[House Hearing, 117 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
REACHING THE LIGHT AT THE END
OF THE TUNNEL: A SCIENCE-DRIVEN
APPROACH TO SWIFTLY AND SAFELY
ENDING THE PANDEMIC
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HEARING
BEFORE THE
SELECT SUBCOMMITTEE ON THE CORONAVIRUS CRISIS
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND REFORM
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SEVENTEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
APRIL 15, 2021
__________
Serial No. 117-13
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Printed for the use of the Committee on Oversight and Reform
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Available on: www.govinfo.gov,
oversight.house.gov or
docs.house.gov
__________
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
44-380 PDF WASHINGTON : 2021
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COMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND REFORM
CAROLYN B. MALONEY, New York, Chairwoman
Eleanor Holmes Norton, District of James Comer, Kentucky, Ranking
Columbia Minority Member
Stephen F. Lynch, Massachusetts Jim Jordan, Ohio
Jim Cooper, Tennessee Paul A. Gosar, Arizona
Gerald E. Connolly, Virginia Virginia Foxx, North Carolina
Raja Krishnamoorthi, Illinois Jody B. Hice, Georgia
Jamie Raskin, Maryland Glenn Grothman, Wisconsin
Ro Khanna, California Michael Cloud, Texas
Kweisi Mfume, Maryland Bob Gibbs, Ohio
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, New York Clay Higgins, Louisiana
Rashida Tlaib, Michigan Ralph Norman, South Carolina
Katie Porter, California Pete Sessions, Texas
Cori Bush, Missouri Fred Keller, Pennsylvania
Danny K. Davis, Illinois Andy Biggs, Arizona
Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Florida Andrew Clyde, Georgia
Peter Welch, Vermont Nancy Mace, South Carolina
Henry C. ``Hank'' Johnson, Jr., Scott Franklin, Florida
Georgia Jake LaTurner, Kansas
John P. Sarbanes, Maryland Pat Fallon, Texas
Jackie Speier, California Yvette Herrell, New Mexico
Robin L. Kelly, Illinois Byron Donalds, Florida
Brenda L. Lawrence, Michigan
Mark DeSaulnier, California
Jimmy Gomez, California
Ayanna Pressley, Massachusetts
Mike Quigley, Illinois
David Hickton, Select Subcommitte Staff Director
Russell Anello, Chief Counsel
Senam Okpattah, Clerk
Contact Number: 202-225-5051
Mark Marin, Minority Staff Director
Select Subcommittee On The Coronavirus Crisis
James E. Clyburn, South Carolina, Chairman
Maxine Waters, California Steve Scalise, Louisiana, Ranking
Carolyn B. Maloney, New York Minority Member
Nydia M. Velazquez, New York Jim Jordan, Ohio
Bill Foster, Illinois Mark E. Green, Tennessee
Jamie Raskin, Maryland Nicole Malliotakis, New York
Raja Krishnamoorthi, Illinois Mariannette Miller-Meeks, Iowa
C O N T E N T S
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Page
Hearing held on April 15, 2021................................... 1
Witnesses
Anthony S. Fauci, MD, Director, National Institute of Allergy and
Infectious Diseases, National Institutes of Health
Oral Statement................................................... 5
Rochelle P. Walensky, MD, MPH, Director, Centers for Disease
Control and Prevention
Oral Statement................................................... 7
David Kessler, MD, Chief Science Officer, COVID Response,
Department of Health and Human Services
Oral Statement................................................... 8
Written opening statements and the written statements of the
witnesses are available on the U.S. House of Representatives
Document Repository at: docs.house.gov.
Index of Documents
----------
* Letter Regarding COVID Vaccines; submitted by Chairman
Clyburn.
Documents entered into the record during this hearing and
Questions for the Record (QFR's) are available at:
docs.house.gov.
REACHING THE LIGHT AT THE END
OF THE TUNNEL: A SCIENCE-DRIVEN
APPROACH TO SWIFTLY AND SAFELY
ENDING THE PANDEMIC
----------
Thursday, April 15, 2021
House of Representatives
Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis
Committee on Oversight and Reform
Washington, D.C.
The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:47 a.m.,
2154 Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. James E. Clyburn
(chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.
Present: Representatives Clyburn, Waters, Maloney,
Velazquez, Foster, Raskin, Krishnamoorthi, Scalise, Jordan,
Green, Malliotakis, and Miller-Meeks.
Chairman Clyburn. Good morning.
The committee will come to order.
Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare a
recess of the committee at any time. I now recognize myself for
an opening statement.
This pandemic has taken a heavy toll on our Nation. More
than 550,000 of our fellow Americans have died, more than in
any other nation on Earth. Nearly one in 10 has been infected
and millions have faced hardships like job loss, mental health
struggles, and the loss of a loved one.
But today, more than a year into the pandemic, there is
reason for hope. Our government's response to the coronavirus
crisis is now driven by science and fact, not politics and
wishful thinking.
After the previous administration failed to contain the
virus, this new approach is already showing results. Since
President Biden took office, we have seen a massive increase in
the pace of vaccinations. Just look at the progress we have
made since January 20 and is shown here on this chart.
We are vaccinating more than 3 million people each day with
a record of 4.6 million shots this past Saturday. More
Americans were vaccinated this past week alone than in the
first six weeks of a vaccine rollout.
One-third of the United States population has now received
at least one dose of the vaccine, and four days from now all
adults will be eligible to receive a vaccine.
We are on the path to finally defeat this virus. Yet,
challenges continue. To protect all Americans from this virus,
we must ensure that vaccines are distributed equitably, and
that vaccine hesitancy is overcome.
Black and brown communities, rural communities, and low-
income communities have all been ravaged by the pandemic, and
we must take special care that they are not left out of our
recovery.
Overcoming these challenges is especially urgent because we
are now seeing more contagious and deadlier variants spread.
These variants are driving a recent increase in new infections,
especially among younger adults, who may feel less vulnerable
to the disease and let their guard down.
In some states, new cases and hospitalizations have more
than doubled in the last two weeks. Hospitals have begun to see
more patients in their 20's, 30's, and 40's.
I look forward to hearing from today's witnesses about what
measures we must continue to take to save lives before all can
be vaccinated.
We are joined today by three of our Nation's top public
health experts to help us understand how a science-driven
approach will put us on the path to return to near normalcy
that can be sustained.
Dr. Anthony Fauci is the director of the National Institute
of Allergy and Infectious Disease and the most trusted voice
guiding Americans through this crisis.
Dr. Fauci, I am glad to welcome you back to the Select
Subcommittee. Your expertise has led us through some of the
darkest days of the pandemic and I thank you for your candor
and for your service and dedication to the American people.
Dr. Rochelle Walensky is the director of the Centers for
Disease Control and Prevention. Dr. Walensky, under your
leadership, the CDC is reaffirming its commitment to science
rather than political interference of the prior administration
and is being restored to its role as the world's preeminent
public health organization.
I look forward to learning more about your work and how you
and all of our Nation's scientists are working to protect our
health.
Dr. David Kessler, the Chief Science Officer for the
coronavirus response, is leading the Biden administration's
vaccination efforts. He was previously appointed by President
George H. W. Bush to serve as commissioner of the FDA.
Dr. Kessler, I thank you for being here today to update us
on our progress toward vaccinating all Americans that.
Dr. Walensky, you recently said we are at a critical point
in this pandemic, a fork in the road, where we, as a country,
must decide which path we are going to take. As we navigate
what we all hope will be the final months of the pandemic, we
must take the path of science.
After so many have died, this is the path to preventing
further loss of life. After so many have lost their jobs, this
is the path to a strong recovery. After so long, this is the
path to safely returning to normal activities as soon as
possible.
I now recognize the distinguished ranking member, Mr.
Scalise, for his opening remarks.
Mr. Scalise. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and appreciate you
holding this hearing. Welcome, our guests, and look forward to
your testimony.
America is at an important inflection point. The COVID-19
pandemic hit our shores just over a year ago. Too many families
mourn the loss of loved ones. Too many children have lost a
year of school.
Many felt depression and millions lost an irreplaceable
year of their childhood. Too many family-owned businesses are
permanently shuttered.
Far too many low-income Americans have been thrown out of
work because of selective ineffective lockdowns. And now, we
are finally starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel,
as the title of this hearing suggests.
American ingenuity has led the way. Operation Warp Speed,
which President Trump put in place, delivered the fastest
vaccine in history. Investments by this U.S. Congress over the
past 25 to 30 years in biomedical research have provided the
platform to deliver these vaccines.
The American pharmaceutical industry, who are world
innovators, as well, Dr. Fauci, is your team at the National
Institute of Health, deserve tremendous credit for the work
that has been done to deliver those vaccines and the American
people are starting to benefit.
Through President Trump's leadership and his refusal to be
told no, that led to extraordinary speed, warp speed, to use
his term, in getting the vaccines from the lab into the arms of
over 100 million Americans, 112 million people to be specific.
More than 33 percent of the U.S. population have received
at least one dose of vaccine. About 70 million people, 20
percent of the U.S. population, have been fully vaccinated.
I commend President Biden for accepting the challenge that
House Republicans issued at the beginning of this year to not
just accept what was already in place--the 100 million vaccine
goal--but to, in fact, double that to 200 million shots. We are
now on pace to reach that goal that we set.
But, Dr. Fauci and Dr. Walensky, the question that I get
asked the most these days is pretty simple: if I got the
vaccine, why can't I resume my normal activities? Why can't my
kids go back to school? Why can't I go to a restaurant with my
friends again?
Neither the CDC nor NIH nor the White House have provided a
satisfactory or consistent answer to that question. In the
absence of logical guidance, Americans have done what Americans
do better than anybody in the world. They have taken the
initiative to safely get back to their everyday activities and
lives as best as they can.
I know we have learned a lot along the way and are still
learning about this virus. But the data now shows that the
harshest lockdowns did not work. School closings did not work.
In fact, they have done devastating damage to these young
kids and still, in many states, are destroying future
opportunities for millions of young children across America
when all the science says schools not only can be reopened
safely, but should be reopened safely.
Despite the evidence, some local communities, especially in
northeastern states, have chosen to remain locked down. Some
communities, more so in the South, have chosen to lift mandates
and safely reopen schools as well as local businesses.
Yet, as of today, the 10 states with the highest infection
rates are all northern states: Michigan, New York, New Jersey,
Connecticut, et cetera. Florida gets a lot of media attention,
much of it unfairly harsh because the people of that state made
an early decision to follow the science to get kids back in
school and to make life as normal as possible while confronting
this challenge of the virus.
Their results, certainly, appear better than those of
lockdown zealots in New York or California. But just last week,
YouTube took down a video of a roundtable that Governor
DeSantis of Florida led talking with doctors about kids and
schools and masks.
YouTube has cited CDC guidance as the reason they took down
that video. Why would anyone want to silence a governor of a
state on the front line of this pandemic holding a roundtable
with doctors about best practices regarding their own
experiences in the real world and sharing what they have
learned?
The American people also deserve better answers about the
Federal Government's response to the unprecedented surge of
illegal migrants crossing our southern border.
Last week, I led 10 of my colleagues to the U.S.-Mexico
border to see firsthand the devastating national security,
humanitarian, and health crisis that President Biden has
created at our southern border with his disastrous open-border
policies.
All Republicans on this subcommittee have made that trip to
the border to see what is going on. At the data processing
facility, we encountered thousands of migrants cramped into
makeshift shelters in overcrowded rooms that were more than 10
times the capacity limits that have been set.
We saw children in tears, who simply wanted to go back home
to be with their families. But, instead, they were here in
these federally run holding cells, with at least a 10 percent
COVID positive rate, many being held for longer than three
weeks, well over the legal limit.
President Biden also is not fully enforcing Title 42 of the
Public Health Safety Act designed to prevent migrants from
spreading COVID in the United States.
Since President Biden took office, families with children
under seven are being dropped off at the McAllen bus station in
Texas and released from custody. No COVID tests, no
quarantines, no enforcement that all Americans have to follow.
Even more concerning is that the Biden administration may
completely end enforcement of Title 42. If that happens, Border
Patrol agents have told us that the number of illegal crossings
at the border could mushroom even higher.
As we toured the data processing facility, we saw the
holding rooms that President Biden set up for young children.
Each room is not supposed to have more than 50 people, six per
cell. But what we saw was more than 400 children packed like
sardines into these cells that were designed for less than 50.
It was heartbreaking to see so many young children packed
into these cells laying on floors, many crying because they
want to return home. Social distancing does not exist in these
facilities.
Dr. Fauci and Dr. Walensky, I would urge you to go down to
the border to see what is going on at that federally run
detention facility in violation of the very CDC guidance that
you issue that we, as Americans, have to follow.
But I also urge you, as public health officials, to
understand the frustration and confusion of the American
people. COVID-positive migrants are released into the country
and that is allowed, but a vaccinated person can't go to a
restaurant. Kids packed into a crowded, poorly ventilated cell
six inches apart, not six feet apart, for 20 hours a day is
being allowed, but we can't reopen schools in America for in-
person learning.
That is lunacy. There is absolutely no reason why this is
going on. President Biden and Vice President Harris need to go
down to the border and see what their policies have created and
reverse what is happening.
The public health messaging only works if the people trust
the messengers. The light at the end of this tunnel, which
every one of us on this subcommittee agrees on this point, as
do our witnesses, that light at the end of the tunnel is to
vaccinate as many people as possible and to reopen America.
The Biden administration needs to do a better job starting
today.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back the balance of my time.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you, Mr. Scalise.
Will the witnesses stand so I can swear them in?
Please raise your right hands. Do you swear or affirm that
the testimony you are about to give is the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
[Witnesses are sworn.]
Chairman Clyburn. You may be seated. Let the record show
that the witnesses answered in the affirmative.
Without objection, your written statements will be made
part of the record. Dr. Fauci, you are recognized for your
opening statement.
STATEMENT OF ANTHONY S. FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF
ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES, NATIONAL INSTITUTES OF HEALTH
Dr. Fauci. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, Ranking
Member Scalise, members of the committee. Thank you for giving
me the opportunity to talk to you today about the role of the
National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases in
research addressing COVID-19.
In April 2020, we put together a strategic plan that had
four elements: fundamental knowledge of the disease,
diagnostics, therapeutics, and vaccines. For the sake of this
hearing, I will focus my remarks specifically on the
development of safe and effective vaccines.
Just last Friday, I published in the journal Science what I
call the story behind the COVID-19 vaccines, because people
were concerned about how quick this was done over a period of,
literally, less than a year.
And I quote what I said in the article, ``The speed and
efficiency with which these highly efficacious vaccines were
developed and their potential for saving lives are due to an
extraordinary multidisciplinary effort involving basic
preclinical and clinical science that had been underway out of
the spotlight for decades before unfolding of the COVID-19
pandemic.''
And in fact, much of this has been done by NIH and its
grantees and contractors involving the basic research and
clinical research that developed the vaccine platforms,
including the messenger RNA and other platforms.
The work of Dr. Barney Graham and Kizzmekia Corbet and
others stabilized the prefusion spike protein, which is used in
virtually all, with few exceptions, of the vaccines that are
now successful, and the NIH clinical trial units that we set up
for flu and influenza have now been converted to testing the
vaccines for COVID-19.
As we are all aware and as you mentioned, Mr. Chairman, we
now have three highly successful and efficacious vaccines that
are being implemented here in the United States. This has been
actually given a very strong recognition by Science magazine as
the science breakthrough of the year.
But, importantly, it is even better than the efficacy of
the vaccines themselves because what we see here is that we
have had an effectiveness which was even better than the
original data.
Let me explain. Efficacy means what you get in a clinical
trial. Effectiveness means what goes on in the community and in
the real world. And as shown on the slide, there have been a
number of studies which have looked at what happens in the real
world.
