[House Hearing, 112 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
THE HOMELESS CHILDREN AND YOUTH
ACT OF 2011: PROPOSALS TO PROMOTE
ECONOMIC INDEPENDENCE FOR HOMELESS
CHILDREN AND YOUTH
=======================================================================
HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON
INSURANCE, HOUSING AND
COMMUNITY OPPORTUNITY
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON FINANCIAL SERVICES
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED TWELFTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
----------
DECEMBER 15, 2011
----------
Printed for the use of the Committee on Financial Services
Serial No. 112-93
THE HOMELESS CHILDREN AND YOUTH ACT OF 2011: PROPOSALS TO PROMOTE
ECONOMIC INDEPENDENCE FOR HOMELESS CHILDREN AND YOUTH
For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office,
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THE HOMELESS CHILDREN AND YOUTH
ACT OF 2011: PROPOSALS TO PROMOTE
ECONOMIC INDEPENDENCE FOR HOMELESS
CHILDREN AND YOUTH
=======================================================================
HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON
INSURANCE, HOUSING AND
COMMUNITY OPPORTUNITY
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON FINANCIAL SERVICES
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED TWELFTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
DECEMBER 15, 2011
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Financial Services
Serial No. 112-93
HOUSE COMMITTEE ON FINANCIAL SERVICES
SPENCER BACHUS, Alabama, Chairman
JEB HENSARLING, Texas, Vice BARNEY FRANK, Massachusetts,
Chairman Ranking Member
PETER T. KING, New York MAXINE WATERS, California
EDWARD R. ROYCE, California CAROLYN B. MALONEY, New York
FRANK D. LUCAS, Oklahoma LUIS V. GUTIERREZ, Illinois
RON PAUL, Texas NYDIA M. VELAZQUEZ, New York
DONALD A. MANZULLO, Illinois MELVIN L. WATT, North Carolina
WALTER B. JONES, North Carolina GARY L. ACKERMAN, New York
JUDY BIGGERT, Illinois BRAD SHERMAN, California
GARY G. MILLER, California GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York
SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West Virginia MICHAEL E. CAPUANO, Massachusetts
SCOTT GARRETT, New Jersey RUBEN HINOJOSA, Texas
RANDY NEUGEBAUER, Texas WM. LACY CLAY, Missouri
PATRICK T. McHENRY, North Carolina CAROLYN McCARTHY, New York
JOHN CAMPBELL, California JOE BACA, California
MICHELE BACHMANN, Minnesota STEPHEN F. LYNCH, Massachusetts
THADDEUS G. McCOTTER, Michigan BRAD MILLER, North Carolina
KEVIN McCARTHY, California DAVID SCOTT, Georgia
STEVAN PEARCE, New Mexico AL GREEN, Texas
BILL POSEY, Florida EMANUEL CLEAVER, Missouri
MICHAEL G. FITZPATRICK, GWEN MOORE, Wisconsin
Pennsylvania KEITH ELLISON, Minnesota
LYNN A. WESTMORELAND, Georgia ED PERLMUTTER, Colorado
BLAINE LUETKEMEYER, Missouri JOE DONNELLY, Indiana
BILL HUIZENGA, Michigan ANDRE CARSON, Indiana
SEAN P. DUFFY, Wisconsin JAMES A. HIMES, Connecticut
NAN A. S. HAYWORTH, New York GARY C. PETERS, Michigan
JAMES B. RENACCI, Ohio JOHN C. CARNEY, Jr., Delaware
ROBERT HURT, Virginia
ROBERT J. DOLD, Illinois
DAVID SCHWEIKERT, Arizona
MICHAEL G. GRIMM, New York
FRANCISCO ``QUICO'' CANSECO, Texas
STEVE STIVERS, Ohio
STEPHEN LEE FINCHER, Tennessee
Larry C. Lavender, Chief of Staff
Subcommittee on Insurance, Housing and Community Opportunity
JUDY BIGGERT, Illinois, Chairman
ROBERT HURT, Virginia, Vice LUIS V. GUTIERREZ, Illinois,
Chairman Ranking Member
GARY G. MILLER, California MAXINE WATERS, California
SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO, West Virginia NYDIA M. VELAZQUEZ, New York
SCOTT GARRETT, New Jersey EMANUEL CLEAVER, Missouri
PATRICK T. McHENRY, North Carolina WM. LACY CLAY, Missouri
LYNN A. WESTMORELAND, Georgia MELVIN L. WATT, North Carolina
SEAN P. DUFFY, Wisconsin BRAD SHERMAN, California
ROBERT J. DOLD, Illinois MICHAEL E. CAPUANO, Massachusetts
STEVE STIVERS, Ohio
C O N T E N T S
----------
Page
Hearing held on:
December 15, 2011............................................ 1
Appendix:
December 15, 2011............................................ 49
WITNESSES
Thursday, December 15, 2011
Cackley, Alicia Puente, Director, Financial Markets and Community
Investment, U.S. Government Accountability Office.............. 27
Diamond, Seth, Commissioner, New York City Department of Homeless
Services....................................................... 29
Dunlap Brandon, Chicago, Illinois................................ 7
Garza, Maria Estella, Homeless Liaison, San Antonio Independent
School District................................................ 31
Johnston, Mark, Deputy Assistant Secretary, Office of Special
Needs, U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development........ 33
Khan, Rumi, 6th grader, Lamberton Middle School, Carlisle,
Pennsylvania................................................... 8
Koon, Brittany Amber, PFC, Ft. Hood, Texas....................... 10
Pastor, Brooklyn, 7th grader, William Paca Middle School,
Shirley, New York.............................................. 11
Poppe, Barbara, Executive Director, United States Interagency
Council on Homelessness........................................ 34
Raynor, Destiny, 9th grader, Winter Springs High School, Sanford,
Florida........................................................ 12
Rodgers, Starnica, Truman College, Chicago, Illinois............. 14
Whitney, Grace-Ann Caruso, Ph.D., MPA, IMH-E (IV), Director,
Connecticut Head Start State Collaboration Office, Connecticut
State Department of Education.................................. 36
APPENDIX
Prepared statements:
Cackley, Alicia Puente....................................... 50
Diamond, Seth................................................ 63
Dunlap Brandon............................................... 66
Garza, Maria Estella......................................... 70
Johnston, Mark............................................... 79
Khan, Rumi................................................... 85
Koon, Brittany Amber......................................... 88
Pastor, Brooklyn............................................. 92
Poppe, Barbara............................................... 94
Raynor, Destiny.............................................. 105
Rodgers, Starnica............................................ 110
Whitney, Grace-Ann Caruso.................................... 112
Additional Material Submitted for the Record
Biggert, Hon. Judy:
December 12, 2011, letter from the the Alliance for Excellent
Education.................................................. 118
December 9, 2011, letter from the American School Counselor
Association................................................ 119
December 8, 2011, letter from the Chicago Coalition for the
Homeless................................................... 120
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise................ 122
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Albuquerque. 123
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Berks
County, Inc................................................ 124
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Bryan-
College Station............................................ 125
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Forsyth
County..................................................... 126
December 13, 2011, letter from Fort Bend Family Promise...... 127
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Gallatin
Valley..................................................... 128
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Greater
Helena..................................................... 129
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Las Vegas... 130
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Midland..... 131
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Monmouth
County..................................................... 132
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of Morris
County..................................................... 133
December 13, 2011, letter from Family Promise of North Idaho. 134
December 9, 2011, letter from the First Focus Campaign for
Children................................................... 135
December 12, 2011, letter from HEAR US Inc................... 136
December 13, 2011, letter from Horizons for Homeless Children 137
December 9, 2011, letter from the Homeless Prenatal Program.. 138
December 13, 2011, letter from Huckleberry House............. 139
December 13, 2011, letter from The Interfaith Hospitality
Network of Augusta, Inc.................................... 140
December 13, 2011, letter from The Interfaith Hospitality
Network of Burlington County............................... 141
December 13, 2011, letter from The Interfaith Hospitality
Network of Essex County, Inc............................... 143
December 13, 2011, letter from The Interfaith Hospitality
Network of Greater Johnson City............................ 144
December 5, 2011, letter from The Interfaith Hospitality
Network of Northwest Philadelphia.......................... 145
December 12, 2011, letter from the National Association for
the Education of Homeless Children and Youth............... 148
December 15, 2011, letter from the National Association of
Home Builders.............................................. 150
December 9, 2011, letter from the National Association of
REALTORS.................................................. 151
December 14, 2011, letter from the National Association of
Secondary School Principals................................ 152
December 6, 2011, letter from the National PTA............... 154
December 8, 2011, letter from the National Center on Family
Homelessness............................................... 155
December 2011 report of the National Center on Family
Homelessness entitled, ``America's Youngest Outcasts 2010'' 156
December 9, 2011, letter from the National Coalition for the
Homeless................................................... 280
December 9, 2011, letter from the National Center for Housing
& Child Welfare............................................ 282
December 9, 2011, letter from the National Health Care for
the Homeless Council....................................... 284
December 8, 2011, letter from the National Human Services
Assembly................................................... 285
December 12, 2011, letter from the National Law Center on
Homelessness & Poverty..................................... 286
December 14, 2011, letter from the National Low Income
Housing Coalition.......................................... 288
December 9, 2011, letter from The National Network for Youth. 290
December 13, 2011, letter from the National Network to End
Domestic Violence.......................................... 292
December 8, 2011, letter from the School Social Work
Association of America..................................... 293
December 13, 2011, letter from The Road Home................. 294
June 2011 National Center for Homeless Education report
entitled, ``Education for Homeless Children and Youth
Program, Data Collection Summary''......................... 295
December 7, 2011, letter from Women Against Abuse............ 331
December 12, 2011, letter from the Western Regional Advocacy
Project.................................................... 332
THE HOMELESS CHILDREN AND YOUTH
ACT OF 2011: PROPOSALS TO PROMOTE
ECONOMIC INDEPENDENCE FOR HOMELESS
CHILDREN AND YOUTH
----------
Thursday, December 15, 2011
U.S. House of Representatives,
Subcommittee on Insurance, Housing
and Community Opportunity,
Committee on Financial Services,
Washington, D.C.
The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:07 a.m., in
room 2237, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Judy Biggert
[chairwoman of the subcommittee] presiding.
Members present: Representatives Biggert, Capito, Stivers;
Waters, Cleaver, and Capuano.
Also present: Representatives George Miller of California,
Green, and Davis.
Chairwoman Biggert. The Subcommittee on Insurance, Housing
and Community Opportunity will come to order. We are having a
hearing today entitled, ``The Homeless Children and Youth Act
of 2011: Proposals to Promote Economic Independence for
Homeless Children and Youth.''
I would like to welcome you all here today. And first of
all, I would like to thank the Judiciary Committee for allowing
us to hold our hearing in this room. We usually are in our
Financial Services Committee room, but they are doing some work
to fix the walls because of the earthquake that occurred about
a month ago. I never thought that Washington would have to
repair walls from earthquakes, but that is the way it is.
I will now turn to opening statements, and without
objection, all Members' opening statements will be made a part
of the record. And I will yield myself such time as I require.
Good morning, everyone, and I would like to welcome our
special guests on panel one, and especially the current or
former homeless children and youth, also in the audience.
Welcome, to you, and thank you so much for being here. And we
hope that your first experience--I assume this is your first
experience--with the U.S. Congress as a witness or in the
audience here is a good one, one that will help many children
in this country.
And I would also like to recognize a now formerly homeless
family that was featured on ``60 Minutes'' recently, the
Metzgers--Arielle, Austin, and their dad, Tom. So welcome--
maybe raise your hands so we can see where you are. Thank you.
Thanks for being here.
Children should not be without a home and they should not
have to fight to prove that they are homeless, and on this, I
hope we all agree. Today's hearing will examine H.R. 32, the
Homeless Children and Youth Act of 2011, which will expand the
McKinney-Vento definition of ``homeless person'' so that
homeless children and youth verified as homeless by other
Federal programs can access HUD housing and services.
We have a unique opportunity to hear from witnesses about
the bureaucratic barriers that are preventing homeless children
and youth from securing HUD homeless assistance. Our ultimate
goal is to ensure that homeless children and youth are eligible
for HUD homeless housing and supportive services.
Secure and more stable housing as well as supportive
services will help kids stay in school and avoid becoming
tomorrow's homeless adults. These goals must be a top priority
for Federal agencies that have homeless programs.
If Federal programs are not working for the people they are
intended to serve, it is our job to find the flaws and reform
those programs. During the past decade, two significant reforms
to the McKinney-Vento Act have been intended to help children
and youth to more easily secure homeless assistance, but our
work is not complete. This week, the National Center on Family
Homelessness released a report revealing that 1 out of every 45
children in the United States is homeless.
The Department of Education reported that student
homelessness is on the rise. There are nearly 1 million
homeless children in the United States, and these statistics
are absolutely unacceptable.
Our subcommittee will work to identify the Federal red tape
that is standing in the way of local providers who are helping
homeless children and youth to increase what they can do. We
will pursue reform measures that break down those barriers. One
such reform measure, H.R. 32, our subcommittee will likely
consider when we come back in 2012.
With that, I recognize the gentleman from Missouri, Mr.
Cleaver, for an opening statement.
Mr. Cleaver. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
I would like to first of all extend a very warm welcome to
the two young men and four young women who are testifying
before this committee. You are having an experience that hardly
any other individuals your age will ever have, and that means
that you are now famous. You can start your own reality TV
show. Thank you for being here to share your own personal
experiences.
You can't turn on the television or go out anyplace during
this time of year without seeing at least the attempt to create
a festive environment. This is a holiday season that generally
captures the attention of just about everybody in this country.
It is difficult, however, for me, having read your
testimonies, to feel the kind of festive atmosphere that I
would normally enter into during this time of the year. While I
have four children, and while I look like I am in my thirties,
I actually have three grandchildren, and it is a bit painful to
read your testimonies. There is nothing that can touch my soul
as much as finding pain with young people.
In my real life, I am a United Methodist pastor, and from
time to time I do become involved in issues adversely affecting
young people. And this testimony that I was able to read
actually touched my soul and caused me to do a great deal of
thinking last night as I was trying to sleep. And in my
struggles last night trying to sleep after having read this, I
thought to myself, ``Now, what about all these other kids
around the country who have no place to sleep?'' I am in my bed
across the street--I live in the Methodist building--and I am
not able to sleep because I am thinking, ``Boy, this is
terrible.'' And then, I thought about people without a place to
sleep, and that really created more pain.
Sometimes, our discussions on the issues of homelessness
can become extremely technical and we become more involved in
program descriptions and specifics, but we cannot lose sight--
we must not lose sight of the fact that this discussion today
is about real people--real stories. And your testimony will
help us to remember that.
One thing we all know is that despite the efforts we have
made over the past several years, and the improvements that we
have made with the HEARTH Act, there is still much that our
Federal agencies could do to improve coordination across
programs and increase access to the services that are being
provided. I think that today we will hear some valuable
perspectives on how we in Congress can help.
