long Beach, and technology makes the 
workplace safer, and it provides employees with the high tech 
skills that benefit their future employment.
    Can you share how employees are trying to improve to their 
effective measures, such as robotics and automation, even if it 
comes with a high price tag? Do those new technologies improve 
safety?
    Mr. Rath. Thank you for your question. In the warehouse and 
distribution sector the largest cause for injuries and 
illnesses inside the plant is musculoskeletal disorders, and 
automation has the effect of removing from the worker and 
moving to the machine the most repetitive tasks, and the tasks 
that are the most load bearing upon the individual worker.
    That has an effect of reducing injury and illness rates 
inside a warehouse, or a distribution center.
    Mrs. Steel. Thank you very much. Thank you Chairwoman, I 
yield back.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you very much. I want to yield to 
Ms. Omar. You have 5 minutes ma'am.
    Ms. Omar. Thank you, Chairwoman. With all the media 
attention around recent layoffs in the corporate offices of 
Amazon, I want to remind us of the longstanding economic 
insecurity that Amazon's warehouse workers and drivers 
experience regularly. According to organizers in my district, 
Amazon has recently laid--tried to lay off dozens of employees 
at a warehouse in Egan, Minnesota, just because they could not 
switch from day shifts to night shifts.
    These workers, many of whom come from low-income and 
immigrant households, are being forced to either leave or 
suddenly accept midnight work schedules. We stand in solidarity 
with Minnesota's warehouse workers, and all who work to fight 
against unfair labor practices.
    Between 2019 and 2021, Amazon's profits tripled, reaching 
more than 33 billion dollars. In 2020, Jeff Bezos net worth 
exploded from 115 billion, to 188 billion dollars. et During 
that same time the serious injury rate of Amazon warehouses was 
more than double the rate of non-Amazon warehouses.
    In Minnesota alone, OSHA found 792 work related injuries at 
Amazon warehouses from 2018 to 2020. This means that one in 
nine Amazon warehouse workers are injured on the job annually 
in Minnesota. This is utterly shameful and unacceptable.
    Mr. Frumin, could you tell us why Amazon refuses to make 
its workplaces much safer, even with all the resources that it 
has at its disposal?
    Mr. Frumin. Thank you, Representative Omar. I wish I could 
be inside their minds. I am not going to go there, but they 
will have to speak for themselves. They have denied that the 
problem even exists, so you know why do they need to change?
    What is clear is that they have a deep investment in their 
business model to push workers as fast as possible, faster than 
humanly possible, to get the products out the door, to meet 
their fast delivery times, to keep ahead of their competitors. 
That is what they are about, and they do not deny it, and they 
are proud of it.
    Jeff Bezos has said that. We are confronted with a company 
which is not going to change on its own. We cannot tell you why 
they think that, but they are going to have to be forced to do 
that. There are different ways, but you and the Congress know 
that the Department of Labor has the authority to do that, and 
we want to see those investigations and enforcement efforts 
take place.
    It would be nice if Amazon were one of the good employers 
that have been spoken about here today, that are doing all the 
right things. Only putting in robots where they cannot hurt 
people, nothing could be farther from the truth, and anyone who 
spent 5 minutes in an Amazon warehouse or looked at the facts 
that Amazon has reported to OSHA, knows differently.
    Ms. Omar. Yes. I have, and I do agree with you. Thank you 
for that. It is shameful to continue to put profits over 
people. I want to discuss the prevalence of extreme weather 
events that are also putting workers in harm's way. Climate 
change and natural disasters have only become more devastating, 
making already dangerous workplaces even more unsafe for 
warehouse workers.
    Sir, how could Amazon, and other corporations better 
weatherize their warehouses and improve workplace policies to 
prevent worker harm from climate change-related dangers?
    Mr. Frumin. Well, I will speak initially to the heat issue, 
and then ask Mr. Kaoosji to describe it in further detail, but 
you know we have seen at Amazon a historic record of them 
failing to take every measure possible to protect workers from 
heat, that is not necessarily a simple matter in a warehouse, 
but certainly giving workers the ability to speak up, and get 
answers from supervisors.
    What should I do when I am feeling sick, having decent 
medical treatment by trained professionals under proper medical 
supervision, that is very important in recognizing the early 
symptoms, and unfortunately what we have seen at Amazon is low 
level emergency medical technicians, operating with no medical 
supervision in violation of State medical licensing laws, 
giving improper treatment to workers, and that is not going to 
solve that problem.
    Mr. Kaoosji.
    Mr. Kaoosji. Well, we saw when the heatwave in September 
when it was over 120 degrees in San Bernardino that only when 
workers spoke up, and collectively took action, were they given 
extra breaks, water, rest. When the company is put in a place 
where they actually are forced to provide those extra breaks, 
it is more proactive than workers who are not in a position to 
speak up themselves, they will still get those protections, 
that is how we see it.
    Ms. Omar. Really appreciate you all. Thank you so much. I 
yield back.
    Chairwoman Adams. Thank you. I want to remind my colleagues 
that pursuant to committee practice, materials for submission 
to the hearing record must be submitted to the committee clerk 
within 14 days following the last day of the hearing, so by 
close of business December 1, preferably in Microsoft Word 
format.
    The materials submitted must address the subject matter of 
the hearing. Only a member of the subcommittee or an invited 
witness may submit materials for inclusion in the hearing 
record. Documents are limited to 50 pages each. Documents 
longer than 50 pages will be incorporated into the record via 
an internet link that you must provide to the committee clerk 
within the required timeframe.
    Please recognize that in the future that link may no longer 
work. Pursuant to House Rules and Regulations, items for the 
record should be submitted to the clerk electronically by 
emailing submission to [email protected].
    Again, I want to thank the witnesses for their 
participation today. Members of the subcommittee may have some 
additional questions for you, and we ask the witnesses to 
please respond to those questions in writing. The hearing 
record will be held open for 14 days in order to receive those 
responses.
    I remind my colleagues that pursuant to committee practice, 
witness questions for the hearing record must be submitted to 
the majority committee staff or committee clerk within 7 days.
    The questions submitted must address the subject matter of 
the hearing. I am going to recognize myself now for the purpose 
of making my closing statement.
    Thank you to our witnesses for your time and testimony. 
Thank you to the committee members for their participation.
    Warehouse work can be dangerous work. Unfortunately, as our 
witnesses made clear, the modern economy is increasing pressure 
on employers to make an already precarious workplace more 
dangerous. As I shared earlier, this Subcommittee is 
responsible for ensuring that every worker comes home safely at 
the end of their shift.
    Throughout the 117th Congress, we have made significant 
progress toward achieving that goal. We held 13 hearings to 
elevate the voices of workersthe voices of workers across the 
Nation. The House passed three of our bills that strengthened 
the safety network for workers.
    We pushed the administration to adopt an enforceable 
emergency workplace safety standard, and protect workers from 
COVID-19. Thanks to the leadership of this Subcommittee, 
President Biden signed legislation into law to shore up 
financing for the Black Lung Benefits Program, to ensure 
disabled miners have improved access to the compensation and 
the care that they need.
    Thank you again to my colleagues for your commitment to 
improving workplace safety. I look forward to continuing our 
work in the 118th Congress. If there is no further business, 
without objection, the subcommittee stands adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 12:04 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
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