For example, the study from the University of Texas
Southwestern showed their employees had a 0.05 percent
infection rate when they were vaccinated, extraordinarily low.
The CDC summarized data from a number of studies showing a
very low level of infection in people who are vaccinated, in
this case, 0.04 per 1,000 person years. In addition, the
durability of the vaccine is considerable.
This study, looking at one of the vaccines but it holds
true for the others, has at least the six-month duration of
protection, very likely much longer than that but at least
that. I cannot talk about vaccines without mentioning the
challenge that we have with variants, which I am sure we will
discuss later in the hearing.
The good news is that one of the variants that is becoming
dominant in this country, the B117, which was originally
recognized in the United Kingdom, is very well covered by the
vaccines that we are using and, in fact, even with others that
are more problematic. If the vaccine doesn't protect against
the initial infection, it protects against severe disease.
I want to close by a comment that I believe really
characterizes where we are. We are in a race between
vaccinating as many people as quickly and as expeditiously as
we possibly can and the threat of the resurgence of viruses in
our country because as we know, we are at a precarious
situation with many states having increases in the daily number
of cases.
In fact, the average is now over 60,000 per day and that is
something that we really must pay attention to.
So, I will close with that comment, Mr. Chairman, and be
happy to answer questions later on. Thank you very much.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much, Dr. Fauci. Perfect
timing.
The chair now recognizes Dr. Walensky.
STATEMENT OF ROCHELLE P. WALENSKY, M.D., MPH, DIRECTOR, CENTERS
FOR DISEASE CONTROL AND PREVENTION
Dr. Walensky. Thank you, Chairman Clyburn and Ranking
Member Scalise, for the invitation to speak with you today.
Over the last three months, I have had the honor of serving
as director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
alongside dedicated staff who are working tirelessly responding
to the COVID-19 pandemic, and addressing ongoing public health
needs of our country.
I am so grateful for their guidance and deep expertise, and
I am committed to supporting their efforts to ensure science
and evidence drive our path forward.
I want to take a moment to recognize the over 560,000
American lives lost--mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers,
grandparents, and children who have died because of this virus.
Every life is lost--every loss is felt by grieving families
and by communities devastated by this pandemic. Although we
have seen incredible advances in science to help curb COVID-19
infections and bringing relief to those who are sick, we must
remain vigilant in our prevention efforts.
The emergence of variants that spread more easily has made
the race to stop transmission even more challenging. As we
monitor disease transmission and variants, we are getting
vaccines into arms quickly, safely, and equitably.
Vaccine safety is a top priority and we take all reports of
adverse events following COVID-19 vaccination seriously. As
announced earlier this week, CDC and FDA recommended a pause in
administering the Johnson & Johnson vaccine while we review
data and assess significance around adverse events reported in
six people.
CDC and FDA are committed to remaining transparent through
this process and will provide updates as they are available.
CDC is working in coordination with national, state, tribal,
and local governmental and nongovernmental partners to build
trust in the vaccines, the vaccinator, and the vaccination
system.
Instrumental to this work is eliminating barriers to
vaccination in communities of color and other
disproportionately affected groups. COVID-19 has underscored
the importance of addressing long-standing systemic health
disparities as a cornerstone of achieving health equity.
And just this past week, I declared racism a serious public
health threat and highlighted ways CDC will confront the impact
of structural inequities to serve as a catalyst for greater
education and dialog around these critical issues.
CDC is committed to expanding evidence-based approaches to
reduce disparities in COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations, and
death, to prioritizing equity and vaccine distribution and to
expanding a diverse work force.
CDC has announced a number of investments in alignment with
these goals, including our largest single investment in health
equity. CDC will distribute $2.25 billion to address COVID-19
health disparities and advance health equity among populations
who are high risk and underserved.
In addition, CDC has invested $3 billion to strengthen
vaccine confidence with a focus on increasing uptake and
equity, particularly in communities hardest hit by this
pandemic.
This is not our first emergency. Since 2009, the U.S. has
faced four significant emerging infectious disease threats: the
H1N1 influenza pandemic, Ebola, Zika, and now COVID-19.
While urgency demanded rapid and unique approaches in
response to each of these threats, none resulted in necessary
sustained investment for public health infrastructure. If we
don't act with permanent fixes, these challenges will continue
to exist when the next public health threat emerges.
I want to leave you with four points today.
First, CDC is leading with science and will continue to be
the public health scientific resource for the American public
and for our international partners.
Second, we are expanding the reach of lifesaving COVID-19
vaccines and improving vaccine confidence. As of April 14, more
than 194 million doses of COVID-19 vaccines have been
administered.
However, to end this pandemic, we must also maintain proven
effective prevention measures: masks, hand hygiene, and
physical distancing.
Third, health equity must be at the intersection of
everything we do in public health, and I am committed to doing
that as CDC director.
And, finally, we must work toward sustainable investments
in public health infrastructure to be better prepared for
whatever comes next.
I look forward to working together to address both the
immediate challenges ahead and addressing the deficiencies in
our public health infrastructure that left our country so
vulnerable to this pandemic.
We will get through this pandemic and I look forward to
working with you to support CDC and to address our public
health challenges at home and abroad.
Thank you for the invitation to testify today and I look
forward to answering your questions.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much, Dr. Walensky.
As I recognize Dr. Kessler, I apologize for uttering a
Gullah Geechee pronunciation of your name earlier.
Dr. Kessler?
STATEMENT OF DAVID KESSLER, CHIEF SCIENCE OFFICER, COVID
RESPONSE, DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES
Dr. Kessler. Chairman Clyburn, Ranking Member Scalise,
distinguished members of the subcommittee, I am David Kessler.
I am honored to be serving as the Chief Scientific Officer of
the COVID-19 response.
Today, the United States is in a special position. We have
administered more than 194 million doses of vaccine for the
prevention of COVID-19.
I am pleased to report that over 79 percent of people over
65 have received at least one dose and over 60 percent of
people over 65 are fully vaccinated. We have enough supply to
deliver 3 million shots per day and we have secured enough
doses of mRNA vaccines for 300 million Americans.
We have already delivered more than 250 million doses to
more than 69,000 vaccination sites and have enrolled more than
142,000 providers to administer vaccines.
I, along with my colleagues here today, are ready to answer
your questions and discuss recent issues surrounding, for
example, the Johnson & Johnson vaccine.
The point that I want to stress is that nothing, nothing,
should detract from the fact that Americans need to get
vaccinated and that we have vaccines available today that meet
our high standards for safety and effectiveness.
I hope we can all agree that it is important that our
fellow citizens get vaccinated and that we help ease the minds
of those who are considering getting vaccinated.
We are in a strong position with respect to vaccines, and
over the next several weeks supply is going to continue to
increase and we will release approximately--up to 28 million
doses a week.
But we need to confront the reality of vaccine hesitancy. I
have focused much of my career on studying drug safety. The
most important way to help people overcome their concerns about
vaccine is to be transparent with them about the safety about
these products.
When it comes, for example, to the mRNA vaccines, real-
world data show that they are more than 90 percent effective in
preventing infection two or more weeks after the second dose,
and that these vaccines have, to date, an excellent, excellent
safety profile.
We continue to make important investments in the
development, manufacturing, and supply of multiple vaccine
platforms to make sure that we will continue to have safe and
effective vaccines to prevent COVID-19. I just want to update
you on three important critical initiatives.
First, as a pediatrician, we need to carefully evaluate
data on the safety and effectiveness of vaccines in adolescents
and children. We expect that data on vaccine safety and
effectiveness in adolescents and children to be carefully
reviewed by FDA and the ACIP, and we will work to expeditiously
deliver those doses if they are authorized or licensed.
Second, we are also working to address questions about
variants. The current vaccines have proven highly effective,
but we are also supporting studies on variants and efforts to
produce the next iteration of these vaccines if they are
needed.
Finally, we are planning for potential booster doses of
vaccines if they are needed. As with other vaccines, a
subsequent dose may be desirable.
I look forward to working with members of this subcommittee
as we address these issues. Thank you for the opportunity to
testify today and I look forward to your questions.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much, Dr. Kessler.
Each member will now have five minutes for questions. The
chair now recognizes himself for five minutes.
I want to begin my questions by going back to the opening
statement of my good friend, the ranking member, who seems to
feel, like I do, that if we get these vaccinations done, we
ought to be able to let kids back into school. I agree with
that.
And I just want to say that, Dr. Kessler, if you are, in
fact, following the science with this. If we get the
vaccinations done, we might be able to resume a meeting on the
floor of the House. We are trying to accommodate the requests
of scientists.
The ranking--I mean, our attending physician has told us
whether it will be required and I think we ought to lead by
example and restore the House to regular order by getting
vaccinated, and then I think the schools might follow. That is
just something that I would like you, Dr. Kessler, to opine
about, if you don't mind.
Dr. Kessler. Mr. Chairman, you just said it more eloquently
than I could ever say. Let us get Americans vaccinated. Let us
get this done, and then we can see the light at the end of the
tunnel. That is the goal.
I mean, I would hope today we can send a very loud clear
signal to our fellow citizens who--I mean, many,
understandably, you know, have questions, may be sitting on the
fence.
But I have looked at the data. We have all studied the data
and looked at the safety and effectiveness of these vaccines
and, today, I think we need to encourage our fellow citizens.
The only way we are going to get out of this, especially
with this increase in variants, sir, is to get people
vaccinated. I hope we can all come together and send that
message.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you, Dr. Kessler.
Dr. Fauci, I heard this morning, and I apologize I am not
able to quote it exactly the comments or statement coming from
Oxford this morning about AstraZeneca versus Johnson & Johnson
and all the other vaccines.
Would you like to enlighten us as to the impact or the
efficacy of their statement?
Dr. Fauci. Yes. I think there is going to be some confusion
about a paper that just came out from the Department of
Psychiatry of the University of Oxford, whose major purpose was
a reasonable purpose.
Using electronic records, they were trying to find out the
difference in the incidence of thrombosis, particularly
cerebral venous thrombosis, following the disease COVID-19
compared to various vaccinations, including influenza, as well
as the mRNA vaccines of Pfizer as well as Moderna.
And they found that, as you might expect, following the
disease you get a very marked increase in the incidence of this
adverse situation of cerebral venous thrombosis.
However, one of the potential confusing aspects of the
paper, Mr. Chairman, is that when they made the calculation of
what the incidence of this is following vaccination with an
mRNA, they gave a number of four per million.
Then they went and made an extrapolation of data that
wasn't even in the study, which showed that according to the
European Medicine Agency, the incidence of this complication
following the chimp adeno of AstraZeneca was five per million,
indirectly suggesting that the complication following one
vaccine is similar to that of the other, and it is impossible
the way this study was designed and conducted to make that
determination.
So, I believe when this paper, which is in a preprint
server, gets submitted to the classical scientific journals and
undergoes peer review that that confusion will be straightened
out and it will be clear that you cannot make any statement the
way this is designed about the adverse events following the
vaccination with the mRNA comparing to anything else.
There were many, many, I would say, procedural gaps in here
regarding the way the study was done. It was a well-meaning
attempt to show that COVID-19 disease is followed by this
complication. But they led to some suggestions that I think are
not called for in the paper.
Thank you.
Chairman Clyburn. Well, thank you very much, Dr. Fauci, for
clearing that up because I think it should go explained, fully
explained, to the American people. The headline of that--of
this morning could very well cause some real setbacks.
I see my time has expired. I now yield to the ranking
member for five minutes of questions.
Mr. Scalise. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Dr. Fauci, Dr. Walensky, we are going to be passing out
some pictures. These are pictures that were taken just last
week during the trip that I took along with 10 of my colleagues
to the southern border over in McAllen, Texas, some from the
border in McAllen at a temporary processing center, some at the
Donna detention facility, where you can see in some of these
cells that are holding people.
I will let you take a look at those. But while you are
reviewing those pictures, I would like to read the CDC guidance
that you all have issued on Mexico and, first, it says level
four, which is the highest level, very high level of COVID-19
in Mexico.
This is CDC. One, travelers should avoid all travel to
Mexico. That is CDC guidelines. Because of the current
situation in Mexico, even fully vaccinated travelers may be at
risk for getting and spreading COVID-19 variants and should
avoid all travel to Mexico. This is CDC.
You go on to say some other things. Then we talk about
traveling back into the United States. This is only if you are
an American citizen.
All air passengers coming to the United States, including
U.S. citizens and fully vaccinated people, are required to have
COVID-19 test results no more than three days before travel or
documentation of recovery from COVID-19 in the past three
months before they board a flight to the United States.
That is a CDC guidance document. So, first, Dr. Walensky,
should everybody who comes in the United States follow this
guidance, not just American citizens but everybody coming into
the United States?
Dr. Walensky. The CDC guidance by air is guidance not just
coming from Mexico. It is air travel from all over the----
Mr. Scalise. So, Guatemala, for example, should follow this
guidance?
Dr. Walensky. It is all over the globe, Europe, everywhere.
All----
Mr. Scalise. El Salvador should follow this guidance?
Dr. Walensky. All over the globe if you travel by air. This
is the guidance.
Mr. Scalise. I appreciate--I appreciate you answering that
because we will get to that in a minute, because on my flight
back from McAllen back home to New Orleans, about half of the
plane were some of the people that are in these pictures who
were getting on these flights not being tested for COVID in
violation of your guidance.
So,let me ask you, and this is, by the way, Secretary
Mayorkas just recently testified that he admitted that
apprehended migrants were released before getting a COVID test,
who came from Mexico, from El Salvador, and getting on an
airplane. Is that in violation of CDC guidance?
Dr. Walensky. The CDC is providing technical assistance to
the Office of Refugee Resettlement from the people who are
leaving the DHS and Custom Border----
Mr. Scalise. So, let me ask you specifically. If somebody
came from one of those countries that you just listed--you said
every country but here you are specifically talking about
Mexico--if they came from Mexico and then got on an airplane
without a COVID test, does that violate CDC guidance?
Dr. Walensky. This is guidance. It is not law. But those
are the recommendations----
Mr. Scalise. OK. So, does--no, it doesn't say
recommendation. This is all are required. That is not a
recommendation, Dr. Walensky. That is a requirement by the
Federal Government for American citizens.
Is there an exemption for people who come here illegally to
this guidance?
Dr. Walensky. They----
Mr. Scalise. It is a yes or no question. Should everybody
comply or just American citizens?
Dr. Walensky. Everybody coming into the United States by
air is supposed to have a test one to three days before coming
and three to five days----
Mr. Scalise. Well, then let me just advise you that the
director of Homeland Security has testified that that is not
happening. And so, I know you all meet with the president more
than me.
I have requested--I know our leadership has requested a
meeting with the president and he has yet to meet with us. You
will meet with him before I do.
Can you let him know that he is violating your own CDC
guidance in how he is running our southern border right now?
Because look at these pictures.
Dr. Fauci, does this look like social distancing to you
that you require when you talk about six feet?
Dr. Fauci. No.
Mr. Scalise. So, in these cells, as you just said, they are
violating the very guidance that you tell Americans to follow.
A restaurant in the United States would be shut down today if
they were being run like this.
Yet, the Federal Government, the Biden administration, is
running this facility. You can see all of these young children
who are next to each other, six inches apart, many without
masks, by the way. Does that follow your guidance that you have
issued?
Dr. Fauci. No.
Mr. Scalise. Well, then why would the Biden administration
not go and stop this? I think one of the reasons is President
Biden and Vice President Harris won't even go see this for
themselves.
That is why I keep urging strongly that they go to the
border. I would love for you all to go to the border to see
this so you can at least give recommendations. They are
violating every guidance that Americans are required to follow.
Again, you look at the CDC guidance on Mexico, it is off
the charts saying how dangerous it is. If you are an American
citizen with the vaccination you have to--not should, have to--
get a COVID test saying you are negative to come back home to
America.
