    [House Hearing, 117 Congress]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                       BACK TO SCHOOL, BACK TO STARTUPS:
       SUPPORTING YOUTH APPRENTICESHIP, ENTREPRENEURSHIP, AND WORKFORCE
                                  DEVELOPMENT

    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                          SUBCOMMITTEE ON INNOVATION,
                  ENTREPRENEURSHIP, AND WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT

                                     OF THE

                          COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS
                                 UNITED STATES
                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                        ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS

                                 SECOND SESSION
                                   __________

                                  HEARING HELD
                               SEPTEMBER 15, 2022
                                   __________

                      [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                Small Business Committee Document Number 117-066
                 Available via the GPO Website: www.govinfo.gov

                                  ___________

                        U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE

    48-580                    WASHINGTON : 2022

                       HOUSE COMMITTEE ON SMALL BUSINESS

                     NYDIA VELAZQUEZ, New York, Chairwoman
                              JARED GOLDEN, Maine
                              JASON CROW, Colorado
                             SHARICE DAVIDS, Kansas
                             KWEISI MFUME, Maryland
                            DEAN PHILLIPS, Minnesota
                             MARIE NEWMAN, Illinois
                           CAROLYN BOURDEAUX, Georgia
                             TROY CARTER, Louisiana
                              JUDY CHU, California
                           DWIGHT EVANS, Pennsylvania
                         CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania
                              ANDY KIM, New Jersey
                             ANGIE CRAIG, Minnesota
                            SCOTT PETERS, California
                  BLAINE LUETKEMEYER, Missouri, Ranking Member
                             ROGER WILLIAMS, Texas
                            PETE STAUBER, Minnesota
                            DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
                            CLAUDIA TENNEY, New York
                           ANDREW GARBARINO, New York
                             YOUNG KIM, California
                             BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas
                             BYRON DONALDS, Florida
                             MARIA SALAZAR, Florida
                          SCOTT FITZGERALD, Wisconsin
                              MIKE FLOOD, Nebraska

                     Melissa Jung, Majority Staff Director
                Ellen Harrington, Majority Deputy Staff Director
                         David Planning, Staff Director

                                C O N T E N T S

                               OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                       Page
    Hon. Jason Crow..................................................     1
    Hon. Young Kim...................................................     2

                                   WITNESSES

    Mr. Noel Ginsburg, Founder & Chief Executive Officer, CareerWise,
      Denver, CO.....................................................     5
    Ms. Deborah Kobes, Senior Director, Jobs for the Future (JFF),
      Washington, DC.................................................     7
    Ms. Shani Watkins, Director, West Sound Technical Skills Center,
      Bremerton School District, Bremerton, WA.......................     9
    Mr. Jared Ebbing, Economic Development Director for Mercer
      County, OH, Mercer County, OH, testifying on behalf of the
      Small Business and Entrepreneurship Council (SBE Council)......    10

                                    APPENDIX

    Prepared Statements:
        Mr. Noel Ginsburg, Founder & Chief Executive Officer,
          CareerWise, Denver, CO.....................................    28
        Ms. Deborah Kobes, Senior Director, Jobs for the Future
          (JFF), Washington, DC......................................    33
        Ms. Shani Watkins, Director, West Sound Technical Skills
          Center, Bremerton School District, Bremerton, WA...........    46
        Mr. Jared Ebbing, Economic Development Director for Mercer
          County, OH, Mercer County, OH, testifying on behalf of the
          Small Business and Entrepreneurship Council (SBE Council)..    52
    Questions for the Record:
        None.
    Answers for the Record:
        None.
    Additional Material for the Record:
        Supporting materials following testimony of Deborah Kobes,
          Senior Director, Jobs for the Future.......................    55

                       BACK TO SCHOOL, BACK TO STARTUPS:
                       SUPPORTING YOUTH APPRENTICESHIP,
                        ENTREPRENEURSHIP, AND WORKFORCE
                                  DEVELOPMENT

