    [House Hearing, 115 Congress]
    [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]

                    VIETNAM: WHY RELIGIOUS FREEDOM AND HUMAN
                      RIGHTS ARE CRITICAL TO U.S. NATIONAL
                                   INTERESTS

    =======================================================================

                                    HEARING

                                   BEFORE THE

                     SUBCOMMITTEE ON AFRICA, GLOBAL HEALTH,
                            GLOBAL HUMAN RIGHTS, AND
                          INTERNATIONAL ORGANIZATIONS

                                     OF THE

                          COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
                            HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                         ONE HUNDRED FIFTEENTH CONGRESS

                                 FIRST SESSION

                                   __________

                                  MAY 25, 2017

                                   __________

                               Serial No. 115-32

                                   __________

            Printed for the use of the Committee on Foreign Affairs

    [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

    Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.foreignaffairs.house.gov/
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                        U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
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                          COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS

                     EDWARD R. ROYCE, California, Chairman
    CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey     ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York
    ILEANA ROS-LEHTINEN, Florida         BRAD SHERMAN, California
    DANA ROHRABACHER, California         GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York
    STEVE CHABOT, Ohio                   ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey
    JOE WILSON, South Carolina           GERALD E. CONNOLLY, Virginia
    MICHAEL T. McCAUL, Texas             THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida
    TED POE, Texas                       KAREN BASS, California
    DARRELL E. ISSA, California          WILLIAM R. KEATING, Massachusetts
    TOM MARINO, Pennsylvania             DAVID N. CICILLINE, Rhode Island
    JEFF DUNCAN, South Carolina          AMI BERA, California
    MO BROOKS, Alabama                   LOIS FRANKEL, Florida
    PAUL COOK, California                TULSI GABBARD, Hawaii
    SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania            JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas
    RON DeSANTIS, Florida                ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois
    MARK MEADOWS, North Carolina         BRENDAN F. BOYLE, Pennsylvania
    TED S. YOHO, Florida                 DINA TITUS, Nevada
    ADAM KINZINGER, Illinois             NORMA J. TORRES, California
    LEE M. ZELDIN, New York              BRADLEY SCOTT SCHNEIDER, Illinois
    DANIEL M. DONOVAN, Jr., New York     THOMAS R. SUOZZI, New York
    F. JAMES SENSENBRENNER, Jr.,         ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York
        Wisconsin                        TED LIEU, California
    ANN WAGNER, Missouri
    BRIAN J. MAST, Florida
    FRANCIS ROONEY, Florida
    BRIAN K. FITZPATRICK, Pennsylvania
    THOMAS A. GARRETT, Jr., Virginia

         Amy Porter, Chief of Staff      Thomas Sheehy, Staff Director

                   Jason Steinbaum, Democratic Staff Director
                                     ------

        Subcommittee on Africa, Global Health, Global Human Rights, and
                          International Organizations

                   CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey, Chairman
    MARK MEADOWS, North Carolina         KAREN BASS, California
    DANIEL M. DONOVAN, Jr., New York     AMI BERA, California
    F. JAMES SENSENBRENNER, Jr.,         JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas
        Wisconsin                        THOMAS R. SUOZZI, New York
    THOMAS A. GARRETT, Jr., Virginia

                                C O N T E N T S

                                  ----------
                                                                       Page

                                   WITNESSES

    Quan Q. Nguyen, M.D., chairman, Rallying for Democracy...........    11
    Nguyen Dinh Thang, Ph.D., president and chief executive officer,
      Boat People SOS................................................    22
    Mr. T. Kumar, director of international advocacy, Amnesty
      International..................................................    29

              LETTERS, STATEMENTS, ETC., SUBMITTED FOR THE HEARING

    The Honorable Christopher H. Smith, a Representative in Congress
      from the State of New Jersey, and chairman, Subcommittee on
      Africa, Global Health, Global Human Rights, and International
      Organizations: Prepared statement..............................     4
    Quan Q. Nguyen, M.D.: Prepared statement.........................    15
    Nguyen Dinh Thang, Ph.D.: Prepared statement.....................    25
    Mr. T. Kumar: Prepared statement.................................    32

                                    APPENDIX

    Hearing notice...................................................    48
    Hearing minutes..................................................    49
    The Honorable Eliot L. Engel, a Representative in Congress from
      the State of New York: Letter to Secretary Tillerson on human
      rights in Vietnam..............................................    50
    The Honorable Gerald E. Connolly, a Representative in Congress
      from the Commonwealth of Virginia: Prepared statement..........    52
    The Honorable Alan S. Lowenthal, a Representative in Congress
      from the State of California:
      Letter on Lien Tri Buddhist Temple.............................    54
      Followup letter on Lien Tri Buddhist Temple....................    56

                       VIETNAM: WHY RELIGIOUS FREEDOM AND
                       HUMAN RIGHTS ARE CRITICAL TO U.S.
                               NATIONAL INTERESTS

                                  ----------

                             THURSDAY, MAY 25, 2017

                           House of Representatives,

                     Subcommittee on Africa, Global Health,

             Global Human Rights, and International Organizations,

                         Committee on Foreign Affairs,

                                Washington, DC.