Yet, if you are coming here illegally, the Homeland
Security secretary admitted in a hearing just the other day
that they are not testing people who come here illegally.
Dr. Fauci, do you think that sends the right message to
America who--people are trying to recover and get back to the
way of life, that if you are a citizen you follow this set of
rules. But if you come here illegally, you don't have to follow
any of your rules.
Dr. Fauci. No doubt it is a very difficult situation at the
border, Congressman.
Mr. Scalise. Do you think this should get fixed?
Dr. Fauci. Excuse me?
Mr. Scalise. Do you think this should get fixed and they
start following the same rules that you and I have to follow?
Dr. Fauci. I mean, obviously, everyone would like to see
that situation fixed, I know. But it is a very difficult
situation that is----
Mr. Scalise. Americans want to get back to their life, but
they don't want two sets of rules either, and that is what is
happening right now at our southern border.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the ranking member for yielding
back.
The chair now recognizes for five minutes Chair Waters.
Ms. Waters. Thank you so very much for this important
hearing, Mr. Clyburn. I just have to take a minute to tell you
it is very emotional for me. As you know, my sister was one who
was infected and died from COVID-19 and all that I had to
depend on was Dr. Fauci.
I would like to tell Dr. Fauci that you, literally, saved
millions of folks who would only listen to your advice based on
what was happening with the Trump administration and the
president of the free world, Mr. Trump, who told--who
disregarded, first of all, the fact that the virus was real and
took too long to get started with any response to it.
He told us it would just disappear, and then he recommended
that we use disinfectant and he proceeded to have gatherings
and himself, I believe, was the cause of so many Secret Service
personnel and others who got infected.
So, we depended on you, and I looked forward to you every
day giving us some directions about what we should do. And when
I go throughout communities and I see everybody masked it is
because of you, Dr. Fauci, that we had to depend on, and I want
to thank you so very, very much for what you have done for all
of us.
And I am so appreciative to the Biden administration, for
all of you now, who have moved in a concerted direction to
ensure that all communities are vaccinated and that, you know,
the gaps that we had under President Trump where we didn't have
enough testing, we didn't get enough vaccines, all of that is
being corrected now and I want to thank all of you for being
here today.
And I just want to say to you, Dr. Walensky, you did
recently describe racism as a serious public health threat and
you said that the disparities seen over the past year were not
a result of COVID-19. Instead, the pandemic illuminated
inequities that have existed for generations.
So, Dr. Walensky, what are the historic inequities that you
were referring to and why is racism such a public health
threat?
Dr. Walensky. Thank you for that question. I am trained in
HIV and AIDS, the reason I am an infectious disease doc. I can
tell you that those communities that have been afflicted by HIV
and AIDS have been a result of they are marginalized
communities, vulnerable communities, communities of African
Americans, Hispanic communities.
You can look at more maternal mortality. You can look at
risk of cardiovascular deaths, up 30 percent in marginalized
communities, African-American and Hispanic communities.
This has been--if you work in medicine, you see that people
who are racially diverse, this is about where they live, where
they work, how they travel, and all of the things that lead to
their lack of access to care and their inability to get the
same care as others.
And so, this is not just a public health threat of COVID-
19. What I can tell you is that over the first six months of
2020 there was one year of life expectancy lost for all
Americans, 2.7 years of life expectancy lost for African
Americans, and 1.9 years of life expectancy lost for Hispanic
Americans.
We have seen this in COVID-19. We are doing outreach now to
reach marginalized, vulnerable, racial and ethnic diverse
communities, and I believe that outreach has to stick because
after we are done with COVID-19, we need to vaccinate 11
million children that have lost their vaccinations.
We need to control hypertension in these communities. We
need to address maternal mortality in these communities. All of
it will happen.
Ms. Waters. Thank you. And I appreciate that the Biden/
Harris administration has taken actions to reach communities of
color, rural communities, and low-income communities, including
establishing a COVID-19 Health Equity Task Force, distributing
vaccines directly to federally qualified health centers, and
targeting funds toward underserved communities.
Dr. Fauci, do you agree that we will not be able to fully
recover from this pandemic if we do not take action to ensure
that all Americans, including hard hit communities of color,
receive coronavirus vaccines and, if so, why?
Dr. Fauci. I absolutely agree with that, Congresswoman
Waters, and that is the reason why equity is such an important
part of the vaccine distribution program that we are carrying
out right now.
There are a number of reasons. One, in order to get this
pandemic under control we have to get the overwhelming majority
of the people in this country vaccinated.
Second, because of the fact that minorities, brown and
Black people, have a higher incidence of infection and when
they do get infected they have a much higher incidence of a
serious outcome including hospitalization and death.
And for those reasons, both for the individual people who
will suffer if they are not vaccinated as well as for the
country itself when you want to get a veil or an umbrella of
protection over the entire country, you have got to include all
citizens from all groups from all demographic groups.
Ms. Waters. Thank you so much, Mr. Clyburn. I appreciate
you all but, Dr. Fauci, I love you. Thank you.
[Laughter.]
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you, Ms. Waters. The chair now
recognizes Mr. Jordan for five minutes.
Mr. Jordan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Dr. Fauci, when is the time?
Dr. Fauci. Sorry?
Mr. Jordan. When is the time?
Dr. Fauci. When is the time? I am not sure what you are----
Mr. Jordan. Well, in your written statement you say now is
not the time to pull back on masking, physical distancing, and
avoiding congregant settings. When is the time? When do
Americans get their freedom back? Can you put your microphone
on, please?
Dr. Fauci. When we get the level of infection in this
country low enough that it is not a really high----
Mr. Jordan. What is low enough? Give me a number. I mean,
we had 15 days to slow the spread turned into one year of lost
liberty. What metrics, what measures, what has to happen before
Americans get more freedoms?
Dr. Fauci. My message, Congressman Jordan, is to get as
many people vaccinated as quickly as we possibly can to get the
level of infection in this country low that it is no longer a
threat. That is when, and I believe when that happens you will
see----
Mr. Jordan. What determines when?
Dr. Fauci. I am sorry----
Mr. Jordan. What? What measure? I mean, are we just going
to continue this forever? When does--when does--when do we get
to the point? What measure?
What standard? What objective outcome do we have to reach
before--before Americans get their liberty and freedoms back?
Dr. Fauci. You know, you are--you are indicating liberty
and freedom. I look at it as a public health measure to prevent
people from dying and going to the hospital.
Mr. Jordan. You don't think Americans' liberties have been
threatened the last year, Dr. Fauci? They have been assaulted,
their liberties have.
Dr. Fauci. I don't look at this as a liberty thing,
Congressman Jordan. I look at this----
Mr. Jordan. Well, that is obvious.
Dr. Fauci [continuing]. As a public health thing.
Mr. Jordan. But the----
Dr. Fauci. I disagree with you on that complete----
Mr. Jordan. Do you think the Constitution is suspended
during a--during a virus, during a pandemic? It is certainly
not.
Dr. Fauci. This will end for sure when we get the level of
infection very low. It is now at such a high level there is a
threat again of major surge----
Mr. Jordan. Dr. Fauci--Dr. Fauci, over the last year,
Americans' First Amendment rights have been completely
attacked. Your right to go to church, your right to assemble,
your right to petition your government, freedom of the press,
freedom of speech, have all been assaulted.
I mean, for a year now Americans haven't been able to go to
church. Even today, when they go to church they are limited in
the size of worshipers who can meet. Your right to assemble?
Oh, my goodness. We had a curfew last fall in Ohio. You had to
be in your home at 10.
In Pennsylvania, had to be in your home. When you are in
your home, you had to wear a mask. In Vermont, when you are in
your home you didn't have to wear a mask, Dr. Fauci, because
you weren't allowed to have people over to your house.
Dr. Fauci. Yes. Congressman Jordan----
Mr. Jordan. Your ability to petition your government----
Dr. Fauci. Well----
Mr. Jordan. For a year--for a year American citizens
haven't been able to come to their Capitol to petition their
government, to talk to their representatives.
And freedom of the press, these very pictures that
Representative Scalise just showed you and talked about, guess
what? The press isn't allowed in those facilities. The press is
not, and the Biden administration will not let the press in
there.
And, certainly, freedom of speech--I mean, freedom of--the
governor of our third largest state meets with physicians and
that--and that video is censored because they dare to disagree
with Dr. Fauci.
So, I just want to know when do Americans get their First
Amendment liberties back.
Dr. Fauci. You know, I don't think anything was censored
because they felt they couldn't disagree with me. I think you
are--you are making this a personal thing, and it isn't.
Mr. Jordan. It is not a personal thing.
Dr. Fauci. No, you are. That is exactly what you are doing.
Mr. Jordan. No, your recommendations carry a lot of weight,
Dr. Fauci. We just had the chair of the Financial Services
Committee said she loves you and you are the greatest thing in
the world.
Dr. Fauci. My recommendations are consistent----
Ms. Waters. Will the gentleman yield? Will the gentleman
yield?
Mr. Jordan. No, it is my--it is my time.
Dr. Fauci. Now, could I answer the question, please?
My recommendations are not a personal recommendation. It is
based on the CDC guidance, which is--which is underscored----
Mr. Jordan. And I am asking the question what measures have
to be attained before Americans get their First Amendment
liberties back?
Dr. Fauci. I just told you that. I told you----
Mr. Jordan. No, you haven't given anything specific. You
said we hope when this--tell me a specific----
Dr. Fauci. Right now--right now we have about 60,000
infections a day, which is a very large risk for a surge. We
are not talking about liberties. We are talking about a
pandemic that has killed 560,000 Americans. That is what we are
talking about.
Mr. Jordan. And I get that, Dr.--and I don't disagree with
that and I understand how serious that is. But I also
understand it is pretty serious when businesses have been shut
down.
People can't go to church. People can't assemble in their
own homes with their friends, with their families. People can't
go to a loved one's funeral. People can't get to their
government, petition their representative to redress their
grievances.
Dr. Fauci. Right.
Mr. Jordan. I also understand the First Amendment is pretty
darn important and it is been a year, and I want to know when
Americans will get those First Amendment liberties back.
Dr. Fauci. Well, you just said people cannot assemble in
their own homes. They can. That is a CDC recommendation for
vaccinating----
Mr. Jordan. Not last fall they couldn't.
Dr. Fauci. I didn't hear that.
Mr. Jordan. Not last fall they couldn't.
Dr. Fauci. I didn't hear what he said.
Chairman Clyburn. The gentleman's time has expired. I will
tell you one instance of when we can get our liberties back. It
is when 90 percent of the members of the U.S. Congress get
vaccinated.
Mr. Jordan. Well, I want to know if that is what Dr.
Fauci--is it 90 percent, Dr. Fauci?
Chairman Clyburn. That is what I am----
Mr. Jordan. Is it 90 percent? That is what I am--that is
what I would like to know. Give us some--give us some objective
standards versus when certain things get reached we might be
able to get back to having our liberty. When? What are the
numbers?
Chairman Clyburn. Well----
Dr. Fauci. You are going to see a gradual from the--right
now we are at an unacceptably high level. We are at--on a daily
basis it is unacceptably high, regardless of who you are.
What you are going to see as more and more people get
vaccinated and we get over 3 million people a day, you are
going to see the level of infection come down and down, and
gradually there will be more flexibility for doing the things
that you are talking about.
Mr. Jordan. Where does it get to? When it comes down--what
number do we get our liberties back? Tell me the number. Tell
me the number.
Chairman Clyburn. When 90 percent of the Members of
Congress get vaccinated.
Mr. Jordan. But you are not a doctor, Mr. Clyburn. He is.
What is the number?
Dr. Fauci. I can't give----
Mrs. Maloney. Thank you for recognizing me, Mr. Clyburn.
Thank you----
Chairman Clyburn. The chair now recognizes, for five
minutes, Mrs. Maloney.
Mr. Jordan. I would like my question answered. I don't--I
don't want--I don't----
Mrs. Maloney. Reclaiming my time. Reclaiming my time.
Ms. Waters. Regular order. Regular order.
Mr. Jordan. No----
Chairman Clyburn. Just a moment.
Mr. Jordan. Mr. Chairman--Mr. Chairman, I don't want you to
answer my question. The American people want Dr. Fauci to
answer the question.
Chairman Clyburn. Well----
Mr. Jordan. What does it have to be?
Mrs. Maloney. The time expired, sir.
Ms. Waters. You need to respect the chair and shut your
mouth.
Chairman Clyburn. Don't worry about this. We are going to
handle this, and I think Mr. Jordan knows me very well. He
knows full well that we are going to handle this.
Your time has expired and the chair now recognizes Mrs.
Maloney.
Mr. Jordan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mrs. Maloney. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for calling this
important hearing and I thank all of the panelists for their
dedication to public health and their being here with us today.
I would like to ask--well, first, I would like to thank Dr.
Fauci for serving, what is it, seven presidents? Selflessly
trying to find answers to save people's lives.
In my district, we call you America's doctor because you
have selflessly worked to help the American people, and I want
to thank you for always telling the American people the truth
even when it is very difficult to hear, and it is not what we
want to hear.
But you tell us the truth, and you testified before the
Oversight Committee back in March 2020, sitting at the same
table, and I asked you, is it going to get better or worse and
you testified it was going to get worse, and, tragically, you
were right.
Back then, in March, there were fewer than 50 known
coronavirus deaths in the United States. And as of today, we
have lost more than 560,000 Americans, more than any other
country on Earth.
And I am going to ask the same question. What is your
assessment today? Is it going to get worse or have we finally
turned the corner? Is it going to start moving in the direction
we want it to go?
Dr. Fauci. We are at a crossroads right now, Congresswoman
Maloney. We are doing very well with regard to the rollout of
vaccines and, yet, we are seeing in the country that there are
several states in which the numbers are going up.
When we had the big peak in the winter, during the holidays
and beyond, then it came down. We would have liked to see it go
all the way down to a very, very low level.
Arbitrarily, we don't know what that number is, probably
less than 10,000 per day. Right now, it is up at a high enough
level that, in fact, if you look at the weekly average it is
starting to creep up.
So, as I said in my last slide, we are at a critical
turning point. Every day, we get better and better at being
able to control it because every day 3 to 4 million people get
vaccinated.
So, if we can get more and more people vaccinated, we
almost certainly are going to be able to blunt an increase that
is a sharp surge in the virus. So, when you say when, it is
very critical now, which is the reason why every one of us,
including the chairman, is saying let us get as many people
vaccinated as quickly as we possibly can.
That is the solution. If we do that successfully, then we
will turn that corner. But we are right at that critical point
right now, which is the reason why vaccination is so important.
Mrs. Maloney. Well, that is the top priority of President
Biden and I believe is the top priority of every Democrat and
probably every person in America to get people vaccinated.
The World Health Organization declared the coronavirus a
global pandemic on March 11, 2020, the very same day that you
testified before the committee, and I want to know when do you
think the designation of a pandemic will be changed and no
longer be considered a pandemic?
Dr. Fauci. Well, there are multiple definitions for
pandemic. The one that is most commonly used is an outbreak of
a disease, of an infectious disease, that is highly
transmissible and involves multiple regions of the world
simultaneously.
You can have an outbreak in one place. Like right now, they
are having a mini epidemic of Ebola in countries in Africa.
That is not a pandemic by any means because it is no place
else.
But if you look at the map of the world, you have now over
120 countries that have this disease. So,``pan'' means all.
When you get it down to the point where it is restricted maybe
to very few places, and you have countries, hopefully, the
United States, hopefully, a lot of other countries in the
world, are free of this, then it is no longer a pandemic. That
is what we mean by pandemic.
