    [Senate Hearing 115-526]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                                                         S. Hrg. 115-526

                              PENDING LEGISLATION

    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                         SUBCOMMITTEE ON NATIONAL PARKS

                                     OF THE

                                  COMMITTEE ON
                          ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES
                              UNITED STATES SENATE

                         ONE HUNDRED FIFTEENTH CONGRESS

                                 SECOND SESSION

                                       on

    S. 599/H.R. 1488                      S. 2441                               S. 2876
    S. 1644                               S. 2570                               S. 2889/H.R. 4895
    S. 1926/H.R. 2156                     S. 2604                               S. 3176/H.R. 5979
    S. 1987/H.R. 2600                     S. 2672                               S. 3287/H.R. 5655
    S. 1993                               S. 2831/H.R. 5751                     S. 3298
    S. 2015                               S. 2870                               H. Con. Res. 33

                                   __________

                                AUGUST 15, 2018

                                   __________

                           Printed for the use of the
                   Committee on Energy and Natural Resources

            Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.govinfo.gov

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                   COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES

                        LISA MURKOWSKI, Alaska, Chairman
    JOHN BARRASSO, Wyoming               MARIA CANTWELL, Washington
    JAMES E. RISCH, Idaho                RON WYDEN, Oregon
    MIKE LEE, Utah                       BERNARD SANDERS, Vermont
    JEFF FLAKE, Arizona                  DEBBIE STABENOW, Michigan
    STEVE DAINES, Montana                JOE MANCHIN III, West Virginia
    CORY GARDNER, Colorado               MARTIN HEINRICH, New Mexico
    LAMAR ALEXANDER, Tennessee           MAZIE K. HIRONO, Hawaii
    JOHN HOEVEN, North Dakota            ANGUS S. KING, JR., Maine
    BILL CASSIDY, Louisiana              TAMMY DUCKWORTH, Illinois
    ROB PORTMAN, Ohio                    CATHERINE CORTEZ MASTO, Nevada
    SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West Virginia  TINA SMITH, Minnesota

                                     ------

                         Subcommittee on National Parks

                             STEVE DAINES, Chairman

    JOHN BARRASSO                        ANGUS S. KING, JR.
    MIKE LEE                             BERNARD SANDERS
    CORY GARDNER                         DEBBIE STABENOW
    LAMAR ALEXANDER                      MARTIN HEINRICH
    JOHN HOEVEN                          MAZIE K. HIRONO
    ROB PORTMAN                          TAMMY DUCKWORTH

                          Brian Hughes, Staff Director
                         Kellie Donnelly, Chief Counsel
                    Michelle Lane, Professional Staff Member
                 Mary Louise Wagner, Democratic Staff Director
                    Sam E. Fowler, Democratic Chief Counsel
                    David Brooks, Democratic General Counsel
              Rebecca Bonner, Democratic Professional Staff Member

                                C O N T E N T S

                                  ----------

                               OPENING STATEMENTS

                                                                       Page
    Daines, Hon. Steve, Subcommittee Chairman and a U.S. Senator from
      Montana........................................................     1
    King, Jr., Hon. Angus S., Subcommittee Ranking Member and a U.S.
      Senator from Maine.............................................     9

                                    WITNESS

    Smith, Mr. P. Daniel, Deputy Director, National Park Service,
      U.S. Department of the Interior................................     9

