[Senate Hearing 113-251]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
S. Hrg. 113-251
NOMINATION OF JOHN H. THOMPSON
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HEARING
before the
COMMITTEE ON
HOMELAND SECURITY AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS
UNITED STATES SENATE
ONE HUNDRED THIRTEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
NOMINATION OF JOHN H. THOMPSON TO BE DIRECTOR OF THE CENSUS, U.S.
DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE
__________
JULY 9, 2013
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COMMITTEE ON HOMELAND SECURITY AND GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS
THOMAS R. CARPER, Delaware Chairman
CARL LEVIN, Michigan TOM COBURN, Oklahoma
MARK L. PRYOR, Arkansas JOHN McCAIN, Arizona
MARY L. LANDRIEU, Louisiana RON JOHNSON, Wisconsin
CLAIRE McCASKILL, Missouri ROB PORTMAN, Ohio
JON TESTER, Montana RAND PAUL, Kentucky
MARK BEGICH, Alaska MICHAEL B. ENZI, Wyoming
TAMMY BALDWIN, Wisconsin KELLY AYOTTE, New Hampshire
HEIDI HEITKAMP, North Dakota JEFF CHIESA, New Jersey
Richard J. Kessler, Staff Director
John P. Kilvington, Deputy Staff Director
Deirdre G. Armstrong, Professional Staff Member
Kristine V. Lam, Professional Staff Member
Keith B. Ashdown, Minority Staff Director
Christopher J. Barkley, Minority Deputy Staff Director
James P. Gelfand, Minority Counsel
Laura W. Kilbride, Chief Clerk
Lauren M. Corcoran, Hearing Clerk
C O N T E N T S
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Opening statements:
Page
Senator Carper............................................... 1
Senator Coburn............................................... 5
Senator Johnson.............................................. 13
Senator Ayotte............................................... 15
Prepared statements:
Senator Carper............................................... 23
WITNESSES
Tuesday, July 9, 2013
Hon. Richard J. Durbin, A United States Senator from the State of
Illinois
Testimony.................................................... 4
Prepared statement........................................... 26
John H. Thompson, Nominee to be Director of the Census, U.S.
Department of Commerce
Testimony.................................................... 6
Prepared statement........................................... 28
Biographical and financial information....................... 30
Responses to pre-hearing questions........................... 46
Letter from the Office of Government Ethics.................. 66
Responses to post-hearing questions for the Record........... 68
Letters of support from:
Asian Americans Advancing Justice............................ 71
American Sociological Association............................ 73
Council for Community and Economic Research.................. 74
Consortium of Social Science Associations.................... 76
Center for Regional Economic Competitiveness................. 78
American Statistical Association............................. 80
Demos........................................................ 81
Marketing Research Association............................... 83
National Association for the Advancement of Colored People... 84
National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed
Officials Educational Fund................................. 86
O'Hare Data and Demographic Services, LLC.................... 88
Population Association of America and Association of
Population Centers......................................... 90
Prison Policy Initiative..................................... 91
NOMINATION OF JOHN H. THOMPSON
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TUESDAY, JULY 9, 2013
U.S. Senate,
Committee on Homeland Security
and Governmental Affairs,
Washington, DC.
The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:35 a.m., in
room SD-342, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. Thomas R.
Carper, Chairman of the Committee, presiding.
Present: Senators Carper, Coburn, Johnson, and Ayotte.
OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRMAN CARPER
Chairman Carper. The Committee will come to order. Welcome,
Mr. Thompson, and to the handsome young men that are with you,
and everybody else, all of our guests, we welcome you this
morning.
I ran into Dick Durbin. I was with him briefly at a meeting
earlier today, and I think he has been detained. He was going
to come to introduce you, and as soon as he joins us. I will
yield to him and ask him to do just that.
Today Dr. Coburn, Senator Johnson, and I--and we will
probably be joined by others on our Committee--we are pleased
to consider the nomination, the President's nomination of John
H. Thompson to be Director of the U.S. Census Bureau. I think
we all realize that the role of the Census is to serve as the
leading source of quality data about the Nation's people and
our economy. The Bureau does this by conducting, as we know,
numerous surveys. Sometimes we think it is just every 10 years,
but it is actually every year, and those surveys in turn
provide lawmakers like us, citizens, and businesses with a view
of our Nation's social and demographic makeup.
The most important and visible survey conducted by the
Census is, of course, the one we do every 10 years. This once-
a-decade undertaking is really one of the few functions for the
Federal Government that is actually explicitly spelled out
under our Constitution. Its execution is often described as the
largest peacetime mobilization in American history.
However, the Census Bureau also conducts other important
surveys such as the American Community Survey (ACS) which
provides Federal, State, and local governments as well as the
private sector with up-to-date information about the population
within a certain geographic area. The collection of these data
is important so that decisions such as how to distribute grant
funding and where to build schools, where to build hospitals,
and retail stores are not made with data that is nearly a
decade old.
Additionally, the Census Bureau collects the data that
provides us with our monthly unemployment numbers. The Census
Bureau's role in this area and in the Federal Government's
efforts to effectively target initiatives aimed at growing our
economy should not be overlooked.
The Census Bureau has now been without a Senate-confirmed
Director for nearly a year when then-Director Bob Groves
departed last August to become the Provost of Georgetown
University. A real loss to our Nation, a real gain for
Georgetown University. I am, therefore, pleased, though, that
the President has nominated what I believe to be a qualified
candidate to lead the Census Bureau at least for the next
several years and maybe even beyond that. I intend to work with
Dr. Coburn and with my colleagues on this Committee to complete
our review and to hopefully report this nomination for action
by the full Senate as quickly as we can.
The nomination of John Thompson comes at a unique time
during the decennial cycle. While most people only pay
attention to the Census Bureau in the year or two leading up to
the decennial census, it is these interim years in the middle
of the decade when some of the critical research, some of the
critical testing, and planning phases are completed and the
groundwork is laid for the actual count.
Last decade, there were many problems, as we will recall,
leading up to the 2010 decennial census. The roots of these
problems were multifold, but they included poor planning and
cost estimation. And I would add to that the inability to use
technology in ways that were cost-effective. Most notably, the
Census Bureau awarded a $595 million contract for the
development of half a million handheld computers. These devices
promised to reduce the time and cost of large operations such
as address canvassing and non-response followup.
However, the project experienced constant setbacks,
including technical problems, escalating costs, and missed
deadlines. Eventually, the decision was made in April 2008 to
abandon the use of the handheld computers for much of the 2010
decennial census and revert back largely to pencil and paper
for the costly non-response followup operation. This decision
ended up adding some $2 billion to the cost of the 2010 census,
which in total cost taxpayers nearly $13 billion, the costliest
counting or enumeration in our Nation's history and twice the
cost of the 2000 decennial census.
I do not want to rehash the details of the handheld
contract or other problems in the years and months prior to the
2010 decennial census, but I do want to call on the lessons
learned during that experience as this Committee conducts
oversight of the Census Bureau as we head into the 2020
decennial census.
