[House Hearing, 117 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                   THE GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION'S 
                      PRIORITIES FOR 2021 AND BEYOND

=======================================================================

                                (117-31)

                             REMOTE HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                            SUBCOMMITTEE ON
    ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, PUBLIC BUILDINGS, AND EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT

                                 OF THE

                              COMMITTEE ON
                   TRANSPORTATION AND INFRASTRUCTURE
                        HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS

                             FIRST SESSION

                               __________

                            NOVEMBER 2, 2021

                               __________

                       Printed for the use of the
             Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure
             
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     Available online at: https://www.govinfo.gov/committee/house-
     transportation?path=/browsecommittee/chamber/house/committee/
                             transportation
                             
                              __________

                    U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
47-038 PDF                 WASHINGTON : 2022                     
          
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------  


             COMMITTEE ON TRANSPORTATION AND INFRASTRUCTURE

  PETER A. DeFAZIO, Oregon, Chair
SAM GRAVES, Missouri                 ELEANOR HOLMES NORTON,
DON YOUNG, Alaska                      District of Columbia
ERIC A. ``RICK'' CRAWFORD, Arkansas  EDDIE BERNICE JOHNSON, Texas
BOB GIBBS, Ohio                      RICK LARSEN, Washington
DANIEL WEBSTER, Florida              GRACE F. NAPOLITANO, California
THOMAS MASSIE, Kentucky              STEVE COHEN, Tennessee
SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania            ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey
RODNEY DAVIS, Illinois               JOHN GARAMENDI, California
JOHN KATKO, New York                 HENRY C. ``HANK'' JOHNSON, Jr., 
BRIAN BABIN, Texas                   Georgia
GARRET GRAVES, Louisiana             ANDRE CARSON, Indiana
DAVID ROUZER, North Carolina         DINA TITUS, Nevada
MIKE BOST, Illinois                  SEAN PATRICK MALONEY, New York
RANDY K. WEBER, Sr., Texas           JARED HUFFMAN, California
DOUG LaMALFA, California             JULIA BROWNLEY, California
BRUCE WESTERMAN, Arkansas            FREDERICA S. WILSON, Florida
BRIAN J. MAST, Florida               DONALD M. PAYNE, Jr., New Jersey
MIKE GALLAGHER, Wisconsin            ALAN S. LOWENTHAL, California
BRIAN K. FITZPATRICK, Pennsylvania   MARK DeSAULNIER, California
JENNIFFER GONZALEZ-COLON,            STEPHEN F. LYNCH, Massachusetts
  Puerto Rico                        SALUD O. CARBAJAL, California
TROY BALDERSON, Ohio                 ANTHONY G. BROWN, Maryland
PETE STAUBER, Minnesota              TOM MALINOWSKI, New Jersey
TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee              GREG STANTON, Arizona
DUSTY JOHNSON, South Dakota          COLIN Z. ALLRED, Texas
JEFFERSON VAN DREW, New Jersey       SHARICE DAVIDS, Kansas, Vice Chair
MICHAEL GUEST, Mississippi           JESUS G. ``CHUY'' GARCIA, Illinois
TROY E. NEHLS, Texas                 ANTONIO DELGADO, New York
NANCY MACE, South Carolina           CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire
NICOLE MALLIOTAKIS, New York         CONOR LAMB, Pennsylvania
BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas                SETH MOULTON, Massachusetts
CARLOS A. GIMENEZ, Florida           JAKE AUCHINCLOSS, Massachusetts
MICHELLE STEEL, California           CAROLYN BOURDEAUX, Georgia
                                     KAIALI`I KAHELE, Hawaii
                                     MARILYN STRICKLAND, Washington
                                     NIKEMA WILLIAMS, Georgia
                                     MARIE NEWMAN, Illinois
                                     TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
                                
                                ------                                7

      Subcommittee on Economic Development, Public Buildings, and
                          Emergency Management

     DINA TITUS, Nevada, Chair
DANIEL WEBSTER, Florida              ELEANOR HOLMES NORTON,
THOMAS MASSIE, Kentucky                District of Columbia
JENNIFFER GONZALEZ-COLON,            SHARICE DAVIDS, Kansas
  Puerto Rico                        CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire, Vice 
MICHAEL GUEST, Mississippi           Chair
BETH VAN DUYNE, Texas                GRACE F. NAPOLITANO, California
CARLOS A. GIMENEZ, Florida           JOHN GARAMENDI, California
SAM GRAVES, Missouri (Ex Officio)    TROY A. CARTER, Louisiana
                                     PETER A. DeFAZIO, Oregon (Ex 
                                     Officio)

                              CONTENTS

                                                                   Page

Summary of Subject Matter........................................     v

                 STATEMENTS OF MEMBERS OF THE COMMITTEE

Hon. Dina Titus, a Representative in Congress from the State of 
  Nevada, and Chair, Subcommittee on Economic Development, Public 
  Buildings, and Emergency Management, opening statement.........     1
    Prepared statement...........................................     3
Hon. Daniel Webster, a Representative in Congress from the State 
  of Florida, and Ranking Member, Subcommittee on Economic 
  Development, Public Buildings, and Emergency Management, 
  opening statement..............................................     4
    Prepared statement...........................................     4
Hon. Peter A. DeFazio, a Representative in Congress from the 
  State of Oregon, and Chair, Committee on Transportation and 
  Infrastructure, opening statement..............................     5
    Prepared statement...........................................     6
Hon. Sam Graves, a Representative in Congress from the State of 
  Missouri, and Ranking Member, Committee on Transportation and 
  Infrastructure, prepared statement.............................    33

                               WITNESSES

Hon. Robin Carnahan, Administrator, U.S. General Services 
  Administration, oral statement.................................     7
    Prepared statement...........................................     9
Nina Albert, Commissioner, Public Buildings Service, U.S. General 
  Services Administration, oral statement \\.............    12

                                APPENDIX

Questions to the U.S. General Services Administration from:
    Hon. Peter A. DeFazio........................................    35
    Hon. Eleanor Holmes Norton...................................    37
Questions to Hon. Robin Carnahan, Administrator, U.S. General 
  Services Administration, from:
    Hon. Sharice Davids..........................................    38
    Hon. Daniel Webster..........................................    39

----------
 Nina Albert, Commissioner, Public Buildings Service, U.S. 
General Services Administration, did not submit a prepared statement.

[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]


                            November 2, 2021

    SUMMARY OF SUBJECT MATTER

    TO:      LMembers, Subcommittee on Economic Development, 
Public Buildings, and Emergency Management
    FROM:  LStaff, Subcommittee on Economic Development, Public 
Buildings, and Emergency Management
    RE:      LHearing on ``The General Services 
Administration's Priorities for 2021 and Beyond.''
_______________________________________________________________________


                                PURPOSE

    The Subcommittee on Economic Development, Public Buildings, 
and Emergency Management will meet on Tuesday, November 2, 
2021, at 10:00 am EDT in 2167 Rayburn House Office Building and 
virtually via Zoom to hold a hearing titled, ``The General 
Services Administration's Priorities for 2021 and Beyond.'' At 
the hearing, Members will receive testimony from the 
Administrator of General Services and the General Services 
Administration's Public Buildings Commissioner.

                               BACKGROUND

    The General Services Administration (GSA) provides 
workspace for 1.2 million federal employees across more than 50 
federal agencies.\1\ GSA's Public Building Service (PBS) owns 
over 1,500 federal buildings.\2\ Approximately 53 percent of 
PBS's portfolio is over 50 years old, and 28 percent is over 75 
years old.\3\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \1\ https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/R/R46410
    \2\ https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/
GSA%20FY%202021%20Congressional%20Justification.pdf
    \3\ https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/
GSA%20FY%202021%20Congressional%20Justification.pdf
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    GSA's PBS leases approximately 8,100 office buildings, 
courthouses, land ports of entry, data processing centers, 
laboratories, and specialized space around the country for 
federal agencies.\4\ During the period from fiscal year (FY) 
2019 through FY 2023, 60 percent of PBS leases will expire.\5\ 
GSA's PBS portfolio is projected to include 183.4 million 
square feet of owned space and 183.5 million square feet of 
leased space in FY 2021.\6\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \4\ https://www.gsa.gov/real-estate/gsa-properties
    \5\ https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/
GSA%20FY%202021%20Congressional%20Justification.pdf
    \6\ https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/
GSA%20FY%202021%20Congressional%20Justification.pdf
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THE FEDERAL BUILDINGS FUND

    GSA's PBS and its activities are funded through GSA's 
Federal Buildings Fund (FBF).\7\ GSA enters into occupancy 
agreements with its federal agency tenants and charges 
commercially equivalent rent.\8\ Those rents fund the FBF.\9\ 
In turn, the FBF funds the operations of PBS, new construction, 
repairs and alterations, and payments for commercial leases. 
The availability of funds in the FBF are subject to annual 
appropriations.\10\
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    \7\ 40 U.S.C. Sec.  592
    \8\ 40 U.S.C. Sec.  586
    \9\ 40 U.S.C. Sec.  592
    \10\ 40 U.S.C. Sec.  3307
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    GSA has raised concerns that because Congress has not 
appropriated $10.3 billion in FBF rent collections over the 
last ten years, ``GSA is collecting commercially equivalent 
rent from its occupant agencies but is precluded from 
reinvesting all of these funds in the aging federal facilities 
occupied by those rent-paying agencies.'' \11\
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    \11\ https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/
02_FY_2022_CJ_FBF_Narrative_Final_2.pdf FBF-11
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    GSA's FY 22 budget requested:

        `` . . . positive net budget authority to adequately preserve 
        and invest in the Federal Government's real estate assets. 
        Providing positive net budget authority in FY 2022 will allow 
        GSA to begin addressing the liabilities resulting from the 
        $10.3 billion in unappropriated FBF [New Obligational 
        Authority] (NOA) over the last decade. Reduced budget authority 
        impedes PBS's ability to fund critical repairs and improvements 
        to the Federal inventory, resulting in avoidable increased 
        costs due to delayed repairs and missed opportunities to 
        consolidate space.'' \12\
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    \12\ Id.
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GSA'S PROCESS

    The Administrator of General Services (GSA) is authorized 
by 40 U.S.C. Sec.  585 to enter into lease agreements (of no 
more than 20 years) to secure space for federal agencies.\13\ 
GSA also acquires space through new construction or 
purchase.\14\
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    \13\ https://www.gsa.gov/cdnstatic/LDG-CHAPTER_INTRODUCTION-
FINAL_9-30-11final_508C.pdf
    \14\ 40 U.S.C. Sec. Sec.  3304, 3305
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    GSA's leasing process begins with the development of space 
requirements. Typically, GSA begins reaching out to expiring 
lease tenants approximately 24 months in advance of the 
expiration to determine whether a continuing need exists, and 
to notify the agency of the need to provide GSA with a request 
for space and begin development of the program of requirements. 
After the space requirements are developed and GSA agrees with 
and finalizes the documentation for the lease, if the lease 
cost is below the ``prospectus'' threshold currently at $3.095 
million, GSA begins the process of lease acquisition.\15\ If 
the lease costs is above the prospectus level, GSA develops a 
prospectus pursuant to 40 U.S.C. Sec.  3307 that includes 
details on the purpose, need, size, scope of the leased 
space.\16\ The prospectus is submitted in the House to the 
Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure and in the 
Senate to the Committee on Environment and Public Works. Both 
committees must approve via resolution each prospectus prior to 
GSA executing the lease.\17\
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    \15\ https://www.gsa.gov/real-estate/design-construction/gsa-
annual-prospectus-thresholds. FY22 threshold will increase to $3.375 
million, Letter dated January 4, 2021 from the General Services 
Administration to the Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure.
    \16\ 40 U.S.C. Sec.  3307.
    \17\ Id.
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    Similarly, for new construction, alteration, or purchase 
projects, GSA works with its tenant agencies on a program of 
requirements and committee action on a prospectus is required 
if the costs are above the prospectus threshold.

PROPOSED ALTERNATIVES TO ADDRESS FUNDING CHALLENGES

    Since 2011, the amount of funds available in the FBF for 
new construction and repairs and alternations has decreased 
below receipts received by GSA from its tenant agencies.\18\ In 
addition, reductions, consolidations, and reconfigurations of 
space to improve efficiency and decrease real estate costs 
often require capital upfront to execute such plans.\19\ Given 
this, a number of solutions have been proposed for alternative 
ways of funding projects, including public-private partnerships 
(P3s), discounted purchase options, and the creation of a new 
fund outside of GSA's FBF.
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    \18\ See appropriations acts beginning in FY2011
    \19\ See, for example, GSA's Consolidations Activities Program, 
Prospectus No. PCA-0001-MU21
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    While GSA has the legal authorities to carry out public-
private partnerships (P3s) and discounted purchase options, the 
Office of Management and Budget's (OMB) interpretation of 
budgetary scoring rules effectively prohibits GSA from using 
these alternatives.\20\ Specifically, OMB's interpretation of 
the budgetary scoring rules effectively would require GSA to 
have the full amount of budgetary authority for a project up 
front.\21\
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    \20\ OMB Circular A-11, Appendix B
    \21\ Id.
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GSA CLIMATE RESILIENCE STRATEGY

    President Biden's Executive Order 14008, Tackling the 
Climate Crisis at Home and Abroad, directed federal agencies to 
develop a climate resilience strategy.\22\ In response, GSA 
published a Climate Change Risk Management Plan in September 
2021.\23\ The plan identifies GSA's vulnerabilities to climate 
change and priorities for action.\24\
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    \22\ 86 FR 7619, pg. 7619-7633
    \23\ GSA. Climate Change Risk Management Plan. September 2021. 
Available at: Climate Change Risk Management Plan (sustainability.gov)
    \24\ Id.
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    GSA guidelines require it only lease properties outside of 
floodplains to mitigate the risk posed to its property.\25\ As 
floodplain maps are updated to account for climate change, GSA 
anticipates the availability of suitable leasing space will be 
restricted and higher rental costs more expensive as a 
result.\26\ GSA will also incorporate updated floodplain data 
into its Building Assessment Tool Survey to ensure owned 
property has service life of thirty years at minimum.\27\
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    \25\ Id.
    \26\ Id.
    \27\ Id.
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    Historic buildings within GSA's portfolio are vulnerable to 
climate change and natural disasters.\28\ Historic buildings 
were constructed using flood maps that do not reflect updates 
to 100-year and 500-year flood risks.\29\ The age and 
architecture of the buildings limit opportunities to make 
modifications that enhance resilience.\30\ Additionally, GSA's 
repair backlog has left properties within the federal real 
estate portfolio at greater risk to extreme weather events.\31\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \28\ Id.
    \29\ GSA. Climate Change Risk Management Plan. September 2021. 
Available at: Climate Change Risk Management Plan (sustainability.gov)
    \30\ Id.
    \31\ Id.
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    In September 2021, the Government Accountability Office 
(GAO) noted that the federal government has not made measurable 
progress to reduce its fiscal exposure to climate change.\32\ 
GSA filed a prospectus (PCR-0001-MU22) requesting one-hundred 
million dollars to make investments that will mitigate their 
financial losses in the long-term.\33\ The proposed use of 
these funds is to, ``conduct formal agency-wide vulnerability 
assessments to align with the climate science from the latest 
National Climate Assessment (NCA) and to fortify agency risk 
management efforts.'' \34\ Funds will also be used to execute 
projects which enhance GSA's access and use of data to 
determine vulnerabilities, update agency guidelines to account 
for climate change, train agency professionals to consider 
climate vulnerability, identify and map at-risk assets, and 
execute capital projects that new data and vulnerability 
assessments determine to be the highest priority.\35\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \32\ GAO. Federal Real Property Asset Management: Additional 
Direction in Government-Wide Guidance Could Enhance Natural Disaster 
Resilience. September 2021. Available at: GAO-21-596, Accessible 
Version, FEDERAL REAL PROPERTY ASSET MANAGEMENT: Additional Direction 
in Government-Wide Guidance Could Enhance Natural Disaster Resilience
    \33\ GSA. Prospectus--Alteration, Climate and Resilience Program, 
Various Buildings (PCR-0001-MU22).
    \34\ Id.
    \35\ Id.
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THE FEDERAL ASSETS SALE AND TRANSFER ACT

