[Senate Hearing 106-807]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]




                                                        S. Hrg. 106-807

        NOMINATIONS OF JOHN RAMSEY JOHNSON AND GERALD I. FISHER

=======================================================================


                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                              COMMITTEE ON
                          GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS
                          UNITED STATES SENATE

                       ONE HUNDRED SIXTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                                 ON THE

NOMINATIONS OF JOHN RAMSEY JOHNSON AND GERALD I. FISHER TO BE ASSOCIATE 
        JUDGES OF THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

                               __________

                           SEPTEMBER 13, 2000

                               __________

      Printed for the use of the Committee on Governmental Affairs



                               __________

                    U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE
67-287                     WASHINGTON : 2000


_______________________________________________________________________
For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, Congressional Sales Office
         U.S. Government Printing Office, Washington, DC 20402

                   COMMITTEE ON GOVERNMENTAL AFFAIRS

                   FRED THOMPSON, Tennessee, Chairman
WILLIAM V. ROTH, Jr., Delaware       JOSEPH I. LIEBERMAN, Connecticut
TED STEVENS, Alaska                  CARL LEVIN, Michigan
SUSAN M. COLLINS, Maine              DANIEL K. AKAKA, Hawaii
GEORGE V. VOINOVICH, Ohio            RICHARD J. DURBIN, Illinois
PETE V. DOMENICI, New Mexico         ROBERT G. TORRICELLI, New Jersey
THAD COCHRAN, Mississippi            MAX CLELAND, Georgia
ARLEN SPECTER, Pennsylvania          JOHN EDWARDS, North Carolina
JUDD GREGG, New Hampshire
             Hannah S. Sistare, Staff Director and Counsel
                       Johanna L. Hardy, Counsel
     Kristine I. Simmons, Staff Director, Oversight of Government 
                              Management,
        Restructuring, and the District of Columbia Subcommittee
       Mason C. Alinger, Professional Staff Member, Oversight of
  Government Management, Restructuring, and the District of Columbia 
                              Subcommittee
      Joyce A. Rechtschaffen, Minority Staff Director and Counsel
          Peter A. Ludgin, Minority Professional Staff Member
       Marianne C. Upton, Minority Chief Counsel/Staff Director,
Oversight of Government Management, Restructuring, and the District of 
                         Columbia Subcommittee
                     Darla D. Cassell, Chief Clerk

                            C O N T E N T S

                                 ------                                
Opening statements:
                                                                   Page
    Senator Voinovich............................................     1

                               WITNESSES
                           September 13, 2000

Hon. Eleanor Holmes Norton, a Delegate in Congress from the 
  District of Columbia...........................................     1
John Ramsey Johnson, to be an Associate Judge of the Superior 
  Court of the District of Columbia..............................     3
Gerald I. Fisher, to be an Associate Judge of the Superior Court 
  of the District of Columbia....................................     4

                     Alphabetical List of Witnesses

Fisher, Gerald I.:
    Testimony....................................................     3
    Biographical information.....................................    28
Johnson, John Ramsey:
    Testimony....................................................     4
    Biographical information.....................................     7
Norton, Hon. Eleanor Holmes:
    Testimony....................................................     1

 
        NOMINATIONS OF JOHN RAMSEY JOHNSON AND GERALD I. FISHER

                              ----------                              


                     WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 13, 2000

                                       U.S. Senate,
                         Committee on Governmental Affairs,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 9:10 a.m., in 
room SD-342, Dirksen Senate Office Building, Hon. George 
Voinovich presiding.
    Present: Senator Voinovich.