As I will mention in greater detail during the question-
and-answer session, for each decennial census the Census Bureau
has invested exponentially more resources to ensure quality
results. The cost of conducting the census has, on average,
doubled decennially since 1970. If that growth continues, the
estimate for the 2020 census will not be $13 billion. It will
be closer to $25 billion. Money we do not have. At a time when
agencies across the Federal Government have been asked to do
more with less, a $25 billion decennial census is just not
acceptable. If you are confirmed, Mr. Thompson, this Committee
will look to you to develop and implement initiatives to
control costs while maintaining the quality and accuracy of the
count.
Another issue leading to the 2010 decennial census that I
want to address is the 7-month leadership vacuum the Bureau
struggled with in 2009. Less than 1 year before Census Day and
facing a number of challenges, the Census Bureau was without a
Senate-confirmed Director. While the nomination and
confirmation process was part of the reason for this lengthy
vacancy, the main issue was the 2008 election and the
transition from the Bush Administration to the Obama
Administration, which created the vacancy at the beginning of
2009. An election in a year ending in the number 8 can lead to
a months-long vacancy at a critical time for the Census Bureau.
To address that problem, a number of us introduced
legislation to create 5-year terms for the Census Director. The
first term started January 2012, and future terms would begin
in January of years ending in the number 7 and the number 2 so
that a Director would be in place for the beginning of either
the planning phase of a decennial census or the operating
phase. This provision was adopted in legislation moving through
Congress in 2012 and was signed into law that year.
Mr. Thompson, if you are confirmed, you will be the first
person to be confirmed who was nominated under this new law,
and you would fill out the term that ends not in 5 years from
the date of your swearing-in but ending December 31, 2016. You
would be eligible, if confirmed, to be nominated for an
additional two full terms. We will cross that bridge when we
come to it.
Additionally, the provision that was signed into law also
sets forth several qualifications for future Census Director
nominees. The law now requires that nominees to be Census
Director have a demonstrated ability in managing large
organizations and experience in the collection, analysis, and
the use of statistical data. I am pleased that the President
has nominated someone who I believe meets these requirements.
If confirmed, Mr. Thompson returns to the Census Bureau
where he spent some 27 years holding various positions,
including Associate Director for the decennial census and Chief
of the Decennial Management Division. In the year 2000, he was
the senior career employee responsible for all aspects of that
year's decennial census. In 2002, he left the Census Bureau and
moved to Chicago to become the executive vice president of the
National Opinion Research Center (NORC) at the University of
Chicago. He performed the duties of that job so well that, in
2008, he was elevated to become president of that organization.
I am pleased that he has agreed to leave Chicago and return
to Washington, DC, to lead the Census Bureau into the next
decennial census, if he is confirmed. We look forward to your
testimony today, Mr. Thompson, and we also look forward to an
introduction of you by our friend and colleague Senator Durbin.
Senator Durbin, welcome.
TESTIMONY OF HON. RICHARD J. DURBIN,\1\ A UNITED STATES SENATOR
FROM THE STATE OF ILLINOIS
Senator Durbin. Thanks, Senator Carper, Senator Coburn, and
Mr. Thompson. I was downstairs in the Senate Judiciary
Committee meeting, and coming back and forth. I apologize for
coming a few minutes late, but I wanted to be here today to
introduce John Thompson formally as the senior Senator from the
State he calls home. He has for nearly four decades had
experience in research and statistics, and he is a strong
candidate for the position of Director of the Census Bureau.
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\1\ The prepared statement of Mr. Durbin appears in the Appendix on
page 26.
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He serves as president of the National Opinion Research
Center, headquartered in Chicago, which conducts social science
research in the public interest. In addition to ensuring the
quality of the research, Mr. Thompson also oversees a
nationwide staff and has helped make NORC's activities more
productive and cost-effective, Senator Coburn. While at NORC,
he directed the National Immunization Survey from 2004 to 2006.
It was the largest telephone survey of its kind in our Nation.
Before starting at NORC 11 years ago, Mr. Thompson worked
at the Census Bureau for 27 years, starting as a mathematical
statistician in 1975 and going on to become the senior officer
responsible for conducting and producing the 2000 census.
Aside from his posts at NORC and the Census Bureau, he is
also a leader in the social science research community, an
elected Fellow of the American Statistical Association (ASA),
an elected member of the Committee on National Statistics, and
serves on the National Academy of Sciences panel addressing
census concerns.
Mr. Thompson's decades of research and statistical
experience will serve him well if he is chosen to lead this new
agency whose primary mission is to produce reliable data about
our Americans and our economy.
I cannot imagine a more qualified nominee. He has shown he
can be an effective person when it comes to producing quality
data and managing a large organization. He will be able to use
his experience to move the census more fully into the digital
world and make it even more reliable, accurate, and accessible.
I would also like to note on a personal basis that, while
living and working in Chicago, Mr. Thompson had the chance to
cheer on his favorite national hockey team--the Chicago
Blackhawks. And now that the team has secured the Stanley Cup,
he is willing to leave Chicago and consider moving to
Washington. But we hope that the Cup will follow him here,
which it has in the past, and I had it in my office 4 years ago
when the Blackhawks were last Stanley Cup champs. He is
certainly welcome, as you all are, to come visit and see this
beautiful trophy.
On a more serious note, in talking with Mr. Thompson, I am
impressed with his enthusiasm for taking on the
responsibilities of Director. His warm personality will make
him a great addition to this agency. He has some ideas about
evaluating research methods, which I am sure you will get into
during the course of this hearing. It is my pleasure to
formally introduce him and to say that I fully support this
nomination. And I hope I can be excused to go back to the
Senate Judiciary Committee downstairs and do a little work
there as well.
Chairman Carper. All right. We are going to vote on whether
or not we should excuse him. [Laughter.]
Thanks so much for coming, for introducing your
constituent, and for offering a little bit of humor. And when
Senator Durbin leaves, we will talk about those Chicago Cubs
and figure out why he did not do a better job getting them to
the World Series. [Laughter.]
All right. Dr. Coburn.
OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR COBURN
Senator Coburn. Well, thank you, Senator Durbin, for that
endorsement. And, John, welcome. I enjoyed our visits in my
office, and as you know, this is an area that I have taken a
keen interest in over the last 9 years.
The last census cost almost $50 per person to count. It is
ridiculous. And I think Senator Carper raised the issues that
the census has to be accurate, but it also has to be
affordable, given the financial place that we are in.
We visited a large number of things, and Senator Carper
mentioned the contracting for the handheld device, and you and
I had discussions on that in my office. I think Dr. Groves has
done a good job in redirecting the organization, and I have
every confidence that you will continue to improve on that.
I look forward to asking you some specific questions this
morning, but I am supportive of your nomination, and I have
expressed to you personally my desires and goals to see your
organization be very successful and very efficient.
So, with that, I will yield back.