    The Federal Assets Sale and Transfer Act of 2016 (FASTA) 
(P.L. 114-287) established a new process for disposing of 
unneeded federal space. Under FASTA, federal agencies (except 
for the Department of Defense, the National Park Service, Coast 
Guard properties, properties located outside the United States 
that are operated or maintained by the Department of State or 
the Agency for International Development, properties controlled 
by Indian and Native Alaskan tribes, the USPS, and the 
Tennessee Valley Authority \36\) are required to develop a list 
of disposal recommendations, which could include the sale, 
transfer, conveyance, consolidation, or outlease of any 
unneeded space.\37\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \36\ https://www.crs.gov/Reports/
R44999?source=search&guid=ca749e38e3594abfbea82839c8844
c6c&index=0
    \37\ See P.L. 114-287.
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    The disposal of unneeded federal real property has been a 
long-standing management challenge for GSA and the federal 
government.\38\ In 2011, the Committee on Transportation and 
Infrastructure and the Obama Administration both proposed 
creating an independent board of experts to develop 
recommendations on specific properties to be disposed of or 
redeveloped for better use.\39\ The Committee, on a bipartisan 
basis, worked on crafting legislation culminating in the 
passage of FASTA in 2016.\40\ FASTA also made other changes in 
law, including codifying and clarifying requirements for the 
Federal Real Property Profile (FRPP) which is the government's 
database detailing all federal real estate assets.\41\
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    \38\ https://www.gao.gov/highrisk/managing-federal-real-property
    \39\ See Hearing on ``Sitting on Our Assets: Cutting Spending and 
Private Redevelopment of Underperforming Buildings,'' Subcommittee on 
Economic Development, Public Buildings, and Emergency Management, 
February 10, 2011 and Section 735, President's Budget Request for 
Fiscal Year 2012.
    \40\ See H.R. 1734, 112th Congress; H.R. 695, 113th Congress; H.R. 
4465, 114th Congress.
    \41\ https://www.gsa.gov/policy-regulations/policy/real-property-
policy/asset-management/federal-real-property-profile-frpp/frpp-
frequently-asked-questions
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The recommendations of the board pursuant to FASTA are 
submitted to the GSA Administrator, the OMB Director, and the 
newly established Public Buildings Reform Board (PBRB), an 
independent agency established by FASTA to identify 
opportunities for the federal government to significantly 
reduce its inventory of civilian real property. The revised 
list of recommendations is then vetted by the Public Buildings 
Reform Board and returned to the OMB Director for final 
approval or disapproval.\42\
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    \42\ https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/R/R44999
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    If the OMB Director approves a set of board 
recommendations, federal agencies must begin implementation of 
all recommendations within two years from the date Congress 
received them, and complete implementation within six 
years.\43\ Agencies must work in consultation with GSA, and 
within their existing authorities to implement board 
recommendations, although they may contract with real estate 
companies for assistance.\44\ The OMB director has the 
authority to exclude a property from the board's 
recommendations if the director determines the property is 
suitable for use as a public park or recreation area by a state 
or local government.\45\
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    \43\ P.L. 114-287.
    \44\ Id.
    \45\ https://www.crs.gov/Reports/
R44999?source=search&guid=ca749e38e3594abfbea82839c8844
c6c&index=0
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    In addition, several sections of the U.S. Code that pertain 
to real and personal property conveyances, particularly those 
for public benefit, would not apply to recommended disposals. 
The McKinney-Vento Homeless Assistance Act still applies to 
properties that are included in the approved set of 
recommendations but which the HUD Secretary determines are 
suitable for use providing services to the homeless.\46\
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    \46\ https://www.crs.gov/Reports/
R44999?source=search&guid=ca749e38e3594abfbea82839c8844
c6c&index=0
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    FASTA was enacted at the end of the Obama administration 
and its implementation during a transition of administrations 
was delayed and, as a result, Congress passed legislation 
extending the term of the PBRB to allow for additional time for 
such transition.\47\ At the same time, Congress also passed 
legislation to provide GSA more flexibility in leasing back 
property to facilitate certain sales.\48\ However, according to 
a recent New York Times article, there has been challenges to 
the implementation of FASTA. As the article notes:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \47\ P.L. 115-437.
    \48\ P.L. 115-438.

        `` . . . [i]t took three years for the five existing board 
        members to be sworn in, and two empty seats remain, including 
        that of the chairman. The Government Accountability Office 
        reported that the board did not adequately document how it went 
        about selecting properties for sale. The board was sued when it 
        sought to sell a Seattle building that is a repository of 
        important tribal records. The General Services Administration, 
        the agency that disposes of most federal properties, has 
        flouted the board's advice.'' \49\
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    \49\ https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/14/business/sale-surplus-
federal-buildings.html
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GSA'S WORKPLACE 2030

    Early in 2020, because of COVID-19, GSA began a process to 
consult with its key tenant agencies and the private sector to 
identify the impacts and trends on federal office space which 
GSA developed into its Workplace (WP) 2030 initiative.\50\ The 
initiative examined the potential of increased teleworking 
beyond COVID, the opportunities it may present to improve 
efficiency and reduce space needs and costs, and the potential 
savings to the taxpayer.\51\
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    \50\ Workplace 2030: Envisioning the Future of Federal Work, 
General Services Administration
    \51\ Id.
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PERFORMANCE GOALS

    According to GSA's 2020 Agency Financial Report,

        ``GSA is meeting its targets to negotiate leases below average 
        market rates, reduce energy costs, and deliver capital projects 
        on schedule and on budget. GSA's Lease Cost Avoidance Plan, 
        which was implemented in FY 2018 and focuses on renegotiating 
        longer leases where favorable terms can be obtained, continues 
        to yield favorable results; in FY 2020, aggregate lease costs 
        are 12.6 percent below average market value. GSA also realized 
        a sharp reduction in energy use in FY 2020 that can be 
        attributed to warmer winter temperatures and reduced building 
        occupancy due to COVID-19.
          GSA will likely miss its performance targets for vacancy 
        rates and operating costs associated with cleaning and 
        maintenance. Vacant space in inventory remains slightly higher 
        than the target of 3 percent, due in part to the Reduce the 
        Footprint and workspace consolidation initiatives, which can 
        result in GSA holding on to vacant space in order to implement 
        longer-term strategic plans with customers. While GSA is 
        slightly above its target, GSA's vacant space rate still 
        compares favorably to the private sector.
          Cleaning and maintenance costs fell short of the 80 percent 
        target for staying within market range. GSA is undertaking a 
        nationwide effort to examine the methods and tools used to 
        procure building maintenance and custodial services in order to 
        lower operating costs without affecting service levels to GSA's 
        federal tenants.
          GSA realized an increase of 1.6 million rentable square feet 
        (RSF) in FY 2020. In FY 2020, GSA continued to carry 1.9 
        million RSF of temporary leased space associated with the 2020 
        Census. In addition, the federally-owned inventory saw 
        increases from the addition of the Department of Transportation 
        headquarters in Washington DC (1.5 million RSF), the transfer 
        of 11 assets totaling 600 thousand RSF from the Department of 
        State for their National Foreign Affairs Training Center, and 
        the activation of building modernization projects.'' \52\
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    \52\ https://www.gsa.gov/reference/reports/budget-performance/
annual-reports/2020-agency-financial-report/managements-discussion-and-
analysis/performance-summary
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                              WITNESS LIST

     LThe Honorable Robin Carnahan, Administrator, 
General Services Administration
     LMs. Nina Albert, Commissioner, Public Buildings 
Service, General Services Administration

 
  THE GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION'S PRIORITIES FOR 2021 AND BEYOND

                              ----------                              


                       TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 2, 2021

                  House of Representatives,
      Subcommittee on Economic Development, Public 
               Buildings, and Emergency Management,
            Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10 a.m., in room 
2167 Rayburn House Office Building and via Zoom, Hon. Dina 
Titus (Chair of the subcommittee) presiding.
    Members present in person: Mr. Webster.
    Members present remotely: Ms. Titus, Mr. DeFazio, Ms. 
Norton, Ms. Davids of Kansas, Mrs. Napolitano, Mr. Massie, Miss 
Gonzalez-Colon, Mr. Guest, Ms. Van Duyne, and Mr. Gimenez.
    Ms. Titus. The subcommittee will come to order.
    I ask unanimous consent that the chair be authorized to 
declare a recess at any time during today's hearing.
    Without objection, so ordered.
    I also ask unanimous consent that Members not on the 
subcommittee be permitted to sit with the subcommittee at 
today's hearing and ask questions.
    Without objection, so ordered.
    As a reminder, please keep your microphone muted unless 
speaking, and should I hear any inadvertent background noise, I 
will request that the Member please mute their microphone.
    To insert a document into the record, please have your 
staff email it to [email protected].
    This morning, I would like to welcome our special guests 
and witnesses. We have the Honorable Robin Carnahan, who is the 
Administrator of the GSA, and we have Ms. Nina Albert, who is 
the Commissioner for the Public Buildings Service of the GSA. 
We look forward to hearing their testimony.
    The GSA provides workspace for so many people who have been 
impacted by the pandemic and beyond that we are anxious to hear 
their testimony. In fact, it is 1.2 million Federal employees 
across more than 50 Federal agencies and over 1,500 Federal 
buildings.
    Approximately 53 percent of the Public Buildings' portfolio 
is over 50 years old, and 28 percent of it is over 75 years 
old.
    GSA leases approximately 8,100 office buildings, 
courthouses, land ports of entry, data processing centers, 
laboratories, and specialized spaces all across the country for 
our Federal agencies' use and occupation. During the period 
from fiscal year 2019 through 2023, 60 percent of those leases 
will expire. The portfolio is projected to include 183.4 
million square feet of owned space and 183.5 million square 
feet of leased space in fiscal year 2021.
    With that kind of portfolio, you can see why we are 
interested in how the agency is doing, what it projects its 
needs will be, and what some of the problems are that we can 
help them to address.
    We also know that 25 leases are expiring between January 
2022 and December 2025, and so, with the new working conditions 
and post-COVID, we would like to know what the plans are for 
those leases, because we haven't seen any information about 
what is going to happen with them.
    In the past, this committee has addressed a number of 
issues that I hope our witnesses will at least provide some 
information today and then perhaps can bring back other 
information. But these are issues that have been important to 
me and to the other members of the committee. And if I could 
just list them briefly, you can see what our challenges are.
    We are always concerned about taxpayer dollars and that 
they are being used most efficiently and most effectively, so 
we need information on the lease versus build alternatives, as 
well as deferred maintenance for the buildings that we already 
have.
    We want to know what the plans are now that the employment 
has shifted to so many people working at home and a need for 
less space, how do we need to rethink our inventory.
    Also, as we build buildings, we have several things that we 
want to consider. One is how to make them sustainable, how to 
make them healthy, how to make them perhaps fit some of the 
LEED standards so we know that they are energy efficient. We 
can't just build back better; we have to include resiliency 
considerations in the buildings that we construct in the 
future.
    Other issues related to that construction include making 
them bird friendly. Some of our buildings have reflecting glass 
that cause birds to crash into them. We want to see how we can 
address that.
    Also, parking and access to other modes of transportation 
that are available as we locate some of these buildings.
    And in addition to that, the design of the buildings 
themselves. We have been fighting an old Executive order from 
the last administration that wanted all the buildings to look 
like the Parthenon. Well, this is not the Federal design code. 
This is not the way they should be. They should fit with the 
geography, they should fit with the culture, and they should 
take into account input from the local artistic community.
    We also want to talk about what happened with the hotel, 
the Old Post Office that was leased by Donald Trump in the last 
administration.
    Now, I don't plan to relitigate everything that happened 
before. We want to move forward, but we do want to know how 
some of those things happened and how we can prevent making the 
same mistakes going forward.
    So that is kind of the agenda that we have. We are anxious 
to hear what your plans are, how we can be helpful.
    And I will now turn it over to our ranking member, Mr. 
Webster, for a comment.
    [Ms. Titus' prepared statement follows:]

                                 
  Prepared Statement of Hon. Dina Titus, a Representative in Congress 
     from the State of Nevada, and Chair, Subcommittee on Economic 
        Development, Public Buildings, and Emergency Management
    I'd like to welcome everyone to today's hearing to examine the 
General Services Administration's priorities for 2021 and beyond.
    Joining us today are the Honorable Robin Carnahan, the 
Administrator of the GSA, and Nina Albert, the Public Buildings 
Services Commissioner.
    Administrator Carnahan and Commissioner Albert, I want to first 
congratulate you on your confirmations and welcome you to the 
subcommittee.
    I am hopeful that our relationship is remarkedly different than we 
had with your predecessors given the important role this subcommittee 
plays in your responsibilities.
    Chief among our duties is the authorization of GSA's acquisition of 
real property.
    This does not include all transactions GSA engages in as the agency 
owns over 1,500 federal buildings and leases approximately 8,100 office 
buildings, courthouses, land ports of entry, data processing centers, 
laboratories, and specialized space--but it does include those 
construction, repair, and alteration projects that exceed $3.3 million, 
and lease transactions that exceed $1.6 million in annual rent.
    In fiscal year 2022, GSA requested committee consideration of 32 
repair, alteration, and construction projects.
    As of last week, we have authorized 25 of those projects.
    I will note however, that you have not submitted a single lease 
transaction for the committee's consideration.
    It would be helpful to have clarity around this as there are about 
25 leases expiring between January of 2022 and December of 2025, and 
with sixty percent of Public Building Service leases expiring in the 
next few years, it is my hope that the government is reimagining and 
modernizing its real estate portfolio to address evolving worker and 
constituent needs post-COVID, as well as reducing the impact on the 
budget.
    The federal government's leasing program is often a focus of this 
subcommittee, and one particular outlease of a federal property is 
probably the highest profile is the Old Post Office Building here in 
Washington, DC.
    The lease is currently held by the Trump Organization in an 
arrangement that has been fraught with legal and ethical questions the 
moment Donald Trump took the oath of office, and according to media 
reports and confirmed by GSA may be in the process of being sold to a 
new lessor.
    I hope that the transaction will not only benefit the American 
public but protects the sensitive law enforcement and national security 
assets that neighbor this property, and does not repeat the same 
substantial mistakes made by GSA in the management of the current lease 
as outlined by GSA's Inspector General.
    It was this subcommittee that directed GSA to redevelop this 
property and given the unique nature of this major outlease of one of 
the most prized pieces of federal real estate in the nation, it will 
remain a point of interest for me and this committee.
    I ask for your commitment to ensure that we are kept abreast of any 
changes that may occur with the lease ownership and provide regular 
updates on the financials and other details of its operations, which 
your predecessors failed to do.
    I know that we previously discussed draft legislation our staff has 
prepared and shared with your staff to reexamine the management of 
these major outleases and set parameters for GSA's outleasing program 
moving forward.
    I want to stress for you and for my colleagues on both sides of the 
aisle that I am not here to relitigate the decisions of the past which 
I found unethical and borderline illegal, and I know you both were not 
responsible for signing the lease or the decisions made when Donald 
Trump became president, but you do have a responsibility to manage this 
lease moving forward.
    My goal, and I hope this is shared with all my colleagues, is to 
ensure that we do not make the same mistakes again.
    I look forward to receiving feedback on this initial draft and I 
encourage your staff to respond expeditiously.
    Thank you, Administrator Carnahan and Commissioner Albert, for 
being with us today and thank you in advance for answering our 
questions.
    With that I recognize Ranking Member Webster for five minutes for 
an opening statement.