        The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 12:36 p.m., in
    room 2172 Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Christopher H.
    Smith (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.
        Mr. Smith. The hearing will come order and good afternoon
    to everyone.
        Before we start, I just want to recognize one of my
    constituents who's here, Joseph Fischer, a Vietnam War veteran,
    a combat veteran who is down visiting. He's from Freehold and I
    want to thank him for his service.
        He was and continues to be totally committed to human
    rights and fairness for the people of Vietnam and I want to
    thank him for joining us today. Thank you, Joe.
        Ladies and gentlemen, over the past 42 years, much has
    changed in Vietnam. Today's people are a little richer but they
    still have very few rights.
        The Vietnamese Communist Party has opened up a bit to the
    outside world but remains closed to democratic reforms and the
    rule of law.
        U.S.-Vietnamese relations have warmed because Vietnam fears
    China's increasing economic power and its incursions in the
    South China Sea, but we see few human rights improvements
    emerge from the better relations. As a matter of fact, there
    has been a profound reversal in the area of human rights
    protection.
        Over the past 2 years, Human Rights Watch has used the
    words dismal and abysmal to describe Vietnam's human rights
    record. Vietnam scored a seven, the lowest score on Freedom
    House's Freedom in the World index.
        From sex and labor trafficking to the censorship of the
    press and the Internet, from restrictions on independent labor
    unions to severe repression of faith communities, the
    Vietnamese Government and the Communist Party is one of the
    world's worst abusers of human rights.
        For too long Vietnam has gotten a free pass on human
    rights. Diplomats are so focused on the fact that Vietnam is
    not China that this oppressive police state is granted trade
    and security benefits without conditionality.
        There is a silent human rights crisis going on in Vietnam
    that must be addressed. Human rights should be a top part of
    the meeting with President Trump's next meeting next week with
    Vietnam's Prime Minister, Nguyen Xuan Phuc. Doing so will
    advance U.S. economic and security interests and, above all,
    it'll advance the cause of the people of Vietnam who deserve
    better than the dictatorship that they are living under.
        The President has a real opportunity to bring about
    tangible reform to Vietnam and that is why we are meeting. The
    proximity of this hearing is precisely designed to try to let
    the President know how important it is that he raise these
    issues robustly with the Prime Minister.
        I have been to Vietnam several times on human rights trips.
    I have met with advocates and young activists for decades, like
    imprisoned rights activist Nguyen Van Dai. I know there is a
    younger generation in Vietnam, 66 percent of who are under the
    age of 40, that looks to the U.S. as a land of opportunity and
    freedom.
        They want the same liberties enjoyed by their relatives in
    California, Texas, Virginia, Louisiana, and so many other
    places where former Vietnamese refugees have flourished. The
    Vietnamese people want the United States to be a voice for
    freedom because their voice in-country is silenced.
        No government that represses its own people or restricts
    fundamental freedoms can be a trusted ally of the United
    States.
        No government that censors the Internet, tortures and jails
    dissidents, and crushes civil liberty and civil society should
    be given generous trade or security benefits, again, without
    strong conditionality.
        The President will face pressure from his advisors, I am
    sure, and especially the business community, to look at Vietnam
    through the lens of trade deals and the containment of China.
        Hopefully, he will be able to see the situation more
    clearly than past administrations both Republican and
    Democratic.
        Failing to press for real and concrete human rights
    improvements underestimates U.S. leverage and will disappoint
    the young generation of Vietnam who are the country's dynamic
    future.
        It should be clear by now that Vietnam needs the U.S.
    markets and security commitments much more than the United
    States needs Vietnam's markets and security cooperation.
        If history is any guide, the President's championing of
    individual rights will meet with some success. If his interest
    in human rights is sustained, those successes could be tangible
    and even far reaching.
        The Vietnamese Government has responded to concerns
    expressed by the last two administrations when they linked
    human rights improvements to better U.S. relations whether to
    gain entry into the World Trade Organization, the TPP--Trans-
    Pacific Partnership, or to address U.S. concerns over religious
    freedom abuses.
        The Vietnamese Government, at least for a time, took steps
    toward reform when pressed by past American Presidents. It is
    when the U.S. loses interest in human rights that conditions
    regress.
        The Communist leaders in Hanoi take our trade benefits and
    security commitments and continue repressing those seeking
    political reform and universally recognized freedoms.
        The business of the Communist Party is to stay in power and
    repressing those they believe will challenge their power. They
    will not embrace human rights improvements or the rule of law
    unless it is a firm condition of better relations with the
    United States.
        I am circulating a letter for signatures to other Members
    of Congress detailing the strategic opportunities available for
    the United States and the Vietnamese people if the President
    pursues a robust human rights agenda.
        The letter urges the President to pursue Internet freedom,
    religious freedom, independent labor unions, and release of
    prisoners of conscience as a condition of U.S. assistance.
        I wrote today to Secretary Rex Tillerson to urge more
    robust human rights diplomacy as well in Vietnam, particularly
    on the issue of religious freedom.
        We, I believe, and the U.S. Commission on International
    Religious Freedom, or USCIRF, recommended that Vietnam be
    designated as a country of particular concern for severe and
    egregious religious freedom restrictions.
        That report provides compelling evidence of egregious and
    ongoing religious freedom violations in Vietnam.
        The President should follow USCIRF's recommendation and
    immediately, without any delay, designate Vietnam as a CPC for
    its religious freedom violations. The designation carries with
    it potential sanctions and visa denials for Vietnamese
    Government officials complicit in religious freedom abuses.
        No Vietnamese Government official who tortures political
    dissidents or restricts their activities should profit from
    access to the United States and let me say that violence and
    intimidation faced by the Hmong and Montagnard by Khmer Krom
    Buddhists, by independent Cao Dai groups is outrageous.
        The torture faced by Ms. Tran Thi Hong is absolutely
    shocking. She was on her way to meet U.S. Ambassador-at-Large
    for International Religious Freedom David Saperstein, who did a
    magnificent job in the last administration for religious
    freedom.
        She was on her way to meet with him to push for the release
    of her husband, Pastor Nguyen Cong Chinh, and she was horribly
    mistreated.
        If there are religious prisoners, if forced renunciations
    into faith are happening, if pagodas and churches and places of
    worship are forcibly closed, how does Vietnam not meet the
    criteria for CPC, as our good chairman, Ed Royce, has asked
    repeatedly as well?
        Over and over again, he has asked the administration
    redesignate them as a CPC country.
        I will be working closely with the State Department on this
    and without objection my full statement will be made a part of
    the record. I'd like to yield to my friend and colleague, Ms.
    Bass.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Smith follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                                  ----------

