[House Hearing, 117 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]




 
                       TACKLING TOXIC WORKPLACES:

                      EXAMINING THE NFL'S HANDLING

                       OF WORKPLACE MISCONDUCT AT

                       THE WASHINGTON COMMANDERS

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                              COMMITTEE ON
                          OVERSIGHT AND REFORM
                        HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                             JUNE 22, 2022

                               __________

                           Serial No. 117-88

                               __________

      Printed for the use of the Committee on Oversight and Reform
      
      
 [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]      


                       Available on: govinfo.gov,
                         oversight.house.gov or
                             docs.house.gov
                             
                             
                             
                              ______                       


             U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 
47-927PDF           WASHINGTON : 2022 
                             
                             
                             
                             
                   COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND REFORM

                CAROLYN B. MALONEY, New York, Chairwoman

Eleanor Holmes Norton, District of   James Comer, Kentucky, Ranking 
    Columbia                             Minority Member
Stephen F. Lynch, Massachusetts      Jim Jordan, Ohio
Jim Cooper, Tennessee                Virginia Foxx, North Carolina
Gerald E. Connolly, Virginia         Jody B. Hice, Georgia
Raja Krishnamoorthi, Illinois        Glenn Grothman, Wisconsin
Jamie Raskin, Maryland               Michael Cloud, Texas
Ro Khanna, California                Bob Gibbs, Ohio
Kweisi Mfume, Maryland               Clay Higgins, Louisiana
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, New York   Ralph Norman, South Carolina
Rashida Tlaib, Michigan              Pete Sessions, Texas
Katie Porter, California             Fred Keller, Pennsylvania
Cori Bush, Missouri                  Andy Biggs, Arizona
Shontel M. Brown, Ohio               Andrew Clyde, Georgia
Danny K. Davis, Illinois             Nancy Mace, South Carolina
Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Florida    Scott Franklin, Florida
Peter Welch, Vermont                 Jake LaTurner, Kansas
Henry C. ``Hank'' Johnson, Jr.,      Pat Fallon, Texas
    Georgia                          Yvette Herrell, New Mexico
John P. Sarbanes, Maryland           Byron Donalds, Florida
Jackie Speier, California            Vacancy
Robin L. Kelly, Illinois
Brenda L. Lawrence, Michigan
Mark DeSaulnier, California
Jimmy Gomez, California
Ayanna Pressley, Massachusetts

                      Russ Anello, Staff Director
                     Chioma Chukwu, General Counsel
          Elisa LaNier, Director of Operations and Chief Clerk

                      Contact Number: 202-225-5051

                  Mark Marin, Minority Staff Director
                                 ------                                
                         C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                              ----------                              
                                                                   Page
Hearing held on June 22, 2022....................................     1

                               Witnesses

Roger Goodell, Commissioner, National Football League
    Oral Statement...............................................     7

Daniel Snyder, Co-Owner and Co-Chief Executive Officer, 
  Washington Commanders
     (Invited)...................................................


Opening statements and the prepared statements for the witnesses 
  are available in the U.S. House of Representatives Repository 
  at: docs.house.gov.

                           INDEX OF DOCUMENTS

                              ----------                              

The documents listed below are available at: docs.house.gov.

  * NBC News Poll; submitted by Rep. Foxx.

  * Committee on Oversight and Reform Letter to the President of 
  USA Gymnastics; submitted by Chairwoman Maloney.

  * Questions for the Record: to Mr. Goodell; submitted by Rep. 
  Comer.



                       TACKLING TOXIC WORKPLACES:

                      EXAMINING THE NFL'S HANDLING

                       OF WORKPLACE MISCONDUCT AT

                       THE WASHINGTON COMMANDERS

                              ----------                              


                        Wednesday, June 22, 2022

                  House of Representatives,
                 Committee on Oversight and Reform,
                                                   Washington, D.C.
    The committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:10 a.m., in 
room 2154, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Carolyn B. 
Maloney [chairwoman of the committee] presiding.
    Present: Representatives Maloney, Norton, Connolly, 
Krishnamoorthi, Raskin, Khanna, Mfume, Tlaib, Brown, Wasserman 
Schultz, Welch, Johnson, Speier, Kelly, DeSaulnier, Comer, 
Jordan, Foxx, Grothman, Gibbs, Higgins, Norman, Sessions, 
Keller, Fallon, and Donalds.
    Also present: Representative Owens.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The Committee will come to order.
    Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare a 
recess of the Committee at any time.
    I now recognize myself for an opening statement.
    Good morning and thank all of you for being here.
    Our hearing today is about protecting women--and all 
workers--from sexual harassment, intimidation, and bullying in 
the workplace.
    We will examine one notoriously toxic workplace--the 
Washington Commanders football team--and the response from the 
NFL.
    During football season, millions of Americans tune in to 
watch their favorite teams. The NFL and its teams collect tens 
of billions in revenues thanks in part to Federal benefits. The 
NFL and its teams have one of the biggest platforms in America. 
So what happens in the NFL has consequences for the rest of our 
country.
    The Committee launched an investigation last October after 
the NFL refused to release the findings of an internal 
investigation into the widespread sexual misconduct at the 
Washington Commanders. The Committee requested these findings, 
but the NFL and the Commanders have refused to produce them, 
while also withholding more than 40,000 documents collected in 
their internal review.
    This lack of transparency suggests that, rather than 
protecting women, the NFL is hoping to sweep this controversy 
under the rug, just as powerful men like Dan Snyder have done 
for decades.
    Today we will hear from Roger Goodell, commissioner of the 
NFL. I am glad he is participating, and I hope we will finally 
get more transparency about what the NFL found and why Mr. 
Goodell has worked so hard to keep it secret.
    We also invited Daniel Snyder to testify today. But rather 
than show up and take responsibility for his actions, he chose 
to skip town. Apparently, Mr. Snyder is in France where he has 
docked his luxury yacht near a resort town. That should tell 
you just how much respect he has for women in the workplace.
    Mr. Snyder's absence is all the more telling given that the 
Committee released new evidence today that Mr. Snyder himself, 
fostered the Commanders' toxic workplace. According to top 
executives, he fired women--but not men--who engaged in 
relationships with other employees, while defending male 
executives accused of sexual harassment. And he kept employees 
from speaking out through a culture of fear.
    As one longtime employee described Mr. Snyder's tactics, 
quote, ``If you don't obey, intimidate. If you still don't 
obey, terminate.'' Finally, the employee added, quote, ``If 
that didn't work, buy them off,'' end quote.
    The Committee has also uncovered evidence that Mr. Snyder 
conducted a shadow investigation to target his accusers, pin 
the blame on others, and influence the NFL's own internal 
review. He filed phony lawsuits to collect private phone 
records, emails, and text messages.
    The Committee has a copy of a dossier created by Mr. Snyder 
using the information he collected. And this dossier is 
absolutely astonishing and extremely disturbing. It shows the 
lengths Mr. Snyder went to, to harass, intimidate, and silence 
his accusers, including journalists, attorneys, and former 
employees, anyone involved. It starts here just naming 
journalists that he wants to investigate and investigated. He 
sent private investigators to former cheerleaders' homes, and 
he offered hush money to buy their silence.
    The NFL was aware of his actions but failed to stop him. We 
obtained a secret legal agreement between the NFL and the 
Commanders that enabled Mr. Snyder to prevent the disclosure of 
documents and information--including to this Committee.
    Some have argued that protecting women isn't worthy of this 
Committee's time. I strongly disagree.
    And I'm not alone. In April, six attorneys general 
condemned the NFL for its ongoing failure to address sexual 
harassment and gender discrimination across the league. The NFL 
itself has launched new investigations based on evidence 
brought to light by the Committee.
    For more than two decades, Dan Snyder refused to protect 
the women who worked for him from the toxic culture he created. 
The NFL has also failed to protect these women. Now I believe 
it is up to Congress to protect them and millions more like 
them. We have introduced two bills, along with Committee 
members, to do exactly that.
    Our first bill, the Accountability for Workplace Misconduct 
Act, will require employers to conduct thorough investigations 
and share the outcome with victims, and it will prohibit 
employers from using nondisclosure agreements to conceal 
workplace misconduct, one of Dan Snyder's favorite tactics.
    Our second bill is the Professional Images Protection Act. 
Our investigation confirmed that the Commanders secretly 
created lewd videos of cheerleaders for the private enjoyment 
of Dan Snyder. That is despicable, and our bill will create 
notice and consent requirements for employers who use their 
employees' professional images.
    Let me also assure my colleagues that we can protect 
workers while also making progress on other important issues. 
Just this month our Committee held a crucial hearing on gun 
violence and advanced legislation to protect LGBTQI rights. And 
next week we will be hearing a bipartisan hearing with 
President Biden's drug czar on the opioid crisis.
    But today our focus is on protecting women in the 
workplace, and I believe that issue merits our full attention.
    In February, the Committee held a roundtable where we heard 
directly from several courageous former team employees.
    Before I yield, I'd like to remind everyone what they said 
about the harassment they endured and the need for 
accountability and they asked Congress to act. We will now play 
a video.
    [Video shown.]
    Chairwoman Maloney. I now yield to my good friend, the 
ranking member, Mr. Comer, for his opening statement.
    Mr. Comer. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    A toxic work environment is one in which staff fear meeting 
or even talking to leadership, where staff is humiliated or, 
worse, demoted, where employees are retaliated against for 
raising questions about possible ethical breaches.
    Now, where did this take place? Steps away from the Oval 
Office at the Office of Science and Technology Policy within 
the Executive Office of the President.
    When? It started shortly after President Biden's 
inauguration in 2021. The very day he was inaugurated, the 
President said, and I quote, ``I'm not joking when I say this. 
If you ever work with me and I hear you treated another 
colleague with disrespect, talked down to someone, I will fire 
you on the spot, no ifs, ands, or buts.'' Joe Biden said that.
    It did not take long for those words to ring hollow. The 
White House Counsel's Office had well-documented allegations 
for a year, but it refused to hold bad actors accountable. For 
all we know, the problems in the Office of Science and 
Technology Policy may still be happening.
    Have we had a single hearing about the hostile work 
environment at President Biden's top science office? No.
    Have Democrats even sent a single oversight letter about 
it? No.
    A core responsibility is of this Committee to conduct 
oversight of the executive branch. But this entire Congress, 
Democrats have turned a blind eye to the Biden administration. 
Instead, the Oversight Committee's investigating a single 
private organization for workplace misconduct that took place 
years ago.
    Let me be clear. No one should be subjected to a hostile 
work environment, and bad actors must be held accountable. The 
workplace misconduct that is the topic of today's hearing has 
already been subject to investigations, fines, settlements, and 
very intense media scrutiny. New leadership has been installed 
and improved workplace policies implemented without 
congressional involvement.
    During the Democrats' so-called investigation, this 
Committee has held a roundtable, two transcribed interviews, 
two depositions, and now this hearing. Democrats, whose top 
economic concern is that the NFL is not collecting enough 
money, even urged the Federal Trade Commission to open an 
investigation based solely on the testimony of a former 
employee with an axe to grind.
    Democrats' playbook is to focus ton past and ignore the 
present and future, all these taxpayer dollars and staff hours 
to reinvestigate what has already been investigated. No new 
punishments have been levied against the Commanders due to this 
investigation because they have already faced consequences for 
their hostile workplace. No new relief has been granted to any 
of the aggrieved parties because Congress has no authority to 
provide relief in any of these instances. No additional 
workplace improvements have been made due to this investigation 
because, unlike at the Office of Science and Technology Policy, 
the workplace overhaul has already begun.
    I would ask why Congress must tackle the NFL football 
team's workplace and not a White House office or our own 
Members. I think we know the answer. Democrats are more 
committed to politics than our Committee's mission.
    Our Committee's mission is government efficiency and 
effectiveness. Our Committee's mission is to protect taxpayer 
dollars from government fraud, waste, and mismanagement. Our 
Committee's mission is to hold government more accountable.
    Instead of conducting oversight of the Federal Government, 
Democrats investigate the private sector. While our Nation 
struggles under the weight of growing inflation and rising gas 
prices, Democrats are demanding oil and gas companies decrease 
production. They did it right here in this Committee with the 
oil CEOs down there.
    Ro Khanna was the first one to ask each energy CEO: Will 
you pledge to cut production? And now we know where the 
President's headed in Saudi Arabia right now. The chairwoman 
even subpoenaed the oil CEOs after they produced thousands of 
documents.
    While Americans are suffering from the effects of Biden's 
border crisis, including fentanyl streaming across the border 
and killing our teens, Democrats have examined paychecks for 
soccer stars and held numerous hearings to demonize the oil and 
gas industry and push their radical Green New Deal climate 
agenda.
    While mothers are struggling to find infant formula on 
store shelves, Democrats held a hearing on pet flea and tick 
collars.
    It's no surprise that a nonpartisan organization gave the 
Democrats an ``F'' in oversight. This Committee is failing the 
American people.
    I urge the chairwoman to get back to the core mission of 
the Oversight Committee and do what the American people elected 
us to do--conduct oversight of the Federal Government and the 
Biden administration, which is on a path to destroy America.
    Let's hold hearings and conduct oversight on the crises 
affecting Americans today: 40-year high inflation, skyrocketing 
gas prices, out-of-stock baby formula, a raging border crisis, 
surging fentanyl overdoses, and our tanking stock market.
    The American people expect us to be their voice in 
Washington. It's past time we start doing what we were sent 
here to do.
    And with that, Madam Chair, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentleman from Illinois, Mr. 
Krishnamoorthi, for an opening statement.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    I'd like to address why we're here today. We're here 
because sexual harassment remains a big problem in the 
workplace. Even as we tackle other challenges in our country, 
we must end sexual harassment.
    Each year millions of fans, including myself, enjoy the 
NFL. NFL teams, coaches, and players influence public opinion 
on sensitive topics, too. For boys and young men, that means 
taking cues as to how they should treat women; and for girls 
and young women, cues as to how they should be treated.
    That reality is why it's so important that the NFL hold 
itself to a, quote, ``higher standard,'' as Commissioner 
Goodell has said, and why the NFL must ensure that those who 
fail to meet that standard are held accountable.
    For the Washington Commanders, that reckoning unfortunately 
has not come. By its own admission, the NFL says that, quote, 
``The workplace culture at the Commanders was not only 
unprofessional, but toxic for far too long.'' Numerous women 
have accused team officials, including the current owner, of 
sexual misconduct.
    Several years ago, another House Oversight Committee chair 
opened an inquiry into sexual harassment charges, that time 
involving USA Gymnastics, explaining that USA Gymnastics set 
the rules and policies that govern the sport of gymnastics and 
has a significant responsibility to its sport and athletes. 
That person was Republican Chair Trey Gowdy. We agree.
    And, similarly, the NFL sets the rules and policies 
affecting pro football, and it, too, has a serious 
responsibility to uphold this sport. As one of America's most 
visible workplaces, the NFL also sets the tone for how 
employers handle sexual harassment.
    Our colleagues on the other side have raised a number of 
issues worthy of this Committee's attention, from gas prices to 
the opioid crisis. We must continue to address those.
    But at the same time, we must tackle sexual harassment, not 
just for the sake of the Commanders' former employees, but also 
for our constituents. Today we must send a clear message that 
the conduct that took place in the Commanders' organization is 
never acceptable, not in the NFL and not anywhere.
    Thank you. I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman yields back.
    I now recognize the gentlelady from North Carolina, 
Representative Foxx, for an opening statement.
    Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Madam Chairman.
    Madam Chairman, I'd like to echo the ranking member's 
comments today. This administration is doing all it can to 
annihilate America. It's like Nero fiddling while the country 
burns. It's been widely reported that approximately 72 percent 
of Americans think the United States is on the wrong track.
    Chairwoman, with unanimous consent, I'd like to submit this 
NBC News poll for the record.
    Chairwoman Maloney. So ordered.
    Ms. Foxx. Thank you.
    Are we looking into what caused the 40-year high inflation 
rate? No.
    Are we examining how the FDA and Biden administration 
failed to address the baby formula shortage? No.
    Are we examining how and why teens are purchasing illicit 
drugs on social media, leading to a record number of overdoses? 
No.
    What about the crisis at the southern border? Are we doing 
anything to address the massive humanitarian and national 
security catastrophe? No.
    Instead, this is another day when this Committee failed to 
do what the American people have elected us to do. Last week we 
had a hearing on pet collars, today a hearing over a single NFL 
team about workplace conduct that occurred years ago.
    As the ranking member mentioned in his opening remarks, no 
one--no one--should be subjected to a hostile work environment. 
Bad actors must be held accountable.
    This hearing is just another example of Democrats failing 
to conduct meaningful oversight of the Biden administration and 
the ongoing catastrophes fueled by President Biden's 
incompetent policies.
    The NFL investigated this conduct, and ultimately the team 
punished the bad actors. The NFL is currently investigating 
additional claims made.
    As we sit here today, many American families are wondering 
how they'll find formula for their babies or formula-dependent 
children. Families are wondering how they're going to pay for 
gas to get to their jobs or pay for groceries. Families are 
struggling to make ends meet. And the Biden administration 
continues to stand on the sidelines, sticking to their message 
that a recession is not inevitable. Families are feeling the 
squeeze now and there's no end in sight.
    Children are suffering from extreme learning loss because 
Democrats bowed to the teachers' unions and kept schools closed 
for 18 months in some deep blue areas of this country.
    The issues of the Washington Commanders and the NFL are the 
last thing on Americans' minds. What is this Committee doing to 
help families working to fix their wounded children and put 
food on the table? Nothing.
    We must reevaluate our priorities as members of the 
Oversight Committee and refocus our energies on overseeing the 
Biden administration and the Federal Government to ensure the 
American people are not left behind.
    Thank you. I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlelady yields back.
    Now we will introduce our witness.
    We will hear from Roger Goodell, the commissioner of the 
National Football League. The witness will be unmuted so we can 
swear him in.
    Please raise your right hand.
    Do you swear to affirm that the testimony you're about to 
give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, 
so help you God?
    Mr. Goodell. I do.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Let the record show that the witness 
answered in the affirmative.
    Thank you. Without objection, your written statements will 
be made part of the record.
    With that, Mr. Goodell, you are now recognized for your 
testimony.