                                  ----------

                          THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 15, 2022

                  House of Representatives,
                   Committee on Small Business,
          Subcommittee on Innovation, Entrepreneurship,
                                     and Workforce Development,
                                                        Washington, DC.
        The Subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10:00 a.m., in
    Room 2360, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Jason Crow
    [chairman of the Subcommittee] presiding.
        Present: Representatives Crow, Davids, Newman, Houlahan,
    Williams, Tenney, and Young Kim.
        Chairman CROW. Good morning. I call this hearing to order.
        Without objection, the Chair is authorized to declare a
    recess at any time.
        I would like to begin by noting some important
    requirements.
        Standing House and Committee rules will continue to apply
    during hybrid proceedings. All Members are reminded that they
    are expected to adhere to these rules, including decorum.
        House regulations require Members to be visible through a
    video connection throughout the proceedings. So please keep
    your cameras on.
        Also, please remember to remain muted until you are
    recognized to minimize background noise.
        In the event a Member encounters technical issues that
    prevent them from being recognized for their questioning, I
    will move to the next available Member of the same party. And I
    will recognize that Member at the next appropriate time slot,
    provided they have returned to the proceeding.
        The COVID-19 pandemic upended the labor market like no
    other event in recent times. The pandemic slowed immigration,
    legal immigration, to a crawl, sparked early retirements, and
    forced many to exit the labor force due to factors like lack of
    childcare. These effects combined to expand a longstanding and
    unprecedented labor shortage that we are still working to
    overcome today.
        As of July 2022, the total number of unemployed individuals
    is roughly 5.9 million, while the number of job openings stood
    at 11.2 million. This gap in available workers has hit small
    firms the hardest. According to recent surveys, over half of
    American small businesses are concerned with hiring enough
    employees to fill open positions and overall employee
    retention.
        Given the fundamental importance of small businesses to the
    American economy, we must find ways to ease this labor shortage
    and build a lasting pipeline of talent into these businesses.
        One promising strategy is to bolster workforce development
    programs to attract young people to small firms. As the new
    school year starts up, America's youth are increasingly looking
    for alternatives to 4-year degrees, given high tuition costs
    and the prospect of student loan debt. More than half of
    American adults agree that college costs limit their ability to
    pursue secondary education.
        The COVID crisis has also exacerbated this issue, as total
    enrollment dropped by nearly 1.4 million between fall of 2019
    and fall of 2021. These figures show that America's youth need
    more options beyond a standard 4-year degree.
        Increasingly, young people are turning to youth
    apprenticeship programs to gain valuable, real-world
    experience, in addition to the instruction they receive in the
    classroom.
        In 2022, roughly 214,000 people age 16 to 24 were in an
    apprenticeship. This is double the number of that demographic
    just a decade ago.
        These apprenticeships have been proven to offer a wealth of
    benefits to small firms beyond just attracting new talent.
        In a study of 4,000 businesses that utilized youth
    apprenticeships, nearly 3 in 4 mentioned that it improved
    productivity, and 4 in 10 said it helped them secure new
    business. However, implementing a costly apprenticeship program
    can be daunting for small firms with tight margins.
        Today I would like us to explore ways Congress can make
    youth apprenticeship programs and other workforce development
    tools more accessible for small businesses.
        Programs like CareerWise, which was originally started in
    Colorado, have successfully spread the youth apprenticeship
    model to cities across America and expanded into a range of new
    industries.
        I want to take a closer look at the successes of CareerWise
    and other programs like it and identify ways the federal
    government can help more small firms utilize apprenticeships to
    attract talent.
        Expanding youth apprenticeships and other types of career
    and technical education can provide young people with a
    comparable alternative to a 4-year university education, while
    bolstering the small business labor force.
        I would now like to yield to the Ranking Member, Mrs. Kim,
    for her opening statement.
        Ms. YOUNG KIM. Thank you, Chairman.
        As Members of the Small Business Committee, we hear
    directly from small business owners and their employees on a
    regular basis on the challenges they face right now. They
    include ongoing inflationary pressures, consistent supply chain
    issues, burdensome regulations, and workforce shortages. The
    inability to find workers have led owners to make business
    adjustments to account for those ongoing staffing shortages.
        As Chair noted, the federal government's Job Openings and
    Labor Turnover Summary reported that they indicate there is
    about 11.2 million job openings at the end of July and 4.2
    million workers left their jobs in the same month. And a recent
    survey reported 86 percent of small business owners said it was
    more difficult to find and retain employees compared with 3
    months ago.
        So small businesses, as we know, they do not only need to
    fill those open positions, but they also need to fill qualified
    and skilled workers. And, in August, 63 percent of small
    businesses reported hiring or trying to hire employees, and an
    astounding 91 percent of those small employers report hiring or
    trying to hire--reported that they have few or no qualified
    applicants for those open positions.
        So this skills gap has been a growing issue for businesses
    and the economy, and it is time to rethink how to expand
    opportunities for individuals often left out by traditional
    recruiting approaches.
        So that brings us to our conversation today where we will
    examine how apprenticeships and career and technical
    educational programs can help these workforce issues.
        Many small firms have turned to on-the-job apprenticeships
    to fill those openings, and one success story I want to share
    with you today is located in Orange County, the company that I
    visited often and worked closely, Veteran Air. Veteran Air is a
    veteran-owned small business serving my district, and they
    utilize an apprenticeship program with all new employees. And
    their employees are paid full time while they train to become
    certified HVAC technicians.
        Veteran Air serves as an example of small businesses
    utilizing apprenticeships and creating opportunities aligned
    with local workforce needs. And I am very proud to have toured,
    visited this Veteran Air's Anaheim facility, and I met with so
    many of their workers and employees. And I tell you they don't
    just work at Veteran Air, but they are actively participating,
    encouraging their employees to get involved and give back to
    their communities.
        And that is the type of partnership that we want to see.
    These are the type of small businesses also that we must
    empower and support in our local communities. Apprenticeships
    and career development programs are not a new concept. But, in
    this changing economy, they can help small firms reach untapped
    talent and focus on the new potential and invest in solving job
    shortages.
        So I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today. And
    I hope to work with my colleagues to address these skills gaps,
    promote career and technical educational opportunities, and
    encourage apprenticeships.
        Thank you.
        And I yield back.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you, Mrs. Kim.
        The gentlelady yields back.
        I would like to take a moment to explain how this hearing
    will proceed.
        Each witness will have 5 minutes to provide a statement,
    and each committee Member will have 5 minutes for questions.
    Please ensure that your microphone is on when you begin
    speaking, and then you return it to mute when finished.
        With that, I would like to introduce our first witness. And
    we will go through all of them, and then we will start with the
    time for each.
        But our first witness is going to be Mr. Noel Ginsburg,
    founder and CEO of CareerWise USA. Throughout his career, Noel
    has stood out as an entrepreneur and nonprofit leader committed
    to serving his community. He founded his first business,
    Intertech Plastics, while in his senior year at University of
    Denver. Go Pioneers. Now it employees nearly 200 people at two
    facilities in Denver, Colorado.
        In 2016, Noel founded CareerWise Colorado, a nonprofit
    designed to create opportunities for students and businesses
    across the State by developing innovative and sustainable youth
    apprenticeship programs. CareerWise has now expanded across the
    country to New York City, Washington, D.C., Indiana, Buffalo,
    and Michigan.
        Last year he was appointed to the Secretary of Labor's
    Advisory Committee on Apprenticeship.
        Thank you for being here, Mr. Ginsburg. I look forward to
    your testimony.
        Our next witness is Ms. Deborah Kobes--am I pronouncing
    that right? Thank you--senior director at Jobs for the Future,
    JFF, and the interim director of the Center for Apprenticeship
    and Work-Based Learning.
        For over a decade, Ms. Kobes has been managing projects to
    develop innovative new training and education models and to
    build capacity for programs--for program delivery among a range
    of organizations. She seeks to create career pathways primarily
    for underrepresented populations, like women and people of
    color, in high-demand areas of the economy.
        Before joining JFF, Ms. Kobes held research positions at
    MIT, the Brookings Institution, and the Urban Institute.
        Thank you, Ms. Kobes, for being here today. We look forward
    to your testimony.
        Our third witness is Ms. Shani Watkins. Ms. Watkins serves
    as the director of the West Sound Technical Skills Center in
    Bremerton, Washington.
        For 25 years, she has worked in both secondary and
    postsecondary education and found her passion working in career
    and technical education. Ms. Watkins is active in her local
    community, serving as a Member of the local Lions Club. She is
    also active in her local regional and national associations for
    career and technical education, currently serving as the
    regional vice president of that organization. Last December she
    was awarded with the ACTE National Administrator of the Year
    award.
        Congratulations.
        Ms. WATKINS. Thank you.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you, Ms. Watkins. We look forward to
    hearing your testimony.
        I will now yield to the Ranking Member to introduce our
    final witness.
        Ms. YOUNG KIM. Thank you, Chairman.
        Our fourth witness is Mr. Jared Ebbing. He is the director
    of Mercer County Community and Economic Development. He is
    testifying today on behalf of the Small Business and
    Entrepreneurship Council, also known as the SBE Council.
        As Community and Economic Development director, Mr. Ebbing
    works with Mercer County and its citizens to plan for future
    projects and to find the funding necessary to complete them.
    Additionally, he works with local school districts to ensure
    every student has the knowledge and awareness of the many
    career opportunities that exist in the area.
        To accomplish this, he created hometownopportunity.com as a
    critical tool for the region's workforce development efforts.
    Mr. Ebbing works closely with local companies throughout the
    county to ensure local businesses possess the tools and the
    workers necessary to grow within the region.
        I know Mr. Ebbing's experience working with small
    businesses and vast knowledge of workforce development programs
    will be extremely beneficial to this hearing and our
    conversation today.
        So, Mr. Ebbing, thank you for taking the time to testify
    before us today. Thank you for joining.
        And thank you, all witnesses, for being with us.
        Chairman CROW. Yes. Thank you all for joining us today.
        Mr. Ginsburg, you are recognized for 5 minutes.

    STATEMENTS OF NOEL GINSBURG, FOUNDER & CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER,
     CAREERWISE, DENVER, CO; DEBORAH KOBES, SENIOR DIRECTOR, JOBS
        FOR THE FUTURE (JFF), WASHINGTON, D.C.; SHANI WATKINS,
    DIRECTOR, WEST SOUND TECHNICAL SKILLS CENTER, BREMERTON SCHOOL
    DISTRICT, BREMERTON, WA; AND JARED EBBING, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT
     DIRECTOR FOR MERCER COUNTY, OH, MERCER COUNTY, OH, TESTIFYING
     ON BEHALF OF THE SMALL BUSINESS AND ENTREPRENEURSHIP COUNCIL
                             (SBE COUNCIL).

                       STATEMENT OF NOEL GINSBURG

        Mr. GINSBURG. Thank you, Chairman Crow and Ranking Member
    Young Kim, for giving all of us the opportunity to speak about
    something which I believe can be transformational for our
    education and workforce system and, in so doing, drive
    opportunity for small and large businesses, but particularly
    small, to build a workforce that will catapult them into the
    future.
        What I would like to start with is why I--where I started.
    When I founded my company, while in college, what I realized
    quickly is that, to be successful, talent would be the core of
    our success, who we could bring in, who I would surround myself
    with.
        And, when I couldn't find that talent, I went to the
    schools, assuming naively that it was their fault that I didn't
    have the talent. But, rather than pointing a finger, I showed
    up at the front door of Montbello High School and said, how can
    I help? And that began what has been a 35-, 38-year
    partnership, because what I realized is the missing piece is
    industry, not to stand on the outside as advisors or critics,
    but to be partners in workforce development.
        The second reason I did this is, over 30 years ago, my wife
    and I sponsored 42 inner city youth through the ``I Have a
    Dream'' Foundation. We made a 10-year commitment that would
    culminate in providing a college scholarship for each one, but
    in that neighborhood, 90 percent were dropping out of high
    school. So our challenge was to change that outcome. Ten years
    later, we graduated over 90 percent of our young people.
        And that sent me on a journey to find a solution that would
    not just serve 42 or a city or a State or maybe even a country.
    And it led me, because I was Chairing the College and Career
    Pathways Council at Denver public schools, to Switzerland to
    learn about a system where, like the U.S., 27 percent of their
    population will get a 4-year degree. Unlike the U.S., 70
    percent will take on an apprenticeship and not just in advanced
    manufacturing or the trades, but banking, finance, insurance.
    And it is a ROI-based system. It is transformational for the
    youth and transformational for the businesses.
        So, with the inspiration from that, I came back to Colorado
    and formed CareerWise with an intention of building a system,
    not a program, that can be that transformational. How it works:
    In the junior year, an apprentice will spend 3 days in the
    classroom and 2 days in a business in a paid apprenticeship,
    not looking over someone's shoulder but learning real skills in
    a whole host of occupations.
        In their senior year, they will spend 2 days in the
    classroom and 3 days in business. And they will get all of
    their high school credit. For some, they will earn college
    credit as a part of their apprenticeship.
        And then, in the third year, they will work either full or
    part time, depending on postsecondary options.
        Then, at the end, the hope is to get a job with the
    training company.
        And so what are we seeing? We have young people now that
    are graduating from their apprenticeship earning between
    $40,000 and as high as $75,000 right out of high school. Our
    completing apprentices are transformational for the businesses
    that they work for and for the future of their own careers.
        Congressman Crow, you mentioned places where in the
    country. On Monday, I was in New York where the CEO Jobs
    Council, founded by the Chairman of J.P. Morgan Chase, Jamie
    Dimon, made a commitment, along with David Banks, their
    chancellor, and Julie Sweet from Accenture, to hire 3,000
    apprentices over the next 3 years in a whole host of
    occupations from banking to finance, both large and small
    business. That represents 135 million in wages and training
    that will go to these young people while they in high school.
    It will change their lives because we have seen that with our
    apprentices to this day.
        The impact of youth apprenticeship is multiples. It defines
    youth apprenticeship early on in a young person's career as an
    options multiplier, not a dead end. And it can lead. You can
    start with the apprenticeship and end with a Ph.D. it
    reinforces that there is equal dignity in multiple career
    paths. College is not the only proxy. We need better ways to
    finance it, and many of our apprentices are getting their
    education paid for through the tuition reimbursement that these
    companies provide.
        It serves young people from marginalized communities in a
    way that is powerful. There is a cement ceiling over many of
    our young people in this country. Youth apprenticeship,
    starting in high school, is like a cement drill, really
    building opportunity for them that is unmatched. For some
    apprentices that choose to continue with a 2- or 4-year degree,
    it has the potential to reduce the financial burden as a
    result.
        So my point here is this can be a transformational
    opportunity--it is for many young people today--but only if it
    is much more than a program. With your help and your guidance
    and the questions that you will ask, hopefully we can move our
    country forward.
        Thank you.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you, Mr. Ginsburg.
        Ms. Kobes, you are recognized for 5 minutes.

