[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                     REVIEWING THE AVAILABILITY OF
                  RESOURCES TO ADDRESS VETERAN HUNGER

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                  SUBCOMMITTEE ON ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY

                                 OF THE

                     COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS

                     U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                     ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________

                       THURSDAY, JANUARY 9, 2020

                               __________

                           Serial No. 116-50

                               __________

       Printed for the use of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs
       
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                    Available via http://govinfo.gov
                    
                              __________

                    U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
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                     COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS

                   MARK TAKANO, California, Chairman

JULIA BROWNLEY, California           DAVID P. ROE, Tenessee, Ranking 
KATHLEEN M. RICE, New York               Member
CONOR LAMB, Pennsylvania, Vice-      GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida
    Chairman                         AUMUA AMATA COLEMAN RADEWAGEN, 
MIKE LEVIN, California                   American Samoa
MAX ROSE, New York                   MIKE BOST, Illinois
CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire          NEAL P. DUNN, Florida
ELAINE G. LURIA, Virginia            JACK BERGMAN, Michigan
SUSIE LEE, Nevada                    JIM BANKS, Indiana
JOE CUNNINGHAM, South Carolina       ANDY BARR, Kentucky
GILBERT RAY CISNEROS, JR.,           DANIEL MEUSER, Pennsylvania
    California                       STEVE WATKINS, Kansas
COLLIN C. PETERSON, Minnesota        CHIP ROY, Texas
GREGORIO KILILI CAMACHO SABLAN,      W. GREGORY STEUBE, Florida
    Northern Mariana Islands
COLIN Z. ALLRED, Texas
LAUREN UNDERWOOD, Illinois
ANTHONY BRINDISI, New York

                 Ray Kelley, Democratic Staff Director
                 Jon Towers, Republican Staff Director

                  SUBCOMMITTEE ON ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY

                    MIKE LEVIN, California, Chairman

KATHLEEN M. RICE, New York           GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida Ranking 
ANTHONY BRINDISI, New York               Member
CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire          JACK BERGMAN, Michigan
ELAINE G. LURIA, Virginia            JIM BANKS, Indiana
SUSIE LEE, Nevada                    ANDY BARR, Kentucky
JOE CUNNINGHAM, South Carolina       DANIEL MEUSER, Pennsylvania

Pursuant to clause 2(e)(4) of Rule XI of the Rules of the House, public 
hearing records of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs are also 
published in electronic form. The printed hearing record remains the 
official version. Because electronic submissions are used to prepare 
both printed and electronic versions of the hearing record, the process 
of converting between various electronic formats may introduce 
unintentional errors or omissions. Such occurrences are inherent in the 
current publication process and should diminish as the process is 
further refined.
                        
                        
                        C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                              ----------                              

                       THURSDAY, JANUARY 9, 2020

                                                                   Page

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

Honorable Mike Levin, Chairman...................................     1
Honorable Gus M. Bilirakis, Ranking Member.......................     2
Honorable Mark Takano, Chairman, Full Committee..................     4

                               WITNESSES

Ms. Pamilyn Miller, Administrator, Food and Nutrition Service, 
  U.S. Department of Agriculture.................................     4

Dr. Thomas O'Toole, Senior Medical Advisor, Providence VAMC, 
  Veterans Health Administration, U.S. Department of Veterans 
  Affairs........................................................     6

        Accompanied by:

    Ms. Christine Going, MPA, RD, FACHE, Co-Chairperson, Veterans 
        Health Affairs Ensuring Food Security Workgroup, Veterans 
        Health Administration, U.S. Department of Veterans 
        Affairs

Mr. Josh Protas, Vice President of Public Policy, Mazon: A Jewish 
  Response to Hunger.............................................    20

Ms. Denise Hollywood, Chief Community and Programs Officer, Blue 
  Star Families..................................................    21

Mr. Vince Hall, CEO, Feeding San Diego...........................    23

                                APPENDIX
                    Prepared Statements Of Witnesses

Ms. Pamilyn Miller Prepared Statement............................    41
Dr. Thomas O'Toole Prepared Statement............................    44
Mr. Josh Protas Prepared Statement...............................    47
Ms. Denise Hollywood Prepared Statement..........................    54
Mr. Vince Hall Prepared Statement................................    57

 
   REVIEWING THE AVAILABILITY OF RESOURCES TO ADDRESS VETERAN HUNGER

                              ----------                              


                       THURSDAY, JANUARY 9, 2020

              U.S. House of Representatives
               Subcommittee on Economic Opportunity
                             Committee on Veterans' Affairs
                                                   Washington, D.C.
    The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:06 a.m., in 
room 210, House Visitors Center, Hon. Mike Levin (chairman of 
the subcommittee) presiding.
    Present: Representatives Levin, Rice, Brindisi, Pappas, 
Lee, Cunningham, Bilirakis, Bergman, Barr, and Meuser.
    Also present: Representative Takano.

           OPENING STATEMENT OF MIKE LEVIN, CHAIRMAN

    Mr. Levin. Good morning, everyone, and welcome back as we 
return from the holiday season to continue our work in the 
Economic Opportunity Subcommittee.
    Without objection, the chair is authorized to call for a 
recess at any time.
    Today's hearing is entitled, ``Reviewing the Availability 
of Resources to Address Veteran Hunger.'' I am hopeful we can 
shed some light on a very important issues for veterans around 
the country.
    This hearing will examine Department of Veterans Affairs 
and Department of Agriculture programs that identify food 
insecurity among nearly 20 million veterans, and provide 
nutrition assistance to those in need.
    Specifically, today's hearing will focus on how veterans 
access nutrition resources, how recent policy changes have 
impacted the availability of resources, and how Congress can 
more effectively support public and non-public agencies that 
seek to end veteran hunger. It is so critically important. This 
continues the subcommittee's efforts to review economic factors 
that contribute to veteran suicide, which we know include 
homelessness and hunger.
    Our subcommittee works in a bipartisan way to strengthen 
education and job-training programs so veterans can get a good 
job, but, unfortunately, that is not always the outcome. 
Sometimes joblessness results in a veteran and their family 
members experiencing hunger. When that occurs, nutrition 
resources should and must be made readily available.
    However, this committee is concerned that decisions are 
being made regarding these resources without thoroughly 
considering the impact on veterans. This subcommittee and 
Congress as a whole need to know how United States Department 
of Agriculture (USDA) considered the effect on veterans as they 
proposed regulatory changes limiting access to nutrition 
programs last year. If veterans were not considered, we must 
understand why USDA felt it was unnecessary or that they were 
unable to do so, and how we can ensure that veterans are 
considered now and in the future.
    In addition to ensuring the availability of resources, it 
is essential that we help veterans secure them.
    Since 2017, VA has screened millions of veterans for 
hunger, but it is unclear how that policy is being carried out 
and what VA is doing when a veteran in need is identified. The 
many Federal and State programs that assist veterans who are 
experiencing hunger can only be utilized if veterans are aware 
of them.
    This is a particularly fitting matter for our subcommittee, 
which has spent this Congress on policies to improve veterans' 
economic outcomes and ultimately their overall wellness. We 
have a responsibility to ensure that no veteran falls through 
the cracks, and I look forward to hearing the testimony from 
our witnesses today to do just that.
    With that, I now recognize my friend, Ranking Member 
Bilirakis, with whom I have worked on a bipartisan basis, now 
for 5 minutes for his opening statement.

     OPENING STATEMENT OF GUS M. BILIRAKIS, RANKING MEMBER

    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I appreciate it. 
Mr. Chairman, I want to thank the witnesses as well who will 
testify today on the important issue of veteran hunger.
    Food security for veterans, as well as all Americans, is an 
essential component for a stable life. Food insecurity can be a 
contributing factor that be detrimental to a person's mental 
health. It is important for us to evaluate the way we are 
providing the security to ensure that it is being provided in 
the most effective manner to help those who need it the most.
    Mr. Chairman, neither of us were Members of Congress when 
President Clinton signed the Personal Responsibility and Work 
Opportunity Reconciliation Act of 1996, also known as the 
Welfare Reform Act of 1996, into law. By the way, that was a 
bipartisan bill and a good bill, in my opinion, but right now 
states are bypassing its original intent.
    This law was a bipartisan effort, as I said, to require 
work or training for work in exchange for the time-related 
financial assistance. This law also included incentives for 
states to get those in need back to work as a means to reduce 
the fiscal burden on the Federal Government and prevent what we 
now call, and I quote, ``multi-generational poverty.'' We want 
to prevent multi-generational poverty, something that--again, 
that is what we should be striving toward, and I know that that 
is your goal as well.
    Broad-based categorical eligibility allows states to 
circumvent income and asset requirements to extend the 
Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, or SNAP, benefits 
based on nothing more than an individual receiving a brochure 
or pamphlet. Currently, of the 2.9 million able-bodied adults 
without dependents that participate in SNAP, 2.1 million or 72 
percent are not working. Additionally, the number of people 
currently participating in SNAP still exceeds pre-recession 
levels. I would like to hear from our panel today on why they 
think this is happening. With such a low unemployment rate, why 
are we seeing so many SNAP participants continue to not work 
and live on these benefits?
    I would also like to hear from our panel ways Congress can 
help lift these people out of poverty and allow them to prosper 
in this booming economy.
    With that being said, under this Administration's 
leadership and our continued use of pro-growth policies, the 
national unemployment rate is now 3.6 percent with veteran 
unemployment rate at an even lower rate of 3.3 percent, again, 
for the month of November.
    Mr. Chairman, it is obvious that the economy is booming. 
Americans are returning to work in record numbers and 
encouraging employment is the foundation for Congress' 
authorization of this program, a great program, which is why I 
am supportive of the Administration's rule on able-bodied 
adults without dependents, which implements the existing work 
requirements from the 1996 law. Again, President Clinton and 
the Republican House really focused on this and got it right. 
How does this apply, in my opinion, to this subcommittee? 
Unfortunately, we know surprisingly very well about how this 
program affects veterans. We simply do not have the idea on 
veterans using the SNAP program or how prevalent food 
insecurity is among veterans.
    Mr. Chairman, you were not here when the Farm Bill was 
authorized last Congress, so you may not be aware that, despite 
requests from our side of the aisle, the Federal Government 
still does not require states to conduct meaningful data 
collection on SNAP participants, including tracking of 
veterans.
    Now, I know that we have veterans that are having a real 
hard time, because I participate in those Stand Down programs 
at least on a yearly basis, but by not tracking the 
information, by not tracking, both Congress and the Department 
of Agriculture, USDA, are left in the dark about how to improve 
this program. I would very much like to work with you and our 
colleagues on the House Agriculture Committee to address this 
issue by putting in place a requirement for states to track 
SNAP benefits for veterans, our heroes, my priority in the 
Congress, I know it is yours as well, Mr. Chairman. Some states 
already do this, but not all states do this.
    I am grateful to our witnesses for giving us an opportunity 
to hear directly from those involved with this program. I look 
forward to hearing what they believe works, does not work, and 
how we in Congress can empower those involved in these programs 
to ensure that no one who has served our great country goes 
hungry. That is the bottom line and that is our goal.
    Once again, I thank you, Mr. Chairman, for holding this 
hearing, and I yield back the balance of my time.
    Mr. Levin. I thank the ranking member for his remarks. I 
too have participated in veterans Stand Down programs in my 
district, and I appreciate our shared objectives here and look 
forward to working on a bipartisan basis with you.
    With that, I would like to recognize my friend, the 
outstanding chairman of the House of Veterans' Affairs 
Committee, Mark Takano, for his opening remarks.

   OPENING STATEMENT OF MARK TAKANO, CHAIRMAN, FULL COMMITTEE

    Mr. Takano. Thank you, Chairman Levin, for yielding a 
little bit of time to me this morning to make my opening 
remarks.
    Good morning to all of our witnesses. Thank you all for 
appearing before this subcommittee.
    Like many of our committee members, I was concerned by the 
SNAP changes that took place last year and how in particular 
they would impact veterans, but also active duty, Guard, and 
Reservists. The Guard and Reservists in particular often face 
employment challenges. And so, you know, we need to find out 
more; we need better data. As with Chairman Levin and many 
Members of Congress joined in sending a letter to Secretary 
Perdue at the USDA on May 24th, 2019, reflecting our many 
concerns. Without good data, we do not know the scope of the 
program, and we--you know, we need data that can be done in 
conjunction with Veterans Health Administration (VHA) 
appointments, but also other interactions like awards, changes 
in benefits, and also with vulnerable populations like homeless 
students and--the homeless population, students, and 
transitioning veterans.
    Many questions exist, so I do appreciate your joining us 
this morning. We are very, very concerned about how, you know, 
the changes in the terms of SNAP benefits are going to affect 
our Nation's veterans, active duty, Guard, and Reservists.
    Thank you, and I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate your 
interest in this subject and your continued leadership.
    That brings us to our witnesses. We have two panels with us 
today, the first representing the Administration and the second 
made up of non-governmental policy experts.
    First, I want to thank USDA for joining us on this 
important topic. From USDA, we have Pamilyn Miller, 
Administrator for the Food and Nutrition Service. We also have 
Dr. Thomas O'Toole, the Senior Medical Advisor at the 
Providence VA Medical Center. Thanks for being here. He is 
accompanied by Christine Going, Co-Chairperson of the VA's 
Ensuring Veterans Food Security Workgroup.
    Thank you all very much for joining us. As you know, you 
will have 5 minutes for your oral statement, but your full 
written statement will be added to the record.
    With that, Administrator Miller, you are now recognized for 
5 minutes. Make sure your microphone is on.

                  STATEMENT OF PAMILYN MILLER

    Ms. Miller. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member 
Bilirakis, and members of the subcommittee. I am Pam Miller, 
Administrator of USDA's Food and Nutrition Service, which is 
responsible for administering the Nation's nutrition assistance 
programs. I am pleased to be joining my colleagues from the 
Department of Veterans Affairs and appreciate the collaborative 
relationship we have had in serving veterans together.
    We all owe great debts to the veterans who have protected 
and defended our Nation. They have earned our respect and 
honor, and they certainly deserve our support as they may face 
the challenges of life after military service.
    Food and Nutrition Services (FNS) programs are not targeted 
to veterans specifically, but provide food assistance that 
veterans and their families may need, particularly in tough 
times. The largest program, the Supplemental Nutrition 
Assistance Program, or SNAP, currently serves about 36 million 
low-income Americans each month. Census data suggests about 1.3 
million veterans reported receiving SNAP in 2017.
    Let me make clear that, because veteran status is not a 
condition of SNAP eligibility, we do not have veteran status as 
part of the data sets that we use to estimate the impact of our 
rules. Congress debated the collection of this information 
during the last Farm Bill and decided that it was not necessary 
or appropriate at this time. I will focus on the purpose and 
effects of the administration SNAP performs.
    The goals of these actions is to align the program with the 
statute established by Congress to reduce inequities among 
participants and encourage households toward self-sufficiency. 
Those eligible to receive nutrition assistance should be 
treated fairly across this country. Over the years, states have 
set policies that compromise consistency with certain standards 
defined in statute, thereby allowing households in one State to 
be eligible for SNAP or to receive more in SNAP benefits than 
households in another State.
    Last month, USDA finalized a final rule to help more able-
bodied adults between the ages of 18 and 49 who do not have 
dependents, or ABAWDs, into promising futures through job 
training and employment. With a robust economy, unemployment at 
a 50-year low of 3 and a half percent, and more than 7.3 
million job openings, there is no better time to engage this 
group of SNAP participants to get the skills they need to be 
successful in the job market.
    This rule does not change work requirements for ABAWDs that 
were set in the 1996 Welfare Reform Law and have been unchanged 
in every Farm Bill since. Time limits do not apply to children, 
their parents, pregnant women, the mentally or physically 
disabled, or anyone 50 years of age or older. Importantly, the 
disability exception includes veterans who are totally 
disabled, permanently homebound, or in need of a regular 
attendant.
    Those subject to time limits can receive SNAP for 3 months 
in a 3-year period unless they are working, volunteering, or 
participating in training such as SNAP's employment and 
training program or one of VA's work programs for at least 20 
hours a week. These limits account for the fact that not all 
participants are fit for employment. States must screen SNAP 
participants for their ability to work and can exempt part of 
their caseload from the time limit at their full discretion as 
established in law.
    The final rule did not change any of these policies; what 
it did was clarify when and where states may seek to waive time 
limits for those who do not meet the ABAWD work requirements. 
Previous regulations were defined so loosely that counties with 
unemployment as low as 2 and a half percent were waived areas. 
Implementing the limits where jobs are available encourages 
ABAWDs to realize their potential, have a sense of community, 
and move toward an independent lifestyle.
    Two other SNAP proposals are pending. One would eliminate a 
loophole called broad-based categorical eligibility that has 
been used to provide SNAP benefits without conducting a robust 
eligibility determination, resulting in benefits going to 
households that exceed statutory income thresholds. The other 
would modernize the calculation of State standard utility 
allowances, which are important in calculating SNAP benefit 
amounts. Under current policy in one State, an elderly person 
is receiving SNAP benefits two and a half times as much as an 
elderly person across the State line in a similar situation 
simply because of the standard utility allowance.
    Both proposals promote a level playing field for SNAP 
participants, with all treated fairly and consistently. The 
comment period for each is closed and FNS is analyzing comments 
to determine next steps.
    Other USDA nutrition programs also help veterans and I am 
happy to address those as well.
    In closing, I am confident we can provide Americans, 
veterans, heroes, with the services and support that they 
deserve. Not only a nutritional safety net, these programs can 
help launch participants on a path toward better health and a 
better life.
    Thank you, and I am happy to answer any questions you may 
have.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Pamilyn Miller Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Administrator Miller.
    Dr. O'Toole, you are now recognized for 5 minutes for your 
opening statement.