  STATEMENT OF ROGER GOODELL, COMMISSIONER, NATIONAL FOOTBALL 
                             LEAGUE

    Mr. Goodell. Thank you. Good morning, Chairwoman Maloney, 
Ranking Member Comer, and members of the Committee.
    I am Roger Goodell, commissioner of the National Football 
League, and I'm here today to discuss the NFL's efforts to 
promote safe and respectful workplaces, including at the 
Washington Commanders.
    The Commanders are one of 32 NFL clubs, each of which is 
managed by its ownership and executives and have their own 
workplaces and policies.
    Two years ago, the Commanders asked me to recommend 
independent counsel to address workplace issues and recommend 
changes to improve the workplace culture. We identified several 
candidates and the club suggested Beth Wilkinson, a 
distinguished former Federal prosecutor.
    Approximately six weeks later, the club asked my office to 
assume oversight of the Wilkinson firm's work. The Wilkinson 
firm conducted a comprehensive review of the workplace at the 
club, interviewing more than 150 witnesses.
    As a result, we gained a clear understanding of what the 
workplace had been at the Commanders, how it had begun to 
change, and what further steps were needed to support our 
ultimate goal of transforming that workplace to one that is 
safe and productive for all of its employees.
    Let me start by expressing my gratitude to the men and 
women who shared their experiences during the investigation and 
to Beth Wilkinson and her team who did their work with the 
highest degree of integrity and professionalism. It required 
substantial courage for many to relive the painful experience 
and tell their individual stories. No one--no one--should 
experience workplaces like the one they described, especially 
not in the National Football League.
    I can say to every victim unequivocally that their 
willingness to come forward has contributed to a substantially 
improved workplace.
    It is clear to me that the workplace in Washington was 
unprofessional and unacceptable in numerous respects: bullying, 
widespread disrespect toward colleagues, use of demeaning 
language, public embarrassment, and harassment. Moreover, for a 
prolonged period of time, the Commanders had a woefully 
deficient H.R. function, particularly with respect to reporting 
practices and recordkeeping.
    As a result, we imposed unprecedented discipline on the 
club: monetary penalties of well over $10 million and 
requirements that the club implement a series of 
recommendations and allow an outside firm to conduct regular 
reviews of their workplace.
    In addition, for the past year, Daniel Snyder has not 
attended league or committee meetings and to the best of my 
knowledge has not been involved in day-to-day operations at the 
Commanders. The cheerleader program has been entirely revamped 
and is now a co-ed dance team under new leadership.
    And the most recent independent workplace report, which we 
have shared with the Committee, confirms that an entirely new, 
highly skilled, and diverse management team is in place, and 
that there has been, quote, ``substantial transformation of the 
team's culture, leadership, and human resources practices,'' 
end quote.
    To be clear, the workplace at the Commanders today bears no 
resemblance to the workplace that has been described to this 
Committee. We did not receive a written report of Ms. 
Wilkinson's findings for compelling reasons that continue to 
this day.
    A critical element of any workplace review is broad 
participation by both current and former employees. Encouraging 
employees to come forward and share their experiences, which 
were frequently painful and emotional, was essential to 
identifying both the organization's failures and how to fix 
them. To encourage this participation, Ms. Wilkinson promised 
confidentiality to any current or former employee.
    For this reason, shortly after we assumed oversight of Ms. 
Wilkinson's work, we determined that a comprehensive oral 
briefing was best to allow us to receive the information 
necessary, both to evaluate the workplace as it was and to 
ensure that the team put in place the policies and processes to 
reform that workplace, all while preserving the confidentiality 
of those who participated in the investigation.
    Oral reports are often used by the NFL and other 
organizations in conducting internal investigations and for 
other issues. If appropriate, we will make public a summary of 
the key findings as we did here. We have been open and direct 
about the fact that the workplace culture at the Commanders was 
not only unprofessional, but toxic for far too long.
    I'm aware that some victims, including those who appeared 
before this Committee, each of whom was invited to participate 
in Beth Wilkinson's investigation, have chosen to share their 
experiences publicly, and I fully respect that choice. Many 
others made a different choice, and it is my responsibility to 
honor the commitment to protect their confidentiality.
    I am confident that should there be another investigation 
at the NFL or our clubs where similar discretion is desired, 
future witnesses will feel comfortable sharing their 
experiences, knowing that we do not go back on our word.
    When the Committee has asked questions or requested 
documents which could violate witness privacy, we have asserted 
privilege. We will continue to do so to safeguard our 
commitment.
    Earlier this year, the Committee heard testimony from 
several former employees that included new and direct 
allegations against Mr. Snyder. We promptly engaged former U.S. 
Attorney Mary Jo White to investigate those allegations. 
Because those new allegations were brought to the Committee in 
a public setting, we will share the results of that 
investigation when it is completed and will take additional 
disciplinary action if warranted.
    Since the Committee opened its inquiry last October, we 
have fully cooperated, producing more than 460,000 pages of 
documents, responding to many written questions, engaging in 
numerous discussions with Committee staff, and I am appearing 
voluntarily today.
    We have not allowed the Commanders or its ownership or 
counsel to direct or make decisions regarding the work that was 
done by the Wilkinson firm, the work currently underway by Mary 
Jo White, or this Committee's inquiry.
    Finally, I want to address the Committee's review of 
nondisclosure agreements. Our policies do not allow a club to 
use an NDA to bar someone from participating in a league 
investigation, and nobody who wished to speak to the Wilkinson 
firm was prevented from doing so by an NDA.
    We also believe that people who come forward and want to 
maintain their privacy should be allowed to do so. The 
assurance that it was safe to participate, and that people 
could rely on the promise to protect their privacy allowed us 
to do a thorough review and make the necessary changes in the 
workplace.
    I have been and remain committed to ensuring that all 
employees of the NFL and the 32 clubs work in a professional 
and supportive environment that is free from discrimination, 
harassment, or other forms of illegal or unprofessional 
conduct.
    Thank you for inviting me today, and I will do my best to 
answer your questions.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Thank you for your testimony and for 
coming today.
    I now recognize myself for five minutes.
    Mr. Donalds. Madam Chair, I have a parliamentary inquiry.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman is recognized.
    Mr. Donalds. Madam Chair, the U.S. Supreme Court case U.S. 
v. Watkins makes clear that Congress' investigative power must 
be related to and in the furtherance of a legitimate task of 
Congress.
    Especially in light of the testimony by Mr. Goodell, how 
does continuing this hearing actually relate to a legitimate 
task of Congress in the face of record high inflation, record 
high gas prices, a completely unsecured border, a fentanyl 
crisis that is killing more people between the ages of 18 and 
45 than any other cause in the United States, a baby formula 
crisis, a tampon crisis?
    Madam Chair, the commissioner has just detailed in his own 
testimony that the Washington Commanders, Redskins, whatever 
you choose to call them, have been held accountable. They've 
made necessary reforms to the organization. You got a chair 
here for Mr. Snyder who told the Committee he was not going to 
be here.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman will suspend.
    Mr. Donalds. But, Madam Chair, what is the purpose of 
this----
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman will suspend.
    Mr. Donalds. What is the purpose of this hearing?
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman will suspend. This is not 
about a stated parliamentary inquiry.
    Mr. Donalds. That is the parliamentary inquiry, Madam 
Chair.
    Chairwoman Maloney. And we have----
    Mr. Donalds. What is the purpose of this hearing?
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman will suspend.
    Mr. Donalds. You can bang the gavel all you want, but I 
don't really care.
    What is the purpose of continuing this, Madam Chair? That 
is the parliamentary inquiry.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman will suspend.
    Mr. Donalds. And how does Congress' business actually be 
continued----
    Chairwoman Maloney. And we have put forward two important 
pieces of legislation that the gentleman can cosponsor.
    Mr. Donalds. How does Congress' business actually be 
continued by continuing this hearing?
    Chairwoman Maloney. OK. All right. I now recognize myself 
for five minutes for questions.
    The NFL's decision not to release the findings of an 
investigation into the toxic workplace culture at the 
Washington Commanders denied victims and the American people of 
a full accounting of what transpired at the team for the past 
20 years.
    Today the committee released new evidence documenting the 
toxic workplace at the Commanders, details that the NFL had not 
previously made public. We found that Dan Snyder refused to 
discipline coaching staff accused of sexual harassment. 
Instead, according to one executive, he tried to, quote, ``make 
the problem go away,'' end quote.
    We found that Mr. Snyder approved the firing of a 
cheerleader for having a relationship with a male team member 
but took no action against the male employee.
    And we found that Mr. Snyder orchestrated a shadow 
investigation, sending private investigators to the homes of 
former employees, terrifying them, offering hush money, and 
compiling a dossier on his accusers.
    Commissioner Goodell, do you think this is acceptable 
behavior for the owner of an NFL team? Mr. Goodell?
    Mr. Goodell. Chairwoman Maloney, that is exactly why we 
took this issue so seriously. It's exactly why we engaged an 
independent investigation with Beth Wilkinson and her firm. She 
had full access to be able to engage with anyone who chose to 
come forward.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Reclaiming my time, I have very limited 
time. And thank you for appearing and for your testimony.
    We don't know how much more information is still out there 
because the NFL has refused to make the findings of the 
Wilkinson investigation public.
    Commissioner Goodell, yes or no, will you commit today to 
providing this committee the full findings of the NFL's 
internal investigation while protecting the identities of the 
confidential witnesses?
    Mr. Goodell. We gave a summary report, Madam Chairwoman. 
The report was broad in its nature but specific to the fact 
that the culture at the Washington football team for too long 
was toxic and incorrect. We made a commitment to protect their 
identities. We are going to continue to do that and make sure 
that we protect that for----
    Chairwoman Maloney. Commissioner, reclaiming----
    Mr. Goodell [continuing]. Not only this investigation but 
also----
    Chairwoman Maloney. Commissioner, respectfully, Mr. 
Commissioner, reclaiming my time, because we have limited time.
    You have claimed you're withholding this information 
because you're protecting the privacy of witnesses. But many 
victims, even in this room, and witnesses have publicly stated 
that they want--they want--this information to be released. And 
the NFL has made other investigations public--and I thank you 
for that--including the 2014 investigation into the workplace 
misconduct at the Miami Dolphins.
    Respectfully, Mr. Commissioner, for full accountability, we 
must have transparency.
    Mr. Snyder, of course, has refused to testify today. We 
thank you for making the Dolphins report public. We'd like to 
have the Wilkinson report made public. And I'm asking you, what 
specific steps will the NFL take to hold Mr. Snyder accountable 
for refusing to testify before Congress?
    Mr. Goodell. Madam Chairwoman, I do not have responsibility 
for whether he appears before Congress. That is not my choice. 
That is his choice.
    Chairwoman Maloney. OK. Let me stop you right here.
    Mr. Snyder has not been held accountable. His refusal to 
testify sends a clear message that he is more concerned about 
protecting himself than coming clean with the American people.
    If the NFL is unwilling or unable to hold Mr. Snyder 
accountable, then I am prepared to do so. That is why I am 
announcing now my intent to issue a subpoena for the testimony 
of Mr. Snyder for a deposition next week. The Committee will 
not be deterred in its investigation to uncover the truth of 
workplace misconduct at the Washington Commanders.
    Finally, I'd like to talk about how we're going to fix this 
problem, not just expose it but fix it. Last week, along with 
many of my colleagues, we introduced two bills to ensure that 
employers like Dan Snyder cannot abuse nondisclosure agreements 
to silence employees and cannot film their employees and use 
it, use the films without their consent.
    Commissioner, do you support the intent of these 
legislative reforms?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, Madam Chairman, we've had an opportunity 
to be able to see your outline of this legislation. And both 
these legislation and concept, we certainly support it, and be 
happy to work with your staff.
    While I have the microphone, I'd also like to say, 
respectfully, that Dan Snyder has been held accountable. As I 
mentioned in the opening, he faced unprecedented discipline, 
including financial fines, being removed and away from the team 
at his request for a period of time, up to the year now 
already.
    And, second and more importantly, transformation of that 
organization that has gone on in the last year, which is really 
important to the employees that are there now. And I hope, 
because of the individuals that came forward in the context of 
this investigation, they helped us make those changes.
    And we accepted every one of the workplace recommendations 
by Beth Wilkinson. And we think that it's had a dramatic 
impact, as you've seen from the independent audit that was done 
just before your hearing back in February that indicated a 
substantial transformation of the organization, which was our 
ultimate objective.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Thank you very much for your testimony.
    I want to thank you for your support of the legislation----
    Mr. Norman. Madam Chairman?
    Chairwoman Maloney.--which we intend to pass and protect 
employees not only at the Commanders, but across this Nation.
    I yield back----
    Mr. Norman. Madam Chairman?
    Chairwoman Maloney.--and now recognize Ms. Foxx----
    Mr. Norman. Madam Chairman?
    Chairwoman Maloney.--for five minutes.
    Mr.----
    Mr. Norman. Madam Chairman, I have got a parliamentary 
inquiry. Following up on what Mr. Donalds raised, by what 
authority is this Committee investigating a private business, a 
private entity, to hold this hearing? What authority do we 
have? Can you cite me that?
    Chairwoman Maloney. We have authority to investigate 
anything and everything, and we are putting forward 
legislation.
    Mr. Norman. Anything----
    Chairwoman Maloney. Ms. Foxx, you are now recognized.
    Mr. Norman. Anything and everything.
    Mr. Comer. We'll remember that Madam Chair, in January.
    Mr. Norman. That's a total embarrassment.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Ms. Foxx, you are now recognized for 
five minutes.
    Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Madam Chair. Would you allow--thank 
you, Madam Chair.
    Mr. Goodell, I am disappointed that this Committee's here 
today squandering yet another opportunity to address the many 
issues facing our country. We have a chance to do something for 
the American people. But just like the Biden administration, 
this Committee's sitting on its hands.
    Today's hearing is merely a distraction from skyrocketing 
inflation, unaffordable groceries, record gas and energy 
prices, supply chain issues, and our open southern border.
    As we have heard in your testimony, the NFL has submitted 
more than 460,000 pages of documents, responded to many 
requests, and engaged in numerous discussions with Committee 
staff. It seems to me an awful lot of Committee--or, rather, 
taxpayer--resources were expended to investigate the Commanders 
and the NFL, which are both private organizations that do not 
employ government officials and are not in the purview of this 
Committee.
    Do you believe that this Committee's investigation is a 
good use of taxpayer funds?