        Ms. Bass. Well, once again, thank you, Mr. Chair, for your
    leadership in general on human rights but especially on human
    rights in regard to Vietnam.
        I think this is going to be an important hearing today. I
    want to thank the witnesses for taking the time to come and
    provide testimony and I know on all of our parts pushing for
    human rights and democracy around the world is really critical
    and one of the reasons why we are concerned about the level of
    cuts and reductions to the State Department. So appreciate you
    for taking your time out today.
        Mr. Smith. I want to thank Ranking Member Bass. Thank you
    so very much.
        I would like to yield to the distinguished chairman of the
    full committee, Congressman Ed Royce.
        Mr. Royce. Well, thank you, Chairman Smith, and thanks for
    calling this important hearing today.
        As we all recall, we had a similar hearing--I think it was
    1 year ago--and I wish there were no need to revisit these
    critical issues.
        But, unfortunately, Vietnam's one-party Communist state
    continues to oppress its citizens and deny them fundamental
    human rights and this is why we are here today. We do have a
    growing relationship with Vietnam, particularly in the security
    and trade areas.
        But for us, as Americans, human rights are a core value and
    we cannot segregate them from our ongoing engagement with that
    government. And I am grateful to our witnesses for
    participating in this hearing.
        It's good to see many of them again here--some old friends
    here. They will detail for us the many cases of violence and
    intimidation directed by the state toward religious people of
    many faiths in Vietnam.
        In addition to those crimes, and there is no other word for
    it than crimes, the state's effort to control every aspect of
    religious practice is a continuous violation of human rights,
    one with no end in sight, and for those who don't understand
    exactly what I am saying, when the state tears up the historic
    Buddhist texts and replaces it, that's what we are talking
    about.
        The Vietnamese Prime Minister arrives next week to meet
    here with President Trump, and alongside everything else that's
    discussed, the United States must call for the Government of
    Vietnam to respect its people's fundamental freedoms and among
    those none could be more important or more personal than the
    right to freedom of religion.
        Yet, in Vietnam the state continues to intimidate and
    harass citizens for nothing more than attempting to practice
    their faith, their religion freely and openly.
        Almost two decades ago I met with the Venerable Thich Quang
    Do, now the supreme patriarch of the Unified Buddhist Church of
    Vietnam. Well, frankly, he was in the same position then and he
    was under house arrest then, 2 decades ago. And, sadly, for all
    those years, he's been under arrest, still persecuted by that
    Communist government. And Thich Quang Do is not alone, the
    chairman mentioned Pastor Nguyen Cong Chinh.
        I've seen the photographs of the results of the beatings
    that he has taken at the hands of the police and the security
    apparatus. We have heard the pleas from his wife and we saw the
    treatment meted out to her.
        So for 5 years now he has remained behind bars on the
    questionable charges of undermining national security. What we
    call for today and what I urge the administration to call for
    in its meeting with the Prime Minister is respect for religious
    freedom.
        The Vietnamese Constitution provides for it. One must ask,
    then, why officials can obstruct and interfere with this
    constitutionally guaranteed right to worship freely. We must
    ask further that if this constitutional right can be ignored,
    what weight can we give any other constitutional or legal
    rights in Vietnam?
        I am pleased that the U.S.-Vietnam relations are warming
    and I hope for a stronger and more productive relationship
    between our countries.
        However, continued cooperation and improvements in our
    relationship must be predicated on a mutual respect for human
    rights and for the rule of law. It is who we are. It is what I
    hope they are. But it is up to them in that government to show
    it, to show respect for their constitution with respect to
    these rights.
        So, Mr. Chairman, thank you again for bringing attention to
    this important issue and I, again, thank the witnesses.
        I yield back.
        Mr. Smith. I want to thank the distinguished chairman for
    his tenacious promotion of human rights in Vietnam. You have
    made sure the full committee keeps a very sharp focus on this
    and I want to thank you for your great leadership.
        I would like to now yield to Mr. Lowenthal.
        Mr. Lowenthal. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for
    allowing me to join with you today. I am very much
    appreciative. I am very pleased to be here and also to share
    with you, as one of the co-chairs on the Congressional Caucus
    on Vietnam.
        As you pointed out, first of all, we are holding this--and
    I applaud your leadership, because this is a very timely
    hearing--in advance of Prime Minister Nguyen's visit to the
    White House next week to meet with President Trump.
        As we all know, the situation of human rights in Vietnam is
    dire. During my time in Congress, although there have been
    small selective attempts to improve the human rights condition
    at times, we have also seen tremendous backsliding and, I would
    say right now as was pointed out by my colleagues, I have not
    really seen any true improvement on the way the Vietnamese
    Government deals with its and treats its own citizens.
        On religious freedom, as was pointed out, the government's
    record is especially troubling. I adopted the case, and I think
    both my colleagues have pointed out the case--I have adopted
    the case of Pastor Nguyen Cong Chinh, a Lutheran pastor
    imprisoned since 2012.
        I adopted his case as a prisoner of conscience through the
    Tom Lantos Human Rights Commission.
        But what have we seen? We have seen Pastor Chinh face
    tremendous mistreatment in prison while his wife, Tran Thi
    Hong, was detained, beaten by security forces last year after
    she met with the visiting U.S. Ambassador-at-Large for
    International Religious Freedom.
        I was also offended when the Vietnamese Government, after
    multiple letters from myself, from the chairman and also
    Chairman Royce and other Members of Congress, when the
    government proceeded to demolish the Lien Tri Temple in Saigon,
    a place of worship, an important religious center, that we
    raised this issue even after multiple entreaties from ourselves
    to really respect the rights of the temple. That did not occur.
        Mr. Chairman, I also ask for unanimous consent to insert
    two letters to the Vietnamese Ambassador urging him to
    intervene to stop the demolition of the Lien Tri Temple to
    which we have received no response at all.
        Thank you and I will reserve the rest of my time for
    questions.
        Mr. Smith. Mr. Lowenthal, thank you very much and without
    objection your request will be in order.
        Mr. Lowenthal. Thank you.
        Mr. Smith. I would like to now introduce our very
    distinguished witnesses for today, beginning with Dr. Nguyen
    Dinh Thang, and many who came to the United States as a refugee
    from Vietnam in 1979.
        After earning his Ph.D., he began volunteering with Boat
    People SOS in 1988 and became the head of Boat People SOS for
    the past 25 years.
        And I would just say, on a very personal note, in the mid-
    1990s when I assumed the chairmanship when the Republicans took
    control in 1994, one of the first people I met with was Dr.
    Thang, and Joseph Rees, who was then my staff director for the
    subcommittee, worked very closely with him and we held a long
    series of hearings starting off with trying to ensure that the
    refugees that were in High Island and I went and visited High
    Island in Hong Kong where boat people were falsely screened out
    as nonrefugees.
        They didn't have any well-founded fear of persecution and
    under a very coercive process about 40,000 were told as the
    Comprehensive Plan of Action was ended that they are not going
    to come to the United States. We held four hearings on that
    alone and Dr. Thang was a true inspiration to this subcommittee
    and to me personally on how there was a false narrative that
    people could go back and there would be no retribution, even
    though they had spent time in High Island and other camps
    dotting that area of the world.
        I will never forget we were told they were repatriation
    monitors and it turned out there were seven of them so I held a
    hearing on it, and they told me that when they met with people
    who were coercively sent back against all of the norms of
    refugee protection that they were retaliated against and they
    were visited by the repatriation monitors.
        The person in tow with them was from the secret police. So
    open are you going to be when you have a thug sitting right
    next to you?
        Dr. Thang helped us put together an amendment to deny any
    U.S. assistance for forcible repatriation. I offered that
    amendment of the floor. It passed overwhelmingly in bipartisan
    fashion and from that came the ROVR program and more than
    20,000 people then got rescreened and were included and came as
    refugees to the United States, one example of many of Dr.
    Thang's leadership and I want to thank him or that.
        We will then have the testimony of Dr. Quan Nguyen, who is
    with Rallying for Democracy in Vietnam. Dr. Quan went to
    medical school in Saigon, served in the South Vietnamese Army
    with the rank of Captain in the medical corps.
        When South Vietnam fell into the hands of the Communists in
    1975, he escaped by boat and became a refugee in the United
    States.
        In addition to his medical practice in Virginia, Dr. Quan
    has been actively involved in advocating freedom, democracy,
    and human rights in Vietnam, and again, he too has done it for
    over a quarter of a century.
        He is the brother of Dr. Nguyen Dan Que, a man that I met
    in Saigon on one of my many trips there--a courageous
    campaigner of human rights. He is in Saigon and he has been
    imprisoned numerous times and is still serving a type of house
    arrest as we meet here today.
        Dr. Quan has campaigned continuously with the United States
    Congress. He's worked very closely with the AFL-CIO to pressure
    the Vietnamese Government to improve human rights.
        Then we will hear from an old friend of this subcommittee,
    Mr. T. Kumar of Amnesty International. He's the advocacy
    director for Asia, Europe, and the United Nations.
        He has testified before the U.S. Congress on numerous
    occasions to discuss human rights abuses. He has served as a
    human rights monitor in many Asian countries as well as in
    Bosnia, Afghanistan, Guatemala, Sudan, and South Africa. He
    also served as direct of several refugee ships and camps. T.
    Kumar has been a political prisoner himself, having served over
    5 years in Sri Lanka for his peaceful human rights activities.
        Amnesty International adopted him as a prisoner of
    conscience. He started his legal studies in prison and
    eventually became an attorney and devoted his entire practice
    to defending political prisoners.
        We are joined by Mr. Garrett from Virginia, if you'd like
    to make any comments.
        I would like to now go to Dr. Thang.