                  STATEMENT OF THOMAS O'TOOLE

    Dr. O'Toole. Good morning, Chairman Levin, Ranking Member 
Bilirakis, and distinguished members of the subcommittee. Thank 
you for the opportunity to testify before you today on ending 
veteran hunger. I am accompanied by Ms. Christine Going, the 
VHA Co-Chair of the Ensuring Veterans Food Security Workgroup.
    There are three points I want to emphasize. First, not 
having enough food to eat is very real for too many Americans 
and for too many of our veterans. Second, the consequences of 
this food insecurity extend far beyond just going to bed 
hungry; its impact is seen in a litany of physical and mental 
health conditions, preventable ER visits and hospitalizations, 
and avoidable deaths. Finally, the Veterans Administration has 
a strong and demonstrated commitment to do all we can to 
address it. One veteran experiencing food insecurity is one too 
many.
    According to the most recent Department of Agriculture 
survey data, more than 11 percent of all households and almost 
one in three households at less than 130 percent of the Federal 
poverty level experience food insecurity. Now, this is despite 
the robust economy and low unemployment rates we have been 
experiencing. Among veterans, while the overall rate is lower, 
specific populations, including younger veterans with families, 
women, low-income veterans, and those with underlying 
depression and psychiatric illnesses, are particularly 
vulnerable.
    In one study, 27 percent of Iraq and Afghanistan war 
veterans reported food insecurity. In another, 48.5 percent of 
homeless and formerly homeless veterans lacked regular access 
to food.
    The consequences of food insecurity are substantial and 
significant. Research has consistently shown the link between 
lacking regular access to food and poorly controlled 
hypertension, diabetes, HIV disease, asthma, depression, 
anxiety, and suicidal ideation. Among older adults, it is 
associated with reduced activities of daily living and being 
over two times more likely to report poor health. Food 
insecurity is a social determinant of health, that along with 
not having stable housing, living poverty, experiencing 
violence, and others are strong predictors for suicide risk 
among veterans. Several international studies have explicitly 
linked food insecurity and suicide risk.
    It is within this context I would like to shift to what we 
are doing about it.
    In early 2016, the Veterans Health Administration launched 
the Ensuring Veterans Food Security Workgroup to partner with 
other government and non-profit agencies in identifying 
veterans at risk, training VA staff, and coordinating resources 
and initiatives. Milestones from these past 3 and a half years 
include implementing an electronic medical record screening 
tool for identifying veteran food insecurity. To date, almost 
100,000 food-insecure veterans have been identified and 
assisted, men and women who might otherwise have gone 
unnoticed.
    Streamlining enrollment of veterans into the Supplemental 
Nutritional Assistance Program, or SNAP, including partnering 
with USDA and MAZON to create veteran-specific educational 
materials; training programs for staff, including a toolkit for 
registered dieticians to support food-insecure veterans; and 
expanding onsite or mobile food pantries at VA medical centers. 
There are currently 57 food pantries in place at VA facilities, 
including the 17 VA Feeding America pantries that alone serve 
more than 40,000 veterans and their families 700,000 meals.
    To conclude, having enough to eat is a basic human need and 
in this country no one should be going without food. It is a 
major determinant of health that needs to be viewed no 
differently than how we consider access to medication or to 
primary care. It is intimately linked to health, and the 
ability to prevent and manage a variety of health conditions, 
not the least of which include mental health and suicide risk.
    Across the VA, we are committed to providing the highest 
quality care our veterans have earned and deserved. Going back 
to the 1921 Veterans' Bureau Act legislation, we have an 
explicit duty and mandate to the health, well-being, and 
welfare of those who served. While we proudly note the progress 
made to address food insecurity among our veterans, there is 
more we can and will do to decrease veteran hunger.
    Moving forward, we need to increase the number of food 
pantries at our medical centers to address the urgent need for 
food, we need to assist and facilitate enrollment in SNAP to 
ensure more consistent access to food, and we need to address 
the root causes of food insecurity through social-determinant-
of-health-focused interventions.
    Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before you 
today, and we are prepared to answer any questions the 
committee may have.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Thomas O'toole Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Dr. O'Toole. With that, I recognize 
myself for 5 minutes to begin the question portion of the 
hearing.
    I did notice the citation that Congress previously rejected 
veteran data tracking in the previous Farm Bill debate and I am 
a freshman Member of Congress, that is true, so I was not here, 
but it is my understanding as well that Congress rejected the 
very rules that you are here defending today. I might still be 
a freshman Member of Congress, but I do have some sense of the 
actions taken by this body in recent years, particularly in my 
role chairing this subcommittee.
    Dr. O'Toole and Ms. Going, a couple questions for you. What 
proportion of the veterans who screen positive for food 
insecurity does VA assist with SNAP eligibility screenings, 
application assistance, or referrals.
    Dr. O'Toole. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    All of our veterans who are screened positive are provided 
assistance. I would like to defer to Ms. Going on some of the 
specific interventions that our social workers and registered 
dieticians do engage in that process.
    Ms. Going. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Yes, any veteran who is screened positive is initially 
offered consultation with a social worker and/or a dietician, 
and in both cases then the care is customized to what the 
veteran needs and one of the questions is are you currently 
receiving SNAP. If they are, then we provide them additional 
services; if they are not, then we assist them in applying for 
SNAP benefits.
    Mr. Levin. So, VA does then monitor ongoing food security 
or SNAP participation for veterans who initially screen 
positive for food insecurity?
    Ms. Going. We do not monitor exactly who has SNAP or who 
does not; it is part of the individual questioning, but it is 
not data that is captured.
    Mr. Levin. You do not. Okay.
    How has the VA collaborated with USDA and with community 
partners to create resources or materials to help raise 
awareness and respond to veteran food insecurity as it exists?
    Ms. Going. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    We have worked with USDA and MAZON to develop veteran-
specific material on how to apply for SNAP, and we have also 
engage nationwide that each facility is responsible for 
developing very specific lists of resources, because resources 
are different based on each VA. Each facility has been asked to 
establish that list based on their local resources.
    Mr. Levin. It seems to me that is a good start, it seems 
that we can always be doing better, and I guess what I wanted 
to ask is what is preventing VA from taking more proactive 
efforts to respond to the needs of veterans who screen positive 
for food insecurity?
    Dr. O'Toole. Well, Mr. Chairman, I would agree with you, 
there is always more we can do, and I think that is actually 
one of the efforts and activities that we are actively engaged 
in through this workgroup. We clearly need to be as proactive 
in connecting veterans to services, but I think also ensuring 
that the consequences of food insecurity that may be manifest, 
and worsening health or mental health, are also being 
concurrently addressed.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you for that.
    Administrator Miller, in considering the proposed rule 
regarding SNAP time limits for able-bodied adults without 
dependents, did USDA consult with VA or analyze the impact, 
specifically the impact on veterans, and, if so, how many 
veterans did you determine would be impacted?
    Ms. Miller. We have data that does encompass the entire 
SNAP population. As we were putting forth the rules and looking 
at our regulatory impact analysis, we looked at our entire SNAP 
population and how they would be affected, and in there it does 
include veterans, but as I said, we do not have specific data 
sets on veterans, because Congress has not given us that 
authority to collect those types of information.
    Mr. Levin. Did you consult with VA?
    Ms. Miller. We did not consult with the VA.
    Mr. Levin. Did you analyze the impact on veterans 
specifically?
    Ms. Miller. It would have been part of our entire SNAP 
population data set that we collect.
    Mr. Levin. But not specifically?
    Ms. Miller. We do not have that data, because it is not 
eligibility, we are not able to specifically assess that.
    Mr. Levin. That is important to understand. How about for 
the proposed rule on broad-based categorical eligibility?
    Ms. Miller. The answer would be the same; again, we look at 
the impacts on our broad SNAP population. If Congress were 
willing to engage in technical assistance and have 
conversation, so if Congress gives that ability to collect that 
data, we are certainly happy to do so.
    Mr. Levin. I assume the answer is the same for the proposed 
rule on the standard utility allowance?
    Ms. Miller. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Levin. Despite the fact that you say that you did not 
have the congressional authorization to carry forward a dialog 
with VA, nonetheless you knew--your own statement, I believe, 
you said 1.3 million veterans received SNAP in 2017; is not 
that what you said?
    Ms. Miller. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Levin. Then you knew that veterans were a uniquely 
important community as part of the SNAP program; did you not?
    Ms. Miller. Our program serves all low-income Americans who 
need assistance and so they would have been captured in our 
data sets for the entire SNAP population.
    Mr. Levin. So veterans have no significance, additional 
importance to you, given their service to our Nation, where 
even a phone call to VA was warranted?
    Ms. Miller. We certainly want to make sure we are serving 
all low-income Americans, including veterans. Our programs----
    Mr. Levin. That is a no, you never contacted VA?
    Ms. Miller. We did not contact VA.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you for that.
    I will go ahead and yield to the ranking member for his 
questions.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I appreciate it.
    Ms. Miller, we are interested in better data collection for 
veterans, as you know, in SNAP, what is the most efficient way 
to gather that information?
    Ms. Miller. The best way to gather this information is 
through the SNAP application process. We have more detailed 
information through the SNAP application process, that is the 
best way for us to gather that data. If we are to require on 
the application that households report their veteran status as 
a condition of eligibility, that does require a statutory 
change and that is what we are lacking at this point.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. Would it take an act of Congress to 
get FNS and the states to collect that information? Why cannot 
USDA require states to provide this data on their own?
    Ms. Miller. Because it would be adding a condition of 
eligibility to the SNAP application process, which requires a 
statutory change. What we are embarking on is a study and it 
would be a survey that would include a question that would help 
us understand veteran status, and so we are embarking on that 
now. That will help us maybe get to some of that data without 
having to change the SNAP application process.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Would FNS find it useful?
    Ms. Miller. Yes, sir, if we could collect the data, that 
would be useful.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. Second question. USDA just finalized 
the able-bodied adults without dependence rule, why does USDA 
believe the criteria for State waivers from the congressionally 
mandated SNAP work requirement need to be changed?
    Ms. Miller. What we have seen right now is we have a very 
robust economy, there are more jobs available than there are 
people who are seeking jobs, and so this is an opportunity for 
us to really engage these able-bodied adults without dependents 
with the resources to help them get into the career field. We 
have got our SNAP Employment and Training Program, we can also 
work through the VA's work programs, and so many other of our 
Federal, State, and local partners, to help engage this 
population.
    We have seen areas with unemployment rates as low as 2 and 
a half percent that have been waived. We think this really is a 
good opportunity to engage these people and making sure that 
ABAWDs are able to return to the workforce.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. For the benefit of the public, when do 
these changes take effect?
    Ms. Miller. The final rule will be implemented April 1st.
    Mr. Bilirakis. April 1st?
    Ms. Miller. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. Why are you making these changes when 
the Farm Bill, the 2018 Farm Bill, made no changes?
    Ms. Miller. We have the authority, our authority was 
retained so that we could address this issue and so, using our 
authority that we have, we are able to do this final rule.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. Has this Administration done anything 
to change the congressionally mandated work requirements that 
were passed as part of the 1996, again, the Welfare Reform Act 
implemented Clinton, Bush, and the Obama administrations?
    Ms. Miller. No, sir. This final rule does not change the 
work requirements, it does not change the time limits. As you 
said, this first was passed on a bipartisan basis, signed into 
law by President Clinton, and it has remained unchanged for 
more than 20 years.
    Mr. Bilirakis. All right, very good.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Ranking Member.
    I would now like to recognize Mr. Pappas for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Pappas. Well, thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I 
share the concern of many folks here that too many veterans are 
food-insecure. Too many are experiencing economic hardships, 
including not knowing where their next meal is going to come 
from.
    I think we all need to leave here with a sense that there 
is so much more to do for those who have worn the uniform of 
this country, pledged everything to the United States, up to 
and including their lives, and it is our job to be able to make 
sure that they are taken care of.
    I wanted to just build on a question that Mr. Bilirakis 
asked you, Ms. Miller, about these rule changes. He asked you 
for a rationale about why these changes were made, why you 
sought to propose these rules, you responded by saying we have 
the authority. I think we are not doubting the authority, but 
can you explain a little bit more about the rationale and also 
talk about the broader population that will be impacted, how 
many will lose SNAP benefits as a result of these rule changes?
    Ms. Miller. Sure. Again, using our authority, we were able 
to implement this final rule, but what we are seeing is that 
there, again, are more job openings than those who are seeking 
jobs, and so knowing this is an able-bodied adult without 
dependents, so we are talking about individuals between the 
ages of 18 and 49, the states have a responsibility to be sure 
they are screening everyone for their assessment for work. We 
are hopeful that, if we can engage this population, we can 
really put them on a path toward a better future.
    States do have the ability to exempt a certain percentage 
of their caseload if they are having difficulty finding work or 
reentering work, but we have had employers reach out to the 
SNAP program about how can we engage with SNAP participants and 
make sure they are getting job training and skills that they 
need to help fill some of the jobs that are out there.
    Again, this is--just given the economy right now, this is a 
great opportunity to engage this population.
    Mr. Pappas. The chairman asked about data for veterans 
specifically and you said you did not have that data, but you 
do have numbers for the broader population of SNAP 
beneficiaries and how that will decrease as a result of these 
rule changes. What is that number?
    Ms. Miller. Six hundred and eighty eight thousand is what 
our estimate showed in Fiscal Year 2021 that may not meet the 
work requirements and so may lose SNAP benefits.
    Mr. Pappas. Six hundred and eighty thousand? We are clearly 
talking about thousands of veterans among that population, I 
think we can extrapolate that figure pretty safely, and we have 
got to do all we can to make sure that those vets get what they 
need. I appreciate the work of the working group, and what you 
are doing to ask the question and identify ways to help our 
vets.
    I am wondering, Mr. O'Toole, if you could talk a little bit 
about those vets that are not seeking care at the VA and what 
the workgroup is doing to reach out to the broader population. 
As we talk about, you know, mental health and suicide, for 
instance, we know that most of the vets that are dying by 
suicide are not connected to care at the VA, a similar 
situation here with food insecurity and those vets that are not 
being reached by these programs. How do we get to them and how 
do we reach them?
    Dr. O'Toole. Thank you, Mr. Congressman, for the question, 
and I think it is an important one to acknowledge in that 
Veterans Health Administration and those enrolled in care in 
the Veterans Health Administration represent only a portion of 
all those men and women who has served our country. The VA has 
launched several initiatives, principally through our suicide 
prevention program, as a means of engaging some of those 
veterans at highest risk and in need and in crisis to try to 
bring them into the system.
    You are right to note that many of the suicides occurring 
are occurring among veterans who are not enrolled in VHA. 
Several initiatives undertaken to help bring some of those 
veterans into our system, as well as to provide community 
resources to them, include the other-than-honorable discharge 
capacities for veterans to seek emergency care and other care 
within the VA system, and I think bringing them in within that 
venue is clearly an option and an opportunity.
    I would like to defer, though, to Ms. Going for specific 
issues within the workgroup that may speak to some of the 
community partnerships you reference.
    Mr. Pappas. Okay.
    Ms. Going. Thank you, Mr. Congressman. The workgroup has on 
an annual basis done education that is intended to the field, 
as well as to the outside. Our educational opportunities were 
advertised to our community partners, so that they could 
participate. You did not have to be a veteran utilizing the VHA 
to be able to listen and participate in our educational series. 
We are currently working on a podcast that will also be 
forward-facing and allow anyone to hear it, it is not limited 
to just veterans receiving care within the VHA.
    Mr. Pappas. Okay. Thanks for your work.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Pappas. We will get to Mr. 
Bergman in 1 second.
    I just wanted to make sure I understand one thing. You know 
the number of veterans that receive SNAP, you know the number 
of overall SNAP beneficiaries that you think will be impacted 
by this proposed rulemaking, and yet you cannot tell me how 
many veterans will be impacted by this proposed rulemaking. I 
am going to ask both agencies, since you are both here, can you 
commit to work together to inform this committee how many 
veterans will be impacted by this proposed rulemaking?
    Ms. Miller. We are happy to work together and look at the 
data that we have, and follow up with you, sir.
    Mr. Levin. Okay. We will follow up and we make sure that we 
do everything we can to get that data, because it is very 
important that this committee understands how many veterans are 
impacted.
    With that, I will yield to Mr. Bergman for his questions.
    Mr. Bergman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thanks to all of 
you for being here. I appreciate Chairman Takano's reference to 
the Guard and Reserve and I wish--unfortunately, he could have 
been here to stay, but I guess this is going to be recorded on 
C-SPAN or somewhere, so he can view it, if he chooses.
    You know, we have got challenges. It is not news to anybody 
and that is why we are having this hearing. When it comes to 
the Guard and Reserve, as opposed to, let us say, servicemen 
and women serving on active duty who just serve honorably and 
then move on with their lives who could be impacted by the 
subject matter here that we are talking about today, is there 
any data out there that suggests, that is broken out by Guard 
and Reserve when it comes to food insecurity? For those of us 
who have served in the Guard and Reserve, you really do not--
you do not move your family, you know, when you get activated 
and deployed, and when your activation, your mobilization is 
complete, then you in most cases will return home to your 
hometown, go back to whatever business you were in before, and 
then continue on in your Guard and Reserve duty.
    The stability of the home life, the family life of the 
Guardsman or Reserve in some cases does not mirror, in many 
cases does not mirror that of, you know, men and women serving 
actively, and then leave active service and then find 
themselves at risk. Is there any data out there that suggests 
any correlation between the stability of home life in the Guard 
and Reserve and active when it comes to this subject?
    Dr. O'Toole. Thank you, Mr. Congressman, and I think your 
point is well taken in terms of those specific needs and 
issues. I would have to defer to the Department of Defense 
(DOD) on any data that they have been collecting. I do know 
that Feeding America has conducted some work and has been 
involved in collecting some of that data, but, again, I would 
have to defer to them on any specific----
    Mr. Bergman. I guess----
    Dr. O'Toole. We do not have that information.
    Mr. Bergman. No. Thank you for your answering because, 
actually, this is quite an opportunity for DOD, VA, USDA, 
whoever else to collaborate on the sharing of data as it 
relates to all men and women who serve in uniform, whether they 
be active, guard, reserve.
    You mentioned, Dr. O'Toole, about a tie between food 
insecurity and suicide risk. You also have several--it has been 
stated from you and from up here that many of these veterans at 
risk are outside the VA health care system.
    Have you tried anything or considered anything that would 
allow different ways to reach the population outside the VA? I 
know I heard podcast. But that is only--if that veteran is not 
connected to the internet and is in a rural or remote area, any 
different things that you have tried yet, whether they be 
successful or not?
    Dr. O'Toole. Thank you for the question, Mr. Congressman. I 
think it is important as we think about food insecurity to also 
realize that often times it is not occurring in isolation. As I 
mentioned, some of the suicide prevention initiatives and 
efforts of reaching out to the community are one example for 
how we can be tapping into that population and trying to reach 
out and engage in a community way.
    Other efforts within VA include our homeless outreach to 
not only veterans, men and women who served who are homeless, 
but also those who are at risk of homeless through Supportive 
Services for Veteran Families (SSVF) programming, through stand 
downs and such.
    I think the convergence of these issues and needs within 
those outreach efforts do provide us an opportunity. You know, 
is there more we can do, absolutely. I think it will always be 
a challenge for us because there is a lot of people who choose 
not to go to the VA despite services and capacities that are 
there. I think these are many--these are some of several 
efforts across different, you know, population group needs that 
I think provide opportunities for us.
    Mr. Bergman. Well, I guess--and you can take this for the 
record, but what help can we as Veterans Affairs Committee give 
to VA in this case to enable an outreach that is not currently 
occurring because people are outside the system, what help can 
we give you as VA to complete that outreach to those veterans 
who are outside the system?
    With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Bergman.
    I would now like to recognize Ms. Lee for 5 minutes.
    Ms. Lee. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you all for 
being here. This is such an important issue for our veterans.
    You know, I also sit on the Education and Labor Committee 
and a few weeks ago we conducted an oversight hearing on the 
Department of Agriculture's proposed SNAP rule that eliminates 
broad based categorical eligibility. The finding was that it 
eliminates access for about a million school children to free 
and reduced lunch, and incredibility frustrating to be on the 
committee with this rule that the Department did not include 
that impact in its initial regulatory impact analysis. Then 
after it did publish the analysis showing this effect, it 
continued to pursue the rule.
    That is just a--I just wanted to point out that 
frustration. Then in my home State of Nevada 17,000 veterans 
receive SNAP benefits, and we know that low income veterans may 
be unemployed, working low wage jobs or have disability. SNAP 
provides such an essential support that enables them to 
purchase food for their families.
    You know, given this pattern, I just want to raise a 
question about the USDA's priorities. Why has the USDA 
prioritized regulatory actions that would reduce State 
flexibilities, limit access to SNAP and increase food 
insecurity rather than actions that would be more proactive and 
responsive?
    Ms. Miller. Thank you for the question.
    Our goal with these proposed regulations and the final rule 
is to align the program with the statute. The statute is very 
clear in setting income limits as well as asset limits for who 
should be receiving SNAP. We are trying to align the program 
with the statute and make sure that participants are treated 
fairly and consistently across the country because we know that 
folks in California are being determined eligible very 
differently than folks who are living in Virginia, for example.
    What we are trying to do is really make sure that everyone 
is on a level playing field. Regardless of which State you live 
in, SNAP participants should know the expectations of how they 
should apply and what the requirements are because the statute, 
you know, defines that for us.
    We are trying to align the program with the statute and 
make sure that everyone is treated fairly and consistently.
    Ms. Lee. Basically, it is our duty to change the statute if 
we want to see additional eligibility.
    Ms. Miller. Yes, ma'am. Congress has that ability to do so.
    Ms. Lee. Okay.
    Ms. Miller. We are happy to always work with you all, 
provide technical assistance, if there are any legislative 
proposals you would like to pursue.
    Ms. Lee. One question I have, so we know that there is 
millions of Americans who are experiencing food insecurity, 
including veterans, and are eligible to--for SNAP, but they do 
not receive the benefits. How is the USDA addressing that SNAP 
participation gap?
    Ms. Miller. We want to make sure that our program does 
reach those who are in need and those who qualify and are 
eligible for the program. States have the ability and they do 
some outreach in making sure that they work with different 
partners, whether it be through other Federal agencies like our 
collaboration has been with the VA in making sure that we have 
provided some training to their case workers and so that they 
know some of those requirements.
    I think there is some outreach opportunities at the State 
level and working with some of our other Federal partners.
    Ms. Lee. The USDA is not taking any ownership of that. It 
is really through those partnerships?
    Ms. Miller. The law prohibits us from doing direct outreach 
for SNAP as part of the 2014 Farm Bill.
    Ms. Lee. Dr. O'Toole, I wanted to thank you for coming in 
today and your work with the veteran food security work group. 
I am particularly concerned given the findings of the 2013 
study that vets with food insecurity tend to be younger, not 
married, earning lower incomes at a lower military pay scale. I 
cannot help but be concerned about student vets.
    I wanted to ask you, you listed numerous actions being 
taken by the VA identifying veterans who experience food 
insecurity, and I applaud that. What can we do to capture 
student veteran hunger?
    Dr. O'Toole. Thank you, Congresswoman.
    The population groups you mentioned are all very vulnerable 
and part of that vulnerability comes from the many challenges 
they experience as they transition from military to civilian 
life, often times with--while still bearing the scars of battle 
and many of the challenges that are associated with that, 
whether it is Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) or other 
conditions and challenges. Being able to enter into gainful 
employment, being able to fully engage are clearly an issue.
    I think obviously the role of student veterans and the 
dynamics that they are struggling with and shortfalls that may 
occur in their capacity to sustain a household are equally 
pronounced.
    I would have to take for the record specific plans and 
actions that we may be able to do specific to that population 
group, but I appreciate you bringing it up.
    Ms. Lee. Thank you.
    My time is expired. Thank you.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Ms. Lee.
    I would now like to recognize my friend, Mr. Barr, for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. Barr. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank Chairman 
Levin and Ranking Member Bilirakis for holding this important 
hearing and addressing this important issue of food insecurity 
among our veterans. I particularly appreciate my friend, Mr. 
Levin, for his passion because we talked about this before the 
hearing today. I know he is very passionate about it. We all 
care very, very deeply, especially when we find homeless 
veterans in our communities, folks who interact with the VA and 
veterans who do not interact with the VA, who struggle with 
food insecurity.
    Dr. O'Toole, I was obviously moved by your testimony that--
when you said that the VA's food insecurity screening tool 
found that over the last 2 years one and a half percent of all 
veterans are screening positive for food insecurity. I just 
think, wow, you know, what about those veterans who do not even 
get the screening. You have got additional food insecurity 
there.
    My view is that for a veteran that is not disabled, 
especially a veteran who is not disabled without--and does not 
have dependents, the best thing we can do for that veteran is 
to get him a good job, a good job, a job that is a win for that 
veteran, obviously, because it addresses that issue of food 
insecurity and shelter insecurity and everything else.
    It is great for the employer because these are heroes to 
our country and they have got great skills to offer these 
employers. You know, let us face it. The economy is doing 
really, really well right now and we have a million more job 
openings in this country than we have unemployed people. What 
if we could fill those job openings with veterans? That is what 
we need to do. That is what we have got to focus on doing.
    I want to talk about what the USDA is doing to try to 
encourage work among, not just our veterans, but others, and 
getting folks back into the labor market.
    Let me ask my first question to Ms. Miller. With respect to 
this able-bodied adults without dependents rule, why does the 
USDA believe that the criteria for State waivers from the 
congressionally mandated SNAP work requirements need to be 
changed?
    Ms. Miller. Thank you, Congressman, and as you just 
commented it was--it is really focused on the fact that we do 
have a very robust economy right now, and there are more job 
openings available than there are job seekers. This seems like 
a perfect environment where we should be engaging this 
population and helping them move into work and getting the 
skills that they need.
    We have programs such as our SNAP employment and training 
program. States are required to run those programs. We do 
provide them with formula funding as well as we have the 
opportunity to provide matching funds as they continue to 
expand and grow their employment and training programs to help 
SNAP participants, these able-bodied adults without dependents 
get the job skills that they need.
    Mr. Barr. Let us go back, Ms. Miller, to your testimony 
about--it is congress's job to change the statutory 
requirements, if needed. I for one do not want to change the 
statutory requirements. I think the waivers have actually 
impeded people from getting back in the workforce.
    Let us just go back to the statute that was a bipartisan 
statute and let us just examine that for a minute. The statute 
limits participation by adults 18 to 49. We are not talking 
about seniors. We are not talking about anybody younger than 
18. We are talking about a prime age worker, 18 to 49, without 
a dependent and without a disability. We are not talking about 
veterans with disabilities here. We are talking about non-
disabled, no dependent veterans between the ages of 18 and 49, 
prime working years. Okay. There is a time limit, 36 months for 
SNAP, unless, unless the individual is working or participating 
in a work program for at least 80 hours per month, that is 20 
hours a week, or volunteering. They can volunteer. They do not 
even have to work. They just have to volunteer, do something 
that gets them work capable.
    Am I describing the underlying statute correctly?
    Ms. Miller. Yes, sir. Everything you have said is correct.
    Mr. Barr. I do not think it is stingy, I do not think the 
statute is stingy. I think the statute actually creates great, 
positive incentives for able-bodied, work capable, no 
dependents, prime age workers to do something to get them back 
into a productive place where they can be self-sufficient. When 
we are talking about food insecurity, to me that is what--that 
is exactly what we need to be promoting.
    To the extent that states are impeding that incentive 
structure, I think that does a great disservice to these heroes 
to our country and encouraging them to be more dependent than 
independent.
    One final question, Ms. Miller. In MAZON's testimony they 
tell a story of a Navy veteran in Maine. The veteran's benefits 
for SNAP were not extended even though the Department of Labor 
ruled him unable to work. Would the proposed rule change for 
State waivers impact people in similar situations?
    Ms. Miller. That was--is an unfortunate situation, and so 
the states have the responsibility to be sure they are properly 
screening individuals for their fitness for work. We can--if 
there are situations like that, we can certainly work with the 
states to provide technical assistance because if he did have 
information from Department of Labor, that would satisfy those 
requirements of having that individual not be subject to the 
final rule that we are talking about.
    Mr. Barr. Okay. Thank you.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Barr. I appreciate your comments 
and working with you on this issue on a bipartisan basis.
    I would now like to recognize Miss Rice for 5 minutes.
    Miss Rice. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    I do not have a question. I just have a comment. I cannot 
believe that we are sitting here talking about this. We should 
all be humiliated that we are talking about taking food away 
from any man or woman, however able-bodied they may be, who 
wore the uniform of this country.
    We must strive to build communities that truly serve, 
support and protect our veterans from the very first moment 
they return to civilian life. I did not say that. Those are the 
words of President Trump. For him to allow you to implement a 
ban like this, basically, to take food out of the mouths of a 
veteran is nothing short of un-American and inhumane. I do not 
even--I cannot even believe we are sitting here talking about 
this.
    You are sitting here and you are talking about--you are 
using terms like level playing field when you are talking about 
taking food away from people. This is disgusting. We are 
sitting up here saying, what can we do. I think we all know 
what we can do and we should just do it so we do not have to 
hear people like you talking about level playing fields when 
you are talking about men and women who wore the uniform of 
this country not being able to get food.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Miss Rice.
    I would now like to recognize Mr. Meuser for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Meuser. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all.
    Clearly a difficult issue, one in which I think we all 
agree in the end, anyone who cannot afford to maintain a level 
of nutrition and food, we--particularly a veteran we as a 
country, we as communities engage in. I, myself, donate 
regularly to food banks, and there are quite a few of them. 
That is for sure. There are some food banks that are--that 
exist for the purpose of veterans. I have one in my district 
known as the Keystone Food Bank.
    What we need to figure out is how to get it done, right, in 
a way that is accountable. I have the Lebanon VA in my 
district. It takes a very holistic view of veteran services. 
They work with many community organizations to connect whenever 
they feel that there is benefits that are not in line with what 
the best interest of the veteran and the deserving.
    Is that a best practice that is encouraged or modeled or 
taught for other VAs to really take this holistic approach, ask 
the questions, not just look at the data of what their income 
levels are?
    Dr. O'Toole. Thank you, Congressman, for that question. I 
think it highlights both an important point and really 
underscores what we view in the VA as our mission. We see our 
role and job as going far beyond just making sure that we are 
managing a health condition or a health problem, but really 
trying to take care of the entire veteran. That extends through 
many examples.
    I would wholeheartedly concur with the great work that is 
being done at the Lebanon VA and the leadership there and the 
staff there and their commitment to those men and women who 
served. It is a great testimony and example of what we are 
trying to do. It gets back to the larger issue in the context 
of food insecurity that we have to look at food insecurity not 
only in isolation, but what are the root causes to it, and work 
with the veteran and support the veteran through that context 
of helping them secure, in addition, stable housing and stable 
employment to addressing domestic violence issues, providing 
the supports that they need so they can support their families.
    That goes far beyond a prescription pad. I appreciate you 
bringing it up. That is very much our commitment, and it is 
also the strategic approach that we have taken to the food 
insecurity screener and the interdisciplinary and team-based 
approached to trying to address what is a much deeper problem 
than just food.
    Mr. Meuser. Yes. I also just want to, before my next 
question, commend the Department of Veterans Affairs, 
particularly over the last 2 years, the MISSION Act, the 
Veterans Choice Act have been implemented on a bipartisan 
basis, but very much led by Secretary Wilkie and your staff. 
Most of you are veterans and, if not, you have dedicated your 
lives more or less, your working lives, to serving veterans. I 
see that throughout the Veterans Administration, and it is 
appreciated.
    Not only is it appreciated by me, since I have 55,000 
veterans in my district, it is appreciated by the veterans and 
their families. They have seen improvements, not just from the 
Lebanon VA, but the VA as a whole. You know, it was not too 
long ago, a couple of years ago, 3, 4 years ago that all we saw 
were disasters within various veterans administrations. The 
work that has been done, we are caring for our veterans better 
now.
    Is there work to do? Absolutely. Such things as the Improve 
Act that we need to pass and provide more community services, 
so as we have the hybrid approach toward the best possible care 
for our veterans. I really commend you for your work and your 
dedication, and thank you for your service.
    The other thing I wanted to ask you, the USDA, who is very 
active in my district, and the Department of Veterans Affairs, 
do they work in unison? Is there a cooperative effort there in 
this regard related to food?
    Ms. Miller. Yes, sir, there is. We work closely. We have 
had some training programs with some of the veterans VA case 
workers so that they are familiar with our programs and helping 
connect vets to our programs.
    Mr. Meuser. All right. Great.
    I yield back, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Meuser.
    With that I would like to thank our first panel. I would 
now like to call up our second panel. While everyone is 
switching around we will take just a minute.
    [Pause]
    Mr. Levin. All right. Thank you, everybody.
    On the second panel today we have Josh Protas, Vice 
President of Public Policy at MAZON: A Jewish Response to 
Hunger. Thank you for being here.
    Also joining us is Denise Hollywood, Chief Community & 
Programs Officer at Blue Star Families.
    Finally, we have Vince Hall, the CEO of Feeding San Diego.
    Thank you all so much for joining us. I am looking forward 
to getting your perspective.
    As you know we will have 5 minutes for your oral statement, 
but your full written statement will be added to the record.
    Ms. Protas, you are now recognized for 5 minutes, or Mr. 
Protas, excuse me. Please use the microphone.