Chairman Carper. Thanks, Dr. Coburn.
John Thompson, nominated to be Director of the Census
Bureau, has filed responses to a biographical and a financial
questionnaire. He has answered pre-hearing questions submitted
by our Committee, had his financial statements reviewed by the
Office of Government Ethics. Without objection, this
information will be made part of the hearing record with the
exception of the financial data, which are on file and
available for public inspection at our Committee's offices.
Our Committee rules require, Mr. Thompson, as you may know,
that all witnesses at nomination hearings give their testimony
under oath, and I am going to ask you, if you will, stand and
raise your right hand. Do you swear that the testimony you are
about to give to this Committee will be the truth, the whole
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you, God?
Mr. Thompson. I do, Senator.
Chairman Carper. All right. Please be seated.
We are going to go ahead and ask you to share with us your
statement, and then I have a couple of traditional questions
that we always ask that are required by law, and then we will
ask more general questions. All right. Thanks. Welcome. We are
glad you are here, and feel free to introduce those two guys
that are sitting over your left shoulder and anybody else in
the audience, any family or friends that you feel moved to
introduce.
Mr. Thompson. Well, thank you, Senator. Let me start by
introducing my son Lowell.
Chairman Carper. How old is Lowell?
Mr. Thompson. Lowell was born in 1980.
Chairman Carper. 1980. That is good.
Mr. Thompson. John Thompson, my other son, who is 25 years
old. Missy Koppelman, who works with me at the NORC, and I do
not know how old she is. [Laughter.]
Chairman Carper. She is young.
Mr. Thompson. And Dan Gaylin, who also works with me at
NORC.
Chairman Carper. When people ask me the age of my two sons,
I say, ``I do not remember their ages, but I know their
names.'' [Laughter.]
I do actually know their ages, too. They are 23 and 24. All
right. Welcome, and we are glad that your two boys could be
with you. They are proud of you. Please proceed.
TESTIMONY OF JOHN H. THOMPSON,\1\ NOMINEE TO BE DIRECTOR OF THE
CENSUS, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE
Mr. Thompson. Thank you, Senator. Chairman Carper, Ranking
Member Coburn, and Members of the Committee, I am pleased that
you have convened this hearing to consider my nomination to the
position of Director of the U.S. Census Bureau. I would like to
begin by thanking President Obama for nominating me to one of
the most important positions in the Federal statistical system.
It is both an honor and a privilege to be given the opportunity
to return to public service. I would also like to thank my
wife, Bonnie, my family, and my colleagues at the National
Opinion Research Center for their support and encouragement.
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\1\ The prepared statement of Mr. Thompson appears in the Appendix
on page 28.
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Let me start by saying that I agree with the views of a
number of previous Census Bureau Directors that a democracy
needs credible, objective, and timely information on the growth
of its population, the changing characteristics of its
communities, and the health of its businesses to form the basis
for solid policy decisions and other critical functions of
governance. The statistical agencies produce such information
in the United States. They are guided by principles of
nonpartisanship, protection of individual privacy, and
provision of high-quality information to inform decisionmakers
and the public on the important issues facing our society and
Nation.
The Census Bureau is an important component of this
information infrastructure. The statistics it collects are used
to produce economic indicators, to determine the needs of local
communities, and to inform policies to make American businesses
more competitive.
We are seeing a growing need for such data to support our
economic growth and create jobs, and it is playing an
increasingly significant role in all aspects of our daily
lives. Going forward, our country will rely more heavily on
institutions like the Census Bureau to deliver this vital
resource. The next leader of the Census Bureau, therefore, must
be committed to maintaining the Bureau's stature as the
exemplary collector and disseminator of the highest quality
information to help America forge its data-driven future.
However, there are a number of rapidly emerging challenges
and opportunities that have the potential to dramatically
change the way in which information is collected, analyzed, and
disseminated. Organizations that will be successful in the
future must seize on these opportunities to produce quality
information on a more timely and efficient basis. I am seeking
your support for my nomination because I believe that I can
provide the leadership and guidance that the Census Bureau
needs at this critical time. If confirmed, I can assure you
that I will use all of my skills and intellect to take the
Bureau into the future, building on the exceptional groundwork
that Dr. Robert Groves has already put in place.
A little bit about me: I spent 27 years at the Census
Bureau, followed by over 10 years at the National Opinion
Research Center. At the Census Bureau, I held a number of
management positions with increasing responsibility for the
1980, 1990, and 2000 censuses, the most significant being from
1997 through June 2001 when I served as the Associate Director
for Decennial Censuses--the career executive with
responsibility for all aspects of census 2000. I am proud to
note that census 2000 was the first to employ state-of-the-art
technology in optical scanning and intelligent character
recognition to capture all of the information from the
questionnaires, and all major operations were completed on
schedule and within budget.
I joined National Opinion Research Center in 2002 as
executive vice president and became its president in 2008. NORC
is a not-for-profit, independent organization affiliated with
the University of Chicago that has been conducting important
research in the public interest for over 70 years. NORC uses
rigorous and innovative methods to conduct large surveys as
well as to analyze and disseminate objective information. It
informs decisionmakers and the public on important social,
economic, and behavioral issues facing the Nation and the
international community.
During my tenure, I have seen and dealt with the dramatic
changes that emerging technology can have on survey processes.
Importantly, I have dealt with the growing demands to produce
more information faster and less expensively through adoption
of new technology and data sources. These are challenges that
leaders of both private and Federal statistical organizations,
including the Census Bureau, must be prepared to successfully
confront.
The Census Bureau, however, has a unique challenge and--at
the same time--opportunity with respect to planning the 2020
census. I believe that the resources now available will support
a new census design that will fundamentally change the way in
which censuses are taken in the United States--a design that
has the potential to produce significantly less costly and
faster results that are of similar or better quality than in
previous censuses. Among the most promising options to
accomplish this are:
First, using the Internet as the primary self-response
option;
Second, taking advantage of technology and operations
research methods to re-engineer the field data collection
operations--reducing both the infrastructure required to
support these operations and the actual hours that enumerators
spend collecting the data;
Third, making better use of Federal records to further
reduce the dependence on in-person visits for data collection;
And, fourth, drawing on the extensive array of emerging
geographic tools and data sets to eliminate the need to
physically canvass large portions of the United States to
prepare the address list to support the 2020 census.
In summary, the environment in which statistical agencies
conduct their business is in a period of dynamic change with
both risks and opportunities. I know what it means to manage in
such an environment. Organizations that will be successful must
constantly track emerging trends and advances and determine how
they can be used to generate new and more effective processes.
Most importantly, organizations must create and foster a
culture of adaptability and creativity.
I want to bring the skills I have developed both inside and
outside of government to lead the Census Bureau. If I am
confirmed, my goal will be to leave a legacy of innovation in
all areas and at all levels of the Census Bureau and to design
a 2020 census that represents a fundamental change for the
future. I am committed to accomplishing this in an environment
that is open and transparent to all stakeholders.