I understand that our subcommittee Chair, Mrs. Biggert's,
bill is intended to reduce the barriers to services for
children and youth who are in highly unstable housing
situations but don't currently meet the HUD definition of
homeless. So I want to thank Mrs. Biggert for her work.
And, there are very few conversations that we can have here
in Washington that will not include a discussion of dollars.
For good or bad, that is the way it goes. And this discussion
is no different, so we have to acknowledge that fact as we move
forward.
I want to thank you, Madam Chairwoman, for what you have
done, and I look forward to hearing the testimony today.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you, Mr. Cleaver.
The gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Stivers, is recognized for 3
minutes.
Mr. Stivers. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. And I would like
to thank you for holding this hearing today to ensure that
homeless children and youth have access to homeless assistance
and services. I appreciate that.
I am pleased to welcome Private First Class Brittany Amber
Koon, who spent much of her childhood in Upper Arlington, Ohio,
in my district, and she recently joined the United States
military--the Army--and completed her initial service and is
stationed at Fort Hood, Texas. I am looking forward to hearing
her testimony today, and I want to thank her and all the
witnesses for sharing their stories.
One of the things that Private First Class Koon's testimony
reminded me, she has a quote in there that she liked the idea
of taking her leadership skills to the next level to serve her
country and she decided to go on active duty because she would
have training and a stable place to live. We have a lot of
young folks in this country who have a lot to offer, and many
of them are fighting homelessness. And I can tell you, I am
pleased to join that fight with Private First Class Koon and to
try to fight homelessness.
I am looking forward to hearing the testimony of all of the
witnesses today. I appreciate your time, and I look forward to
hearing your testimony.
And I appreciate the chairman for holding this hearing, and
I look forward to continuing the fight to make things better
for young folks who are suffering from homelessness.
Thank you so much.
And welcome, Private First Class Koon.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
Mr. Cleaver?
Mr. Cleaver. Mr. George Miller is here with us. He is not a
member of this subcommittee, but I would ask unanimous consent
to allow him to speak on this issue that he feels very strongly
about.
Chairwoman Biggert. Without objection, it is so ordered.
The gentleman from Massachusetts is recognized for 1
minute.
Mr. Capuano. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
Madam Chairwoman, thank you for having this hearing, and I
congratulate the young people who are here today. I don't think
this is a usual situation. Congress is not a usual place. So
don't think this has anything to do with most of your real
life.
But I want to be really clear: This proposal today is a
good proposal. It is something that is long overdue and I
congratulate the chairwoman for submitting it.
But I also want to be very clear: This is not going to be
the final answer to ending homelessness with children or with
others. The only way this country is going to do that is to put
money on the table to build more affordable housing. Simple.
Otherwise, there will be no place to go. Simply getting a
family into a shelter is better than not, but we can't just
leave them in a shelter. That is not real advancement; that is
not real opportunity.
It is better than not, but we need to build affordable
housing in this country right up the ladder for the people at
the bottom, the people on the next rung up, and the next rung
up. And we need to make sure that those people can afford to
buy a home. In today's world, we will be able to afford
tomorrow by keeping mortgage rates at a reasonable level.
Otherwise, most of the world will be forced into subsidized
housing if they can't get into their own home or homeownership.
And if that happens, we will never be able to build our way out
of it.
So I want to be really clear: This is a good proposal that
is long overdue that I strongly support and I look forward to
passing.
But as far as I am concerned, we really have to get serious
about addressing homelessness in this country, which, to me, is
a national embarrassment. It is a national embarrassment that
we have children on the streets. It is a national embarrassment
that we have veterans on the street. It is a national
embarrassment that we don't take care of some of our people
with mental challenges who are also on the street.
I think it doesn't speak well for us as a society. So for
me, this is a great thing, but I want to be very clear that
this will not end homelessness. The only way for us to do that
as a society is to be honest about it and to try to put money
on the table to build more affordable housing so that people
will be able to move up the ladder on their own.
Madam Chairwoman, I yield back the remainder of my time.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
Mr. Green, from Texas, you are recognized for 2 minutes.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
Please permit me, Madam Chairwoman, to thank you for
hosting this hearing. It is, without question, one of the most
important hearings that we will have, and one of the most
important hearings that I think that I have been a party to. So
I am grateful that you have had the vision and the foresight to
cause us to visit these issues.
I would like to concur with my colleagues who have stressed
the importance of the issue. I also want to stress the
importance of the fact that we can solve the problem. It is not
something that is beyond our ability to resolve.
So the question really isn't whether there is a way to
resolve this issue of homelessness with our young people. The
question is really whether we have the will.
Do we have the will to do it? If we only have the will,
this country, which prides itself on its future, will take
charge and make sure that the future continues to be bright for
all of our children.
I thank you, and I yield back the balance of my time.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you, Mr. Green.
We are joined by Ranking Member Miller, the ranking member
of the Education and the Workforce Committee.
Thank you for joining us, and you are recognized for 4
minutes.
Mr. George Miller of California. Thank you, Chairwoman
Biggert, for holding this hearing on such a critical issue
facing our Nation today. I want to thank you for your
leadership on this issue and the Committee on Education and the
Workforce. You have been a consistent champion of homeless
children and families, and it has been a pleasure to partner
with you on such important issues.
I also want to thank all the young people who are here to
tell their stories today to the committee and to the Congress.
I can't tell you how important it is that Congress hears
directly on the realities that you and your families face
because of the lack of adequate housing. I have served on the
Education Committee for my entire time in public office, and I
know what a dramatic impact housing and mobility have on a
student's education.
Public schools have a unique perspective on social and
economic issues like homelessness. Unlike other community
service organizations, schools see the full range of children
without housing, not just children and youth who make it into a
shelter. They see kids moving from place to place, from couch,
to basement, to car, to motel, and to another couch. None of
these places should be considered a home.
We know that homelessness puts kids at a much higher risk
of educational failure. Students without stable homes have more
attendance problems and they don't do as well in school.
Student homelessness is also often overlooked as a contributor
to the Nation's dropout crises.
Without an education, these students will have a more
difficult time obtaining jobs that pay decent wages, and they
are more likely to experience homelessness as an adult. Federal
education law, through the McKinney-Vento Act, requires schools
to support homeless students in a number of ways, including
keeping homeless students in the same school when it is in
their best interest and providing transportation or immediately
enrolling them in new schools.
However, education is only part of the answer. In order for
homeless students to succeed in school, they must receive
housing and other supportive services that will stabilize their
situations and enable them to concentrate on their education.
Unfortunately, school districts face barriers when they try
to refer kids to the Department of Housing and Urban
Development's homeless programs because of the difference in
the definitions of ``homeless.'' This prevents kids from
getting services they need and limits community collaboration.
And perhaps equally disturbing, this mismatch in definition
also keeps the true scale of children and youth homelessness
hidden from view.
H.R. 32 is similar to legislation enacted by the Education
and the Workforce Committee, the Child Nutrition and Higher
Education Act. Both of these laws help homeless kids get
services through the programs by taking advantage of point
people in the public schools. Similarly, H.R. 32 gets rid of
the interagency barriers by allowing school districts and
liaisons and others in Federal and child youth programs to
verify children and youth in HUD homelessness services.
It is absolutely critical that this coordination,
collaboration, and availability be made acceptable within the
laws of this country so that these children will not have these
artificial barriers put up to stability in their residencies,
and in stability in their education attainment, and stability
in their family life so that they can continue to seek and to
successfully complete their educational opportunities in this
country.
And I want to thank you again, Madam Chairwoman, for
holding this hearing.
And again, thank you to the students we are going to hear
from.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you very much.
And now, we will introduce all of the panel members, and
then we will come back and you will each have 5 minutes for
your statement.
We have: Brandon Dunlap, from Chicago, Illinois; Rumi Khan,
who is in sixth grade at Lamberton Middle School, Carlisle,
Pennsylvania--thank you for being here; Brittany Amber Koon,
PFC, Fort Hood, Texas--thank you for being here; Brook Pastor,
who is in seventh grade at William Paca Middle School, Shirley,
New York--thank you for being here, also; Destiny Raynor, who
is in ninth grade at Winter Springs High School in Sanford,
Florida--it is a little cold here, isn't it, compared to that;
and Ms. Starnica Rodgers, from Truman College in Chicago,
Illinois. Thank you all for being here.
With that, without objection, your written statements will
be made a part of the record, and then you will each be
recognized for a 5-minute summary of your testimony.
So we will start with you, Brandon Dunlap.
STATEMENT OF BRANDON DUNLAP, CHICAGO, ILLINOIS
Mr. Dunlap. Good morning. Thank you for having me here
today to testify in support of H.R. 32.
I am from Chicago, Illinois. I graduated from Kendall
College and currently work in the food and beverage department
of the Union League Club. I am proud of what I have
accomplished so far but it has been very difficult. A safe and
secure place to live would have been very helpful to me in many
ways.
For most of my childhood, I did not have a stable place to
live. My parents separated when I was young. After they split,
my mom, sister, and I ended up living with different relatives
and friends.
Since then, my mom got and lost a number of apartments, and
when we were not together, I had to move from place to place.
The summer before my junior year, I received a phone call just
before work from my sister stating that the sheriff was there
to put our things on the street. My mother was nowhere to be
found.
I went to work with tears in my eyes, not knowing where I
was going to go for the night. The tears wouldn't stop, so my
manager offered to let me go home. The tears came even stronger
than possible because I had no home to go to.
That night, I stayed with my cousin. However, he didn't
allow me to have a key to come and go as I pleased, and there
wasn't enough room for me or even a bed. I slept on the floor
under the pool table.
Some nights, I would travel a long distance on public
transportation from school to work, often in bad weather, only
to find that my cousin was not home and I needed to find
somewhere else to stay for the night. I would scramble to call
different friends and family members and then get back to the
bus to travel a long distance to another place to stay.
I developed a rotation theory in which I would try to avoid
staying in the same place two nights in a row. I had to have a
plan, and then a backup plan, and then more plans just in case
the backup plan didn't work.
The time and energy it took for me to figure out where to
sleep each night and travel to get there, plus my job at
Subway, left little time for homework. I have faced many
barriers to housing in my life. My mom had issues she needed
help with, but if she had had stable housing and services, she
may have been able to address those issues, and my homelessness
could have been prevented.
After I was on my own in high school, I could not afford my
own housing, and even if I could have, no one would rent to a
teenager. Although people at my school were helping me with
other things, nobody was able to help me with my living
situation. I would have loved some place to live that was safe,
warm, and consistent, and a healthy place to do homework, go to
school, work, eat, and live my life.
It would have been very difficult to verify my living
situation growing up. To ask for proof that an adult allowed
me, a homeless child, to live with them for only 14 days would
possibly cause some adults to feel guilty or worry that they
could get in trouble.
I didn't want anyone who was helping me to get tired of my
presence. Asking them for verification would be another burden
for them.
For the same reasons, I would not feel comfortable asking
them to state that I moved twice within 60 days. Most people
knew only what I told them about my living situation and didn't
keep track of the number of days or moves.
Also, family members would have been reluctant to verify
something that might show my parents were not caring for me. I
also didn't want to risk doing anything that might involve any
authorities because I didn't want them going after my parents.
If, in order to access housing services, I had to show that
I would likely be homeless for a long time, that would be
difficult for me, as I always hoped that I wouldn't be homeless
for too long.
I would also like to repeat something I said in the
beginning of my statement: I am proud of what I have
accomplished. When I was homeless, it was like steering a ship
in a storm on the open ocean. Above all else, this situation
has forced me to look to myself for success.
However, I hope that other young people do not have to go
through what I went through. I hope that the situation of young
people who are staying temporarily with friends and families is
considered homeless by all government agencies, and they are
given assistance with a stable place to live.
Thank you for giving me the opportunity to share my
experience with you today.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Dunlap can be found on page
66 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
Rumi Khan, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF RUMI KHAN, 6TH GRADER, LAMBERTON MIDDLE SCHOOL,
CARLISLE, PENNSYLVANIA
Mr. Khan. Good morning, Mrs. Biggert, and members of the
subcommittee. Thank you for holding this hearing so you can
learn about homelessness from how we see it as kids.
My name is Rumi Khan, and I am 11 years old. I am in 6th
grade at Lamberton Middle School in Carlisle, PA.
Me and my mom are homeless. We got that way because my dad
was abusing me and my mom. He hit me, and called me stupid and
retarded. He tried to choke my mom.
We left our home in June last year and went to stay in a
hotel for a couple of nights. She tried to find a shelter for
us to stay in but they didn't have any room.
One of her friends from work offered to let us stay there.
Her friend changed and would get really mean with me. Sometimes
she was nice, but you never knew when she would smack her son
or pull his hair.
Once the lady pushed me up the stairs and she was really
mad at me. When my mom said something to her about pushing me
up the stairs, she told my mom to leave.
Another friend that my mom grew up with heard about our
situation and invited us to stay with him. It turned out that
he had mental problems and was a big liar.
My mom tried to get us into shelters for families who have
been abused but we couldn't because of me. They don't allow
older boys like me to stay there.
We were in one shelter for a little while, but had a time
limit, so they moved us into a hotel. It was really scary
because drug dealers stood around outside. Sometimes men would
knock on our door, and when my mom would open it they would
just look at us and my mom would try to not say anything to
make them mad and tell them they had the wrong door.
I didn't want anyone to know where I was staying. When the
school bus dropped us off, I waited until no one would see me,
and I then went to the hotel.
Another friend said he had a spare room we could stay in,
but then his wife got mad, and we got kicked out. So we went
and stayed at a motel for one night. It was better not being
around all the fighting, but we couldn't afford to stay there
longer than one night.
We had to change States to find a place to stay. My mom's
friend invited us to stay with her until we could find a place.
It was really hard having to start all over again.
We had to leave there, too, and stay in another hotel for
one night, and then we got into Safe Harbor.
Staying with other people was tough. It was really hard
adjusting to families' different lifestyles. If we crossed the
line for some reason--boom--we were out.
The hardest part of having to move so much and stay in so
many different places was we lost everything. It affected my
attitude because I lost all my friends over and over again. I
was afraid to get close to people because I knew we had to move
again.
I struggled in school and came to school very exhausted
because of having to sleep in different places, constantly
moving and not being able to rest. I know my mom was thinking
that we should maybe go back to my dad. I missed him a lot, but
I knew he hadn't gotten any help, and I was too afraid that he
would hurt us again.
Now we are at least in one place, and I don't think we will
get kicked out, at least not for just nothing. Moving around
and staying with so many different people was really hard.
I hope that now that we are at Safe Harbor, we will be able
to stay for a while and find a place to live. Thanks for
listening to what homelessness is like for me and my mom.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Khan can be found on page 85
of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
Brittany Koon, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF BRITTANY AMBER KOON, PFC, FT. HOOD, TEXAS
Ms. Koon. Good morning. Thank you, all the members of the
subcommittee, for this opportunity to share my story today.