    Mr. Goodell. Is that a question for me?
    Ms. Foxx. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Goodell. Congresswoman, that is not a determination 
that I should be making.
    Listen, I understand the importance of your 
responsibilities. I can't be the one who would tell you what 
you need to be focused on.
    But we believe and we understand our responsibility in the 
NFL in today's society. We understand that. We do hold 
ourselves accountable. We hold ourselves to a high standard.
    We believe that we've addressed this issue responsibly, 
fairly, by protecting not only the people who came forward to 
help us address this, but also making sure that we saw that 
transformation in the Washington Commanders organization, which 
is really a significant transformation.
    Ms. Foxx. Well, to followup on what my colleagues are 
saying, this Committee has no jurisdiction over private 
entities. Our jurisdiction is on government entities.
    So I want to reiterate, I think, what you said. You have no 
doubts about the independence of the Wilkinson investigation or 
its findings, correct?
    Mr. Goodell. I do not.
    Ms. Foxx. Do you believe that somehow a congressional 
investigation would reach a different or, quote, ``better'' 
conclusion than the independent investigations conducted on 
behalf of the NFL?
    Mr. Goodell. I have tremendous regard for Beth Wilkinson 
and her team. They were thorough. They were comprehensive. 
We've made sure that NDAs did not block access to any of the 
people. It was their choice of which to participate. But we had 
over 150 people who came forward.
    We believe we understand what the environment was at the 
Washington Commanders for far too long, and it was 
unacceptable, unprofessional, and we dealt with that. And I 
think we've now seen a dramatic turnaround in a very short 
period of time. I think that will be important for all of us.
    Ms. Foxx. Well, I think the allegations against the 
Commanders were disturbing and appreciate you've taken them 
seriously in your role as commissioner.
    You've also worked hard to promote inclusivity, 
specifically around women, in the game of football, from fans 
to coaches to referees to executives.
    Can you tell me more about why that's important and what 
the NFL is doing in this space, and particularly talk about the 
importance of having women in day-to-day leadership roles, such 
as Tanya Snyder's?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, Congresswoman, we think diversity is an 
important element to our success. It's fundamental to what we 
do. We believe that having the best people, diverse people, 
including women and people of color, people that can contribute 
to the NFL to make us better, that's a foundational issue for 
us. And so we have many programs to try to create that.
    It's as ongoing effort. It will always be. We will never 
reach the goal line, as we say in football. But we do believe 
that we have made significant progress, but we're committed to 
making more progress. And I think the work that's being done 
here has made the NFL better. But I also think hopefully it's 
been a shining light for others to see that we have taken on 
our issues and made really significant improvement that people 
can see.
    Ms. Foxx. I thank you for being here today and for 
testifying voluntarily.
    I yield back, Madam Chair.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlelady yields back.
    And before I recognize the gentlewoman from the District of 
Columbia, Ms. Norton, I would like to clarify what I said 
before.
    This Committee has the authority to investigate conduct 
within Congress' legislative jurisdiction, and that includes 
protecting women in the workplace. And this Committee and my 
colleagues and I have already introduced two bills to address 
the problems that we saw in our investigation, and I'll be glad 
to share them with anyone on the Committee.
    Mr. Jordan. Madam Chair, just a question.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Do you have a point of order?
    Mr. Jordan. No, just a clarification.
    Chairwoman Maloney. No. OK. Clarification.
    Mr. Jordan. So when you said you had the authority to 
investigate anything and everything, you didn't really mean 
that?
    Chairwoman Maloney. Well, I just clarified what I said. 
Reclaiming my time.
    Mr. Jordan. No, I mean, it's a simple question.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Reclaiming my time.
    Mr. Jordan. You didn't mean it when you said----
    Chairwoman Maloney. Reclaiming my time.
    Mr. Jordan [continuing]. Anything and everything?
    Chairwoman Maloney. Reclaiming my time.
    Some of my colleagues across the aisle have suggested that 
our investigation into workplace misconduct at the NFL is a 
waste of time. I strongly disagree. The issue of sexual 
harassment is one of the most prominent--in one of the 
prominent and respected workplaces in this country and a cover-
up on behalf of a powerful owner should matter to all of us. It 
is even more surprising, given that this Committee has 
investigated sexual harassment and assault in sports, including 
when Republicans were in the majority.
    In 2018, under the leadership of then Republican Chairman 
Trey Gowdy, the committee launched a bipartisan investigation 
into USA Gymnastics' handling of allegations against Larry 
Nassar.
    In a letter to the President of USA Gymnastics signed by 
Chairman Gowdy, then Ranking Member Ms. Foxx--Member Cummings--
also Ms. Foxx and myself, the Committee wrote, and I quote: 
``Sexual assault should not be tolerated. But when it does 
occur, it is imperative that swift and immediate action be 
taken to stop the abuse, prevent it from occurring, and address 
its effects,'' end quote.
    I would like to enter the letter into the record.
    Without objection, so ordered.
    Chairwoman Maloney. And we are here today to hold another 
sports governing body accountable, because the NFL has failed 
the thousands of employees that work for teams across the 
country. And that failure has endangered women across the NFL 
and sent a powerful message to every workplace that 
accountability is optional.
    My time has expired. The gentlelady is recognized, Ms. 
Norton. And I place the letter in the record.
    Ms. Norton. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    Mr. Goodell, in 2014 the NFL revised its personnel conduct 
policy. So I want to discuss a passage of that.
    It said, ``Ownership and club or league management have 
traditionally been held to a higher standard and will be 
subject to more significant discipline when violations of the 
personal conduct policy occur.''
    Mr. Goodell, can you briefly explain why the league holds 
owners to a higher standard of conduct?
    Mr. Goodell. Because they're ultimately accountable for 
what happens in their organization. They set the standard. And 
all of us in the NFL hold ourselves accountable to that.
    Ms. Norton. Well said, sir. I completely agree with that.
    But Dan Snyder appears--with respect to Dan Snyder, it 
appears that did not happen. Before taking over the 
investigation, you admitted the NFL was monitoring the internal 
investigation. But as the committee investigation, our 
Committee's investigation confirmed, in July 2020 allegations 
of potential misconduct by Mr. Snyder were known by the 
investigators in the matter you were monitoring.
    Mr. Goodell, did the NFL know about the 2009 allegations of 
sexual misconduct against Mr. Snyder before it took over the 
investigation, yes or no?
    Mr. Goodell. We did know about the 2009 allegations by July 
2001--2000, excuse me--and we made sure that our independent 
investigator was aware of those allegations. And she was not 
blocked by NDAs. She had the ability to speak to anybody who 
was willing to come forward. It was their choice. She did speak 
to Mr. Snyder twice. So we were aware of that issue in that 
summer.
    Ms. Norton. So the NFL was monitoring the so-called 
independent investigation, yet it allowed Mr. Snyder to oversee 
the investigation of the team and his own conduct for at least 
six weeks before stepping in. Isn't that correct?
    Mr. Goodell. I'm sorry, Congresswoman. I'm not sure I 
followed your questioning there.
    Ms. Norton. That the NFL was monitoring the supposed 
independent investigation, yet, though you were doing that, the 
NFL allowed Mr. Snyder to oversee the investigation of the team 
and his own conduct for at least six weeks before stepping in. 
Isn't that correct?
    Mr. Goodell. Congresswoman, I think I would try to clarify 
that--and I said it in my opening statement--is that we were 
asked to give recommendations for counsel to be able to look 
into the workplace issues. We gave them several candidates. 
They selected Beth Wilkinson, which is an excellent choice.
    They began that investigation. And within several weeks, it 
was no more than six weeks to my recollection, they asked to 
have that investigation turned over to the league. We accepted 
to do that, but we said there would be no further 
investigations by the Washington Football Team at that point, 
we would take over this investigation.
    And we did with an independent. And she went ahead, and she 
made her decisions on how to conduct this investigation 
independently. And that's what we expected from her, and she 
did an outstanding job on that.
    Ms. Norton. I'm glad you did that after that six-week 
period.
    Mr. Goodell, will you commit today that if any future 
allegations against a team owner alleging misconduct arise that 
the NFL will conduct an independent investigation, not the team 
under inquiry, yes or no?
    Mr. Goodell. As part of the personal conduct policy, if 
there was an allegation that triggered that, the league would 
take over that investigation.
    Ms. Norton. Thank you for that, for making that point 
clear.
    I yield back, Madam Chair.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlelady yields back.
    Mr. Comer. Madam Chair, before we go to the next 
questioner, I would like to formally request that former NFL 
player Burgess Owens be waived on the committee today.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Without objection. And welcome.
    OK. The gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Jordan, is now recognized.
    Mr. Jordan. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    Commissioner, you believe in the First Amendment, don't 
you?
    Mr. Goodell. I do.
    Mr. Jordan. I mean, all parts of it, all, you know, all 
rights we have, your right to practice your faith, your right 
to petition the government, right to assemble, freedom of 
press, freedom of speech, you believe in all that.
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, Congressman.
    Mr. Jordan. Why do you ban Dave Portnoy from NFL games?
    Mr. Goodell. Pardon me? I couldn't hear your question.
    Mr. Jordan. Why do you ban Dave Portnoy from NFL games? 
He's a journalist. In fact, he's a sport journalist. Why is he 
banned?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, I'm not familiar with that issue. 
I'm happy to check with my staff, but I'm not aware of that.
    Mr. Jordan. Really?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Jordan. Well, I think we're all aware of that. I mean, 
he interviewed the President of the United States. Interviewed 
President Trump in the White House. Seems to me if he can get 
into the White House, he should be able to get into a football 
game, particularly as a member of the press and a member of the 
sports press.
    Do you know anything about that?
    Mr. Goodell. I don't, sir.
    Mr. Jordan. Do you agree with the Washington Redskins' 
decision to fine Jack Del Rio $100,000?
    Mr. Goodell. That was the decision that was made by Coach 
Rivera. Again, as I stated earlier, they are responsible for 
monitoring and managing their own workplace. He made that 
decision on his own. I did not speak to him. I have great 
respect for Coach Rivera. He made his decision for reasons I'm 
sure that he thought were important.
    Mr. Jordan. But I--I appreciate all--I appreciate all that, 
Commissioner. But that's not what I asked you. I said, do you 
agree with the Washington Redskins' decision to fine Jack Del 
Rio $100,000?
    Mr. Goodell. I don't think it's my position to be able to 
say whether it was the correct decision or not.
    Mr. Jordan. Well, Mr.--Coach Rivera in his statement, when 
he fined his assistant coach $100,000, he said Del Rio, quote, 
``does have the right to voice his opinion as a citizen of the 
United States, and it is most certainly his constitutional 
right to do so.''
    I don't know if that's actually accurate anymore because, 
if you do voice that, you end up getting fined and have to 
write a check for $100,000.
    Does that concern you?
    Mr. Goodell. I, again, have great respect for Coach Rivera. 
I presume that he had reasons for doing what he did, and I'm 
sure he took a lot of factors into consideration there.
    Mr. Jordan. Last year at the start of the season--I'm 
looking at The New York Times article, a piece from September 
5, 2021--last year, start of the NFL season, you made this 
statement. You said, ``We, the National Football League, 
encourage all to speak out and peacefully protest.''
    Did you really mean that when you said that, Mr. Goodell?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes. I think people are always responsible for 
what they say and what they do. But yes.
    Mr. Jordan. And when you said you encourage all to speak 
out, you meant all, not just some.
    Mr. Goodell. That's correct, Congressman. But you're 
responsible for what you say. There are consequences for what 
you do and say in life.
    Mr. Jordan. Yes. So, see, I mean, this is the concern I 
have. It seems to me the NFL encourages all to speak out, 
unless you're Dave Portnoy and not allowed to a game, unless 
you're Jack Del Rio, you get fined. That is, I think, the 
concern not only I have, but a lot of your fans across this 
country have this standard.
    Does that concern you at all?
    Mr. Goodell. It always concerns me what our fans think and 
how they react. But we try to make sure that we're responsible 
in all our comments.
    Mr. Jordan. Yes, let me just read the tweet from Mr. Del 
Rio. It said, ``Would love to understand the whole story about 
why the summer of riots, looting, burning, and the destruction 
of personal property is never discussed but January 6 is.''
    What part of that statement, what part of that tweet 
warranted a $100,000 fine?
    Mr. Goodell. Again, Congressman, I didn't issue the fine. I 
wasn't part of the decisionmaking process. Coach Rivera 
obviously had reasons which he believed were substantial to do 
that, and I have great respect for him.
    Mr. Jordan. Yes, but, I mean, this whole hearing is about 
the NFL stepping in when something happened at the Washington 
Football Team's organization. And now we had something that 
happened in the Washington Football Team's organization, and 
you said you had no part of that, you're not going to comment 
on it, it's not something that should concern you.
    But it seems like it should when an assistant coach issues 
a tweet that I think a lot of people--a lot of people would 
say, you know what, we condemned, we Republicans condemned the 
violence that took place in the summer of 2020 and we condemned 
the violence that took place on January 6th. We've been 
consistent.
    I think that was the point the coach was making. He gets 
fined, and you have nothing to say about it.
    Mr. Goodell. I am not going to interfere with the workplace 
decisions that a club makes on a matter like that. That is not 
a--that is not something that rises to the occasion such as the 
subject that we're talking about today, when you have a 
workplace that is obviously toxic and unacceptable and 
unprofessional. That is as much information----
    Mr. Jordan. No one supports that, but we do support the 
First Amendment. And I understand this is a private 
organization. But the chilling impact when speech is curtailed 
like this and you get fined for a tweet that you put out, I 
think that is a concern to all of us. That's why I raise it in 
the Committee hearing today.
    Madam Chair, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired. He 
yields back.
    The gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Connolly, is recognized 
for five minutes.
    Mr. Connolly. I thank the chair and thank her for 
accommodating me today. I will just begin by saying there's a 
lot of chutzpah coming from the other side of the aisle. When 
the Republican was in the majority under my predecessor, Tom 
Davis, when he was chairman, had no problem having hearings on 
steroids and baseball, also a sports issue, also a private 
entity. But there were no questions about jurisdiction then. 
And when it comes to being lectured about the lack of 
oversight, I remember four long years in the Trump 
administration, not a single Republican voted for a single 
subpoena during those four years, and we had no oversight 
hearings on our Committee over the Trump administration and its 
misdeeds, and God knows that was feral territory. So I'm not 
going to be lectured by those folks telling us about our 
dereliction of duty and oversight.
    Mr. Goodell, do you believe the NFL has held Mr. Snyder and 
others accountable for 20 years of misconduct at what is now 
called the Commanders?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, I do.