                       STATEMENT OF DEBORAH KOBES

        Ms. KOBES. Thank you.
        Good morning, Chairman Crow, Ranking Member Young Kim, and
    other Members of the Subcommittee. Thank you for inviting me to
    testify today about the value and potential of apprenticeship
    for America's youth and in development of the nation's talent
    pipeline.
        My name is Deborah Kobes. I am a senior director at Jobs
    for the Future, and I lead our Center for Apprenticeship and
    Work-Based Learning.
        JFF works to transform America's workforce and education
    systems to achieve equitable economic advancement for all.
    Apprenticeship and work-based learning have the power to
    connect young people to high-demand, high-quality jobs, and
    they offer small businesses a grow-your-own talent solution.
        The good news is that youth apprenticeship is growing. JFF
    just released an analysis that shows that the number of youth
    below the age of 25 registering as apprentices has more than
    doubled between 2010 and 2020, which significantly outpaces the
    growth of Registered Apprenticeship overall. These youth
    apprentices earned an average wage of $31 an hour, which far
    exceeds the average wage for young workers.
        Youth apprenticeship has become more accessible to more
    populations, with female and Latinx representation increasing
    throughout the decade.
        While progress has been made, disparities continue. Nearly
    90 percent of youth apprentices are male, and almost two-thirds
    are white. Male youth apprentices earn nearly twice as much as
    women, and White apprentices earned about $7 more per hour than
    Black apprentices. These data show the need to continue to
    explicitly address diversity, equity, inclusion, and
    accessibility in Registered Apprenticeship and youth
    apprenticeship.
        Employers are central to youth apprenticeship. They hire
    the apprentices. They supervise the on-the-job learning. In
    exchange for their participation, employers benefit from
    recruiting talent, aligning education and training with company
    needs, and building a loyal workforce.
        Yet small businesses face a range of challenges in
    participating in youth apprenticeship. Many express concerns
    about liability issues and insurance costs of youth employment,
    which vary by state and by industry.
        Establishing a work schedule that accommodates state
    requirements for school seat time and attendance, as well as
    navigating other K-12 and postsecondary requirements, can be
    difficult. And identifying and managing the multiple sources of
    public funding for apprenticeship can be confusing and time-
    consuming, particularly for small businesses who are unfamiliar
    with the funding sources.
        Yet, while it is especially important for small businesses
    to engage in youth apprenticeship, this can be an expensive
    proposition upfront.
        To drive the expansion of high-quality youth apprenticeship
    programs, JFF recommends that Congress build on the National
    Apprenticeship Act to define youth apprenticeship as a
    Registered Apprenticeship program specifically designed for
    serving youth ages 16 to 24, whether in or out of school.
        Congress should incentivize States to align their education
    and workforce systems and update K-12 policies, such as seat
    time requirements, in ways that encourage engagement in and
    expansion of youth apprenticeship.
        We also urge policies that encourage the development of
    high-quality work-based learning opportunities as part of core
    academic as well as career and technical education programs. To
    drive diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility in youth
    apprenticeship, we recommend that Congress refocus investments
    on completion and wage equity.
        We recommend providing flexible funding that supports pre-
    apprenticeship, inclusive outreach and recruitment, accessible
    classroom instruction, robust mentorship, and apprenticeship
    navigators to guide young people through their program.
        Youth apprentices also need supportive services to address
    barriers that are just the cost of training materials and
    testing fees; access to technology and the internet, especially
    in the age of COVID; and transportation to school and work,
    which often have to happen in the same day.
        We recommend that Congress support employers in providing
    inclusive workplaces, facilitating the creation of training,
    funding, and support to small businesses to increase their
    capacity to adopt these best practices.
        To increase small business participation in youth
    apprenticeship, JFF recommends investing in intermediaries,
    particularly local and industry organizations, to convene
    employers and stakeholders, as well as to reduce the
    programmatic and administrative burdens of delivering youth
    apprenticeships.
        Similarly, Congress can support sector strategies that
    convene employers to build career pathways and regional talent
    pipelines while incentivizing youth apprenticeship as a
    featured strategy within those sector partnerships.
        Congress can assist small businesses in accessing
    information and training to navigate the differing state youth
    employment laws, as well as the multiple streams of public
    funding available.
        In parallel, Congress can encourage greater investment in
    youth apprenticeship by stakeholders administering eligible
    funding, such as WIOA, Pell Grants, and the emerging
    infrastructure and CHIPS grant.
        Thank you again for the opportunity share this testimony. I
    appreciate the Committee's longstanding interest in
    apprenticeship, and I look forward to supporting your efforts
    to facilitate the use of youth apprenticeship among small
    businesses.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you, Ms. Kobes.
        Ms. Watkins, you are recognized for 5 minutes.

                       STATEMENT OF SHANI WATKINS

        Ms. WATKINS. Good morning, Chairman Crow and Ranking Member
    Young Kim, Members of the committee. Thank you for the
    opportunity to appear before you today to discuss this
    important issue.
        My name is Shani Watkins, and I am the director of West
    Sound Technical Skills Center in Bremerton, Washington. I also
    serve as the Region V vice president for the Association for
    Career and Technical Education, known as ACTE, and am the 2022
    ACTE Administrator of the Year.
        West Sound Technical Skills Center provides advanced career
    and technical education, or CTE programs, to 10 school
    districts across the Kitsap Peninsula. It provides increased
    equity and access for students in small, rural areas, as well
    as larger suburban areas. It serves more than 500 students in
    their junior and senior years of high school.
        Students spend half their day at West Sound Tech and the
    other half of their day at their sending school. We offer 13
    programs across areas such as IT, automotive, construction,
    HVAC, healthcare, law and public safety, and more.
        CTE programs like the ones offered at my school engage
    students through hands-on active learning and prepare them with
    the skills they need for both further education and fulfilling
    careers in vital in-demand industries and occupations.
        At West Sound Tech, we have a variety of partnerships with
    local businesses, including small business, to provide
    important relevant learning and learning, paid work
    opportunities for our students to better prepare for life after
    high school. This morning I would like to share with you a few
    examples of these partnerships.
        Each year, West Sound Tech holds a try-a-trade day where
    our industry partners bring their tools and equipment to our
    local fairgrounds so that students from grades 9-12 can
    experience firsthand what different careers offer. We also hold
    an on-site event for students called the West Sound Tech Works.
    This is a 2-day event where our local business and industry
    partners come to share their experiences and knowledge with
    students. Students attend sessions and participate in different
    workshops provided by our industry partners.
        In addition, West Sound Tech holds an evening event called
    Explore Your Future with community partners including business
    and industry, local support services, 2-year and 4-year
    colleges, apprenticeship programs, and the military. In total,
    more than 65 different partners hold booths with information
    for families about opportunities and pathways after high
    school. Typically we have more than 500 students and families
    in attendance at that event.
        Each spring, we also hold a practice interviewing event for
    students with business and industry partners from the student's
    specific content area.
        In another partnership example, the Puget Sound Naval
    Shipyard supports an annual work-study program, hiring up to 30
    students during the summer between their junior and senior
    years. These students are provided an hourly wage and benefits,
    while participating in work and training situations at
    different shops located throughout the shipyard. Students learn
    key safety requirements, use various hand and power tools, and
    acquire the fundamental knowledge and skills necessary to work
    in an industrial environment.
        At the end of the summer, students return to school for
    their first semester of their senior year. Then, during the
    second semester of their senior year, the students again work
    full time in the shipyard. Often the work-study experience
    leads to a future career for those students. Once hired after
    high school, candidates qualify to enter various apprenticeship
    programs offered at the shipyard.
        This model could be replicated with other small businesses
    to better support workforce needs and experiences for students
    to prepare for living-wage careers.
        As in the shipyard partnership, West Sound Tech has a long
    history of preparing students to enter into apprenticeship
    program after high school. Both our construction careers and
    welding courses have pre-apprenticeship articulations with the
    Laborers and Iron Workers Union respectively.
        Students meet all requirements for entry into the
    apprenticeship programs while they are at West Sound Tech. For
    example, students in the construction program learn all of the
    physical requirements for entry, complete the minimum math
    requirements, and obtain relevant certifications.
        Despite our strong partnerships and work-based learning
    opportunities, barriers exist for our students. The cost of
    programs, transportation, the needs of low-income students for
    paid work experience, and the lack of capacity in small
    businesses are all challenges we grapple with regularly.
        Increased federal funding for programs like the Carl D.
    Perkins Career and Technical Education Act and apprenticeships,
    the expansion of youth and pre-apprenticeship activities,
    incentives for small businesses to partner with educational
    institutions, and targeted investments in paid work-based
    learning experiences, and student certifications can all help
    to address these challenges.
        In conclusion, stronger partnerships between small business
    and secondary schools will help to increase a segment of the
    economy that is currently experiencing significant challenges
    in finding a ready workforce. Students engaged in CTE programs
    are better prepared in the workforce, less likely to need
    significant students loans, and are more likely to have the
    skills and credentials to meet workplace needs.
        Thank you, Chairman Crow, Ranking Member Young Kim, and
    Committee for this opportunity today.
        I look forward to answering any questions you may have.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you, Ms. Watkins.
        Mr. Ebbing, you are recognized for 5 minutes.

