[House Hearing, 114 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
EXAMINING THE CHALLENGES FACING NATIVE
AMERICAN SCHOOLS
=======================================================================
HEARING
before the
SUBCOMMITTEE ON EARLY CHILDHOOD,
ELEMENTARY, AND SECONDARY EDUCATION
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION
AND THE WORKFORCE
U.S. House of Representatives
ONE HUNDRED FOURTEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
HEARING HELD IN WASHINGTON, DC, APRIL 22, 2015
__________
Serial No. 114-10
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Education and the Workforce
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COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND THE WORKFORCE
JOHN KLINE, Minnesota, Chairman
Joe Wilson, South Carolina Robert C. ``Bobby'' Scott,
Virginia Foxx, North Carolina Virginia
Duncan Hunter, California Ranking Member
David P. Roe, Tennessee Ruben Hinojosa, Texas
Glenn Thompson, Pennsylvania Susan A. Davis, California
Tim Walberg, Michigan Raul M. Grijalva, Arizona
Matt Salmon, Arizona Joe Courtney, Connecticut
Brett Guthrie, Kentucky Marcia L. Fudge, Ohio
Todd Rokita, Indiana Jared Polis, Colorado
Lou Barletta, Pennsylvania Gregorio Kilili Camacho Sablan,
Joseph J. Heck, Nevada Northern Mariana Islands
Luke Messer, Indiana Frederica S. Wilson, Florida
Bradley Byrne, Alabama Suzanne Bonamici, Oregon
David Brat, Virginia Mark Pocan, Wisconsin
Buddy Carter, Georgia Mark Takano, California
Michael D. Bishop, Michigan Hakeem S. Jeffries, New York
Glenn Grothman, Wisconsin Katherine M. Clark, Massachusetts
Steve Russell, Oklahoma Alma S. Adams, North Carolina
Carlos Curbelo, Florida Mark DeSaulnier, California
Elise Stefanik, New York
Rick Allen, Georgia
Juliane Sullivan, Staff Director
Denise Forte, Minority Staff Director
------
SUBCOMMITTEE ON EARLY CHILDHOOD, ELEMENTARY, AND SECONDARY EDUCATION
TODD ROKITA, Indiana, Chairman
Duncan Hunter, California Marcia L. Fudge, Ohio,
Glenn Thompson, Pennsylvania Ranking Minority Member
Dave Brat, Virginia Susan A. Davis, California
Buddy Carter, Georgia Raul M. Grijalva, Arizona
Michael D. Bishop, Michigan Gregorio Kilili Camacho Sablan,
Glenn Grothman, Wisconsin Northern Mariana Islands
Steve Russell, Oklahoma Suzanne Bonamici, Oregon
Carlos Curbelo, Florida Mark Takano, California
Katherine M. Clark, Massachusetts
C O N T E N T S
----------
Page
Hearing held on April 22, 2015................................... 1
Statement of Members:
Rokita, Hon. Todd, Chairman, Subcommittee On Early Childhood,
Elementary, and Secondary Education........................ 1
Prepared statement of.................................... 3
Fudge, Hon. Marcia, L., Ranking Member, Subcommittee On Early
Childhood, Elementary, and Secondary Education............. 4
Prepared statement of.................................... 6
Statement of Witnesses:
Burcum, Ms. Jill, Editorial Writer Minneapolis Star Tribune,
Minneapolis, MN............................................ 9
Prepared statement of.................................... 12
Cladoosby, Mr. Brian, President, National Congress of
American Indians, Embassy of Tribal Nations, Washington, DC 16
Prepared statement of.................................... 19
Nose, Mr. Roman, Executive Director, Tribal Education
Departments National Assembly, Boulder, CO,................ 25
Prepared statement of.................................... 27
Emrey-Arras, Ms. Melissa, Director, Education, Workforce and
Income Security Issues, U.S. Government Accountability
Office, Boston, MA......................................... 31
Prepared statement of.................................... 33
Additional Submissions:
Ms. Emrey-Arras:.............................................
Statement Visuals........................................ 82
Ms. Fudge: prepared statement of Hon. Rick Nolan, a
Representative in Congress from the State of Minnesota..... 87
Mr. Nose:....................................................
Prepared statement of.................................... 90
EXAMINING THE CHALLENGES FACING
NATIVE AMERICAN SCHOOLS
----------
Wednesday, April 22, 2015
House of Representatives,
Subcommittee on Early Childhood, Elementary,
and Secondary Education,
Committee on Education and the Workforce,
Washington, D.C.
----------
The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10:05 a.m., in
Room 2175, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Todd Rokita
[chairman of the subcommittee] presiding.
Present: Representatives Rokita, Thompson, Brat, Carter,
Bishop, Grothman, Russell, Fudge, Davis, Sablan, and Takano.
Also present: Representatives Kline, Nolan, and Robert C
``Bobby'' Scott.
Staff present: Lauren Aronson, Press Secretary; Janelle
Belland, Coalitions and Members Services Coordinator; Kathlyn
Ehl, Legislative Assistant; Matthew Frame, Staff Assistant; Amy
Raaf Jones, Director of Education and Human Resources Policy;
Nancy Locke, Chief Clerk; Krisann Pearce, General Counsel;
Lauren Reddington, Deputy Press Secretary; Mandy Schaumburg,
Education Deputy Director and Senior Counsel; Juliane Sullivan,
Staff Director; Leslie Tatum, Professional Staff Member; Brad
Thomas, Senior Education Policy Advisor; Tylease Alli, Minority
Clerk/Intern and Fellow Coordinator; Barbera Austin, Minority
Staff Assistant; Kelly Broughan, Minority Education Policy
Advisor; Jacque Chevalier, Minority Senior Education Policy
Advisor; Denise Forte, Minority Staff Director; Ashlyn
Holeyfield, Minority Education Policy Fellow; Tina Hone,
Minority Education Policy Director and Associate General
Counsel; Brian Kennedy, Minority General Counsel; and Richard
Miller, Minority Senior Labor Policy Advisor.
Chairman Rokita. Well, good morning, and welcome to today's
subcommittee hearing.
I would like to thank our witnesses for joining us to
examine the very serious challenges facing Native American
schools.
Nearly a century ago the Federal Government made a promise
to deliver to Native American children a quality education that
just doesn't teach math and science, but preserves their
customs and culture. Under the Department of Interior's Bureau
of Indian Education, the Federal Government is expected to
support the education of more than 40,000 students through
approximately 185 elementary and secondary schools located on
or near Indian reservations.
Unfortunately, the Federal Government is failing to keep
its promise to these vulnerable children.
As reports from congressional committees, government
watchdogs, investigative journalists, and academics have
detailed, the state of BIE education is abysmal. Too many
schools lack adequate infrastructure and educational resources,
compromising the health, safety, and future postsecondary and
professional opportunities of the children they are supposed to
be serving. And it has been this way for far too long.
A 1969 Senate report from the Committee on Labor and Public
Welfare describes the Federal Government's failure to provide
an effective education as a ``national tragedy and a national
disgrace,'' and that has ``condemned the American Indian to a
life of poverty and despair.''
Despite countless calls for change, all we have seen is
decades of inaction. As one of today's witnesses chronicles in
an acclaimed Minneapolis Star Tribune series on the failing BIE
system, ``Federal neglect continues to handicap learning at BIE
schools nationwide. Kids shivering in thin-walled classrooms or
studying under leaky roofs year after year aren't getting the
education they need or deserve.''
A report by the nonpartisan Government Accountability
Office further details these concerns. Entitled the ``Bureau of
Indian Education Needs to Improve Oversight of School
Spending,'' that report reveals a chronic failure to fix and
replace decrepit and antiquated schools. The GAO cites a
bungling bureaucracy that includes a lack of information to
effectively monitor and fix the problems plaguing school
facilities, as well as confusion and poor communication about
who is actually responsible for addressing the various needs of
these schools.
The details of these reports are sobering. However, words
on paper will never fully convey the troubling state of Native
American education. That is why members of this committee have
visited these schools to learn firsthand about the challenges
they face.
This year, for my part, I visited several BIE schools,
including the Theodore Roosevelt Indian School and John F.
Kennedy Indian School, both in Arizona, and this was with BIE
Director Monty Roessel; as well as the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school
in Minnesota with Chairman John Kline.
The conditions at these schools are deplorable. Some
classrooms lack desks, books, computers, pencils, paper, and
while others lack proper flooring, roofing, and ventilation.
Some schools are missing a working water heater, for
example. Others are missing front doors and are rodent-
infested. And for many students, attending these unsafe and
unhealthy schools is their only option.
Despite the many obstacles that stand in the way of these
students and educators, their resiliency and determination to
create better lives for themselves is nothing short of
inspiring. They understand the importance of an education and
the opportunities it will afford them.
I have also met dedicated teachers and school
administrators in these places who are working hard to overcome
these challenging conditions and help improve the lives of
their students with quality educational opportunities. They are
to be commended.
It is paramount that we uphold our promise to provide
Native American children an excellent education that preserves
their tribal heritage. Though the current system poses
significant challenges, turning a blind eye is not the answer.
The Federal Government must live up to its responsibility.
We look forward to learning from our witnesses about the
Bureau of Indian Education and the schools under BIE's
jurisdiction. I am confident that today's hearing will help
advance real solutions that ensure Native American children
have access to safe and healthy schools that support quality
teaching and learning.
So with that, I will now recognize the ranking member,
Congresswoman Fudge, for her opening remarks.
Good morning.
[The statement of Chairman Rokita follows:]
Prepared Statement of Hon. Todd Rokita, Chairman, Subcommittee on Early
Childhood, Elementary, and Secondary Education
Good morning, and welcome to today's subcommittee hearing. I'd like
to thank our witnesses for joining us to examine the very serious
challenges facing Native American schools.