My name is Brittany Amber Koon. I was born in a little
house in Upper Arlington, Ohio, that had been in the family for
years until it was foreclosed on in the middle of my 7th grade
year.
My mom, my sister, my brothers, and I doubled up with a
neighbor. That was the beginning of a long, scary journey of
instability and lonely transition that would lead me to foster
care and homelessness, but finally success as a proud member of
the United States Army.
After aging out of foster care during my senior year of
high school, I became homeless again. I had a scholarship to
college but I lived in my car and on the couches of some
relatives and friends for 2 months before college. Housing
solutions just didn't really exist.
I made it through my first year of college, but as the year
ended, I was again without housing. I crashed out on the couch
of a girl I met at a party. After a couple of weeks, I was
buying all the groceries, and because she did not have a car
and I did, I was expected to drive her and her kids wherever
they needed to go. I was not able to find other housing, so I
felt stuck.
This happens a lot when you are doubled up. You feel
indebted to the people who are letting you stay, but then you
are taken advantage of by them. They took my money and then
told me I had to leave.
I started hanging out at bars and nightclubs so I would
have somewhere to go at night. I know it sounds dangerous, but
I was making friends at the bars because they would let me come
back and crash on their couches.
At the time, I thought staying with these people was better
than my car, but it really wasn't. In my car, I was in control
and didn't have to worry about what would happen to me, or
people who would try and touch me when I was asleep. I wondered
why there was no help.
As it got colder, I asked Angela, from the Youth
Empowerment Program, to take me to a shelter, but there was a
waiting list. I decided to move in with my boyfriend. Then, my
relationship went bad and he kicked me out. I was so stressed
that I had to quit school for the second time.
That is when I talked to Angela's husband about going into
the military. I decided to go active duty so I would have
training and a stable place to live.
I am now stationed at Fort Hood, Texas. Even though I feel
more stable and supported than I have in years, I still don't
have a place to call home. I am coming back from Fort Hood for
the holidays, but I still have to couchsurf while I am home.
I feel that making youth document their homelessness
through the people they couchsurf with will only create
problems and stress on us and more frustration with the system.
None of the people I lived with would have been willing to
document that I was living there. They would have been
suspicious and afraid of getting in trouble. Also, I didn't
know many of them well enough to ask them.
I believe that allowing homeless education liaisons and
others to help youth document their situation would be best
because it would be easier for a youth to trust adults we know.
Most youth who are doubled up are getting used. This is true of
too many youth. In fact, Danielle Jinx and Shannon McDaniels
are here to support me today, because they also have been in my
situation.
It is very important for HUD to count doubled-up youth,
because I don't think people realize how hard it is for them.
If we were not counted, we could never be served effectively.
Recognizing that there are limited resources, I would
suggest increasing resources to those programs so that every
youth could be housed. But ignoring us has only reinforced our
knowledge that our community has abandoned us and that nobody
cares about us.
Like me, you have chosen to serve your country--you here in
Washington, and me in the field. Just as you have faith in me
that I will be out there protecting you, it is my hope that you
will use your power here to protect youth like me.
Thank you again for this opportunity.
[The prepared statement of PFC Koon can be found on page 88
of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
Next, Brooklyn Pastor is recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF BROOKLYN PASTOR, 7TH GRADER, WILLIAM PACA MIDDLE
SCHOOL, SHIRLEY, NEW YORK
Ms. Pastor. Hello. My name is Brooklyn Pastor. I am 12
years old and I am in 7th grade at William Paca Middle School
in Shirley, New York. I am here today with my mom, and also Ms.
Benjamin, from Parent-Child Home Program.
I have lived in over 16 places in my life--6 shelters, 4
times doubled up with many different people, and we had our own
house 6 times. We had to go to emergency motel rooms many other
times in between shelters and houses.
I really hate moving from place to place. It is so hard
because you get to know people and then you have to move. It
made my life hard.
When we lived with other people, they were not nice to us.
We couldn't ask them for anything. They were mostly mad that we
were there and did not want anyone else to know, especially
their landlord.
They would never let us stay where we were. My mom couldn't
tell anyone where we lived or for how long. It was like being
invisible.
The hardest thing about living with other people is
watching my mom cry because the people would yell at my mom
because we did not have any money and they would yell at us to
get out. It hurt me to see my mom hurting and I couldn't do
much to help her.
I am always trying to help my younger sister and brother to
decrease my mom's load when I come home from school. Mom has
enough to do so I try to play with them and keep them happy. So
I do that at home and maybe not so much homework.
I do not have time to socialize because I am looking to see
if I can help Mom. I follow her around to try to keep things
going. If my mom is late for a bill, I worry and get afraid,
and do not ask her for anything until it is paid.
It is especially hard for my 2-year-old brother because he
does not understand why Mom is always crying. He cries, too. He
asks her not to cry.
He wants Mom's attention. She has to go out a lot to work
and to appointments. He has to stay with different people.
He has no daycare or preschool because there is no money
for that transportation and no openings near us. There are no
services for his age except the Parent-Child Home Program that
comes to us.
We are in a house now, but things are not perfect. We had a
hurricane and the roof caved in, and my ceiling is still
hanging, and it is not fixed, and the landlady yells at my mom.
I do not want to ever be homeless again. I think the only
way we will never be homeless again is if my mom got a
different job--a real job in an office or something. She works
in a restaurant, and I hope that will happen soon.
This year, my mom got her high school diploma and a
driver's license and she is going to school in a few weeks to
be a certified nurse's assistant.
The thing that helped us go all through this is being close
to my mom, and being close to God. Mom does good things for
people even when we don't have enough money, and I know God
will help us.
I would like people to know that it is different going
through this than just hearing about it. You never experienced
being homeless. It is worse than hearing about it or watching a
movie about it. You are in it. There are a lot of kids going
through it.
Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Pastor can be found on page
92 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
Destiny Raynor, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF DESTINY RAYNOR, 9TH GRADER, WINTER SPRINGS HIGH
SCHOOL, SANFORD, FLORIDA
Ms. Raynor. Hello. My name is Destiny Rayner, and I am a
freshman at Winter Springs High School in Florida. I am here
today with my father and my sister, Kimberly. I would also like
to introduce you to the Metzger family--Austin, Arielle, and
their dad. They were homeless in central Florida, too.
My parents used to have this thrift shop and a beauty
store. We lost our housing when the economy got really bad and
we had to close all of our stores. Neither of my parents had a
job, and they just kept looking for several months.
That summer, the power and water got shut off. We didn't
have electricity or water for 6 months. We had to eat at the
gas station at the corner because they had a microwave.
The toilet smelled really bad because we couldn't flush
because the water was shut off. We had to bring buckets to a
local church to fill with water for the toilet bowl.
My parents didn't want to go to a shelter because the
shelter split families up and we wanted to be together. So
after we lost our home, we ended up moving in with my
grandmother. This was horrible. It is a three-bedroom mobile
home but only two rooms were usable.
My mother, sister, and I slept in one bed. My dad slept on
a small couch and my brother slept on a lazy boy chair. We
stayed there for 2 to 3 weeks until we couldn't take it
anymore. My grandmother was also dying of cancer so it was
really hard.
With our last bit of money, we moved into a motel. The
school district homeless coordinator, Beth, met us after 1 week
and started to help us.
My parents pay the bill if my dad is able to make money at
the day work labor place. When we don't have the money, Beth
pays from her donations from her program. Beth is here today,
too.
The hardest thing about living in a motel is being on a bus
and watching all of the other kids getting off knowing that
they are going to their own home and I am going back to a one-
room motel. It makes me feel really upset.
Prior to planning the trip to Washington, I only told one
friend, Jona, about the situation. I was afraid that people
would talk badly about the situation and we would be called
poor and homeless.
My teacher announced in class that we should all donate and
help the homeless kids because they are poor. She was talking
about me.
I know how bad it feels. It is just that any minute, you
can be kicked out of the motel if you do something wrong or if
your parents don't have the money. You just can't go to your
own room and have your own privacy.
I was doing really well in school--As and Bs. But since
this has happened, three of my grades dropped to Cs and Ds. I
am now working on bringing them back up.
Once the school program, Families in Transition, started
helping, it made it easier and took a little weight off my
shoulders. Now, I feel that I can focus more on my school
rather than the home situation.
It is still hard for me and my family. Everyone is just too
loud in one room and my brother always gets a headache. He gets
so much more aggravated than he used to get.
My parents have no personal bonding time with each other
anymore. They are always busy making sure that we are taken
care of and they have enough money to pay for the room.
I have seen my dad cry in the last month more than I have
in my entire life. When I see my father cry it hurts me a lot
because I know he is trying his best and it just still isn't
good enough.
It makes me feel scared that we will never get out. Last
week, he went the whole week without getting a job and it was
horrible.
The Families in Transition program from the school was the
biggest relief because they helped with so much. They helped
set up a school bus so my parents wouldn't have to stress about
getting us to school.
They helped sign us up for a free breakfast and lunch
program and sign us up for a backpack program so every
Thursday, our backpacks are filled with food. Our food stamps
didn't cover the whole month and we would always run out the
last 2 weeks.
There are some programs that provide housing help, but we
don't qualify because my dad doesn't have a regular job and he
doesn't make enough money. When Beth pays for the motel room,
we are considered homeless; when my dad pays for the hotel
room, we are not considered homeless. That doesn't make any
sense to me. It is the same hotel room and it is hard to live
in when you are young, no matter who pays.
What we really need is a home of our own, and since two
nights ago, that has now happened. Because of the ``60
Minutes'' segment, our community came together and provided my
family with a home.
I now know that my family's basic needs will be met, and I
can concentrate on what is really important--my education. My
prayer for today is that not only has our community stepped up
for us, but now for our government to stand up for us as well
and help all of the other homeless children so that they, too,
can get a home, as well.
Thank you for the opportunity to be here today.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Raynor can be found on page
105 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much for your testimony.
We have been joined by another Member from Illinois, Danny
Davis. I ask unanimous consent that he be allowed to
participate. Without objection, it is so ordered.
Starnica Rodgers, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF STARNICA RODGERS, TRUMAN COLLEGE, CHICAGO,
ILLINOIS
Ms. Rodgers. Good morning, everyone. My name is Starnica
Rodgers. I am 18 years old, and I have lived in Chicago my
whole life.
Thank you for the opportunity to testify here today. It is
a true honor.
Currently, I am a student at Truman College. I just
finished my first semester and received one A and two Bs. I am
also 8 months pregnant and I am expecting my baby boy next
month. Don't worry; I checked with my doctor and she said it is
safe to fly.
Right now, I am staying at a shelter for parenting teens on
Chicago's north side. It is run by the Night Ministry.
When I first got there, I was very nervous. I was worried
about being in a new environment. But now, I realize that
everyone is there for the same reason: We are all homeless and
alone.
Since I have been there, I have found support from other
girls and staff. They helped me with my homework and found
clothes for me to wear to school and they are helping me find a
more permanent place to live.
I have been homeless on and off for my whole life. My mom
was a single mother with four kids and has worked minimum wage
jobs her whole life. I remember watching my mother struggle to
pay the rent and us having to go to a shelter when I was five.
I want my life to be better.
As I grew up, my mom and I started getting into a lot of
fights. She was verbally abusive to me and sometimes physically
abusive.
By the time I was 16, I knew I had to leave for my own
safety. There I was, 16 and homeless.
I went from house to house, staying for 2 or 3 days at
other family members' houses, not knowing where I was going to
end up. Throughout the struggles, I was dedicated to graduating
from high school, no matter what.
I worked with the McKinney-Vento counselor so I could get
free transportation to get to school. I graduated this year and
I am very proud of that accomplishment.
I am now in college. I am on the drama team and I was
elected to student senate. I will graduate college no matter
how hard the obstacles may be.
With a college degree, I know that I will be able to get a
good-paying job with a guaranteed salary. My dream is to be a
social worker and help people who are going through the same
struggles I have faced.
Right now, I am working into a transitional program also
run by the Night Ministry. The program receives Federal HUD
funding, but there are not enough housing programs in Chicago
for people like me. Before I got into the program, I had to
call over 25 different programs but they were all full or had a
wait list.
I have had to struggle my whole life to find a place to
call home, so I hope that you understand how important stable
housing is to a young person. Without these programs, I know
that I wouldn't be able to attend college. I would be too busy
worrying about where I was going to stay every night.
Thank you for listening to my story, and thank you for the
supporting programs that are helping me. I hope that you will
think about the 10,000 youth in Chicago who are homeless or the
teens in your town who don't know where they are going to sleep
tonight. Our country should give more money to programs that
help homeless youth so we can be able to break the cycle of
homelessness and become successful adults.
Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Rodgers can be found on page
110 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
And thank you all for your compelling testimony. I don't
know, this must be your first time testifying, but I think you
have a career. That was very, very, very good.
We are now going to have questions from the Members of
Congress, and we will each take 5 minutes to ask questions. And
I will yield myself 5 minutes to start.
Brandon, if I may call you Brandon, you said you were
concerned about HUD's documentation requirements, and I think
you said that in order for you to be successful in accessing
housing services, you had to show that you would be homeless
for a long time. Does that kind of--
Mr. Dunlap. Sixty days, if I am not mistaken, or 14 days in
more than one place. And that would be really inconvenient to
put on the person I was staying with. I didn't want to overstay
my welcome; I was already asking a huge favor, and to ask for
documentation I think would be--I didn't want to jeopardize my
situation.
Chairwoman Biggert. It seems, too, that certainly you
didn't want to be homeless for a long time, so that it defeats
the purpose of--
Mr. Dunlap. Yes.
Chairwoman Biggert. --HUD helping.
And then you also said that in school--schools that really
recognized the homeless and provided the services.
Mr. Dunlap. Yes.
Chairwoman Biggert. And I think that has been mentioned a
couple of times that--we are trying to not--and we have already
worked with the schools and the definition there. We are really
trying to move this into Health and Human Services and HUD to
provide such help. Why do the schools seem to have the ability
to help the homeless?
Mr. Dunlap. At school, the teachers would be able to
recognize certain patterns in students, and no representative
from HUD knew my situation, and I wouldn't tell them if they
asked because I didn't know this person. But at school, I am
familiar with the teacher; if the teacher asked and showed
genuine concern, I would share information.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
And then, Rumi Khan, you testified about finding Safe
Harbor. Could you tell us a little bit more about Safe Harbor,
how you got into that, and what it means to you?
Mr. Khan. Me and my mom came in and asked for a place to
stay and they gave--first we were in the emergency side for a
little while and--
Chairwoman Biggert. Who is they?
Mr. Khan. Safe Harbor.
Chairwoman Biggert. Okay.
Mr. Khan. Safe Harbor gave us a place to stay which is on
the emergency side, and we stayed there for a little while and
then they got to move us up to the transitional side, and it is
like a little apartment. And we have our own space, we have our
own room, and it feels very safe.