    Mr. Connolly. Do you believe you've held him to account?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Connolly. Sufficiently?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes. Most importantly, Congressman, I think we 
were able to, in addition to the accountability, be able to 
effectuate change in the organization that, as I mentioned 
before, is a substantial transformation. We----
    Mr. Connolly. This substantial----
    Mr. Goodell. Part of----
    Mr. Connolly. Let's talk about that substantial 
transformation. Instead of releasing the Wilkinson report, you 
issued a four-page press release. And inter alia, you said in 
that four-page press release, ownership and senior management 
actually paid little or no attention to these issues documented 
in the Wilkinson report; is that correct?
    Mr. Goodell. I don't have the release in front of me, but--
--
    Mr. Connolly. Well, all right. But the Committee's 
investigation has shown that's actually not true. Mr. Snyder 
paid lots of attention in ordering executives to fire 
cheerleaders who fraternized with players. He told other 
executives to keep cheerleaders, quote, ``skinny with big''--
and here he used a pejorative word to describe a part of the 
female anatomy--or he said he'd kill them.
    He intervened in H.R. decision after H.R. decision 
personally, deciding never to punish the favorite coach who 
groped lower-level employees, but punished the women in those 
cases, not the men, in a very consistent pattern.
    We've also now learned that there are at least two sexual 
assault allegations about him personally.
    Were you aware of that when you issued the statement that 
you, you know, he paid little or no attention to these issues?
    Is that news to you?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, as I stated, I think, earlier, 
the latest allegation was from your roundtable this February. 
So I was not aware of that until that time.
    Mr. Connolly. So does that change your mind now that you're 
aware of it?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, that's why we appointed Mary Jo White to 
look into to determine whether the allegation and what the 
facts are behind the allegation. We'll release that report when 
it's completed, because she brought that up in a public 
setting.
    Mr. Connolly. Well, you're committing now to release that 
report?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, I am, because she brought it up in a 
public setting, Congressman. I stated that in my opening.
    Mr. Connolly. Oh, so is that distinction you're making 
between the Wilkinson report and the White report? One was 
brought up in a public setting and the other was not?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Connolly. I don't get it because virtually----
    Mr. Goodell. As I said in my opening, I also made the 
distinction, it's a very important distinction, is that to get 
people to participate, Congressman, we promised them 
confidentiality and privacy. And the important thing for us is 
to be able to stand behind that, not just for this case with 
the Washington Commanders, but----
    Mr. Connolly. Commissioner, I've got one minute----
    Mr. Goodell. Future cases--people need----
    Mr. Connolly. Commissioner, I understand that, but you're 
acting as if the victims have not subsequently, in fact, called 
for the public release of the report. Virtually every victim 
we've met with in our roundtable, in private meetings we've 
had--I've got a lot of constituents who are victims of this 
culture, all of them have called for the release of the report. 
They've even created T-shirts saying, ``release the report.''
    So your concern about privacy, while commendable, seems to 
have been overtaken by the need for--for the public to 
understand what happened and to determine on its own based on 
that report, whether that culture unlike what you assert is 
continuing.
    Mr. Goodell. But Congressman, I would disagree with you 
respectfully on many occasions. There are obviously people who 
have come out. I mentioned, again, that in my opening 
statement. You have had witnesses who came forward, and I 
respect them for that choice. But there are also others who 
have made a choice not to come forward, not to disclose their 
identities, and to request that their identities be kept 
private. We think that's fundamental in the concept of trying 
to make sure--to the Committee's point here, none of us want 
sexual harassment or bad workplaces.
    Mr. Connolly. I understand----
    Mr. Goodell. We think it's fundamental to have a workplace 
that people can come forward and tell of incidents, and they 
can be followed up. We also think that----
    Mr. Connolly. Commissioner----
    Mr. Comer. Madam Chair, his time has expired.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired. Thank 
you for your questions, though. Thank you very much.
    The gentleman from Florida, Mr. Donalds----
    Mr. Connolly. Madam Chair--Madam Chair, can I just make a 
point? Last time I checked, you're the chair of the Committee. 
It's up to you to decide when my time is up, not Mr. Comer. 
Thank you.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Your time is up.
    The gentleman from Florida, Mr. Donalds, is recognized for 
five mines.
    Mr. Donalds. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    Look, I think it's important in this hearing to clarify a 
couple of things. Was the workplace environment at the 
Washington Redskins/Commanders abhorrent? The Commissioner has 
testified yes, in the previous roundtable, everybody agreed to 
that.
    Has the organization been held accountable through 
financial fines, the distancing of Mr. Snyder from the team for 
an extended period of time, and with transformation of team 
culture? The answer to all of those is yes as testified by the 
Commissioner of the National Football League. It's been brought 
up in this hearing that, yes, four years ago when Mr. Gowdy was 
chair of this Committee, that we did investigate sexual 
harassment associated with U.S.A. Gymnastics. But it's 
important to understand the context of those hearings.
    The disgusting actions of Dr. Nassar were actually coming 
to light at the same time as Congress was holding those 
hearings, at the same time as that was moving through the 
criminal procedures. So let's understand what we're talking 
about here. The workplace environment of the Washington 
Redskins at that period of time was abhorrent. Everybody in 
this hearing agrees with that.
    But have they been held accountable? According to the 
Commissioner, yes, they have been held accountable, which goes 
back to point that Republicans on this Committee are actually 
saying. If you want to bring legislation about this, that's 
fine. That's one thing. But if you want to sit a chair in this 
middle of this hearing room with Mr. Snyder's name on it 
knowing full well that Mr. Snyder told the Committee he was not 
going to be able to attend, well, that takes on the elements of 
a show hearing.
    And if Congress is going to go through the pathway of 
conducting show hearings where Members of Congress want to take 
their pound of flesh from American citizens regardless of their 
stature, what you're going to get is American citizens actually 
having less respect for the committees of Congress. We have so 
many issues facing us in the United States right now.
    Gas prices are through the roof. I was just at the border 
for the fourth time last week. I've had four trips to the 
border. The President of the United States has never been. 
Meanwhile, fentanyl is coming into every community in the 
United States. It is killing people in our country between the 
ages of 18 and 45. It is the No. 1 cause of death. This 
Committee has said nothing about fentanyl to this point. Not 
one word. We've not done it here.
    So I think if you're going to examine why Republican 
Members are frustrated with this hearing, it is not about the 
conduct of the Washington Redskins. It's not about that 
conduct, because we find that conduct to be distasteful. But 
you have to also look at the facts that the National Football 
League, which is the entity responsible for the Washington 
Redskins, they've gone through that investigation. They've 
actually held the team accountable.
    So what are we doing now? Are we actually going to ignore 
the real-life economic issues that are harming every American 
in the United States, whether you happen to be male or female, 
whether you happen to be rich or poor, whether you happen to be 
black or white, or are we going to continue to do these show 
hearings?
    Yes, while America struggles in the reality of Joe Biden's 
disastrous economic policies today in the United States.
    That is the ire--that is the--that is why Members of 
Congress on the Republican side of the aisle are so confounded 
as to why we've hauled in the Commissioner from the NFL. Look, 
I'm going to be fully transparent which y'all. I ain't really 
got no love for the NFL, OK? You know, like, I don't really 
have much love for the NFL. I love football. I've had my issues 
with certain rulings that have come from the NFL.
    There's things that, Commissioner Goodell, I don't agree 
with your decisions on certain things that you've done in your 
tenure, but I'm not going to use my time as a Member of 
Congress to grill you on that. That is your business as running 
the NFL. If the owners have a problem with you, let the owners 
deal with it. Me, personally, I'm a Cowboys fan. So, you know, 
if the product on the field of the Washington Commanders is not 
good, that's great for me personally. But I'm not going to use 
my time as a Member of Congress to grill that organization when 
they've already been held accountable by the governing body who 
is responsible for them, which is the NFL, which the 
Commissioner of the NFL has already testified to today.
    So Madam Chair, if you want to understand why Members on 
this side of the aisle are frustrated, it's not about holding a 
sexual harassment in the workplace accountable. It is not that. 
It is about us conducting show trials, which distract us from 
the business Congress should be looking at.
    And with that, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman yields back. And I'd like 
to remind him that during the hearing with the cheerleaders 
earlier, you called for the release of the Wilkinson report, 
and I agree with you completely. We're still working to get 
that report released. It's a bipartisan effort with your call 
for it.
    The gentleman from Illinois, Mr. Krishnamoorthi, is 
recognized for five minutes.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    Thank you, Commissioner, for being here today. Sir, I'd 
like to turn your attention to this chart I have here to my 
right. This chart shows us the length and detail of reports 
released after recent NFL investigations.
    On the far right is Deflategate, which examined the air 
pressure in footballs used by Tom Brady, and following that 
inquiry, you released a 243-page detailed report. Next to it is 
the Miami Dolphins sexual harassment inquiry, and after that 
you released a 148-page detailed report. And next to that bar 
is the Ray Rice domestic violence situation, where you released 
a 96-page detailed report following that inquiry. Now, with 
regard to the Commanders, unfortunately, we received a five-
page press release, sir.
    Now, sir, you had mentioned that the reason for the press 
release as opposed to a detailed finding as you had in the 
other cases was because of privacy concerns; isn't that right?
    Mr. Goodell. That was one of the issues, yes.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. However, I have this 148-page Miami 
Dolphins harassment report that you did, where you have 
redacted the names of various individuals out of privacy 
concerns. And so, it is possible to release a detailed report, 
and at the same time, protect people's privacy, yet you chose 
not to do so in this particular case with the Commanders.
    Sir, I'd like to turn your attention to 2009. You're aware 
that in 2009, Dan Snyder was accused of sexually assaulting an 
employee on a private airplane, correct?
    Mr. Goodell. Am I aware of that? Yes, I'm aware of that 
allegation.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And sir, Mr. Snyder settled those 
claims for $1.6 million, but he did not inform you in 2009 that 
he'd been accused of sexual assault, correct?
    Mr. Goodell. I don't recall him informing of that, no.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And failing to report such an incident 
under the League's personal conduct policy would be a violation 
of that policy, right?
    Mr. Goodell. It's an element of the policy that they're 
supposed to report incidents that would violate the policy, 
yes.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And, moreover, the policy requires that 
the NFL handle all inquiries into sexual assault allegations, 
not the team. However, in this particular case, the Commanders, 
themselves, handled the inquiry, so that's yet another 
violation of the personal conduct policy; isn't that right?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, Mr. Chairman, this is something that--
our personal conduct policy has gone through changes over the 
last--I would say the last 15 years, of significant changes, to 
take care and address issues that we see need clarifications. 
And clearly, we made significant changes in 2014 with our 
personal conduct policy because we believe it needed to have--
--
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. But the NFL is supposed to be in charge 
of the investigation, right?
    Mr. Goodell. Today, that is absolutely correct. Yes.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And if the sexual assault allegations 
are substantiated, that assault would obviously be a violation 
of personal conduct policy as well, because sexual assault is a 
violation of the personal conduct policy in the NFL, right?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes. Absolutely.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Now, let me direct your attention to 
the case of Tiffany Johnson. She came before us and testified 
before me at the February roundtable and answered my questions, 
basically alleging that Mr. Snyder intentionally touched her in 
a sexual manner against her will during a work dinner, and that 
is why you hired Mary Jo White to investigate those 
allegations, correct?
    Mr. Goodell. That is correct.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And as you sit here today, you don't 
have personally--personally, any knowledge of evidence that 
would dispute her allegations as you sit here today?
    Mr. Goodell. That's an ongoing investigation that's being 
handled by Mary Jo White. She's very capable of doing that. 
She'll report back to me when she's completed the 
investigation, and we've made it clear----
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And if it is substantiated--if it's 
substantiated, Ms. Johnson's sexual battery claim would 
certainly warrant further disciplinary action, correct?
    Mr. Goodell. It's an ongoing investigation. So it would be 
inappropriate for me to comment on that. But we said before 
that we would consider discipline if the results of the 
investigation warrant it.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. So let me ask you this: You called the 
Commanders' workplace not only unprofessional, but toxic for 
too long.
    Sir, in your view, is Dan Snyder's behavior in the 
workplace culture he created and fostered one of the worst and 
most toxic you've seen in your time as Commissioner and your 
decades of service in the NFL?
    Mr. Goodell. I have not seen a workplace in the NFL that is 
anywhere near what we saw in the context of that period of time 
for the Washington Commanders.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Sir, with all the challenges we have 
going on as a country, why is it important that we still put an 
end to sexual harassment and a toxic work environment at the 
Washington Commanders?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, I think we have----
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman may answer, but the 
gentleman's time has expired. You may answer, but his time has 
expired.
    Yes, Mr. Goodell. Go ahead.
    Mr. Goodell. I think we have made those changes and as I've 
said, it's verified by independent auditors that the changes 
have been made and the organization will continue to do that. 
But I don't think any of us want to have workplaces that are 
not safe, not allow all of our employees to feel safe and to be 
productive without harassment or without discrimination or any 
other issues that would be negative in a professional 
workplace.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Thank you.
    The gentleman from Kentucky, Mr. Comer, you are now 
recognized for five minutes.
    Mr. Comer. Thank you, Madam Chair. Before I begin my 
questions for Mr. Goodell, I'm going to have to correct the 
record once again for Mr. Connolly. This is becoming a habit. I 
believe, Madam Chair, he's hanging out with Adam Schiff too 
much here lately. He just keeps making things up.
    In 2017, when the Republicans were in control of this 
Committee, we had 112 Trump administration witnesses testify. 
In 2018, Republicans still in control of this Committee, we had 
59 administration witnesses. That was during the tenure of 
Chaffetz and Gowdy. In 2019, when the Democrats retook the 
majority, you had 80 Trump administration witnesses testify. 
