[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                   FURTHER EXAMINING FOREVER GI BILL
                         IMPLEMENTATION EFFORTS

=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                  SUBCOMMITTEE ON ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY

                                 OF THE

                     COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS

                     U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                     ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS

                             FIRST SESSION

                               __________

                       TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 19, 2019

                               __________

                           Serial No. 116-46

                               __________

       Printed for the use of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs
       

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                    Available via http://govinfo.gov
                    
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                   U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE                    
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-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------                       
                  
                     COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS

                   MARK TAKANO, California, Chairman

JULIA BROWNLEY, California           DAVID P. ROE, Tennessee, Ranking 
KATHLEEN M. RICE, New York               Member
CONOR LAMB, Pennsylvania, Vice-      GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida
    Chairman                         AUMUA AMATA COLEMAN RADEWAGEN, 
MIKE LEVIN, California                   American Samoa
MAX ROSE, New York                   MIKE BOST, Illinois
CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire          NEAL P. DUNN, Florida
ELAINE G. LURIA, Virginia            JACK BERGMAN, Michigan
SUSIE LEE, Nevada                    JIM BANKS, Indiana
JOE CUNNINGHAM, South Carolina       ANDY BARR, Kentucky
GILBERT RAY CISNEROS, JR.,           DANIEL MEUSER, Pennsylvania
    California                       STEVE WATKINS, Kansas
COLLIN C. PETERSON, Minnesota        CHIP ROY, Texas
GREGORIO KILILI CAMACHO SABLAN,      W. GREGORY STEUBE, Florida
    Northern Mariana Islands
COLIN Z. ALLRED, Texas
LAUREN UNDERWOOD, Illinois
ANTHONY BRINDISI, New York

                 Ray Kelley, Democratic Staff Director
                 Jon Towers, Republican Staff Director

                  SUBCOMMITTEE ON ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY

                    MIKE LEVIN, California, Chairman

KATHLEEN M. RICE, New York           GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida Ranking 
ANTHONY BRINDISI, New York               Member
CHRIS PAPPAS, New Hampshire          JACK BERGMAN, Michigan
ELAINE G. LURIA, Virginia            JIM BANKS, Indiana
SUSIE LEE, Nevada                    ANDY BARR, Kentucky
JOE CUNNINGHAM, South Carolina       DANIEL MEUSER, Pennsylvania

Pursuant to clause 2(e)(4) of Rule XI of the Rules of the House, public 
hearing records of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs are also 
published in electronic form. The printed hearing record remains the 
official version. Because electronic submissions are used to prepare 
both printed and electronic versions of the hearing record, the process 
of converting between various electronic formats may introduce 
unintentional errors or omissions. Such occurrences are inherent in the 
current publication process and should diminish as the process is 
further refined.
                         
                         C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                              ----------                              

                       TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 19, 2019

                                                                   Page

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

Honorable Mike Levin, Chairman...................................     1
Honorable Jack Bergman, Acting Ranking Member....................     2
Honorable David P. Roe, Ranking Member, Full Committee...........     4

                               WITNESSES

Dr. Paul R. Lawrence, Under Secretary, Veterans Benefits 
  Administration, U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs............     5

        Accompanied by:

    Ms. Charmain Bogue, Executive Director, Education Services, 
        Veterans Benefits Administration

    Mr. James P. Gfrerer, Assistant Secretary, Office of 
        Information and Technology, U.S. Department of Veterans 
        Affairs

    Mr. Robert Orifini, Information Technology Specialist, Office 
        of Information and Technology, U.S. Department of 
        Veterans Affairs

Dr. Jay Schnitzer, Vice President, Chief Technology Officer, The 
  MITRE Corporation..............................................     7

                                APPENDIX
                    Prepared Statements Of Witnesses

Dr. Paul R. Lawrence Prepared Statement..........................    27
Dr. Jay Schnitzer Prepared Statement.............................    29

                       Statements For The Record

The American Legion..............................................    33
The Student Veterans of America..................................    35
The Veterans Education Success...................................    39

 
                   FURTHER EXAMINING FOREVER GI BILL
                         IMPLEMENTATION EFFORTS

                              ----------                              


                       TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 19, 2019

             U. S. House of Representatives
               Subcommittee on Economic Opportunity
                             Committee on Veterans' Affairs
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:01 a.m., in 
room 210, House Visitors Center, Hon. Mike Levin (chairman of 
the subcommittee) presiding.
    Present: Representatives Levin, Brindisi, Pappas, Luria, 
Lee, Cunningham, Bergman, Banks, and Meuser.
    Also present: Representative Roe.

           OPENING STATEMENT OF MIKE LEVIN, CHAIRMAN

    Mr. Levin. Good morning. I call this hearing to order.
    I want to thank everyone for joining us today in the 
Economic Opportunity Subcommittee. Today we are convening to 
receive another update on VA's implementation of the Forever GI 
Bill and, specifically, whether the Department is ready to 
fully implement Sections 107 and 501 on December 1st.
    It has been more than 2 years since Congress passed the 
Forever GI Bill into law in August 2017. The VA was given 1 
year to implement the Forever GI Bill, which was by no means an 
easy task. VA had to make major modifications to its legacy 
information technology systems that processed education claims 
and payments in order to process the monthly housing allowance 
changes required by Sections 107 and 501. The fact that we are 
still modifying outdated systems for veterans' education 
benefits is an issue that we must address sooner rather than 
later.
    Nonetheless, VA repeatedly reported to Congress that the 
work was on track, that was until July 2018, 1 month before 
implementation, when VA raised concerns about implementing the 
bill on time. The botched implementation in August 2018 led to 
thousands of veterans either not receiving their housing 
stipend for months or receiving an erroneous amount.
    Many veterans, as we all know, rely on their monthly 
housing stipend to pay for their living expenses while they 
attend classes that will prepare them for opportunities in the 
job market. There were stories of veterans being evicted and 
facing other economic hardships.
    The Inspector General conducted its own assessment, as well 
as requesting that MITRE conduct an independent technical 
assessment to identify why this occurred. The findings were 
stark. In the past, the VA lacked an accountable leader who 
could oversee project delivery and, I quote, ``resulting in 
unclear communication of implementation progress and 
inadequately defined expectations, roles, and responsibilities 
of the various VA business lines and contractors involved,'' 
end quote.
    That is something that we cannot afford to repeat, which is 
why Congress and specifically this subcommittee has been 
closely tracking VA's progress for the last year.
    In our previous hearings regarding the President's budget 
request, we examined the shortfalls in Forever GI Bill 
implementation. In May 2019, we held a joint hearing with the 
Technology Modernization Subcommittee on VA's progress in 
updating IT systems and processes to meet the implementation 
date.
    VA's officials since have provided our subcommittee staff 
with monthly updates on the status of IT system modifications 
and assured they will not repeat the mistakes of the past, and 
I appreciate that very much.
    Last month, I traveled to VA's Muskogee, Oklahoma regional 
office and saw firsthand the systems that VA uses to process 
education claims. I am grateful to the Under Secretary and 
others for joining me on that visit. I learned a lot. It is 
obviously very important that we continue to modernize the 
systems that are in place.
    We have repeatedly asked if VA officials are getting today 
and in the future what they need to provide our Nation's 
veterans the benefits that they deserve. This committee urges 
the Department to be forthright about their needs, which I 
trust that you will be, and, as you know, Congress has to 
juggle several funding requests across the Federal Government 
and, as is often the case, the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
    Nonetheless, the focus of today's hearing is on the 
implementation of Sections 107 and 501, and it is just 12 days 
away. In 12 days, those changes are scheduled to go into 
effect. Progress seems to be on track, but we have got to 
perform our oversight duty to ensure smooth implementation 
without unintended adverse effects to veterans.
    Our opportunity here today is to see where things stand and 
learn from the failures of the past, and hopefully build on 
that for the future. I look forward to hearing the testimony 
from our witnesses to do just that.
    Now I would like to recognize Congressman Bergman, who is 
sitting in for Ranking Member Bilirakis, for 5 minutes for his 
opening statement.

    OPENING STATEMENT OF JACK BERGMAN, ACTING RANKING MEMBER

    Mr. Bergman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you all for 
joining us at today's subcommittee hearing on the continued 
implementation of the Harry W. Colmery Veterans Education 
Assistance Act of 2017, also known as the Forever GI Bill. This 
bill was signed into law by President Trump on August 16th, 
2017, and is one of the best illustrations of the work that 
Congress can get done when we work together in a bipartisan 
manner. This was the first major improvement to the GI Bill 
since 2011 and encompassed over 30 provisions brought forth by 
many members of this House, who all share our commitment to the 
men and women who serve either in uniform or alongside their 
active duty spouse or parent.
    As we all know, despite the best efforts and good 
intentions of many in the Department, VA was unable to meet the 
August 1 deadline of 2018, effective date for Sections 107 and 
501 of this law. This failure led to some of the most 
significant GI Bill processing delays since the program's rocky 
rollout in 2009. Students suffered several financial hardships 
because of these delays and even today thousands of veterans 
are still not being paid the correct amount of monthly housing 
allowance under the law; some are being overpaid and some are 
being underpaid. It is because of this subcommittee's hearings 
and bipartisan oversight that many of these issues came to 
light.
    On November 28th, 2018, Secretary Wilkie issued a full stop 
on the development of the failed IT modifications, and decided 
to reset development and implementation completely. I thank and 
praise the Secretary for making this difficult decision.
    This reset aimed at full implementation by December 1, 
2019, which, as we know, is rapidly approaching. Since this 
reset, VA has done a great job of keeping the committee 
informed of their efforts to get the system online, as well as 
keeping schools and students informed about upcoming changes, 
many of which could have significant financial impact on 
students' monthly housing allowance.
    It is my understanding from staff and member meetings that 
VA is poised to meet the December 1 deadline and deliver the 
changes as required by law. We have come a long way from last 
November's issues of blue screens of death and lack of 
bandwidth that hampered processors' ability to do their jobs.
    I want to give significant credit to Dr. Lawrence, 
Assistant Secretary Gfrerer, and their dedicated teams of 
career VA employees and contractors, for their efforts to get 
this right. While it is important to acknowledge that it has 
been done, we still have questions that need to be answered 
about where VA goes from here.
    Today, I am looking forward to hearing from our witnesses 
how they are going to, first, ensure every veteran that has 
been owed money as a result of IT failures, some since August 
1st, 2018, will be made whole, as well as a time line on when 
students can expect such payments; second, provide proper 
accounting for the amount of money in the overpayments that are 
going to be forgiven as a result of these payments' delays; 
and, last, provide resources and attention to upgrading current 
VA legacy systems to ensure that the types of delays that 
occurred never happen again.
    These legacy systems have been hanging on a thread for far 
too long and calls from this subcommittee about the need for 
significant upgrades have been ignored by senior VA political 
leaders, especially those from the previous administration, for 
far too long.
    The Forever GI Bill will not be the last time that Congress 
changes this education program, which means that it is time for 
VA to build a truly agile system that is prepared for the 
inevitable evolution of this great benefit.
    Before I yield back, I want to take a moment to say thank 
you to the student veterans and schools for their patience and 
understanding throughout this whole process. The IT system's 
failures and associated delays with the implementation of this 
law have been a burden for all involved. I am hopeful that 
today we can highlight the good work that has been done to 
finally get this right.
    I thank our panel for being here and, Mr. Chairman, I yield 
back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Congress Member Bergman, I appreciate 
your remarks.
    I would now like to recognize the ranking member of the 
House Veterans' Affairs Committee, Dr. Roe, for 5 minutes for 
his opening statement.

    OPENING STATEMENT OF DAVID P. ROE, RANKING MEMBER, FULL 
                           COMMITTEE

    Mr. Roe. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for 
recognizing me.
    It is important that we are here today to review the 
implementation of the Forever GI Bill. As one of the coauthors 
of this legislation, I was disappointed last year to witness a 
rocky implementation of Sections 107 and 501. Last August 2018, 
a year ago, I was in Springfield, Illinois with Congressman 
Rodney Davis at a roundtable, education roundtable, where we 
realized that there was a significant problem when we were 
talking to the community colleges and other colleges that were 
represented.
    As these delays were beginning to unfold, I applaud then 
Chairman Arrington and Ranking Member O'Rourke's efforts to 
understand where things went wrong and how the VA could work to 
put implementation of this important law back on track.
    I personally want to thank and acknowledge the work of Dr. 
Lawrence, Assistant Secretary Gfrerer, Ms. Bogue, and Mr. 
Orifici, and their talented staff, for their hard work to 
straighten things out and get this right. I thank you for that 
work.
    Like many of the members today, I am very interested to 
hear about VA's communication plans for alerting students to 
changes to monthly housing allowance payments that will go into 
effect when the student's January 1st payments begin. While no 
plan is foolproof, we must do all we can to ensure that every 
student is contacted and educated about the potential change to 
their housing allowance payments. These changes have the 
potential to impact thousands and I am concerned that, despite 
VA's best efforts, some students will be very surprised when 
they see an unexpected decrease in payment on January 1.
    I am also interested in hearing about VA's plans to hold 
Secretary Wilkie's commitment that ever student veteran who was 
shortchanged due to the IT failures are made whole. It is 
important to make sure these payments are made in a responsible 
way, so that they do not negatively impact the processing of 
spring enrollments; however, it is imperative that students 
have some idea of when they should expect their payments that 
they are owed under the law.
    Thank you again, Mr. Chairman, for recognizing me and for 
holding this important hearing. I thank the panel for being 
here today, and I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Dr. Roe.
    I would now like to get to our witnesses. We are fortunate 
to have true experts from the VA, also MITRE Corporation, I am 
grateful to all of you for being here.
    Dr. Paul Lawrence, Under Secretary at the Veterans Benefits 
Administration. Good to see you. Ms. Charmain Bogue, Executive 
Director of Veterans Benefits Administration (VBA) Education 
Services. Good to see you again. Mr. James Gfrerer, Assistant 
Secretary with VA's Office of Information and Technology. Mr. 
Robert Orifici, Information Technology Specialist in the Office 
of Information of Technology. Dr. Jay Schnitzer, Vice President 
and Chief Technology Officer of the MITRE Corporation.
    Thank you all again for joining us. As you know, you will 
have 5 minutes for your oral statement, but your full written 
statement will be added to the record.
    Under Secretary Lawrence, I would like to start with you, 
and you are now recognized for 5 minutes.