And sometimes, I don't feel homeless because I do have a
roof over my head. And me and my mom are together in that room,
and we have neighbors and we have friends in there.
Chairwoman Biggert. How did you find Safe Harbor? Was it
recommended to you by somebody?
Mr. Khan. Yes.
Chairwoman Biggert. That was fortunate, wasn't it?
Mr. Khan. Yes.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
And, Brooklyn, you said that your mother now is going to
school to get a diploma and a driver's license and then is
going to be trained to be a nursing assistant. Who helped your
mother during the hardest times and how did she figure out how
to do that as well as take care of you?
Ms. Pastor. I would say Ms. Benjamin helped us the most
through everything.
Chairwoman Biggert. What kind of help do you wish your
mother had when you were moving between places?
Ms. Pastor. I don't know. I just wish--because she was
always there for everyone else, even when we didn't have it,
and I wish that they would have done the same for her when we
needed help, but they didn't.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
And then, Brittany Koon, you certainly had some bad
experiences, and--but it seems like with--you are wearing the
uniform, that things have really straightened out for you?
Ms. Koon. Yes--
Chairwoman Biggert. In your statement, you said that
ignoring the youth has only reinforced your knowledge that your
community abandoned you and that nobody cared about you. Do you
still, as you have moved on, feel that way, that--
Ms. Koon. Honestly, yes, I do.
Chairwoman Biggert. Okay. Thank you.
My time has expired and, Mr. Cleaver, you are recognized
for 5 minutes.
Mr. Cleaver. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
I really have reservations about asking you a lot of
questions, or any, for that matter. In my State of Missouri, we
have approximately 24,000 homeless children, which means, to me
at least, there is a certain level of invisibility, and some of
you kind of mentioned it, and that is you try to stay under the
radar, you don't want to be noticed.
I am wondering, as you have struggled, have you met other
young people who were in your same situation, and if so, how
did--was there any attempt to measure each other's situation to
see if there was a place or a way to get help? Did any of you
meet others in your same situation?
Which even promotes the whole issue that it is probably
more severe that--this invisibility. They wouldn't want anybody
to notice, to be accurate.
Ms. Rodgers?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes. I am actually in a program now where
there are several other girls in my situation, and we all
connected and asked, ``Okay, how did you get here and did you
call other resources that maybe turned you down or that we can
get in, because we all are in the same situation?'' Well, we
are. We are either pregnant or have a child.
So the programs that they were into we just asked, ``Okay,
well could we get into those programs?'' and the answer was
always no. This is probably the best way for us to go is to
stay in this shelter.
Mr. Cleaver. One final question: My wife and I took in a
young man and kept him and actually sent him off to school with
our kids--our twin boys. He was later killed in a ValuJet crash
in the Everglades. But the one thing that we discovered was
that he had never been to a dentist. He had never been to a
doctor, for some obvious reasons.
And I don't need any details, but I am wondering how much
health care you have had--going to dentists or getting
checkups. Anybody?
Mr. Dunlap. As a child, I was well taken care of, but as
the years went on, like in high school, I don't recall ever
really going to the doctor. It is a question of how did I get
past the physicals now, so I am just--no doctor visits, no
dentists, nothing.
Mr. Khan. I have, also. I go to the doctor or the dentist,
too, all the time.
Ms. Koon. I didn't have a lot of health care, but I had to
go do a lot of work at the dentist in order to get into the
Army.
Mr. Cleaver. Thank you very much--
I yield back the balance of my time.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
The gentleman from Ohio, Mr. Stivers, is recognized for 5
minutes.
Mr. Stivers. Thank you so much, Madam Chairwoman.
I think many of you mentioned in your testimony--I think
Brandon, and Brittany, and I think Destiny all talked a little
bit about--or maybe it was Brooklyn--about grades, and how your
housing situation really impacted your schooling and your
ability to continue your education. Can you just help me
understand--obviously those businesses are linked, and it then
can change the course of your life in a negative way because
you don't get the education you are pursuing or you don't get
as good an education.
Do any of you want to expound upon the--sort of the impact
and the connection between your experience when you were
homeless and--or having to jump between home and home, and what
it meant to your schoolwork and your ability to ready yourself
for your future?
Mr. Dunlap. It was very difficult to study, given the long
distance traveling, and maybe even traveling again after I
traveled the initial long distance. There was no real time for
homework. It was a lot of planning and, okay, it is late now; I
have to go to sleep because class starts at 8:00.
Mr. Khan. It is hard for me because I lack sleep, too, and
when we were moving, it was very stressing and tiring, and
staying up late was affecting my schoolwork because I couldn't
focus in school, and my grades have gone down a little bit, but
I am trying to go to sleep earlier and bring my grades up so I
can get As.
Ms. Koon. It affects you that when you are sitting in class
you are sitting there worried about where are you going to go
after, where are you going to eat, how are you going to get
your homework done? Half the time, you don't have Internet
access, or if you break a pencil, you might not have a pencil
sharpener to complete it.
And then, you are worried about all night, well, am I going
to be safe? What is going to happen to me?
Do I have the gas--for me, I was living in my car--do I
have the gas to get back to school tomorrow? Should I sleep in
the school parking lot and let the cops bang on my door again
and wake me up? You are always worried about something.
Ms. Rodgers. Yes. I can speak on that.
In high school, it was harder than college because there
were people I grew up with and it was hard to let them know
that I was homeless or that I needed help. But in college, I
got more help at the shelter that I am living in, like I got
more help with my essays.
In high school English, I had to do a lot of papers, and I
didn't have a lot of the equipment that I needed to do the
papers with. And the after-school programs that I was involved
in didn't help me either.
But going on into college, I got a lot more support at the
shelter I have lived in. But when I was homeless, my grades
were maybe Ds and Cs. I was barely passing. And in high school,
I got As and Bs for my first semester.
Mr. Stivers. I think many of you talked about the HUD
requirement on documentation, and I think Chairwoman Biggert
had asked the question before. But obviously that came up in
multiple testimonies from you, and I think that is something we
need to take a pretty serious look at because obviously, I
think Brandon did a good job of explaining how it created a
hassle on the people who were trying to help you, and a lot of
you brought it up, and so I know that is something else we need
to take a serious look at.
Are there any other specific issues that you think we
should take a serious look at? I think the chairwoman's bill
addresses a lot of things that will help homeless youth. Does
anybody have anything other things that--like that that this--
through the system that you experienced?
Ms. Raynor. When you live in a motel, if you can pay for it
at least for 14 days, you are not categorized as homeless, but
it is still not your home. Because, as I mentioned, at any
moment you can be kicked out for anything.
We had a lot of help from Beth. Like, when someone else
paid for it for you, you were homeless. If you can pay for it
for 14 days, you are not.
But it is the same room either way it goes. It is not your
home. You don't have your own privacy. You are all crammed in
one little room.
That makes no sense because it is the same place. And I
think that should be changed.
Mr. Stivers. Great. Thank you.
And I appreciate your time. It looks like my time has
almost expired. I really appreciate you sharing your stories
and experiences with us, and we are going to work hard to do
the best we can to help. So thank you so much.
And I yield back.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you, Mr. Stivers.
Ms. Waters, do you have any questions?
Ms. Waters. Thank you very much--
Chairwoman Biggert. You are recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Waters. Yes.
I would like to first thank all of our young panelists who
are here today for coming to share your stories so that we can
be better informed and know how best to use our public policy
influence to do much better than we are doing about
homelessness. I would like to share with you that recently I
decided to walk through the systems in Los Angeles, and what I
saw disturbs me greatly. I do not think the systems are working
the way we think they are from up here.
And for the last 3 or 4 weeks, I have been trying to get a
family--a mother with three children--placed in transitional to
permanent housing, and I have not been able to do it. So I have
gone to the big agency, called the oversight agency, and I am
confronting them on how the systems are not working. And I
think that the members of this committee, Mrs. Biggert--under
her leadership--we should all not just visit shelters and sit
down and talk with people who are supposed to be implementing
what we think is public policy; we have to walk through the
system with people who require shelters and are--transitional
housing or permanent housing.
I discovered that this mother with three children was being
asked for all kinds of documentation before she could get into
this shelter. They wanted the birth certificates of all the
kids, which is unreasonable, and some other documentation that
they were asking for.
So let me just say to you that a priority on my list of how
I spend my time will be to try and correct some of these
problems. Other things I discovered: In one shelter, they had
to be in by 4:00 or they lost their bed, and this person had
stayed out till 5:00 so I had to put them in my car and take
them back and tell them that I wanted them to be sheltered
despite the fact he had missed by 1 hour. And it goes on, and
on, and on, so I know what you are going through.
One question I may follow up on from Mr. Stivers, and that
is, I am very concerned about while you are trying to get into
permanent housing, your families--what is happening with your
education and school? Because long distances--many of our
homeless young people are long distances from the schools.
Would it help if somehow we could put something in the
system that would require tutoring at every shelter where there
are children? What kind of assistance could help while your
families are working on getting permanent housing? Do you have
any suggestions what we could do to help with--how we could
give support so you don't fall behind and you don't get bad
grades simply because you can't sleep at night because you are
in a situation where you don't feel safe, or there is noise?
Would tutoring help, with someone on the site, or places
where you have numbers of young people? Would it help to try
and get some assistance from the school district to have
teachers or a teacher on site? Would any of that help?
Mr. Dunlap. I definitely feel tutoring would help a lot.
And I also feel that someone trained to deal with children in
high-stress situations would also help.
Mr. Khan. I think transportation to school would help a lot
because I ride my bike to school and it is very tiring, and I
get to school very exhausted and my legs hurt.
Ms. Waters. How many schools have you gone to, or stories
about young people who may have gone to three, four, five
schools in a year? Have you heard that?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes. I actually tried to stay at the same
school, which I shouldn't have done because I was--I missed so
many days going from house to house. I was going from the south
side and my school was on the west side. And I should have
transferred schools but I knew that I wasn't going to be on the
south side for long.
So either way, it was hard.
Ms. Waters. So if you had a teacher or a tutor who was in
the area of the shelter who could keep you on track until you
could get in a permanent place so you wouldn't lose time or
lose grades, would that help?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes. That would help a lot. And it would
especially help high school students. Because I know the
classes that are mandatory, those are the classes that I need
help with the most. Those are the classes that the tutor can
help me with.
Ms. Waters. So if there was a teacher who was helping you
and then could help you transfer your work to your permanent
school once you got permanent placement and be like an advocate
and a support person, that would be helpful?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes.
Ms. Waters. Thank you very much. I yield back.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
Let me just say that the first thing that we did work on in
this whole issue was the education, and to make sure--this was
a--it was put into No Child Left Behind and it was to makes
sure that no homeless child was turned away from school. And we
didn't have to have the records; you didn't have to have your
grades and whatever, but you could be enrolled immediately in
school where you were homeless living at the time or where you
had been in school. And I know that it took us, then, several
years--and this was under Mr. Miller's committee at the time,
and--
Ms. Waters. Would the gentlelady yield for a second?
Chairwoman Biggert. --and just was that--go ahead--
Ms. Waters. I just wanted to add to that, that is
absolutely very helpful, but the real problem I am running into
is the number of schools--
Chairwoman Biggert. Right.
Ms. Waters. --that the young people end up going to while
they are homeless, and they lose credit.
Chairwoman Biggert. And having to switch so often, and you
are absolutely right. But we did add transportation, too. I
think that took us a long time to get that in.
But I think you are absolutely right that we should really
look at maybe the tutor or the teacher actually at these
shelters. That would be a big help. And that would go through
the HUD. But that is something we should look at for this bill,
so I appreciate it.
Ms. Waters. Thank you very much.
Chairwoman Biggert. Mr. Green, from Texas, you are
recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Green. Thank you very much, Madam Chairwoman.
I also would like to thank the ranking member, Mr.
Gutierrez, for his efforts in these areas, as well.
I am very concerned about your indications that you were
homeless but you did not want anyone to know that you were
homeless. And I understand why. You have all spoken quite well,
and let me compliment you. It took a lot of courage to do it as
well as you have, and I thank you for the courage that you have
exhibited today.
But you all said that you didn't want people to know. Was
there, on any of the school campuses, a counselor or someone
who had some degree of responsibility to work with you and help
you from the school campus? Did anyone have a counselor or
anyone on the campus that you were able to work with?
Mr. Dunlap. There were counselors on staff at school but I
didn't speak to them until I had a connection from someone who
didn't work at the school.
Mr. Green. Until you had--did you say a connection?
Mr. Dunlap. Yes.
Mr. Green. Would you--
Mr. Dunlap. Rhonda Perwin--she helped me get scholarships
and introduced me to the Coalition for the Homeless, and from
that point on, that is when I talked to the counselor, Mr.
Murphy, at my high school, but he didn't help any.
Mr. Green. Was there any outreach? Did you feel that you
were in an environment wherein you could go to someone at the
school and say, ``We need help. We have this situation and I
just want to talk to someone?'' Did any of you feel that there
was any avenue, any means available for you to do this?
Mr. Dunlap. I personally didn't reach out because I didn't
want any authorities going after my parents.
Mr. Green. Yes, Ms. Raynor?
Ms. Raynor. I didn't have on-school help, but we had a
coordinator named Beth. She is actually here today. She is
helping with a few hundred families, helping them with food,
places to stay, making sure they keep up with their education.
If it wasn't for her, I would still be staying in a motel,
and my grades would still be horrible. At my school, we don't
have anyone on campus, really, who helps, but there are a lot
of kids there.
We had a program that everyone got to come and have a free
lunch and stuff. We had hundreds and hundreds of kids there who
came because they were homeless, and there is nothing--there is
no one at the school to help, but most of the kids don't want
everyone to know. There is no point in telling people if
nothing is going to happen.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Ms. Raynor.
Ms. Rodgers?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes. I actually didn't feel comfortable
telling everybody that I was homeless because I knew that they
were going to look at me differently. I was afraid that it
would get out in the whole school and that I was going to have
to transfer because the people were looking down on me.
But I did talk to this one lady who came up to the school
and who got me into the McKinney-Vento program that gave me bus
cards so I can get to school, and they noticed that I was
homeless because of my attendance, and I was coming in late--
like, I was doing all the work and I was getting good grades
doing the work, but my attendance was affecting my grades. So
they actually came to me, but I didn't actually tell anyone my
whole story.
Mr. Green. Yes, Ms. Koon?
Ms. Koon. It is not always that you don't want to share,
because I am very open when it comes to sharing with people. It
is just that society puts a label on you.
Like, I was talking to people in my unit about--they asked
me what I was going to D.C. for, and I let them know, and they
laughed at me. They said, ``You can't get into the Army if you
are that way,'' or, ``Why are you going to this expensive
college and you are living in your car? That is not possible.''
People just label it based on what you are doing with what you
have.
Mr. Green. Mr. Khan?