             OPENING STATEMENT OF SENATOR VOINOVICH

    Senator Voinovich. The hearing will come to order. I would 
like to welcome everyone here this morning, especially our 
nominees, Gerald Fisher and John Ramsey Johnson, who have been 
nominated to serve as Associate Judges for the District of 
Columbia. Let me state for the record that both of our nominees 
have been subjected to a very thorough screening process.
    They were recommended by the District's Judicial Nomination 
Committee, subjected to FBI background investigations and 
subsequently nominated by the President of the United States. 
Since the nominations were received, the Committee staff has 
also conducted separate background checks and interviews of 
both of the nominees.
    And I want to say that yesterday I visited with the White 
House Counsel and looked over the FBI reports and so forth, so 
I am pretty familiar with your backgrounds, and then our staff 
has done a lot of work. So I think, for the record, people 
should know that both of these candidates have been subjected 
to an enormous amount of scrutiny by not only the White House, 
but by the Senate, and have gone through all the various 
screenings that one has to go through, and you all ought to 
feel very good about the fact that you are here, because if you 
had not done that well, you would not be here today.
    We are privileged to have with us today Congresswoman 
Eleanor Holmes Norton, who does an outstanding job of 
representing the District. She has been very conscientious 
about trying to make sure that we get the very best people on 
the courts here in the District. Eleanor, it is nice to welcome 
you here this morning.

STATEMENT OF ELEANOR HOLMES NORTON, A DELEGATE IN CONGRESS FROM 
                    THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

    Ms. Norton. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. The District 
very much appreciates that you have moved so expeditiously to 
hold this hearing, to fill two spots, two places on our local 
bench. As you may know, I do not participate in the selection 
of the local benches. I do U.S. District Court judges, because 
I regard that as a home-rule matter, but since this is an 
Article I court, it is always a great pleasure to sponsor and 
introduce nominees who have completed a thoroughly professional 
screening process.
    We have a wonderful doubleheader here today, with two 
outstanding nominees. First, let me introduce John Ramsey 
Johnson. I know that the U.S. Attorney's Office--and I see the 
United States Attorney here--will miss this mainstay of the 
U.S. Attorney's Office. He has himself served as interim U.S. 
Attorney, appointed first by Attorney General Janet Reno, then 
by the U.S. District Court judges themselves.
    He has held the second-highest position in the U.S. 
Attorney's Office, Acting Principal U.S. Attorney. In that 
office, as a career U.S. Attorney, Mr. Johnson has done it all. 
He has, across the board, deep experience in prosecuting 
everything from local crimes to international terrorism, civil 
and criminal appeals, and training new assistants. His work in 
the U.S. Attorney's Office has been excellent preparation to 
serve on our Superior Court bench.
    Despite his busy professional life, Mr. Johnson has managed 
to be elected to office at his local public school PTA, where 
his son is in the second grade, and to act as a mentor to 
youngsters. He is almost a lifelong resident of the city, went 
to undergraduate school at Georgetown, got his law degree at 
Antioch Law School, now known as the University of the District 