              ALPHABETICAL LISTING AND APPENDIX MATERIAL SUBMITTED

    Agenda...........................................................     7
    American Battlefield Trust:
        Letter for the Record........................................    54
    Barr, Hon. Andy:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    55
    Belton, Mark:
        Letter for the Record........................................    57
    Chesapeake Conservancy:
        Letter and Resolution #8 12.17.15 for the Record.............    58
    City of Santa Clarita (California):
        Letter for the Record regarding S. 1993......................    62
        Letter for the Record regarding S. 1926/H.R. 2156............    64
    City of Thousand Oaks (California):
        Letter for the Record........................................    66
    Corkern, Wilton and Mary Bruce:
        Letter for the Record........................................    68
    Daines, Hon. Steve:
        Opening Statement............................................     1
    Dunn, Cindy Adams:
        Letter for the Record........................................    70
    Essex National Heritage Commission:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    72
    Faull, Dr. Katherine M.:
        Letter for the Record........................................    76
    Feinstein, Hon. Dianne:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    77
    Garcetti, Hon. Eric:
        Letter for the Record........................................    81
    Hughes, Elizabeth:
        Letter for the Record........................................    83
    Kaine, Hon. Tim:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    84
    King, Jr., Hon. Angus S.:
        Opening Statement............................................     9
    Knight, Hon. Steve:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    85
    Markey, Hon. Edward J. and Warren, Hon. Elizabeth:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    87
    McConnell, Hon. Mitch:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    88
    Military Order of the Purple Heart:
        Letter for the Record........................................     3
    National Parks Conservation Association:
        Letter for the Record dated August 14, 2018..................    90
        Letter for the Record dated August 30, 2018..................    94
    Oil Region Alliance:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    96
    Platts, Mark:
        Letter for the Record........................................   100
    Potomac Conservancy:
        Letter for the Record........................................   101
    Rivers of Steel Heritage Corporation:
        Statement for the Record.....................................   102
    Shatto, Marian L.:
        Letter for the Record........................................   111
    Smith, P. Daniel:
        Opening Statement............................................     9
        Written Testimony............................................    15
        Response to Question for the Record..........................    52
    U.S. Department of Agriculture:
        Statement for the Record.....................................    12
    Ventura County (California) Board of Supervisors:
        Letter for the Record........................................   112
    Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States, Department of
      Montana:
        Letter for the Record........................................     4
    Vietnam Veterans of America:
        Letter for the Record........................................   113
    Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund:
        Letter for the Record........................................     5
    West Hollywood (California) Chamber of Commerce:
        Letter for the Record........................................   114
    (The) Wilderness Society:
        Letter for the Record........................................   115

                                   ----------
    The text for each of the bills which were addressed in this hearing can
    be found on the committee's website at: https://www.energy.senate.gov/
    public/index.cfm/2018/8/subcommittee-on-national-parks-legislative-
    hearing-08-15-2018

                              PENDING LEGISLATION

                                  ----------

                           WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 15, 2018

                                   U.S. Senate,
                        Subcommittee on National Parks,
                     Committee on Energy and Natural Resources,
                                                        Washington, DC.
        The Subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 4:03 p.m. in
    Room SD-366, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Steve Daines,
    presiding.

                OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. STEVE DAINES,
                       U.S. SENATOR FROM MONTANA