                       STATEMENT OF JARED EBBING

        Mr. EBBING. Thank you, Chairman Crow, Ranking Member Young
    Kim, and the distinguished Members of the Subcommittee.
        Again, my name is Jared Ebbing. I am the Community and
    Economic Development Director here in Mercer County, Ohio.
        Mercer County is a rural county in west-central Ohio which
    is along the Ohio and Indiana border. We are part of a region
    of Ohio that is known for its small, homegrown companies
    involved in everything from advanced manufacturing to ag to
    food processing.
        My office works with our many local companies to ensure
    that they have the personnel necessary to continue to grow
    their businesses and invest in our area.
        The vast majority of the jobs created here in Mercer County
    can be attributed to small businesses. While we do have a
    couple of nationally known, larger corporations, most of our
    companies started right here years ago in somebody's basement,
    garage, or outbuilding with just a handful of workers. The
    entrepreneurial spirit here has always been alive and well in
    this region because people just know how to make things and
    have never really been afraid of the hard work needed to make
    it happen.
        While these businesses haven't really asked for anything
    more than our local support in their efforts to grow and
    expand, they now are most certainly worried about the
    sustainability of their workforce in the future.
        COVID-19 and its impact created an unprecedented new set of
    challenges for businesses. While larger corporations adjusted,
    utilizing remote work as an option, many of our smaller
    manufacturers had a hard time managing, training, and thus,
    developing their future workforce as a result of the pandemic.
        Additionally, the Great Resignation, supply chain issues,
    increased raw material costs, and now hyper wage inflation have
    all compounded their issues, making it very difficult for our
    small businesses to manage their operations.
        As such, we hear from our companies every day that say
    that, even though there is work there, they are struggling to
    complete it due to the various open positions that they have.
    So many of these unfilled positions are middle-skill jobs,
    meaning they require a high school diploma and some form of
    postsecondary education but not necessarily always a
    traditional 4-year college degree.
        As a result, companies are indeed looking at
    apprenticeships and any other on-the-job training programs that
    could help. In order to make this happen, ongoing collaboration
    among our stakeholders at every level is vital to identify best
    practices and implement impactful programs. I would like share
    one such example of a program that we have implemented to great
    success.
        Hometownopportunity.com is an online-based resource simply
    aimed at increasing the awareness of our many local, great
    careers that exist in our area to our students and to our
    families. Our companies are most certainly in need of our local
    talent, who all too often do not realize that these great
    opportunities exist right here in their own backyard.
        Furthermore, we are utilizing this resource to make
    meaningful connections between our emerging workforce and the
    companies hoping to hire and thus train them.
        We focus our efforts on first making sure students are
    aware of what our local companies do, what skills are needed,
    and what opportunities truly exist.
        Properly educating our students on the myriad of options
    and opportunities to them may sound simple, but it is actually
    surprisingly difficult when teenagers' attentions and interests
    aren't necessarily on their future. We have all been there.
        Through these career navigation tools, new career-based
    curriculum within our schools, and the hiring of countywide
    career coaches, an appreciable increase in the awareness among
    our young people is finally occurring.
        With such awareness and newfound interest, students are
    enrolling in job shadow opportunities, along with pre-
    apprenticeship programs, which eventually lead to full
    apprenticeships programs at our local companies. It is a long
    process, but once students are aware of what is here, it is so
    much easier to introduce them to the necessary training that
    combines on-the-job paid experiences with their classroom
    learning.
        Although we feel very good about our local initiatives that
    we have implemented to date, more resources, ideas, and support
    would help. A national push for career development courses
    within our schools is needed. Similar support was given to the
    successful implementation of STEM-based classes across the
    country over the past decade, resulting in more young people
    becoming interested in science and math.
        Encouraging our classrooms nationwide to increase and offer
    more meaningful awareness and guidance curriculum, such as
    CareerWise and Edge Factor, would most certainly have a
    positive impact on our nation's youth. Additionally, an
    expansion of federal programs, such as Apprenticeship USA and
    Pell grants for technical education, would also help our
    emerging workforce become better trained for the careers of the
    future.
        Now more than ever we need to find ways to enhance the
    workforce development initiatives and programs that work. We
    must continue to support the business organizations and
    nonprofits who train, advocate, and bring entrepreneurs
    together, work with our educators to ensure we are not just
    graduating students from school but to an actual meaningful
    career, engage with organizations, such as the Small Business
    and Entrepreneurship Council, U.S. Chamber, and Small Business
    Administration to come up with new ideas, resources, and
    innovative policy solutions.
        Doing so will empower small businesses and thus, our
    communities to succeed long term by investing in our greatest
    asset: our people.
        In closing, thank you to the Subcommittee for the
    opportunity to testify today and for advocating and making
    policies that support small businesses across this great
    country of ours.
        Thank you.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you, Mr. Ebbing.
        I will begin by recognizing myself for 5 minutes. I would
    like to start with you, Mr. Ginsburg. You had mentioned, you
    know, years ago, when you first looked towards Switzerland and
    Europe that already had these well established and very
    successful programs. I would be interested in what you learned
    as you tried to replicate or use elements of that model here in
    the United States, starting in Denver and in Colorado, both
    with respect to resistance that you may have faced, cultural
    resistance or other structural resistance to implementing and
    expanding these models but also just the barriers, both with
    businesses and in the education system, that you faced.
        Mr. GINSBURG. Thank you, Chairman Crow. Big questions. What
    I will tell you, what impressed me about their system is that
    it was market based, meaning that they didn't create
    apprenticeships if the jobs didn't exist. So, as industries
    grew and shrank, at least a young person would have the
    opportunity to know what their opportunities would be post
    apprenticeship.
        Second is that their model scales so that 70 percent of
    young people take advantage of it and 40 percent of businesses
    participate because there is a true return on investment to the
    business. They do not subsidize the wages. Their education
    system is virtually free, much more so than it is here, so the
    related training is not as expensive, and there needs to be
    investments. But that is a powerful driver to scale.
        Now, when you bring that to the U.S., what we have learned
    is, when the U.S. built its road system in the country, our
    highway system, you needed the roads, you needed the off-ramps,
    the on-ramps, everything that made traffic flow and commerce
    flow. Youth apprenticeship in particular is not something that
    is intuitive for a business to think there is an ROI for. Plus,
    they don't have the tools they need to be successful.
        So building those tools for them, creating the connections
    with the high schools so that it could be successful, and to
    drive the ROI, which is what I observed overseas, is that, if a
    young person is still living at home and is making $15 an hour,
    up to $45,000 over the 3 years of their apprenticeship, the
    company is investing in them. As I mentioned, our employers in
    Colorado have invested over $45 million in wages and training
    dollars, but there is a--it is not an expense in the sense of a
    donation. It is an investment in their workforce.
        So the challenges ahead, particularly in a registered
    system, which I think is critical to ensure that, if you are
    doing business in 50 States or 2 States or 3, you are not doing
    business in different ways. The registered system, it is part
    of my role at the ACA is to make it simpler and more
    streamlined for businesses and more business responsive. In
    schools, in 50 States, we have, in essence, 50 different ways
    to do it. When seat time is a requirement, as it is in New
    York, for example, it is very difficult for an apprentice to
    spend time in a workplace.
        Now, we are hacking the system on a small scale right now.
    In Colorado, we have a competency-based system. So our students
    are earning credit for the learning that takes place in the
    workplace. We need more of that across the country. Those are
    some of the challenges.
        With employers, it is about setting up the system.
    Intermediaries are critical. In Switzerland, for example,
    industry associations drive their system. They are not ways to
    lobby Congress or the local Senate. It is, in essence, to build
    their future workforce, and as a result, a very small country
    competes with companies like the U.S. because of the quality of
    their workforce.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you for that.
        Ms. Kobes, you had mentioned the need to invest in
    intermediaries. Can you just briefly describe for us, you know,
    what do you see as the most effective intermediary models that
    you have worked with?
        Ms. KOBES. Absolutely. And I will pick up on some of what
    Noel was saying about intermediaries as well. You know, JFF is
    a national intermediary, so I don't want to undermine our value
    here. But, to your question, I think there is a real need to
    invest in local intermediaries and industry associations
    because that is who small businesses are already working with.
    So, to get the word out to small businesses, to give them a
    partner that they trust in really launching a program, having,
    you know, local chambers, local business associations within a
    specific industry, that is a place that you already have an in
    with small businesses.
        And then those intermediaries can bring together the
    employers to find what their common skills and competency needs
    are, design a program, broker the relationships with the