This year, now that Biden's President, you've had only 36 low-
level career civil servants testify and no Cabinet Secretary. 
So I wanted to correct the record of what Mr. Connolly said. 
That was completely false.
    Commissioner Goodell, when did you learn this Committee was 
investigating the Washington Commanders?
    Mr. Goodell. I'm sorry. What--I'm sorry, Ranking Member?
    Mr. Comer. When did you learn this Committee was 
investigating the Washington Commanders?
    Mr. Goodell. I believe it as late October of last year, 
1921.
    Mr. Comer. Were you surprised?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Comer. Why?
    Mr. Goodell. Because I thought we had handled this 
situation in a way that was responsible for a workplace. We 
had, as I said, implemented unprecedented discipline. We had 
made the changes to transform the workplace. So it was----
    Mr. Comer. One reason--Let me get this straight, one reason 
you were surprised was because the NFL took action and held the 
bad actors accountable. And another reason would probably be 
because Congress really has no jurisdiction over the day-to-day 
operations of the NFL.
    The committee Democrats asked the NFL to produce documents, 
correct?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Comer. A lot of documents, right?
    Mr. Goodell. I think we're over 460,000.
    Mr. Comer. 450,000. Nearly half a million documents.
    Mr. Goodell. 60.
    Mr. Comer. Would it surprise you, Mr. Goodell, that 
committee Democrats haven't sent a single document request to 
the Biden administration about the infant formula shortage, but 
they've requested half a million documents from the NFL?
    Does that surprise you?
    Mr. Goodell. I'm not sure I have a point of view on that 
one. I was only focusing on what the NFL was requesting.
    Mr. Comer. The Democrats haven't even--just make this 
point, sir, the Democrats haven't even sent document requests 
to the Biden administration about the botched withdrawal from 
Afghanistan, or the COVID origination or the impacts of school 
closures on kids, or what they're doing about illegal 
immigrants and fentanyl streaming across the southern border, 
about skyrocketing inflation, energy prices, not one request on 
these problems. I think that's what the people in my district 
in Kentucky care about. I'm pretty sure that's what most people 
in America care about.
    But Commissioner, you had Beth Wilkinson conduct an 
investigation in the workplace conduct of the Washington 
Commanders. And Mary Jo White's in the midst of a related one. 
You've already stated that.
    And you've also stated the Commanders have made dramatic 
improvements at its organization; is that correct?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Comer. So why are we here?
    Why do you think we're here today?
    Because that's what a lot of the people on my side of the 
aisle, Republican Members, minority Members, you know, why are 
we here?
    Why do you think we're here, sir?
    Mr. Goodell. Ranking Member, I was given an invitation, and 
I felt it appropriate to show up when Congress asked me to show 
up. And I believe that this matter was handled appropriately, 
and I wanted to make sure I stated our point on that.
    Mr. Comer. And you believe--let me get this right, you 
believe that Dan Snyder has been held accountable for a past 
toxic work environment, but the NFL continues to go in and 
monitor the situation.
    And how would you describe the current situation of the 
work environment in the Redskins or Commanders Football 
Program? How are things today in the NFL's view?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, Ranking Member, it's not just the NFL 
going in. More importantly, it's an independent organization, 
Vestry Laight, that is auditing, goes in, and is meeting with 
employees, going through processes, checking with HR. Again, we 
had very woeful H.R. processes for too long in that 
organization. They've been implemented into the organization 
now. It is actually a very professionally run organization from 
an H.R. standpoint.
    I think employees from reports that I've seen in this, that 
you also have a copy of, employees feel comfortable with the 
environment in the workplace. They see a dramatic change. And I 
think that the changes that the Commanders have made, including 
implementing new executive leadership from President Jason 
Wright to Coach Rivera, I think you see a dramatic change in 
the organization.
    And Dan Snyder made those--I understand Dan Snyder made 
those changes. But I also believe that Beth Wilkinson's 
recommendations to the workplace, the 10 recommendations she 
made, were very important to implement. And that's why we have 
ongoing oversight to that to make sure that that continues, 
which I think is the most important objective when we began 
this, is not just the accountability, but really to make sure 
that we change the direction of this workplace, and make sure 
that it was safe for our employees.
    Mr. Comer. Very good.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired. Thank 
you.
    The gentleman from Maryland, Mr. Raskin, is recognized for 
five minutes.
    Mr. Raskin. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    After The Washington Post expose of decades of sexual 
harassment in the team, Dan Snyder announced he'd be conducting 
an independent investigation into the toxic workplace culture. 
But then when allegations surfaced implicating Mr. Snyder 
himself, the NFL said it was taking over the investigation. So 
far so good.
    But then in September 2020, Mr. Goodell, you entered into a 
secret common interest agreement with Dan Snyder's team to 
share information about the investigation, which included an 
investigation into his own conduct, but you never told the 
women who were participating in interviews with Ms. Wilkinson 
that there was this secret agreement to share information. So 
now Mr. Snyder got access to these interviews.
    How is that protecting the privacy and confidentiality of 
the women, which you've asserted is your key value here?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, the common interest agreement--and I'm 
not an attorney--is a legal document that helps us transfer the 
Commanders' investigation to the League investigation. It is an 
agreement that did not prevent us from sharing information.
    Mr. Raskin. No. It guaranteed that you would share 
information, right?
    Mr. Goodell. No. It allowed us to make sure that we could 
continue the investigation with Beth Wilkinson so that she 
would not have to go back and have to meet with some of the 
people she'd already met as witnesses and have to go through 
that entire process again.
    Mr. Raskin. OK. But let me----
    Mr. Goodell. Nothing--nothing in that common interest 
agreement--and by the way, I'll just point out too that common 
interest agreement was entered into just a couple of weeks 
after we took over the investigation when it was clear--well, 
before it was clear that this Committee was even focused on 
this issue.
    Mr. Raskin. Right. This Committee has nothing to do with 
it. The point is, that Mr. Snyder had access to all of the 
interviews of the women whose confidentiality interest you're 
now purporting to assert.
    I'm puzzled by this, too: Why would you pay hundreds of 
thousands or millions of dollars to investigate sexual 
harassment in a toxic workplace environment, but then publish 
no written report about it?
    You had a 243-page written report on Deflategate, as my 
colleague from Illinois pointed out, and you had another 
published report about sexual harassment with the Miami 
Dolphins where the names were redacted where people felt there 
was a confidentiality problem.
    Why wasn't redaction sufficient to protect the anonymity of 
the women who were involved in the case of the Washington team?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, if I may, I just want to, I 
think, clarify something. To my knowledge, and my understanding 
is Dan Snyder did not have access to those interviews that Beth 
Wilkinson had done, even while the team was overseeing that----
    Mr. Raskin. So you're saying--he's never seen those 
interviews you're saying?
    Mr. Goodell. Not to my knowledge, and I don't believe so.
    Mr. Raskin. OK. Why wasn't redaction sufficient to protect 
the anonymity of the women being interviewed in the case of the 
Washington team when it was sufficient in the case of the 
Dolphins?
    Mr. Goodell. In the case of the Dolphins, my recollection 
was no one had asked for any confidentiality. Not only in the 
Washington matter----
    Mr. Raskin. They did because. Your names were redacted. 
Please.
    Mr. Goodell. Not only in Washington did they ask for 
confidentiality in many cases, we also promised them 
confidentiality to make sure----
    Mr. Raskin. That's what redaction is for. OK. That's what 
redaction is.
    Mr. Goodell. Redaction--Congressman, with all due respect 
redaction doesn't always work in my world. I promise you. We 
needed to take extra steps to make sure these people who did 
come through and courageously come forward----
    Mr. Raskin. All right. I've got to reclaim my time here 
because I've got another question for you.
    Between August 2020 and April 21 while the 
Wilkinson investigation was taking place, Dan Snyder conducted 
a parallel investigation of the women who spoke out, and he 
filed 10 lawsuits in seven states around the country in an 
effort to expose and undermine those women who had allegedly 
participated in The Washington Post series.
    One Federal judge described Snyder's legal actions as 
quote, ``an effort to burden and harass individuals formally 
associated with the team who may have acted as sources for The 
Washington Post, adding that the subpoenas that he issued were, 
quote, being done for what the court perceives is an improper 
purpose, to discover the sources for the embarrassing and 
damning The Washington Post story.''
    So did you do anything to try to stop Dan Snyder from 
harassing these women in court after they'd been sexually 
harassed, and do you condemn this action by Mr. Snyder?
    Mr. Goodell. I think any action that would discourage 
people from coming forward would be inappropriate and 
absolutely wrong. In fact, when we took over the investigation, 
we told the Washington Commanders that they were not to do any 
investigations. By April 1921, I think is the date you gave me, 
my recollection from your question, we were in the final 
stages. And Beth had probably met with most of the men and 
women that wanted to come forward. We were getting close to 
concluding our investigation or Beth's investigation.
    Mr. Raskin. So you condemned that form of illegal 
harassment against the women who came forward?
    Mr. Comer. The chair's time----
    Mr. Goodell. As I said, any kind of harassment against 
people who want to come forward and tell the truth, we would 
not permit, and we would not find acceptable.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired.
    The gentleman, you are allowed to respond to his question.
    OK. We now recognize from Texas, Mr. Fallon. The gentleman 
from Texas.
    Mr. Fallon. Commissioner, thank you. I want to be frank 
with you, I'm angry and I'm concerned. Last week marked the 
50th anniversary of Watergate, which was a scandal that led to 
a series of felony convictions and the first resignation of a 
United States President, that tore at the very fabric of 
American society. In a scant 7-1/2 years ago, another scandal 
rocked our Nation, threatening the very core and foundation of 
our republic, that being, of course, Deflategate, where in an 
AFC championship game, the NFL footballs, the pigskins, the 
rock, the pill, the hen egg, the melon and the leather was 
mysteriously under-inflated by two PSI, pounds per square inch. 
This led to a multifaceted investigation, months long, 
thousands of dollars spent, where the GOAT, Mr. California 
cool, the real slim Brady, the master of the tuck, the lord of 
the rings, Tom Terrific, Tom Brady was suspended by the League.
    Mr. Commissioner, I'm sure you're aware that many in New 
England worship Thomas Edward Patrick Brady, Jr., as a demigod 
of sorts, and being a New England native myself, I don't blame 
them one bit. So my point here, sir, is that this country 
simply can't afford another scandal, particularly a preventable 
one. So I'm surprised in reviewing the League rules to prepare 
for this hearing, this critical hearing, we uncovered that the 
NFL requires footballs today to be inflated to a gage pressure 
of between 12.5 and 13.5 PSI, and the rules don't state and 
specify the temperature at which these measurements are to be 
made. And the pressure temperature law states that there is a 
positive correlation between the temperature and the pressure 
of a gas when there's a fixed volume and mass.
    So how can we, Commissioner, guarantee the consistency of 
the PSI levels of footballs moving forward?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, Congressman, it's been quite a while 
since I focused on this issue, but I'll tell you, our 
procedures now are that our game officials make that check 
prior to the game. And so, they are the ones to do that 
individually, and then the balls are under protected order from 
that point on. They are not allowed to be tampered with from 
that point on. So I think, hopefully, we found that 
consistency, and make sure that the rules apply to everyone, 
and that they're applied equally.
    Mr. Fallon. Commissioner, are you currently in New York 
City?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, I am.
    Mr. Fallon. All right. So you're at sea level, and we're 
here in Washington, DC. at sea level.
    So, sir, what do we do in Denver at Mile High Stadium, 
5,280 feet high above sea level, and how do we account for the 
variances that could and do occur when there's differing 
atmospheric pressures vis-`-vis the PSI and your balls?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, Congressman, it's one of the reasons 
why--and several of your colleagues have mentioned, that we had 
a lengthy report following Deflategate. And the reason why is 
because we had several studies that went 50 pages or more 
talking about these exact issues. I can't recite exactly what 
they were at this point in time. But they considered altitude. 
They considered temperature. They considered all those issues 
in the variants. That's why that report was so lengthy is 
because we wanted to put those procedures out, as well as the 
research that went into that.
    Mr. Fallon. Well, Mr. Commissioner, I'd like to offer my 
sincere apologies, because this hearing, as I said earlier, I'm 
angry and upset because this hearing is a sham, and it's a 
farce, and it's a clown show. And it's a terrible waste of your 
time as a CEO of a multibillion dollar privately held 
enterprise. It's a waste of this Committee's time. And worst of 
all, it's a waste of American taxpayers' time. We're here 
suffering inflation at a 41-year high, 8.6 percent; gasoline at 
$5 a gallon, highest it's ever been in our history.
    We have a southern border wide open, more porous than in 
250 years, and the drug cartels are making record profits, and 
this unchecked narcotics trafficking has fueled an opioid 
crisis, which is directly responsible for the deaths of 100,000 
Americans. That's why I mentioned I was angry, and I'm upset. 
And we're here harassing the NFL, and I might add, engaging in 
a partisan bizarre witch hunt of an NFL team and trespassing 
without just cause into the internal affairs of a privately 
held entity when we face these other crises on multiple fronts. 
Quite frankly, it's disgusting. It's a disgrace.
    And Madam Chair, we can and must do better. I yield back.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi.
    [Presiding.] Thank you, Mr. Fallon. And we're going to have 
the ONDCP director next Monday, so you can direct those 
questions about the drug trade to him.
    We are going to now call on Mr. Khanna for his five minutes 
of questions.
    Mr. Khanna. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you also to you, 
Representative Krishnamoorthi, Chairman Krishnamoorthi, for 
your leadership on these issues. I know you've been advocating 
and leading on these issues for a number of years just to have 
basic equality in all our workplaces.
    Chairman Goodell, I'm a, of course, 49ers fan. I represent 
Silicon Valley, and I'm a fan not of just the team on the 
field, but I'm sure you know Hannah Gordon there who's a senior 
executive, and she has participated on a number of panels 
actually in Silicon Valley about creating a workplace that 
empowers women, about making sure that women have equal pay, 
about tackling issues of childcare, about tackling issues of 
discrimination, and she's, I think, extraordinary. She's really 
helped shape the culture of the 49ers.
    So my question for you is, do you look at clubs like the 
49ers and extraordinary leaders like Hannah Gordon in seeing 
what best practices may be for all the clubs in the League?
    Mr. Goodell. We absolutely do. Hannah Gordon was a former 
employee of ours. She is outstanding. She's a true 
professional. She made a difference here in our organization, 
and she's doing that again with the 49ers. I have nothing but 
respect for her.
    But as part of the changes that happened over the last 
several years is an elevation, I would call it, of sharing of 
best practices amongst all our clubs from this office, as well 
