[House Hearing, 117 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
HISTORIC PROTESTS IN CUBA AND THE
CRACKDOWN ON FREE EXPRESSION
=======================================================================
HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON
WESTERN HEMISPHERE, CIVILIAN SECURITY,
MIGRATION AND INTERNATIONAL ECONOMIC POLICY
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
July 20, 2021
__________
Serial No. 117-62
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Foreign Affairs
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Available: http://www.foreignaffairs.house.gov/, http://docs.house.gov,
or http://www.govinfo.gov
__________
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
45-170 PDF WASHINGTON : 2022
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COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York, Chairman
BRAD SHERMAN, California MICHAEL T. McCAUL, Texas, Ranking
ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey Member
GERALD E. CONNOLLY, Virginia CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey
THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida STEVE CHABOT, Ohio
KAREN BASS, California SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania
WILLIAM KEATING, Massachusetts DARRELL ISSA, California
DAVID CICILLINE, Rhode Island ADAM KINZINGER, Illinois
AMI BERA, California LEE ZELDIN, New York
JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas ANN WAGNER, Missouri
DINA TITUS, Nevada BRIAN MAST, Florida
TED LIEU, California BRIAN FITZPATRICK, Pennsylvania
SUSAN WILD, Pennsylvania KEN BUCK, Colorado
DEAN PHILLIPS, Minnesota TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee
ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota MARK GREEN, Tennessee
COLIN ALLRED, Texas ANDY BARR, Kentucky
ANDY LEVIN, Michigan GREG STEUBE, Florida
ABIGAIL SPANBERGER, Virginia DAN MEUSER, Pennsylvania
CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania AUGUST PFLUGER, Texas
TOM MALINOWSKI, New Jersey PETER MEIJER, Michigan
ANDY KIM, New Jersey NICOLE MALLIOTAKIS, New York
SARA JACOBS, California RONNY JACKSON, Texas
KATHY MANNING, North Carolina YOUNG KIM, California
JIM COSTA, California MARIA ELVIRA SALAZAR, Florida
JUAN VARGAS, California JOE WILSON, South Carolina
VICENTE GONZALEZ, Texas RON WRIGHT, Texas
BRAD SCHNEIDER, Illinois
Sophia Lafargue, Staff Director
Brendan Shields, Republican Staff Director
------
Subcommittee on Western Hemisphere, Civilian Security, Migration and
International Economic Policy
ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey, Chairman
JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas MARK GREEN, Tennessee, Ranking
ANDY LEVIN, Michigan Member
VICENTE GONZALEZ, Texas AUGUST PFLUGER, Texas
JUAN VARGAS, California MARIA ELVIRA SALAZAR, Florida
Alexander Brockwehl, Staff Director
C O N T E N T S
----------
Page
WITNESSES
Vivanco, Mr. Jose Miguel, Executive Director, Americas Division,
Human Rights Watch............................................. 9
Paya Acevedo, Ms. Rosa Maria, Director, Cuba Decide.............. 18
APPENDIX
Hearing Notice................................................... 53
Hearing Minutes.................................................. 54
Hearing Attendance............................................... 55
ADDITIONAL MATERIALS SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
Amnesty International letter submitted for the record from
Representative Castro.......................................... 56
Information submitted for the record from Rosa Maria Paya........ 61
RESPONSES TO QUESTIONS SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
Responses to questions submitted for the record.................. 65
HISTORIC PROTESTS IN CUBA AND THE CRACKDOWN ON FREE EXPRESSION
Tuesday, July 20, 2021
House of Representatives,
Subcommittee on Western Hemisphere,
Civilian Security, Migration and
International Economic Policy
Committee on Foreign Affairs,
Washington, DC.
The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:05 a.m., in
room 2172, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Albio Sires
(chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.
Mr. Sires. Good morning, everyone. Thank you to our
witnesses for being here today.
And I would like everyone to know that this meeting was
scheduled before what happened in Cuba. Not that I was
prophetic. It's just that it so happens that it's very apropos
to have this hearing today.
This hearing, titled ``Historic Protests in Cuba and the
Crackdown on Free Expression'' will come to order.
Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare a
recess of the committee at any point and all members will have
5 days to submit statements, extraneous materials, and
questions for the record, subject to the length limitation in
the rules.
To insert something into the record, please have your staff
email the previously mentioned address and contact subcommittee
staff.
As a reminder to members joining remotely, please keep your
video function on at all times, even when you're not recognized
by the chair. Members are responsible for muting and unmuting
themselves, and please remember to mute yourself after you
finish speaking.
Consistent with H.R. Res. 8 and the accompanying
regulations, staff will only mute members and witnesses as
appropriate when they're not under recognition to eliminate
background noise.
I see that we have a quorum and I now recognize myself for
opening remarks.
What we have witnessed over the last week in Cuba is
nothing short of historic. Cubans have taken to the streets by
the thousands to call for freedom and democracy.
They have been clear in demanding an end to the
dictatorship. It is important to remember that public
gatherings are totally prohibited in Cuba. So, every individual
who has joined these demonstrations has put their lives on the
line.
They have decided that it is worth--it is worth it to risk
jail time, beatings, torture, and even death if it means that
Cuban people might finally have the chance to be free.
We must not lose sight of just how powerful that is. The
Cuban people are fed up. They have had enough of a repressive
dictatorship. We must stand with them in their quest for
freedom.
I appreciate the statements of strong support we have seen
so far from President Biden and Speaker Pelosi. I am ready to
work with the Biden Administration to translate those
statements into actions we can take--actions we can take to
provide immediate support to the Cuban people. We need to work
urgently to restore and expand internet access on the island.
Unfortunately, there is no silver bullet to solve this
problem. The regime is effective at confiscating equipment
needed for satellite connections, and it is adapting and
improving its censorship tools with the technical support from
the Chinese government.
However, I believe we can still do much more to address
this issue by working with private companies and civil society
to expand internet access to help Cubans use the VPN and other
circumvention tools.
Another immediate step we should take is to identify and
sanction perpetrators of human rights abuses under the
Magnitsky Act. During the current crackdown on protesters, the
Cuban State has carried out dozens of documented beatings on
journalists and protesters, and hundreds of arbitrary arrests.
We also know of at least one killing at the hands of the
State security and we support their--and we suspect there are
others. I believe we should immediately sanction every single
official who has committed these severe human rights
violations.
We should also expand our support for those protesting or
Cuban civil rights society, more broadly. I have long advocated
for U.S. assistance to Cuban pro-democracy organizations. We
should deepen that support at this critical moment.
We must remember that there was a human rights crisis in
Cuba before July 11th. They are already 150 political
prisoners--there were already 150 political prisoners at the
beginning of this month, and regime has increasingly targeted
artists from the San Isidro movement.
I call on our allies in Europe and Latin America to step up
and work with us to promote human rights in Cuba.
Now it's also the time to finally put an end to the Cuban
doctors program. This is a State-sponsored form of human
trafficking whereby 50,000 Cubans have their passports
confiscated, their movements restricted, and their wages
garnished. The regime retaliates against their family members
if they try to leave the program.
We saw in Venezuela how the Cuban doctors were ordered not
to provide life-saving medical treatment to people who were not
loyal to the Maduro government. This is shameful.
I am glad Secretary Blinken highlighted this horrific,
horrific program when we launched the State Department's
Trafficking in Persons report.
The United Nations Special Rapporteur on contemporary forms
of slavery and trafficking in persons have also denounced these
forced labor programs.
We need countries throughout the world to stand together in
saying they will not work with the Cuban regime to exploit
these doctors anymore.
I will soon be introducing my legislation to address this
important issue and I urge my colleagues to support it.
I will end on a personal note. I fled Cuba with my family
when I was 11 years old and I remember how the military came to
my house and searched my house because they accused my father
of hoarding merchandise.
Luckily, somebody tipped off the family--we came from a
very small town--and my father was able to take the merchandise
and bury it in the backyard. So as the military pulled away, we
were very fortunate somebody tipped us off.
I also remember the military coming into my house as soon
as we filed papers to leave and take inventory of every single
item that we owned, from the house to the picture on the wall.
And when we received our exit visa, they came back and
checked off that every single item in that house was left
behind to the Cuban government.
Two months later, they turned the house over to a communist
member, a party member in the town, that my father built. It
was not a big house. It was a very modest house. But, still,
you had to turn every single thing that you owned to the
government before you could leave.
I have not forgotten that. It is because of this repressive
regime that I have never--I was never able to return to Cuba to
see my grandmother before she died. I have spent every day
since I left Cuba hoping it would 1 day become a democracy. I
hope that this is the beginning of the end of the Castro and
Diaz-Canel dictatorship.
But what I know for sure is that the Cuban people provide
an inspiring example of courage, and they deserve our full
support.
Thank you, and I will now turn to the ranking member, Mark
Green, for his opening statement.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Chairman Sires, and thank you for
sharing your personal story as well. Thanks for holding this
hearing and thank you to our witnesses for being here today.
I especially want to thank Ms. Rosa Maria Paya. Rosa Maria.
we applaud your courage in the face of tyranny. The testimony
we're about to hear from her is from a courageous individual
whose family has been permanently scarred.
On July 22d, it will be 9 years since her father, Oswaldo
Paya, and his colleague, Harold Cepero, were extrajudicially
killed by the Cuban regime. He was a brave man and,
regretfully, joins the ranks of many others who've died at the
hands of the regime and under suspicious circumstances.
Last Sunday was a momentous and an inspirational day. Tens
of thousands of Cubans all throughout the country took to the
streets demanding freedom from the communist dictatorship. Some
even waved the American flag as they demanded libertad.
Since 1959, Cuban people have been trapped by the iron grip
of Fidel Castro, his brother, and its handpicked successor.
Despite brutal and violent crackdowns from the regime, many
courageous Cubans continued demanding their God-given right to
liberty and democracy, something three generations and millions
of Cubans have been deprived of.
Let's be clear. This is not about COVID-19. This is not
about the embargo. What are the Cuban people shouting in the
streets? Libertad.
Cubans are sick and tired of being oppressed and they are
in the streets openly and bravely demanding an end to
communism. Even prior to these recent protests, anti-regime
sentiment has steadily increased in the country.
In November, the communist regime broke up a hunger strike
led by the San Isidro movement, a collective of artists,
musicians, writers, and scholars. This led to a large protest
by hundreds of artists and activists in front of the regime's
Ministry of Culture.
These protests have been dubbed by some observers as an
awakening of civil society in Cuba, and it sure looks that way.
A new generation is rising up and they want to live in freedom.
I am in awe of the courage of the Cuban people and the many
risks they take protesting the violent and brutal dictatorship.
We must not ignore the dangers they face.
An untold number of peaceful protesters and activists
remain in prison. Demonstrators risk jail, degrading treatment,
torture, even death, all for liberty.
Additionally, the communist regime uses Chinese technology
to block and censor internet service and disrupt communications
across the island. These violations of basic human rights are
absolutely unacceptable.
We must demand action. This is a crisis that requires a
bipartisan response. And, Chairman Sires, I know this issue
hits home for you and I know you hear, as no one else can, the
Cuban people's cries for liberty and dignity.
Holding the communist regime accountable for its repressive
policies while supporting the people's quest for freedom and
democracy is crucial.
I hope we can prioritize this issue for the good of all
Cubans and for the good of the Western Hemisphere, at large.
The Cuban people have never experienced the kind of self-
government and freedom that many Americans take for granted.
As the freest and most prosperous nation in the world, the
United States must unequivocally stand with the Cuban people
against the communist regime.
There's a light at the end of the tunnel, and Cuba has
never been closer. When will the Cuban people finally be free?
When people of faith are no longer afraid of arbitrary
detentions, threats, and harassment from communist officials,
that is liberty.
When artists, musicians, and writers can freely express
their political opinions in song without fear of retaliation,
that is liberty. When parents do not have to wait hours in line
for basic staples like rice and beans just to feed their
starving children, that is liberty.
When the dying communist regime breathes its last breath,
when a sovereign republic takes its place, and when separated
families are reunited in a free Cuba, that is liberty.
Mr. Chairman, the people of Cuba are looking to the United
States for help and guidance. I look forward to working with
you to answer their cries.
Thank you, and I yield.
Mr. Sires. Thank you very much, Ranking Member Green.
I will now yield to Ranking Member McCaul for his opening
statement.