Mrs. Maloney. And what are the key steps we have to take to
make that happen faster, hopefully, besides vaccinations? Do we
have anything----
Dr. Fauci. Well, there are a couple of things. There are a
couple of things that can do. One is until you get people fully
vaccinated and get it under control where it is no longer a
threat, it is the public health measures that we talk about
almost every single day. The wearing of masks, the physical
distancing, the avoiding congregate settings, the washing of
hands.
When the vaccine protection takes over, then you could have
a gradual diminution of those types of guideline restrictions,
which everyone would like to get rid of, not only Congressman
Jordan.
Mrs. Maloney. Well, my time has expired.
Mr. Chairman, if we could submit questions to the record. I
have other questions for the panelists.
Thank you.
Mr. Jordan. Mr. Chairman, just a question. Mr. Chairman?
Chairman Clyburn. Yes, sir.
Mr. Jordan. So earlier, you said--I just want to make sure
we, the committee, heard you right. You said Americans get
their First Amendment rights back when 90 percent of Congress
gets vaccinated. Is that what you said?
Chairman Clyburn. No.
Mr. Jordan. OK. What did you say?
Chairman Clyburn. I said we will get back to the number you
request. We will get our liberties back to do what we wish when
90 percent of the Members of Congress demonstrate to the
American people that we will all be getting vaccinated. That is
what will drive this down, vaccinations.
Mr. Jordan. So, 90 percent of Congress gets vaccinated and
Americans get their liberties back?
Chairman Clyburn. In my opinion.
Mr. Jordan. OK.
Chairman Clyburn. In my opinion.
Mr. Raskin. Mr. Chairman, a point of order. A point of
order, Mr. Chairman. Can any member ask questions of the
chairman----
Chairman Clyburn. The chair now recognizes for five minutes
Dr. Green.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and ranking member, and
thank you to our witnesses.
I recently visited our southern border to see the
conditions on the ground for myself and what I found was a
crisis spiraling out of control.
As a physician, I focused my time looking at the care given
and the public health conditions as well as the threats to U.S.
health posed by the failure of this administration to act and I
would like to share what I thought were three startling
observations related to COVID.
First, a mass exodus of people after Biden canceled the
asylum agreements has filled facilities to grotesque levels. In
one pod built for 33, I saw 621 young girls crammed into that
space stacked nearly on top of one another.
They can't test for COVID so it only occasionally happens
when they are turned over to the NGO's, and in that rate or in
that group the positivity rate is 10 percent, and that means
thousands and thousands of COVID-positive immigrants are being
released into the U.S. monthly.
Churches in several states still can't fully open, but the
left seems completely fine with COVID incubators blasting
positive patients into our population. If this committee fails
to address this, this committee has no credibility whatsoever.
Second, there is no vaccination assessments going on at
all, and with many indigenous peoples coming through the border
from Northern Triangle countries where vaccinations for things
as rudimentary as measles is not confirmed, Americans are at
risk for another massive health crisis.
This administration's failure to ensure the American people
are protected from this threat is an egregious violation of
their oaths.
Third, COVID variants. Right now, the U.S. doesn't have a
huge problem with mutated variants of the COVID virus. There
are some present. It is not a huge problem.
While I was on the border, I met with family after family
coming from Brazil. Brazil has a particularly nasty variant
and, again, with no screening we simply have no idea how much
of the positive patients are bringing COVID variants into our
country.
What do the members of this Select Committee on the
opposite side of the aisle got to say about that? Crickets.
There are a few more points that I want to make about public
health in regards to this horrendous crisis caused by the Biden
administration's failure.
First, illicit drugs kill tens of thousands of Americans
every year. Much of the heroin and fentanyl coming into the
United States crosses our southern border, and while what we
are able to catch comes through checkpoints for the most part,
the volume bypassing those checkpoints during this crisis has
skyrocketed.
What they have seized since the president's executive
orders opened our border has been an 800 percent increase.
While we are there--while we were there, multiple splash and
grabs happened.
That is where the cartels just drive a dope-filled car into
the river and the mules on our side go across with rafts and
grab the drugs. Pounds of fentanyl was seized, not by Border
Patrol agents but by Texas State Guardsmen.
But they are not enough, and we know drugs, gang members,
and guns are bypassing agents consumed with handling the mass
sea of humanity pouring in. The agents are so overwhelmed the
actual screenings to determine if a migrant is a drug
trafficker are no longer done by law enforcement. We are paying
NGO's to do it.
Americans will suffer because of these criminals, and
Biden--and Biden sits quietly by letting it happen. This is a
gross dereliction of duty and, again, Americans will suffer
because of his and Vice President Harris' failures.
One last point. Currently, there is no DNA testing of those
claiming to be families. We know how the cartels work. The
Guatemalan ambassador told me they seize children, carry them
across the border as a ticket into the United States. In some
cases, when they get across the border they just dump the
children.
It is hard to believe except there is video after video
showing it happening. Cartel members are claiming children and
simply walking into the U.S. as fraudulent families.
Essentially, by not testing these people we are encouraging
human trafficking.
Think about that. The Biden administration is facilitating
human trafficking. Again, this is an egregious failure because
they know it is happening and yet they do nothing. It is
appalling. This is what we get with an open border.
Americans are being infected with a deadly virus,
potentially other pathogens. Coronavirus variants are pouring
into the U.S. More Americans will die from drug overdose and
more children and women are being trafficked and raped, and
Biden and Harris sit in D.C. with no plans to visit the border
and no solutions to offer.
Anyone who attempts to cover this up by deflecting to B.S.
accusations that this is Trump's fault are complicit in these
crimes.
With a nauseated stomach at this point by the failures of
our president, I yield.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentleman from yielding back
from that tirade. The chair now recognizes Ms. Velazquez for
five minutes.
Ms. Velazquez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
In the name of liberty and freedom, you know, I just would
like to discuss with Dr. Fauci we have over 500,000 people that
died, and the truth matters here. Because President Trump talk
about fake virus, that it will disappear by magic. Then when we
have the vaccine, the infrastructure wasn't there to make sure
the people have been getting the vaccination.
So, obviously, elections have consequences, and we can
start discussing the fact that today more than 120 million
Americans, roughly, a third of the population, have received at
least one vaccine dose.
Dr. Fauci, what are we doing today that that we didn't do,
that the previous administration didn't do, in getting the
vaccination in people's arms?
Dr. Fauci. Well, there has been a major effort to
facilitate the distribution of vaccines that have multiple
components to it. One is to get community vaccine centers,
including in those areas that generally are underserved with
minorities.
Keeping equity is an important issue. Getting federally
qualified health centers involved, getting pharmacies to play a
major role in the distribution of vaccines, including
pharmacies in those areas where the demography shows that we
have minorities who are in need of a vaccine, to use mobile
units as well as to get vaccinators, namely, people to put
vaccine in the arms of individuals, and that includes the
military, that includes retired healthcare providers such as
doctors, nurses and others.
So,there really has been a full-blown effort to try and get
as many vaccines into as many people as we possibly can as
quickly as we can, also, to address the issue of vaccine
hesitancy, and the CDC has been given $3 billion to facilitate
that. Maybe I could get Dr. Walensky to address there.
Ms. Velazquez. Sure.
Dr. Fauci. The CDC is playing a very important role in this
distribution issue.
Ms. Velazquez. And we have seen a higher percentage rate of
African Americans' willingness to get vaccinated.
Dr. Walensky. Yes. I want to acknowledge that we are
working on this and we have more work to do. We know that there
is 12 percent of Americans that are African American. Only
eight percent of the vaccine has gone to them.
We know that there is 19 percent of Americans that are--who
are Hispanic and only nine percent of vaccine has gone to them.
We saw some of the crowding out of people who are mobilizing to
places where we intentionally put vaccine in high SVI areas and
they were crowded out by other people. People traveled far to
get vaccine.
Right now, we have vaccine in 29,000 pharmacies with the
goal of having vaccine within five miles of every single
American-owned pharmacies. We are putting our community
vaccination sites within high SVI regions and we are reaching
out to the federally qualified health care centers in
collaboration with HRSA.
Ms. Velazquez. Thank you.
Dr. Kessler, I will turn to you. As the leader of a vaccine
development efforts, what are you doing to prepare for the
potential spread of variants, especially those that may be more
contagious or resistant to vaccines?
Dr. Kessler. It is a very important question,
Congresswoman. We are studying--we are monitoring the efficacy
of the current vaccines against these variants. As my
colleagues, I am sure, will join in, luckily, against these
variants we are seeing clinical evidence of strong efficacy.
Even though these current vaccines work against these
variants, we are taking steps to develop the next generation of
vaccines that are directed against these variants if, in fact,
they could be more effective.
Ms. Velazquez. I would like to ask this question because I
know that it is in people's mind, at least I am asking myself.
Should we expect to need vaccine boosters in the coming months?
Dr. Kessler. Again, a very important question and the
answer is we don't know everything at this moment. We are
studying the durability of the antibody response. It seems
strong. But there is some waning of that, and no doubt that the
variants challenge, right--I mean, they make these vaccines, in
essence, work harder.
So, I think that for planning purposes, and planning
purposes only because there is no decision, I think we should
expect that we may have to boost and probably have to boost
again. No decision, but the current thinking is that,
certainly, those who are more vulnerable may have to go first.
But I think you have--with many vaccines, we understand
that at a certain point in time we need to boost, whether that
is 9 months, 12 months, and we are preparing for that time.
Ms. Velazquez. Thank you. I yield back.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much.
The chair now recognizes for five minutes, Ms. Miller-
Meeks.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
As a physician and a former director of the Iowa Department
of Public Health, I have a variety of questions that I could
ask, which would take longer than five minutes. So, some of
them I would like you to answer very briefly.
So, there is a traditional definition of herd immunity.
Herd immunity comes about by having naturalized immunity from
contracting a disease and/or vaccination.
So, Dr. Kessler, what is the level of herd immunity, to
your understanding? Please, very brief.
Dr. Kessler. What is the----
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Well, at what level of the population has
to be--has to have immunity for us to have herd immunity and
protection? Is that 50 percent? Is that 60 percent? I just want
a number.
Dr. Kessler. Congresswoman, no one knows. In my view, I
don't know the exact number. I can give you estimates of what I
think will bring down the numbers that----
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Dr. Fauci?
Dr. Fauci. You are asking me?
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Yes, sir.
Dr. Fauci. We don't know that for this particular
infection. We know it for other----
Ms. Miller-Meeks. What is typically considered traditional
letter in public health for herd immunity? When we talk about
measles, when we talk about any other disease?
Dr. Fauci. Well, measles, it is--it is 90 percent. You get
below that you start getting into trouble.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. And but that----
Dr. Fauci. But herd immunity is due to a number of things.
You have to worry about, A, the combination of the vaccine
plus----
Ms. Miller-Meeks. I understand. Dr. Walensky, I just wanted
a brief--because that goes to part of the question when do we
get out of this.
Dr. Fauci. OK.
Dr. Walensky. The epidemiologic term of herd immunity is 1
minus 1/Rt. Rt for this virus is somewhere between two and
three. But we know with variants that that Rt is changing over
time, increased transmissibility.
So, in fact, I think it is changing, given the variants.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. OK. Thank you very much.
So, the reason I asked that question is that you have said
that were--between vaccinating as many people as quickly and as
expeditiously as possible as we have the emergence of new
variants.
As a member of the Doctors Caucus, we submitted a letter to
the FDA that the FDA use real-world evidence that we have
gained from Israel and the U.K. in elongating the--between the
prime dose and the secondary dose for the Pfizer and the
Moderna vaccine.
This would enable us to get as many people possible
vaccinated with the prime dose and then within a 12-week span
get their second dose. This is especially important as we are
opening up to young adults and children.
So, 16-to 17-year-olds have then emergencies authorization
approved for Pfizer, and we know 12-to 15-year-olds, as
published recently, have 100 percent effectiveness.
So, now that we have a vaccine that has gone on to pause,
would you be supportive of asking the FDA to use real-world
evidence in order to increase the duration between the first
and second dose of Pfizer and Moderna so we can get more people
vaccinated?
Dr. Kessler, yes or no?
Dr. Kessler. I think it is more complicated than a yes or
no, Congresswoman.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. OK. Dr. Fauci?
Dr. Fauci. Same thing. It is a complicated issue.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Dr. Walensky?
Dr. Walensky. It is complicated.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. OK. I am glad to see you all putting your
medical information and real-world evidence on the line to
answer that question when we are trying to get as many people
vaccinated as possible as rapidly as possible.
Earlier this week, I made a second trip down to the border,
and I can tell you firsthand that the number of migrants
crossing constitutes a crisis, and we all know that the COVID-
19 pandemic is not over.
I saw migrants apprehended at 11 p.m. at night, who, on the
next day, were on planes with Members of Congress. Not that it
matters if you are a Member of Congress, but just meaning we
saw them so we know that this is real. And these migrants are
flying all over the country.
I had specifically authored and put forward a bill that all
migrants be tested at the Central Processing Facility.
Dr. Fauci, do you think all migrants crossing our borders
from any borders should be tested for COVID-19 before entering
this country or being sent to other places within our country?
Dr. Fauci. Ideally, that would be the case.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. OK.
Dr. Walensky, what are the requirements for U.S. citizens
returning home from overseas? Do they have to show proof of a
negative test before entering and what kind of negative test?
Dr. Walensky. They have to show proof of a negative test or
having had disease within the prior three months to enter by
air.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. OK. Are any of you aware of what kind of
tests migrants are given and when they are given tests?
Dr. Walensky. Testing is occurring as they leave CBP on the
way to OR facilities.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. So, typically, testing is at--they are in
facility so they have been in a--the Central Processing
Facility, transiting, and then sent to a community either by
air or by bus to another community, and then having testing.
So, again, I would say, do you recommend that migrants have
testing at the border? And if so, will you put forth that
recommendation?
Dr. Kessler?
Dr. Kessler. Certainly, will yield to my colleagues. It
is----
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Dr. Fauci?
Dr. Fauci. Ideal conditions you would want to get testing
at the border. Yes.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Dr. Walensky?
Dr. Walensky. We are working to get testing and vaccines at
the border for people, eligible workers as well as people who
are eligible.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. I would, certainly, appreciate your
support for my bill to test migrants at the border.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I yield back my time.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentlelady for yielding back.
The chair now recognizes Mr. Foster for five minutes.
Mr. Foster. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Dr. Kessler, I would like to ask a little bit about the
sort of the level of detail, the planning, for in case we need
boosters for variants or so on.
Do we have manufacturing capability reserved for the major
candidate vaccines? Because--or is that manufacturing capacity
when the U.S. gets its first vaccine, is that now being
dedicated and contracted to providing vaccines for the rest of
the world?
Dr. Kessler. It is an excellent question, Congressman.
We are in discussions right now, making sure that we can
secure those vaccines for boost or variants. We are in that
process right now.
Mr. Foster. All right. So, but at this point, there is
not--there are not contracts in place that guarantee that we
will have access if we do need, you know, a significant effort
for a third dose for Americans?
Dr. Kessler. Yes.
Mr. Foster. OK. Yes, if you can keep us posted on that. We
have very effective interface through the GAO, who is Congress'
typical, you know, interface to the Oversight.
And so just letting them see the project management plans
for those sort of contingencies, I think, would be very
valuable. Representative Green and I have had really good
results working through them and I urge you to continue and
strengthen all your collaboration with them.
Dr. Kessler. We would be happy to do so, sir.
Mr. Foster. Yes.
Let us see. Another question involves the effort toward
therapeutics. You know, I am--I am concerned that not enough
attention may have been placed on the need for therapeutics and
the need to continue, you know, approving new COVID treatments.
The therapeutics, they may become increasingly important as
the--as the virus pandemic disappears and we are now dealing
with occasional flare ups. I was rather disappointed, you know,
that the--although the antibody therapeutics seemed to work
pretty well, we didn't really have in place, you know, the mass
treatment centers to use them, and so these quite effective
medicines ended up sitting on a shelf.