as the 32 clubs. As we stated earlier, they all have their own 
work forces and workplaces. Those are their prerogative, but we 
do believe that understanding and sharing is an important 
element to making sure we have better workplaces.
    We also, at the league level, have had many times where we 
require certain training mechanisms. Some of that came out of 
2014 with respect to domestic violence and sexual assault. All 
personnel are required to go through annual training. In 
addition, we made sure that sexual harassment is a requirement 
of all personnel in the NFL, that includes clubs, leagues, 
owners, commissioners, so that we can do everything we possibly 
can to make sure that our work forces and workplaces are safe, 
and people have a full understanding of what's expected of 
them.
    Mr. Khanna. I appreciate that, and I hope you'll look not 
just to Hannah Gordon and the leadership on issues of gender 
and equity, but the 49ers in my district have provided STEM 
education for people left out.
    I guess my point, Chairman Goodell, is I know people 
focused on the legal issues, but you know this better than I 
do, that if you look at the top three or four shows that the 
American public watch, I was shocked when I realized this; it's 
Sunday Night Football, Monday Night Football, Thursday Night 
Football. NCIS is the only one that competes.
    And I think you would agree that given the cultural 
significance of the NFL, and I grew up as a football fan, many 
of us in Congress are football fans. I think there's a higher 
bar where what you do really matters to shaping the culture of 
the Nation. And I guess my request and my plea to you would be 
to realize that responsibility. Obviously, on issues of gender, 
of issues of equality, of issues of helping get young people 
involved in the STEM and education, and just realize that, you 
know, you have a huge platform and make a big difference to the 
culture of the country.
    And that's, I think, spirit of these hearings as opposed to 
some legalistic dispute is just what can you do with the 
platform you have?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, I could not agree with you more. 
We take that responsibility seriously. We understand the impact 
we have in our communities, as well as nationally and even 
globally. And that's why we have worked hard to try to meet 
that standard. We're not perfect, but we work hard whenever we 
see something that we can improve on. We dig in, and we do our 
best to make sure that we're a leading voice and something--an 
institution that people can look to to say, they're doing 
things the right way.
    I appreciate your comments. It's well beyond gender. To 
your point, it's diversity in general. It's making sure that we 
do everything in our communities, including making sure that 
our communities are addressing the difficult issues that some 
of you have talked about today and making sure that our teams 
are playing an active force in some of that, whether it's our 
work on how do we get people to vote. Our clubs are actively 
using their facilities, they're actively using their platform 
of which to encourage people to get out and vote.
    Mr. Khanna. I appreciate that. Thank you for your time.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you, Mr. Khanna.
    Now, I'm going to be calling on Mr. Grothman for his five 
minutes.
    Mr. Grothman. Thank you. As was just pointed out, Mr. 
Goodell, you have attracted tens of millions of dollars from 
Americans who watch your games every week. You've got a large, 
captive audience.
    Would you agree the NFL has a tremendous amount of power 
and ability to influence American culture?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, Congressman, I think I just made that 
point. I agree with you.
    Mr. Grothman. I'm a little bit troubled by your embracement 
of what I'll call left woke anti-American propaganda way 
exaggerating any amount of racism in America. Under your 
leadership, the NFL has perpetuated the narrative that 
America's a racist country, including the myth of systemic 
racism in policing. You've committed hundreds of millions of 
dollars to, quote, ``fight racism in America.'' You've kind of 
promoted the Black Lives Matter movement. And, of course, the 
heads of that movement were Marxist. They're kind of 
antifamily. I realize it's a diffuse organization, and not 
everybody believes in that. But nevertheless, the founders 
believed in that.
    The NFL is committed to leveraging the NFL Network with its 
other media properties to place increased emphasis on raising 
awareness and promoting education and social justice issues of 
our fans. That's what you say.
    Mr. Goodell, studies show that when you control for crime 
rates, there is no systemic racism in policing. Mr. Goodell, 
could you use your opportunity to raise awareness among your 
fans about the fact that study after study shows that when 
controlling for variables such as crime rates, there is no 
significant relationship between a person's race and whether or 
not they'll be arrested or shot at by police?
    Do you think you could use your power to get that out there 
given what you've done in the past?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, first I make no apologies for 
fighting racism. We believe strongly that there's no place for 
racism and hatred in our society.
    Mr. Grothman. That's not the point.
    Mr. Goodell. I also--well, I'm just trying to clarify a 
point that I heard in your question.
    The second point to it is, we have an incredibly strong 
relationship with law enforcement. We are supportive of the 
work that they do. We understand the difficult job that they 
have, and the dangerous job they have. But we all want great 
policing. We want to make sure that the police are properly 
resourced and properly equipped. But more importantly, our work 
has been focused on how do we develop better relationships 
between the law enforcement and the communities.
    And personally, I've gone into some of those communities 
with law enforcement and done what we call ride-alongs. And in 
that context, you understand the gap that we have to fill 
between what law enforcement is faced with, how they do their 
jobs, and what the community expects from them. And I think 
more communication, more work to try to improve that 
relationship is not only going to improve policing, but I think 
it's going to improve our societies in general and our 
communities.
    Mr. Grothman. Mr. Goodell, study after study shows there is 
not system racism in our police departments. There is narrative 
out there, for example, who, to this day, mislead the public as 
to what happened in Ferguson. The Black Lives Matter movement 
fanned the flames out there even though Barack Obama's own 
Justice Department found that shooting was justified. And you 
have kind of piled on with the narrative that we have a 
fundamental problem.
    Will you do what you can to use your mouthpiece given the 
damage I think you've created in the past to straight the 
records--straighten out the record with regard to racism in our 
police departments?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, with all due respect, I think, 
again, we've been incredibly supportive of law enforcement, and 
we'll continue that. So----
    Mr. Grothman. OK. I'll give you another question.
    This is on the internet. You never know what you can 
believe on the internet. I look on the internet, and we see 
that you're making about $64 million a year, not as an owner, 
not as somebody who is taking personal risk, not somebody who 
has to block or tackle or risk your body. To a certain extent, 
the NFL is profitable because they shake down cities, tell them 
you're going to--we're going to leave your city unless you 
build a big--you know, hundreds of millions of dollars a 
stadium.
    Do you think it's appropriate given the monopoly the NFL 
has that you have no personal risk, either physical risk or 
financial risk, in your job, could you comment on that $64 
million salary?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman, I started as an intern nearly 40 
years ago in the NFL, and I am very fortunate to have made a 
career at being at the NFL. It's an organization I'm proud of. 
I'm happy to have opportunities I've had, and people have 
mentored me and given me those opportunities. My compensation 
is something that is determined with discretion from the 
ownership. They make that determination. I am very fortunate to 
be here in this job. I'm proud of it. And I wish I could say 
anything more to you that would make you more comfortable, but 
those are determinations that are made by the ownership.
    Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you for the questions, Mr. 
Grothman.
    One thing I just wanted to clarify, the Commissioner said 
that the difference between releasing the Miami Dolphins report 
and the Wilkinson investigation is that witnesses in the Miami 
Dolphins case did not request their identities to remain 
confidential. That is not correct.
    According to page 54 of the Dolphins report, it says 
witnesses, quote, ``specifically asked that their identities 
remain confidential. A few even seemed to fear potential 
retaliation for cooperating with our inquiry, and we honored 
their request,'' closed quote.
    I'd now like to recognize the gentlewoman from Ohio, Ms. 
Brown, for her questions.
    Ms. Brown. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I appreciate this 
committee holding this hearing.
    Commissioner Goodell, you've repeatedly touted that the NFL 
should be held to a high standard, and I applaud you for that. 
You have also assured us that when the NFL took over the 
investigation of the Commanders, it was to, quote, ``provide 
greater public assurance of the integrity and independence of 
this investigation.'' And yet, it's been reported eight days 
after the NFL assumed oversight of the Wilkinson investigation, 
assigned--it signed an agreement with the Commanders--a secret 
agreement is how some might call it, but the agreement gave Dan 
Snyder and the Commanders the right to veto the release 
information or communication shared with the Wilkinson 
investigation.
    So my question, yes or no, Mr. Goodell: Is it true that the 
Commanders blocked the NFL from turning over 40,000 documents 
from the internal investigation to this Committee in response 
to its October 2021 request?
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman--Congresswoman, sorry, this was a 
legal agreement that allowed the transfer of the--the 
investigation that was begun under the Washington Commanders' 
authority and was transferred to the NFL. I'm not a lawyer, but 
I fully understand from our people--my understanding is that it 
did not prevent us from sharing any information.
    Ms. Brown. Just reclaiming my time. Is that a yes or no, 
Mr. Goodell? I'm sorry.
    Mr. Goodell. The answer to my question it's neither. I'm 
trying to bring clarity to the question.
    Ms. Brown. I'm going to respectfully reclaim my time. The 
NFL--it's also been reported that the NFL stood by while Mr. 
Snyder ran a shadow investigation, deploying private 
investigators to the homes of his accusers in an effort to 
intimidate them while he offered them hush money to buy their 
silence.
    Mr. Goodell, did you or anyone from the NFL tell Mr. Snyder 
or his attorneys to stop using private investigators, yes or 
no, please?
    Mr. Goodell. As soon as we took over the investigation, we 
made it clear to them that they should not be investigating any 
of these matters. Second, we asked that the Commanders reach 
out to current employees, as well as former employees, to 
encourage them to participate. So any efforts to intimidate 
witnesses or prevent them from doing it would be inconsistent 
with that.
    Ms. Brown. What about the subpoenaing of private emails and 
phone records from former employees about confidential 
communications with The Washington Post regarding the 
Commanders' toxic workplace?
    Can you tell me about that?
    Mr. Goodell. I'm not sure I understand your question, 
Congresswoman.
    Ms. Brown. Did you ask for that to cease, or was there any 
engagement from you to stop that usage?
    Mr. Goodell. For what to cease? I'm sorry.
    Ms. Brown. The subpoenaing of private emails and phone 
records from former employees about confidential communications 
with The Washington Post regarding the Commanders' toxic 
workplace?
    Mr. Goodell. I'm not clear on what that is. I'm happy to 
followup with our staff and our attorneys to make sure we get 
you an answer, but I'm not familiar with that.
    Ms. Brown. OK. All right.
    Well, after hearing some of the questions that have been 
put forth and your responses, it seems to me that the NFL 
picked a side in this investigation, which silenced the voices 
of employees and allowed Mr. Snyder to pedal his own version of 
the facts. And I think it's been stated here while I, again, 
applaud the efforts and the steps that you have taken to 
reverse course, I associate myself with the comments of my 
colleague, Mr. Ro Khanna, we can and we must do better.
    We should not allow the owners to decide what information 
is made public, and we should not allow them to silence their 
employees with nondisclosure agreements that conceal workplace 
misconduct. So it is my hope and my belief that this Committee 
must act to pass meaningful legislation that will protect the 
workers in the League and around the country.
    And so with all sincerity, I thank you for coming forward 
and taking the time to answer this Committee's questions, and 
hope that you will continue to take the steps to lead the 
Nation as an example of what it takes to have a productive, 
quality, safe, workplace. Thank you so much.
    And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. [Presiding.] Thank you.
    The gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. Keller, is recognized 
for five minutes.
    Mr. Keller. Thank you Madam Chair and Ranking Member Comer.
    This Committee had a joint roundtable last February, and 
the subject came up. And my position on this is the same, and 
that is, there no excuse for abusive behavior or harassment in 
any work environment. In any instances of such behavior, they 
should be fully investigated and violators held accountable.
    But as I also pointed out in February, this Committee has 
been tasked with investigating waste, fraud, and abuse of 
taxpayer dollars and ensuring government agencies are operating 
properly. The fact that we are not discussing historically high 
inflation prompting the highest fed rate hike since 1994, a 
nationwide gas average topping $5 a gallon, or the fentanyl 
crisis exacerbated by disastrous open-border policies is 
unacceptable.
    Instead, we are now conducting congressional oversight over 
a private organization already undergoing an investigation. 
Madam Chair, this Committee must refocus efforts on the most 
pressing issues affecting the American people, not duplicative 
ongoing efforts to investigate misconduct.
    My question, Mr. Goodell, what steps has the NFL taken to 
promote safe, working environment for its employees?
    Mr. Goodell. We've made a number of steps going back 
several years. One, and I mentioned some of this, but annual 
training that's required across all personnel, from clubs to 
league officials, to employees, including players, owners, 
commissioners. We've had sexual harassment training also. We 
continue to do that on an annual basis, which is also required. 
So we continue to put this front and center. I've had several 
conversations with our clubs about the importance of 
maintaining professional workplaces, that it's their 
responsibility.
    So, I think the steps that have been made clearly have had 
an impact. But again, we're not perfect. But we want to make 
sure that our employees feel safe, and they have a place where 
if they have--I should have mentioned one other thing--is 
mandatory hotlines. We, at the League, have had a mandatory 
hotline for people to confidentially raise any issues they 
think are important, and we also have required that of all our 
32 clubs. So I think steps to make it easier for people to 
report, if there are violations or alleged violations, and most 
importantly, for us to followup responsibility, have been 
welcomed and needed, and are the important steps that need to 
be taken to keep our workplace safe and productive.
    Mr. Keller. OK. The Commanders are required to submit 
semiannual reporting assessments to the NFL through July 31 of 
2023.
    What sort of metrics does the team report, and do these 
metrics provide an accurate picture of the Commanders' 
workplace culture?
    Mr. Goodell. They actually don't give it to us. It's put in 
a report. It's actually gathered by an independent firm, Vestry 
Laight. They go in. They meet with employees. They meet with 
the executives, as well as HR, and anybody they wish. They have 
full access. The report that we saw in February that was shared 
with all of you indicated a substantial transformation of the 
organization. Many of those that were in the organization said 
that it's a major change and a positive change, and something 
where they feel that they're in an organization that they're 
proud of and they think that the policies that have been 
implemented by the Commanders and the executives all way up to 
the ownership are productive and helpful.
    Mr. Keller. So they're doing everything that's been put in 
place by the NFL to create a culture that would be an 