Thank you and I am looking forward to working with this
Committee.
Chairman Carper. Thanks very much for that testimony. Let
me just start off with a couple of simple, straightforward
questions. One, why do we need a census? The Constitution says
we must have a census every 10 years. Why do we need it? Why do
we need to do interim censuses and gather information in the
meantime? Why is it important?
Mr. Thompson. The census is important for a number of
reasons----
Chairman Carper. Before you do that, let me ask these
perfunctory questions. All right? The three that I mentioned.
No. 1, is there anything you are aware of in your
background that might present a conflict of interest with the
duties of the office to which you have been nominated?
Mr. Thompson. No.
Chairman Carper. No. 2, do you know of anything, personal
or otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from fully and
honorably discharging the responsibilities of the office to
which you have been nominated?
Mr. Thompson. No.
Chairman Carper. And, No. 3, do you agree without
reservation to respond to any reasonable summons to appear and
testify before any duly constituted Committee of Congress if
you are confirmed?
Mr. Thompson. I certainly do.
Chairman Carper. OK. Good. Thank you. All right. Back to my
question. Why do we need a census? Why do we need a good one?
Why do we need one that is cost-effective? Why is it important
for our country?
Mr. Thompson. Well, the census has a number of important
purposes, the first being the reapportionment of the House of
Representatives every 10 years.
Chairman Carper. That is not so important to us in
Delaware. [Laughter.]
Maybe someday.
Mr. Thompson. Second, it provides data that is used to
redraw the congressional boundaries every 10 years. And, third,
it provides a variety of data that are used to administer
important Federal programs and are used by businesses, city
planners, academics, people interested in the status of our
country.
Chairman Carper. How do businesses use this information?
Why is it important?
Mr. Thompson. It is important because they use it to make
decisions that will help them grow, help them make right
decisions, like where to put a new franchise, where certain
individuals are that will buy their products based on ages,
demographics, and income.
Chairman Carper. All right. Well, I think a lot in terms of
roles of government; I think we all do. One of the roles of
government is to provide a nurturing environment for job
creation and job preservation, and I explain that part of what
the census does is it provides information to businesses so
they can make smart business decisions in terms of location of
the kinds of businesses and their future plan, their future
strategy, and implement the strategies for those businesses.
Bob Groves, I think generally very much admired for the
work that he did, I think he came in at a tough time and
provided good leadership for the Census Bureau, and he has gone
on to Georgetown to be their provost, and they are lucky to
have him. Why was he effective? Why do you think he was an
effective leader? What were the qualities that made him an
effective leader?
Mr. Thompson. Well, I think there are a number of
qualities.
Chairman Carper. I think you know him.
Mr. Thompson. I know Bob Groves.
Chairman Carper. Pretty well.
Mr. Thompson. I believe I recommended to this Committee
that he be considered to be the Director of the Census Bureau.
He is a long-time colleague. He is one of the best survey
methodologists in the world, so he brought that knowledge to
the Census Bureau. He brought some management skills to the
census. I know that the 2010 census needed a lot of leadership,
and under his leadership they ended up with ultimately a census
that produced what appeared to be very accurate counts. But he
also started at the Census Bureau to foster a culture of
innovation and drawing creativity from all areas of the Bureau,
and I think those are the three fundamental things that he
brought.
Chairman Carper. What do you bring? Do not be immodest.
Frankly, I appreciate humility, I admire humility, I admire
modesty, but this is not the time. What do you bring? What did
the President see in you?
Mr. Thompson. Well, Senator, I understand a lot about
statistical methodologies, not at the level of Robert Groves,
but I do not think there is anybody else in the world that
probably does. I have experience in managing large operations.
I have experience in motivating people to do very good work.
And I believe I have the kind of experience that will allow me
to form relationships with the many stakeholders of the Census
Bureau and to put in place the groundwork for a new census
process.
Chairman Carper. I think I mentioned to you I was out in
Silicon Valley about 2 years ago at a technology summit, a
summit on innovation and technology, and I think it might have
actually been hosted on the campus of Google, as I recall. And
during one of the panel presentations, there were four or five
of these companies, very successful technology companies, that
talked about how they use social media to solve any wide range
of challenges and gave just very interesting presentations on
how they were able to solve problems and address issues in ways
that a couple years ago we never would have imagined that could
be done.
How do we capture that kind of innovation and that
understanding of how to use the technical skills that we have,
many of them just on our handheld devices today? How do we
within the Census Bureau capture that input from the private
sector and use their ideas, harness their ideas to be able to
drive us to a better count, a more accurate count, and in a
more effective way? How do we actually do that? Because I think
there are folks out there that would like to be part of this
process, and maybe not even with a profit motive in mind, just
because it would be interesting, challenging, and important.
Mr. Thompson. Yes. Well, Senator, I feel very strongly that
the Census Bureau needs to form partnerships with the private
sector to bring in new skills and new ideas, and if I am
confirmed, I will certainly work toward setting up the
appropriate vehicles, avenues for that to take place.
Chairman Carper. Talk to us about the survey that we do, I
guess every year, the American Community Survey. I think when
folks were critical of the Census Bureau, including some
Members of Congress, they talked about the American Community
Survey and they indicated among other things some of the
questions are inappropriate, they are deemed to be invasive of
people's privacy. Why does the census need to know some of the
answers to some of these questions? And Dr. Coburn, Senator
Johnson, and I over here, we are big on common sense, and we
learned that from our parents, and you probably did, too.
I think you make a good case and others make a good case
for the value of the survey--not just the decennial census--to,
among others, our business community and State and local
governments, but there is also great value in this American
Community Survey. But I am not so sure that some of the
questions are entirely appropriate or are needed. And I just
want you to think out loud about that for us here today and
what changes, if any, might be appropriate as we try to address
the criticisms of this particular survey. Some would say let us
just get rid of it. I do not know that this is a smart thing to
do. But if it is not perfect, make it better. How do we make it
better?
Mr. Thompson. Well, Senator, let me start by saying that I
think the American Community Survey is very important. It
replaced the decennial long form, so it provides the
information that used to come from the decennial long form
every 10 years now on an annual basis and now in small areas
just like the decennial long form.
I am also aware at a very high level of a number of issues
associated with the American Community Survey. If confirmed, I
am looking forward to digging into those issues with the many
stakeholders of the American Community Survey. I would not want
to design a new survey without getting the right kind of input
in place.
Chairman Carper. OK. Well, we will probably have a chance
to talk about this some more.
Mr. Thompson. I look forward to it.
Chairman Carper. Dr. Coburn, please.
Senator Coburn. Well, thanks again for your statement. The
American Community Survey is kind of tied up in this lack of
confidence in government today, which is difficult for you
because it makes your job more difficult.