Mr. McCaul. Thank you, Chairman Sires and Ranking Member
Green, for your passionate remarks this morning, and for
holding this important hearing on historic protests that we are
seeing in Cuba.
I think this is a pivotal point in history. It's a moment
in time, and we need to take advantage of it.
Since last Sunday, tens of thousands of brave Cubans from
all around the country have protested the communist
dictatorship that has repressed them for over 60 years, and
despite being met with brutal violence and censorship, they
continue risking their lives to fight for freedom.
And as freedom-loving Americans, we stand with them. The
people of Cuba were promised communism would work. They were
told to sacrifice their freedoms and ambitions in exchange for
a utopia of equality and world-class health care.
Instead, three generations over 60 years have been doomed
to misery and shortages as a result of this failed ideology.
Brave Cubans have woken up to the lies and propaganda fed to
them by Fidel Castro and his cronies, and the world must bear
witness and recognize the significance of this historic time.
And they are protesting the dictatorship waving the
greatest symbol of liberty, libertad, known to man, the
American flag, because they know and the regime knows that
America stands for everything the Cubans are fighting for:
freedom, liberty, and democracy.
Regime thugs are snatching innocent Cubans from their homes
simply for calling for freedom, and we know the Venezuelans are
in there, too, with their military as they crack down--they
knock doors down and take people out of their homes and throw
them in prison.
The idea that a protester will be sentenced to 20 years in
prison for simply exercising what we--what is sacred in this
country and it's the right to free speech, and they are
violently cracking down and violating the religious freedoms
and liberties of the Cuban people.
They're also using Chinese technology to block and censor
internet access from the island, and this committee will be
working with technologies within the State Department to open
up those lines of communication.
We cannot let our adversaries take advantage of the
situation and infiltrate our hemisphere. And the world is
watching, and they're watching very closely what we do at this
moment in time.
These human rights violations cannot and will not go on
punished. Cubans deserve liberty and all that it entails, and
we must do everything in our power to fight with them for their
freedom.
And that work begins in Congress and it begins at the White
House. I was proud to co-sponsor a bipartisan resolution with
my colleagues stating our solidarity with the brave Cuban
people.
We must also make sure the Administration is doing
everything it can to provide uncensored internet access around
the country. We need to work with the Biden Administration to
lead the international effort for Cuban freedom and freedom
fighters, supporting the democracy leaders and activists on the
island.
Simply put, we have a moral obligation and a duty to
support their aspirations. We need our democratic and freedom-
loving allies around the world and peace-loving people around
the world to stand with the people of Cuba, to support them
against this oppressive regime.
I want to take this moment to commend our witness, Rosa
Maria Paya, for her strength, for her advocacy. Almost 9 years
ago her father was murdered by the Cuban regime, and we are so
sorry, Ms. Paya.
And many others were, too, and many sit in prison rotting
in jails because of this monster and his successors. He was an
internationally known Cuban dissident, your father, and to this
day, his death has never been properly investigated.
Your family, like many others, who dare to speak to the
truth to power has paid the ultimate price in your struggle for
freedom, and I have to say, Ms. Paya, I admire your bravery. I
want to thank you for being here today.
What is happening in Cuba is all the proof we need that
communism and socialism are bankrupted ideologies that can only
lead to utter failure and human misery.
So, in closing, as Cubans continue to stand up and reject
communism and the dictatorship that has doomed three
generations of Cubans, we just say we will stand with them as
they bravely fight for freedom. Cuba libre.
I yield back.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Ranking Member McCaul.
I will now introduce Mr. Jose Miguel Vivanco, who is a
leading expert on human rights issues throughout Latin America
and the Caribbean. He is an executive director of the Americas
Division at Human Rights Watch.
Mr. Vivanco previously worked as an attorney for the Inter-
American Commission on Human Rights at the Organization of the
America States. He is also the founder of the Center for
Justice and International Law.
Mr. Vivanco studied at the University of Chile and
Salamanca Law School in Spain and holds a Masters of Laws
degree from Harvard Law School.
Mr. Vivanco, we welcome you to the hearing.
We will then hear from Ms. Rosa Maria Paya. She is a widely
recognized Cuban activist and a vocal advocate for freedom and
human rights in Cuba.
She serves as the director for Cuba Decide, an organization
focused on restoring democracy and the rule of law to Cuba.
She is the daughter of Aldo Paya, a well-known dissident
who dedicated his life to the struggle for freedom in Cuba and
who was killed at the hands of the regime in July 2012. Ms.
Paya holds a degree in physics from the University of Havana.
Ms. Paya. thank you for joining us today.
I ask the witnesses to please limit your testimony to 5
minutes, and without objection, your prepared statements will
be made part of the record.
Mr. Vivanco, you are recognized for your testimony.
STATEMENT OF MR. JOSE MIGUEL VIVANCO, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR,
AMERICAS DIVISION, HUMAN RIGHTS WATCH
Mr. Vivanco. Thank you, Mr. Chair, members of the
subcommittee. Thank you for inviting me to testify today on
this very, very important matter for human rights in the
Western Hemisphere.
This hearing could not be more timely. Since July 11th,
thousands of Cubans have taken to the streets across the
country in landmark demonstrations, protesting long-standing
restrictions on rights, freedoms, the scarcity of food and
medicines, and the government's response to the COVID-19
pandemic.
The Cuban Government has reacted with brutal repression and
censorship. Since the protests began, several organizations
have reported countrywide internet block and restrictions on
social media and messaging platforms.
Cuban rights groups report that around 500 people have been
detained. Human Rights Watch has conducted thousands of
interviews to document the government's response to the
protests.
We have received credible reports of police beatings and
documented multiple cases of arbitrary detention of protesters,
activists, and journalists, including many who have been held
incommunicado and some whose whereabouts remain unknown.
People detained include members of the San Isidro and 27N
movements to coalitions of artists and journalists who have
been facing a government crackdown.
In recent months, Human Rights Watch has been continuously
documenting abuses against them including arbitrary detention
and restrictions of movement and communications.
Victims include people who have performed in or even simply
played or promoted ``Motherland and Life,'' a song by Cuban
artists that challenge the Cuban government's old slogan,
``Motherland or Death,'' patria o muerte, and criticize the
repression in the country.
We found consistent and repeated patterns in the abuses,
which strongly suggest a plan by the Cuban authorities to
systematically repress these independent artists and
journalists.
Mr. Chair and members of the subcommittee, even as the
Cuban government insist on its decades-old repression, Cuba is
changing.
Thousands of Cubans are overcoming their fear of the
government, and despite the government's attempts to restrict
communications, increased access to the internet has enabled
many to organize protests and reports on abuses in ways that
were virtually impossible only a few years ago.
At this critical juncture, we urge the U.S. Congress and
the Biden Administration to take the necessary steps to
dismantle the embargo and abandon the ongoing policy of
isolation, which has been--which have produced no improvements
on human rights in the island.
For too long, the U.S. embargo has provided the Cuban
government with an excuse for its problems, a pretext for its
abuses, and a way to garner sympathy abroad with governments
that might otherwise have been willing to condemn the country's
repressive practices more vocally.
Rather than isolating Cuba, the policy has isolated the
United States, impeding the multilateral and coordinated
approach that is needed to press the Cuban government to end
its repressive policies and practice.
I urge the U.S. Congress and the Biden Administration to
take steps toward a new approach in Cuba, including, one,
progressively dismantling the policy of isolation toward Cuba;
two, collaborating with governments in Latin America and the
European Union to ensure a multilateral and coordinated
approach; three, working with these governments to monitor and
denounce restrictions on access to internet in Cuba.
Cuba is changing and it's past time the U.S. policy
changes, too.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Vivanco follows:]
STATEMENT OF VIVANCO
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Mr. Sires. Thank you.
Ms. Paya. I now turn to you for your testimony.
STATEMENT OF MS. Rosa Maria Paya.ACEVEDO, DIRECTOR, CUBA DECIDE
Ms. Paya. Thank you so much, Mr. Chair, and thank you so
much to all the Members of the Congress for this opportunity
and for your kind words.
My name is Rosa Maria Paya.from the citizen initiative Cuba
Decide to promote human rights. Our network on the ground have
seen explosive growth over the last 16 months.
My father, Oswaldo Paya, was killed in Cuba under the
orders of the Castro brothers on July 22d, 2012. The Cuban
peoples are in the streets fighting for freedom. In at least 45
cities massive protests took place. This regime has responded
with brutal repression, causing countless arrests, injuries,
and death.
On national TV, Miguel Diaz-Canel has called for a war in
the streets and to fight using any means. In the eastern
provinces, the police shot one protester in the head. It is on
video. The name of the victim is still unknown.
Daniel Cardenas was shot inside his home in the city of
Cardenas. His wife was present. It's on video.
Diubis Laurencio was shot in the back and killed in
Naranjo. It's on video. He was 36 years old and his family is
now denouncing that officials precisely called him a
delinquent.
Videos show people arriving at hospitals badly hurt by
police beatings and bullets, one shot in the arm, another in
the leg, another in the stomach. The victims are workers and
students, not only members of the organized opposition.
FDP has documented at least 532 detained and missing
persons, but we estimated the actual number to be in the
thousands. The regime has its days numbered and the world is
watching.
In this context, to lift the sanctions against the Cuban
regime is to fund the Cuban police and military who oppress the
people in the streets, obeying top government officials like
General Raul Castro, Miguel Diaz-Canel, General Rodriguez
Lopez-Callejas, General Alvarez Casas, Minister of Interior,
General Lopez Miera, Minister of the Armed Force.
It is a moral imperative to stop the regime abuses after 62
years of crimes against humanity perpetrated by a military
dictatorship that has never been accountable.
Despite the lack of food and medicine, the protesters are
demanding freedom, human rights, and democracy. They were
shouting, ``No more fear,'' ``Change is possible,'' and ``Down
with the dictatorship.''
None of them mentioned the U.S. embargo, but instead
homeland and life, patria y vida, the alternative to the Castro
slogan of ``Homeland or death.''
To accept the blackmail of the migratory crisis by the
Cuban regime is to fail the Cuban people. We urge the U.S.
Government not to make unilateral concessions to the regime
but, rather, demand the release of all political prisoners, an
end for the repression, and respect for our fundamental
freedoms, including the legalization of all political parties.
I would like to share five policy recommendations from the
majority of the Cuban civil society on and off the island.
We humbly ask to the U.S. please, the U.S. should apply
individual sanctions, making full use of the Global Magnitsky
Act, targeting top officials and individuals involved in human
rights abuses.
The U.S. should replicate its approach to the South African
apartheid and require all companies in relations with Cuba to
mandatorily embrace the Sullivan principles.
The U.S. should take action to break the regime's
communication monopoly by enabling independent access to
internet to Cubans, bypassing the censorship of the regime.
The U.S. should invite the European Union and the
Organization of American States--all the members of the
Organization of American States to take similar steps and use
all available tools, including the Inter-American Treaty of
Reciprocal Assistance to address the threat posed by the Cuban
regime.
The regime is illegitimate and should continue to be
excluded from the Summit of the Americas until it complies with
the Inter-American Democratic Charter.
The U.S. has the ability to stop the impunity of the regime
and protect persons from its brutal repression. All options
within the international law must be on the table to protect
civilians' lives in Cuba.
My father said that the American and the Cuban people
[Spanish language spoken]. We want to be free and we want
to be friends. Thank you for this opportunity, and thank you to
the American people.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Paya follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Mr. Sires. Thank you very much.
Before I begin questions, I ask unanimous consent that
Representatives Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Val Demings, Nicole
Malliotakis, and Scott Perry participate at today's hearing
after all subcommittee members have had the opportunity to
participate in questioning the witnesses.
I will now begin questions by recognizing myself for 5
minutes.
The State Department in 2021 Trafficking in Persons Report
reports for Cuba maintained Cuba as a Tier 3 country. In his
remarks at the launch of the report, Secretary of State Anthony
Blinken said that the regime has profited from its exploitive
overseas medical missions.
What are some of the conditions that Cuban doctors are
subjected to as part of this medical mission and what does the
international community need to do to put an end to this
exploitation?
Mr. Vivanco?
Mr. Vivanco. Mr. Chair, the Cuban doctors deployed in
different parts of the world provide a valuable service to many
communities in Latin America, in Africa, in Asia, but at the
expense of their most basic freedoms. That is the price.