Mr. Khan. Also, I haven't gone to my friends because I am
embarrassed and I am afraid that they are going to make fun of
me because they have everything and I am homeless, and it is
kind of embarrassing for me. And I don't go to the counselor at
my school, but me and my mom went to a counselor and she was
supposed to come to the school every other week or something,
and she has never come, and I can't share with anybody but my
mom.
Mr. Green. Thank you very much.
Madam Chairwoman, I just think I will close with this: We
all have a duty to do all that we can, even if it is not
enough. We have a duty to all that we can, and from my perch, I
am convinced that we are not doing enough. There is more that
we can do that we are not doing.
And while we have addressed the young people who have
spoken, I do want to thank the adults who came today who are
with them, whether you are a mother, father, brother,
significant other--whatever. I just want to thank you for the
role that you are playing in helping us to give these young
people a brighter future.
And with this, I will yield back the balance of my time.
Thank you.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you, Mr. Green.
And let me just say that we are very happy that you have
told us, because--and not been afraid to come to the U.S.
Congress, because things are going to change, and it is--we are
working on this bill, and just giving us a lot more to put into
it. So we really appreciate that.
Mr. Miller, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. George Miller of California. Thank you very much, Madam
Chairwoman.
Let me certainly begin by thanking you so much for coming
and sharing your stories with us, as Members of Congress. The
legislation that is under consideration this morning is really
designed to address many of the things that you have mentioned,
and some parts of the Federal law already do that, and other
parts are inconsistent with that, and we are trying to remove
those barriers so it would be easier for you, and your parents,
and the counselors to access the services that you need while
you and your family members are homeless.
So that is our goal is to address exactly what you have
told us in person here today. But I think it is very important
that we hear from you.
And I want to tell you that you just--all of you just
exhibit a remarkable strength and maturity beyond your years,
and I recognize that adverse situations, such as being
homeless, can make you grow up very fast, and that is
unfortunate. But you have obviously responded to help other
members of your family in this same situation, and it is an
exhibition of strength and character that sometimes we don't
always see.
But also, I want to just commend you for your own
achievements in school, as difficult as it has been. There have
been ups and downs, but you have persevered, and you should
really feel very good about yourselves, and certainly we feel
very good about your willingness to come here and to publicly
demonstrate to us the need for this legislation so that it
would be easier for you and your families and for other
homeless children.
On the other side of this ledger, on the education side, we
have put many provisions into the law to try to reduce the
barriers and the obstacles to you getting services in schools--
transportation and counselors being required. But again, when
they go to some of the housing agencies, they find that there
are barriers, and we are trying to reduce those. So hopefully,
your testimony will turn out to be very valuable to us and very
helpful to us.
And you look back and you will remember this, when you made
this kind of contribution on behalf of others who will be
homeless in the future. So I hope you take that away from this
hearing. And thank you again so very, very much.
And obviously, our very best wishes for you and your
families and that circumstances will change for the better for
all you. Thank you.
Chairwoman Biggert. The gentleman yields back.
Mr. George Miller of California. Yes, I yield back.
Chairwoman Biggert. The gentleman from Illinois, Mr. Davis,
is recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. Davis. Thank you very much, Madam Chairwoman. And let
me first of all thank you not only for calling this hearing,
but certainly for giving me the opportunity to participate,
though I am not a member of this particular committee.
I also want to commend you. We get an opportunity to ride
back and forth together on the airplane, and sometimes we even
get seated in the same row. And I want to commend you for your
passion and your sensitivity to this issue. I know of it
firsthand because we do get a chance to talk, and I am aware of
how high you hold this as a priority and the work that you have
done on it over the years, so I thank you very much for that.
I also want to commend Representative Miller for the
leadership he has provided as chairman and now ranking member
of the Education Committee, trying to make sure that we merge
together the housing and social service needs with the
educational needs of students who are homeless.
I want to commend all of the witnesses. I have been totally
intrigued by your testimony and I appreciate your level of
understanding and recognition of where our country not only is,
but where we need to go.
Particularly do I want to welcome Brandon and Starnica,
since both of them are from Chicago, where I come from. And I
think the Night Ministry, which I am very familiar with, is one
of the most innovative and creative programs I have ever heard
about, read about, participated with, or observed what it does
not only with homeless youth but with other homeless
individuals, and we are fortunate that the Coalition for the
Homeless has been one of the most effective advocacy groups for
homeless persons in this country, at least for the last 20
years. And so, I would commend them.
Brandon, I didn't get a chance to hear your testimony,
unfortunately. Are you associated with a program, or what
program are you connected with?
Mr. Dunlap. I am here with the Coalition for the Homeless.
Mr. Davis. All right. So you are connected with the
Coalition for the Homeless, and I am sure you can verify what I
said about them, because not only do they pinpoint the need for
services, but they are so inspirational in terms of their
approaches to doing it.
Starnica, where do you get your health care?
Ms. Rodgers. Iriteen, which was connected with the Night
Ministry. The recommended me over to Iriteen.
Mr. Davis. Is it a clinic? Is it a--
Ms. Rodgers. It is the clinic.
Mr. Davis. Is it a school-based clinic?
Ms. Rodgers. No.
Mr. Davis. It is not a school-based clinic but is it a
community health center clinic?
Ms. Rodgers. It is for teens, so it is a teen clinic.
Mr. Davis. It is a teen health clinic, which I think also
do fantastic work. So I am just delighted that you all came to
share with us.
Chicago is somewhat fortunate. Truman College, which you
attend, which is a part of the city college system, does, in
fact, have a level of sensitivity to all kinds of students. It
is also a college that is a united nations of students, and so
they pay particular attention to the needs of young people, the
needs of their students, and they are located in an area where
I think individuals from every race, creed, nationality,
color--everybody lives in Uptown, in the area where it is
located, and I think that also helps.
The Chicago Board of Education has tried--I happen to be
very much aware of what they do because the woman who directed
their homeless program for several years happened to have been
my sister's classmate in college, so I became very familiar
with them. The one question that I wanted to ask is, do any of
you know other homeless young people who have not been able to
connect with any program?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes.
Mr. Davis. So you know young people who are not connected
to a program or a service?
Ms. Rodgers. Yes.
Mr. Davis. Brandon, do you know young people who--a few. A
few.
And that kind of projects and indicates that we not only
need the legislation, but we also need to make sure that there
is adequate funding for the programs that are authorized.
So again, I thank you all for coming, for your
participation.
And I thank you, Madam Chairwoman, for your diligence and
for the opportunity to be here. And I yield back.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
We have a second panel, but we--I have just one question,
so if people would like the second round, if you could keep it
to 2 minutes so that we could have the second panel.
But I just want to come back to--Rumi, you talked about the
fact that you and your mother were turned away from a shelter
because you were an older boy.
And I think, Destiny, you talked about the fact that going
to a shelter, you were afraid that the family would be split
up. So I wanted to come back to that.
If you two could explain a little bit more. I know that
this has been true, and I have heard this before, that they
don't want to take in older boys. But what happened, and did
this happen in other places, too?
Mr. Khan. It has happened in--like in Safe Harbor, they
don't accept older males or single males. I guess it is because
they don't want to start relationships in a shelter. That is my
best guess.
And, yes, that has happened to me, and I am not sure why it
has happened. So, yes, I--
Chairwoman Biggert. That is something we will have to look
into, then. Thank you.
And Destiny?
Ms. Raynor. Most of the shelters down in Florida separate
the males and females not depending upon the age, and we all
wanted to stay together because it would separate my younger
brother and my dad. They would go to a separate shelter and it
would be me, my little sister, and my mom. And we didn't want
that to happen.
Chairwoman Biggert. What would happen, let's say, to a
family that has--the father and two daughters who are young?
Ms. Raynor. They would be separated. The children would go
to a different shelter, and I guess the leaders of the shelter
would take care of them.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you. We will look into this, too.
Thank you.
Mr. Cleaver, do you have anything just--okay. Thank you.
Mr. Stivers?
Mr. Stivers. Thank you. I will be brief.
I just wanted to say to Brandon, and Rumi, and Brittany,
and Brooklyn, and Starnica how proud we are of you and what a
great job you did on your testimony today. We are proud of your
accomplishments, your college graduation, joining the military,
but we are also proud of your perseverance and your passion on
this subject.
I want to share just a really quick story so you understand
that while homelessness affects a lot of people, it certainly
does not have to get in your way. We have a colleague--a good
friend of mine named Hansen Clarke, from Detroit, Michigan--who
was homeless, and after his homelessness he went on to college,
and then became a State representative, State senator, and now
he is a Member of Congress.
So I just want all of you to know that you have bright
futures. You have a lot to offer our society. And we, as a
society and as an institution here in Congress, need to do a
better job of trying to help get folks the resources they need,
and that is what I think the chairwoman's bill is about. And I
am looking forward to supporting that and I appreciate your
testimony today, and we are going to take it and try to address
the situations you brought up. But I just wanted to make sure
you know how proud of you we all are. Thank you.
Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
Mr. Green, do you have any comments?
Mr. Green. Just a brief comment, Madam Chairwoman. I think
these young people have given us an opportunity today to
understand that this is not a problem for Democrats or
Republicans or conservatives or liberals. This is an American
problem and it deserves an American solution.
I look forward to working with you to reach that solution.
Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
Chairwoman Biggert. Mr. Miller? Thank you.
Mr. Davis?
Mr. Davis. Madam Chairwoman, the only thing that I would
say is, I remember my mother telling me when I was a young
person that problems are like babies--the more you nurse them
the more they grow--and that it is not always what your problem
does to you but it is a matter of what you do with what could
have been your problem.
I think you all are well on the way to not having problems
but having solutions.
Thank you very much.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
And with that, we will excuse this panel, and there are
seats available for you to listen to the other panel.
The Chair notes that some Members may have additional
questions for this panel which they may wish to submit in
writing. Without objection, the hearing record will remain open
for 30 days for Members to submit written questions to these
witnesses and to place their responses in the record.
If we could have the second panel come up.
I know it is going to be hard to top that panel, but thank
you all for being here, and I will now introduce the second
panel: Ms. Alicia Cackley, Director of Financial Markets and
Community Investment, U.S. Government Accountability Office;
Mr. Seth Diamond, commissioner, New York City Department of
Homeless Services; Ms. Maria Estella Garza, homeless liaison
for the San Antonio Independent School District; Mr. Mark
Johnston, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Special Needs, Office
of Community Planning and Development, U.S. Department of
Housing and Urban Development, commonly known as HUD; Ms.
Barbara Poppe, executive director, U.S. Interagency Council on
Homelessness; and Dr. Grace Whitney, director of Connecticut
Head Start State Collaboration Office, Connecticut State
Department of Education.
Thank you all for being here, and you will be recognized
for 5 minutes.
We will start with Ms. Cackley.
STATEMENT OF ALICIA PUENTE CACKLEY, DIRECTOR, FINANCIAL MARKETS
AND COMMUNITY INVESTMENT, U.S. GOVERNMENT ACCOUNTABILITY OFFICE
Ms. Cackley. Chairwoman Biggert and members of the
subcommittee, good morning. I am pleased to be here to
participate in today's hearing on homeless children and youth.
The Census Bureau indicates that 22 percent of all children
in the United States lived in poverty in 2010, and the
Department of Education identified nearly 940,000 homeless
students during the 2009-2010 school year, an 18 percent
increase since the 2007-2008 school year. Multiple Federal
agencies administer programs designed to address the needs of
children and youth experiencing homelessness, but some programs
use different definitions to determine eligibility. These
definitions range from people living in emergency or
transitional shelters or on the street to those living with
others because of economic hardship or living in motels or
campgrounds because they lack other adequate accommodations.
My statement today is based on GAO's June 2010 report on
differences in the Federal definitions of homelessness and
other factors that impact the effectiveness of programs serving
persons experiencing homelessness. In that report, we found
that definitional differences have posed challenges to
providing services for persons experiencing homelessness,
including children and youth. In particular, children and youth
living in certain precarious situations, such as doubling up
with others or living in motels, historically were excluded
from receiving government-funded housing services, and we
certainly heard about that this morning.
In our work, we also found that the data collected on the
homeless have a number of shortcomings, and consequently do not
fully capture the true extent and nature of homelessness.
Further, counts of homeless children and youth vary by agency,
partly because various Federal programs have used different
definitions.
Congress enacted the Homeless Emergency Assistance and
Rapid Transition to Housing Act of 2009, the HEARTH Act, which
broadened the general definition of homelessness and provided
great statutory specificity concerning those who should be
considered homeless. Last month, HUD issued a new rule on the
definition of homelessness, adding a new category:
unaccompanied youth and families with children and youth who
are defined as homeless under other Federal statutes.
The HEARTH Act and HUD's recent definitional changes may
alleviate some challenges previously faced by children and
youth in accessing services. In particular, some children and
youth who previously were not considered homeless by HUD will
now qualify as homeless. However, not enough time has passed
for us to assess the impact of these changes, and the
broadening of the definition does not mean that everyone who
meets the new definition will be entitled to benefits in all
homeless assistance programs. Constraints on resources will
likely continue to restrict access to housing services for many
children and youth.
Another finding in our 2010 report was that different
definitions of homelessness make effective collaboration across
Federal programs more difficult. Based on our work, we
recommended that Federal agencies develop a common vocabulary
for homelessness.
The agencies agreed with our recommendations and have taken
some steps toward implementing them. For example, in January of
this year the Interagency Council convened a meeting of experts
to discuss the development of a common vocabulary and issued a
report to Congress in June that summarized the feedback
received during that meeting. The report notes that a common
vocabulary would allow Federal agencies to better measure the
scope and dimensions of homelessness and may ease program
implementation and coordination.
Recently, Interagency Council staff told us that they held
three meetings this fall to discuss implementation of a common
vocabulary and data standard with key Federal agencies. The
Interagency Council also noted that individual Federal agencies
have taken some positive steps to create this common data
standard and improve coordination across agencies. For example,
HHS and VA have been working with HUD to plan the potential
transition of some of their data collection and reporting to
HUD's Homeless Management Information System.
To sum up, we believe that a common vocabulary and data
standard used by all the Federal agencies that provide services
for the homeless is an important step toward the goal of
providing efficient and effective programs to end homelessness.
It would allow for the collection of consistent data that
agencies could use to better understand the nature of
homelessness and it would allow for more effective
communication and collaboration across Federal, State, and
local programs that serve the homeless.
Chairwoman Biggert, this concludes my prepared statement. I
would be happy to respond to questions.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Cackley can be found on page
50 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
Mr. Diamond, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF SETH DIAMOND, COMMISSIONER, NEW YORK CITY
DEPARTMENT OF HOMELESS SERVICES
Mr. Diamond. Thank you.
Good morning, Chairwoman Biggert, and members of the
subcommittee. I am pleased to be with you today to discuss New
York City's ongoing efforts to prevent family homelessness and
to work with those who are homeless to return to the community
as quickly as possible.
New York City's approach mirrors President Obama's Federal
strategic plan to prevent and end homelessness. It emphasized
preventing homelessness, increasing economic security through
employment, improving access to mainstream programs, and
improving the health and stability of vulnerable populations.