Can you say anything, I guess, Dr. Kessler, about what the
plans are, going forward, to make sure that not only do we have
the therapeutics but they actually can get to the patients who
need them?
Dr. Kessler. Again, an excellent question. Over the last
month, we have stepped up our efforts to provide the monoclonal
antibodies directly because for those who test positive, early
stage of the disease but at high risk, monoclonal--the
administration of monoclonal antibodies can save lives.
Dr. Fauci and I are working on stepping up a program for
increased antiviral drug discovery. That is going to be
absolutely critical. We need better molecules and small-
molecule therapies, especially there are going to be certain
people for whom the vaccine does not provide protection, and we
are going to need to offer that.
So, we have to develop better antiviral therapies.
Mr. Foster. Dr. Walensky, can you say a little bit about
the monitoring of, I think, what are called vaccine
breakthrough events?
That when someone, you know, gets sick despite being
vaccinated. You know, what level of surveillance is going into
that right now and--yes.
Dr. Walensky. Thank you for that question.
Mr. Foster. It is important.
Dr. Walensky. Indeed, and, in fact, just this morning, we
announced where we are. Seventy-seven million people
vaccinated, 5,300 breakthrough infections that we--or 5,800, I
am sorry, that we are aware of, 396 of whom were hospitalized
and there have been 74 deaths.
So, we are keeping a close eye on this. We are reaching out
to all of our state health officials as well as to our
hospitals to make sure that people who are identified as a
breakthrough infection we can--we can--and defined as two weeks
after your second dose or you are two weeks after your final
dose, so that we can identify the cases that we are having.
Mr. Foster. And do you collect more detailed information on
the--you know, the genetics, just everything about those
breakthrough patients?
Dr. Walensky. Yes, and we are partnering with academic
institutions as well. Not all of these can be sequenced. But we
would like to make sure that some of these are sequenced.
Some of these breakthroughs are, of course, failure of an
immune response in the host, and then some of them we worry
might be related to a variant in--that is circulating. So, we
are looking at both.
Mr. Foster. Well, I am glad you are on the case, and I
yield back.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentleman for yielding back.
The chair now recognizes Ms. Malliotakis for five minutes.
Ms. Malliotakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all to
the doctors for being here today and sharing your wisdom with
us and giving us an update on what is happening.
You know, I wanted to talk about just, really, with you
about some of the hypocrisy and double standards that we are
seeing.
Because, Dr. Fauci, you said it--you know, your
recommendations are consistent. Some of the policies that we
are seeing coming out of, you know, this administration or some
of the leaders on the local and state levels, really, is a
double standard.
So, for example, you know, I wanted to ask you your
thoughts on the--on the U.S.-Canada border remaining closed.
And this is something that is having an economic impact.
No nonessential travel is having a impact on families that
want to vacation as well, and then we see the southern border
being completely wide open.
And I wanted to see if you thought that was an
inconsistency and that we should be consistently moving
forward. This is a decision that is going to be revisited next
week. So, I wanted to know what your thoughts are on keeping
the northern border closed.
Dr. Fauci. Congresswoman, I am not an expert on border
controls, but it is very clear that the situation at the
southern border is really, really profoundly different than the
situation that I can see.
Just as a private citizen looking at it, not as a medical
person but just looking at the need to get into the country
from the individuals who are coming from a variety of other
countries using Mexico as a gateway to get in versus the
situation in Canada.
It is really, clearly, very, very different.
Ms. Malliotakis. But they are citing public health as a
reason to keep the northern border closed. So, my question is,
you know, individuals flowing from 60 different countries not
being tested, perhaps bringing in variants, that should be, I
think, a concern and I would just recommend that, you know, we
have some consistency in this policy, moving forward. It is
either a public health crisis or it is not, and that is just,
like, one of the things I wanted to, you know, bring up today.
And I think the other thing is, you know, my colleague
really made a good point in describing the situation at these
facilities, and I was there along with him in this trip and
when you see how these facilities--COVID capacity of 250, you
have 4,000 individuals, and then you come to New York City and
you are telling--maybe not you, maybe it is our mayor--telling
us that we cannot have kids in school five days a week.
Just it is that type of double standard, the fact that
these facilities could be at 900 percent capacity and my local
restaurants are at a 50 percent capacity and they are
struggling to keep their doors open.
That is the type of inconsistency and the double standards
that we are seeing from our leadership, whether that be
national, state, or local.
In my case, it is--a lot of it is local. And, you know, the
president did say he wants to open our schools within the first
100 days of his administration. That is approaching.
That is approaching in the next week or two. And we still
don't see that there is any plan, despite the fact that we gave
the money. In the December CARES package the money was put in.
The CDC recommended, saying it was going to be a $28
billion dollar estimated cost. They put in $64 billion and the
schools are still not open. New York has received $4 billion of
that money.
So, I would just--you know, since you meet with the
president regularly, I would just bring up some of these
inconsistencies and double standards that we are seeing, and
say that if we want people to follow these rules and these
guidelines, they need to be consistent and they need to be
fair.
Any comment? I would appreciate that.
Dr. Walensky. On February 12, we released our initial
guidance in this administration on getting schools open
February 19.
We updated those guidance based on updated science, and for
all levels of community transmission the guidance recommends
full in time in-person learning five days a week.
There are some restrictions and high levels of transmission
in high school students if they are not able to maintain six
feet apart. But for the most part, this was a guidance and an
operational plan to open schools.
Ms. Malliotakis. Well, I hope you can share that with Mayor
de Blasio. Thank you.
Chairman Clyburn. Does the gentlelady yield back?
Ms. Malliotakis. I am done for this round. Thank you.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you for yielding back.
The chair now recognizes Mr. Raskin for five minutes.
Mr. Raskin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Dr. Brooks, who was Donald Trump's coronavirus response
coordinator in his administration, just told America that
hundreds of thousands of COVID deaths of Americans could have
been prevented by the Trump administration had it acted more
forcefully and effectively to counter the disease rather than
denying it and diminishing it and trivializing it.
It would take a week to describe all of the lethal failures
of the Trump administration and his congressional enablers in
the coronavirus response. Let us take this one. Scientists all
over the world were shocked when some of Trump's top political
advisors were openly pushing for a herd immunity strategy to
deal with the coronavirus.
And last year, I asked his HHS secretary about this and he
assured us that herd immunity was not the official strategy of
the government with respect to corona.
But just days later, he went to a private meeting with
three major advocates of the herd immunity strategy, and the
subcommittee revealed emails showing that a Trump appointee
stated, and I quote it--please put this up if you would, Mr.
Chairman--``We need to establish herd. Infants, kids, teens,
young people, young adults, middle-aged with no conditions have
zero to little risk. So, we use them to develop herd. We want
them infected. We want them infected.''
Dr. Fauci, in your expert opinion, is deliberately exposing
Americans to infect them with the coronavirus a sound public
health strategy?
Are there any categories of Americans named by this Trump
appointee that we want to see infected--infants, kids, teens,
young people, middle aged?
Chairman Clyburn. Your mic is not on.
Dr. Fauci. As I have mentioned many times in different
committee hearings, the best way to get protection of the
community is to vaccinate them, and I had great concerns about
essentially letting people get infected for the purpose of
getting enough immunity in the community to then get to this
elusive terminology of herd immunity.
The best way, and repeat it--we are all saying the same
thing--is to get as many people vaccinated as quickly as you
possibly can, and before all of them are vaccinated to protect
everyone from getting infected by the implementation of the
public health measures that we talk about all the time--the
mask wearing, the physical distance, and the avoiding of
congregate settings.
Mr. Raskin. Dr. Kessler, at one point Donald Trump, trying
to invoke his herd immunity theory, accidentally called it herd
mentality and it was a telling Freudian slip because it is, in
fact, a herd political mentality which has enabled these
dangerous anti-scientific dogmas.
To what extent is anti-scientific conspiracy theory and
propaganda a threat to our ability to crush the virus or,
indeed, to counter any of the public health problems facing us
today, whether it is climate change or gun violence or anything
else? Is a political herd mentality trying to overrun
scientific findings and data a problem for us?
Dr. Kessler. Congressman, I think your point is probably
the one that gives me the greatest pause. I think the greatest
risk right now is the issue of vaccine hesitancy.
I think over the next several weeks, we are going to have
more supply. Twenty-eight million doses a week we are putting
out, and I think demand is going to decrease versus what we see
today, and I think that is a result of vaccine hesitancy and I
think we need to confront that directly.
I think--and I don't think we can just put it aside. I
think we have to realize that it is very real. There are those
who distrust the healthcare system, there are those who
distrust government, and I think we need to address that head
on.
I am enormously pleased to be sitting here with all the
debate that has gone on around. What I heard from the chair and
the ranking member and from everyone here, I assume this is
correct. But we really need to encourage all our fellow
citizens to get vaccinated, because while we don't know----
Mr. Raskin. And do you believe, Dr. Kessler, if 100 percent
of Members of Congress were vaccinated that that would send a
positive signal to the population?
Dr. Kessler. Yes.
Mr. Raskin. My time is up. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield
back.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much.
The chair now recognizes Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Is he here?
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you.
Chairman Clyburn. Oh, I am looking for you to be visual.
Thank you so much for being in person today.
[Laughter.]
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you so
much for your service to our country. Thank you for being here
today.
Dr. Fauci, on April 13, Fox News host Tucker Carlson talked
about the effectiveness of vaccines on his primetime show, and
he said, quote, ``Maybe it doesn't work and they are not
telling you that,'' close quote. On April 14, yesterday, during
the day on CNN, you called Carlson's statements, quote/unquote,
``A crazy conspiracy theory.''
Last night, Mr. Carlson responded to you, saying it is not
a conspiracy theory. He said, referring to vaccine, quote, ``If
this stuff works, why can't you live like it works? Why are you
wearing a mask?''
Well, what is the answer, Dr. Fauci?
Dr. Fauci. The vaccine trials that were done that showed
the high degree, 94-95 percent efficacy, the primary endpoint
of the vaccine efficacy was to prevent clinically relevant
disease--clinically recognizable disease.
What we don't know right now but we will know as we gather
more information that you can get infected even though you have
been vaccinated, and because you are vaccinated have no
symptoms.
And, therefore, you could have virus in your nasal pharynx
and you could then transmit it inadvertently to somebody else.
You are vaccinated. You are protected. You are not getting
sick.
So, the wearing of the mask is predominantly--predominantly
to prevent you inadvertently infecting someone else, even
though you are protected from disease by the vaccine.
As we learn more and more, which we will, and the evidence
gets better and better that a vaccinated person has a much
lesser chance of getting infected asymptomatically and even if
they do the virus is very likely very low in the nasal pharynx,
when those data become clear, the CDC, being a science-based
organization, will use that scientific data to say now a
vaccinated person can actually walk around without a mask.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Got it. So, basically----
Dr. Fauci. There is another issue also. One other thing,
sir. Let me say----
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Yes. Go ahead.
Dr. Fauci [continuing]. What is important is that there are
variants that are circulating, too, and we want to make sure
that if you have full protection against one type of a virus
that a variant might come along that might escape the
protection.
So, if you want full protection and you are out in the
community where there is a lot of virus out there, that is why
we still recommend wearing a mask.
And in answer to a question before, when you get the level
of virus really low all of that is going to go away, and you
are not going to have any--very, very little risk. Therefore,
people will not have to wear masks.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Got it.
Let me show you this chart, Dr. Fauci. It is of the United
States. It is a map created by the CDC. Basically, what it does
is it shows the highest incidence of COVID since the start of
the pandemic. The darkest blue is where COVID rates were the
highest per 100,000 residents. There are four in the middle of
the country--North Dakota, South Dakota, Utah, and Tennessee.
I want to direct your attention to South Dakota for one
moment. The governor of that state is a woman named Kristi
Noem. Governor Noem said the following: ``We never instituted a
shelter in place order. We never mandated that people wear
masks. We never defined what an essential business is.''
That is what she said at something called CPAC, the
Conservative Political Action Conference, in February. And, in
fact, she invoked you during that speech and she said, ``I
don't know if you agree with me, but Dr. Fauci is wrong a
lot.'' And then you responded, saying the numbers in South
Dakota, quote/unquote, ``don't lie.''
What did you mean by that?
Dr. Fauci. Well, at the same time that the governor was
saying that, if you look at the number of hospitalizations and
deaths per population, South Dakota is way up there in that
particular category. So, I don't think that is a good track
record.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. That is not a successful administration
of COVID-19, correct?
Dr. Fauci. Excuse me?
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. That is not a successful handling of
COVID-19, correct?
Dr. Fauci. If you are using hospitalizations and deaths as
a parameter, that is not very successful.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Dr. Walensky, there was something
called the Sturgis motorcycle rally in South Dakota. Four
hundred and sixty-thousand people showed up. No one was wearing
masks.
In a CDC study in a morbidity and mortality weekly report,
it was found that 34 percent of counties in Minnesota
experienced COVID-19 cases related to the Sturgis rally.
Dr. Walensky, is it fair to say that what happened in South
Dakota with regard to not adopting restrictive measures on
COVID-19 caused deaths in Minnesota?
Dr. Walensky. We were very worried when people came to that
rally that they would get infected and bring it home. So, I
can't tell you the individuals but that was the concern at the
time.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And you can't rule out deaths in
Minnesota related to the Sturgis rally?
Dr. Walensky. No.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much.
The chair now will move to a second round of questions, and
I now recognize Mr. Scalise for five minutes.
Mr. Scalise. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And at first just--I know it has been talked about a lot on
what percentages should be or shouldn't be vaccinated. I would
not--I would push back on the suggestion that Americans only
get their liberties back if a certain percentage of Members of
Congress get vaccinated.
I would like to use the science--I am talking about medical
science now, not political science--on this.
Let us start with schools. Dr. Walensky, you have talked
about this a few times, but you were quoted as saying, quote,
``Safe reopening of schools does not suggest that teachers need
to be vaccinated in order to reopen safely,'' end quote.
CDC since put out guidance that talks about the things that
need to happen to reopen schools. It is really focused on
social distancing and wearing masks. I don't even think you all
mentioned vaccinations.
You know, and teachers should be prioritized, in most
states are prioritized for vaccinations. But the CDC guidance
doesn't mention it.
Do you still stand by the statement that you made that safe
reopening of schools does not suggest that teachers need to be
vaccinated in order to reopen?
Can you----
Dr. Walensky. ACIP recommends teacher and educator
vaccination.
Mr. Scalise. But you are the CDC director. What is your
recommendation? Do you stand by what you said?
Dr. Walensky. The CDC guidance specifically----
Mr. Scalise. Let me ask specifically about what--you said
that statement I just read. Do you still stand by that
statement, yes or no?
Dr. Walensky. I do.
Mr. Scalise. You do? OK.
And, Dr. Fauci, you have also made comments about the CDC
guidance on schools. You were asked about school re-openings
and you said, quote, ``I would back the CDC recommendations
because that is really based on data,'' and you just heard the
CDC director said that safely reopening schools should really
be conditioned upon the social distancing and on masks. Do you
stand by that as well?
I can't hear. If you can turn your microphone on, please.
Dr. Fauci. Yes.
Mr. Scalise. So, you do stand by that.
So, again, vaccinations should be available to all
teachers. Most states are doing it. Those that aren't should
prioritize teachers. But reopening schools should really be
based on that science, right. The medical science that social
distancing and mask protocols are what drives that. Is that
correct?
Dr. Fauci. Yes.
Mr. Scalise. And I would imagine you acknowledge, as I have
seen--I have seen so much medical data that shows the damage.
You know, we have talked about COVID deaths, and they are all
tragic.
We have seen a lot of other deaths in America, deaths tied
to depression because people can't go about their lives. That
is a real factor. We have seen so many young kids, millions
today that still can't go back in the classroom, not because of
medical science, because of political science that is
destroying these kids' lives.