To the point that we believe that the use of these doctors
amount to the practice of forced labor, the Cuban doctors are
subject of draconian rules that violate the right to privacy,
freedom of expression and association, liberty of movement,
among several other freedoms that are restricted during their
missions when, you know, they are deployed in different
communities and the Cuban government profits substantively with
their service.
Mr. Sires. Do you have an estimation of how much they
profit? How much it makes for the island?
Mr. Vivanco. It's quite difficult to get a number, for lack
of transparency. So there are different type of figures out
there. However, we are looking into a very, very significant
income for the government of Cuba.
Mr. Sires. And when these doctors are sent to these
countries, they're sent by themselves? Families are left
behind?
Mr. Vivanco. Their families are left behind and they even
restrict access to the money that they are supposed to be
making until the conclusion of the mission.
In other words, their promised payment, which is 10 times
or more what they will be able to earn in their practice as
doctors in Cuba. That is the attraction, of course.
But the way that the Cuban government pay them and their
family is conditioned to their performance in their communities
and to the conclusion of the full program, usually after one or
2 years.
Mr. Sires. And if they ask for asylum in the country that
they're serving, what happens?
Mr. Vivanco. They lose the money that they're supposed to
earn. That's why they pay at the end. They keep paying some
small portions for them to be able to survive in the local--in
the community--in the local country, as well as for the family
to get some, you know, a stipend.
But they might lose all the benefits and their family are
not going to be able to leave the country. The Cuban doctor, if
he's lucky, might get some political asylum in that country,
but isolated for who knows how long from their family.
Mr. Sires. Because he's never going to be able to bring the
family to where he has asked for asylum?
Mr. Vivanco. It will be very, very difficult.
Mr. Sires. Thank you.
You know, during the protests, the Cuban government shut
down internet access in entire areas of the island. I know you
made some recommendations on what this country can do. Can you
expand on that?
Ms. Paya. Yes, of course. Thank you so much.
We have known that the United States and--for United
States--and I'll thank you again--private enterprises are able
or could have the capacity to provide internet access--
satellite internet access, bypassing the censorship of the
regime.
In this moment, we ask United States to move quickly and to
enable the Cuban citizens with a way of communication that in
this moment has the capacity of saved lives.
Mr. Sires. Now, the reports are there are over 50 cities
the people turned out while the--was the internet shut off in
all those cities?
Ms. Paya. Almost in all the island. Almost in all the
island.
Mr. Sires. The entire island?
Ms. Paya. Almost the entire island. People just started
communicating using wi-fi hotspots through VPNs. But it was
very, very difficult to get any access to communication.
Mr. Sires. Do you know the reaction of the EU to the
shutting down of the internet and the people demonstrating on
the island?
Ms. Paya. Well, there have been--there have been reactions
from the European parliament and from the European
parliamentarians that have been very, very solidarios with the
Cuban people.
But I do not know of any response from the European
External Action Service actually in the direction of supporting
the Cuban people. Actually, they insist in maintaining a
cooperation agreement that includes political dialog that have
been already violated by the Cuban regime, which human rights
laws have been already violated.
Mr. Sires. My time is up. Thank you very much.
Congressman Green?
Mr. Green. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Rosa Maria.
We often hear that the United States embargo is the
primary--is the primary cause of lack of prosperity and
democracy on the island.
We hear that Cuban entrepreneurs would succeed only if they
could trade and engage with their American counterparts. In
previous testimony, you informed Congress, and I quote, ``There
cannot be free markets where there are no free persons.''
Could you elaborate on that?
Ms. Paya. Yes, that's actually a phrase of my father, and
thank you so much for your words about him. And I think that
the best answer to your question is coming from the Cuban
people in the streets.
They were not asking for the end of the embargo. They were
asking for the end of the dictatorship. The end of the
dictatorship is a demand of the Cuban people. That's the demand
alone, and that's the demand that we need solidarity to.
Mr. Green. So just to make sure I heard you correctly, the
people that are in the streets protesting, they're not
protesting an embargo. They're protesting the communist regime
that's in charge and a dictatorship over their--over their
country?
Ms. Paya. They have been shouting, ``Change is possible.
Down with the dictatorship. No more fear. Freedom. Freedom.
Freedom.'' I think that's eloquent enough.
Mr. Green. It is. Thank you.
It's interesting that small fringe elements of the left
here are trying to say that it's the embargo. But truth be
known, it really has nothing to do with the embargo.
If you look at 90 percent of the companies in Cuba, they're
held by military holding companies, meaning the Cuban military
runs 90 percent of the economy in Cuba.
Well, there's a law in the United States that says an
American company cannot do business with the Cuban military. So
if we lift the embargo, we cannot even do business with them.
And where does the money go if 90 percent of the companies are
held by the Cuban military?
Well, it just empowers the dictatorship. This insane notion
that lifting the embargo is going to somehow provide freedom
for the Cuban people is crazy. It's absurd.
And the only reason you would say that is unless you're
trying to hide behind socialism and communism as an effective
model. But everywhere else it's been in the world it's been
disproved.
Let's look at North Korea. They cannot get rice. They're
starving. Remember, the USSR and Berlin? They built a wall to
keep their people in. And socialism, look at Venezuela.
It is not the embargo, Mr. Chairman, that is causing the
people of Cuba to suffer under this totalitarian dictatorship
and lifting it will only empower them. Cuba's egregious
religious freedom violations well documented and they are
widespread.
The U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom has
called for Global Magnitsky Act sanctions on the head of Cuba's
Office of Religious Affairs, Caridad Diego, for her direct role
in leading campaigns of repression against Cuba's religious
communities.
Can you both share examples of how the regime restricts and
penalizes religion in policy and practice?
Sir, if we could start with you.
Mr. Vivanco. The exercise of fundamental freedoms in Cuba
depends on the degree of tolerance of the Cuban government.
There is no rule of law in Cuba. There is a total concentration
of power, no independent judiciary. The judiciary is under the
subordination of the executive branch. If the government
believe that is----
Mr. Green. If I could--if I could interrupt you just a
second. I think I understood you to say there's no rule of law.
It's just total power concentrated in the hands of the
dictatorship.
Mr. Vivanco. Exactly.
Mr. Green. How then--I'm going to--I'm going to flip back
to my previous question, because you supported lifting this
embargo.
How then if the total power is all in the hands of one
individual does lifting the embargo free the people? I do not
understand.
Mr. Vivanco. Congressman Green, in foreign policy, you have
multiple options. If you want to influence, if you want to have
impact on the record of any given country, the option that you
have chosen for over or close to 60 years is the isolation.
That policy has bring no change in Cuba. I believe----
Mr. Green. Well, I would submit to you right now there's
change happening. There are thousands of Cubans in the streets.
There's a spotlight on the Cuban government. The world is
crying for the internet to be open so we can see and see with
transparency what's going on.
We're at a point right now that may just be a great
opportunity, for two reasons--one, to show exactly what's going
on in Cuba under this totalitarian dictatorship, happened
because of the embargo, and two, to once again put another head
of a communist dictator on the wall.
And I mean that proverbially, for all the people that are
going to go out there and say Green is espousing some kind of
violence. I am not.
I am saying--but here's another failed communist regime.
That's what I think. Two great opportunities. That system does
not work and we can free the Cuban people.
And, unfortunately, Mr. Chairman, I'm out of time. Thank
you.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman Green.
Congressman Castro.
Mr. Castro. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you, Ranking
Member, for organizing this hearing today.
And before I address my questions to our witnesses, I want
to reiterate my support, most of all, for the Cuban people.
I continue to be moved by their plight for their freedoms
and their fight for their freedoms, their COVID-19 assistance
and an end to hunger in their nation, and I expressed my
solidarity with them, especially with those brave Cubans who
remain disappeared who have been imprisoned for standing up for
their human rights and for their families.
And I join U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Michelle
Bachelet in her call to the Cuban government to immediately
release those arrested during the protests.
I also think it's necessary for the United States to, as
President Obama said during his visit to Havana, ``Bury the
last remnant of the cold war in the Americas and pursue a Cuba
policy that improves the lives of the Cuban people.''
And so I wanted to ask a few questions of our witnesses, or
actually, before I do that, I know there's a debate about the
embargo and how much that's responsible versus the Cuban
government and so forth.
And most of all, we support the freedom of the Cuban people
and their right to choose the leadership of their nation. As
Americans, we want to be as helpful to that as possible.
But in this debate about communism and socialism and so
forth, our biggest trading partner of the United States is a
communist country, China. We have no embargo against China.
That's our biggest trading partner.
So I have a question to Mr. Vivanco. Thank you for your
testimony today, and a question that remains after the mass
protests across Cuba is what the U.S. Government can do to best
improve the lives of the people of Cuba.
In his historic speech and diplomatic trip--in his historic
speech and diplomatic trip to Havana, President Obama discussed
at length how the United States embargo and policy of isolation
toward Cuba was not working, saying, quote, ``The embargo is
outdated and should be lifted.''
So, Mr. Vivanco, what is the current purpose of the U.S.
embargo on Cuba and how does it help or hurt the Cuban people?
Mr. Vivanco. Congressman Castro, thank you very much for
your question.
In my view, following human rights conditions in Cuba for
over 30 years, my conclusion is that it's time for the U.S. to
take a different approach. It's the only country in the world
that enforce a policy of isolation.
That policy is rejected unanimously for the rest of the
world. Even conservative governments from Europe and Latin
America has never agreed with the policy of embargo because it
impose indiscriminate sanctions against the people of Cuba and
has showed to be absolutely ineffective.
If you want to bring change to Cuba and transition from
dictatorship to democracy, you need to create a multilateral
approach, a new type of approach to create the right type--kind
of incentives and pressure for the Cuban to take those steps.
Cuba is not isolated for the rest of--from the rest of the
world. Tourists from Europe, Canada, or any country in Latin
America could spend time, money, their money. They could invest
in extractive industries in Cuba.
The only one that is isolated from Cuba is the U.S. The
only one that is isolated in this debate at global level on the
Cuban affairs is the U.S.
Why? Because the policy of isolation made the position of
the U.S. actually kind of impotent with regard to the debate on
Cuba.
Mr. Castro. I also wanted to ask you about remittances, the
ability for folks to send money to Cuba. You know, remittances
are a vital lifeline to millions of Cubans, especially the most
vulnerable, like the elderly, and are used to purchase basic
necessities like sanitary items and food, and even obtaining--
for obtaining access cards to have access to the internet.
The Trump administration imposed restrictions on
remittances and pushed the largest receiver of family
remittances in Cuba, Western Union, to abandon operations on
the island. Unfortunately, these harmful policies continue
today.
So I wanted to ask you, can you describe how remittances
help the most vulnerable of Cubans to survive and obtain daily
necessities?
Mr. Vivanco. It is absolutely essential to facilitate the
use of remittances. The sent of--the ability of Cuban families
and friends to send money for their relatives to be able to
survive in the country, to be able to buy the minutes to use
wi-fi and internet, which is available in Cuba and is one of
the vehicles that explain this mobilization in Cuba, I think is
the right approach to reestablish the ability of Cuban families
to send money to their relatives in Cuba.
Mr. Castro. Thank you. I yield back, Chairman.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman Castro.
Representative Pfluger.
Mr. Pfluger. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you to both
of you for your testimony.
Ms. Paya. thank you for your personal story.
For over 60 years, the Cuban people have been oppressed by
the worst impulses of a brutal regime and failed promises of
communist propaganda, and what we're seeing today is those
people saying enough is enough.
We must stand with them and finally rid the Western
Hemisphere this hegemonic oppression. And, unfortunately, the
Biden Administration is sending very dangerous and mixed
signals through both policy and rhetoric to those that wish to
flee this brutal regime.
But if you're fleeing a communist regime where defectors
are silenced or shot, and everyday citizens are starving to
death, you're not welcome in America.
This is the message that Secretary Mayorkas, who himself
was born in Havana, gave last week when he remarked that Cuban
refugees attempting to flee by the sea will not be permitted in
the United States.
This message is echoed again by acting assistant secretary
at the State Department when he remarked that the protests were
peaceful and rooted only in concerns about rising COVID cases
and medicine shortages.
This is false. The Cuban people, as you've mentioned, are
shouting ``Libertad.'' They're waving the American flag.
They're standing for freedom. They're not shouting, down with
an embargo.