                    STATEMENT OF JOSH PROTAS

    Mr. Protas. Thank you.
    Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and distinguished 
members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to 
testify today. My name is Josh Protas and I am proud to serve 
as Vice President of Public Policy for MAZON: A Jewish Response 
to Hunger.
    Inspired by Jewish values and ideals, MAZON takes to heart 
the responsibility to care for the most vulnerable in our midst 
without judgment or precondition. For nearly 10 years we have 
prioritized addressing the long overlooked issue of hunger 
among veterans and military families. The Supplemental 
Nutrition Assistance Program or SNAP is the most crucial tool 
in supporting veterans who struggle to put food on the table.
    Unfortunately, it is under attack through administrative 
actions that will increase hunger and hardship for struggling 
veterans. I would like to tell you about one of these 
individuals, Tim Keefe, a Navy veteran in Maine. I spoke with 
Tim last week and he agreed to allow me to share his very 
painful experience.
    After being injured Tim could not return to work and fell 
on hard times. He applied for SNAP so that he could afford to 
buy food. Because the State of Maine chose not to waive the 
time limit for able-bodied adults without dependents or ABAWDs, 
Tim lost SNAP benefits after only 3 months. 3 months is the 
limit, not 36.
    He repeatedly asked to the numerous officials who passed 
him along in the bureaucratic maze, what do I eat between now 
and then? Nobody had an answer for Tim. Without SNAP, Tim had 
no assistance and became homeless. He resorted to scrounging 
for food and even catching squirrels to eat to get buy.
    Reflecting on his time, Tim shared, ``There were many times 
when I would go 2 or even 3 days without food. The food bank 
has only limited resources. I had to add 7 holes on my belt to 
keep my pants on.'' For people like Tim, SNAP can literally 
save lives. We know that SNAP helps about 1.3 million low 
income veterans, but a recent report suggests that nearly two-
thirds of veterans who struggle with hunger and are eligible 
for SNAP are not currently enrolled. Nobody, and certainly no 
veteran like Tim, should ever be forced to ask, what do I eat 
because they cannot get the help they need from the country 
they fought to protect.
    MAZON urges Congress to, one, protect and improve SNAP. 
USDA must withdraw the 3 harmful proposals that would strip 
SNAP benefits from millions of Americans, including veterans. 
Of particular concern is the rule that would restrict waivers 
from current SNAP time limits. This rule is not nuanced. It is 
not flexible. It is not a reflection of the realities of 
struggling Americans. It is entirely inappropriate for USDA to 
move forward with changes to SNAP without understanding how 
they will impact America's veterans.
    Food insecurity can often trigger a downward spiral of 
economic hardship and despair which, unfortunately, can lead to 
suicide. Improving access to SNAP for struggling veterans is an 
important tool in the campaign to end veteran suicide and needs 
to be prioritized.
    Two, connect veterans to SNAP. We are pleased that the VA 
took MAZON's advice in 2015 to start screening veterans for 
food insecurity. The current process is not doing enough and 
does not capture all veterans who struggle. VA must adopt the 
validated 2 question hunger vital sign screening tool to more 
accurately identify all veterans who are at risk of food 
insecurity.
    For veterans who screen positive, VA should require and 
provide onsite SNAP eligibility and application assistance, 
which is not happening broadly.
    Three, share nutrition assistance information during 
transition. VA should integrate materials about programs like 
SNAP as part of the transition assistance program and other 
veteran outreach efforts. Include this information as part of 
the new solid star veteran suicide prevention initiative and 
work with USDA and community partners like MAZON to develop 
veteran specific resources about SNAP.
    Four, listen to veterans. Negative public perceptions of 
SNAP are ramped up by proposals to restrict the program for 
only certain Americans. This creates a chilling effect and adds 
to the stigma and shame that make veterans and others reluctant 
to seek help that they need. This committee should hold a 
follow up hearing to listen to veterans who have real lived 
experiences with food insecurity.
    Last, Congress must address the related issue of hunger 
among currently serving military families that has been ignored 
for far too long. MAZON believes this is an urgent matter of 
national security, military readiness, retention and 
recruitment.
    The best way we can support and honor the veterans is to 
ensure that they have what they need and never have to struggle 
with hunger. For someone like Tim, that means ensuring access 
to SNAP. When Tim turned 50, the state's SNAP time limit no 
longer applied and he was able, once again, to get the 
assistance he so desperately needed. Tim is in a much better 
place now. He wants to make sure that others, veterans and non-
veterans alike, do not fall through the cracks like he did.
    Thank you. I look forward to your questions.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Josh Protas Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you. I appreciate that.
    I would now like to recognize Ms. Hollywood for her opening 
statement.

                 STATEMENT OF DENISE HOLLYWOOD

    Ms. Hollywood. Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member and 
distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for the 
opportunity to testify before you today. My name is Denise 
Hollywood and I am the Chief Community & Programs Officer at 
Blue Star Families.
    Blue Star Families builds communities that support military 
families by connecting research and data to programs and 
solutions. Since its inception in 2009, we have engaged tens of 
thousands of volunteers and served more than 1.5 million 
military family members. Blue Star Families is nationally 
recognized for our annual military family lifestyle survey, 
which uses both quantitative and qualitative data to reveal a 
snapshot of the current status of military families.
    In our 2018 survey of our 10,000 respondents, we found that 
7 percent of military family respondents and 12 percent of 
veteran family respondents indicated that someone in their 
household had faced food insecurity in the past year.
    Additionally, 9 percent of military family respondents and 
18 percent of veteran family respondents indicated that someone 
in their household had sought emergency food assistance through 
a food bank, food pantry or charitable organization.
    In order to comprehend the issue of food insecurity among 
veteran families, we must first understand the factors that 
contribute to food insecurity while these families are still 
actively serving in the military.
    Such factors include high rates of military spouse 
unemployment and under-employment, limited availability and 
high cost of childcare, out of pocket relocation and housing 
expenses, and unexpected financial emergencies. Many of these 
factors arise from frequent relocation due to military orders.
    According to the Department of Defense, active duty 
military families relocate on average once every 2 to 3 years 
typically across State lines or overseas. Frequent relocation 
makes it difficult for military spouses to find and maintain 
gainful employment, partly because employers are wary of hiring 
individuals who have gaps in their resumes as a result of 
previous moves.
    If a military spouse works in a licensed profession, he or 
she must also undergo the costly processing of re-licensing in 
a new State. In 2018, we found that 30 percent of military 
spouse respondents were unemployed. This figure dwarfs the 
civilian unemployment rate which, in 2018, was less than 4 
percent. 56 percent of military spouse respondents who would 
have liked to be employed cited childcare as a reason for why 
they were not currently working.
    Meanwhile, 70 percent of millennial military family 
respondents reported that having two incomes was vital to their 
family's well being. Thus, the military spouse employment 
crisis directly contributes to food insecurity by preventing 
military families from achieving a vital second source of 
income.
    The financial difficulties of modern military families are 
further compounded by frequent out of pocket relocation 
expenses. Although the Federal Government covers the majority 
of the expenses incurred due to relocation, one-third of 
respondents reported spending over $1,000 in un-reimbursed 
expenses during their last military move.
    All of these factors, out of pocket expenses, rising costs 
of childcare, spouse unemployment and others, can contribute to 
food insecurity among currently serving military families.
    Food insecurity among active duty military families does 
not end when service members retire. To the contrary, the 
financial difficulties of military families can be aggravated 
by transition related challenges. It is critical that we work 
to address the underlying causes of military and veteran family 
food insecurity.
    At the same time, however, this committee can take 
immediate steps to address veteran hunger by protecting and 
strengthening programs like SNAP that alleviate veteran hunger; 
instructing the VA and USDA to be more proactive in their 
efforts to identify veterans who are experiencing food 
insecurity; and establishing VA partnerships with non-profits 
to help reach veterans who are not receiving services through 
the VA network.
    The Federal Government must also work to expand its data 
collection around military and veteran family food insecurity 
so as to better inform policy responses to these issues. Blue 
Star Families is well situated to help in this endeavor.
    I would like to again thank the distinguished members of 
the subcommittee for the efforts to eliminate military and 
veteran hunger. Those who make significant sacrifices for our 
country should never struggle to put food on the table.
    Thank you.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Denise Hollywood Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Ms. Hollywood.
    Now I would like to recognize Mr. Hall for 5 minutes, and 
thank you for all your good work in my neck of the woods out in 
North County, San Diego.