Do you recognize that it is causing depression, drug
overdoses, drug abuse from--for kids tied to some of those
decisions?
Dr. Fauci. The psychological effects of keeping children
out of school are well known. It definitely is not something
that is favorable for children. It is much to their advantage
to be in school.
Mr. Scalise. Well, I appreciate that. And I hope that all
of the school systems across America follow the medical science
and stop this political science destruction of kids, trying to
hide behind science when, in fact, as the CDC director just
said, Dr. Fauci just said, schools absolutely should reopen.
The CDC guidance is very clear on what it takes to reopen,
and it is social distancing and masks. Follow that medical
science.
Now I want to get back to the pictures that I showed
earlier about the Donna Detention Facility. And so now you both
had a chance to see them. You both looked.
Let me just ask you, if it is a restaurant in any state. If
a restaurant is set at 250-person capacity and there is a
thousand or 4,000--4,000 people in a restaurant that is set for
250-person capacity, Dr. Fauci, would you consider that a major
concern and probably--wouldn't that restaurant be shut down?
Dr. Fauci. It would be a major concern, yes.
Mr. Scalise. So, you go to the Donna Detention Facility
today, and I was just there Friday morning, six days ago, in
Donna, Texas, at that detention facility rated for 250 people.
Border Patrol told us there were over 4,000 people, young
kids in that facility that day, six days ago. Not six feet
apart. As you can see, in most cases, six inches apart, many
without masks. Do you consider this a major concern?
Dr. Fauci. Yes.
Mr. Scalise. So, again, and I would--I would urge you,
because you have closer access to President Biden than I do, I
would--I really want President Biden to go see this. He ought
to see this. He won't see it. Vice President Harris won't see
it. You have seen it and you know what the science says, the
medical science.
Could you please urge President Biden? He can fix this
right now. There are three major things he did. The remain in
Mexico policy was working. Every Border Patrol agent tells you
that. President Biden got rid of it.
It has caused this magnet of these young people being
exploited, abused, exposed to COVID. They say at least 10
percent of COVID--of these kids are COVID positive.
If you look at these conditions and 10 percent of the
people in this room are COVID positive, do you think,
ultimately, way more than 10 percent will get COVID and then
get on an airplane without a COVID test, as they are being
done, sent around the country? Is that a major concern?
Dr. Fauci?
Dr. Fauci. Yes, that would be a major concern. Yes.
Mr. Scalise. It is happening right now. It needs to end.
President Biden can end this today. He needs to stop this
national health crisis and the super spreader COVID event that
he has created at our southern border.
I yield back.
Dr. Walensky. May I just add one thing, Representative?
And just for the record to show that our school guidance
does, in fact, speak to vaccination. We have layered mitigation
strategies. We say it is not conditional upon safe reopening of
school----
Mr. Scalise. But not conditional. The guidance, clearly--
socially distanced, wear masks to reopen schools today. Thank
you for that.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you.
The chair now wishes to accommodate the schedule of Mr.
Raskin and we are going to yield to him.
Mr. Raskin. Mr. Chairman, I am very grateful to you.
Dr. Walensky, your predecessor, Dr. Redfield, admitted
recently that he was repeatedly instructed by Trump
administration officials to pressure and change scientific
reports the data--the conclusion for recommendations.
As the new CDC director, do you think it is a danger to
public health to have political appointees from outside the
agency dictating findings and conclusions to CDC's scientists?
Dr. Walensky. I have let the American people know that the
CDC is going to be led by science and our subject matter
experts that review that science.
When I became CDC director on January 20, I asked Dr. Anne
Schuchat, my principal deputy, to review all of the guidance
that was on the CDC website related to COVID and to ensure that
it was backed by our CDC experts and our subject matter
experts.
And in that review, three pieces of guidance came down--two
had actually come down prior to my arrival, and one soon
thereafter.
Mr. Raskin. Well, I think the American people can rest
assured that we are in the hands of real science now and not
the right-wing political science being dictated by the Trump
administration.
Dr. Fauci, I want to followup on a line of questioning that
Mr. Scalise began about whether you would have major concern in
certain situations.
Donald Trump mobilized a crowd of tens of thousands of
people to stop the steal on the false allegation that he had
actually won the 2020 Presidential election.
I think this is decisive refutation in itself that people
have been able to exercise their First Amendment liberties to
assemble and speak and so on.
But then at least 800 or 900 of them went way beyond their
legitimate First Amendment liberties. They stormed the Capitol.
They broke windows. They assaulted police officers--the Capitol
police, the Metropolitan Police Department. Over 90 percent of
these people, closer to 100 percent, did not have masks on.
And do you think that this caused a super spreader event?
Because hundreds of Capitol officers and MPD officers and
others have come down with COVID-19 since the violent
insurrection unleashed against the Capitol in an attempt to
overthrow the 2020 election. Would that be a major concern for
you, too?
Dr. Fauci. You know, as I have said many times, that any
congregate setting where you have massive numbers of people who
are not wearing masks always poses a risk for a super spread
situation, regardless of where that congregation is.
Mr. Raskin. Well, these people were pressed up against each
other. They were coughing, spitting. There was tear gas in the
air. A lot of them had brought bear mace. They were assaulting
police officers face to face.
We have lots of photo footage of it. I didn't bring the
photos this time, but I will just because I know Mr. Scalise
will be extremely concerned about it when he sees the
photographs of what that mob was doing.
Would you consider that something really dangerous for
people to do, to show up without masks, to be assaulting police
officers, to be screaming, chanting, yelling, all in the
context of people also coughing and sneezing because of tear
gas, mace, and bear mace and other chemical irritants brought
by these domestic violent extremists?
Dr. Fauci. You know, as I have said, Congressman Raskin,
any kind of congregate setting where you have that type of a
circumstance where people are crowded together without masks
definitely poses a risk for a super spreader event.
Mr. Raskin. OK. Thank you.
And, Dr. Kessler, let me ask you this. The vaccines are a
remarkable triumph for science and investment and in scientific
research and development. They are a decisive refutation of all
the anti-scientific propaganda, irrationalism, magical
thinking, wishful thinking, that we saw over the last four
years.
And, yet, that same kind of anti-scientific dogma now
proves to be a blockade to our ability to make progress on a
whole host of other problems like gun violence, for example,
where there are people who don't want us to have scientific
research on gun violence as a public health epidemic, like
climate change, where there are people who are denying the
overwhelming weight of scientific consensus.
Would you speak generally to the problem of people placing
their ideological agendas above the findings of scientists?
Dr. Kessler. Congressman, there were 769 deaths yesterday,
approximately, from COVID-19. I don't know where we are going
to be in a June/July with those number of deaths.
I mean, every time we have looked at the epidemiology, we
are humbled because we can't predict the direction.
But the thing that I am absolutely certain is that if we
want to take that number of deaths down, if we want to get back
to normal, to every American, please, please be vaccinated.
Ideology, whatever your concerns, these are very safe and
effective vaccines. Let us get everyone vaccinated.
Mr. Raskin. Well, we will take that to heart, and thank you
very much, Mr. Chairman, for calling the hearing.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentleman for yielding back.
The chair now recognizes Mr. Jordan for five minutes.
Mr. Jordan. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Dr. Fauci, American citizens, some of them lost their
businesses because of lockdowns imposed due to the virus, and
we have been told for a year they can't go to church, can't go
to work, can't go to school, can't go to a loved one's funeral,
can't go to their United States Capitol to petition their
government, and if they dare speak anything that is contrary to
what you have said or CDC has said, they get censored, as
evidenced by the governor from our third largest state just
last week facing that situation.
All the while, as the ranking member, Mr. Scalise, has
pointed out, migrants enter the country illegally from 60
different countries. They are processed, put on a plane paid
for by the American taxpayers, without getting tested, flown
somewhere or bussed somewhere in the country. It just doesn't
hardly seem fair.
And so, I will go back to the question I asked the first
round. Can you give us a specific measurement that will have to
be attained, some outcome, some result that we have to reach,
so that Americans know they are going to get their liberties
back and be able to move on with their lives?
Dr. Fauci. You are asking for a number. If I have a number,
it would have to be my best estimate and that would be that the
number of infections per day are well below 10,000 per day.
At that point and up to that point, there would be a
gradual pulling back of some of the restrictions you are
talking about, particularly when people are vaccinated more and
more because it is a combination.
If you are vaccinated, you are protecting yourself, for
sure, and the more people that get vaccinated in the community
the lower the level of infection will be.
Mr. Jordan. I understand. I understand. Well, give us an
idea. I mean, look, you have given us thoughts on all kinds of
subjects. You have opined on all kinds of issues. Give us your
best guess then.
Dr. Fauci. I just did.
Mr. Jordan. No, you didn't. You didn't give us a time. When
do you think this is--are we going to be doing--are we going to
be here two years from now wearing masks and asking Dr. Fauci
the same question?
Dr. Fauci. No, I doubt--I doubt--well, let me--let me--you
are ranting again. Let me just----
Mr. Jordan. No, I am not ranting.
Dr. Fauci. Yes, you are.
Mr. Jordan. No, I--here is how it works, Dr. Fauci.
Dr. Fauci. Right.
Mr. Jordan. I get to ask you the questions. You are the
highest paid official in the U.S. Government. You have given us
your advice on baseball, on dating apps, on cruise ships. You
told us zero masks, one mask, two masks, now back to one mask.
I am just asking you, when is it going to end? You can say
I am ranting. I am actually asking the question that the
citizens I get the privilege of representing. And my name
actually goes on the ballot.
I don't think your name has ever been on a ballot. My name
goes on the ballot. The citizens I represent want to know the
answer to when they can get their liberty back.
Dr. Fauci. You know----
Mr. Jordan. You can call that ranting. I actually call it
standing up for the Constitution, which I take an oath to
uphold, Dr. Fauci, every year--every term that I serve in this
Congress representing the folks in the Fourth District of Ohio.
So, it is not ranting. It is defending the First Amendment. And
we would like an answer or your best guess, since you have got
an answer for everything else.
Dr. Fauci. Well, when we get the people in this country
vaccinated, the overwhelming majority of the people in the
country, and we project that that will very likely be sometime
in the beginning to mid of the summer.
Because as the president has said, when we get to the end
of May there will be enough vaccinations to vaccinate everybody
in the country. It will--the reason I can't give you a precise
number because I am not 100 percent sure how many people will
want to be vaccinated. That is what I am saying. If you get the
overwhelming number of people who----
Mr. Jordan. You gave us--you gave us a guess on Texas. Look
at the--look at the chart here. You gave us a seven-day average
of case rate per 100,000 people. You gave us your guess on
Texas. You said when Texas ended their lockdown, ended their
mandate, that this was, quote, ``inexplicable,'' and would lead
to a--would lead to a surge in cases.
Texas is near the bottom of the 50 states. But all the
states at the top--all the states at the top are lockdown
states. So, how great was that--that guess didn't seem to be
too good.
What explains why Texas is so darn low compared to the rest
of the states? Lockdown states have a much higher case rate
than the state of Texas, which has over a month ago now said,
we are not going to lock down--we are not going to have all
these mandates that you say we have to have.
Dr. Fauci. Yes. There is a difference between lockdown and
the people of obeying the lockdown. You know, you could have a
situation where they say, we are going to lock down and, yet,
you have people doing exactly what they want to do.
Mr. Jordan. Is that--is that what is happening in the top
eight states in the country? They are just not--they are just
not following what has been told? They are not listening to Dr.
Fauci?
Dr. Fauci. I am sorry. You are speaking so fast I am not
even hearing what you are saying.
Mr. Jordan. Well, you can look at the numbers.
Dr. Fauci. I can't see that. It is too far away.
Mr. Jordan. OK. Well, Michigan is at 551 cases for 100,000.
Texas is at 77. Wisconsin is at 109 because their state Supreme
Court overruled their governor--the Republican court--and said
we are not going to have a lockdown in Wisconsin and their
numbers are five times lower than the state of Michigan, which
is right next door.
Chairman Clyburn. The gentleman's time has expired.
Mr. Jordan. But, Mr. Chairman, it is typical when you are--
there is a question on the table that the witness gets a chance
to respond to that last question. I want to know why----
Chairman Clyburn. I will ask the--I will ask the----
Mr. Jordan [continuing]. Why Wisconsin is at 109 and right
next door Michigan is at 551. Michigan is locked down and
Wisconsin isn't.
Chairman Clyburn. I think the gentleman answered you quite
clearly.
Mr. Jordan. He didn't answer that. He hasn't answered one
question I have asked today.
Chairman Clyburn. There is a big difference in being a
lockdown state by order and being a state that obeys orders.
That answered the question, in my opinion. And with that----
Mr. Jordan. Yes, we don't obey orders in----
Chairman Clyburn. The chair recognizes Mr. Krishnamoorthi
for five minutes.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Dr. Fauci, the number-one Facebook post today about
vaccines is Tucker Carlson's suggesting they don't work, going
back to our exchange from before. There are calls now to take
down his post by Facebook, as it has become the most engaged
post and fueling the anti-vaxxer movement online.
Would you--it seems appropriate, given what Big Tech needs
to do to take down these anti-vaxxer claims to take down Tucker
Carlson's Facebook post as well? What do you think?
Dr. Fauci. You know, Congressman, I am really not expert
enough about what should be taken down.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. OK. Dr. Kessler--Dr. Kessler, this is
your beat, vaccine hesitancy. If this is as serious a anti-
vaxxer claim and it is getting the engagement it should,
shouldn't we take down this Facebook post?
Dr. Kessler. Vaccines work. Any suggestion that they don't
would be false and misleading, and I would ask--we have been
sitting here. I would just ask that all members of this
committee reinforce that point to the American people.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Dr. Fauci, with regard to Facebook,
Chelsea Clinton has now called for this Facebook post to be
taken down and numerous others. How about you?
Dr. Fauci. You know, when I--I was trying to answer the
question when you switched over to Dr. Kessler. I am not an
expert enough on what liberty should or should not be
encroached upon by taking things down from Facebook.
I don't want to go on the record and say something should
be taken down from Facebook because that is not my area of
expertise, what one can or cannot take down from Facebook.
I can comment that I certainly disagree with what he said
and I made it very clear that I disagreed with what he said.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. And should he retract his statements?
Dr. Fauci. Should he what?
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Should Tucker Carlson retract his
statements in light of your testimony today?
Dr. Fauci. You know, I wish that he would not have said it.
Again, I don't want to get into a back and forth because that
is what happened between me and Tucker Carlson.
I am too busy doing my job to going back and forth with
people like Tucker Carlson. He could say what he wants to say.
I wish he would not. I don't think it is productive.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Given what he has said and what he has
posted on Facebook and social media, do you believe that it
advances or sets back our drive to vaccinate the population?
Dr. Fauci. Well, the statement he made is that he doesn't--
it looks like the vaccines might not be working. The
implication was since you are asking us to wear masks the
vaccine might not be working.
My comment to that is that the vaccines were shown the mRNA
vaccines to be between 94 and 95 percent effective. So, my
answer to him is merely one of data. Look at the data. The
vaccines are highly efficacious and have been shown in the
field to be highly effective.
In fact, that was the third or fourth or fifth slide in my
presentation.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. No, but it is a simple question, Dr.
Fauci. Is it--are his statements advancing the cause of getting
us to the point where we can remove our masks and, quote/
unquote, ``exercise our liberties,'' or are we now setting back
the program of getting to that state?
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. His statements are, certainly, not
advancing the cause of trying to get as many people vaccinated
as quickly as we possibly can.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Dr. Kessler, you said that each week we
are going to be delivering or we are delivering 28 million
doses of vaccine, and I assume that the demand right now meets
the supply.
But at some point, you said, it is going to plateau. And
when do you expect the demand to be less than the supply?