While our administration downplays the severity of the
crisis in Cuba and pledges to turn away Cuban refugees,
President Biden has simultaneously thrown open the southern
borders to cartels, coyotes, and others.
Meanwhile, the Administration advocating for socialist
policies right here in the United States, when we see massive
government control over society simply does not work.
Cuba is showing us in real time and the world how quickly
communism collapses and leads to a spiral of deadly conditions
of poverty, starvation, and hopelessness, causing enough
desperation that right now Cubans are staring down the
oppressors in the streets and risking their lives to cross
treacherous waters on homemade rafts to reach the shores of
liberty, the symbol of freedom, the United States of America.
The United States remains the beacon of freedom and
democracy around the world and we must do everything within our
power to support those who are valiantly standing for liberty,
and we must do it right here at home.
There have been a chorus of this very body right here in
Congress supporting the Cuban people in their efforts and I,
certainly, support that effort as well.
And instead of throwing our doors open to human traffickers
on our southern border, President Biden must take decisive
action to bolster the pro-democracy movement and support the
brave Cubans who are fighting in their own streets for liberty.
Ms. Paya. how important is it to have freedom of speech?
What does it mean to have freedom of speech?
Ms. Paya. Thank you so much.
It is--it is fundamental and it is--it is the root of what
is going on in Cuba. The people of Cuba have n't wait for the
Cuban regime to authorize them to speak. They are shouting
``freedom'' in the streets.
And if I make a call, a request, for all of you, is to
please to listen to what the Cuban people is demanding on the
street. At the highest possible risk, which is life, they are
demanding freedom. They are demanding the end of the
dictatorship.
Please do not politicize that. It is not about politics and
not--it is not about right and left. It is about the main
contradiction that the Cubans have experienced, which is not
the embargo or any other contradiction between the military
dictatorship and any other country. It's the main
contradiction.
The root of the suffering of the Cuban people is the
conflict between a group of militaries that have held power in
illegitimate way for more than 62 years and a whole population
that is demanding a change, that is demanding a transition
process, that is demanding democracy.
And now United States and the rest of the world have the
opportunity and the challenge to take sides with that Cuban
people to hold accountable--help the Cuban people to hold
accountable that region and to bring about freedom in Cuba.
That also means democratic stability and also means getting
rid of one of the threats that the national security of this
country has in this hemisphere.
Mr. Pfluger. Thank you for that.
And I just want to go back to one of the remarks that you
made, that you said that lifting sanctions is, basically,
funding terrorism. It's funding the dictatorship to do what
they want through military action.
And I appreciate your comments on that, and Mr. Chairman, I
know I'm out of time. Thank you again for holding this hearing.
I yield back.
Mr. Sires. Thank you very much.
Congressman Andy Levin, you're on.
Mr. Levin. Thanks so much to the chairman and ranking
member for holding this really important hearing this morning.
You know, one of the subjects of the protests has been
access to COVID vaccines. In my view, this is an area where the
U.S. might be able to actually heed the Cuban people's call.
But it's my understanding that sending vaccines to Cuba
would require a special license, at least from the Department
of Commerce and perhaps also Treasury.
Last week, Ricardo Herrero, executive director of the Cuba
Study Group tweeted, ``Everyone trying right now to coordinate
aid to the Cuban people is running into a morass of OFAC and
Commerce shipping and banking restrictions. This is how current
U.S. policy does not help.''
Mr. Vivanco, do you believe that current sanctions and the
current sanctions regime makes the delivery of humanitarian aid
to the Cuban people more difficult?
Mr. Vivanco. Indeed, I believe that the measures that the
Biden Administration and this Congress could take to facilitate
access to medicine and vaccine even to alleviate these painful
times of the Cuban people who have no access to vaccine.
I believe also that the Cuban government has been reluctant
to accept vaccines from Russia and China for dogmatic reasons.
They are--they were hoping to develop their own vaccine.
Mr. Levin. Right.
Mr. Vivanco. And if the U.S. Government could help and
provide some relief for the Cuban people with access to
vaccine, I think it will be terrific.
Mr. Levin. And it would really have a big impact on our
relationship directly with the people, right?
Mr. Vivanco. Exactly.
Mr. Levin. Yes. And, you know, given the crackdowns that we
have seen on the protesters--horrible crackdowns--it seems that
the kind of sanctions that we're talking about here, the kinds
that are not targeted, have not prompted the government to
improve its human rights record. Would you agree?
Mr. Vivanco. I agree 100 percent.
Mr. Levin. So what--tell us, in your view, what do you
think the best approach would be for us to influence the Cuban
government on its human rights record, something you've devoted
your career to, including the crackdowns on protesters?
If we want to get away from ideology and talking points and
actually help improve the human rights record there, what
should we do?
Mr. Vivanco. Actually, Congressman Levin, I do believe that
the best way to support the dictatorship is keep the status
quo. In other words, change nothing. Insist on a policy that
has failed, the policy of isolation. The policy of sanctions
has bring no improvement on human rights in Cuba.
My sense is that the U.S. foreign policy toward Cuba is not
inspired on the need to improve human rights and democracy in
Cuba. It is just a policy that reflect the preferences of the
electorate in Florida and has nothing to do with the goal to
improve human rights in Cuba.
Mr. Levin. So do you think there are things we can do, and
what are they? Because I'm with you. I agree with you. But what
should we do?
Mr. Vivanco. What you should, you know, try to do,
especially now that you have the majority in the House, is to
take the necessary steps to at least open up a debate about the
lack of effectiveness of a policy of isolation toward Cuba and
to empirically help establish whether there is any other
democracy in the world that has been willing to join forces
with the U.S. in the policy of isolation.
You will conclude that the rest of the world every year
systematically condemned that policy, and only Israel and the
U.S. support the policy of isolation on Cuba.
So if you could take internal steps to at least open up a
debate about the lack of effectiveness, the impotence of the
U.S. Government in affecting Cuban human rights conditions in
Cuba, I think that will be very, very helpful.
Mr. Levin. Well, thanks. You know, obviously, there are
strong policy disagreements on this subject. But I think we all
agree on our commitment to the Cuban people and their well-
being, and I hope that in the interest of that commitment we're
able to have a nuanced and honest conversation about what
policies are helpful and which are harmful.
And you're making a very strong case that we have been
beating our heads against the wall for 60 years, not helping
the human rights situation in Cuba. So we really have to find a
more effective way.
And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman.
Congresswoman Salazar.
Ms. Salazar. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Jose
Miguel Vivanco, for being here, and Rosa Maria Paya.
And your family paid the highest sacrifice. Your father,
Oswaldo Paya, stood up for a free Cuba. That is something that
the Castro regime fears. They killed him and they covered it
up, saying that it was a car crash so that we will never know
the truth.
I met him twice when I was a news reporter, and he was the
epitome of decency. I can say that. And I'm glad that you're
here today because of your bravery and your commitment to his
memory.
After a week of silence, now the Biden Administration is
saying they're going to review the effect of the remittances.
That is very embarrassing. It's a slap in the face to you, to
your father, to all the Cuban people and to us, the elected
officials, who were not informed or consulted.
The people of Cuba, as we have said, they're not shouting
``[Spanish language spoken] embargo, no more--we want more
remittances.'' They're shouting ``Libertad.''
The bare minimum the Biden Administration could do is to
connect the internet because that way the world will be able to
know and see the truth and they can communicate among
themselves.
They will also know that they're not alone and that the
United States is with them.
The Biden administration could enhance the wi-fi from
Havana embassy or from Guantanamo and this can be done in
minutes. Also, the private sector has developed--there's
balloons that can carry wi-fi directly to the island.
I'm going to say this message in Spanish.
[Spanish language spoken.]
Ms. Salazar. Now, my question is, I'm going to--if I have
more time, I'm going to ask you questions, but I would like to
talk to Mr. Vivanco and ask you a simple question.
I was a news reporter, and I saw when Obama lifted all
restrictions. For two and a half years he gave the opportunity
to the Cuban government to really join the international
community, and they spit on Obama. Two years.
Dozens of American companies wanted to do business in Cuba
and the Castros did not allow it. Madonna went to celebrate her
birthday in the--while the Damas de Blancos were being beaten
on the streets. Mick Jagger went to do a big concert.
I interviewed dozens of American companies who wanted to do
business with the Cuban government, and during the Obama years
the Cubans said no. No. I do not know. Let me see. Because they
are in the business of power.
So when you're telling me, Mr. Vivanco--and you have a
fantastic organization that you represent, looking out for
human rights--when you tell me the embargo is the solution,
Obama proved it, and they spit on him, which was lamentable.
So why do we have to lift the embargo? Please.
Mr. Vivanco. I never said that the embargo is the solution.
I say that the embargo is the problem. It's not the solution.
And if you want----
Ms. Salazar. What do you mean by that?
Mr. Vivanco. Well, because, you know, and second,
Congresswoman Salazar, the--part of the problem is the
perception, the notion that there is some sort of quid pro quo
relationship with the Cuban government. The Cuban government, I
do not think, is interested in lifting the embargo. I think the
embargo help the Cuban government to keep that notion, that
narrative, that they are a victim of the U.S. Government. But--
--
Ms. Salazar. But if the United States wants to do business
and the American companies want to do business in Cuba, if the
tiering isn't going to let them it does not matter if there was
an embargo or not. They just simply cannot go. Home Depot or
Sheraton.
Mr. Vivanco. What you need is to create the conditions for
the international community, for the rest of democracies in the
world, to----
Ms. Salazar. Obama created it, sir. Or didn't he?
Mr. Vivanco. Right? No, but what you need is to create the
conditions for democracies in Latin America and Europe to join
support for human rights in Cuba. They are not crossing that
line because the policy of isolation that day----
Ms. Salazar. Sir, Obama lifted the policy of isolation for
two and a half years and the Castro regime did not respond.
Mr. Vivanco. I do not think Obama----
Ms. Salazar. They gave everything in exchange of nothing.
Let's look at the empirical evidence. Obama allowed for any
American company to go and invest in Cuba----
Mr. Vivanco. I do not think that----
Ms. Salazar [continuing]. Whether it was construction,
hotel, hospitality, and they--and the Cubans did not sign the
contract.
Mr. Vivanco. Right. But----
Ms. Salazar. There was a ferry. I remember--I was there
was. I was a news reporter. A ferry that wanted to go from Key
West to Havana. The Cubans never allowed it. So what are you--I
just would like to understand your position so maybe I can
support it.
But I do not see it because history proved it already with
President Obama. So now if you lift the embargo, what's going
to happen is the China model, and the Chinese model is the
worst thing that could happen to the Cubans.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Ms. Salazar. Sorry.
Mr. Sires. On the second round you'll be able to continue
your questioning.
Ms. Salazar. Thank you. Sorry.
Mr. Sires. Debbie Wasserman Schultz is recognized.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I thank
the gentleman for his indulgence in waiving on--allowing us to
waive on to the committee.
I had a chance to watch the subcommittee proceedings
remotely. There was a couple of things I think it's important
to point out.
First is that President Biden has proposed additional
sanctions and left the sanctions from the previous
administration in place. He declared himself, in his own voice,
Cuba as a failed State.
He gave voice to the Cuban protesters, issuing a clarion
call for freedom and he has stood solidly since the protests
broke out and before that in support of a free Cuba.
I also think, and Ms. Paya, I really want to agree with you
about how important it is that this issue be nonpartisan. Not
bipartisan, but nonpartisan. So you'll forgive me if I defend a
few things prior to going back to what should be a nonpartisan
issue.
I really think the audacity of those in the Republican
Party who widely across this country support voter suppression
and have supported the suppression and the--and thrown
obstacles in the path of people across this country who simply
want to cast their lawful and constitutional right to vote and
who have denied that January 6th was an insurrection have a lot
of nerve suggesting that they are the champions of freedom in
another country when they are engaging in suppression of the
people's right to vote and freedom here.
Okay. So setting aside that partisan--that partisan moment
for a second, I want to ask Ms. Paya if you could talk with me
about Afro-Cuban--the Afro-Cuban environment, which I think is
so under reported and so few people are aware of.
According to the University of Pennsylvania's Professor
Amalia Dache, almost 70 percent of the Cuban population is of
African descent. Let that sink in for a moment.
The State Department's 2020 Human Rights Report suggests
that Cubans of African descent suffer significant racial
discrimination, including subjection to racial slurs and
beatings by security agents in response to the political
activity.