    education and training providers, and then even step in to help
    with the administration of the program in an ongoing basis.
        So, a lot of small businesses, you know, might be put off
    by the paperwork or not sure, you know, what they are fully
    signing up for in administering a program, and they can find it
    easier to really enter the space if their role is to be the
    employer, not to hold together the whole apprenticeship program
    and all of the different relationships required.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you. My time has expired.
        The Ranking Member, Ms. Kim, is now recognized for 5
    minutes.
        Ms. YOUNG KIM. Thank you, Chairman.
        I really appreciate all of our witnesses focusing on youth
    apprenticeship. It is critically important. And, in my
    district, we have several high schools that are in the IB
    program and then they are also providing technical programs,
    like one high school in my district is, you know, Troy High
    School, and they provide not only the IB but Troy tech programs
    through which they encourage their students to take 150 hours
    of internship, and they do get credit for their graduation
    requirements.
        And both--I mean, all of you spoke about the need to make
    this, as Mr., you know, Ginsburg, you mentioned, you don't want
    this to be just a program, but you want this to be a
    transformational system.
        And, you know, Ms. Watkins, Ms. Kobes, you all talked about
    utilizing the intermediaries, and the Chairman also asked
    through your question how we can replicate this through
    nationwide efforts so that it could become a system, not just a
    program at one school or at one district.
        So what are some of the challenges that you face, Mr.
    Ginsburg, as you make this CareerWise a, you know, successful
    program? When you work with the local school districts,
    presenting this idea to provide the students with the credits,
    what kind of challenges, if any, did you face in making this
    idea into a credit offered system?
        Mr. GINSBURG. I assumed when I first learned about this
    approach at ETH University in Switzerland, that our biggest
    obstacle would be the schools. How do you take a young person
    out of class for both 2 days a week and then 3 days a week and
    then earn their credit? In the room with me in the delegation
    was the head of curriculum at Denver public schools, and she
    said simply: I can do that.
        And we now have 17 school districts that do that.
        So the challenge, frankly, is not the schools directly; it
    is in how they schedule. If you have blocked schedules, as some
    districts do that we--in other States that we work with, it is
    difficult to let a student out. So, you know, changing those
    policies and scheduling to enable it is one way to address that
    problem.
        The real challenge, honestly, is scale with business. They
    need the support, which intermediaries provide, to give them
    the tools, the training, and the technology to successfully
    launch a youth apprenticeship program, and youth is important.
    The statistics that you were sharing earlier go up to 24.
        Doing this while students are skill in school, I believe,
    is key, is the bridge to opportunity and the systemic change
    that we need. And the numbers that we are seeing at CareerWise
    are much more balanced, both in male and female, with over
    indexing on marginalized communities in terms of the outcomes
    in those students that are being hired.
        Ms. YOUNG KIM. Thank you.
        I want to address the next questions to Mr. Ebbing, who is
    joining us virtually. You know, in your testimony, you talk
    about raising awareness of the opportunities that exist for
    youth apprenticeships and career development courses in high
    schools. I mean, that is what everybody is talking about, but
    specifically through your hometown opportunity. So can you
    please elaborate on that and talk about that resource as well
    as other ways that you are raising awareness for those
    programs, and can you cite some of the examples?
        Mr. EBBING. Yeah, most certainly. Appreciate it. Appreciate
    the question. Yeah, you know, so, when I first got into this
    role, it was just startling at how many young people and their
    families just didn't know, you know. They went through high
    school; they would go through the traditional route and would
    graduate and just didn't know either what was here or what
    training programs even existed. So they just kind of followed
    the beaten down path of what had always been, and what has
    always been isn't what is today and what is the future for our
    companies and what they need, and what the training options
    that are truly out there.
        So we realized early on, you know, all these programs that
    could and would exist aren't going to make an impact if people
    aren't--if students aren't aware of what they need to be, you
    know, aware of. So we kind of just started with that simple
    process of creating, you know, relationships with our schools
    and our companies to make sure the schools, the guidance
    counselors, the teachers all knew what these opportunities were
    and, again, created this platform that really helps connect the
    dots, you know, create that curriculum, create that content
    that students, you know, can say: Oh, I didn't know this was an
    option for me.
        And, just in the last 10 years since we have been doing it,
    I mean, the number of young people that are--you know, 10 years
    ago were just simply just straight going off to college, which
    there is nothing wrong with that, but just simply doing it in
    college, I would say 90 percent of our students were going down
    that path. Now I would say it is closer to probably 50/50.
        Many more young people are going into the career-based
    fields. Our career high schools are filling up. Like I said, at
    least 50 percent of the students are now going that direction.
    And many, many more are enrolling in pre-apprenticeship
    programs and then apprenticeship programs.
        So, to us, it really starts with awareness and making sure
    that students at a very--at early age as possible, understand
    what is here and start to direct them into what programs could
    be--if we do that right, I think more and more students will
    take advantage of these programs and will most certainly
    benefit the companies because they have somebody that, you
    know, truly wants to be there and understands why--you know,
    why they are going in that direction, so----
        Ms. YOUNG KIM. Thank you.
        I will yield back. We are over time.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you. The gentlelady's time has
    expired.
        I will now recognize the gentlelady, Ms. Davids from
    Kansas, the Chairwoman of the Subcommittee on Economic Growth,
    Tax, and Capital Access, for 5 minutes.
        Ms. DAVIDS. Thank you, Chairman Crow, and to Ranking Member
    Young Kim for holding this hearing today.
        You know, in the Kansas Third and across the country, we
    are definitely seeing serious workforce shortages in every
    sector, and it has, I think, been especially challenging for
    small businesses. And, you know, as we continue to invest in
    our youth and workforce development programs, I know we are
    hearing from you all about some of the better ways for us to be
    able to do that.
        This is going to be the way that we build a stronger and
    more resilient economy, and that includes young people, us
    encouraging the work you are doing and encouraging young people
    to go into and explore entrepreneurship and apprenticeships.
        And that is why I was really, really proud to help
    introduce the 21st Century Entrepreneurship Act with my fellow
    Committee Member Rep. Dean Phillips. And, for folks who aren't
    familiar with this bill, our bill would require the SBA to
    develop an entrepreneurship curriculum for the 21st Century
    Learning Centers, which provide additional educational
    opportunities and resources to typically underserved students,
    which we have heard you all make reference to in your work.
    This curriculum will be developed and implemented using the
    partnership with local volunteers from SCORE, which is the
    Service Corps of Retired Executives.
        So I wanted to--Ms. Kobes, in your written testimony, you
    did recommend expanding youth entrepreneurship opportunities in
    conjunction with youth apprenticeship. I am curious, if you
    could share with us, though, how the legislation like the 21st
    century entrepreneurship bill could help do that, and then
    maybe talk a little bit about the ways that entrepreneurship
    and apprenticeships can go hand in hand.
        Ms. KOBES. Yeah, I will start with the last part of your
    question, which I think youth apprenticeship and
    entrepreneurship actually go together quite well. So I
    appreciate that question, and I think small businesses are a
    place where you see that juncture.
        So, if you think about a student who hasn't really explored
    entrepreneurship before, being in a small business is a setting
    where they are more likely to see all of the different aspects
    that you need to really operate a business. So, through what
    you think of as, you know, the more traditional parts of a
    youth apprenticeship, a student would learn the technical
    skills that they need in the industry that they are focused on.
        And so they could learn--I think you mentioned HVAC. You
    know, they could learn their HVAC skills or, you know, their
    insurance skills or whatever. But then, being in a small
    business, they will actually see much more upfront and closely
    than they would in a large business what it actually takes to
    make all of the back-end decisions to run that business, to
    market the business, you know, the different partners that you
    would need to be engaged with, and the people that they are
    learning from would bring that broader range of skills and
    exposure. And so that value of a small business for students
    who are really considering entrepreneurship is a great pairing.
        In terms of, you know, how specific legislation can support
    entrepreneurship, I can follow up with you in writing. JFF has
    thoughts on that that go beyond my thoughts for this morning,
    so I can put that in the record for you as a follow-up.
        Ms. DAVIDS. Oh, that would be great. And one of the most
    disappointing parts about these is we only get 5 minutes on--
    especially when they are very interesting hearings likes the
    one today.
        Mr. Ginsburg, I actually do have a specific question for
    you, but I saw a lot of head nodding while your fellow witness
    was speaking. Do you want to add anything to that first
    question? And then I will follow up. I actually have questions
    for everybody on the panel.
        Mr. GINSBURG. Well, I would certainly say ditto. That is
    why I was shaking my head. Everything you said is so right on.
    And we are now in the second year of a pilot working just with
    Black-owned businesses in inner city Denver, which tend to be