                    STATEMENT OF VINCE HALL

    Mr. Hall. Well, Chairman Levin, thank you so much, Ranking 
Member Bilirakis, and distinguished members of the committee. 
My name is Vince Hall. I'm the Chief Executive Officer (CEO) of 
Feeding San Diego, which is a leading hunger relief and food 
rescue organization in San Diego County. We are also a very 
proud member of the Feeding American network.
    For perspective, San Diego is 4,500 square miles. It has a 
population of 3.4 million people, making it larger than 20 U.S. 
states. It has one of the largest concentrations of veterans 
and military personnel in the world. Our Navy, Marine, Coast 
Guard bases and National Guard armories are a critical part of 
this Nation's national defense infrastructure. Our county is 
home to 143,000 active duty military, 260,000 military 
dependents, 243,000 veterans, and 583,000 family members of 
veterans. Over 1.2 million San Diegans, 37 percent of our 
population, have direct ties to the military. It is a proud 
heritage, but it comes with solemn responsibilities.
    The greatest among these responsibilities is to ensure that 
our veteran and military families have a dignified quality of 
life that honors their sacrifices. All too often, despite the 
efforts of our government, it falls to organizations like 
Feeding San Diego and Feeding America to close this significant 
gap between what our heroes have and what they need to provide 
for their families.
    I am proud of my organization, but I take no pride in the 
fact that our country stations people in San Diego without 
paying them enough to live in San Diego. I take no pride in 
seeing ever larger numbers of veterans lining up at our Feeding 
Heroes food pantries every year.
    Now the good news is that Feeding San Diego has innovative 
food rescue approaches to delivering healthy, fresh and 
nutritious food that would otherwise go to waste. Last year we 
rescued 24 million pounds of food that was going to leave the 
food system and go to the waste system from stores, farms, 
manufacturers and other sources.
    With our faith-based and charitable partners across the 
county, we distributed 26 million meals worth of food, 97 
percent of which was rescued food that otherwise would have 
gone to a landfill. According to the USDA, 40 percent of the 
food in this country goes to waste every day. That is more than 
enough to solve hunger for every man, woman and child in need.
    Through our partnership with Feeding America, we rescue 
food in San Diego County from 200 Starbucks stores every night 
of the year, 260 grocery stores, 19 school district central 
kitchens and dozens of other sources. We also rescue fresh 
produce from 225 farms and packing sheds up and down the State 
of California through our partnership with the California 
Association of Food Banks.
    We could not do this by ourselves. We are proud to partner 
with 170 religious and charitable organizations across the 
county who work hand in hand with us to implement this 
innovative model. Many of these organizations are specifically 
focused on the needs of veterans and active duty military 
families, groups like the United Service Organizations (USO), 
US for Warriors, Courage to Call, Military Outreach Ministries, 
and Support the Enlisted Project.
    Our distributions reach families through a dignified 
farmer's market-style model, which allows individuals to select 
the foods that are best for their families' needs. Our military 
can access fresh, nutritious fruits and vegetables without 
stigma or unnecessary bureaucracy through these pantries.
    As strong as our efforts are, there is much more to be done 
and there are serious threats to our progress. We are asking 
Congress to do several things which would help us to finally 
solve veteran and military family hunger. Foremost among these 
is to oppose cuts to the SNAP program which threaten millions 
of Americans, including many of the veteran and active duty 
military families that we serve.
    Feeding America is 200 food banks strong. For every one 
meal that is provided by our entire network, the SNAP program 
provides 9 meals. So even a relatively small cut to the SNAP 
program threatens to create a staggering increase in demand at 
America's food banks, a demand that we simply cannot meet.
    I also encourage Congress to include needed improvements in 
child nutrition re-authorization which will help to increase 
food access for the children of military and veteran families.
    I want to end my testimony by sharing Desiree's story. 
Desiree participates in our Feeding Heroes' program. Her 
husband is a communications officer in the Navy who makes just 
over $34,000 per year. She has 4 kids and her husband has been 
deployed now for nearly 8 months. She told us that she knew 
life as a military spouse was going to have its challenges. She 
never expected that one of those challenges would be feeding 
her own children.
    Thousands of military families face similar challenges. We 
see too many kids standing in food lines while their parents 
are serving on the front lines.
    It has been an honor to testify today on behalf of everyone 
we serve at Feeding San Diego, including Desiree and her 
family.
    Thank you.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Vince Hall Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you so much, Mr. Hall, for your leadership 
and your work in San Diego. I am glad this has provided an 
opportunity to highlight some of the great work you are doing.
    Really for all 3 of you, thank you as non-governmental 
leaders and experts for bringing your perspective today.
    I want to thank the VA representatives for sticking around 
to hear them.
    Is anyone from USDA still here?
    Let the record--yes, someone is from USDA still here? No.
    Let the record reflect that no one from the United States 
Department of Agriculture who administers the SNAP program took 
the time to stay to listen to non-governmental organization 
experts who see firsthand in the field how food insecurity is 
impacting the veteran community. Let the record reflect that.
    With now I would like to turn to some questions.
    Mr. Hall, I was really delighted to join you recently to 
tour your distribution center, and I enjoyed learning about all 
the good work that you are doing and how you do it.
    Are most veterans that you see that are referred to Feeding 
San Diego, do they get there from VA or from elsewhere? Can you 
comment on any stigma or any reluctance to seek assistance 
among food insecure veterans?
    Mr. Hall. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    The referral system is very informal and it often happens 
through peer networks. We have different groups of veterans 
that we serve. Transitioning veterans who have just left the 
service or perhaps as long as 5 or 10 years who are still 
trying to find their footing in civilian life find us through 
support organizations that they turn to shortly after their 
discharge from active duty.
    Senior veterans might come to us through neighborhood-based 
senior programs, and it is only as we begin to serve them that 
we learn that they are veterans who might be eligible for VA 
benefits and services.
    A lot of just person to person referrals cause people to 
find their way to our food pantries, even the VA medical center 
in San Diego consistently refers people to Feeding San Diego 
for hunger relief services.
    You hit on a key point, Mr. Chairman, and that is stigma; 
that no one who has worn the uniform of the country feels pride 
in accessing food through hunger relief charities. It is really 
our duty, our obligation morally to support those who have 
served this country to ensure that they do not need to turn to 
charitable organizations to have a minimal quality of life 
after they, themselves, have put their life on the line for 
this country.
    Only by partnering with these organizations that have the 
trust of veterans do we find that we are able to create safe 
environments where we minimize that stigma and maximize their 
dignity. It is still always an ever-present challenge.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you for that.
    Mr. Protas, you noted in your testimony that VA's current 
screening tool of a single question only identifies veterans at 
risk of very low food security.
    Can you explain the difference between very-low and low 
food insecurity and why it is important to identify and address 
both.
    Mr. Protas. Sure. Thank you for the question.
    The difference is really a technical difference in the way 
that USDA defines the two. Low food insecurity is defined as 
households with reduced--that have reduced the quality, 
variety, and desirability of their diets, but the quantity of 
food intake and normal eating patterns were not substantially 
disrupted.
    Very-low food insecurity describes that at times during the 
year, eating patterns of one or more household members were 
disrupted and food intake reduced, because the household lacked 
money or other resources for food.
    The truth is, both of those categories are considered food 
insecure and that people have to alter their eating habits, 
which ultimately results in poorer nutrition and poorer health 
outcomes.
    The single question that is being asked, we think, 
captures, really just those who experience very-low food 
insecurity, and the rate--it is under 2 percent that they are 
determining. We know that the rates for certain parts of the 
veteran population, and veterans in general, are much higher 
than that, so many people are falling through the cracks.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you for that.
    For both you and Mr. Hall, by USDA's own admission, its 
recent proposed rule changes to SNAP will lead to significant 
reductions in SNAP participation, which will, no doubt, include 
loss of SNAP benefits for struggling veterans; although, as I 
am sure you remember from our first panel, they do not know how 
many, although they promise to get us that number, though they 
are not here anymore to hear this.
    Mr. Hall, as an organization that provides both, direct 
food and also enrolls individuals in SNAP, what impact do you 
think these changes are going to have for your organization, 
for Feeding San Diego? Do you--and other food banks and 
pantries across the country, do you have the capacity to make 
up for these cuts while also maintaining the robust emergency 
response that you provide to the San Diego community?
    Mr. Hall. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    The short answer to the question is no, we do not have that 
capacity. It is so complicated to get somebody enrolled in SNAP 
under the current eligibility criteria that we have had to 
redirect our staff resources to not just helping people apply 
for SNAP, but, instead, doing fewer applications and helping 
more people through the entirety of the documentation process 
to get them to the finish line where they can receive SNAP 
benefits. We have actually scaled back our enrollment process 
to meet the complex bureaucracy that surrounds the existing 
SNAP program. This is going to add an entirely new layer of 
complication, which we cannot afford to support.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you.
    Mr. Protas, what is the experience in Maine that you 
highlighted in your testimony teach about the ability for 
hunger-relief organizations to mitigate the impact to veterans 
from SNAP policy changes?
    Mr. Protas. Sure. Thank you for the question.
    In 2015, then-Governor LePage, the Governor of Maine, chose 
not to take State waivers for the time limits on SNAP, even 
though the State was eligible for those waivers. The State saw 
an increase in hunger that resulted. Thousands of Mainers, 
including about 2800 veterans, lost access to SNAP.
    It did not mean that they had a bettering of their life 
circumstances. It did not mean that because they lost the 
$1.40-per person, per-meal benefit, that they were inspired to 
get work.
    I think the short goal is to get people back to work who 
can, but just taking food away from people does not magically 
make them work, and that was the case that happened in Maine. 
The story from Tim that I shared was a very personal story of 
somebody who was hurt, but we know that there were thousands of 
other veterans and tens of thousands of other Mainers who lost 
access to SNAP and went hungry, as a result of that change.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you very much.
    With that, I would like to turn it over to the ranking 
member, Mr. Bilirakis.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you--very much.
    Mr. Chairman, I understand that the statute--and I agree 
with you, the USDA should be here; they should have stayed--but 
I understand they are barred by statute, they cannot request 
the veteran status, and I would like to discuss that with you, 
because we have to give them that authority to do so. I would 
appreciate that. I understand it was taken out in the Farm 
Bill, that authority. Let us get that done together.
    Doing down the panel, and I guess we will start with Mr. 
Protas--is that okay--would you support an increase in the 
Federal Government's ability to require States to track the 
veteran status of SNAP beneficiaries, and if not, why not?
    Mr. Protas. I think I would support that. I think USDA has 
ways to collect information right now that they are not. The 
estimates about the 1.3 million veterans who participate in 
SNAP currently comes from census bureau data from the American 
Community Survey. There are ways to get this data and to get 
information.
    I think it would be fine to inquire about veteran status, 
but that should not be the barrier to USDA in doing more to 
examine this problem.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. I do want to commend all the groups 
for all of your good work in helping our heroes. I really 
appreciate it so much and we respect you tremendously.
    Again, the question for Mr. Protas and Mr. Hall, Feeding 
San Diego, do you believe that SNAP should be a temporary-
assistance program? Mr. Protas first.
    Mr. Protas. I think for the vast majority of SNAP 
participants, SNAP is temporary assistance and it works the way 
it was designed, but there are some individuals--those who are 
disabled, those who are not able to work--where it may provide 
longer-term support.
    Ideally, people get back to work and SNAP is a stepping-
stone, but if they do not have jobs in their communities and 
there are not job-training opportunities, it is difficult. 
There are many barriers people face to work.
    Ms. Miller talking about employment and training programs, 
and I think that is really important. We saw in the last Farm 
Bill that there were 10 pilot programs for employment-training 
programs and we should see what works out of those. We should 
see the results of those employment-training programs.
    The truth is, there are not job-training slots for every 
SNAP recipient who wants to better their skills to get work. If 
we really want to get people back to work, which I think is a 
shared goal, let us invest in those employment and training 
programs so that it is--so that SNAP is a temporary assistance.
    Just taking food away from people is not the motivator that 
is all of a sudden going to have somebody, then, seek work. 
They are looking for work, they just do not have jobs or do not 
have training opportunities in their communities or they face 
barriers to work like transportation or childcare.
    Mr. Bilirakis. All right. Thank you.
    Mr. Hall, again, do you believe that SNAP should be a 
temporary-assistance program?
    Mr. Hall. I agree with the previous response that for 
people with permanent disabilities, with seniors, with people 
who do not have a path to self-sufficiency, SNAP is an 
important part of meeting their monthly nutritional needs; 
however, I also would say that we have a program where the data 
in San Diego tracks the national average. That the average SNAP 
person--participant is within the program for less than a year.
    It is a successful program that is lifting people out of 
poverty, and when we look at the number of SNAP recipients who 
are not working, it is typically not the same people each 
month, that is, that this is a program that fluctuates and new 
people find themselves in crisis and people find their way back 
into the workforce and then they are no longer in the program.
    I think the program is functioning well and it is serving 
its intended purpose.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. A question for Mr. Protas, and Ms. 
Hollywood, any time you want to chime in, please do not 
hesitate to. I want to give you an opportunity first, let us do 
that.
    Do you have any questions or do you want to add to that in 
any way?
    [Nonverbal response.]
    Mr. Bilirakis. Okay. All right.
    Mr. Protas, in your written statement, you provide the 
story of Tim, a veteran, a hero from Maine. Why was the 
Department of Labor, the determination not enough for him to 
qualify for SNAP?
    Mr. Protas. I think there was a misunderstanding between 
State agencies and unfortunately we know that there is a lot of 
confusion about disability status; in fact, Ms. Miller noted in 
her testimony that veterans who receive full disability rating 
are exempted from work requirements.
    That is actually not the case. Any veteran who has a 
disability rating and receives any benefit at all from the VA 
is exempted from work requirements. We have the head of the 
Food and Nutrition Service who did not properly convey that and 
understand those regulations.
    I think there is a lot of confusion and better information 
needs to be distributed and USDA has a role to play, but then 
State agencies that administer SNAP and other safety-net 
programs have to play a role, as well, and I think the VA can 
play a part in better communicating those guidelines so people 
do not fall through the cracks like Tim.
    Mr. Bilirakis. I just want to emphasize that all of us want 
our veterans, obviously, and their families, to have food 
security. It is just a matter of, I think we need, you know, 
more hearings, and as the chairman told me, he would like to 
have a panel of veterans to get their input on this.
    I really appreciate your input, your testimony, both panels 
today, and I yield back. Thank you.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Ranking Member.
    Yes, I agree with your suggestion, as part of your 
testimony, that we should be hearing from veterans, themselves, 
so we would absolutely love to do that. In addition, I would 
appreciate the chance to work with the ranking member to get 
the data to know exactly how many veterans are being impacted 
by this and, in fact, there are reasons why USDA or VA cannot 
work together to provide that information. We need to 
understand that, as well.
    We did, at least, get while the USDA administrator was 
here, the commitment that she would work with VA to try to get 
that data to us. We will keep at it and it is going to take 
more hearings, and I look forward to working with you together 
on that.
    With that, I would like to recognize Mr. Pappas for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. Pappas. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    I would like to second that recommendation, that we 
continue to look for ways to listen to the veterans, and I 
appreciate the way that this panel has brought out some 
personal stories of how veterans have been impacted by food 
insecurity and economic hardship, and if there is an 
opportunity for a roundtable or some way to pull together a 
forum, Mr. Chairman, I would absolutely love to participate in 
that.
    I appreciate your comments here today, the work you do on 
behalf of veterans and those who are struggling across our 
country. We all know, and we heard in the last panel, that 36 
million Americans rely on food stamp benefits in this country 
every month, and that is at a time when we consider that the 
economy is doing well. 1.3 million veterans accessed the SNAP 
program, according to recent data, and we have got to make sure 
that those vets continue to find ways to be connected, even as 
this administration seeks to pull the rug out from under those 
who are struggling, who rely on the SNAP program. I think it is 
outrageous that they have moved forward with these Draconian 
measures that target folks who are struggling and who are 
really living day-to-day.
    Mr. Hall, you said a few things that I hear a lot from food 
pantries, from the food bank, from charities across my district 
that understand that even at a time of significant economic 
growth for many in our country, that there are those who are 
struggling and that the SNAP program does not necessarily meet 
the needs of those who are food insecure.
    I am wondering if you could just continue to talk a little 
bit about what changes to this program mean for organizations 
like yours that are already stretched to the max, and why we 
need to make sure that we are doing all we can to fill in those 
gaps.
    Mr. Hall. Thank you, Congressman.
    It is a very difficult challenge to convey how the SNAP 
program works in the real world. There are the complexities of 
finding eligible populations, and we know that only a 
percentage of eligible veterans in this country are 
participating in the SNAP program. We know that the 
documentation requirements that are required to successfully 
enroll, the lag time that is created before you receive a 
benefit card in many instances. In California, this is a 
County-administered program and the County of San Diego is a 
terrific partner with Feeding San Diego and has a full-time 
employee in our food bank office to help us process SNAP 
applications. Often it can take weeks and weeks to help 
somebody who is in a crisis to get access to those SNAP 
benefits.
    We also see, sir, that the SNAP benefits off run out the 
second or third week of the month and we see an increase in 
demand at food pantries from SNAP beneficiaries because the 
benefit amount is not enough to secure the quantity of food 
that they need to properly nourish their families. It is a 
situation where the program works well within the guidelines 
that Congress has established for it, but Congress simply has 
not created the program in a way that is designed to solve 
hunger in this country. It is absolutely, at this moment, 
essential, critical, supplemental aid for many, many veterans 
and, frankly, for many active-duty military families.
    If I may just add, for active-duty military families, 
having their basic allowance for housing counted as income for 
purposes of disqualifying them from SNAP is an absolutely 
inexcusable affront. I know many of the members on both sides 
of the aisle agree on this, but I do not understand why we have 
not fixed it yet.
    Mr. Pappas. Certainly no one is getting rich on the four-
to-five-dollar-a-day average that SNAP pays for food 
assistance, and if anyone thinks that is an overly generous 
benefit, they should try living on it.
    I am wondering if we could zero in on the fact that younger 
veterans--veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan, in particular--are 
experiencing food insecurity at higher rates. Do you know why 
that is the case and how can we do outreach to those 
communities to make sure that they are getting what they need?
    Mr. Protas. A recent study by researchers at the University 
of Minnesota found food-insecurity rates about 27 percent for 
veterans who were returning from the wars in Iraq and 
Afghanistan, and these are astronomically high rates and very 
concerning.
    It was mentioned before about the economy that is booming, 