                 STATEMENT OF PAUL R. LAWRENCE

    Mr. Lawrence. Thank you. Good morning, Chairman Levin, 
Ranking Member Bergman, and members of the subcommittee. We 
appreciate the opportunity to appear before you today to 
discuss the status of VA's implementation of the Colmery Act.
    On November 28th, 2018, VA announced changes in the 
implementation of the Colmery Act, Sections 107 and 501, which 
deal primarily with the calculation of the monthly housing 
allowance. Secretary Wilkie announced a reset of VA's 
implementation to give the Department time, contracting 
support, and the resources necessary to develop the capability 
to process enrollments in accordance with the law by December 
1st, 2018.
    VA established a Program Integration Office, or PIO, as a 
formal entity within the Department made up of government 
leaders, staff, federally funded research and development 
center support, and contract support. The PIO captured business 
requirements for Sections 107 and 501, maintained an integrated 
master schedule, managed a program risk register, and 
reformulated the configured control process.
    Previously, VA engaged MITRE to perform an independent 
technical assessment of the capabilities necessary to meet the 
requirements of the Act. MITRE provided 20 recommendations 
intended to help VA successfully test and deploy the Colmery 
Act.
    Since the formation of the PIO in December 2018, Office of 
Information Technology (OIT) has worked diligently in 
partnership with VBA. OIT assigned proven leaders to partner 
with us in governance and leadership of the Colmery Act 
delivery, and co-located staff with VBA's Education Service. 
OIT has worked closely with us and MITRE to improve our 
requirements and testing process. Through these improvements, 
the team successfully deployed two software bills and updated 
five legacy systems in order to support the December 1st 
launch. These bills were completed on schedule and have been 
fully tested.
    Since the last hearing before this committee in May, we 
have successfully implemented each recommendation made by 
MITRE. MITRE's recommendations in support have been 
instrumental in the development and deployment of the new 
solution. We are on track to meet the December 1st, 2019 launch 
date.
    I am also proud to report that we have accomplished the 
requirements of public law to establish a tiger team. VA Chief 
Information Officer (CIO) and I participate in the weekly tiger 
team meetings and engage with the Colmery delivery team several 
times each week.
    Importantly, we are fulfilling the Secretary's promise to 
make every Post-9/11 GI Bill beneficiary 100 percent whole. The 
process to correct housing records will continue through 2020, 
as VA will begin accepting updated records from schools in 
circumstances where the student was studying at a different 
campus than originally provided to VA. Also, as promised, if a 
student was overpaid due to VA's challenges in implementing the 
law, VA will notify the impacted student individually with the 
amount VA intends to waive. Concurrently, VA will review the 
debt to ensure it was incurred solely based on implementation 
of Sections 107 and 501. Upon confirmation, VA will notify the 
student of the completed waiver. In the process, VA does not 
require anything additional from the impacted student veterans.
    VA has numerous initiatives in place to better serve and 
inform schools, veterans service organizations, State approving 
agencies, and the stakeholders of how implementation affects 
the student population and process. We provided 9 monthly 
updates to Congress; we executed 40 direct email campaigns 
reaching over a million GI Bill students and other 
stakeholders; we participated in two conferences in July 2019, 
in which we had the opportunity to connect with nearly 1400 
representatives from schools across the country.
    VA also hosted 45 focus groups and webinars, reaching over 
30,000 school certifying officials and other stakeholders. 
During the webinar sessions, we outlined the extension campus 
updates, shared a time line for future changes, and provided 
opportunities to ask questions. VA held nine in-person and 16 
virtual sessions with School Certifying Offices (SCOs), 
allowing them to review and interact with our updates to the 
education processing IT system. The feedback from these was 
overwhelmingly positive.
    In addition, VA conducted a Forever GI Bill school tour 
this past September, visiting campuses across the country to 
reach students who are directly affected by the Forever GI 
Bill. We visited six states--North Carolina, New York, 
Maryland, Oklahoma, Virginia, and Texas--connecting with 15 
schools and hundreds of GI Bill students. I personally visited 
the Community College of Allegheny County and the University of 
South Carolina Columbia, where I hosted roundtables with 
students and school officials. I heard firsthand that the 
communication we have in place is reaching all levels 
successfully.
    VA has made tremendous strides toward developing and 
deploying the IT solution to support Sections 107 and 501. My 
first priority as Under Secretary is to provide veterans the 
benefits they have earned in a manner that honors their 
service. On December 1st, we will start providing this same 
level of high customer service to our student veterans.
    Mr. Chairman, thank you. This concludes my testimony. We 
are prepared to respond to your questions.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Paul R. Lawrence Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Under Secretary Lawrence.
    Mr. Schnitzer, you are now recognized for 5 minutes for 
your opening statement.

                   STATEMENT OF JAY SCHNITZER

    Mr. Schnitzer. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bergman, Ranking Member Dr. 
Roe, and distinguished members of the Subcommittee on Economic 
Opportunity, thank you for inviting us to testify before you 
again today on matters relating to the implementation of 
Sections 107 and 501 of the Colmery Act, also known as the 
Forever GI Bill.
    The law amended the location basis for the monthly housing 
allowance and aligned those payments with the Department of 
Defense's basic housing allowance rates.
    My name is Jay Schnitzer, I am Vice President and Chief 
Technology Officer with the MITRE Corporation. I would like to 
make a brief statement and submit my full remarks for the 
record.
    MITRE is a 501(c)(3) not-for-profit corporation operating 
federally funded research and development centers on behalf of 
Federal agency sponsors, including the Department of Veterans 
Affairs.
    As I stated in my previous testimony in May, the challenges 
which impacted the Forever GI Bill program 1 year ago have been 
seen repeatedly across the government as agencies struggle to 
execute highly complex, integrated mission requirements, and 
modernize their systems and processes to address new mission 
needs. At that time, I summarized the key findings from the 
independent technical assessment we delivered in November 2018 
on the VA's implementation of Sections 107 and 501 of the 
Forever GI Bill.
    The focus of that independent assessment, requested by VA's 
Office of Information Technology, was to identify issues 
related to the delayed delivery of a long-term solution, or 
LTS, and to recommend a resolution to the issues associated 
with completing and deploying the required system updates. The 
assessment explored the following six areas: one, leadership 
and governance; two, technical environment; three, process; 
four, requirements management; five, personnel authorities and 
responsibilities; and, six, software code evaluation.
    As noted by the assessment, several key findings were 
related not to technical considerations, but rather to the 
assignment of responsibilities and questions about governance, 
authorities, priorities, and goals. Among other things, we 
identified the need to establish a single cross-organizational 
business leader and champion for the overall effort; new 
governance structures, new program governance structures, 
including a new Light Governance Council; a Program Integration 
Office; and an end-to-end systems integrator to coordinate 
planning, development, and integrated testing efforts.
    To VA's credit, these recommendations and others were fully 
accepted by the leadership soon after our independent technical 
assessment was completed. Further, progress on implementation 
of these recommendations have been transparently tracked and 
reported on by VA.
    Our current assessment is that these changes have had a 
significant impact on the delivery of this program and that VA 
will meet the target deployment on December 1 for the planned 
functionality.
    As the deployment date approaches, three key milestones 
have been successfully completed, which indicate that the 
deployment will occur as planned, specifically; one, the 
Colmery team has completed all development milestones on or 
ahead of schedule, including bill deadlines and end-to-end user 
acceptance testing; two, a series of tabletop exercises have 
been conducted to further verify end-to-end operational and 
functional readiness; and, three, two dry runs, equivalent to a 
full dress rehearsal, are being conducted for the Section 501 
batch runs to identify any challenges or issues that can be 
addressed prior to deployment.
    Information technology programs, especially those requiring 
a great deal of integration among new technology, legacy 
systems, and new business rules and processes are inherently 
high risk. VA now has in place an integrated program team that 
is deliberately managing that risk by identifying the critical 
path activities and decisions needed to succeed and 
contingencies to mitigate the risk.
    Going forward, we encourage VA to leverage this model to 
reduce risk and improve results across the VA's other critical 
programs by; one, adopting this management model enterprise-
wide by establishing for each critical program a senior 
accountable business leader and a Light Governance Council; 
two, working to strategically simplify the legacy system 
environment by determining opportunities to modify, modernize, 
or replace legacy systems as they implement new programs; and, 
three, continuing use of modern information technology methods, 
processes, and tools that underlie the independent technical 
assessment recommendations.
    MITRE remains committed to the success of this initiative 
in partnership with VA leadership and the selected systems 
integrator. On behalf of the entire MITRE team, I greatly 
appreciate the opportunity to come before you again today to 
provide this update, and I look forward to your questions.
    Thank you.

    [The Prepared Statement Of Jay Schnitzer Appears In The 
Appendix]