As we heard so powerfully this morning, shelter can be
particularly difficult for children, many of whom have to leave
their school and community they know when coming into the
shelter system. There are 16,500 children in New York City's
shelter system, and we work closely with all our families to
ensure we can bring as much stability as is possible into the
lives of children living in shelter.
The most important service we can provide for children is
to make sure they are enrolled in school and are attending each
day. We recognize that teachers and Education Department
officials are critical in those efforts. We try and place
families in shelter as close as possible to the school where
their youngest child was enrolled, and staff from the City's
Department of Education is located at our family intake center
to assist families and enroll children in a new school if that
turns out to be necessary.
Once families are placed in shelter, education staff
collaborates with shelter-based staff to ensure children have
transportation to reach school. We have also begun to provide
attendance data to shelters so they can track how children are
attending school and work with families where attendance is an
issue. We have also established homework rooms in shelters as a
quiet place for students to work and receive tutoring from the
many not-for-profit organizations that partner with us.
It is far better for families not to be in shelter at all.
To help those already in shelter, we have worked to increase
our employment efforts, and this year, alone 7,500 shelter
households have moved into jobs providing not only income, but
greater stability.
For those at risk of homelessness, New York City prevents
homelessness primarily through a network of 13 prevention
offices, called Homebase, located throughout the City. These
offices use a range of services in their efforts to fight
homelessness. Among the services is a close coordination with
local schools. Homebase does regular presentations to parent
and teacher groups and school officials so that if they become
aware that a family is dealing with housing issues they can be
referred for services.
The service mix that Homebase offers is different in each
case, but our offices are operated under two important
principles. First, those who ask for assistance must take
concrete and verifiable steps to improve their situation, and
assistance is contingent on their taking those steps.
Individuals working with a caseworker must design a plan to
address the circumstances that put them at risk of homelessness
and put that plan into action. The plan might include, for
example, an aggressive job search, looking for a new apartment,
or attending financial counseling.
Second, as called for in the Open Door report, Homebase is
an evidence-based effort where we continuously and rigorously
review our work to ensure it is efficient and cost-effective.
Especially at a time of limited resources, it is critical that
our services be based on solid and reliable data. Homebase
meets that test and its programs are continually evaluated to
both ensure we are targeting those most in need of services and
that wherever possible, we are providing the services that are
not only beneficial to the family but will prevent those
households from needing shelter.
To further ensure Homebase prevention services are
effective, we have undertaken a series of independent
evaluations of the program. These reviews, conducted by leading
researchers at universities across the country, as well as a
random assignment study undertaken by Abt Associates, one of
the Nation's leading social sciences research firms, looks at a
series of the most critical questions involving our prevention
efforts. The research is under way and we look forward to
sharing the results as those findings become available.
Prevention efforts have become a greater part of the
national discussion of homelessness, and we are gratified that
the new Emergency Solutions Grants (ESG) supports prevention
work. We think this change will be critical in encouraging
communities across the country to direct more resources towards
prevention, and believe if those programs are established and
operated under the high standards we have used, they can be
effective, and believe it would be a good investment of
taxpayer dollars to expand the ESG funding to allow additional
prevention resources to be put in place.
HUD resources now are primarily dedicated to shelter,
however, should be focused on those with the greatest need.
With financing already stretched thin, to further dilute those
allocations would hurt the substantial efforts being made in
New York and across the country to assist those in shelter.
Dedicated resources are essential to provide those in
shelter with needed housing, employment, and rehabilitative and
case management services. While those living with others may be
in need of services, those needs can be addressed through other
funding streams, such as ESG. Existing allocations, such as the
Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) program, also
provide an opportunity to assist those at risk of homelessness.
I thank you for the opportunity to testify and look forward
to answering your questions.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Diamond can be found on page
63 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
Ms. Garza, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MARIA ESTELLA GARZA, HOMELESS LIAISON, SAN ANTONIO
INDEPENDENT SCHOOL DISTRICT
Ms. Garza. Thank you.
Good morning, Representative Biggert, Representative
Gutierrez, and members of the subcommittee. My name is Estella
Garza, and for the past 17 years I have been the homeless
liaison at San Antonio Independent School District in San
Antonio, Texas.
Last year, we enrolled 3,171 homeless students in San
Antonio ISD. That is a 56 percent increase over the year
before, and we are on track for another increase this year.
About 80 percent of the homeless students we serve live in
doubled-up situations, staying with other people because they
have no other place to go. We can debate HUD homeless versus Ed
homeless, but in reality, they are all the same kids. Families
and youth can't find spaces in the shelters or the shelters
don't have the space to serve families or unaccompanied minors,
so they are all--what is left is just for them to be doubled
up.
And they bounce from one situation to another. In San
Antonio there isn't a double-up population, a motel population,
and a shelter population; it is all one group--a homeless
population.
However they are defined, they are here and they will be
here. If they are not counted in our view of homelessness, it
will be extremely skewed.
And when we talk about ending homelessness in 5 or 10
years, we must realize that we cannot do that without
addressing the needs of our doubled-up children and youth
because if they continue to experience the instability of
doubling up as their norm, then they will become the chronic
homeless adults of tomorrow.
As we heard from our youth who testified earlier, doubled-
up children live in extremely overcrowded and stressful
conditions that affect every aspect of their development. We
work hard to serve our families and youth despite their
constant mobility, but since they have no way to access stable
housing, ultimately school districts are losing children.
Example: I assisted a mother this October who had been
doubled up in 5 different homes in a 2-month period. She didn't
know where to enroll her son. That same day, he was enrolled,
but I couldn't help to access HUD's services. She was not
homeless, according to HUD.
Another family who comes to mind is a mom, a veteran with a
high school son. They were living in a motel in a terrible
neighborhood in one room with no cooking facilities--not even a
microwave or a refrigerator.
I remember her son's exact words: ``This life is for the
birds, not humans.'' Housing services? Mom paid the hotel. They
are not homeless, according to HUD.
I had hoped the changes to the HUD definition and the
HEARTH Act would allow San Antonio to provide housing and
supportive services to the children and youth I serve. However,
after reading the regulations, and particularly the
documentation requirements, I realized that the new definition
would not make any difference for the vast majority of my
families and youth.
For example, it will be impossible for a doubled-up family
to provide verification from the host family about how long
they can stay, how many times they have moved, or even
confirming they were actually staying there at all. Host
families don't want to admit to any agency that they have two
families in their apartment when their lease and occupancy
indicates one family.
I have seen families get evicted from HUD-subsidized
housing for going over the occupancy limits by housing a
doubled-up family, so now we have two homeless families, not
one. So it is understandable that even a case manager calling a
host family will be threatening and likely to result in the
host family asking the doubled-up family to leave immediately.
If HUD's goal is to create a high degree of anxiety and
animosity among family members in my community, these
documentation requirements are an excellent way of doing that.
They will destroy families' support networks, create more
mobility for my kids, more stress, and even greater challenges.
It seems like HUD is trying to keep their old definition of
homelessness and eliminate my doubled-up families and youth by
requiring too much documentation.
I understand HUD categorizes these families and youth as
at-risk, but the services my families and youth need most are
housing and supportive services, which are not available for
at-risk families. Plus, the at-risk population, again, won't be
counted, which again creates a false picture of homelessness in
my community.
H.R. 32, the Homeless Children and Youth Act, would be more
efficient than HUD's paper chase and it would help our COC
identify common needs and pursue common goals with one mindset.
I am used to certifying homelessness for other Federal
programs, such as the USDA free meals at school, HHS Head
Start, and the College Financial Aid for Unaccompanied Homeless
Youth. I certainly will be glad to accept the responsibility of
certifying children and youth who are in clearly homeless
situations under the U.S. Department of Education's definition
so that we can serve them and prevent them from becoming
tomorrow's homeless adults.
Thank you so much for your time.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Garza can be found on page
70 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
Mr. Johnston, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MARK JOHNSTON, DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY, OFFICE
OF SPECIAL NEEDS, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND URBAN
DEVELOPMENT
Mr. Johnston. Chairwoman Biggert, Ranking Member Cleaver,
and Mr. Green, thank you for the opportunity to testify today
on this very important issue. I want to also thank you for
having the young, courageous witnesses on the first panel, and
they are certainly evidence that all of us need to do more to
help so many in this Nation who have no place to call home.
Families with children make up too large a share of our
homeless population, making up nearly 40 percent of all people
living on our streets and in our shelters. Sadly, one in five
homeless families are living in cars and other unsheltered
places.
This week, HUD released its national Point-In-Time count
for homeless persons. HUD partners with communities each
January to count the number of persons at a point in time who
are either unsheltered--that is, living outside--or are in
homeless shelters. These counts do not include persons who are
at risk of having no housing, such as persons living with other
family or friends, of which there are many, especially in these
very difficult economic times.
The number of persons living unsheltered or in shelters
declined by just over 2 percent between 2010 and 2011.
Importantly, this overall decline reflects reductions in all
subgroups--individuals, the chronically homeless, veterans, and
families with children. The reduction in homelessness among
families was 2.4 percent from 2010 and 5 percent since 2007.
While we as a Nation have a long ways to go, given high
record poverty rates and unemployment rates, it is heartening
that we are seeing at least some progress again in reducing
homelessness. These reductions are a testament to both recent
nationwide homeless prevention efforts as well as continued
funding of proven programs authorized by this subcommittee that
provide supportive housing to homeless families and
individuals.
The HEARTH Act provides communities, for the first time, a
full range of tools to prevent and end homelessness. In
particular, HEARTH expressly allows for HUD programs to serve
persons who are defined as ``at risk of homelessness'' and
expands the definition of who is considered homeless.
HUD began to train this week, on Tuesday, on the definition
of homelessness with our over 8,000 local grantee partners. It
is important to note that as grantees begin to use the new,
more expanded definition of homelessness and the definition of
at-risk homelessness we continue to receive essential flat
funding year after year. We are obviously in a time of great
fiscal constraint, and it will be very challenging to serve
more people without additional resources.
Related to the definition, I would like to acknowledge the
good work of GAO in assessing the need for a common vocabulary
when it comes to the issue of homelessness. I enthusiastically
support the finding that there should be a common vocabulary.
The HEARTH Act was the result of many years of hard work
from those on this committee and in the Congress in general,
the advocacy community, homelessness service providers, and
HUD. I was personally involved in these efforts from the
beginning and I was very heartened to see Congress pass this
bipartisan bill.
In addition to broadening the definition of homelessness,
the HEARTH Act also consolidates three HUD programs into one,
creates the Emergency Solutions Grants program, and the Rural
Housing Stability Program. So now, for the first time, HUD's
homeless assistance programs will have the full range of tools
that communities need to confront homelessness for families and
children, from prevention for those who are at risk of losing
their housing to emergency shelter, transitional housing, rapid
re-housing, and permanent housing.
To implement the HEARTH Act amendments, HUD has developed
and is issuing six sets of regulations, the details of which
are in my written testimony.
Finally, we realize that solving homelessness will require
more resources than are available through HEARTH. We are
involved in several initiatives to help reduce and end
homelessness for families with children and for youth that
attempt to both bring more resources to the table and to find
the best strategies to deal with this problem.
In conclusion, I want to thank you for the opportunity to
testify today, and I look forward to answering any questions
you may have.
[The prepared statement of Deputy Assistant Secretary
Johnston can be found on page 79 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you, Mr. Johnston.
Ms. Poppe, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF BARBARA POPPE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, UNITED STATES
INTERAGENCY COUNCIL ON HOMELESSNESS
Ms. Poppe. Good morning, Chairwoman Biggert, Representative
Green, and members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the
opportunity to testify on the impact of homelessness on
children and youth.
I want to thank Chairwoman Biggert for her leadership on
the passage of the HEARTH Act. Today, we are here to discuss
three requirements in that Act: a change in HUD's homeless
definition, a GAO study on Federal definitions, and the
development of a Federal plan.
I am pleased to report that we have made progress on all
three. HUD's new definition reflects the agreement that was
reached in the HEARTH Act, and we have followed up on the GAO's
study to advance Federal work on a common vocabulary. And, as
you know, we have the first ever Federal strategic plan to
prevent and end homelessness.
It is horrifying in a Nation as wealthy as ours that nearly
1 million children and youth experience homelessness. The
testimony we have just heard underscores this tragedy.
As Deputy Assistant Secretary Mark Johnston has noted, the
latest HUD data shows that nearly 240,000 family members were
homeless on a single night in January of 2011. While the 2011
Point-In-Time count is less than the 2010 count, other trends
are not so positive.
There is significant mismatch between income and housing.
More families are experiencing foreclosure. The shrinking
affordable housing stock, falling household incomes, and
increased competition from higher-income renters have really
widened the gap between the number of low-income renters and
the number of affordable units.
The needs of family, youth, and children vary, and often
require not only housing and employment but also attention to
education, health care, and other needs. These operate out at
different silos at a local level, often managed by different
jurisdictions. Instead of a tailored and holistic response,
families and youth confront a highly fragmented, uncoordinated
set of services that they are are usually left to navigate on
their own.
Not only is this tragic for homeless families, there is a
growing body of evidence that repeated housing instability is
costly to public systems. The good news is that there are
solutions. Investing in more housing assistance now can save
money over the long term for schools, child welfare, the health
care system, and other public institutions.
In June of 2010, the Obama Administration acted. For the
first time, the Federal Government set a goal to end family,
youth, and child homelessness by 2010. Opening Doors is based
on a growing body of evidence that shows how targeted,
comprehensive solutions are more cost effective than temporary
fixes.
Affordable housing is a cornerstone of any effort to reduce
and ultimately end homelessness. The preservation and expansion
of affordable housing through rehabilitation, new construction,
and rental assistance is critical to ending family
homelessness.
Unfortunately, though, the trend lines for affordable
housing are going in all the wrong directions. Too many
Americans cannot afford a safe place to call home. Despite the
growing need, housing assistance programs are threatened at all
levels of government in the current budget environment.
Next to affordable housing, prevention is also critical.
Targeted interventions that keep families from losing a home in
the first place spare children the trauma of homelessness,
absences from school, or changes in schools. The key drivers
are access to affordable housing, financial assistance, and
support during a crisis.
Another proven solution is rapid re-housing. Short-term
assistance helps families quickly move out of homelessness and
into permanent housing. HPRP made an enormous impact around the
country and helped many communities shift to more cost-
effective programs focused on prevention and rapid re-housing.
Housing stability, though, over the long term requires the
right types of support provided in a highly coordinated way.
These include good health care, education, transportation,
child care, and a job that pays enough to meet household needs.
Federal collaboration is moving from silos to solutions
that connect these systems to prevent homelessness whenever
possible, and when it does not happen, to resolve it as quickly
as possible. That is work we are doing across Federal agencies.
So, too, this needs to occur at State and local levels.
What gets measured gets done, and this Administration has
improved data collection, analysis, and reporting. Agencies
within HHS and VA are coordinating with HUD on these efforts.