of Columbia Law School, and he was a captain in the Air Force. 
This is an outstanding candidate, we believe, for you to 
consider, Mr. Chairman.
    I would next like to introduce Gerald Fisher, also an 
excellent candidate who has had a distinguished career in 
private practice, most recently at Fisher and Hansen. His deep 
experience comes as a supervising attorney initially at 
criminal defense clinics which involve five of our six law 
schools: Georgetown, Howard, George Washington, Catholic, and 
American. He himself is a specialist in complex criminal and 
civil litigation. Over 15 years, he has taught evidence, trial 
practice, and capital punishment jurisprudence at Georgetown 
Law School as an adjunct professor.
    Mr. Fisher is frequently on the faculty for child-advocacy 
programs around the country. He is a graduate of the College of 
William and Mary in Virginia, and Catholic University Law 
School here. He clerked in our own District of Columbia Court 
of Appeals. I am very pleased to recommend this highly-
qualified candidate.
    Senator Voinovich. Thank you very much. I just would like 
to say that the fact that I am here should not be interpreted 
as the fact that this is not very important to the Members of 
the Senate. I know that several other Members would like to 
have been here this morning, but they have some conflicts in 
their schedule. I just want the family to know that this is a 
big deal. And so we are glad to have all of you here. Mr. 
Ramsey, would you like to introduce your wife and children?
    Mr. Johnson. I certainly would, Mr. Chairman. Thank you 
very much. This is my wife, Monica McGowan, and my daughter, 
Molly, who is about to turn 12, and my son, John, who is seven. 
And I also have with me today, if I may mention them, U.S. 
Attorney Wilma Lewis and a close colleague of mine, also from 
the office, Channing Phillips. Thank you.
    Senator Voinovich. You are going to be missing somebody 
important in your operation.
    Ms. Lewis. Yes, we will.
    Senator Voinovich. I am sure you are rejoicing in the fact 
he is going to have an opportunity to serve in another way. I 
told the children, ``You know, I think you are going to see 
more of your dad.'' [Laughter.]
    He is going to work hard, but one thing, for the most part, 
judges do control their schedules, as contrasted to people who 
are in the Attorney's office--you are always there; aren't you?
    Mr. Fisher, would you like to introduce--I know that your 
law partner is here today, and you are welcome to introduce 
your friends.
    Mr. Fisher. I would like to introduce Mary Kennedy, who is 
my significant other, my life partner, and next to her is Kurt 
Hansen, my law partner at Fisher and Hansen. As I indicated to 
you earlier, if I am fortunate enough to be confirmed, I am the 
fourth partner that he has had who ascends to the Superior 
Court bench.
    Senator Voinovich. He ought to go into business, just 
advertise. [Laughter.]
    We have a tradition here in this Committee that we ask all 
of our witnesses to go under oath, and if you will both stand, 
I would like to swear you in. Please raise your right hand and 
repeat after me. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you 
will give the Committee today will be the truth, the whole 
truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you, God?
    Mr. Fisher. I do.
    Mr. Johnson. I do.
    Senator Voinovich. Let the record show that both of our 
candidates answered in the affirmative. Mr. Johnson, we are 
pleased to have you here today, and would you like to make any 
kind of an opening statement?