        Senator Daines [presiding]. The Subcommittee will come to
    order.
        Before we get started, I would like to take a moment to
    recognize Darla Ripchensky. Happy Birthday. She is the Chief
    Clerk here on the Committee.
        On this occasion of her birthday, I do think it is
    important that we recognize Darla. In fact, I was chatting with
    my staff here today, I think one of my staff members said he
    sent you four emails already today.
        We want to thank you for the incredible work that you do in
    service to the Energy and Natural Resources Committee and to
    the United States Senate as a whole.
        Darla, thank you for everything you do and have a happy
    birthday.
        I know it is a bit unusual to hold a legislative hearing in
    this room in August but it does give us, as a Committee, a nice
    opportunity to continue to move the priorities of this body
    forward.
        The 24 bills we are examining this afternoon cover a wide
    range of issues relating to the federal land administered by
    the Department of the Interior (DOI), primarily by the National
    Park Service (NPS), as well as one item that would, if enacted,
    be administered by the United States Forest Service.
        Some of the items we will hear today are new to this
    Subcommittee and others we have heard before in previous
    Congresses, but this will give us a great opportunity to update
    the record as well as for members to ask questions as they see
    fit.
        Because we have so many items on the agenda today, I will
    not go through each one individually, but I would like to
    highlight a few before we get started.
        First, I would like to highlight Senate bill 3298, which I
    recently introduced with my colleague, Senator Duckworth. I
    think most of us are very familiar with the Vietnam Veterans
    Memorial Wall, now one of the most iconic memorials on the
    National Mall. In fact, Montana currently has approximately
    31,000 Vietnam Veterans. Montana, on a per capita basis,
    usually is either second or third in the nation for veteran
    populations. The Wall honors not only the veterans, but all
    those who served and sacrificed in that war. It is a place of
    great significance, not only to Vietnam Veterans, but to our
    country as a whole.
        The Wall was funded and built by the Congressionally-
    authorized, non-profit organization, Vietnam Veterans Memorial
    Fund, Incorporated, in 1980. Now, several decades later, this
    group is working hard to build an education center near the
    Wall. We want to ensure that future generations of Americans
    understand the importance of the Vietnam War and its impact on
    our shared history as Americans. They have worked hard to raise
    funds for the education center but need a bit more time to meet
    their deadline which runs out in November 2018. This
    legislation, the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Visitor Center
    Extension Act, will provide them with the time that they need
    to continue raising funds so that the center can be built and
    an endowment created for ongoing maintenance requirements.
        At this time, I would like to enter several letters of
    support for this legislation into the official record from both
    Montana and other national groups who have asked Congress to
    extend the authorization.
        I do that without objection.
        [Letters of support for Senate bill 3298 follow:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Senator Daines. Speaking of those who have served, we have
    another item on our agenda today, Senate bill 3287, the Camp
    Nelson Heritage National Monument Act, which was introduced by
    Leader McConnell, and its companion bill, H.R. 5655, which
    recently passed the House by a vote of 376 to 4. This
    legislation would establish Camp Nelson Heritage National
    Monument as a unit of the National Park System. Camp Nelson
    opened during the Civil War, originally as a supply depot. It
    quickly transformed into a training and recruiting center for
    the Union Army, primarily for African American soldiers. Over
    the course of the Civil War, Camp Nelson recruited over 10,000
    African American soldiers into the Union Army and became a
    temporary home for families of the soldiers.
        Several significant events at the site, including a
    temporary expulsion of the families, led the U.S. Army to
    change its policies toward refugees and family members of
    soldiers.
        This site, which has already been designated as part of the
    National Park Service's National Underground Railroad Network
    to Freedom and as a National Historic Landmark, is an important
    part of our nation's history and we look forward to hearing
    more about it today.
        As I mentioned earlier, we have two dozen items on the
    agenda, ranging from modifications to memorials on the National
    Mall to adjusting funding caps for National Heritage Areas and
    lifting reversionary interests on federal lands held by the
    Park Service. Each of these agenda items are not only important
    to individual senators but to our nation's parks and citizens
    as a whole.
        This Subcommittee is so important to our members and our
    citizens because we often talk about very local issues and
    about access to parks. My wife and I were literally in
    Yellowstone National Park just last week.
        In Montana, access to public lands and recreation is at the
    forefront of our minds and our economy. It is my hope, as
    Chair, I can continue to further that discussion.
        In fact, I just got back from hiking in the Montana
    wilderness. My wife and I did a 25-mile loop up where there are
    no boot prints, no trails, just elk hair caddis, a fly rod and
    cutthroat trout. We spent time visiting our public lands,
    seeing firsthand the economic benefits they provide to our
    communities.
        The purpose of this hearing is to consider the
    Administration's views on pending legislation and allow
    Committee members an opportunity to ask questions. We will also
    include written statements that have been sent to the
    Subcommittee in the official hearing record.
        Because of the large number of bills on today's agenda I
    will not read through the list, but at this time I will include
    the complete agenda in the hearing record, without objection.
        [Today's complete agenda follows:]