Our Nation has faced economic uncertainties during the
first 18 months of Opening Doors implementation, but one thing
remains clear: Homelessness is an urgent problem. Not only is
it devastating to families and individuals who experience it,
but it is costly to society as a whole.
Republicans and Democrats in Congress and across the
country have collaborated for decades to fight homelessness.
Family, youth, and child homelessness is an outrage that should
know no partisan boundaries and is an area where we can make a
real difference together.
We need to invest in what works; we need to invest in our
future--our children. Let us work together to ensure that by
2020, not a single American child or youth experiences
homelessness.
Thank you for the opportunity to testify, and I look
forward to your questions.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Poppe can be found on page
94 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
Dr. Whitney, you are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF GRACE-ANN CARUSO WHITNEY, PH.D., MPA, IMH-E (IV),
DIRECTOR, CONNECTICUT HEAD START STATE COLLABORATION OFFICE,
CONNECTICUT STATE DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION
Ms. Whitney. Good morning, Chairwoman Biggert,
Representative Green, and members of the subcommittee. Thank
you for the opportunity to provide testimony today.
My name is Grace Whitney. For the past 15 years, I have
served as director of the Head Start State Collaboration Office
for the State of Connecticut. The Head Start Act requires that
State collaboration offices be in each State to partner with
States in specific priority areas, one of which is children
experiencing homelessness.
For babies, toddlers, and preschoolers, living doubled-up
in motels and other homeless situations creates toxic stress,
causing developmental challenges such as physical delays and
failure to thrive, higher incidence of persistent illness,
mental health problems such as trauma and depression, irritable
behavior, and trouble eating and sleeping. Young children's
neural networks, their actual genetic expressions, and the
architecture of their young brains are being created based on
repetition of experiences. Unhealthy conditions accumulate and
seriously jeopardize their potential for a healthy future.
For instance, one of our former Head Start managers
explains that children living in motels ``live in extremely
crowded rooms with numerous family members and often have very
limited food preparation options.'' Often, these environments
are full of transient adults and outdoor areas are unsafe so
children are forced to stay inside these cramped quarters,
certainly not ideal for young children and, of course, as you
know, infants and toddlers who must move. Many of these
families would be excluded using the HUD definition.
Families living in unstable conditions, including those who
reside in motels or doubled-up, often move repeatedly. This is
extremely stressful for babies and young children who need
consistency and routine for healthy development and emotional
stability.
Relocating often requires families to re-qualify for
essential services, provide documentation yet again, and they
can lose their place in line. High mobility is stressful for
parents, too, and often leads to depression, which interferes
with parenting, further compromising child development.
In Connecticut, we find that even young children in HUD
shelters often are not getting adequate services and there are
delays in accessing services due surely to the lack of
awareness of the needs of babies, toddlers, and preschoolers.
Head Start focuses its services on those families most in need.
Head Start uses the McKinney-Vento education definition of
homelessness, which recognizes the full range of family and
child homelessness that Head Start programs see every day.
Head Start is a mainstream program without sufficient
capacity to serve all eligible children. In fact, with current
funding, Head Start nationally serves about 50 percent of
eligible preschoolers and less than 5 percent of eligible
infants and toddlers.
Yet, Head Start programs are required to identify and
prioritize doubled-up or other homeless children due to their
dire living circumstances. Homeless families are allowed to
enroll immediately while documentation is obtained. Head Start
staff strive to begin services right away, to offer or obtain
all needed services quickly, and to work in whatever ways they
can with community partners to remove barriers.
In serving homeless children, Head Start is a natural
partner for HUD homeless and housing service providers. Head
Start is a comprehensive, two-generational program that
provides a full range of health, mental health, education, and
social services to children and their families.
Since roughly half of children in HUD shelters are age five
and under, these are children who are not on the radar screen
of the schools. Our services complement those of HUD providers
and are a critical strategy to meet the multiple needs of
homeless families that may otherwise go unmet.
However, since HUD does not consider many doubled-up
families or motel families to be homeless, this can present a
barrier to Head Start programs who cannot then provide these
families with the critical referrals to HUD-funded programs.
Even those who might qualify under HUD's definition may still
face barriers due to requirements for documentation, which can
not only be stressful but impossible for families. Such
requirements can create delays in achieving stability for
babies and young children, consume precious staff time and
resources, and create circumstances which put the needs of
vulnerable children last, setting them further back
developmentally.
Most beneficial for young children are policies and
practices that recognize and align with their unique needs and
promote rather than hinder their health and future success.
In closing, we all share the goal of ending family
homelessness. However, without dedicated attention to the needs
of young children, working together for multiple systems, we
will fall far short of this goal.
To break the cycle of homelessness, we must evaluate all
homeless and housing policies, including the definitions of
homelessness from a child development perspective, and ensure
housing policies take into account the threat to further lives
of these young, the very dire consequences to literally the
well-being of our Nation, of doing anything less.
Thank you again for the opportunity to share my experiences
and those of the Head Start programs in the State of
Connecticut.
[The prepared statement of Dr. Whitney can be found on page
112 of the appendix.]
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you so much.
And now, we turn to the questions by Members, and I am glad
to see there are a couple of us here. It really is important,
and it is a shame that there is so much going on and that this
happens with--when we talk about homelessness, that we keep
pushing and pushing for this.
And so, I will yield myself 5 minutes.
The definition of HUD--as you know, I worked on the
definition for Education, and I think that is when we realized
what--the discovering of--and really getting to know the
numbers of how many homeless children there were because of
enrolling in schools and then being able to do that right away,
and then finding out that HUD didn't match that.
And really, the first generic definition of HUD was this is
an individual who lacks a regular and adequate nighttime
residence. And it was really addressed for what we would call
the people who were living on the street or under the bridge,
and it was very important that they were protected by this.
But moving, then, towards young people, children, and
expanding that was very slow. We had the HEARTH Act, and
working on that, and I can remember that at that hearing--and
there were a few people there, but it was a most important
hearing, and one of our Members of Congress testified. It was
the first time he had ever talked about the fact that he was
homeless and had been abused. And I have to say, we were all in
tears--all five of us. And it had such an impact so that we
really worked on changing the definition there. But it wasn't
enough.
If you look at the HUD definition, with Title 1, obviously,
it is the general definition. But then the things that you have
to go through, still, that an individual or family who will
immediately--imminently lose their housing, including the
housing they own, rent, or live in sharing with others, rooms
in hotels or motels not paid for by a Federal, State, or local
government program, court order, individual or a family having
a primary night residence that is a room in a hotel or motel
and where they lack resources to reside there for more than 14
days, or credible evidence that the owner will not allow the
person to stay more than 14 days, has no subsequent resident
identified, lacks the resources needed to obtain other
permanent housing, unaccompanied youth and homeless families
with children, having experienced a long-term period without
living independently in permanent housing, having experienced
persistent instability as measured by frequent moves, can be
expected to continue in status for an extended period of time.
We really just can't make these kids jump through all those
hoops. Most of the children--homeless children--recognized by
the Department of Education would not meet the HUD standards,
and I think this is what has happened to some of the children
that were here today.
And they don't qualify. If they don't meet the requirements
they don't qualify for the homeless housing and supportive
services.
We really have to make this change, and I really am happy
to see that you are bringing this up, and talking about it, and
doing it. But I think that we really have to have a definition
that is the same as the other agencies, that is the same as the
Department of Education, if we are going to get all of this
together. And that is why we have H.R. 32, as well as doing
some other things.
I don't think that the kids on panel one or most of the
homeless kids are recognized as homeless, as I said, by the
Department of Education should be considered at-risk. These
kids are homeless. That is their problem and their challenge.
And so, HUD needs to recognize this fact, and I think Congress
and every Federal agency needs to work together to help these
homeless kids.
And I would hope that we can work together and continue to
do that. And as you do rulemaking, too, it is very important
that you don't put up more and more barriers to do that.
Ms. Garza, throughout your testimony you mentioned that you
couldn't help certain families secure housing or assistance
through HUD's programs, and the reasons why families, children,
and youth can't secure is important. Can you address that
quickly?
Ms. Garza. As I indicated, 80 percent of our families that
we identified are in doubled-up situations. Many of these
families are chronically homeless. We work with these families
on an ongoing basis, year after year after year.
Because they are in a doubled-up situation, they really
don't qualify for HUD services, and these families, being that
they have been chronically homeless, there are a lot of mental
health issues, so the supportive services are especially--would
be very beneficial for the families that I serve.
Chairwoman Biggert. And I think we heard today in the
testimony that moving--and they would be doubling up with
somebody and then they would be asked to leave. It is for
various reasons. Sometimes because they were--people might be
afraid that they--they have rented for one family and suddenly
there is another family living there so they are somewhat
illegitimate.
But I think just the idea that they are being kicked out of
someplace and they have nowhere to go, and this keeps
happening, is just--
Ms. Garza. Because they are doubled-up--going from doubled-
up to doubled-up they are--they have already exhausted a lot of
their family connections, their family support systems. They
have gone from family member to family member to family member
to family member, and in every location they have overstayed
their welcome. And so, because of that then, again, their
limitation or their resources become very limited as to where
they can go
So it gets to be a really challenging situation when they
actually just move in, because they have to be somewhere in a
relative's house, and then have to ask them for documentation
to support that they really are homeless for HUD. That would be
really, really challenging.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you.
We are hearing so much about this, and having this panel
was great. And we have a couple people here today who are
really active in this. One is Diane Nylan, who has traveled all
over the country visiting homeless throughout the country and
then did a documentary that is called ``Heroes,'' and I hope
that you have all had an opportunity to see that. And then
Alexandra Pelosi did one called, ``The Motel Kids,'' and it was
about the kids in Florida that was very moving.
And, of course, ``60 Minutes'' has had a program on this
lately, and then we have Barbara Duffield here, from the
National Coalition on Homelessness, that has done so much. So
we have all the tools and we have the help, we just have to get
this done.
And with that, I recognize the gentleman from Texas, Mr.
Green, for 5 minutes.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
Again, I thank the witnesses for appearing today. It has
been said and I will say it again, it is better to build a
strong child than to repair a broken adult. Now, for those who
deal in the social sciences--the psychologists, psychiatrists,
the criminologists, paleontologists--I just want you to know, I
don't necessarily like the language of a ``broken'' adult, but
I need to communicate, so just allow me to communicate.
I would be interested in knowing if you have seen any
empirical evidence on the number of people who are incarcerated
or were incarcerated who were homeless for some period of time
in their lives. Anyone with anything that you can point me to?
I am sure that Google will help, but you may give me a head
start if you have some empirical intelligence.
Mr. Johnston. One or two observations I have is, years ago
we did a study that looked in part at that topic and about 50
percent of homeless adults had had some experience with the
criminal justice system, either in prisons or in jails. I know,
having visited Rikers Island before and seeing their homeless
prevention program out there, there are tremendous challenges
we have in our cities and communities everywhere with people
coming into the jail system because they were homeless and
often leaving the jail system because they are homeless. And
so, prevention really is a key factor here.
Mr. Green. Now, someone indicated that people move from one
State to another because they find that in State A they don't
receive the resources that they can receive in State B. To what
extent do you find this to be the case, where we have people
who literally will hear, ``If you go over to State A, you will
get some help.''
Ms. Poppe?
Ms. Poppe. Certainly, the implementation of Federal
programs at State and local levels varies quite widely because
a great amount of discretion is given to locals and States as
to how they implement the Federal programs. But the other piece
that occurs is that the resources that States and local
governments contribute to the solutions also vary. So some
States contribute and support heavily in homeless programs to
provide assistance; other States provide very little if no
assistance at all.
And so, the resources available to families vary greatly. I
think you can see that most in the unsheltered numbers is the
high rate of unsheltered children and youth that we see
primarily in southern States and in California is reflective of
a lack of investment by often State and local governments in
real housing solutions to address the problem. And so,
certainly, that variation is quite different from what services
are available in the State of New York, say, and what would be
available in the State of California.
Mr. Green. Do you find that people will migrate based upon
knowledge that they receive about these benefits from one State
to another?
Ms. Poppe. Most of the studies that I have seen indicate
that people are moving for reasons of greater economic
opportunity, so they are moving to find the jobs. And then,
sometimes, those jobs don't pan out, and in that case, they
experience homelessness.
So it is not that they moved for homeless services per se.
They moved because they were seeking a better job opportunity
than they had in that situation. I think an exception to that
will be domestic violence victims who often are fleeing abusive
situations, and they do try to leave the State or other
communities simply for safety reasons.
Mr. Green. Thank you.
Mr. Johnston, would you care to add something to this,
please?
Mr. Johnston. I remember being in St. Petersburg a few
years ago and there was a statewide conference on homelessness
that I was going to be speaking at the next morning, and I was
walking around the City talking with people who were out on the
streets at night in a park, and this one particular gentleman
observed that he is actually from Ohio but he comes down in the
winter time to stay in Florida. He is increasingly staying
there time and time again.
I was intrigued with that, and as we looked at our data
within communities all across the country, the vast majority of
people do tend to stay within--where their family is from,
frankly, although there certainly are examples, as Barbara is
mentioning, that if they need greater economic opportunity,
they are going to be searching wherever that might be.
And I did want to also emphasize the point: I have seen
huge disparities on the level of assistance provided. ``60
Minutes'' contacted us before they did the story; we provided
them all of the data that we had and they therefore picked the
State of Florida in large part because two-thirds of all
homeless families live outside in Florida.
There are very few places like that in the country, but
every State is somewhat different. And that is certainly a huge
concern that families with children will be living outside.
Mr. Green. I really would like to explore this more, but my
time is limited, so I will move onto something else.
We have heard a good indication that one can be housed yet
homeless--housed yet homeless--doubled-up, as you have put it,
living with a friend. And the intelligence that you accorded us
with reference to how this impacts the formative years of very
young children is very, very disturbing, which gets us to this
notion of a need for a common definition, but a common
vocabulary. A common vocabulary could be of great benefit
across agencies, as I am understanding your testimony today.
I also understand, and I want you to help me with this, is
the genuine appeal for assistance, that these definitions were
promulgated because there was a need that they were trying to
meet so they arrived at a definition that would work for a
given need, which developed these silos and definitions and
stovepipes that did not function well across lines. How do we
deal with the different needs that have to be met with a common
definition?
And I am hopeful and believe that we are moving in the
right direction. I just want to hear from the experts on the
record as to how we get it done. So which of the experts would
like to be first?
Mr. Johnston?
Mr. Johnston. About 2 years ago, HUD, the Department of
Health and Human Services, and the Department of Education
launched an effort and submitted a proposal to Congress to try
a demonstration in particular for homeless families, and
another one for currently homeless persons. And we were trying
to link up mainstream resources that HUD has with HHS and
Education.
And it was interesting--this went on for about a year, in
terms of really fine-tuning a proposal that we could use, and
when we spoke the word ``homeless'', it certainly was used in
different ways, from my good friend, Joe McLaughlin, from
Education, as he would describe what homelessness meant from
their statutory definition versus ours.