    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Dr. Schnitzer.
    With that, without objection, the chair is authorized to 
call a recess at any time, and I now recognize myself for 5 
minutes to begin the question portion of the hearing.
    Under Secretary Lawrence, thanks again for having me to 
Muskogee recently. I will start with the major question that I 
think we all have today, which is very simple: is VBA ready to 
meet the December 1st implementation date for Sections 107 and 
501 of the Forever GI Bill?
    Mr. Lawrence. Yes.
    Mr. Levin. I am glad to hear you say that, you say that 
with confidence.
    Mr. Lawrence. Ten out of ten.
    Mr. Levin. Ten out of ten. Oh, and your microphone, sir.
    Mr. Lawrence. Sorry. Ten out of ten.
    Mr. Levin. Ten out of ten, all right. Ready for the spring 
2020 semester, particularly since, you know, we know in the 
past what happened with August 2018.
    I know that you dedicated a lot of resources within VBA to 
meet to the December 1st implementation date and one of the 
issues, as you know, in August 2018 was delayed education claim 
processing time, which was caused by IT systems and the 
decision to delay school certifications.
    My question for you, Mr. Under Secretary, what have VBA and 
Education Services changed to ensure that the processing time 
will not be longer than normal after December 1st?
    Mr. Lawrence. I would like to ask Charmain to jump in here 
in a second, but I would point out the following last year. 
Last year, what happened, if--you were not here, I know--there 
was delay in getting the software ready. We were always 1 week 
away from having the software ready, which delayed the 
processing.
    As was pointed out, we received the software in October, so 
it is ready. We are ready to roll per normal, so we are not 
going to have a bunch of held applications waiting for us to be 
ready. We are ready, but we have taken extensive steps to 
prepare, hire, and train, and I would like Charmain to jump in 
here and explain that.
    Ms. Bogue. Yes, good morning. Basically, we have done a few 
things. One, we are at the lowest point for our pending 
inventory right now to prepare for what is coming for the 
December 1st rollout. We are traditionally about 60K in terms 
of our pending inventory, right now we are at 40K. Those are 
the lowest numbers we have seen since implementation of Post-9/
11.
    Number 2, we are in the process of hiring nearly 500 
employees, between temporary and permanent staff members. We 
are already at 54 percent when it comes to hiring those members 
and they were on board by the end of November, ready for the 
December 1st rollout.
    Then, last, we are ready to ramp up for mandatory overtime. 
Right before the spring peak period comes into place in 
January, we will kick in for mandatory overtime and folks will 
be working mandatory overtime, so we are prepared for the 
spring semester.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you for that.
    In November 2018, MITRE released a report stating that 
the--you know, basically, that the findings, the systems, the 
processes of the Education Services at VBA, providing a status 
update, and then we had of course a hearing in May where VA had 
completed, I believe, 10 of the 20 recommendations from MITRE. 
As you shared in your testimony, Under Secretary Lawrence, VA 
has now implemented all 20 of those recommendations, I think is 
what you said.
    As a point of clarity, when you say implemented, do you 
mean completed or initiated?
    Mr. Lawrence. Completed.
    Mr. Levin. Great.
    Under Secretary Lawrence and Dr. Schnitzer, I would like to 
hear from both of you on my next question, if I could. What is 
VA doing to internalize the lessons learned from 2018 and the 
assistance provided by MITRE, so not just in Education 
Services, but across the enterprise?
    Mr. Lawrence. Perhaps I can start and I will speak to VBA 
in particular, and maybe we can get Mr. Gfrerer to jump in, 
because I know some of those affect what he does.
    I think, if you recall, three things came about last time 
which were really important and we decided to implement it in 
VBA on all our significant projects that involve IT. One is a 
clear, accountable official responsible for that. While it is 
me in this one, in other opportunities we do where we have IT 
there is a clear, accountable business unit leader there.
    Another is we hire the right contractors. We talked about a 
systems integrator and a software developer in this. We make 
sure we are hiring the right contractors.
    We have, while the role was played by MITRE now and MITRE 
in some of those in VBA, but else-wise other firms providing 
program integration and oversight, giving us the expertise to 
watch over the whole initiative.
    Those are three things we are doing in VBA based on the 
learning based on the learning, as Dr. Schnitzer pointed out, 
from this project.
    Mr. Levin. Anything you would like to add, sir?
    Mr. Schnitzer. Thank you. The only thing I would like to 
add--and I agree with everything Dr. Lawrence just said--was 
that some of these lessons are being shared across VA, so from 
Dr. Lawrence's leadership to leadership in other parts of VA as 
examples of things to consider, and I know that is ongoing at 
VA as well.
    Mr. Levin. Could you maybe give me a specific example of, 
you know, how VA maybe has changed their process in some area 
outside of Forever GI Bill implementation from, you know, the 
work that you have done and the lessons that have been learned?
    Mr. Lawrence. Can I deflect that to Mr. Gfrerer? He has a 
broader view of the IT.
    Mr. Levin. Sure.
    Mr. Gfrerer. Again, while the focus was on some of the past 
mistakes of the previous year, I would point to the current 
year and what we are doing. Dr. Lawrence referred to a few of 
them, but the first thing I would cite is that the Department 
has surely from a culture standpoint shifted to a Development 
Operations (DevOps) mentality. Again, at the risk of being too 
technical, previously they had followed a waterfall 
methodology, which is all requirements are listed up-front, and 
then it is likely for the program to be successful, as opposed 
to what we refer to as a minimum viable product within Agile.
    The Department has done that and then, as Dr. Lawrence has 
said, additionally the testing, the modernization efforts, the 
table-top exercise. All of those things that we have done in 
MISSION Act and some of the others have led up to the 
preparation of the environment and setting the condition for 
the launch on December 1st, but also for those days afterwards, 
to make sure that we stabilize the environment, that the 
software is acting in an appropriate fashion, that all the 
other interconnected systems are contributing to the delivery 
of the outcomes.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you very much. I will come back with some 
more questions, but I want to give my colleagues an 
opportunity. I would like to recognize Congressman Bergman for 
5 minutes.
    Mr. Bergman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Dr. Lawrence, assuming that the IT modifications are 
successfully deployed on the 1st of December, what is the plan 
for providing retroactive payments to student veterans who have 
been underpaid, some all the way back to August 2018?
    Mr. Lawrence. Certainly. We intend to true everybody up, as 
promised by the Secretary.
    There are two parts to this answer I would like to draw on, 
there is an IT component and there is a processing component, 
so let me start with Mr. Orifici explaining some of the IT 
things we need to do.
    Mr. Orifici. All right. As we move forward with the IT 
components of this, we are currently working, we started the 
first sprint toward the development of the retroactive payment 
piece for Section 107, and that is currently underway. We plan 
to complete the IT capability for 107 retroactive payments in 
the winter of this year and then we will go on to testing 
activities then for deployment in the spring.
    The other component of that is with the December 1st 
launch, we have a batch process that will run, which will start 
the true-up process for Section 501 of the Colmery Act, and 
that will launch at the stroke of midnight on December 1st.
    Mr. Bergman. Good. Whoever you want to answer this next 
one, it is kind of a follow-on. Once these needed upgrades are 
ready--so I am hearing about March 2020--will there be a 
phased-in approach to pay students? Is it reasonable to expect 
that, if all the systems work out the way that you hope, that 
the students should expect to be made whole by next summer?
    Ms. Bogue. That is a good question. We have been working 
closely with the schools over the last year in terms of the 
retroactive piece and going back to correct records, and, yes, 
it will be a phased approach. Our first priority is to pay 
those that were underpaid for that timeframe and then our 
second priority is those that were overpaid, and then there is 
the third category of those where there is no change 
whatsoever.
    Also the phased approach will include, we will have a set 
timeframe in which we will allow schools to come back in to 
certify, to give them ample time, at least a 6-month window, in 
order to come back and recertify enrollments for that time 
period. We believe, doing that, it will help with the workload 
as it relates for the schools, as well as making sure there is 
no impact to students for the summer and the upcoming fall 
semesters.
    Mr. Bergman. Realistically, by a year from now, given your 
projections, we should be--the students should be made whole?
    Ms. Bogue. Realistically, yes, they should be made whole. 
It is contingent upon the schools, but the schools are already 
tracking that information. We have been working very closely 
with the schools to make sure that they are tracking the 
information of those students that are owed funds. Like I said, 
the first priority is those that are underpaid, that we make 
that the first priority to get those in the door to make sure 
that we cut them a check for the difference.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. The earliest would be?
    Ms. Bogue. The earliest in terms of those going out the 
door, I would say by early summer we will start seeing checks 
go out the door.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. Dr. Lawrence, Section 501 of the Colmery 
Act requires housing allowance amounts for many students to 
decrease with their January 1st payments. What is the VA's plan 
on how to communicate these changes to the students and what 
will the process be for an equitable relief for those students 
who will see their payments drop by a considerable amount?
    Mr. Lawrence. I am going to enlist Charmain in just a 
second, but I do want to comment on this, because I know one of 
the lessons learned from our interactions last year was a real 
egging on for more communication from us. We have tried real 
hard to up our communication game in terms of explaining to 
students, explaining to schools what is going to take place.
    As you point out, one of the consequences of this law is 
the way they change where they get their credits they will 
receive less in their monthly housing allowance and this is of 
real concern to us, to include us notifying your offices of 
schools in your State that will be affected by this.
    I really want Charmain to jump in here, because this has 
been a real area of concern.
    Ms. Bogue. Over the last couple of months we have had some 
targeted outreach at those with a lower rate zone, we called it 
the 24 Percent Campaign. Out of the 8,300 extension campus 
locations that we collected across the Nation, 24 percent of 
those locations fall in a lower rate zone. We targeted those 
particular areas and worked with schools and students to 
basically push out messaging to inform them of what is 
transpiring and what is coming down the pike.
    What we realized is that the majority of schools have 
already started working with their students to basically inform 
them that if they are spending most of their time at one of 
those extension campus locations in a lower rate zone, to 
expect a lower rate, and to provide them the information in 
terms of what that rate will be.
    Also, like as Dr. Lawrence said, just this Monday we put 
out information to the congressional districts in the area as 
well, to make sure they are aware of what is going on. Also we 
have connected with the Veteran Services Organizations (VSOs), 
so that way they are educated about what is happening.
    It is not just the students and the school administrators 
that we are educating, but it is the community that we are 
educating about what is happening with the monthly housing 
allowance changes.
    Mr. Bergman. Well, thank you.
    Mr. Lawrence. I notice the time is up, could we just answer 
the second part of your question, sir, about equitable relief?
    Mr. Bergman. Sure. I see my time has expired and I know we 
are going to have a second round here, but, you know, there is 
an old saying, bad news does not get better with time and the 
point is if--it just is what it is and the point is, the sooner 
our student veterans have an indication that there is going to 
be a change to the lesser, the better they can plan on the 
front end. Do not wait until you have all the numbers, get the 
word out that there are going to be some changes and the 
details will come later.
    With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, and I echo those remarks.
    I would now like to recognize Ranking Member Roe for his 
questions for 5 minutes.
    Mr. Roe. Thank you. Just to follow on with that line of 
questioning, I think that is probably the most important part 
of what you are right now. This 24 percent, is that 175,000, 
200,000 students? About how many students is that?
    Ms. Bogue. The 24 percent represents just the extension 
campus locations for the schools, not the student count.
    Mr. Roe. Okay.
    Ms. Bogue. For the student count, we have done some 
preliminary work with schools and what they have indicated is 
that about 16 percent of the student population would be 
impacted by the 107 piece, and let me equate that to some 
numbers.
    Within a term, basically 500,000 students receive a monthly 
housing allowance. Of those 500,000, 420,000 there is no impact 
to them, because they are staying at their main campus, but 
about 80,000, 16 percent, they could be potentially impacted by 
the 107 changes. What we are looking at right now, of the 
80,000, about 21,000 would receive a lower rate.
    Mr. Roe. Well, if we act like we are self-serving, we are, 
because our phones are going to ring off the wall, and then 
your phones are going to be ringing off the wall, because we 
are going to be calling you. I think that is the thing. If you 
are in an area--and, as the General said, students, you know, 
they do not have too much money and when you reduce the amount 
that they have, it is going to be a real impact on some 
students and the quicker they get that information the better.
    Again, I want to commend you all for getting this rolled 
out. I am really excited about how it is going to work.
    Dr. Schnitzer, just a couple things I wanted to ask you. 
What do you believe are the biggest lessons learned by VA 
officials in this process, and how can they apply these 
experiences to improve future IT modifications, whether it be 
the GI Bill process or other businesses? I think--John and I 
were talking about that, about there should be some lessons 
learned here.
    Mr. Schnitzer. Thank you, Dr. Roe. I think the three things 
are what I mentioned, but I will call them out specifically as 
being the most important. I think having a single business 
leader have ultimate authority within the organization, Number 
one; Number two, having the Light Governance structure is 
really critical; and, Number 3, incorporating the concept of a 
Program Integration Office. Those three components and those 
scaled for other issues as well, so those can be used 
generally.
    Mr. Roe. When we roll out the next--and there will be a 
next sometime--I think we could certainly utilize what we have 
learned here to not have this year hiccup, and then give you 
enough time to get the old IT or either invest in new IT where 
we can roll it out better, would that be a fair statement?
    Mr. Schnitzer. That is correct, sir.
    Mr. Roe. Dr. Lawrence, about the--you did not get a chance 
to finish, because you ran out of time, on the equitable relief 
plan.
    Mr. Lawrence. Yes, certainly. We are very sensitive to that 
and we understand what you were describing about our student 