                                 COMMITTEE ON
                          ENERGY AND NATURAL RESOURCES

                         Subcommittee on National Parks

                    HEARING ANNOUNCEMENT AND AGENDA

        This notice is to advise you of a legislative hearing
    before the Committee on Energy and Natural Resources'
    Subcommittee on National Parks. The hearing will be held on
    Wednesday, August 15, 2018, at 4:00 p.m. in Room 366 of the
    Dirksen Senate Office Building in Washington, DC.
        The purpose of this hearing is to receive testimony on the
    following bills:
       S. 599 (Donnelly) / H.R. 1488 (Visclosky), to
            redesignate the Indiana Dunes National Lakeshore as the
            ``Indiana Dunes National Park'', and for other
            purposes;
       S. 1644 (Cardin), to clarify the status of the
            Captain John Smith Chesapeake National Historic Trail
            as a unit of the National Park System;
       S. 1926 (Harris) / H.R. 2156 (Knight), to provide
            for the establishment of a national memorial and
            national monument to commemorate those killed by the
            collapse of the Saint Francis Dam on March 12, 1928,
            and for other purposes;
       S. 1987 (Grassley) / H.R. 2600 (Young), to provide
            for the conveyance to the State of Iowa of the
            reversionary interest held by the United States in and
            to certain land in Pottawattamie County, Iowa, and to
            express the sense of Congress relating to the continued
            provision of information relating to certain national
            historic trails;
       S. 1993 (Feinstein), to adjust the boundary of the
            Santa Monica Mountains National Recreation Area to
            include the Rim of the Valley Corridor, and for other
            purposes;
       S. 2015 (Baldwin), to clarify the status of the
            North Country, Ice Age, and New England National Scenic
            Trails as units of the National Park System, and for
            other purposes;
       S. 2441 (Casey), to amend the Steel Industry
            American Heritage Area Act of 1996 to repeal the
            funding limitation;
       S. 2570 (Markey), to repeal the funding
            authorization sunset and the total funding cap for the
            Essex National Heritage Area;
       S. 2604 (Casey), to amend the Oil Region National
            Heritage Area Act to reauthorize the Oil Region
            National Heritage Area, and for other purposes;
       S. 2672 (Moran), to authorize the Society of the
            First Infantry Division to make modifications to the
            First Division Monument located on federal land in
            President's Park in Washington, DC, and for other
            purposes;
       S. 2831 (Hatch) / H.R. 5751 (Bishop), to redesignate
            Golden Spike National Historic Site and to establish
            the Transcontinental Railroad Network;
       S. 2870 (Gardner), to authorize the Secretary of the
            Interior to conduct a special resource study of the
            site known as `Amache' in the State of Colorado;
       S. 2876 (Bennet), to amend the National Trails
            System Act to provide for the study of the Pike
            National Historic Trail;
       S. 2889 (Wicker) / H.R. 4895 (Thompson), to
            establish the Medgar Evers National Monument in the
            State of Mississippi, and for other purposes;
       S. 3176 (McConnell) / H.R. 5979 (Rogers), to
            establish the Mill Springs Battlefield National
            Monument in the State of Kentucky as a unit of the
            National Park System, and for other purposes;
       S. 3287 (McConnell) / H.R. 5655 (Barr), to establish
            the Camp Nelson Heritage National Monument in the State
            of Kentucky as a unit of the National Park System, and
            for other purposes;
       S. 3298 (Daines), to extend the authority of the
            Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund, Inc., to establish a
            visitor center for the Vietnam Veterans Memorial; and
       H. Con. Res. 33 (Goodlatte), designating the George
            C. Marshall Museum and George C. Marshall Research
            Library in Lexington, Virginia, as the National George
            C. Marshall Museum and Library.
        Senator Daines. We have one witness today, Mr. P. Daniel
    Smith, the Deputy Director, acting in the capacity of the
    Director, National Park Service, U.S. Department of the
    Interior.
        Mr. Smith, thank you for being with us here today.
        But first, let me turn to the Ranking Member, Senator King,
    for his opening remarks.