    Mr. Webster. Thank you, Chair Titus, and thank you for who 
you have invited today, the Administrator and the Commissioner.
    Prior to COVID-19, we made significant progress on right-
sizing Federal office space. Through the reduction and 
consolidations of space approved by the committee in GSA's 
prospectus process, we saved taxpayers over $4 billion. 
Following COVID, we are facing new opportunities, given this 
shift in workspace needs due to increased remote work, as well 
as indications that teleworking may continue at higher levels 
post-pandemic.
    But right-sizing the Federal real estate portfolio is not 
only about shrinking space. It is about ensuring that there is 
reduction in cost, and that the agencies have the right place, 
and that they get rid of unneeded properties as quickly as 
possible.
    The goal, for example, for the Federal Assets Sale and 
Transfer Act, is not just to simply streamline the disposal 
process but to get agencies to look more strategically at their 
assets. This helps produce financially sound and operationally 
efficient results from sales, redevelopments, outleases, and 
other activities.
    To achieve significant changes, as we saw during the 
``freeze and reduce the footprint'' efforts, it takes the 
administration, including GSA and OMB, working together with 
Congress, to spur agencies to make better decisions about their 
space. It also means alternative financing options should be on 
the table. It makes no sense for taxpayers to effectively pay 
for a building, sometimes many times over, through the lease 
and then have to pay fair-market value on top of that just to 
purchase it.
    Although the GSA has the legal authorities to negotiate 
discounted purchase options and enter into public-private 
partnerships, it has not been able to take advantage of those 
authorities. GSA should be free to use these authorities where 
appropriate to facilitate the right-sizing of the portfolio and 
reduce the cost to the taxpayer. I hope we can work together to 
ensure that we achieve that, and I look forward to hearing from 
our witnesses today.
    Thank you, Chair Titus. I yield back.
    [Mr. Webster's prepared statement follows:]

                                 
Prepared Statement of Hon. Daniel Webster, a Representative in Congress 
from the State of Florida, and Ranking Member, Subcommittee on Economic 
        Development, Public Buildings, and Emergency Management
    Thank you, Chair Titus. I want to thank the GSA Administrator and 
Public Buildings Commissioner for being here today.
    Prior to COVID-19, we made significant progress on right-sizing 
federal office space. Through reductions and consolidations in space 
approved by the Committee in GSA's prospectus process, we saved 
taxpayers over $4 billion dollars. Following COVID, we are facing new 
opportunities given the shift in workplace needs due to increased 
remote work, as well as indications that teleworking may continue at 
higher levels post-pandemic.
    But right-sizing the federal real estate portfolio is not only 
about shrinking space, it's about ensuring we reduce costs, that 
agencies have the right space, and that we get rid of unneeded 
properties as quickly as possible.
    The goal, for example, for the Federal Assets Sale and Transfer Act 
(FASTA) is not just to simply streamline the disposal process, but to 
get agencies to look more strategically at their assets. This helps 
produce financially sound and operationally efficient results from 
sales, redevelopments, outleases, and other activities.
    To achieve significant changes, as we saw during the ``freeze-and-
reduce-the-footprint'' efforts, it takes the Administration, including 
GSA and OMB, working together with Congress to spur agencies to make 
better decisions about their space.
    It also means alternative financing options should be on the table. 
It makes no sense for the taxpayer to effectively pay for a building, 
sometimes many times over, through a lease, and then have to pay fair-
market value on top of that to purchase it. Although the GSA has the 
legal authorities to negotiate discounted purchase options and enter 
into public-private partnerships, it has not been able to take 
advantage of those authorities. GSA should be free to use these 
authorities where appropriate to facilitate the right-sizing of the 
portfolio and reduce costs to the taxpayer. I hope we can work together 
to ensure we achieve that.
    I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today on GSA's 
priorities.

    Ms. Titus. Thank you, Mr. Webster.
    I now recognize the chairman of the T&I full committee, Mr. 
DeFazio.
    Mr. DeFazio. Thanks, Madam Chair. Thanks for holding this 
hearing.
    Administrator Carnahan, Commissioner Albert, welcome to the 
committee.
    We want to be a good partner with GSA. So far in fiscal 
year 2022, you asked for 32 repair, alteration, and 
construction projects. As of last week, we have authorized 25.
    The Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act has $3.4 billion 
for land ports of entry, which need a tremendous amount of 
work. And the Build Back Better Act includes $500 million to 
help make Federal buildings more energy efficient. And then 
outside of our jurisdiction, of course, although it was part of 
the INVEST Act in the last Congress, is the purchase of zero-
emission vehicles for the Postal Service, which will be a 
tremendous boost to the EV industry and also tremendously 
reduce pollution. I am looking forward to that acquisition.
    I really want to work with GSA to make it easier, and I 
would agree with a number of things the ranking member just 
said. In particular, I have heard about how frustrating it is 
that you can't access--I understand now there is $10 billion of 
rent that you have collected. Now, like a good landlord, you 
put aside funds, and then you use that to make repairs or new 
acquisitions. Unfortunately, Congress has not allowed you full 
access, or easy access, to those funds, and I hope that is 
something that we can find a way to correct in the future, and 
would look forward to working with you and your staff on ways 
to figure how to do that and have you make the case that if you 
had access to those funds, how you could actually save money in 
the end, because of not deferring maintenance to the point 
where buildings are basically on the verge of demolition and 
other issues with deferred maintenance.
    But, I have got to say that I think your agency is a little 
bit Congress-shy, should I say. Our requests for technical 
assistance take too long. We are not getting answers about 
questions about your post-COVID space requirements. And that 
makes it difficult for us to help you, and you have got to help 
us work on that culture.
    I am hoping for transformational changes under your 
leadership so that we can address some of these issues. Should 
you have more space than you can afford to maintain? What does 
it mean if Congress allocates less money than you request every 
year? What about the rent structure? How many courthouses does 
the Federal judiciary really need? And how big do those things 
need to be?
    The robing area for the judges in the new Federal 
courthouse in Eugene where my office is housed--their robing 
areas are bigger than my office. There are real questions and 
scrutiny that needs to be applied. I realize they are a third 
and independent branch, but that doesn't mean they have to have 
excess space.
    And to put it mildly, your predecessor was challenging to 
work with. I won't go beyond that. I will just leave it there.
    But we still don't have answers about GSA's failure to 
properly consider the Emoluments Clause of the U.S. 
Constitution when it came to the Old Post Office Building. It 
was pretty darn clear when I read it, and we never, ever got 
clear answers to how that was actually constitutional.
    And no clarity at all about the very sudden decision to 
cancel the decade-long effort to get the FBI a new and secure 
headquarters outside of downtown Washington, DC. That was a 
very long effort, very, very suspiciously and abruptly 
canceled. We still don't have good answers to that. We would 
like answers to that.
    So, I am looking for new transparency under your 
leadership, and I look forward to your testimony today and 
working with you in the future.
    Thank you, Madam Chair.
    [Mr. DeFazio's prepared statement follows:]

                                 
   Prepared Statement of Hon. Peter A. DeFazio, a Representative in 
      Congress from the State of Oregon, and Chair, Committee on 
                   Transportation and Infrastructure
    Thank you, Chair Titus. Administrator Carnahan, Commissioner 
Albert, welcome to the Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure.
    The bread and butter of your work with this committee is securing 
the authorization of GSA construction, alteration, and leasing 
requests. In FY22 GSA requested consideration of 32 repair, alteration, 
and construction projects. As of last week, this committee had 
authorized 25 of those projects--proof of our good-faith effort to work 
with GSA.
    This committee has also supported many of GSA's infrastructure 
requests, which will provide significant new resources to assist the 
agency. The Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act includes $3.4 
billion for land ports of entry, and the Build Back Better Act includes 
$500 million to help green federal buildings.
    Outside of T&I's jurisdiction, the Build Back Better Act includes 
significant funding for GSA for the procurement of zero-emission and 
electric vehicles, for emerging and sustainable technologies, and for 
the purchase of goods, services, and systems to improve energy 
efficiency, promote the purchase of lower-carbon materials, and reduce 
the carbon footprint.
    And I, personally, want to work with GSA to make it easier to 
finance new construction projects. I've heard from previous 
Administrators about how frustrating it is that GSA is unable to use 
all the rent it has collected in the Federal Building Fund and reinvest 
it in our public assets. If we want to fix the growing backlog of 
deferred maintenance, GSA needs access to more of the funds it is 
collecting.
    I believe that the new infrastructure funding and easier access to 
construction funding could really transform the Public Buildings 
Service. But Administrator Carnahan, we need GSA staff to be more 
responsive. Requests for technical assistance are taking too long, 
questions about agency space needs post-Covid have not been addressed. 
There is a culture within PBS of hiding from Congress, but that makes 
it difficult for us to help you.
    I am hoping for transformational leadership under your guidance. 
Ask the big questions. Should GSA own more space that it can't afford 
to maintain? What does it mean if Congress gives you less money then 
you request every year? What needs to change about GSA's rent 
structure? How many courthouses does the federal judiciary really need? 
And how are you going to make 100 percent of the owned portfolio a 
high-performing green building?
    Administrator Carnahan, your predecessor was challenging to work 
with. We still have unanswered questions about GSA's failure to 
properly consider the Emoluments Clauses to the U.S. Constitution when 
evaluating the Old Post Office lease. No clarity about the cancellation 
of the decade-long effort to build a new headquarters for the FBI.
    I hope for and expect more transparency under your leadership. 
Thank you, Chair Titus. I yield back the balance of my time.

    Ms. Titus. Thank you, Mr. DeFazio.
    I don't think Mr. Graves is here, so we will move on with 
our witnesses.
    I want to welcome you both. And thank you, Ms. Carnahan, 
for talking to me on the phone before we had this hearing. I 
feel like we have started off on a better foot than with your 
predecessor, and I appreciate that.
    So, our witnesses, for the record, are the Honorable Robin 
Carnahan, Administrator of the General Services Administration; 
and Ms. Nina Albert, Commissioner of the Public Buildings 
Service, General Services Administration.
    Thank you both for being here.
    Without objection, our witnesses' full statements will be 
included in the record.
    Since your written testimony will be made part of the 
record, the committee requests that you limit your oral 
testimony to 5 minutes.
    We can now proceed with that testimony. Administrator 
Carnahan, you are up.

 TESTIMONY OF HON. ROBIN CARNAHAN, ADMINISTRATOR, U.S. GENERAL 
SERVICES ADMINISTRATION; AND NINA ALBERT, COMMISSIONER, PUBLIC 
    BUILDINGS SERVICE, U.S. GENERAL SERVICES ADMINISTRATION

    Ms. Carnahan. Well, thank you, Chairwoman Titus, Ranking 
Member Webster, Chairman DeFazio, and members of the 
subcommittee. It is a great honor to be with you here today. I 
am pleased to be here as GSA's Administrator, and on behalf of 
our employees, talk about our mission, which I think has never 
been more important.
    Now, I know this committee has been very interested in 
GSA's efforts to keep our buildings safe and operational 
throughout the pandemic. So, I want to start by thanking 
everyone on the committee for your support, but also 
acknowledging the tireless work of the GSA team to respond to 
the pandemic.
    I can tell you that the work from the Public Buildings 
Service, as well as our Federal Acquisition Service, has been 
heroic over the past 2 years. They have acquired and 
distributed huge amounts of supplies; amended thousands of 
service contracts to ensure more cleaning; helped many, many 
Federal, State, and local partners meet their emergency needs.
    My written testimony goes into more details, and 
Commissioner Albert and I will be happy to discuss any of this 
important work later today.
    Like me, I know the committee is very interested in what 
comes next. So, I appreciate the chance to be here to talk to 
you and outline what I see as the biggest priorities and 
opportunities for GSA in the months ahead.
    First, I want to acknowledge that President Truman's 
original purpose for creating GSA in the first place remains 
our North Star, and that is to streamline Government so it 
works better for the people we serve and to save money doing 
it. That mission hasn't changed, but especially coming out of 
the pandemic, in which all of us have had to adapt to new ways 
of working, the way GSA delivers on that mission certainly has 
and will continue to change.
    In our real estate portfolio, that means finding ways to 
both right-size in light of our partners' changing needs and 
rebalance our portfolio so that we can consolidate, whenever 
possible, into owned Government buildings that offer customers 
the type of workspaces they need going forward.
    A number of those kind of new offerings are already in 
progress, like an office-in-a-box concept, and also pilot 
projects that will allow agency staff to access Federal and 
private coworking spaces that can offer both shorter commuting 
times and secure work environments.
    In governmentwide acquisition, this means becoming the 
marketplace of choice for our partners by making it so easy and 
so fast and so cost effective to buy through GSA that it just 
wouldn't make sense for agencies to look anywhere else. We know 
that in order to create that kind of marketplace, it is going 
to require us to make it easier, faster, and cheaper for 
businesses, especially small businesses from underserved 
communities, to access and sell to Government buyers.
    And when it comes to technology, it means making smart bets 
on creating a suite of shared, secure services that all 
agencies at every level of Government can access to improve the 
way they deliver services to the public and save money.
    We all witnessed how outdated and hard-to-use Government 
technology through the pandemic took a toll on so many families 
across the country. And we know that when we make Government 
websites work better for people at their time of need, it isn't 
just about a website; it is about showing that our Government 
can and does work effectively for the people it serves.
    Of course, to accomplish all of this, we need Congress' 
support and partnership, and that is why the President's budget 
request, the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, and the 
reconciliation package is so important. Those are funds that 
will allow us to repair and upgrade public assets, providing an 
historic opportunity to consolidate agencies from this costly 
leased space into federally owned space; make our buildings 
safe, sustainable, and resilient to future emergencies; and 
create adaptive, flexible spaces better suited for the 
workforce of the future.
    All this also includes, as the chairman said, modernizing 
more than 30 land ports of entry, supporting border security, 
and promoting trade and commerce.
    With this funding, we can also do our part to combat 
climate change. We can reduce greenhouse gas emissions in 
Federal facilities by fully 95 percent. We can put more than 
150,000 zero-emission vehicles on the road, along with charging 
infrastructure at our public buildings, and we can help the 
Government lead by example and dramatically reduce its carbon 
footprint.
    We can also make long deferred and sorely needed 
investments in our digital infrastructure so that we can 
provide better, secure, accessible services to the public and 
our agency partners.
    Overall, these investments will allow GSA to make critical 
upgrades, the ones we need to ensure our Government can 
effectively and efficiently deliver for the public now and be 
better prepared for the future. Whether you are a teacher, a 
construction worker, a small business owner, or a Member of 
Congress, these are smart investments.
    I look forward to partnering with the committee in the 
years ahead, and I look forward to your questions today.
    [Ms. Carnahan's prepared statement follows:]