and I just want to say that the economy is not booming for 
everyone. That jobs are not available in every community, 
especially in rural communities, and we also have many people 
who are transitioning from military service, who are taking 
low-paying jobs and experience underemployment; maybe it is a 
part-time job without benefits, maybe they are cobbling 
together a couple of part-time jobs. That underemployment rate 
was recently documented for recently returning veterans at a 
rate substantially higher than the civilian population. I think 
that is part of the situation here and we need to do a better 
job for those who are transitioning to make sure that they are 
aware of the benefits that can help them during that temporary 
time of need.
    Ms. Hollywood. Income invariability, I think--income 
variability, too, I think is a key component here, because 
people go from getting a steady paycheck on active duty and 
then suddenly they are thrown into this crisis where they are 
piecemealing various jobs together in order to get a solid 
paycheck.
    Mr. Pappas. Sure. Thank you.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Pappas.
    I would now like to recognize Mr. Bergman.
    Mr. Bergman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Thanks to all of you for being here, because what we are 
talking about--and especially the children of servicemembers--
if kids are hungry, they cannot learn, pure and simple. When 
you think about the things we do in schools because the kids do 
not have food at home to eat or when they go home on Friday 
afternoon for the weekend and we send backpacks full of food 
home with them because of their homelife situation puts them at 
risk, so I thank you for what you are doing. I have kind of a 
hodgepodge of questions here based upon the testimony that each 
of you gave.
    Mr. Protas, you used the example of Tim. Was he in the VA 
system?
    Mr. Protas. He was not receiving healthcare in the VA 
system, no.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. Was that by choice?
    Mr. Protas. I am not sure that he qualified for medical 
care through VA. His disability was not a service-related 
disability; it was a job-related disability, so I am not sure.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. Well, the reason I ask questions like 
that is because, you know, data counts and when we use examples 
of things, I want to make sure we do--because what we are 
trying to do here as the committee--it does not make any 
difference which side of the alley you are on--to understand 
what our role here, as Congress is, to do the right thing, in 
this case, for veterans and their families.
    For the whole panel, could each of you give a rough 
number--this does not have to be accurate--a rough-percentage 
breakdown of the veterans that you interact with who are inside 
or outside the VA system, kind of like I just asked about Tim--
60/40, 70/30--what do you think?
    Mr. Protas. I think it is maybe 60/40--60 outside of the 
VA, 40 in.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay.
    Ms. Hollywood. Sir, our survey does not address that 
specific question. Our survey, specifically--the data that we 
gather, approximately 85 percent of our respondents are 
military family members----
    Mr. Bergman. They are active-duty?
    Ms. Hollywood. Active-duty. Then the other 15 percent are 
family members and the other 15 percent are active-duty and 
veterans.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay.
    Mr. Hall. Sir, a significant portion of our Feeding Heroes 
program, sir, is active-duty military families. Within the 
veteran community, we do not have a mechanism to track how many 
are actively engaged with the VA versus those who are not, so, 
unfortunately, I just do not have that data.
    Mr. Bergman. What could the--and this is not a question to 
be answered here, but, again, I would really appreciate a 
response--because active-duty, Camp Pendleton, 32nd Street, you 
know, Balboa Hospital, North Island, Coronado, okay, what 
could--again, not to be answered now, unless you have a quick 
solution you have already thought of--these men and women are 
stationed there. They are active-duty. They are full-time. In 
most cases or many cases, they are either living onboard base 
or they are getting their Basic Allowance Housing (BAH) out in 
town, okay. I am guessing BAH is relative to the cost-of-living 
in San Diego, okay.
    Is there anything that the--and these people are full-time 
employees of the U.S. Government, so take it out of the 
military and let us say we moved all the Forest Service 
firefighters out there to be stationed temporarily in San Diego 
to be jumpers in the event we had forest fires, okay: Could 
they afford to live or is it just because San Diego is a cost-
of-living?
    By the way, first of all, let me compliment you on your 
talk about food waste and recapturing food, if you will.
    Are you familiar with Anthony Bourdain's 2017, Wasted! The 
Story of Food Waste?
    Mr. Hall. Yes, sir.
    Mr. Bergman. You know, that impacted me greatly when I 
first saw it. What saddened me is we have got 8, soon-to-be 10 
grandkids--and we are now great-grandparents, so we are now 
looking at three generations down--what saddened me about that 
movie was it cannot be shown in middle schools or any school, 
for that matter, because of the language in it. So, if you 
could impact your fellow filmmakers out there--not that you are 
in the film business--to make it middle-school presentable, 
because the messaging we are talking about here is building 
resiliency.
    In the military we have families who are committed to the 
country. It is our responsibility to be committed to them, but 
in building that resiliency within the family, within that 
servicemember so the family can survive and thrive when the 
servicemember has gone to the fight--and I know I am going over 
a minute or so, Mr. Chairman, if you will allow me to 
continue--but the idea is that when they leave active-duty, 
they have served honorably, they are end of active-duty, and 
they are out in the civilian workforce, can families, in your 
particular case, afford to live in San Diego?
    If they got out--they served 4 or 8 years honorably and 
they got out at the E5 or E6 level or something like that, they 
do not have a pension because they did not serve 20 years, what 
do you tell them?
    Mr. Hall. It is increasingly hard, General--I am sorry--
Congressman.
    Mr. Bergman. No, that is okay. It is okay here. It is 
accepted. You just cannot say that in the Armed Services 
Committee.
    Mr. Hall. Thank you, sir.
    It is increasingly difficult to understand San Diego's 
complex housing equation. Our cost-of-living is now about 40 
percent higher than the national average, so it is unreasonable 
to expect that folks in the economic condition that you have 
described are going to be able to easily locate, find housing, 
and support their families in San Diego.
    Unfortunately, our active-duty military families do not get 
to make that choice--they are stationed in San Diego--and when 
their families arrive, the BAH is not sufficient to support 
them. We have many families traveling from as far away as 
Riverside and Imperial Counties to work.
    Mr. Bergman. I know the roadways very well, but San Diego 
has one problem because of your cost-of-living. San Francisco 
probably has a similar problem. Places like New York, Boston, 
D.C. have a similar problem to that, as well.
    My district happens to be very rural and remote. We have a 
slightly different problem; usually the tyranny of distance and 
the availability of we need more, you know, good-paying jobs, 
because the economy is on fire in a positive way, not in a 
wildfire sort of way.
    The point is--okay, I see a hand coming up--Mr. Protas.
    When Mr. Protas is done answering, I will yield back, sir.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Bergman.
    Mr. Protas. Sure. Just quickly, thank you for raising the 
issue about currently serving military families. I agree with 
Mr. Hall that the basic allowance for housing is a barrier and 
we have tried in the past in the Farm Bill context, to have 
that basic allowance for housing excluded as income.
    There is been an opportunity in the National Defense 
Authorization Act (NDAA). We worked very closely with the 
National Military Family Association and Congresswoman Davis 
and Congressman Young for a bipartisan solution for a military 
family basic needs allowance. It would be an allowance to help 
junior-enlisted personnel who have larger households who really 
struggle to make ends meet and do not qualify for SNAP, even 
though they need it because the BAH is counted.
    There is something that Congress can do. Congressman Levin 
has been a cosponsor of that provision, and thank you very 
much. We would love to see that taken care of in the next NDAA 
to make sure that those military families are taken care of.
    As you mentioned, too, the children in military families 
are a next-generation issue. When families today who are in the 
military are struggling or even for veterans who have children, 
those children are much more likely to go into service 
themselves, and if they experience food insecurity as children, 
they are more likely to experience obesity and diet-related 
health conditions that may not make them fit to serve. The 
Mission: Readiness organization of retired admirals and 
generals has really prioritized this. So, it is not only an 
issue for readiness now, but for recruitment down the road.
    Mr. Levin. Thanks.
    Mr. Bergman, I resemble the remark of living in a high-cost 
area. It is very true, but we are not going to solve all the 
reasons for that. Certainly, it is not the auspices of this 
discussion. I think this discussion is a fairly simple one, 
which is: Are we going to allow veterans to go hungry?
    I think the answer should be equally simple: We cannot 
allow veterans to go hungry. Not one veteran in need should go 
hungry, period.
    With that, I would like to recognize Mr. Barr.
    Mr. Barr. Thank you, again, Chairman Levin for your 
leadership and holding this hearing.
    I could not agree with you more: We should not have a 
single veteran in this country food insecure.
    I want to thank our second panel for your organizations, 
for your dedication, for your work in fighting this problem. I 
have to give a shout-out to my food pantries back home in 
Kentucky, who I know serve many veterans. God's Pantry--Mr. 
Hall, you may know Michael Halligan; he does a great job and it 
is a great organization--and there is a great network of food 
pantries within God's Pantry's network in Central and Eastern 
Kentucky--and Tamara Sandberg, who leads our whole statewide 
effort in this regard.
    I also want to compliment our agriculture commissioner back 
home in Kentucky who is doing some innovative things to address 
food insecurity, Commissioner Ryan Quarles. He is working very 
closely with our food pantry network back in Kentucky.
    Mr. Protas, I want to kind of explore a little bit more, 
the conversation that you were having with Ranking Member 
Bilirakis about the temporary nature of SNAP, and, obviously, I 
appreciate your comment that the temporary nature--and Mr. 
Hall, as well--that the temporary nature of SNAP certainly is 
applicable to able-bodied, work-capable adults, but obviously 
should not necessarily apply to a senior citizen, someone who 
is disabled.
    I would just remind everybody that, of course, the 
underlying bipartisan statute does not apply--the work 
requirements do not apply to disabled individuals, as far as I 
read it. That is not--it does not appear to be at issue.
    I do take seriously, Mr. Protas, your good point that in 
Maine, for example, and other places, where there may be--and 
rural areas--I represent these exact places that you are 
describing--in rural places, where even in a booming economy, 
there is underemployment, there is difficulty in finding those 
7 million job openings in those particular economic places. As 
I read the proposed regulation from the USDA, it looks like 
they are taking that into account, because it moves to an area-
specific request for waivers, rather than sweeping statewide 
waivers.
    I would invite you to comment on that.
    Mr. Protas. Sure. One point about disability, those who are 
recognized or properly recognized disabilities are exempted 
from work requirements, but many people fall through the 
cracks, and I think it would be wrong to discount that, that 
there are many people with mental health disabilities or 
physical disabilities that do not get fully recognized. Part of 
that may be because of economic barriers, because they cannot 
afford to go to a doctor to get the proper documentation. There 
are many hoops that people have to jump through sometimes to 
get their disability properly certified, so----
    Mr. Barr. I think that is a fair point and we should 
probably work together to address that, but when you are 
talking about a bona fide, non-disabled person, you do agree 
that this should be a temporary program?
    Mr. Protas. It should be a temporary program for those who 
are not able to work and who have opportunities available to 
them.
    As far as the proposed rule change, States--it is limiting 
State flexibilities. It was not just flexibilities about 
statewide waivers; there were area waivers that were currently 
exercised.
    I do not know in Kentucky if you feel that USDA has a 
better sense about the job opportunities than your State 
officials--I think the way the 1996 welfare reform law worked 
is that there was a certain amount of flexibility for States to 
seek those waivers, knowing the job opportunities in their 
communities. They know best what is----
    Mr. Barr. I think that is a fair point, but as I read the 
proposed rulemaking, the move to area-specific request for 
waivers make sense because the States can apply for those in 
those pockets in Rural Kentucky where we do have difficult 
labor-market conditions.
    One other point I read in the regulation that is not 
received a lot of attention, the proposed rule continues the 
use of exemptions for adults who are having difficulty entering 
the workforce. You are aware of that. I mean, that seems, to 
me, to address a lot of the concerns that you otherwise might 
have with the rule.
    Mr. Protas. There is actually--there is a continuation of 
those exemptions. I believe in the proposed rule, there is an 
elimination of the carryover of exemptions. That is a concern; 
it actually limits the number of exemptions.
    I am not aware that every State has fully taken advantage 
of those exemptions to waive. My concern and Mazon's concern is 
that it is limiting State flexibilities and it is limiting the 
options to help those who are really struggling.
    Mr. Barr. Well, I really do appreciate your work and I 
appreciate your feedback on this and I certainly will continue 
to monitor USDA as it implements this because we obviously want 
these great organizations to continue to serve our veterans 
when there is a real need and we also want them to encourage 
work where we can.
    Thank you very much. I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Barr.
    Now, I would like to recognize Mr. Meuser.
    Mr. Meuser. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    We are, of course, the Veterans' Affairs Committee here, 
where it focuses on veterans, not necessarily the entire 
population, although we care greatly about that, as well. No 
veteran should go hungry--I think that that is understood--and 
whatever procedures and perhaps legislation or actions that 
need to be taken, we need to simply do a better job in assuring 
that that occurs.
    Now, related to your organizations, and I stated earlier 
that I am very familiar with various food banks, very often the 
community has to step up and you need campaign fundraising 
events and things of that nature and other Government 
participation.
    We are, to an extent, talking about a broader issue here, 
and that is SNAP. The thing is, if you look back at the data on 
the number--the average participant and the population of those 
that receive SNAP benefits over the years, something does not 
add up.
    What I mean by that is this, if you go back to 1992, there 
was a recession, so there were 25 million people on SNAP. As 
the economy improved, as you would expect, the number of people 
receiving the supplemental nutritional program reduced quite a 
bit--went down to 17 million--in 2000. Then it crept up into 
2007 to 26 million, and then we had the so-called Great 
Recession, so, granted, you would expect it to increase; 
however, it increased from 28 million in 2008, those on the 
SNAP program, to 45 million in 2000--or excuse me--47 million 
in 2013, 45 million in 2015. That is equivalent to the 
population of 22 states, the entire population of 22 states was 
on the SNAP program.
    2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, we have a far-better economy than 
we did 5 years ago. We have many jobs that are going 
unfulfilled. The Farm Bill last year did have the idea of some 
work requirements. I believe it was between the ages of 19 and 
56, if you are able-bodied and not caring for children, you 
needed to work and if you still worked--30 hours I think it 
was--and if you still worked and your income met the demands, 
then you would receive the SNAP benefits. It did not get 
passed.
    What we now have done over the last 2 years is not change 
the criteria to my understanding, but enforced eligibility 
requirements. We now have 34 million people, okay, last year, 
34 million versus years past. So, in 2000, it was 17 million. 
In 2019, after reducing it, double that--double that. That is 
still 18 states--18 states, all population on the SNAP program.
    I guess it is a--you have to understand it is a reasonable 
question with hundreds of thousands of jobs being created, a 
very strong economy, a 3.5 percent--not my district, mind you--
it is higher--so I get it. There is still a lot of work to be 
done and more people need to be included in this strong 
economy, but overall it is going very well, and so placing 
reasonable work requirements on SNAP recipients--and by the 
way, if they cannot get a job, the Farm Bill called for 20 
hours of volunteer service would be sufficed and clearly would 
not have raised their income levels that much. They still would 
have been recipients.
    I just find it hard to believe that we do not want to 
really take into consideration levels of accountability and 
have an organized approach so that the money is there for those 
who need it. I make that comment and I ask for your comments in 
response.
    Mr. Protas. I think it is alarming how many Americans 
struggle with food insecurity and I think rather than the 
concern being directed at how many people participate in SNAP, 
there should be concern about how many people struggle. Thirty-
six million Americans who are currently served by SNAP, you say 
it is 18 states--that is larger than the entire population of 
Canada.
    What is wrong in this country that that many Americans 
struggle to put food on the table?
    In terms of the increases in SNAP participation----
    Mr. Meuser. I could argue, what is wrong with the 
organization and accountability and enforcement of eligibility 
requirements is what is trying to be done.
    Mr. Protas. Well, I think you also need to recognize that 
SNAP helps the working poor and the vast majority of working-
age adults who can work, do work. So, we have low-income 
households who are receiving extra help that they need from 
SNAP, people who are working two or three part-time jobs.
    There is something wrong with----
    Mr. Meuser. My time is over, so I do recognize it, but it 
is at a very, very high level--it includes will 18 states--34 
million versus 20 years ago, 17 million; that is a bit of a 
disparity.
    I yield, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Meuser.
    With no further questions, we can begin to bring this 
hearing to a close. I really want to thank our witnesses on 
both, the first and the second panel, and I would like to--I 
will have a brief close, but I would like to thank my friend, 
the ranking member, Mr. Bilirakis, for a brief closing 
statement.
    Mr. Bilirakis. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Briefly--again, I really appreciate you holding this 
hearing and, again, we got some answers today, but we need some 
more answers--obviously, we need the data and then giving the 
USDA the authority statutorily to provide this data, as well, 
for our veterans.
    Again, no veteran should go hungry. I mean, all of us agree 
with that. I mean, we serve on this committee. It is our top 
priority, I understand--at least mine and I know the 
chairman's--to take care of our veterans and their families.
    I do believe--and, again, we need to explore this even more 
and I really appreciate your testimony--but I do believe long-
term--we have to think long-term--and I think all of you agree 
that job training so that our veterans can provide for their 
families in the future is really the key.
    Short-term-wise, sure, absolutely. No veteran should go 
hungry, and we will continue to work on this issue.
    I appreciate everyone's input today, and I yield back, Mr. 
Chairman. I appreciate it.
    Mr. Levin. I thank the ranking member for his work on this 
and look forward to continuing to work with him on a bipartisan 
basis to address this pressing issue.
    I thank my colleagues on both sides of the aisle for their 
thoughtful questions and comments today. You know, it is an 
interesting day that we are holding this hearing. We are voting 
on a war-powers resolution later today and I am thinking of the 
men and women of extraordinary character who are serving this 
country and sacrificing for our national security and the very 
least we can do is provide our military families and our 
veterans with food security; it is the very least we can do.
    This committee asked earlier in this hearing how many 
veterans will be impacted by the administration's proposed 
changes to the SNAP program, and I appreciate that USDA agreed 
to work with VA, to the very least, to try to provide us with 
that data. That does not tell the whole story, does not go far 
enough in my opinion.
    Our veterans are more than statistics and, furthermore, 
there are those veterans who are suffering from mental 
illnesses who are undiagnosed. How is this decision going to 
impact them? It would be definitely worth that discussion.
    Hearing from veterans, themselves, I think is critically 
important. I look forward to working with you all and to making 
sure that that happens in the weeks and months ahead.
    I am particularly concerned with how USDA will work with VA 
to communicate better. I am concerned that USDA did not see fit 
to have a representative here to hear from these non-
governmental experts in this area. It does not take an act of 
Congress to pick up the phone, to communicate, to speak with 
one another; it just takes a level of care and concern.
    We set the highest expectations of our military to serve 
our country and we need to set equally high expectations of 
ourselves to serve them. We should not be allowing a single 
veteran in need to go hungry ever.
    If we want to serve veterans, we have to start by making 
sure they are not hungry--this really is not that hard.
    Again, I thank our witnesses for joining us today.
    All members have 5 legislative days to revise and extend 
their remarks and include additional materials.
    Without objection, the subcommittee stands adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 12:07 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]  
      