                 STATEMENT OF HON. ANGUS S. KING, JR.,
                        U.S. SENATOR FROM MAINE

        Senator King. Thank you, Senator Daines. Just as you were
    in Yellowstone this past weekend, I am going to be in Acadia
    National Park in Maine next weekend, assuming we are allowed to
    go home, but I am looking forward to that visit to Mount Desert
    Island.
        Thank you to our witness, Deputy Director Smith, for taking
    the time to join us here today and for analyzing, on behalf of
    the Administration, these bills. We will be talking about a
    wide variety of important National Park related issues.
        You can tell by looking at these bills and the people who
    have sponsored them just how important historic and natural
    preservation is to the people in all corners of this country.
    Whether it is commemorating a beloved and respected historical
    figure, trail, or site, the American people trust--important
    word, trust--the National Park Service as a steward of these
    treasured resources. When you consider the general lack of
    trust in government as an institution these days, maintaining
    and living up to that trust is no small feat. Yet, the National
    Park Service has done it and is doing it every day.
        That is why I can understand that the Park Service must be
    prudent in taking on more property, sites, and projects. I will
    be interested to hear today why some sites make the list and
    make the cut and others do not.
        Your task is important, and we appreciate the insights and
    experience that you bring to our hearing.
        Thank you, Mr. Smith.
        Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
        I look forward to the hearing.
        Senator Daines. All member statements will be added to the
    hearing record.
        It is now time to hear from our witness, Mr. Smith, Deputy
    Director, National Park Service, U.S. Department of the
    Interior.
        At the end of the testimony, we will begin questions. Your
    full written testimony will be made part of the official
    hearing record.
        Mr. Smith, you may proceed.

            STATEMENT OF P. DANIEL SMITH, DEPUTY DIRECTOR,
             NATIONAL PARK SERVICE, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF THE
                                INTERIOR