Nearly a century ago, the federal government made a promise to
deliver to Native American children a quality education that preserves
their customs and culture. Under the Department of Interior's Bureau of
Indian Education, the federal government is expected to support the
education of more than 40,000 students through approximately 185
elementary and secondary schools located on or near Indian
reservations.
Unfortunately, the federal government is failing to keep its
promise to these vulnerable children.
As reports from congressional committees, government watchdogs,
investigative journalists, and academics have detailed, the state of
BIE education is abysmal. Too many schools lack adequate infrastructure
and educational resources, compromising the health, safety, and future
postsecondary and professional opportunities of the children they are
intended to serve. And it has been this way for far too long.
A 1969 Senate report from the Committee on Labor and Public Welfare
describes the federal government's failure to provide an effective
education as a ``national tragedy and a national disgrace'' that has
``condemned the [American Indian] to a life of poverty and despair.''
Despite countless calls for change, all we have seen is decades of
inaction. As one of today's witnesses chronicles in an acclaimed
Minneapolis Star Tribune series on the failing BIE system, ``federal
neglect [continues to handicap] learning at BIE schools nationwide . .
. Kids shivering in thin-walled classrooms or studying under leaky
roofs year after year aren't getting the education they need or
deserve.''
A report by the nonpartisan Government Accountability Office
further details these concerns. Entitled the ``Bureau of Indian
Education Needs to Improve Oversight of School Spending,'' the report
reveals a chronic failure to fix and replace decrepit and antiquated
schools. The GAO cites a bungling bureaucracy that includes a lack of
information to effectively monitor and fix the problems plaguing school
facilities, as well as confusion and poor communication about who is
actually responsible for addressing the various needs of these schools.
The details of these reports are sobering. However, words on paper
will never fully convey the troubling state of Native American
education. That is why members of the Education and the Workforce
Committee have visited these schools to learn firsthand about the
challenges they face.
This year, I have visited several BIE schools, including the
Theodore Roosevelt Indian School and John F. Kennedy Indian School in
Arizona with BIE director Dr. Monty Roessel, as well as the Bug-O-Nay-
Ge-Shig (BUG-OH-NAY-GHEE-SHIG) School in Minnesota with Chairman John
Kline.
The conditions at these schools are deplorable. Some classrooms
lack desks, books, computers, pencils, and paper, while others lack
proper flooring, roofing, and ventilation. Some schools are missing a
working water heater. Others are missing front doors and are rodent-
infested. And for many students, attending these unsafe and unhealthy
schools is their only option.
Despite the many obstacles that stand in the way of these students
and educators, their resiliency and determination to create better
lives for themselves is nothing short of inspiring. They understand the
importance of an education and the opportunities it will afford them.
I've also met dedicated teachers and school administrators who are
working hard to overcome these challenging conditions and help improve
the lives of their students with quality educational opportunities.
It is paramount that we uphold our promise to provide Native
American children an excellent education that preserves their tribal
heritage. Though the current system poses significant challenges,
turning a blind eye is not the answer. The federal government must live
up to its responsibility.
We look forward to learning from our witnesses about the Bureau of
Indian Education and the schools under BIE's jurisdiction. I am
confident today's hearing will help advance real solutions that ensure
Native American children have access to safe and healthy schools that
support quality teaching and learning.
With that, I will now recognize the ranking member, Congresswoman
Fudge, for her opening remarks.
______
Ms. Fudge. Good morning. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
And thank you all for being here today.
School facilities are a problem in poor communities across
this country, but especially so in Native American schools.
It has been more than 7 years since this committee held a
hearing on American Indian education. That is far too long.
American Indian students need and deserve better.
American Indian students face daunting educational
challenges, more than any population in this country. The
condition of their facilities is only one of the many
challenges they face.
We also need to turn our attention to academic issues,
including but not limited to graduation rates. In 2014 students
attending Bureau of Indian Education schools graduated at a
rate of just 53 percent, while American Indian and Alaska
Native students enrolled in non-BIE schools had a graduation
rate of 68 percent, still well below the national average of 81
percent.
It is clear the Federal Government has failed to meet its
obligation to deliver quality education services that meet all
students' needs in safe and healthy facilities.
In BIE, tribally controlled, and public schools much needs
to be done. But today we will examine the condition of Bureau
of Indian Education facilities.
The poor condition of school buildings affects the health
and safety of students and fails to provide an environment
conducive to learning. In a February 2015 report, the GAO
outlined some of the challenges facing the Department of
Interior and the Bureau of Indian Education that affect the
repair and maintenance of BIE schools.
GAO is here today and I look forward to hearing more about
your findings, especially what steps must be taken to address
and prevent these issues going forward.
There must be collaboration among all entities with
responsibility for the education of American Indian students in
order for them to achieve academic success. While congressional
oversight is required to ensure the Department of Interior and
the Department of Education fulfill their obligations to
American Indian students, we know the long history of broken
federal promises to our tribes and their children, which
requires extra vigilance.
It is important for those responsible to know this is a
priority and we are watching. The need is too urgent for us to
do nothing.
To the witnesses, I thank you for being here today and I
look forward to hearing your testimony.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
[The statement of Ms. Fudge follows:]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Rokita. Thank the ranking member.
Pursuant to committee rule 7(c), all members will be
permitted to submit written statements to be included in the
permanent hearing record. And without objection, the hearing
record will remain open for 14 days to allow such statements
and other extraneous material referenced during the hearing to
be submitted for the official hearing record.
I will now turn to the introduction of our distinguished
witnesses.
And first, I recognize the chairman of the full committee,
Mr. Kline, to introduce our first witness.
Mr. Kline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I am extremely pleased to have the honor today to introduce
our first witness, who is Ms. Jill Burcum. I was asked, when we
were talking about setting up this hearing and when Mr. Rokita
and I made the trip up to northern Minnesota to look at the
deplorable conditions in one of our schools, well, why was I
doing that; and I said, ``Well, because of the work that Ms.
Burcum had done in the Star Tribune of bringing this issue to
our attention.''
She is an editorial writer with the Star Tribune in
Minneapolis. She joined the editorial board in March of 2008
after working in the Tribune's newsroom as an editor and
reporter for 10 years.
She authored the Star Tribune's four-part series on BIE
schools entitled ``Separate and Unequal.'' And just this week
Ms. Burcum was named a 2015 Pulitzer Prize finalist for
editorial writing for this series. And so we are very, very
proud of her.
We are happy that you are here. We thank you for being
here.
And I yield back.
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentleman.
And let me add my welcome, as well.
I will resume introducing our witnesses.
President Brian Cladoosby is the president of the National
Congress of American Indians here in Washington, D.C. and is
the chairman of the Swinomish Indian Senate. President
Cladoosby also serves as the president of the Association of
Washington Tribes and is a member of the executive board of the
Washington Gaming Association. Previously he served as
president of the Affiliated Tribes of Northwest Indians.
Welcome, sir.
Mr. Quinton Roman Nose, who I have met before, is the
executive director of the Tribal Education Departments National
Assembly in Boulder, Colorado. Mr. Roman Nose has dedicated
most of his career in the Indian education field to promote and
develop educational initiatives and opportunities to improve
the education levels of Native American students and tribal
members.
Welcome, sir.
Ms. Melissa Emrey-Arras is the director of education,
workforce, and income security issues with the U.S. Government
Accountability Office in Boston, Massachusetts. Ms. Emrey-Arras
oversees the agency's K-12 and higher education work, including
leading national studies on BIE schools.
Particularly welcome today. Thank you for your hard work.
I will now ask our witnesses to stand, if you would, and
raise your right hand.
[Witnesses sworn.]
Let the record reflect that the witnesses answered in the
affirmative.
And you may be seated. Thank you.
And before I recognize you to provide your testimony, let
me briefly explain the lighting system. You will have 5 minutes
to present your testimony. When you begin, the light in front
of you, of course, will be green; with 1 minute left it will
turn yellow; and when it becomes red that means stop.
As simple as that sounds and is, sometimes it is hard for
us up here to abide by it, so I say it as much for us as I say
for you. But with that, I don't expect there will be any
issues.
And now I would like to recognize the witnesses for 5
minutes of questioning starting with Ms. Burcum.
Go ahead, please.
STATEMENT OF MS. JILL BURCUM, EDITORIAL WRITER, MINNEAPOLIS
STAR TRIBUNE, MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA
Ms. Burcum. Chairman Rokita, Chairman Kline, Ranking Member
Fudge, and members of the subcommittee, thank you for your
sincere interest in American Indian education--
Chairman Rokita. Ms. Burcum, put the microphone right to
your mouth. Thank you.
Ms. Burcum. This better?
Chairman Rokita. Just turn it. There you go. There.
Ms. Burcum. All right.
So thank you for your sincere interest in what is a
national crisis: the shameful conditions of school buildings in
the federal Bureau of Indian Education system.
My name is Jill Burcum. I am an editorial writer with the
Star Tribune newspaper based in Minneapolis, Minnesota. Our
Upper Midwest coverage region is home to many large tribal
nations.
I went on the road in 2014 with photographer David Joles to
document safety and structural failures of the facilities in
which some of our nation's most disadvantaged learners attend
class. The results were published in a series of editorials at
the end of the year called ``Separate and Unequal.'' The
editorials drew an outraged response from across the nation as
we revealed the shameful conditions of these facilities.
Many readers felt the same way I did. As a mom, I thought
many times I would not be comfortable sending my children to
school in these buildings. And I believe that committee members
would feel similarly about sending their children,
grandchildren, nieces, or nephews to schools with roofs that
leak, have rotten subflooring, dangerously inadequate
electrical systems, sewers that back up, and have classrooms so
cold that kids have to wear mittens, coats, and hats in class.