    very small. There might only be two or three employees, but now
    they have an apprentice. And for all the reasons you said,
    these young people are getting to see the entire business. It
    is what I did when I started Intertech with 12 employees. I
    learned everything.
        So apprenticeship works particularly well for small
    businesses because the economics works well, and people like
    working with young people and seeing them grow and expand. So
    more to come in terms of the evidence, but what I know from the
    evidence we have so far with Black and Brown students in our
    programs is they take advantage of this more so than White
    students, frankly, because the narrative of ``I am going to
    college'' still exists. So, for marginalized communities, this
    is a real game changer and ultimately can make college more
    affordable if they choose.
        Ms. DAVIDS. Thank you. And we will definitely follow up. I
    would love to hear more about the pilot program. Chairman, I
    yield back.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you. And we will have a chance to go
    for a second round if we want to as well. The gentlelady yields
    back.
        I now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr. Williams, the
    Vice Ranking Member of the Committee for 5 minutes.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you,
    Ranking Member Young Kim, for bringing everybody here.
        And thank you for the panelists. It is a great panel.
        Just to begin with, I am from Texas. I employ 700 people
    down there as we speak. I think we got six apprentices working
    for us this morning. But I would like to start off by
    addressing the recent announcement we have had of another month
    of staggering high inflation.
        And, for over a year, American families and businesses have
    been put under increased financial stress due to increasing
    prices. And Tuesday's consumer price index reading of 8.2
    percent showed that inflation is still painfully high, causing
    more uncertainty for small business owners on main street.
        A recent survey by the NFIB found that 86 percent of the
    business owners reported having to raise their average selling
    prices due to Biden's skyrocketing inflation. And I am in the
    car business, and it is not easy to raise prices on customers.
    These constant rising prices are not sustainable. We must keep
    reckless government spending and begin to get more disciplined
    with our finances, just as every business and family across the
    country is forced to do.
        So, Mr. Ebbing, briefly, can you elaborate on how increased
    prices have altered operations for the businesses you work
    with, and how does this affect their ability to plan for future
    growth opportunities? If you can do that fairly quickly.
        Mr. EBBING. Yeah. Everything you said we do here on a daily
    basis. They have to make ends meet, and they are reluctant to
    increase their pricing because they don't want to lose, you
    know, potential business, but at the same time they have to.
    And, on top of that, you know, the hyper wage inflation that
    they are experiencing, they are being forced to do more with
    less.
        So it is very challenging. You know, obviously the
    workforce piece of it is a huge piece of the puzzle that we
    need to try to help solve because there is a lot of other
    things going on right now, again, including increased prices
    that they are having to deal with every single day. We hear it
    every day.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Yeah. As I said, I have been in the car
    business now for 51 years, an 89-year-old family business. We
    have hundreds of people. And I know firsthand that we are
    always in need of more mechanics, technicians, other critical
    skilled workers.
        I was secretary of state of Texas before I was in Congress,
    and one of the stories I like to tell is that we lost a
    billion-dollar improvement in Texas on the coast, Governor
    Perry and myself. We had locked it in, were going to sign it
    next week, and I get a call in, and they decide to go to
    Minnesota. And, if you are from Texas, Minnesota is not a
    factor. But they are going to Minnesota simply for one thing:
    Minnesota had welders. And I always tell that story because
    this is a good example of what we are talking about.
        So I know about the need of these skilled workers, and our
    country is facing a growing skills gap, as we have talked
    about, as younger generations are not joining the vocational
    workforce at a high enough rate. We have 100,000 kids every
    year dropping out of school in the ninth grade in Texas. That
    is 100,000 every year, and we need to let them know it is okay
    to be a welder, plumber, carpenter, mechanic, and so forth, and
    you all are doing that.
        And so it is not necessary for a high school student to
    always attend a 4-year college. I think we have seen that. But
    a 4-year degree is not for everyone. So we need to ensure
    students know that there are other higher demand opportunities
    that provide them with a good-paying job, successful career.
    And we know the jobs what they can get when they get out,
    right. Everybody thinks lawyer, business guy, architect, or
    whatever, but lots of times--many times there is more out there
    for these paying jobs than is in other areas.
        And that is why I introduced the Student Debt Alternative
    and CTE Awareness Act--check it out--which informs high school
    students about career and technical education opportunities
    before they commit to a traditional 4-year university and take
    out student loans. Of course, they may not have to pay the
    student loans back, but at least they have that in front of
    them. Instead of forcing students into years of debt, this
    ensures that high school seniors know what their viable options
    are.
        So, Ms. Watkins, how can we encourage more students to
    pursue CTE, and how is your center ensuring that high school
    students are made aware of the CTE programs and continue to
    stay involved?
        Ms. WATKINS. That is an excellent question. I think we are
    often what we consider the best-kept secret in our area. In
    terms of recruiting and marketing and supporting students, a
    huge part of that goes back to what parents understand and what
    our typical rhetoric has been, which is college for all, which
    is great if that is the direction you want to go. If you have
    interest and opportunity in other areas, such as welding--for
    example, I have a 16-year-old son who has decided he wants to
    be a welder, and he is going to work in Louisiana. So it is
    giving them an opportunity to see their aspirations and to try
    things out when they are younger. And so I think a big part of
    this goes back to exposing students at younger ages to a
    variety of careers that go beyond what is typically addressed
    in an academic environment.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Go ahead. I am sorry.
        Ms. WATKINS. Oh, that is okay.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Well, I was going to say, in closing, there
    is no reason a kid in the ninth grade should lose hope----
        Ms. WATKINS. No.
        Mr. WILLIAMS.--in this country. And that is why it is
    important what you are doing and what my bill does and others.
    We have to keep--the greatest workforce in the world is right
    here in America.
        Ms. WATKINS. Absolutely.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield my time
    back.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you.
        The gentleman yields back.
        I will now recognize the gentlelady from New York, Ms.
    Tenney, for 5 minutes.
        Ms. TENNEY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member.
        And thank you to the witnesses for this great Committee
    discussion because I am a small business owner that is always
    looking to try to find people to work in our business and to
    work with our community partners. And, you know, we hear a lot
    about this labor shortage. It is the number one thing I hear on
    the campaign trail from employers is how do we get people to
    come to work, how do we get them trained and skilled.
        And we are advertising for the first time extensively
    instead of having a waiting list for employees, which is really
    unusual for our business. We are in a rural area where we could
    provide a lot of benefits that most businesses don't, except
    the government, but we compete against the government for great
    employees.
        But, you know, this is great that we are trying to find
    students younger and get them into things. And, you know, the
    tight labor market obviously is great for students--or great
    for young people and great for people to get--you know, to
    drive up the wages, get better benefits. We know what that is
    like because we are in a rural area, so we have always
    experienced the tight labor market. And it gives the employees
    an advantage to be able to take care of their families.
        One of the issues that arise for us that I am looking at is
    we cannot find candidates really who have the experience, so
    this is really why it is so important. And this is not good for
    workers who are not able to take advantage of these job
    opportunities and what employers are looking for and needing
    the staff. We have always tried to bridge gaps with--a lot of
    our salespeople are very clever. They know how to--you can work
    with the local BOCES and get, you know, an apprentice to come
    in and help. And that is one of the things that I think that we
    need to rebalance, how the government responds to this tension
    and without getting in the way of the employers but providing a
    resource.
        And, you know, we obviously have a lot of immigrants that
    are coming in, which are wonderful in our farm communities and
    especially helping us, but we also have foreign labor that are
    being incentivized to come in and take jobs from others. And
    this sometimes can be a disincentive through some of our small
    businesses who really just want to hire, as my colleague from
    Texas pointed out.
        We have great educational institutions in my region. I just
    want to mention our BOCES again. They are phenomenal with the
    work that they do. Herkimer College, Mohawk Valley Community
    College in my area, the community colleges, and generally the
    system in New York are doing a wonderful job, and they provide
    this hands-on training and extra training and high-tech
    training. Yesterday we talked about right to repair and getting
    people to be able to learn how to fix things again, and that is
    a big issue.
        But right now the answer to this--what I am concerned about
    with this tight labor market is also--one thing I wanted to
    just bring up, and I know it is--I am using up a lot of my time
    that I want to ask a couple of you questions--is that one of my
    greatest experiences as a Member of the New York State Assembly
    was an inner city group came in, young students who said they
    were for keeping the minimum wage the same because if the
    minimum wage went up, there would be less of them who would be