Many have also reported employment discrimination,
particularly for positions of prominence within the tourism
industry, media and government.
Despite this, Afro Cubans have historically been at the
forefront of the fight for Cuba's democracy and freedom, even
though there has been a significant erasure of Afro-Cubans from
history.
Can you share with us the specific challenges or threats
that Afro-Cuban activists face on the island, and how has the
economic crisis in Cuba and the COVID-19 pandemic
disproportionately affected Afro-Cubans?
Ms. Paya. Thank you--thank you so much for that question
because, actually, Afro-Cubans are also the largest population
in jail, are also the largest population with access--with
families that comes from situations of vulnerability, and are
also--within the Cuban opposition, the Cuban civil society, we
have seen it with all the actions that Movimiento San Isidro
has made have been also one of the most affected and targeted
by the Cuban regime.
It was already a challenge 1 week ago to be of African
descent and walk by the streets of Havana without actually
being asked for the ID to--just to check it.
Actually, he was a Havanian or he needed to be deported to
the eastern provinces. That's what Cubans of African descent
actually endure in our country. And I think it's a very
important and relevant point because this is widely ignored or
not commented on about the race systems of the character of
this communist regime that have been--that have been using its
propaganda as a machinery actually to get to Cuban rights
defenders around the world when they are actually trying to
suppress those rights.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. May I just interrupt you for a
moment and just ask you to confirm, you know, while the Cuba
regime has declared racism ended, you know, after the
revolution, isn't it true that they have completely banned and
prohibited any African or Black activism organization from
existing and functioning on the island?
Ms. Paya. They have prohibited any independent organization
asking for rights of Cubans of African descent. Yes, that's
actually true.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Thank you. Thank you for the----
Ms. Paya. Of course--of course, they have entitled
themselves as the defenders of those rights.
[Laughter.]
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Right. The irony.
Mr. Chairman, thank you for your indulgence, and I just
also want to point out that I, myself, have been a longtime
opponent of lifting the embargo.
I yield back the balance of my time, which I no longer
have.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Congressman Perry, you're recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Perry. Mr. Chairman, with all due respect, you seat in
here as far as I know, and I appreciate it. But I think the
good representative from New York should be next and----
Mr. Sires. It goes by seniority.
Mr. Perry. I'm happy to defer.
Mr. Sires. You're older.
Mr. Perry. No, I can go. I can go.
[Laughter.]
Mr. Sires. Do you want to defer to her?
Mr. Perry. Yes, I think it'd be appropriate.
Mr. Sires. Yes, but before her I have Demings.
Why do not you just go and we'll take care of it.
Congressman Perry?
Mr. Perry. All right. All right. Thanks, Mr. Chairman.
Well, I appreciate the opportunity to speak before this
subcommittee regarding what I think is the evil dictatorial
regime of the Cuban Communist Party, and I'll be clear about
that.
Before I continue, I want to pay tribute to one of our
witnesses here today, Rosa Maria Paya. and thank you for all
the work that you've done to give the Cuban people a democratic
voice.
I know I speak for everyone on this committee in condemning
the despicable murder of your father, Oswaldo, at the hands of
the Castro regime nearly 9 years ago on July 22d.
It is long past time for an independent investigation to be
commissioned into Mr. Paya's death. You have our word and our
commitment that we will do everything we can to bring this
grotesque regime to account for its numerous crimes against
humanity.
Those who have lived through the evils of the Cuban regime
could tell us what little regard the Castros have for the
dignity and worth of every human life. We know that they
sadistically tore apart families, imprisoned and killed
thousands of political dissidents, supported groups like the
FARC and Sendero Luminoso, who we--who decapitated people live
on television and destroyed Cuba's economy.
I recall November 2016, when the far-left apologists like
Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau insisted that Cuba,
under Castro, was actually a progressive egalitarian utopia.
I could only shake my head at the stomach-churning
ignorance of a prominent Head of State. This is unacceptable at
any level at every level.
What most folks do not know is that compared with the
average monthly income of approximately $20 for a Cuban
citizens, Fidel Castro boasted a $900 million net worth in
2006--$900 million.
Egalitarian is, certainly, not a word I would use to
describe Cuba under Castro. Castro also sent doctors abroad on
so-called humanitarian missions to bolster his own finances,
all while the hospitals in Cuba remain chronically under
supplied and even lack such basic products as aspirin and
blankets.
The Castros are both self-serving tyrants and their puppet
successor, Mr. Diaz-Canel, is cut from the same oppressive
communist cloth. You'll hear from apologists that excessively
long wait times at Cuban hospitals due to medicine shortages
and lack of economic opportunity is entirely the fault of the
American embargo.
Couldn't be further from the truth. The embargo is the only
reason Cuba isn't thriving economically, they'll say.
What these apologists won't tell you is that Cuba trades
extensively with almost every country in the rest of the world.
The U.S. embargo does not prevent Cuba from trading with other
countries or non-American companies.
Indeed, Cuba trades extensively with China, Spain,
Venezuela, and Russia. Gross mismanagement and dictatorial
policies are to blame for Cuba's current state, not the
embargo. In a true fashion, it is the little people in Cuba--it
is the average citizen that suffers under socialism, under
communism, under this dictatorship, and it is the people at the
top that thrive.
And just as an aside, that's what some of the people in
this government in the United States of America want to bring
to America.
Today, we are, thankfully, able to bear witness to the
tenacity and character of the Cuban people as they rise up to
tell their evil government that they've had enough.
Freedom has been subverted for generations in Cuba but not
for 1 day longer, if the Cuban people have anything to say
about it.
I wish to iterate a word of caution to my colleagues. We
must not undermine the efforts of Cuba's pro-democracy anti--
socialist movement. While the Cuban people languished under the
progressive Castro regime, former President Obama reengaged the
``wet foot dry foot'' policy for the Cuban people in
retaliation for Cuban Americans voting overwhelmingly
Republican in the 2016 election.
We can only hope that President Biden eschews such
atrocious and blatantly obvious political retribution and
instead commits the full resources of the U.S. Government to
benefit those yearning to be freed from tyranny 90 miles away
from our shores.
Now, Ms. Paya, can you tell us how internet access would
bolster the pro-democracy movement in Cuba right now and what
America can do right now to make sure that happens?
Ms. Paya. Thank you so much.
Actually, it has already done that. They're very censored,
and as far as internet access existing in Cuba has already give
empowerment to the Cuban people and now there are more Cubans
that actually know in 3 hours--last Sunday, just in 3 hours the
protests replicated around the whole island, 3 hours after
there was no internet at all in the island, or it was almost
cutted completely.
So yes, to give internet access, satellite internet access
with the capacity of bypassing the censorship or just being out
of control of the Cuban regime has the possibility now also to
save lives because we are going to be able to, for instance,
verify all the atrocities that we haven't been able actually to
put in numbers, and a--and to put in the reports to the Inter-
American Commission of Human Rights or to the--or to the U.N.
because we have no communication.
We have no connections, and that connection and that
freedom of speech that we were just talking previously is the
only tool that the Cuban people right now. That, and their own
bodies, and they are putting those bodies on the streets and
they are demanding freedom and the end of the dictatorship.
If I may, I want to mention that last year, we collect 45
tons of food and medicine as humanitarian aid, and we sent it
to the island without any obstacle from the American government
or institution. The only obstacle was the Cuban regime that
confiscated all that humanitarian aid and actually they just
stole it.
Mr. Sires. Thank you.
Mr. Perry. I thank the chair and the ranking member--
committee's indulgence.
Mr. Sires. Congressman Demings? Congresswoman.
Mrs. Demings. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman, and thank
you to you and the ranking member for allowing me to
participate in today's very important hearing.
The testimony and responses to our questions have been
powerful, and I believe they are so necessary to our
understanding of the dictatorial communist and socialist regime
in Cuba.
On July 11th and since, Cubans have bravely told us what
they want for their future, and that's freedom. Let's be clear
about that. We, as a Nation, know or we should know that people
are willing to sacrifice everything--to be beaten, to be in
prison, to even die--for the sweet taste of freedom, and we as
a nation have another opportunity, yet another opportunity, to
get this right. And I am hoping that we will stay focused on
freedom and not the destructive politics of the day.
I, too, am specifically interested, first of all, on the
unique challenges that Afro-Cubans face. And my colleague did
ask about that.
But Mr. Vivanco, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the
unique and specific challenges that Afro-Cubans face.
Mr. Vivanco. Yes, the Afro-Cuban community is large in Cuba
and has been historically discriminated in spite of the
official line that Cuba is not--I mean, it's a racial
democracy.
It's not--we know that it's not a democracy. We know that
it's a dictatorship. And we know that they discriminate against
those ones who comes from the Afro-Cuban community.
And you see that when, as Rosa Maria Paya said, on the
streets in control--police control and as well as in the
prisons, in Cuban prisons, Cubans' access to--Afro--Cuban
access to education and as well as the top positions within the
dictatorship.
Mrs. Demings. Thank you so much.
And I'd also like to ask about Cuban LGBTQ rights activists
who were arrested and beaten by plainclothes security officers
in May 2019 for organizing an unauthorized demonstration after
government officials had canceled a planned annual march
against homophobia.
How would you evaluate current legal protections for LGBTQ
individuals in Cuba and the level of societal discrimination
against them as well?
Mr. Vivanco. As my colleague, Rosa Maria Paya said,
everything depends on Cuba whether you are independent or
you're part of the official machinery. So an LGBTQ organization
that try to develop their own approach, their own policies, and
they're trying to make an effort so, for instance, to monitor
human rights conditions for their own community are not
allowed, are prohibited, and are subject of all sort of, you
know, sanctions and persecution in Cuba unless you're part of
the official structure.
Mrs. Demings. Ms. Paya, anything you'd like to add there?
Ms. Paya. Yes. I think it was very well established and
occurred, and if I--if I just ask, there are many members of
the LGBT community, many Cubans of African descent within the
opposition movement, and the--and the Cuban civil society.
We Cubans, we understand that all of us, we need the
fundamental human rights. But I need to say that those that are
members of LGBT community or the Cubans of African descent have
an extra challenge when they have to face the repression of
the--of the Cuban State security.
And just briefly mention the case of Hector Luis Valdes
Cocho. Actually, he's a Cuban of African descent and he's a
member of LGBT community, and he was almost raped during a
arbitrary detention a few days ago.
Mrs. Demings. Thank you both so very much for your
testimony.
Mr. Chairman, I do yield back.
Mr. Sires. Thank you for participating.
Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis.
Ms. Malliotakis. Thank you. Thank you, Chairman.
Despite my Greek last name, many of you may not know that
I'm of Cuban descent. My mom is a Cuban refugee. My grandfather
had his gas stations and small business home taken away from
him by this regime.
I still have family that are living there, and I could just
say that this--because I've heard one of my colleagues earlier
talk about COVID vaccinations. That is the least of their
problems, Okay.
Nobody needs COVID-they need them, perhaps, but it's not--
it's not the issue and that is not what they're fighting for.
They want freedom. They are starving. They need access to
medicine. They do not have any of these things because the
regime takes it all.
And with regards to the embargo, you know, I very much
disagree with you, Mr. Vivanco, because Cuba does business with
nearly every other country in the world, hundreds--at least
$100 billion in trade annually for that small island. The
regime takes everything.
The regime takes everything. Anything that comes into this
island, whether it's money, whether it's food, whether it's
medicine, the regime takes it and lifting the embargo will do
nothing except prop this communist regime, this murderous,
brutal communist regime, which you understand as someone who is
an advocate for human rights, further up, and it will do
nothing to actually help the people.
And so my question is, first, to someone who truly
understands as a dissident herself, Ms. Paya. Can you please
explain to my colleagues how this regime weaponizes anything
that comes into this island against their own people?
Ms. Paya. Yes, thank you. Thank you so much for that
question, because one of the things that the regime weaponized
are actually human beings, Cubans, and I think that everybody
here already understand that the Cuban regime can be thinking
on blackmailing the United States with the migratory--with the
migratory crisis.
To be--to get into that trap in this moment is to fail the
Cuban people. The root of the problem--the root of the problem
is the dictatorship and the Cuban people understand that, and
that's why they are--they are demanding the end of the
dictatorship.