Dr. Kessler. I think over the next number of weeks. I
think----
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. So, we will be gathering a surplus of
vaccines at that point?
Dr. Kessler. It is--you know, we are a diverse country and
there is going to be areas where there is appointments that
will go unfilled, and there will be areas of the country where
it is still going to be hard to get an appointment.
But I think we are getting to that inflection point and I
think we all have to individually work hard and personally to
talk to people. Listen to people. Understand people's fears,
people's concerns. We have a--we have a big job ahead of us if
we are going to get----
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. If we have surplus vaccines at some
point where the demand is less than the supply and is just
gathering, what are the contingency plans to do with those
surplus vaccines?
Dr. Kessler. We are going to work day and night, and we
are, to build further confidence in the American people. We
know the most important thing that we can do is to invest in
trusted messengers across the country.
We are leading with the science. I think you have seen that
this week's actions should give the American people increased
confidence in the FDA and the CDC. We have a big job ahead of
us and we are not going to stop until we have vaccinated
everybody that we can.
Mr. Jordan. Will the gentleman from Illinois yield for a
question?
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. Go ahead.
Mr. Jordan. Will the gentleman yield?
Chairman Clyburn. The time has expired.
Mr. Krishnamoorthi. I can't yield you anything, but go
ahead.
Chairman Clyburn. The gentleman's time has expired.
The chair now recognizes Dr. Green for five minutes.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And I want to begin round two here by thanking
Representative Bill Foster for his allowing me to partner with
him on the GAO Task Force. Bill and I don't agree on a lot of
political positions, but I have grown to deeply respect his
scientific knowledge and his management skills as he has worked
with them to make sure contracts were appropriate, operations--
Operation Warp Speed went well.
And he and I did agree on sending a letter to the
administration asking that we use one dose for Moderna and
Pfizer until everyone is vaccinated. I still believe that is a
strong position. The data from, particularly, our allies has
shown that to be very true.
Second, someone earlier mentioned that Tennessee's
infection rate--basically, mentioned our infection rate in an
effort to imply that open states performed more poorly than
closed states.
But a simple glance at the per capita death rate paints a
very clear picture that there is minimal correlation, if any,
between deaths and closures and mask mandates.
Florida, for example, is the third largest state. It ranks
28th in per capita deaths. Tennessee is the 6th in population--
16th in population and we are 21st in per capita deaths. That
is consistent across all the states. There just isn't
correlation. Those statistics need to be checked and confirmed,
or what was said earlier should be.
Someone else asked this question earlier and I think it is
worth mentioning again. You know, do such conditions that were
described at the Donna facility on the border conform to
current CDC guidelines.
The answer was very clear. It doesn't. And that begs the
question how is it OK to let 600-plus children lay row on row,
shoulder to shoulder, yet the NEA says we still can't send
Americans back to school.
I think that is a question that we should be asking the
national--the National Teachers Association. I am sorry. That
is very frustrating to see this continued push to keep kids out
of school, but it seems to be OK that that we let them languish
in those facilities on the border.
Dr. Fauci, I have a question for you, and I would like for
you, if you could, to elaborate--I am surprised no one has
asked this question yet--and it is about the J&J vaccine.
I, too, am one of those folks who believe that the Moderna
vaccine, the Pfizer vaccine--I have looked very hard at the
data on those. Those are safe.
I took the first vaccine myself. I am holding on a second
to keep in--keep consistent with Dr. Foster and my push to have
one vaccine first.
But you recently made some comments about the J&J vaccine.
As I understand it, there were only six cases of clots, and out
of several million 7 or 8 million that have been administered.
I would love for you to elaborate on this, because I am
very concerned that this halt or what you have said about the
halt has probably contributed to things like these Facebook
posts and others who are concerned about vaccine safety.
So, if you could kind of comment on the incidence of this
clot versus the number of vaccines, and then the pause and what
it may be communicating to people about the safety of the
vaccines.
Dr. Fauci. Thank you very much for that question. It is an
important question.
So, the CDC and the FDA made a determination when they saw
the accumulation of six, a relatively small number, of this
really quite devastating complication of an adverse event of
cerebral venous sinus thrombosis with thrombocytopenia.
And they did it, as they have stated very clearly, even
though it is a very low level, when you look at it the number
as of now would be, like, less than one per million. They did
it out of an abundance of caution and called it a pause to be
able to do two things: one, to examine it more carefully to
make sure that there are not a lot more out there, and to alert
physicians to be on the lookout for this.
But also another important component of it is that if there
are more of these situations where people have this and they
come to a physician, if the physicians are not aware of it,
they may treat the person inappropriately because this is a
clotting situation and the standard way to treat a thrombosis
is with an anticoagulant call heparin.
However, in this case, heparin is contraindicated because
it could actually make the situation worse.
So, there were two reasons to do it: one, out of an
abundance of caution to see what we are dealing with, and B, to
make sure they alert physicians about what to do with it.
Hopefully, we will get a decision quite soon as to whether or
not we can get back on track with this very effective vaccine.
Mr. Green. I would love for you, though, sir, to just in
your future comments about it be very careful, because I think
they are contributing to some of this vaccine hesitancy. And I
just--if I could just ask you to do that in the future. You
know, just a request. Thank you. And I yield.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you very much.
The chair now recognizes Mr. Foster for five minutes.
Mr. Foster. Thank you.
And just one quick question on the last subject.
In your epidemiological modeling, what is the difference in
the projected total mortality by the time the--that the
pandemic burns out because of the delay that is implied by a
delay in the J&J vaccine?
And if you don't have a just off the--you know, offhand
answer to that, if you could answer that for the record, it
would be very, very informative. Because that is the tradeoff,
as I perceive it, between the risk of those one in a million
of, you know, people who would, you know, be at risk otherwise.
And now I will change back to our favorite subject here. I
just want to thank you for your testimony about the long-term
Federal investments in science that were so crucial to getting
out from under this pandemic.
You know, I have been out of science and at this crazy
business for about 12 years now, and I cannot count the number
of times that we Democrats have had to compromise in
negotiations or give up things that we care about to defend the
scientific budgets against the cuts proposed and voted for by
Republicans from Paul Ryan to Mick Mulvaney to Donald Trump.
Well, that is my rant, and there is no need for you to
comment on this. But, now, what I would like to ask you about
are next-generation vaccines. You know, these may be really
important, both for boosters in the U.S. in the future and for
the rest of the world to keep new variants from coming back at
us from offshore.
And what I have been reading about all these great concepts
for next-gen vaccines, you know, the self-amplifying mRNA
vaccines, the nose spritz, which could be much better for
vaccine hesitancy, oral vaccines, which will be, obviously,
great for convenience and for vaccine hesitancy. And then all
these neat things like the electrical apheresis devices for DNA
vaccines and so on that don't have needles. Anyway, what are
the promising technical approaches and the plausible timelines
for these, both in the U.S. and abroad?
Dr. Fauci. Well, there are a--thank you for that question.
There are a couple of approaches to the evolution of variants.
One of them is to actually boost against the wild type virus,
and the reason we see that because the higher the titer of
antibodies, we find that even when a variant comes along and
diminishes the efficacy of the vaccine by two, three, or four
fold, there is still enough cushion in the effectiveness of the
vaccine that it spills over and protects against this new
variant.
The other approach is one that we have already started in
Phase 1 and 2A trials, and that is to make a boost that is
specifically directed at the variant in question. The one that
we are directing it at is the one that is the most problematic
for us right now.
Theoretically, it is not dominant in the country. But,
theoretically, it could be the most problem and that is the
South African isolate, the 351. The ultimate end game, when you
talk about the next generation, would be what we call a
universal SARS-CoV-2 vaccine and, ultimately, a universal
coronavirus vaccine.
And there are a number of ways of doing that. We have
important and new platform technologies and we believe, for
example, that we can apply the mRNA technology to get to that
goal of getting a broad response against all possible variants.
These are activities that have already started with the
funding that has been generously given to us by the Congress.
Mr. Foster. And are you also continuing to experiment
either in the U.S. or abroad with different dosing regimens?
For example, given the phenomenal effectiveness in children of
the mRNA vaccines or at least one of the mRNA vaccines, are you
considering looking at giving two half doses or maybe only one
dose to children and see if that is effective?
Because, obviously, even if we choose not to do it in the
U.S. it will have huge advantages to the rest of the world if
you can demonstrate that that sort of approach actually works.
Dr. Fauci. As part of the dose--as part of the age de-
escalation, which means that, for example, we know now for the
Pfizer that the 12-to 15-year-olds there was, essentially, 100
percent efficacy of that vaccine.
But when you do an age de-escalation and you go from 12 to
9 years old, 9 to 6, 6 to 2, and 6 months to 2 years, there
will be a dose de-escalating also on that, and perhaps Dr.
Kessler can comment further on that.
Dr. Kessler. Getting the dose right in children is
absolutely essential. And, in fact, one of the reasons why it
takes longer in kids is because that--collecting that data is
being undertaken right now and that is what we will have, I am
confident.
Again, I don't want to get out ahead of it in front of FDA
and the ACIP. But we will likely have a vaccine for adolescents
from 12 to 16 over the next several months. But the younger age
groups, in order to get that dose data, it will take longer.
Mr. Foster. Thank you, and I believe my time has expired,
and I yield back.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentleman for yielding back.
The chair now recognizes Ms. Malliotakis for five minutes.
Ms. Malliotakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I wanted to continue the conversation regarding our
schools. And as I mentioned, the CDC had recommended a $23
billion cost to reopen. That was the estimation in December,
and that COVID bill is $64 billion, almost nearly triple the
amount of money that was needed.
And then in this last package they put in another $110
billion, which would be eight times the amount that the CDC
estimated it would cost.
Now, my question for you is, because New York City School
system is still basically closed.
Yes, there is some in-person instruction at elementary
schools and some at the middle school level. But the reality
is, is that the CDC is recommending five days a week in-person
instruction.
What can you do to assist us to get that message to the
local level? Because this is really having an impact, and as
Dr. Fauci is from the community, from the city that I
represent, so he understands maybe the impact that this is
having.
But from a medical standpoint, I mean, we are talking about
COVID. But then this is creating all sorts of other issues:
nutrition, obesity, school athletics remains shut down. I can't
get 12 kids in a hockey league to be able to play. Just
nonsensical stuff that we are seeing.
And I understand it is a local decision and it is about
local management. But what can you and the administration do to
try to talk some sense into the leadership in New York City to
get our schools open, get school athletics back on track?
Children, you have seen across the country, sadly, committing
suicide.
This is having a mental health--another public health
crisis is being created as a result. Both parents are trying to
go to work. You know, it is really hard, particularly on single
mothers. The after school centers are closed.
I mean, what can we do as a Federal Government, as an
administration, to try to--are you meeting with them? Are you
communicating with them regularly?
Are you visiting with these chancellors on the local level
to come up with a plan to meet this 100-day goal that the
president sent that we are about to reach any day now?
Dr. Walensky. So, we have put forward this operational
guidance. We have been collaborating with the Department of Ed.
We have been talking to the teachers unions and we have been
talking to individual states.
What I can say is that the guidance speaks to all the
layered mitigation strategies that need to be in place in order
for this to be safely done, and schools are working toward that
in many of these places.
I do want to say that we have definitively said the schools
should be the first place to open and the last place to close.
Many of the outbreaks associated with children are
happening on the athletic field. They are happening in
wrestling. They are happening in hockey. They are happening in
basketball.
So, we have limited guidance--we have guidance that limits
the school sports in the context of highest transmission.
Ms. Malliotakis. OK. Thank you very much. I would like to
give Mr. Scalise 30 seconds and the remaining on my time to Mr.
Jordan.
Mr. Scalise. Thank you. I appreciate the gentlelady from
New York.
Real quick, because there were some comments that were
brought up regarding Tucker Carlson, some things that were said
but other parts of the context that were left out.
So, I did just want to include on Mr. Carlson's show on
Wednesday, he did say, quote, ``Wait a second. Who is doubting
that vaccines work? For the record, we never for a minute
doubted it.''
He goes on to say, ``So, when they said this stuff works we
never questioned it.'' So, I think it is important to put that
on the record as well because that was left out, I think a
little bit unfairly.
Yield back.
Ms. Malliotakis. Mr. Jordan?
Mr. Jordan. I thank the gentlelady for yielding.
That was--that was a subject I wanted to touch on. We just
had a member--I wish he was still here. That is why I tried to
ask him a question. Representative Krishnamoorthi actually
lobbying for Tucker Carlson, a member of the press--actually
lobbying for his statements to be censored.
A member of the government telling someone in the press,
advocating for someone in the press to have their statements
censored. And Dr. Fauci says I am ranting when I talk about the
First Amendment.
For goodness sake, you got a Member of Congress in the
government saying someone in the press should be denied their
ability to speak that statement. They should be taken off of
Facebook, taken down.
This is how scary it has gotten, and the longer it goes,
Dr. Fauci--the longer it goes, the scarier it is going to be
for the liberties that we, as American citizens, have. That has
been my point the entire time.
But I wish the gentleman were still here. But I cannot
believe what I heard where a Member of Congress is saying and
asking you all a question, and you all won't give the right
answer, which is, of course, his statement shouldn't come down.
It would have been easy to say, Dr. Fauci, if you actually
cared about the First Amendment, of course, I disagree with his
statement. I know you do. I don't know that I disagree with
everything he said because he just was put in context--when you
get the whole context.
But you disagreed with his statement. What you should have
said he can say what he wants, shouldn't be taken down. I just
respectfully disagree.
I yield back to the gentlelady from New York.
Chairman Clyburn. The gentlelady's time----
Dr. Fauci. Mr. Chairman, could I--just to clarify?
Congressman Jordan, I definitely think he has the right to
say whatever he wants to say. Well, he was talking about things
that I think are legal or not legal about taking things down.
Why don't we just make it so that you understand very
clearly that I think that Tucker Carlson can say whatever he
wants to say. It is freedom of speech.
Mr. Jordan. Well, God bless you. I appreciate it.
Chairman Clyburn. Well, you know, I would just say, Mr.
Jordan, that there is something about this country that we pay
entertainers very well. I don't care about how much money they
make. But I want them to be recognized as entertainers.
Mr. Jordan. Tucker Carlson is a member of the media. He is
a member of the press.
Chairman Clyburn. Tucker Carlson--Tucker Carlson, in my not
so humble opinion, is an entertainer.
And with that, I will yield five minutes to Ms. Waters.
Ms. Waters. Thank you so very much, Mr. Chairman.
Again, Dr. Fauci, I would like to thank you for your
courage and your integrity, and I want to ask you about a
couple of friends that I have that I think have been considered
or is being considered long haulers.
Now, they tell me about some of their symptoms. I think one
has not gotten the taste and the smell returned. The other one
is having, I think, headaches and some other kinds of things.
What can they expect? Should they get booster shots? What
can be done for the long haulers?
Dr. Fauci. We are now--that is a great question,
Congresswoman Waters. We are studying very intensively now what
is a real and unfortunate syndrome, and that is a certain
percentage of people--and we are collecting large cohorts now
to find out exactly what that percent is.
It ranges in some observational studies from 10 percent to
20 to 25 percent of people who have varying levels of
involvement of COVID-19.
Some are in the hospital. Some are in the hospital
seriously ill. Some are taken care of at home and are out of
work or whatever for a month. But at the end of the day, when
they clear the virus from the body, they have this peculiar
persistence of a constellation of symptoms that are
unexplainable, because the virus is gone and, yet, they have
profound fatigue, muscle aches, sleep disorders, temperature
dysregulation, fast heartbeat called tachycardia, and a thing
called brain fog, which means they have difficulty focusing on
anything, on a computer or on reading.