Unfortunately, parents in the BIE system don't have a
choice on where their kids go to school, and this is why action
is required.
When we first began digging into the issue we focused on
the plight of the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig High School on the Leech
Lake Indian Reservation in northern Minnesota. Conditions were
far worse that we had feared.
This is a school housed in something Midwesterners call a
pole barn. These are metal sheds widely used on farms and by
businesses, but not for schools.
The Bug school, named after Chief Hole in the Day, is not
even in a nice pole barn. It is more than 30 years old. The
metal walls don't keep out the extreme winters. The foundation
and roof leak.
Electrical cables and pipes line the walls, and teachers
can't even turn on all the electrical equipment at the same
time. The science classroom lacks safety equipment needed for
hands-on learning and experiments.
The heating system has been repaired more times than anyone
can remember, and one of the days that I visited it failed
again. The repairmen just shook their heads when I asked them
how long they could keep resuscitating it.
It quickly became clear that the Bug school was a symptom
of a broken BIE system. There are 183 schools with about 49,000
students. Sixty-four of these schools are in poor condition,
and many of them have been in this condition for a decade or
more.
Here is what that inaction means in the real world: On the
Pine Ridge Reservation in South Dakota, I stood on a rotten
wooden floor in one of the main hallways at Crazy Horse High
School and I felt like the floor was going to give way beneath
me. The Wounded Knee Elementary School at the western edge of
the Pine Ridge Reservation should be a safe, secure place that
offers hope to the students that it serves. Instead, this badly
aged and under-equipped building mirrors the conditions in a
nearby drug- and crime-ridden neighborhood that local residents
refer to as a prairie ghetto.
In Arizona, a school administrator became emotional when I
called. One of the two remote schools she oversees had been
slated for replacement for over a decade. She had been told by
BIE officials that nothing could be done.
Her reaction when a newspaper from Minnesota called was,
``Thank God.'' She was simply glad that someone cared and
someone was trying to help.
You would think conditions like this inspire urgency at the
federal agencies that oversee these schools. They haven't.
Replacement school construction has shrunk dramatically over
the past decade. Incredibly, it was zeroed out in the Obama
administration's 2013 and 2014 budget requests.
My interviews and exchanges with Interior Secretary Sally
Jewell and BIE Director Charles Roessel did not inspire
confidence. I believe they both personally care deeply about
American Indian students, but there is a longstanding defeatism
within Interior about improving conditions, and there is an
entrenched, spread-out bureaucracy too often focused on red
tape for red tape's sake and not on progress.
One story I was told by the American Horse School in South
Dakota is that they spent days working on a grant application
only to be told multiple times they had submitted it on the
wrong-colored paper. What a waste of time.
In the meantime, no one is doing anything at this agency
about a school replacement list that was over a decade old and
still not complete. Where are these agencies--where is this
agency's priorities and where in the urgency--where is the
urgency?
The burden for Secretary Jewell and Director Roessel is
changing that culture, and I have yet to hear a game plan for
how they intend to do that. And I hope that we pursue this.
Thank you for your consideration and your time.
[The statement of Ms. Burcum follows:]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Rokita. I thank the witness.
President Cladoosby, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MR. BRIAN CLADOOSBY, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL CONGRESS
OF AMERICAN INDIANS, EMBASSY OF TRIBAL NATIONS, WASHINGTON,
D.C.
Mr. Cladoosby. Good afternoon, Chairman Rokita, Ranking
Member Fudge, and members of the committee. My name is Brian
Cladoosby. I am the chairman of the Swinomish Tribe located in
Washington State, and I am appearing today as president of the
National Congress of American Indians.
Thank you for inviting me to testify today on this very
important topic.
One of the first things I ask members of Congress and the
administration when I meet them is, ``Are you my trustee?'' In
my State of Indian Nations address over the past 2 years I have
focused on ensuring that the trust relationship between the
Federal Government and tribes is upheld and brought into the
21st century.
Nowhere is that more important than with our youth, because
when we talk about our youth not only is the Federal Government
a trustee, but so am I. As president of NCAI, chairman of the
Swinomish Tribe, a father, and a grandfather, there is no more
solemn obligation as a leader than to safeguard our children.
The future and very existence of our tribes depends on the
education, health, and well-being of the next generations. So
today, when we talk about Indian education and the Bureau of
Indian Education specifically, we need to think about how we
can modernize and elevate and antiquated system to meet the
needs of 21st century Indian students.
Historically, inconsistent federal policies have undermined
the success of Native students. You only need to look at the
current graduation rate at BIE schools of 53 percent to know
that change is needed.
In fact, when we look at all the challenges our Native
students face, all the baggage they bring, the historic trauma,
it is commendable that five out of 10 of our students succeed
in conditions that would seem insurmountable to many others.
The challenges at BIE schools are well documented by
congressional hearings, by GAO, OIG reports, and by the
administration itself. In Senate testimony, Interior Secretary
Jewell, who is ultimately responsible for BIE schools, stated,
``Indian education is an embarrassment.''
Many students attend schools that were built in the 1930s
and 1940s, with 34 percent of the schools in poor condition and
20 percent over 40 years old. It is difficult to attract
teachers to the rural areas where many BIE schools are located,
and if you do, there is often inadequate housing.
Management at headquarters has been inconsistent, with 33
BIE directors in the past 36 years. Tribes have repeatedly
pointed to overly burdensome administrative requirements, lack
of funding, and lack of flexibility to include language and
culture in the curriculum as persistent obstacles.
To move forward we need sustained, consistent growth, along
with an acknowledgement that tribes are best suited to
determine and meet the needs of their students.
Since its beginning in the late 1800s, the BIE system never
allowed tribes to truly control the education of their
students. It wasn't until the Indian Self-Determination and
Education Assistance Act of 1975 that tribes had the ability to
take over the operation of their schools. The last 40 years
have shown that tribes have the capacity to run their own
schools, but more must be done.
With 184 BIE schools located on 63 reservations in 23
states, this reform effort will not succeed if it is not
modified to the individual needs of the schools. Each school is
subject to the federal requirements of the BIE as well as the
state they reside in, which leaves little flexibility, even for
those schools that are tribally controlled.
So a one-size-fits-all approach will not work. Tribes want
the ability to have more control over their curriculum so that
language and culture can again be the cornerstone of education
for Indian students.
It will be important for the BIE to meet the tribes where
they are and take into account their capacity and their
cultural needs, and to provide the tools tribes need to support
their students, their teachers, and their communities. In other
words, true local control will take a true partnership.
But it can be done. At the White House Tribes Nation
Conference last December, a tribal leader asked BIE Director
Monty Roessel for advice on transforming to a tribally
controlled school. Monty's response surprised many in the room
when he said, ``My advice is to start fresh.''
Too many tribal schools end up looking just like the BIE
model. Monty advised that tribal leader to build his ideal
curriculum based on the traditions, culture, and unique needs
of the students, and if he did that, his school would be a
success. If that is truly the approach that the BIE and the
committee takes in seeking solutions to the issues facing our
students, then we can't help but be successful.
At Swinomish we have a Tribal Education Department with a
mission of supporting a lifelong student education. We have
made it a point to work respectfully and collaboratively with
the local schools, parents and guardians, students, and other
tribal departments.
The tribe has been fortunate enough to hire 12
paraprofessionals to support and advocate for our Native
students with the school district, and they are able to track
each student's grades, attendance, and are available for
specialized tutoring should the need arise. We have an
attendance officer who supports students and families to ensure
student attendance and will offer rides should students miss a
bus or school bus.
These investments in our Swinomish students have led to a
graduation rate of Swinomish students of 100 percent last year,
up from 50 percent in 2010.
And finally, I would like to invite you to come out and
visit our youth.
Chairman Rokita, I know that you have recently visited BIE
and tribal schools in Arizona and I commend you for that. And
clearly that has informed your agenda here today to make sure
all of our Native students are provided with the best
educational opportunities possible.
And to all other committee members, I invite you to meet
our students, see our schools, and help us build a brighter
future for our students and our tribes.
Thank you very much.
[The statement of Mr. Cladoosby follows:]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentleman.
Mr. Roman Nose, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MR. QUINTON ROMAN NOSE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, TRIBAL
EDUCATION DEPARTMENTS NATIONAL ASSEMBLY, BOULDER, COLORADO
[DEMOCRAT WITNESS]
Mr. Roman Nose. [Speaking native language.]
Good morning.
Chairman Rokita and Ranking Member Fudge, I am Quinton
Roman Nose. I am Cheyenne from Oklahoma. I am also the
executive director of the Tribal Education Departments National
Assembly, a nonprofit organization for the education
departments of American Indian and Alaskan Natives.
I come here in a spirit of my great grandfather. He came in
the late 1800s with Captain Pratt seeking funding for the very
first boarding school, Carlisle Indian School. Came here
seeking a better life for our Indian students through
education.
I appreciate the opportunity to speak to you today, and I
thank Representative Rokita for setting this important hearing.
Over 90 percent of our American Indian students are education
in SEAs and public schools. The Bureau of Indian Education
still oversees 185 schools, serving about 41,000 students.
Overall, the federal education policy is failing Native
American students. Native American students drop out of high
school at a higher rate, score lower on achievement tests than
any other group. The national dropout rate for Native American
students is double than that of their peers.
Likewise, the Office of Civil Rights report Data Collection
Snapshot recognized that Native American elementary and
secondary students in public schools are disproportionately
suspended and expelled. OCR also found that Native American
kindergarten students are held back at twice the rate of their
Anglo counterpart, and 9 percent of our Native American ninth-
graders repeat the ninth grade.