veterans, you know, live on modest incomes, the housing 
allowance will go down in certain situations, so we want to 
explain that. We share your concern that they call you and you 
direct them to us. We would also like your help to communicate 
this is not a VA failure, this is just how the law and the 
rules work. We want to make sure that is well understood, but 
we are prepared for that.
    I want Charmain to talk about equitable relief.
    Ms. Bogue. Equitable relief will provide a one-time relief 
for students for that particular term. So if they realize that 
there is a drop in their rate for that term, so let us say--I 
will use San Fran as a great example, San Fran the rate is 
$4300, but in Sacramento the rate is about 2500 bucks. If they 
realize that they are spending most of their time in the 
Sacramento area, the difference there, they can come in and 
say, VA, hey, I planned my life around the situation of 
receiving $4500. We will say, hey, we will do a one-time of the 
difference for that particular term, and we will hand that over 
to the student.
    We understand that process usually takes about 3 months, so 
we are working with tiger teams in our regional processing 
offices to expedite that to have 2-week turnaround times all 
the way up to the Secretary, because the Secretary has to 
approve all equitable relief requests.
    Mr. Roe. I think that is the right thing to do and to give 
people who are caught off-guard, and there will be some no 
matter how much you try to do this.
    Dr. Lawrence, I know that the VA has made a significant 
investment in time and resources to improve communication to 
the schools and students about the changes coming as a result 
of the Colmery Act, can you just very briefly again go through 
exactly what you have done and how can we help you get that 
information out?
    Mr. Lawrence. Sure. I am happy to have Charmain jump in 
here, because she has done a lot of this.
    We have really upped our game in terms of just, you know, 
emails and the like--nobody receives letter anymore--emails, 
those sort of--as much social media as we could imagine. 
Facebook, Charmain has been on Facebook at all the conferences, 
we have folks who are doing Twitter and the things like that. 
We have been to the conferences, we have spoke to the officials 
and, as I said, I personally have been to roundtable at 
universities to understand if this has happened. We have taken 
that counsel really seriously.
    Charmain, if you want to jump in here.
    Ms. Bogue. Yes, social media is a powerful tool, I will 
tell you, and even though we are posting on our media channels, 
we have asked for your staff, as well as for our VSO partners, 
to amplify that messaging to also post on their social media 
channels. We usually post a couple times per week.
    As Dr. Lawrence, we went out on a national school tour. You 
know, New York is a great example. We went to John Jay College, 
we went to Columbia University, but we invite all the local 
schools to come out. The entire CUNY and SUNY system came out 
and supported us to talk about the changes that are going on 
and what is happening, and how it is applicable to their State. 
We continue that dialog.
    We also put out a simple, five-page pamphlet for students 
about the monthly housing allowance changes.
    We will continue doing that, you know, in the future as it 
relates to communications. You know, like Dr. Lawrence said, 
veterans are not sitting there waiting for a snail mail letter 
to come in the mail.
    Mr. Roe. Okay. I yield back. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you.
    I would now like to recognize Representative Banks for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. Banks. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Dr. Lawrence, it is clear that the VA needs to modernize 
its legacy systems after years of neglect and I think it is 
fair to say from what we have heard today that you are 
committed to doing just that. Could you please share with the 
committee, though, your plan for a full replacement and what it 
will cost to avoid the need for a reset in the future, and what 
will it take in additional financial resources to get there?
    Mr. Lawrence. You are right. Part of my experience in this 
journey is that our legacy systems are old--and Congressman 
Bergman talked about updating our legacy systems, I just do not 
think that is practical anymore, we need to replace them at 
some point. For us to have a world-class system for our 
veterans, you just can imagine what it would take, right? Call 
center technology that is unbelievably responsive, you know, 
processing power and the like to be able to deal with the 
issues we deal with, as well as the expected increases in what 
the--or changes in the GI Bill will bring. Our systems right 
now are inflexible and limit us tremendously and require more 
resources to be fixed.
    I am in the process of reviewing with the CIO and others 
our initiatives to understand modernization before Colmery, as 
well as beginning to benchmark against some of the like 
projects. We would appreciate that you can appreciate we will 
come forward with an ask through our internal process. We want 
to make sure that this is done correctly, so we do not have to 
be in this situation again; that it has to be honest and, quite 
frankly, done quickly.
    Mr. Gfrerer. Congressman, if I could just add quickly on 
that? I do not want anyone to leave here with the impression 
today that there is a binary decision here. We are not living 
with just our legacy system, there is a pathway. There is an 
OIT and a Department of Modernization strategy, we have 
migrated to the applications to a cloud environment, refactored 
them and stabilized them. We have put in an application 
performance interfaces, we are doing things around managed 
services.
    There is a host of things between legacy and fully 
modernized systems that are occurring, it is just of course 
never fast enough or responsive enough for the business.
    Mr. Banks. Do both of you feel comfortable that we have 
identified everything that needs to be modernized in order to 
execute the program?
    Mr. Lawrence. I think we are completing that analysis, so 
not quite everything yet.
    Mr. Banks. How close to everything?
    Mr. Lawrence. Pretty close.
    Mr. Banks. Okay.
    Mr. Gfrerer. I would be a little more specific and say it 
is part of our joint business plan. Every year, we have 
specific goals within what we intend to accomplish given the 
restraints of funding and other, you know, constraints. You 
know, again, with the Continuing Resolution (CR) environment 
too, that adds an additional level of kind of to the Rubik's 
cube for this year, which makes it a little more challenging.
    Mr. Banks. I am not sure if that makes me more or less 
comfortable, but with that, Mr. Chairman, I will yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Representative Banks.
    I would now like to recognize Representative Meuser for 5 
minutes.
    Mr. Meuser. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all 
very much.
    Dr. Lawrence, what has been stated here is some very 
encouraging news and information. December 1st, you have 100 
percent likelihood to go online. By early summer, I think I 
heard right--Ms. Bogue, is that it, Charmain?
    Ms. Bogue. That is correct.
    Mr. Meuser. Okay, thank you. That you will have a true-up 
on all past inequities that have existed, all milestones have 
been achieved up until now. You mentioned the tabletop 
executions are taking place well, you have had two stress tests 
or dry runs that seem to have gone well. Also, you have an 
integrated program team to implement and mitigate risk. All 
this is quite encouraging.
    I do want to mention just in what I am reading here, 
Accenture refers to the legacy systems as ancient, so that is 
something I want to ask you about. As I--well, first of all, 
has Accenture proved to be a good partner?
    Mr. Lawrence. They have successfully completed all the 
tasks we have asked them to do, so the answer is yes.
    Mr. Meuser. Great. The past failures that have existed--
and, let us face, there have been some past failures, so why--
what have we done to--and, obviously, following these 
principles and a new team, which, again, I applaud, but what do 
you base why these legacy systems have remained ancient and why 
have we been put into a position where we did have such large 
past failures, Dr. Lawrence?
    Mr. Lawrence. I will start and I will ask Mr. Gfrerer, the 
CIO, to jump in here. I do not really have a good answer to 
that. I do not know whether it was failure to listen to perhaps 
the coaching from the committee to really step back and deal 
with the bigger problem ahead, versus the short-term solution 
to a problem and not see what is coming.
    I have had the unique experience this year to really 
appreciate--this is the 75th anniversary of the GI Bill, right? 
It gets modernized regularly, it will be modernized against as 
more benefits are expanded. I do not know that the leaders had 
the chance to really appreciate what that meant and argue for a 
little more pay and a little more money, understanding the 
benefits would be longer.
    I do not know, Mr. Gfrerer, would----
    Mr. Gfrerer. Yes. I guess the thing I would emphasize is, I 
certainly talk to my counterparts in commercial financial 
services to compare notes and the challenges are not entirely 
dissimilar. They face the same obstacles in terms of percent of 
spent and, you know, upgrading and modernizing their legacy 
systems. I think that is one thing. I would not want the 
committee to feel like the government is so far out in left 
field as compared to like private sector counterparts. There 
are a lot of the same headwinds and struggles, I can assure you 
of that.
    Secondarily, again, I think when you look at some of the 
time lines, I think the chairman and others mentioned the kind 
of challenging time lines. You know, I would point to MISSION 
Act, for example. When you get very complex pieces of 
legislation that have to go through the entire rulemaking 
period, which eventually go into user requirements, and then 
you look at like about 5 or 6 months being left to develop the 
software and the code to meet these very exotic systems, that 
can be incredibly challenging. MISSION Act, for example, I have 
been on record that we essentially did 4 months of development 
that if in a corporate entity you would have probably taken 18 
to 24 months.
    Again, I think there is some expectation of management, you 
know, working with the committee around what we can achieve in 
a certain timeframe.
    Mr. Meuser. I can appreciate that. I was Secretary of the 
Department of Revenue in Pennsylvania and, when a new tax code 
would come in, there would be a mad rush to certainly integrate 
and implement, and we did work with Accenture relatively 
successfully as well.
    Mr. Schnitzer, my question to you is, would these 
principles and lessons learned that you described, can they be 
applied elsewhere throughout the VA system?
    Mr. Schnitzer. Yes, sir, and not only across the VA system, 
but elsewhere in the Federal Government.
    I would just point out that some of the challenges that 
have been shared by my colleagues within VA and its various 
agencies apply elsewhere in the Federal Government as well.
    Mr. Meuser. Are they saving money?
    Mr. Schnitzer. Using these approaches? Saving money, 
perhaps, but, more importantly, providing better services.
    Mr. Meuser. Higher quality, better delivery systems. Okay, 
great.
    What was mentioned by Ms. Bogue that there were 500,000 
students that are within this GI Bill and receiving the housing 
nationwide?
    Ms. Bogue. Every term we have about 500,000 students who 
are receiving a monthly housing allowance because their course 
load is more than half time.
    Mr. Meuser. Okay.
    Ms. Bogue. That is that number that----
    Mr. Meuser. I am out of time, but can we get a listing, a 
spreadsheet of where those 500,000 are, where they go to 
school?
    Ms. Bogue. Sure. Yes----
    Mr. Meuser. Great.
    Ms. Bogue.--we can provide that information.
    Mr. Meuser. Thank you very much.
    Ms. Bogue. You are welcome.
    Mr. Meuser. I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Meuser.
    Some additional questions for Under Secretary Lawrence. 
Again, it was really a pleasure getting to spend the day in 
Muskogee, Oklahoma, understanding from your team there how GI 
Bill benefits are processed. I particularly appreciate the 
opportunity to sit down with one of the call center workers and 
just listen in on several of the calls, and just try to 
understand in real time the complexity of being able to process 
those benefits. One of the things I noticed is that they used a 
number of different applications, a number of different 
software systems running simultaneously.
    How many different applications does one of those call 
center workers have to use as they are processing one of those 
claims?
    Ms. Bogue. For the Education call center agent, it depends 
on the question that is coming in the door, but nine times out 
of ten the question coming in the door is about the status of 
their particular benefits, so they would probably have to use 
about three or four systems in order to look at that 
information.
    One of those systems is our long-term solution, which will 
tell you where the information is processed, and then we have 
our benefits delivery network, which is another system which 
will tell you when the money has been released and to verify 
banking information across the board. Then we have our normal 
CRM tool, the Client Relations Management tool, which is the 
call center management tool.
    Those are three examples of a system they could use from 
day to day for each call.
    Mr. Levin. For the main data base with a lot of the 
personal information of the veteran, what programming language 
is that dependent on?
    Mr. Lawrence. I think you saw us using Cobalt that day.
    Mr. Levin. Cobalt?
    Ms. Bogue. Yes.
    Mr. Levin. I think that was created in 1959 and was 
popularized in 1968. I was born in 1978, so, you know, it is 
obviously a dated technology.
    Given that--and, you know, this is being kind to say that 
Windows OS machines usually last about a decade, it usually 
does not last that long, how are you able to integrate a new 
software that is now 50-plus years old?
    Mr. Gfrerer. Well, first I would say that the Federal 
standards around tech refresh for microcomputers is about 4 
years, sir. Ten years would be--that would be below sub-
optimal, so just to set the record----
    Mr. Levin. I am just happy if my phone lasts through the 
year.
    Mr. Gfrerer. Exactly. Your question was around the legacy 
systems and just, you know, what we are doing. Again, I would 
tell you that it is not a static, it is not the same Cobalt, 
for example, that was started in 1959, there has been 
modification language. Then we start to put technology in 
between that, the application performance interfaces again, so 
we can Web-enable them and tie them to the systems, and then we 
are always looking for ways to combine functionality.
    Again, it could be a little misleading if we led you to 
believe that literally the same architecture that was on the 
Veterans Benefit Management System that was coded in the 1960's 
or the 1970's exist today. There have been a lot of updates 
along that, much like you would if in Department of Defense 
(DOD) with an aircraft, right, where it may be the existing 
shell, but the guts, the internal avionics and all those things 
are much more upgraded.
    Mr. Levin. Well, I certainly respect and appreciate all the 
hard work over decades of getting the system to, you know, 
function with interoperability of Oracle data bases, Microsoft 
data bases, and the like, but clearly, you know, it is very out 
of date.
    Are there other data bases that are used throughout VBA 
that also rely on things like Cobalt or is that something that 
is specific to Education Services? I guess is that something 
that we need to address only in Education Services or is it 
part of a far larger discussion?
    Mr. Gfrerer. Well, I will start off with that. It is 
certainly enterprise-wide, right? I mean, we are here with 
Veterans Benefits Administration today, but, again, we have an 
integrated network throughout and a lot of our development 
efforts are similar across the administrations and the 
corporate portfolio.
    Rob, I do not know if you want to focus beyond that.
    Mr. Orifici. Thank you. When it comes specifically to 
Cobalt and to Benefits Delivery Network (BDN), Education 