                                 
Prepared Statement of Hon. Robin Carnahan, Administrator, U.S. General 
                        Services Administration
    Good afternoon Chairwoman Titus, Ranking Member Webster, and 
Members of the Subcommittee. My name is Robin Carnahan, and I am the 
Administrator of the U.S. General Services Administration (GSA). I am 
joined today by Public Buildings Service (PBS) Commissioner Nina 
Albert. We appreciate the opportunity to speak with the Subcommittee 
about GSA's priorities under the Biden-Harris Administration.
    Today, we want to briefly touch on GSA's pandemic response--which 
has been a critical effort and for which we have appreciated Congress's 
continued support. Primarily, though, we want to outline what we see as 
this incredible moment of opportunity for the government and the 
country--a chance to dramatically cut long-term costs, better enable 
mission execution for our partner agencies, and better serve the 
public. We'll touch on a few of the key programs and initiatives that 
are part of how we think we can seize this opportunity. The most 
important of these are the President's Fiscal Year 2022 Budget Request, 
the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, and the reconciliation 
package.
    Especially at this critical moment, I am honored and humbled to 
serve GSA in my new role, and to work alongside proven leaders like 
Commissioner Albert to fulfill our mission.
                GSA's Response to the COVID-19 Pandemic
    GSA is a vital partner of other Federal departments and agencies in 
their response to State- or Federally-declared emergencies, including 
assisting agencies in responding to COVID-19. Since the beginning of 
the pandemic, GSA has supported agencies by keeping buildings open, 
providing clean facilities for all occupants and the visiting public, 
and providing technology and services to support the mobile work 
environment. We have amended and updated all of our custodial contracts 
to clean and disinfect Federal workplaces in accordance with the 
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the Occupational 
Safety and Health Administration, and the Safer Federal Workforce Task 
Force guidance. GSA has also adjusted air ventilation and filtration 
systems in buildings in accordance with CDC guidance.
    GSA helped Federal, State, and local partners respond to the COVID-
19 pandemic by procuring and delivering 51 million pairs of protective 
gloves, more than 983 gallons of disinfectant and cleaning solutions, 
more than 662,000 gallons of hand sanitizer, 1.3 million masks and face 
shields, more than 208,000 Meals Ready to Eat, 18,000 laptops for 
agency partners, and 15,000 beds and cots for medical needs, providing 
support to the USNS Comfort and USNS Mercy in preparation for their 
deployment to New York City and Los Angeles, and helping to convert 
Lumen Field in Seattle into a field hospital.
    With additional resources from the Coronavirus Aid, Relief, and 
Economic Security Act (CARES Act) in March 2020, GSA has executed and 
delivered enhanced cleaning in GSA-controlled Federally owned and 
leased space, in accordance with CDC guidance for cleaning and 
disinfection. Furthermore, GSA has invested CARES Act funding into FY 
2022 to make our buildings safer, increasing ventilation and improving 
air filtration within existing heating, ventilation, and air 
conditioning systems to improve indoor air quality and better protect 
building occupants.
    GSA amended more than 4,500 leases to include disinfection 
requirements consistent with CDC guidelines. GSA also secured emergency 
leases to support agencies in responding to the pandemic, including 
four for the U.S. Department of Homeland Security, Federal Emergency 
Management Agency (FEMA), and for the U.S. Small Business 
Administration to support its efforts working with FEMA.
    GSA is also working with the U.S. Office of Personnel and 
Management, the Office of Management and Budget (OMB), and other 
agencies on the Safer Federal Workforce Task Force, providing Federal 
Executive Branch agencies with ongoing guidance to keep Federal 
employees safe, enable agencies to continue operating during the 
pandemic, and plan for a safe and effective reentry.
    It was an honor for GSA to support the national response during 
this global crisis, and I am focused on ensuring that GSA will continue 
to be a part of the solution as we move forward together.
                 Navigating the Post-Pandemic Landscape
    Our country is at a critical juncture as we re-emerge from one of 
the most disruptive pandemics and pivot to opportunities to provide a 
more resilient environment for the future.
    Right-Sizing the Real Estate Portfolio--Government-wide adoption of 
telework as a result of the pandemic presents GSA with a unique 
opportunity to right-size its real estate portfolio. With more than 50 
percent of PBS's total annual appropriated budget paying for leased 
space, GSA has the opportunity to reinvest in its existing buildings 
and reduce costly leases to save taxpayers money over the long-term. We 
plan to capitalize on increased telework across the Federal Government 
to work with agencies to consolidate into Federally owned buildings and 
reduce costly leases. GSA has demonstrated its ability to succeed in 
this area. Since FY 2018, GSA has achieved over $4.5 billion in lease 
cost avoidance by negotiating leases below market costs, reducing 
rentable square feet and moving from leased space to Federally owned 
space. GSA's actions led to the U.S. Government Accountability Office 
(GAO) removing costly leasing from its High Risk Report for the first 
time in 17 years. GAO credited GSA's progress made in reducing leasing 
costs and improving monitoring efforts.
    Future Space Needs--Of course, as a provider of space to partner 
agencies, we also recognize that we need to enhance our engagement to 
help them plan for our ``new normal.'' We have expanded communications 
with Federal agencies through targeted outreach; this effort includes 
quarterly surveys that gauge the real estate, telework, and technology 
needs of GSA's customer agencies. While agencies are still considering 
what a new post-pandemic will look like, including the level and 
frequency of telework, GSA will work alongside agencies to help them 
make data-driven space decisions that factor in future telework 
postures.
    Providing Agencies with a Vision for the Future--GSA has been 
partnering with agencies to define what future workspace will look like 
for the Federal Government. Through an on-going engagement called 
``Workspace 2030'' with more than 100 experts across 18 Federal 
agencies, GSA is leading efforts to develop an integrated solution set 
that includes real estate, technology, and human capital solutions. The 
future of work will include the full range of options, from in-office 
to remote working environments to the hybrid work model--whereby 
employees work part of the week in the office and part of the week 
teleworking--most likely deploying all three of these models at the 
same time. It will be important for GSA to make it as easy as possible 
for agencies to operationalize all of these workplace models, depending 
on their mission needs as well as their employees' needs.
    GSA launched Workplace 2030 to learn from the COVID-19 pandemic to 
address future workspace needs. Workplace 2030 is not a one-size-fits-
all solution, but rather a process that results in the creation of work 
solutions through conversation with our agency partners. Through this 
initiative, agencies have positively responded to new and innovative 
ways of working that have transformed the way the Federal Government 
will work, long into the future. We are positioning ourselves to be 
agile and flexible to this changing environment.
    Through Workplace 2030, GSA is offering numerous services and 
options for agencies to test and try. For example, GSA is piloting a 
space solution called ``FlexHub,'' which is a Federal co-working space, 
as well as home office technology equipment and furniture packages, and 
finally the ``Workplace Innovation Lab,'' which allows GSA to try new 
and emerging office furniture, technology, and other industry 
innovations. GSA recently awarded an Indefinite Delivery, Indefinite 
Quantity contract to five private, co-working companies whereby 
agencies can access short-term, turnkey office space to meet temporary 
space needs. By offering and testing a variety of workspace options, 
GSA is proactively engaging agencies to help them make decisions about 
their longer-term workspace needs.
    As we navigate out of the pandemic, GSA is committed to developing 
the new offerings that agencies will need to embrace new ways of 
working--and proactively engaging with partner agencies to ensure we 
don't just snap back to the way things were before.
                          Building Back Better
    GSA is putting together the programs, initiatives, and outreach 
strategy that will allow agencies to adapt to new ways of working, and 
save money in the process. However, for us to be able to effectively 
pursue this opportunity, we will need to make smart and strategic 
investments--and will need the resources to do so. That's why we are so 
excited about the possibilities presented by the Infrastructure 
Investment and Jobs Act, the reconciliation package, and the 
President's Fiscal Year 2022 request.
    Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act--The Infrastructure 
Investment and Jobs Act (IIJA) includes over $3.4 billion to modernize 
and upgrade more than 30 land ports of entry (LPOEs) along the northern 
and southern borders. These resources will allow us to modernize these 
ports for the future--improving our nation's border security while also 
making these facilities more sustainable. These projects will also 
provide the Federal inspection agencies with the facilities they need 
to better promote trade, tourism and commerce. These are mission-
critical gateways for commerce that need to be secure, efficient, and 
functional.
    Reconciliation Package--We recognize that what ends up in the final 
reconciliation package, as of the moment of putting together this 
testimony, is still up in the air. But let us tell you some of the 
critical opportunities we have through this infrastructure package as 
well. The President's initial proposal included $5 billion to invest in 
Federal buildings. We have the opportunity to use these funds for 
facilities in up to 34 states, the District of Columbia and the 
Commonwealth of Puerto Rico. This work would help to address the 
growing backlog of needed repairs in our public assets, as well as make 
key investments to make these buildings more habitable, resilient and 
sustainable. With these improvements, we can consolidate agencies into 
federally-owned space, with the potential to save billions of dollars 
in annual lease costs. We can also dramatically reduce our carbon 
footprint by increasing efficiency and electrifying many of these 
buildings and incorporating solar, geothermal, and carbon free sources 
of energy wherever possible. These resources can also be utilized to 
catalyze emerging markets; for instance, GSA has established a working 
group within our Green Building Advisory Council \1\ to look at issues 
of embodied carbon in construction materials. We can leverage these 
funds to buy lower-carbon materials as we work to modernize our 
existing facilities. These investments will also create thousands of 
good-paying American jobs, many of them union.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \1\ The Green Building Advisory Committee was established by 
Congress in the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007, and 
operates under the provisions of the Federal Advisory Committee Act 
(FACA).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The President's proposal also included $5 billion to electrify the 
federal fleet. With this money, depending on market conditions, we can 
convert between 164,000 and 269,000 vehicles in the federal fleet to 
zero-emission vehicles, and install 82,000 to 269,000 charging stations 
across the country at federal facilities. This is an important signal 
of the government's commitment to lead by example in achieving the 
President's goal of supporting electrification of our country's 
vehicles. It also is in line with the direction of the market, where we 
have seen major American automakers pledge to go all-electric in the 
years ahead.
    As Congress has moved forward with consideration of the 
reconciliation package, some Committees have also proposed making 
critical investments in our digital infrastructure. As the agency 
sitting at the nexus of partner agency needs, GSA strongly agrees with 
making investments in this area as well. As we saw coming out of the 
CARES Act, the ability of the public to access the resources they 
need--and to limit bad actors from engaging in fraud--is heavily 
dependent on having effective and secure digital services. Moreover, as 
agencies embrace the opportunity to more effectively utilize and share 
their physical infrastructure, they will need to make upgrades to their 
digital infrastructure. This will have substantial benefits to the 
delivery of services to the public; to the productivity of the federal 
workforce; and will also allow the federal government to further reduce 
its carbon impacts. I know that Committees in both the Senate and House 
have proposed funding for the Technology Modernization Fund, and the 
Federal Citizen Services Fund, and GSA is also supportive of those 
investments.
    Fiscal Year 2022 Budget Request--The President's FY 2022 budget 
request is the final component that will allow us to achieve this 
transformation of the federal workspace. The budget includes net 
positive budget authority for the Federal Buildings Fund (FBF). This is 
key to our ability to seize the opportunity before us to ``right-size'' 
the federal real estate portfolio.
    As background, to sustainably care for and modernize our public 
assets, the FBF was designed with the assumption that GSA would be able 
to reinvest the rent that agencies pay into the fund back into our 
public assets--much like a private sector landlord. Yet, for the past 
decade, GSA's ability to access this rent has been statutorily 
limited--and this has resulted in an inability to address the growing 
backlog of deferred maintenance and to keep facilities in a good state 
of repair. GSA must address these deferred maintenance needs to 
continue to provide safe, functional, and healthy workspace for Federal 
employees, and to manage capital costs responsibly. Without safe and 
efficient facilities, we can't take advantage of this opportunity to 
consolidate agencies out of costly leased space. This is the year to 
get this done.
    Moreover, we are leaving savings on the table from smart new 
investments, like the ongoing consolidation of the Department of 
Homeland Security at St. Elizabeths. This project will consolidate DHS 
from more than 40 locations around the District to a modern, secure, 
and sustainable campus. We have already made significant investments at 
this facility and can continue to reap greater and greater value from 
those investments in the future; we stand to save half a billion 
dollars in real estate costs once we complete the project. Our FY 2022 
request includes $257 million to continue this project. DHS is a great 
example of the kind of mission that will always require a robust in-
person presence, and the surrounding physical infrastructure to support 
it.
    Finally, access to the FBF will allow GSA to take the steps 
necessary to reduce the carbon impact of the federal government's real 
estate portfolio, as well as make our assets more resilient to future 
climate events. This year, the Biden-Harris Administration has included 
$100 million for a new Climate Resilience and Mitigation Fund. With 
these resources, we can bolster our risk profile data and make targeted 
investments in facilities across the country that are likely to be 
impacted by severe climate-related events. Again, this is the time to 
make our buildings more resilient and reduce their climate impacts. 
This is just one example from our budget request, but every project on 
our list will incorporate a robust plan to reduce carbon impacts.
    GSA looks forward to working with this Committee to address our 
critical infrastructure repair needs, address the challenges of real 
estate needs after the pandemic, and seize the opportunity in front of 
us to make smart investments that will right-size the portfolio, cut 
real estate costs, and deliver a more effective and sustainable federal 
footprint.
                                Closing
    In closing, I want to thank the Committee for its support of so 
many of GSA's critical investments, and I would ask that Members of 
this Committee continue to support GSA's FY 2022 budget request, the 
Infrastructure Investment & Jobs Act, and the reconciliation package. 
Every dollar we invest today will have outsized savings in the future--
allowing us to consolidate agencies and cut long-term real estate 
costs, address our repair backlog, promote economic activity in 
communities across the country, reduce our carbon footprint, and make 
our public assets more resilient to future climate impacts. In our 
view, this is the moment to build back better.
    With that, we again appreciate the opportunity to be here, and 
would be happy to answer any questions you have.