We have many sources of data reflecting underachievement in
Native American students. I would like to point out that even
though a report released by the Department of Education on
March 16th of this year indicates that graduation rates for
American Indian students have increased in recent years,
however, Native American students continue to have the lowest
graduation rates of all ethnic and racial groups.
At the same time, tribal governments involved in the
education of Native American students have been severely
restricted until recently. Since 1988, Congress has authorized
funding specifically to build tribal capacity to directly serve
Native American students. Funds were recently appropriated for
the first time, but these tribal education agencies, TEAs, need
continued funding in order to fulfill critical needs of Native
American students.
TEAs are in a unique position to halt and reverse the
negative outcomes for Native American students. TEAs have
already proven they are capable of improving Native American
student outcomes.
As an example, Chickasaw Nation, one of the STEP grantees,
has a science, technology, and math program, among other
education programs, that serves approximately 250 Chickasaw
students. Ninety percent of senior students participating in
that program enrolled in college. The work of the Nez Perce
Tribe in Idaho--their TEA is another good example.
The most recent research shows that the achievement in
Native American students have found a connection between low
achievement and low cultural relevance. The Nez Perce Tribe,
another STEP grantee, has made a large inroad to providing
teacher training on the integration of cultural pedagogy,
tribal education standards, and Common Core standards.
While TEAs can assist in curbing the challenges, the
challenges are widespread. For instance, the FCC estimates that
the percentage of Americans in rural tribal communities without
access to fixed broadband--it is eight times higher than the
national average.
There was a rulemaking committee estimated that 61 of the
183 BIE schools were in poor condition and that bringing them
to fair condition would cost $1.3 billion. TEDNA supports
efforts to build or repair school buildings for tribal schools
and would encourage more funding and a smoother, streamlined
process so that more buildings can be completed under the
original plans.
As the GAO reported in the series report, BIE needs better
management and accountability, improved oversight of spending,
and to greatly upgrade many facilities. TEDNA generally
supports the current BIE reorganization plan, but wants to
ensure that there is local and regional input from tribal
leadership.
The BIE reorganization plan will move toward allowing more
tribes to have more control of their education system even
though we recognize it will be a difficult process. We are
aware of arguments from both sides, the pro and cons, of the
reorganization plan. We support the efforts of those tribes and
their TEAs who are willing to participate in this process.
We appreciate the BIE Sovereignty in Education grant. We
also applaud the House's initiative for appropriating TEA
fundings on 25 U.S. Code Section 2020, a historic
appropriation. The recent initiatives recognize the importance
of TEAs.
In closing, while there are serious challenges facing
Native American students, there are promising TEAs and programs
that are currently making advances. With the assistance of the
House appropriating funds for TEAs, we are hoping to continue
to make gains and provide TEAs with a greater role in the
education of their students.
Again, I thank you, Chairman Rokita, for recognizing the
importance of Native education and the challenges we are facing
in educating our students.
Should you have any questions, I am happy to answer them.
Also, we will be submitting written testimony within the 2-week
period.
Thank you.
[The statement of Mr. Roman Nose follows:]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentleman.
Ms. Emrey-Arras, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MS. MELISSA EMREY-ARRAS, DIRECTOR, EDUCATION,
WORKFORCE AND INCOME SECURITY ISSUES, U.S. GOVERNMENT
ACCOUNTABILITY OFFICE, BOSTON, MASSACHUSETTS
Ms. Emrey-Arras. Thank you.
Chairman Rokita, Ranking Member Fudge, and members of the
subcommittee, thank you for inviting me here today to discuss
GAO's work regarding Indian Affairs' oversight of and support
for Indian education.
Over the past 10 years, Indian Affairs within the
Department of Interior has undergone several reorganizations,
resulting in multiple offices across different units being
responsible for Indian education.
Within Indian Affairs, the Bureau of Indian Education
oversees 185 elementary and secondary schools that serve
approximately 41,000 students on or near Indian reservations in
23 states. These schools receive almost all of their funding
from the Department of Interior and the Department of
Education.
Student performance at these schools has been consistently
below that of Indian students at public schools, raising
questions about whether students at these schools are, in fact,
receiving a quality education.
My remarks will cover findings from our prior work.
Specifically, I will focus on three key management challenges
at Indian Affairs: one, its administration of schools; two, the
capacity of its staff to address school needs; and three,
accountability for managing school construction and monitoring
school spending.
In terms of administration, we have found that
organizational fragmentation and poor communication undermine
administration of these schools. In addition to the Bureau of
Indian Education, multiple offices have responsibility for
educational and administrative functions at these schools.
For example, Indian Affairs provided us with a chart on
these offices, and I think you can see it on the side. And this
is just a chart for just school facilities. And as you can see,
it shows numerous offices across three organizational
divisions.
Fragmentation and poor communication among Indian Affairs
offices has led to confusion among schools about whom to
contact when they have problems, and it has also resulted in
delays of key educational services and supplies like textbooks
to students.
In 2013, we recommended that Indian Affairs develop a
strategic plan for the Bureau of Indian Education and a
strategy for communicating with schools. Although Indian
Affairs agreed with the recommendations, it has not yet fully
implemented them.
Limited staff capacity within Indian Affairs poses another
challenge to addressing school needs. Indian Affairs data
indicate that about 40 percent of its regional facility
positions, such as architects and engineers, are vacant.
We also found that staff do not always have the skills and
training that they need to oversee school spending. We
recommended that Indian Affairs revise its workforce plan so
that employees are placed in the right offices and have the
right skills to support schools. Although Indian Affairs again
agreed with this recommendation, it has not implemented it.
Inconsistent accountability also hampers management of
school construction and monitoring of school spending. We have
found that Indian Affairs did not consistently oversee some
school construction projects.
For example, at one school we visited Indian Affairs spent
$3.5 million to replace multiple roofs in 2010. The new roofs
have leaked since they were installed, causing mold and ceiling
damage. And again, there is another picture. Indian Affairs has
not addressed the problems, resulting in continued leaks and
damage to the structure.
At another school we visited, a high voltage electrical
panel was installed next to the dishwasher, which posed a
potential electrocution hazard. School facility staff told us
that although the building inspector had approved this
configuration before it opened, safety inspectors later noted
that it was, in fact, a safety hazard.
In 2014 we found that the Bureau of Indian Education does
not adequately monitory school expenditures using RBM
procedures or risk-based monitoring approach. As a result, the
bureau failed to provide effective oversight of schools when
they misspent millions of dollars in federal funds.
We recommended that the agency develop RBM procedures and a
risk-based approach to improve its monitoring. Indian Affairs
again agreed, but it has not yet implemented these
recommendations.
In conclusion, our work shows that Indian Affairs continues
to face challenges overseeing and supporting Indian education.
Unless these issues are addressed, it will be difficult for
Indian Affairs to ensure the long-term success of a generation
of students.
Thank you.
[The statement of Ms. Emrey-Arras follows:]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentlelady.
I would like to recognize the chairman of the full
committee, Mr. John Kline, for his questioning.
Mr. Kline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And thanks, to the witnesses. A great panel.
Sometimes I don't know whether to laugh or cry when I am
hearing these stories. It is just absolutely incredible.
Mr. Burcum, when we were up at the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school
the other--oh, a couple of weeks ago now, I mean, it is clearly
appalling. It is the northern part of Minnesota, spring time,
and yet there is still snow on the ground and ice on the lakes,
and it is cold and there are drafty openings, and it is just
appalling.
I know that--it is my understanding, at least, that you
have talked to Secretary Jewell about the Bug school
particularly. What do they say?
Ms. Burcum. That is a very good question. Secretary Jewell
has also visited the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school and I think, you
know, her visit inspired hope that there is going to be a new
school sometime soon.
But when I had exchanges with Secretary Jewell and Dr.
Roessel, there is no plan, as far as I can tell, to rebuild the
school. And what they tell me is that, number one, they have
many other schools in tough shape, as hard as that is to
believe, and that, you know, their hands are just tied. There
is no funding available, they are busy doing this bureaucratic
reorganization.
It just doesn't seem like there is, you know--there is a
lot of defeatism, I think, within that agency. It is like it
has been a problem for so long that maybe collectively, you
know, even new leadership throws up its hands even after they
have seen the conditions at these schools.
Mr. Kline. Again, laugh or cry.
Ms. Emrey-Arras, the GAO has done an enormous amount of
work, and you personally have done an enormous amount of work.
And I am looking--we have a paper copy of what you showed on
the screen up there, and in discussing the situation over the
last few weeks I have made the point that you have a
bureaucratic mess. Just a bureaucratic mess.
Who is in charge? We talked about the Secretary of
Interior, but you have got the BIA, you have got the BIE, you
have got the Department of Education, you have vacancies. You
just have a mess.
Why do you think, since we have known about this for a long
time, to--and many of us more now aware of it, thanks to Ms.
Burcum's work--why do you think it is so slow to be recognized
and improved, and where is the particular--or most particular--
obstacle that keeps us from addressing this problem?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. That is really tough to answer. We have
had multiple recommendations that would really get at the heart
of a lot of these issues: Have a plan. Know what you are doing.
Have the right people with the right skills with the right
training to do their jobs.
And those recommendations have remained unaddressed. Or
perhaps they will do something but it remains in draft form and
it is never realized.
So it continues to create issues--
Mr. Kline. Is that because of the change in leadership, or
what prevents this from coming to fruition here? Because
clearly nobody--nobody can go visit one of these schools and
not say, ``We need to fix this.''
Ms. Emrey-Arras. Right.
Mr. Kline. But it doesn't happen.
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have noted that the turnover in
leadership has been an issue. I think also there is lack of
communication with schools.
When you showed that chart, I don't think most people could
understand what was going on there. We had experiences with
schools where they had real issues. They were out of hot water
in elementary schools. They needed to get hot water for their
kids and they didn't know who to contact, and it took sometimes
a year to get those hot water heaters replaced.