Services, the majority of the functionality remaining on that 
BDN legacy system.
    Ms. Bogue. If I could just add, in the space of education, 
just to give you context, we actually utilize 23 systems to 
process education benefits across our six programs.
    Mr. Levin. That is all helpful. You know, count me among 
those that absolutely believe we need to modernize this system, 
I was completely convinced of that. I think everybody is 
working really hard and doing the very best they can with the 
software that they have got, the resources that they have, 
which leads me to the next question. What resources do you need 
from Congress, from us, to ensure that as you overhaul this 
system from Cobalt to something that is modern and sustainable 
going forward, what is it that you will need?
    Mr. Gfrerer. Congressman, we are certainly in discussions 
with Office of Management and Budget(OMB) around what we think 
are the future investments necessary to modernize the system; 
we have found a very receptive audience with our colleagues 
there. We are quantifying that. Also, in our past meeting with 
you, I complimented and thanked again the Congress on in the 
Fiscal Year 2020 budget there is actually a line around 
infrastructure readiness. Again, addressing that technical debt 
that creeps into any organization, government or otherwise.
    I think, directionally, we are heading in the right 
direction. It is always a question of managing around the 
resources that are available, but I think largely we are headed 
in the right direction.
    Mr. Levin. Do you have any other unfunded mandates that 
would take precedence over overhauling your infrastructure?
    Mr. Gfrerer. I think that is a great question. I know with 
Dr. Lawrence and VBA, again, as a partnership, I think one of 
the challenges that occasionally gets left out is that with the 
centralized appropriation in VA when a piece of legislation is 
passed, I think we need to do a better job of communicating 
with the committee and the appropriators around making sure 
that sufficient resources are added. Otherwise, we do as you 
said, are impacted by unfunded requirements, sometimes in the 
current year of execution.
    Mr. Levin. My last question. I know Congress authorized $30 
million in the Forever GI Bill to fund the IT modifications 
that the bill mandated, but that the funds were never 
appropriated. Do you anticipate that this $30 million or 
perhaps additional funding for the IT infrastructure overhaul 
will be requested in the President's Fiscal Year 2021 budget?
    Mr. Gfrerer. Congressman, what I would say is that we 
certainly have an unfunded requirements process that we have 
worked with our Office of Enterprise Integration and our Chief 
Financial Officer this year, so we are addressing that with 
respect to any reprogramming or supplementals or future year 
budget requests that might come out of that. I am not prepared 
to address that at this time.
    Mr. Levin. Anybody else care to comment on that? No?
    All right, with that, I will turn it over to Congress 
Member Bergman for additional questions.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. We are 11 days from crossing the line of 
departure. Those of you who have served in uniform know exactly 
what that means, because no plan survives first contact. Okay.
    I would like to just start right here, Ms. Bogue, and go 
down the line, what in your mind is going to be the single 
biggest pop-up that stuff is hitting the fan in the wrong 
direction on the 1st of December or shortly thereafter? Do you 
want to go out and make a prediction here?
    Ms. Bogue. I am not going to say hit the fan, what I am 
going to say is my concern is making sure that we are over-
communicating, right? I want to make sure that we are 
communicating at all levels to make sure that students and 
schools and everyone is aware the changes are rolling out and 
to understand the impact to students.
    That is what keeps me up at night to make sure that we have 
a robust----
    Mr. Bergman. Let me ask you--hold on----
    Ms. Bogue.--communications plan.
    Mr. Bergman.--hold on. Okay, and that is a nice--that is a 
good answer, but the point is what is your preparation--if you 
are not going to verbalize necessarily what could hit the fan, 
what is your preparation for when it does, whatever the ``it'' 
is?
    Ms. Bogue. I believe that we are very prepared and I do not 
foresee anything hitting the fan, but I will tell you that 
between our office, as well as OIT, we have a pretty aggressive 
strategy to have all boots on the ground and all hands on deck 
to make sure that we mitigate for any issues that come up on 
December 1st.
    Mr. Bergman. All liberty is canceled?
    Ms. Bogue. All what?
    Mr. Bergman. All liberty is canceled----
    Ms. Bogue. All liberty.
    Mr. Bergman.--during the fight. Okay.
    Ms. Bogue. Correct.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. Dr. Lawrence.
    Mr. Lawrence. We have spent an awful lot of time over the 
last year thinking about this, and I am not so certain what the 
military analogy is of sort of getting to fight the war over 
again, you get to start again, because I think we had a lot of 
time last year to figure out what we did not enjoy about our 
previous war, so that gave us a real baseline.
    What Dr. Schnitzer talked about and the CIO alluded to is 
we have had numerous tabletops where we plan through what is 
going to happen on December 1st. We have anticipated as much as 
we think we can and we are prepared for that, but your point is 
there might still be something else. That is what we are 
worrying about, but, as Charmain pointed out, December 1st is 
on a Sunday, so we are working on Thanksgiving. We have people 
ready to jump in to help deal with all the situations, but we 
know what is at stake, because the period of time last year, 
and it was described in the statements about veterans waiting 
for their checks, something we do not want to have happen.
    Most of us are veterans in the VA, you know that, so we 
feel this very personally. I would like to think we have 
anticipated everything, but we are prepared for things we have 
not thought about.
    Mr. Bergman. Okay. Mr. Gfrerer.
    Mr. Gfrerer. Well, General, I do not get a chance often to 
use the military parlance, so I will talk in terms that you 
will probably accept in terms of shaping, sustaining, and 
decisive. Shaping, we have taken the network and all of the 
architecture, we have done a freeze moratorium on systems that 
could introduce additional risk, we have done the testing in 
terms of the systems to make sure that they will interact 
properly.
    In terms of sustaining, as was mentioned earlier, we have a 
robust incident management plan. It has been rehearsed through 
these tabletops, as Dr. Lawrence said. We have an enterprise 
command operations center that is 24/7, people will be on a 
call within minutes if a related system if experiencing latency 
or some challenges.
    Then I would say, decisive, the resources will be brought 
to bear. Even on Sunday, December 1st, if a particular system, 
if there is a bandwidth issue, whatever, we will bring to bear 
all of our power with the enterprise command operations team, 
with the service desk, and with our commercial providers to 
make sure that those challenges are addressed, like I said, 
literally within minutes.
    Mr. Bergman. Thank you.
    Mr. Orifici?
    Mr. Orifici. Thank you for the question.
    Looking at this, I think we have looked at everything that 
has gone wrong in the past year and anything that has caused an 
incident with our systems, and we have prepared scenarios 
around those and how to remediate and effectively remove those 
issues, and we have practiced those. We have run mock calls 
where we have pulled people in and worked through these 
exercises.
    With the level of planning, I am hoping for a smooth run, 
but we are prepared for the obstacle course, if we encounter 
it.
    Mr. Bergman. Doctor.
    Mr. Schnitzer. Sir, somebody a lot smarter than me once 
said, predictions are hard, especially about the future. I do 
not think I can predict how things will go off the rails 
exactly, but your point is well taken. Something always happens 
that is unexpected and unpredicted; I think the mitigation in 
this case is the quality of the team. The difference now is 
that we have got people who have been through it before, there 
is plenty on the bench, and who are really well prepared at 
this point with really good systems in place and good support.
    I think there is readiness and people willing to step up 
and deal with it when it comes and who know how to do so.
    Mr. Bergman. Well, you know, thank you all for your 
honesty, because, Number one, things are going to happen and 
there are going to be mistakes that are made. Please try to 
make them be new mistakes, that is the key, because it will 
show, if we make the same mistake again, we did not learn. I am 
very appreciative of all your efforts to ensure that we will 
embrace the change on behalf of the veterans. Thank you.
    I yield back.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, General Bergman.
    I would like to recognize Ms. Luria for 5 minutes.
    Ms. Luria. Well, thank you, Dr. Lawrence, Ms. Bogue, for 
appearing again.
    After the last time you appeared before the subcommittee in 
May, I sent a letter specifically addressing the correction of 
the underpayments in Section 107 and 501. Unfortunately, I am 
still awaiting a response to that letter, so I thought today's 
hearing would be a good opportunity to follow up on some of 
those questions.
    At that time I asked if you could estimate approximately 
how many students have been underpaid; do you have that data 
now?
    Ms. Bogue. We did talk about that a little bit earlier and 
what we said is, over the last year, we have basically been 
working with the schools to obtain information through our 
focus groups and our webinars and, based off of data from the 
schools, what we realized is about 16 percent of their student 
population would be impacted by the 107 changes. What that 
equates to in terms of numbers, for each term about 500,000 
students receive a monthly housing allowance; of the 500,000, 
420,000 will not be impacted, because they are still going to 
remain at the main campus location. The remaining 80,000, 16 
percent will basically have some impact as it relates to the 
107 changes. Of the 80,000, 22,000 potentially will receive a 
lower rate; and then 40,000, no change whatsoever; and then 
19,000, they will receive actually a higher rate.
    Again, I just want to add that those are preliminary 
numbers sort of coming in the door. Once we flip the switch on 
December 1st and we continue to monitor new enrollments coming 
in the door, those numbers will shift, and we will make sure to 
provide updates in the January timeframe in terms of the latest 
numbers after we flip the switch.
    Ms. Luria. Well, thank you. Based off the understanding 
that you are still collecting data to come up with the finite 
numbers, students who are impacted, my next question was, what 
is the price tag. I understand that you might not have an exact 
number now, but do you have an estimate of the range of the 
amount as far as people who are owed more funds based off the 
change?
    Then, if I am correct, those who were overpaid will not be 
financially impacted, there is a process by which they can have 
those fees waived if they have been previously overpaid 
throughout this process?
    Ms. Bogue. You are talking about two aspects. The piece I 
just mentioned is the point-forward piece for any new term that 
starts on or after December 1st. The second part of that is the 
retroactive piece when we will have to go back and correct 
records, but that piece will not happen until the spring 
timeframe when we go back to correct records, and we will have 
a better sense of the funding piece as it relates to 
overpayments and underpayments for that retroactive piece.
    Ms. Luria. Anyone who was overpaid will not have a 
financial----
    Ms. Bogue. That is correct.
    Ms. Luria.--burden for that?
    Ms. Bogue. Anyone who was overpaid, we will review their 
information, make sure it was solely based on the 107 issue, 
and we will waive that debt; that is a correct statement.
    Ms. Luria. The next thing I wanted to focus on was the IT 
systems for implementing this. I know that, you know, this is a 
change that requires different programming, different systems 
for communication. While talking to some of our subcommittee 
staff who had the opportunity to visit the regional office in 
Muskogee it was brought to their attention that there was not 
the possibility to communicate electronically with students who 
were impacted.
    Can you comment on that? Then what types of systems you 
might be able to put in place to smooth that communication 
between affected students, for this and other issues, and then 
just smoothing out the process to make it more efficient?
    Ms. Bogue. I am unclear of this particular issue as it 
relates to Muskogee, but we are able to connect with students 
electronically. Actually at the local level VCE's claims 
examiners are able to email students, if they need to; however, 
if there is certain Personal Identifiable Information (PII) 
information, then we are not able to share that through via 
email channels because of the security natures of it.
    Also at a national level, right here in headquarters we 
also communicate with students on major changes that are 
happening to the program. We have an email distribution of over 
700,000 students in our data base and any time there is any 
changes to the GI Bill program we are emailing students at the 
national level.
    Ms. Luria. The PII specifically for an individual's claim, 
does that hinder the process? Because I would assume that there 
is information that has to go back and forth, bank account 
information, those types of things.
    Ms. Bogue. Correct.
    Ms. Luria. Is there no secure process by which that 
information can be exchanged for payment?
    Ms. Bogue. Not via email, but we have another tool called 
Right Now Web, which is available on our website, and an 
individual can use that tool to communicate via electronically.
    Mr. Gfrerer. Well, and I would add too, the information in 
eBenefits is a secure system and it can be updated and reviewed 
in there. We are in the process of all of those are 
consolidating down on VA.gov.
    Again, as a recipient within veterans' benefits, I sat down 
with our Chief Technology Officer (CTO), Mr. Charles 
Worthington, and actually looked at where I can verify my 
eBenefits direct deposit information. All of that functionality 
is collapsing down on VA.gov, part of our modernization 
efforts.
    Ms. Luria. Well, thank you. And I appreciate the efforts 
toward modernization and I will go take a look at that myself, 
so that I can become familiar with what is available there for 
veterans. Thank you.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you.
    I would now like to recognize Mr. Meuser for additional 
questions.
    Mr. Meuser. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I actually do 
not have any more questions. I really just want to thank you 
all for your great work. Thank you for your service, thank you 
for taking care of the over 50,000 veterans that I have in 
Pennsylvania's 9th congressional, and God speed.
    Mr. Levin. Thank you, Mr. Meuser.
    If there are no further questions, we can begin to bring 
this hearing to a close. I want to thank our witnesses again 
for joining us today, and I thank you for your hard work as we 
approach December 1st.
    It is clear to me from my visit to Muskogee, my 
conversations with many of you, that you are working incredibly 
hard toward a successful December 1st deadline, I thank you 
sincerely for that. It is also clear to me that we have got to 
make some real investments in the modernization of our 
technology for the GI Bill and for education benefits. You have 
my unwavering commitment that as long as I am in Congress I 
will work with you and try to convince my colleagues however we 
need to that the very least we can do for our veterans who have 
served, who have given so much to our country, is to make sure 
that we can process their benefits quickly using sustainable 
and modern technology.
    All members are going to have 5 legislative days to revise 
and extend their remarks, and include additional materials.
    Without objection, the subcommittee stands adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 11:09 a.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]