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                         A  P  P  E  N  D  I  X

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                    Prepared Statements of Witnesses

                              ----------                              


                  Prepared Statement of Pamilyn Miller

    Thank you Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and members of 
the Subcommittee for the opportunity to discuss the role of the 
nutrition assistance programs administered by the U.S. Department of 
Agriculture (USDA) in serving the Nation's veterans. I am Pam Miller, 
Administrator of the Food and Nutrition Service (FNS). FNS is 
responsible for administering America's nutrition assistance programs, 
which leverage the Nation's agricultural abundance to ensure every 
American has access to wholesome, nutritious food, even when they face 
challenging circumstances.
    Every American owes an immeasurable debt to the veterans who have 
served and fought to defend our Nation. The men and women who have 
borne the perils and hardships to secure and protect our freedom and 
our way of life have not only earned our respect and honor, they 
deserve our support as they deal with the challenges of life after 
military service.
    At FNS, we operate programs that touch the lives of one in four 
Americans every day. Our programs serve a broad range of households 
with low-incomes to meet their nutritional needs - such as those of the 
elderly, pregnant women, infants and young children - and operate in 
settings where immediate access to food is important, such as schools 
and child care facilities. While our programs are not targeted 
specifically to veterans, they are available and designed to provide 
benefits that veterans and their families may need, particularly when 
they face difficult economic circumstances.
    A recent USDA analysis of dietary intake data from the National 
Health and Nutrition Examination Survey found that, similar to other 
Americans, veterans' well-being would benefit from improvements in 
their diets. In particular, their consumption of added sugars and solid 
fats is too high, and their consumption of fruits, vegetables, whole 
grains and dairy products is too low relative to the Dietary Guidelines 
for Americans.
    The largest of our 15 nutrition assistance programs, the 
Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program or SNAP, currently serves 
about 36 million low-income people each month. Data from the American 
Community Survey suggests that in calendar year 2017, about 1.3 million 
veterans reported receiving SNAP at some point during the previous 12 
months. This represented less than 3 percent of all SNAP participants. 
In that same year, about 7 percent of all living veterans received 
SNAP, while about 14 percent of all Americans received SNAP at some 
point.
    The Subcommittee has asked about the impact of the Administration's 
SNAP reforms, both proposed and finalized, on veterans. Let me say at 
the outset that because veteran status is not a condition of 
eligibility for SNAP, meaning that veterans in need of food assistance 
qualify for SNAP in the same way that other households do, based on 
their income, assets, and other non-financial eligibility factors. For 
that reason, we do not have veteran's status as part of the 
administrative datasets that we use to estimate the impact of these 
rules on different sub-groups of SNAP participants. Given the limited 
number of veterans receiving benefits, survey data is also limited in 
what it can reliably tell us. I will instead speak more generally about 
the purpose and effects of our current and upcoming rules.
    Let me begin by explaining the overall purpose of these regulatory 
reforms, which is to use the authority we have under the current law, 
including the 2018 Farm Bill, to administer SNAP, and all our nutrition 
programs, as Congress intended and has specified in law. Overall, we 
are seeking to achieve a more modern, equitable and effective SNAP 
program.
    The Food Stamp Program was launched in the 1930's, and today's 
nationwide program was created in the 1970's. SNAP has grown and 
evolved over time, and it is crucial to continue to make reforms to 
improve customer service and integrity in the program. SNAP statute 
provides USDA discretion to allow State agencies - SNAP's front-line 
customer service organizations - flexibility in certain aspects of 
administration. While this flexibility works well in several areas, in 
some it has compromised the consistency of operations over time with 
certain standards defined in statute, and even led to disparities in 
benefits for similarly situated individuals and households simply 
because of the State where they live. For this reason, and in 
recognition of our responsibility to ensure the program operates 
consistent with the law, a major portion of the Administration's SNAP 
agenda seeks to strike a better balance between practical operational 
flexibility and the national standards that define the program's 
purpose and support its effectiveness. We have focused in three key 
areas.
    We recently announced changes to the criteria for when and where 
states may apply for waivers of the time limit for able-bodied adults 
without dependents between the ages of 18 and 49 - ``ABAWDs.'' This 
rule does not apply to children, their parents, individuals over 50 
including the elderly, pregnant women, or individuals with a 
disability. The USDA definition in SNAP for individuals with a 
disability automatically includes veterans who are totally disabled, 
permanently homebound, or in need of regular aid and attendance, as 
well as a surviving spouse or child of a veteran who is receiving VA 
benefits and is considered permanently disabled, so they are also not 
the subject to this time limit.
    The statutory time limit only applies to work-capable adults 
without children or other dependents. Long-standing SNAP statute sets 
the limits for this subgroup to 3 months of benefits in a 3-year period 
- unless they are working, volunteering, or participating in work 
training for at least 20 hours per week, or participating in workfare, 
for as little as 6 hours a week. States may waive these limits in areas 
with an unemployment rate above 10 percent or where there are ``not 
sufficient jobs.'' However, the previous regulations were defined so 
loosely that counties with an unemployment rate as low as 2.5 percent 
are included in currently waived areas. The recent final rule places 
common-sense limits on such waivers. As a result of the new limits on 
waivers, significantly more ABAWDs will be expected to work, volunteer, 
and/or participate in a work program, or participate in workfare, in 
order to receive SNAP for more than 3 months in a 36-month (3-year) 
period.
    Congress was clear that parents with dependent children in the 
home, those over 50 years old including the elderly, those with a 
disability, and pregnant women, are not subject to time limits. This 
rule has no impact on such individuals, including the veterans among 
them.
    Congress also established a wide range of ways for individuals to 
engage and maintain benefits; the rule did not make changes to existing 
regulations in this area and FNS continues to encourage SNAP State 
agencies to leverage SNAP-funded Employment & Training (E&T) programs, 
as well as services provided by other Federal agencies, including the 
VA work programs, State and county governments, and local providers, to 
meet the needs of their participants working toward self-sufficiency. 
In addition to providing for work and various training programs to 
count toward the work requirement, current law and regulations also 
include volunteering for just 6 hours a week through a workfare 
program, perhaps at a local food bank, as a way to maintain SNAP 
eligibility while gaining valuable work experience. Similarly, Federal 
law explicitly exempts certain individuals from the time limit, 
including those unable to work due to physical or mental challenges - 
challenges that some veterans may face. An individual does not need to 
be permanently disabled or receiving disability benefits to be exempted 
from the time limit under this criterion. Moreover, when an 
individual's ``unfitness for work'' is obvious to the SNAP eligibility 
worker, States have the discretion to exempt the individual without 
documentation from a medical office or other source. Federal rules 
allow States this flexibility to prevent placing unnecessary burden on 
individuals who are clearly unfit for employment but may be undiagnosed 
and/or disconnected from supportive services or benefits, such as 
people with apparent mental illnesses and the chronically homeless. 
States are responsible for assessing an individual's fitness for work 
methodically and comprehensively, typically when certifying applicants 
for benefits.
    To be clear, the rule did not change these responsibilities, nor 
did it take away states' statutory flexibility to waive the time-limit 
in areas of high unemployment and to exempt a percentage of their 
caseload, as established in law, at their full discretion. What the 
rule did accomplish was to establish clear standards for applying for 
and receiving waivers. The strong economy is creating opportunities for 
all, and this Administration's view is that now is the time to help 
more Americans enter, re-enter, and succeed in the workforce - 
including veterans.
    Another rulemaking, which we are working to finalize, proposed to 
eliminate a loophole called ``broad-based categorical eligibility'' 
that has been used to provide SNAP benefits to households without a 
robust eligibility determination by the conferring TANF program. This 
would end the practice of allowing households to be eligible for SNAP 
by simply being handed a brochure from another Federal program. 
Limiting this eligibility rule to those receiving specific, concrete, 
and work-supporting benefits would retain categorical eligibility's 
advantage of streamlining program administration, but in a fiscally 
prudent way. And it promotes integrity by better aligning eligibility 
with the income and resource standards set explicitly in statute. The 
comment period for the proposed rule is closed, and the agency is 
examining comments as we contemplate a final rule.
    The third major reform we have proposed would truly standardize and 
modernize the method for setting State SNAP standard utility allowances 
across the country. For many years, SNAP rules have allowed states to 
use their own methods to establish a standard utility allowance in lieu 
of documenting actual utility costs. Such standards can be a useful 
program efficiency, but the variation in State methods for determining 
the allowance amount has resulted in the inconsistent treatment of 
similarly situated households across State lines. Moreover, it has been 
so long since State SUA methodologies were assessed that some states 
cannot explain their original SUA or even the year it was set. USDA's 
proposal would replace the patchwork of outdated and inconsistent State 
methods for setting these allowances with a modernized, uniform 
approach based on up-to-date data on actual household utility costs in 
each State. The proposal would also replace an antiquated ``telephone 
allowance'' with a telecommunications allowance that includes the cost 
of basic internet service - no longer a luxury, but often a necessity 
for school, work, and job search for families, including veterans and 
their families.
    The Department recognizes and earnestly undertakes its role to 
provide SNAP benefits to those who truly need them, while ensuring that 
SNAP participants have a launch pad to a better life.
    Let me emphasize further that these are not the only improvements 
we are pursuing in SNAP. One that may be of particular interest to 
veterans that participate in SNAP is a pilot Congress authorized in the 
Farm Bill for online SNAP purchasing. The Secretary articulated the 
core principle behind this innovative effort - ``People who receive 
SNAP benefits should have the opportunity to shop for food the same way 
more and more Americans shop for food - by ordering and paying for 
groceries online. As technology advances, it is important for SNAP to 
advance too.'' The pilot began this spring in New York with three 
retailer chains. The pilot will expand to more states in 2020. For 
veterans who may face mobility challenges due to age or service-related 
injuries or disabilities, or those living in rural areas, this kind of 
service can be particularly important.
    Similarly, SNAP is only one of many USDA nutrition assistance 
programs that provide support to veterans and their families. Low-
income veterans starting new families may benefit from the WIC program, 
which safeguards the health of low-income women, infants, and children 
up to age 5 who are at nutritional risk by providing nutritious foods 
to supplement diets, information on healthy eating, and referrals to 
health care. We have worked with the WIC community, including State 
administrators and clinic staff, business partners and participants, to 
explore ways to enhance the food package and improve the WIC shopping 
experience - with implementation of electronic benefit transfer (EBT), 
a critical improvement strategy - and questions about access, and the 
potential role of technology to simplify the client application and 
participation experience. The President's Budget has consistently 
funded WIC, our largest discretionary program, to ensure sufficient 
funding for all eligible women, infants and children who wish to 
participate.
    The children and grandchildren of veterans can rely on the 
nutritious meals provided through the Child Nutrition Programs, 
including the school meals programs, the Child and Adult Care Food 
Program, and the summer feeding programs, to get a healthy start in 
life. USDA has worked closely with program operators to make sure that 
they can serve children well. Through customer service roundtables and 
other venues, we heard that school nutrition professionals needed 
targeted adjustments to existing meal standards to ensure that school 
meals were both nutritious and appealing to the students being served. 
So Secretary Perdue extended school meal flexibilities related to 
flavored milk, whole grains, and sodium. We also heard that the 
education and training standards for nutrition professionals USDA 
implemented under the last reauthorization put strain on small and 
rural school districts where a disproportionate number of veterans 
live, and we have responded by revising the rules, in accordance with 
the law, to allow these districts more hiring flexibility. We are now 
working on additional flexibilities in schools and in the Summer Food 
Service Program.
    FNS also collaborates and coordinates with other USDA agencies to 
better serve veterans. The Department's Military Veteran Agricultural 
(MVA) Liaison, first authorized by the 2014 Farm Bill, coordinates 
across the Department to provide information, resources and support for 
active duty military and veterans interested in agriculture, and to 
facilitate relationships within and beyond USDA to make sure military 
veterans have full access to resources and services to help them 
succeed in civilian life. FNS works with the MVA Liaison to ensure 
eligible service members and their families have an understanding of 
nutrition assistance eligibility criteria, employment opportunities for 
transitioning members as they arise, and available nutrition resources 
to assist the family toward a healthy lifestyle.
    FNS's work in support of our Nation's veterans is just one facet of 
USDA support.
    Veterans make up 13 percent of on-board employees, and the 
Department provides on the job training through apprenticeship programs 
as agricultural commodity graders, wildland firefighters and food 
inspectors. Many USDA agencies have programs focused on veterans:

      The Economic Research Service prepares valuable research 
related to veterans, including the diet quality report that I 
mentioned, and a forthcoming report that examines food security among 
households with working-age veterans.

      The National Institute of Food and Agriculture supports 
veterans in the agricultural sector through programs such as the 
Enhancing Agricultural Opportunities for Military Veterans Competitive 
Grants Program (AgVets), the Beginning Farmer and Rancher Development 
Program (BFRDP) - which devotes at least 5 percent of its funding to 
serving military veterans, the National AgrAbility Project for military 
veterans, and a range of other partnerships to support and strengthen 
military families.

      Under USDA's Natural Resources Conservation Service, 
veterans receive preference and higher payment rates for certain 
conservation programs including the Environmental Quality Incentives 
Program (EQIP), Agricultural Conservation Easements Program (ACEP), and 
Conservation Stewardship Program (CSP). These voluntary conservation 
programs provide financial and technical assistance to producers to 
address concerns, strengthen operations, protect, and restore 
conservation practices.

      The Farm Service Agency provides farm loan programs to 
help veterans purchase farmland, buy equipment, and make repairs and 
upgrades.

      USDA's rural housing programs can help veterans become 
homeowners, repair or improve their existing homes, and offset the 
costs of rent. Veterans starting or expanding rural businesses may seek 
USDA funding and technical support in the form of loans, loan 
guarantees, processing and marketing of products, and energy efficiency 
improvements.

      USDA's Office of Advocacy and Outreach works with states 
and organizations to create programs to assist veterans with 
transitioning to farming, ranching, and other agricultural jobs. One 
key program is the Outreach and Assistance for Socially Disadvantaged 
Farmers and Ranchers and Veteran Farmers and Ranchers Program, which 
provides training, outreach and technical assistance to underserved and 
veteran farmers and ranchers.

    In closing, I would like to thank the Committee for the opportunity 
to join you, and again emphasize our interest in and dedication to 
providing America's veteran heroes with the service and support that 
they deserve. I am confident that we can continue to do so while 
advancing this Administration's broader nutrition assistance priorities 
- to improve customer service for partners and participants, to protect 
and enhance integrity, and to strengthen the bonds between FNS programs 
and a better life through employment.
    I am happy to answer any questions you may have.
                                 ______
                                 

                  Prepared Statement of Thomas O'Toole

    Good afternoon, Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and 
distinguished Members of the Subcommittee. Thank you for the 
opportunity to testify before you today on the topics of ending Veteran 
hunger, our partnership with the Department of Agriculture (USDA) to 
provide nutrition assistance to Veterans, and economic factors that may 
contribute to Veteran suicide. I am accompanied today by Ms. Christine 
Going, VHA Co-Chairperson for Ensuring Veteran Food Security Workgroup.

Introduction

    Food insecurity is a social determinant of health along with 
homelessness. Research published in 2015 in the Public Health Nutrition 
journal, found that Veterans of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan 
disproportionately report experiencing food insecurity. Approximately 
27 percent of those studied reported food insecurity. These Veterans 
tended to be younger, unmarried/unpartnered, unemployed or working in 
lower incomes positions, and living in households with more children 
compared to other veterans. Understanding the behavioral, social, and 
environmental significance of social determinants of health is the 
first step in keeping people healthy.
    The link between food insecurity and health issues needs to be part 
of any population health strategy. Research published in the 2017 
Health Research and Educational Trust journal showed 40 percent of 
factors contributing to health issues are social or economic, compared 
to 20 percent that are medical care issues. This research confirms the 
relationship between food insecurity and the poor management of health 
conditions such as hypertension, diabetes, HIV, and depression. A 
review of socio-economic factors, such as the inability to afford food, 
physical environmental factors including lack of access to a grocery 
store, and clinical care factors, such as the lack of access to care, 
all have effects on overall health.
    The cycle of food insecurity and is most prominent in low income 
populations. As a person becomes more unwell, the likelihood of missing 
work and health care costs increase, and the financial burden leading 
to difficult financial tradeoff decisions all fuel the continuation of 
the food insecurity cycle.

Food Insecurity Linked to Mental Health and Suicide Risk

    Suicide is a complex issue with no single cause. It is a national 
public health issue that affects people from all walks of life, not 
just Veterans. Suicide is often the result of a multifaceted 
interaction of risk and protective factors at the individual, 
community, and societal levels. Thus, VA has made suicide prevention 
its top clinical priority and is implementing a comprehensive public 
health approach to reach all Veterans--including those who do not 
receive VA benefits or health services.
    VA's promise to enrolled Veterans remains the same: to promote, 
preserve, and restore Veterans' health and well-being; to empower and 
equip them to achieve their life goals; and to provide state-of-the-art 
treatments. Veterans possess unique characteristics and experiences 
related to their military service that may increase their risk of 
suicide. They also tend to possess skills and protective factors, such 
as resilience or a strong sense of belonging to a group. Our Nation's 
Veterans are strong, capable, valuable members of society, and it is 
imperative that we connect with them early as they transition into 
civilian life, facilitate that transition, and support them over their 
lifetime.
    The relationship between food insecurity and known risk factors for 
suicide in the Veteran population is emerging. According to research 
published in 2016 in the journal, SSM-Population Health, Veterans who 
report food insecurity are more likely to have poor mental and physical 
health those without food insecurity--studies of the general population 
revealed similar findings. In 2018, the Women's Health Issues journal 
published research that found food insufficiencies contribute to higher 
risks for mental health conditions in women Veterans. In addition, data 
published in 2019 in the Aging and Mental Health journal found people 
who experience food insecurity are more likely to report suicidal 
ideation, suicidal behavior, or both. Research published in 2017 in the 
American Journal of Preventive Medicine even found a dose-response 
relationship--as food insecurity increases, one's mental health becomes 
poorer and vice versa.
    In 2018, VA published its National Strategy for Preventing Veteran 
Suicide, which guides VA's efforts for suicide prevention. This 10-year 
strategy provides a framework for identifying priorities, organizing 
efforts, and focusing national attention and community resources to 
prevent suicide among Veterans through a broad public health approach 
with an emphasis on comprehensive, community-based engagement. This 
approach is grounded in four key focus areas as follows:

      Primary prevention that focuses on preventing suicidal 
behavior before it occurs;

      Whole Health offerings that consider factors beyond 
mental health, such as physical health, social connectedness, and life 
events;

      Application of data and research that emphasizes 
evidence-based approaches that can be tailored to fit the needs of 
Veterans in local communities; and

      Collaboration that educates and empowers diverse 
communities to participate in suicide prevention efforts through 
coordination.

    Through the National Strategy we are implementing broad, community-
based prevention initiatives, driven by data, to connect Veterans in 
and outside our system to health care with support on national and 
local facility levels.

Ensuring Veteran Food Security Workgroup

    In early 2016, VHA created the Ensuring Veteran Food Security 
Workgroup. The purpose of the interdisciplinary group was to 
collaborate with a number of government and non-profit agencies, 
including but not limited to the USDA, the Department of Defense (DoD) 
and a non-profit organization MAZON, to focus on the issue of food 
insecurity, the identification of Veterans at risk, VHA staff training, 
and the coordination of resources and initiatives to support the 
Veterans for whom we care.
    The VHA group membership includes staff from various VHA Offices, 
including Nutrition and Food Services, Social Work Services, Community 
Engagement, Homeless Patient Aligned Care Teams, Homeless Programs, 
Nursing Service, Voluntary Service, Veterans Canteen Service, Employee 
Education System, and ad hoc members from Health Informatics, as well 
as research consultants.
    The Ensuring Veteran Food Security Workgroup charter outlined the 
objectives for the workgroup, which included the development of an 
initial screening tool for Veterans relating to food insecurity; a 
process for enrollment of eligible Veterans into the Supplemental 
Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP); the creation of agreements with 
community non-profit organizations and other government agencies; the 
establishment of nutrition support and resources specific to the needs 
of Veterans with food insecurity issues; and the development and 
coordination of existing and enhanced training programs for staff on 
the policy and resources and collaborations that are created to support 
food security among our Veteran population.
    In October 2017, VHA rolled out a national food insecurity 
screening tool as part of the regular screenings that occur during VA 
Primary Care visits. All Veterans are screened on an annual basis 
unless they are a resident of a nursing home or long-term care 
facility. If the Veteran is screened positive for food insecurity, a 
Veteran will be screened every 3 months thereafter. Veterans positively 
identified for food insecurity are offered a referral to a social 
worker and a dietitian, and VA further assesses for clinical risk and 
complications.

Progress Made from the Ensuring Veteran Food Security Workgroup

    As of November 30, 2019, the data show the following information:

      Total number of Veterans screened - 6,224,359;

      Total number of Veterans screened positive - 93,815;

    A review of our data underscores some important observations. 
First, the overall incidence of food insecurity among the entire 
Veteran population appears to be low based on the six million Veterans 
screened to date. However, there is extremely high food insecurity 
among certain types of Veterans - specifically, our Operation Enduring 
Freedom/Operation Iraqi Freedom/Operation New Dawn Veterans, homeless 
Veterans, and Veterans with limited access to food (such as those who 
lack of transportation or reside in a `food dessert') - whose rates of 
reported food insecurity exceed the USDA national average for 2018 of 
11.8 percent. Second, the screening tool utilized by VHA is different 
from what is used in other surveys and was designed to capture real 
time incidence of food insecurity to allow for referrals at the time of 
screening. VHA's screen is different from the 18-question survey used 
by the USDA which assesses food insecurity over a 12-month period 
compared with VHA's screener which queries the previous 3 months. The 
VHA screening question is based on the one question screener developed 
by Kleinman et al. from Massachusetts General Hospital and validated in 
a community clinic-based sample of 1750 families. That survey had high 
sensitivity and specificity and time-to-time reliability when compared 
with the USDA Household Food Security Scale. The VA team worked with 
these researchers when modifying it for a VA ambulatory care setting 
with findings from the VA trial published in peer reviewed literature.
    The Workgroup has been involved in several activities that assist 
food insecure Veterans. Among these are:

      Ensuring that the screening tool has been installed at 
every VHA site that offers primary care across the country;

      Presenting to Congress at the Educational congressional 
Meeting in support of the Agriculture Improvement Act of 2018 (the 2018 
Farm Bill);

      Supporting the expansion of the number of facilities 
involved in the VA/Feeding America program, which establishes onsite or 
mobile food pantries on VA property (There are currently 17 pantries 
serving more than 40,000 Veterans and their families with roughly 
700,000 meals. This is in addition to the approximately 40 reported 
food pantries already onsites that are managed outside of the current 
Memorandum of Agreement with Feeding America.);

      Working with USDA and MAZON to create Veteran-specific 
SNAP educational materials;

      Establishing relationships with like-minded stakeholders, 
including Food Research and Action Center, the National Military 
Families Coalition;

      Providing two national webinars to educate clinical staff 
on the clinical reminder screening tool, the impact of food insecurity 
on medical care management (diabetes/hypoglycemia), and the use of data 
to drive change on the local level;

      Developing a Toolkit for Registered Dietitians to support 
food insecure Veterans; and

      Presenting at the 2019 Anti-Hunger Policy Conference on 
VHA's response to food insecurity among enrolled Veterans.