acceptable workplace environment?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes.
    Mr. Keller. They're meeting----
    Mr. Goodell. They're clearly--I'm sorry.
    Mr. Keller. They're meeting their goals, I guess is my 
question, in the things that they've been asked to do?
    Mr. Goodell. I think this work is something that is you 
never achieve the goal line. I think you have to continue to 
work on this, but I think the steps that have been taken, the 
recommendations made by Beth Wilkinson that were implemented by 
the Commanders, the executives and the ownership have taken 
this seriously and made significant changes to their 
organization. There will be more work to do. We all have more 
work to do.
    Mr. Keller. Yes. But I guess the point is, everything 
they've been asked to comply with, they've been complying with, 
as they should----
    Mr. Goodell. That is correct.
    Mr. Keller. That is correct. The Commanders have been fined 
$10 million following the initial investigation into the matter 
last year among other penalties.
    If the Commanders have been meeting the required outcomes 
of what the NFL has put forth--and you say of course there's 
always training and things that we need to do. But they're made 
this progress and been doing the things that the other 
organizations have been doing, quite frankly, why do we need to 
have you here to today?
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired.
    The gentleman may answer the question.
    Mr. Goodell. As I said, Congressman, I was invited. I think 
I wanted the opportunity to say that we really have made 
significant changes to the Commanders' organization. They 
have--and I think it's an important lesson and instructive in 
the sense of making sure that we have participation of the 
employees in identifying what the culture is, identifying the 
efforts and making sure independent people look at that and 
make recommendations and those recommendations are implemented 
through organizations so that they can get better.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Gentleman's time has expired.
    Mr. Keller. The NFL's going to continue doing that. And I'm 
glad they are. I'm glad you're doing those things in the NFL, 
so people have a safe place to work. I think now the Committee 
can focus on things they should be focused on to help the 
American people----
    Mr. Johnson. Madam Chair.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired.
    Mr. Johnson from Georgia is recognized. Mr. Johnson from 
Georgia.
    Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Madam Chair. And I would implore my 
colleagues on the other side of the aisle to have respect for 
the chair and to cease and desist conversation when that gavel 
comes down.
    Mr. Goodell, credible, numerous and serious allegations of 
sexual misconduct have been made against the Washington 
Commanders and owner Dan Snyder, who also stands accused of 
maintaining a toxic work environment that victimizes female 
employees of the organizations. It should be noted that Mr. 
Snyder turned down an invitation to appear before this 
Committee, and I thank you for agreeing to appear before us 
today. And you do so because you understand that Congress has 
granted the NFL an exception from the antitrust laws, which 
enables NFL teams to collaborate on TV contracts. And the NFL 
does not want Congress to tamper with that antitrust exemption, 
am I correct, Mr. Goodell?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, we do--I'm here because I feel it's our 
responsibility to do that and----
    Mr. Johnson. You would never refuse a request by the 
Committee to come to testify before the Committee because 
you're concerned about what Congress can do about the NFL's 
antitrust exemption; isn't that correct?
    Mr. Goodell. If I could, let me just address the first part 
of the question.
    Mr. Johnson. Well, I just want to get a yes-or-no answer 
for that question.
    Mr. Goodell. It's not a yes-or-no answer.
    Mr. Johnson. It is. It is, Mr. Goodell. Please, cooperate 
with me now.
    Mr. Goodell. I'm trying to, sir.
    Mr. Johnson. I'm working with you. Just answer my question, 
sir. I mean the reason why you come is because you respect our 
ability to tamper with the NFL's exemption--antitrust 
exemption, correct?
    Mr. Goodell. I'm here because I believe you should hear our 
experience with the Washington Commanders as I said. Second, 
regarding the answer----
    Mr. Johnson. OK. All right. Well, let me move on.
    Mr. Goodell. I'm trying to address your antitrust 
exemption. I think the antitrust exemption that was put back in 
early 1960's has been very good----
    Mr. Johnson. It has been very profitable for the NFL, and 
I'm going to reclaim my time.
    Mr. Goodell. OK.
    Mr. Johnson. The findings of NFL's investigation into 
allegations of sexual harassment by Dan Snyder and the 
Commanders organization remains secret, and Mr. Snyder has, 
himself, has not been held accountable by the NFL. 
Additionally, the NFL has entered into an agreement with Dan 
Snyder, which prevents the findings of the internal 
investigation from coming to light. Every step of the way, the 
NFL appears to have been part of a cover up that has resulted 
in credible allegations of the maintenance of a culture of 
sexual harassment at the Washington Commanders being swept 
under the rug.
    Meanwhile, for all we know, women working for Washington 
Commanders are still being subjected to a hostile workplace 
environment while the NFL has stood by Dan Snyder. Statements 
that the NFL has held Dan Snyder accountable are impossible to 
verify because of your unwillingness to reveal the findings of 
the internal investigation. With the antitrust exemption that 
the NFL enjoys, which has enabled it to be wildly profitable as 
an enterprise, it is no secret that the influence your company 
has in the Nation and across the world, Mr. Goodell, is 
fundamental.
    Why not use this as an opportunity to positively influence 
the public by holding Dan Snyder accountable for his actions?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, we believe we have held him accountable. 
As we said, we had an independent investigation.
    Mr. Johnson. In what way have you held him accountable?
    Mr. Goodell. He was fined over $10 million. He stepped away 
from the organization now for a year. He's required----
    Mr. Johnson. So the organization--so the investigation then 
has been completed if it has resulted in a fine. Why haven't 
those results been released to the public?
    Mr. Goodell. We released a summary report, which as I 
stated----
    Mr. Johnson. Why not the full report?
    Mr. Goodell. Because there is no full written report.
    Mr. Johnson. Why not?
    Mr. Goodell. We had an oral report.
    Mr. Johnson. Why has there not been a full written report 
rendered on this very important issue?
    Mr. Goodell. There was a five-page report that not only 
talked about our findings in a summary form, it talked about 
the toxic organization and the facts that we needed to 
implement new policies and procedures there. We've put those 
recommendations from the independent investigator, Beth 
Wilkinson, and they implemented and adopted each of those ten 
recommendations----
    Mr. Johnson. A five-page report, Mr. Goodell, is----
    Mr. Comer. His time has expired----
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired. The 
gentleman's time has expired.
    I will now call upon Mr. Gibbs from Ohio.
    You're now recognized, Mr. Gibbs, for five minutes.
    Mr. Gibbs. Yes, thank you.
    First, before I yield my time, I want to associate myself 
with the comments made by Ranking Member Comer about I hope we 
have some hearings in the future with Secretaries, Cabinet 
Secretaries dealing with our border, dealing with our energy 
crisis. We've not had a Cabinet Secretary before this Committee 
this Congress. It would be nice to have that.
    And so I want to yield the rest of my time to Congressman 
Burgess Owens, former NFL football player. I yield my time.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you. Thank you so much for that.
    And thank you, Chairwoman Maloney----
    Mr. Johnson. Madam Chair, I have a parliamentary inquiry.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman may ask his parliamentary 
inquiry.
    Mr. Johnson. Yes. Is it proper for a Congressman who or 
Congressperson who does not serve on a committee but has been 
waived onto the Committee to participate in the questioning of 
a witness without any further proceedings?
    Chairwoman Maloney. He's been waived onto the Committee. 
And, yes, you can have a member on the Committee yield their 
time to a waived-on committee member.
    Mr. Johnson. Thank you. And I yield back.
    Mr. Owens. And, Chairwoman, can I----
    Chairwoman Maloney. Mr. Owens, you're now recognized.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you. Can I also reclaim the time just 
taken a few minutes from me, please?
    Chairwoman Maloney. Yes, you can.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you so much.
    I want to thank again Chairwoman Maloney, Ranking Member 
Comer, and members of the Committee for holding this hearing 
and especially for allowing me to participate.
    I'd like to thank Commissioner Goodell for coming to the 
Committee today. It's long been a long dream of mine to ask the 
commissioner some questions. And I'm going to take a little 
different tack, something I'm very, very concerned about with 
the NFL.
    The term ``racism'' is thrown around today with alarming 
casual frequency. For example, according to Newsweek, requiring 
Black individuals to get an ID to vote is racist. According to 
NBC News, requiring college applicants to include letters of 
recommendation in their application is racist. And my absolute 
favorite, a recent USA Today headline asking if math is racist.
    What's truly racist is this condescending soft bigotry of 
low expectation that have far too long plagued my community. It 
was prevalent when I entered the NFL in 1973 when it was 
understood that certain positions were reserved for Whites 
only. Positions of leadership and intelligence, like 
quarterback, center, middle linebacker, free safety, and head 
coaches, were considered off limits to Black Americans.
    Doug Williams finally broke the White quarterback barrier 
in 1988 as the NFL's first Black quarterback to both start and 
win a Super Bowl championship.
    Yet, Commissioner, decades later, despite all this progress 
on and off the field, we're once again forced to discuss under 
your watch the NFL's engagement in racism behind the scenes.
    In June 2021, the NFL was forced to announce it was ending 
its practice of race-norming when paying out compensation to 
players experiencing brain damage due to concussions on the 
field. The NFL has for years used separate tests based on race 
to score players' cognitive threshold. The test taken by Black 
players was different than that by White players. The result 
determined if financial compensation was warranted.
    Doctors were required to use race-based norms that assumed 
Black players were inherently less intelligent than their White 
teammates. If this sounds like a throwback to the Jim Crow laws 
of the Deep South, that's because it is.
    This practice came to an end only after lawsuits against 
the league by two former Black NFL players who were 
accidentally given the cognitive tests normally reserved for 
White players. When they both qualified for compensation, the 
NFL demanded that they be tested again. This time, when the 
clinician applied the race-norming algorithm recommended by the 
NFL program manual, they were denied compensation.
    As a result of this practice, the NFL compensated injured 
Black players and their families less than White players and 
their families. To say that Black players should be judged by a 
lower standard of brain function than their White teammates is 
without question a perfect example of real racism.
    Commissioner, due to the time I have to ask you a couple of 
questions, just want some yes or noes if you wouldn't mind.
    Do you acknowledge that, until 2021, the race-norming 
algorithm was used to evaluate intelligence of Black players as 
part of the NFL class action settlement?
    Mr. Goodell. Was it a specific time that you're asking 
about? But this, as you know, I think this was--this is an 
issue that was part of a settlement with our former players. A 
Federal judge oversaw it. Race-norming is not just used in the 
NFL.
    Mr. Owens. But, Commissioner, if you wouldn't mind, yes, 
this was back in the 2013 settlement. Did you recognize the 
race-norming algorithm was part of that settlement? You 
commented on that, and I know the NFL's apologized for that.
    Mr. Goodell. Yes. The Federal--yes, the two parties agreed 
to that because it was a standard medical procedure.
    Mr. Owens. All right. So----
    Mr. Goodell. What we agreed to do just recently is----
    Mr. Owens. Reclaiming my time. I'd like to reclaim my time.
    Mr. Goodell. Sure.
    Mr. Owens. Thank you so much.
    Do you agree that the NFL's use of a scale for Black 
Americans versus those of any other race is the definition of 
systemic racism? Real simple, yes or no?
    Mr. Goodell. It was not required by any doctor to use those 
standards, and we have adopted new standards approved by the 
Federal judge.
    Mr. Comer. If it was not required, then why was it used? 
Because in the day there were separate tests used for Blacks 
and Whites.
    Mr. Goodell. Because that was the method--that's a medical 
standard far beyond the NFL.
    Mr. Owens. OK. So that being said, I know you apologized 
for it. The NFL's apologized.
    I'll just say--let me just say this real quickly. Speaking 
on behalf of my Black and White brothers who gave their careers 
to make sure that we got past racism, this is an atrocity. And 
the fact the NFL has judged Black people at a different rate in 
intelligence than White people is something that needs to be 
looked at.
    I look forward to having this conversation with you when 
we--as we get into the coming months.
    And I thank you, and I'll yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman yields back.
    Mr. Goodell. Congressman----
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlewoman from Michigan, Ms. 
Tlaib, is now recognized.
    Mr. Goodell. May I----
    Ms. Tlaib. Thank you so much.
    Mr. Goodell. May I----
    Ms. Tlaib. And I just want to commend my colleague. You 
know, this is why lived experience is so incredibly important.
    As a survivor of sexual harassment in my first job outside 
of college, I can tell you it is so incredibly important that 
Congress leads on this issue in making sure that everyone is 
safe away from discrimination. Again, that can be incredibly 
traumatic and can last a very long time with people as they 
move from career to career.
    You know, when dozens of women came forward with 
allegations of attacks at workplace at the Commanders, team 
owner Dan Snyder stated, and I quote, ``I have admittedly been 
too hands-off as an owner and allowed others to have day-to-day 
control, to the detriment of our organization.''
    Commissioner, you were personally briefed on internal 
investigation into the Commanders, as you know. And sitting 
here today, do you believe that Dan Snyder was a hands-off team 
owner? Was he a hands-off team owner, sir?
    Mr. Goodell. In my judgment----
    Ms. Tinker. Yes or no, was he hands-off?
    Mr. Goodell. The owner is responsible for the workplace.
    Ms. Tlaib. The Committee has recently obtained evidence 
that shows exactly how involved Dan Snyder was in fueling the 
toxic workplace environment. The Committee conducted a 
deposition of Dave Pauken, who was chief operating officer of 
the Commanders for a number of years. He worked with Mr. Snyder 
every single day.
    Do you want to know? He said basically--this is what he 
said to us--that he said, quote, ``Both hands on when it came 
to Mr. Snyder.'' So he's very directly involved.
    Mr. Pauken also detailed his role in decisions, big and 
small. And I'd like to talk about one of those decisions if I 
may, Commissioner, that I found particularly troubling.
    In the fall of 2002, the team hired a new head coach who, 
according to Mr. Pauken, quote, ``groped a member,'' ``groped a 
member of the public relations staff at an event.''
    According to Mr. Pauken, he consulted with Mr. Snyder about 
what to do, even though, as he said, quote, ``I knew what we 
were going to do.''
    Do you know what that--what he was talking about, 
Commissioner, here? And, of course, it was nothing. He was 
going to do nothing. Mr. Pauken said that he, Mr. Snyder, 
decided, quote, ``We weren't going to confront the new coach.''
    Commissioner Goodell, Mr. Pauken participated in a number 
of interviews with the law firm handling internal 
investigation. Has NFL looked into these allegations against 
the former coach?
    Mr. Goodell. Listen, all of those allegations----
    Ms. Tlaib. Has he?
    Mr. Goodell [continuing]. Should be treated seriously.
    Ms. Tlaib. Has he? You're working with the firm.
    Mr. Goodell. All----
    Ms. Tlaib. Has he, sir?
    Mr. Goodell. All these allegations have been treated very 
seriously.
    Ms. Tlaib. So the allegation of groping a public relations 
staffer was investigated?
    Mr. Goodell. All I can tell you is we hired an independent 
investigator to look at the whole thing.
    Ms. Tlaib. Yes, got it. I got it. They did the same thing 