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                         A  P  P  E  N  D  I  X

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                    Prepared Statements of Witnesses

                              ----------                              


                 Prepared Statement of Paul R. Lawrence

    Good Morning Chairman Levin, Madam Chair Lee, Ranking Members 
Bilirakis and Banks, and Members of the Subcommittees. I appreciate the 
opportunity to appear before you today to discuss the status of VA's 
implementation of the provisions in the Harry W. Colmery Veterans 
Educational Assistance Act of 2017 (Colmery Act) or, as it is more 
commonly referred to, the Forever GI Bill. Accompanying me today are 
James Gfrerer, Assistant Secretary for Information and Technology and 
Chief Information Officer (CIO); Charmain Bogue, Executive Director of 
Education Service, Veterans Benefits Administration; and Rob Orifici, 
Information Technology (IT) Specialist, Office of Information and 
Technology (OIT).

Forever GI Bill ``Reset''

    As you are aware, on November 28, 2018, VA announced key changes 
and a reset in the implementation of sections 107 and 501 of the 
Colmery Act. These sections dealt primarily with the calculation and 
processing of monthly housing allowance (MHA) payments under the Post-
9/11 GI Bill. Section 107 requires VA to pay the monthly housing 
allowance (MHA) based on the campus where the student physically 
participates in most of his or her classes. Section 501 requires VA to 
align its MHA payments with the Department of Defense's Basic Allowance 
for Housing. These sections proved difficult to implement because of 
the dual challenge of updating and integrating multiple legacy systems 
with new and more complicated business rules that came about because of 
the statutory requirements, while also maintaining a high level of 
payment accuracy. Secretary Wilkie's reset of VA's implementation 
efforts was to give the Department the time, contracting support, and 
resources necessary to develop the capability to process enrollments, 
in accordance with the law, by December 2019.
    The Secretary took three actions to ensure the successful 
implementation of these two provisions of the Forever GI Bill. First, 
on November 26, 2018, he appointed me as the single person responsible 
and accountable for overseeing implementation of the Colmery Act. With 
the support of our CIO, we developed an organizational structure to 
plan and execute the tasks associated with the implementation of 
Colmery Act provisions.
    Next, he directed VA's Office of Acquisition, Logistics, and 
Construction to provide acquisition support in the areas of 
contracting, program integration, systems implementation, and software 
development. On February 15, 2019, VA awarded a contract to Accenture 
Federal Services, a world-class integrator, to provide systems 
integration support to coordinate planning, development, and integrated 
testing of all systems associated with Colmery Act implementation.
    Last, he directed OIT, and any other offices required to support 
this effort, to ensure that adequate staffing, funding, and any other 
necessary resources are provided. On November 28, 2018, VBA established 
a Program Integration Office (PIO) as a formal entity which reports 
directly to me as the single accountable official for the Colmery Act's 
implementation. Assigned and/or aligned Government leaders, staff, 
Federally Funded Research and Development Center support, and contract 
support make up this newly established office. The PIO also completed 
the refinement and finalization of a comprehensive set of business 
requirements for sections 107 and 501; maintained an integrated master 
schedule; managed a program risk register; and reformulated the 
configuration control process. As the accountable official since 
January 2019, I have met with PIO personnel and the CIO weekly to 
ensure our progress continued, except one time when I was meeting 
Chairman Levin of the HVAC Subcommittee on Economic Opportunity in 
Muskogee for a regional office site visit.
    VA has made significant progress in the development and deployment 
of the new solution, and we are on track to meet the December 1, 2019, 
target date. Upon implementation of the fully developed IT solution, VA 
will begin paying MHA payments in accordance with the law and start 
retroactively correcting records affected by the implementation delay. 
The process to correct housing records will continue through 2020 as VA 
will begin accepting updated records from schools in circumstances 
where the student was enrolled at a campus different from what was 
originally provided to VA. This will cover the time period of August 1, 
2018 through November 30, 2019. While VA now has these locations within 
its systems for processing, we require the school to tell us where the 
student was attending classes. The timing of this retroactive work 
balances feedback received from schools regarding the workload this 
would create with VA timeliness standards for processing housing 
records. This will fulfill Secretary Wilkie's pledge that ``VA is 
dedicated to ensuring that those who are underpaid are made 100 percent 
whole, retroactively, if necessary.''
    As promised, if a student was overpaid due to VA's challenges in 
implementing the law, VA will notify the impacted student individually 
with the amount VA intends to waive. Concurrently, VA will review the 
debt to ensure it was incurred solely based on implementation of 
section 107 or 501. Upon confirmation, VA will notify the student of 
the completed waiver. In this process, VA does not require anything 
additional from the impacted student.
    To address the incoming workload resulting from implementation of 
the law, VA has begun hiring temporary full-time employees. In Fiscal 
Year 2020, 331 temporary full-time employees will be onboard to ensure 
VA maintains our processing timeliness goals of 28 days for original 
applications and 14 days for supplemental enrollment documents. As of 
November 13, 2019, VA is processing original applications in 20.7 days 
and supplemental enrollment documents in 12.1 days.

Individual Technical Assessment

    In November 2018, VA chartered MITRE to perform an Independent 
Technical Assessment (ITA) of the capabilities necessary to meet the 
requirements of the Colmery Act. The ITA focused on identifying issues 
related to the delayed delivery of updates to the Chapter 33 
application residing on the Long-Term Solution (LTS) environment and 
recommending resolution to the issues associated with completing and 
deploying the required system updates. MITRE provided 20 
recommendations intended to help OIT ensure adjustments to LTS are 
successfully tested and deployed in the near future.
    Since the last hearing before this Committee on May 9, 2019, PIO 
has successfully implemented each MITRE recommendation as of September 
30, 2019. PIO defined and executed an operating plan and improved the 
development of business requirements. These improvements provide better 
visibility into the overall effort required across VA and OIT to meet 
the requirements of the Colmery Act and to provide for a higher 
probability of successful deployment of capabilities for future 
implementation of Colmery Act sections. PIO also established common 
development and test environments and processes which allow for faster 
cross-organizational time to release.

Communication with Stakeholders

    VA has numerous initiatives in place to better serve and inform 
schools, Veterans Service Organizations (VSO), State Approving 
Agencies, and other stakeholders of how the implementation affects 
their student population and process. We executed over 40 direct email 
campaigns reaching over a million GI Bill students and other 
stakeholders. We designed communications toolkits which were provided 
to students, schools, regional offices, VSOs, and Congress. VA also 
hosted over 45 focus groups and webinars reaching over 30,000 School 
Certifying Officials (SCOs) and other stakeholders. During the webinar 
sessions, VA outlined the extension campus updates; shared a timeline 
for future changes; and provided opportunities to ask questions.
    VA held 9 in-person and 16 virtual sessions with SCOs allowing them 
to view and interact with updates to our education claims processing IT 
system, VA-ONCE. The feedback from the SCOs was overwhelmingly 
positive.
    VA participated in two conferences in July 2019 in which VA had an 
opportunity to connect with nearly 1,400 representatives from schools 
across the country. During the conferences, VA provided information on 
sections 107 and 501 and the impact to GI Bill beneficiaries. Question 
and answer sessions were held with the Executive Director of VA's 
Education Service. Additionally, we provided copies of VA's Forever GI 
Bill communication toolkits. The toolkits provide language to use when 
corresponding with students, including high-level messaging, email and 
social media verbiage, and web and print-ready materials regarding 
sections 107 and 501.
    In addition, VA commenced a Forever GI Bill School Tour this past 
September, visiting campuses across the country to reach those who are 
directly affected by the Forever GI Bill. We visited six states (North 
Carolina, New York, Maryland, Oklahoma, Virginia, and Texas) connecting 
with 15 schools, and hundreds of GI Bill students and school officials. 
Veterans Resource Fairs were held during our visits, which provided 
students the opportunity to meet with Veterans Claims Examiners to 
receive answers on situation-specific questions and check on active 
claims in the VA education system. Campus leaders welcomed VA and 
provided tours of their Veterans Resource Centers. I personally visited 
the Community College of Allegheny County and University of South 
Carolina-Columbia where I hosted roundtables with students and school 
officials. I heard firsthand that the communications we have in place 
are reaching all levels successfully. But most importantly, we had 
meaningful conversations with students utilizing the GI Bill on how 
they interact and engage with VA and their benefits. VA has future 
school tours scheduled across the country through 2020.

Veteran Employment Through Technology Education Courses (VET TEC) and 
    Science, Technology, Engineering, and Mathematics (STEM)

    On April 1, 2019, VA launched the VET TEC Pilot Program. Since its 
inception, VA has found over 4,000 Veterans eligible for the program. 
These Veterans may, at any time, choose a program they wish to enroll 
in. Currently, there are over 100 students enrolled in a VET TEC 
program. VA began accepting applications for the Edith Nourse Rogers 
STEM Scholarship program on August 1, 2019, and since that time has 
received over 8,000 applications with over 750 scholarships awarded.

Promises Fulfilled

    VA has made tremendous strides toward developing and deploying the 
IT solution to support sections 107 and 501. I am proud to report we 
have accomplished the President's requirement in the Forever GI Bill 
Housing Payment Fulfillment Act of 2018 (Public Law 115-422) to 
establish a Tiger Team to implement sections 107 and 501 of the Colmery 
Act and are fulfilling the Secretary's promise to make every Post-9/11 
GI Bill beneficiary 100 percent whole. Our goal, as always, is to 
provide a seamless experience for GI Bill students by leveraging 
innovation for timely and accurate claims processing and protecting the 
integrity of the GI Bill program.
    Mr. Chairman and Madam Chair, this concludes my testimony. My 
colleagues and I are prepared to respond to any questions you or other 
Members of the Subcommittees may have.
                                 ______
                                 

                  Prepared Statement of Jay Schnitzer

    Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and distinguished Members 
of the Subcommittee on Economic Opportunity, thank you for the 
opportunity to testify before you again today on matters relating to 
the implementation of Sections 107 and 501 of the Colmery Act, also 
known as the Forever GI Bill (FGIB). These provisions impact all Post-
9/11 GI Bill beneficiaries in receipt of a Monthly Housing Allowance 
(MHA), as they changed the way the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) 
must pay MHA. The law amended the location basis for the MHA and 
aligned MHA payments with the Department of Defense's basic housing 
allowance (BAH) rates. As you know, implementation of this legislation 
is a critically important issue for untold numbers of Veterans. MITRE 
very much appreciates the opportunity to share our insight from our 
work on this critical program.
    MITRE is a 501(c)(3) not-for-profit corporation. We are chartered 
to operate in the public interest, which includes operating federally 
funded research and development centers, or FFRDCs, on behalf of 
Federal agency sponsors. We currently operate seven FFRDCs sponsored by 
a variety of Federal sponsors including the Department of Veterans 
Affairs, which is a co-sponsor of MITRE's Center for Enterprise 
Modernization (CEM). Our Center for Enterprise Modernization was 
established in 1998 by the Department of Treasury's Internal Revenue 
Service (IRS) and we have been proud to support many modernization 
efforts under that FFRDC, including aspects of the VA's modernization 
efforts. The other primary sponsors for which MITRE operates FFRDCs 
include the Department of Defense; the Centers for Medicare and 
Medicaid Services at the Department of Health and Human Services; the 
National Institute of Standards and Technology; the Federal Aviation 
Administration; the Department of Homeland Security; and the U.S. 
Courts -- the latter being the only non-Executive Branch entity that 
has created an FFRDC to date.

Background

    As stated in our previous testimony provided in May 2019, the 
challenges which impacted the FGIB program 1 year ago are seen 
repeatedly across the government as agencies struggle to execute highly 
complex, integrated mission requirements and modernize their systems 
and processes to address new mission needs. At that time, I summarized 
the key findings from the Independent Technical Assessment (ITA) we 
delivered in November 2018 on the VA's implementation of Sections 107 
and 501 of the FGIB.
    The focus of that independent assessment, requested by VA's Office 
of Information Technology (OIT), was to identify issues related to the 
delayed delivery of the Long-Term Solution, or LTS, and to recommend a 
resolution to the issues associated with completing and deploying the 
required system updates. The assessment explored the following six 
assessment areas:

        1. Leadership and Governance;

        2. Technical Environment;

        3. Process;

        4. Requirements Management;

        5. Personnel Authorities and Responsibilities; and

        6. Software Code Evaluation.

    The ITA team's review of the observations, findings, and 
recommendations -- informed by industry benchmarks and best practices, 
insight from subject matter experts, and experience with large-scale 
software intensive systems -- enabled it to identify four systemic 
findings that were preventing rapid integrated capability delivery 
under the strategy then in place:

        1. Technical and business leaders were not fully empowered to 
        address issues related to the Colmery Act due to a lack of 
        clear authority, priorities, and goals;

        2. Work priorities, resources, and authorities for execution 
        were not aligned for the delivery of Colmery Act functionality;

        3. Operations and processes within and across VBA and OIT were 
        not focused on the Colmery Act functionality, impeding the 
        information flow to leaders; and

        4. Data and tools were not integrated across LTS and the legacy 
        systems, impeding delivery of the Colmery Act functionality.

    As noted by the assessment, several key findings related not to 
technical considerations, but rather to the assignment of 
responsibilities and questions of alignment centered around governance, 
authorities, priorities, and goals. Among other things, we identified 
the need to establish:

      A single cross-organizational business leader and 
champion for the overall effort;

      New program governance structures, including a new Light 
Governance Council -- one streamlined and built for speed -- to serve 
as the decision authority for definition and enforcement of norms for 
executing program activities, as well as the approval or disapproval of 
lifecycle processes, control gates, activities, funding, acquisitions, 
resources and systems required to achieve successful implementation;

      A Program Integration Office, accountable for definition, 
coordination, and management of functional, technical, and programmatic 
activities across the VA; and

      An end-to-end systems integrator, to coordinate planning, 
development, and integrated testing of all systems associated with 
implementation of FGIB, including new software development, interfaces 
with legacy systems, systems architecture, and testing.

    In response, the Under Secretary for Benefits was appointed to 
oversee overall implementation of the effort, aided by the Chief 
Information Officer and supported by a Light Governance Council, 
referred to as Program Governance, led by two Co-Chairs, representing 
the interests of the business and the technical communities 
respectively and supported by a Program Integration Office (PIO), led 
by key leaders from the Education Service, Office of Business Process 
Integration and OIT, who are responsible for definition, coordination, 
and management of functional, technical, and programmatic activities.
    To VA's credit, these recommendations and others were fully 
accepted by the leadership soon after our ITA was completed, briefed to 
senior leaders in December and presented to this committee. Further, 
progress on implementation of those recommendations has been 
transparently tracked and reported on by VA. This degree of leadership 
commitment and focus has been instrumental in the progress we've seen 
to date.