Mr. Kline. Well, looking at this chart and listening to
your testimony, knowing the work you have done and the work all
of you have done in this, it seems to me that we just can't let
up.
I mentioned to a number of people that Congress itself is
not well organized to address this. We are having this hearing
in Chairman Rokita's subcommittee where we have jurisdiction,
if you will, over the U.S. Department of Education, who has
about this much to do with this issue, and virtually zero to do
with the building construction issue.
So we are not well organized here either, but we can't
let--we in Congress can't let that be an excuse, and I think we
all owe it to these kids to get past the confusing charts and
the way we are organized in Congress and say it is somebody
else's. It is time now for it to be all of our responsibility,
and we should never visit a high school built on a pole barn
that was designed for--to work on cars and trucks, and you have
got kids in there in the winter, in the cold, wearing their
coats and mittens because it may be easily 30 below zero
outside a little metal wall with gaps this big letting that
cold air in where you have a blanket to stop it.
My time is expired. I yield back.
Chairman Rokita. Thank the gentleman.
Ranking Member Scott is recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Scott. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Roman Nose, can you--you mentioned some very successful
programs. Could you describe those again and what the results
of those programs were?
Mr. Roman Nose. There are several successful TEAs. The one
that I will be referring to is a result of four grants given to
tribes, their TEAs, in which to work with states in a
partnership to look at one of the federal title programs that
are given to the local school district. So the TEA and the LEA
and the SEA come together to look at how that program is
implemented. So it is up to the tribe to pick what title
program they are going to work with.
Also, within the bureau they are just starting that process
with Section 2020. And so I think things are looking up, but
when you look at the minimal number of tribes who receive these
grants--four for STEP, six for SIEA, and I am not sure how many
are going to receive the new Section 2020 grant--but you look
at 565 tribes, you know, the TEA, you know, needs are very,
very much under-met.
Mr. Scott. Well, when you implemented those programs where
you implemented them, did they make a difference?
Mr. Roman Nose. Yes, they did. I think the overall success
in every one of them, regardless of what title program they
looked at, is that there was more communication, more
collaboration, more learning of what the other party does
between the TEA, the SEA, and the LEA.
Mr. Scott. Did you show academic improvement?
Mr. Roman Nose. I think in some instances there were. There
were more about the structure of how a program is developed,
not test scores.
Mr. Scott. Okay. Well, do you have evaluations of those
programs that we could see?
Mr. Roman Nose. I will contact them and make whatever
evaluations are available to you.
Mr. Scott. Thank you.
Ms. Emrey-Arras, how long--do you know how long these
programs--these problems have been known?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have been reporting at GAO for decades
on issues specifically regarding facilities.
Mr. Scott. There are a number of specific issues that came
up. One is the quality of the teachers. Did you find anything
being done to recruit highly qualified teachers?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have done some work in the past on
teacher recruitment and teacher turnover issues. Back in 2001
we reported that turnover rates at BIE schools were much higher
for teachers than at public schools and that one of the
struggles that schools faced in recruitment was just really the
remote locations of the schools. One of the schools was telling
us that it was over 90 miles to major shopping, which was a
difficult thing to sell people on when you are trying to hire a
teacher for a job.
Mr. Scott. Was anything being done about that? I mean, you
say the problem. Was there a solution?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. Our work has not focused on best practices
for that issue; we focused on documenting the concerns that the
individuals had at that point.
Mr. Scott. So you didn't find anybody working on the--you
stated the--you identified the problem, but you don't see
anybody working on it?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. That was just one small piece of a larger
study that we did back in 2001, sir.
Mr. Scott. Well, okay. You also found excessive
suspensions. We know that suspensions are highly correlated
with future dropping out, crime, unemployment. What is being
done to deal with excessive suspensions?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have not done any recent work regarding
that issue, but we would be happy to do so if you are
interested in that.
Mr. Scott. Okay. Did you try to ascertain, following up on
the chairman's comment, did you ascertain whether the Bureau of
Indian Education has the expertise to do education or whether
or not some of this ought to be more appropriately placed in
the Department of Education?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have not looked at that straight on. We
have looked at the issue of whether the individuals that are
doing monitoring of school spending have the expertise, and the
answer was ``not all the time.''
We had people tell us that they were looking at single
audits for tribes, and they were not accountants, they didn't
know financial issues, and they didn't know what they were
looking at, and they had no training. So we had concerns.
Mr. Scott. Would that expertise be found in the Department
of Education?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. That is something that we have not
explored, sir.
Mr. Scott. I think you mentioned vacancies. Are vacancies
not being filled because they are not being filled or because
there is no funding to fill the vacancies?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We will be looking at that as we continue
our ongoing work. Our facilities study is still in the works
and we plan on issuing later this year, sir.
Mr. Scott. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Rokita. Thank the gentleman.
In order to accommodate members' schedules, I am going to
reserve my questioning for later and now recognize Mr. Bishop,
from Michigan, for 5 minutes.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you, to all of you, for being here today. Appreciate
your testimony.
I thought I might ask--there has been some discussion today
and, Ms. Emrey-Arras, I wondered if I might direct this
question at you: In a world of diminishing resources and
funding, if there is anything that you could share with us, any
ideas that you might have with regard to more efficient
distribution of resources out of the Department of the Interior
and the other funding sources.
Ms. Emrey-Arras. Although our facilities work is still
ongoing, we did report in our February testimony on one of the
practices that we have observed so far that is very interesting
in terms of resources, and that is in eastern Oklahoma there is
a group of four tribal schools that have gone together to pool
resources for facilities, and in doing so, they have been able
to hire two architects and individuals to help them with their
data entry for the facilities database. And we have heard that
is a promising practice and we will continue to look at that as
we go forward.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you.
President Cladoosby, I am fortunate, being from Michigan,
I--we have a number of tribal reservations there and have had
the opportunity to visit most of them, and have also had the
opportunity to review and to see up close and personal their
education environments. And it is extremely impressive.
I don't think that the vast majority of folks who don't--
haven't seen that understand the role the tribe plays in the
education of these youngsters and these young individuals, and
I wondered if you might be able to more clearly give us some
kind of description as to the role that the tribe plays in the
education of young people, and also how that may have evolved
over the years.
Mr. Cladoosby. Sure. Thank you very much for that question.
And once again, it always boils down to the bureaucracy
that is placed on these schools and local control. You know, if
tribes have the opportunity to develop the curriculum and
implement it--and places that have been successful in Indian
Country have done just that.
There is a lot of historical knowledge that cannot be
taught in public schools. A lot of things. I can give you a lot
of examples of historical knowledge that will never be taught
in a state-run school that can only be taught in a tribal
school, just because of our history.
And so I would say it boils down to just local control. You
know, we have federal rules; we have state rules that these
schools have to abide by. But if you just let the locals
implement what they think is best for their schools, you will
have success.
Mr. Bishop. There is always some discussion, if I might
follow up with that question, as to why these environments
don't rely on the local public schools around. And you have
just mentioned that you do some tribal education, including
language, customs, history.
Is there anything that you do that you can do as a tribe in
that environment that the public schools around can't do?
Mr. Cladoosby. Yes. Once again, it gets back to being able
to teach the kids--you know, we suffer from a lot of historical
trauma in Indian Country, and as many of you know, the boarding
school experiences--that historical trauma was not a pretty
picture and, you know, overcoming that historical trauma is so
very important. And reacquiring that culture and reacquiring
that language, reacquiring those teachings, those customs,
those stories is very important.
And we have been working--in Washington State right now
they just passed a bill that makes it mandatory that every
school has to teach tribal culture, and so, you know, those are
steps in the right direction for states, looking at the
importance of that. And so those are some of the things that,
you know, the tribes are working with our local school
districts to start implementing.
Mr. Bishop. Thank you very much.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentleman.
I would like to notify committee members that we have had
a--we have been joined by Congressman Rick Nolan, from northern
Minnesota. He is off committee, but he is--has a district that
includes the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school that Ms. Burcum
originally reported on.
Sir, welcome. You will be recognized in due time. Thank you
for being with us today. Thanks for the hospitality you gave
committee members in northern Minnesota.
Ms. Fudge, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
Ms. Emrey-Arras, you, in your testimony, outlined schools
that have been forced to divert their building maintenance
funds so that they can use them for facility operations, and
you indicate that there was at least one school that you found
that had--was only being funded at 50 percent of what it
needed. Can you please tell me what the primary cause of
underfunding in BIE schools is?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have not looked at those underlying
issues but do report, as you mentioned, that some are using
money that is intended for keeping the lights on and keeping
the buildings warm for maintenance, and then what happens is
there is this domino effect where they pull the money to keep
the lights on so they don't fix the rainspouts, maybe, and then
the foundation has issues subsequently because there hasn't
been regular maintenance. So there is a problem there.
Ms. Fudge. Okay. So you are saying that you determined that
there is a problem but you don't know why there is one.
Ms. Emrey-Arras. This is an ongoing study that we are
currently working on. The information that we testified on in
late February is from this ongoing work, so we do not have
recommendations yet from that study.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you. But I would argue that some of it is
just that the Congress doesn't give the funding to the
Department of Interior it should.
Number two, also to you: Do you believe that moving the
responsibility of facilities and repair under BIE as opposed to
BIA would help the process?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. There have been different processes over
time where they have done centralization and then
decentralization, and gone back and forth. I think our primary
interest is in making sure that whatever structure is present
is one that is attuned to the customers, the schools, and as
part of that they need to make sure that there is communication
with schools, the schools--
Ms. Fudge. Is that a yes or a no?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. I am sorry?