 TESTIMONY OF JOHN RAMSEY JOHNSON,\1\ TO BE AN ASSOCIATE JUDGE 
       OF THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

    Mr. Johnson. Only very briefly. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I 
wanted to tell you that I am greatly honored to be testifying 
here today. I wanted to thank the President for nominating me 
to be an Associate Judge of the Superior Court. I particularly 
wanted to thank you for holding this hearing and the Committee 
for moving forward on this. This is really a great honor, and I 
will be very happy to answer any questions you may have.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \1\ The biographical information of Mr. Johnson appears in the 
Appendix on page 7.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Senator Voinovich. Mr. Fisher.

 TESTIMONY OF GERALD I. FISHER,\1\ TO BE AN ASSOCIATE JUDGE OF 
         THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

    Mr. Fisher. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I also share Mr. 
Johnson's sentiments about being very honored to be here--both 
being nominated by the President and being allowed to come 
before this Committee. I just wanted to add my special thanks 
to Delegate Norton for taking her time out from what I know is 
a very busy schedule today to come and introduce us.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \1\ The biographical information of Mr. Fisher appears in the 
Appendix on page 28.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    And I also wanted to thank the Committee staffers, who have 
really made this process extremely understandable and easier 
than I otherwise thought it would be. The last point is I am 
especially happy to be here today with Ramsey Johnson, who is a 
friend and colleague of 20 years and, in my opinion, as 
deserving of this position as anybody in the city. Thank you 
very much.
    Senator Voinovich. I mentioned earlier that I read your 
background, and you have been through a series of 
investigations and staff work. I would be interested for the 
record to have each one of you respond to why it is that you 
want to hold this position. Both of you are successful in your 
own particular fields and I would be interested in knowing why 
it is that you want to serve on the bench.
    Mr. Johnson.
    Mr. Johnson. Yes, Senator. Thank you. I have, as I think 
the record indicates, spent essentially my entire life in 
Washington, D.C., and it is my hometown. Even though I 
understand it is the Nation's capital and has various members 
of the diplomatic corps and others here, but I actually live in 
the house I grew up in, and my wife and I have put an addition 
on the back, but we are raising our children in the same place 
where I grew up. They are learning to ride their bicycles on 
the same sidewalk.
    And all of that has given me a connection to this city that 
I find very rewarding. The Superior Court of the District of 
Columbia serves the people of the District of Columbia and all 
their many problems. Usually problems bring people to a 
courthouse, from family law to difficulties with juveniles and 
adult crime, and civil cases. It is, to me, looking at it as a 
lawyer, an important part of the lifeblood of a community.
    And I am hopeful that, based on my years of experience and 
training, and just my years, that I can bring some judgment, 
perspective and love of this city to the job, and not only 
would it be, I hope, rewarding for me, but that it would, in 
fact, benefit the people who live and work here.
    Senator Voinovich. In Ohio, it is like our Court of Common 
Pleas, where you really deal with the problems of the people in 
the area.
    Mr. Johnson. Exactly.
    Senator Voinovich. It is not a bad thing to have somebody 
who lives in the area be a judge on the bench. One of the 
things we did in our city when I was mayor was that we had a 
residency requirement and a lot of people hooted and howled 
over it. It was not retroactive, but for new people, they had 
to live in the city. It has really made a big difference. It 
really has, because there is a certain sense of commitment to 
the city because you are a resident of the city, and it is a 
good dimension and it is great.
    Mr. Fisher.
    Mr. Fisher. Thank you, Senator. I share a lot of the 
feelings that Mr. Johnson has, although I have not been here in 
the city nearly as long. I have lived here over 20 years now. I 
must confess that I do not leave private practice without some 
regrets. I enjoy litigation and I enjoy many of the things I 
do. I guess I have come to the point in my career where there 
is a certain frustration in being unable to solve and address 
problems from the position that I am in, and I think being a 
judge can help you to do that.
    Hopefully, I, too, will bring some wisdom and some judgment 
and some experience and maybe just good old common sense to the 
job and can do more good for this city than I have thus far 
been able to do.
    Senator Voinovich. Well, I do not think enough people in 
this country have an appreciation about how important our good 
judges are to our society, and it is nice that both of you are 
interested in pursuing a seat on the Superior Court.
    I have some questions that must be answered. They are 
mandatory questions and I am going to ask each one of you--I 
will read the question first and then you can respond to it. 
First, are you aware of anything in your background that might 
present a conflict of interest with the duties of the office to 
which you have been nominated?
    Mr. Johnson.
    Mr. Johnson. No, Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Voinovich. Mr. Fisher.
    Mr. Fisher. No, Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Voinovich. Do you know any reason, personal or 
otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from fully and 
honorably discharging the responsibilities of the office to 
which you have been nominated?
    Mr. Johnson. No, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Fisher. No.
    Senator Voinovich. Do you know of any reason, personal or 
otherwise, that would in any way prevent you from serving the 
full term for the office to which you have been nominated?
    Mr. Johnson. No, Mr. Chairman.
    Mr. Fisher. No, Mr. Chairman.
    Senator Voinovich. Let the record show that the answers to 
all those questions were no.
    Is there anything else that you would like to add?
    Mr. Johnson. No, sir. Thank you.
    Mr. Fisher. I don't believe so.
    Senator Voinovich. The procedure is that once this hearing 
is held, then it will go to the Committee as a whole and for 
review. We will see what we can do to move it along as quickly 
as we can and hopefully get it done before we get out of here. 
I know that you are needed in the positions which you are 
seeking, and I will do what I can to move this along for you, 
but at this stage of the game here in Congress, it is hard to 
figure out what is going on. Thank you so much for being here 
and I am so glad that you were able to bring your friends, Mr. 
Fisher, with you, and Mr. Johnson, your family.
    Mr. Fisher. Thank you, Senator.
    Mr. Johnson. Thank you.
    Senator Voinovich. I wish you good luck in your new career. 
The hearing is adjourned.
    [Whereupon, at 9:26 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.]

                            A P P E N D I X

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