    Ms. Titus. Thank you very much, Administrator.
    Now we will go to Ms. Nina Albert, who is the Commissioner 
for the Public Buildings Service.
    Ms. Albert. Good morning, Chairwoman Titus, Ranking Member 
Webster, and members of the subcommittee. My name is Nina 
Albert, and I am the Commissioner of the Public Buildings 
Service, or PBS, representing more than 5,500 employees.
    I am happy to join Administrator Carnahan this morning to 
discuss with you PBS' priorities.
    I come to GSA with experience in real estate and economic 
development, most recently serving as the vice president of 
real estate and parking at the Washington Metropolitan Area 
Transit Authority. I led WMATA's headquarters consolidation and 
accelerated transit-oriented development throughout the 
Washington region.
    I also served in the DC government, where I oversaw major 
waterfront revitalization projects and served as the Department 
of Environment's chief of green economy, where I developed 
commercial property incentives for energy and water efficiency. 
I am pleased to bring these and my other experiences to GSA.
    Since the start of the COVID pandemic, GSA has proudly 
supported agencies by keeping buildings open for mission 
support, providing enhanced facilities cleaning, and providing 
technology and other services to support remote work. As a 
result of greater rates of telework throughout the Federal 
Government, GSA desires to seize this opportunity to optimize 
the Federal real estate footprint and is partnering with our 
customers in the executive and judiciary branches to understand 
how their space needs may change in the future.
    GSA is using what we are learning from these discussions to 
develop an integrated hybrid workplace that will likely combine 
human capital, technology, and real estate solutions. To get 
there, we need to capture space utilization data, design 
workspaces for enhanced mobility and collaboration, advance 
smart buildings, and support employee productivity and well-
being.
    One of my primary focuses will also be to develop the 
strategies and plans for consolidating more agencies into 
federally owned facilities and reduce our dependence on leases. 
Already since fiscal year 2018, GSA has renegotiated more than 
1,100 leases at below-market rates, moved more than 200 leases 
into federally owned space, and avoided more than $4.5 billion 
in lease costs.
    The coming 5 years promise to achieve even greater space 
and cost savings, and reinvesting in federally owned facilities 
will be key to this strategy.
    Unfortunately, we are coming from behind, and too many 
Federal buildings have fallen into a state of disrepair due to 
lack of consistent funding for maintenance. To gain the full 
benefit of building ownership and to be the best stewards of 
the American taxpayer dollar, we must address the growing list 
of deferred maintenance projects.
    By the way, replacing antiquated building systems with 
high-performance electrical, mechanical, plumbing, and envelope 
systems, as well as managing our buildings using real-time 
utilization data, we can significantly reduce greenhouse gas 
emissions, conserve water and energy use, and promote climate 
resilience.
    GSA's goal is to supply 100 percent of our electricity 
needs from renewable energy sources by 2025 and achieve carbon 
pollution-free electricity by 2035.
    Looking forward, the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act 
and the Build Back Better initiative will help America continue 
to make smart investments in federally owned facilities. 
Specifically, these two bills will help PBS complete nearly 100 
projects across 34 States, the District of Columbia, and Puerto 
Rico. The goal is to modernize and consolidate our footprint, 
to make it more efficient and resilient, all the while creating 
good-paying American jobs.
    In closing, I would ask that this subcommittee support and 
advocate for GSA's fiscal year 2022 budget request, the 
bipartisan infrastructure deal, and the Build Back Better 
initiative. These programs will all enable GSA to make critical 
investments in building infrastructure and allow the Federal 
Government to better serve the American people.
    Thank you.
    [Commissioner Nina Albert did not submit a prepared 
statement.]
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    We will now move on to our Members' questions. Each Member 
will be recognized for 5 minutes, and I will start by 
recognizing Mr. DeFazio.
    Mr. DeFazio. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    The 2025 figure that you just put out, Ms. Albert, could 
you just repeat that again? You expect to be, what did you say, 
carbon neutral by 2025, and then sustainably supplied by 2035? 
Was that it?
    Ms. Albert. Our commitment is to source our power purchases 
from 100 percent renewable energy sources by 2025, and then by 
2035, get to carbon pollution-free electricity.
    Mr. DeFazio. OK. I am trying to understand the difference 
between----
    Ms. Albert. Sure.
    Mr. DeFazio [continuing]. Sustainable and carbon-free, 
because----
    Ms. Albert. Yes. The difference is that buildings--so there 
is power purchasing which powers buildings, but there is a 
whole variety of other fuel uses for a building, primarily to 
heat the building. And so, most buildings run on natural gas or 
some other--mainly natural gas. And so, to get to--to alleviate 
our reliance on natural gas, that is what will take us to 2035.
    Mr. DeFazio. OK. So, I get, you have got, over here we are 
talking about lights--or in parts of the country where you 
might heat with electricity, that will be sustainable, but 
other places where you are using natural gas or heating oil or 
whatever, those will be till 2035. OK, I get that. Well, I hope 
you can meet those goals, and that will be great.
    Do you know what the deferred maintenance backlog is on 
our--I mentioned already that apparently there is $10 billion 
in collected rent which is difficult to access. Do you know 
what the deferred maintenance backlog is? Is it less than or 
more than $10 billion?
    Ms. Albert. Well, of the collected rent that we receive, 
typically about half of that goes to pay for our lease 
obligations. We collect approximately anywhere from between $10 
billion and $11 billion in rent from our Federal agencies. 
About half of that goes to pay back lease obligations, which 
leaves approximately half to invest into our own facilities.
    We have been awarded over the past 10 years, rather than 
the $5 billion, closer to $3.5 billion to $4 billion. The 
limitation on access to that remaining $1 billion has resulted 
now in what we estimate to be close to $9.5 billion in deferred 
maintenance and liabilities.
    Mr. DeFazio. Well, this is interesting. This so much echoes 
the Harbor Maintenance Trust Fund, where we were collecting an 
ad valorem tax, depositing it in a fund program created by 
Ronald Reagan, and Congress underspent that money for years.
    We finally last year resolved that. It only took me 25 
years. I hope it doesn't take us 25 years to access more 
sensibly your revenues and to keep up with your backlog. And we 
would be very interested in specifics or ideas that the agency 
could provide.
    I guess I am not quite certain what the barrier is. I mean, 
you are making requests that are just not met. Is that correct?
    Ms. Carnahan. I will jump in here for a second.
    Mr. DeFazio. Sure.
    Ms. Carnahan. OK. So, we understand that there has been 
traditionally a cap, a spending cap, that each of the 
appropriation subcommittees has to deal with, and they are able 
to do allocations within that subcommittee. And when those are 
limited, if it is a choice between spending money on Head Start 
or childcare or building deferred maintenance, the choice has 
gone to investing in kids.
    So, what we are asking for is that this be treated as it 
should, which is a separate fund, that is used to maintain our 
buildings.
    As you alluded to, we have a lot of leases coming up in the 
next few years. This is an opportunity to consolidate into more 
cost-effective, federally owned space. That is only going to 
happen if the space is maintained well, and agencies want to go 
there, and is the type of space that meets their mission needs.
    So, this is just a unique confluence of events where we 
have deferred maintenance, we have leases coming up, we have 
agencies rethinking how much space they need. This is a smart 
time to invest. And if we do this, we are able to save $2 
billion a year of tax money----
    Mr. DeFazio. Great.
    Ms. Carnahan [continuing]. In lower lease costs. So that 
makes a lot of sense to me.
    Mr. DeFazio. Sure. When do you expect--how many agencies 
have provided their future projections for space needs post-
COVID? Well, we are still in COVID, I guess, but looking ahead 
to post-COVID, have any agencies provided that data to you? Or 
when would you expect to get some of that data so you can begin 
to make those future plans?
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes. Workplace 2030 is talking about this all 
the time with agencies across the Government. I think Nina 
might have, if you want to address this more specifically, but 
these are ongoing conversations we are having with every 
agency.
    As can you imagine, all of them are rethinking how much 
telework is going to impact their space needs. And this is not 
going to be something that is resolved in the next few weeks 
but definitely something over the next year or so.
    Nina?
    Ms. Albert. Absolutely.
    Ms. Titus. You might want to wrap this up. We are way over 
time.
    Mr. DeFazio. OK. All right. Well, thank you, Madam Chair.
    Ms. Titus. Well, I was going to let Nina finish. I am 
sorry.
    Mr. DeFazio. Oh, OK, good. All right.
    Nina, please proceed.
    Ms. Albert. Well, thank you so much. We have been already 
engaging our customers. No one is prepared to make a hard-line 
decision right now because many customers are waiting to get 
back into full reentry mode, see how employees are starting to 
use space, and what the hybridized model looks like for their 
agency and for their people. But we are hearing back from 
people, anywhere between 20 percent reductions all the way up 
to 50 percent reductions, which is in line with what GSA's own 
expectations are.
    So, it will depend agency by agency. And as Administrator 
Carnahan said, it is going to be an ongoing conversation, but 
we do believe that overall for the Federal Government, we will 
be able to reduce the footprint, and there is a great 
opportunity to reposition our existing portfolio and reduce our 
reliance on leases.
    Mr. DeFazio. Excellent.
    Thank you, Madam Chair. I thank the witnesses.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    I now recognize Mr. Webster.
    Mr. Webster. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    GSA has announced information on its implementation of the 
Biden administration's vaccine mandate. Can you describe the 
requirements for contractors and lessors of a public building 
site?
    Ms. Carnahan. I will speak generally to the vaccine 
mandate, and, Commissioner Albert, if you would like to go into 
any further details.
    As you know, Congressman, we are working hard to ensure 
that the pandemic is under control, that folks are able to get 
safely back into their everyday lives and their work schedules 
and higher vaccination rates. The higher they are, the faster 
we are going to get there. So, every step we are taking is to 
move forward that goal.
    We are working closely with the contractors. The intent is 
not to punish anyone but to make sure that folks get vaccinated 
as soon as they possibly can. We understand that many of the 
contractors are having to deal with unions and employees and 
educating folks, and so, we are doing all we can to encourage 
them to make progress on this by the deadlines that are set.
    Mr. Webster. OK. And even the ones that rent the buildings, 
those too, you are doing the same thing there?
    Ms. Carnahan. Right. This would apply to Federal employees 
and to Federal contractors.
    Mr. Webster. Yes. Do these requirements cover existing 
leases? If so, has there been any analysis on the impact of the 
mandate on leasing costs and competition?
    Ms. Carnahan. They do apply to existing leases. I don't 
know about the second question.
    Nina, do you have anything you want to add on that?
    Ms. Albert. I don't. Right now, we have received a fair 
number of contract modifications that have been approved, both 
by contractors as well as lease amendments approved by our 
lessors. We are not at the deadline yet for their response to 
the lease amendments.
    The concerns that have been raised to date have really just 
been around the deadlines and how tight they are, and so we are 
working with our contractors and lessors to make sure that they 
have the time that they need to implement these mandates. And, 
candidly, we are working with lessors and contractors as they 
are sharing with us either their concerns around the deadlines 
or any other questions that they might have about the guidance 
that has been put out.
    Mr. Webster. Could you commit to providing the committee 
staff with some sort of briefing on this?
    Ms. Albert. Absolutely.
    Ms. Carnahan. Certainly. Yeah, certainly. Whatever would be 
helpful for you, we are happy to visit with you about it.
    Mr. Webster. OK. I had another thought as I was asking that 
question is, I heard the word ``cleaning'' a lot in your two 
presentations, about keeping the buildings clean. That is 
laudable. But on the other hand, since cleaning became an issue 
and now it is not as much because it has been determined, after 
60 years, that the virus is an aerosol. It doesn't fall to the 
ground even at a larger weight and so forth, or size. And so, 
the real problem is in the air.
    I talked to the building engineer here at the Capitol and 
then another one who replaced him, gave them some information. 
And then also, I talked to the Speaker and to the minority 
leader about the issue and about what they needed to do as far 
as aerosol versus things falling to the ground which I believed 
over 2 years ago.
    But my question would be, are you, in these new buildings, 
making provisions for some sort of air cleaning? I mean, there 
are ionizers, there are also UV lights. Are those being added 
to buildings that are under construction or being designed and 
so forth?
    Ms. Carnahan. I am going to defer to the Commissioner on 
this one.
    Ms. Albert. Well, Congressman, thank you for that question. 
I don't want to overlook how important cleaning in the case--
when there is a COVID case or a suspected COVID case comes up. 
We are still poised to respond and make sure that the building 
tenants are notified and that we are adequately and 
appropriately cleaning where the suspected case is found in the 
building and disinfecting high-touch surfaces. So, I just 
wanted to put that on the radar and let you know that that is 
still a high priority.
    As it pertains to what we are learning now about how the 
virus spreads, which is through airborne means, we have 
surveyed all of the buildings--as you know, we have a very 
large portfolio--to understand what type of ventilation systems 
are in place, because one of the goals is to increase air 
ventilation in spaces, and then the other is air filtration.
    So, many of our newest buildings already have the best or 
the recommended level of air filtration and options for 
ventilation. Where we are really focused, and CARES Act funding 
is going to allow us to implement this where we have--we have 
already implemented some, but we are looking at implementing 
more, which is to retrofit those older buildings, where 
applicable, with appropriate ventilation mitigations as well as 
air filtration mitigations.
    So, I am hoping that that is answering your question. Like 
I said, the most modern buildings have what is recommended by 
the CDC for air filtration and ventilation. And where we are 
really focusing is dealing with retrofitting our older 
buildings.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    Mr. Webster. I yield back.
    Ms. Titus. I will now recognize myself for 5 minutes.
    Appreciate those detailed answers. But before we can very 
effectively move forward, we need to address the three 
elephants in the room.
    The first is the Old Post Office. Now we know that that is 
being leased again, we don't want to make the same mistakes we 
made before, but GSA hasn't really complied with the inspector 
general's directive to review the definition of ``Emoluments 
Clause.''
    Now, most of our buildings aren't 100 percent leased, we 
just lease a little part of them, but we like to get that in 
place and wonder what your plans are for that moving forward, 
and what are the responsibilities left for the Trump 
Organization, if it is leased, and how we ought to be handling 
that new lease.
    Second one, the chairman mentioned the FBI building. Are 
they moving? Are they building? Are they staying? Tell us what 
is happening there.
    And then third, what about that misguided decision to send 
the BLM out to Grand Junction? Some are coming back, some are 
staying. How is that affecting your public building decisions 
in the near term?
    I would ask the Administrator and then Ms. Albert can weigh 
in.
    Ms. Carnahan. Thanks. I will address a few of those, 
Congresswoman, and let Commissioner Albert respond to some of 
the others.
    With respect to the Old Post Office, as we have talked 
about, I know that this is an important topic, I know that 
there is a lot of history about this that long predates my 
arrival 4 months ago at GSA, and I very much respect Congress' 
oversight role in all of this.
    I have instructed the team to ensure that the tenant is 
fully compliant with all its lease obligations and that we at 
GSA are being as transparent as we possibly can be with the 
committee in its oversight request and always focused on doing 
everything we can to protect the public's interest in every 
way.
    So, I cannot turn back the clock on things that have 
happened in the past, but I can commit that going forward, I am 
very interested in making sure we have the right procedures in 
place for these kind of outleases and that Congress' role in 
that is one that is appropriate. So, that is with respect to 
the Old Post Office.
    On FBI, that, again, is a topic I know that is of great 
interest to the committee, and lots of Members that I talk to 
bring up this topic. What I can tell you is that I have reached 
out to Director Wray, that our teams are working closely 
together to sort of better understand what their needs are in 
light of the changed circumstances of the last few years, and 
we will welcome any kind of direction or input from Congress as 
we take this important project on.
    I get that this is a matter of great urgency, but we also 
have to make sure that we are responding to the needs of the 
FBI and what they're looking for going forward, and that is 
what we are working on.
    Commissioner, do you have anything you want to add on 
either of those or the BLM question?
    Ms. Albert. I just wanted to make or ask a clarifying 
question. Chairwoman Titus, did you mean the Bureau of Labor 
Statistics, BLS, or BLM?
    Ms. Titus. I thought it was BLM that moved some of its 
folks out to the West and then had to move them back, and some 
are still left out there. Was it an old lease, a new lease, 
that sort of thing?
    Ms. Albert. I am sorry, I don't have a lot of details about 
that, but I will make sure to get information back to this 
committee so I can appropriately answer that question.
    Ms. Titus. OK. Well, I would appreciate that. And it is 
Bureau of Land Management, not Labor Statistics.
    Ms. Albert. Correct, right.
    Ms. Titus. That would have been even a worse decision to 
move them to Grand Junction. I can't imagine why that would 
have happened.
    Well, before you leave, let me just ask you about the 
design of Federal buildings. Will you commit to working with me 
so that we can put those in place so that we don't go back to 
having every building follow the same pattern, but we can 
improve the program for allowing local input and consideration 
of the location of the building, whatever it may be, that we 
decide to construct?
    Ms. Carnahan. Certainly, Congresswoman.
    I will take this, Commissioner.
    This is a topic I know is of great interest to you and the 
public. First, I just want to put out there that the President 
has revoked the previous administration's Executive order on 
the topic that you raised, so I think that should address 
immediate concerns.
    Second, I couldn't agree more that the design of our public 
buildings should reflect the diversity of our communities. It 
should fit into those communities; part of our job is to ensure 
that that happens.
    So, we are happy to work with you on whatever way you see 
appropriate to move that forward so that you can be confident 
that is happening going forward.
    Ms. Titus. Well, thank you, Administrator. There is a 
bipartisan bill that I introduced, H.R. 5291, that would do 
this, it is called the Democracy in Design Act. If you would 
take a look at that, I would appreciate it, give us any input 
so we can try to work to move that forward. That would be 
great.
    Ms. Carnahan. Certainly will. Thanks, ma'am.
    Ms. Titus. And now I recognize Mr. Massie.
    Mr. Massie. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
    Ms. Carnahan, can you tell us what the deadline is for the 
vaccine mandate from the Biden administration for Federal 
employees?
    Ms. Carnahan. I can tell you that there is a target date of 
December 8that they have put out there, that they want there to 
be progress on vaccinations. So, that is the hard-and-fast date 
that I know of.
    Mr. Massie. What will happen to employees who refuse to 
take the vaccine by December 8?
    Ms. Carnahan. So, we are talking about contractors here?
    Mr. Massie. Just Federal employees.
    Ms. Carnahan. OK. So, the Federal employee date, I believe, 
is different. That is sometime in November. I think it is the 
22nd. So, my understanding is that for those who choose not to 
be vaccinated, that is who you are speaking about----
    Mr. Massie. Yes.
    Ms. Carnahan [continuing]. There are going to be steps that 
they can take for reasonable accommodation where that is 
appropriate.
    Mr. Massie. So, how many requests have you received for 
religious accommodations, given that the deadline is coming 
upon us, or medical accommodations or exemptions?
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes. I don't have that number, Congressman, 
but certainly I can check on that and see what it is. The 
deadline is several weeks away. So, we can give you a rolling 
number or we can give you the one----
    Mr. Massie. Right. How long do you think it will take you 
to process those requests for exemptions given that the 
deadline is 3 weeks away?
    Ms. Carnahan. You know what, I don't know the answer to 
that question, Congressman. I know that is a thing that is 
ongoing right now, and I can get back to you about that.
    Mr. Massie. OK. How many have been granted or requested? Do 
you know how many have been requested or granted at this point?
    Ms. Carnahan. I do not.
    Mr. Massie. Is there a form that Federal employees at the 
GSA can fill out right now and apply for a religious exemption 
or is that form not available yet?
    Ms. Carnahan. So, my understanding is that folks have been 
asked to say their vaccination status and provide proof of 
their vaccination, that we have gotten very high-level number 
of responses to that. I don't have the number off the top of my 
head, but I can get that to you very quickly----
    Mr. Massie. OK.
    Ms. Carnahan [continuing]. And that a large number of those 
have provided proof of vaccination. So, I don't know what the 
number is. It is a relatively small number that we are going to 
be considering for religious and other kinds of health 
exemptions.
    Mr. Massie. I hope you will consider them all, all of the 
requests. Attorney General Garland testified to me last week in 
the Judiciary Committee that the Religious Freedom Restoration 
Act requires the consideration and granting of religious 
accommodations in the context of vaccine mandates.
    Have you received any guidance from the Biden 
administration on how to process these requests, given that the 
law requires that religious accommodations be made to the 
vaccine mandate?
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes, thanks, Congressman. The team is working 
very hard on this. This is a matter of great interest to 
everybody across the administration, and I think it is 
important that there be as much consistency as possible so that 
there is predictability in it. So, yes, the team is working 
closely with the rest of the administration on this.
    Mr. Massie. Can you provide us with the guidance that you 
have been given from the Biden administration? And I am not 
picking on the GSA. You just happen to be in this committee 
today. This is a question that I asked the DOJ and other 
departments.
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes. Whatever we can provide, we will 
provide. So, I will ask the team about that and to circle back 
with you and your staff.
    Mr. Massie. Ma'am, I am trying to determine what kind of 
guidance has been given.
    Ms. Albert, have you received any guidance or communication 
from the Biden administration regarding the possible 
implementation of vaccine passports or other proof of 
vaccination to enter Federal facilities or for contractors or 
the general public?
    Ms. Albert. Well, as you probably are aware, GSA cochairs 
and is part of the Safer Federal Workforce Task Force, which is 
a multiagency group working on the vaccination mandate as well 
as others, and so making sure that the communications from the 
Federal Government to our contractors is clear.
    Please--you know, we are obviously receiving feedback from 
contractors and questions, and we are processing those very 
quickly and continuing to evolve our guidance as we learn more.
    Mr. Massie. Have there been any discussion of vaccine 
passports and requiring proof of vaccination to enter Federal 
buildings?
    Ms. Albert. I have not heard anything about vaccine 
passports. In order to enter into a Federal building right now, 
you need to--and this is the current state of what the guidance 
says--is be able to provide either--you have to wear a mask if 
the locality requires mask-wearing indoors, so compliance with 
local guidance around mask-wearing, social distancing of 
course, and then just a provision or an attestation about 
vaccination status.
    Mr. Massie. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. My time is 
expired. I yield back.
    Ms. Titus. All right. Thank you, Mr. Massie.
    We will now go to Ms. Holmes Norton.
    Ms. Norton. Thank you very much, Madam Chair, for this 
important hearing.
    I have a question for Administrator Carnahan. We have had a 
running drama with the SEC building here in the Nation's 
Capital. On September 30, the GSA entered into a lease on the 
SEC's behalf for a new SEC headquarters building. I am pleased 
that GSA has prioritized cost effectiveness in this procurement 
process.
    The SEC has wasted hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars 
on leasing errors, including overestimating the amount of space 
needed for its headquarters by 300 percent at a cost of $500 
million. More recently, in 2019, the SEC effectively vetoed the 
GSA's entire procurement process, allowing a multimillion-
dollar procurement funded by taxpayers simply to go to waste.
    I introduced the Securities and Exchange Commission Real 
Estate Leasing Authority Revocation Act, that is H.R. 1468, to 
revoke the SEC's authority to independently lease general 
purpose office space and instead to provide for the GSA to 
lease such space for the SEC.
    I am asking you, what is the administration's view of this 
bill?
    Ms. Carnahan. Well, thanks for the question, Congresswoman. 
I am not familiar or have a position on the bill specifically. 
I can address generally the situation at the SEC.
    Ms. Norton. Please do that.
    Ms. Carnahan. As you know, the facility that was delivered 
to the SEC was based on the needs and requirements that they 
laid out and that Congress approved. So that is what was done, 
that is the work GSA did.
    You probably also are well aware that there has been a 
protest of the award by one of the losing bidders, which limits 
what I can go into in terms of the specifics.
    The broader question that you raise, which is one about 
agencies and how much space they are going to need in the 
future, as we have been talking about, all of the agencies in 
this post-COVID environment are looking to what their space 
needs are going to be. And GSA is very focused on how we can 
consolidate and be good stewards of tax money by consolidating 
agencies into existing space. So that just--know that that is 
what we are thinking about all the time when it comes to these 
projects.
    Ms. Norton. You don't think that an agency should have 
independent authority to go out and lease whatever building it 
feels like leasing?
    Ms. Carnahan. Well, I know different agencies have 
different authorities--and, Nina, I don't know if you can speak 
to any of that--but that is an issue that is better addressed 
by Congress than by GSA.
    Ms. Albert. Just speak to and reaffirm what the 
Administrator just said. I mean, obviously, GSA has the 
authority to lease space. Some other agencies also have such 
authorities. In certain cases, we are able to delegate our 
authority to others, and we evaluate whether or not that is 
appropriate, as well as are a partner with that delegated 
agency when they do receive authority from us, to ensure that 
the leases that they enter into have oversight and have the 
benefit of GSA's expertise.
    In all cases, when we are going through these consolidation 
opportunities or headquarters moves, GSA is in partnership with 
the organization and the agency it's looking to move. We are 
the ones with the authority and the real estate expertise to 
help them conceive and design their new space. But, ultimately, 
they are the end user, and they are a very, very important part 
of the discussion and the conception of what their needs are.
    Ms. Norton. OK. They are important--but I wanted to 
establish, in fact, agencies can independently go out and lease 
for themselves.
    Final question to Commissioner Albert. What steps, if any, 
has GSA taken to jump-start the Southwest Ecodistrict, 
including selling the Department of Energy's four-star 
building?
    Ms. Albert. Well, this is a personal area of interest of 
mine, being from Washington, DC. It is a great opportunity. I 
will look into that and have been interested in that. I don't 
have specific plans to share at this moment, but that is 
something that I would really look forward to working with you 
on.
    Ms. Norton. Madam Chair, I would like to, as you can see, 
get the answer on that question.