    able to engage in summer programs. So I just want to mention
    there was a lot of interesting aspects of teaching students
    about the economy and economic issues.
        But I first want to just draw my attention to Mr. Ginsburg.
    And you wrote about how many enterprise employees have
    effective training programs but have difficulty in recruiting
    young people. What is the problem with recruiting young people?
    And I have this question burning in my mind: Why aren't they
    coming out to work, and how do we get them out to work and
    understand the value and dignity of good work?
        Mr. GINSBURG. I don't think that it is--well, thank you for
    the question. It is not because they don't want to work; it is
    they don't know what the opportunities are. What is unique
    about youth apprenticeship that starts in high school and does
    career exploration in middle school is they then have an idea
    of what they might be interested in.
        The second part of that though is--and as an employer, I
    tried for many years to make those connections, but until
    CareerWise working as that intermediary, we didn't have the
    connection to the schools to help the students explore what it
    is their interests are, to be exposed to the different career
    options, and what the compensation looks like----
        Ms. TENNEY. So you are saying the schools aren't even
    talking about this?
        Mr. GINSBURG. They are not connected to the businesses
    until now. It is not that they didn't want businesses to share
    that information. Businesses were not showing up. We have
    created an opportunity----
        Ms. TENNEY. So career day and job fairs and all the things
    that we host as Members of Congress?
        Mr. GINSBURG. Very episodic.
        Ms. TENNEY. Yeah.
        Mr. GINSBURG. Not systemic.
        Ms. TENNEY. Okay.
        Mr. GINSBURG. And the systemic component--we have--in our
    tech platform, it enables employers to see the apprentices, see
    what their resume is essentially, have a video of that young
    person explaining their interests and why, and it makes those
    connections.
        Ms. TENNEY. Quickly, because I want to ask you this though,
    what are the--in manufacturing, what are the toughest jobs to
    fill? I only have a few seconds left.
        Mr. GINSBURG. All of the technical skills.
        Ms. TENNEY. All of them.
        Mr. GINSBURG. I will tell you that we have an apprentice
    who designed, engineered, and built and programmed automation
    cells that enabled us to bring product back from China, over $5
    million worth of product back from China. And he was a high
    school student when he did that. He is now earning $70,000. The
    difference was we connected with the schools, in this case
    Cherry Creek School District, and made the opportunity
    available for him. It has changed his life.
        Ms. TENNEY. That is tremendous. Thank you so much. I yield
    my time back. Thank you.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you. The gentlelady yields back.
        I am going to take an opportunity to do one more quick
    round here because I know there is some more questions, and if
    you all had some more, I will loop back with you.
        But I wanted to flesh out--so I will recognize myself for
    another 5 minutes--with Ms. Watkins, because one thing that you
    touched on at the beginning, and you have touched on a couple
    of points, because we have talked a lot about systematic issues
    in the school districts and the education issue, systematic
    issues within the business system, but I really want to drive
    on the students, the apprentices themselves, right. And you
    touched on in your opening testimony the idea of some barriers
    that they face, whether it is transportation, whether it is
    childcare.
        So, in CTE and the shipyards and the areas in Bremerton
    where you do business, like what are some of those barriers
    that the individuals are facing, and what are you seeing as
    effective to breaking down those barriers?
        Ms. WATKINS. Thank you for the question. So I would say,
    first of all, transportation is a huge challenge for
    particularly our location. We are very rural. We have students
    that travel an hour and a half one way each day to participate
    in CTE programs with us because they are not offered in their
    areas. And those students have less access to viable careers in
    their industries locally, so transportation for them to do an
    apprenticeship program or to have a work-based learning
    experience is more challenging. So transportation is a huge
    issue.
        The other thing that happens with a lot of our students is
    that they come from poverty. We have a lot of students that
    have to support their own families, and so that creates a
    barrier when internship opportunities, work-based learning
    opportunities are nonpaid; they have to make a decision between
    finding a job versus finding an opportunity for that career. So
    that is two of the big ones for us.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you for that, and I appreciate it.
        I will now yield to the Ranking Member, Mrs. Kim, for 5
    minutes.
        Ms. YOUNG KIM. Thank you very much. I am really glad that
    we held up the hearing as long as we could so we can have
    Member Houlahan join us because I know you always engage our
    witnesses with great questions. So I am glad you are here.
        And I know on our side we have some Members who want to ask
    questions. But, rather than asking a question, I just, again,
    wanted to reiterate my special thanks for all of you being here
    to share your expertise on how the youth engagement, youth
    apprenticeship, the programs that you are, you know,
    implementing is really working.
        And I am really glad to hear, Ms. Watkins, to hear that
    your 16-year-old son is engaged in welding and becoming a
    certified welder. That will surely prepare him for the job
    market that is out there.
        But the challenges that we talked about is also, even when
    we have hearings like this, we have great, you know, Members of
    the small business community that we wanted to bring and share
    their experience as well, just like you are doing. But the
    challenge is they can't be here because they can't take the
    time off because they are small businesses. How do they
    backfill if they leave their operation?
        So those are the challenges of meeting the labor force, you
    know, the shortages. So I just wanted to echo the difficulties,
    the challenges, the workforce development that we need to focus
    on, training, retaining, the quality labor force; these are the
    challenges. So it is really important.
        And, Chairman, I really want to thank you for your
    leadership for us holding these type of hearings. More and
    more, it is needed. But obviously we want to be able to do more
    roundtable type of discussions so that we can listen to more
    real life expertise, meeting with those challenges by telling
    us what we can do better so we can help build that workforce
    and fill the gap and all that stuff.
        So I just wanted to thank you again and share that we
    understand what you are facing. We appreciate the information
    you are sharing, and we will go to work in making sure that
    youth apprenticeship, for example, as Mr. Ginsburg and all of
    you mentioned, that it is not just a program, but we can help
    to make it a transformational system that works.
        Thank you. I yield back.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you.
        The gentlelady yields back.
        I will now recognize the gentlelady from Pennsylvania, Ms.
    Houlahan, for 5 minutes.
        Ms. HOULAHAN. Thank you, Mr. Chair. And thank you so much
    for the chance to speak. And sorry for being tardy. I am trying
    to straddle three different committees today at the very same
    time slot. But my heart is very much with small businesses. I
    am an entrepreneur myself, and I am grateful for the
    opportunity to sit with you today.
        Thank you again for your testimonies.
        There is definitely going to be a generation of youth that
    will be on the forefront of addressing the emerging challenges
    that we are all facing collectively today. Because these
    challenges will inevitably require innovative, technical, and
    advanced solutions, the benefits of youth apprenticeship and--
    of CTE can't be underestimated especially amid our workforce
    issues that are impacting businesses on account of the
    pandemic.
        So I am hopeful that today's youth will be able to benefit
    from the recent action that has been taken in Congress to
    address some of our nation's most pressing issues, including
    the passage of the bipartisan Infrastructure Investment and
    Jobs Act, the bipartisan CHIPS and Science Act, and the
    Inflation Reduction Act.
        It is really critical that our nation's youth and small
    business owners will be able to access the vital workforce
    development resources that we have provided in light of these
    once-of-a-generation investments and the millions of jobs that
    we hope that they will be able to create.
        My first question is to Ms.--is it Kobes?
        Ms. KOBES. Kobes.
        Ms. HOULAHAN. Kobes, apologize. You mentioned in your
    testimony that recipients of these new federal resources will
    require assistance to be able to learn about apprenticeships
    and connect to appropriate stakeholders. Could you please
    elaborate on what this Committee and what Congress in general
    can be doing to make sure that small businesses can tap into
    the public funding that is available for youth apprenticeship?
        Ms. KOBES. Yes. Thank you for the question. And I think
    that ties into the earlier questions around inflation and how
    our economy is affecting individuals as well. It is certainly
    true that the economy has affected small businesses in a very
    serious way. It is also exacerbating the challenges faced by
    the rising inequality in our country, and individuals who are
    left out of economic opportunity are facing those consequences
    even more severely during inflation. And, you know, the
    investments made through the bills that you mentioned really
    create an opportunity to invest in our workforce.
        And I have seen--my husband even works for a manufacturing
    company in batteries, and they were applying for, you know, a
    new grant, and it includes now, you know, an equity plan around
    job quality, around workforce development. And he came to me
    and he said: Who should we be talking to?
        You know, they are in Colorado as well and expanding into
    other locations. But they don't have the background to know
    these are the workforce development agencies that we can work
    with; these are the schools that could provide us talented
    solutions; you know, these are the intermediaries even that we
    should be tapping into.
        And so what you have now is funding that is going out to
    more businesses, to, you know, state agencies, transportation
    agencies, all of these different opportunities that build in
    workforce as a core strategy to actually succeed through these
    grants. But they are not workforce people, and so you really do