        Mr. Smith. Chairman Daines, Ranking Member King, thank you
    for the opportunity to present the Department of the Interior's
    views on the 25 bills on today's agenda.
        I will submit full statements for the record, and I will
    briefly summarize our views.
        The Department supports the following bills:
      --S. 2889 and H.R. 4895 which would authorize the Secretary
            of the Interior to establish the Medgar Evers Home
            National Monument in Jackson, Mississippi, as a unit of
            the National Park System.
      --S. 3176 and H.R. 5979 which would authorize the Secretary
            to establish Mill Springs Battlefield National Monument
            in Nancy, Kentucky, as a unit of the National Park
            System.
      --S. 3287 and H.R. 5655 which would authorize the Secretary
            of the Interior to establish Camp Nelson Heritage
            National Monument in Nicholasville, Kentucky, as a unit
            of the National Park System.
        All three of these sites are designated national historic
    landmarks and all three are owned by organizations that have
    indicated a desire to donate the properties to the National
    Park Service. These sites offer exceptional opportunities for
    the National Park System to increase its ability to preserve
    and interpret the story of the Civil War and the Civil Rights
    Movement in this nation.
        In tandem, with supporting the legislative efforts of the
    sponsors of these three pieces of legislation, the Department
    is working on a parallel effort to prepare for the potential
    designation of these sites as national monuments under the
    Antiquities Act. The National Park Service has opened a 30-day
    public comment period on all three of these designations to
    garner public input. Either through legislation or through the
    use of the Antiquities Act, we hope to see the vision of these
    three units become reality.
        The Department also supports:
      --S. 2831 and H.R. 5751 which would re-designate Golden Spike
            National Historic Site as Golden Spike National
            Historical Park.
      --S. 3298 which would extend the authority for the
            establishment of the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Visitors
            Center until 2022.
        For several of the bills we support we are requesting
    amendments. These amendments are explained in our full
    statements, and we look forward to working with the Committee
    on those amendments.
        The Department does not object to the following bills:
      --S. 2015 which would designate as units of the National Park
            System the three national scenic trails that currently
            are not units, the North Country, Ice Age and New
            England National Scenic Trails.
      --S. 2672 which would authorize modifications to the First
            Division Monument located in President's Park.
      --S. 1987 and H.R. 2600 which would require the
            relinquishment of the deed restriction on property the
            Federal Government conveyed to the State of Iowa for
            use as a national trail center. However, the Department
            would like to work with the Committee on amendments to
            ensure that public uses are preserved on the property.
        The Department does not support the following six bills:
      --S. 1993 which would adjust the boundary of Santa Monica
            Mountains National Recreation Area to include the area
            known as the Rim of the Valley corridor.
      --S. 2441 which would eliminate the funding limitation for
            the Steel Industry National Heritage Area.
      --S. 2570 which would eliminate the funding authorization
            sunset and the funding limitation for the Essex
            National Historic Area.
      --S. 2604 which would extend the funding authorization sunset
            and funding limitation for the Oil Regional National
            Heritage Area.
      --S. 2870 which would authorize a special resource study of
            the site known as `Amache' in Colorado.
      --S. 2876 which would authorize a study of the Pike Trail for
            potential designation as a National Historic Trail.
        The Department does not support H.R. 599 and H.R. 1488
    which would re-designate Indiana Dunes National Lakeshore as
    Indiana Dunes National Park; however, we do not object to the
    provision in the House bill that would rename the Miller Woods
    Trail as the Paul H. Douglas Trail.
        The Department opposes S. 1644 which would designate
    Captain John Smith Chesapeake National Historic Trail as a unit
    of the National Park System.
        Finally, the Department defers to the Department of
    Agriculture for a position on S. 1926 and H.R. 2156 because
    those bills would authorize a national memorial on U.S. Forest
    Service land.
        [The information referred to follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Mr. Smith. On H. Con. Res. 33, because that resolution
    would confer the designation of national to the library in
    honor of George C. Marshall, whose work was associated with
    those two departments.
        Mr. Chairman, that concludes my remarks. I look forward to
    answering your questions.
        [The prepared statements of Mr. Smith follow:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Senator Daines. Thank you, Mr. Smith, for your testimony.
        We will now move to questions from the Committee. I will
    start. I would like to ask you about the Vietnam Veteran
    Memorial Visitors Center Extension Act, Senate bill 3298, which
    I introduced with Senator Duckworth.
        First, I want to thank the Department for your support of
    this legislation. It is my understanding that according to your
    written testimony that the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund
    (VVMF) has obtained the appropriate approvals and worked
    through very extensive design review and consultation to begin
    the construction process. At this point, the only thing holding