    Ms. Titus. OK. We will be sure to follow up with Ms. 
Albert. Thank you.
    I now recognize Ms. Van Duyne for 5 minutes.
    Ms. Van Duyne. Thank you very much.
    Administrator Carnahan, thank you for testifying today. As 
you know, outside of the DC region, the largest cluster of 
federally owned and operated real estate is the 47 land ports 
of entry along the southern border with Mexico. The vast 
majority of these ports are owned or leased by the GSA or with 
CBP involvement and are in dire need of modernization. These 
ports have a real impact on economic activity in border States.
    In each State, thousands of Americans and Mexicans pass 
legally through the checkpoints to work, shop, or go to school. 
President Biden is finally allowing nonessential travel to 
resume between the U.S. and Mexico----
    [Audio interruption.]
    Ms. Van Duyne [continuing]. Not sure whose mic is on, but--
--
    Ms. Titus. Ms. Norton, I think your mic is on. Thank you.
    Ms. Van Duyne [continuing]. So, you have been in office 
since July. Have you visited the southern border yet?
    Ms. Carnahan. No, ma'am. I have not yet visited the 
southern border. I did visit a land port of entry in Vermont a 
month ago, and----
    Ms. Van Duyne. Yes, that is definitely not on the southern 
border. And Texas is not as much interested in Vermont as we 
are about the ports along the Texas-Mexican border.
    So, will you commit to visiting the ports of entry along 
the Texas-Mexican border soon?
    Ms. Carnahan. I am very interested in getting to the 
southern border. I will tell you, I haven't been traveling that 
much in light of COVID but am very interested in getting out to 
all the places that we serve.
    Ms. Van Duyne. Well, I would hope that this would be a 
priority, especially with all that is going on in our southern 
border, getting down there and seeing for yourself what needs 
to happen.
    As we face critical supply chain crisis, combined with 
historic levels of illegal immigration, what is the impact of 
allowing land port of entries to deteriorate?
    Ms. Carnahan. As you have already pointed out, these land 
ports of entry have all kinds of maintenance needs. It is about 
having security at our borders, but also about having openness 
for business and other kinds of transport. And so, this is the 
first entryway into the United States. We ought to be making 
those ones that are welcoming, secure, and appropriate for the 
services they provide.
    Ms. Van Duyne. So, again, I would ask that you commit to 
actually going down there and visiting it firsthand.
    Last month, you made comments on reimagining how people 
work and make sure that Federal Government employees have 
everything that they need to work, whether they are remote, in 
the office, or using a hybrid model. Unfortunately, what my 
constituents and I have seen is a nonresponsive Federal 
workforce. Wait times are out of control, and it is clear that 
agencies such as the IRS, Social Security, USCIS are not being 
effective while working remotely.
    So, have you had conversations with agencies to see what is 
needed to get agencies back up and running so that the 
Government can be responsible for its constituents?
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes, thanks for that question. This is a 
topic of great interest to me is how Government can work better 
for the people it serves and save money doing it. We have seen, 
certainly through the pandemic, over and over again, the 
failure of Government websites to be able to deliver for people 
at a really urgent time of need.
    And so, while GSA is not in charge of every Government 
website, we do have the ability to help support agencies with 
what are called shared services. What I mean by that are things 
that every interaction with Government has to have. Right? So, 
there are login services, for example, that need to be secure. 
There are identity verification services that every----
    Ms. Van Duyne. But my question----
    Ms. Carnahan [continuing]. Agency would need.
    Mr. Van Duyne. And I am sorry, but I have a very limited 
time. My question had to do with making sure that we are having 
our employees get back to work in their offices. So, have you 
had conversations with those agencies that I mentioned, 
specifically the ones that are not working well remotely? Have 
you had conversations with them to make sure that we are doing 
everything that we can to get those employees back in the 
office?
    Ms. Carnahan. So, GSA has had people in offices across the 
country throughout the pandemic. We will continue to do that. 
We are ready to serve and stand up with any other of our agency 
partners who want to have their people come back to work. We 
are interested in supporting that, but we don't make the 
decision ultimately about when they are returning to their 
offices.
    Ms. Van Duyne. OK. Well, I appreciate that.
    One final quick question. I understand the GSA announced 
that there is a new diversity initiative. When the President 
announced the initiative, GSA said that ``when we make policy, 
build buildings, buy supplies, and deploy technology, we will 
keep diversity, equity, inclusion, and accessibility at the top 
of the list.'' The mission of the GSA is to provide Federal 
agencies with buildings, leased office space, services, 
supplies, things like that.
    So does the DEIA, which is what I just read, as President 
Biden defines it, trump GSA's main mission of providing office 
Government services?
    Ms. Carnahan. Look, GSA's mission, as I have said from the 
outset, is to make Government work better for the people it 
serves and to save money doing it. That is going to continue to 
be our mission. That may change over time, how we deliver on 
that mission. And ensuring that we give access to everyone is 
an appropriate thing for Government to do. So, we will be 
focused on that, as well as looking out for taxpayer money.
    Ms. Van Duyne. I appreciate that. Thank you.
    I yield.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you. And I might just remind Ms. Van 
Duyne, since she is interested in the difficulties at the land 
ports of entry, there is $3.4 billion in the Senate 
transportation bill. She might want to use some of that money 
for helping with those ports. And since the IRS is a concern 
not being able to help the people of this country, there is $2 
billion for taxpayer services in the reconciliation bill. So, 
she might want----
    Ms. Van Duyne. I appreciate that, but we all know throwing 
money at something----
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    We will now recognize Ms. Davids.
    Ms. Davids of Kansas. Thank you. Thank you, Chairwoman.
    And thank you, Administrator Carnahan and Commissioner 
Albert, for taking the time to testify here today.
    I represent the Kansas Third Congressional District, which 
is in the Kansas City metro area and is an area that has 
absolutely been impacted by some of the increasing severe 
effects of climate change and severe weather events.
    I am curious about, though, the ways that GSA has taken a 
look at building codes and reviewing building codes and the 
ways that that cannot only help us better prepare for severe 
weather events, but also to actually make a dent in some of the 
climate change impacts that we are having. I am very curious if 
you could tell us a little bit about what you are doing. And 
either of you can speak to that.
    Ms. Carnahan. Let me just say a few things at the outset 
and then defer to Commissioner Albert on this.
    Look, the impacts of climate change are real. They are ones 
that present a risk to our portfolio. And we are spending time 
thinking about that, both the existing portfolio and what we 
need to do and what the major risks are and how we can mitigate 
those. But we are also thinking about how these changes should 
impact how we think about locating future Government 
facilities.
    So that is really about doing better with data, 
understanding all of our portfolio, and doing the evaluations 
to figure out certainly things in flood zones or other kinds of 
climate risks to our systems, and then putting a price tag on 
what it would cost to do that mitigation.
    So, Commissioner, do you have anything you want to add to 
that?
    Ms. Albert. Yes. I would just like to respond to the 
specific question about building codes. As you know, building 
codes are set and which codes are used are set by the locality. 
We comply with all local codes. But in terms of what the 
Federal Government's own standards are, as the GSA sets them, 
we really incorporate into our design specifications and lease 
guidelines what codes are required for Federal buildings or for 
the Federal Government to lease space from other landlords.
    And so, that is really how we set the standard for things 
like building resilience. It is really in how buildings are 
designed and the design standard that we bring it to, which in 
many cases is above what local codes mandate.
    Ms. Davids of Kansas. Yes. And I think, in all the research 
that I have seen, if we really took a strong, hard look at 
improving building codes, we could actually really make a dent 
on things like carbon emissions and that sort of thing. So, I 
appreciate the work you guys are doing over there to address 
that.
    And then I think, since I just have like a short amount of 
time here, but I do think that, piggybacking off of the 
previous questions that we had, I know there is the--you know, 
the Federal Buildings Personnel Training Act of 2010, which 
actually coincidentally enough was brought up by Congressman 
Russ Carnahan, our Administrator's brother. The Federal 
workforce is, of course, becoming more complex. The buildings, 
the systems, they are becoming more sophisticated. And the 
technology is progressing at a very quick pace.
    I know that you all are working on smart buildings and 
trying to make sure that our smart employees are trained up in 
the way that they need to be. If you want to take this last 
minute or so to kind of talk about where you are at on 
implementing that plan and piece of legislation.
    Ms. Carnahan. That is great. Thanks for the question. You 
are right, smart buildings and technologies make--they are just 
wise investments. They improve health. They improve energy 
efficiency. They save us money. And so, that is all good, but 
it does require training facility managers to be able to do all 
of those things.
    We have identified a couple of courses, one in the 
cybersecurity area, which is particularly relevant for any kind 
of smart buildings, as well as public health. And so, we are 
doing trainings. And we are working with agency partners, 
including the State Department and the Corps of Engineers on 
doing this as well.
    One of the consistent things we hear, frankly, from our 
partners is that training is really useful, but when push comes 
to shove, training budgets are often things that get cut. So 
just know that is something that is a challenge but something 
we think is a worthy investment.
    Nina, do you have anything you want to add on that?
    Ms. Albert. I will just add that smart buildings are part 
of the ecosystem of sustainable building design, and that is 
absolutely the direction that GSA is going in. We are really 
focused on upskilling our workforce. We have the fortunate 
position of not only having the Green Proving Ground which can 
test certain types of building, smart building technologies, 
but we are also putting into place and have evaluated what 
specific skills we need to concentrate on to upskill our 
workforce, to be able to respond to, manage, as well as analyze 
data that we are getting back as a result of the smart building 
system.
    So, this is an area of focus. As we further green our 
buildings, make them more sustainable, this is a crucial aspect 
of being able to manage smart buildings, high-performance 
buildings into the future. And so, we are not taking our eye 
off of this ball.
    Ms. Davids of Kansas. Thank you so much. Appreciate you.
    And thank you, Chairwoman. I yield back.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you. Maybe you will keep us updated as you 
move to more and more smart buildings. Thank you.
    We now go to Mr. Gimenez.
    Mr. Gimenez. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    I have got a couple of questions for Ms. Carnahan. Have you 
started a process to begin the consolidation of Federal 
properties in order to reduce the amount of money that we spent 
as a Federal Government on all of our agencies? Have we started 
the process on that?
    Ms. Carnahan. Well, we think about it all the time, 
Congressman. Leases come up on different cadences. That is why, 
as I mentioned before, the fact that we have got about over 40 
percent of our leases coming up in the next 4 years. That is 
the moment we should be investing in our own property so that 
the transitions can be easily made by agencies out of that 
leased space and into owned space. It will save $2 billion a 
year in lease payments which, to me, is a very smart investment 
and payback of the American people.
    Mr. Gimenez. I would probably think you would probably save 
a heck of a lot more.
    Do you find in the Federal Government that agencies seem to 
silo themselves, that they consider themselves somewhat like 
independent of the Federal Government? Not really, but do they 
really think of themselves kind of as independent?
    Ms. Carnahan. Well, look, I think that a lot of what drives 
agencies' decisionmaking when it comes to space is financial 
incentives. Right? And one of the challenges that we see over 
and over again is they are--because agencies are not able to 
have the proceeds of the money if they dispose of something, 
right, and they have to then come to get extra money to build 
out new space, there is just not a lot of incentive for them to 
make that change, because the budget process is set up in a way 
that sort of encourages the status quo.
    So, I would be really interested in working with you and 
the committee on ways to create smart incentives to encourage 
these agencies to consolidate, and that means giving them the 
funds to do the build-outs to make that happen.
    Mr. Gimenez. I doubt that is going to work. I was the mayor 
of Miami-Dade County, and I also was a department director. I 
know that when I was a department director, I wanted to get 
bigger. All right? And that I felt as, you know, my agency was 
the most important agency in the agency that I was working for, 
the city of Miami at the time when I was a director. And so, 
when I became the mayor, I said, no, we are going to centralize 
this thing, and we are going to make smart decisions based on 
what the greater good of the county is, not the agency, 
although--and they are not mutually exclusive.
    So, have you talked to the President or somebody in charge 
and said, look, we need to do some kind of an Executive order 
that kind of forces agencies to work with GSA in order to start 
to consolidate a lot of these properties and to have a more 
holistic strategy of--it is what you need; it is not what you 
want. OK?
    And so, I know with agencies, if you ask them what they 
want, they will ask for three times the number of square feet 
that they actually need, et cetera, et cetera. And so, have you 
thought about asking the President to issue some kind of an 
order that says, look, we need to start consolidating to save 
some real dollars here?
    Ms. Carnahan. So, I have, Congressman, been talking to 
everyone I can talk to. I have not spoken to the President 
about this topic directly. But I have spoken to lots of people 
about the need to be able to take this unique moment where 
agencies are rethinking what their space needs are, because 
they have just spent 20 months with people teleworking, and 
they know that this is going to change going forward.
    So, there are not a lot of times in Government, certainly, 
that there is a seismic shift in how people are thinking about 
how they deliver service, and we are at that moment. So, the 
question is whether we are going to be smart and take advantage 
of it. The way we do that is we create incentives for people to 
move into shared space. The only way that happens----
    Mr. Gimenez. Ma'am, but the only person that----
    Ms. Carnahan [continuing]. Is if we invest in that.
    Mr. Gimenez. Sorry. Sorry to interrupt you. But the only 
person that they all work for is the President. OK? So that is 
the one person that everybody--that is the head. That is the 
head. That is the top of the pyramid here. And so, the 
President is the one that has to issue the order to do that to 
get it moving along.
    Incentives may work or they may not work. It is actually 
going to take some action and orders from the President to say, 
this is what we are going to do as a country. This is the way 
that we are moving forward.
    Also, the other thing that I want to talk about is, I know 
the Federal Government has extensive properties all over the 
place. Some are being used, some are not. And some--the ones 
that are not being used are not productive. They are actually 
costing us money to maintain.
    Do you have a plan to put forward so that we can start to 
release some of this unused, unnecessary Federal lands and make 
them productive instead of being an expense on the Federal 
Government?
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes, it is a great question. I share your 
urgency about this. There is no reason why it should take such 
a long time to dispose of properties that folks have decided 
they don't need to use anymore, but it is a longer process than 
I like. In my home State in Missouri, I have learned about one 
in St. Louis that has taken many, many years. Everybody knows 
it needs to be disposed of, but it still hasn't been. There are 
often issues with getting that done. Sometimes those are 
environmental issues. Sometimes those are other, kind of, 
community issues.
    The main thing we have got to sort of balance against speed 
is the impact on the community. Because you can imagine, if you 
are giving up a big Federal tenant in a space, that is going to 
have an impact on a community. And so, we don't want to make 
those decisions lightly, and we want to be in close 
consultation with the communities where they are located.
    Mr. Gimenez. Thank you, ma'am. My time is up, and I yield 
back.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    I now recognize Miss Gonzalez-Colon.
    Miss Gonzalez-Colon. Thank you, Madam Chair.
    And thank you, Administrator, for being with us today. My 
question will be: Given the significant seismic activity impact 
in the island of Puerto Rico, how confident are you that the 
Degetau Federal Building remains structurally sound, and what 
efforts is the GSA taking while working toward the immediate 
seismic reinforcement to ensure my constituents that the 
facility is safe for occupancy?
    Ms. Carnahan. Well, thanks for the question, Congresswoman. 
I know that this is a topic of great concern to you and your 
constituents. I have been only marginally briefed on this 
topic, but I believe Commissioner Albert can speak more 
specifically to that building.
    Ms. Albert. Thank you so much.
    This is a priority for us. We have already obligated $48 
million in repairs and improvements to facilities in Puerto 
Rico following Hurricanes Irma and Maria. We are also 
continuing our work in various campuses that are ongoing right 
now. So, we are very pleased with the progress that we have 
made in the Build Back Better proposal. We can use about $500-
plus million to complete the projects of the Federal facilities 
that are in Puerto Rico, and in that design and construction 
work, seismic protections, as well as other protections, for 
other climate change events are being incorporated.
    So, thank you for that question.
    Miss Gonzalez-Colon. Thank you, Commissioner, as well, and 
Administrator.
    And the reason I make this question is that you already 
know that last week this committee passed a resolution for $22 
million for the phase of design and the construction of the new 
annex to the building, and I am happy with that. But I know as 
well that this is just the first phase of a long project.
    And when do you think my constituents can see the whole 
project being built? I know the different phases are going up 
to--this phase is 2022 to 2024. And the construction for 
seismic retrofit is back in 2028 to the fiscal year 2031. So, 
do you say--how committed is the administration in terms of 
having the funds for all the phases in the future?
    Ms. Albert. Well, this is part of--these projects will be 
part of the Build Back Better program for us. So, if that 
funding is approved, then we are well positioned and do have 
these projects in our priority list for completion.
    As you know, the $22 million that kicks off the design, we 
are absolutely prepared to execute on that as soon as the 
fiscal year 2022 budget is approved. And that is really what 
gets the entire process moving, and we are anxious to get 
started and to be able to deliver those projects for you.
    Miss Gonzalez-Colon. Thank you.
    And my question, Administrator, right now will be: How will 
GSA use the lessons learned throughout the 2010 ARRA project in 
San Juan to ensure a high level of management, coordination, 
and oversight is provided to ensure the successful completion 
of this complex project can be done? We got a lot of experience 
with that project in the past, and I just want to know if GSA 
is taking into account all the mistakes and situations that 
happened during that process in 2010.
    Ms. Carnahan. So, I appreciate your question. As you know, 
I was not around in 2010, so not familiar with all of the 
history, certainly not as much as you are.
    Miss Gonzalez-Colon. Me neither.
    Ms. Carnahan. But I will say that our teams are committed 
to doing all they can to deliver these things on time, on 
budget, and meeting the mission needs of the team. That takes a 
lot of close collaboration with people that are on the ground, 
certainly with people in your office. And so, we will look 
forward to collaborating going forward.
    Miss Gonzalez-Colon. Thank you, Administrator.
    My last question will be just to let you know that Puerto 
Rico has an agency dedicated to the promotion and use of 
public-private partnerships to the benefit of the Government 
and to save taxpayers money for my constituents. And I think it 
will be beneficial for GSA to have the ability to use P3 
partnerships.
    My question to you is: Do you believe in P3 projects, and 
are you committed to work with my office and this committee to 
come up with solutions to ensure GSA can utilize P3 
partnerships in the future?
    Ms. Carnahan. Yes, thanks. I am a big fan of public-private 
partnerships. In fact, whenever we can do anything that is a 
smart, quicker way to speed up projects and also save money, it 
makes sense. But what we need to make sure of is those are set 
up in ways that do make sense and don't mean the Government is 
overpaying for something. So, they need to be financially 
appropriate and looking out for taxpayers.
    One of the things that we have done a lot of when it comes 
to P3s is energy savings performance contracts. So that is one 
where we have a lot of experience where, as you know, that is 
where we enter into long-term contracts with companies that 
upgrade and improve the energy efficiency of facilities, and 
then they are paid back sort of over time as we pay for those 
utility costs.
    There are plenty of ways we can expand those, and we would 
really look forward to working with you on how to do that.
    Miss Gonzalez-Colon. Thank you, Administrator. My time has 
expired. But I want to say thank you for coming today, and I 
invite you to come to the island whenever you are ready.
    Thank you, Madam Chair.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    We will now recognize Mr. Guest for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Guest. Thank you, Madam Chairman.
    Commissioner Albert, I want to speak with you a few minutes 
on flexible coworking space. We know, prior to the pandemic, 
that the GSA was reducing our real estate footprint because of 
excess capacity. We know because of COVID we have seen more 
individuals now teleworking, and that has created uncertainty 
about the amount of space that we need going forward in the 
future.
    I know several weeks ago, there was a news release report 
by the Federal News Network, and it said: ``The General 
Services Administration, building on lessons on workplace 
flexibility learned during the COVID-19 pandemic, is giving the 
Federal workforce new opportunities to keep working outside of 
their traditional offices.''
    It goes on to say: ``GSA last week took the first major 
step in implementing its long-term future of work strategy by 
awarding a first-of-its-kind contract to provide flexible 
coworking spaces for Federal employees nationwide. The 
contract, whose total GSA estimates is $50 million, harkens 
back to a similar concept the agency experimented with more 
than a decade ago.''
    And so, two things. First, I ask if you could kind of 
expand upon the flexible coworking spaces, how you see that 
going forward as we are looking to retool coming out of COVID-
19? And then, also, when can we expect to see task orders 
issued for competition under this contract?
    Ms. Albert. Well, thank you so much for that question, 
Congressman Guest.
    We have actually just last week hosted a virtual event with 
I think it was 40 different agency customers that were really 
interested in learning more about the coworking task, or IDIQ. 
So, we answered questions about the contract and what it allows 
them to do. This is the first-of-its-kind contract that the 
Federal Government has done.
    Why we decided to offer it was just to give more 
opportunity and more options for agencies. And it is 
particularly well-suited to address short-term space needs. 
When you are entering into a longer term or a larger size 
lease, there is a process affiliated with that. And the 
flexible coworking contract allows us to offer space as a 
service.
    So, it is a little bit more off the shelf. If an agency 
needs space for a month or up to a year, they can go ahead and 
get access to this space. And there is a whole variety of 
different spaces that most of these landlords or service 
providers offer, from conference room space to individual 
offices and everything in between.
    So, it has been met with a lot of interest. We believe it 
gives us additional flexibility and broadens the services that 
we are able to provide to customers.
    Ultimately, we will see, just like we are doing as--I mean, 
this is the great experiment, candidly, for both the private 
sector and the public sector. Everyone understands that the 
future of work will be more designed with flexibility and 
mobility in mind where different people are going to need 
different spaces but what they value when they come to an 
office is collaboration and other kinds of spaces.
    So, we are going to have to evolve our own spaces, and 
having access to coworking space allows agencies to decide what 
kinds of spaces they think they need without the Federal 
Government making an upfront capital investment in delivering 
that kind of space. So, we can use this as an opportunity for 
agencies to come back to us, say, hey, I have been using a lot 
of this kind of space over that kind of space and that is what 
I want in the future.
    So, we see a great advantage to it. There is a lot of 
interest from our agencies, and we look forward in the next 
year to learning more about how the space is going to be used.
    Mr. Guest. Thank you.
    And kind of an unrelated question, Commissioner, while I 
have got you, is on page 7 of the written testimony, it talks 
about the proposed $5 million investment in Federal buildings. 
Going on over onto page 8, it talks about some of the potential 
savings. And then it says: ``We can leverage these funds to buy 
lower carbon materials as we work to modernize our existing 
facilities.''
    And just curious, as it relates to low-carbon materials, 
what type of materials would you be referring to there?
    Ms. Albert. Well, there is a variety, but the most common 
example is really embedded carbon in concrete. And so, we would 
be working with concrete manufacturers, for example, doing 
direct outreach with industry and industry groups to understand 
where they see the opportunity. Carbon is also embedded in the 
production of a lot of different types of materials, steel 
among them, equipment, others.
    This is going to be a long-term partnership with industry 
and equipment manufacturers, as well as material manufacturers, 
to figure out how we are going to reduce carbon in the 
production of these materials.
    Mr. Guest. And I know my time is up, but would mass timber 
products also be included in something that you would be 
looking at as far as a lower carbon material?
    Ms. Albert. That is absolutely an option, yes. There is 
nothing that we have that precludes the use of that.
    Mr. Guest. Thank you. Madam Chairman, I am out of time, so 
I yield back.
    Ms. Titus. Thank you.
    Well, that concludes the Members we have for questions.
    Mr. Webster, do you have any closing comments before we 
adjourn?
    Mr. Webster. No. I just want to follow up on some of the 
things I was talking about, but I am going to do that in 
writing. Thank you, Chair.
    Ms. Titus. Well, thank you.
    And thank you, Administrator and Commissioner. We really 
appreciate your commitment to transparency and cooperation. You 
can tell by the questions that there is a lot of interest from 
the Members on what you are doing and what you are planning to 
do.
    I also appreciate your working with us, with the 
appropriators to get some of the money that you collect, that 
you need to then reinvest in our buildings to make them safer, 
make them healthier, make them greener. So, we want to work 
with you to do that.
    You set the market in many places where you are located for 
commercial real estate, so we want you doing it the most 
efficient way possible. Always keep the taxpayer in mind but 
not building to look like the Parthenon.
    So, thank you. Thank you very much. And we will appreciate 
you getting back with some of those questions. And I know that 
we will be in touch moving forward. We welcome your wise 
counsel on these issues.
    So, that concludes our hearing. Your comments will go into 
the record. As I said, they have been very helpful.
    I ask unanimous consent that the record of today's hearing 
remain open until such time as our witnesses have provided 
answers to any questions that may be submitted to them in 
writing.
    I also ask unanimous consent that the record remain open 
for 15 days for any additional comments and information 
submitted by Members or the witnesses to be included in the 
record of today's hearing.
    Without objection, so ordered.
    The subcommittee stands adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 11:34 a.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]