What in your mind is in the American Community Survey that
is also captured by private and other organizations out there
in a sampling method?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, I am not aware of any private
organization that provides the level of detail comprehensively
for the country that the American Community Survey does. But I
understand also that there are undoubtedly opportunities to
draw on resources to make the American Community Survey more
effective. And, again, if I am confirmed, I would really look
to finding ways to make it more efficient, make it less
burdensome on the American public while still providing the
same level of information.
Senator Coburn. You talked in your opening statement about
being able to provide a census more efficiently, more
effectively, same quality of data or better, and do it for a
better price, and most of that is going to be technology
related.
Does the Committee have your commitment that this is one of
the things that you will strive for every day as you lead this
organization?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, that is one of the primary reasons
that I am excited about going back to the Census Bureau, is to
lead the effort to design a fundamentally new way to take the
2020 census. So you have my commitment on that.
Senator Coburn. You and I in private conversations talked
about getting the census online as a part of that and incenting
people to comply. Have you given any thought on your future
plans for the 2020 census and how we will try to move toward
using this new technology to where, in fact, we can do it more
effectively, more efficiently, and incentivize people to comply
so that we do not have the after-census review costs that are
so expensive and oftentimes so difficult to ascertain?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, I really think that motivating self-
response by the Internet is an incredibly important goal for
the 2020 census. It will reduce the need to print hundreds of
millions of questionnaires, to process those questionnaires, to
have the storage space for them, to mail them, so that is very
important.
But I also want to note that I also understand that there
are parts of the American population that will not have access
to the Internet, even by 2020, and will need to have some other
way that they can respond.
Senator Coburn. Sure, but that is part of your
comprehensive plan. But the fact is that will not lessen your
desire or intensity to utilize that technology.
Mr. Thompson. No.
Senator Coburn. Just being aware that there are areas where
we are not going to get feedback utilizing that.
Senator Carper and I held a lot of hearings on the 2010
census before it came about, and one of the problems was
contracting at the Census Bureau, and what I am looking for is
a commitment on cost-plus contracts, that, first of all, we are
not going to utilize them unless they are an absolute
necessity, and then we are going to make sure we get value out
of cost-plus contracts.
What are your thoughts on that? And what will be your
policies that you set up to guide those thoughts?
Mr. Thompson. Well, Senator, I agree with you that fixed-
price contracts, if you can provide the level of specification,
are the best value for the government. But even if you do cost-
plus contracts, the real key is you have to have in place some
detailed specifications; you have to have in place performance
metrics, a delivery schedule for getting the results; and you
have to have in place good management procedures that include
formal change control processes. And if I am confirmed, I
really want to work toward defining the level of specifications
that will maximize the use of fixed-price contracts.
Senator Coburn. One of my biggest frustrations here is when
we have contracts and they do not perform, the Justice
Department does not seek out or redress for the Federal
Government based on lack of performance. Would you commit that
if you have contractors that are contracting for you either
under fixed-price or otherwise, you will give a referral to the
Justice Department to make the Federal Government whole and the
money that it spent in that regard?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, you have my commitment that I will
use every legal option at my disposal to direct toward
contractors that do not perform.
Senator Coburn. All right. Thank you.
My office has heard from a lot of private entities, as have
other Members of this Committee, that they can perform some of
the mapping work that the census currently undertakes on its
own for a tiny fraction of the price that the census spends.
Are you committed to making sure that the census takes
advantage of this new private industry rather than tasking the
government to re-create the wheel when it is already available
out there commercially?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, you have my commitment to that as
well. I think that there are a number of sources of emerging
geographic information that can improve the processes that the
census have in place in that area.
Senator Coburn. One of the other concerns I have with the
census, but really it applies to the whole government, we
spend, outside of intelligence, $85 billion a year on
information technology (IT) contracts, of which about half are
failures. I think it is really important that you are on top of
any area where we have an IT--and I think you have already
referenced the weakness and the problem, because setting
performance standards and holding compliance to those
performance standards before you ever purchase something is the
key to that. That is where we fail across the Federal
Government. I mean, we are throwing $40 billion a year away in
this government on IT contracts. And my hope is that you will
foster a culture of adapting the agency to products that have
been tested and work rather than take products off the shelf
and try to change them because the census does not want to meet
the IT program.
The problem is we have great IT programs out there. The
government takes them in and then tries to change the program
to fit the government rather than the government try to fit the
program. My hope would be that your leadership would be
exerted, that if we are going to buy something off the shelf,
we actually take advantage of the technology from that proven
off-the-shelf product rather than try to change it to meet--
because it is easier than changing some programs or parameters
within the census.
The other area is I would like to discuss your thoughts on
counting prisoners and military personnel in terms of the
census.
Mr. Thompson. So that is a very good question, Senator. My
thoughts on that are that before each census, the Census Bureau
works with stakeholders to define the rules they use, to
determine where to count people where they usually live as of
the census day, and then after each census, because our
population and society is so dynamic, they review those rules
for the next census. And my thoughts really on that are that I
am going to--if I am confirmed, I am looking forward to
reviewing those rules with the stakeholders in planning for the
2020 census so that there is agreement that we have the right
rules in place.
Senator Coburn. All right. Thank you very much.
Chairman Carper. Thank you, Dr. Coburn. Senator Johnson.
OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR JOHNSON
Senator Johnson. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Thompson,
welcome. Thank you for your testimony.
Let us go back to that American Community Survey. It is my
understanding the fines, if you do not respond to that, range
somewhere between $100,000 and $500,000. Is that your
understanding as well?
Mr. Thompson. I understand there are fines, Senator. I am
not aware of the specific level of the fines right now. But let
me just say that I do not think fining people is the way to
encourage response. The Census Bureau is a data collection
agency, not an enforcement agency. And I really think that
explaining to people why it is important, why their data is
important, what it will be used for, is the best way to
encourage response.
Senator Johnson. Do you have any idea how often those fines
are assessed? Really is it the Census Bureau that has the
discretion in terms of how big that fine would be?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, I do not have any current
understanding on how the fines are assessed. I know that the
Census Bureau does not determine those fines. They are
determined by statute, and they are administered by the Justice
Department.
Senator Johnson. OK. Do you think that is appropriate? I
mean, as head of the agency, would you try and minimize those
fines?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, that is a very complicated issue,
and I really do not have the insight or understanding to really
make an effective decision there.
Senator Johnson. OK.
Mr. Thompson. But if I am confirmed, I can assure you
that----
Senator Johnson. We should talk.
Mr. Thompson. We will talk.
Senator Johnson. The information I have in terms of the
cost per household is $39 in 1990, $70 per household in 2000,
and $96 per household in 2010. There is obviously some
inflationary gains or cost increases. Do you know the reason
for the cost increases outside of inflation?
Mr. Thompson. I do know something about the cost increases
from the 1900 to the 2000 census, and in 2000, there was a
situation where the census had been planning to use sampling to
make the counts less expensive and use statistical adjustment
to make the counts more accurate. That was a fairly
controversial position. And late in the game, there was a
decision by the Supreme Court that sampling would not be used
for the purposes of apportionment, which then meant that the
census in 2000 had to be redesigned starting in January 1999,
which added considerably to the cost.