    them back is raising the necessary funds. Once they reach the
    required dollar amount, they will be eligible to receive a
    construction permit. Is that your understanding?
        Mr. Smith. That is also my understanding, Senator, yes.
        Senator Daines. It is also my understanding that part of
    the obligation of the VVMF is to raise enough money before they
    receive their construction permit to help pay for ongoing
    maintenance of the site. Is that also your understanding?
        Mr. Smith. It's my understanding, yes, Senator and also,
    that that really is the amount that they still need to raise.
    They've raised, by far, the majority of the money necessary to
    build this visitor center.
        Senator Daines. How does that work as it relates to the
    endowment and the maintenance and so forth?
        Mr. Smith. It's been standard process, while I've been with
    the Park Service over the years, that for these type of
    construction projects that because of the maintenance that will
    continue in years later, we do ask for endowments of that type.
        There was----
        Senator Daines. So they will have to raise the funds for
    the construction and they have to raise the funds that match
    the construction plus another, what, another 10 percent or so
    to create that endowment? Is that the understanding?
        Mr. Smith. Yes, yes.
        Senator Daines. Okay.
        Mr. Smith. And that was the situation for the Vietnam
    Veterans Memorial, the same features were input, in that they
    had to raise money for that endowment. Yes.
        Senator Daines. Thank you.
        I want to shift gears now to Senate bill 2089, the Medgar
    Evers and monument designations.
        Today we are examining three bills that, if enacted, would
    establish national monuments. These include Senate bill 3176;
    Senate bill 3287, introduced by Leader McConnell; and Senate
    bill 2889, introduced by Senator Wicker. It is my understanding
    that there is a tremendous amount of local support for each of
    these designations. It is also my belief that obtaining local
    support is vital prior to designating a national monument or
    enacting a new land use decision. It is also my understanding
    that the Department supports each of these bills.
        I did note that your written testimony on Senate bill 2889
    suggests a few tweaks to the language which includes the
    addition of Medgar Evers' wife, Myrlie, in the name of the
    monument. Could you talk a bit about the importance of
    including Myrlie Evers in the name of this monument and why the
    Department suggested some small changes to the legislation?
        Mr. Smith. Mr. Chairman, the tragedy that happened to
    Medgar Evers is well known. His wife was at his side during all
    the time he served with the NAACP in the civil rights movement
    in Mississippi. While he was so active around the country, she
    ran that office in Mississippi. After his death, she took on
    the role that he had carried forward and she was a full
    participant in everything for the civil rights movement that
    was going on at that time. They were partners in life and it's,
    we feel, it's very important that it should also recognize her
    contributions to the civil rights movement.
        Senator Daines. Thank you for that answer.
        One more question and then I am going to yield to the
    Ranking Member, Senator King.
        I have also noticed in your written testimony the
    Department is not in support of extending the authority for the
    national heritage area bills we are considering today--Senate
    bill 2441, Senate bill 2570 and Senate bill 2604.
        As your testimony states, nearly all heritage areas were
    initially authorized to receive federal funding for a set
    period of time which is generally 15 years with a cap on that
    funding which is typically $10 million. Could you speak to why
    the Department believes it is important to limit the scope of
    authorization or repealing caps on these heritage areas?
        Mr. Smith. Yes Senator, and I give you these comments
    realizing the value that these national heritage areas do have.
        In the original heritage areas that were created, and we're
    up to 49 now and few more are being considered in this
    Congress, we're now to a point where the funds for those are at
    about $20.3 million. Congress has, in the past few years for
    the new heritage areas, limited those funds to where it's
    $150,000 until there's a general management plan and then a cap
    of $300,000 after that. The ones that have been grandfathered
    have up to $700,000 that are appropriated for them.
        The original intent in this wonderful idea for national
    heritage areas was that there would be a cap on the amount of
    money that they received and there would be a sunset clause in
    those.
        Basically, I have testified consistently on the fact that
    we do not support these bills, primarily because of the
    National Park Service budget situation that we're in where when
    we have $20.3 million going to these heritage areas, it's money
    that could be used more for the operation of the National Park
    Service and, of course, in our total budget where we are so
    concerned about deferred maintenance.
        Again, by stating that position, I, in no way, say that
    these are not very valuable in what they do in their local and
    regional and states, but it's a budgetary issue and an issue of
    priorities in the Department at this time.
        Senator Daines. Thank you, Mr. Smith.
        Senator King.
        Senator King. Mr. Smith, what I am interested in is why
    some are approved and others are not. There seems to be concern
    about the backlog--which we share, and as you know, we are
    working on that--and concern about expenditures. I am not
    objecting to the ones that you are approving or that you
    approve of, but I wonder how you distinguish one from another.
    The Chesapeake Trail, for example, versus Medgar Evers National