                       Submissions for the Record

                              ----------                              

  Prepared Statement of Hon. Sam Graves, a Representative in Congress 
     from the State of Missouri, and Ranking Member, Committee on 
                   Transportation and Infrastructure
    Thank you, Chair Titus, and thank you to our witnesses for being 
here today.
    This Subcommittee has a long, bipartisan history of taking a 
leading role in reforming federal real estate.
    From pressing agencies to reduce their space footprint, to changing 
how we dispose of unneeded real estate, we have saved the taxpayer 
billions of dollars.
    Now we are faced with a potential opportunity to realize more 
savings.
    Understanding GSA's priorities, particularly in the public building 
space, is important to help the Committee work with GSA to continue to 
improve management of federal real estate.
    I look forward to hearing from the GSA Administrator and Public 
Buildings Commissioner today and welcome them.
    Thank you, Chair Titus. I yield back.


                                Appendix

                              ----------                              


   Questions from Hon. Peter A. DeFazio to the U.S. General Services 
                             Administration

Sustainability:
    Question 1. Does PBS know how many of its owned and leased spaces 
have sustained damage from weather-related natural disasters?
    Answer. The U.S. General Services Administration (GSA) establishes 
priority codes for tracking projects resulting from natural disasters. 
These codes track damage to buildings from major weather events such as 
Hurricanes Irma, Harvey, Maria, and Florence. In addition, GSA has 
submitted emergency reprogramming requests to Congress for isolated 
weather events, such as a 2020 derecho in Cedar Rapids, IA and a hail 
storm in 2017 that damaged several buildings at the Denver Federal 
Center. Since 2017, GSA has tracked 59 buildings in GSA's inventory 
that have sustained damage due to weather-related natural disasters.

    Question 2. Does GSA tally the cost of repairs needed due to 
weather related natural disasters?
    Answer. Yes. As mentioned above, GSA establishes priority codes for 
tracking project costs and other financial activity resulting from 
natural disasters. This process allows GSA to tally the costs 
associated with these types of repairs.

    Question 3. How has the COVID-19 pandemic's reduced building 
occupancy and utilization impacted GSA's energy consumption?
    Answer. The average energy usage per gross square foot (BTU/GSF) 
across the portfolio at the onset of the pandemic (trailing 12-months 
through Feb. 2020) was about 54,120 BTU/GSF. Since having 12-full 
months of pandemic operations, energy usage has averaged about 49,760 
BTU/GSF, or an -8.1% change, which is a significant decrease, 
particularly given the steps GSA has taken to increase ventilation and 
improve air filtration in its facilities consistent with guidelines 
promulgated by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). 
However, the changes weren't uniform throughout the portfolio. For 
example, land ports of entry--which have critical national security 
functions and 24/7 operations and implemented no telework--saw almost 
no change in energy usage during this time. Additionally, GSA 
facilities with very dense tenant populations (higher numbers of 
tenants per square foot) tended to reduce energy use more than 
buildings with lower tenant population densities.

    Question 4. What does GSA need to transform its owned portfolio to 
healthier, sustainable, well-designed buildings that are smaller and 
more cost-effective?
    Answer. GSA has one of the largest Federal sustainable building 
portfolios in the country. In FY 2020, GSA had 269 federally owned 
buildings that were identified as sustainable per the Guiding 
Principles for Sustainable Federal Buildings [https://
www.sustainability.gov/pdfs/guiding_principles_for_sustainable_federal_
buildings.pdf]. Those buildings comprise approximately 40% of GSA's 
federally owned square footage. We know how to design, build, and 
operate sustainable Federal buildings and are a recognized leader in 
the real property industry.
    To transform to a climate resilient, more sustainable, and cost-
effective portfolio, GSA needs sustained reinvestment to modernize and 
maintain efficient and high-performing buildings. With full access to 
the future annual revenues and collections deposited in the Federal 
Buildings Fund (FBF), GSA could convert more existing federally owned 
facilities to become sustainable, reducing their carbon impact; create 
and sustain thousands of good-paying jobs; and ensure newly constructed 
facilities are designed and built both in a sustainable, resilient and 
efficient manner.
    While investments from appropriations such as the Infrastructure 
Investment and Jobs Act (Public Law 117-58) modernize and improve 
portions of GSA's portfolio, these types of appropriations are targeted 
to specific facilities (Land Ports of Entry for this law) and not the 
entire GSA real estate portfolio. Access to all of the future annual 
revenues deposited into the FBF would have an even greater impact on 
the portfolio since it would provide a consistent source of funding to 
modernize, transform and maintain the entire inventory.
Repair Backlog:
    Question 5. What is the current level of deferred maintenance on 
the Government's owned portfolio?
    Answer. GSA does not track deferred maintenance needs for the 
entire owned Government portfolio, only those buildings under GSA's 
custody and control. Since 2010, GSA has received approximately 60% 
less than the requested funding to address repair and alteration needs 
for GSA-controlled federally owned facilities. The reduction in funding 
has led to an increase in both GSA's deferred maintenance and repair 
needs and the overall outyear liabilities within the owned portfolio. 
GSA's immediate deferred maintenance need has grown every year for the 
last 6 years and is now estimated to be approximately $2.59 billion at 
the end of FY 2021. This deferred maintenance is categorized as work 
needing to be performed immediately or the next fiscal year to restore 
or maintain acceptable conditions within the building inventory.