      STATEMENT OF NGUYEN DINH THANG, PH.D., PRESIDENT AND CHIEF
                   EXECUTIVE OFFICER, BOAT PEOPLE SOS

        Mr. Thang. Mr. Chairman and distinguished members of the
    committee, around this time last year some optimistic ones out
    here have had some cautious hope and expectation that with a
    new leadership coming in to play in Vietnam there would be a
    better day for the country and her people.
        Instead, over the past 12 months, we have observed a
    crackdown against independent religious communities intensify
    significantly.
        We have documented close to 100 religious prisoners at this
    time, with over 60 percent of them being Montagnard Christians
    in the Central Highlands. Less than a month ago, Pastor A Dao,
    whom I know personally, of the Montagnard Evangelical Church of
    Christ in Kontum Province, was sentenced to 5 years in prison
    on bogus charges.
        Following his arrest the authorities in five provinces
    mounted a very well-coordinated effort to force members of his
    church to renounce their faith. So far, they have succeeded
    because out of the 1,500 regional members of the church, 1,000
    have signed a statement to abandon the church, to leave the
    church.
        The following chart illustrates the gravity of religious
    persecution in the Central Highlands over the past few years.
    In green are forced conversion--incidents of forced conversion
    in three provinces across a number of years.
        In yellow are incidents that involve torture. In red are
    incidents of death caused by torture and in blue are prison
    sentences in each of those years.
        So, clearly, persecution against independent churches in
    Vietnam has not subsided and the government frequently uses
    torture as its tool for religious repression. Perhaps best
    known to the State Department and Members from Congress is the
    case of Ms. Tran Thi Hong, and Chairman Royce and Congressman
    Lowenthal have mentioned that case.
        But let me add one thing here. There is a picture of Ms.
    Hong after the first working session with the public security.
    She was beaten up, tortured. She couldn't walk at all, and her
    neighbors had to drag her into her home.
        Fortunately, the torture after almost 2 months stopped only
    because Ambassador-at-Large Saperstein made a phone call
    himself to the Vietnamese Embassy expressing great concern and
    also because six U.N. human rights experts jointly and publicly
    denounced the violation of human rights against Ms. Hong.
        We have received many reports of death by torture. As an
    example, Pastor Ksor Xiem of the Dega Church Gia Lai Province
    was arrested on Christmas Eve of 2015 so that he could not hold
    Mass for his followers. His captors tortured him brutally as he
    refused to renounce his faith and disband his church. He was
    left to go home but he died 15 days later.
        Around Christmastime last year, Y Ku Knul, a member of the
    Montagnard House Church in Dak Lak Province, was abducted while
    working the field. Two days later, his wife found his body
    hanged on a tree and all covered with bruises, and this is his
    body before burial. The public security had demanded him, the
    victim, to deliver his own younger son, 21 years old at the
    time, who was doing missionary work in Cambodia, to the public
    security police and he refused, and the surviving wife believed
    that his death was a result of that. And now his son is seeking
    asylum in Thailand.
        Most tragic was the death, perhaps in police custody
    earlier this month, of Nguyen Huu Tan, 38 years old. He came
    from a very respected Hoa Hao Buddhist family. His father is a
    Buddhist monk with the UBCV.
        That is Unified Buddhist Church of Vietnam, which has been
    outlawed by the Government of Vietnam for the past 42 years. On
    May 2nd--that is about 3 weeks ago--some 80 public security
    agents searched his home--Tan's home--without a search warrant.
    They collected receipts of money transfer from the U.S. and a
    small piece of yellow cloth.
        Based on that, the public security charged that Tan had
    received money from reactionary forces abroad to work on a plan
    to fly the South Vietnamese flag in public someday.
        Actually, the receipts came from the monthly remittance
    sent by Tan's oldest sister from Savannah, Georgia, and the
    yellow cloth is the lining of a gift box also from the same
    sister.
        Tan was taken away at 2:00 a.m. At 7:00 a.m., his family
    was told to report to the provincial department of public
    security of Vinh Long Province. Hours later, Tan's wife and
    father were brought inside to see his body.
        His throat was thoroughly slit. The authorities said that
    Tan had cut his own throat with a letter opener only this long.
    And here is Tan. I apologize for the gruesome picture. His
    family did not believe in that story and demanded an autopsy by
    an independent professional and proper investigation. The
    authorities now are threatening to arrest the two brothers of
    Tan unless the family drops its demand.
        Tan's older sister, the one who sent money home to Tan over
    the years, is Ms. Nguyen Thi My-Phuong. She and her husband
    arrived in town from Savannah yesterday to be at this hearing.
    So I would like to acknowledge their presence here. This is Ms.
    My-Phuong, flying in from Savannah.
        Expropriation of properties is another form of persecution
    often used by the government to cripple independent religious
    organizations.
        Of the thousands of facilities belonging the Hoa Hao
    Buddhist Church before 1975 only one temple remains to this
    day, the Quang Minh Tu Temple in An Giang Province, and the
    government is determined to take it. The independent Cao Dai
    groups now control only 5 percent of its 532 pre-1975 religious
    facilities and the government is targeting the remaining
    facilities one by one.
        Similarly, about 90 percent of all pagodas belonging to the
    United Buddhist Church of Vietnam have been expropriated and
    turned over to the government-created Vietnam Buddhist Sangha.
        The government demolished the Lien Tri Pagoda last year and
    is targeting half a dozen other pagodas in Danang City, Ba Ria-
    Vung Tau, and Dong Nai Provinces. Entire Catholic parishes have
    been targeted as well. Located near the now infamous Formosa
    Steel Plant in Ha Tinh Province, the century-old Catholic
    parish of Dong Yen is facing extinction.
        On March 17, 2015, one of the districts of Ha Tinh Province
    sent in the police to seize land, destroy homes, and bring down
    religious facilities.
        They beat up parishioners, causing injuries to many,
    including one pregnant woman and a Catholic nun. The government
    then barred 153 children of the parish from going to school for
    more than 2 years as punishment.
        Of the 1,000 original families in the parish, 158 continue
    to fight to preserve their church and their community. And this
    subcommittee has held many hearings on the Catholic parish of
    Con Dau in Danang City. In May 2010, the police assaulted
    mourners attending the funeral of a 93-year-old parishioner.
    Over 100 parishioners were injured, 62 arrested and tortured
    for days or weeks, and some of those victims have testified
    before this subcommittee, six sentenced to prison terms.
        One parishioner who initially escaped capture was caught
    and beaten to death. The government then handed 110 acres they
    had took from Cao Dau Parish to Sun Group, a private developer,
    to sell to individual investors for a total price estimated at
    $ deg.1.2 billion U.S. dollars.
        Ironically, Danang City were host of this year's APEC
    Summit, which President Trump will attend in November, and key
    summit activities will be held at a five-star resort in Danang
    City owned by none other than Sun Group.
        This would give the appearance that the U.S. Government
    tolerates religious persecution, land grabbing, and the use of
    torture. As he welcomes Vietnamese Prime Minister Nguyen Xuan
    Phuc to the White House next week, President Trump should
    insist that APEC Summit be moved to another location and its
    venue not be at any facility owned by Sun Group.
        I further recommend that in its enforcement of the Global
    Magnitsky Human Rights Accountability Act and the Frank Wolf
    International Religious Freedom Act, our State Department
    should investigate information that we have provided to them on
    close to 100 religious prisoners and close to 200 government
    officials implicated in gross violations of human rights.
        Finally, I'd like to propose and recommend that concerned
    Members of Congress establish an ongoing communication
    mechanism to raise concern directly with the Vietnamese
    Government on reported gross violations of human rights as they
    arise.
        While hearings like this are very important, they shed
    light on the most recent and most egregious violations, there
    is a need for an ongoing mechanism that offers the same level
    of attention to reported violations between hearings.
        Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Thang follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                                  ----------

        Mr. Smith. Dr. Thang, thank you very much for your
    testimony and recommendations.
        We have a substitute for Dr. Quan. I just have to--under
    orders of his cardiologist Dr. Quan was told he--it would be
    better not to be here just because of that.
        But we do have Mr. Dave Nguyen, who has also been very
    active in the human rights fight who will read Dr. Quan's
    testimony.