Ms. Fudge. Is that a yes or a no?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We do not have an official position on the
structure.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you.
Mr. Roman Nose, according to a recent report from the
Alliance for Excellent Education, there are over 1,200 high
schools across the country that fail to graduate one-third or
more of their students. These schools disproportionately serve
low-income students and students of color. In four states--
Alaska, Montana, North Dakota, and South Dakota--more than 90
percent of the kids in these schools are American Indian and
Alaska Native students.
How can federal policy help to turn these schools around so
that these young people have an opportunity to succeed?
Mr. Roman Nose. Thank you for asking that question. I think
there are many ways of looking at this.
One is the sole purpose of the STEP program was to get the
three entities to work together, the federal title programs,
the tribal education agency, and the state education agency. In
those--some of those states that you mentioned, they have not
progressed to the point that they recognize the value of tribal
education agencies in their state. Therefore, some of the
states did not choose to participate in the STEP program, which
is optional.
Also, the overlying factor of that is TEAs need to know
where they are at. They need to have good data. And the FERPA
issue has been there for many years, and it requires a
technical amendment that we just insert tribe so that they can
have access to that.
And also, there is a lack of understanding that because we
have bureau schools with school boards, many people think that,
well, the SEA controls the local school boards to some extent.
Well, that relationship between SEAs and the LEAs is not there
for TEA; it is in their local school system.
Sometimes there is a lack of communication, lack of
capacity, and so forth.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you very much.
President Cladoosby--
Mr. Cladoosby. It is a tough one. Cladoosby.
Ms. Fudge. I got you. How does the Department of Interior
generally, and BIE specifically, work with tribes to strengthen
leadership and administrative capacity in order to support
tribal control of schools?
Mr. Cladoosby. You know, in my testimony I said that, you
know, we have had a high turnover at leadership at BIE--33
directors in 36 years. I mean, that is sad. That is a very sad
statistic. And once again, you know, it boils down to funding
and local control.
And when you look at the two federal school systems that
the Federal Government operates, they operate the DOD school
systems and they operate the BIE school systems. And in 2014
there was a $315 million request for school construction for
DOD schools; there was only a $2 million request for BIE
schools.
And, you know, when--if we could show you a slideshow of
what a DOD school looks like--a federally run DOD school and a
federally run BIE school, and it would be a sad, sad, sad
picture. And so once again, it gets down to, you know,
Congress, as the trustees of these young Native American kids,
needs to bring an awareness to this funding disparity.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you.
Chairman Rokita. Thank the gentlelady.
Now I recognize Mr. Grothman for 5 minutes.
Mr. Grothman. Thanks. I have a few questions. First one is
for Ms. Emrey.
Looking at the memorandum we have prepared here, there is a
line that says in the November 2014 report, GAO found BIE-
operated schools spend 56 percent more per pupil than public
schools nationally, and that is kind of a shocking number. I
mean, I guess maybe it proves one more time that the amount of
funding is overrated. But is that an accurate statement?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. That is accurate. And it actually may be a
lower bound estimate because the BIE schools also have
administrative costs that aren't being included in that, in
terms of the structure. So they are, in fact, funded at a
higher level per pupil than the public schools on average.
Mr. Grothman. Wow. Okay.
If that is so, I will ask Mr.--get your name right--
Mr. Cladoosby. Cladoosby. It is a tough one.
Mr. Grothman. And that is a shocking number, so obviously
we are putting enough money in this situation. Do you see or do
you see a difference on, like, test scores and that sort of
thing between BIA schools and locally administered schools?
Mr. Cladoosby. I think the statistic of 53 percent
graduation rate compared to 80 percent graduation rate tells a
big story right there.
Mr. Grothman. Okay. I will give you another question,
because for whatever reason, we always get these breakdowns by
ethnic group, which I always think is a--do you folks keep
track of breakdown by--or of test scores by family structure? I
mean, a lot of times--I don't have any Indian schools in my
district, but a lot of time the teachers in my district feel
one of the things that affects educational achievement is the
family structure.
And do you, when you keep track of your statistics either
by a school or by individual, have statistics showing the
degree to which maybe some of these problems may be affected by
family structure?
Mr. Cladoosby. Definitely. The parents are the key to the
education of our students.
And I mentioned historical trauma. That has occurred in our
communities at very, very high levels, and with that historical
trauma came a lot of poverty, drug and alcohol abuse, run-ins
with the law, jails, prisons.
And I can guarantee you 100 percent that if we invest in
our kids that we will destroy this historical trauma, destroy
poverty. We will create productive members of society who will
pay taxes and be removed from the welfare rolls.
I am a 100 percent believer in that and I am seeing that as
I travel across the nation to Indian countries North, South,
East, and West, where these tribes are investing a lot in
destroying historical trauma.
Mr. Grothman. Okay. I don't know the answer to this. I know
in the United States as a whole we are kind of still going the
wrong direction on family breakdown. Different people can argue
why that is.
But I wonder within the Indian community, are there changes
in statistics on that--you know, kids raised in a, you know, an
intact family are not safe today compared to 40 years ago or 80
years ago? Do we know?
Mr. Cladoosby. Yes. Yes. Once again, when I travel across
Indian Country I am seeing those tribes that are in locations
where economic development is making a--great strides, but I am
still also seeing, like in the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation,
where we have 80 percent unemployment, you know, 80 percent
alcoholism rate, 80 percent dropout rate.
So, you know, the location of the tribes plays a big part
in it, also. But we do also have success stories at Pine Ridge.
Mr. Grothman. Okay.
Now we will give another question for Ms. Emrey-Arras.
Can you outline some of the misuses of funding by BIE?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. Sure. So external auditors identified
millions of dollars that were inappropriately spent. In fact,
they identified $13.8 million in unallowable spending at the
time of our study.
And one of the examples we found was that a school had lost
$1.2 million in federal funds that were improperly transferred
to an offshore account. Interior later said that they were the
victims of a hacking incident, yet there were such weak
controls that it remained questionable what, in fact, had
happened.
Mr. Grothman. Okay. I will give you a follow-up question,
because you just heard what the past person said. Do you, and
from what you see, a situation which the funds are more wisely
used by locally administered schools rather than these schools
administered out of Washington?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We have not done that analysis, sir.
Mr. Grothman. Okay.
Chairman Rokita. Gentleman's time is expired.
Mr. Grothman. Okay. I am sorry. Thanks.
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentleman.
Mr. Sablan, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Sablan. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
And good morning, everyone.
In preparing for today's hearing, I read the editorial
series in the Star Tribune that Ms. Burcum--that highlighted
the very poor condition of BIE schools in Minnesota. The titles
of the series just struck me, ``Separate and Unequal.'' It is,
of course, a reference to the milestone Supreme Court decision,
Brown v. Board of Education, which found that separate by
definition cannot be equal when it comes to how we educate our
children.
So separating one group of children from another leads to
inequality, perpetuates inequality. The situation is of--the
situation of neglected and inadequate BIE school facilities,
which GAO reported was in Minnesota and elsewhere--Montana,
North Dakota, New Mexico--proves that.
We have school facilities in my district in Northern
Mariana Islands and other U.S. ancillary areas--1,866--that are
also substandard. The Office of Insular Affairs at Interior
commissioned the Army Corps of Engineers a few years ago to
rank these facilities by hazards posed to students, and since,
federal funding for school repairs in the areas have been
allocated based on Army Corps rankings. Of course, we could use
more money to get the job done more quickly.
I understand Chairman Kline and other members who represent
Minnesota have requested more funding this year for BIE
schools, and I hope they are successful. And I hope these funds
are used in a systematic, prioritized way.
I would like to point out another connection between BIE's
schools and schools in my district, and that is the way that
Title 1-A grants in Elementary and Secondary Education Acts are
allocated. Funding for BIE students and students for what are
called the outlying areas--the Northern Marianas, American
Samoa, Guam, and the U.S. Virgin Islands--is separated out from
all other Title A funding.
BIE and the outlying schools receive 1 percent of the total
Title I funds and then the secretary of education decides how
to divide that money between BIE and the island schools. And
that system has resulted in BIE students getting about twice as
much as students in my district.
We are having a hearing today about how bad all the BIE
schools are, and they are when it comes to school buildings.
But when it comes to federal funds to help run these schools,
well, I have to speak up for students in my district who are
getting the short end of the stick.
The problem goes back to the headline in the Star Tribune:
``Separate and Unequal.'' When we separate one group of
students from another, inequality arises, and that is the case
of Title I funding.
Instead of treating BIE students and students in the
outlying areas the same way we treat students in the states,
instead of basing funding on the number of students served and
on whether those students come from low-income households, the
Elementary and Secondary Education Act has a set-aside, they
call it, for my students. And set-aside is just another way of
sending--saying ``separate.'' And separate, as the Supreme
Court ruled, is not equal.
The House has yet to act on reauthorization of the
Elementary and Secondary Education Act, and I am well aware
that there is nothing in the bill that Chairman Kline has
reported that will end this separate but unequal Title I-A
funding for Native American children in the BIE schools and for
the indigenous and diverse student body in schools in my
district. But until the House acts on the ESEA, we still have
an opportunity to change this unequal practice, and I plead on
Chairman Kline to please consider my proposal.
And today's hearing is just one more opportunity to remind
us all that until we do change Title I of ESEA, we will
continue to have students who are separate, not equal.
And at this time, Mr. Chairman, I would like to yield time
to my colleague from northern Minnesota, Mr. Nolan, who is a
strong champion for this issue in Congress.
[The statement of Mr. Sablan follows:]
[GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Rokita. Nolan is recognized.
Mr. Nolan. I want to thank Congressman Sablan.
And I particularly want to thank Chairman Rokita and full
committee Chairman Kline for their bipartisan, collaborative
determination to get to the bottom of this situation and
centuries of neglect of the children in Indian Country here.