Senator Johnson. Moving forward, have you established some
kind of goal, I mean with the advances in information
technology, do you have a goal in terms of productivity gains,
actually reducing the cost per household?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, I believe that if we can get the
right level of resources and justify the need for those
resources, of course, to do the research necessary, that we can
put in place a census that should be no more expensive,
adjusted for inflation, than the 2010 census.
Senator Johnson. OK. Well, hopefully we can actually reduce
that cost.
You mentioned sampling. Statistics was not exactly my best
course in college. What percentage of the population is
actually canvassed, I mean physically accounted for?
Mr. Thompson. With the decennial census?
Senator Johnson. Right.
Mr. Thompson. The goal is to count 100 percent. There are
some processes in place where some statistical imputation is
used for households where they just cannot get, in spite of all
their efforts, a response from an individual. But the goal is
to count everyone.
Senator Johnson. So you said there is quite a bit of
controversy in terms of a plan for sampling using statistics.
So we do not do that in any way, shape, or form now? We do not
augment the canvassing with any kind of sampling or statistics?
Mr. Thompson. Let me just draw a little line here. There
are a lot of uses for sampling to do quality control, things
like that that make it more effective.
Senator Johnson. OK.
Mr. Thompson. But there is not a use of sampling to produce
the counts for apportionment, and I believe that there are far
better ways than using statistical adjustment to improve the
other counts that----
Senator Johnson. So how do we fill in the counts then? I
mean, is there no adjustment to the actual canvassing? In other
words, the people we count, that is the number? Or do we
augment that going, well, we really think we only got about 95
percent so we are going to bump it up by 5 percent?
Mr. Thompson. No. That would be a statistical adjustment.
They do not do that. There is a process for a small number of
households--at least this was the case in the 2000 census--
where despite the best efforts to knock on a door, you could
not get a response, and for a very small percentage of cases, a
determination had to be made regarding was the household
occupied or not, and if it was occupied, how many people would
have been there. If you just said no, you would be assuming
that it was all zero, and that was not right either. But this
was a very small portion of the count that was----
Senator Johnson. OK. But it is specific to households, it
is a very detailed augmentation.
Mr. Thompson. Right.
Senator Johnson. OK. Now that I am a Senator, I actually
use the Census Web site more than I did as a private citizen. I
just want to get your evaluation and opinion of the current
Census Bureau Web site, and its ease of use.
Mr. Thompson. I actually do not have that much trouble
using it, but I am sort of like an insider. The Web site is
much better than the Web site when I was there, so I find it
easy to use. But I think the real determination of a Web site
effectiveness is to work with the various outside users and get
their opinion on how easy it is to use and then build in
improvements.
Senator Johnson. Picking up a little bit on Senator
Coburn's questions, you are coming from the private sector now.
Are there other private sector models that you will bring, and
experience, to the Census Bureau to improve it, whether it is
the Web site or just your whole data collection, and your
productivity?
Mr. Thompson. Well, the experiences I have had at NORC have
dealt with using systems to automate telephony, to use the
Internet as a response option, to use mobile computing, to use
social media. I intend to bring those findings into the Census
Bureau.
Senator Johnson. OK. Well, again, thank you for your
responses.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Carper. Thank you, Senator Johnson.
Senator Ayotte, welcome. Good morning.
OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR AYOTTE
Senator Ayotte. Good morning. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I want to thank you, Dr. Thompson, and let me just say your
qualifications are impeccable, and I am very pleased that you
want to take on this important position, and we look forward--I
look forward to working with you.
I just wanted to start with whether you had another
particular to review the 2012 U.S. Government Accountability
Office (GAO) report, which really focused on concerns about the
cost of the census. Have you had a chance to review that
report?
Mr. Thompson. I have reviewed the report, but at a very
high level.
Senator Ayotte. OK, because I think one of the things the
report identified in it was that the costs of the decennial
census rose from $8 billion in 2000 to $13 billion in 2010,
which would be a 56-percent increase. And I know that you
talked about a Supreme Court case that would have changed
sampling methodology. But according to the GAO, one of the
concerns they raised in that report was that the Census Bureau
could not identify specific sources of cost growth from 2000 to
2010. And so within the report, the GAO found that the Bureau
had not developed mitigation or contingency plans for looking
forward to 2020, which I know Dr. Coburn already asked you
about. So I think that is one of the key issues for you,
thinking about the prior cost growth, thinking about obviously
the fiscal challenges facing the Nation, of not doubling the
cost growth looking forward to the 2020 census and having a
strong plan.
What initial thoughts do you have on that for us here today
to make sure that we are responsibly using taxpayer dollars?
Mr. Thompson. Well, let me first say that I do have the
greatest respect for the GAO and for the inspector general
(IG). They actually helped me a lot when I was there in 2000.
And if I am confirmed, I do want to sit down with them, really
understand their concerns in detail, and work for them.
Senator Ayotte. Good.
Mr. Thompson. But I think it is important that you have a
well-laid-out planning process with metrics, with milestones,
and you have a good cost model so you can control costs, track
costs, understand where you are. I think that is very
important, and that is one of the things that I would plan to
have in place.
Senator Ayotte. And, Dr. Thompson, to the extent you can,
would you be coming back to the Committee also to share some
thoughts on as you came up with the metrics and modeling
looking forward to 2020?
Mr. Thompson. Oh, I would welcome any opportunity to come
work with the Committee.
Senator Ayotte. Terrific.
Mr. Thompson. I would value the input.
Senator Ayotte. Great. And I know that you have already
been asked questions about the American Community Survey, but
this issue really--certainly as Dr. Coburn identified, this is
an issue of trust with the government and also my
constituents--I mean, I hear some deep concerns about some of
the questions and the depth of this survey. And it cannot be
underestimated. The stories that we hear, of course, are that
my constituents are contacted, they are visited, they are
visited, they are visited, and then they find out really the
extent of the questions that they are asked.
So what I did today was just looked at the current survey
just to kind of get a sense of what it looks like, and it is
about 48 questions, but that does not include subparts. And I
think if I went through the subparts, it probably gets close to
100 questions that they are asked. And some of them are quite
intrusive. I mean, I look at things like, ``Because of a
physical, mental, or emotional condition, does this person have
serious difficulty concentrating, remembering, or making
decisions?'' That is a very personal question. Or, ``Does this
person have difficulty dressing or bathing?'' Obviously about
someone with a disability.
There is a whole length of other questions, I mean, very
detailed questions, that this is an issue that I would hope
that in your new position we would not be asking questions of
individuals that are not fully justified or necessary, because
these are very intrusive questions to ask individuals about,
and obviously these questions go from the background of your
heritage all the way to your income to where you live.
I mean, I love this one: ``Does this house, apartment, or
mobile home have a sink with a faucet?''
These are very detailed questions, so you can understand,
with your average person where they are subject to fines being
asked detailed questions by the government that are very
personal, why that would raise very deep privacy concerns with
many individuals.