       STATEMENT OF QUAN Q. NGUYEN, M.D., CHAIRMAN, RALLYING FOR
                               DEMOCRACY

        Mr. Nguyen. Thank you. Honorable Chairman Chris Smith and
    distinguished members of the subcommittee, I'm here to read a
    letter on behalf of Dr. Quan Nguyen, the chairman of Rallying
    for Democracy in Vietnam.
        The letter: Forty-two years ago when the Communist forces
    began to occupy South Vietnam, I left my country on a small
    boat and escaped to America.
        I have been lucky to be able to rebuild my life here and
    it's truly an honor to testify before the distinguished
    subcommittee about the long struggles of Vietnamese people.
        Thank you for holding this hearing, allow me to share some
    important issues that I believe should be brought to light.
        As we all know, Vietnam is a one-party system where there
    is no separation of administrative, judiciary, and legislative
    branches. The situation in Vietnam is ripe for transformation.
    The people in Vietnam deserve support for their quest for
    freedom and democracy from the international community,
    particularly the United States.
        In that spirit, I would like to draw attention to the
    important issue of religious freedom. To the Government of
    Vietnam, religion is opium and the Hanoi government's policy
    has always been to repress religious freedom.
        There is an unfortunate misconception from the West that
    the mere existence of churches and temples in Vietnam implies
    that there is freedom of religion. That is far from the truth.
    Per the latest report on the U.S. Commission on International
    Religious Freedom, religious freedom in Vietnam has
    deteriorated significantly.
        The Vietnamese Communists used Decree 92 issued in August
    2012 to strictly control all religions in Vietnam. All churches
    need to be registered and accepted by the government.
        The registration procedure allows the government to refuse
    application of a church considered to be nonfriendly to the
    government.
        For years now the Communist government has refused to
    recognize the Unified Buddhist Church. So if you want to become
    a monk, nun, or priest, you have to notify and get permission
    from the local government.
        All promotions and appointments inside a church have to be
    accepted by the government. Even if the Vatican wants to
    appoint a new cardinal or bishop, it needs to inform and get
    approval from the Vietnamese Government.
        So at the end of every year each church is required to
    notify the local governments of its detailed plans for the next
    year such as the dates and times of events being held and what
    are the purpose and how many people will attend. Bishop of
    Kontum Patriarch Hoang Duc Oanh was actually refused permission
    to organize a Christmas Mass.
        Father Nguyen Van Ly, the Most Venerable Thich Quang Do,
    Pastor Nguyen Cong Chinh, and several leaders of local
    indigenous Cao Dai and Hoa Hao Churches are all examples of how
    religious leaders who advocate religious freedom are continued
    to be imprisoned and placed under house arrest.
        The recent death of Mr. Nguyen Huu Tan, Hoa Hao Buddhist
    follower, in the police station in Vinh Long where his neck was
    cut by the police and the violent attacks of the Vietnamese
    security forces on peaceful manifestations of the Catholics in
    central Vietnam against the destruction of the environment have
    caused people's anger and upset.
        The government continues to seize several properties
    belonging to the Catholic and Buddhist churches. Last year,
    they pressured Lien Tri Temple to stop activities and to sell
    its lands to the local government for a development project.
        The local government also pressured the Fathers of the
    Redemptorists Vietnam--Dong Chua Cuu The Viet Nam--to stop its
    health care program for the veterans of the south.
        In light of this religion freedoms violation, the U.S.
    Government should push for the following course of action. The
    Vietnamese Government should implement U.N. principles on
    religious freedom including the release of those in prison for
    beliefs and practices and fully restore the rights of
    citizenship, property, and residence permits.
        The Vietnamese Government should stop repressing indigenous
    religious subsets, Hoa Hao and Cao Dai. They should also stop
    promoting its state churches to interfere with the Buddhist and
    Catholic religions.
        Lately, on November 18, 2016, the National Assembly finally
    rectified a law of belief and religion even with the extensive
    criticism from human rights and religious groups.
        In fact, in an open letter to the Vietnamese Government
    prior to the ratification of the law, a number of organizations
    and lawmakers reject the clause stating that ``religious groups
    must be registered and approved by the government in order to
    practice.''
        This clause should be omitted as it gives the government
    the power to continue to oppress the people. In fact, the law
    will go in effect starting January 2018. The current situation
    in Vietnam on human rights, labor rights, transparency,
    intellectual property, copyrights really do not meet the
    requirements of the U.S. Government as a trusted bilateral
    economic partner.
        We are truly looking to Congress to emphasize that Vietnam
    needs to carry out fundamental reforms in these areas and to
    make sure that they become reality before Vietnam can be taken
    off the CPC list.
        There should be no waivers or delays implementing these
    requirements. International monitors need to strictly enforce
    treaty provisions before written and verbal agreements with
    Vietnam.
        The reforms that Vietnam must carry out will ultimately
    help to democratize Vietnam. Only a democratic Vietnam can be
    the U.S.'s true reliable strategic partner in Asia.
        Therefore, now is the golden opportunity for the U.S.,
    especially with the upcoming visit by the Prime Minister of the
    Communist regime of Vietnam, to convince the Hanoi's government
    to embark on this win-win journey for all which would allow
    Vietnam to become a more democratic country and to
    simultaneously secure a comprehensive strategic partnership
    with the United States in Asia.
        This would bring prosperity to Vietnam, bring peace and
    security to the region and neutralize the pressure from China.
    Vietnam should see this opportunity and react positively by
    ensuring more human rights.
        Last but not least, Mr. Chairman and distinguished Members
    of Congress, I have been lucky to live in America's free
    society where I can express my own opinion without being
    intimidated or harassed.
        Therefore, I believe that is my responsibility to speak for
    my compatriots back home who do not have at all these
    privileges.
        Thank you for giving me the opportunity for today.
    Respectfully yours, Dr. Quan Q. Nguyen.
        [The prepared statement of Dr. Quan follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                                  ----------

        Mr. Smith. Mr. Nguyen, thank you very much for your
    personal leadership for reading Dr. Quan's statement. Tell him
    how we hope he feels better.
        I would like to now yield to Mr. Kumar.

    STATEMENT OF MR. T. KUMAR, DIRECTOR OF INTERNATIONAL ADVOCACY,
                         AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL

        Mr. Kumar. Thank you very much, Congressman and Chairman
    Smith, and other members of the committee.
        Before I start, I would like to urge chairman to admit our
    statement in the record.
        Mr. Smith. Without objection, so ordered.
        Mr. Kumar. Thank you. I also want to mention about you,
    Chairman Smith, about your unwavering and strong commitment to
    human rights and this hearing is an example of that, and thank
    you again from Amnesty International.
        Today we are here to discuss Vietnam's Prime Minister's
    visit to Washington to meet with President Trump. We were also
    here when the annual U.S.-Vietnam Human Rights Dialogue is on
    its way now and we are also here before President Trump will be
    visiting Vietnam for the APEC Summit. Even though it's not
    bilateral, it's a visit by President Trump.
        So we are looking at three opportunities. The first
    opportunity is taking place at the moment. I hope State
    Department, which is leading the discussion, is very clear and
    firm in highlighting the cases and the abuses that are
    happening, including religious freedom issues.
        We hope that reflects in the Prime Minister of Vietnam's
    visit to Washington when he makes statements. We will know the
    results when he comes, whether dialogue is making any
    difference or not.
        So going into the issue of what's happening in Vietnam from
    the human rights perspective, I just want to touch on the
    overarching issue. The institutions which guarantee human
    rights, freedom, and even fair existence are the two main
    institutions--their judiciary and media.
        Both are under the complete control of the government
    there. We know that the party is in control--the Communist
    Party--but even these institutions are not free. So what the
    results is when there is an abuse against an individual, a
    citizen of Vietnam, he or she has no way to get justice there.
    Media can't report because they are under the control of the
    government.
        They can't go to the judiciary. The judiciary is under the
    control of the government. That's why international pressure is
    extremely important to make changes in the country so that
    citizens of Vietnam can have some basic protections to live as
    human beings and enjoy their rights.
        What we have documented over the years is that there are
    hundreds of political prisoners who have been arrested,
    tortured, some died during torture, and have been incarcerated
    in gruesome manners in that country purely for peaceful
    political expression of views including the latest online
    actions.
        That also extends to the religious freedom issues where
    religious minorities as well as independent religious groups
    are facing the difficult times in that country.
        One other issue that disturbs us there is that Vietnam is
    extremely numb when it comes to international pressure. The
    only country or few countries that have some leverage on
    Vietnam are the U.S. and some other countries in Europe. That's
    why U.S. leadership is extremely important in this.
        If the U.S. fails to speak, you can't expect any other
    countries in Asia or any other country, even European will dump
    it, saying ``Okay, the powerful country is just ignoring the
    plight of the people--why should we get involved?''
        On the other side of the coin is that the Vietnamese
    Government takes it extremely serious about what the U.S. is
    saying. Congressman Smith, you know, you have visited Vietnam.
        I presume you even visited some prisoners or prisoner
    families that need changes there. Even you have seen changes
    when there is a threat of Vietnam being put on the list for
    religious freedom issues.
        That shows they take it very serious. So the question today
    is now a great opportunity is happening in a week's time and
    whether President Trump will take advantage of that. That's
    what the big question now we are having.
        So this particular hearing is of extreme importance on that
    note. President Trump and his advisors will be watching this
    and we hope that'll translate into some action in terms of
    human rights.
        The issue of religious freedom--coming back to the issue--
    there are two issues that disturb us. One is the new draft law
    now which has become a law, per se, on religion and belief.
        It's pretty much tightened the noose--pretty much tightened
    the control of the government on religious issues. They are
    religious freedom for religious groups there. Even the
    registration aspects make it very difficult to register.
        So you throwing a new law that the group wanted to
    register. It makes it impossible to register because the
    cumbersome nature of the registration makes it very difficult.
        Number two, the law is written in such a way that the
    government authorities have numerous openings to interfere in
    religious activities. Legally they can interfere.
        When this draft law came up, Amnesty International and
    numerous international human rights organizations who take a
    strong view on every country--Chairman, you know, even in--on
    this country we take strong views--so we have taken a very
    strong view and said wait a minute, you have this draft law.
        Make sure you change the law so that--make edits so that it
    will have some impact on the--so that religious groups can act
    freely and have freedom. It did not happen.
        So President Trump can raise that from the religious point
    of view. This is the beginning, by the way, there. We don't
    what else is going to come up there. Second issue is the forced
    renunciation of religious groups.
        Okay, they don't not only allow people to worship as they
    wish or belong to a group or a religious group as they wish.
    They come after you and force individuals to renounce religion.
        So even these two issues should shake the conscience of the
    White House and President Trump. We hope he will take note of
    this and take advantage of the meeting he's having. We all know
    that security will be on the top of the agenda. We have nothing
    against it.
        We know that South China Sea issues are going to be on the
    agenda. We know that trade deals will be on the agenda, even
    though TPP is out, they will be discussed. What we are asking
    is to raise the concern of the people of the country.
        We have all these deals--trade deals, security deals. But
    hold the people of that country--you are dealing with a leader
    who is not an elected leader. It's a one-party state. So you
    have a duty and responsibility to ensure that you raise human
    rights.
        What type of human rights issue should President Trump
    raise? As I mentioned on the religious freedom issue, two
    issues at least he should raise.
        One is the new draft law should be amended. Number two,
    forced renunciation should stop right away. He should also
    demand immediate and unconditional release of political
    prisoners and religious leaders and religious prisoners there.
        The other one he should urge is when he arrives in November
    for the APEC Summit, at least some prisoners should be
    released. That call should be there. Chairman Smith, you know
    what happened when President Obama visited last time.
        They not only did not release any prisoners, they started
    arresting people, and President Obama kept quiet and came out.
    The same impression should not be given by President Trump.
        President Trump should not give the impression to
    Vietnamese that he will keep quiet when he's there when they
    start arresting and harassing civilians and other human rights
    defenders, he will keep quiet.
        So the message should be given here next week. One more
    thing, while he's in Vietnam in November he should also meet
    with families of the political prisoners. It's a goodwill
    gesture. Nothing is going to happen to President Trump for
    meeting there.
        The message should be also very clear to Vietnamese
    authorities that if they go after the families whom he is
    meeting, they will pay a dear price. Hope that happens.
        So we are talking about an issue here from three
    opportunities. One is happening now, the dialogue. Second is
    next week's meeting. Third is the APEC conference.
        Whether the new administration under President Trump will
    take the lead issue, we are not asking that human rights become
    the top priority.
        We are asking human rights be one of the issues you'll
    discuss. And always after the event--after the dialogue, after
    the meeting here that both leaders come and address the press.
        We have an appeal to the press, please ask questions on
    human rights, and we have an appeal to President Trump, to
    ensure that before even there's a question on human rights you
    proactively say what he cares--that he cares about human
    rights.
        Thank you, Chairman, for inviting Amnesty International,
    and once again, we applaud your leadership on human rights
    issues.
        Thank you.
        [The prepared statement of Mr. Kumar follows:]
        [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