So, what we are trying to do is to find out, A, what is the
percent of people, B, is there an underlying common cause of
that, because up to now on superficial looking there is no
specific laboratory test that is giving us any clues.
But it is a real phenomenon and we are taking it very
seriously. As a matter of fact, we have invested $1.15 billion
in a multi-institution type of an approach with the NIH, the
CDC, multiple institutes within the NIH. It is something we
take very seriously.
Ms. Waters. Well, let me just continue with that. We are
talking about the various variants and we are also hearing some
conversation about the possibility of booster shots that may be
necessary.
Would there be a different booster shot for different
variants? For example, you describe one coming out of South
Africa. Someone alluded to one coming out of Brazil. We have
heard about the U.K.
Do you think that if we have to have booster shots it may
be different kinds of booster shots, depending on the variant
that is the problem?
Dr. Fauci. Yes. That is a great question and that is one of
the things I tried to address in a partial answer to one of the
questions.
There are a couple of ways of looking at variants. One is
the boost against what we call the wild type, the underlying
original one. If you get it high enough, it could spill over
into protection to the variant.
The other is to specifically make a boost against the
variant. The problem with that is that if you get more and more
variants, that is almost like playing whack-a-mole. You hit
this one, then you go to the other one, you go to the other
one.
And that is the reason why what we are putting a lot of
effort in is to try and get a more universal vaccine that would
cover all different types of variants. That is the ultimate end
game.
But until then, we are trying to isolate and find out what
the most damaging or potentially dangerous variant is and to
make a special boost against that, and that is what we are
doing.
Ms. Waters. That is--that is very good to hear, and I am
going to be paying a lot of attention to that because I,
without, you know, having any specific scientific knowledge, I
just think that there may come a time when we have to have
booster shots.
Now, having said that, I want to talk just one--a bit about
something right here at home. It is very simple. The Members of
Congress are congregating in the elevators. They pile in the
elevators.
And when I am on an elevator and it stops, I will only let
two other people on because I won't live with more than three.
And some say, well, I have had shot so I am wearing my mask.
What advice do you have for us to, basically, be more safe
and to be fine examples of what to do to prevent the virus?
Dr. Fauci. Yes. There are a couple of things to be done. I
think we should encourage all Members of Congress to get
vaccinated because I think that would be really good for their
own personal protection as well as for the community of the
Congress.
The other thing is that what we do in our Federal--some of
our Federal buildings--I know we do it at the NIH--when you
have the elevator, they have these things here that are in the
corner and they say no more than four if the elevator is a
certain size, and no more than two if it is a much smaller
size.
But it actually works and people abide by that and they
respect that, and I think that is a good thing if we can get
that done.
Ms. Waters. Thank you for your advice. Again, I appreciate
you so very much. Thank you and I yield back.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentlelady for yielding back.
The chair now recognizes Ms. Miller-Meeks for five minutes.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Dr. Walensky, since this pandemic started, as a physician
and former director of the Iowa Department of Public Health, I
have referred to this as life versus life. Not life versus the
economy, not life versus liberty, but life versus life.
At that time, I said that we would see with hospitals
closed, with businesses closed, childcare closed, that we would
see the increased deaths from cancer treatments not being
given, also cancer not being detected, from drug overdose,
suicide, depression, mental health.
And now we have, certainly, that data. We have--the San
Francisco Chronicle published earlier this year that the rate
of drug overdose deaths, even with Narcan being rapidly
dispensed and in the public, was over 30 percent higher than it
had been the year before.
We also know the same statistics out of Japan. We also know
from Las Vegas that, having closed their schools, what forced
the Las Vegas school district to open their schools was the
publication that--in the New York Times that from March 16 to
June 30 of 2020 there were six suicides in young children, and
between July 1 and December 31 there were additional 12--18
suicides, the youngest of which was nine years old, which is
tragic.
So, my question for you is do you know how many excess
deaths, not COVID but excess non-COVID-related deaths have been
incurred during this past year?
Dr. Walensky. I know there was an MMWR report out today
actually that describes from January 2020 to February 2021
excess deaths of about 500,000, about 75 percent of which are
attributable to COVID.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. Thank you. So, excess deaths of 500,000,
which is somewhat similar to what we have. So, thank you for
that.
Dr. Walensky. Seventy-five of which are attributable to
COVID so that is the same----
Ms. Miller-Meeks. So, non-COVID-related excess deaths was
what I was asking. But I will go to my next question but thank
you for that.
I was at the border earlier this week in the Rio Grande
Valley sector--and thank you, Representative Waters, for
bringing up congregating in the elevators and crowding, because
when I was there at the Donna Processing Facility, that
facility was at 420 percent capacity. They had brought it down
from 5,000 per day to 3,500 per day. This facility was not
built for that.
While I was there, as a woman and a mother I was concerned
about young women being smuggled into the country, brought
across without any parental support or parental guidance, and
asked them about pregnancy, rape, sexual assault, and they
informed me that the week before they had an 11-year-old girl
recently pregnant and a girl between 11 and 15, who, the day
she arrived at that facility, gave birth to twins.
So, does pregnancy put individuals or these young people--
they are not being tested for COVID. We already know that. But
does it put them at a higher risk for severe illness from
COVID-19?
Dr. Walensky. Epidemiologic studies say that outcomes of
COVID in pregnant women are increased ICU risk and on other
things.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. OK. And does the overcapacity in the
shelter put them at higher risk for COVID-19?
Dr. Walensky. Crowding is a risk for COVID-19, yes.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. So, I have been working on vaccine
hesitancy throughout. As soon as the vaccine--and I thank the
previous administration and President Trump for getting the
vaccine to this point in time--but it is really the Nation's
vaccine, not a particular president's vaccine. And working on
that, and even this weekend on Saturday was able to vaccinate
20 young individuals who were attending a meeting.
And so, we have talked about vaccine hesitancy and the need
to get across that. But I am wondering if--and, Mr. Chair, I
would like to introduce this article into the record, if I may,
from September 2020 when Dana Bash asked Vice President Harris
if she would get the vaccine, and quote, ``I would say that I
would not trust Donald Trump and it would have to be a credible
source of information that talks about the efficacy and the
reliability of whatever he is talking about. I will not take
his word for it.''
Is this the kind of information you think that also
contributes to vaccine hesitancy?
Dr. Walensky. I think we all have a role to get vaccinated,
and I would encourage everybody to get vaccinated with the FDA-
authorized vaccines.
Ms. Miller-Meeks. So, I fully respect her freedom of
speech, as Dr. Fauci respects Tucker Carlson's. But I think,
yes, it is incumbent upon all of us to be transparent, to be
ethical, to give information, and this also applies to the--how
we handle the J&J vaccine as well to the pause.
Thank you so much and, again, I appreciate all of you being
here and your testimony today.
Chairman Clyburn. Thank you.
The chair now recognizes himself for five minutes to close
the second round of questioning.
I wish to say that I remember the statement made by Vice
President Harris. I also seem to remember that she had a very
public vaccination, very public. She and the president as well.
I am old enough to remember the Tuskegee experiment, and I
know what hesitancy that has caused. I am also remembering the
polio vaccines, one being a shot, which we owe to the genius of
Dr. Jonas Salk, the other being a little drop of serum on a
lump of sugar, all to the genius of Albert Sabin.
I need not tell you which one of those was preferred, and
so I will not have to explain to you which community got what
vaccine. And that is why the vice president was so public with
her vaccination and that is why I was very public with mine and
received my second one on January 7.
As you can imagine, I mean, the day after January 6, my
mind was on a lot more than the vaccination. But I thought it
serious enough to have that vaccination done on that day in the
same place that had been ransacked the day before.
And I think it is important, in my opinion, that we
recognize mask mandates and closures, and though it seems as if
a few of my colleagues here believe that mask mandates and
closures haven't helped save lives. That is what they have said
here.
I want to know, Dr. Fauci, would you agree with that?
Dr. Fauci. I believe that mask mandates have helped.
Chairman Clyburn. How about you, Dr. Walensky?
Dr. Walensky. I agree with Dr. Fauci.
Chairman Clyburn. Dr. Kessler?
Dr. Kessler. Absolutely, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Clyburn. Well, I want to thank the experts here,
and I would hope that the public looking in or listening in on
this hearing today will take to heart the fact that the
scientists, the people who have spent their lives in this field
saving lives, will take heed, and as they listen to the words,
for those who haven't spent a day studying these issues or
practicing them, those who spend their time practicing the
words of persuasion rather than in hearing the scientific
research that got rid of polio and so many other diseases.
You know, I have taken my single shot, and for what I know
about these kinds of diseases, when the scientists tell me that
the research says they will be helpful to my comfort and well
being, I am going to take it and I urge all of my constituents
and all others who may have any confidence in my opinion to
please follow the scientists and get vaccinated.
With that, I yield back and I will call and end to the
second round of questions.
And I will now yield to my ranking member for any closing
comments he would like to make.
Mr. Scalise. I want to thank Chairman Clyburn for having us
here and really appreciate our witnesses for coming.
I know for Dr. Fauci, you have been back a few times. When
you look at some of the conversations we have had, I know when
I listen to constituents of mine they want to follow the
science and get back to their lives as best as they can.
And we are over a year into this now. We see some states
who have opened more broadly using science and some states that
have stayed shut down, in many cases going against the science.
And again, you can look at the chart. The states that are
the most closed down right now have some of the highest
incidence of COVID transmission. And you look at number 50. Out
of 50, Texas is probably one of the most open states.
So, the science shows and the data shows that you can
safely reopen. Some are just choosing not to, and that is
really where we get to the concern.
When you look at some states that are practicing more
political science while ignoring medical science, that is what
angers so many of us. You look at school reopening, and I
appreciate Dr. Fauci and Dr. Walensky both said if you follow
the CDC guidance, which says socially distance and wear a mask,
every school should be open today. And yet, about half of our
schools in America are not educating kids in the classroom.
And the science is real clear on this. Long-term damage is
being done to those kids. Some are committing suicide. Some are
turning to drugs. Some have lost a generational ability to have
the same opportunity as anyone else.
This is a national disgrace. Ten years from now people are
going to look back and go, how did America let that happen to a
generation of kids where for over a year they did not learn the
same way as everybody else in America learn.
When you watch a teachers union head send his kids to
private school while telling the teachers in the public school
system that they shouldn't teach kids in the classroom.
You want to talk about racial disparity in this country?
This is a national disgrace that is occurring before our very
eyes, and instead of waiting 10 years and looking back on how
did we lose a generation of millions of young kids, let us do
something about it now.
Every one of us should be able to stand up, Mr. Chairman,
Republican and Democrat. Whatever you think of unions, whatever
you think of school choice, if your school system doesn't want
to educate your kids in the classroom and the science says do
it, absolutely do it--if you want to take their money and not
educate their kids, shouldn't you be able to take that money
somewhere else where they are willing to educate your kid?
Because your kid is going to lose his opportunity at life if
this goes on.
So, much damage has already been done. We have got to undo
the damage, and the science--the medical science--backs it up.
The American Academy of Pediatrics, CDC. You don't need to look
far.
You don't need to reinvent the wheel, because it is out
there, what you can do to open schools today. You don't need
billions more dollars. We have spent billions of dollars to
reopen schools.
The bill that was passed, the $1.9 trillion massive
spending bill, over 90 percent of which had nothing to do with
COVID medicine, the money going to schools wasn't even
dedicated to opening schools.
And so, people would beg the question, what is the money
for then because I want my kid back in school. It is denying
that kid opportunity. They are committing suicide. We ought to
be concerned about those numbers.
Then let us turn to the border and, again, I appreciate the
testimony from our witnesses, because when confronted with the
pictures that the Biden administration will not let the press
see, the Biden administration is keeping the press out of this
facility in Donna.
It is a national disgrace what is going on in there. But,
more importantly, as both Dr. Fauci and Dr. Walensky attested,
it is a violation of CDC guidelines.
When you got a facility designed for 250 people with over
4,000 crammed in it, kids on top of kids, that is a violation
of every CDC protocol out there. And this isn't some private
sector entity, because your business would be shut down in
America if you were doing this. But because the Biden
administration is running it and keeping the press out, it
remains open today.
Last Friday, that was what I saw. Major violations of CDC's
own policy. When they say in the guidance regarding Mexico,
very high level of COVID-19 in Mexico.
So, if you are an American taxpayer, CDC, and I know Dr.
Walensky will back this up, CDC says before you travel back to
the United States, all air passengers coming to the United
States, including U.S. citizens and fully vaccinated people,
are required to have a negative COVID-19 test.
And yet, if you come across the border illegally, many of
these young kids are given a free airplane ticket with no COVID
test.
Border Patrol agents telling at least 10 percent have COVID
in this facility crammed on top of each other, which, as we all
know, based on science, way more than 10 percent are going to
walk out onto an airplane with COVID and transmit it to the
rest of the country.
This is insanity. It has to stop. President Biden, go to
the border and see this for yourself, and then pull out your
pen and reverse the executive orders that you created that have
created this national disgrace.
Let us solve this based on medical science.
I thank, again, our witnesses.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
Chairman Clyburn. I thank the gentleman for yielding back.
Before we close, I would like to enter into the record a
letter that the committee has received from Henderson
Incorporated, and I think we have made that letter available. I
would like unanimous consent to enter it into the record, with
respect to the role of physicians and dentists in the vaccine
rollout.
I ask unanimous consent, Mr. Ranking Member, that it be
entered into the record.
Chairman Clyburn. As a former public school teacher whose--
I have a daughter who followed me into that arena and recently
retired as a public school teacher, a second daughter serving
on the board of our public school district commission, Board of
Commissioners, today's hearing reassures me that under the
leadership of this administration we are on the right track
toward overcoming the coronavirus pandemic.
All of us want to see our children back in school. We want
our children back in school safely with teachers who have had
the vaccinations and all others with whom they may come in
contact.
Millions of Americans are being vaccinated every day, and
just days from now, all adults will be eligible to receive a
vaccine. We are prioritizing equity and increasing vaccine
access in low-income, minority, and rural communities.
In addition to our vaccination program, the Federal
Government continues to expand testing and critical supplies of
going where they are needed most. Research into the disease
continues. We can finally see the light at the end of the
tunnel.
It is in the distance. But I think we are finally beginning
to see it, because we are leading the science instead of
politics and that is what has made this possible.
We placed our trust in our country's best doctors,
scientists, and public health experts and we have guided us--
and they have guided us out of this chaos and confusion.
I am glad that we could hear from Dr. Walensky on her work
to restore the CDC's reputation as the world's preeminent
public health organization after the Trump administration
tarnished the agency by bullying scientists and altering
scientific reports.
We must commit today to never again allow politics to
interfere with the public's health. Despite significant
progress in vaccinations and a decrease in deaths for the last
several months, the pandemic is not yet over. Almost 5,000
people died from the virus this past week alone and more
contagious variants are spreading fast.
If we are not careful, thousands of lives will be lost that
could have been saved. We heard today that we must do--what we
must do to save lives.
We must continue to wear masks and avoid crowds until all
Americans have had an opportunity to be fully vaccinated, and
we must overcome vaccine hesitancy so that all Americans
benefit from these lifesaving scientific breakthroughs,
including those of us who the American people have given
leadership positions by their actions.
We all ought to lead not by our words or by our deeds, not
just by precepts but by examples. We ought to be an example. I
often refer to the halls of the House as America's classroom
from which lessons ought to be taught.
I understand, as I said earlier, the weariness of people
that have had their lives disrupted. If we take these simple
steps and continue to follow scientists, we can swiftly and
safely end this deadly pandemic.
I look forward to working closely with our witnesses to
achieve this in the months ahead, and I thank you for joining
us here today.
With that, without objection all members will have five
legislative days within which to submit additional written
questions for the witnesses to the chair, which will be
forwarded to the witnesses for their response.
This hearing is adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 1:38 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
[all]