Regarding all the things that are sent to the island, I
have to say we want to send everything to the island but under
the condition of no interference of the Cuban regime and that
condition is just because when the regime interferes, that
sends hard currency or humanitarian assistance or whatever it
is. Doesn't end in the hands of the Cuban people but in the
hands of the repressors.
So it's very important. It's very important that this
country help us, not to give money to the repressors but to
help--but to help the Cuban--but to help the Cuban people.
If I may, to make this discussion about the embargo is to
take the old approach. The Cuban people is in the streets.
Something has changed.
In July--July 11, a week ago, the people is--the whole
island demanding freedom, demanding the end--the end of the
dictatorship. And there are many things, many new things, many
fresh things that this administration, that the members of the
OAS, that the European Union could do and should do to help the
people.
And I will repeat, please, targeted individual sanctions
rise because of the repression, targeted the--targeting the
individuals, the generals that are commanding those killings
and those detentions.
Replicate the South African experience. When we said,
please, put consequence to the enterprises that actually enrich
the regime, we're not asking for any sort. We're asking for the
Sullivan Principles, the same experience that actually worked
to end the apartheid.
Why we cannot have that in Cuba now when the Cuban people
is demanding that?
Ms. Malliotakis. Thank you very much. So yes, the communist
regime, if you are one of them, one of the communists, if you
join their communist revolution then you will be taken care of
somewhat by what's coming into this island.
If you are someone who is a dissident or just an average
Cuban, you get absolutely nothing. That is the--that is the
false promise of communism, that everything would be equal,
right? That's what socialism claims. We want equality.
Yet, it could not be further from the truth. The communist
dictators, the ruling class live like kings, and everyone else
lives in squalor. And that is what we're trying to end by
pushing for freedom on this island and allowing them to
determine their own future.
Mr. Vivanco, I will, though, ask you a question, because as
someone who is involved in Human Rights Watch, I would love to
know your opinion about Cuba, along with China and Russia and
Venezuela, the most egregious human rights violators, being
members of the United Nations Human Rights Council.
Mr. Vivanco. Do I have a second to answer your question?
Mr. Sires. Sure.
Mr. Vivanco. Look, a couple of points. I'm not in
disagreement with you on the first point that when you
mentioned that Cuba is not isolated. I fully agree with you.
That is precisely the problem.
You have failed to persuade the rest of the international
community that you have to isolate Cuba. Cuba is not isolated.
It is trading with, you know, with any other country, including
Brazil. Brazil is the most important source of food for Cuba.
And so the trouble is that you are insisting on a policy
that create fundamental disagreement for the rest of
international community, and the challenge for me is to create
conditions to bring in those democracies to exercise pressure
on the Cuban government.
But the line of the--of the isolation and the embargo is
not supported for the--by the rest of the world. That is,
essentially, the problem that you have here. It's a pragmatic
problem.
You need to look at this one with different eyes to see
what could be--what will be the most effective policy from the
U.S. to improve human rights conditions to force the
dictatorship to transit from dictatorship to democracy.
And, certainly, the approach that--you know, that the U.S.
has taken for 60 years is not working. That is my point.
Ms. Malliotakis. They're doing business with everybody in
the world and it's not working. But if you could respond to my
human rights question----
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congresswoman. We're going to have
second--we're going to have a second round. Thank you very
much.
I'm going to ask a second round of questions, if you do not
mind, and I'll start by saying this. I'm so happy that
Congresswoman Demings raised the Afro-Cuban situation in Cuba,
because for many years the propaganda machine in Cuba has told
the world how in Cuba there is no racism, that the Afro-Cuban
is equal to the white Cubans.
I mean, this propaganda machine it's incredible throughout
the world, because I have traveled extensively and people tell
me--I said, that's not--that's not accurate. You know, just--
you know, just like they have five vaccines in Cuba.
Well, why do not they use them? Just like when they said
they've discovered oil off the island of Cuba. Well, how many
barrels have they extracted? You know, it made the whole east
coast of this country in a panic thinking that they were going
to have drilling 90 miles from----
So the propaganda machine in Cuba, it's the best in the
world. So I was so happy that you touched upon that point. That
is a lie about how equal the society in Cuba is.
And as far as the vaccine, I am all for sending vaccines to
Cuba. My problem is that what you're going to have is the same
situation you had in Venezuela.
We sent vaccines to Venezuela. The government takes it, so
it does not get to the people. It just gets to the people who
support this dictatorship.
So how do you get around that, Mr. Vivanco? How do you get
around the government taking everything you send to the island
to help ease the situation on the island when the government is
just a taker?
Mr. Vivanco. Mr. Chair, best vehicle to address that
challenge is to do it through United Nations. United Nations,
when they--when they come in into humanitarian crises like the
one facing in Venezuela, one of the fundamental preconditions
is that the distribution, access, and administration of all the
food or medicine is done under the U.N. flag, not the local one
because, obviously, the temptation for the dictatorship in
Venezuela as well as in Cuba is to take advantage of that, one,
and two, you know, to take advantage to do some more propaganda
by using that type of support.
So I do not see a way that the U.S. Government, even the
Biden Administration, could provide access to or support for
vaccine--vaccination of the Cuban people without doing through
some sort of vehicle like the United Nations, who has the
capacity and they know how to make those distribution according
to U.N. principles, which are--which are, you know, by
definition nonpolitical.
Mr. Sires. In terms of the five vaccines that the Cuban
claims they have, the Abdala and the other ones, vaccines, why
do not they use it?
Mr. Vivanco. Part of the problem is that the way that they
have handled the COVID epidemic in Cuba has been a disaster.
As I said before, our information revealed that they have
rejected vaccines coming from China and Russia just because
they want to prove and to demonstrate to their own people and
the rest of the world that they have the capacity to produce
their own vaccine, and then distribute that one to the rest of
the world.
Well, all of that, you know, plan has failed. But it's part
of another piece of propaganda.
Mr. Sires. Propaganda.
Would you like to add something to that?
Ms. Paya. Yes, just add that actually the Cuban regime also
rejected the COVAX help--COVAX's initiative of the U.N. or in
relation with the U.N. and they also rejected the COVID vaccine
in a very criminal decision not to immunize the Cuban--the
Cuban population and provoke an even deeper crisis that they
were already--that we were already facing.
Whether it is United Nations or the European Union or any
other multilateral organization, the key thing is the
nonintervention of the Cuban regime. As soon as they
participate in the process, they are going to--they are going
to solace in the help or they are going to weaponize that help
against the Cuban people.
Mr. Sires. Thank you.
Congressman Green.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for the
witnesses who are willing to do a second round.
One of my colleagues earlier commented that China was a
good example where the U.S. has no embargo and inferred that
because of that it's proof--a reason why we should lift the
embargo with Cuba.
I'd encourage those who are supporting lifting the embargo
and citing China as proof to go and watch the video of the
protesters in Hong Kong. Go ask the Uighurs what it's like to
live in China under the Communist Party of China.
I'd like to ask you to go and talk to the churches in China
where they're forcing them to take the cross down and replace
it with pictures of Xi Jinping.
The only other place in the world I can recall in my
limited travels as a military officer and running a not for
profit is that where the president's picture is so ubiquitous
is Saddam Hussein in Iraq.
Go ask the Falun Gong folks what it's like to have your
organs forcibly removed and sold.
I do not see the lifting of the embargo making a huge
change there in China. Ask the student or the researcher how
easy is it to search the internet in China? They do not call it
the Great Firewall of China for nothing.
So this notion that, I mean, lifting the embargo is going
to make totalitarian dictatorships change overnight is just--it
pales. I'm an ER physician, not a brain surgeon. So perhaps
maybe there's something I do not know.
But I've looked--I'm sitting here thinking. Totalitarian
dictators in the past, how many of them with opened economic
have actually stepped down from power and allowed for a
republic to develop? I cannot think of one in history.
A question for Ms. Paya. There's strong international
consensus for restoring Venezuela's democracy. People are
working together. Countries are supporting us and our, you
know, actions there.
Yet, in Cuba, as Mr. Vivanco has said, they are doing in
Cuba--I mean, we haven't gotten others to join us there. What
is the difference? And this is just a genuine question. What is
the difference and why are--why are they not helping with Cuba
but they seemed to be very helpful with Venezuela and the
socialist dictator down there?
Ms. Paya. I think that's a question for the rest of the
world, because what it is--a reality is that tolerating 62
years of the communist dictatorship in the island of Cuba does
not only affected several generations in my country but have
gravely and seriously affected the democratic stability of the
whole continent.
Actually, we wouldn't be talking about the collapse of the
democracy in Venezuela without the support, the coordination,
and the interference of the Cuban regime.
Same thing with the--with the repression in Nicaragua, and
you know history. You know about the interference programs of
the Cuban G2, well trained by the Stasi and KGB in Latin
America.
So this--in this pivotal moment that we are living as a
Nation, a nation that lives inside but also outside the island
because of the dictatorship, our goal for the international
community is, please, see directly to the Cuban people, to the
suffering of the Cuban people, and to the demand of the Cuban
people, and that demand is freedom and that demand is the end
of the dictatorship.
And that demand is not only going to help Cuba, but it's
going to help peace and national security of our whole
hemisphere.
Mr. Green. Throughout the region. Absolutely. It seems to
boggle the mind that the world will join us to jump on
Venezuela, but the folks that are actually--I mean, the Cuban
military is in Venezuela. The Cuban military is helping
Nicaragua.
Ms. Paya. Yes.
Mr. Green. I mean, it just makes no sense to me that the
rest of the world is--has joined us in this fight and yet that
seems to be the reason why it's failed. Because we haven't
gotten all the rest of the world involved, so let's just lift
the sanctions. Makes no sense to me. Thank you.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman Green.
Congressman Vargas, thank you for coming.
Mr. Vargas. Mr. Chairman, thank you very much and thank you
for allowing me to be here. I apologize. I had a committee
running same time as this one. The only thing I would correct
for the record, maybe, Dr. Green said, I'm not sure that a ER
physician would yield to a brain surgeon in every instance.
Maybe in this case.
[Laughter.]
Mr. Green. Point taken.
Mr. Vargas. With that being said, I have great concern for
what's going on, obviously, in Cuba. I'd like to see the
dictatorship gone, the authoritarian rule and, obviously, have
democracy and have people have the opportunity to vote and to
choose whomever they want. They haven't had that opportunity.
I'd like to see the Cuban people be able to lift their
standards of living. Obviously, Cuban Americans, when they come
to the United States, they do very, very well and I'm sure that
that country would be able to lift up its standard of living if
it had freedom, if it had democracy.
But a lot of people ask, in a practical sense what can we
do to really help, I mean, other--short of sending the Marines.
I mean, how, in a practical sense, can we help Cuba in this
moment?
Why do not I begin with you, Mr. Vivanco?
Mr. Vivanco. What we need is the support of the rest of the
international community. Bringing change on Cuba and improving
the record of Cuban human rights and democracy without the
support of Western democracies, European democracies, Canada,
Latin American democracies, is going to be difficult--has been
very, very difficult.
And normally, when you raise questions about Cuba to a head
of a State in any Western democracy, they will ask you what
about the embargo. That is the problem. It becomes a
distraction.
And they say, you know, we are not going to join forces.
This has been told to me many times because I care about Cuba,
and I travel the world raising questions about Cuba or
Venezuela.
So when you say, you know, what about those--you know, free
speech in Cuba, freedom of religion in Cuba, free association?
You know that we have never heard about a strike in Cuba. Why
are there no strikes in Cuba? Because there are not independent
unions in Cuba--are not allowed.
So when you try to create a debate outside the U.S., in
Mexico, for instance, which has a lot of influence in Cuba, the
natural reaction of those ones who should be supporting human
rights in Cuba is what about the embargo? We do not support the
embargo.
And then you try to divide the conversation and say, you
know, let's discuss the embargo later. Let's focus on Cuba now,
you know, and the rest of the world is not willing to----
Mr. Vargas. Let me interrupt you just for 1 second, and
thank you for that answer. I mean, a lot of people believed,
including myself, maybe there was going to be an opening when
the Soviet Union imploded.
When the Soviet Union imploded, a lot of us thought, well,
this is a satellite State, really, of the Soviet Union and
there's going to be change in Cuba. But it didn't really happen
because they continued to have support from other countries
around the globe, and they continue to have it.