So that is what you are hearing from the public, and I
would think that our responsibility, both as Members of
Congress and your responsibility in your new position, would be
to be as least intrusive as possible in terms of respecting the
privacy of the American people. That is the commitment I am
asking for from you today, because I can understand if I were
asked some of these questions why I would get my dander up.
Mr. Thompson. Senator, well, let me say that I would not
want to unduly burden the American public, and I would be
committed to ensuring that the questions that are asked have to
be asked and there is a right purpose to them and a documented
purpose.
I also want to assure you that my whole career has been
devoted to protecting the privacy of the responses, both at the
Census Bureau and at NORC, the company I am at now. It is just
critical to be in a position to continue to earn their trust so
that you can collect vitally important information.
Senator Ayotte. Well, what I would hope is for obviously
every single question on this survey, that it be scrutinized
very carefully to really ask put yourself in the shoes of the
people being asked, the American people, and then also why is
this necessary for government to have this information. And I
think there has to be a fairly high justification, particularly
with some of the very personal questions that I raised. So I
would hope that you would bring that kind of standard into
reviewing this process.
Mr. Thompson. Senator, if I am confirmed, I would love to
explore these with you in more detail. Again, I do not want to
unduly burden the American public, but at the same time, I want
to collect the information that is necessary to administer the
important programs that the American Community Survey is
designed to support.
Senator Ayotte. Now, I appreciate that, and I think it is
the issue of, people understanding, us making sure that we are
really scrutinizing this so that information that does not need
to be collected is not collected. So I appreciate very much
your willingness to take this on and your prior experience in
this area, and I look forward to working with you.
Mr. Thompson. Thank you, Senator.
Senator Ayotte. Thank you.
Chairman Carper. Senator Ayotte, thank you. Thanks for
coming. Thanks very much for those questions.
Senator Ayotte. Thank you.
Chairman Carper. Sometimes people say to me, ``Well, what
have you done before you were a Senator that actually prepared
you for what you are responsible for doing now?'' And there are
a number of things that I have done. And we all came here on
different paths. Dr. Coburn had an incredible life and career
that enabled him to lead businesses, big businesses, become a
doctor, and serve in the Congress. We all come from different
paths, but we pick up training, experiences from those
different paths, core values. My core values, as I talk about
from time to time, include figuring out the right thing to do,
do it, not the easy thing, not the expedient thing, the right
thing to do; and treating other people the way we want to be
treated. We focus here on trying to get better results for less
money, but, really, how do we focus on excellence in everything
that we do? And just do not give up. We do not give up. So
those are my core values.
Talk to us about your core values as a human being, as a
leader. Where do they come from? Where do those core values
come from? And how are they going to help you in what you do?
We talk about job experience and so forth. Sometimes our core
values are more important than anything else, particularly as a
leader.
Mr. Thompson. So one of the values that has motivated me
throughout my career is to produce information that has an
important social good, and that is one of the reasons I went to
the Census Bureau so that I could work on that.
Another value that I really think is important is that I
have always been very honest, very open with people, and to do
things that have integrity, to make the right kind of decision,
and to be open about it.
My core values I guess are really based on honesty,
integrity, and openness.
Chairman Carper. Where does that come from? How did you
learn these things?
Mr. Thompson. Well, I guess it started with my parents, who
did a good job convincing me that it was very good to be open
and honest. And then as I got to the Census Bureau, I got to
work initially, both at Census and outside Census, with some of
the finest statisticians who built the field, and they had this
ethic about being open and about being honest, and learning
from them was very important.
Chairman Carper. I was talking with someone the other day
about lessons learned, and they were talking about we have good
role models and we have bad role models, but we can learn from
both of them. From the bad role models, we can learn how not to
do bad things or stupid things. So both of those work.
You had the opportunity to leave the Census Bureau after, I
think, about 27 years and to go off to join the folks at the
National Opinion Research Center. Most people have never heard
of it. Most everybody has heard of the census and the Census
Bureau. Most people do not have a clue what the National
Opinion Research Center does. And you got there, and you ended
up in a pretty important job, ended up being the president of
the operation for a number of years.
Just talk to us, for people who do not have a clue about
the National Opinion Research Center or what they do, talk to
us why that was an important thing for you to do in terms of
your growth and your ability to assume these responsibilities
that have been nominated for.
Mr. Thompson. Thank you, Senator. Actually, I probably am
one of the few people that had known of the National Opinion
Research Center for quite a while. They had provided a lot of
advice to me when I was at the Census Bureau on various
statistical matters. They have a long history of doing
excellent survey methodology work. So when I was looking around
to retire after 27 years at the Census Bureau, I visited a
number of companies, and NORC was a company that shared my
vision of doing work that was very important for the public
good. And at the time, NORC also offered a new challenge in
that they were reinventing themselves at the time and needed
some help to fix their data collection operations. And I was
happy to go help out this organization which shared this view
of doing high-quality work in the public good.
And as I got to NORC, I had the opportunity then to work
with technology to make operations more effective and reduce
costs, and I had the opportunity to establish a vision for the
company when I took over as president, which was based on
establishing a leadership position in our field and drawing on
our most important resource--our employees--to do that.
Chairman Carper. During the time I served as Governor, I
was involved in the National Governors Association (NGA), and I
remember meeting with other Governors. We would talk about the
challenges that we faced in our respective States. And I would
come back, and we would have cabinet meetings, and whatever
issue we were focusing on--raising student achievement,
environmental issues, job creation, financial controls--I would
always say, ``Some Governor in some State, has wrestled with
this issue, they have figured out how to deal with it in an
effective way, and we have to find that State, that person,
figure out how they do it, and see if it is something that
could be exported to us, if we could do it.''
Just about every other major country in the world--I think
all of them conduct a census and have done it for a long time.
Some of them probably do it pretty well. Some, probably not.
Who are the countries that we can learn from? And what are some
specific lessons we might be able to learn as we prepare for
2020?
Mr. Thompson. I think right off the bat, our neighbor to
the northern, Canada, would be a really good place to start
working with. They have been using the Internet as a primary
response option. I believe that they had a very successful
utilization of that, so I think that would be one really good
country to start with.
England uses some similar methods to the United States.
They would be another good country, as would Australia.
Chairman Carper. And what could they learn from us?
Mr. Thompson. Well, what they would learn from us, I
believe, is how to use automation in a very diverse setting,
because our country I believe is more diverse than England and
Australia, and how we go about putting that in place would be,
I think, very valuable for them.
Chairman Carper. OK. I want to go back to the American
Community Survey again. Senator Johnson talked about the level
of fines. You indicated--I thought it was a good response. You
said, ``Our focus should not be so much on how much we want to
fine people for their failure or refusal to actually
participate, but try to better explain why the American
Community Survey is important, why it is of value to our
country, and why we need for folks to spend some time to comply
with that or respond to it.''