Current Assessment

    Our current assessment is that these changes have had a significant 
impact on the delivery of this program. As a result, we anticipate that 
VA will meet the target deployment of December 1 for the planned 
functionality. This leadership team has been both highly integrated and 
extremely proactive. Over the course of this past year, they have 
quickly made informed, data-driven decisions and worked across all 
organizations involved in or affected by this program and the changes 
being made to implement it. As the December 1 deployment date 
approaches, three key milestones have been successfully completed which 
indicate that the deployment will occur as planned. Specifically:

        1. The Colmery team has met or come in ahead of schedule on all 
        development milestones. Since my previous testimony, the team 
        completed Build 1 (7/5/19) and Build 2 (10/18/19), which 
        included end-to-end user acceptance testing with all 
        interdependent systems. These builds were completed on 
        schedule, and the team reviewed testing material through 10/23/
        19, at which time the Minimally Viable Product was formally 
        accepted by VA.

        2. In preparation for the deployment, a series of tabletops 
        have been conducted to further verify end-to-end operational 
        and functional readiness. Representatives from about twenty 
        (20) dependent systems and/or offices have worked together to 
        flesh out standard operating procedures (SOPs) and develop 
        contingency plans for hypothetical scenarios.

        3. In addition, two dry runs are being conducted for the 
        Section 501 retro batch runs to identify any challenges or 
        issues that can be addressed prior to deployment. This is 
        equivalent to a ``full dress rehearsal'' before the December 1 
        deployment.

Future Actions

    As stated in previous testimony, Information technology programs, 
especially those requiring a great deal of integration between new 
technology, legacy systems, and new business rules and processes, are 
inherently high risk. Our experience, along with many industry case 
studies, shows that clear leadership and accountability, along with 
simplified governance that facilitates decisions making while avoiding 
bureaucracy, mitigates that risk and leads to more successful results. 
The VA now has in place an integrated program team that is deliberately 
managing that risk by identifying the critical path activities and 
decisions needed to succeed, and contingencies to mitigate the risk.
    Going forward, we encourage VA to take this experience and leverage 
this model to reduce risk and improve results across the VA's other 
critical programs by:

        1. Adopting this management model as an enterprise-wide model 
        by establishing for each critical program a senior accountable 
        business leader, assisted by the CIO, and a light governance 
        council supported by a PIO;

        2. Working to strategically simplify the legacy system 
        environment by determining opportunities to modify, modernize 
        or replace legacy systems as they implement new programs; and

        3. Continuing use of modern IT methods, processes and tools 
        that underlie the ITA recommendations and have contributed 
        overall to the success of this effort, such as DevOps and 
        automated testing.

    MITRE remains committed to the success of this initiative in 
partnership with VA leadership and the selected systems integrator. 
MITRE is currently working with VA to instantiate the PIO activity as 
an organic capability moving forward. We appreciate the opportunity to 
provide independent, conflict-free strategic advice to the Program 
Integration Office through this phase. As the operator of the VA's 
FFRDC, we stand ready to assist the VA to fully establish the 
capability to perform this integration and modernization function as a 
core competency and a standard, integral part of their management 
approach.
    In closing, let me just note that of MITRE's roughly 8,500 
personnel, some 30 percent are Veterans. There are few duties that our 
employees consider more noble and consequential than honoring, through 
our support for the VA, the service and sacrifice of our Nation's men 
and women in uniform. On behalf of the entire MITRE team, I greatly 
appreciate the opportunity to come before you again today to provide 
this update, and I look forward to your questions.

                       Statements for the Record

                              ----------                              


               Prepared Statement of The American Legion

    Chairman Levin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and distinguished members 
of the subcommittee, on behalf of National Commander, James W. ``Bill'' 
Oxford, and the nearly 2 million members of The American Legion, we 
thank you for the opportunity to share the views of The American Legion 
on the Department of Veterans Affairs continued implementation of the 
Harry W. Colmery GI Bill (hereafter referred to as the ``Forever GI 
Bill'').
    In the summer of 2017, the Administration and Congress enacted the 
Harry W. Colmery Educational Improvement Act, named after The American 
Legion's Past National Commander and the author of the original GI Bill 
(The Servicemen's Readjustment Act of 1944). The Forever GI Bill 
eliminated the arbitrary 15-year limit, increased benefits for Purple 
Heart recipients, expanded Yellow Ribbon eligibility, restored benefits 
to victims of school closures, and calculated housing allowances based 
on the beneficiaries' zip code of class attendance. Section 107 of the 
Harry W. Colmery Veterans Educational Assistance Act addresses the 
perceived inequities in the Post 9/11 GI Bill by mandating that the 
housing allowance be calculated based upon the location of the campus 
where the majority of a student's classes were taken.

                               Background

    When the Forever GI Bill was signed into law on August 15th, 2017, 
the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) had under 12 months to 
develop and launch 16 provisions of the bill, which included 
restoration of lost benefits due to closed schools including 
calculation of the monthly housing stipend based on location of 
campuses, and aligning housing stipends to Department of Defense 
levels. By May 2018, serious doubts were beginning to emerge that VA 
was at risk of missing these deadlines.\1\ By October 2018, pending GI 
Bill claims rose to 228,640, a 68 percent increase from the previous 
year. Furthermore, over 1,400 claims were reported as delayed past 60 
days. Timeliness of delivery rose to 35.4 days for original claims and 
23.8 for supplemental claims. By November 2018, confidence in the VA's 
ability to implement the GI Bill was at an all-time low.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \1\  https://www.stripes.com/house-lawmakers-question-va-s-ability-
to-meet-deadline-for-gi-bill-changes-1.580317
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    In the following year, The American Legion convened a ``Veterans 
Benefits Administration GI Bill Symposium'' on February 28th, 2019 
during our 59th Washington Conference. The purpose of this symposium 
was to establish a dialog between the VA and the school certifying 
officials (SCOs) who were the first point of contact student veterans 
turned to when their housing checks did not arrive on time. The SCOs 
made it clear to VA staff that payment delays have direct consequences 
on student veterans' faith in the VA system; timely payments must be 
prioritized above any Forever GI Bill implementation requirements.
    Implementation challenges spilled into second-order effects on GI 
Bill processing times, resulting in extended housing payment delays for 
student veterans in the Fall Semester of 2019. As The American Legion 
focused on helping veterans who were falling into hardship due to 
missed GI Bill payments, news of the payment backlog sparked bipartisan 
outrage, and the VA reassigned its Director Education Service.\2\
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    \2\  https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2018/11/15/
veterans-arent-getting-their-gi-bill-payments-because-vas-year-old-
computer-system-broke/
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    The American Legion shares this view, and commends VA for its 
improvements to benefits delivery:
[GRAPHIC] [TIFF OMITTED] T1376.004


    The American Legion is pleased to share that VA appears to have 
executed a remarkable turnaround to bring Forever GI Bill 
implementation back on track and restore confidence in VA's ability to 
effectively administer education benefits.
    By October 16th, 2019, pending GI Bill claims fell to 74,343, the 
lowest it has been since passage of the Post-9/11 GI Bill in 2008. 
Claims over 60 days dropped to 233, and timeliness of delivery 
accelerated to 23.3 days for original claims and 13.1 days for 
supplemental claims. The American Legion also commends VA for achieving 
its fastest GI Bill processing numbers to date, and encourages VA's 
education service to continue to prioritize timely benefits processing.

                          Technical Challenges

    The calculation and processing of Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits is a 
complex process requiring inputs and oversight from veterans, SCOs, and 
VA Education Liaison Representatives. The intricacy of this process 
requires routine stakeholder engagement and feedback loops that were 
not part of the Forever GI Bill's initial 2018 implementation plan. The 
lack of organizational integration throughout the software development 
lifecycle resulted in both communication and technical gaps across the 
implementation phases. The Post-9/11 GI Bill provides a monthly housing 
allowance for a student veteran based upon the facility code assigned 
to the main campus of the approved educational facility.
    Initially, in attempt to implement Section 107 as broadly as 
possible, VA defined a training site as a ``campus'' included: 1) the 
individual campus of a school where the student is taking classes 
(i.e., the school's science center, humanities building, or athletic 
center), 2) the physical location where a student is learning in a 
study abroad program, or 3) an internship, externship, practicum or 
student teaching site. Recognizing earlier this year that this 
definition was too broad, VA then changed the definition of a 
``campus'' for housing payment purposes to be only those locations 
where the physical site of the training is either owned or leased by 
the school and the school has ownership or control over the student's 
classroom instruction. Additionally, VA has assigned sub-facility codes 
to the campuses in the zip codes that meet this definition as some 
students found themselves attending branch campuses with a higher cost 
of living than the main campus. In response to this challenge VA reset 
its implementation efforts last year for Section 107 of the law to 
allow the Department time to reestablish contracting support and 
resources to develop the capability to process and deploy for spring 
enrollments for 2020.
    The American Legion eagerly looks forward to the successful 
implementation of Sections 107 of the Forever GI Bill and applauds VA 
efforts to make necessary adjustments to its information technology 
platform to expedite facilitatation. However, we strongly suggest that 
VA remain cognizant of challenges produced for veterans and schools by 
future changes and request they take said challenges into consideration 
going forward.

                       Stakeholder Communication

    Presently, VA Education Service has achieved transparent 
stakeholder engagement that incorporates schools, veterans 
organizations, student beneficiaries, and third-party contractors to a 
degree seldom seen in its history. The American Legion believes this is 
the result of solid leadership and hard-learned organizational lessons 
from the VA's ``Colmery Act (PL 115-48) Section 107 -- Focus Group'' on 
March 7th, 2018. The purpose of this focus group was to brief schools 
and veterans organizations on VA's newly established definition of 
``campus'' to meet Forever GI Bill guidelines to calculate housing 
allowances based on campus zip codes (the aforementioned Section 107). 
VA did not seek sufficient input on higher education's definition of 
``campus,'' and as a result included internship and externship sites in 
its campus definition.
    Following the results of the initial Forever GI Bill 
implementation, VA commissioned both a public Office of Inspector 
General report and an internal MITRE Corporation Independent Technical 
Assessment to determine the causes of the botched rollout; both 
determined unclear communication to VA stakeholders as a contributing 
factor to implementation failures along with an absence of leadership:

    Throughout planning and early implementation efforts, VA lacked a 
single accountable official to oversee the project, which resulted in 
unclear communications to VA stakeholders of implementation progress 
and inadequately defined expectations, roles, and responsibilities of 
the various VA business lines and contractors involved.\3\
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    \3\  https://www.va.gov/oig/pubs/VAOIG-19-06452-97.pdf

    In November 2018, the VA Secretary named the Under Secretary for 
Benefits as the senior official responsible for implementing the 
Forever GI Bill. In subsequent months, new leadership was established 
at VA Education Service along with a new contractor, Accenture, to 
oversee Forever GI Bill implementation. The product of these changes 
was a strikingly more engaged outreach strategy in 2019. This effort 
allowed for better communication with veteran support organizations and 
congressional stakeholders, and VA Education Service began hosting 
monthly stakeholder meetings to brief staffers on implementation 
progress.
    This also enhanced communication with schools. Accenture launched a 
roundtable and webcast to collect comments and insights on how to best 
implement, communicate, and provide training on GI Bill implementation, 
which is a markedly different approach from 2018 that incorporates 
stakeholder feedback instead of dictating stakeholder requirements. 
Finally, VA increased and improved its outreach directly to student 
veterans. The Under Secretary for Benefits hosted multiple Facebook 
Live feedback sessions, and VA Education services launched a VA School 
Tour that has visited nine sites across the country to collect feedback 
from beneficiaries' and faculty experiences.

                               Conclusion

    Seventy-five years ago, The American Legion pioneered the 
proposition that America must invest in the transition back home for 
those who defend her. As daring as the passage of this ``GI Bill of 
Rights'' was, its ultimate success could not have been realized without 
effective implementation led by the Veterans Administration's post-war 
chief: General (Ret.) Omar Bradley.
    The implementation challenges of the Harry W. Colmery Veterans 
Educational Benefits Act of 2017 demand VA to rise to this earlier 
caliber of leadership, and The American Legion stands ready to support 
its successful execution.
    For additional information regarding this testimony, please contact 
Mr. Ernest Robinson at The American Legion's Legislative Division at 
(202)-263-2990 or [email protected].
                                 ______
                                 

         Prepared Statement of The Student Veterans of America

    Chairman Levin, Chairwoman Lee, Ranking Member Bilirakis, Ranking 
Member Banks, and Members of the Subcommittees:
    Thank you for inviting Student Veterans of America (SVA) to submit 
our testimony on the ongoing Forever GI Bill implementation efforts.
    With more than 1,500 chapters representing nearly one million 
student veterans, service members, families, and survivors using 
Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) benefits in schools across the 
country, we are pleased to share the perspective of those directly 
impacted by the in the implementation of sections 107 and 501 of the 
Forever GI Bill.
    Established in 2008, SVA has grown to become a force and voice for 
the interests of veterans in higher education. Student Veterans of 
America places the student veteran at the top of our organizational 
pyramid by conducting rigorous research on student veterans, providing 
a myriad of programs supporting their success, and advocating for 
improvements to veterans benefits and higher education policy. As the 
future leaders of this country, and some of the most successful 
students in higher education, it is imperative that we foster the 
success of veterans in school to prepare them for productive and 
impactful lives.\1\
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    \1\  Shane, Leo. Military Times. Report: Young vets are more 
successful than their civilian peers. July 29, 2017. https://
www.militarytimes.com/veterans/2017/07/29/report-young-vets-are-more-
successful-than-their-civilian-peers/
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    Edward Everett, our Nation's 20th Secretary of State, and the 
former President of Harvard University was famously quoted as stating, 
``Education is a better safeguard of liberty than a standing army.'' 
While we have the finest military the world has ever known, the 
sentiment remains; the importance of education to our country's 
national security continues to be critical. Ensuring the success of 
student veterans on campus must first start with ensuring they have 
reliable and timely access to their earned education benefits.