So in a practical sense, when you say that Western
democracies should kick in, well, I think they should, but if
they do, how would that really make a difference if they're
getting support from these other countries--if Cuba is getting
support from other countries?
Of course, they do not like us very much. It still seems
like they will carry on. I mean, that's what people want to
know. How, in a practical sense, can we make a difference with
the reality on the ground there and the international reality
as it is? How can we make a difference?
Mr. Vivanco. The only--look, I sound like a broken record.
But the best way to contribute constructively to the Cuban
debate is by looking into your own policy and make a very
objective empirical assessment of the--whether that policy has
been effective or has failed.
My conclusion is it has failed because, you know, you have
a very strong dictatorship in place. So it's time to introduce
some adjustments. Former President Obama didn't lift the policy
of isolation. What he did was to reestablish diplomatic
relations with Cuba.
But the heavy lifting--the work needs to be done here in
Congress. If this policy is not subject of a real and serious
objective nonpartisan, you know, evaluation, we will keep the
status quo and I bet you that nothing will change in Cuba.
Mr. Vargas. Thank you. I have more questions, but my time
is up. So I will yield. Thank you.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman.
Congresswoman Salazar.
Ms. Salazar. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I have a
couple of questions for both of you. Let me start with you,
Rosa Maria.
Basically, yes or no--if the White House gives green light
to connect internet either through Guantanamo or Raven Company
or the U.S. embassy in the middle of El Malecon, will the
Cubans go back into the streets?
Ms. Paya. The Cubans are already in the streets and----
Ms. Salazar. But more and more.
Ms. Paya. Of course. Of course. I mean, that connection
allows communication and allows coordination.
Ms. Salazar. Do you think that then more Cubans will feel
emboldened because they know that the world is watching them
because of the wi-fi?
Ms. Paya. That's very important. That's key. I do think
that and I do think that everybody needs to send a message to
the Cuban people that they are not alone.
Ms. Salazar. But if the Biden Administration is not saying
clearly that they are with--that the Biden Administration or
the U.S. Government is with the Cuban people, are they
receiving that information?
Ms. Paya. The best way to deal with the Cuban people is
with real actions and internet is one of them.
Ms. Salazar. Right. Now, what else can we do besides
forcing the Biden Administration to give the green light so we
can turn on the internet right now, which is the most effective
manner, through the embassy or in Guantanamo with a tower, a
wi-fi tower?
We're talking about Netflix quality video. We're talking
about just the ability to lift the videos that show how they're
being beaten on the streets. What else could we do besides
that?
Ms. Paya. You could, please, help us to put these
recommendations on the radar of the--of the president and,
please, also do it as not just personal recommendations but,
actually, these are the suggestions, the recommendations of the
majority of the Cuban civil society in opposition that took
part of a platform called Pasos de Cambio, and----
Ms. Salazar. Unfortunately, the Biden Administration is not
paying attention to us or to the Cuban people, which is the
most important part.
So then I go to Mr. Vivanco. Were you saying--you're
saying--I've been hearing you repeat once and many times that
we need the international community to join the United States
in order to create change in Cuba.
But then my question is now, putting the embargo aside,
putting politics aside, where is the international community
now when they see that the people are shouting on the streets?
That has nothing to do with the Americans or with the embargo.
Where is that international community?
Mr. Vivanco. Unfortunately, the reaction of the
international community is not, you know, up to the level that
is required.
Ms. Salazar. And why is that? Why is that? Why do you think
that is?
Mr. Vivanco. Because, unfortunately--let me give you--let
me cite you an example. The president--the current president of
Argentina----
Ms. Salazar. Okay.
Mr. Vivanco [continuing]. Alberto Fernandez----
Ms. Salazar. Yes.
Mr. Vivanco [continuing]. He says, I have no idea what is
going on in Cuba but I am against the embargo. So that is a
very unfortunate reaction, right. He is the leader of a
democratic country. He is not a dictator. So this is not--you
know, we are not looking into Russia or China.
This is one of the biggest democracies in Latin America.
And he, you know, he seems to be, you know, somebody who should
be aware about what is going on in Cuba.
Ms. Salazar. So everything is the embargo. But then if you
are telling me that he does not even know what's happening in
Cuba. So that means that they do not care what's happening. And
like I repeat, what's happening in Cuba has nothing to do with
the embargo.
But then--and I want you to tell me where I'm wrong in this
statement. You lift the embargo, as you're advocating the
United States to do. Then the Castro brothers will have access
to loans, specifically from the World Bank from and the IMF,
and everybody will be doing business with Cuba because there is
no more American embargo on it. Right?
And then what happens then? Then, accordingly, so I go back
to Obama. Then what happens next? We will then have given
oxygen to a repressive apparatus to continue repressing the
Cubans. And then where's the democracy in this whole picture?
Mr. Vivanco. Let me--let me answer your question, and I
think it's also relevant for the comment made by Congressman
Green. He said--and I believe and I agree with you, Congressman
Green. You said, I do not believe that lifting the embargo will
bring change and democracy overnight in Cuba.
Ms. Salazar. So then we have to wait, what, 50 years----
Mr. Vivanco. I agree--I agree 100 percent. I agree 100
percent. So, in other words, this is not a trickle-down
economics. It's not like you lift the embargo, then bingo, you
have democracy in Cuba the following day.
What you need is the multilateral pressure and you need to
build that one, and that will take time to build that, you
know, diplomacy with democracies in the world who care about
human rights in Cuba.
Ms. Salazar. But that depends on those democracies. And I
agree, that depends on those democracies and you just pointed
out the fact that those democracies are just not tuned in.
So we do not--if they will, at some point. So one way or
the other, we do not know when democracy is going to get to
Cuba. But in the meantime, the Cubans are on the street and no
one is paying attention including the Biden Administration.
That's reality.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Ms. Salazar. Thank you. Sorry. Thank you for the time.
Mr. Sires. Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. I'd
like to turn to the subject of Cuban doctors and just reference
a March 2019 report by the New York Times that detailed how
members of Cuba's medical mission in Venezuela said that they
were told to provide oxygen tanks and other desperately needed
medical assistance only to individuals who committed to voting
for the Maduro regime.
In multiple cases, they described being ordered to withhold
lifesaving treatment to individuals who hadn't proven their
political loyalty to Maduro.
Are these medical missions still going on in Venezuela, and
what has been their impact?
To either one of you.
Ms. Paya. Yes, they have--they have been taking place in
Venezuela and in many other--and in many other countries, and
it is very important that not only--not only United States, not
only the United Nations that actually issued a report elevating
the Cuban medical brigades' treatment to the treatment of
forced labor.
And it's very important that the rest of the world restrain
for participating in these kind of activities that are designed
to give money to the Cuban repressors as in over the life and
the human rights of the Cuban doctors.
But you made a very good point because it's not this--these
international missions that the Cuban regime has around the
world and not just for--and not just for money. Also for
espionage, and I have a very--a specific data from the Cuban
medical missions that took place in Bolivia during the Evo
Morales--during the Evo Morales presidency.
From 503 medical doctors are supposed--medical doctors
working on Venezuela, 497 were not medical graduates. So that
the impression that the Bolivian State was making in medicine
or health was actually being made on espionage and given a
State security.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. And Senor Vivanco, you mentioned
earlier that the exploitation of Cuban doctors has been helpful
in some countries. But compare that with the information coming
out of Cuba in terms of the reality of health care on the
island, where in--even in Havana, pregnant women are required
to bring their own sheets, that they actually have to bring
cleanser so that they can clean the feces off of the walls and
the toilets so that they can have some semblance of sanitary
conditions to give birth.
Can you--can either view describe the facade, the real
lies, fabrications, of the wonderment that is portrayed of how
excellent the Cuban healthcare system is compared to the
reality of it being rationed and individuals, particularly of
Afro-Cuban descent, are actually discriminated against when it
comes to access to health care?
Mr. Vivanco. Just a couple of points. I do believe that the
Cuban doctors, those ones who are doctors--I'm not talking
about spies--Cuban doctors are heroes and should--and deserve
as much respect as we could give them because they go----
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Right, and this is not of them.
Mr. Vivanco. Say it again.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. My criticism is not them.
Mr. Vivanco. No. No. No. That's right.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. I think they're being enslaved.
Mr. Vivanco. It's very important to make that distinction
between the doctors who goes to, you know, remote and poor
communities all over the world to service them from the
machinery, the structure used by the Cuban government where the
doctors become actually victims, and they have no rights, no
right to, you know, privacy, free speech, association, and so
on and so forth.
By the way, the chair of the subcommittee asked me before
what happened if those--any of those doctors applied for
political asylum, for instance, and abandoned----
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. But if you could focus--if you could
focus specifically on the actual--the reality of healthcare
access and conditions on the island.
Mr. Vivanco. I do not have that data, the current data of
reliable data of the current----
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Do you? Ms. Paya, do you?
Ms. Paya. Yes, I do not have data because we do not have
any statistics. But we have seen videos and we are in total
connection with the Cubans in the island and the--and the
reality seems to be of a total collapse of the healthcare
system, at least in the provinces Matanzas, the people were
even--Matanzas, yes--the people were even dying in the aisles
and in the entrance and in the houses without proper medical--
without proper medical attention.
We are facing a very--a very high prices of the sanitary
system, of the healthcare system, and it's clear that the
authorities of the dictatorship are not--are not capable of
actually solving the problem. They are not prepared or they are
not willing to.
Ms. Wasserman Schultz. Mr. Chairman, the portrayal of the
Cuban healthcare system is mythological, that is one that
provides all kinds of free and wonderful access to health care
to people on the island. That is simply untrue.
And in addition to that, the reason that we do not have the
information that we need is because they deny access to the
data, unlike free countries which universally share data so
that everyone can have access to it and see what's really going
on in terms of the treatment and the health and well-being of
their people.
I yield back the balance of my time.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Congressman Perry.
Mr. Perry. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank the
witnesses.
I read a book one time entitled, ``And the Russians
Stayed,'' talking about Cuba.
Now, the folks that are for ending the embargo--so I'm
sitting at the table, some on the other side of the aisle here
in this building, and most, I think, importantly and
vociferously the Chinese, the Russians, and the Cuban
dictatorship. I think that's an interesting coalition and it's
important to recognize it for what it is.
Ms. Paya. can you--can you describe to us, if you can,
because we have heard the reports but it's hard to get
verification, what are the Venezuelans and the Russians and the
Chinese doing in Cuba right now to stomp out this freedom
movement?
Ms. Paya. Yes. And again, we only--we only know what is
public. We only know what the anecdotes of the witness in Cuba
mentioned. But just taking into consideration what is public,
Russia issued a statement in the first days of last week,
encouraging Miguel Diaz-Canel, the puppet of Raul Castro, which
holds the charge of president of the dictatorship, encouraging
Diaz-Canel to use all the measurements available within the
Cuban law to a stop the protest. That were not the exact words,
but that was the message.
And I have to say to use all the measurements within the
Cuban law includes the--includes the violence, includes the
weapons against the Cubans--the Cubans that are actually trying
to change the system because, actually, the Cuban constitution
that was imposed in 2019 in the Article 4 that constitution
allows anyone to fight even using the--they call it lucha
armada, even using weapons to fight anyone that is trying to
change their political and economical system that that
constitution established, which is the Cuban Communist Party as
the Director of the Society and the State.
So, basically, Putin was giving his endorsement to the
killing of the Cubans in the streets if they were trying to
change the--to change the system.
Having said so, Cuba--the Cuban regime has been the gateway
to the intelligence service of Chinese, of Russians, and the
connections, the coordination, the kind of a relationship that
the Cuban regime passed over the Maduro dictatorship have been
widely documented.
And they are in charge, for instance, of the counter
intelligence, specifically, the military counter intelligence.
So that's there now.
Mr. Perry. So everyone knows that the Russians and the
Chinese have their most important listening stations located in
Cuba, and so with people are saying, well, Mr. Vivanco, the
embargo is not working.
And I agree with you to a certain extent that doing the
same thing over and over again and expecting different results
is insanity. And for 60 years, and before that Bautista, the
same thing, right? Dictatorship and us with the embargo now and
hoping it will work.
But I would submit to you that while I agree with you that
it's not working under its current form, because other
countries are happy to trade with Cuba, they're happy to trade
because there's something in it for them.