    Question 6. What plan is in place to address this backlog?
    Answer. GSA is pursuing a multi-pronged approach to address our 
mounting deferred maintenance backlog. First and foremost, GSA hopes to 
work with Congress to restore the previous practice, maintained until 
2010, of providing full authority to GSA to invest the annual revenues 
it collects from its agency tenants for facilities maintenance, rent 
payments and operations. In addition, GSA seeks to increase the 
pipeline for disposition of under-utilized real properties and to 
strategically prioritize investments in those buildings that will 
remain long-term holds for the Government.
COVID-19:
    Question 7. How has the COVID-19 pandemic changed GSA's Public 
Buildings Service? What has PBS learned in the year and a half when so 
many federal employees have not been in their offices?
    Answer. GSA continues to engage with its customer agencies to 
identify what their needs will be going forward. During the COVID-19 
pandemic, the Public Buildings Service (PBS) has been working with its 
customer agencies to define what the future of work might look like for 
the Federal Government. Many agencies have seen the value in telework 
and are making plans to expand those programs. While our clients are 
awaiting the outcome of returning to facilities, they are indicating an 
initial desire, and capacity, to reduce their space needs.

    Question 8. How is PBS determining how much real estate each tenant 
needs?
    Answer. GSA is engaging with customer agencies to assess their 
future office space needs and reflect the changing needs of the post-
pandemic Federal workforce. GSA is using this information to develop 
workspace strategies tailored to each customer agency. GSA uses a data-
driven approach to gain insight into agencies' future operating 
postures and real estate needs, recognizing that each customer will 
have different requirements. As part of this effort, GSA will be 
engaging 24 CFO Act agencies to develop individual National Workspace 
Portfolio Plans that reflect the agencies Future of Work. These plans 
will define the customer's desired future real estate footprint, the 
steps necessary to reach that footprint, and strategies for supporting 
the customer's evolving workstyle needs through technology and services 
solutions. These efforts will help GSA and the agencies develop a more 
optimized, sustainable, and efficient real estate portfolio.

    Question 9a. Looking at pre-Covid utilization data and agency 
requirements, what was PBS consuming and how will that change in the 
next five years and ten years?
    Answer. Based on limited real-time building utilization data, pre-
COVID GSA-controlled office buildings (32 owned and 3 GSA Regional 
Office Leased buildings) averaged a 69% utilization rate and decreased 
to an average of 29% utilization during the first year of COVID. Given 
that many agencies have not fully returned to GSA-controlled facilities 
and that the Future of Work is still being defined, it is difficult to 
exactly predict the rate of occupancy post-COVID. However, PBS is 
anticipating, based both on utilization trends and on anecdotal 
feedback, that there will be reduced office space demand in the next 5 
to 10 years. Note: See Q3 for Average energy usage/Gross Square foot.

    Question 9b. How much space will you need and for how long do you 
want to control it?
    Answer. It is too early to provide an answer to this question. GSA 
is in the midst of customer engagements, as outlined in the answer to 
Q8.

Questions from Hon. Eleanor Holmes Norton to the U.S. General Services 
                             Administration

    Question 1. The General Services Administration (GSA) is 
administering public building contracts that were awarded before the 
COVID-19 pandemic but performed after its onset. Contractors and 
subcontractors performing these contracts subsequently implemented 
worker safety protocols issued by the Occupational Safety and Health 
Administration and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 
which impacted costs and productivity in the performance of the 
contracts.
    Is GSA allowing equitable adjustments for COVID-19-related direct 
and indirect costs, which could not have been anticipated at the time 
the parties entered into the contracts? If not, please explain why not.
    Answer. Whenever a contract is modified, whether unilaterally or 
bilaterally, the contractor has an opportunity to seek an equitable 
adjustment. During the onset of the pandemic, GSA unilaterally amended 
leases and bilaterally modified contracts to require lessors and 
contractors to perform daily disinfection cleaning of high-contact 
surface areas. As this was a change to the lease and contract vehicles, 
GSA allowed lessors and contractors to seek an equitable adjustment so 
long as they were able to demonstrate an impact due to the requirements 
resulting in a price increase.

    Question 2. If GSA is allowing equitable adjustments for COVID-19 
related direct and indirect costs, is it dosing so for all project 
types, such as buildings in large urban areas and buildings outside of 
large urban areas?
    Answer. GSA considers each request for equitable adjustment based 
on the terms and conditions of the contract, regardless of the project 
type or geographic location. GSA allows equitable adjustments where a 
contractor demonstrates how the requirement has increased costs and why 
the costs are allocable to the contract, and then determined fair and 
reasonable by a Contracting Officer.

    Question 3. Please provide examples of GSA's evidence with Small 
Business Administration 8(a) firms, Minority Business Enterprises and 
Women Business Enterprises on the projects described in Question 2.
    Answer. Equitable adjustments have been considered from all 
contractors, regardless of business size/socio-economic status. As an 
example, here is a listing of six equitable adjustments approved by PBS 
for small business contractors:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                   Type of Work
                                 Modification       (Custodial,     Equitable                     Socioeconomic
       Contract Number              Number         Construction,   Adjustment     Vendor Name       Categories
                                                       Etc.)         Amount
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
47PB0017D0008................  PS0012..........  Custodial.......    $18,349   ACT SERVICES      8(a), WOSB.
                                                                                CORP.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GS-P-04-15-EW-5089...........  PS0027..........  Custodial.......    $21,060   DAE SUNG, LLC...  Minority Owned
                                                                                                  Business.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GS-05P-15-SV-D-0072..........  PS0019..........  Custodial.......    $20,381   AMERICLEAN        Minority Owned
                                                                                JANITORIAL        Business,
                                                                                SERVICES CORP.    8(a).
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
47PM0919C0009................  PS0009..........  Custodial.......    $15,010   TILT UP           Minority Owned
                                                                                CONSTRUCTION,     Business,
                                                                                INC.              WOSB.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
47PK0220F0045................  Order for COVID   Custodial.......    $15,527   M&M MANAGEMENT    Minority Owned
                                scope.                                          SERVICES, INC.    Business,
                                                                                                  8(a).
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
47PJ0019F0188................  PA0013..........  Custodial.......     $4,745   Integrity         Minority Owned
                                                                                National          Business.
                                                                                Corporation.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Most of GSA's janitorial services contracts are awarded to Non-
Profit Agencies in the Ability-One Program. GSA has modified all 458 
janitorial contracts; these contracts are comprised of 208 small 
business contractors and 241 Ability-One Non-Profit Agencies. Overall, 
98% of all janitorial contractors have a socioeconomic designation.
    GSA has approved 275 contract modifications for equitable 
adjustments in response to the 458 COVID-19 cleaning modifications. Of 
the contractors that received equitable adjustments, 113 were small 
businesses and 155 were Ability One Non-Profit Agencies. Overall, 97% 
of the contractors that received equitable adjustments have a 
socioeconomic designation.

    Question 4. Does GSA plan to include pandemic cost contingency 
recovery clauses in future contracts, similar to the labor, material 
and price escalation contingency clauses currently in the Federal 
Acquisition Regulations?
    Answer. GSA will implement additional clauses as published and 
required in the Federal Acquisition Regulation.

      Questions from Hon. Sharice Davids to Hon. Robin Carnahan, 
          Administrator, U.S. General Services Administration

    Question 1. I appreciate that the Biden-Harris Administration is 
currently engaged in a whole-of-government review and update of U.S. 
national biopreparedness policies as directed by the President in 
Executive Order 13987 and National Security Memorandum-1.
    As the President's American Jobs Plan stated, the United States has 
the opportunity and need to fundamentally transform our capabilities to 
protect the nation. I am pleased that the President is directing 
Executive Branch agencies to lead the way in this regard to protect the 
hundreds of thousands of Americans employed by the Federal Government.
    In Section 8.2 (Pathogen protection within the built environment) 
of the American Pandemic Preparedness: Transforming Our Capabilities 
report issued on September 21, 2021 (WH Pandemic Preparedness Plan: p. 
14), Assistant to the President for Science and Technology Eric S. 
Lander and Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs 
Jacob J. Sullivan state that efforts will be made to ``develop and 
deploy new technologies to improve indoor air quality, surface 
materials, and related aspects of transportation, buildings, and other 
infrastructure to suppress pathogen transmission among people.''
    Would you please provide to my office a detailed description of how 
the General Services Administration will implement this plan to protect 
those employed by the Federal Government by making Federal Government 
buildings, transportation, and infrastructure safer regarding improved 
indoor air quality? Thank you.
    Answer. GSA has taken numerous steps to improve indoor air quality 
in its federally owned facilities throughout the COVID-19 pandemic. 
These steps have helped to mitigate risk for Federal employees, 
contractors, and visitors accessing GSA-controlled facilities.
    In the ``P100, Facilities Standards for the Public Buildings 
Service,'' the latest revision in 2021 added heating, ventilation, and 
air conditioning (HVAC) requirements to include a minimum of Minimum 
Efficiency Reporting Value-13 (MERV-13) filtration, and Ultraviolet-C 
(UV-C) for coil disinfection. The MERV-13 filtration in all air 
handlers will provide a significant improvement with respect to disease 
transmission.
    Operationally, GSA has made the following changes to mitigate the 
risk of COVID-19 transmission, all of which comply with CDC 
recommendations:
      Increased ventilation rates, where feasible.
      Confirmed ventilation systems operate properly and 
provide acceptable indoor air quality for each space's current 
occupancy level.
      Increased outdoor air ventilation while using caution in 
highly polluted areas.
      Opened outdoor air dampers and windows as feasible, 
considering outdoor weather conditions.
      Improved central air filtration to MERV-13 or the highest 
compatible with the filter rack, and sealed edges of the filter to 
limit air bypass.
      Ran HVAC systems longer to increase air exchanges.

    Additionally, GSA is working on the acquisition of Smart Sensor 
Technologies for installation/deployment of sensors. The national Smart 
Sensor technology contract would allow for deployment of occupancy 
sensors, indoor air quality (IAQ) and indoor environmental quality 
(IEQ) sensors for GSA-managed, federally owned facilities.

      Questions from Hon. Daniel Webster to Hon. Robin Carnahan, 
          Administrator, U.S. General Services Administration

    Question 1. Despite early confusion, since the Summer of 2020 we 
have known that SARS-CoV-2 spreads via airborne transmission, 
especially in indoor environments. Indeed, a major awaking occurred 
within the scientific community when the long-accepted ``fact'', that 
virus particles larger than 5-microns could not be aerosolized, was 
upended thanks to research and persistence of a few diligent 
physicists.
    Given that building environmental systems can play a significant 
role in reducing the risk of viral airborne transmission, has GSA made 
any changes in building systems designs or operations to mitigate the 
risk of SARS-CoV-2 transmission?
    a.  If so, please describe some of the operational and/or design 
modifications that have been made.
    Answer. In the ``P100, Facilities Standards for the Public 
Buildings Service,'' the latest revision in 2021 added HVAC 
requirements for a minimum of Minimum Efficiency Reporting Value-13 
(MERV-13) filtration, and Ultraviolet-C (UV-C) for coil disinfection. 
The MERV-13 filtration in all air handlers will provide a significant 
improvement with respect to disease transmission.
    Operationally, GSA has made the following changes to mitigate the 
risk of SARS-CoV-2 transmission, in compliance with CDC 
recommendations.
      Increased ventilation rates, where feasible.
      Confirmed ventilation systems operate properly and 
provide acceptable indoor air quality for each space's current 
occupancy level.
      Increased outdoor air ventilation and using caution in 
highly polluted areas. With fewer people in the building, these 
measures increased the effective dilution ventilation per person even 
further.
      Opened outdoor air dampers/windows as feasible, 
considering outdoor weather conditions.
      Improved central air filtration to MERV-13 or the highest 
compatible with the filter rack, and sealed edges of the filter to 
limit air bypass.
      Kept systems running longer hours to increase air 
exchanges.

    Additionally, GSA is working on the acquisition of Smart Sensor 
Technologies for installation/deployment of sensors. The national Smart 
Sensor technology contract would allow for deployment of occupancy 
sensors, indoor air quality (IAQ) and indoor environmental quality 
(IEQ) sensors for GSA-managed, federally owned facilities.

    b.  If not, does GSA plan to incorporate these changes in future 
designs to allow greater flexibility in increasing fresh air supply or 
retrofitting systems with equipment that can neutralize or trap viral 
threats?
    Answer. GSA is incorporating changes to operations and future 
designs, per Q1a.

    c.  Additionally, what steps has GSA taken to provide information 
to, and ensure lessors are implementing best practices with regards to 
modification of operations or retrofit of existing systems to improve 
indoor air quality and reduce the risk of SARS-CoV-2 transmission?
    Answer. On July 8-9, 2021, the PBS Office of Leasing issued letters 
to all lessors recommending that they follow ``current industry 
practices by considering the application of the latest Centers for 
Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) guidance with respect to building 
ventilation and water systems'' as set forth in the Interim Guidance 
for Businesses and Employers Responding to Coronavirus Disease 2019 
(COVID-19), May 2020, under sections ``Consider improving the 
engineering controls using the building ventilation system'' and 
``Ensure the safety of your building water system and devices after a 
prolonged shutdown.'' In addition, the PBS Office of Leasing and PBS 
Office of Facilities Management (OFM) partner to enforce lease contract 
terms. Lease Administration Managers (LAMs) from OFM act as contracting 
officer representatives and perform annual and ad hoc lease inspections 
and respond to customer concerns at leased locations. They work with 
the Lease Contracting Officer to address any deficiencies and take any 
necessary corrective action.

    Question 2. This Committee led the work in passing the Federal 
Assets Sale and Transfer Act (FASTA). The intent of this legislation 
was to cut red tape that plagued the federal government for decades in 
getting rid of unneeded properties. This law was intended to realize 
untapped value in federal real estate through leveraging the value in 
property to provide new space to address space needs. However, based on 
how GSA decided to implement the FASTA board's first round of 
recommendations, it seems GSA is treating FASTA as simply a streamlined 
disposal process. Could you elaborate on the process that GSA engages 
with the FASTA board and OMB? Further, will you commit to working with 
us to ensure FASTA's intent is carried out?
    Answer. In accordance with FASTA, the Public Buildings Reform Board 
(PBRB) directed GSA to sell the final approved list of twelve (12) 
properties identified as the High Value Assets (HVA) (after one 
additional property was removed from the list). All the properties that 
were ready for conveyance have either been sold or are currently being 
actively marketed to be sold via competitive auction. As of January 20, 
2022, GSA has sold six (6) properties for a total of $65.5M; five (5) 
of which have closed with the 1 remaining property to close, and 
proceeds will be collected, by the end of January.
    GSA meets with the PBRB staff weekly to coordinate FASTA 
implementation responsibilities. In addition, GSA has periodic meetings 
with the PBRB members to review progress on the HVA sales as well as 
potential future recommendations. GSA has also coordinated with OMB 
throughout this process.
    GSA is committed to working with the Committee to ensure the intent 
of FASTA is carried out and exploring strategies to meet the objectives 
of the legislation based on agency experience and lessons learned 
through the implementation of FASTA thus far.

    Question 3. In the past, the Government Accountability Office (GAO) 
and the Committee have found that often federal courthouses are 
overbuilt costing the taxpayer billions. Recently, the Judiciary 
updated the courthouse design guide.
    a.  Please confirm if GSA consulted during this process, and if so 
how (meeting, call, email) and whether GSA provided feedback?
    Answer. GSA was provided a draft of the U.S. Courts Design Guide 
(USCDG) in November 2019 and provided comments and feedback to the 
Administrative Office of the U.S. Courts (AOUSC). GSA partnered with 
the AOUSC throughout the review and comment period and conveyed several 
impacts to the cost of new courthouses as a result of the proposed 
revisions. The Judicial Conference approved the USCDG in March 2021, 
and a copy was provided to GSA.

    b.  Additionally, with the new guide in place, what is GSA doing to 
ensure new courthouse projects are not overbuilt and how does GSA track 
this?
    Answer. GSA is committed to delivering its capital construction 
projects within the size and scope authorized by Congress. New 
courthouse projects are based on the courthouse benchmark formula that 
creates consistent budget formulation. The benchmark is based on past 
completed projects, and GSA and occupant agency design guide 
requirements. GSA has policies and procedures in place to review 
projects for conformance with the approved prospectus. GSA is required 
to report to Congressional authorizing committees when the design of a 
new courthouse exceeds the authorized size by more than 10%. In 
addition, GSA must notify Congress if project costs exceed 10% of 
congressionally authorized appropriations.

                           [all]