So I think the need for a common vocabulary is incredibly
valuable. When we interviewed with the GAO, we certainly
supported that and look forward to that, and I know ICH has
taken great leadership to move forward on that, because the
challenge in this country is there are so many different
needs--huge housing needs--that we have to be able to converse
very well across agencies at Federal and local levels to solve
this problem.
Mr. Green. Mr. Diamond?
Mr. Diamond. I would agree that there are tremendous needs,
and I certainly think that we should do more to invest both in
people in shelter and in people who are living in precarious
living situations of all kinds. New York City has made a great
effort, and the HPRP funding that we have we have really used
in a targeted way for at-risk families, in particular.
Our concern with broadening a definition, though, is
diluting the resources. At a time of level or even declining
funding, broadening the definition away from shelter
potentially means taking resources away from the shelter system
to use in other situations.
There are other needs, clearly, and there are funding
streams available. But we really need to make sure we continue
our investment in those in shelter, because those are high-need
families who have a variety of case management and other kinds
of services that need to be provided if they are going to be
able to leave the shelter system.
Mr. Green. Mr. Poppe, would you care to respond?
Ms. Poppe. What I wanted to add is that as we have heard
all of the testimony this morning from the young people they,
in fact, were all eligible for HUD programs related to
providing mainstream housing assistance. But the reality is,
those mainstream housing programs are oversubscribed. HUD
programs can only meet about one-fourth of the need for those
who are eligible.
And so, the larger issue goes back to the need for the
resources to meet those needs, and that is why the Interagency
Council has worked across the definitions toward this end of
creating a common vocabulary so that even in these places we
can talk about the different eligibility criteria and how we
can try to effectively use the scarce resources that are
available to get families who are living precariously and
doubled-up in really difficult circumstances the best access to
affordable housing, which is what I heard each of these young
people testify about, was what they were really looking for was
a safe, stable home.
We just, as a country, haven't yet made that commitment of
the resources that the Federal, State, and the local, and the
private sector resources to make that occur. And that is the
work that sits before us, and that is the larger call to end
homelessness.
Mr. Green. Thank you very much, Mrs. Biggert. I will wait.
If there is another round I will wait. Thank you.
Chairwoman Biggert. Let's do another round.
Let's go to Mr. Sherman first for 5 minutes.
Mr. Sherman. We have a shortage of housing for the
homeless. We have an incredible shortage of money here in the
Federal Government. And we have an enormous surplus of boarded-
up houses, at least in some communities.
Is there any way that we can use the housing stock that has
already been constructed to meet these needs? And knowing that
some of these houses that are boarded-up are 2,000 or 3,000
square feet, is there any way that they can accommodate more
than one homeless family?
I will ask Mr. Johnston.
Mr. Johnston. We do have an initiative that we have had for
years, and it certainly is much more active during years where
we have huge foreclosures, like in the recent past, where
discounts can be made to allow these houses to be used for a
variety of different reasons, including housing homeless
persons.
Mr. Sherman. It is one thing to find somebody who is
homeless but somehow has the finances to make reduced mortgage
payments. Is that the kind of program you are talking about, or
are you talking about a program by which community
organizations acquire use or ownership of these structures?
Mr. Johnston. It was really the latter, in terms of
foreclosed properties.
Mr. Sherman. How many of these foreclosed properties have
been turned over to those housing the homeless in the last
year?
Mr. Johnston. I will get that answer for you because I do
not know.
Mr. Sherman. Because everywhere I look in--well, not
everywhere I look--in many places where you look around the
country, the homes are being boarded up, they are being torn
down. The ones that are being torn down are in bad shape when
measured against good housing. They are palaces compared to
sleeping in your car, and even better compared to sleeping in
the car you don't have.
So we are in this bizarre circumstance where we have
boarded-up houses and people sleeping on the streets, and
that--on another night, can you tell me what--
Mr. Johnston. Actually, it just occurred to me, I did not
refer to the Neighborhood Stabilization Program--multibillion
program funded by Congress that has been tremendously helpful,
to look at distressed areas with high foreclosure rates, to be
able to rehabilitate and get those houses back into service.
And it is in many, many tens of thousands--
Mr. Sherman. That is back into service for people who are
going to own the homes, which really get people out of
apartments and into homes that they can--single family homes
they can live in, which is an outstanding idea. I don't know if
that affects the problems that we are talking about today,
although it could be an--
Mr. Johnston. When we did the training for and launching of
this program, we also encouraged the use of these properties
for nonprofit organizations to house persons with special
needs, including homeless persons.
Mr. Sherman. Okay. Gotcha.
What problems are you having administering the HEARTH Act?
Mr. Johnston. I am sorry. What problems what?
Mr. Sherman. The HEARTH Act?
Mr. Johnston. We are just now launching the implementation
of the HEARTH Act amendments. The definition of homelessness,
for instance, comes into effect on January 4th; the first
program coming out of line is the Emergency Solutions Grants
program, which is January 4th, as well.
I will mention that we have identified a few technical
challenges--technical errors that we have found in the law that
are going to be limiting communities. For instance--and one of
the most concerning ones to--
Mr. Sherman. When did you discover these errors and when
did you bring them to the attention of members of this
committee?
Mr. Johnston. Committee staff recently received a copy of
them to look at; we briefed them on it.
Mr. Sherman. When did you discover the problems?
Mr. Johnston. We discovered the problems probably a year-
and-a-half, 2 years ago.
Mr. Sherman. Okay.
Mr. Johnston. And let me say, the Senate was hopeful to
actually be enacting changes to this.
Mr. Sherman. So you found the problems a year-and-a-half
ago, you waited a year-and-a-half to tell the House, but
somebody in the Senate did know about the problems and was
trying to do something about it.
I yield back.
Chairwoman Biggert. So you sent it to the House of Lords,
which takes a while to get to these things. Could we see a copy
of it please?
Mr. Johnston. Yes.
Chairwoman Biggert. I have not received anything.
Mr. Johnston. Okay.
Chairwoman Biggert. I appreciate it. Thank you.
Dr. Whitney, you highlight some very compelling evidence
for many of the barriers that have prevented the children and
youth from getting the housing assistance and services from
HUD, and I won't read them over again, that is in your
testimony. But I just want to say thank you for all that you
are doing.
And I had the opportunity years and years ago--I am a
lawyer and I had been clerking for a judge on the U.S. Court of
Appeals who was waiting for my job that was going to start in
September, so I spent the summer volunteering at Head Start in
Hull House, in Chicago, and it was the first year. It had just
opened. And so that was--I won't tell you how long ago that
was, but it was a long time. And it was really, I think, for
the help--that was kind of the start of really helping
preschool kids to be ready to go to school, and we just need
more and more of that right now.
And we need the kids who are homeless--I guess I am not
asking questions, really, but I really would hope that we could
all work together to really to solve this and really take a
look at removing these barriers, because the more regulations
that we get in the harder it is.
And I know, Mr. Diamond, it seems like you don't really
like H.R. 32.
Mr. Diamond. I am certainly supportive of the concept of
investing in people who are in difficult housing situations,
and the City makes a major investment in trying to help those
families. And we have offices throughout the City that provide
services.
Our concern is that shelter is a very expensive and needed
resource. In New York City, it costs $3,000 a month to keep a
family in shelter. And if we are going to take money away from
the shelter system, it will have an impact on our ability to
effectively serve those families.
So that is our concern. Not that there isn't a need, not
that if there were increasing resources available we wouldn't
want to invest in everyone who has needs, but our concern is
taking resources away from those who are in the shelter system.
Chairwoman Biggert. That really is a different issue, but I
know that this is something that--even when we were trying to
do the HEARTH Act, to get that through, to try and get
everybody on board was difficult. But I think everybody now
realizes the importance of it.
And I think New York is probably doing more than a lot of
the States, really, in the programs that you have. I was
impressed by that. But I really would like to see us all being
on board with making sure that there aren't these barriers.
So, Ms. Cackley, we haven't asked you any questions. Would
you like to make another comment from--
Ms. Cackley. I do just have one comment. I wanted to also
make the point in talking about the benefits of a common
vocabulary is, one of the other things that it does is it
allows you to do a much better job of measuring homelessness,
which then allows you to know what it is you are dealing with
in a much more complete way. Prioritizing does have to take
place, but you can't really even prioritize if you don't know
the extent of the problem. So for that purpose, having a common
vocabulary allows measurement to happen.
Chairwoman Biggert. Thank you. And then all the measurement
would be the same, hopefully.
Ms. Cackley. That would be the hope.
Chairwoman Biggert. Okay.
With that, I yield back.
Mr. Green, do you have something briefly?
Mr. Green. Yes, ma'am. I will make it very brief. Thank
you.
I would like to, if I may, Mrs. Biggert, thank the staff.
They just provide us an inordinate amount of intelligence, and
it means a lot to have people to assist us to the extent that
they do.
Following up on what you said, Ms. Cackley, do others agree
that a common definition would yield greater intelligence on
the length, breadth, width, and depth of the problem? Is there
anyone who differs?
Mr. Johnston. I think there is a distinction between common
vocabulary and common definition, in the sense that if we all
understand the terms we are using, we have a common dictionary
that we can all use, then we can understand each other, we can
communicate, and we can implement programs.
I, too, have a concern, as does Mr. Diamond. If you were to
expand HUD's homeless definition, which is in the law, to, for
instance, the Education definition, it has some big challenges
with it.
And what I mean by that is, we have enough funding from
Congress for 3 years in a row to house 200,000 people in
transitional and permanent housing. Expanding the definition
greatly does not allow us to serve a single additional person,
and that is sort of the concern we have about having one common
definition when the resources that we provide are very, very
expensive.
Chairwoman Biggert. Would the gentleman yield?
Mr. Green. Of course, Madam Chairwoman. Of course.
Chairwoman Biggert. I might have said that the wrong way.
What we are looking for is that if a child is homeless under
the definition--Education--then they should be considered
homeless. It doesn't really put that definition into HUD. It
doesn't expand it to adults.
Mr. Green. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.
Let me move to another area rather quickly, and this is in
the area of veterans who are homeless, and they have children,
too, of course. And all children are important. No child should
be elevated to some status higher than another.
But I am curious, do we have, Ms. Poppe, any intelligence
on the children of veterans?
Ms. Poppe. Thank you, Mr. Green, for that question. This is
an area that has been a strong focus of the President and VA
Secretary Shinseki, to focus on the needs of homeless veterans,
and that we might one day end that by 2015.
Just this week, we reported a 12 percent reduction in the
percentage of veterans experiencing homelessness. There are a
couple of new programs--or programs that have been really
pushed out by this Administration.
One is the HUD-VASH Program. The VASH Program provides rent
subsidies through HUD combined with health care services and
other supports through the VA, and that program is able to
serve veterans' families, including the children in them. And
so, it is a holistic response to veterans' homelessness.
The VA has also just put together, with the support of
Congress, the Supportive Services for Veterans Families. That
program provides flexible assistance that, too, can serve
families with children.
Historically, the VA services have been limited to the
veteran themselves, and with these two initiatives, they can
now serve family members who are part of that. So yes, we are
seeing veterans' families, unfortunately, experiencing
homelessness, and yes, we are able to respond and we believe
that these responses is what is contributing to the overall
reduction in homelessness among veterans.
Mr. Green. Thank you.
Madam Chairwoman, I want to thank you again, and alert the
witnesses that the Chair recently marked up a piece of
legislation styled ``Homes for Heroes,'' and this piece of
legislation would station a person in HUD whose sole
responsibility would be to monitor homelessness among our
veterans and there would be a report accorded Congress. So I
want to thank you for allowing that legislation to receive a
markup, and hopefully, it will matriculate through Congress and
get to the President's desk.
Thank you very much.
Chairwoman Biggert. The gentleman is very humble. It was
his legislation that passed.
Just one further thing for clarification.
Ms. Cackley, you note in your testimony that the Department
of Education identified nearly 1 million homeless students
during the 2009-2010 school year, and that there was an 18
percent increase since the 2007-2008 school year. So you note
that some evidence suggests that homelessness among children is
increasing.
How do you explain the discrepancy between the HUD report--
numbers that were just reported by the Administration on
Tuesday and the Education numbers?
Ms. Cackley. I haven't looked at them in great detail, but
I would assume that part of the discrepancy is the definitional
differences, still.
Chairwoman Biggert. Okay. Thank you.
With that, I ask unanimous consent to insert the following
materials into the hearing record: December 7th, 2011 letter
from Women Against Abuse; December 8th letter from National
Center on Family Homelessness; letter from the Chicago
Coalition for the Homeless; letter from the National Human
Services Assembly; letter from the Social Work Association of
America; letter from the American School Counselor Association;
letter from First Focus Campaign for Children; letter from Hear
Us; letter from the Homeless Prenatal Program; letter from the
National Association of REALTORS; letter from the National
Coalition for Homelessness; letter from the National Center for
Housing and Child Welfare; letter from the National Network for
Youth; letter from the Western Regional Advocacy Project;
letter from the National Health Care for the Homeless Council;
letter from Alliance for Excellent Education; letter from the
National Law Center on Homelessness and Poverty; letter from
the National Association for Education of Homeless Children and
Youth; letter from Family Promise; letter from Family Promise
of Midland; letter from the National Network to End Domestic
Violence; letter from Horizons for Homeless Children; letter
from the Interfaith Hospitality Network of Augusta; letter from
Family Promise of Greater Helena; letter from Interfaith
Hospitality Network of Burlington County; letter from Family
Promise of Morris County; letter from the Interfaith
Hospitality Network of Essex County; letter from the Family
Promise of Forsyth County; letter from the Road Home; letter
from the Family Promise of Albuquerque; letter from the Fort
Bend Family Promise; letter from the Interfaith Hospitality
Network of Northwest Philadelphia; letter from the Family
Promise of Monmouth County; letter from the Family Promise of
North Idaho; letter from the Family Promise of Hawaii; letter
from the National PTA; letter from the National Association of
Secondary School Principals; report from the National Center on
Family Homelessness; and the June 2011 data collection summary
report from the U.S. Department of Education.
Without objection, it is so ordered.
Mr. Green. Madam Chairwoman, I have a unanimous consent, as
well, from the National Low Income Housing Coalition. I would
like to ask--
Chairwoman Biggert. Without objection, it is so ordered. We
left one out?
And thank you all. Really, thank you for being here and
thank you for your testimony.
The Chair notes that some Members may have additional
questions for the panel which they may wish to submit in
writing. Without objection, the hearing record will remain open
for 30 days for Members to submit written questions to these
witnesses and to place their responses in the record.
And there is one more request for unanimous consent--the
National Association of Home Builders. Without objection, it is
so ordered.
With that, thank you so much. You have all been great
witnesses, and you have been a great panel. Thank you.
The hearing is adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 12:45 p.m., the hearing was adjourned.]
A P P E N D I X
December 15, 2011
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