in that previous job I was at. They did the same thing and 
wrote it off.
    Committee staff conducted another deposition, Commissioner, 
this time of former president of business operations, a CEO, 
Brian Lafemina. He testified that he raised allegations----
    Mr. Goodell. Lafemina.
    Ms. Tlaib. Sorry, sir. I know. Made by Rachel Engleson, a 
former Commanders employee, about the misconduct of Commanders 
executive Larry Michael.
    Ms. Engleson alleged that Mr. Michael, quote, ``would touch 
her face in an unwanted fashion, talk about her looks in front 
of large audiences, and kiss her.''
    Mr. Lafemina says that he brought these allegations to Mr. 
Snyder's attention in July 2018. According to Mr. Lafemina, Mr. 
Snyder's response was, quote, ``Larry was a sweetheart, and 
Larry wouldn't hurt anybody.''
    Two years later, in July 2020, Mr. Michael resigned from 
the club after seven--I repeat--seven former employees said he 
routinely discussed the physical appearance of female 
colleagues in sexual and disparaging overtones. He even made 
crude comments about an intern.
    Take a listen to what he said, Commissioner, if we can play 
the audio, please.
    [Audio recording played.]
    Ms. Tlaib. Unbelievable. So disgusting.
    Mr. Snyder wasn't hands-off. He simply turned a blind eye 
to the conduct he didn't want us all to see, right? This is all 
too common in the American workplace.
    Commissioner Goodell, is this an acceptable way to run a 
team?
    Mr. Goodell. That example you just showed me is not 
acceptable and it's why we went into this investigation.
    Ms. Tlaib. Could have been your daughter, sir. It could 
have--I mean, it literally is disgusting.
    Mr. Goodell. I completely agree with that.
    Ms. Tlaib. Would you commit to doing more? I mean, right 
now you keep saying you did everything possible. You're 
setting--you have to do more. Yes or no, are you willing to do 
more?
    Mr. Goodell. Yes, of course I'm willing to do more. I never 
said that we are actually going to stop. I actually said the 
opposite. We will continue to----
    Ms. Tlaib. But you had a report that recommended Dan Snyder 
be removed as a team owner. You can recommend that Dan Snyder 
be removed as a team owner.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlelady's time has expired. The 
gentleman may answer her question.
    Your time has expired.
    You may answer her question. Should Dan Snyder be removed?
    Mr. Goodell. I think I answered----
    Ms. Tlaib. Remove him. Will you remove him?
    Mr. Goodell. I don't have the authority to remove him, 
Congresswoman.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The time has expired.
    The gentleman from Texas, Mr. Sessions, is recognized for 
five minutes. And votes have been called. OK.
    Mr. Sessions. Madam Chairman, thank you very much. I 
appreciate you and Mr. Comer trying to work together.
    Commissioner, I want to thank you for taking time to be 
with us today. I think you've heard that Congress is sometimes 
assertive about some of the ideas that we have. But I thank you 
for taking your time to be here, I think answering questions 
that dealt with someone else's behavior; also your own, because 
as commissioner you have a responsibility for the league.
    I want to thank you for trying to work with people across 
the spectrum--athletes, coaches, fans, television networks, 
owners--and to tell that you I think that from my perspective--
and I have been a football fan for many, many years. Jerry 
Jones is a very close and dear friend of mine. And I've watched 
Mr. Jones and the Cowboys, as well as almost every other team 
in the league, to be able to work through athletes' 
circumstances and things that happen.
    I think you've done an outstanding job, and I think that it 
said volumes to me about the changes that had been made within 
the Commander organization.
    I think that we're all entitled to make mistakes, and I 
think we're entitled to try and make up for it. I think it says 
volumes that you as commissioner will lead the effort to have 
conversations not just with owners, but really the teams that 
are involved about that which you believe would be in the best 
interest of the league, because that is really what your job 
is.
    But, Commissioner, I want to say this to you. I think it's 
also important that we here in Congress recognize we're not 
perfect either, and we do things that can be seen in ways that 
are not always the same way everybody in Congress would want.
    But I have watched in this town over the last few years 
about an attack against Dan Snyder, an attack at the former 
Redskins organization, because of the name that was selected 
many, many, many years ago and a team and a name that became 
influential across the country in a positive fashion, positive 
fashion not just with perhaps African-American athletes but 
other athletes who chose to come and play here.
    But, Mr. Commissioner, I want you to know that this 
organization here in Congress makes mistakes also, and 
sometimes those mistakes are letting us get ahead of a 
professional conversation that we need to have with a 
conversation that is perhaps political.
    And I want to show an article that was in Politico that 
discussed this very directly where it was assumed that this 
could be fundraising fodder, a reason to get rid of Dan Snyder 
in this town by Members of this organization, as a matter of 
fact, not just Members of this organization but chairman of the 
House Oversight Subcommittee.
    And, Mr. Commissioner, I want you to know that I think we'd 
like to invite you back next year. I think you have a story to 
tell that is one of significance and one of taking many, many 
people, diverse backgrounds, people who are, sure, in the 
entertainment industry, but people who also stand up as heroes 
to many of our children.
    And I think that you've done a great job in taking these 
men, who by all accounts may not have had the greatest of life. 
Perhaps they've turned themself into something better. I could 
think about Don Perkins. I could think about lots of people 
with the Dallas Cowboys that I've watched, Calvin Hill, a 
number of people that have used their position in society as a 
result of their athletic ability. Their credentialing has 
helped them in life.
    Bill Glass, a personal friend of my family's, became a 
Christian minister and helped those who were in prison as a 
result of his direct observations from working in the NFL about 
diverse people.
    So I think that there's a great story to tell, and none of 
us are perfect.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired.
    Mr. Sessions. But we do represent ideas.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired.
    Mr. Sessions. And I hope that you'll accept our invitation 
to come back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman's time has expired.
    Mr. Sessions. I yield back my time and thank the 
gentlewoman.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlelady from California, Jackie 
Speier, is recognized for five minutes.
    Ms. Speier. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    I apologize for also having the National Defense 
Authorization Act up in Armed Services.
    Commissioner, you announced at the conclusion of a 10-month 
internal investigation, and despite hundreds of interviews, you 
insisted that there was no written report. And yet documents 
obtained by the committee reveal that the NFL agreed to a 
written report when it took control of the investigation.
    I'd like us to put that up on the screen.
    In the very first paragraph it says, and I quote, ``As part 
of the investigation, Wilkinson Walsh will complete a written 
report of its findings.''
    Is this the agreement you signed, yes or no?
    Mr. Goodell. I have never seen the agreement before, 
Congressperson, but I know that we signed an engagement letter 
that was essentially the same engagement letter that was signed 
by the Washington Commanders.
    Ms. Speier. All right. So you made the decision to receive 
an oral rather than a written report. Is that correct?
    Mr. Goodell. We did in October of that year on the basis 
of----
    Ms. Speier. OK.
    Mr. Goodell [continuing]. Providing confidentiality to the 
people who came forward. It was important to----
    Ms. Speier. But that's bogus because those--reclaiming my 
time.
    The survivors have begged you to release that report. It is 
the Commanders, it's Dan Snyder that had PIs hired to 
intimidate them and show up at their doorsteps.
    So the question is, did you ever--were you ever aware of a 
written report or were you ever aware of a PowerPoint 
presentation, yes or no?
    Mr. Goodell. I am not aware of that. And I want to clarify 
something you said in respect to the people coming forward. 
People coming forward, their confidentiality was important to 
them. Some have come forward and not been concerned about their 
privacy or confidentiality. But there are many others, the vast 
majority of the people that were spoken to in the context of 
this investigation, have wanted to continue their privacy and 
their confidentiality.
    Ms. Speier. Will you free Beth Wilkinson----
    Mr. Goodell. So we respected that.
    Ms. Speier. Will you free Beth Wilkinson to be able to 
speak freely about the findings from her internal investigation 
with this Committee?
    Mr. Goodell. As we've said many times before in the context 
of this, the details and the investigation of Beth Wilkinson 
are privileged. We're going to protect the----
    Ms. Speier. We're asking you----
    Mr. Goodell [continuing]. Confidentiality and privacy----
    Ms. Speier. We're asking you----
    Mr. Goodell [continuing]. Of those people who came forward.
    Ms. Speier. We're asking you whether or not--OK. Let me ask 
you this then.
    For those victims that would like to have the report 
released as it relates to them, will you release that?
    Mr. Goodell. We couldn't do that and protect the 
confidentiality. That's an issue of privilege.
    Ms. Speier. That's not true. You could----
    Mr. Goodell. Well, Congresswoman----
    Ms. Speier. No, not if the victims are willing to have that 
information about themselves released.
    Mr. Goodell. I'm not an attorney, but we can't waive 
privilege for some that would impact others, I don't believe. 
But we--I'm happy to have our attorneys be able to address that 
with you. I'm not an attorney.
    Ms. Speier. So the Carolina Panthers, there was an 
investigation of them two years before the Commanders 
investigation. They included several recommendations for the 
league to strengthen its protection of workers. One was a 
specific prohibition to nondisclosure agreements to limit 
reporting of potential violations.
    Did the league ever adopt that recommendation?
    Mr. Goodell. Mary Jo White made four recommendations. I 
think that's what you're referring to. We've implemented three 
of the four.
    The one we didn't, that we were concerned with, was that 
all workplace functions--excuse me--violations or allegations 
had to be reported to our office. We don't think we're situated 
to be able to handle all that. But, obviously, that's something 
that the individual clubs are going to have to be able to 
address their own workplace.
    Ms. Speier. Would you----
    Mr. Goodell. If there's violation of law or a personal 
conduct policy, that will be reported to us.
    Ms. Speier. All right. Reclaiming my time. Reclaiming my 
time.
    Would you put in place a prohibition that nondisclosure 
agreements cannot be used by the various organizations under 
the NFL?
    Mr. Goodell. Well, I think this is similar to what the 
Chairwoman mentioned in your legislation, and we said that we 
are operating on the basis that nondisclosure agreements cannot 
prevent a witness from coming forward and sharing the 
information with us. We understand the legislation----
    Ms. Speier. I'm just asking what you would do 
professionally yourself.
    Mr. Goodell. Right now we're--we do not let our employees--
excuse me--our employees to use a nondisclosure agreement to 
not to cooperate with a league investigation.
    Ms. Speier. So nondisclosure agreements by each of your 
various teams are not being used? Is that what you're saying?
    Mr. Goodell. No, I'm not saying that.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentlelady's time has expired.
    The gentleman may answer her question.
    Mr. Goodell. I'm not saying that. state by state, our teams 
operate in different states. They have different laws. So the 
Federal legislation is something that we're willing to work 
with the Committee on.
    Chairwoman Maloney. Thank you. The gentleman's time has 
expired.
    And before we close, I want to offer the ranking member an 
opportunity to offer any closing remarks he may have.
    Ranking Member Comer, you are now recognized.
    Mr. Comer. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    And let me thank Commissioner Goodell for testifying here 
today. Really appreciate that and the conversation.
    And let me summarize what we heard today from two and a 
half hours of the testimony is that there was a toxic work 
culture at the Washington Redskins football team. The NFL came 
in, had independent auditors come in. They identified the 
problem. Those people were held accountable. They were 
terminated. And the NFL has ongoing investigations into this. 
And from what we've heard today, the problems have been fixed 
and the organization moves on.
    We don't believe this was a role of Congress. We don't 
think this was a good use of congressional time. We don't think 
that was a good use of taxpayer dollars.
    Madam Chair, before I close, I want to let Mr. Goodell know 
that I will be sending two additional questions for the record, 
and, obviously, he can't answer because the Committee's over, 
but just want to publicly say what those questions will be.
    No. 1, it's been reported that you retained former U.S. 
Attorney General Loretta Lynch to investigate a former minority 
shareholder for his involvement in manufacturing false 
allegations about Mr. Snyder. Is that true? That's the first 
question.
    The last question. It has also been reported that, after 
reviewing Attorney General Lynch's investigation, you 
permanently banned that minority shareholder from ever owning 
an NFL team or otherwise participating in business 
relationships with the NFL. Is that true?
    And I think the answers to those two questions might solve 
some of the uncertainty that still remains about the Washington 
football team.
    With that, Madam Chair, thank you, and I yield back.
    Chairwoman Maloney. The gentleman yields back.
    In closing, I want to thank you, Commissioner Goodell, for 
appearing before us today. We appreciate very much your 
testimony and your willingness----
    Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Madam Chair? Madam Chair, this is 
Debbie Wasserman Schultz.
    Chairwoman Maloney. We are in closing right now and I have 
to get to the floor to vote. So I have to close right now.
    We appreciate your testimony. And as we learned today, the 
Committee's investigation has uncovered new evidence of 
troubling conduct at the Washington Commanders' workplace.
    And as we heard today, the Commissioner agreed that this 
conduct was incredibly serious. In fact, he testified that he 
has, quote, ``not seen any workplace in the NFL that is 
anywhere near what we saw,'' end quote.
    I am happy that Commissioner Goodell recognizes that the 
NFL has one of the most influential platforms in America and 
that Mr. Snyder's actions were unacceptable. Unfortunately, Mr. 
Goodell has not agreed to release the findings from the NFL's 
internal investigation. Without transparency, we cannot have 
true accountability.
    That is why I announced my intent to issue a subpoena to 
Daniel Snyder to appear for a deposition next week. We will not 
be deterred by billionaire owners or political posturing. The 
victims demand answers, and we all demand justice.
    I want to briefly address some questions raised today about 
the Committee's jurisdiction. To be clear, what I was conveying 
earlier is that the Oversight Committee has broad investigative 
authority under House Rule X to investigate any matters within 
Congress' legislative power.
    As I also explained earlier, this Committee has a long 
bipartisan history of investigating workplace conduct in 
professional sports, including sexual misconduct.
    This investigation has already led to two bills that I 
introduced to help strengthen protections for workers from 
workplace misconduct.
    I would invite all of my colleagues on both sides of the 
aisle to join me in supporting these efforts. The Committee 
will not waiver in our efforts to conduct this investigation to 
ensure that women and all Americans are protected in the 
workplace.
    With that, and in closing, I want to thank our panelist 
again for your remarks. And I want to commend my colleagues for 
participating in this important conversation.
    With that, without objection, all members will have five 
legislative days within which to submit extraneous materials 
and to submit additional written questions for the witnesses to 
the chair, which will be forwarded to the witnesses for 
response.
    I ask our witness to please respond as promptly as 
possible. Again, thank you for your attendance today.
    This hearing is adjourned, and I hope I can make the vote.
    [Whereupon, at 1:38 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]