    need a way to get the word out to all of those potential
    grantees so they can navigate the new workforce incentives that
    are built within the grant opportunities.
        Ms. HOULAHAN. Does anybody have anything else to add? I
    have another question I would love to ask as well, but, Mr.
    Ginsburg, you look eager.
        Mr. GINSBURG. What I would say is, in order to scale this,
    how we connect with business, at CareerWise we say we are
    student centered but business driven, that that connection in
    educating businesses on how this impacts their bottom line in a
    positive way, how it fills that early pipeline of talent that
    is essential is part of it, and those intermediaries are
    essential to make it easier for them until it becomes systemic.
        And we need our colleges, our community colleges. Our CTE
    programs are powerfully effective, but it--right now it is a
    fragmented system. It needs to be a holistic system. So driving
    investments to bring those people together and to ensure that
    business voice is at the center because, if it won't, they
    won't do it. And that is a tragedy for them and our young
    people and ultimately our country.
        Ms. HOULAHAN. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, could I ask a second
    question? I just want to make sure I don't run out of time.
        Chairman CROW. Yeah.
        Ms. HOULAHAN. Perfect. Thank you.
        I also would like very much to focus on the importance of
    youth workforce development with regard to STEM and STEAM.
    Very, very excited that my community is actively investing in
    initiatives that would be able to prepare our youth for
    valuable and needed STEM careers with the development of new
    STEM high school academies in places like Reading,
    Pennsylvania, that have been funded by federal COVID aid, as
    well as West Chester University's new sciences and engineering
    center.
        To, Mr. Ebbing, who I believe is on the screen, similar to
    my community in Pennsylvania's Sixth District, you mentioned
    that local schools in your area are establishing new career-
    based curricula. Can you please describe how these developments
    benefit local communities across our country as well as student
    success and career readiness?
        Mr. EBBING. Yes. Thank you very much for the question.
    Yeah, it has been a game changer for us. We have been layering
    career connection curriculum in at the freshman and sophomore
    year already in with the STEAM curriculum so that they not only
    become interested in STEM and STEAM and all that goes with it
    but how the careers, you know, relate to those courses.
        So, to us, it has been a game changer in the sense of just
    truly layering in that information at an early age. So every
    freshman will take the class. A lot of sophomores will take it
    to, again, learn not just about the class work but how it
    relates to the real world. And we bring companies in to educate
    them on what this class work means to them as a company.
        And it just sows the seeds, you know, of awareness and
    connecting the dots that, when the students become juniors and
    seniors, whether or not they want to go into career technical
    education or straight into a pre-apprenticeship program, now
    they are armed with that information of truly understanding
    what this class means to the real world and the careers. So
    layering it in, we believe, is very important as part of that
    education model in their early high school years.
        Ms. HOULAHAN. Thank you. I appreciate all of your time, and
    I yield back.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you.
        The gentlelady yields back.
        I will now recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr.
    Williams, for 5 minutes.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Thank you, Chairman.
        And I just made a few notes here. You know, one thing we--
    and I am sure you are involved with them too. I represent Fort
    Hood, large military base in America. We have got a lot of
    soldiers that are transitioning out, that need some assistance.
    And I hope somehow they are included in your program too
    because a lot of them are 20, 21, 22 years old. They are
    disciplined. They know how to work. And they need a job, and
    they are pretty good. So that is a big, I think, opportunity
    for us to do that.
        And I think also a lot of these kids today don't have the
    background we had from the fact that you go to work and, hey,
    if you make money, that is good. Profits are really good and so
    forth. They don't hear that so much anymore. They almost hear
    the opposite. They hear that $15 minimum wage is a career. It
    is not a career. Okay. They need to think bigger than that.
    Drawing unemployment is not a career. Okay. They need to--
    bringing a payroll check home is pretty good. And I think they
    have to fight with that all the time.
        And then they hear about, well, that you can borrow money,
    and it will be written off; you don't have to pay it back. Then
    they hear back that this--like the student loans, they don't
    have to pay their car notes for various reasons. They have got
    forbearance on their apartments. I mean, it sets a bad tone for
    a mind that wants to work and get after it. We need to be much
    more positive towards these kids and show them how to make a
    living. They don't need all this.
        And, at the end of the day, from a small business owner
    standpoint, we need to cut taxes. We need to quit raising taxes
    and talking about it, cut taxes so I have extra money that I
    can go out--instead of having six apprentices, I can go have 16
    apprentices. So that is kind of the things we need to do.
        And so I would just say real quick, Ms. Watkins, and we
    have talked about this, but I want to hear what you have to say
    about the opportunity, what steps can a business owner like
    mine--I employ over--almost 300 people--what can I do to
    establish connections with CTE programs and recent graduates?
    You know, I told you, we have got a bill; we would tell them:
    Hey, there is opportunity out there.
        But how can I do that?
        Ms. WATKINS. That is a great question. So I think, first of
    all, going back to the Swiss model or the German model, one of
    the key things is that it is like a stool with three prongs. It
    has government support. It has business support. And it has the
    school support. And I think small businesses, in particular,
    helping us reach out to you and you reaching back to us. I
    think there is opportunity as simple as reaching out and
    saying: Hey, I need employees that can do these things.
        We have an automotive program right now, and right across
    the street from our center is the Haselwood Group, and the
    Haselwood Group is an automotive group that is next to us. So
    they actually work with bringing our students in just to see
    what their shops look like now because the parents' shop days
    of what it looked like in an automotive shop is not what it
    looks like today. So getting them involved and into and
    interested in that way also I think is really critical.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. Well, you are right. I mean, I get back to my
    business, and these kids are electricians. They are not
    mechanics, you know, or you used to call them wrenches. And
    these are smart kids.
        Ms. WATKINS. Absolutely.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. And they really, really do well, and it is--
    shops are cleaner. Just a great opportunity for them. And we
    need them bad. We need body people. We them in body shops; we
    need them badly, that can fix these cars and so forth.
        So, anyway, look, we get political here a lot. Most of the
    time we are. I have already been political in my statements
    today. But, at the end of the day, what you all are doing is
    great, and it is going to--my business is a third-generation
    business. Now my kids run it. And they have got to be able to
    have a workforce to continue the business and so forth. And we
    have got to make tax cuts permanent so we make more money
    because what we don't have--what people are saying about
    businesses like mine and yours, that if we make money, we don't
    save it; we spend it, and we invest, and we give opportunities.
        So thank you for being here. I yield--yes, sir, Mr.
    Ginsburg.
        Mr. GINSBURG. Well, something you said resonates with me in
    that the jobs that you create in your shop pay really well.
    But, in this country, if we say there is only one path to
    opportunity and that is a 4-year degree, then there is
    something less than in a job in your shop or in my company. And
    it shouldn't be. There should be equal dignity in any path that
    you choose that leads to a career that puts a roof over your
    head, a car in the garage, and opportunity for your children.
    And business holds the key to that.
        And I just want to emphasize that, when we talk about the
    future, it is not just one pathway to opportunity in this
    country anymore. That ends up with trillions of debt,
    noncompleters in our 4-year system, and business without the
    talent they need.
        Mr. WILLIAMS. I mean, you talk about dignity, I can tell
    you, we had a cold snap in Texas, and those plumbers and those
    welders were called, and nobody asked them, what are you going
    to charge me when you get out here? So they--but you are right.
    A job is a job. A job in America is the greatest job. I yield
    back.
        Chairman CROW. Thank you.
        The gentleman yields back.
        Thank you to our witnesses, again, for joining us today.
    The pandemic inflicted a deep shock on the American labor
    force, and as we continue to work back toward normalcy,
    workforce development programs can help boost our pool of
    qualified workers, provide young people with the education and
    skills they need to launch their careers.
        Although I will say, some people say ``return back to
    normal,'' and we are not ever going to return back to the
    normal as it used to be because things are changing. The
    workforce is evolving. The future is looking different, and it
    should because I think, as you all mentioned, there are greater
    opportunities for our young people that we have to pursue for
    them.
        We have seen the power of youth apprenticeship programs in
    providing that and the ability to upskill workers and to help
    small businesses meet their staffing needs. So I think there is
    consensus that embracing this model and others like it, we can
    make these programs more accessible to young people and small
    businesses alike. So I look forward to working with the
    Committee Members to pursue policies that will help achieve
    this goal.
        Without objection, Members have 5 legislative days to
    submit statements and supporting materials for the record.
        And, if there is no further business to come before the
    Committee, without objection, we are adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 11:21 a.m., the Subcommittee was adjourned.]

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