                                  ----------

        Mr. Smith. Mr. Kumar, thank you very much for your stellar
    leadership, your personal commitment, having served as a
    political prisoner, served in prison.
        Just incredible, and now you speak out on behalf of others.
    Your recommendations were, I think, extraordinarily incisive.
    So thank you for that.
        I'd like to yield to Mr. Garrett.
        Mr. Garrett. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, gentlemen, Mr. Kumar
    in particular, for your leadership not only in word but deed as
    it relates to the important issue of human rights.
        I see stark parallels as it relates to the previous
    administration's visit to Vietnam and the impact it had on the
    religious dissident community with testimony we heard before
    this subcommittee I believe last week as it related to
    religious minorities in China that President Obama was to meet
    with them.
        They did not show up at the meeting and ultimately 2 hours
    after he was on Air Force One returning to the United States a
    group was rounded up and arrested, many of whom we believe are
    still imprisoned, some of whom we don't know the status of
    their well being at all.
        And that same thing repeating itself in Vietnam is
    indicative of, I think, a lack of attention by the media
    globally, here in the United States and abroad as it relates to
    these important issues.
        I will tell you that you are correct that human rights are
    an issue but not the only issue. Certainly, security and
    stability are foci of the United States and I would welcome a
    strong relationship with a prosperous Vietnam as a stabilizing
    force in the region and the counterbalance to regional
    dominance by China.
        However, it's very difficult if you sit here where I do or
    where Chairman Smith does, to have any desire to promote
    prosperity and enhanced relations with a nation that treats its
    religious minorities the way the current Government of Vietnam
    does.
        One of the things that troubles me in the short period of
    time that I've been here is the concept that perhaps we'll have
    these meetings and instead of helping in the subject we will by
    virtue of having brought light to it hurt people in places like
    Vietnam who are exposed by the courage of individuals such as
    yourselves to speak.
        And so my immediate question to myself is what can I do to
    make sure that this meeting is for a net positive, for the
    better?
        And so while I have to leave and should have left about 10
    minutes for a meeting that I can't get around, I will promise
    everyone in this room the following: I will draft a letter to
    the President and copy the Vice President relating to the
    upcoming meetings with the Vietnamese Prime Minister on any
    future travels to Vietnam.
        In that letter I will ask that the President speak directly
    to human rights violations to Vietnam and articulate hopefully
    on behalf of himself and certainly on behalf of members of this
    committee and this elected legislative body that there will be
    hesitance to enhance relations, be they security relations or
    trade relations with any nation that oppresses individuals who
    exercises their God-given right to worship as they choose.
        I find it ironic but not humorous that there are
    individuals so devoted to a belief structure that they are
    willing to be beaten and in some instances killed and will not
    abandon that belief structure and yet a government such as that
    in Vietnam, after 42 years, for example, of trying to stymie
    the UBCV, still can't put out that light.
        You would think that at some point the government would
    realize that human beings will continue to make decisions for
    themselves and change their policy.
        To the extent that my voice might be helpful to prompting
    that outcome, I promise you it will be heard by our
    administration and I hope that our administration will carry it
    to the Government of Vietnam.
        Chairman Smith, I thank you for holding the hearing. I hope
    that you all will keep us abreast as it relates to developments
    following meetings between our head of state and that of
    Vietnam because I want to hope that changes for the better will
    be made and I want to hear if they are or are not so that we
    can act accordingly, moving forward.
        Thank you.
        Mr. Smith. Mr. Garrett, thank you very much for your
    leadership and for your very, I think, very appropriate
    remarks.
        Mr. Garrett. And a sincere apology on having to depart. But
    thank you all for having the courage to be here and we will
    certainly be a voice on your behalf.
        Mr. Smith. Thank you.
        Mr. Kumar, you made an excellent point in reminding us that
    when President Obama went to Vietnam in May 2016 that things
    got worse as he left and that is--and what was the consequence?
    Zilch.
        There was no consequence to that kind of abuse of
    individuals, almost as if they were trying to insult and in
    some way degrade the Presidency of the United States.
        I know the President had time to meet with the celebrity
    chef, Anthony Bourdain, while he was there on May 23, 2016, but
    not with political prisoners or their families, which I think
    would have sent a very clear and unambiguous message to Hanoi
    as to what U.S. priorities really are.
        Shaking hands and big smiles only go so far. Yes, meet with
    the Prime Minister. Meet with the top leadership. But only meet
    with them if you're prepared to raise individual cases and
    raise the larger human rights issues and I think all three of
    our distinguished witnesses have outlined that so very, very
    well today.
        I think it needs underscoring with exclamation points that
    when Ms. Hong met with Rabbi Saperstein, who I have a
    tremendous amount of respect for, and he certainly personally
    intervened after the fact when he realized, again, in an
    affront to a high American official, in this case the
    Ambassador-at-Large for International Religious Freedom.
        She, as you pointed out, as you all have, certainly, T.
    Kumar as well and Dr. Thang made reference to, she met with
    Rabbi Saperstein on March 30 of last year. She urged
    intervention for her husband, whose health was deteriorating,
    and for that she was interrogated 15 days later by the public
    security police.
        She was tortured for meeting a high official of the United
    States Government. That should have invited an immediately
    snapback by the United States Government, by the Obama
    administration in terms of sanctioning.
        CPC should have been immediate--a reimposition of Country
    of Particular Concern and the imposition of sanctions for that
    outrageous action against her and the picture you've provided
    us, Dr. Thang, of her, Ms. Hong, her inability to even walk
    just underscores the brutality of the secret police in Vietnam.
        And my hope is next week and now with the State Department
    in terms of their contacts with the Vietnamese that we will
    say, those days are over, and I, frankly, will be unceasing as
    chairman of the human rights subcommittee in trying to ensure
    that those days of gross violations of human rights and
    especially with the proximity of that visit.
        Two visits, President Obama, Rabbi Saperstein--retaliation
    that follows almost immediately thereafter. So my hope is that
    maybe you might want to expand upon that.
        How is Ms. Hong doing now and, again, I remember just an
    example, in 1982, I was in the Soviet Union.
        I met with Natan Sharansky's mother, who pleaded with me
    and Sam Gejdenson and members of the National Conference on
    Soviet Jewry to try to get humanitarian assistance to her son,
    Natan Sharansky, who was dying, or at least she thought he was
    very, very sick, in the gulag of the Soviet Union. She was not
    retaliated against by the Soviet leadership for making that
    plea to a congressional delegation and a National Conference on
    Soviet Jewry delegation.
        The mom was not retaliated against. Sharansky's situation
    actually improved when we raised his case with the Soviet
    officials. They responded. How can Vietnam do just the opposite
    and make matters even worse?
        Again, the reason and the proximity of this hearing is to
    say to President Trump and Vice President Pence--and I've known
    the Vice President for many years--he is a deeply committed
    believer, very faithful man who believes in human rights--that
    they need to be very clear and bold, and I think, Mr. Kumar,
    you said it doesn't have to be the top priority.
        I hope that it would be. But we need it to be a major
    priority at the very least in this dialogue and with this
    conversation with the Prime Minister. So if you might want to
    speak to Ms. Hong as to how she's doing now, and then just a
    few other questions that I will put on the table.
        You know, the Office of International Religious Freedom
    hopefully will soon have an Ambassador-at-Large. I would hope
    that the first thing that he does, if it is who I think it will
    be, will be to redesignate Vietnam as a Country of Particular
    Concern.
        Let's not forget that before the bilateral agreement
    between the United States and Vietnam agreed to, Ambassador
    John Hanford removed CPC status because he was told that there
    was a whole series of what he called deliverables, and ending
    of forced renunciations of faith was one of those and a greater
    expansion of freedom.
        I travelled to Vietnam, went to Hanoi, Hue, and Saigon. Met
    with about 60 pastors. I went and visited with the Venerable
    Thich Quang Do in his pagoda and another high-ranking leader of
    the Unified Buddhist Church, who was also under house arrest in
    another pagoda, and they were all hopeful.
        We were told the Vietnamese Government, with the trade
    agreement things would change. Almost immediately after that
    bilateral trade agreement went into effect, there was a
    snapback and retaliation has been brutal ever since and many of
    the people who signed Bloc 8406 and that wonderful manifesto
    for freedom and human rights became a hit list for the
    Vietnamese Government.
        So we have to be forewarned, eyes wide open that we are not
    kidding as a government. Vietnam has to change in a very
    significant way.
        Free the political prisoners, end the renunciations of
    faith and I think the Danang concern that you've raised, Dr.
    Thang, is an excellent one because we had, as you recall,
    hearings on how that land was stolen and how people were killed
    and you reiterated some of that today.
        So if you'd like to speak to any of those points and then
    we'll conclude.
        Mr. Thang. Yes, Mr. Chairman. Ms. Hong, we got words from
    her a few days ago. Last week she did go to make a prison visit
    to her husband in prison.
        His health doesn't look promising. He's still being denied
    access to medical care. Ms. Hong herself was in very frail
    health and therefore she had to skip for the past 2 months a
    prison visit to her husband.
        I'd like to point out Vietnam's response to the official
    communication from six human rights experts from the U.N.
        Just last month they came with a response claiming that Ms.
    Hong wasn't tortured, wasn't beaten, but she bumped her head
    against the taxi, the car that was taking her to the People's
    Committee office and injured herself, and she was very
    aggressive and abusive.
        She was a menace to the public security agents. That's
    their response. But, you know, she is very petite and very
    frail herself.
        So I couldn't imagine that she could pose any threat to
    those bullying public security agents at all. But the positive
    aspect of it is is that they stopped harassing her since the
    day that Rabbi Saperstein made the phone call directly to the
    Vietnamese Embassy in town and the U.N. special rapporteurs
    came out with a public statement denouncing the mistreatment of
    Ms. Hong.
        That points to the fact that the more attention given to
    people inside Vietnam, the communities who are under
    persecution inside Vietnam, the more intense the attention, the
    better off they are. That's why I suggested that Members of
    Congress take all the available opportunities to communicate
    directly their concerns to the Vietnamese Government.
        Now, the persecution against Pastor Nguyen Cong Chinh and
    Ms. Hong is just reflective of a long-term consistent policy
    from the top leadership of the Communist Party of Vietnam to
    eradicate all independent house churches in the Central
    Highlands.
        In 2002, the Communist Party set up the so-called Central
    Highlands Steering Committee to oversee the implementation of
    that policy and then 2 years later the Ministry of Public
    Security established the so-called Central Highlands Security
    Bureau to execute that policy.
        And therefore the ordinance on belief and religion of 2014
    didn't change that policy at all. The designation of CPC status
    for Vietnam and the lifting of that designation didn't change
    that policy at all.
        On February 27, 2015, on the Web site of General Tran Dai
    Quang there is an article. At the time he was the Minister of
    Public Security.
        There was an article extolling the exploits of the public
    security forces in Central Highlands and this is the verbatim
    statement:

              ``When I arrived in the Central Highlands, our task
            of rescuing the people from the evil Ha Mon cult . .
            .''

        Hai Mon is actually a Catholic variance based on the common
    belief that the Virgin Mary did appear in Ha Mon location and
    that stirs a lot of Montagnard to become Catholics.

            ``. . . was accomplished only recently. The Security
            Team of the Police Force of the Town of Kontum
            performed deeds that were representative of the
            indefatigable efforts of safety forces throughout the
            Central Highlands in our fight against reactionary
            enemy forces disguised as ethnic religious groups.''

        Unfortunately, General Tran Dai Quang, the former Minister
    of Public Security, is not Vietnam's President, and that might
    explain why things have gotten worse over the past 12 months.
        And I would like to also add one point here about APEC
    Summit. It shouldn't be held in Danang City because Prime
    Minister Nguyen Xuan Phuc knows very well about that incident.
        He's fully aware about that incident, about Con Dao Parish.
    The Con Dao parishioners have twice engaged and talked directly
    to him when he was still the Vice Prime Minister and after he
    had become the Prime Minister, the parishioners of Con Dao also
    talked with him directly one more time.
        So he's fully aware of that incident and he should
    understand why we have so much concern about having the APEC
    Summit held in Danang City. That would bring all the issues
    about religious persecution, torture, land grabbing into
    sharper focus.
        Thank you.
        Mr. Smith. Let me just ask, if I could, your
    recommendations to the President and to the State Department,
    and I think it bears underscoring how important it is to--and
    it's the law.
        And as you know, I am the author of the Frank Wolf
    International Religious Freedom Act that was signed at the end
    of last year and that requires designated persons lists and the
    idea of a religious prisoners list so we know who it is
    regardless of their denomination or faith tradition that are
    being held and are prisoners of conscience.
        You did ask that the State Department investigate 200
    Vietnamese Government officials implicated in gross violations
    of human rights.
        They certainly can be made inadmissible to the United
    States pursuant to the Magnitsky Act--brand new human rights
    legislation--and they ought to be and have to be, and we can do
    identical, in a parallel way, with the new International
    Religious Freedom Act, make them--those who persecute based on
    faith inadmissible to the United States and other things as
    well like not being able to use our financial system.
        I think what should go forward from this hearing is that we
    are calling on the Trump administration to implement the law
    robustly.
        Not a cursory way, not just a few individuals but to be as
    comprehensive as possible and I think this is an engraved
    invitation to you, to Mr. Kumar, and others what you do already
    but to all of us, when we know of someone or have lists to get
    it to State, get it to the White House, get these people on the
    list if the information is accurate, and I know you
    painstakingly seek accuracy, so that we focus on those who are
    committing these crimes.
        In 2004, I authored a bill called the Belarus Democracy Act
    and that had these similar provisions like we put into the
    Frank Wolf International Religious Freedom Act and that was to
    hold individuals to account.
        So if you're part of a regime that tortures and abuses, you
    can't come here nor can your family. We don't want you here. We
    think you should be prosecuted, frankly, but that's probably
    not going to happen but at least the inadmissibility to the
    U.S. has to become a mainstay of our human rights work and it
    will make a difference.
        So, again, if you wanted to elaborate or speak to that
    issue and also on the issue of human trafficking and we have
    had specific hearings on human trafficking and the abuse of
    labor trafficking especially by the Vietnamese Government.
        I wrote the Trafficking Victims Protection Act and the very
    first case prosecuted by the U.S. Government was a Vietnamese
    case which has never been adequately resolved with Daiwa.
        And, you know, it just shows the past is prologue. They
    still, I believe, with a great deal of impunity, violate the
    rights of their own citizens by turning into commodities
    people's labor, completely in contravention of ILO standards.
        So if you wanted to speak to that as well and then we will
    conclude.
        Mr. Thang. Yes, Mr. Chairman.
        I would like to elaborate on the fact that since January
    2014 our organization, Boat People SOS, has joined with two
    other organizations, one based in England and the other one
    based in Germany, to train people inside Vietnam, especially
    members of independent religious communities and indigenous
    communities, on how to compile and prepare reports to the U.N.
    special rapporteurs and so far they have generated over 100
    reports--incident reports, and we have shared most of them with
    the State Department.
        And in those reports there is a very elaborate process to
    identify government officials who are behind the violations and
    we have lists of witnesses.
        We have contact information. So it has been very, very
    thoroughly worked on we are very confident about the accuracy
    of the information in there.
        And we continue to train people inside Vietnam to become
    rapporteurs themselves. So we will continue to produce and
    submit reports to your subcommittee.
        Regarding human trafficking, things haven't changed at all.
    Most alarming is that--you still remember the case in Jordan,
    and you talk with the King of Jordan, the Queen of Jordan about
    that case. That involved over 250 Vietnamese workers who are
    under slavery conditions in Jordan.
        At the time, we got a copy of a communique from Vietnam to
    an interagency delegation from Hanoi Center, Jordan--Amman,
    Jordan--to identify the strike leaders and take them home for
    punishment and the one who authored that or approved that order
    was none other than the then Minister of Labor, Invalids, and
    Social Affairs (MOLISA) and she's now the Chairwoman of
    Vietnam's National Assembly.
        So I don't think that things would change at all with
    regard to the fight against human trafficking by the Vietnamese
    Government. So she got promoted, and you know many other
    instances where the perpetrators got promoted. Those who
    committed or who are complicit in human trafficking got
    promoted to higher positions in the Government of Vietnam
    before.
        Mr. Smith. Mr. Kumar?
        Thank you both, all three of you, for your very, very
    incisive testimony, for your leadership. You know, we will be
    looking at some additional legislation toward Vietnam.
        Four times the House passed the Vietnam Human Rights Act,
    which I was a sponsor of, with great input from both of you,
    and each time it failed in the Senate, even though we had
    overwhelming bipartisan support in the House.
        So we are looking at a new imitative and above all right
    now we are asking the President to raise these issues and the
    State Department, and you have provided tremendous insight as
    to what those issues ought to be and also to enforce our law
    and hold the country itself responsible and also individuals
    who are perpetrating these horrific crimes.
        The hearing is adjourned.
        [Whereupon, at 1:57 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]

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