    Monument versus--I mean, there are any number of different
    ones--Pike National Historic Trail. How do you make those
    decisions?
        Mr. Smith. That's an excellent question, Senator.
        For the three that we've discussed that are on the parallel
    track, both through legislation or possibly a designation by
    the President and the Antiquities Act, those sites are all
    national historic landmarks. Those sites all have tremendous
    local support for them to be included in the system. Those
    sites all have donated properties so there will not be
    acquisition costs for that land. All three actually have
    established visitor centers. So they are very unique in coming
    into the system.
        There will be some cost to them, obviously, with staff and
    certainly some improvements and whatever else, but those are
    just so significant because of their status of being so
    significant to our history that we've made the decision that
    those should be supported.
        There's not a moratorium at the Department on new sites.
    It's just basically a realization that some things, even on
    some of the studies we talk about on these bills----
        Senator King. Well, there are two studies that you object
    to, as I recall.
        Mr. Smith. Yes. Well, the studies are, part of the studies
    are a little bit financially, but mostly we've got a backlog of
    20 studies right now that we have not completed or have not
    actually begun. We usually have a three-year timeframe to begin
    those. So, again Senator, it becomes a budgetary and a priority
    issue within the Department of how much the system can take at
    any one time.
        But for the ones today, the significance of the three that
    we've discussed the most, those are just very, very significant
    and suitable for inclusion in the system and because of the
    interest of the local constituencies for those, we have made
    the decision to support those bills.
        Senator King. But I am sure there is local support for the
    Oil Region National Heritage Area Act. I mean, I am sure there
    is local support for that in Pennsylvania.
        Perhaps you could provide for the record a succinct
    summary, not case by case, but the general criteria. I can
    understand, for example, you describe the three as already, in
    effect, done. They have visitor centers, and they are already
    national sites of one description or another.
        So, really, I think what you are saying is we are changing
    the name without necessarily changing the obligation of the
    government, but it would be helpful to me to distinguish
    because there are 24 bills. I know the sponsors feel strongly
    about all of them. They all have local support and local
    interest.
        I would be interested if you could submit for the record a
    narrative of the criteria used to decide that some are entitled
    to further protection and funding, while others are not. I
    think that is important, just for our colleagues who are deeply
    interested in all of these bills.
        Mr. Smith. Senator, we will provide that for the record.
        And one other statement on the heritage areas.
        Actually, we have that position because that's the original
    intent of Congress. Congress basically set forward the
    circumstances under which we do national heritage areas and in
    the original legislation for all of these there's a sunset
    clause and an authorization at a certain level. We're actually
    trying to comply with what Congressional direction has been on
    these heritage sites.
        Senator King. Okay, I think that is helpful to give us that
    background.
        Well, I would like to associate myself with the Chairman's
    comments at the beginning about the extension on the Vietnam
    area.
        I have no objection, whatsoever, to those that you are
    designating. I just want to be sure that everybody had a fair
    consideration in terms of these important designations.
        Mr. Smith. Could I speak to the Vietnam Veterans Visitors
    Center?
        Senator King. Please.
        Mr. Smith. I'm a veteran of the Vietnam War, drafted on
    Christmas Eve of 1968 and served with the 4th infantry division
    in Vietnam in '69 and '70. When I came out of the Army I had
    the privilege, later, of being with the Reagan Administration
    when Jan Scruggs and the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund
    accomplished what they did to build that memorial. I was there
    on the day we broke ground for it, I was there on the day when
    President Reagan dedicated it and I think that the position
    that the Department has taken there is a very necessary one.
        Our country has been at war for quite a while now, but
    we've had the support of the American people. The Vietnam
    Veterans Memorial, the country was in a tremendous social
    upheaval and I think it's very important that that story be
    told. I thank you for the personal privilege to add that to the
    record.
        Senator King. I am glad that you did. Thank you very much,
    and thank you for your service.
        Mr. Chairman.
        Senator Daines. Thank you, Senator King.
        I, too, thank you for those comments and for your service
    to our country.
        I also would agree with Senator King's request to further
    illustrate the rationale behind the decision around what is
    supported and what is not. I think this will help the Committee
    if there are some issues around Congressional intent we need to
    deal with as a Committee and legislate it as something we could
    take as an item for consideration as well.
        If there are no more questions for today, members may also
    submit follow-up written questions for the record.
        This hearing record will be open for two weeks.
        I want to thank Mr. Smith for his time, for your service to
    our country and your testimony today.
        The hearing is adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 4:30 p.m. the hearing was adjourned.]

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