It is a shared responsibility, though. It should not fall
just on the Census Bureau. It should fall on the business
community who use that information on State and local
governments, and on the Federal Government, on us. We have a
shared responsibility to explain why it is important and not
just to say, OK, if you do not do it, you are going to get
fined. That is not the right response.
I think the American Community Survey can be considered
almost a dress rehearsal for the decennial and give us a chance
to experiment with some new ideas, new technologies, new
approaches that we do not want to bet the house on every 10
years, but we might be able to try some things on the ACS that
would inform us going to 2020. Talk about how that might
happen.
Mr. Thompson. Certainly, Senator. Well, first off the bat,
you have--the ACS is now starting to offer the Internet as a
response option.
Chairman Carper. Talk a little bit more about that. Expand
on that.
Mr. Thompson. So there are options to learn how to motivate
response via the Internet through the ACS. There is a wide body
of research going on in the public and private sector right now
about how to motivate individuals to respond via the Internet.
And the ACS certainly offers a good test bed for trying new
methodologies, bringing in researchers from outside the
government to work with the Census Bureau to put in place the
Internet techniques.
The other opportunity, I think, that the ACS--well, there
are at least two more. Another opportunity that the ACS offers
is the ability to try out new technology on a limited basis to
see how it works, to understand the mechanics of it, to
understand the human factors that are associated with
introducing it.
And, finally, the ACS, because it is a widely dispersed
survey, does offer the opportunity to have people do on-the-
ground checks where you can look at some of the private sector
geographic products and compare them to what the Census Bureau
has and understand the nature of the differences and the nature
of the gaps in them.
Chairman Carper. OK. I want to go back to several years ago
to the run-up to the 2010 census. And I do not remember this
with great precision, but my recollection is we had three
Directors or Acting Directors of the Census just over a period
of like a couple of years in the run-up to the Census. One of
the reasons why a number of us on this Committee supported the
idea of having a 5-year term for the Census Director was to
provide some continuity and so that we would not ever go
through that situation again.
If you should be confirmed for this position, you will fill
out the remainder of the 5-year term that was being served by
Dr. Groves; I think it is about 3 years. And if you are
interested and the President is interested, whoever is
President, and wants to nominate you again, he could do it, and
that would carry us conceivably through the 2020 census. So we
will have the opportunity for real continuity for 3 years and
then maybe another 5 years, and hopefully not face what we
faced several years ago.
I think most people in this country, if you said, how would
you like to be Director of the Census as opposed to being a
movie star or a Senator or whatever, people would probably have
other--Dr. Coburn? [Laughter.]
People would say, ``That is not a very interesting or
exciting job.'' Actually, I think it could be a hugely exciting
job.
Mr. Thompson. I think it is a very exciting job, Senator.
At least it is very exciting to me. I think there is tremendous
opportunity to work as Director with the other statistical
agency heads to find efficiencies and adopt new technologies in
government. The Census Bureau touches so many other agencies.
There is tremendous opportunity.
And the other thing that I think is really exciting is to
really put in place a design for a 2020 census. That is a
fundamental change in the way censuses are taken, and that is
very exciting to me.
Chairman Carper. All right. My last question is: What can
we do on our side, our end of this government in the
legislative branch, in this Committee, what can we do to help
the Census to do a better job, better results, more accurate,
but not for a whole lot more money?
Mr. Thompson. Senator, if I am confirmed, I would hope that
I would have the opportunity to work with you and the other
Members of the Committee on those issues and that you would be
amenable to having me come down to talk to you about ideas and
things, gain your advice and counsel. That would be just
invaluable help.
Chairman Carper. All right. Sometimes when we have a
hearing, we get to the end of the hearing--we always ask you to
do an opening statement. This is one of those hearings where
you will be given a chance just to offer a short closing
statement as well, and you could re-emphasize something you
thought was important, maybe something that occurred to you
that you did not say earlier, something that comes to you by
virtue of the questions you have heard. Maybe you want to more
fully answer a question. But this is your opportunity to do
that.
Mr. Thompson. Well, thank you, Senator. Let me just re-
emphasize the fact that I am glad that the President nominated
me for this position. I am very excited about the opportunities
to provide leadership to one of the most important statistical
agencies in the United States. I am looking forward, if I am
confirmed, to having the opportunity to lead the effort to
design a new census. And I am also looking forward to the
opportunity to build on the work that Bob Groves already
started, to put in place a permanent culture at the Census
Bureau that is adaptive and innovative. That is what I am
really excited about. And I am interested in doing that in an
environment that is open and transparent to all stakeholders.
Chairman Carper. When we were considering legislation to
provide for a 5-year term for the Census Director, we also
considered whether or not to change the chain of command for
the Census. And I think the idea was to say whether or not the
Census Director should report directly to the Secretary of
Commerce or to have the Census Director reporting not to the
Secretary of Commerce but another reporting arrangement.
In your view, what is the appropriate relationship between
the Census Director and the Under Secretary for Economic
Affairs and the Census Director and the Secretary of Commerce?
And how do you envision working with the Under Secretary? I
think it is Mark Doms, Under Secretary Doms. And we have a new
Secretary there, Penny Pritzker. Just talk a little bit about
that reporting relationship.
Mr. Thompson. Sure. So I have always had pretty good
relationships when I was at Census with the Under Secretary for
Economic and Statistical Affairs (ESA), and with the Secretary
of Commerce when I had the opportunity to work with them. And I
am really looking forward to working with Mark Doms. He is the
Under Secretary for Economic Affairs. And I am really looking
forward to working with Secretary Pritzker, if I am confirmed.
I met both of them. I think they are very qualified
individuals, and I think that we will have a very productive
working relationship.
Chairman Carper. All right. Good enough.
OK. I think with that it is a wrap. I went on too long
here, and Dr. Coburn I think gave up on me and bailed. I
apologize in his absence for not yielding.
We appreciate your willingness to do this. We appreciate
the President giving us a good nominee, a good name, and his
responsibility and the Administration's responsibility is to
find able people to fill these positions. Our responsibility,
after they have vetted them, is for us to vet them and to
review your credentials and have a chance to talk with you and
have a public hearing like this, and, frankly, talk to a lot of
other people who know you and are familiar with the work that
you do and have done and your capabilities and the nature of
the responsibilities the Census Director is going to be facing
in the years to some.
So we are grateful for your past service, grateful for your
willingness to come back and to serve in this capacity.
I want to again welcome your sons for joining us here
today. As I watched you speak, from time to time I could see
their lips move---- [Laughter.]
As you were giving some of your testimony. But I thought
you did and they did a good job in responding to our questions.
We have some more time here for folks who are not here in
person today to ask questions, but the hearing record will
remain open until, noon tomorrow--for the submission of
statements for those who want to give them and for questions
for the record.
With that having been said, this hearing is adjourned.
Thanks very much.
Mr. Thompson. Thank you, Senator.
[Whereupon, at 11:47 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.]
A P P E N D I X
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