Congressman Fudge, I want to commend you and the other
members of the committee.
I want to also have the opportunity to welcome Jill Burcum
for her brilliant reporting on this whole issue, and the Bug-O-
Nay-Ge-Shig school in particular.
The conditions are truly appalling. As Chairman Kline said,
they are horrific.
It sends a message that we do not honor our obligations. It
sends a message that children in Indian Country's education is
not important. And in my judgment, it is a level of neglect
that rises to the level of child abuse.
And I want to thank everybody here for their efforts and
their determination to get to the bottom of it and fix it once
and for all.
Last but not least, I come out of the sawmill and the
pallet factory business, and we have quite a number of
buildings--pole buildings, I might add--all of which are in
better shape than the dilapidated, falling-down, dangerous,
half-century-old building that the children are trying to be
educated in the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school.
Thank you, everyone.
Chairman Rokita. I thank the gentleman.
I will now recognize Mr. Russell, for 5 minutes.
Mr. Russell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And thank you for the panel and the excellent detail that
you have provided us today.
Mr. Roman Nose, it is nice to see you. And I would ask, as
we examine the BIE school system today, my question for you,
sir, would be, can you give us one or two recommendations that
would help improve where the school system is today and how we
could improve it?
Mr. Roman Nose. That is a loaded question, but I certainly
will try and answer that.
For BIE schools, certainly the local tribes need to be
given more resources to make them sufficient enough to all the
things that an SEA has to do with their school district. And
also, they need technical assistance to develop infrastructure
like curriculum standards, and so forth.
So the small amount of money we have been given is really
not sufficient. It is just to build their--start to build their
capacity. And, you know, once again, if you look to that very
small percentage of how much money has been given, there is
still great need.
In that respect, some of the tribes who do have their own
resources are going ahead and trying to resolve that issue.
I think that the BIE, you know, needs to look at maybe
different models, maybe even a pilot program or turn over those
schools who what to go to Department of Defense and see how
they operated within that infrastructure, maybe even turn a few
over to Department of Education. But, you know, the question
that tribes would have is the question of sovereignty, and so
it is a big question, so--
Mr. Russell. Well, thank you for that, sir.
And, Ms. Burcum, as you have traveled the country touring
schools and meeting students, what surprised you the most?
Ms. Burcum. I think as we got to know the students my
observation is that there is a lot of untapped potential here.
You know, the statistics are very grim when you look at
graduation rates, for example, or reading and math scores.
But the thing to remember about these students is that they
are not--they go through so much before they even walk in the
door of that school. I got to know Seneca Keezer while I was up
at the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school, and she lost her mother at age
12; she has two younger sisters; she has a dad who not only has
diabetes but is in a wheelchair.
She gets up, you know, her students--or her sisters, she
cooks them breakfast, she makes sure that they have all their
homework and gets on the bus before she goes to school. And she
also takes care of her dad.
When she comes home she cooks dinner for everybody,
supervises homework, and then takes care of her dad, helps him
with everything, and then she gets to do her own homework, and
then she gets to go to bed. She does this day after day.
I felt, as a, you know, a 46-year-old mother, that I was
talking to a peer, not, you know, a young girl who was a senior
in high school.
And a lot of students have similar stories. I mean, we have
mentioned the family issues that are, you know, I think, you
know, a true concern and, you know, potentially, you know, a
hurdle to learning.
But there is a lot of that on these reservations. These
kids go through so much before they go to the classroom.
And what the cultural education does at these schools is it
provides that sense of family that isn't--that maybe not--that
isn't there at home. You have dedicated teachers; you have
elders who are coming into these schools. At the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-
Shig school, for example, there are parking spots reserved for
elders.
They are getting something at these schools that they are
not going to get at public schools, and sometimes they are not
getting at home. These kids are to be admired, and it is
something to take into perspective when you look at some of the
educational statistics.
Mr. Russell. Well, thank you for that.
Mr. Cladoosby, in your opinion, what steps are needed to
ensure the BIE system effectively serves students?
Mr. Cladoosby. Well, I think we definitely need to look at
the long term and look at the plans going forward that we have
to understand that there is no quick fix, there is no one-size-
fits-all; acknowledge tribal sovereignty in a real way and
acknowledge that the communities have the opportunity to teach
things that the other schools can't; acknowledge historical
trauma, that, you know, a lot of people probably up there don't
really understand historical trauma from a tribal perspective,
and it is real, and we are still living it. And I am a firm
believer that education will destroy historical trauma.
And continue to work on building capacity within these
schools. And, you know, Congress can start right away by, you
know, allocating $1.3 billion to create brand new schools in
this program. $1.3 billion. Let's just do it.
Chairman Rokita. Gentleman's time is expired.
Mr. Russell. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Rokita. Thank the gentleman.
Mr. Thompson, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Thompson. I want to thank the chairman and ranking
member for putting this hearing together.
Thanks for all of you folks for coming here, sharing your
expertise, your commitment to this really important issue.
I want to start out and follow up, Ms. Burcum, thank you
for, you know, providing some transparency on this issue. You
know, obviously, reading your testimony, your articles that you
wrote wasn't--you know, part reporter, part mom. You know, you
brought that passion to it, and that is appreciated when we are
talking about education.
In your testimony you describe the concerning physical
conditions of the Bureau of Indian Education high schools.
Given your interactions with school administrators, parents,
students of these schools--excuse me--can you elaborate on how
these under-equipped facilities contribute to the many
challenges facing American Indian education?
Ms. Burcum. I am glad to do that. That is an excellent
question.
I think the most shocking classroom that I went into was at
the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig High School, and we are all acquainted
with the need for kids to have science and math fundamental
skills to compete in the workforce. And at the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-
Shig school the science classroom used to be part of an
automotive shop. There are no microscopes. They don't have the
safety equipment to do chemistry experiments or many biology
experiments. The periodic table is out of date.
And I think, ``How are these kids--how are we equipping
these kids to compete, to pull their communities up and be good
citizens and parents for the next decades when we don't have
the facilities and the classrooms to give them the education
that they need?''
You know, science and math are challenging. You need to
have a hands-on learning experience.
And I think it is especially helpful for American Indian
students. You have to have that, and we don't have that. So
that is a way that it is holding back students at that school.
When I was out in the Pine Ridge--on the Pine Ridge
Reservation, I talked to the elementary school principal, and
she came up to me later after we had talked and she said, ``If
I could make one point to you it is this: If you want to raise
reading scores, you need to have a library for these
children.''
They are so far out. They are 90 miles away from Rapid
City. I don't believe that there is a library on the
reservation, or at least in the communities that I visited.
So if you want them to read, which is how you get ahead,
that is how you become a better reader--you want them to raise
their reading scores, they need to have books. They don't even
have a library at their elementary school.
So those are some key ways that learning is being held back
by the decrepit facilities that we have.
Mr. Thompson. Thank you.
Ms. Emrey-Arras, given your expertise, how do you think the
past two restructuring efforts and the Bureau of Indian Affairs
further complicated communications from a school's perspective,
and how can this be improved?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. I think, quite simply, people do not know
who to contact when they have problems, and that continues.
When we talk to schools, they are asking us who they should
contact at Interior because it is not clear to them.
I mean, some really basic things are missing, like an up-
to-date phone directory. The directory that they have is from
2011.
And we have pointed this out to them, and on Friday they
said, ``Oh, we have updated our directory. It is all in
draft,'' you know. But then we looked on the Web site and it is
still the old one from 2011 up there. So if you are trying to
contact someone, you don't know how to reach them.
Mr. Thompson. Thank you.
This question I will throw out in general: Can any of you
discuss the academic preparation and academic needs of students
being served by the BIE school system, and what do you think
are the benefits of the schools that you have observed?
Ms. Burcum. I will respond to that question first.
First of all, you have a very dedicated staff of teachers
who are at these schools. The pay is lower than they could have
gotten elsewhere; they are often on very remote reservations.
They are there because they have a real passion and a
connection with these kids.
And I think also--they made a point over and over again
that I didn't quite understand, which is that the culture--
learning the culture enriches the educational experience for
these kids and makes them better citizens. And I didn't quite
understand until the end of my long reporting quest.
And imbued in their language and culture are values. And I
said, ``Okay, I still don't understand.''
And finally I was given this example: The Ojibwe word for
older woman is ``she who holds it all together.'' The Ojibwe
word for older man is ``keeper of the earth.'' There are values
that are just implicit in this culture that are transmitted and
reiterated and reinforced when we add that to the curriculum.
And when you have cultural aspects of the day woven into
it, you also keep kids coming back. These are kids that have
not succeeded at public schools, often. They bounce around a
lot. It is surprising once you actually start looking at the
system.
And they come to this school because they feel comfortable,
because they have dedicated staff who are family to them, and
they feel at one with their culture. And this gets at the
historical trauma that my colleague has been talking about.
They have activities that connect them to their family and
their communities, such as wild rice harvesting, such as
learning how to make maple syrup. All of these things keep them
coming back.
Chairman Rokita. Gentleman's time is expired. I thank the
gentleman.
Recognize myself for 5 minutes. And one of the problems
with going last is that all the questions have been asked and--
of course, not all, but a lot of ones that I had in mind.
But it also allows me to take it all in and listen more,
and one of the things I want to explore is why--and I will ask
Ms. Emrey-Arras first--is it possible, or why can't the BIA or
the BIE be operated more like a school district? I mean, it
is--it has geographical challenges, obviously, but what if it
was just organized and run like a decent or well-run school
district in the United States? Would we get better results?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. We think it should be run in a responsible
and efficient way, where you have people who are trained for
the positions that they are tasked with that know what to do
and have, you know, communications with their colleagues. I
mean, just some of the basics seem to be missing here.