Next Steps

    VA plans to continue working to identify Veterans with low food 
security and connect them to resources that will alleviate food 
insecurity. With that in mind, our goals and projects for the coming 
year include:

      Expanding food insecurity screening to acute care 
patients and Veterans seeking health care through emergency 
departments;

      Continuing to support the expansion of the Feeding 
America/VA relationship;

      Maximizing the utilization of the food insecurity 
screener throughout VHA to include generating local data that will 
drive interventions;

      Evaluating the possibility of modifying our current 
screening tool language to be more specific in its ability to identify 
the different degrees of food insecurity based on clinical feedback; 
and

      Conducting data analysis on the characteristics/
demographics of those Veterans screening positive for food insecurity.

Conclusion

    VA believes food security, like housing, is a basic human necessity 
and is a major determinant of health. There is a relationship between 
food insecurity and the management of a variety of health care issues, 
including mental health. One Veteran experiencing hunger or food 
insecurity is one Veteran too many. VA is committed to providing the 
high-quality care our Veterans have earned and deserve. We continue to 
improve access and services to meet the nutritional needs of Veterans, 
and we support all efforts to decrease Veteran hunger.
    Thank you again for the opportunity to appear before you today. I 
am prepared to answer any questions you or the Committee may have.
                                 ______
                                 

                   Prepared Statement of Josh Protas

    Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and distinguished members 
of the House Committee on Veterans' Affairs Subcommittee on Economic 
Opportunity, thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today.
    My name is Josh Protas, and I am proud to serve as Vice President 
of Public Policy for MAZON: A Jewish Response to Hunger, a national 
social benefit corporation working to end hunger among people of all 
faiths and backgrounds in the U.S. and Israel. Inspired by Jewish 
values and ideals, MAZON takes to heart the responsibility to care for 
the vulnerable in our midst without judgment or precondition. In 
Deuteronomy 15: 7-8, we are commanded: ``If there is among you a poor 
person, one of your kin, in any of your towns within your land which 
God gives you, you shall not harden your heart or shut your hand 
against them, but you shall open your hand to them, and lend them 
sufficient for their needs, whatever they may be.'' Founded in 1985, 
MAZON identifies emerging and persistent hunger needs and works to 
promote policies to address these needs. This work is informed by 
longstanding partnerships with hundreds of food banks, pantries, and 
other anti-hunger direct service agencies as well as more recent 
relationships with direct service providers and advocates for veterans, 
military families, Tribal nations, rural communities, college students, 
and seniors.
    Our Board of Directors has made hunger among veterans and military 
families a core priority for our education and advocacy efforts. We 
hold a strong interest in the development of effective and 
compassionate Federal food and nutrition policies for veterans and 
military families. This is not MAZON's first time appearing before 
Congress on this topic. Four years ago, Abby Leibman, MAZON's President 
and CEO, spoke as a witness before the House Committee on Agriculture 
Subcommittee on Nutrition to discuss military and veteran hunger. In 
2015, MAZON sponsored the first ever congressional briefing on the 
issue of veteran food insecurity, and in January 2018, MAZON 
coordinated and moderated a congressional briefing about ``Veterans in 
the Farm Bill.'' Each of these occasions proved to be significant in 
shining a more prominent spotlight on these long-ignored issues and 
resulted in positive steps by Federal agencies to take a more active 
role in collecting data about and addressing veteran food insecurity.
    While there has been some progress in addressing veteran food 
insecurity in America made by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs 
(VA) and the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) since 2015, that 
progress has been extremely modest compared to the severity of the 
problem. If Congress and Federal agencies do not take timely and 
concerted efforts to prioritize this critical issue, it will only get 
worse and become more difficult to resolve. This is in part due to the 
harmful impact of administrative changes to the Supplemental Nutrition 
Assistance Program (SNAP) promulgated by the current Administration, 
which are condoned and even celebrated by some Members of Congress.
    There are tens of thousands of veterans struggling to adjust and 
survive following the transition from military service. Some have 
recently returned from combat, while others are elderly and facing 
challenges they thought they had long overcome. Far too often, this 
struggle leads to despair because there is either an actual, or 
perceived, lack of support; and available support is tinged with stigma 
or shame, involves an overly complicated application process, or 
veterans simply do not know that help exists or how to access it. The 
result for those of limited financial means is often a downward spiral 
that triggers despair, hopelessness, and tragically can lead to self-
harm or even suicide. In fact, recent findings from the National Bureau 
of Economic Research suggests ways to address the troubling correlation 
between economic hardship and ``deaths of despair.'' The study found a 
significant reduction in non-drug suicides among adults with high 
school education or less due to simple policy interventions that 
improved their economic well-being: an increase in the minimum wage and 
the earned income tax credit.\1\ As part of the efforts to address the 
recent suicide epidemic by veterans and military service members, 
policymakers must recognize the vital importance of Federal nutrition 
assistance programs like SNAP in helping to meet their basic needs. It 
is clear that Members of Congress should support policy proposals that 
expand access and participation in SNAP in an effort to strengthen the 
program, not weaken it. Failing to make improvements to SNAP, as well 
as failing to ensure that veterans are aware of and connected to the 
program, ignores a valuable and effective tool in the campaign to end 
veteran suicide.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \1\ Dow, WH; Godoy, A; Lowenstein, CA; Reich, M. ``Can Economic 
Policies Reduce Deaths of Despair?'' The National Bureau of Economic 
Research. April 2019. https://www.nber.org/papers/w25787.
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    The scope of food insecurity among veterans is complex, and we 
simply need more data to be able to respond effectively to the needs of 
America's food insecure veterans. What we do know is that SNAP helps 
about 1.3 million low-income veterans, based on American Community 
Survey data, and that about 7 percent of veterans live in households 
that receive SNAP. Florida has the largest number of veterans 
participating in SNAP (116,000), followed by Texas (97,000), California 
(94,000), Pennsylvania (63,000), and New York (59,000).\2\ Several 
years ago, Blue Star Families helpfully added questions about food 
insecurity to its Annual Military Lifestyle Survey. However, we should 
not have to rely solely on this survey--the Federal Government should 
routinely gather comprehensive national data to better inform proactive 
and robust policy responses to this unacceptable--yet solvable--
problem.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \2\ ``Number of Veterans Living in Households Where Someone 
Participates in SNAP (2016-2018).'' December 20, 2019. Center on Budget 
and Policy Priorities updated data from 2018 report and analysis of 
data from the Census Bureau's American Community Survey: https://
www.cbpp.org/research/food-assistance/snap-helps-almost-14-million-low-
income-veterans-including-thousands-in.
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    Data about veteran SNAP participation only tell part of the story. 
Appallingly, we do not know how many veterans are struggling with 
hunger, without the assistance of SNAP.
    A recent issue brief by Impaq International notes that among food 
insecure veterans, less than one-third were in households receiving 
SNAP, and among veterans in households with incomes below the poverty 
threshold, only about 4 in 10 were in SNAP-recipient households.\3\ 
These findings should be deeply troubling to this Subcommittee--this 
means that the majority of veterans who experience food insecurity do 
not get the help they need and to which they are entitled. These 
veterans struggle needlessly, and we fail them as a country when we 
leave SNAP benefits that they desperately need on the table. If we take 
the figure of 1.3 million veterans who participate in SNAP and then 
project--based on the findings by Impaq International--how many more 
should be receiving SNAP benefits, an estimated 4.3 million veterans 
experience food insecurity but do not receive SNAP. Nearly 4.3 million 
veterans who could have assistance available to them are instead are 
struggling in vain for unacceptable reasons. Connecting these food 
insecure veterans with SNAP would support better physical and mental 
health outcomes, employment and economic security, and overall well-
being. It would also realize significant long-term health care savings 
by preventively addressing costly diet-related chronic health 
conditions. This simple but impactful action should be a top priority 
for the VA, USDA, and Congress.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \3\ Pooler, P; Srinivasan, M; Mian, P; Miller, Z. ``Veterans and 
Food Insecurity.'' Impaq International. November 2018. https://
www.impaqint.com/work/issue-briefs/veterans-and-food-insecurity.
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    Furthermore, we are deeply concerned about special populations of 
veterans that face heightened rates of food insecurity:

      In a study of post-9/11 veterans at the Minneapolis VA 
Healthcare System, over one in four veterans (roughly 27 percent) 
reported problems with food security--about twice the rate of the 
general population.\4\

    \4\ Widome, R; Jensen, A; Bangerter, A; Fu, S. ``Food Insecurity 
Among Veterans of the U.S. Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.'' Public 
Health Nutrition, 18(5), p. 844-849. May 2014. https://
www.cambridge.org/core/journals/public-health-nutrition/article/food-
insecurity-among-veterans-of-the-us-wars-in-iraq-and-afghanistan/
F03B64DD63287F2BE5F2067F3E5AC5FB.
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      Recent academic research has noted that more than one in 
four women veterans struggle with hunger and that this prevalence of 
food insecurity is associated with delayed access to health care and 
worse health outcomes.\5\, \6\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \5\ Nerain, K; Bean-Mayberry, B; Washington, DL; Canelo, IA; 
Darling, JE; Yano, EM. ``Access to Care and Health Outcomes Among Women 
Veterans Using Veterans Administration Health Care: Association With 
Food Insufficiency.'' Women's Health Issues, 28(3). February 2018. 
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29475630.
    \6\ Petersen, H. ``Our Veterans Shouldn't Go Hungry.'' U.S. 
Department of Veterans Affairs, Vantage Point Blog. December 4, 2019. 
https://www.blogs.va.gov/VAntage/69018/veterans-shouldnt-go-hungry/.

      A recent study about ``Hunger & Homelessness at Worcester 
State University,'' which is part of a growing body of research about 
food insecurity among college students, found that an alarming 67 
percent of student veterans reported being food insecure. While this 
represents a small sample size from a single college campus, it 
illustrates the need for additional data about the concerning level of 
need among student veterans.\7\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \7\ Saltsman, A; Fowler, M; Dogali, M; Johnston, G; Wetherell, O. 
``Hunger & Homelessness at Worcester State University.'' Urban Action 
Institute of Worcester State University and WSU's Department of Urban 
Studies CityLab. March 2019. https://www.worcester.edu/WorkArea/
DownloadAsset.aspx'id=13534.

      Rural and remote areas also experience higher rates of 
poverty and food insecurity than urban and suburban regions, and Native 
American and rural veteran populations face greater barriers to 
accessing many critical supports and services including employment, 
healthcare, transportation, and nutritious food. Furthermore, American 
Indian and Alaska Native veterans serve in the Armed Forces at higher 
rates per capita than any other group and this population experiences 
food insecurity at rates higher than any other demographic group in the 
U.S. Though there has not been specific data collected about food 
insecurity rates for Native American or Alaska Native veterans, it is 
clear that there is a high level of need that exists and is not being 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
adequately addressed.

      Recent research indicates that low-income, working-age 
veterans raising children have more than twice the odds for very low 
food security compared to non-veterans.\8\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \8\ Kamdar, N; Lester, H; Daundasekara, S; Greer, A; Utech, A; 
Hernandez, DC. ``Food Insecurity Among U.S. Veterans with Children: 
Findings from NHANES 2011-2014.'' Poster presentation at American 
Public Health Association Annual Meeting, Philadelphia, PA. November 
2019.

    Food insecurity and SNAP participation rates among veterans are 
clearly tied to issues of unemployment and underemployment for many 
veterans. While veteran unemployment rates have declined in recent 
years, underemployment affects more veteran job seekers than non-
veteran job seekers. A recent report found that nearly one-third of 
veteran job seekers are underemployed--a rate 15.6 percent higher than 
non-veteran job seekers.\9\ Current SNAP work requirements do not 
increase employment outcomes, nor do they reduce poverty or food 
insecurity. USDA's rule change that would limit those who could be 
exempted from existing work requirements, particularly individuals who 
are underemployed or have difficulty maintaining regular schedules with 
sufficient hours, would move us further in the wrong direction. Taking 
food away from people makes it more difficult for them to find and 
sustain meaningful work. Restrictive and arbitrary SNAP work 
requirements only act as a barrier to accessing the program, 
exacerbating the problem of food insecurity for veterans and others who 
struggle instead of helping to solve it.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \9\ Barrera, Cathy & Phillip Carter. ``Challenges on the Homefront: 
Underemployment Hits Veterans Hard.'' Call of Duty Endowment & 
ZipRecruiter. November 2017. https://www.callofdutyendowment.org/
content/dam/atvi/callofduty/code/pdf/ZipCODE_Vet_Report_FINAL.pdf.
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    SNAP is the cornerstone of our Nation's nutrition safety net--it 
helps approximately 36 million low-income Americans by providing a 
modest allowance to help people pay for food. While the main goal of 
SNAP is to provide nutrition assistance, there is a ripple effect in 
communities that supports the Federal, State, and local economies--
every $1 spent in SNAP benefits generates $1.70 in economic 
activity.\10\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \10\ ``Policy Basics: The Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program 
(SNAP).'' Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. June 25, 2019. 
https://www.cbpp.org/research/food-assistance/policy-basics-the-
supplemental-nutrition-assistance-program-snap.
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    SNAP also supports and encourages work, with a carefully designed 
benefit formula that contains an important work incentive--for most 
SNAP households, the program provides income support as they earn more 
and work toward self-sufficiency.
    Another important facet of SNAP is that it supports healthy eating. 
For all Americans, research has made it clear that adequate nutritious 
food is a vital prerequisite for good health and for reaching one's 
full potential in life. For those with medical challenges, that 
connection is even more crucial. The billions of dollars invested in 
health care for veterans cannot, and must not, overlook the 
relationship between food security and health. Modest investments in 
nutrition support could mean the difference between emotional and 
physical well-being and poverty and despair for countless veterans.
    While SNAP is one of the most successful and efficient Federal 
assistance programs, veterans often face unique barriers to accessing 
the program. For a veteran trying to find out about and access SNAP, 
the process can often be difficult and confusing. While SNAP guidelines 
are set at the Federal level, each State designs its own application 
process--the rules are complicated, they vary from State to State, and 
the application can be lengthy, often requiring recertification. This 
obviously makes for a complex landscape for an applicant.
    We must work together to ensure that struggling veterans and those 
who serve them: (1) know that SNAP exists, (2) know they might be 
eligible for SNAP, (3) know where to apply for SNAP, and (4) know how 
to apply for SNAP. No program can work effectively if it is too 
difficult to access, if potential recipients are unaware that it 
exists, and if it comes with restrictions that unintentionally leave 
out vulnerable populations like veterans, among others.
    In the past year, we have seen unprecedented administrative attacks 
that would restrict and cut SNAP for millions of Americans, including 
veterans. There is no more insidious rule than that which proscribes 
harsh and arbitrary work requirements for childless unemployed and 
underemployed adults age 18-49 (otherwise known as ``Able-Bodied Adults 
without Dependents,'' or ABAWDs). On February 1, 2019, the Trump 
Administration posted a notice for proposed rulemaking that, by USDA's 
own estimate, would result in nearly 688,000 people losing access to 
SNAP. MAZON submitted comments to USDA expressing deep concern that 
this rule change would severely impact populations like veterans, who 
often face unique challenges and may require more than 3 months to 
secure employment that enables them to be self-sufficient. On November 
12, 2019, my organization participated in a meeting with the Office of 
Information and Regulatory Affairs (OIRA) to further explain our deep 
concerns, then on December 4, 2019, USDA seemed to dismiss our formal 
comments and tens of thousands of others as they issued a Final Rule.
    In order to understand the misguidedness of this administrative 
change, it is important to note that most SNAP recipients who are able 
to work do, in fact, actually work. Under current law, childless adults 
ages 18 to 49 are restricted to only 90 days of SNAP benefits in 3 
years unless they can prove they are working or participating in an 
employment and training program for 80 hours per month. States 
currently have flexibility to request waivers from this harsh and 
arbitrary time limit for communities that face high unemployment or 
insufficient job opportunities.
    It is clear that a significant number of those who are subject to 
this rule are veterans. This rule is not nuanced, it is not flexible, 
it is not a reflection of the realities of struggling Americans in 
general, and it clearly does not recognize the realities of veterans in 
that age bracket. These are men and women who often endure many 
transitions before they secure long-term employment. They are among our 
Nation's underemployed, picking up work when and where they can. MAZON 
continues to urge USDA to withdraw the rule, and we are committed to 
pursuing all available advocacy strategies to ensure that this 
draconian measure is overturned. If the goal of USDA and the current 
administration is to move able-bodied recipients of SNAP toward self-
sufficiency and into employment, there are clearly more effective 
actions--including targeted investments in employment and training 
programs that are sorely lacking in most communities--to prioritize 
instead of the current ideologically driven approach.
    Furthermore, we have proof that this type of policy increases 
hunger and hardship.
    The State of Maine offers a cautionary tale. In 2015, then-Governor 
LePage chose not to seek a State waiver for SNAP ABAWD requirements, 
even though his State was eligible for the waiver due to limited job 
opportunities throughout the State. The devastating impacts of this 
decision rippled across Maine, with increased demand on the charitable 
emergency food network, which was already overburdened and straining to 
keep up with the need. Mainers struggled to find work, in many cases 
settling for low-wage jobs with limited or no benefits. Thousands of 
individuals were forced to make painful tradeoffs--having to decide 
whether to pay for food or medicine.
    MAZON's partners in the State reported on the widespread food 
insecurity that persisted and the harmful impact on Mainers in need, 
including an estimated 2,800 veterans in Maine who were affected by the 
newly imposed SNAP time limits. Preble Street--our local partner that 
provides barrier-free services to empower people experiencing 
homelessness, hunger, and poverty--has submitted a packet of materials 
to be included in the official record for today's hearing, documenting 
increased food insecurity among Mainers, including veterans, due to 
this situation. These materials include personal testimonies from 
several veterans who were directly impacted by the SNAP policy changes.
    I would like to briefly tell you about one of these veterans, Tim 
Keefe. I spoke with Tim last week and he agreed to allow me to share 
about his very painful experience since he is not here to do so 
himself. I urge this Subcommittee to hold another hearing on this topic 
to be able to hear directly from veterans like Tim who have lived 
experience struggling with food insecurity--it is critical to hear the 
voices of those personally impacted by this issue.
    Tim is a Navy veteran living in Maine. After being injured at work 
and completing all measures included in the worker's compensation 
process, Tim found himself unable to return to work and fell on hard 
times. With no income, Tim applied for SNAP so that he could buy food. 
Though the Department of Labor determined that Tim was medically unable 
to work, he was told that this was not an acceptable verification of 
disability status for SNAP. Because of the SNAP policy change made by 
the State of Maine to no longer waive the time limit for ``able-bodied 
adults without dependents,'' Tim lost his SNAP benefits after 3 months. 
The question he repeatedly asked--to officials at the State SNAP 
office, to officials at the Social Security office where he inquired 
about the appeal process for disability claims, and to others in the 
bureaucratic maze he was forced into as he sought assistance--was, 
``What do I eat between now and then?''
    Nobody had an answer for Tim, and he went through a very difficult 
and painful period. Without SNAP, Tim had no assistance, and he became 
homeless. Tim endured the harsh weather in rural Maine, living in a 
tent until he was found and then moving again and again. He resorted to 
scrounging for food and even catching squirrels to eat to get by. Tim 
shared in his testimony before the Maine State legislature calling for 
an exemption for veterans from SNAP work requirements, ``There were 
many times, more than I'd like to try and count, when I would go two or 
even 3 days without food. I had to add seven holes to the only belt 
I've owned for this year to keep my pants on.'' Tim turned to the 
Preble Street Veterans Housing Services that helped him with emergency 
housing and he was able to get food from the local food bank. But that 
only went so far. Tim noted that, ``the food bank has limited 
resources. Last month I was able to eat two meals a day for 10 days and 
one meal a day of rice and beans or a canned vegetable for the 
remainder of the month. I am truly grateful for that food, but I know 
that I am still lacking in nutrition and calories.''
    After Tim turned 50, the SNAP time limit no longer applied to him 
and he was able once again to get the assistance from SNAP that he so 
desperately needed. Fortunately, Tim is in a much better place now. But 
he wants others to know about the unnecessary and heart-breaking ordeal 
that he went through to help inform policy change so that other 
struggling individuals--veterans and non-veterans alike--do not fall 
through the cracks like he did. Nobody should ever be forced to ask, 
``but what do I eat?'' because they can't get the help they need from 
SNAP.
    MAZON has time and again raised concerns about the impact of SNAP 
time limits for people like Tim who need assistance from SNAP. During 
the 2018 Farm Bill process, we persistently urged the House and Senate 
Agriculture Committees to protect and strengthen SNAP for all who need 
it, including veterans. We testified before the House Agriculture 
Committee and participated in Farm Bill Listening Sessions, raising 
concerns about proposals that would make it harder for people to know 
about, apply for, and access SNAP. As a result of thoughtful and 
engaged debate and deliberation, in the end Congress agreed that 
significant changes to the SNAP ABAWD waivers were unwarranted and 
unwise. The final Farm Bill--which passed both chambers with historic 
bipartisan margins of support--instead strengthens ten pilot programs 
that are currently examining best practices for SNAP employment and 
training.
    We all can agree that those who make great personal sacrifices for 
our country should not have to struggle to provide regular, nutritious 
meals for themselves or their families. Therefore, we urge this 
Committee to consider the following policy recommendations:

        1. Protect and Improve SNAP

        USDA must withdraw its three harmful administrative proposals 
        that would strip SNAP benefits for millions of Americans. 
        Congress must continue to reject these changes to SNAP that 
        would severely hurt veterans, among others. The policies are 
        misguided and ill-informed, and we simply do not know enough 
        about how populations like veterans will be impacted. It is 
        entirely inappropriate for USDA to move forward with 
        administrative changes to SNAP without making any effort to 
        understand how this will negatively impact the lives of 
        America's veterans.
        Furthermore, Congress and USDA should increase the amount of 
        SNAP benefits to better support nutritious food purchases, 
        invest further in the SNAP Employment and Training Program to 
        build on successful models, with targeted Veterans E&T 
        initiatives, and support the Veteran Farmers Market Nutrition 
        Program initiative to incentivize purchase of fresh fruits and 
        vegetables from farmers markets.

        2. Connect Veterans to SNAP

        In response to MAZON's 2015 congressional briefing about 
        veteran food insecurity, the VA initiated the Ensuring Veteran 
        Food Security Working Group, piloting and later implementing 
        across the VA network a formal process to identify veterans who 
        are food insecure. While this represented an important initial 
        step, we are concerned that these actions do not go far enough 
        and that more oversight is needed.
        The VA should adopt the validated two-question Hunger Vital 
        Signs screening tool, which is used by groups like the American 
        Academy of Pediatrics, in order to more accurately identify all 
        veterans who are at risk of food insecurity. The current 
        screening tool of a single question only identifies veterans at 
        risk of very-low food security, which is not sufficient. The 
        results of the VA food insecurity screenings indicate very low 
        rates of food insecurity and do not track with academic 
        research and other data, including from Blue Star Families 
        Military Lifestyle Survey. Too many struggling veterans fall 
        through the cracks with the current screening protocol and the 
        VA must adopt a more comprehensive and validated screening 
        method. The VA must also require a more comprehensive 
        intervention and response for veterans who screen positive for 
        food insecurity, including onsite SNAP eligibility screening 
        and application assistance in addition to a broader nutrition 
        consultation and/or referral to a local food pantry or other 
        local services. MAZON recommends the initiation and funding of 
        a VA pilot program to demonstrate and evaluate such a SNAP 
        application assistance program.
        There has been evidence of confusion and misinformation about 
        veteran eligibility for SNAP, particularly regarding the 
        consideration of VA disability ratings and the exemption from 
        SNAP time limits for able-bodied adults without dependents. To 
        provide clarification and help ensure that fewer veterans 
        experience food insecurity, USDA should prepare and distribute 
        guidance specific about veterans and SNAP eligibility to USDA 
        regional offices, State SNAP agencies, VA centers, veteran 
        service organizations, and community partners.

        3. Integrate Nutrition Assistance Information into Transition 
        Materials and Training

        The transition to civilian life poses significant challenges 
        for many veterans, and many do not feel that they have adequate 
        preparation and resources to help them succeed. Key findings 
        from a recent Pew Research Center survey of veterans 
        highlighted difficulties experienced by many veterans during 
        the transition to civilian life--only about half of veterans 
        say the military prepared them well for their transition to 
        civilian life; post-9/11 veterans were more than twice as 
        likely than pre-9/11 veterans to say that readjusting to 
        civilian life was difficult; and about one third of veterans 
        say they had trouble paying the bills after leaving the 
        military, yet only 12 percent indicated that they received food 
        assistance from the government. Furthermore, about 40 percent 
        of veterans say that the government has not given them enough 
        help.\11\
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    \11\  Parker, K; Igielnik, R; Barroso, A; Cilluffo, A. ``The 
American Veteran Experience and the Post-9/11 Generation.'' Pew 
Research Center. September 10, 2019. https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/
2019/09/10/the-american-veteran-experience-and-the-post-9-11-
generation/.
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        As part of its efforts to meet the needs of veterans who are 
        recently transitioning, underemployed, or vulnerable, the VA 
        must proactively address the issue of veteran food insecurity. 
        The VA should integrate information about Federal nutrition 
        assistance programs like SNAP as part of the Transition 
        Assistance Program (TAP) materials and trainings; include 
        information about Federal assistance programs like SNAP as part 
        of the VA's new ``Solid Start'' suicide prevention program; and 
        work with community partners and USDA to create and actively 
        distribute veteran-specific resources about food insecurity and 
        SNAP. All relevant VA staff must be trained on issues of food 
        insecurity, so that they know and understand SNAP and its 
        rules.

        4. Listen to Veterans

        The stigma associated with receiving SNAP poses an intangible 
        yet formidable barrier that is especially pronounced for the 
        veteran population. Negative public perceptions of SNAP have 
        been heightened in recent years as a result of rhetoric 
        associated with regulatory changes proposed by the Trump 
        administration designed to restrict access to SNAP. This 
        creates a chilling effect and adds to the stigma that makes 
        veterans and other individuals in need reluctant to seek help 
        and apply for SNAP.
        This Subcommittee, or the full House Veterans' Affairs 
        Committee, should hold a follow up hearing on the issue of 
        veteran food insecurity to include the perspective of 
        individual veterans who have real lived experience with this 
        issue, researchers who have examined food insecurity within the 
        veteran and general populations, and additional veteran service 
        organizations to explore models for community partnerships 
        around outreach and SNAP enrollment.
        4We also urge USDA and the VA to collaborate with veteran 
        service organizations and anti-hunger organizations to develop 
        a strategic outreach plan for veterans who do not receive care 
        or services through the VA, including peer-to-peer outreach. 
        Such efforts ideally could take place within the context of a 
        Federal interagency task force focused on veteran food 
        insecurity, modeled on the successful example of the United 
        States Interagency Council on Homelessness that has made great 
        strides toward the goal of ending veteran homelessness in the 
        U.S. Exploration of such an interagency approach to addressing 
        veteran food insecurity would be a worthy next step for this 
        Subcommittee, in collaboration with the House Committee on 
        Agriculture's Subcommittee on Nutrition, Oversight, and 
        Department Operations.

        5. Explore Related Issues

        Last, I implore Congress--especially members of this 
        Subcommittee who also serve on the House Armed Services 
        Committee (Reps. Bergman, Brindisi, Banks, and Luria)--to 
        address the separate but related issue of food insecurity among 
        currently serving military families. This is another long-
        neglected issue of national security, military readiness, 
        retention, and recruitment, and we at MAZON have proposed easy, 
        common-sense policies for Congress to enact as soon as 
        possible.

    In closing, I would like to again thank Chairman Levin and Ranking 
Member Bilirakus for inviting me to share MAZON's perspective on this 
critically important issue. The failure to address veteran food 
insecurity undercuts our next generation of Americans who want to serve 
in the Armed Forces and presents a challenge to our national security. 
Children from families where a parent served in the military are much 
more likely to enlist for military service than counterparts from 
civilian households. But low-income, working age veterans raising 
children have much higher odds of experiencing very low food security 
compared to non-veterans.\12\ As we are reminded by Mission: Readiness, 
an organization of over 750 retired admirals, generals, and other top 
military leaders, obesity--which is directly related to food insecurity 
and poor nutrition--limits the pool of eligible recruits for military 
service and negatively affects our national security.\13\ Failing to 
address the crisis of food insecurity and obesity for our Nation's 
children--especially the children in military and veteran households 
who are more likely to serve in the military--threatens our national 
security.
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    \12\ Kamdar, N; Lester, H; Daundasekara, S; Greer, A; Utech, A; 
Hernandez, DC. ``Food Insecurity Among U.S. Veterans with Children: 
Findings from NHANES 2011-2014.'' Poster presentation at American 
Public Health Association Annual Meeting, Philadelphia, PA. November 
2019.
    \13\ Maxey, H; Bishop-Josef, S; Goodman, B. ``Unhealthy and 
Unprepared.'' Council for a Strong America. October 2018. https://
www.strongnation.org/articles/737-unhealthy-and-unprepared.
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    While food pantries across the country provide critical food 
assistance to veterans and others in need, they were only conceived as 
a temporary and emergency response to the widespread problem. Veteran 
food insecurity will not be solved by food pantries that are already 
struggling to keep up with current demands and cannot make up for the 
gaps in our safety net programs, which continue to be at risk of 
harmful changes and cuts.
    Allowing veterans who have made great personal sacrifices in 
service to our Nation to struggle with hunger is shameful, insulting, 
unnecessary, and costly. Indeed, it is unconscionable. If our Federal 
agencies and Congress do not take more proactive steps to identify 
veterans who may experience food insecurity and to connect them with 
available benefits and resources, we do these veterans and our Nation 
as a whole a grave disservice.
    Thank you, and I look forward to your questions.
                                 ______
                                 

                 Prepared Statement of Denise Hollywood

    Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and distinguished Members 
of the House Committee on Veterans' Affairs Subcommittee on Economic 
Opportunity, thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today.
    My name is Denise Hollywood, and I am the Chief Community and 
Programs Officer at Blue Star Families (BSF). BSF builds communities 
that support military families by connecting research and data to 
programs and solutions, including career development tools, local 
community events for families, and caregiver support. Since its 
inception in 2009, BSF has engaged tens of thousands of volunteers and 
serves more than 1.5 million military family members.
    With strong ties to all branches of service, active duty, veterans, 
and their families, BSF is nationally recognized for its annual 
Military Family Lifestyle Survey. The largest of its kind, the survey 
provides both quantitative and qualitative data that reveals a snapshot 
of the current State of service members and their families. The annual 
Military Family Lifestyle Survey is used at all levels of government to 
help inform and educate those tasked with making policy decisions that 
impact service members and their families - who also serve.

Financial Issues a Top Stressor for the First Time

    In our 2018 Survey of over 10,000 respondents, we found that 62 
percent of military family respondents and 65 percent of veteran family 
respondents reported experiencing some or a great deal of stress 
regarding their family's current personal financial condition. 
Moreover, ``financial issues/stress'' was ranked as the top stressor 
for the first time among military families. When comparing military 
family respondents to their civilian counterparts, military family 
respondents reported higher rates of difficulty making ends meet than 
civilian families (13 percent of military family respondents compared 
to 7 percent of civilian families).
    Such financial distress can lead to food insecurity among active 
duty and veteran families. In 2018, 7 percent of military family 
respondents and 12 percent of veteran family respondents indicated that 
someone in their household had faced food insecurity in the past year. 
Additionally, 9 percent of military family respondents and 18 percent 
of veteran family respondents indicated that someone in their household 
had sought emergency food assistance through a food bank, food pantry, 
or charitable organization.

Unaddressed Factors During Active Duty May Contribute to Veteran 
    Families Facing Food Insecurity

    In order to comprehend the issue of food insecurity among veteran 
families, we must first understand the factors that contribute to food 
insecurity while these families are still actively serving in the 
military. Such factors include:

      high rates of unemployment and underemployment among 
military spouses,

      limited availability and high costs of childcare,

      out-of-pocket relocation and housing expenses,

      unexpected financial emergencies.

    Many of the factors contributing to military family food insecurity 
- including spouse un/underemployment, lack of affordable childcare, 
and out-of-pocket expenses - arise from frequent relocation during the 
service member's tenure of service. According to Department of Defense 
statistics, active duty military families move an average of once every 
two to 3 years, typically across State lines or overseas.
    Frequent relocation makes it difficult for military spouses to find 
and maintain gainful employment - partly because employers are wary of 
hiring individuals who have gaps in their resumes as a result of 
previous moves. If a military spouse works in a licensed profession, he 
or she must also undergo the time-consuming and often costly process of 
relicensing whenever they relocate to a different State.
    In 2018, we found that 30 percent of military spouse respondents 
were unemployed (not working but had actively sought work in the past 4 
weeks); and among the 46 percent of military spouse respondents who 
were employed full-time or part-time, more than half (56 percent) 
reported that they were underemployed (meaning they were overqualified, 
underpaid, or underutilized in their current position). Compare these 
findings to the civilian unemployment rate, which, in 2018, was less 
than 4 percent.
    The military spouse employment problem is further exacerbated by a 
scarcity of affordable childcare. In 2018, 56 percent of military 
spouse respondents who would have liked to be employed cited the lack 
of quality, affordable childcare as a reason for why they were not 
currently working.
    Finding affordable childcare can be particularly difficult for 
military families shortly after they move. Among those service member 
respondents who resided in their community for less than a year, 79 
percent of female service members and 65 percent of male service 
members were not able to find consistent childcare.
    Meanwhile, 70 percent of millennial military family respondents (37 
years old and under) reported that ``having two incomes was vital to 
their family's well-being.'' Among military spouse respondents who were 
not working but would like to be, only 10 percent reported that they 
were financially secure with just their service member's paycheck. 
Thus, the military spouse employment crisis directly contributes to 
food insecurity, by preventing military families from achieving a vital 
second source of income.
    The financial difficulties of modern military families are further 
compounded by frequent out-of-pocket housing expenses. As of 2019, the 
Basic Allowance for Housing (BAH) has been reduced to 95 percent of 
local area rent. This means that military families are increasingly 
forced to pay out-of-pocket for quality housing. In 2018, we asked: 
``What amount of your monthly out-of-pocket housing costs, including 
utilities, are not covered by your BAH?'' We found that:

      43 percent of respondents had out of pocket costs of less 
than $500 per month;

      8 percent had out of pocket costs between $500 and $1,000 
per month; and

      2 percent reported out of pocket costs of over $1,000 per 
month.

    Furthermore, military family respondents identified the cost of 
housing as their top financial stressor after military spouse un/
underemployment. Your colleague, Rep. Susan Davis (D-CA-53), once 
summarized the issue as such: ``The military pay system is not designed 
for junior enlisted members with families in high-cost areas.''
    Finally, although the Federal Government covers the majority of the 
expenses incurred due to relocation, one-third (31 percent) of our 2018 
respondents reported spending over $1,000 in unreimbursed expenses 
during their last move. These respondents likewise reported relocating 
an average of four times due to military orders. Thus, over an average 
of four moves, military families may spend upwards of $4,000 in out-of-
pocket moving expenses.
    All of these factors - out-of-pocket expenses, rising costs of 
childcare, spousal un/underemployment, and others - can contribute to 
food insecurity among currently serving military families. Food 
insecurity among active duty military families does not end when 
service members retire. To the contrary, the financial difficulties of 
military families can be further compounded by transition-related 
challenges.

Government Safety Net Programs Are Not Adequately Meeting Family Needs

    It is no doubt critical that we work to address the underlying 
causes of military family food insecurity (by eliminating out-of-pocket 
expenses, increasing the availability of affordable childcare, and 
improving spouse employment outcomes). However, these issues are 
persistent and will take time to resolve. In the interim, Congress 
ought to tackle the issue of veteran food insecurity upstream by 
removing senseless legislative barriers which prevent many military 
families from qualifying for Federal nutrition assistance, despite 
being food insecure.
    As detailed in a 2016 report by the Government Accountability 
Office (GAO), BAH is currently treated as income for the purpose of 
determining eligibility for the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance 
Program (SNAP). As such, many military families are barred from 
qualifying for SNAP, despite being food insecure. Meanwhile, housing 
vouchers for low-income civilians are not treated as income for the 
purposes of determining SNAP eligibility. Furthermore, BAH is not 
treated as income for Federal income tax purposes or for determining 
eligibility for most Federal assistance programs. Current policy for 
SNAP eligibility thus establishes an unnecessary and harmful barrier to 
nutrition assistance for struggling military families.
    In 2018, Blue Star Families and MAZON endorsed an amendment to the 
farm bill which would have excluded the Basic Allowance for Housing as 
income when calculating SNAP eligibility. That effort failed, and the 
final 2018 farm bill further confounded the issue by only omitting the 
first $500 of a service member's BAH from being treated as income for 
the purpose of determining SNAP eligibility.
    Undeterred, Blue Star Families and MAZON then endorsed the Military 
Family Basic Needs Allowance (MFBNA), which would have alleviated 
military family food insecurity by supplementing the base pay of junior 
enlisted members at or below 130 percent of the Federal poverty line. 
BAH would not have been treated as income when calculating eligibility 
for the Basic Needs Allowance. Moreover, the Defense Finance and 
Accounting Service (DFAS) would have automatically notified service 
members of their eligibility - thereby removing the need to disclose 
one's financial circumstances to command. Thus, the MFBNA was 
structured in a streamlined and efficient manner to eliminate common 
barriers to nutrition assistance, including shame, stigma, and fear of 
retribution.
    While the MFBNA was included in H.R. 2500 (the House version of the 
NDAA), it was ultimately excluded from the final draft of the National 
Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2020 - which instead 
commissioned a report on military family food insecurity. While we 
commend the inclusion of such a provision and loforward to providing 
assistance to Congress and the DoD as they seek to undertake this 
effort, such a report will be of little consolation to those military 
families who are struggling at this very moment to put food on the 
table.
    We therefore call upon Congress to take immediate action to support 
active duty and veteran families facing food insecurity by adopting the 
following recommendations put forward by our friends at MAZON:

        1. Protect and strengthen programs (like SNAP) that seek to 
        alleviate veteran hunger;

        2. Instruct the VA and USDA to be proactive in their efforts to 
        identify veterans who are experiencing food insecurity and 
        thereon connect them with SNAP;

        3. Establish VA partnerships with VSOs and anti-hunger 
        organizations to help reach veterans who are not receiving 
        services through the VA network.

    The Federal Government must also work to expand its data collection 
around veteran and military family food insecurity, so as to better 
inform policy responses to these issues.
    I would like to again thank the distinguished Members of the 
Subcommittee for their efforts to eliminate military and veteran 
hunger. Those who make significant sacrifices for our country should 
never struggle to put food on the table. Blue Star Families welcomes 
the opportunity to lend our expertise to Congress as they seek to 
resolve this critical issue.
                                 ______
                                 

                    Prepared Statement of Vince Hall
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