Background

    The Harry W. Colmery Educational Assistance Act, more commonly 
known as the Forever GI Bill, was signed into law in August 2017 and 
created the largest expansion of education benefits for veterans in 
nearly a decade.\2\ The bill includes dozens of provisions that 
increase access to higher education, reduce inequities within the 
benefit, and turn the GI Bill into a benefit of service far beyond the 
current generation. Nearly all the law's provisions are already in 
effect and benefiting student veterans across the country.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \2\  Harry W. Colmery Veterans Education Assistance Act of 2017 
Sec. 108. Pub. L 115-48. (2017). https://www.Congress.gov/bill/
115thcongress/house-bill/3218.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    While SVA was proud to work alongside many members of this 
subcommittee and their staffs to pass the Forever GI Bill, we remain 
watchful of the law's ongoing implementation of the provisions aimed at 
addressing inequities in the Monthly Housing Allowance (MHA) students 
receive. The Spring 2020 semester will be a crucial indicator of this 
process, as the new MHA provisions should have taken effect by this 
date.
    In several oversight hearings this Committee held over the past 
year, senior VA officials assured the Nation's student veterans and 
this Congress that late payments and failures associated with a lack of 
accountability at VA have been sufficiently addressed.\3\ At the time, 
student veterans expressed the dire straits of the situation, noting, 
``I'm about to lose everything that I own and become homeless. I don't 
want to be that veteran on the street begging for change because I 
haven't received what I was promised.'' \4\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \3\  Wentling, Nikki, ``Federal watchdog: VA leadership failures 
are to blame for GI Bill payment issues,'' March 21, 2019, https://
www.stripes.com/Federal-watchdog-va-leadership-failures-are-to-blame-
for-gi-bill-payment-issues-1.573672
    \4\  McCausland, Phil, NBC News, Veterans haven't received GI Bill 
benefits for months due to ongoing IT issues at VA, Nov. 11, 2018, 
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/veterans-haven-t-receive-gi-bill-
benefits-months-due-ongoing-n934696
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    In response to a March 2018 focus group outlining VA's plan to use 
zip codes to calculate campus-based MHA rates as required by section 
107 of the law, SVA raised concerns in an April letter with the planned 
strategy and the potential roadblocks we saw with VA's plans. Our 
concerns centered around the use of zip codes to define campus location 
instead of existing Department of Education coding mechanisms and the 
unintended consequences that could create.\5\
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    \5\  Student Veterans of America. SVA Response to VA's Campus 
Definition. https://studentveterans.org/images/pdf/will/SVA-Response-
to-VAsCampus-Definition.pdf
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    As late as a July 2018 hearing before this Committee, there was a 
reassurance by VA that the IT updates needed to implement the MHA 
changes would be ready soon. However, by early August it became clear 
VA would not only miss the Forever GI Bill implementation deadlines 
because of continued IT challenges, but routine updates to MHA 
calculations -- such as cost-of-living adjustments -- would also not be 
calculated for the Fall semester leading to inaccurate or significantly 
delayed payments. Only after SVA, alongside other veteran serving 
organizations (VSO), made clear the urgency of proceeding with 
certification and communicating the direction to proceed did VA make 
those communications, as detailed below.
    Beginning in September last year, SVA began to hear from student 
veterans that MHA payments were missing or inaccurate. On September 14, 
2018, SVA along with 14 other VSOs wrote VA to express our 
disappointment and concern over the continued IT failures and the lack 
of transparent communication on the issue to students and 
stakeholders.\6\ By mid-October, VA sent letters and emails to all GI 
Bill users, issued several statements online, and took internal steps 
to address the backlog.\7\
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \6\  Student Veterans of America. VSO Response to Forever GI Bill 
IT Delays. https://studentveterans.org/images/pdf/will/Forever-GI-
BillDelays_VSO-Letter-.pdf
    \7\  U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs, Veterans Benefits 
Administration. Education and Training. https://www.benefits.va.gov/
gibill/
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    Then, in November 2018, VA announced a ``reset'' of the 
implementation process, establishing a new deadline of December 1, 
2019, and returning students to the uncapped Department of Defense 
(DoD) housing rates until the Spring 2020 semester. These rates were 
based on the school's administrative campus location, not the location 
where each student takes their classes as VA was planning to do. 
Essentially, housing allowances were processed as they were before the 
Forever GI Bill became law while VA worked to get their systems and 
processes working properly.
    Now, with the ``reset'' deadline two weeks away, VA will complete 
the final testing phases for the implementation of the remaining 
sections of the Forever GI Bill. These changes redefine their 
interpretation of ``campus'' location to reduce administrative burdens 
on students, schools, and VA, and retroactively correct any 
underpayments students saw during from the Fall 2018 semester onward 
based on the uncapped DoD rates. VA will also not collect debts from 
any students overpaid due to the change in rate calculations.

VA Outreach and Communication

    SVA commends VA and its staff for improving public outreach efforts 
to spread awareness, and we commend the obvious dedication to 
successfully implementing the Forever GI Bill. In our November 2018 
testimony before this Committee, our primary recommendation was to 
provide more consistent and transparent communication to students, 
school staff, and stakeholders working alongside students during 
dynamic situations such as these delays. All stakeholders in this 
process have a vested interest in transparent and timely communication. 
It is important that VA acknowledge potential issues and proactively 
communicate those issues and ways to address them in a timely manner so 
that students, schools, and other stakeholders can make informed 
decisions about their education and finances.
    Anecdotally, SVA is hearing generally positive feedback from 
student veterans and School Certifying Officials (SCOs) regarding VA's 
communications for upcoming changes to the MHA. While it may be too 
early to tell, we are hopeful that these comments are representative of 
the experience stakeholders will have once the Spring 2020 semester 
starts. It is critical that the lines of communication between VA and 
stakeholders remain open following the December 1 deadline to 
communicate concerns and, if new problems arise, ensure they are 
addressed immediately.
    One such concern that was recently reported to SVA concerns the SCO 
hotline at VA. SCOs call into this dedicated hotline for assistance 
only to be met with frequent claims by VA support staff of missing or 
unavailable information, lack of access to relevant data, or lack of 
knowledge or adequate training to answer the SCOs' questions. These 
hotline employees apparently do not receive training on the VA ONCE 
system -- one of the primary methods for SCOs submit student GI Bill 
certification documents to VA. VA's employee training in this area 
should be reviewed and enhanced to better serve SCOs and, in turn, our 
student veterans.
    Last, in addition to the generally positive feedback from SCOs, SVA 
has received limited reports from SCOs about workload and communication 
concerns, particularly related to new extension campus requirements. 
The ability of SCOs to perform their job duties is critical to SVAs 
mission of helping student veterans and military-connected students 
succeed in higher education. We encourage the Committee to work with 
organizations like the National Association of Veterans' Program 
Administrators (NAVPA) to better understand these concerns and to 
address them in an efficient and effective manner.
    SVA remains committed to working closely with our partners, 
Congress, and VA to monitor and improve the implementation process. To 
that end, SVA believes VA should answer several outstanding questions 
to clarify any remaining ambiguity that exists for stakeholders.

Outstanding Questions

    1. What does VA need to commit to a comprehensive modernization of 
its education benefit IT infrastructure?

    The issues with the VA's antiquated IT systems and their conflicts 
with modern coding remain. These problems will continue to negatively 
impact VA's administration of educational benefits. SVA encourages VA 
to pledge to modernize its outdated education benefit IT systems.

    2. Will the payments be retroactive to August 1, 2018 and be 
calculated through the date of the new IT system implementation, which 
is currently set for December 1, 2019?

    While the Secretary's announcement last November made clear the VA 
would calculate underpayments owed to students based on Forever GI Bill 
requirements, it was less clear on the specific dates those 
underpayments would honor. The statement said: ``To clear up any 
confusion, I want to make clear that each and every post-9/11 GI Bill 
beneficiary will be made 100 percent whole -- retroactively if need be 
-- for their housing benefits for this academic year based on Forever 
GI Bill rates, not on post-9/11 GI Bill rates.''
    VA should articulate to all stakeholders how payments were or will 
be calculated back to August 1, 2018 for all terms that were underpaid, 
as the law requires. Further, VA should clarify the status of any 
ongoing correction payments that stem from the pause on routine 
adjustments, like cost-of-living, which has been in place while VA 
makes improvements to its systems and processes in advance of the 
December 1, 2018 deadline. If VA resumes routine adjustments for Spring 
2020, SVA expects VA will have to make retroactive payments that 
account for the lack of such adjustments for all academic terms 
beginning Spring 2019 through Fall 2019.

    3. How will the VA prevent another backlog when they process both 
new claims and prior underpayments?

    We also acknowledge VA has made progress with recently implemented 
policies to adjudicate its oldest claims and increased the total number 
of claims processing staff to address the backlog, but we remain 
concerned about the potential number of claims that will need to be 
processed for underpayments. This number could be staggering once you 
add up the several semesters that have come and gone before the new IT 
system is live.
    Processing those underpayments will be in addition to the normal 
claims processing required for current and new GI Bill students. A 
realistic plan to process both the underpayments and the current claims 
with sufficient resources, both in manpower and infrastructure, to 
prevent any sort of backlog or delay in payments is critical. This must 
also include any burden on SCOs for processing prior underpayments if 
there is a requirement for their intervention.
    There are many, both in Congress and among the veteran community, 
ready and willing to advocate for what VA needs to best serve student 
veterans, but we must first know what those needs are -- both from an 
authorization and appropriations standpoint -- for VA to meet this 
mission. VA will have to move quickly on these asks if they hope to 
have resources committed in time to meet its upcoming needs.

    4. How will VA communicate updates and progress?

    One of the biggest frustrations during the GI Bill payment delays 
experienced this past year was the lack of clear and timely 
communication from VA on what was happening, what they were doing, and 
what students and schools should do if they needed help or more 
information. SVA has heard reports of significant improvement in this 
area, but the need to always strive to improve communication cannot be 
stressed enough as the last provisions roll out to student veterans 
everywhere.
    These delays had significant financial impact on student veterans, 
varying in severity, with no ability of student veterans to predict 
when their claims would be processed, and payment received. This 
impacted some students' plans for continuing in higher education, their 
housing, their ability to pay bills, incurring late payment fees with 
their colleges for tuition, books, or fees, and even negatively 
impacting their credit reports. Regardless of the extent of this 
problem, or its severity, there is no question there was impact that 
was not addressed well, and it must not re-occur.
    Consistent, clear, and timely communication from VA will be the 
best way to ensure it has what it needs following the December 1, 2019 
deadline and to keep students, schools, and stakeholders supportive. 
Additionally, continuing to examine how to insure more accurate contact 
information is a longstanding goal VA should continue to work toward 
that will ultimately aid in all VA's communication efforts.
    The success of veterans in higher education is no mistake or 
coincidence. Research consistently demonstrates this unique population 
of non-traditional students is far outpacing their peers in many 
measures of academic performance.\8\
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    \8\  Cate, C.A., Lyon, J.S., Schmeling, J., & Bogue, B.Y. (2017). 
National Veteran Education Success Tracker: A Report on the Academic 
Success of Student Veterans Using the Post-9/11 GI Bill. Student 
Veterans of America, Washington, DC, http://nvest.studentveterans.org/
wp-content/uploads/2017/03/NVEST-Report_FINAL.pdf.
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    Further, this success in higher education begets success in 
careers, in communities, and promotes family financial stability, 
holistic well-being, and provides the all-volunteer force with powerful 
tools for recruitment and retention. At our 10th annual national 
conference in 2018, the President and CEO of SVA, Jared Lyon, shared 
the story behind the quote on our anniversary challenge coin, ``Some 
attribute the following text to Thucydides and others note that it's a 
paraphrase of a book written by Sir William Francis Butler from the 
late 1800's. The reality, either way, rings as true today as it ever 
has, and the phrase goes like this, `The nation that makes a great 
distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its 
thinking done by coward and its fighting done by fools.' '' \9\
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    \9\  Jared Lyon, Defining Our Future: Today's Scholars, Tomorrow's 
Leaders, Jan. 5, 2018, https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/defining-our-
futuretodays-scholars-tomorrows-leaders-jared-lyon
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    Supporting that success is paramount, and it starts with providing 
necessary resources and abilities at VA to successfully manage 
education benefits. We commend VA's commitment to ensuring these 
remaining provisions of the Forever GI Bill are finally implemented 
successfully and hope to see continued efforts to ensure seamless 
transition into higher education continue while also advocating for 
improvements to help meet that same goal.
    We thank the Chairman, Chairwoman, Ranking Members, and the 
Committee members for your time, attention, and devotion to the cause 
of veterans in higher education. As always, we welcome your feedback 
and questions, and we look forward to continuing to work with this 
Committee and the entire Congress to ensure the success of all 
generations of veterans through education.
                                 ______
                                 

          Prepared Statement of The Veterans Education Success

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