Chairman Rokita. Is there any evidence that they have
actually looked at--whether it is the DOD, as Mr. Cladoosby
indicated--looked at the DOD to model, or just any other school
district? Is there any evidence that they are trying to do
anything like that in their restructuring plans or anything?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. I am not aware of that. Others may be more
familiar with that.
Chairman Rokita. Mr. Cladoosby?
Mr. Cladoosby. Yes. I think that would be something that we
could work together at looking at, you know, what is working at
the DOD schools versus the BIE schools and what is not working,
and why.
Chairman Rokita. But what if it was run like a school
district?
Mr. Cladoosby. Once again--like a state-run school district
where--
Chairman Rokita. In a rural district or--
Mr. Cladoosby. --where the tribe collects taxes and it is
paid for that way, or--
Chairman Rokita. No, just in terms of its organization,
where if the water heater was broken you can call somebody and
it gets done, you know, closer than a year--gets fixed.
Mr. Cladoosby. Yes. That is a great question. I mean--go
ahead, Mr. Roman Nose. I will let you jump in.
Chairman Rokita. Mr. Roman Nose?
Mr. Roman Nose. Certainly the changing of the directors,
you know, 32 or whatever it was--
Mr. Cladoosby. Thirty-three in 36 years.
Mr. Roman Nose. Thirty-three in 36 years--you know,
leadership, if you look at all the SEAs, their superintendent
or director of education department is there for many years.
Some of them are there to provide some leadership, plus they
have adequate staff--trained staff--to do that. And then when
you come down to the tribal education department, many, many of
them lack the resources to actually become a TEA that would be
fully functioning.
And then you look at the curriculum. You have got to
understand that TEAs--we don't just look at the education of
the Native student just inside the four rooms of the classroom.
We don't just look at the four test scores.
Someone was asking a question about, you know, comparing
the family structure to the success of the students. I think
the recent initiative of Obama where they are putting the
generation indigenous together, where they are going to get
silos of programs to work together to, you know, try to be more
productive in providing these services and letting them work
together, you know, how the success of that student.
You know, education of our students just doesn't happen
inside the classroom. It happens outside the classroom just as
well. So I think--
Chairman Rokita. Thank you. And I am one that doesn't
believe that the school building makes the school; it is what
happens inside it.
And we have Taj Mahals, in terms of school buildings around
the United States that I have seen, and they are poor schools.
On the other hand, as Ms. Burcum and we all identified here,
when the school building becomes a distraction to learning, as
clearly Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig and others are, you know, that is the
problem.
Ms. Burcum, did you--you mentioned briefly a contrast
between DOD and how this is run. Would you like to elaborate?
Or have you studied in your reporting--to my earlier question--
school districts in a regular suburban or rural setting, and
are there any lessons to be learned or any applications that
can be made?
Ms. Burcum. Well, to your school district question, I--it
is an interesting proposition. I would like to think about that
a little bit more.
But I would say that I think there are some opportunities
for more local innovation. For example, I will tell you,
Minnesota is very interested in the well-being of the students
in BIE schools. We provide additional funding, and there is an
effort being led in the state right now to look at public-
private partnerships to accelerate the building process for BIE
schools like the Bug-O-Nay-Ge-Shig school.
So I think that there are lots of opportunities for local
innovation; I just don't think that you have a BIE system
that--it doesn't encourage it, and I think that there are a lot
of people who feel like they are going to be punished, you
know, they are going to be put down lower on the priority
construction list if they try something new. And that is wrong.
Chairman Rokita. All right.
Ms. Emrey, can you react to that last point? Do you have
any evidence to show that--
Ms. Emrey-Arras. I think people are concerned about the
list. And in terms of the work that we have done regarding
that, we have serious concerns about the quality of the data on
that, so it just--there is a real struggle to know how the
agency is going to use that list going forward in terms of
prioritizing funding when there are serious data quality issues
with that list to begin with. So I think that is something to
pay attention to going forwards.
Chairman Rokita. Thank you.
I violated my own red light policy, which is why I needed
to say that earlier.
Mr. Takano, you are recognized for 5 minutes. I am not
last, as a matter of fact.
Mr. Takano. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the
opportunity.
In my district I have the Sherman Indian Institute, which
is a residential school, and I wonder if anyone on the panel
could speak to the governance of these residential schools. And
I find them--I find out that the regular meeting--the way the
governance works is the tribes that send--it is on a pro rata
basis. The tribes that send students to the schools are
involved in governance, but I am finding that the boards don't
always have full participation as far as the meetings.
Can you tell me about just the meeting requirements? And do
people have to come physically to these meetings? Can they do
them, you know, by teleconferencing?
Because I think part of the accountability problem is this
governance structure, and I have many students that come from a
different state that are, in my district in Riverside, many
from Arizona and neighboring states. And I find the way the--
for parents to kind of hold that school accountable is
difficult.
So can you explain a bit about the governance structure and
how we might improve that, and is that a--do you see that as a
problem, in terms of the effectiveness of these schools?
Ms. Emrey-Arras. I would defer to my colleagues on this
one.
Mr. Roman Nose. When you said Riverside is that--
Mr. Takano. Sherman Indian Institute.
Mr. Roman Nose. Sherman. They are in a category called off-
reservation boarding schools, and I am also chairman at the
Riverside Indian School, which is in Anadarko, Oklahoma.
Mr. Takano. Okay.
Mr. Roman Nose. So what you are speaking of, if any tribe--
federally recognized tribe of the United States--can send their
students to those particular schools. And they are kind of
unique because most of the other boarding schools are more the
local, regional, tribal level, whereas the ORB schools can get
students from all over the United States.
Mr. Takano. How many of these residential schools currently
exist in our nation? Do you know that?
Mr. Roman Nose. ORB schools I know there are four. I am not
sure how many there are in the BIE system that are residential
that are controlled by either the BIA or grant or contract
school. I don't have that--
Mr. Takano. Okay. But--
Mr. Cladoosby. There are 184 BIE schools, and 14 are
peripheral dormitories located on 63 reservations--
Mr. Takano. So there are about 14 of them across the--
Mr. Cladoosby. Fourteen, yes.
Mr. Takano. And the governance structure for these 14
schools, you know, is based on which tribes send their students
to these schools, is that correct?
Do you know just how these meetings are conducted, the
rules for them? How are parents able--how are parents and the
tribes able to hold these schools accountable for how effective
they are?
Mr. Cladoosby. Are you referring to the 14 dormitory--
Mr. Takano. Yes, the 14 dormitory schools, which I assume
Sherman Indian Institute is one of them.
Mr. Cladoosby. Right, right. Once again, it depends on the
location of the parent in regards--relationship to the school.
And, you know, we have had students go from Washington to
Oklahoma, and the parents probably did not have a very big say
on, you know, the local control, local issues. It just depends
on location.
Mr. Takano. Well, this is kind of more complicated because
it is not about local control, it is about a school that, say,
many of the Navajo nations send their young people to. It is
many miles away, and a school board that doesn't--I mean, it is
a strange governance system.
I am perplexed as to how to turn these schools into centers
of excellence. And part of the problem is I am trying to
understand the governance structure, how regular are the
meetings, how involved are the tribes in these meetings.
Mr. Cladoosby. Yes. That would have to be a follow up to
get back to you on that to give you a better understanding.
Mr. Takano. Yes. It would be helpful if we could get--I
would encourage the staff of this committee or some--somehow to
get a report on all this, because I see a lot of federal
resources being put into the facilities that are residential,
and I am not completely satisfied with the effectiveness.
Mr. Cladoosby. Right. With all due respect, I don't see a
lot of money going into facilities in the BIE schools, as we
have acknowledged here today.
Mr. Roman Nose. The students at those residential schools,
certainly for the ORB schools, they mainly come there primarily
because the economic condition of their family. Their families
can't support them, and so that is why they choose to go to one
of these ORB schools.
Mr. Takano. Well, I think it is incumbent upon us to make
sure that they are truly gateways to opportunity.
Mr. Chairman, I don't--my time is--I can't see a clock, but
I think I have asked my questions.
Chairman Rokita. Yes. There is a red light there.
Mr. Takano. Oh, there. I am--
Chairman Rokita. No, I missed it too, Mr. Takano. I thank
the gentleman. Gentleman's time is expired.
I will now recognize Ms. Fudge for her closing remarks.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
And thank you all for your testimony today.
Certainly I hope that the Committee on Natural Resources,
which has jurisdiction over the Department of Interior, will
take up this issue. All we can do at this point is just make
recommendations to the bureau, and I certainly do hope that we
will be doing that, Mr. Chairman.
As well, I just want to hopefully impress upon them, as we
have talked about today, the importance of a culturally
relevant curriculum as well as safe schools, and treating all
Americans the way that our children should be treated.
And I thank you very much.
Chairman Rokita. Thank the gentlelady.
On behalf of the members who participated today, and also
the members who couldn't make it, thank you, each one of you,
for your testimony today, but more importantly, your
leadership. You are truly needed to help us solve this issue,
and I hope you stick with us.
Small jurisdiction as it is over this issue or not, we
intend to be involved. We commit ourselves to trying to solve
this problem with fellow members of Congress.
And I think all this comes down to leadership--leadership
on your behalf, those that you represent; leadership on our
behalf; leadership from the President and the administration of
the executive branch. You know, that is also going to be key
here.
And so with that, seeing no more business before this
committee, let me once again thank the witnesses for coming
today.
This committee meeting is adjourned.
[Additional submission by Ms. Emrey-Arras follows:]
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[Additional submission by Ms. Fudge follows:]
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[Additional submission by Mr. Roman Nose follows:]
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[Whereupon, at 11:32 a.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
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