There's money in it for them. There's influence. There's
China. There's Russia. And this is the time--right now is the
time when the United States with the embargo needs to step up
and do even more as the Cuban people put their lives on the
line, literally, on the streets of Cuba at the hands of the
Venezuelans, at the hands of the Chinese and the Russians, who
will kill them in their homes.
And now's the time for the United States to up the ante, to
say we--go to these other countries and say, you must stop
trading with them. You must stop helping. Now is the time, not
to back off, not to do exactly what the dictatorship wants.
Ms. Paya. certainly, the Cuban people can defend
themselves against the Venezuelan police, the Russians, the
Chinese. Certainly they can defend themselves. They're armed,
aren't they?
Ms. Paya. No, they are disarmed----
Mr. Perry. Say it isn't so.
Ms. Paya [continuing]. And peaceful people demanding
freedom in the streets and they are confronting an eState with
all its resources and the resources of their--of their other--
of the other enemies of freedom to the world.
Mr. Perry. Ladies and gentlemen, now is the time for the
United States to lead, not back off on the embargo but to step
up and force other countries, demand other countries, to step
up and stop the insanity happening 90 miles off our coast.
I yield the balance.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman.
Congressman Vargas.
Mr. Vargas. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I believe it was
Albert Einstein who was credited with saying, if you do the
same thing over and over again and you expect a different
result, that's insanity. And I think that that's right.
I mean, if you continue to do the same thing and expect a
different result, that is insanity. I'd argue, I mean,
everybody's putting the blame seems--not everybody, some people
to be putting the blame on this administration.
But I would say, hey, where was the Reagan Administration?
Where was the George H. W. administration? Where was the George
W. administration? Where was the Trump administration?
If it's so easy to do, why wasn't it done? I mean, the
reality is, I think it's very difficult to get change there and
again, because it does have, I think, these other States that
help it.
I gave the chance last time to Ms. Paya.
Mr. Vivanco, how would you do it differently? Because it
does seem to me that nothing's going to come of all this.
You're going to have a lot of poor people suffering in Cuba
again.
You're going to have this, you know, the people in the
streets. They're going to get repressed. They're going to get
attacked. A lot of them--not a lot of them, but a number of
them are going to get killed. They're going to disappear.
All the terrible things that normally happen, and nothing's
going to change because we're going to continue to do the same
thing.
Ms. Paya. Congressman Vargas, I do appreciate the analysis
of the--of the history because I do believe that we are in a
pivotal moment, that this moment is qualitatively different
from anything that we have seen before in the 62 years.
We have seen massive protests across the whole island, tens
of thousands, probably hundreds of thousands of Cubans, maybe a
million Cubans in the streets demanding freedom and demanding
the end of the dictatorship, demanding those things from a
dictatorship that actually is in one of the most vulnerable
moments in history, too, for many reasons, but also because the
access to resources have been--have been diminished during the
last--during the last years, but especially because the Cuban
people have fundamentally changed in its behavior, and it's
going out in the streets and it's demanding freedom, not just--
not just on Sunday, but only during this year til January--til
June 30 there have been more than 1,100 protests in Cuba.
So there are many fresh and important things that
international community and United States can do--can do to
help us, and one of these is rise the cost of the repression
against the Cuban people, imposing targeted individual
sanctions against the ones that are giving the orders to kill
and to shut down young people in the streets. Internet access.
Mr. Vargas. If I could interrupt.
But I have to say, ma'am, I'm old enough to remember the
collapse of the Soviet Union and that was also a moment like
this, when everyone said, oh, here it comes. Here's the--here's
where it's going to be the big change. There wasn't. There
wasn't, and----
Ms. Paya. So, sir, you're talking about the collapse of the
Soviet Union and I'm talking about the Cuban people in the
streets.
Mr. Vargas. But, remember, Cuba--no, I understand. But the
reason I say that is that history seems to repeat itself. I
remember that time. Now I'm 60 years old. I do not know how old
you are, but I'm 60, and so I remember that time very well,
that this is an opportunity. Everybody was saying, now it's
going to happen. There's going to be changed on the island.
You're going to see now a democracy. The Castros are going to
fall. They didn't.
Ms. Paya. Again, we----
Mr. Vargas. And now I look at it again, and I do not--I
mean, I do not want to argue with you because I agree--I'd like
to see the change. Probably we'd both like to see--I'd like to
see a democracy where people can vote freely for whomever they
want and not to have the dictatorship that they have today.
I just fear that we're going to do the same thing again and
nothing is going to change.
Ms. Paya. Well, you can help us to change that and that's
part of why we are--we are doing this. And just to clarify what
is fundamentally different from 1900's is that it's not the
Soviet Union collapsing. It's the Cuban people protesting in
the streets. The product flow here does not rely on any other
foreign country. It relied on the Cuban people. We are the
protagonist of our--of our history. We are already being that,
and what we are asking is solidarity with the solution and the
demand that we are----
Mr. Vargas. And I guess if I could--my time is about over.
That's the problem. The solution--I mean, I think that there's
a lot of solidarity. There was back when the Soviet Union
collapsed, too, and nothing happened. That's my point, that the
solidarity was there but it's the policy that does not change.
Have you----
Ms. Paya. Then practical things to do rise the--rise the
cost of the repression. Impose targeted sanctions over those
that are still commanding a repression. Give internet access.
We saw the censorship of the--of the Cuban regime.
Apply the Sullivan Principles and take a similar approach
to the one that you took with South Africa to end the
apartheid.
Involve the international community, the European Union,
the OAS, not under the premise of the cynicism of the--of the
world with the embargo but on the premise of the Cuban people
demanding freedom on the streets. I think that's--that would be
a fresh approach.
Mr. Vargas. Thank you very much.
Ms. Paya. Thank you.
Mr. Vargas. My time is up.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman Vargas. Congresswoman
Malliotakis?
Ms. Malliotakis. Thank you very much and I, again, want to
thank both of you for being here today and to discuss a topic
that is very personal and important to me. And, certainly, we
talked a lot about what the Biden Administration should be
doing and I echo what you say, Ms. Paya, when you say we need
to involve the international community.
We need to--we need the president to lead as the leader of
the free world to push for freedom and democracy in Cuba and,
certainly, use whatever abilities we have to engage the
international community, the freedom-loving democracies from
around the world, to also join that effort to push this regime
out.
What I want to ask, though, is what can the United Nations,
because I've been very disappointed with their lack of interest
in actually assisting in this situation right now, what do you
believe the United Nations should be doing at this time to help
this cause?
Ms. Paya. Thank you so much for that question, and I have
to say that I have been shut down by the Cuban--by the
dictatorship--the Ambassador of the Cuban dictatorship in the
Human Rights Councils in the United Nations. The fact that they
have a seat there is very, very telling to what the United
Nations have been doing for the Cuban people.
Anyways, there are special rapporteurs that have to make
his work--their work, and they have been doing it and those
kind of technical approach as the one that reported on the
forced labors of the Cuban doctors should be taken into
consideration.
My suggestion, of course, I was--I'm hoping that the High
Representative Michelle Bachelet asks for a visit to the island
and actually confirm with her own eyes what is taking place in
Cuba.
I do not have a lot of hope for the Cuban regime accepting
that, but that should be the kind of--the kind of bold
involvement that we are hoping for an organization that should
be protecting the right to democracy and the human rights in
Cuba.
Ms. Malliotakis. You mentioned the Human Rights Council,
and I'm glad you brought it up because one of the reasons why
President Trump withdrew the United States from the Human
Rights Council is because it's a farce. It's an absolute sham,
particularly when you look at the members who sit on that
Council.
It's not just Cuba who, you know, allows no freedom of
speech, no freedom of press, no freedom to demonstrate, as
we're seeing people being beat in the streets by communist
regime forces. They're being abducted and jailed and shot at.
They're treated as slaves for what equates to 15 U.S. dollars a
month. They have a dual currency system.
When something is--they're being paid in Cuban pesos and
yet they're being asked to purchase things in something that is
equivalent of U.S. dollars. You know, it's a 25 to 1 ratio.
How do you expect them to do that, and they're slaves to
the government and they do not have the right to come and go
from the island as they please.
So the fact that Cuba is on the Human Rights Council along
with China, Venezuela, Russia, the most egregious human rights
violators.
Mr. Vivanco, as somebody who is involved with the Human
Rights Watch, I would love for you to comment on that.
Mr. Vivanco. It is a shame. It is a shame. There is no
other, you know, reaction. That is the--probably the most
honest comment that I can give you how dictatorships are
members of the Human Rights Council.
But let me explain to you one little detail which is--I
think is relevant. They get elected because every region, every
geographical region of the world, has some chance to present,
for instance, one or two candidates for one or two vacancies.
Last time, when Venezuela was, you know, competing for a
position, unfortunately, Latin America were given two posts and
Latin America as a--as a region presented two candidates for
two posts.
So there was--I mean, and one of the candidates was
Venezuela, the other one was Brazil. And Brazil, under the
current government of President Bolsonaro, very close ally to
President--former President Trump, you know, decided to avoid
any further candidate from stepping in because they were afraid
that if there were three candidates for two posts at the Human
Rights Council Brazil will be eliminated.
So what we did was to convince Costa Rica in the last
minute to run to try to defeat Venezuela and Costa Rica did it.
But, you know, it was late already, you know, and
unfortunately, finally, Brazil was selected and Venezuela was
selected.
Ms. Malliotakis. Any advice you have for the Biden
Administration at this moment when they're looking to reenter
Human Rights Council how we can use that as leverage to try to
change the makeup of this council?
Mr. Vivanco. I think that if you look at the votes, the
positions of the Human Rights Council, not the membership--the
membership, I agree with you. I mean, at least, I do not know,
40 percent of them are dictatorships, who get selected at the
Human Rights Council to protect themselves, you know, to try to
interfere in the business of the top entity that is supposed to
supervise human rights all over the world.
But there is still a slim majority that is committed to
fundamental freedoms and rights. So I welcome the decision of
the current administration, the Biden Administration, to rejoin
the Human Rights Council because there are very important
battles and debates that are happening precisely there.
Ms. Malliotakis. Thank you.
Mr. Sires. Thank you. Well, we have come to the end. I want
to thank you for your patience. I want to thank you for coming
and testifying before our committee.
And we'll just have some closing remarks, then we'll close
the hearing.
Thank you again for joining us today. I have been inspired
by the scenes of courage we are witnessing in Cuba. Young
people, in particular, have been stepping up and making clear
that they refuse to become a lost generation.
Their creativity, bravery, and advocacy ought to remind
that the status quo in Cuba is a tremendous waste of talent and
potential.
I urge the Biden Administration and my colleagues in
Congress to rise to the occasion and seize the best opportunity
to help the Cuban people. Nothing is more important to me than
seeing the Cuban people finally become free.
With that, I turn it over to my colleague, Congressman
Green.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for allowing some
closing comments, and I want to thank the witnesses for being
here. I want to thank you for your intensity. I think on both--
everybody here is excited about the opportunity that we see at
this moment in time.
We're frustrated and angry with the human rights abuses
that have gone on for so many years, and I agree that with the
embargo not working, I just--I think it's time to double down.
I think it's time, and my criticisms aren't of the Biden
Administration, per se, as much about, you know, earlier when I
was talking about socialism and communism and I was referring
to sort of fringe members.
I think we all know the senator I'm talking about who
supports socialism and my own colleagues here in the House who
support socialism, and some who've advocated for universal rent
control, which is right out of Karl Marx.
That's not--I'm not saying that's the Biden Administration.
I'm saying when I--my criticism there is just let's act. It's
time, and there's a chance--there's an opportunity to bring
freedom to another group of people and that's why I'm so
passionate.
But I believe very deeply that there's a lot of--I was
listening to, you know, Congresswoman Wasserman Schultz, who I
do not agree with very often.
But as she was talking about this, I'm, like, yes, that's
right. Those physicians are enslaved, and if they're doing that
they'll probably sell vaccine we give them anyway, right.
So, I mean, let's do what we can to continue to agree where
we can, and, Chairman Sires, I just want to thank you for your
friendship and your unbelievable leadership on this issue over
the decades.
You are a champion for the people of Cuba because you are
one of them, and you have done an amazing job leading through
the challenges of a divided government here in Washington, DC.
Thanks for your time. Appreciate you all.
Mr. Sires. Thank you, Congressman Green, for those remarks.
Thank you for your comments.
And with that, this hearing is adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 12:24 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]
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